From donm at cts.com Mon Sep 1 00:05:00 2003 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:37 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: <20030831212905.C80015@newshell.lmi.net> Message-ID: On Sun, 31 Aug 2003, Fred Cisin wrote: > On Mon, 1 Sep 2003, Mail List wrote: > > That darn Radio Shack. You can't even go in there and buy a battery without > > going through their interrogation process. I got to the point that when > > they asked > > me for my first name, I said Johnny, and when they asked me for my last name, > > I said Cash. Johnny Cash. Now do you want to sell the GD battery or what? > > When they ask for your address, recite the address of the store that you > are in. See how many of the clerks will notice. They seem to have stopped asking for that information in the stores that I visit here. - don From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Mon Sep 1 00:07:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:37 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: <3F52CB05.9010207@mdrconsult.com> References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <3F52A8D4.1050008@cox.net> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030901005448.089d6ec0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> > The Flying Butt Monkeys, IIRC. That is truly wild. The cue cat thing, all the time spent defeating it, etc. I wish I had the spare time some people have. Maybe someday. Best Regards At 11:28 PM 8/31/03 -0500, you wrote: >Mail List wrote: >>Hello John, >> > And the whole point of their baseless lawsuit was that people who >> were using the >> > CueCat for other than they intended were "depriving them of >> revenue". Of course, >> > since they *gave* the thing away, that case was uninforceable. >>Particularly since >> > they were sent unsolicted through the mail. >>Who were they trying to sue? Their customer base? > > The Flying Butt Monkeys, IIRC. > > For real. > > > Doc From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Mon Sep 1 00:13:01 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:37 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: <20030831212905.C80015@newshell.lmi.net> References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <3F52A8D4.1050008@cox.net> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030901005847.089d2ec0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> > When they ask for your address, recite the address of the store that you > are in. See how many of the clerks will notice. That's good. But at the mall or the strip malls, I don't know the address. I should find out, to be prepared in advance. But the truth is, with Radio Shack not seeming to stock as many basic DIY components these days, I only go there every once in a while anymore. Last things I bought there were some lithium coin cells, some electronic clocks and digital display alarm clocks, but they were pretty nice. Better selection of that kind of thing than Kmart, and exactly what I needed at the time. Best Regards At 09:30 PM 8/31/03 -0700, you wrote: >On Mon, 1 Sep 2003, Mail List wrote: > > That darn Radio Shack. You can't even go in there and buy a battery without > > going through their interrogation process. I got to the point that when > > they asked > > me for my first name, I said Johnny, and when they asked me for my last > name, > > I said Cash. Johnny Cash. Now do you want to sell the GD battery or what? > >When they ask for your address, recite the address of the store that you >are in. See how many of the clerks will notice. From cisin at xenosoft.com Mon Sep 1 00:23:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:37 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030831221303.J80015@newshell.lmi.net> > > > That darn Radio Shack. You can't even go in there and buy a battery without > > > going through their interrogation process. I got to the point that when > > > they asked > > > me for my first name, I said Johnny, and when they asked me for my last name, > > > I said Cash. Johnny Cash. Now do you want to sell the GD battery or what? > > When they ask for your address, recite the address of the store that you > > are in. See how many of the clerks will notice. On Sun, 31 Aug 2003, Don Maslin wrote: > They seem to have stopped asking for that information in the > stores that I visit here. ... because they now know their own address? From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Mon Sep 1 01:09:01 2003 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:37 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <3F52A8D4.1050008@cox.net> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030901005847.089d2ec0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <3F52DF85.8010507@jetnet.ab.ca> Mail List wrote: > That's good. But at the mall or the strip malls, I don't know the > address. I should > find out, to be prepared in advance. But the truth is, with Radio Shack > not seeming > to stock as many basic DIY components these days, I only go there every > once > in a while anymore. Last things I bought there were some lithium coin > cells, some > electronic clocks and digital display alarm clocks, but they were pretty > nice. Better > selection of that kind of thing than Kmart, and exactly what I needed at > the time. I never found Radio Shack to sell anything that one could ever do useful things with for projects as they never seemed to have any thing in stock. The real DIY is hi-fi audio with good old tubes is making a comeback but don't expect to find it here. I consider Radio Shack just any low end electronics store, that sells a few cables, connectors and a odd part. From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 1 01:25:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:37 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 1 Sep 2003, Mail List wrote: > > But they're still pretty goofy looking. > > Like a mouse, shaped very much like a real animal mouse. Actually, it's shaped like a long cat. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 1 01:28:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:37 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: <3F52DF85.8010507@jetnet.ab.ca> Message-ID: On Sun, 31 Aug 2003, Ben Franchuk wrote: > The real DIY is hi-fi audio with good old tubes is making a comeback but And homebrew video game systems. Check out: http://www.xgamestation.com -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Mon Sep 1 03:43:00 2003 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:37 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: <200308312316.57677.jcwren@jcwren.com> References: <3F52A8D4.1050008@cox.net> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <200308312316.57677.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: In message <200308312316.57677.jcwren@jcwren.com> "J.C. Wren" wrote: > I had about 50 that I had acquired by asking for several ("me and my friends > need one") everytime I went to Tech America or Radio Shack. I've got a few of them *somewhere*, but I need more (I was going to build a keyboard wedge for it). Anyone got a few spare PS/2 Cuecats? :) Thanks. -- Phil. | Acorn Risc PC600 Mk3, SA202, 64MB, 6GB, philpem@dsl.pipex.com | ViewFinder, Ethernet (Acorn AEH62), http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ | 8xCD, framegrabber, Teletext ... Real techs don't lick nine-volt batteries! From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Mon Sep 1 04:00:01 2003 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: References: <3F52A8D4.1050008@cox.net> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <200308312316.57677.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: <3091082b4c.philpem@dsl.pipex.com> In message Philip Pemberton wrote: > I've got a few of them *somewhere*, but I need more (I was going to build a > keyboard wedge for it). Anyone got a few spare PS/2 Cuecats? :) Gah! I really shouldn't post messages until I'm awake... Instead of "Keyboard wedge" I meant to say "RS232 interface"... Later. -- Phil. | Acorn Risc PC600 Mk3, SA202, 64MB, 6GB, philpem@dsl.pipex.com | ViewFinder, Ethernet (Acorn AEH62), http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ | 8xCD, framegrabber, Teletext ... Real techs don't lick nine-volt batteries! From tothwolf at concentric.net Mon Sep 1 04:21:00 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: <004e01c36f7d$7bd11140$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> References: <004e01c36f7d$7bd11140$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: On Sun, 31 Aug 2003, Nico de Jong wrote: > From: "Fred N. van Kempen" > > > Is anyone here knowledgeable in the area of (older) barcode laser > > scanenrs? I got some Symbol handheld scanners, and they *seem* to > > work (they beep when pointed at the barcode on my Coke bottle ;-) ... > > My experience is mainly with Intermec. What seems to be the problem ? If > you want to do things off-line, you can write in Dutch. I've had quite a bit of experience in repairing an Intermec 1545. I ended up using Everclear to clean the optics, if that counts for anything. (Lab grade alcohol proved to be quite difficult to obtain.) The "brains" of these bar code readers are in the wedge, which with the right cables, can support nearly any computer or terminal ever made. I'd actually not mind finding a couple more 1545s with or without wedges, as they seem to be pretty well made. The only major design flaw I've found with the 1545 is the mounting of the red laser filter, which is stuck in place with a small square of plastic with self stick adhesive. Intermec has had a lot of problems with those falling off and the filter falling out of place. -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Mon Sep 1 04:29:00 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: anyone have a working Apple 40 meg tape drive? In-Reply-To: <200308302056.h7UKunlM010084@spies.com> References: <200308302056.h7UKunlM010084@spies.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 30 Aug 2003, Al Kossow wrote: > I think I've come up with something that will work. > The outer and inner cross section of the roller is .7" and > .5" so I dug around at Weird Stuff to see if any old DC2000 > drives were close. The Colorado 250 appears to be, and with > a bit of work with a small flat blade screwdriver I was able > to remove the rubber from the .5" shaft. Now, I need to clean > the goo out of one of the MCD-40 mechanisms and try it. > > This may be a workaround for the HP's as well. If someone has > a caliper handy, I'm curious what the cross sections are for > the roller in that. Nearly all of the DC2000 type Colorado drives use the same roller, and they are pretty common. Didn't someone on the list find a type of hose that worked to replace some of these rollers? All of the Wangtek drives for my systems have had their rollers turn into that goo mess. -Toth From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Mon Sep 1 05:41:00 2003 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: WTD: 74S188 PROMs or MFM data separator Message-ID: <09e3112b4c.philpem@dsl.pipex.com> Hi, I'm trying to build a data separator for a floppy disc controller board. The board uses a NEC 765 (aka uPD765) controller. I've found a schematic for a ZX Spectrum +2A FDC at http://simandl.jinak.cz/stranky/zxs/zxs_a.htm - this seems OK, except it uses a 74S188 fuse PROM as part of the data separator state machine. Does anyone have any spare 74S188s in their junkbox that they could be persuaded to part with? I'm also interested in the format the data separator supports - I can't tell from the state data if the state machine runs in FM or MFM mode. If it's FM, does anyone have a schematic for an MFM data separator that uses fairly standard (i.e. 74LS, 40xx, etc) ICs? Thanks. -- Phil. | Acorn Risc PC600 Mk3, SA202, 64MB, 6GB, philpem@dsl.pipex.com | ViewFinder, Ethernet (Acorn AEH62), http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ | 8xCD, framegrabber, Teletext "High voltage. Yeah, right. I can hold this 20kV wire with my fingers... YEAARGH!" *thud* From ceby2 at csc.com Mon Sep 1 08:58:00 2003 From: ceby2 at csc.com (Colin Eby) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: AS/400 1991 9404 Message-ID: Folks -- I just wanted to take an opportunity to thank Sellam and Walter for the AS/400. Walter help me load the beast up, along with not one but three versions of the complete manual set. My back is much better now, if anyone asks. The system is home, and ticking over nicely. I've spent the balance of the weekend toying with it. I'd especially like to thank the guys for the opportunity at an IBM 5364. Walter had this sitting in the back of his basement and mentioned it while packing up manuals. I've had my eye out for such a critter for about two years. I haven't got a PC set up as a controller yet, but I'm very keen to take a crack at it. As always, I can offer myself as at least a physical resource for the S/36 gear, and now a bit of the OS/400. Anyone interested in a surplus set of manuals (and possessed of a strong back) reply quick. The surplus will be dutifully recycled. That should give you DEC geeks a warm and fuzzy since most of it will be reincarnated as toilet paper, I'm sure. Thanks again, Colin ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 12:06:33 -0400 From: W. E. Perry To: donate@vintage.org Subject: AS/400 1991 9404 I have a 1991 vintage AS/400 9404, located in New Jersey, with original QIC120 distribution of system software through 1993 OS/400 v3 and *ALL* manuals. In storage since 1995, but working then. Would you want this machine or could you point me to someone who might? Thank you. Walter Perry From jhfinexgs2 at compsys.to Mon Sep 1 09:00:13 2003 From: jhfinexgs2 at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: EBAY fraud alert References: <200308292309.h7TN9c2r017940@onyx.spiritone.com> Message-ID: <3F534EC5.4DCB350F@compsys.to> >"Zane H. Healy" wrote: > > This is a rather common scam that has been going on for about a year or > > so. It has spread to PayPal, and is one of the rationalizations that > > ebay is using to force all users to change from email address IDs to an > > alias. If Ebay is doing anything about these scams, they are keeping it > > a secret. > eBay is forcing users to change from an email address to an alias? This is > the first I've heard about it. I know they won't let you get a new account > and use your email address as they want to control peoples ability to reach > you. I've not seen anything that says that I have to change mine to an > alias. Personally I like that people are able to easily find my email > address on eBay. Jerome Fine replies: I have a comment and a question! I have an OLD e-mail address from an ISP that I cancelled 2 years ago. It still seems to be active since I can send an e-mail to the address: Jerome Fine and it does not get rejected. I used that e-mail address with eBay when I first signed up with eBay to request information and send in bids. Of course, I can't pick up any e-mails that eBay sends, let alone the 30 spam a day that I was receiving at the end, but my old e-mail address still seems to be acting as a bit bucket since I just sent a test message to it. AND as far as eBay is concerned, my user id is still and I can still ask a question of a vendor by supplying: user id: jhfine@idirect.com password: xxxxxx so, it must all still be working as far as eBay is concerned and eBay still accepts and allows an OLD user ID with an @ character. Question: As far as the OLD ISP is concerned, is there any way that a user can at least pick up e-mails that are still sent to that old address as long as the ISP is still accepting them? Question: Is there anything as far as practice goes on the internet that requires an ISP who accepts an e-mail (i.e. without rejecting it) to at least forward that e-mail to the old original person even if that person no longer has a paid for account? Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From at258 at osfn.org Mon Sep 1 09:05:00 2003 From: at258 at osfn.org (Merle K. Peirce) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: AS/400 1991 9404 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Did yopu ever find a home for your 5360, Colin? On Mon, 1 Sep 2003, Colin Eby wrote: > Folks -- > > I just wanted to take an opportunity to thank Sellam and Walter for the > AS/400. Walter help me load the beast up, along with not one but three > versions of the complete manual set. My back is much better now, if anyone > asks. The system is home, and ticking over nicely. I've spent the balance > of the weekend toying with it. I'd especially like to thank the guys for > the opportunity at an IBM 5364. Walter had this sitting in the back of his > basement and mentioned it while packing up manuals. I've had my eye out for > such a critter for about two years. I haven't got a PC set up as a > controller yet, but I'm very keen to take a crack at it. As always, I can > offer myself as at least a physical resource for the S/36 gear, and now a > bit of the OS/400. Anyone interested in a surplus set of manuals (and > possessed of a strong back) reply quick. The surplus will be dutifully > recycled. That should give you DEC geeks a warm and fuzzy since most of it > will be reincarnated as toilet paper, I'm sure. > > Thanks again, > Colin > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 12:06:33 -0400 > From: W. E. Perry > To: donate@vintage.org > Subject: AS/400 1991 9404 > > I have a 1991 vintage AS/400 9404, located in New Jersey, with original > QIC120 distribution of system software through 1993 OS/400 v3 and *ALL* > manuals. In storage since 1995, but working then. Would you want this > machine or could you point me to someone who might? > > Thank you. > > Walter Perry > M. K. Peirce Rhode Island Computer Museum, Inc. Shady Lea, Rhode Island "Casta est quam nemo rogavit." - Ovid From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Mon Sep 1 12:27:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030901131835.00a76180@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Hello Sellam, > Actually, it's shaped like a long cat. Ahh. I see that now. Thanks. Best Regards At 11:09 PM 8/31/03 -0700, you wrote: >On Mon, 1 Sep 2003, Mail List wrote: > > > > But they're still pretty goofy looking. > > > > Like a mouse, shaped very much like a real animal mouse. > >Actually, it's shaped like a long cat. > >-- > >Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival >------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > >[ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] >[ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at >http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From patrick at evocative.com Mon Sep 1 13:24:00 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Heathkit H89 Video Question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > >From the schematic, the CRT filament runs off the flyback (2 brown > wires), so it's not suprising it goes out when the horizontal output > stage fails. > > I also assume that the +53V supply (emitter of Q204) is fine when the > thing fails. Yes, no problem there. > > > After tracing the (good) horizontal output signal from the > terminal logic > > > board into various part of the video board, and checking > voltages where I > > > felt I could reach safely in a hot set, I discovered that if I shot > > > horizontal output transistor Q217 with cold spray I'd get > video back right > > > away. > > One problem -- on my schematic the HOT is Q214. There is no Q217. I'll bet the schematic you are looking at it is for a later reduced-emission version. I don't have that schematic, but the one I do have matches the machine I'm working on... an upgraded H88. > > 2) The load is too heavy. This could be the flyback (but I > doubt it -- a > > shorted turn in the flyback is going to have more serious effects that > > this), it could be something powered from the flyback (again unlikely) Again, I have very little experience in this area, but given the voltages and general temperment of the circuit, it didn't seem likely to me that flyback failure would normally be this subtle. > Check the diodes (D207-D211) on the output side of the flyback, and the > associated caps. Will do... > > 3) The drive waveform is wrong. I don't have the H89 schematics > to hand, > > but there's often a low-value electrolytic capacitor (a few uF) in the > > There is,. It's C226 (10uf) on my schematic. Also check R254 (1.2R), R255 > (100R) and L202 (a small coil). I don't have my schematic at hand at this moment, but those are all familiar parts/values... If the drive waveform was disrupted, are there any other symptoms typical? When the display is operating, it appears pretty much perfect, until just a few seconds before the HOT shuts down. Thanks for the tips... I have enough spare parts that I could just send the whole video section to the graveyard, but it seems a minor problem and a good education to figure it out and fix it. I appreciate the elp. --Patrick From aek at spies.com Mon Sep 1 14:08:00 2003 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Apple 40SC tape details Message-ID: <200309011901.h81J13a8006220@spies.com> I was able to read a tape this morning, after pulling the drive apart and making sure every last trace of the old pinch roller was cleaned from the shaft. The motor runs HOT (which explains why the old rubber which was already soft liquified) and any little bit left will contaminate the cartridge. It is also souluble in isopropyl alcohol.. So be careful if you try to clean a tape head with a surviving (unlikely..) roller. It is a block-addessed device (like DECtape II's). So that it is saved somewhere, here are the specs: 3M MCD-40 rev 4.0 firmware (Apple Tape 40SC) 4848 blocks 8192 bytes/block (39714816 bytes total) The drive always retensions when you put in a tape. It will then do the usual tape head positioning, pause, then do one last read before extinguishing the red light. If the light flashes, tape loading failed. I've put some emails out to people I know who might have the actual specs/pgmg info, but I'm doubtful that they saved it. From luc at e2t.be Mon Sep 1 14:29:00 2003 From: luc at e2t.be (Luc Vande Velde) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Digital DSM Disribution tape In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720E7A08@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD69A@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Someone asked a few weeks ago for a copy of the DSM distribution tape.(9track 1600bpi) I found it back this afternoon (by accident in a search for some other old stuff) To make it clear - this is the native version of DSM (Digital Standard Mumps) version 3.3 and it runs only on PDP11 not on vax or other PDP's Min. machine on UNIBUS = 11/40 on QBUS = 11/23 If someone can tell me how to make it available I have my ears wide open; or if someone is willing to do that's even better gr. Luc From spedraja at ono.com Mon Sep 1 14:45:01 2003 From: spedraja at ono.com (SP) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Digital DSM Disribution tape References: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD69A@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <00c801c370bf$bfe18c00$0d02a8c0@cavorita.net> The way would be to do one copy of the tape contents in one virtual tape available to use with one of the PDP11 simulators availables. I use SIMH and I should like to manage DSM some time :-) Cheers Sergio ----- Original Message ----- From: "Luc Vande Velde" To: Sent: Monday, September 01, 2003 9:21 PM Subject: Digital DSM Disribution tape > Someone asked a few weeks ago for a copy of the DSM distribution > tape.(9track 1600bpi) > I found it back this afternoon (by accident in a search for some other old > stuff) > To make it clear - this is the native version of DSM (Digital Standard > Mumps) version 3.3 > and it runs only on PDP11 not on vax or other PDP's > Min. machine on UNIBUS = 11/40 on QBUS = 11/23 > If someone can tell me how to make it available I have my ears wide open; or > if someone is willing to do that's even better > > gr. > > Luc From luc at e2t.be Mon Sep 1 15:07:00 2003 From: luc at e2t.be (Luc Vande Velde) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Digital DSM Disribution tape In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720E7A0C@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD69B@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Can you tell me a bit more about this virtual tape creation? I have a few PDP11's working but they all run DSM It's the only Digital operating system I know - I never used RSX RT11 and so... I also have a 9track tapecontroller for pc and a Kennedy 9600 drive on it but this was used on MSM (the pc version of DSM made by Micronetics)and they controlled the drive direct without os intervention. Luc -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]Namens SP Verzonden: maandag 1 september 2003 21:32 Aan: cctalk@classiccmp.org Onderwerp: Re: Digital DSM Disribution tape The way would be to do one copy of the tape contents in one virtual tape available to use with one of the PDP11 simulators availables. I use SIMH and I should like to manage DSM some time :-) Cheers Sergio From kth at srv.net Mon Sep 1 16:05:00 2003 From: kth at srv.net (Kevin Handy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: <200308312316.57677.jcwren@jcwren.com> References: <3F52A8D4.1050008@cox.net> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <200308312316.57677.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: <3F53BD70.5040200@srv.net> J.C. Wren wrote: > Yea, that's the basic summary. The bitch was each CueCat had a unique ID, so >when you scanned a product, they'd note that. If the UPC of the product >wasn't one they knew about, you could enter the information. The whole >"payback" of the CueCat was that they'd build this database of customers and >products they were interested in, and do targetted marketing. And the whole >point of their baseless lawsuit was that people who were using the CueCat for >other than they intended were "depriving them of revenue". Of course, since >they *gave* the thing away, that case was uninforceable. Particularly since >they were sent unsolicted through the mail. > > They were kind of slick engineering in some respects. Wel built, very low >cost, and as I recall, they had a pretty good scan rate of success. The mods >in the 'net show how to read the scanned codes out (I think you had to XOR >everything with the unit ID, and delete some headers and trailers), and how >to defeat the ID part in the unit. But they're still pretty goofy looking. > > There is a mod available for many version of the cuecat that causes it to output decoded barcode information (no serial number, no encryption). It involves adding one jumper. > I had about 50 that I had acquired by asking for several ("me and my friends >need one") everytime I went to Tech America or Radio Shack. I eventually did >nothing with them, and gave them all to a friend of mine. From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 1 16:09:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Heathkit H89 Video Question In-Reply-To: from "Patrick Rigney" at Sep 1, 3 11:16:40 am Message-ID: > > >From the schematic, the CRT filament runs off the flyback (2 brown > > wires), so it's not suprising it goes out when the horizontal output > > stage fails. > > > > I also assume that the +53V supply (emitter of Q204) is fine when the > > thing fails. > > Yes, no problem there. Good... As I said, 'alwyas check the power supplies' :-) > > One problem -- on my schematic the HOT is Q214. There is no Q217. > > I'll bet the schematic you are looking at it is for a later reduced-emission > version. I don't have that schematic, but the one I do have matches the > machine I'm working on... an upgraded H88. Quite possibly. It's the schematic that came with my Z90 (which has always AFAIK been a Z90, it wasn't upgraded from anything), and it matches the machine I have. > > > 3) The drive waveform is wrong. I don't have the H89 schematics > > to hand, > > > but there's often a low-value electrolytic capacitor (a few uF) in the > > > > There is,. It's C226 (10uf) on my schematic. Also check R254 (1.2R), R255 > > (100R) and L202 (a small coil). > > I don't have my schematic at hand at this moment, but those are all familiar > parts/values... If the drive waveform was disrupted, are there any other The component references are probably different. Look at the base circuit of the HOT. Typically you'll find it's driven by the secondary of a small transformer (the horizontal drive transformer) with some R's and C's around. It's those you need to check. > symptoms typical? When the display is operating, it appears pretty much > perfect, until just a few seconds before the HOT shuts down. Electtolyic caps can do some very strange things!. The capacitor may be OK when cold, and then fail when it warms up.... > > Thanks for the tips... I have enough spare parts that I could just send the > whole video section to the graveyard, but it seems a minor problem and a > good education to figure it out and fix it. I appreciate the > elp. --Patrick What's the fun in board swapping :-) -tony From donm at cts.com Mon Sep 1 18:07:00 2003 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: <20030831221303.J80015@newshell.lmi.net> Message-ID: On Sun, 31 Aug 2003, Fred Cisin wrote: > > > > That darn Radio Shack. You can't even go in there and buy a battery without > > > > going through their interrogation process. I got to the point that when > > > > they asked > > > > me for my first name, I said Johnny, and when they asked me for my last name, > > > > I said Cash. Johnny Cash. Now do you want to sell the GD battery or what? > > > When they ask for your address, recite the address of the store that you > > > are in. See how many of the clerks will notice. > > On Sun, 31 Aug 2003, Don Maslin wrote: > > They seem to have stopped asking for that information in the > > stores that I visit here. > > ... because they now know their own address? > No, they just don't ask for any address, Fred. - don From gtoal at gtoal.com Mon Sep 1 18:10:00 2003 From: gtoal at gtoal.com (Graham Toal) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: BBC Micro 6809 2nd proc Message-ID: <200309012303.h81N3OWO028056@gtoal.com> I mentioned some time ago that I'd once built a second processor for the BBC micro using a 6809. I found it again recently and here's a photo... http://www.gtoal.com/tmp/CNXT0053.JPG You can see the Tube (furthest), CPU (next to it), boot rom (left of the CPU), 64K DRAM, and two custom chips; one is an 8-bit counter for dynamic ram refresh, and a PLA for address decoding. I forget what the other small TTL chip did; it may have been a couple of inverters to create a signal delay? I found this today which I think is the logic table for the dynamic refresh and address decode PLA: { Ras' = (Eclk + Qclk)' RomCS = A15.A14.A13.A12.A11.A10 TubeCS = A15.A14.A13.A12.A11.A10' Cas = Q.(RomCS' + TubeCS')' Count' = Q.(RomCS' + TubeCS') TW' = E' + R/NW TR' = E' + R/NW' } IN A10, A11, A12, A13, A14, A15, Eclk, Qclk, R/W' X X X X X X X X 1 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 X X X X X X X X 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 X X X X X X 0 X X 0 0 1 1 0 0 0 X X X X X X 0 X 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 X 1 1 1 1 1 X 1 X 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 X X X X X X 0 0 X 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 1 1 1 1 X X X 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 1 1 1 1 1 X X X 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 X X X X X 0 X 1 X 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 X X X X 0 X X 1 X 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 X X X 0 X X X 1 X 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 X X 0 X X X X 1 X 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 X 0 X X X X X 1 X 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 OUT Count', RAS', TW', TR', TubeCS, RomCS, CAS { Ras' use as is. Cas invert with 30ns <= delay <= 60ns RomCS invert TubeCS invert Count' feed directly into counter, counter clocks on falling edge TR' use as is TW' use as is } I also found an HP Plotfile which *may* be the layout of this chip that I'd love to see again - if anyone has a utility to convert HP plotter codes into something more readable that they could run this through in a few minutes (don't put a lot of effort into it, I can write my own utility if I need to) I'ld love to see what it looks like again...: http://www.gtoal.com/tmp/plotfile.txt The chip was laid out in my own layout language called the "Tiled Orthogonal Abutment Language" ;-) - it was basically a crude tiling system with no overlap, pretty much like the way the very first release of M$ Windows worked: http://www.gtoal.com/tmp/megaroute.toal The two empty sockets originally contained 2 32K static rams with battery-backup built-in, instead of the 64K SIL, eprom, and counter. Unfortunately you had to pre-load it with boot rom contents on another system then transfer the ram without the battery falling off :-) (glued on, kinda hacky!) I prototyped it with the static ram and then got it working with dynamic ram when the chips were returned from fab. The custom chips weren't strictly necessary; I was working in the VLSI CAD group and they needed some test chips when trialling a new production line, so all the programmers got the chance to design a chip if they wanted to. I took the chance to do these for the 6809 as I'ld always liked that CPU in preference to the 6502 in the BBC systems. I think if I had needed to I could have used off the shelf chips that would have done the same job. Anyway it was a nice small & cheap system to build in either incarnation; I was disappointed that Acorn didn't pick it up. (The primary reason being that Roger was a speed freak and that the 6809 was obviously not going to be pushed as far as the 6502 was being improved) I also wrote a compiler for it because I had no luck at all getting the only company I could find that wrote a C compiler (Introl) to reply to my letters (http://www.gtoal.com/athome/tmp/c.letter) asking about the possibility of bundling it with our processor, although they were quick enough to send brochures for sales of a single unit when they thought I was an end-user at first. My compiler is here if you're interested; it was no great shakes but it worked for me... http://www.gtoal.com/athome/edinburgh/skimp/skimp-6809/ - and as a result of the Edinburgh history project resurrecting Imp, I've been able to get it running again, with the intention of perhaps writing some Vectrex games with it... (You can see the output of the compiler in this article: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/compilers101/message/187 ) An early (unfinished) source of my boot rom (I lost the final one) is here: http://www.gtoal.com/athome/tmp/kernel.txt - I guess the final working binary is still in the eprom - it does still boot up! Graham From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 1 18:40:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: BBC Micro 6809 2nd proc In-Reply-To: <200309012303.h81N3OWO028056@gtoal.com> from "Graham Toal" at Sep 1, 3 06:03:24 pm Message-ID: > I mentioned some time ago that I'd once built a second processor for > the BBC micro using a 6809. Interesting... [...] > I also found an HP Plotfile which *may* be the layout of this > chip that I'd love to see again - if anyone has a utility to I assume that's HPGL of some flavour > convert HP plotter codes into something more readable that they > could run this through in a few minutes (don't put a lot of > effort into it, I can write my own utility if I need to) I'ld > love to see what it looks like again...: http://www.gtoal.com/tmp/plotfile.txt Do a search for hp2xx. I found this about 6 years ago somewhere on the net, it would translate HPGL into a number of formats, including .eps . I assume it's still around somewhere, probably updated by now. It would only handle a small-ish subset of HPGL, but it managed to translate the output of EASY-PC (a cheap PCB layout program) into .eps so I could include it in my LaTeX documents. -tony From zmerch at 30below.com Mon Sep 1 18:50:00 2003 From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: EBAY fraud alert In-Reply-To: <3F534EC5.4DCB350F@compsys.to> References: <200308292309.h7TN9c2r017940@onyx.spiritone.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030901192554.00ab2c98@mail.30below.com> At 09:51 09/01/2003 -0400, you wrote: [snip] >Jerome Fine replies: > >I have a comment and a question! [snip] >Question: As far as the OLD ISP is concerned, is there any way that >a user can at least pick up e-mails that are still sent to that old address >as long as the ISP is still accepting them? Short Answer: Maybe. Long Answer: Depends on a *lot* of stuff, like: what MTA (Mail Transport Agent - a.k.a. mail server software) they're using, if they're actually queueing the incoming mail, etc... Many mail server programs can be instructed to accept mail, then silently drop it into the bit-bucket - if that's the case, then if you were to contact your old ISP, it may be able to have it forwarded to your new account instead of just dropping it - it's trivial in qmail (what I've used for almost a decade). Other MTAs can [probably] do it as well, but I'm only versed in qmail... If you do contact your ISP, you may have to pay a monthly charge to keep the email address functional - at Iceberg Computers, it's $5USD/month to keep an email address w/storage. Each ISP will have their own rules & rates, tho. >Question: Is there anything as far as practice goes on the internet that >requires an ISP who accepts an e-mail (i.e. without rejecting it) to at >least forward that e-mail to the old original person even if that person >no longer has a paid for account? IANAL, but in my experience, no. As email is not considered a "private" form of communication [which is 1 reason of many why all those damnable legal disclaimers are 1) useless, and 2) stupid] so if you abandon your account, AFAIK the data therein is now the property of the ISP. And -- the ISP *may* have good reason to keep the account open - many, many people abandon email accounts due to spam, and many ISPs will route the incoming mail from that abandoned account directly into their spamfilters -- I was looking at doing this myself, but there were too many false positives. Some ISPs don't care about false positives to the same level as me, however. :-( To know for sure, you will want to contact your old ISP, and ask them -- make sure you get past the countermonkeys, tho, and talk right with the sysadmin who [hopefully] should have a clue... HTH, Roger "Merch" Merchberger From coredump at gifford.co.uk Mon Sep 1 18:59:00 2003 From: coredump at gifford.co.uk (John Honniball) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: BBC Micro 6809 2nd proc In-Reply-To: <200309012303.h81N3OWO028056@gtoal.com> References: <200309012303.h81N3OWO028056@gtoal.com> Message-ID: <3F53DBAA.4060702@gifford.co.uk> Graham Toal wrote: > I also found an HP Plotfile which *may* be the layout of this > chip that I'd love to see again - if anyone has a utility to > convert HP plotter codes into something more readable that they > could run this through in a few minutes (don't put a lot of > effort into it, I can write my own utility if I need to) I'ld > love to see what it looks like again...: http://www.gtoal.com/tmp/plotfile.txt Some versions of Paint Shop Pro can read HPGL files (I think you must rename them to a '.hgl' extension). The software creates a bitmap and draws the HPGL graphics into it. I think you can scale it all up to get less pixellation, and with a careful choice of scale and printer resolution, it works quite well. -- John Honniball coredump@gifford.co.uk From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Mon Sep 1 19:59:00 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: 7 track tape drives Message-ID: <030901205004.aa7a@splab.cas.neu.edu> Well, I went through the hardware I have at home and here is the list. Most of the stuff hasn't been turned on for over 10 years, probably more like 15. It has been in my workshop/basement, so it is pretty dry. The list of manuals will come later. The list of tape drives at work will come after that, but those (I think) are all 9 track, as are most of these. Anyway, here is the list of drives/controllers/formatters. Kennedy 9220 (192-9220-066) two cables, and a Kennedy 5427 mounted on the back. Formatter maybe. Cipher F880 1600/3200 BPI, 100/50/25 IPS IDT (Innovative Data Technology) TD11051, 800/1600 BPI, 45 IPS, 3 connectors, read, write, motion, 36 pin edge connectors, and a cable from (THIS) drive? bringing all 3 connectors into a single 50 pin edge higher densidy connector. Kennedy 9000 (192-9000-019) 9 track 800/1600 BPI, 37.5 IPS Cipher 910640 800/1600 BPI, 75 IPS 2 Emulex TC01/TU01 board pairs, QBUS 1 Emulex TC02 Formatters?: Pertec F6181-1/0085 Formatter, 2 boards, NRZI Read/Write, PE Read Datum 10341 Q/HP (Kennedy 120-0025-01) controller Datum Formatter 5091-120 Pertec f84942(0)/13.9, 901006-01 with R/W 7/9 NRZI Prime formatter 3101-0001 (Kennedy 9219-509), 3 boards inside As I said, I have been holding on to this stuff so I could someday set up a system to read the 15 or 20 tapes I have. All RT-11 or VMS, with a couple off an RSX-11 system. If there is something here that could help out with somebodys project, I would be glad to lend it out, or even give it away, just as long as it either makes it back so I can eventually read my tapes, or if somebody wants to read the tapes they can have all/any of the tape drive hardware. The list of manuals for the formatters/drives will be along shortly. Regards, Joe Heck From aek at spies.com Mon Sep 1 20:11:01 2003 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: 7 track tape drives Message-ID: <200309020103.h8213gl8014862@spies.com> > I have been holding on to this stuff so I could someday set > up a system to read the 15 or 20 tapes I have. I'd be happy to read the tapes for you. If possible, I'd like to borrow any Pertec formatter manuals that you have to add to the www.spies.com/aek/pdf/pertec archive. d From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Mon Sep 1 20:44:00 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: 7 track tape drives Message-ID: <030901213423.aa86@splab.cas.neu.edu> Well, here is the list of manuals for tape drives and formatters. I have a couple of controller manuals at work (emulex/dilog qbus ) And yes, Al, you can borrow any of the manuals to make an archive. I'll let you know exactly what I have for tapes to read in the next week or so. Thanks. Cipher Technical Manual 799816-004, rev c. M890 Cachetape Unit Volume 1, operation and Maintenance, jan 1984. Cipher technical manual 799816-003 revision g Model F880 Magnetic tape transport volume 1 operation maintenance, August 1983 Digi-Data Microprocessor-controlled Formatter operation Manual, 0552580-0000 1980 Digi-data D.M.A magnetic tape interface for PDP-11 operation and maintenance manual, 0552521-0000, 1980 (UCI, Unibus compatible interface.) Digi-data Syncronous transport operation and maintenance manual, model 1140, 1640, 1740 and 1840, 0552457-0000 3/81, 40 series magnetic tape transport. Same as previous, but from 8/80. Pertec Phase encoded formatter, model f6x9, manual 101399, specifically model f649-40, copyright 1971. Kennedy model 9100 Digital tape transport operation and maintenance manual, July 1987, 93-09100-999, for model 9100, part 192-9100-081, std interface, 75 ips, 800/1600 cpi 9 trk. Pertec, Models t6x40 and t6x60 syncronous write, syncronous read tape transports, operating and service manual 100884, for model t6840-9, copyright 1978. Pertec, looks like the same as above, different transport serial number. Datum, peripheral equipment division, model 5091 nrzi formatter, instruction manual 1800.6, series 5091 magnetic tape formatter systems,around 1976 Datum, peripheral equpment division, model 5091 1600PE formatter, instruction manual, publication 1803.8, series 5091 magnetic tape formatter systems, also about 1976 Wangco MOD 11 NRZI moagnetic tape transport operation and maintenance manual 201086 E, october 1974. Wangco MOD 10 magnetic tape transport operation and maintenance manual 200237, June 1972 same as the MOD 10, but December 1973, labeled on the outside MOD 10A, but cover sheet says MOD 10. Wangco MOD 10 PE or MOD 10 PE/NRZI magnetic tape transport operation and maintenance manual, 200951, May 1974, but inside it says Perkin-Elmer MOD 10 magnetic tape transport, PE and PE/NRZI, 200951-001 Wangco MOD 10PE or MOD 10 PE/NRZI operation and maintenance manual, 200951K, February 1976 That's all for now. Regards, Joe Heck From bob at jfcl.com Mon Sep 1 23:23:00 2003 From: bob at jfcl.com (Bob Armstrong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Heathkit H-11 Manuals Needed Message-ID: <03090121141060@jfcl.com> Has anyone scanned the manual for the H-11, HT-11, et al? I'd appreciate a pointer if someone has. Thanks, Bob Armstrong From jpl15 at panix.com Tue Sep 2 00:00:00 2003 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: 7 track tape drives In-Reply-To: <030901213423.aa86@splab.cas.neu.edu> References: <030901213423.aa86@splab.cas.neu.edu> Message-ID: On Mon, 1 Sep 2003 TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu wrote: > Well, here is the list of manuals for tape drives and formatters. I have > a couple of controller manuals at work (emulex/dilog qbus ) [snippage] > > Kennedy model 9100 Digital tape transport operation and maintenance manual, > July 1987, 93-09100-999, for model 9100, part 192-9100-081, std interface, > 75 ips, 800/1600 cpi 9 trk. I have three of these beasts to maintain - one on my 11/44 system, two for 'partz'. I'd love to have the manual.. I can copy/return, or copy forward to archivist... Lemme know the price and I'll pay the Shippin'. Cheers to the List and Thanks to you for offering this Stuff to us! John From healyzh at aracnet.com Tue Sep 2 02:19:00 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: OT: Shipping from England Message-ID: Out of curiosity, does anyone happen to have any idea just how much it would cost to ship a 12 Volume Encyclopedia set from England to the West Coast? Zane P.S. Yes, I'm seriously thinking of getting a set of Encyclopedia's from England. -- -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From luc at e2t.be Tue Sep 2 02:23:00 2003 From: luc at e2t.be (Luc Vande Velde) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: UNIX on pdp11 (was Digital DSM Disribution tape) In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720E7A0C@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD69C@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> As I picked up from the reactions it would be best to put a PDP11 on-line with UNIX on his disks to make usable images of the tape Are there somewhere on the web unix distributions for PDP11? And how do I get it on a tape? Luc -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]Namens SP Verzonden: maandag 1 september 2003 21:32 Aan: cctalk@classiccmp.org Onderwerp: Re: Digital DSM Disribution tape The way would be to do one copy of the tape contents in one virtual tape available to use with one of the PDP11 simulators availables. I use SIMH and I should like to manage DSM some time :-) Cheers Sergio ----- Original Message ----- From: "Luc Vande Velde" To: Sent: Monday, September 01, 2003 9:21 PM Subject: Digital DSM Disribution tape > Someone asked a few weeks ago for a copy of the DSM distribution > tape.(9track 1600bpi) > I found it back this afternoon (by accident in a search for some other old > stuff) > To make it clear - this is the native version of DSM (Digital Standard > Mumps) version 3.3 > and it runs only on PDP11 not on vax or other PDP's > Min. machine on UNIBUS = 11/40 on QBUS = 11/23 > If someone can tell me how to make it available I have my ears wide open; or > if someone is willing to do that's even better > > gr. > > Luc From arcarlini at iee.org Tue Sep 2 02:54:00 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Shipping from England In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000401c37126$64137ac0$5b01a8c0@athlon> > Out of curiosity, does anyone happen to have any idea just > how much it would cost to ship a 12 Volume Encyclopedia set > from England to the West Coast? See if you have better luck with the ParcelForce website than I did: http://www.royalmail.com. You'll have to supply it with some info like weight and size. Guessing for these I ended up with something like ?40 ($60) but it's easy to drive this up or down, try airmail if you need a shock :-) > P.S. Yes, I'm seriously thinking of getting a set of > Encyclopedia's from England. Out of interest - a set of Encyclopedia's what exactly :-) -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de Tue Sep 2 04:09:00 2003 From: jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de (Jochen Kunz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: UNIX on pdp11 (was Digital DSM Disribution tape) In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD69C@e2t_server_3.e2t.be>; from luc@e2t.be on Tue, Sep 02, 2003 at 09:15:21 CEST References: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720E7A0C@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD69C@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <20030902094936.M518055@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> On 2003.09.02 09:15 Luc Vande Velde wrote: > As I picked up from the reactions it would be best to put a PDP11 > on-line with UNIX on his disks to make usable images of the tape > Are there somewhere on the web unix distributions for PDP11? http://www.pups.org/ or http://www.tuhs.org/ > And how do I get it on a tape? There is a programm called "maketape" in the 2.11BSD distribution. I used it with great success to write PDP-11 and VAX BSD tapes. Of corse this requires that you have a machine with a suitable tape drive, *IX like OS (for maketape) and network (to get the distfiles onto it) at hand. I created my 2.11BSD tapes on the QBus PDP-11 machine. I replaced PDP-11 CPU and RAM with VAX CPU and RAM, netbooted NetBSD, wrote the tapes, remounted the PDP-11 CPU and RAM and started the installation. -- tsch??, Jochen Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/ From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 2 06:02:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Digital DSM Disribution tape In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD69A@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: On Mon, 1 Sep 2003, Luc Vande Velde wrote: > Someone asked a few weeks ago for a copy of the DSM distribution > tape.(9track 1600bpi) Yes, that was Sergio and me. > If someone can tell me how to make it available I have my ears > wide open; or if someone is willing to do that's even better I already offered to come pick it up, image it, and put it online for those who want it... :) Cheers, Fred From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 2 06:04:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: UNIX on pdp11 (was Digital DSM Disribution tape) In-Reply-To: <20030902094936.M518055@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Sep 2003, Jochen Kunz wrote: > > And how do I get it on a tape? > There is a programm called "maketape" in the 2.11BSD distribution. I > used it with great success to write PDP-11 and VAX BSD tapes. Of corse > this requires that you have a machine with a suitable tape drive, *IX > like OS (for maketape) and network (to get the distfiles onto it) at > hand. I created my 2.11BSD tapes on the QBus PDP-11 machine. I replaced > PDP-11 CPU and RAM with VAX CPU and RAM, netbooted NetBSD, wrote the > tapes, remounted the PDP-11 CPU and RAM and started the installation. Just another plug: I have (so far) archived about 900 tapes (TK50,TK70 and magtapes) into TDF file format, which is basically a superset of the wellknown E11/SimH "tap" format supporting tape label info (what was written on the paper labels), block and file CRC checking, and compression. It takes E11 about a minute to fully install an ULTRIX-11 V3.2 tape this way ;-) Cheers, Fred From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 2 07:38:01 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: (SUMMARY) barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: <004e01c36f7d$7bd11140$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: All, Many replied that with the wedge given, the scanner I have will just "type in" the scanned code through the keyboard port. The LL-425 controller can be programmed (by scanning barcodes ;-) to a variety of wedges and systems - I reset it to IBMPC PS/2. This helped some, but not much. The scanner still made my PC (a laptop) go nuts. Thanks to a local friend, who mentioned that most laptops have a detection system on the (single) PS/2 port, to see whether the user connected a mouse or a keyboard to it. It defaults to a mouse, so, if a keyboard doesnt ID itself, it will assume a mouse. Guess what? The scanner doesn't ID as a keyboard, so, was seen as a mouse by the lappy. Which produces, uhh, weird results ;-) I forced it into keyboard mode by connecting a PS/2 keyboard to the scanner, and indeed, it works ! Had I tested this on a regular, 2-port PC, it would have worked right away. Thanks to all who have responded! This beastie will be used to help me archive CD's and tapes on a barcode basis... much easier for the database! Cheers, Fred From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 2 07:43:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: UNIX on pdp11 (was Digital DSM Disribution tape) In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD69C@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Sep 2003, Luc Vande Velde wrote: > As I picked up from the reactions it would be best to put a PDP11 > on-line with UNIX on his disks to make usable images of the tape Yup. > Are there somewhere on the web unix distributions for PDP11? > And how do I get it on a tape? Yup, I can send or bring you 2.9BSD, 2.11BSD and/or ULTRIX-11, the latter of which I actually maintain myself ;-) --f From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 2 08:00:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: The problems of organizing a computer collection In-Reply-To: <68072E8A-DBD1-11D7-BB05-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 31 Aug 2003, Ian Primus wrote: > I have been striveing to organize both my physical and digital space as > of late, and hsve been trying to reorganize the basement. It's a war we can't win, lieutenant :) It gets worse if you assume that there are various kinds of collectors, based on how they collect. I myself like to get stuff, clean it up (yes, I have a steady supply of lab-quality alcohol, straight from the hospital lab) and restore it to its glory. And then set it up nicely, with periphs attached, networked if possible, and loaded with at least an OS. All my PDP-11's (6), VAXen (19), DECstations (8), Alphas (2), (DEC) PC's (2) and terminals/Xterminals, network gear et al are in this shape, connected, and ready to roll. [blush] Worse, they are usually always running, except for the PDP-11's, as I am wary of their power supplies blowing up on me... yes, it can be quite warm in here with all that stuff running.. [/blush] As you said... these beasties usually don't come small, nor do they come alone. We're talking manuals (my whole wall is DEC manual-covered), keyboards, mice, cables, media, the works. And that is good.. I strive to get systems as "complete" as I can possibly get them... Regarding storing cables: I did find a fix for that... On the wall in the machine room, I have a curtain slide (basically a round, .75" diameter aluminium rod) with distance brackets, at about 3.5ft from the floor, and my cables are usually draped over it.... this cleanly stores cables of up to 6 feet. There are several sections (AC, AC-UPS, UTP, UTP-X, serial, special, fiber SM, fiber MM, SCSI, DSSI, ...) which makes for an easy "grab" if I need a cable *now* (which happens quite often ;-) The (paper) manuals are all stored in regular DEC-style 3-ring binders (I found a source for these, yayy!) so this actually looks quite neat now. Media are magtapes (downstairs, in basement... still need one or two original magtape "hanging racks" ...), TK's (TK50, TK70, TK85, DLT) (neatly on shelves, soon to be barcoded) and the truckload of diskettes (diskette binder) and CD's (CDROM binder). Spare parts... one can NEVER have enough of them, and I will ALWAYS take an offer of systems, or parts of systems, or even dead systems, simply for spares. These are not quite organized yet, although I recently moved from cardboard boxes to neat PVC see-through crates which can be stacked- this already helps. Cheers, Fred From dwoyciesjes at comcast.net Tue Sep 2 08:36:00 2003 From: dwoyciesjes at comcast.net (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Alpha PC64 hardware question... References: Message-ID: <3F549AED.1644A289@comcast.net> "Steven N. Hirsch" wrote: > > On Fri, 29 Aug 2003, David Woyciesjes wrote: > > > Quick one here. I have one of those EB64/PC64 motherboards, but only a > > 200MHz CPU for it. Problem is, the board is set up for a 266MHz CPU. Has > > anybody overclocked a 200MHz CPU to 266 in one of these? With > > appropriate fans for good cooling, of course. > > Why not set the board for a 200Mhz. CPU? That's one of the documented > options. I would, except I don't have the required PLL and crystal parts for it. > > Also, these boards can run off of a regular AT style power > > supply, correct? > > I'm not so sure about that. IIRC, this thing requires more 3.3V current > capacity than an off-the-shelf power supply could muster. I've yet to see > a 'mini' (aka tower) AT supply which delivered 10A @ 3.3V. I had to buy a > special supply in order to get mine going. > > Steve Really? Well, I do have a lead on a dead system with the appropriate power supply (working) and I believe a 275 MHz chip in it. Looks like this will solve my problem properly! Woo hoo! -- --- Dave Woyciesjes --- ICQ# 905818 From jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de Tue Sep 2 11:32:00 2003 From: jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de (Jochen Kunz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Alpha PC64 hardware question... In-Reply-To: <3F549AED.1644A289@comcast.net>; from dwoyciesjes@comcast.net on Tue, Sep 02, 2003 at 15:28:13 CEST References: <3F549AED.1644A289@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20030902170035.A26874@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> On 2003.09.02 15:28 David Woyciesjes wrote: > > Why not set the board for a 200Mhz. CPU? That's one of the > > documented options. > I would, except I don't have the required PLL and crystal > parts for it. Change the PLL? PLLs are there that you don't need to change anything beside some jumpers and perhaps a crystal. On the EB164, e.g., the PLL has a fixed ratio of 1:10 so you allways need a crystal that is 1/10 of the CPU clock. The jumpers are there to set the CPU to IO clock ratio. -- tsch??, Jochen Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/ From dwoyciesjes at comcast.net Tue Sep 2 12:03:00 2003 From: dwoyciesjes at comcast.net (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Alpha PC64 hardware question... References: <3F549AED.1644A289@comcast.net> <20030902170035.A26874@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> Message-ID: <3F54CB82.79D8869A@comcast.net> Jochen Kunz wrote: > > On 2003.09.02 15:28 David Woyciesjes wrote: > > > > Why not set the board for a 200Mhz. CPU? That's one of the > > > documented options. > > I would, except I don't have the required PLL and crystal > > parts for it. > Change the PLL? PLLs are there that you don't need to change anything > beside some jumpers and perhaps a crystal. On the EB164, e.g., the PLL > has a fixed ratio of 1:10 so you allways need a crystal that is 1/10 of > the CPU clock. The jumpers are there to set the CPU to IO clock ratio. > -- Well, I may be wrong about what the parts are called, but I do need to get two parts in order to use a 200MHz CPU on the board. But since it looks like I'll be getting my hands on a 275MHz CPU, it doesn't matter now... :) -- --- Dave Woyciesjes --- ICQ# 905818 From healyzh at aracnet.com Tue Sep 2 13:24:00 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Shipping from England In-Reply-To: <000401c37126$64137ac0$5b01a8c0@athlon> References: <000401c37126$64137ac0$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: > > Out of curiosity, does anyone happen to have any idea just >> how much it would cost to ship a 12 Volume Encyclopedia set >> from England to the West Coast? > >See if you have better luck with the ParcelForce website >than I did: http://www.royalmail.com. You'll have to supply >it with some info like weight and size. Guessing for these >I ended up with something like ?40 ($60) but it's easy to >drive this up or down, try airmail if you need a shock :-) Thanks for the info! The non-airmail is enough of a shock. The set weighs in at about 15Kg, so I listed it as 18Kg to allow for error and packaging. I came up with about ?80 shipping on something that's currently at ?31 on eBay. Somehow I just don't think I'll bother bidding on this as I don't think I want to pay to ship it :^/ > > P.S. Yes, I'm seriously thinking of getting a set of >> Encyclopedia's from England. > >Out of interest - a set of Encyclopedia's what exactly :-) "National Encyclopedia 12 Vols 1870's" http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3546724019&category=1108&rd=1 I'm looking for 2-3 old (1870's to 1930's timeframe) Encyclopedia's for a couple of writing projects. I probably should be smart and see what all is available in this area. OK, I just realized something, it should be 13 volumes, and it's missing one volume. I *definitely* won't be bidding on it. Zane -- -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Sep 2 14:07:01 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Cool finds! Mutltibus weather computer Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030901191205.007b4100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Went out this past weekend and found several interesting items. The weirdest is a Kavouras Triton SX computer built by Kavouras in Minneapolis. This thing is a Multibus computer and has a bunch of ports on the back, including a lot of video, sync and color ports. Also ports for terminal, MODEM, tablet, control and Doppler! I searched the net and the only thing that I could find out about Kavouras was that they deal with weather forecasting and broadcasting. Finally found this link, , and realized that what I have is probably a computer used to generate graphics for weather forecasting. Neat! Probably too unique just to scrap for parts. Anyone interested in it? I'll swap for something useful/interesting or sell it for a few bucks. Has a hard drive and floppy drive in it. It looks complete but some of the cables have been unplugged from the cards and I don't know where they go so I haven't tried to power it up. Joe PS other finds included two dedicated computers with a pile of PC/104 cards in them. From aek at spies.com Tue Sep 2 14:32:00 2003 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: 7 track tape drives Message-ID: <200309021925.h82JPGML015314@spies.com> > July 1987, 93-09100-999, for model 9100, part 192-9100-081, std interface, > 75 ips, 800/1600 cpi 9 trk. I have three of these beasts to maintain - one on my 11/44 system, two for 'partz'. I'd love to have the manual.. I can copy/return, or copy forward to archivist... -- I have a copy scanned, will try to get it over to www.spies.com/aek/pdf/kennedy in the next day or so. I have a 9000 manual scanned as well. From arcarlini at iee.org Tue Sep 2 14:48:00 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Shipping from England In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000101c3718a$1292ec30$5b01a8c0@athlon> > The non-airmail is enough of a shock. I remember waiting 6 weeks for surface mail when shipping a manual from Canada to the UK, and that was something like $20 shipping on a $20 manual. > >Out of interest - a set of Encyclopedia's what exactly :-) > > "National Encyclopedia 12 Vols 1870's" Actually it was the abberrant apostrophe to which I referred, but I guess shipping on those is cheap :-) Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From aek at spies.com Tue Sep 2 16:25:00 2003 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: 7 track tape drives Message-ID: <200309022117.h82LHkwD029131@spies.com> I have a copy scanned, will try to get it over to www.spies.com/aek/pdf/kennedy in the next day or so. I have a 9000 manual scanned as well. -- done.. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Sep 2 16:32:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Shipping from England In-Reply-To: <000101c3718a$1292ec30$5b01a8c0@athlon> References: Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030901212227.007c6100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 08:40 PM 9/2/03 +0100, you wrote: >> The non-airmail is enough of a shock. > >I remember waiting 6 weeks for surface mail when shipping a >manual from Canada to the UK, and that was something like >$20 shipping on a $20 manual. Does the UK offer any king of Book Rate or Media Rate shipping? The US Postal Service does and it's a LOT cheaper than even surface mail. But you have to ask for it. It's not even shown as an option for international shipping on their website. Joe From emu at ecubics.com Tue Sep 2 16:48:00 2003 From: emu at ecubics.com (emanuel stiebler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Old manual got wet Message-ID: <3F551057.2030400@ecubics.com> Hi, here is the problem: I have an old manual which spent some time in water, and now after it dried out, I have more or less just a piece of wood :( So, how do you guys deal with something like that ? Put it in water again, and try to remove page after page ? Any better ideas ? cheers From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Sep 2 17:27:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:38 2005 Subject: Old manual got wet In-Reply-To: <3F551057.2030400@ecubics.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030901222842.007c9570@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Is it "solid" or can you open the pages at all? If it's solid the only thing that I've been able to do is to soak them and peel the pages off one by one, IF I COULD! They usually come apart in pieces. If it has slick pages then they're probably coated with fine clay to give them the smooth surface. I've NEVER been able to get one of those apart. Even ones that are only sticking in spots will usually pull the coating (with pictures and text) off of one of the pages. The best bet is to open it and dry it BEFORE it dries in a solid mass. I've had good luck rescuing wet manuals. I open them and set them in front of a fan and dry them out. I keep opening it to different pages both to dry it evenly and to separate the pages before they're permanently stuck together. If I can, I stand it on edge and set the fan where it will flip the pages around. That saves me a good bit of manual labor. But you need to open it to EVERY page and make sure that none of them are stuck together. The secret is NOT to let them dry out on their own. If they do then some or all of the page will stick together. I've never had much luck getting them apart after they're dried. Joe At 03:49 PM 9/2/03 -0600, you wrote: >Hi, >here is the problem: >I have an old manual which spent some time in water, and now after it >dried out, I have more or less just a piece of wood :( >So, how do you guys deal with something like that ? Put it in water >again, and try to remove page after page ? >Any better ideas ? > >cheers From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 2 19:00:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! In-Reply-To: <20030902094936.M518055@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> Message-ID: Hi all, YAY! Took me a while to find it, but today marked the arrival of my DEC RoamAbout wireless-LAN gear... a truly fun bit of stuff to have. (I already have Cisco Aironet on the main network, but hoped to be able to add DEC-branded stuff to the VAXlab network...which now came true!) If anyone happens to have RoamAbout stuff laying around, and would be willing to part with it, pse let me know! Cheers, Fred From doc at mdrconsult.com Tue Sep 2 19:11:00 2003 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F552FED.8040702@mdrconsult.com> Fred N. van Kempen wrote: > Hi all, > > YAY! Took me a while to find it, but today marked the arrival > of my DEC RoamAbout wireless-LAN gear... a truly fun bit of > stuff to have. > > (I already have Cisco Aironet on the main network, but hoped > to be able to add DEC-branded stuff to the VAXlab network...which > now came true!) > > If anyone happens to have RoamAbout stuff laying around, and > would be willing to part with it, pse let me know! Crap, Fred, there were 5 or 6 cards and a couple of base stations at the local Goodwill for months. None of my DEC stuff is PCMCIA-era, so I never paid it any mind. :\ From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 2 19:20:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! In-Reply-To: <3F552FED.8040702@mdrconsult.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Sep 2003, Doc Shipley wrote: > Crap, Fred, there were 5 or 6 cards and a couple of base stations at > the local Goodwill for months. None of my DEC stuff is PCMCIA-era, so I > never paid it any mind. :\ Aargh! And I just forked a fortune (relatively speaking..) for just one card and a base station(+card) ... *SIGH* --fred (in tis-not-fair mode..) From doc at mdrconsult.com Tue Sep 2 19:32:00 2003 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F5534BB.20507@mdrconsult.com> Fred N. van Kempen wrote: > On Tue, 2 Sep 2003, Doc Shipley wrote: > > >> Crap, Fred, there were 5 or 6 cards and a couple of base stations at >>the local Goodwill for months. None of my DEC stuff is PCMCIA-era, so I >>never paid it any mind. :\ > > Aargh! And I just forked a fortune (relatively speaking..) for > just one card and a base station(+card) ... > > *SIGH* I have to roll up that way tomorrow. I'll see if they still have any of it. I must be getting old - it never occured to me that anything wireless was old enough to be interesting.... Doc From dholland at woh.rr.com Tue Sep 2 19:35:00 2003 From: dholland at woh.rr.com (David Holland) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: The problems of organizing a computer collection In-Reply-To: <68072E8A-DBD1-11D7-BB05-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> References: <68072E8A-DBD1-11D7-BB05-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1062548913.32500.13.camel@crusader> On Sun, 2003-08-31 at 12:37, Ian Primus wrote: > - Oh, I can't forget cables. Almost all computer equipment requires a > large number of easily tangled, serpent-like items known as cables. FWIW, if the cable is small enough, Zip Lock bags work pretty well for storing cables. (As well as for misc & sundry adapter bits) At least it keeps them from tangling upon themselves. David > > So, what have other people's experiences with organization been? > > Ian Primus > ian_primus@yahoo.com From meltie at meltie.com Tue Sep 2 19:41:00 2003 From: meltie at meltie.com (meltie) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Vax emulator? In-Reply-To: <200308280814.h7S8EBXA029878@gtoal.com> References: <200308280814.h7S8EBXA029878@gtoal.com> Message-ID: <200308300022.04640.meltie@meltie.com> On Thursday 28 Aug 2003 9:14 am, Graham Toal wrote: > I have access to licenced VMS install CDs that came with some uVaxen > some time ago at the University where I work. The systems have been > surplussed long ago but we kept the software. If there a decent > (free) emulator that will run these on a Windows/XP or Linux PC? > > The ones I've found on the net would appear to be either commercial or > sufficiently cut down or incomplete as not to be practical, but this is > just from reading, not from using. I'd be delighted to be proven wrong. > > G You want either: ts10 - http://sourceforge.net/projects/ts10/ or simh, which people have already provided URLs for! melt -- Dance like no-one's watching, sing like no-one can hear you, love like you've never been hurt, wash like everyone has a nose, eat like cholesterol is a myth. From meltie at meltie.com Tue Sep 2 19:42:25 2003 From: meltie at meltie.com (meltie) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking In-Reply-To: <9AA0945D5FB72242873A28B8EF80DAD03935AE@DNPG-EXC1> References: <9AA0945D5FB72242873A28B8EF80DAD03935AE@DNPG-EXC1> Message-ID: <200308300049.43020.meltie@meltie.com> On Friday 29 Aug 2003 8:17 pm, Dave.Whipple@DNPG.com wrote: It is probably a bad idea to spam (even if it is ~on-topic) your fans, especially if you can't even use a spellchecker, or think about simple grammar, such as ending sentences with a full-stop. > Hi Everyone, My company builds the Decservers adn we are the original > networking division otherwise known as DNPG. > I noticed there are a lot of Dec users out there and I am sure they would > like to know what we have designed lately. > We have a brand new Decserver 708 with 8 ports of DB-9 and full modem > control encase in metal and ready to deliver. > We have the new 90M+ which has replaced the Decserver 90M, 90L and 90L+. > We have the 716 and 732. > We have a brand new switch family known as the Compass Family. 24 ports > 10/100 with 2 uplink slots for fiber or copper in Gigabit or 100 base. > These also do upto 128 VLANs at the closet level. The other switch in the > family is 4 ports fixed copper gigabit and has 4 uplink slots to be > configured as you wish. > > Now this is the first time we will mention our brand new Console Servers, > Cservers which are linux based and are due out in September. > > We have also partnered up with Console Works and TDI offering out of band > management for all of the devices that you want to watch and deem important > in real time. > This solution lets you oversee and proactively manage in real time from > anywhere at anytime. Reboot a workstation in Paris from a blue screen from > your bed with a laptop. That is power and management > > Thank you, > > dwhipple@dnpg.com > Dave Whipple > Account Manager > direct dial: 603-216-6044 > fax:603-216-0778 > toll free: 877-341-9594 X6044 > > DNPG, LLC > Digital Networks > 20 North Wentworth Ave > Londonderry, NH 03053 -- Dance like no-one's watching, sing like no-one can hear you, love like you've never been hurt, wash like everyone has a nose, eat like cholesterol is a myth. From kleb_2003 at hotmail.com Tue Sep 2 19:43:53 2003 From: kleb_2003 at hotmail.com (Kleb J.F) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: DEC Server Message-ID: Hi Stuart I was recently given two DEC Server 100's. I was wondering if you could help me find some information on these devices and what they were, and could be used for. Thank you Caleb _________________________________________________________________ ninemsn Extra Storage is now available. Get five times more storage - 10MB in your Hotmail account. Click here http://join.msn.com/ From Wolfgang.Noszek at telekom.de Tue Sep 2 19:45:15 2003 From: Wolfgang.Noszek at telekom.de (Wolfgang.Noszek@telekom.de) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Tektronix 4054 Message-ID: <82C36495BF9C914CB4DC6581F84ABE2467C1B2@G8DNR.krf01.telekom.de> Hi Monty, I'm from Germany and I also have a 4054. My problem is, that I can get no doks for the system - can you help? Wolfgang From simon-ulbrich at gmx.net Tue Sep 2 19:46:37 2003 From: simon-ulbrich at gmx.net (Simon Ulbrich) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Looking for HP 10342B Bus Preprocessor software Message-ID: <000201c36f2e$d0b24a70$0d01a8c0@simon> Hello Glen, I'm searching for the Software for the HP 10342. I have read your posting from Dec 26 08:12:15 2002 Could you please send me the .zip, too There was another posting about the manual for the 10342B. Did you or s.o. else publish it? I've manuals for all components of my LA and Preprocessor except for the 10342... If noone published it, can you tell me how to setup the S3 and J5 on the board? Thanks Simon Ulbrich From kb0cw at earthlink.net Tue Sep 2 19:48:01 2003 From: kb0cw at earthlink.net ({USER_FIRSTNAME} {USER_LASTNAME}) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: BOGEN model CHS-60A Amplifier Installation Manual Message-ID: <000a01c36f39$fc64f680$e637a444@y6k3b5> Hello Chris, I understand that you have an installation manual for the BOGEN model CHS-60A Amplifier. I would like to know if you could share it with me? Thanks, Alfred Dodds Laguna Niguel, CA kb0cw@earthlink.net From jack.rubin at ameritech.net Tue Sep 2 19:49:24 2003 From: jack.rubin at ameritech.net (Jack Rubin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: 1985 computer "pioneer" interviews Message-ID: <000001c37021$8ede7080$1f6fa8c0@eths.k12.il.us> I recently re-discovered about 2.5 hours worth of audio tapes I recorded in 1985 (mostly at NCC in Chicago), including interviews with Roger Melen (Cromemco), Maury Goldberg (MiniMicroMart), Carl Helmers (Byte Magazine) and a lecture by Roger Amidon (TDL). In the interviews, I was trying to get info on the pre- and early Altair days; I wasn't always too successful, but the diversions are interesting as well. The one that hurt the most was Helmers asking me if I had spoken with Gary Kildall. Gary was in attendance and promised to talk with me but he never showed up at the appointed time. I've copied the tapes as mp3's but there is still about 144 MB of material. What's the best way to share this material? I'll post them to my website if people want to download them but that's a lot of stuff. If you want a CD, you can send me $5 via PayPal to cover materials and postage and I'll burn copies and mail them to you (outside the US at whatever the postage costs). I'm on digest so you may want to reply to me directly. Jack Rubin Wilmette, Illinois USA jack.rubin@ameritech.net From jkrywalski at adelphia.net Tue Sep 2 19:50:46 2003 From: jkrywalski at adelphia.net (Jim Krywalski) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Gridcase 1520 Message-ID: Am at a loss as to where to look for help on this one. Recently aquired a Gridcase 1520 for some old DOS programs that I still need to run to interface with some machine PLC's. Need to boot from the "A" drive because the software can't be installed on the "C" drive. HOW DO I GET TO THE BIOS SETTINGS?.... I've tried all the normal stuff, CTL.S, ALT.S, etc., but nothing I do works...... (Have also tried to swing a cat over my head three times while facing east, but that only resulted in a clawed arm on my part!) Thanks in advance.............. From shirker at mooli.org.uk Tue Sep 2 19:52:09 2003 From: shirker at mooli.org.uk (Shirker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Intergraph boards - anyone want? Message-ID: I have the motherboard (1xVME) and "Mesa" graphics boards (3xVME) from a 6800 Series if anyone wants them. Free, you pay shipping or collect. Please forward this to anyone you know who is interested in Intergraph computers - thanks! Boards are located in UK. Ed. -- I remember why I started becoming less tolerant, and I think I should strive to become less tolerant in future. - RobA From giarmy at earthlink.net Tue Sep 2 19:53:36 2003 From: giarmy at earthlink.net (FRANCIS BAKER) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Xerox 6085 SW and HW Message-ID: <000801c370d6$2f120c10$8c31bc3f@yourg4lzvxou0c> Kathy, I wonder if you still have the Xerox 6085 software. Mine wants me to scavenge the volume using the disk, VP Scavenge. Do you have it? I would also be interested in the 6085 and the 4045 printer, if they're in good working order. Francis Baker POMIL Research Analyst PO Box 3541 Warrenton VA 20188 (540) 347-7469 giarmy@earthlink.net From =?koi8-r?Q?=22?=stephen Tue Sep 2 19:55:01 2003 From: =?koi8-r?Q?=22?=stephen (=?koi8-r?Q?=22?=stephen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Comodore SX64 monitor help needed. In-Reply-To: <20030821101029.GA197093@earthlink.net> Message-ID: i have an SX64 with a dead monitor, can anybody point me in the direction of a schematic? there seems to be schematics of the logic section around, but i cant find the monitor sheets :( From vdhb.belgium at pandora.be Tue Sep 2 19:58:30 2003 From: vdhb.belgium at pandora.be (Jaap van der Horst) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: DOS 3 Message-ID: <000801c37154$7de00210$6e9182c3@Jaap> Dear Mr. Fuller Please let me introduce myself: My name is Jaap van der Horst and I live in Belgium. One of my friends is desperately looking for DOS 3.0 or higher. I am not very good at working the net but I believe you did sent out a msg expressing the same request. Should you meanwhile be in possession of this operating system could you please let me know how we can obtain a copy. Thank you and kind regards, Jaap van der Horst From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 2 19:59:59 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: DEC Server In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 30 Aug 2003, Kleb J.F wrote: > Hi Stuart Err... this is a mailing list, not a personal address. > I was recently given two DEC Server 100's. I was wondering if you could > help me find some information on these devices and what they were, and could > be used for. DECserver 100's were the first of DEC (Digital)'s line of ethernet terminal servers. These terminal servers connected to an Ethernet on one end (like the VAXen, PDP-11's et al), and on the other end connected to terminals and modems. These servers ran the LAT (Local Area Transport) protocol, which is somewhat like what TELNET does over IP/TCP these days... it connects a terminal to a login session on a host system, such as a UNIX or VMS host. The LAT protocol then takes care for efficient transport of keystrokes and screen data over the network. At the time, this was a revolutionary change from how terminals were otherwise connected; up till then, host systems spent a lot of their time (read: brain power, computing resources) on the actual servicing the serial lines to which the (sometimes hundreds!) of terminals were connected. By offloading this processing to the dedicated 'dec servers' (hence the name: DECserver), host systems could spend more time on actual work. It also allowed terminals to be further away from the hosts, since the rules for serial line lengths no longer applied, but the new rules of Ethernet cabling ruled instead. Documentation (and load software) for these devices is still available. Cheers, Fred From gj.killinger at austin.utexas.edu Tue Sep 2 20:01:23 2003 From: gj.killinger at austin.utexas.edu (Gary J Killinger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: floppy drive Message-ID: Hello Do you still have any 8" floppy drives? with cables?? let me know..thanks gary.k From sieler at allegro.com Tue Sep 2 20:02:58 2003 From: sieler at allegro.com (Stan Sieler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: 9121 vs 9122 In-Reply-To: <00a701c36da2$19f4a9a0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Message-ID: <3F547532.31461.445C1AF@localhost> > Ok, if both 9121 and 9122 use the same media, what is the difference between > these two drives? IIRC, 9121 is single sided, 9122 is double sided. -- Stan Sieler sieler@allegro.com www.allegro.com/sieler/wanted/index.html From jwstephens_2000 at yahoo.com Tue Sep 2 20:04:24 2003 From: jwstephens_2000 at yahoo.com (jim stephens) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: UCSD P-Code and Pick for IBM PC/XT/AT Message-ID: <20030902182331.66499.qmail@web80402.mail.yahoo.com> Ibm had a distribution of the Pcode and UCSD pascal that came in the same beige / pink boxes that Dos was in. I have that set. Pick started out with support on the PC for the XT and followed with their "classic" virtual port thru a release called R-83M. Licenses are not transferable, but if you find a site with the disks, you may be able to reinstall if you get all their notes. They may not be sold directly, so you should doubt authenticity of sale of anything but current product. Pick is now "Raining Data" and was merged with a rinky dink company that made a Mac database called Omnus. The current powers that are there are trying to get the most from the Omnus side of the business, which has been turned into yet another company that ran amuck and decided to put out the end all "4th gl" development package other than do their original product. Pick / Raining data support a release which predates the merger called D3. Concurrent with the R83 Pick Pc releases, there was a lot of work on another system by Pick which was called Open Architechure, and later Advanced Pick, and finally after porting from a standalone install to a release that runs on top of various host Unix type OS/s now D3. I think there is a standalone D3 available with limited driver support. the hosted version also runs on most Server type windows systems as well. I am sure someone from the pick community can correct this posting if need be. It became an impossible task to support all the hardware variants that exist as a standalone bootable system since driver code is never been designed to be OS independent. So the OS that dominates (now MS, in the past Unix and MS) gets the support from the hardware people and all the Pick / Beos / whatever OS's get screwed unless they are very limited to the generic support. for more Pick info or questions better answered by current players, please see usenet group comp.databases.pick which is inhabited by a nice group of developers and users most of the time. I know there are UCSD pascal usenet groups, but I don't know the current state of the groups, they may be zombies, dead, or taken over by weirdos. Jim From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 2 20:05:50 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! In-Reply-To: <3F5534BB.20507@mdrconsult.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Sep 2003, Doc Shipley wrote: > I have to roll up that way tomorrow. I'll see if they still have any > of it. Ooooh, that would be good! :) > I must be getting old - it never occured to me that anything wireless > was old enough to be interesting.... Well, first of all, networking is my "field" .. so, yes, I am interested in how it was done earlier (yes, I worked with the old 3Mbps Ethernet... :) The RoamAbout stuff, like most other DEC Networking stuff I have (both old, like the DELNI's and DS200's, and newer, like this thing, and the DEChub 900 stuff I am looking for, is just so I can extend VAXlab (my DEC network) into "original hardware" for the network gear as well as the machines: VXT2000+ X terminal (okokok, with 17" Iiyama color mon.. ;-) VAX servers (with OpenBSD/vax, incl. XDM display service) DS200 term/console servers DELNI ethernet hubs (yes, I need more AUI cables... anyone?) InfoServer boot support for VXT and CDROMs several VAX, PDP11, DECstation and Alpha boxes recently added: several notebooks and now: wireless LAN ;-) The network core is still cisco (catalyst switch, simple hub and a 2501 router) but I have a bunch of DECnis routers awaiting a new life... -f From dmabry at mich.com Tue Sep 2 20:12:00 2003 From: dmabry at mich.com (Dave Mabry) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Gridcase 1520 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F553B26.20901@mich.com> Hit the "F" key after the beep on boot. Jim Krywalski wrote: > Am at a loss as to where to look for help on this one. > > Recently aquired a Gridcase 1520 for some old DOS programs that I still need > to run to interface with some machine PLC's. > Need to boot from the "A" drive because the software can't be installed on > the "C" drive. > > HOW DO I GET TO THE BIOS SETTINGS?.... > > I've tried all the normal stuff, CTL.S, ALT.S, etc., but nothing I do > works...... > > (Have also tried to swing a cat over my head three times while facing east, > but that only resulted in a clawed arm on my part!) > > Thanks in advance.............. > > . > -- Dave Mabry dmabry@mich.com Dossin Museum Underwater Research Team From dmabry at mich.com Tue Sep 2 20:13:27 2003 From: dmabry at mich.com (Dave Mabry) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Gridcase 1520 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F553C53.5010006@mich.com> Sorry, I should have been more specific. The "F" key is to force a boot from the floppy. I don't think there is an internal "BIOS" setup, but not sure about that. Jim Krywalski wrote: > Am at a loss as to where to look for help on this one. > > Recently aquired a Gridcase 1520 for some old DOS programs that I still need > to run to interface with some machine PLC's. > Need to boot from the "A" drive because the software can't be installed on > the "C" drive. > > HOW DO I GET TO THE BIOS SETTINGS?.... > > I've tried all the normal stuff, CTL.S, ALT.S, etc., but nothing I do > works...... > > (Have also tried to swing a cat over my head three times while facing east, > but that only resulted in a clawed arm on my part!) > > Thanks in advance.............. > > . > -- Dave Mabry dmabry@mich.com Dossin Museum Underwater Research Team From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 2 20:14:49 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: floppy drive In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Sep 2003, Gary J Killinger wrote: ... Crap, another wave of those.... Jay! 'sup?? --fred From tothwolf at concentric.net Tue Sep 2 20:28:00 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: The problems of organizing a computer collection In-Reply-To: <1062548913.32500.13.camel@crusader> References: <68072E8A-DBD1-11D7-BB05-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> <1062548913.32500.13.camel@crusader> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Sep 2003, David Holland wrote: > On Sun, 2003-08-31 at 12:37, Ian Primus wrote: > > > - Oh, I can't forget cables. Almost all computer equipment requires a > > large number of easily tangled, serpent-like items known as cables. > > > FWIW, if the cable is small enough, Zip Lock bags work pretty well for > storing cables. (As well as for misc & sundry adapter bits) At least > it keeps them from tangling upon themselves. I tend to coil up longer cables, and either weave the end around the coil, or hold the coil together with tywraps or twist ties. Smaller cables I usually coil or bundle (depending on how the wire wants to lay) and hold them in place with tywraps or twist ties. Zip Lock bags work great for things like AppleTalk adapters. -Toth From jwest at classiccmp.org Tue Sep 2 20:32:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: floppy drive References: Message-ID: <002b01c371ba$15283c40$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> another wave of what? The floppy drive thread? Or the suspicious requests for info? Trying to get caught up folks... moderated posts got way behind. Fred, sure you're not subbed to both lists? Jay ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fred N. van Kempen" To: Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2003 7:58 PM Subject: Re: floppy drive > On Tue, 2 Sep 2003, Gary J Killinger wrote: > > ... > > Crap, another wave of those.... Jay! 'sup?? > > --fred From h.godavari at shaw.ca Tue Sep 2 20:35:00 2003 From: h.godavari at shaw.ca (harsha godavari) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: DOS 3 References: <000801c37154$7de00210$6e9182c3@Jaap> Message-ID: <3F554395.D3619CBE@shaw.ca> Mr van der Horst: DOS 3.2 or 3.3 come on two 5.25" disks (360k) DOS 6.2 (last of the versions) comes on three 3.5" High density disks (1.4mb). I can send you copies of either one gratis. Let me know if you are interested. Regards Harsha Godavari Jaap van der Horst wrote: > Dear Mr. Fuller > > Please let me introduce myself: > > My name is Jaap van der Horst and I live in Belgium. One of my friends is > desperately looking for DOS 3.0 or higher. > > I am not very good at working the net but I believe you did sent out a msg > expressing the same request. Should you meanwhile be in possession of this > operating system could you please let me know how we can obtain a copy. > > Thank you and kind regards, > > Jaap van der Horst From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 2 20:39:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: floppy drive In-Reply-To: <002b01c371ba$15283c40$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Sep 2003, Jay West wrote: > another wave of what? The floppy drive thread? Or the suspicious requests > for info? The latter. > Trying to get caught up folks... moderated posts got way behind. Take your time... > Fred, sure you're not subbed to both lists? Very sure. :) --f From jfoust at threedee.com Tue Sep 2 21:43:00 2003 From: jfoust at threedee.com (John Foust) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: UCSD P-Code and Pick for IBM PC/XT/AT In-Reply-To: <20030902182331.66499.qmail@web80402.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20030902212855.031108c0@pc> At 11:23 AM 9/2/2003 -0700, jim stephens wrote: >I know there are UCSD pascal usenet groups, but I >don't know the current state of the groups, they >may be zombies, dead, or taken over by weirdos. I believe they're all dead: http://www.threedee.com/jcm/ - John From mikeford at socal.rr.com Tue Sep 2 22:15:01 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: The problems of organizing a computer collection In-Reply-To: <68072E8A-DBD1-11D7-BB05-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030902182343.02e8c890@pop-server.socal.rr.com> At 12:37 PM 8/31/03 -0400, Ian Primus wrote: >I have been striveing to organize both my physical and digital space as of >late, and hsve been trying to reorganize the basement. I have come up with Boltless commercial shelving. Rapid Rack, Econo, Riviteer, and many more make shelving that holds 400 to 600 lbs per shelf, assembles quickly, and is ROCK stable, plus each shelf (its hard to explain, but easy to see) holds more stuff since nothing is in the way, support structure is all at the outside on the corners. Home depot sells a moderately cheesier shelf called Gorilla Rack, but its not nearly as good. Sams Club carries some decent Wire Shelving by Seville (the patent for Metro must have run out) and at $69 for a 48x18x72 6 shelf rack on wheels, its a steal, and you get REAL used to how handy a STRONG rack on wheels is. Flip top plastic storage containers, ie the ones at Home Depot for $5 each. Fillem up, stack/put on shelves. Don't stack heavy ones more than 2 high, or hinges warp. Markers and masking tape so you can find stuff later on. From nico at farumdata.dk Wed Sep 3 00:05:01 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: floppy drive References: Message-ID: <006e01c371d7$6daf05c0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> From: "Gary J Killinger" To: Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2003 7:19 PM Subject: floppy drive > Hello Do you still have any 8" floppy drives? with cables?? let me know..thanks gary.k > Dont forget the power supply ! Most need +24V Nico From curt at atarimuseum.com Wed Sep 3 00:11:01 2003 From: curt at atarimuseum.com (Curt vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: PDP-11/73 or 11/83's in the US for sale? References: Message-ID: <002001c31131$51284850$1a02a8c0@starship1> Anyone have a spare Micro-PDP/11 like an 11/73 or 11/83 they are interested in selling? Looking for a known working system please. I want to setup RSTS 7.x onto this system to read a bunch of RSTS RL02's I have. Curt From wmsmith at earthlink.net Wed Sep 3 01:17:00 2003 From: wmsmith at earthlink.net (Wayne M. Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: The problems of organizing a computer collection In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030902182343.02e8c890@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: <001201c371e1$f142e820$2cb2d642@WaynePC> > At 12:37 PM 8/31/03 -0400, Ian Primus wrote: > >I have been striveing to organize both my physical and > digital space as > >of late, and hsve been trying to reorganize the basement. I > have come > >up with > > Boltless commercial shelving. > Rapid Rack, Econo, Riviteer, and many more make shelving that > holds 400 to > 600 lbs per shelf, assembles quickly, and is ROCK stable, > plus each shelf > (its hard to explain, but easy to see) holds more stuff since > nothing is in > the way, support structure is all at the outside on the > corners. Home depot > sells a moderately cheesier shelf called Gorilla Rack, but > its not nearly > as good. Sams Club carries some decent Wire Shelving by > Seville (the patent > for Metro must have run out) and at $69 for a 48x18x72 6 > shelf rack on > wheels, its a steal, and you get REAL used to how handy a > STRONG rack on > wheels is. > I have been buying this type of wire shelving made by Nexel -- 800 lbs. per 24 x 48 inch shelf. So far I have 11 feet it. Of course, it's expensive. A 24 x 48 5 shelf unit with 74" posts runs around $220. But it is the best and very nice to look at. I have been buying mine from Superior Shelving -- http://www.superiorshelving.com/nexel/pages/nexelWire.html -W From SPEDRAJA at ono.com Wed Sep 3 01:23:00 2003 From: SPEDRAJA at ono.com (Sergio Pedraja Cabo) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: UCSD P-Code and Pick for IBM PC/XT/AT Message-ID: <906f10387.10387906f@ono.com> > Remitente: jim stephens Hello ! > Ibm had a distribution of the Pcode and UCSD pascal > that came in the same beige / pink boxes that Dos was > in. I have that set. Well... Having in mind the difficult of locate any kind of operative UCSD system in the Internet and any other place... Perhaps one security copy of the USCD disks could be realized to allow some believers to see the light :-) It's only a suggestion, of course :-)) Cheers Sergio From lgomez at cdromsa.es Wed Sep 3 03:04:00 2003 From: lgomez at cdromsa.es (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Luis_G=F3mez?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Tatung Einstein 256 In-Reply-To: <200308300022.04640.meltie@meltie.com> Message-ID: <000901c371f0$f0f7d790$9600a8c0@Luis> I need information about this vintage computer. I'm trying connect this computer to a monitor and build a PSU Regards From SPEDRAJA at ono.com Wed Sep 3 03:12:00 2003 From: SPEDRAJA at ono.com (Sergio Pedraja Cabo) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: The problems of organizing a computer collection Message-ID: <133a315281.15281133a3@ono.com> I use too the NEXEL metalic cabinets with wheels. Hard, light, brilliant, and support A LOT of weight. It's expensive but the product has the price adjusted, I think. Cheers Sergio ----- Mensaje Original ----- Remitente: "Wayne M. Smith" Fecha: Mi?rcoles, Septiembre 3, 2003 8:09 am Asunto: RE: The problems of organizing a computer collection > > At 12:37 PM 8/31/03 -0400, Ian Primus wrote: > > >I have been striveing to organize both my physical and > > digital space as > > >of late, and hsve been trying to reorganize the basement. I > > have come > > >up with > > > > Boltless commercial shelving. > > Rapid Rack, Econo, Riviteer, and many more make shelving that > > holds 400 to > > 600 lbs per shelf, assembles quickly, and is ROCK stable, > > plus each shelf > > (its hard to explain, but easy to see) holds more stuff since > > nothing is in > > the way, support structure is all at the outside on the > > corners. Home depot > > sells a moderately cheesier shelf called Gorilla Rack, but > > its not nearly > > as good. Sams Club carries some decent Wire Shelving by > > Seville (the patent > > for Metro must have run out) and at $69 for a 48x18x72 6 > > shelf rack on > > wheels, its a steal, and you get REAL used to how handy a > > STRONG rack on > > wheels is. > > > > I have been buying this type of wire shelving made by Nexel -- 800 > lbs.per 24 x 48 inch shelf. So far I have 11 feet it. Of course, > it'sexpensive. A 24 x 48 5 shelf unit with 74" posts runs around > $220. But > it is the best and very nice to look at. I have been buying mine from > Superior Shelving -- > http://www.superiorshelving.com/nexel/pages/nexelWire.html > > -W From mikeford at socal.rr.com Wed Sep 3 03:21:00 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? References: <3F52CB05.9010207@mdrconsult.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <3F52A8D4.1050008@cox.net> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030903005814.02e8fb20@pop-server.socal.rr.com> At 12:58 AM 9/1/03 -0400, Mail List wrote: >That is truly wild. The cue cat thing, all the time spent defeating it, etc. >I wish I had the spare time some people have. Maybe someday. Thing is a barcode reader is a really cool handy thing to have, IF you can use it for what you want to do. If the companies had not been such putzii in restricting use to JUST what they wanted me to do with it, most likely I would have kept it handy and used it for both mine and their objectives. As it is now I don't use them for anything. My favorite is the CS1504 key fob sized unit with memory for a few hundred barcodes that WuliWeb sent to me, but seems like the CueCat has lots more software for it (I also have a few of those). I plan to get something going like Thokbook and isbn/barcode book collection database thingy, but its still on the list of stuff to do. From kai at techie.com Wed Sep 3 03:51:00 2003 From: kai at techie.com (Wesley Widner) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: EBAY fraud alert In-Reply-To: <3F534EC5.4DCB350F@compsys.to> Message-ID: <000001c371ff$d53fe740$c8454545@b30567.sbnl.com> Sometimes sysadmins like to keep old accounts that are getting a lot of spam open so that they can train their anti-spam software's heuristics. Alternately most mailserver configurations are set to blindly accept anything to @theirdomain to keep spammers from guessing valid user accounts. ---- ---Wesley Widner -- - -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Jerome H. Fine Sent: Monday, September 01, 2003 8:51 AM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: Re: EBAY fraud alert >"Zane H. Healy" wrote: > > This is a rather common scam that has been going on for about a year or > > so. It has spread to PayPal, and is one of the rationalizations that > > ebay is using to force all users to change from email address IDs to an > > alias. If Ebay is doing anything about these scams, they are keeping it > > a secret. > eBay is forcing users to change from an email address to an alias? This is > the first I've heard about it. I know they won't let you get a new account > and use your email address as they want to control peoples ability to reach > you. I've not seen anything that says that I have to change mine to an > alias. Personally I like that people are able to easily find my email > address on eBay. Jerome Fine replies: I have a comment and a question! I have an OLD e-mail address from an ISP that I cancelled 2 years ago. It still seems to be active since I can send an e-mail to the address: Jerome Fine and it does not get rejected. I used that e-mail address with eBay when I first signed up with eBay to request information and send in bids. Of course, I can't pick up any e-mails that eBay sends, let alone the 30 spam a day that I was receiving at the end, but my old e-mail address still seems to be acting as a bit bucket since I just sent a test message to it. AND as far as eBay is concerned, my user id is still and I can still ask a question of a vendor by supplying: user id: jhfine@idirect.com password: xxxxxx so, it must all still be working as far as eBay is concerned and eBay still accepts and allows an OLD user ID with an @ character. Question: As far as the OLD ISP is concerned, is there any way that a user can at least pick up e-mails that are still sent to that old address as long as the ISP is still accepting them? Question: Is there anything as far as practice goes on the internet that requires an ISP who accepts an e-mail (i.e. without rejecting it) to at least forward that e-mail to the old original person even if that person no longer has a paid for account? Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Wed Sep 3 03:56:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030903005814.02e8fb20@pop-server.socal.rr.com > References: <3F52CB05.9010207@mdrconsult.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <3F52A8D4.1050008@cox.net> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030903042809.00a2e840@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Hi Mike, > If the companies had not been such putzii in restricting use to JUST what they > wanted me to do with it, most likely I would have kept it handy and used it for > both mine and their objectives. As it is now I don't use them for anything. I know what you mean. Another similar consumer data collection thing is going on with the grocery stores and the Harris Teeter VIC card and the Food Lion MVP card. You get some special buys if you have their card with you when you check out and they scan it, but when you let them scan your card, they know who you are and what you are buying. I don't know if you have those grocery stores in your area or not. It's never really been any inconvenience with it though. But last year when my mom was in the hospital for the first time, for something very serious that is, Harris Teeter's database must have recognized that she hadn't been shopping there for a significant amount of time, and they sent some coupons in the mail as an incentive to get her to come back and start shopping there again. I guess the important thing is just don't give them your email address too, or only give them the email address that you don't mind receiving the junk mail at. > My favorite is the CS1504 key fob sized unit with memory for a few hundred barcodes > that WuliWeb sent to me, but seems like the CueCat has lots more software for it (I also > have a few of those). I plan to get something going like Thokbook and isbn/barcode book > collection database thingy, but its still on the list of stuff to do. Some years ago when I was working as a tech for a small local computer company, they had me build and set up a couple of systems for a local retailer that were to be networked together, and one was to operate a cash drawer, and both were to have bar code scanners for scanning the UPCs on their merchandise. It's been so long now that I don't remember exactly what I had to do to make it all work, but I'm not sure I remember the scanners they were using needing a device driver. They did plug in inline with the keyboard. If I found one that just worked, with no device driver requirement, just as though you had typed the characters on the keyboard, that would be great. If it were pen sized and shaped, so super small and compact, that would be even better. Does such a scanner exist? I'm getting kind of tired of devices that only work with some operating systems and not with others, or get left orphaned when a new major release of an operating system comes out. From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Wed Sep 3 06:46:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Archive tape drive Model 5945L-2 Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030903073510.00ac8e80@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Archive tape drive Model 5945L-2 I doubt anyone is going to want this, but I have one of these coming. Untested. If anyone wants this, pick up in person in Va. Beach, VA Archive tape drive Model 5945L-2 Archive 5945L-2 60MB 1/4" QIC-02 5.25" FH From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Wed Sep 3 07:13:01 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: PART NUMBERS AND EVOLUTION OF PERIPHERALS Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030903080339.00a780b0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> found this link that might be of interest to someone ... PART NUMBERS AND EVOLUTION OF PERIPHERALS http://www.ics-finmek.com/ics/swtool/manuals/mag_opt/cap2.pdf discusses magnetic storage devices, ie floppy drives, hard drives, and tape drives From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Wed Sep 3 07:34:00 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: DEC Server Message-ID: <030903081425.af3a@splab.cas.neu.edu> Decserver 100's are terminal servers for going from terminals that use 3 wires (rcv,xmt, gnd) to ethernet. The connection is for an AUI, which normally goes to thick-wire ethernet, but can adapt to normal ethernet. The biggest problem, as I recall, is they only speak LAT, so if you want to hook up terminals to something that doesn't run DECNET/LAT you have a tough time. Of course, us VMS guys don't care. That's what I remember. Anybody else, please correct me if the memory is wrong... Joe Heck From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Wed Sep 3 07:36:58 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: PDP-11/73 or 11/83's in the US for sale? Message-ID: <030903082503.af3a@splab.cas.neu.edu> curt, where are you physically? I have 3 working systems, which I can part with one easily, but they are not what you would call "commercial", although I could put one together in a BA223 box, but shipping would be more than the box. Also, I always ran RT-11, so I don't know what the disk drive requirements are. It's nothing to put a processor, 256 megs of memory and a dlv11j into a box. Do you have the RL02 subsystem with the controller? regards, Joe Heck From dwoyciesjes at comcast.net Wed Sep 3 08:53:01 2003 From: dwoyciesjes at comcast.net (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! References: Message-ID: <3F55F08D.8110296@comcast.net> "Fred N. van Kempen" wrote: > > DELNI ethernet hubs (yes, I need more AUI cables... anyone?) I think I can help out here, I have a bunch here in New Haven, CT, USA. And 2 DELNIs I want to get rid of also... -- --- Dave Woyciesjes --- ICQ# 905818 From curt at atarimuseum.com Wed Sep 3 09:22:00 2003 From: curt at atarimuseum.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: PDP-11/73 or 11/83's in the US for sale? Message-ID: <200309031421.h83ELU459965@huey.classiccmp.org> Hi Joe, I'm in New York near Connecticut. Sounds great dude, I have an RL02 and right now an RLV12 Qbus controller, but I have a place in FL I've been buying Dec parts from and he has RLV11's so that wouldn't be a problem.... I want to also start looking around for an RX02 setup, I actually have a controller board already that was in my Vax4000-200 when I bought it. Curt > curt, where are you physically? I have 3 working systems, which I can > part with one easily, but they are not what you would call "commercial", > although I could put one together in a BA223 box, but shipping would > be more than the box. Also, I always ran RT-11, so I don't know what > the disk drive requirements are. It's nothing to put a processor, 256 > megs of memory and a dlv11j into a box. Do you have the RL02 subsystem > with the controller? > > regards, > > Joe Heck From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 3 12:12:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: CGA monitors available for pickup Message-ID: I've got a few CGA monitors here that are available if anyone wants to come pick them up. Northern NJ, (Ridgewood, 07450). Last I knew, they worked (there are at least 4, maybe more). -chris From vcf at siconic.com Wed Sep 3 12:18:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:39 2005 Subject: Old manual got wet Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Sep 2003, emanuel stiebler wrote: > here is the problem: > I have an old manual which spent some time in water, and now after it > dried out, I have more or less just a piece of wood :( > So, how do you guys deal with something like that ? Put it in water > again, and try to remove page after page ? > Any better ideas ? I believe folks have suggested freeze drying in the past? It would probably be useful to check with some experienced librarians on this. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From arcarlini at iee.org Wed Sep 3 12:20:47 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking In-Reply-To: <200308300049.43020.meltie@meltie.com> Message-ID: <001701c3723d$c5d332b0$5b01a8c0@athlon> > It is probably a bad idea to spam (even if it is ~on-topic) > your fans, It's no more on-topic than it would be if HP were spamming about the new ES47 (unless dnpg are still selling* the HUB90 stuff and friends). Antonio [*] And the original definition of on-topic was something like "not sold commercially for at least 10 years"; under that definition this would clearly fail. -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From kth at srv.net Wed Sep 3 12:23:31 2003 From: kth at srv.net (Kevin Handy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030903042809.00a2e840@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> References: <3F52CB05.9010207@mdrconsult.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <3F52A8D4.1050008@cox.net> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030903042809.00a2e840@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <3F562A78.5090605@srv.net> Mail List wrote: > Hi Mike, > > > If the companies had not been such putzii in restricting use to JUST > what they > > wanted me to do with it, most likely I would have kept it handy and > used it for > > both mine and their objectives. As it is now I don't use them for > anything. > > I know what you mean. Another similar consumer data collection thing > is going > on with the grocery stores and the Harris Teeter VIC card and the Food > Lion MVP > card. You get some special buys if you have their card with you when > you check > out and they scan it, but when you let them scan your card, they know > who you are > and what you are buying. I don't know if you have those grocery stores > in your area > or not. It's never really been any inconvenience with it though. But > last year when > my mom was in the hospital for the first time, for something very > serious that is, > Harris Teeter's database must have recognized that she hadn't been > shopping there > for a significant amount of time, and they sent some coupons in the > mail as an incentive > to get her to come back and start shopping there again. I guess the > important thing > is just don't give them your email address too, or only give them the > email address > that you don't mind receiving the junk mail at. > > > My favorite is the CS1504 key fob sized unit with memory for a few > hundred barcodes > > that WuliWeb sent to me, but seems like the CueCat has lots more > software for it (I also > > have a few of those). I plan to get something going like Thokbook > and isbn/barcode book > > collection database thingy, but its still on the list of stuff to do. > > Some years ago when I was working as a tech for a small local computer > company, > they had me build and set up a couple of systems for a local retailer > that were to be > networked together, and one was to operate a cash drawer, and both > were to have > bar code scanners for scanning the UPCs on their merchandise. It's > been so long > now that I don't remember exactly what I had to do to make it all > work, but I'm not sure > I remember the scanners they were using needing a device driver. They > did plug in > inline with the keyboard. If I found one that just worked, with no > device driver requirement, > just as though you had typed the characters on the keyboard, that > would be great. If it What you want is called a keyboard wedge. Percon, Symbol, etc. sell them. Depending on which one you get, you can attach pens, hand-held lasers, card readers, etc. > were pen sized and shaped, so super small and compact, that would be > even better. The pen scanners have more problems scanning items than the laser scanners. You also have to control your swiping speed with the pens. The laser scanners work MUCH more reliably. If you are using the scanners in a dirty enviornment, look into infrared versions instead of the visible ones, as they can scan through crud better. > Does such a scanner exist? I'm getting kind of tired of devices that > only work with some > operating systems and not with others, or get left orphaned when a new > major release of > an operating system comes out. > Which is one reason to use a keyboard wedge. They are usually programmed by scanning barcodes from a manual. The computer doesn't have to know they are there for them to work. Only time you would need to change them, is if the keyboard connector changed. From teoz at neo.rr.com Wed Sep 3 12:27:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Tandy 1000 Message-ID: <050401c3723e$2ca73400$347ca418@neo.rr.com> I am looking to add a Tandy 1000 to my collection of old gaming computers (for the old 320x200 resolutions the tandy and PCjr only had). Anybody have one they want to get rid of cheap (I need the monitor also)? Located in Ohio/USA From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 3 12:34:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: CGA monitors available for pickup Message-ID: >I've got a few CGA monitors here that are available if anyone wants to >come pick them up. Northern NJ, (Ridgewood, 07450). > >Last I knew, they worked (there are at least 4, maybe more). I just walked past one of the piles of CGA monitors, and at least one is actually a PCjr monitor (but I have some PCjr to CGA adaptor pigtails if anyone wants to use it as a CGA monitor). -chris From CyndeM at vulcan.com Wed Sep 3 12:37:00 2003 From: CyndeM at vulcan.com (Cynde Moya) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: The problems of organizing a computer collection Message-ID: When you put the boards and such away, do you include a pouch of silica gel to absorb the excess water and decrease the possibility of corrosion? Does this matter? From Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com Wed Sep 3 12:54:00 2003 From: Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com (Feldman, Robert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Old manual got wet Message-ID: Freeze drying can be used, but requires significant equipment. Look at pages 13-17 of http://www.mcfoa.org/DisasterPlan.pdf Wet books can also be frozen simply to prevent further damage (such as mildew) and to give time to treat the books one by one: freezing locks up the water so it can't do more damage as a liquid. See for example: http://aic.stanford.edu/conspec/bpg/annual/v05/bp05-21.html Once the book has dried out, there is not much that can be simply done to repair the damage. Bob -----Original Message----- From: Vintage Computer Festival [mailto:vcf@siconic.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2003 11:57 AM To: Classic Computers Mailing List Subject: Re: Old manual got wet On Tue, 2 Sep 2003, emanuel stiebler wrote: > here is the problem: > I have an old manual which spent some time in water, and now after it > dried out, I have more or less just a piece of wood :( > So, how do you guys deal with something like that ? Put it in water > again, and try to remove page after page ? > Any better ideas ? I believe folks have suggested freeze drying in the past? It would probably be useful to check with some experienced librarians on this. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 3 13:08:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Old manual got wet In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030902181324.007b1100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 09:57 AM 9/3/03 -0700, you wrote: >On Tue, 2 Sep 2003, emanuel stiebler wrote: > >> here is the problem: >> I have an old manual which spent some time in water, and now after it >> dried out, I have more or less just a piece of wood :( >> So, how do you guys deal with something like that ? Put it in water >> again, and try to remove page after page ? >> Any better ideas ? > >I believe folks have suggested freeze drying in the past? It would >probably be useful to check with some experienced librarians on this. I believe thye only freeze them when they don't hve the tme to dry them immediately (ie a large collection of books gets soaked). They freeze them rather than let them dry on their own. They can then thaw and dry them at their convinence. Joe > >-- > >Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- >International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > >[ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] >[ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 3 13:13:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking In-Reply-To: <001701c3723d$c5d332b0$5b01a8c0@athlon> from "Antonio Carlini" at Sep 3, 3 06:06:53 pm Message-ID: > > It is probably a bad idea to spam (even if it is ~on-topic) > > your fans, > > It's no more on-topic than it would be if HP were spamming > about the new ES47 (unless dnpg are still selling* the > HUB90 stuff and friends). > > Antonio > > [*] And the original definition of on-topic was something like > "not sold commercially for at least 10 years"; under that > definition this would clearly fail. While not disputing that the original message was off-topic, I thought that actually 'stuff _related_ to classic computing' could be advertised here. In other words if somebody finds a source of still-in-production paper/media/chips/etc for our wonderful toys then it was OK to mention it here. No I don't want this list to turn into a load of adverts, but equally, if somebody has a source for some obscure consumable then that might benefit the rest of us.. For example, I would consider it OK to mention that : Standard thermal fax paper rolls (available in the UK from Rymans amongst other places) work fine in the HP9866 printer (used on the 9830 'calculator' and other machines) [That happens to be a true statement, BTW. And I am not sure the 9830 is a 'calculator' by any reasonable definition, as it's a desktop machine with a few K of RAM running BASIC...] -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 3 13:15:50 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Comodore SX64 monitor help needed. In-Reply-To: from "=?koi8-r?Q?=22?=stephen" at Sep 2, 3 10:24:52 am Message-ID: > i have an SX64 with a dead monitor, can anybody point me in the > direction of a schematic? I have a Commodore service manual which coers the 250622-01 and -02 monitors. These are NTSC and PAL versions of a colour monitor that runs on a 12V DC supply. Alas 'SX64' is not mentioned anywhere.. Could this be applicable? I don't have a scanner, but could certainly look things up for you. -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 3 13:19:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Tatung Einstein 256 In-Reply-To: <000901c371f0$f0f7d790$9600a8c0@Luis> from "=?iso-8859-1?Q?Luis_G=F3mez?=" at Sep 3, 3 09:56:50 am Message-ID: > I need information about this vintage computer. I'm trying connect > this computer to a monitor and build a PSU I doubt it's any help, but I have some info, including schematics, on the 'normal' Einstein with 64K RAM. The PSU is internal, and provides (IIRC), +5V, +12V and -12V. The monitor connector is a 6 pin (IIRC) DIN socket. Internal links set this to either R-Y, B-Y and Y (composite luma and sync) or RGB + sync. I have pinouts, etc if you think they're any use. -tony From bpope at wordstock.com Wed Sep 3 13:21:50 2003 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking In-Reply-To: from "Tony Duell" at Sep 3, 03 06:47:43 pm Message-ID: <200309031810.OAA19248@wordstock.com> And thusly Tony Duell spake: > > > [That happens to be a true statement, BTW. And I am not sure the 9830 is > a 'calculator' by any reasonable definition, as it's a desktop machine > with a few K of RAM running BASIC...] Sounds like a VIC-20... ;) Cheers, Bryan Pope From rogersda at cox.net Wed Sep 3 13:29:00 2003 From: rogersda at cox.net (rogersda@cox.net) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking Message-ID: <20030903182147.TFZS1408.fed1mtao05.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> > > It is probably a bad idea to spam (even if it is ~on-topic) > > your fans, > > It's no more on-topic than it would be if HP were spamming > about the new ES47 (unless dnpg are still selling* the > HUB90 stuff and friends). I hate to sound "clintonian" but it may depend on how one looks at it. From the labels on the boxes of DECserver 90s I've been replacing lately, it appears that DNPG is supplying the rebuilt spares and, from the serial numbers, some replacement spares are from current production where the old units were not repairable. Dale, the DECdude From pcw at mesanet.com Wed Sep 3 13:36:00 2003 From: pcw at mesanet.com (Peter C. Wallace) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Sep 2003, Fred N. van Kempen wrote: > Hi all, > > YAY! Took me a while to find it, but today marked the arrival > of my DEC RoamAbout wireless-LAN gear... a truly fun bit of > stuff to have. > > (I already have Cisco Aironet on the main network, but hoped > to be able to add DEC-branded stuff to the VAXlab network...which > now came true!) > > If anyone happens to have RoamAbout stuff laying around, and > would be willing to part with it, pse let me know! > > Cheers, > Fred > I hava a baseport missing the PCMCIA card that anyone can have for shipping costs... I may have an (flat square)antenna somewhere also Peter Wallace From kai at techie.com Wed Sep 3 13:44:00 2003 From: kai at techie.com (Wesley Widner) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: DEC OS In-Reply-To: <20030903182147.TFZS1408.fed1mtao05.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> Message-ID: <010601c3724a$41fc8380$0201a8c0@netmaster> I have a DEC Alphastation 500a and need to decide on an OS to put on it since I want to use it as a MySQL server. I've got a choice of WinNT, RH 7.3, Debain, FreeBSD and NetBSD. I've successfully loaded WindowsNT but I can't seem to find any alpha software for it so I'm leaning towards *nix systems instead. I've not been able to load the RH 7.3 supplied by support.compaq.com but I have been able to load Debain and had it working at one time but I wiped it out for some reason and have to reinstall it again. Anyhow, does anyone else have any suggestions on this subject? I'm leaning towards the BSD options at the moment. ---- ---Wesley Widner -- - From vcf at siconic.com Wed Sep 3 14:25:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Sep 2003, Peter C. Wallace wrote: > I hava a baseport missing the PCMCIA card that anyone can have for shipping > costs... I may have an (flat square)antenna somewhere also Peter, I think I'm interested in this. I'm going to be in the north Berkeley area this early afternoon. If you get this, please call me and I can swing by: 925/216-0569 Thanks! -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From arcarlini at iee.org Wed Sep 3 14:29:00 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Shipping from England In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030901212227.007c6100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <000601c37250$90ae2d70$5b01a8c0@athlon> > Does the UK offer any king of Book Rate or Media Rate > shipping? Not that I've ever heard of. 1st class, 2nd class, and various options for parcels. > The US Postal Service does and it's a LOT cheaper > than even surface mail. But you have to ask for it. It's not > even shown as an option for international shipping on their website. If I ever ship from the US again I'll be sure to ask for that. Is it actually available for international shipping? Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From jwest at classiccmp.org Wed Sep 3 14:40:01 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: OT Re: DEC OS References: <010601c3724a$41fc8380$0201a8c0@netmaster> Message-ID: <003501c37252$211f73e0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> FreeBSD runs mySQL very well, as long as you bear in mind the following... this all applies to FreeBSD v4.8 and prior. I wouldn't recommend the 5X train yet. 1) You MUST compile with the LINUX_THREADS option 2) You MUST use mySQL v4.X or higher #1 is because threading is somewhat broken on FreeBSD, always has been on releases prior to 5.X. However, this "brokeness" only appears under extremely heavy thread load so in typical (even production) use isn't noticed. By heavy load I'm talking about the mysql server eating up 99+% of the cpu. If you never hit that high of a load you won't have a problem. This thread issue is exacerbated specifically by mySQL and they way it is designed - many other (but not all) threaded applications don't have a problem. #2 is because FreeBSD has "BROKEN_REAL_PATH". If you use mysql v4.x and higher, this is taken care of for you (as well as another minor couple of things too specific to FreeBSD - this all assumes you are using the FreeBSD port). Rumor has it that threading is completely redone in FreeBSD v5x, so none of this may be a problem if you use 5X. However, last I checked, even on the current (v5.1) freebsd release, they are still recommending to stay away from threads till it's field proven. As a comparison to Linux, well, Linux has a severe problem with its virtual memory architecture, something FreeBSD excells in. I will take FreeBSD/mysql(as patched above)/great VM system, to Linux/mysql(no patching neede)/horrid VM system any day of the week. Jay West ----- Original Message ----- From: Wesley Widner To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2003 1:36 PM Subject: DEC OS I have a DEC Alphastation 500a and need to decide on an OS to put on it since I want to use it as a MySQL server. I've got a choice of WinNT, RH 7.3, Debain, FreeBSD and NetBSD. I've successfully loaded WindowsNT but I can't seem to find any alpha software for it so I'm leaning towards *nix systems instead. I've not been able to load the RH 7.3 supplied by support.compaq.com but I have been able to load Debain and had it working at one time but I wiped it out for some reason and have to reinstall it again. Anyhow, does anyone else have any suggestions on this subject? I'm leaning towards the BSD options at the moment. ---- ---Wesley Widner -- - From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 3 14:48:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Shipping from England In-Reply-To: <000601c37250$90ae2d70$5b01a8c0@athlon> References: <3.0.6.32.20030901212227.007c6100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030902195404.007b4c80@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 08:21 PM 9/3/03 +0100, you wrote: >> Does the UK offer any king of Book Rate or Media Rate >> shipping? > >Not that I've ever heard of. 1st class, 2nd class, and various >options for parcels. > >> The US Postal Service does and it's a LOT cheaper >> than even surface mail. But you have to ask for it. It's not >> even shown as an option for international shipping on their website. > >If I ever ship from the US again I'll be sure to ask for that. Is >it actually available for international shipping? It is for some areas including the UK and Australia but I don't know if it's available worldwide. As I said, it doesn't even show up as an option on their website so you have to ask for it. Around here you have to go to the post office and get a large canvas sack to put it in and fill out a tag that goes on the sack. I've sent stuff via bookrate for years and never had to do that before. I suspect that they're just making us do their job! Joe > >Antonio > >-- > >--------------- >Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From arcarlini at iee.org Wed Sep 3 15:53:01 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000101c3725c$6a480b90$5b01a8c0@athlon> > While not disputing that the original message was off-topic, > I thought that actually 'stuff _related_ to classic computing' could be > advertised here. I'd certainly agree with that, and I'd go for the more lenient "at least 10 years old" guideline rather than "not made for at least 10 years" anyway. OTOH: if someone wants to donate a G5 mac ... :-) Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From arcarlini at iee.org Wed Sep 3 15:58:00 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! In-Reply-To: <3F5534BB.20507@mdrconsult.com> Message-ID: <000201c3725d$083a7680$5b01a8c0@athlon> > I must be getting old - it never occured to me that > anything wireless > was old enough to be interesting.... The Roamabout stuff appeared pretty early on in the days of wireless networking - it's possibly even legitimately on-topic (although I'd have to go dig out some product catalogues to be sure one way or the other). At some stage, the firmware was upgraded to be 802.11b compliant, so a true collector seeking the authentic feel of mid-90s wlan will want to get hold of the older firmware. (Don't look at me - I have no Roamabouts AFAIK). Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 3 16:20:01 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking In-Reply-To: <200309031810.OAA19248@wordstock.com> from "Bryan Pope" at Sep 3, 3 02:10:40 pm Message-ID: > And thusly Tony Duell spake: > > > > > > [That happens to be a true statement, BTW. And I am not sure the 9830 is > > a 'calculator' by any reasonable definition, as it's a desktop machine > > with a few K of RAM running BASIC...] > > Sounds like a VIC-20... ;) YEah, but... It's got a 16 bit (sort-of, it's bit-serial with 16 bit registers) processor; it's got a 1-line LED display; the built-in BASIC is really cut-down (no string variables, for example), but if you add all the option ROM modules you get just about everything you'd expect including matrices; it's got the legendary HP build quality; _and_ it dates from 1973... It's a good few yearrs earlier than most 'home computers'... -tony From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Sep 3 16:25:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking In-Reply-To: <000101c3725c$6a480b90$5b01a8c0@athlon> References: <000101c3725c$6a480b90$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: <20030903141202.D70108@newshell.lmi.net> > I thought that actually 'stuff _related_ to classic computing' > could be advertised here. so,... if somebody finds a source for gears for the RS plotter/printer, or rollers for tape drives, or hammer pads for TTYs,... then it would be OK to post From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 3 16:36:01 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking In-Reply-To: <000101c3725c$6a480b90$5b01a8c0@athlon> from "Antonio Carlini" at Sep 3, 3 09:46:13 pm Message-ID: > > While not disputing that the original message was off-topic, > > I thought that actually 'stuff _related_ to classic computing' could > be > > advertised here. > > I'd certainly agree with that, and I'd go for the more lenient > "at least 10 years old" guideline rather than "not made for > at least 10 years" anyway. Agreed. I've always been the sort of person who goes by the obvious intent of the rules/regs, not the letter. Especaily when doing the former is of benefit to just about everyone. The intent of the rules on this list seem pretty clear to me. This is not the place to talk about relatively modern stuff. There are better places to do so, where you'll find people who are interested in such machines and who can provide a more useful/accurate answer (to be honest, whatever you may think of my knowledge of classic computers, I can assure you I know _nothing_ about modern PCs or Macs). However, if somebody has obtained some interesting toy that is not mainstream and which is only 9 years old, I would not expect them to get flamed for discussing it here. -tony From hitndahedfred at comcast.net Wed Sep 3 19:37:00 2003 From: hitndahedfred at comcast.net (fred townsend) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: 2813 manual Message-ID: <000801c371be$b467c3d0$82175344@c6w0p0> please,,please,,,would you copy the manual for me,,i have a 2813 but no white-papers,,,,thank you,,,fred townsend From billdeg at degnanco.com Wed Sep 3 19:38:38 2003 From: billdeg at degnanco.com (B.Degnan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Gridcase 1520 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030902223102.00a66ec0@mail.degnanco.net> Just Maybe.....?? Press "F" on booting for flop, "H" for HDD, "R" for ROM bd From waltje at pdp11.nl Wed Sep 3 20:25:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: DEC OS In-Reply-To: <200309032207.h83M7P6Q001625@onyx.spiritone.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Sep 2003, Zane H. Healy wrote: > The *BEST* OS to run on an Alpha is OpenVMS, and you can run MySQL under > OpenVMS, but I think it takes some effort. Err, now THAT is what I call flamebait. --fred From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Sep 3 20:26:01 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: The problems of organizing a computer collection In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Sep 2003, Cynde Moya wrote: > When you put the boards and such away, do you include a pouch of silica > gel to absorb the excess water and decrease the possibility of > corrosion? Does this matter? If you intend to seal the boards in plastic, I'd highly recommend the use of a silica gel pack. I don't mean just placing the board in an anti-static bag and possibly taping it closed, but actually heat sealing the anti-static bag, or even sealing the board/anti-static bag inside another anti-static bag (usually a different type of bag when double bagged). The most common reasons one might want to seal a board in plastic is to keep out all dust and humidity. For most computer boards, that is probably overkill. I could see it being a good idea for long term storage of certain hard drives though. Maybe this would also be a good idea for core memory boards? -Toth From waltje at pdp11.nl Wed Sep 3 20:26:03 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Sep 2003, Peter C. Wallace wrote: > I hava a baseport missing the PCMCIA card that anyone can have for shipping > costs... I may have an (flat square)antenna somewhere also Oooh! That would be great, but from what I have read, Sellam beat me to it.... [.. which reminds me, gotta beat him (up) a lil next time I'm there..] --f -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From dittman at dittman.net Wed Sep 3 20:41:00 2003 From: dittman at dittman.net (Eric Dittman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: DEC OS In-Reply-To: from "Fred N. van Kempen" at Sep 04, 2003 03:14:44 AM Message-ID: <20030904013346.14D667F83@dittman.net> > > The *BEST* OS to run on an Alpha is OpenVMS, and you can run MySQL under > > OpenVMS, but I think it takes some effort. > Err, now THAT is what I call flamebait. Not really. OpenVMS is the best OS for Alphas, since OpenVMS is the best overall OS. :-) How's that for flamebait? -- Eric Dittman dittman@dittman.net From pcw at mesanet.com Wed Sep 3 22:18:00 2003 From: pcw at mesanet.com (Peter C. Wallace) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Fred N. van Kempen wrote: > On Wed, 3 Sep 2003, Peter C. Wallace wrote: > > > I hava a baseport missing the PCMCIA card that anyone can have for shipping > > costs... I may have an (flat square)antenna somewhere also > Oooh! That would be great, but from what I have read, Sellam beat > me to it.... > > [.. which reminds me, gotta beat him (up) a lil next time I'm there..] > > --f Actually Eric Dittman beat him to it, but you can still beat up Sellam... > > -- > Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist > Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ > Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ > Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA > Peter Wallace From mikeford at socal.rr.com Wed Sep 3 22:31:01 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: barcode scanners, anyone? References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030903005814.02e8fb20@pop-server.socal.rr.com> <3F52CB05.9010207@mdrconsult.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <3F52A8D4.1050008@cox.net> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831223226.00a6ba70@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030831235952.08c13120@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030903200744.02dc08c0@pop-server.socal.rr.com> At 04:48 AM 9/3/03 -0400, Mail List wrote: >They did plug in >inline with the keyboard. If I found one that just worked, with no device >driver requirement, >just as though you had typed the characters on the keyboard, that would be >great. If it >were pen sized and shaped, so super small and compact, that would be even >better. >Does such a scanner exist? I'm getting kind of tired of devices that only >work with some >operating systems and not with others, or get left orphaned when a new >major release of >an operating system comes out. I keep vintage machines around for just that reason, but my guess is just what you describe is out there, in fact I think most older barcodes worked just like that, faking keyboard input. From donm at cts.com Wed Sep 3 22:52:00 2003 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030903180012.092202c0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Sep 2003, Mail List wrote: > Hello Antonio, > > > And the original definition of on-topic was something like > > "not sold commercially for at least 10 years"; under that > > definition this would clearly fail. > > There are a whole lot of items that most would consider on-topic that > third party commercial dealers are still selling. A better definition might > be items that haven't been sold by the original equipment manufacturer > for 10 years. > > Best Regards Or, why not simply items that apply/relate to equipment at least 10 years old? - don > At 06:06 PM 9/3/03 +0100, you wrote: > > > It is probably a bad idea to spam (even if it is ~on-topic) > > > your fans, > > > >It's no more on-topic than it would be if HP were spamming > >about the new ES47 (unless dnpg are still selling* the > >HUB90 stuff and friends). > > > >Antonio > > > >[*] And the original definition of on-topic was something like > >"not sold commercially for at least 10 years"; under that > >definition this would clearly fail. > > > > > >-- > > > >--------------- > >Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 4 00:32:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Some interesting stuff up on VCM Message-ID: I have these listings on the Vintage Computer Marketplace currently: DEC H7225-BF Constant Voltage Conditioner http://marketplace.vintage.org/view.cfm?ad=139 (1.2 * shipping or free for pickup in Livermore, CA) Acorn Electron http://marketplace.vintage.org/view.cfm?ad=25 $40 obo Sinclair ZX Spectrum http://marketplace.vintage.org/view.cfm?ad=24 $40 obo Sharp PC-5000 http://marketplace.vintage.org/bid.cfm?ad=113 Current bid: $1 -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Thu Sep 4 02:23:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030903180012.092202c0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030904030633.00a65e80@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Hello Don, > Or, why not simply items that apply/relate to equipment at least > 10 years old? That too. In fact, upon further reflection, I thought that there might still be items that were released 10+ years ago, that might now be considered classic, but might still be being manufactured new, and still sold, even by the original equipment manufacturer. No specific example comes to mind, but there must be some. So, I thought a refinement to be, "items which were originally released 10 or more years ago, regardless of whether or not still being made and sold", and as you have suggested, "items that apply/relate to equipment at least 10 years old" might be the best definition to apply as to whether or not an item is, or is not, on topic. Best Regards At 08:43 PM 9/3/03 -0700, you wrote: >On Wed, 3 Sep 2003, Mail List wrote: > > > Hello Antonio, > > > > > And the original definition of on-topic was something like > > > "not sold commercially for at least 10 years"; under that > > > definition this would clearly fail. > > > > There are a whole lot of items that most would consider on-topic that > > third party commercial dealers are still selling. A better definition might > > be items that haven't been sold by the original equipment manufacturer > > for 10 years. > > > > Best Regards > >Or, why not simply items that apply/relate to equipment at least >10 years old? > - don > > > At 06:06 PM 9/3/03 +0100, you wrote: > > > > It is probably a bad idea to spam (even if it is ~on-topic) > > > > your fans, > > > > > >It's no more on-topic than it would be if HP were spamming > > >about the new ES47 (unless dnpg are still selling* the > > >HUB90 stuff and friends). > > > > > >Antonio > > > > > >[*] And the original definition of on-topic was something like > > >"not sold commercially for at least 10 years"; under that > > >definition this would clearly fail. > > > > > > > > >-- > > > > > >--------------- > > >Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From Edward.Tillman at valero.com Thu Sep 4 03:04:00 2003 From: Edward.Tillman at valero.com (Tillman, Edward) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking Message-ID: Has anyone actually tried to scale "on-topic" into something we can wrap our arms around? Once upon a time, I was told that any platform carrying a version of Windows was off topic. What of my DEC SL486DX with DOS 5.0, WIndows 3.1 and Office 4.0? The DEC manufacturer's tag clearly shows a manufacture date of 1991 (so did some of the files I cleaned out of it...). A DEC recovery service tag also clearly shows a complete overhaul in 1993. Is it on-topic by year of manufacture, but off-topic because of its onboard applications? What applies? What doesn't? Ed Tillman Store Automation Tech Support Specialist Valero Energy Corporation San Antonio, Texas, USA Office: (210)592-3110, Fax (210)592-2048 Email: edward.tillman@valero.com -----Original Message----- From: Mail List [mailto:mail.list@analog-and-digital-solutions.com] Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 2:15 AM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: RE: Dec or Digital Networking Hello Don, > Or, why not simply items that apply/relate to equipment at least 10 years old? That too. In fact, upon further reflection, I thought that there might still be items that were released 10+ years ago, that might now be considered classic, but might still be being manufactured new, and still sold, even by the original equipment manufacturer. No specific example comes to mind, but there must be some. So, I thought a refinement to be, "items which were originally released 10 or more years ago, regardless of whether or not still being made and sold", and as you have suggested, "items that apply/relate to equipment at least 10 years old" might be the best definition to apply as to whether or not an item is, or is not, on topic. Best Regards [...] Pared for bandwidth... -- Ed From llyon at commodore.thebbs.org Thu Sep 4 03:17:00 2003 From: llyon at commodore.thebbs.org (Lance Lyon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking References: Message-ID: <013701c372bb$c9312d80$0100a8c0@LANCE> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tillman, Edward" To: Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 5:55 PM Subject: RE: Dec or Digital Networking > Has anyone actually tried to scale "on-topic" into something we can wrap our > arms around? Once upon a time, I was told that any platform carrying a > version of Windows was off topic. Indeed, in another 2 years Windows 95 will fall into the 10+ year range. cheers, Lance // http://commodore.thebbs.org telnet://commodore.thebbs.org Since 1987 - Australia's oldest Amiga BBS // From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Thu Sep 4 03:40:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking In-Reply-To: <013701c372bb$c9312d80$0100a8c0@LANCE> References: Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030904043029.061bec30@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Hello Lance, > Indeed, in another 2 years Windows 95 will fall into the 10+ year range. Yikes! Now I know I'm getting old. Best Regards At 06:08 PM 9/4/03 +1000, you wrote: >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Tillman, Edward" >To: >Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 5:55 PM >Subject: RE: Dec or Digital Networking > > > > Has anyone actually tried to scale "on-topic" into something we can wrap >our > > arms around? Once upon a time, I was told that any platform carrying a > > version of Windows was off topic. > >Indeed, in another 2 years Windows 95 will fall into the 10+ year range. > >cheers, > >Lance > >// http://commodore.thebbs.org > telnet://commodore.thebbs.org > Since 1987 - Australia's oldest Amiga BBS // From Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com Thu Sep 4 04:03:01 2003 From: Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com (Andreas Freiherr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: DEC Server References: <030903081425.af3a@splab.cas.neu.edu> Message-ID: <3F56FB12.9060404@Vishay.com> TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu wrote: > Decserver 100's are terminal servers for going from terminals that use > 3 wires (rcv,xmt, gnd) to ethernet. The connection is for an AUI, which > normally goes to thick-wire ethernet, but can adapt to normal ethernet. > The biggest problem, as I recall, is they only speak LAT, so if you want > to hook up terminals to something that doesn't run DECNET/LAT you have > a tough time. Of course, us VMS guys don't care. > > That's what I remember. Anybody else, please correct me if the memory > is wrong... > > Joe Heck No reason for a correction: it was indeed DECnet and LAT only. Somebody please fill me in, but I think the DECserver 300 was the first to talk Telnet, starting at firmware V2.0? Except, perhaps, that thickwire was the "normal Ethernet" at those times. Unlike some later / third-party models, the original DECservers always had to download their operating system from a host on the network. Commonly, the host was a VAX or PDP-11, but software for other machines (including DOS PCs, provided they were running DECnet-DOS) existed. If you turn power on without a load host on your network, you may, depending on local settings on the DECserver, see messages on the console port (any of the eight terminal ports) reporting "load failures". DECnet (MOP, to be more precise) was used for software download and upline dumps (the latter was rare, I remember having excellent stability and very long uptimes with all DECservers except the MUXserver 100) exclusively, while LAT was used for the actual sessions (connections from terminal ports to hosts on the net). LAT is *not* part of DECnet (which is often claimed), it's a separate protocol. However, it was common to run LAT on a host that also would run DECnet. The DECserver 100 hardware is, BTW, based on a Motorola 68000, and there is even a low-level monitor program included in the load software, so you can retrieve hex dumps from the DECserver's memory etc. Hope that helps. In case you don't want your unit any more, throw it at me! ;-) Andreas -- Andreas Freiherr Vishay Semiconductor GmbH, Heilbronn, Germany http://www.vishay.com From luc at e2t.be Thu Sep 4 04:09:00 2003 From: luc at e2t.be (Luc Vande Velde) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720ED292@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD6BB@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Fred, I have piles of this AUI cables (in nice blue color even) Im sure I can spare a few And Belgium is a bit closer for you then the us ;)) gr. Luc -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]Namens David Woyciesjes Verzonden: woensdag 3 september 2003 15:46 Aan: cctalk@classiccmp.org; waltje@pdp11.nl Onderwerp: Re: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! "Fred N. van Kempen" wrote: > > DELNI ethernet hubs (yes, I need more AUI cables... anyone?) I think I can help out here, I have a bunch here in New Haven, CT, USA. And 2 DELNIs I want to get rid of also... -- --- Dave Woyciesjes --- ICQ# 905818 From Edward.Tillman at valero.com Thu Sep 4 07:09:01 2003 From: Edward.Tillman at valero.com (Tillman, Edward) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking Message-ID: Indeed... So, what qualifies at "on-topic?" Who's the "Chief Mugwump of the Wizengamot" who can Ed Tillman Store Automation Tech Support Specialist Valero Energy Corporation San Antonio, Texas, USA Office: (210)592-3110, Fax (210)592-2048 Email: edward.tillman@valero.com -----Original Message----- From: Lance Lyon [mailto:llyon@commodore.thebbs.org] Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 3:09 AM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: Re: Dec or Digital Networking ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tillman, Edward" To: Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 5:55 PM Subject: RE: Dec or Digital Networking > Has anyone actually tried to scale "on-topic" into something we can wrap our arms around? Once upon a time, I was told that any platform carrying a > version of Windows was off topic. Indeed, in another 2 years Windows 95 will fall into the 10+ year range. cheers, Lance From kandres at epssecurity.com Thu Sep 4 07:48:01 2003 From: kandres at epssecurity.com (Kevin Andres) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: GRIDCASE 1520 Message-ID: Guys, You are right on. I sent some info to Jim privately. I still have a plasma GRIDCASE 1520 running on my bench, using DOS to exercise some obsolete equipment that I repair. The Cmos battery is gone so it can't remember its hard drive type, but as long as I can boot to floppy or the ROM it runs fine. I just don't see putting the time into the battery issue right now. It was limited, 1520 anyway, to 40M tops as I recall, the accessable COM port was 2 instead of 1, the internal modem used COM1. The BIOS is machine code and was NOT user accessable. The closest you could get was a utility called GRIDSCAN, which would show the various settings, but you couldn't change them. The startup routine would get so far and you hit "F" for floppy, "H" for hard drive, "E" for external pack. The machine would look for ROM (2 slots) at reboot, so if you were lucky enough to have the DOS 3.3 ROM then it would come up in DOS and you could go from there. I had used it in the field a lot. It has a metal case and is near indestructible. Plus the equipment I used it on was usually located in dark areas, so the plasma display was nice. Also in reference to the water damaged manual, the professionals suggest nothing for after the fact restoration from adherence. They claim freezing it at -15 to hold then freeze drying seems to be the answer. Look at www.mcfoa.org/disasterplan.pdf . Sounds like its time to make coffee! Kev From dwoyciesjes at comcast.net Thu Sep 4 08:31:00 2003 From: dwoyciesjes at comcast.net (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! References: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD6BB@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <3F573CC0.34249845@comcast.net> Cool, I was hoping, for Fred's sake, that someone closer would be able to help him out. Anyway, I'm still looking to get rid of my AUI cables and DELNIs. Free. Come get them, or get ahold of me to make shipping arrangements. *Apologies for this ad, but I know you guys will use whatever you get from me...* Also, I still have piles of stuff in my garage to get rid of. Same deal, free, come and get it. I can ship small items, and small quantities, but not large boxes right now. Two guys are stopping by tonight for some things, but I'm sure there will be stuff left. The list is here... http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dwoyciesjes/hardware.htm If you do want to give me something for whatever you take, look here... http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dwoyciesjes/wanted.html Luc Vande Velde wrote: > > Fred, I have piles of this AUI cables (in nice blue color even) > Im sure I can spare a few > And Belgium is a bit closer for you then the us ;)) > > gr. > > Luc > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > > "Fred N. van Kempen" wrote: > > > > DELNI ethernet hubs (yes, I need more AUI cables... anyone?) > > I think I can help out here, I have a bunch here in New Haven, CT, USA. > And 2 DELNIs I want to get rid of also... > > -- -- --- Dave Woyciesjes --- ICQ# 905818 From waltje at pdp11.nl Thu Sep 4 08:33:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking In-Reply-To: <000101c3725c$6a480b90$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Sep 2003, Antonio Carlini wrote: > OTOH: if someone wants to donate a G5 mac ... :-) Dude, stop using computers that sound like baskets of fruit... --f From waltje at pdp11.nl Thu Sep 4 08:34:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking In-Reply-To: <20030903141202.D70108@newshell.lmi.net> Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Sep 2003, Fred Cisin wrote: > so,... > if somebody finds a source for gears for the RS plotter/printer, > or rollers for tape drives, or hammer pads for TTYs,... > then it would be OK to post Most definitely! --f From waltje at pdp11.nl Thu Sep 4 08:37:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: Cool addition: DEC RoamAbout ! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Sep 2003, Peter C. Wallace wrote: > Actually Eric Dittman beat him to it, but you can still beat up Sellam... Ohh! Can I? Can I? *jumps up and down, Donkey-style* Duh. Eric beat me to the goodies. Bah. --fred (pouty) From waltje at pdp11.nl Thu Sep 4 08:40:01 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:40 2005 Subject: On/OffTopic criteria (was: RE: Dec or Digital Networking) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Bah.. people, try to keep subjects sane :) > Has anyone actually tried to scale "on-topic" into something we can wrap our > arms around? Once upon a time, I was told that any platform carrying a > version of Windows was off topic. What of my DEC SL486DX with DOS 5.0, > WIndows 3.1 and Office 4.0? The DEC manufacturer's tag clearly shows a > manufacture date of 1991 (so did some of the files I cleaned out of it...). > A DEC recovery service tag also clearly shows a complete overhaul in 1993. > Is it on-topic by year of manufacture, but off-topic because of its onboard > applications? What applies? What doesn't? Hmm.. or, how about selecting on the basis of things still being in active production or not? The SL486DX in your example might not fit the 10-year rule, but since it is no longer in production (read: EOL, EOP), it "probably" will fit the "no longer supported, probably still used, and if interesting to someone, probably collected by someone" rule, making it a ClassicCmp issue.. --f From jwest at classiccmp.org Thu Sep 4 08:46:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: On/OffTopic criteria (was: RE: Dec or Digital Networking) References: Message-ID: <00f601c372e9$b3639460$033310ac@kwcorp.com> The current criteria is anything not produced for at least 10 years. Thus, by my thoughts... the machine in question here is on topic. The windows O/S on it is not. From e.huininga at sozawe.groningen.nl Thu Sep 4 09:34:01 2003 From: e.huininga at sozawe.groningen.nl (Eelco Huininga) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: BBC Micro 6809 2nd proc Message-ID: > I mentioned some time ago that I'd once built a second processor for > the BBC micro using a 6809. > [...] nice job! > [...] > - I guess the final working binary is still in the eprom - it > does still boot up! Any chance you'll be able to get the code from the eprom? Cheers, Eelco From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Thu Sep 4 10:23:00 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: BBC Micro 6809 2nd proc In-Reply-To: <200309012303.h81N3OWO028056@gtoal.com> Message-ID: <20030904151520.26490.qmail@web21104.mail.yahoo.com> --- Graham Toal wrote: > I mentioned some time ago that I'd once built a second processor for > the BBC micro using a 6809. > ... > I also found an HP Plotfile which *may* be the layout of this > chip that I'd love to see again Paint Shop Pro's attempt at rendering it is at: http://www.moosenet.demon.co.uk/temp/plotfile.jpg in a much-reduced 697x606 form (~ 100KB transfer) The default render was four times that size (pixel-wise) and chews up 14MB on disk in PSP's own format. Doesn't mean anything to me, but it might be familar to you. I think I still have a pile of 6809s somewhere... cheers Jules ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From uban at ubanproductions.com Thu Sep 4 10:42:00 2003 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: Imlac PDS-1 Function Location In-Reply-To: <3F16CBE1.3020200@tiac.net> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030716181801.03dd0bc8@mail.ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20030904103055.02042c58@mail.ubanproductions.com> Hey Bob, I've made a copy of my PDS-1 and PDS-1D schematic sets (11x17) for Al Kossow to scan. I had made a PDS-1D set for him before, but it was incomplete. My copy of the PDS-1 is missing the Function Location diagram which indicates where each of the cards is located. Do you have that sheet in your schematic set? If so, do you have a scanner, or could you make a xerox of that sheet and send it to Al to incorporate into the set I am sending him? --tnx --tom From allain at panix.com Thu Sep 4 11:14:00 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: OffT: netBSD on OnT: Mac References: <00f601c372e9$b3639460$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Message-ID: <009d01c372fe$0d7d9720$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> My question is a little OT, I'm trying to get a 1993 Mac LC575 (68040) to run 2000 netBSD 1.5. Already I've pored over, line by line, the 'install' doc included for arcana since I'm getting neither a simple fail or success and there are few warnings in it, no big red flags. Here's the relevant symptoms: booting to kernel_install gives me a fs that df says is 2MB in size, and I haven't found instructions to mount the other fs (following). There were problems with all the other kernels, like generic. Using the Mac side installer has allowed base and other installs (over 20MB), and they're persistent, but the included boot kernels don't seem to access it. All I get is the MiniShell. Changes to the 2MB fs in the kernel boot are temporary, as if all i'm seeing is an in-memory kernfs. If you've seen this yourself, let me know, else have a happy one. Since my question is OT maybe you should reply directly, not that I expect a lot of bandwidth anyway . John A. From kth at srv.net Thu Sep 4 11:23:00 2003 From: kth at srv.net (Kevin Handy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: Digital DSM Disribution tape In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F576FB9.4090002@srv.net> Fred N. van Kempen wrote: >On Mon, 1 Sep 2003, Luc Vande Velde wrote: > > > >>Someone asked a few weeks ago for a copy of the DSM distribution >>tape.(9track 1600bpi) >> >> >Yes, that was Sergio and me. > > > >>If someone can tell me how to make it available I have my ears >>wide open; or if someone is willing to do that's even better >> >> >I already offered to come pick it up, image it, and put it online >for those who want it... :) > > I have a TK25 tape with a typewritten label 'DSM 3.1 Operating System / 4-25-86'. I don't know if it really contains that, and I don't have a TK25 set up to work right now, but if anyone wants it, let me know. (USA address preferably: shipping costs you know.) From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 4 11:27:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: It has been a while since we've gone through this again, but this has to be probably the 8th time... On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Tillman, Edward wrote: > Has anyone actually tried to scale "on-topic" into something we can wrap our > arms around? Once upon a time, I was told that any platform carrying a > version of Windows was off topic. What of my DEC SL486DX with DOS 5.0, > WIndows 3.1 and Office 4.0? The DEC manufacturer's tag clearly shows a > manufacture date of 1991 (so did some of the files I cleaned out of it...). > A DEC recovery service tag also clearly shows a complete overhaul in 1993. > Is it on-topic by year of manufacture, but off-topic because of its onboard > applications? What applies? What doesn't? The bottom line is this: do you really want to trudge through a bunch of boring discussions about PCs and Windows? I certainly do not. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Thu Sep 4 11:38:01 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: OffT: netBSD on OnT: Mac In-Reply-To: <009d01c372fe$0d7d9720$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <20030904163012.66203.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com> --- John Allain wrote: > My question is a little OT, I'm trying to get a 1993 > Mac LC575 (68040) to run 2000 netBSD 1.5. you might want to try asking on one of the Mac mailing lists - see: http://www.lowendmac.com/500/lc575.shtml good luck! Jules ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From rogersda at cox.net Thu Sep 4 11:47:00 2003 From: rogersda at cox.net (rogersda@cox.net) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: DEC OS Message-ID: <20030904163914.XYBC15700.fed1mtao02.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> > > > The *BEST* OS to run on an Alpha is OpenVMS, and you can run MySQL under > > > OpenVMS, but I think it takes some effort. > > > > Err, now THAT is what I call flamebait. > > Not really. OpenVMS is the best OS for Alphas, since OpenVMS is the best overall > OS. :-) Took the words right out of my mouth. ;) Dale, the DECdude From dwoyciesjes at comcast.net Thu Sep 4 11:49:01 2003 From: dwoyciesjes at comcast.net (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: OffT: netBSD on OnT: Mac References: <20030904163012.66203.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3F576AF8.32A56C54@comcast.net> Jules Richardson wrote: > > --- John Allain wrote: > > My question is a little OT, I'm trying to get a 1993 > > Mac LC575 (68040) to run 2000 netBSD 1.5. > > you might want to try asking on one of the Mac mailing lists - see: > > http://www.lowendmac.com/500/lc575.shtml > > good luck! > > Jules > Or even better yet, try the NetBSD Mac/68k mailing list... http://www.netbsd.org/Ports/mac68k/ and the archives at http://mail-index.netbsd.org/port-mac68k/ -- --- Dave Woyciesjes --- ICQ# 905818 From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Thu Sep 4 11:50:00 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030904164218.36955.qmail@web21102.mail.yahoo.com> nice subject :) > The bottom line is this: do you really want to trudge through a bunch of > boring discussions about PCs and Windows? > > I certainly do not. Not if they're boring, no. The way I see it the list seems to pretty much manage itself though - whether people are even reading the 'official' topic guidelines or not. The diversions into guns or cars that seem to crop up every now and then aside, the computing aspect of things seems to stay largely 'on topic' in my mind in that it seems to typically fit with what I'd call 'classic'. When there are computer-related posts about something reasonably new then the poster normally has a good enough reason for asking here, and I would have though those posts can be forgiven. The signal to noise ratio is still low, and I would expect that (almost) everyone receives posts that are notionally 'on topic' but oof no interest to them anyway. I don't see any need to get our panties in a twist and thrash out what is and isn't on topic to be honest - it all seems to work well enough already as far as I can see. cheers Jules ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From jruschme at netzero.net Thu Sep 4 12:03:00 2003 From: jruschme at netzero.net (John Ruschmeyer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]On > Behalf Of Vintage Computer Festival > > > The bottom line is this: do you really want to trudge through a bunch of > boring discussions about PCs and Windows? > > I certainly do not. Er, not really... but then I go MEGO on the days when I have to wade though lots of PDP or Vax posts. (Almost makes me wonder if this list should split into a number of more "targeted" lists.) Regardless, does anyone know of a good set of forums/lists for discussion of older PC/Dos/Windows issues? I'm thinking of something like the LowEndMac lists, but PC-based. <<>> From arcarlini at iee.org Thu Sep 4 12:21:01 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: DEC Server In-Reply-To: <3F56FB12.9060404@Vishay.com> Message-ID: <000a01c37307$ceaaa100$5b01a8c0@athlon> > No reason for a correction: it was indeed DECnet and LAT BTW: Someone else said that DS100 was the DEC first terminal server. But the DECSA (PDP-11/24 based) preceded it. (I think that was code named Pluto; if it wasn't, then there must have been an even earlier one). > only. Somebody please fill me in, but I think the DECserver 300 was the > first to talk Telnet, starting at firmware V2.0? The DS100 and DS200 didn't do telnet, at least none o fmine ever did and I think I had the latest download code for both of them. The DS300 did, and you may be right about V2.0 firmware being required. > Except, perhaps, that thickwire was the "normal Ethernet" at > those times. Thickwire was common, but Thinwire was certainly on the up and up. Even thickwire tended to be mostly a big yellow snake in the ceiling dropping down to racks with DELNIs and then AUI to everything in the rack. > DECnet (MOP, to be more precise) was used for software download and > from terminal ports to hosts on the net). LAT is *not* part of DECnet > (which is often claimed), it's a separate protocol. However, it was > common to run LAT on a host that also would run DECnet. MOP isn't part of DECnet either. > The DECserver 100 hardware is, BTW, based on a Motorola > 68000, and there > is even a low-level monitor program included in the load software, so > you can retrieve hex dumps from the DECserver's memory etc. There used to be a tech manual for one of (or maybe both of) the DS100 or DS200 with enough detail that you could write your own firmware for it. I've never seen that manual, but it would be nice if it magically appeared and someone scanned it for us! 68000 and variants were used by many products produced by various parts of DEC's Networking group on both sides of the Atlantic. (The DECservers, the HUB stuff, many of the WAN host interfaces). Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From jrice54 at charter.net Thu Sep 4 12:30:00 2003 From: jrice54 at charter.net (James Rice) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: <20030904164218.36955.qmail@web21102.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030904164218.36955.qmail@web21102.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3F5772F7.1040703@charter.net> I agree that the list runs fairly well without a "list nazi" stomping around policing everyone's posts. I'm on several Mac lists on LEM. I posted a question on a list and was slapped down by the list police. It concerned a Daystar Genesis with a G4 upgrade card running OS-X. It seems that it wasn't welcome on the Powermac list becase Apple didn't make it. It wasn't welcome on OldMacMP list because it wasn't running it's original MP processor card and it wasn't welcome on the G-List becasue it wasn't a factory G-4. The only place it was considered on topic was on the Unsupported-X list. >The bottom line is this: do you really want to trudge through a bunch of >boring discussions about PCs and Windows? > >I certainly do not. > > It depends. I find Sgi VW320/540 workstations worthy of discussion as well as the Intergraph NT based systems. How about a Raptor-3. NT based, but hardly your father's Dell. I'm interested in Sgi's, NeXT, Sun's, Mac's and older DOS machines. I wade through lots of posts about DEC's and other big iron that I never read because that's not my thing. http://webpages.charter.net/jrice54/classiccomp2.html From jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de Thu Sep 4 12:34:00 2003 From: jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de (Jochen Kunz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: DEC OS In-Reply-To: <20030903215251.8DB7F7F83@dittman.net>; from dittman@dittman.net on Wed, Sep 03, 2003 at 23:52:51 %z References: <20030903215251.8DB7F7F83@dittman.net> Message-ID: <20030904172421.GM1354@oblina.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> On 2003.09.03 23:52 Eric Dittman wrote: > Didn't Linux run on Alpha in 64-bit mode before NetBSD? http://www.netbsd.org/Ports/alpha/ NetBSD/alpha is a true 64-bit system that fully implements the LP64 architecture, using 64-bit pointers and 64-bit long integers (standard integers are still 32 bits) in a linear four terabyte (4TB) address space. NetBSD/alpha was the first free OS to run on the Alpha and supports by far the largest number of alpha system types of any free OS. -- tsch??, Jochen Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/ From jbmcb at hotmail.com Thu Sep 4 12:44:00 2003 From: jbmcb at hotmail.com (Jason McBrien) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) References: Message-ID: I don't mind old PC/MAC posts as long as they are geared towards the more esoteric hardware. "I can't get my monitor to work on my Performa 400" is probably the wrong question to ask in this forum, but "Anyone know how to access the LCD panel on an Apricot 486?" is just wierd enough. We could have a "recomended" models covered list for Macs, and maybe divvy up the PC compatables by bus type/processor. I'd say EISA and MCA based PC's are odd enough to be covered by classiccmp, especially because most manufacturers that made the cards are gone or don't support them anymore. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vintage Computer Festival" To: Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 12:11 PM Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) > It has been a while since we've gone through this again, but this has to > be probably the 8th time... > > On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Tillman, Edward wrote: > > > Has anyone actually tried to scale "on-topic" into something we can wrap our > > arms around? Once upon a time, I was told that any platform carrying a > > version of Windows was off topic. What of my DEC SL486DX with DOS 5.0, > > WIndows 3.1 and Office 4.0? The DEC manufacturer's tag clearly shows a > > manufacture date of 1991 (so did some of the files I cleaned out of it...). > > A DEC recovery service tag also clearly shows a complete overhaul in 1993. > > Is it on-topic by year of manufacture, but off-topic because of its onboard > > applications? What applies? What doesn't? > > The bottom line is this: do you really want to trudge through a bunch of > boring discussions about PCs and Windows? > > I certainly do not. > > -- > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage mputers ] > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From dittman at dittman.net Thu Sep 4 13:06:01 2003 From: dittman at dittman.net (Eric Dittman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: DEC OS In-Reply-To: <20030904172421.GM1354@oblina.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> from "Jochen Kunz" at Sep 04, 2003 07:24:21 PM Message-ID: <20030904175820.F3B7C7F83@dittman.net> > > Didn't Linux run on Alpha in 64-bit mode before NetBSD? > http://www.netbsd.org/Ports/alpha/ > > NetBSD/alpha is a true 64-bit system that fully implements the LP64 > architecture, using 64-bit pointers and 64-bit long integers (standard > integers are still 32 bits) in a linear four terabyte (4TB) address > space. NetBSD/alpha was the first free OS to run on the Alpha and > supports by far the largest number of alpha system types of any free OS. Linux was the first free OS to run on the Alpha (in 32-bit mode). NetBSD was the first free 64-bit OS. It predated the 64-bit version of Linux/Alpha by about five months. Linux did support SMP on the Alpha in 64-bit mode long before NetBSD. -- Eric Dittman dittman@dittman.net From healyzh at aracnet.com Thu Sep 4 13:10:00 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: <3F5772F7.1040703@charter.net> References: <20030904164218.36955.qmail@web21102.mail.yahoo.com> <3F5772F7.1040703@charter.net> Message-ID: >>The bottom line is this: do you really want to trudge through a bunch of >>boring discussions about PCs and Windows? >> >>I certainly do not. > >It depends. I find Sgi VW320/540 workstations worthy of discussion as well as the Intergraph NT based systems. How about a Raptor-3. NT based, but hardly your father's Dell. I'm interested in Sgi's, NeXT, Sun's, Mac's and older DOS machines. I wade through lots of posts about DEC's and other big iron that I never read because that's not my thing. Personally I've always considered there to be a "Coolness" clause to the 10-year rule. Which covers stuff like SGI's, NeXT (I guess they're all finally on topic now), and even really cool PC hardware (the SGI VW320/540's would probably fall under this clause). As most probably know, my area of interest has pretty much solidified on DEC Hardware and software. I basically use DEC HW/SW and a Mac at home, but I'm still interested in "Cool" computers (which accounts for the 270Mhz R12000 based SGI o2 sitting here next to my monitor). Currently the main PC hardware that counts as "Cool" in my book are the VIA EPIA Mini-ITX boards, which are *definitely* off topic, but cool becuase of what you can do with them. I personally want to get one to build a very low power PDP-10, I'd run a stripped down Linux and use KLH10 to run TOPS-10 or TOPS-20 on it. I really don't want to trudge through a bunch of PC and Windows discussions here, but I've got to admit that if I ever find the time to setup a DOS box like I've been wanting to, I'll probably have a few questions (it's been over 10 years since I really did anything with DOS), and I'll probably ask them here. Zane -- -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 4 13:54:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, John Ruschmeyer wrote: > Er, not really... but then I go MEGO on the days when I have to wade though > lots of PDP or Vax posts. (Almost makes me wonder if this list should split > into a number of more "targeted" lists.) We also discussed and summarily dismissed that concept in the past. I think we should put together an archive of all the past "10 year rule" threads and put them on a website somewhere. Then, whenever someone (inevitably) brings this up we can refer them to the website. Members of this mailing list need to realize that this list has been around now for 6.5 years, and it's always been like this, and it probably always will (well, with the exception of the CCTALK/CCTECH split, which I ignore anyway). No matter how many times it's argued over, the consensus will be that we just don't want to discuss 10 year old PCs or Windows. > Regardless, does anyone know of a good set of forums/lists for discussion of > older PC/Dos/Windows issues? I'm thinking of something like the LowEndMac > lists, but PC-based. http://www.oldskool.org -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 4 13:56:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Zane H. Healy wrote: > Personally I've always considered there to be a "Coolness" clause to the > 10-year rule. Which covers stuff like SGI's, NeXT (I guess they're all > finally on topic now), and even really cool PC hardware (the SGI > VW320/540's would probably fall under this clause). True, coolness factor counts for a lot. I guess the bottom line is that if someone is getting way too PC, they'll hear about it from others. > I really don't want to trudge through a bunch of PC and Windows > discussions here, but I've got to admit that if I ever find the time to > setup a DOS box like I've been wanting to, I'll probably have a few > questions (it's been over 10 years since I really did anything with DOS), > and I'll probably ask them here. As with everything, with enough time passed, even DOS and Windows will be interesting to discuss. Just not right now. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From cb at mythtech.net Thu Sep 4 14:02:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) Message-ID: >I agree that the list runs fairly well without a "list nazi" stomping >around policing everyone's posts. I'm on several Mac lists on LEM. I >posted a question on a list and was slapped down by the list police. It >concerned a Daystar Genesis with a G4 upgrade card running OS-X. It >seems that it wasn't welcome on the Powermac list becase Apple didn't >make it. It wasn't welcome on OldMacMP list because it wasn't running >it's original MP processor card and it wasn't welcome on the G-List >becasue it wasn't a factory G-4. The only place it was considered on >topic was on the Unsupported-X list. The LEM lists, while can be helpful, are VERY VERY bad examples of a "nice" list. They are however great examples of how to run a list who's goal is to piss off every subscriber inside of 6 months. The nazis they have as list nannies are unreal, and the list mom may be the worst of the bunch. I think even Sellam would find their level of topic policing to be too much ;-) -chris From oldcomp at cox.net Thu Sep 4 14:18:00 2003 From: oldcomp at cox.net (Bryan Blackburn) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) References: Message-ID: <3F578D7C.2060609@cox.net> I have a delete key on my keyboard. It works, but it would get way too much use if we started running windoze tech support threads. IMHO, if it has an 8086 or higher processor, it's neither interesting nor vintage. :) (I would be happier if the list drew a firm line in the sand at 1980!) -Bryan From teoz at neo.rr.com Thu Sep 4 14:39:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) References: Message-ID: <000801c3731b$0377cd00$347ca418@neo.rr.com> Well if there is a 10 year rule that would mean anything from mid 1993 and earlier, which catches alot of the commodity PC era almost up to windows 95. Everybody here has a special era they collect and have knowledge of, thats the reason I joined the list. As newer and younger people join the list I would assume the focus would change to newer equipment. If you want to keep this list from moving into the newer machines then you probably want to have a specific dateline of what is on topic and what is not. This would keep people from joining and talking about a class of machines that most users dont care about. I personally dont care much about the early 90's intel pc architecture, but I do care about the addons that pertain to gaming (classic sound cards, video cards, memory managers, etc.) same with the early 8 bits and later 16 bit home computers (c64, Amiga 500/1200, Atari 800/ ST, Apple II). I also get into early macs (IIfx, 840av, 950 aws, a few PCI macs) some for their architecture and some just because the video capture hardware I am interested in run on those machines. Most people hate hearing the common questions repeated over and over, but if you just direct those people to places where they can get their feet wet they will probably learn enough to get into that particular equipment and come back with some really good discusions down the road. It keeps any list from stagnating because sooner or later the old members will have talked everything to death. From jrice54 at charter.net Thu Sep 4 14:47:00 2003 From: jrice54 at charter.net (James Rice) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: References: <20030904164218.36955.qmail@web21102.mail.yahoo.com> <3F5772F7.1040703@charter.net> Message-ID: <3F5792FA.40506@charter.net> I agree with the "Coolness clause". I guess I like hardware that is not the usual Dell/HP/Gateway crap. After working on that multi-giga-hertz junk all day and battling the lastest worm/virus , I have to go home to a refreshing session on my 33mhz R3000 Iris indigo or my 33mhz Turbo Dimension NeXT Cube. Now this is OT but I think it's cool. My company outfitted all the service techs with Tablet PC's last week for record keeping in the field. We actually got them before the suits and sales droids. I will have to admit, they are cool. It's the closest thing to an electronic notebook I've ever played with. James Zane H. Healy wrote: >Personally I've always considered there to be a "Coolness" clause to the 10-year rule. Which covers stuff like SGI's, NeXT (I guess they're all finally on topic now), and even really cool PC hardware (the SGI VW320/540's would probably fall under this clause). From jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de Thu Sep 4 15:21:00 2003 From: jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de (Jochen Kunz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: DEC OS In-Reply-To: <20030904175820.F3B7C7F83@dittman.net>; from dittman@dittman.net on Thu, Sep 04, 2003 at 19:58:20 %z References: <20030904175820.F3B7C7F83@dittman.net> Message-ID: <20030904185250.GQ1354@oblina.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> On 2003.09.04 19:58 Eric Dittman wrote: > > > Didn't Linux run on Alpha in 64-bit mode before NetBSD? > > http://www.netbsd.org/Ports/alpha/ > > > > NetBSD/alpha is a true 64-bit system that fully implements the LP64 > > architecture, using 64-bit pointers and 64-bit long integers > (standard > > integers are still 32 bits) in a linear four terabyte (4TB) address > > space. NetBSD/alpha was the first free OS to run on the Alpha and > > supports by far the largest number of alpha system types of any free > OS. I should have written below the URI: "On this web site is written:" > Linux was the first free OS to run on the Alpha (in 32-bit mode). Maybe. But runing in 32 bit mode on Alpha is typical Linux. Instead of doing it right from the beginning, make a kludge to get somthing running in some way. > NetBSD was the first free 64-bit OS. As I wrote. > It predated the 64-bit version > of Linux/Alpha by about five months. Maybe. I don't care about Linux/Alpha. > Linux did support SMP on the Alpha in 64-bit mode long before NetBSD. Sure. NetBSD/Alpha (and NetBSD/VAX) SMP came with NetBSD 1.6. The "problem" with SMP and NetBSD is that the NetBSD folks are doing things The Right Way (C) (R) (TM) right from the start, even when The Right Way (C) (R) (TM) takes longer. SMP needs a lot of well thought out infrastructure work, especially on an OS that supports that many platforms like NetBSD. After the 1.6 release with SMP base support many platforms (notably sparc, macppc, i386) got SMP very quick. But we are drifting OT now. Back to the original question about an OS for an Alpha to run MySQL: What about Tru64? There is a US$ 99 hobbyist licence available. I like NetBSD very much, but have to admit that Tru64 is a _far_ more capable OS. OpenVMS is, no discussions, very capable but not everyones "taste". -- tsch??, Jochen Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/ From vance at neurotica.com Thu Sep 4 15:22:00 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: <3F578D7C.2060609@cox.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Bryan Blackburn wrote: > IMHO, if it has an 8086 or higher processor, it's neither interesting > nor vintage. :) (I would be happier if the list drew a firm line in the > sand at 1980!) Wouldn't that leave out machines like the PDP-11/93? Peace... Sridhar From zmerch at 30below.com Thu Sep 4 15:26:01 2003 From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: <000801c3731b$0377cd00$347ca418@neo.rr.com> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030904160548.0303bc10@mail.30below.com> Rumor has it that TeoZ may have mentioned these words: >Well if there is a 10 year rule that would mean anything from mid 1993 and >earlier, which catches alot of the commodity PC era almost up to windows >95.... [snip] And would have *excluded* discussions about the Tandy Color Computer 3 up until last year; as they were listed in the Radio Shack Catalog up to 1992 (altho they were closeout that last year...) -- Now, if one wanted to split hairs, one could have said "I bought mine in 1987, so *mine* is ontopic..." but that gets just as tedious as all them thar Winders blatherings IMNSHO... (BTW, I bought mine in '86... had the first one in probably a 150 mile radius of my house... ;-) On that note, the *coolest* 8-bit CPU known to man or beast may yet be off-topic... I don't know when Hitachi made their 63C09; have they been out 10 years??? Yes, I *still* want one of those... just don't have the time to futz with it if I had one, that's why I don't order one. (Mark Malette (?) of Cloud-9 still had some in stock, last I checked... they ain't cheap, but hey... whaddya want for a cooler 6809 than the 6809... ;-) >[snip] That's my $0.0000000000000002, or what it's worth... Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers zmerch@30below.com What do you do when Life gives you lemons, and you don't *like* lemonade????????????? From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 4 15:29:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, chris wrote: > The nazis they have as list nannies are unreal, and the list mom may be > the worst of the bunch. I think even Sellam would find their level of > topic policing to be too much ;-) Somewhat. I e-mailed the list "mom" to ask if it would be OK to post a message about the Vintage Computer Marketplace and never got a response after a few days, so I went ahead anyway. One person flamed me and said the message would be removed from the archive, one person politely scolded me, and another person sent me a note saying it sounded interesting and that they would be checking it out. It wasn't unexpected, but whatever. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 4 15:31:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: <000801c3731b$0377cd00$347ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, TeoZ wrote: > the reason I joined the list. As newer and younger people join the list I > would assume the focus would change to newer equipment. If you want to keep ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Wrong. If the focus of this list ever changes to supporting old PCs then it has effectively died. Old computers don't die. They just get older. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Thu Sep 4 15:32:00 2003 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (ben franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) References: <3F578D7C.2060609@cox.net> Message-ID: <3F579E3B.9020704@jetnet.ab.ca> Bryan Blackburn wrote: > I have a delete key on my keyboard. It works, but it would get way too > much use if we started running windoze tech support threads. > > IMHO, if it has an 8086 or higher processor, it's neither interesting > nor vintage. :) (I would be happier if the list drew a firm line in the > sand at 1980!) No, it is vintage just often not a quality product. A separate group say classicpc might be a better option. Ben. From jwest at classiccmp.org Thu Sep 4 15:53:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: ADMIN Re: YADA10YR References: Message-ID: <00c601c37325$5cf2b520$033310ac@kwcorp.com> The reason Sellam never got a response to his query was because I still have not caught up on all my emails from being out a few days (funeral). I am slowly catching up on them as I get "spare time", they are all saved in queue and I'll get to them when I can. Ya know I'm also trying to build a new classiccmp server (well, the drive in a temp machine)... geeze. My feeling about Sellam posting some items from the VCM list is that it is ok, unless a bunch of people complain. Most times I just go with what the obvious majority wants. With regards to the YADA10YR... I didn't know it was a discussion. The policy is "not manufactured for 10 years". However, I reserve the right to bend that occasionally when moderating posts, depending on the circumstances. It's handled on a case by case basis. I have no problems with someone asking about BIOS access on an old PC. Especially if it hits the 10 year no longer manufactured rule. Yes, "coolness factor" counts. But I will nix threads about general windows issues. This rule is not meant to restrict posting, it's meant to keep things on-topic. And yes, it is subjective, and I will use good common sense when pulling that rule off the shelf. If you don't think I'm capable of making that call... get some bandwidth, go install mailman..... If that makes me a list-nazi so be it. Jay West ----- Original Message ----- From: Vintage Computer Festival To: Classic Computer Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 3:12 PM Subject: Re: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, chris wrote: > The nazis they have as list nannies are unreal, and the list mom may be > the worst of the bunch. I think even Sellam would find their level of > topic policing to be too much ;-) Somewhat. I e-mailed the list "mom" to ask if it would be OK to post a message about the Vintage Computer Marketplace and never got a response after a few days, so I went ahead anyway. One person flamed me and said the message would be removed from the archive, one person politely scolded me, and another person sent me a note saying it sounded interesting and that they would be checking it out. It wasn't unexpected, but whatever. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival --------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com Thu Sep 4 15:56:00 2003 From: Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com (Feldman, Robert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) Message-ID: What TeoZ says has happened/is happening to the Obsolete Computer Helpline, which now, IMHO, has lost most of its usefulness. The classiccmp list seems fairly good at selfpolicing, however. It just sometimes gets off into too much YADA YADA YADA ;) Bob -----Original Message----- From: Vintage Computer Festival [mailto:vcf@siconic.com] Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 3:15 PM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: Re: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, TeoZ wrote: > the reason I joined the list. As newer and younger people join the list I > would assume the focus would change to newer equipment. If you want to keep ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Wrong. If the focus of this list ever changes to supporting old PCs then it has effectively died. Old computers don't die. They just get older. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From dittman at dittman.net Thu Sep 4 16:03:00 2003 From: dittman at dittman.net (Eric Dittman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: DEC OS In-Reply-To: <20030904185250.GQ1354@oblina.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> from "Jochen Kunz" at Sep 04, 2003 08:52:50 PM Message-ID: <20030904205604.36F9D7F83@dittman.net> > I should have written below the URI: "On this web site is written:" > > > Linux was the first free OS to run on the Alpha (in 32-bit mode). > Maybe. But runing in 32 bit mode on Alpha is typical Linux. Instead of > doing it right from the beginning, make a kludge to get somthing running > in some way. The 32-bit port was just temporary to get by until Linus and Compaq got the 64-bit port working. > > NetBSD was the first free 64-bit OS. > As I wrote. > > > It predated the 64-bit version > > of Linux/Alpha by about five months. > Maybe. I don't care about Linux/Alpha. I'm more of a SysV fan, so that's why I'm not big on NetBSD. I did try NetBSD on my Alphastation 500/500 (1.6), but I had problems with the network when I tried to use GigE with Jumbo packets. > > Linux did support SMP on the Alpha in 64-bit mode long before NetBSD. > Sure. NetBSD/Alpha (and NetBSD/VAX) SMP came with NetBSD 1.6. The > "problem" with SMP and NetBSD is that the NetBSD folks are doing things > The Right Way (C) (R) (TM) right from the start, even when The Right Way > (C) (R) (TM) takes longer. SMP needs a lot of well thought out > infrastructure work, especially on an OS that supports that many > platforms like NetBSD. After the 1.6 release with SMP base support many > platforms (notably sparc, macppc, i386) got SMP very quick. The Linux SMP worked. As time went on, it worked better. > Back to the original question about an OS for an Alpha to run MySQL: > What about Tru64? There is a US$ 99 hobbyist licence available. I like > NetBSD very much, but have to admit that Tru64 is a _far_ more capable > OS. I really prefer Tru64. I'm really not happy that HP is going with the inferior HP/UX instead. -- Eric Dittman dittman@dittman.net From jrice54 at charter.net Thu Sep 4 16:07:00 2003 From: jrice54 at charter.net (James Rice) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR In-Reply-To: <00c601c37325$5cf2b520$033310ac@kwcorp.com> References: <00c601c37325$5cf2b520$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Message-ID: <3F57A5BE.6080900@charter.net> Jay, I'm sure no one thinks you are a "list nazi". You have filled your role as list owner and moderator with common sense, tolerance and good humor. As far as I'm concerned, it's your list, you make the rules. As you said, if someone doesn't like, they can go start another list. I'm just happy to be here. James Jay West wrote: >With regards to the YADA10YR... I didn't know it was a discussion. The policy >is "not manufactured for 10 years". However, I reserve the right to bend that >occasionally when moderating posts, depending on the circumstances. It's >handled on a case by case basis. I have no problems with someone asking about >BIOS access on an old PC. Especially if it hits the 10 year no longer >manufactured rule. Yes, "coolness factor" counts. But I will nix threads about >general windows issues. This rule is not meant to restrict posting, it's meant >to keep things on-topic. And yes, it is subjective, and I will use good common >sense when pulling that rule off the shelf. If you don't think I'm capable of >making that call... get some bandwidth, go install mailman..... If that makes >me a list-nazi so be it. From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Sep 4 16:18:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: Dec or Digital Networking In-Reply-To: from "Tillman, Edward" at Sep 4, 3 02:55:33 am Message-ID: > Has anyone actually tried to scale "on-topic" into something we can wrap our > arms around? Once upon a time, I was told that any platform carrying a > version of Windows was off topic. What of my DEC SL486DX with DOS 5.0, Err, since when? While many of us don't care much for Windows for technical reasons (but this is not the place for anti M$ flamewars, so I'll leave it at that), I didn't think that discussions of 10-year-old+ versions were off-topic. In fact the inital FAQ for this list specifically mentions you can talk about 10-year-old PCs, and I would assume by extension the software that runs on them. -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Sep 4 16:18:13 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: <3F578D7C.2060609@cox.net> from "Bryan Blackburn" at Sep 4, 3 12:07:40 pm Message-ID: > IMHO, if it has an 8086 or higher processor, it's neither interesting COunterexamples : THe PC-incompatibles -- things like the HP110, HP150, original Apricot, Sirius/Victor 9000, etc that run MS-DOS, but which certainly are not PC clones. IMHO those are at least as interesting as the home micros of about the same time. And of course the Sequent machines that were boxes of 386s running in parallel IIRC. > nor vintage. :) (I would be happier if the list drew a firm line in the > sand at 1980!) What, and cut out cool machines like the PERQs (after the PERQ 1a)? -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Sep 4 16:18:15 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: <3F5792FA.40506@charter.net> from "James Rice" at Sep 4, 3 02:31:06 pm Message-ID: > I agree with the "Coolness clause". I guess I like hardware that is not > the usual Dell/HP/Gateway crap. After working on that multi-giga-hertz Hey, I _like_ HP machines... Of course the HP machines I like are not the modern ones, which are crap from what I can see. They're machines that are certainly on-topic here, like the HP9830, HP Integral (a lunchbox with HP-UX in ROM...), their calculators of 20-30 years ago (and yes, I consider a calculator that you can program in machine code, that has a disk drive, a full-width inkjet printer, an RS232 port and a HPIB port to be a computer...) -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Sep 4 16:19:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: DEC Server In-Reply-To: <000a01c37307$ceaaa100$5b01a8c0@athlon> from "Antonio Carlini" at Sep 4, 3 06:13:06 pm Message-ID: > BTW: Someone else said that DS100 was the DEC first terminal > server. But the DECSA (PDP-11/24 based) preceded it. (I think > that was code named Pluto; if it wasn't, then there must have I thinkl you're right, I remember seeing a code name on at least one of the PCBs in my DECSA, but I don't feel liking climbing over a dozen other machines to check right now :-) The DECSA does a heck of a lot more than operate as a terminal server, of course... -tony From dwoyciesjes at comcast.net Thu Sep 4 16:20:01 2003 From: dwoyciesjes at comcast.net (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR References: <00c601c37325$5cf2b520$033310ac@kwcorp.com> <3F57A5BE.6080900@charter.net> Message-ID: <3F57AA81.6FE59F86@comcast.net> Actually, I do believe Sellam was talking about sending a message to the list mom for LowEndMac, not you Jay. James Rice wrote: > > Jay, I'm sure no one thinks you are a "list nazi". You have filled your > role as list owner and moderator with common sense, tolerance and good > humor. As far as I'm concerned, it's your list, you make the rules. As > you said, if someone doesn't like, they can go start another list. I'm > just happy to be here. > > James > > Jay West wrote: > > >With regards to the YADA10YR... I didn't know it was a discussion. The policy > >is "not manufactured for 10 years". ..... If that makes > >me a list-nazi so be it. -- --- Dave Woyciesjes --- ICQ# 905818 From vance at neurotica.com Thu Sep 4 16:20:03 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > the reason I joined the list. As newer and younger people join the > > list I would assume the focus would change to newer equipment. If you > > want to keep > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > Wrong. If the focus of this list ever changes to supporting old PCs > then it has effectively died. Old computers don't die. They just get > older. Anyway, I'm one of the younger members of this list, but many of my computers are older than I am by a significant margin. Peace... Sridhar From toresbe at ifi.uio.no Thu Sep 4 16:30:01 2003 From: toresbe at ifi.uio.no (Tore S Bekkedal) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: Bell 103 modem standards Message-ID: <000801c3732a$92b60950$0200a8c0@cluzone> Hell! I just picked up a modem for a classmate (I finance the restoration with tech support - *sigh*), and on the label on the outside, with the supported protocols, and along with the V.24 V.90 yadda yadda there was at the end, Bell 103, Bell 212A...! (I may have the numbers slightly off, but I'm sure about the 103 part). ...Is this a common protocol? In a brochure that came with the DECUS newsletter, about Telecommunications, it mentioned these protocols, and described them as Low-Speed (defined as less than 2000 baud, I believe). This was also mentioned as built-in options for the TTY 33's, and I seem to recall them being mentioned several other places. Is this me being wrong, has the protocol been constantly upgraded speedwise, is the protocol "Just something that stuck around", and therefore direly needing support from every new modem? Or is this just a case of truly, *truly* excellent backwards compat? I mean, the brochure was all in all dated 1967. -Tore (: Lame smilies and RaNdOm CaPiTaLiSaTiOn, oh, and 5(R33P733 57Y13 writing makes you live longer, d00d! OmG! :) :O!!! :)!!! From cisin at xenosoft.com Thu Sep 4 16:34:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: <3F578D7C.2060609@cox.net> References: <3F578D7C.2060609@cox.net> Message-ID: <20030904141620.A294@newshell.lmi.net> > IMHO, if it has an 8086 or higher processor, it's neither interesting > nor vintage. :) (I would be happier if the list drew a firm line in the > sand at 1980!) The last years of CP/M extended to about 1984. Well, except for things like Amada machine tools that were using CP/M based systems well into the 90's. A fair number of people consider the Kaypro (1983?) and Otrona Attache (1984?) to be valid topics. I think that the DEFACTO, informal, unofficial, line has become about 20 years on intel based products. It seems that people are now comfortable about talking about original PCs (5150 1981) and XT and DOS up to V3.xx, but that AT (286 1983?) are still not of much interest. Just think - in ten or 20 years, people might think that XP is interesting! -- Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin@xenosoft.com From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Sep 4 16:36:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: from "vance@neurotica.com" at Sep 4, 3 05:11:46 pm Message-ID: > Anyway, I'm one of the younger members of this list, but many of my > computers are older than I am by a significant margin. Last time I demonstrated one of my minis to a university computer club, I suddently realised that the machine was older than the students :-) -tony From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Sep 4 16:43:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: Need VGA cable for Ampro SBC Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030903214838.007b1eb0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Does anyone have a spare video cable for the Ampro SBCs with built-in video ports? Or a schematic? It uses a 2 x 11 retangular socket. See for a picture. Joe From cisin at xenosoft.com Thu Sep 4 16:49:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: ADMIN Re: YADA10YR In-Reply-To: <00c601c37325$5cf2b520$033310ac@kwcorp.com> References: <00c601c37325$5cf2b520$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Message-ID: <20030904143632.X294@newshell.lmi.net> On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Jay West wrote: > The reason Sellam never got a response to his query was because I still have > not caught up on all my emails from being out a few days (funeral). I am IIRC, he was grousing about the moderation and management of ANOTHER list. I have yet to hear any valid complaints about what you do. Your common sense approach has worked well for us. -- Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin@xenosoft.com From jrice54 at charter.net Thu Sep 4 16:53:00 2003 From: jrice54 at charter.net (James Rice) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:41 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F57B08C.9050104@charter.net> I'm 50. It's getting damn hard to find a computer older than me. James vance@neurotica.com wrote: >Anyway, I'm one of the younger members of this list, but many of my >computers are older than I am by a significant margin. > >Peace... Sridhar From cisin at xenosoft.com Thu Sep 4 17:04:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: Bell 103 modem standards In-Reply-To: <000801c3732a$92b60950$0200a8c0@cluzone> References: <000801c3732a$92b60950$0200a8c0@cluzone> Message-ID: <20030904144035.C294@newshell.lmi.net> On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Tore S Bekkedal wrote: > Hell! > I just picked up a modem for a classmate (I finance the restoration with > tech support - *sigh*), and on the label on the outside, with the > supported protocols, and along with the V.24 V.90 yadda yadda there was > at the end, Bell 103, Bell 212A...! (I may have the numbers slightly > off, but I'm sure about the 103 part). > ...Is this a common protocol? In a brochure that came with the DECUS > newsletter, about Telecommunications, it mentioned these protocols, and > described them as Low-Speed (defined as less than 2000 baud, I believe). > This was also mentioned as built-in options for the TTY 33's, and I seem > to recall them being mentioned several other places. 2000??!? Bell 103 was the protocol for 300 baud. I don't think that I've ever seen it successfully used past about 600 baud, and if you look at the frequencies that it used, I don't think that frequency shift keying COULD be used faster than that without switching to much higher frequencies. That was why phase shift keying was developed. Take the frequencies used, and calculate HOW MANY cycles of an audio tone would occur at those frequencies at various bit rates. Then think about what method you would use for identifying the frequency of a tone if you didn't have multiple complete cycles to count. > Is this me being wrong, has the protocol been constantly upgraded > speedwise, is the protocol "Just something that stuck around", and > therefore direly needing support from every new modem? Or is this just a > case of truly, *truly* excellent backwards compat? I mean, the brochure > was all in all dated 1967. There is still some occasional need for "low speed" telecommunications. The TTYs used by deaf people are still mostly using Baudot (actually Murray) code with V.18? protocol. The newer fancier ones can now also do ASCII with Bell 103! Some "voice modem"s can simulate the V.18 protocol with a bit of software. When MICROS~1 came out with the "Microsoft Cordless Phone", they claimed that that software and hardware could do it, but their tech support were unable to come up with how to invoke that "supported" feature of the software. -- Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin@xenosoft.com From jwest at classiccmp.org Thu Sep 4 17:18:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: ADMIN Re: YADA10YR References: <00c601c37325$5cf2b520$033310ac@kwcorp.com> <20030904143632.X294@newshell.lmi.net> Message-ID: <002d01c37331$382115f0$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Fred wrote... > IIRC, he was grousing about the moderation and management of ANOTHER list. Well... offlist... Sellam HAD sent me an email a week or two ago, asking about posting a list of items for sale on the VCM forum, at least a few times, till things get started. Since his post started with mention of that, I ASSumed he was referring to that. If he had done the same thing on a different list, and was referring to that incident, then it was an honest (but understandable) mistake on my part. Honestly, if I was really dead set against his posting the VCM list a few times to the classiccmp list, I would have replied to it immediately. I wasn't terribly opposed to it, wanted a bit of time to think about it, and then of course it fell to the bottom of my task list. Surely collectively all the brainpower here can come up with a way to keep all our jobs from interferring with our hobbies :) I was watching YADA10YR turn into a long debate, and I just wanted to attempt to nip it in the bud, as it looked like something that could go on for a good while. All hail the "signal to noise ratio" :) Jay West From TRUTHANL at columbus.rr.com Thu Sep 4 17:29:00 2003 From: TRUTHANL at columbus.rr.com (..) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: Flamingo Dec3000 Model 500 Message-ID: <002101c37332$d3f391a0$6401a8c0@LARRY> I am trying to add a user acct to my Alpha System running Dec Unix 4.08. I am logged in as root. When I use the GUI the error message I get when trying to open AcctManager is that bin/x11/dxacct requires system PRIVILEGED access. The dialog box has three choices 1. RUN as ROOT; 2. RUN as ROOT, 3.Cancel : Either run as root times out with no more dialog for create, or what ever.... When I pull up a terminal window and do "who" I see a "root console", a "root TTY", and a third "root :0" user. When I try running DXacct from the Bash 2.02# command line I get a message stating "Another user" has the Passwd and Group files locked - Try again later. What is wrong with my environment? Why three root instances? Can someone suggest A better forum to get such an answer? I am a Digest subscriber, contact me offlist at truthanl at columbus rr com. Sincerely Larry Truthan From cmcnabb at 4mcnabb.net Thu Sep 4 18:04:00 2003 From: cmcnabb at 4mcnabb.net (Christopher McNabb) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: PDP-11/83 Power Supply Wierdness Message-ID: <1062716122.23367.8.camel@unix> My PDP-11/83 has recently (past few weeks) been displaying some odd symptoms. The system is a PDP-11/83 in a "Corporate Cabinet". Most of the time, when the power switch is turned on, the "run", "halt", "ready" lights blink on then go off. Also, the Red light on the TK-50 will come on then go off. You also hear a relay closing and opening in the rack power supply. About every 10th try, the DC OK light will come on and the system will start to power up. Then all the lights go off after a couple of seconds and the rack power supply relay clunks. When the switch is turned off, "run", "ready", and the TK-50 light blink on and you hear what sounds like the relay in the rack power supply closing and opening. Kevin, do you remember it doing anything like this when it was yours? -- Christopher McNabb The McNabb Family From bshannon at tiac.net Thu Sep 4 18:16:00 2003 From: bshannon at tiac.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) References: <000801c3731b$0377cd00$347ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <3F57C610.9080705@tiac.net> IMO, 'coolness' is the key factor, but it cannot be used as any form of criteria for the list simply because what I find cool, someone else will not. So I tend to think about the 'collectability' of a given bit of hardware. This is much easier to define in a common way. One key factor in 'collectability' is rarity. Most PC's (but not all) are commodity products, produced by the tens of thousands, even millions. to my eyes, such machines will never have much value as a collectable. Its also true that commodity products generally are not good examples of ground-breaking new technology, so they also lack intrinsic value as collectables. Now if you had the first PC with an Active Matrix color LCD (was not a laptop BTW!), which was also an EISA-bus AC powered 'portable', then I would say that PC is a bit collectable, and on-topic. But this is because it broke new technical ground and marked a turning point in computing technology. It was also not produced in any great numbers and was quickly obsoleted, so its a rather rare machine. A blanket cut-off date is simple snobbery, and ignores that computer evolution does continue today. I don't see much classic potential in a Geo Metro, no matter how old it gets. Same for any clone PC thrown together from off-the shelf parts, or even a brand-name 'me-too' PC. I would not want to see the list turn into a MS-DOS or Windows support group, that would be a plug-pulling situation for my personally. From teoz at neo.rr.com Thu Sep 4 18:52:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) References: <000801c3731b$0377cd00$347ca418@neo.rr.com> <3F57C610.9080705@tiac.net> Message-ID: <002101c3733e$5bac7020$347ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Shannon" To: Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 7:09 PM Subject: Re: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) > IMO, 'coolness' is the key factor, but it cannot be used as any form of > criteria for the list simply > because what I find cool, someone else will not. > > So I tend to think about the 'collectability' of a given bit of > hardware. This is much easier to define > in a common way. > > One key factor in 'collectability' is rarity. Most PC's (but not all) > are commodity products, produced > by the tens of thousands, even millions. to my eyes, such machines will > never have much value as a > collectable. > > Its also true that commodity products generally are not good examples of > ground-breaking new > technology, so they also lack intrinsic value as collectables. > > Now if you had the first PC with an Active Matrix color LCD (was not a > laptop BTW!), which was > also an EISA-bus AC powered 'portable', then I would say that PC is a > bit collectable, and on-topic. > But this is because it broke new technical ground and marked a turning > point in computing technology. > It was also not produced in any great numbers and was quickly obsoleted, > so its a rather rare machine. > > A blanket cut-off date is simple snobbery, and ignores that computer > evolution does continue today. > > I don't see much classic potential in a Geo Metro, no matter how old it > gets. Same for any clone PC > thrown together from off-the shelf parts, or even a brand-name 'me-too' PC. > > I would not want to see the list turn into a MS-DOS or Windows support > group, that would be a > plug-pulling situation for my personally. Its not just the hardware, its the software that you run on it thats classic. While I have no love for the commodity PC I do love the classic games that ran on them. The best selling PC in the world was a C64, it was ground breaking for price performance, sold in the 8-10,000,000 and isnt rare at all. A machine without software is just a nice looking door stop. Its a combination of the machine and the software that makes a classic in my eyes. I agree with the windows support group being a bad idea. A Powermac 8500 isnt a classic machine, but when people start talking about getting their Videovision Studio with Telecast running and the cool things it can do I get interested (yes I have a setup). I am also interested in not so common software (Apple A/UX , Desqview/X on the PC) on common equipment. Where do you draw the line between "How do I save a file in windows 95" to "I have a glitch in my A/D data aquisition card in my Pentium Lab machine"? From bshannon at tiac.net Thu Sep 4 19:14:00 2003 From: bshannon at tiac.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) References: <000801c3731b$0377cd00$347ca418@neo.rr.com> <3F57C610.9080705@tiac.net> <002101c3733e$5bac7020$347ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <3F57D3A2.5090908@tiac.net> TeoZ wrote: > >Its not just the hardware, its the software that you run on it thats >classic. >While I have no love for the commodity PC I do love the classic games that >ran on them. >The best selling PC in the world was a C64, it was ground breaking for price >performance, sold in the 8-10,000,000 and isnt rare at all. >A machine without software is just a nice looking door stop. Its a >combination of the machine and the software that makes a classic in my eyes. > Actually, the software ~may~ be classic, but this is not always the case.. In many cases a classic CPU exists and is quite practical to restore and operate, but the vintage peripherals like disk drives are no longer practical for normal use. Most often this is because the media has a finite life and is no longer made. More commonly someone finds a CPU but none of the supporting peripherals come with it. Rather than use a real classic CPU as a doorstop (real classics are too large for a task better left to a commodity product like the C64) you can interface the classic machine to a PC or other host system and get software from some of the excellent archives on the web (like Jeff Moffat's). After all, many real classics have core memory and simply are not as disk-dependant as modern systems. > >I agree with the windows support group being a bad idea. A Powermac 8500 >isnt a classic machine, but when people start talking about getting their >Videovision Studio with Telecast running and the cool things it can do I get >interested (yes I have a setup). I am also interested in not so common >software (Apple A/UX , Desqview/X on the PC) on common equipment. Where do >you draw the line between "How do I save a file in windows 95" to "I have a >glitch in my A/D data aquisition card in my Pentium Lab machine"? > Easy! Both are off-opic IMO. From cb at mythtech.net Thu Sep 4 20:19:01 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: ADMIN Re: YADA10YR Message-ID: >> The reason Sellam never got a response to his query was because I still have >> not caught up on all my emails from being out a few days (funeral). I am > >IIRC, he was grousing about the moderation and management of ANOTHER list. Correct, I was complaining about the lists provided by LowEndMac.com >I have yet to hear any valid complaints about what you do. >Your common sense approach has worked well for us. I've got no complains about the way this list is run. -chris From thompson at new.rr.com Thu Sep 4 21:20:00 2003 From: thompson at new.rr.com (Paul Thompson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: DEC Server In-Reply-To: <000a01c37307$ceaaa100$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Antonio Carlini wrote: > 68000 and variants were used by many products produced by various > parts of DEC's Networking group on both sides of the Atlantic. > (The DECservers, the HUB stuff, many of the WAN host interfaces). It was also used in various XMI and BI boards I've seen over the years for non-networking purposes. Those tended to have a lot of DEC and not DEC chips on them of many different types. From rogersda at cox.net Thu Sep 4 22:29:01 2003 From: rogersda at cox.net (rogersda@cox.net) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: DEC OS Message-ID: <20030905032034.EPSU9938.fed1mtao03.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> Eric, It may not be as bad as it sounds. Just like the IA64 has ended up being "finished" by a lot of Alpha Engineers (they got the last 150 from HP about a month ago), it appears that next major version of HP/UX is going to end up being a lot more "Tru64" than HP/UX. HP has made commitments to retain the distinguishing features of Digital Unix, e.g. clustering and AdvFS, and they don't plan on offering two parallel versions, one with and the other without. It will be easier to include the "look and feel" of HP/UX into Tru64 - and call it HP/UX - than to make HP/UX do *real* clustering. It's sorta like buying a Bentley ... it's still mainly Rolls-Royce under the skins. Dale the DECdude > I really prefer Tru64. I'm really not happy that HP is going with the > inferior HP/UX instead. From oldcomp at cox.net Thu Sep 4 23:53:00 2003 From: oldcomp at cox.net (Bryan Blackburn) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) References: Message-ID: <3F581463.6050109@cox.net> >>IMHO, if it has an 8086 or higher processor, it's neither interesting >>nor vintage. :) (I would be happier if the list drew a firm line in the >>sand at 1980!) > > > Wouldn't that leave out machines like the PDP-11/93? > > Peace... Sridhar > Yes. Yes it would. :) It's just my area of personal interest. Don't get me wrong, I own 30+ machines from that era, I just don't find them particularly interesting when compared to earlier machines. I don't advocate the dropping or changing of any current list rules, I was just stating my preference. -Bryan From vcf at siconic.com Fri Sep 5 00:19:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: Historical relevance of common clone PC was Re: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: <3F57C610.9080705@tiac.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Bob Shannon wrote: > I don't see much classic potential in a Geo Metro, no matter how old it > gets. Same for any clone PC thrown together from off-the shelf parts, or > even a brand-name 'me-too' PC. Actually, at some point in the future, common (for today) PC clones that were built from parts by individual users will be very historically relevant as examples of the time when PC's became a commodity! -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Fri Sep 5 00:20:01 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: <002101c3733e$5bac7020$347ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, TeoZ wrote: > The best selling PC in the world was a C64, it was ground breaking for price > performance, sold in the 8-10,000,000 and isnt rare at all. Correction: 17-22 million. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From tothwolf at concentric.net Fri Sep 5 03:00:01 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: Historical relevance of common clone PC was Re: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Bob Shannon wrote: > > > I don't see much classic potential in a Geo Metro, no matter how old > > it gets. Same for any clone PC thrown together from off-the shelf > > parts, or even a brand-name 'me-too' PC. > > Actually, at some point in the future, common (for today) PC clones that > were built from parts by individual users will be very historically > relevant as examples of the time when PC's became a commodity! And maybe those "Sams" 386-486 computers that were sold as part of those learn-to-repair PCs courses will become highly collectible ;) -Toth From dittman at dittman.net Fri Sep 5 07:43:00 2003 From: dittman at dittman.net (Eric Dittman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: DEC OS In-Reply-To: <20030905032034.EPSU9938.fed1mtao03.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> from "rogersda@cox.net" at Sep 04, 2003 11:20:34 PM Message-ID: <20030905123552.2C5C47F83@dittman.net> > It may not be as bad as it sounds. Just like the IA64 has ended up being "finished" by a lot of Alpha Engineers (they got the last 150 from HP about a month ago), it appears that next major version of HP/UX is going to end up being a lot more "Tru64" than HP/UX. HP has made commitments to retain the distinguishing features of Digital Unix, e.g. clustering and AdvFS, and they don't plan on offering two parallel versions, one with and the other without. It will be easier to include the "look and feel" of HP/UX into Tru64 - and call it HP/UX - than to make HP/UX do *real* clustering. HP has committed to adding the features to HP/UX, but they have found that easier said than done. I know that making Tru64 look like HP/UX is easier than adding TruClusters and AdvFS to HP/UX, but that's still a lot of work because Tru64 and HP/UX are so different in how they are configured (in terms on where program, utilities, and configuration files are located). [please split your lines, BTW] -- Eric Dittman dittman@dittman.net From jbmcb at hotmail.com Fri Sep 5 08:31:01 2003 From: jbmcb at hotmail.com (Jason McBrien) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) References: Message-ID: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vintage Computer Festival" To: Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 2:37 PM Subject: RE: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) > Members of this mailing list need to realize that this list has been > around now for 6.5 years, and it's always been like this, and it probably ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > always will (well, with the exception of the CCTALK/CCTECH split, which I > ignore anyway). If the list is only 6.5 years old, does that mean discussing it is off topic? :) From jbmcb at hotmail.com Fri Sep 5 08:38:00 2003 From: jbmcb at hotmail.com (Jason McBrien) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: Historical relevance of common clone PC was Re: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) References: Message-ID: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tothwolf" To: Sent: Friday, September 05, 2003 4:09 AM Subject: Re: Historical relevance of common clone PC was Re: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) > On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Bob Shannon wrote: > > > > > I don't see much classic potential in a Geo Metro, no matter how old > > > it gets. Same for any clone PC thrown together from off-the shelf > > > parts, or even a brand-name 'me-too' PC. > > > > Actually, at some point in the future, common (for today) PC clones that > > were built from parts by individual users will be very historically > > relevant as examples of the time when PC's became a commodity! > > And maybe those "Sams" 386-486 computers that were sold as part of those > learn-to-repair PCs courses will become highly collectible ;) > > -Toth Or you can get your degree. You can major in computer repair or business administration! Wasn't that the era when PC's became commodity enough that "Repairing" one meant running a DOS floppy checker on a drive to see if it's dead, and throwing a new one in if it was? I remember my friend's dad had a floppy drive alignment gadget, hooked up to an oscilloscope and let you realign the heads of your floppy drive. Cost twice as much as a new floppy drive, but if you fixed one twice, it's paid off :) From Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com Fri Sep 5 09:11:00 2003 From: Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com (Feldman, Robert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: OT: Australian computer "collectors" :) Message-ID: who stole two mainframe computers from the Australian Customs at the Sydney Airport. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/3083228.stm From geneb at deltasoft.com Fri Sep 5 09:50:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: OT: Australian computer "collectors" :) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > who stole two mainframe computers from the Australian Customs at the Sydney Airport. > > http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/3083228.stm > I have no idea, but all you need to do is find the guys that need a wheelbarrow to haul the huge balls it took to pull that heist off.... g. From jwest at classiccmp.org Fri Sep 5 10:19:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) References: Message-ID: <00ae01c373b1$bd0da6e0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> It was written... >If the list is only 6.5 years old, does that mean discussing it is off topic? :) Awesome! Perfect ammunition for this list-nazi *GRIN* Now NO discussion is allowed ;) Thanks for a great laugh this morning! From vcf at siconic.com Fri Sep 5 11:15:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 5 Sep 2003, Jason McBrien wrote: > If the list is only 6.5 years old, does that mean discussing it is off > topic? :) Actually, YES! Thank you! You've solved the problem. Now everyone go back to discussing old computers!! ;) -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From teoz at neo.rr.com Fri Sep 5 11:17:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: Historical relevance of common clone PC was Re: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) References: Message-ID: <003001c373c7$f3a886a0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jason McBrien" To: Sent: Friday, September 05, 2003 9:31 AM Subject: Re: Historical relevance of common clone PC was Re: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) > > Or you can get your degree. You can major in computer repair or business > administration! > > Wasn't that the era when PC's became commodity enough that "Repairing" one > meant running a DOS floppy checker on a drive to see if it's dead, and > throwing a new one in if it was? I remember my friend's dad had a floppy > drive alignment gadget, hooked up to an oscilloscope and let you realign the > heads of your floppy drive. Cost twice as much as a new floppy drive, but if > you fixed one twice, it's paid off :) I still havnt made up my mind which is better, expensive computer equipment you can repair that lasts forever or extemely cheap equipment that dies in a few years that gets tossed. If everything made from the start of computing was cheaply made none of us would have this hobby now, then again I dont miss paying $700 for a 300dpi laser printer or $2000 for the first 2x CDR burner. From vcf at siconic.com Fri Sep 5 11:18:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: OT: Australian computer "collectors" :) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 5 Sep 2003, Feldman, Robert wrote: > who stole two mainframe computers from the Australian Customs at the > Sydney Airport. Whoops! Sorry, my bad. I thought it was a Commodore 64. No wonder I couldn't figure out how to connect up the 1541 drive. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From kth at srv.net Fri Sep 5 12:31:00 2003 From: kth at srv.net (Kevin Handy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: PDP-11/83 Power Supply Wierdness In-Reply-To: <1062716122.23367.8.camel@unix> References: <1062716122.23367.8.camel@unix> Message-ID: <3F58D119.3000704@srv.net> Christopher McNabb wrote: >My PDP-11/83 has recently (past few weeks) been displaying some odd >symptoms. The system is a PDP-11/83 in a "Corporate Cabinet". Most of >the time, when the power switch is turned on, the "run", "halt", "ready" >lights blink on then go off. Also, the Red light on the TK-50 will come >on then go off. You also hear a relay closing and opening in the rack >power supply. > >About every 10th try, the DC OK light will come on and the system will >start to power up. Then all the lights go off after a couple of seconds >and the rack power supply relay clunks. > >When the switch is turned off, "run", "ready", and the TK-50 light blink >on and you hear what sounds like the relay in the rack power supply >closing and opening. > >Kevin, do you remember it doing anything like this when it was yours? > > > Never had that problem myself. It sounds like the power distribution module in the bottom of the cabinet is turning off. The distribution module turns on power to the other boxes when the CPU box is turned on, and turns it off when the power to the CPU box is turned off. Check the control cable that runs from the CPU box into that module and make sure it hasn't come loose (it's a fairly small cable). The CPU box is plugged in a always-on extension in the distribution box, and when power is turned on, it sends a signal down that wire that turns on everything else. If power in the CPU box fails, then the signal disappears, and the rest of the system will also shut down (and the relay in the distribution module will clunk). It sounds like the CPU box power supply is shutting down. Toggling the power switch usually resets it. I's guess it's complaining about the power it is receiving (rightly or wrongly). There is a small toggle switch on the power distribution panel (accessible from the back of the machine) that controls how it behaves. Try putting it in manual mode, which will cause everything to always be powered. If everything else retains power when the CPU box fails, then it is something with power in the CPU box. If all power still fails, then it is probably the power distribution box. If it doesn't fail, you may have too many things plugged into the wall power outlet to handle the initial startup current, and the CPU box may be shutting down due to bad(low) power, pulling all the other boxes off. Try leaving the tape drive off during power on to reduce the initial power requirements (power switch is on the front of the tape drive, if you haven't noticed it). RSTS/E, at least, doesn't need it to be on when the system is powered up. Also check to see if the power supply on the CPU box if full of crud, and overheating or otherwise causing a fault. (Blow it out with compressed air while power is turned off). Power supplies seem to like packing themselves with all the dust they can possibly suck in. Another possibility is too many things in the CPU box. You could try moving one or two boards to the expansion box. If the power supply is failing, I believe it is the same one used in the BA-23 boxes, and it should be easy to find a replacement. Actually replacing it may not be as easy as finding one ;) From jrkeys at concentric.net Fri Sep 5 13:36:00 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: Higher Count of C64 Sold Message-ID: <00c901c373db$61fb0a20$4408dd40@oemcomputer> In the 2002 issue of Guinness World records it states that almost 30 million C64 computers were sold between 1983 and 1993. From bpope at wordstock.com Fri Sep 5 13:48:00 2003 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: Higher Count of C64 Sold In-Reply-To: <00c901c373db$61fb0a20$4408dd40@oemcomputer> from "Keys" at Sep 5, 03 01:27:35 pm Message-ID: <200309051838.OAA02029@wordstock.com> And thusly Keys spake: > > In the 2002 issue of Guinness World records it states that almost 30 million > C64 computers were sold between 1983 and 1993. > It is pretty cool that one item could keep selling for a decade. Plus the sound and graphics of games kept getting better. Whereas today you must upgrade your hardware every six months to get the same effect. Cheers, Bryan Pope From cisin at xenosoft.com Fri Sep 5 14:10:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: OT: Australian computer "collectors" :) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030905115640.W20266@newshell.lmi.net> On Fri, 5 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > who stole two mainframe computers from the Australian Customs at the > > Sydney Airport. > Whoops! Sorry, my bad. I thought it was a Commodore 64. No wonder I > couldn't figure out how to connect up the 1541 drive. That might, indeed be difficult, unless you build a custom interface. But can you get an IEEE-488 (lab instrument, et.) interface? The MSD drive for the Commode can connect to that. Or,... could you do terminal emulation with a PC, and connect the 1541 to the parallel port? From patrick at evocative.com Fri Sep 5 14:11:00 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: FW: Need Heath/Zenith H/Z-90 schematics (repost) Message-ID: This is a repost; I never saw my original message make it through to the list. Apologies if this is a duplicate and I just missed it... I've been working from a set of H-88 schematics for a long, long time, extrapolating and tracing differences between the '-88 and the '-90. I was wondering if anyone either had a spare copy of the schematics they'd be willing to sell to me, or make a brief loan of them so I can run a copy of them on a large-format duplicator, or...? Thanks in advance! --Patrick From bpope at wordstock.com Fri Sep 5 14:17:00 2003 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: OT: Australian computer "collectors" :) In-Reply-To: <20030905115640.W20266@newshell.lmi.net> from "Fred Cisin" at Sep 5, 03 11:59:51 am Message-ID: <200309051907.PAA02467@wordstock.com> And thusly Fred Cisin spake: > > Or,... > could you do terminal emulation with a PC, and connect the 1541 to the > parallel port? Yes you can connect the 1541 to the parallel port (and get _much_ faster transfer speeds!), but you still need to connect the serial bus. Maybe a XP1541 cable? :-D Cheers, Bryan From geneb at deltasoft.com Fri Sep 5 14:52:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: OT: Australian computer "collectors" :) In-Reply-To: <20030905115640.W20266@newshell.lmi.net> Message-ID: > On Fri, 5 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > > who stole two mainframe computers from the Australian Customs at the > > > Sydney Airport. > > Whoops! Sorry, my bad. I thought it was a Commodore 64. No wonder I > > couldn't figure out how to connect up the 1541 drive. > > That might, indeed be difficult, unless you build a custom interface. > > But can you get an IEEE-488 (lab instrument, et.) interface? > The MSD drive for the Commode can connect to that. > > Or,... > could you do terminal emulation with a PC, and connect the 1541 to the > parallel port? > Naw, grab an XA1541 cable and a copy of 64HDD. You can turn your old 386 into a .D64 disk server for your C-64. :) g. From geneb at deltasoft.com Fri Sep 5 14:54:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: FW: Need Heath/Zenith H/Z-90 schematics (repost) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > I've been working from a set of H-88 schematics for a long, long time, > extrapolating and tracing differences between the '-88 and the '-90. > Do you mean the 89? Regardless, what differences have you found so far? g. From cisin at xenosoft.com Fri Sep 5 15:15:01 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: Historical relevance of common clone PC was Re: YADA10YR In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030905130125.D20266@newshell.lmi.net> > I don't see much classic potential in a Geo Metro, no matter how old it > gets. Same for any clone PC thrown together from off-the shelf parts, or > even a brand-name 'me-too' PC. That's what was said about the Edsel, and about the VW, and about the Ford model T and model A (Geo Metros of their time!) Even the most commonplace items of the past become interesting and "collectible" after they've been gone for a long time. From cb at mythtech.net Fri Sep 5 15:26:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: BOGEN model CHS-60A Amplifier Installation Manual Message-ID: >I understand that you have an installation manual for the BOGEN model >CHS-60A >Amplifier. I would like to know if you could share it with me? Sorry to say, I no longer have that manual, I mailed it to someone that asked for it a number of weeks ago. -chris From mtapley at swri.edu Fri Sep 5 15:51:00 2003 From: mtapley at swri.edu (Mark Tapley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: CARDIAC In-Reply-To: <200308201639.JAA24724@clulw009.amd.com> References: <200308201639.JAA24724@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: >Hi > I believe that John Rible owns the publication rights >to these. He would have it in a computer readable format. >You might contact him at: > >jrible@sandpipers.com > >later >Dwight Sent email 2 weeks ago, no known response yet. FWIW. If anyone has a scanned copy or something else suitable to make a kit from, please let me know. -- - Mark 210-522-6025, page 888-733-0967 From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Sep 5 16:17:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: info? AMI 6800/6809 system that ran Flex Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030904212235.007d7180@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Anybody know anyting about an OLD (76ish) AMI system with a 6800 or 6809 CPU that ran Flex? I've been offered one and I'd like to know more about it. The chassis and such are home made but the cards are factory made. I have some pictures that I can provide if anyone wants to see them. Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Sep 5 16:20:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: MOS operating System? Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030904212544.007ab600@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Went to a surplus store today and found a package that said that it was "MOS Operating System" and that it was a multi-user system and that it was MS-DOS compatible. Does anyone know anything about it? I've never heard of it before. The package was sealed so I couldn't open it to read any details. Joe From patrick at evocative.com Fri Sep 5 17:30:01 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: FW: Need Heath/Zenith H/Z-90 schematics (repost) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > I've been working from a set of H-88 schematics for a long, long time, > > extrapolating and tracing differences between the '-88 and the '-90. > > > > Do you mean the 89? Regardless, what differences have you found so far? > > g. Glen, no, I mean '90. The -90 added some additional traces on the CPU board, removed a jumper, etc. There are also changes apparent on the terminal logical board, and the video board, and in the case of one machine I'm working on, there's an additional board between the video board and the yoke that looks "native." Even the serial cards seem to come in two or three different revisions. --Patrick From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Fri Sep 5 17:41:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: Historical relevance of common clone PC was Re: YADA10YR In-Reply-To: from "Jason McBrien" at Sep 5, 3 09:31:34 am Message-ID: > throwing a new one in if it was? I remember my friend's dad had a floppy > drive alignment gadget, hooked up to an oscilloscope and let you realign the > heads of your floppy drive. Cost twice as much as a new floppy drive, but if I still have (and use) devices like that. I have a proper drive exerciser (not essential -- you can do the same thing with software on the host machine 99% of the time). You step the heads to the correct track with an alignemnt disk in the drive and look at the output of the read amplifier on the 'scope. Then shift the heads until the 2 lobes are the same amplitude. I also have a little gadget that connects to a PC serial port. Inside is an ADC and a microcontroller. It's supposed to read the amplitude of said lobes and the PC will display how far off-track you are. I find this a _lot_ less convenient than the 'scope, though. Why do I bother? well, I've had _new_ branded floppy drives that are marginally aligned. I value my data ... And of course you can't buy new drives for many classic machines [1] so you have to be able to repair them [1] And IMHO while you should repair classic computers (they were designed to work and should be kept working), you should also keep as many of the original parts as possible. Better to replace a small component in the drive than the entire drive. > you fixed one twice, it's paid off :) > -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Fri Sep 5 17:41:13 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: Historical relevance of common clone PC was Re: YADA10YR In-Reply-To: <003001c373c7$f3a886a0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> from "TeoZ" at Sep 5, 3 12:08:26 pm Message-ID: > I still havnt made up my mind which is better, expensive computer equipment > you can repair that lasts forever or extemely cheap equipment that dies in a I know which I prefer -- the former.... It's a lot less hassle for one thing (I have lost count of the times that the new 'replacement' has subtle incompatibilties with the old unit, for example)..... It's also cheaper in the end... > few years that gets tossed. If everything made from the start of computing > was cheaply made none of us would have this hobby now, then again I dont > miss paying $700 for a 300dpi laser printer or $2000 for the first 2x CDR > burner. I have said many times that now I can't pay _enough_ for things. I _want_ to pay $5000 for a home VCR, for example (and I want to get a VCR that has a die-cast metal deck, proper bearings, proper heads, glassfibre PCBs, and so on). I want to get a laserprinter that's built like an old CX or SX (and not one of the modern pieces of plastic junk I see for sale). -tony From jwest at classiccmp.org Fri Sep 5 18:08:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: MOS operating System? References: <3.0.6.32.20030904212544.007ab600@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <002501c37401$5faedaf0$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Sure. One of my customers was running it before we replaced it with Pick. It was rather cute... multi-user DOS. It ran on one PC, the other users used dumb terminals. I SEEM to recall that it might have supported some users connected via some odd network cable, but I think it was serial. Each user basically got their own "C:\" prompt. You could only run character-based applications though. Jay West ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe" To: Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 11:25 PM Subject: MOS operating System? > Went to a surplus store today and found a package that said that it was > "MOS Operating System" and that it was a multi-user system and that it was > MS-DOS compatible. Does anyone know anything about it? I've never heard of > it before. The package was sealed so I couldn't open it to read any details. > > Joe From liste at artware.qc.ca Fri Sep 5 18:35:00 2003 From: liste at artware.qc.ca (liste@artware.qc.ca) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: Turing books looking for a home Message-ID: A Guide to the PC-Turing Interpreter, J.N.P. Hume (don't have the disk), 1986 The Turing Language Report, Richard C. Holt and James R. Cordy, 1983 (2 copies) Neither has an ISBN. Anyone want? -Philip From waltje at pdp11.nl Fri Sep 5 21:11:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: MOS operating System? In-Reply-To: <002501c37401$5faedaf0$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Message-ID: Hi, > Sure. One of my customers was running it before we replaced it with Pick. It > was rather cute... multi-user DOS. It ran on one PC, the other users used > dumb terminals. I SEEM to recall that it might have supported some users > connected via some odd network cable, but I think it was serial. Each user > basically got their own "C:\" prompt. You could only run character-based > applications though. MOS (also called PC/MOS, and the later PC/MOS-386) were multi-user, single-tasking versions of a DOS, more or less compatible with the MS- and PC-DOS systems. MOS ran on the larger 286 and 386 systems, and DID use their hardware segmentation (286) and protection (386) support. As Jay already said, MOS presented each session with its own DOS shell (command prompt). I cant remember for sure, but I believe there was no system-level security, meaning, no login support or concept of "users". MOS was very, very popular (in Holland) in the BBS world, where several nodes could be run off a single (fast) PC using PC-MOS, a package like RBBS-PC (or Lynx), and FIDO and/or MAILER software, preferrably used with multispeed buffered serial drivers. Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From vcf at siconic.com Fri Sep 5 21:12:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: Higher Count of C64 Sold In-Reply-To: <00c901c373db$61fb0a20$4408dd40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: On Fri, 5 Sep 2003, Keys wrote: > In the 2002 issue of Guinness World records it states that almost 30 million > C64 computers were sold between 1983 and 1993. That's way higher than the statistics I've encountered in the past. I wonder what their source is? -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Fri Sep 5 21:15:01 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: MOS operating System? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030904212544.007ab600@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: > Went to a surplus store today and found a package that said that it was > "MOS Operating System" and that it was a multi-user system and that it was > MS-DOS compatible. Does anyone know anything about it? I've never heard of > it before. The package was sealed so I couldn't open it to read any details. Hmm, I have this but never really looked at it. I came across it the other day among the piles of boxes waiting to be unpacked. If I see it in the next week or so I'll put it and check it out. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From class at fliptronics.com Sat Sep 6 04:41:00 2003 From: class at fliptronics.com (Philip Freidin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: OT: Australian computer "collectors" :) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 5 Sep 2003 08:02:25 -0600, Feldman, Robert wrote: >who stole two mainframe computers from the Australian Customs at the Sydney Airport. > >http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/3083228.stm Australia, which as we all know was colonised by convicts sentenced to "transportation" from England, has a long tradition of celebrating this heritage. Indeed the almost national anthem of Australia celebrates such behaviour. I draw your attention to statement 1210 of the lyrics of this Australian classic: 0000 Waltzing Matilda 0010 "Banjo" Paterson, 1893 0110 1. Once a jolly swagman sat beside the billabong, 0210 Under the shade of a coulibah tree, 0310 And he sang as he sat and waited till his billy boiled: 0410 Chorus: 0510 Who'll come a waltzing matilda with me 0610 Waltzing matilda, waltzing matilda 0710 Who'll come a waltzing matilda with me 0810 And he sang as he sat and waited by the billabong 0910 Who'll come a waltzing matilda with me. 1010 1110 2. Down came a jumbuck to drink beside the billabong 1210 Up jumped the swagman and seized him with glee 1310 And he sang as he tucked the jumbuck in his tuckerbag 1410 1510 Chorus: 1610 You'll come a waltzing matilda with me 1710 Waltzing matilda, waltzing matilda 1810 You'll come a waltzing matilda with me 1910 And he sang as he tucked the jumbuck in his tuckerbag 2010 You'll come a waltzing matilda with me. 2110 2210 3. Down came the stockman, riding on his thoroughbred, 2310 Down came the troopers, one, two, three. 2410 "Where's that jolly jumbuck you've got in your tuckerbag? 2510 2610 Chorus: 2710 You'll come a waltzing matilda with me 2810 Waltzing matilda, waltzing matilda 2910 You'll come a waltzing matilda with me 3010 Where's that jolly jumbuck you've got in your tuckerbag? 3110 You'll come a waltzing matilda with me. 3210 3310 4. Up jumped the swagman and plunged into the billabong, 3410 "You'll never catch me alive," cried he 3510 And his ghost may be heard as you ride beside the billabong, 3610 3710 Chorus: 3810 Who'll come a waltzing matilda with me 3910 Waltzing matilda, waltzing matilda 4010 Who'll come a waltzing matilda with me 4110 And his ghost may be heard as you ride beside the billabong, 4210 Who'll come a waltzing matilda with me. And for the rest of you (play the music, and sing along): http://www.contemplator.com/folk2/waltzmat.html http://www.contemplator.com/folk2/msic-folk2/wmatilda.mid Glossary: Swagman: A man who seeks casual work while traveling about carrying his swag. Swag: The pack or bundle containing the personal belongings of a swagman. Billabong: A dead-end channel extending from the main stream of a river. Coulibah tree: Native Gum tree of Australia. Billy: A metal pot or kettle used in camp cooking. Jumbuck: A sheep. Tucker: Food Tuckerbag: A bag for carrying food, used by a traveler in the bush or by a swagman Waltzing: A ballroom dance in triple time with a strong accent on the first beat. Stockman: A man who owns or raises livestock (Land owner) Waltzing Matilda is, briefly, a song about a tramp who camps by a creek and steals a sheep. Three policemen arrive; rather than submit to capture, the tramp commits suicide by drowning himself in the creek (see... the song is better :-) Just thought you would like to know. Philip Freidin ================= Philip Freidin philip@fliptronics.com From geoffrob at stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au Sat Sep 6 05:40:00 2003 From: geoffrob at stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au (Geoff Roberts) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: OT: Australian computer "collectors" :) References: Message-ID: <013e01c37462$026e83c0$0200a8c0@geoff> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Philip Freidin" To: Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2003 7:02 PM Subject: Re: OT: Australian computer "collectors" :) > Australia, which as we all know was colonised by convicts sentenced to > "transportation" from England, has a long tradition of celebrating this > heritage. The number of Brit (and to a lesser degree) Yank Quartermasters I've seen desperately searching for Lt. N. Kelly or D. Kelly to recover some kit issued to them is staggering. > Indeed the almost national anthem of Australia celebrates such > behaviour. I draw your attention to statement 1210 of the lyrics of this > Australian classic: > > 0000 Waltzing Matilda > 0010 "Banjo" Paterson, 1893 There are several variants of the song, and probably the most well known version is significantly different here: > 2210 3. Down came the stockman, riding on his thoroughbred, That would be "Squatter" not stockman. A Stockman is the equivalent of the US cowboy and would be unlikely to be on a 'thoroughbred', that would be an expensive animal/ He would probably be on the classic 'Waler' or some other 'bush' horse. The Squatter would be the well off owner of the sheep. They were not landowners in the strict sense of the word, they simply went into the bush in the early days of the colony and 'squatted' on as much land as they could handle. The Crown legitimised most of this at a later time. > Glossary: > > Swagman: > A man who seeks casual work while traveling about carrying his swag. > Swag: > The pack or bundle containing the personal belongings of a swagman. Also known as a 'Matilda. US nearest equivalent would be 'bindle'. '> Billabong: > A dead-end channel extending from the main stream of a river. Uh, well, I think the technical term is Ox-Bow Lake. Where a meander of the river has been cut off and left a small body of water behind that no longer carries the flow of the river through it. > Coulibah tree: > Native Gum tree of Australia. One of many. And it's Coolibah. > Billy: > A metal pot or kettle used in camp cooking. Traditionally, for boiling water and making 'billy tea' but used to heat any liquid or semi liquid food. > Jumbuck: > A sheep. > Tucker: > Food > Tuckerbag: > A bag for carrying food, used by a traveler in the bush or by a swagman > Waltzing: > A ballroom dance in triple time with a strong accent on the first beat. In this context "Waltzing Matilda' is slang for dancing around the country with your 'Matilda', another slang term for a swag. ie, wandering around carrying your swag = 'Waltzing Matilda' This is quite clear in another more recent song called 'The Band Played Waltzing Matilda" > Stockman: > A man who owns or raises livestock (Land owner) That's just plain wrong. See above. A stockman is semantically equal to the US cowboy. These days they are also known as 'ringers'. Note: This is not the same meaning as 'ringer' of a shearing shed. The man who could shear the most sheep in a day 'rung' the shed and he was known as the 'Ringer'. That other old Aussie song "Click go the shears' epitomises this. > Waltzing Matilda is, briefly, a song about a tramp To be absolutely correct, closer to the the US subspecies known as the Hobo. A migratory worker. Often a shearer. A tramp is rather different. > who camps by a creek > and steals a sheep. Three policemen arrive; rather than submit to > capture, the tramp commits suicide by drowning himself in the > creek (see... the song is better :-) Yeah. It's sorta the 'unofficial' national anthem I guess. For reasons that escape me, the mob that run the Rugby World Cup objected to it being sung (something of a tradition) at Rugby matches. Not that we give a damn if they like it or not. Given the nature of Aussies, I think they just guaranteed we will *always* do it now, just to piss 'em off. They might as well tell the Kiwis not to do their Haka. > Just thought you would like to know. Not a bad effort. Geoff in Oz From zmerch at 30below.com Sat Sep 6 09:46:01 2003 From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:42 2005 Subject: info? AMI 6800/6809 system that ran Flex In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030904212235.007d7180@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030906100532.00ad1200@mail.30below.com> Rumor has it that Joe may have mentioned these words: >Anybody know anyting about an OLD (76ish) AMI system with a 6800 or 6809 >CPU that ran Flex? I've been offered one and I'd like to know more about >it. The chassis and such are home made but the cards are factory made. I >have some pictures that I can provide if anyone wants to see them. > > Joe If it ran FLEX, it's *probably* 6809-based -- I dunno if there was ever a FLEX for 6800; but there was even a version of FLEX for the Tandy CoCo. Other than the requisite: "If you don't want it... don't forget me" statement, I'd say 'Snag it' -> it's prolly at least as rare as an Apple 1; mind you, prolly not worth as much (yet) but IMHO, more interesting (as the 6809 *is* my favorite processor... ;-) Oh, and I wouldn't mind seeing the pix... HTH, Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers zmerch@30below.com What do you do when Life gives you lemons, and you don't *like* lemonade????????????? From jcwren at jcwren.com Sat Sep 6 10:01:00 2003 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: info? AMI 6800/6809 system that ran Flex In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030906100532.00ad1200@mail.30below.com> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030906100532.00ad1200@mail.30below.com> Message-ID: <200309061052.51657.jcwren@jcwren.com> FLEX for the 6800? Sure! http://www.swtpc.com/mholley/FLEX20/Flex20_Index.htm -- John On Saturday 06 September 2003 10:34 am, Roger Merchberger wrote: > Rumor has it that Joe may have mentioned these words: > >Anybody know anyting about an OLD (76ish) AMI system with a 6800 or 6809 > >CPU that ran Flex? I've been offered one and I'd like to know more about > >it. The chassis and such are home made but the cards are factory made. I > >have some pictures that I can provide if anyone wants to see them. > > > > Joe > > If it ran FLEX, it's *probably* 6809-based -- I dunno if there was ever a > FLEX for 6800; but there was even a version of FLEX for the Tandy CoCo. > > Other than the requisite: "If you don't want it... don't forget me" > statement, I'd say 'Snag it' -> it's prolly at least as rare as an Apple 1; > mind you, prolly not worth as much (yet) but IMHO, more interesting (as the > 6809 *is* my favorite processor... ;-) > > Oh, and I wouldn't mind seeing the pix... > > HTH, > Roger "Merch" Merchberger > > -- > Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers > zmerch@30below.com > > What do you do when Life gives you lemons, > and you don't *like* lemonade????????????? From jrkeys at concentric.net Sat Sep 6 10:30:00 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Vectrex Games at Thrift Message-ID: <00bf01c3748a$9a760300$bf09dd40@oemcomputer> The other day I found 10 in the box games with manuals and overlays at the local Goodwill. :-) Could not find the console or any other parts of it. :-( I got the following; Scramble, Star Trek, Ripoff, Webwars, Berzerk, Spinball, Pole Position, Solar Quest,Armor Attack, and Heads Up Action Soccer. From r_beaudry at hotmail.com Sat Sep 6 11:19:00 2003 From: r_beaudry at hotmail.com (Rich Beaudry) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: IBM PC/XT 3.5" floppy drivers Message-ID: Hello all, I have an old IBM 3.5" 720KB floppy, meant to be installed in an XT. The kit came with a 5.25" floppy that contained drivers, and a program called "35INSTAL.COM". The floppy is totally unreadable, so I cannot complete the installation on my XT. Does anyone have this diskette who could loan it to me, or make me a copy? I can get the drive's part number, if necessary... Thanks! Rich B. From cisin at xenosoft.com Sat Sep 6 12:21:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: IBM PC/XT 3.5" floppy drivers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030906100741.C40754@newshell.lmi.net> On Sat, 6 Sep 2003, Rich Beaudry wrote: > Hello all, > I have an old IBM 3.5" 720KB floppy, meant to be installed in an XT. The > kit came with a 5.25" floppy that contained drivers, and a program called > "35INSTAL.COM". The floppy is totally unreadable, so I cannot complete the > installation on my XT. Does anyone have this diskette who could loan it to > me, or make me a copy? I can get the drive's part number, if necessary... > Thanks! If you upgrade to DOS 3.20 or newer, then you do NOT need that disk. If your XT has IBM's BIOS, then you need to add DRIVER.SYS to your CONFIG.SYS file. If you are using a non-IBM BIOS, then you can use DRIVPARM instead (in MS-DOS, and present but not documented in PC-DOS) NOTE: DRIVPARM is incompatible with IBM's BIOS. If you want to use DOS <3.20, then you want that disk. NOTE: SOME versions of MS-DOS 2.11 support 720K. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sat Sep 6 12:52:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: info? AMI 6800/6809 system that ran Flex In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030906100532.00ad1200@mail.30below.com> References: <3.0.6.32.20030904212235.007d7180@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030905174841.007b26e0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 10:34 AM 9/6/03 -0400, you wrote: >Rumor has it that Joe may have mentioned these words: >>Anybody know anyting about an OLD (76ish) AMI system with a 6800 or 6809 >>CPU that ran Flex? I've been offered one and I'd like to know more about >>it. The chassis and such are home made but the cards are factory made. I >>have some pictures that I can provide if anyone wants to see them. >> >> Joe > >If it ran FLEX, it's *probably* 6809-based -- I dunno if there was ever a >FLEX for 6800; but there was even a version of FLEX for the Tandy CoCo. I don't know if it ran Flex when it had a 6800 CPU but it started out with a 6800 and was later upgraded to a 6809. I have a couple of 8" disks from it and they have Flex on them. > >Other than the requisite: "If you don't want it... don't forget me" >statement, I'd say 'Snag it' -> That's already in the works! :-) it's prolly at least as rare as an Apple 1; >mind you, prolly not worth as much (yet) but IMHO, more interesting (as the >6809 *is* my favorite processor... ;-) > >Oh, and I wouldn't mind seeing the pix... OK I'll send them to you directly. If there's enough interest I'll post them on the web. Joe > >HTH, >Roger "Merch" Merchberger > >-- >Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers >zmerch@30below.com > >What do you do when Life gives you lemons, >and you don't *like* lemonade????????????? From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sat Sep 6 13:02:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: info? AMI 6800/6809 system that ran Flex In-Reply-To: <200309061052.51657.jcwren@jcwren.com> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030906100532.00ad1200@mail.30below.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030906100532.00ad1200@mail.30below.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030905175245.007a77c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 10:52 AM 9/6/03 -0400, you wrote: >FLEX for the 6800? Sure! >http://www.swtpc.com/mholley/FLEX20/Flex20_Index.htm > > -- John I know about Flex. I'm trying to find more about the system itself. Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sat Sep 6 13:04:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: info? AMI 6800/6809 system that ran Flex Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030905180732.007a05c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> BTW I meant to add that the seller's father bought the boards directly from AMI as part of a bulk purchase through a "computer club" that he used to be a member of. He lived in Palo Alta and worked at SRI (Stanford Research Institute) at the time. I wonder if he was a member of the original Home Brew Computer club and bought the boards through them? He was in the right area at the right time. I'm trying to get more details. BTW does anybody know if there's a list posted anywhere of the early members of the Home Brew Computer club? Joe >At 10:34 AM 9/6/03 -0400, Roger wrote: >>Rumor has it that Joe may have mentioned these words: >>>Anybody know anyting about an OLD (76ish) AMI system with a 6800 or 6809 >>>CPU that ran Flex? I've been offered one and I'd like to know more about >>>it. The chassis and such are home made but the cards are factory made. I >>>have some pictures that I can provide if anyone wants to see them. >>> >>> Joe >> >>If it ran FLEX, it's *probably* 6809-based -- I dunno if there was ever a >>FLEX for 6800; but there was even a version of FLEX for the Tandy CoCo. > > I don't know if it ran Flex when it had a 6800 CPU but it started out with a 6800 and was later upgraded to a 6809. I have a couple of 8" disks from it and they have Flex on them. > >> >>Other than the requisite: "If you don't want it... don't forget me" >>statement, I'd say 'Snag it' -> > > That's already in the works! :-) > > >it's prolly at least as rare as an Apple 1; >>mind you, prolly not worth as much (yet) but IMHO, more interesting (as the >>6809 *is* my favorite processor... ;-) >> >>Oh, and I wouldn't mind seeing the pix... > > OK I'll send them to you directly. If there's enough interest I'll post them on the web. > > Joe >> >>HTH, >>Roger "Merch" Merchberger >> >>-- >>Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers >>zmerch@30below.com >> >>What do you do when Life gives you lemons, >>and you don't *like* lemonade????????????? From jcwren at jcwren.com Sat Sep 6 13:12:00 2003 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: info? AMI 6800/6809 system that ran Flex In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030905175245.007a77c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030906100532.00ad1200@mail.30below.com> <3.0.6.32.20030905175245.007a77c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <200309061403.47217.jcwren@jcwren.com> And I understand that. However, someone else was questioning if Flex ran on the 6800, and that was a reply to *that* question. --John On Friday 05 September 2003 20:52 pm, Joe wrote: > At 10:52 AM 9/6/03 -0400, you wrote: > >FLEX for the 6800? Sure! > >http://www.swtpc.com/mholley/FLEX20/Flex20_Index.htm > > > > -- John > > I know about Flex. I'm trying to find more about the system itself. > > Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sat Sep 6 13:53:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Percom LFD-400B Mini-Disk Controller for SWTPC? Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030905185749.007b1730@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I think my SWTPC is going to be my next restoration project. Mine has a Percom LFD-400B Mini-Disk Controller. Does anyone here have any information about it? It's not listed on Michael Holley's website. I also need info about a Boaz 64k (32k installed) memory board if anyone has any but it's not as crutial as the FD cntroller. Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sat Sep 6 14:22:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: SGI Modular IRIS? Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030905192737.007a77c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Anybody know anything about these? I spotted one in a scrap yard. It's a white box about the size on and end table. I searched the net for info on it but didn't find much and none of the hits talked about the hardware or what software it ran. I opened the front and it had a 5 1/4" hard drive, 5 1/4" tape drive and a 3 1/2" hard drive all mounted in removable sleds. I grabbed the one in the 3 1/2" sled since it looks like it will fit my Indigo. But I'm wondering if the whole thing is rare and should be rescued. Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sat Sep 6 14:45:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Flex mailing list? Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030905194914.007a9e50@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Anybody know what has happened to the Flex mailing list or to Ian Blythe who hosted the Flex website? (http://www.flexusergroup.com/) I tried to subscribe to the list but the message bounced. I found two addresses for Ian but both are no longer valid. Joe From hansp at citem.org Sat Sep 6 15:29:00 2003 From: hansp at citem.org (Hans B Pufal) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Flex mailing list? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030905194914.007a9e50@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <3.0.6.32.20030905194914.007a9e50@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3F59DA22.9010706@citem.org> Joe wrote: > Anybody know what has happened to the Flex mailing list or to Ian Blythe >who hosted the Flex website? (http://www.flexusergroup.com/) I tried to >subscribe to the list but the message bounced. I found two addresses for >Ian but both are no longer valid. > > From the sig line of the fufu mailing list which is currently quite active: FLEX & UniFLEX Users' mailing list http://www.flexusergroup.com/ http://www.evenson-consulting.com/swtpc/ Ian was job-hunting in the UK, he is still active on the mailing list. --hbp From rdd at rddavis.org Sat Sep 6 15:57:00 2003 From: rdd at rddavis.org (R. D. Davis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Flex mailing list? In-Reply-To: <3F59DA22.9010706@citem.org> References: <3.0.6.32.20030905194914.007a9e50@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <3F59DA22.9010706@citem.org> Message-ID: <20030906205103.GE911@rhiannon.rddavis.org> Quothe Hans B Pufal, from writings of Sat, Sep 06, 2003 at 02:59:14PM +0200: > FLEX & UniFLEX Users' mailing list > http://www.flexusergroup.com/ > http://www.evenson-consulting.com/swtpc/ Is this the same FLEX OS that runs on PERQ graphics workstations? -- Copyright (C) 2003 R. D. Davis The difference between humans & other animals: All Rights Reserved an unnatural belief that we're above Nature & rdd@rddavis.org 410-744-4900 her other creatures, using dogma to justify such http://www.rddavis.org beliefs and to justify much human cruelty. From allain at panix.com Sat Sep 6 17:27:01 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Recycling Center goodies References: <00bf01c3748a$9a760300$bf09dd40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <001201c374c4$8d957460$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> I should start by saying that the Friday before the 1st Saturday of the month is a good time to advertize your want lists, because I may pass over things you're looking for. My area recycling center has computers-OK-day once a month. There will be between 20 - 60 large pieces, and small things. The proprietor usually sorts by working/not working status. Don't mean to tease, but here's some things left behind (why I should know your want lists) o Bernoulli Boxes (1x2,1x1) o ISA -> Token Ring cards, cables o Token Ring Hubs (3) o Umax SCSI scanner o ISA -> Ethernet cards o Iomega Jazz drive o working Pentiums/WGAS Here's some stuff I got, available to the list: o PCMCIA -> Token Ring cards (IBM) o PCMCIA -> ArcNet card (T/Conrad) o PalmPilot (I) Modem o Handspring USB cradle o IBM ("clicky") PS2 keyboard o TokenRing baluns For keeps I got a few goodies too, like a Supermac 21" monitor, an AppleVision AV monitor, Apple LaserWriter. Worth checking every month, never any Dec though . John A. From allain at panix.com Sat Sep 6 17:43:01 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: SGI Modular IRIS? References: <3.0.6.32.20030905192737.007a77c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <003301c374c6$c13309c0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> I was just reading about Ken Olsen's afterDec startup, "Advanced Modular Solutions, Inc.". If I get the intent of the company, it was to make disparate systems easily interconnectable. It would not be beyond the scope of what I saw for them to "modularize" products from other companies, like SGI. Don't believe the company is current, though. If it's an AMSI, it's rare. John A. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sat Sep 6 19:55:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Flex mailing list? In-Reply-To: <3F59DA22.9010706@citem.org> References: <3.0.6.32.20030905194914.007a9e50@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <3.0.6.32.20030905194914.007a9e50@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030906204207.007b1a00@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Thanks. I found the evenson-consulting site after posting the questions. It had the address that you gave and I have successfully signed up the list. I tried using the address on Ian's Flex site but a lot of stuff on it seems to be out of date. Joe At 02:59 PM 9/6/03 +0200, you wrote: >Joe wrote: > >> Anybody know what has happened to the Flex mailing list or to Ian Blythe >>who hosted the Flex website? (http://www.flexusergroup.com/) I tried to >>subscribe to the list but the message bounced. I found two addresses for >>Ian but both are no longer valid. >> >> > From the sig line of the fufu mailing list which is currently quite >active: > >FLEX & UniFLEX Users' mailing list >http://www.flexusergroup.com/ >http://www.evenson-consulting.com/swtpc/ > >Ian was job-hunting in the UK, he is still active on the mailing list. > > --hbp From jwstephens_2000 at yahoo.com Sat Sep 6 20:23:01 2003 From: jwstephens_2000 at yahoo.com (jim stephens) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Old manual got wet Message-ID: <20030904015331.49216.qmail@web80403.mail.yahoo.com> Most recovery techniques rely on reducing the manuals moisture to a certain level and maintaining it there and the the best way I heard was to take to a facility that can freeze dry and vacumn dry in parallel. The contents of the Los Angeles public library was nearly destroyed but for using old aerospace facilities around the area to put large quantities of books into old vacumn test chambers with liquid nitrogen cooling, and some mods to the vacumn systems to tolerate the extraction of the moisture. Most computer manuals are printed on paper that shoulc be recoverable, since it basically is high rag based paper, w/o any applied coatings. The sort of papers used by magazines use either plactic coatings, or a very fine clay coating with treatment over paper to get the "slick" look, and those were nearly impossible to recover. (unless new techniques were developed since I last read, anyway). I don't know if you can do this with any resources you have, or know of, but the vacumn / freeze dry method is the best I have heard of. Of course be sure to pack it to guard against mildew and rot, or you won't have anything worth restoring either. Jim From rs at therica.net Sat Sep 6 20:23:16 2003 From: rs at therica.net (rs@therica.net) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Happy manual? Message-ID: <000801c37293$1c82d0c0$ba01a8c0@chvlva.adelphia.net> Dennis- did anyone ever help you out? I'm far from Atari these days, brain-dust at this point, but I was trying to remember who made the Happy, and your post was the first thing shown in the Google search. I might have a copy of the manual somewhere, buried in this house, if you still need help. I decided a few nights ago to see what was new in the emulator world, having briefly attempted to convert over to that in the mid-90's, and had such a hostile and arrogant reply from Darek Mihocka, what a ******. It brought back memories of other unpleasant individuals in this same genre of the old Atari world from years past. best, Rob Happy Enhancement murphy, dennis b (BMC Eng) cctalk@classiccmp.org Thu Mar 27 12:55:04 2003 a.. Previous message: Computer Pioneer Adam Osborne Dies b.. Next message: AdamComputer.com domains c.. Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- Hello all, Just broke my old Atari out of jail (closet). The setup is an Atari 800 with 2-810 disk drives, one of them with the Happy Enhancement. I can't for the life of me fine the manual for the Happy drive. Can anyone help. Thanks, Dennis ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- a.. Previous message: Computer Pioneer Adam Osborne Dies b.. Next message: AdamComputer.com domains c.. Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] From jack.rubin at ameritech.net Sat Sep 6 20:23:19 2003 From: jack.rubin at ameritech.net (Jack Rubin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: audio files posted - 1985 computer pioneer interviews Message-ID: <000001c37296$304a4360$1f6fa8c0@eths.k12.il.us> I've posted the interviews I had with several personal computer "pioneers" and a lecture by Roger Amidon at the 1985 National Computer Conference at www.sideslip.net/vintage_computing/1985_interviews (note that URL has underscores - vintage_computing and 1985_interviews. CDs are available for those who don't want to endure a 144M download. Current CD orders will go out this weekend. Please consider all material released to the public domain under the GNU copyleft agreement. Jack Rubin Wilmette, Illinois USA From jtacoustic at cstone.net Sat Sep 6 20:23:23 2003 From: jtacoustic at cstone.net (jay taylor) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: tektronix 4205 Message-ID: Greetings- this is a message for Tim Rutherford; i found your post to i'm not even sure what via yahoo, you were looking for a Tektronix 4205. i've got one, including keyboard and mouse, but i have not even powered it up yet. are these things worth anything? thanks. jt From david at thecoolbears.org Sat Sep 6 20:23:26 2003 From: david at thecoolbears.org (David Coolbear) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Netbooting Sun 3 Message-ID: <001001c37313$4a82e110$0301010a@thecoolbears.org> I've been trying to netboot a Sun 3/60. It was manuafactured in 88, so hopefully it qualifies as "Classic". Anyway, I'd like to get SonOS4.1.1 running, but I don't have any information on how to get it to netboot. As a first step, I've tried to netboot NetBSD, but had very little success and no help from the NetBSD mailing list. I've got rarpd, bootparam and tftpd running on a linux server. With NetBSD, the sun gets an ip address from rarpd, gets a bootloader from tftp but then times out: root on le0 nfs_boot: trying RARP (and RFC/bootparam) nfs_boot: client_addr=192.0.0.10 (RARP from 192.0.0.1) nfs_boot: timeout Has anyone out there got this to work? On either OS? From cia at raytheon.com Sat Sep 6 20:23:29 2003 From: cia at raytheon.com (Lance J Armstrong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Data I/O 29A manuals Message-ID: Jim, Thanks for putting the 29A .pdf files online. We really needed them for our programmer, to reprogram some old parts in a vital system that's still working out there in the field. Lance From alex at cmmrboot.uah.edu Sat Sep 6 20:23:33 2003 From: alex at cmmrboot.uah.edu (Alex Fedoseyev) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Closet sale - some stuff to go. Message-ID: <200309042141.QAA17586@cmmrboot.uah.edu> Hi, DO you have still this part: SGI - Onyx boards IO4 (030-0646-105) - w/ vcam also SCSI differential, IOADAPT, and SCSI SE How much is it, if you have it ? Thank you Alex -- Dr. Alex Fedoseyev, Center for Microgravity Research, VBRH D-4, University of Alabama in Huntsville, Huntsville, AL 35899, USA Phone : (256) 824-6050 / Fax: (256)824-6944 E-mail: alex@uahtitan.uah.edu Web: http://uahtitan.uah.edu/alex/ From holger.veit at ais.fhg.de Sat Sep 6 20:23:36 2003 From: holger.veit at ais.fhg.de (Holger Veit) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: UCSD P-Code and Pick for IBM PC/XT/AT In-Reply-To: <906f10387.10387906f@ono.com>; from SPEDRAJA@ono.com on Wed, Sep 03, 2003 at 08:15:45AM +0200 References: <906f10387.10387906f@ono.com> Message-ID: <20030905094451.A23948@ct-mail.citytraffic.de> On Wed, Sep 03, 2003 at 08:15:45AM +0200, Sergio Pedraja Cabo wrote: > > Remitente: jim stephens > > Hello ! > > > Ibm had a distribution of the Pcode and UCSD pascal > > that came in the same beige / pink boxes that Dos was > > in. I have that set. > > Well... Having in mind the difficult of locate any kind of operative > UCSD system in the Internet and any other place... Perhaps one > security copy of the USCD disks could be realized to allow some > believers to see the light :-) You might be interested in looking at www.klebsch.de for a P-Code interpreter and at some mirror of ftp.apple.asimov.net, like ftp.mayn.de/pub/mirrors/apple.asimov.net/programming/apple_pascal and see what happens... Holger From philip at awale.qc.ca Sat Sep 6 20:24:00 2003 From: philip at awale.qc.ca (philip@awale.qc.ca) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Turing books looking for a home Message-ID: A Guide to the PC-Turing Interpreter, J.N.P. Hume (don't have the disk), 1986 The Turing Language Report, Richard C. Holt and James R. Cordy, 1983 (2 copies) Neither has an ISBN. Anyone want? -Philip From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sat Sep 6 20:51:01 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Display writer software Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030906213833.007cd280@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Spotted this on E-bay. At leat one of the disk has Display Writer software on it. These are 8" disks for the original Dispaly Writer NOT the later DW software for the PC. Joe From teoz at neo.rr.com Sat Sep 6 20:52:58 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: IIgs SCSI card Rom Message-ID: <005901c374e1$5199bf80$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Anybody on the list have the apple II scsi card rev "c" rom that they can make a copy off? I am getting a scsi card for my IIgs but it only has revision "b" rom. I dont have the "c" code or a burner. Willing to pay for the ROM chip and shipping to Ohio. Thanks From charlesmorris at direcway.com Sat Sep 6 21:11:00 2003 From: charlesmorris at direcway.com (Charles) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: 8/L has been sold. Have ADM-3A for sale. Message-ID: The 8/L, ASR33, DF32 disk emulator project has been sold. Thanks for all your interest (and offers). Anyone who wants the DF32 emulator schematic and artwork, I can email you a copy. I hope someone can take my "first draft" and make a useful unit for those who are interested. I have a working ADM-3A that I may want to sell also. It has a homebrewed lower-case 2716 ROM (thanks Steve Loboyko for the font files). I installed the "optional" parts for current loop on the main PCB, and used it with the 8/L. The only thing that's missing is the little aluminum panel covering the dip switches. Any interest? Same deal as before, please email offers, "sealed bids". thanks Charles From cisin at xenosoft.com Sat Sep 6 21:11:35 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Display writer software In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030906213833.007cd280@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <3.0.6.32.20030906213833.007cd280@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <20030906185945.Q47156@newshell.lmi.net> On Sat, 6 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: > Spotted this on E-bay. At leat one of the disk has Display Writer > software on it. These are 8" disks for the original Dispaly Writer NOT the > later DW software for the PC. > In addition to the stand-alone word-processor software for the Display Writer, there was also a CP/M available for it - watch for that! From hansp at citem.org Sat Sep 6 23:02:00 2003 From: hansp at citem.org (Hans B Pufal) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Flex mailing list? In-Reply-To: <20030906205103.GE911@rhiannon.rddavis.org> References: <3.0.6.32.20030905194914.007a9e50@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <3F59DA22.9010706@citem.org> <20030906205103.GE911@rhiannon.rddavis.org> Message-ID: <3F5A4464.9050401@citem.org> R. D. Davis wrote: >Is this the same FLEX OS that runs on PERQ graphics workstations? > > I do not think so.. The FLEX we are talking of is a unix-like system written in the late 70's and early 80's for 6809 based systems. -- hbp From oliv555 at arrl.net Sun Sep 7 02:17:00 2003 From: oliv555 at arrl.net (no) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Annual cleanup / mostly DECstuff Message-ID: <3F5AD961.5050706@arrl.net> Have a bunch of items needing new homes, most are freebies. Contact me off-list thanks, -nick o -- free, local pickup only, NO shipping! -MicroVAX III+ in a BA23 pedestal cab (11/73 badge): w/m7625(ka655),m7622(ms650),m7555,UC07,rx33, no HD -AlphaStation 200 4/233, 196mb, DECunix -Mac 7300/180, 4.5Gb hd, keyboard+mouse -HP Network Analyzer J2219 FDDI (486 color laptop) -misc DEC drives: tzk12 tk50 (2)rz24 (2)rz26 (2)rz28 -- other freebies, U-pay shipping: (2) KDA50 m7164, m7165, w/manual (1) m9401 (1) m9405 w/cables (2) m9047 rf31/rf72 user guide RF series user guide(covers 31,35,36,72,73,74) VMS instal'n guide for vax6200 VMS instal'n guide for MVII, VSII several MicroVMS pocket refs/user guides RT11 v5 master index (3) la36 user guides -- For Sale: (local only, no shipping) $25 Vaxstation 4000/vlc +manual +VT320/lk401(dim) $25 Vaxstation 4000/60 +manual/puck/SZ16c-da/vt420/lk401 $40 IBM rs6000/7043 (43p/140), 200mhz, 128mb, 2.1gb, keyboard+mouse $40 Digital multia vx51b-f2, 128mb, 300mhz intel/overdrive $50 Digital Alpha 366XL, 256mb kbd+mouse From geoffr at zipcon.net Sun Sep 7 02:30:00 2003 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: COPY ][ software. In-Reply-To: <20030906185945.Q47156@newshell.lmi.net> References: <3.0.6.32.20030906213833.007cd280@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <3.0.6.32.20030906213833.007cd280@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030907002342.026a5c80@mail.zipcon.net> is there anyone who hase Copy][ Plus for the apple ][ ?? The old disk I have seems to have gone to the bit bucket in the sky and I'm looking at getting an old apple ][ E running again and want to make back up copies of OGRE :) From waltje at pdp11.nl Sun Sep 7 04:26:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Netbooting Sun 3 In-Reply-To: <001001c37313$4a82e110$0301010a@thecoolbears.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, David Coolbear wrote: > With NetBSD, the sun gets an ip address from rarpd, gets a bootloader from > tftp but then times out: > > root on le0 > nfs_boot: trying RARP (and RFC/bootparam) > nfs_boot: client_addr=192.0.0.10 (RARP from 192.0.0.1) > nfs_boot: timeout > > Has anyone out there got this to work? On either OS? Yes. Make sure you also have the Linux box export a root file system over NFS, which is where the install files are. Your Sun is trying to mount that directory as its root, so it can move on to installing on the disk :) For Netbooting xBSD, you need: - rarpd (/etc/ethers) for giving it an IP address - bootparamd (/etc/bootparams) for telling it where to find the root fisk (over NFS) - mountd (/etc/exports) for mounting the NFS disk - nfsd (no config files) for actual NFS I/O I usually have something called /export/OpenBSD/ on my server, where all the OpenBSD files live: /export/OpenBSD /vax /i386 /sparc and point the clients to that in bootparams with a line line: testvax root=vaxlab:/export/OpenBSD/vax where 'vaxlab' is a VAX serving things here. So, the client gets an IP address, and then tries to mount the above. When succeeded, it will continue to load, usually the "bsd.rd" kernel which includes a RAM disk image with just enough brains to set up things. The above is OpenBSD, but since they all share the same code base, I kind of assume this part of them is the same for all. Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From sebastian.brueckner at epost.de Sun Sep 7 05:19:01 2003 From: sebastian.brueckner at epost.de (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Sebastian_Br=FCckner?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: PDP-8/L Maintenence Manual Vol II Message-ID: <3F5B0416.9060100@epost.de> Hello everyone! Since some people requested it, I uploaded the complete manual today. I hope it will be of use for some of you: http://cpp.seriousassault.de/pdp8/ Tell me if something is unreadable or if you have any suggestion for improvement! Regards, Sebastian PS: www.pdp8.net seems to have the same manual available for a few days now. I did not yet have the time to check it out. Is it exactly the same? From curt at atarimuseum.com Sun Sep 7 08:27:00 2003 From: curt at atarimuseum.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Happy manual? Message-ID: <200309071326.h87DQw336963@huey.classiccmp.org> The Happy Enhancement was made by Happy Computing who also did TurboDOS... I have several images of the rom's and I may have a manual if anyone needs it, let me know. Curt > Dennis- did anyone ever help you out? I'm far from Atari these days, > brain-dust at this point, but I was trying to remember who made the Happy, and > your post was the first thing shown in the Google search. I might have a copy > of the manual somewhere, buried in this house, if you still need help. I > decided a few nights ago to see what was new in the emulator world, having > briefly attempted to convert over to that in the mid-90's, and had such a > hostile and arrogant reply from Darek Mihocka, what a ******. It brought back > memories of other unpleasant individuals in this same genre of the old Atari > world from years past. > > best, > Rob > > > > Happy Enhancement > murphy, dennis b (BMC Eng) cctalk@classiccmp.org > Thu Mar 27 12:55:04 2003 > > a.. Previous message: Computer Pioneer Adam Osborne Dies > b.. Next message: AdamComputer.com domains > c.. Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > --- > > Hello all, > > Just broke my old Atari out of jail (closet). The setup is an Atari 800 > with 2-810 disk drives, one of them with the Happy Enhancement. I can't for > the life of me fine the manual for the Happy drive. Can anyone help. > > Thanks, > Dennis > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > --- > > > a.. Previous message: Computer Pioneer Adam Osborne Dies > b.. Next message: AdamComputer.com domains > c.. Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] From spectre at floodgap.com Sun Sep 7 08:53:01 2003 From: spectre at floodgap.com (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Annual cleanup / mostly DECstuff In-Reply-To: <3F5AD961.5050706@arrl.net> from no at "Sep 7, 3 02:08:17 am" Message-ID: <200309071357.GAA16076@floodgap.com> > Have a bunch of items needing new homes, > most are freebies. Contact me off-list Um, where are you? :-) -- ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com -- Matter can neither be created nor destroyed, nor returned without a receipt. From oliv555 at arrl.net Sun Sep 7 10:11:00 2003 From: oliv555 at arrl.net (no) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Annual cleanup / mostly DECstuff (Houston) In-Reply-To: <3F5AD961.5050706@arrl.net> References: <3F5AD961.5050706@arrl.net> Message-ID: <3F5B4880.6040103@arrl.net> DUH! Location= Houston. Thats what happens when I post at 2 in the morning no wrote: > Have a bunch of items needing new homes, > most are freebies. Contact me off-list > > thanks, > > -nick o > > -- free, local pickup only, NO shipping! > > -MicroVAX III+ in a BA23 pedestal cab (11/73 badge): > w/m7625(ka655),m7622(ms650),m7555,UC07,rx33, no HD > -AlphaStation 200 4/233, 196mb, DECunix > -Mac 7300/180, 4.5Gb hd, keyboard+mouse > -HP Network Analyzer J2219 FDDI (486 color laptop) > -misc DEC drives: tzk12 tk50 (2)rz24 (2)rz26 (2)rz28 > > -- other freebies, U-pay shipping: > > (2) KDA50 m7164, m7165, w/manual > (1) m9401 > (1) m9405 w/cables > (2) m9047 > rf31/rf72 user guide > RF series user guide(covers 31,35,36,72,73,74) > VMS instal'n guide for vax6200 > VMS instal'n guide for MVII, VSII > several MicroVMS pocket refs/user guides > RT11 v5 master index > (3) la36 user guides > > -- For Sale: (local only, no shipping) > > $25 Vaxstation 4000/vlc +manual +VT320/lk401(dim) > $25 Vaxstation 4000/60 +manual/puck/SZ16c-da/vt420/lk401 > $40 IBM rs6000/7043 (43p/140), 200mhz, 128mb, 2.1gb, keyboard+mouse > $40 Digital multia vx51b-f2, 128mb, 300mhz intel/overdrive > $50 Digital Alpha 366XL, 256mb kbd+mouse From jrkeys at concentric.net Sun Sep 7 10:25:01 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: PCjr goes for over $150 Message-ID: <019601c37553$0b579390$f90add40@oemcomputer> Here's a complete unit that sold for $159+ on eBay, http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2750719864 From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sun Sep 7 12:20:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Flex mailing list? In-Reply-To: <3F5A4464.9050401@citem.org> from "Hans B Pufal" at Sep 6, 3 10:32:36 pm Message-ID: > R. D. Davis wrote: > > >Is this the same FLEX OS that runs on PERQ graphics workstations? > > I am almost sure they are not the same thing. > > > I do not think so.. The FLEX we are talking of is a unix-like system > written in the late 70's and early 80's for 6809 based systems. I've only used (6809) flex briefly, on an Acorn System of all things, but I don't remember it as being very unix-like. I remember it as being single-tasking with no I/O ridirection, pipes, or anything like that. OS-9 was much more like '6809 unix' (to the user, internally it's very different!) -tony From cheri-post at web.de Sun Sep 7 12:59:00 2003 From: cheri-post at web.de (Pierre Gebhardt) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) Message-ID: <200309071751.h87Hp3Q32013@mailgate5.cinetic.de> > > Anyway, I'm one of the younger members of this list, but many of my > > computers are older than I am by a significant margin. > > Last time I demonstrated one of my minis to a university computer club, I > suddently realised that the machine was older than the students :-) > > -tony I think that one shouldn't forget how difficult it is, to get "old and interesting" machines. To get a PDP-8 is certainly not easy if you just started collecting and if don't live in the states were it's a bit easier to get old computers. I belong to the young members, too and I'm proud of my PDP11/23 I got on Ebay. Young guys will certainly start to collect 10 or 15-year-old machines. Computers of the 60s and 70s are cool, but try to find them in the year 2003 for less money... Besides, nice machines were built in the 80s, I wouldn't draw a line at 1980... Pierre ______________________________________________________________________________ 38xTestsieger - WEB.DE FreeMail - Deutschlands beste E-Mail Design-Mails - einfach schoenere E-Mails - http://f.web.de/?mc=021129 From jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de Sun Sep 7 14:06:00 2003 From: jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de (Jochen Kunz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: Netbooting Sun 3 In-Reply-To: <001001c37313$4a82e110$0301010a@thecoolbears.org>; from david@thecoolbears.org on Thu, Sep 04, 2003 at 11:35:18 %z References: <001001c37313$4a82e110$0301010a@thecoolbears.org> Message-ID: <20030907183144.GC1459@oblina.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> On 2003.09.04 11:35 David Coolbear wrote: > With NetBSD, the sun gets an ip address from rarpd, gets a bootloader > from tftp but then times out: > > root on le0 > nfs_boot: trying RARP (and RFC/bootparam) > nfs_boot: client_addr=192.0.0.10 (RARP from 192.0.0.1) > nfs_boot: timeout I had (possibly) the same error when I netbooted a SPARCstation 1+ from a FreeBSD machine. It was quite simple. The primitive IP stack of the netloader on the client machine can't answer arp requests. But the server broadcasts a arp (arp, not rarp) when the tftp or NFS action is starting. Solution was simple: Set the arp information for the client on the host paermanent. Somthing like arp -s 192.0.0.10 00:11:22:33:44:55 permanent on the boot server. I successfully installed NetBSD via netboot on a 3/60 back in the NetBSD 1.3 days. It should still work. Did you check the NetBSD diskless HOWTO? SunOS, did you check http://www.sun3arc.org/ and http://www.sun3zoo.de/ If you have speciffic problems with SunOS on Sun3, ask Peter, the man behind the Sun3 Zoo. He is very kind and helpfull. -- tsch??, Jochen Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz From r_beaudry at hotmail.com Sun Sep 7 14:45:01 2003 From: r_beaudry at hotmail.com (Rich Beaudry) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: IBM PC/XT 3.5" floppy drivers Message-ID: >> I have an old IBM 3.5" 720KB floppy, meant to be installed in an XT. The >> kit came with a 5.25" floppy that contained drivers, and a program called >> "35INSTAL.COM". >If you upgrade to DOS 3.20 or newer, then you do NOT need that disk. >If your XT has IBM's BIOS, then you need to add DRIVER.SYS to your >CONFIG.SYS file. >If you are using a non-IBM BIOS, then you can use DRIVPARM instead >(in MS-DOS, and present but not documented in PC-DOS) >NOTE: DRIVPARM is incompatible with IBM's BIOS. >If you want to use DOS <3.20, then you want that disk. >NOTE: SOME versions of MS-DOS 2.11 support 720K. Fred, That did it! And a big "duh" on my part .... The PC in question is an original IBM PC/XT 5160, and it has a 1/2 height 360KB drive, and a hard drive (10MB full-height 5.25" w/ XEBEC Controller). There was a hole above the 360KB drive dying to have a drive put in :-), so I added the 720KB disk (an original IBM part). The hard drive boots IBM DOS 3.30, so I gave DRIVER.SYS a try -- It worked first shot! Of course, I could have looked in my IBM DOS 3.30 manual, but that would have been to easy :-) Thanks again! Rich B. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sun Sep 7 15:12:01 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: id this Performance Technology Inc card? Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030907160419.007b3e90@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Found two of these this morning. I think they're some kind of bridge board but I'm not sure. The cards are about 4 x 7" and have three LSI on them along with various EPROMS and SSI ICs. The three main ICs are a NCR/5380 SCSI interface, a WDC 2793 FD controller and a Hitachi HD63B03 CPU. Also has a 4 pin power connector like that used on a disk drive. Three are two other coonectrors, one is a 34 pin IDC header and the other is a 50 pin IDC header. There are also three socketed resistor packs (terminating resistors?). Anybody know any more about these? Joe From SUPRDAVE at aol.com Sun Sep 7 16:09:00 2003 From: SUPRDAVE at aol.com (SUPRDAVE@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: PCjr goes for over $150 Message-ID: In a message dated 9/7/2003 11:19:23 AM Eastern Daylight Time, jrkeys@concentric.net writes: Here's a complete unit that sold for $159+ on eBay, http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2750719864 I got about half that about 4 years ago from a complete pcjr package deal with some reference books. guess I better email the winner and offer him a pcjr box that I found on the side of the road just last year and a jr monitor still in the box, heh. From spectre at floodgap.com Sun Sep 7 16:19:00 2003 From: spectre at floodgap.com (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: PCjr goes for over $150 In-Reply-To: from "SUPRDAVE@aol.com" at "Sep 7, 3 05:00:50 pm" Message-ID: <200309072122.OAA13930@floodgap.com> > I got about half that about 4 years ago from a complete pcjr package deal > with some reference books. > guess I better email the winner and offer him a pcjr box that I found on the > side of the road just last year and a jr monitor still in the box, heh. Hey, my unit has some extra RAM and the parallel port expansion. Wonder what he'd pay for those? ;-) Never mind, I actually *like* the PCjr. It's an intriguing orphan. -- ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com -- Arguments with furniture are rarely productive. -- Kehlog Albran ----------- From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sun Sep 7 16:30:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) In-Reply-To: <200309071751.h87Hp3Q32013@mailgate5.cinetic.de> from "Pierre Gebhardt" at Sep 7, 3 07:51:08 pm Message-ID: > I think that one shouldn't forget how difficult it is, to get "old and > interesting" machines. I do know the problem. I'm finding it very hard to increase the collection at the moment... > To get a PDP-8 is certainly not easy if you just started collecting Even 10 years ago PDP8s were not easy to find. I'd been seriously collecting for at least 6 years before I managed to get one. PDP11s were a bit easier to find. [...] > Besides, nice machines were built in the 80s, I wouldn't draw a line > at 1980... I would agree with you. Problem is that the really nice computers of the 1980s (hey, who said 'PERQ' ? :-)) are not easy to find either... -tony From teoz at neo.rr.com Sun Sep 7 16:34:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:43 2005 Subject: PCjr goes for over $150 References: <200309072122.OAA13930@floodgap.com> Message-ID: <000e01c37586$9c0449a0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Which was the better machine, the pcjr or the tandy 1000 clone? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cameron Kaiser" To: Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2003 5:22 PM Subject: Re: PCjr goes for over $150 > > I got about half that about 4 years ago from a complete pcjr package deal > > with some reference books. > > guess I better email the winner and offer him a pcjr box that I found on the > > side of the road just last year and a jr monitor still in the box, heh. > > Hey, my unit has some extra RAM and the parallel port expansion. Wonder > what he'd pay for those? ;-) > > Never mind, I actually *like* the PCjr. It's an intriguing orphan. > > -- > ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- > Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com > -- Arguments with furniture are rarely productive. -- Kehlog Albran ----------- From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Sun Sep 7 17:06:00 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: id this Performance Technology Inc card? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030907160419.007b3e90@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <20030907215748.23978.qmail@web21102.mail.yahoo.com> > Found two of these this morning. I think they're some kind of bridge > board but I'm not sure. Sounds like a SCSI floppy interface for sure - not sure what system they would have come from. I have a few Manta boards which are pretty much identical in layout (they're not to hand or I'd check the chip IDs) but I don't know if these would be a clone or use a totally different command protocol. You could try plugging one into something with a SCSI host adapter and see what it IDs itself as at least. cheers Jules ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From jrice54 at charter.net Sun Sep 7 18:27:00 2003 From: jrice54 at charter.net (James Rice) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: PCjr goes for over $150 In-Reply-To: <000e01c37586$9c0449a0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> References: <200309072122.OAA13930@floodgap.com> <000e01c37586$9c0449a0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <3F5BBE30.1050902@charter.net> I've always liked the Tandy better. With 3-5 ISA slots and using standard half-height floppy's, it was pretty expandable. I ran a company on three 1000SX's networked with arcnet and outfitted with 10-30 mb hard drives until 1992. I paid $2700 each for the SX's in 1985. They each had 384mb ram, 2 floppys, memory plus boards, digimouse/clock boards, a 12" CGA monitor, no hard drive and one DMP-130A printer. I paid $375 for enough 256mb chips to upgrade all hem to 640k. I later paid $1000 each for three 10mb hard drives. I was running a DOS accounting package that I used until I upgraded to 486's with WFWG 3.11 in 1993. I still have two of them, a 1000HD that I was given and a 1000SL that I paid a buck for at a surplus shop. All have original Tandy CM-11 monitors, two are on my home network with 10BaseT cards and one has a 286Express turbo board. I still have one of the original 10mb external hard drives but lost the controller for it. As I remember, Tandy 1000's used a non-standard IRQ for the hard drive controller. The strange IRQ, the female serial ports, the card edge parallel port and and the Tandy 1000 only keyboard were the strangest thing about them. TeoZ wrote: >Which was the better machine, the pcjr or the tandy 1000 clone? > > > -- http://webpages.charter.net/jrice54/classiccomp2.html From SUPRDAVE at aol.com Sun Sep 7 19:25:00 2003 From: SUPRDAVE at aol.com (SUPRDAVE@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: PCjr goes for over $150 Message-ID: <24.458b518f.2c8d2453@aol.com> In a message dated 9/7/2003 5:12:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time, spectre@floodgap.com writes: > I got about half that about 4 years ago from a complete pcjr package deal > with some reference books. > guess I better email the winner and offer him a pcjr box that I found on the > side of the road just last year and a jr monitor still in the box, heh. Hey, my unit has some extra RAM and the parallel port expansion. Wonder what he'd pay for those? ;-) Never mind, I actually *like* the PCjr. It's an intriguing orphan. it's not bad. Mostly bought by IBMers I'm sure. I've got lots of jr stuff. Now that I'm moving my entire collection to the house, I hope to find all the parts to connect up the jr hard drive to see if it actually works. From jpl15 at panix.com Mon Sep 8 00:54:00 2003 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: Need Covalent Terminal info Message-ID: A considerable amount of Googling, et al., has turned up no readily-available info, so I apply here: I have a Covalent Systems model 1410 terminal, which I bought at Weirdstuff last VCF, because cosmetically it *looks* like a VT100... anyway it was cheap and it works, but it appears not to emulate any known DEC CRT in it's present configuration, and the two sets of dipswitches on the back are cleverly un-marked. (Why do 'engineers' DO this shit??? Are they ashamed of their work? DO they hate techs??) Anyway, if anyone has any Covalent terminal info, or can point me to same, I'd be Much Obliged. The Collateral good news is that my 11/44 system has survived the move and garage temps over 110F and booted up this afternoon (now that it's cooling off a bit in northwestern Nevada) with no problems at all. I've spent the last few hours poking around on it and trying to remember how to drive RSX11 without having to drag a bunch of manuals out. I was using the Covalent for the system console, and a VT220 for the user term. I have a Decwriter on the way to use for the Console - and, I can now have my dream come true: the Machine will live in the Garage, and the terminals will be in my office - where it's Quiet. Cheers John From drido at optushome.com.au Mon Sep 8 01:28:00 2003 From: drido at optushome.com.au (Dr. Ido) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: Tandy 1000s was Re: PCjr goes for over $150 In-Reply-To: <000e01c37586$9c0449a0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> References: <200309072122.OAA13930@floodgap.com> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.20030908161403.0133a180@mail.optushome.com.au> At 05:25 PM 9/7/03 -0400, you wrote: >Which was the better machine, the pcjr or the tandy 1000 clone? Personally I prefer the Tandy 1000. The PCjr was never released here in Australia. We got the PC JX which is basically a PCjr with 3.5" floppy drives and expansion modules that stack on top of the machine rather than alongside it. I like the Tandy 1000s because the later models were upgraded quite nicely over the original Tandy 1000/PCjr while still retaining compatibility with the 3 voice sound and the 16 color graphics mode. I've got a Tandy 1000RL which has an 8Mhz 8086-2, 640KB RAM, DOS 3.3 in ROM, 720KB 3.5" floppy, 40MB XT/IDE hard disk and standard PS/2 keyboard/mouse ports (I did like the original Tandy 1000 keyboard, but the layout can be a pain sometimes). The case is tiny and it only has 1 ISA slot, but there isn't much you need to add to it. I currently have an Hitachi CDROM controller card in there running an old external single speed CDROM (which believe it or not actually reads CDRs), but I may swap that for a network card in future. On the subject of Tandy 1000s, did anyone ever manage to get an Inboard/386 card working in one? I remember getting some old 286 upgrade card working in a 1000SX, but that card didn't have onboard RAM so the speed increase was minimal. I could never get any of the cards with onboard RAM to work. From allain at panix.com Mon Sep 8 08:11:00 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: Need Covalent Terminal info References: Message-ID: <001f01c37609$3cc17340$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> > (Why do 'engineers' DO this shit??? Are they ashamed > of their work? DO they hate techs??) Engineers? Nyeah. Marketeers that want to drive up revenues through sales of manuals and support calls. John A. From jcwren at jcwren.com Mon Sep 8 08:16:00 2003 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: Apple I replicas to be available In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200309080907.42707.jcwren@jcwren.com> http://www.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,60329,00.html - Story http://www.vintagecomputer.tk/ - Replica site --John From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 8 08:54:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 Message-ID: I have two rather old monitors marked as "Sabre" on the front. They have a DE9 female socket on the back, but also carry a label claiming the monitors to be SVGA. I've never seen SVGA use DE9 connectors, I've always seen them with the high densitry 15 pin connectors (as commmonly seen on current PC monitors). Anyone know the pinout for an adaptor? Anyone have a particular desire for these monitors? -chris From jrice54 at charter.net Mon Sep 8 09:25:00 2003 From: jrice54 at charter.net (James Rice) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F5C8DA3.3080405@charter.net> I have a older Vox-On monitor that is configured like that. I also seem to remember some older NEC models that needed a HD15 to DE9 cable. I still have the cable, so I can look at it when I get home. As far as the Sabre label, American Airlines used to private label a lot of AST computers and monitors as Sabre for distribution to travel agencies for connection to the Sabre reservation network. There were a lot of P100 Sabre systems floating around DFW for a while. James chris wrote: >I have two rather old monitors marked as "Sabre" on the front. They have >a DE9 female socket on the back, but also carry a label claiming the >monitors to be SVGA. I've never seen SVGA use DE9 connectors, I've always >seen them with the high densitry 15 pin connectors (as commmonly seen on >current PC monitors). > >Anyone know the pinout for an adaptor? Anyone have a particular desire >for these monitors? > >-chris > > > > http://webpages.charter.net/jrice54/classiccomp2.html From bob_lafleur at technologist.com Mon Sep 8 09:36:00 2003 From: bob_lafleur at technologist.com (Bob Lafleur) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <001101c37615$907b5b20$023ca8c0@blafleur> I have a Sony CPD-1304 VGA/SVGA monitor that has a 9-pin connector as well. I have a 9-15 pin adapter cable to use it on a PC, and they also supposedly made (but I never got one) a cable to use it with a Mac II class computer. -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of chris Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 9:46 AM To: Classic Computer Subject: SVGA with DE9 I have two rather old monitors marked as "Sabre" on the front. They have a DE9 female socket on the back, but also carry a label claiming the monitors to be SVGA. I've never seen SVGA use DE9 connectors, I've always seen them with the high densitry 15 pin connectors (as commmonly seen on current PC monitors). Anyone know the pinout for an adaptor? Anyone have a particular desire for these monitors? -chris From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 8 09:43:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 Message-ID: >I have a older Vox-On monitor that is configured like that. I also seem >to remember some older NEC models that needed a HD15 to DE9 cable. I >still have the cable, so I can look at it when I get home. As far as the >Sabre label, American Airlines used to private label a lot of AST >computers and monitors as Sabre for distribution to travel agencies for >connection to the Sabre reservation network. There were a lot of P100 >Sabre systems floating around DFW for a while. No sooner did I post the email than I found one DE9 to HD15 cable. It had fallen behind the cabinet that one of the monitors was sitting on top of. So now I have at least one cable and can use that to make a 2nd if need be. I think you might be right on the Sabre label. It does look like the American Airlines Sabre system logo (although it has been a long time since I have seen that logo so I might be wrong). I'm not sure how I wound up with two monitors from their systems however. -chris From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 8 09:46:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 Message-ID: >I have a Sony CPD-1304 VGA/SVGA monitor that has a 9-pin connector as >well. I have a 9-15 pin adapter cable to use it on a PC, and they also >supposedly made (but I never got one) a cable to use it with a Mac II >class computer. I might have a cable or two like that for the Mac. I have some that are 15 pin like the Mac RGB connector, and go to a 9 pin like a CGA connector. I don't know what they go to, they were just in a box of cables that I aquired. Humm... I wonder if I can use one of those cables with my Sabre monitors? -chris From dbwood at kc.rr.com Mon Sep 8 09:48:00 2003 From: dbwood at kc.rr.com (Douglas Wood) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 References: Message-ID: <162701c37617$05f0d320$6601a8c0@kc.rr.com> Do you mean "DB9" connectors? Douglas Wood Software Engineer dbwood@kc.rr.com ICQ#: 143841506 Home of the EPICIS Development System for the PIC http://epicis.piclist.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "chris" To: "Classic Computer" Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 8:45 AM Subject: SVGA with DE9 > I have two rather old monitors marked as "Sabre" on the front. They have > a DE9 female socket on the back, but also carry a label claiming the > monitors to be SVGA. I've never seen SVGA use DE9 connectors, I've always > seen them with the high densitry 15 pin connectors (as commmonly seen on > current PC monitors). > > Anyone know the pinout for an adaptor? Anyone have a particular desire > for these monitors? > > -chris > From jrice54 at charter.net Mon Sep 8 09:57:00 2003 From: jrice54 at charter.net (James Rice) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: NADADSCN (not another discussion about D shell connector names) In-Reply-To: <162701c37617$05f0d320$6601a8c0@kc.rr.com> References: <162701c37617$05f0d320$6601a8c0@kc.rr.com> Message-ID: <3F5C950C.9040100@charter.net> Here we go again. Douglas Wood wrote: >Do you mean "DB9" connectors? > >Douglas Wood >Software Engineer >dbwood@kc.rr.com >ICQ#: 143841506 > >Home of the EPICIS Development System for the PIC >http://epicis.piclist.com > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "chris" >To: "Classic Computer" >Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 8:45 AM >Subject: SVGA with DE9 > > > > >>I have two rather old monitors marked as "Sabre" on the front. They have >>a DE9 female socket on the back, but also carry a label claiming the >>monitors to be SVGA. I've never seen SVGA use DE9 connectors, I've always >>seen them with the high densitry 15 pin connectors (as commmonly seen on >>current PC monitors). >> >>Anyone know the pinout for an adaptor? Anyone have a particular desire >>for these monitors? >> >>-chris >> From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Sep 8 10:51:01 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: <3F5C8DA3.3080405@charter.net> References: Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030908112904.007b4480@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 09:09 AM 9/8/03 -0500, you wrote: >I have a older Vox-On monitor that is configured like that. I also seem >to remember some older NEC models that needed a HD15 to DE9 cable. You're right. A lot of the old NEC Multisyncs that we used had a small adapter that went from HD-15 to DE9. It was a metal adapter about 1 1/2" long. It plugged in between the computer and the cable. Joe I >still have the cable, so I can look at it when I get home. As far as the >Sabre label, American Airlines used to private label a lot of AST >computers and monitors as Sabre for distribution to travel agencies for >connection to the Sabre reservation network. There were a lot of P100 >Sabre systems floating around DFW for a while. > >James > >chris wrote: > >>I have two rather old monitors marked as "Sabre" on the front. They have >>a DE9 female socket on the back, but also carry a label claiming the >>monitors to be SVGA. I've never seen SVGA use DE9 connectors, I've always >>seen them with the high densitry 15 pin connectors (as commmonly seen on >>current PC monitors). >> >>Anyone know the pinout for an adaptor? Anyone have a particular desire >>for these monitors? >> >>-chris >> >> >> >> >http://webpages.charter.net/jrice54/classiccomp2.html From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Sep 8 10:56:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: Apple I replicas to be available In-Reply-To: <200309080907.42707.jcwren@jcwren.com> References: Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030908114732.007b5940@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> He needs to find a web hosting site that works if he expects to sell any! I tried over and over to look at his site and the only thing that worked was the pop-up ads! Joe (an X-potential customer) At 09:07 AM 9/8/03 -0400, you wrote: >http://www.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,60329,00.html - Story >http://www.vintagecomputer.tk/ - Replica site > >--John From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Sep 8 11:00:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: pinging Jeff Kaneko Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030908115236.007b4100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Jeff, Your mail box is full and you e-mail is bouncing. Joe From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 8 11:02:56 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 Message-ID: >Do you mean "DB9" connectors? I was under the impression that the small D shell size was an "E" not a "B". That "B" was the larger size commonly found on 25 pin connectors (lets not split hairs here, everyone knows what I mean by 25 pin connector... ie: a common PC parallel connector, or the larger serial connector, or a Mac SCSI connector). I used to call it a DB9, but I was corrected many moons ago by others on this list with FAR more knowledge on the topic than I have, so I took them at their word, and have made an effort to always refer to it as a DE9 now. I suppose the HD15 "VGA" connector would then be a DE15. And a DB9 would be a "25 pin" shell with only 9 actual pins in it (9 pin spaces, as from what I understand the count is based on number of spaces, not actual number of pins present). Hopefully we will avoid the whole "whats a "centronics/amphenol/telco/SCSI" connector called" discussion. That one really makes my head spin :-) But I am curious what the Sun monitor connector is called (that one that is a DB shell with 3 large barrel pins as well as some smaller pins). -chris From paul at frixxon.co.uk Mon Sep 8 11:06:00 2003 From: paul at frixxon.co.uk (Paul Williams) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: Need Covalent Terminal info In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F5CA592.3030909@frixxon.co.uk> John Lawson wrote: > I have a Covalent Systems model 1410 terminal, which I bought at > Weirdstuff last VCF, because cosmetically it *looks* like a VT100... > anyway it was cheap and it works, but it appears not to emulate any known > DEC CRT in it's present configuration, and the two sets of dipswitches > on the back are cleverly un-marked. If there are ten switches in each pack, on different sides of the RS232 connectors at the back, then this might be a re-badged TeleVideo 950. If you're looking at the back of the terminal, the righthand dipswitches control comms parameters, and the left set control things like key click and local editing. For a quick test, see if switch six (counting from the left) on the lefthand switch pack controls reverse video. - Paul From allain at panix.com Mon Sep 8 11:22:00 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 References: <3.0.6.32.20030908112904.007b4480@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <048a01c37623$eada16c0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Just as a quick warning, I got magic zaps (bad electrical sounds in the monitor) once when I used a random HD15/DE9 cable. Don't screw things down on the first try. There are a *few* standards for DE9-VGA apparently. It would be best to know the pinout of your monitor first. I now will not "wing it" unless I'm willing to lose the monitor. John A. From allain at panix.com Mon Sep 8 11:27:00 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 References: Message-ID: <049001c37624$8ef7a380$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> > (that one that is a DB shell with 3 large barrel > pins as well as some smaller pins). two coax barrels, 10 pins, one barrel = 13w3 three barrels = 3w3 BTW I'm looking for a 13w3 -> HD15 cable if someone has one to spare. John A. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Sep 8 11:42:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030908123317.007cd100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 11:52 AM 9/8/03 -0400, you wrote: >>Do you mean "DB9" connectors? > >I was under the impression that the small D shell size was an "E" not a >"B". That "B" was the larger size commonly found on 25 pin connectors >(lets not split hairs here, everyone knows what I mean by 25 pin >connector... ie: Agreed! Note, that even D what-ever is not entirely correct. Different manufacturers call it different things. >But I am curious what the Sun monitor connector is called (that one that >is a DB shell with 3 large barrel pins as well as some smaller pins). I've always heard it called a 13W3.I don't know if that it's officail designation or not. It's widely used on SUN and SGI monitors. Joe From teoz at neo.rr.com Mon Sep 8 11:45:01 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 References: <3.0.6.32.20030908112904.007b4480@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <048a01c37623$eada16c0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <00ae01c37627$3bd93a80$657ca418@neo.rr.com> I think the commodore 128 had a digital output that went to a 9 pin connection and probably would make a mess connected to a analog 9 pin cga input. Most pc cables are idiot proof, its when your connecting a non PC (or older almost PC compatible) to a PC monitor that you have to be carefull. I hate companies like tandy that switched wires on their "standard" cables so you HAD to buy their version. Even if they do mate correctly you have to worry about 15khz outputs (amiga, atari st, c64 etc) that dont sync on modern 30+Khz monitors without some kind of help in between. ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Allain" To: Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 12:11 PM Subject: Re: SVGA with DE9 > Just as a quick warning, I got magic zaps (bad electrical sounds in the > monitor) once when I used a random HD15/DE9 cable. Don't screw > things down on the first try. There are a *few* standards for DE9-VGA > apparently. It would be best to know the pinout of your monitor first. > I now will not "wing it" unless I'm willing to lose the monitor. > > John A. From pat at purdueriots.com Mon Sep 8 11:48:00 2003 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA/13w3 [was: SVGA with DE9] In-Reply-To: <049001c37624$8ef7a380$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, John Allain wrote: > BTW I'm looking for a 13w3 -> HD15 cable if someone > has one to spare. I've got bunches of female 13w3 to male DE15(HD15) cables from Sun equipment if you want one. $10 including shipping should get it anywhere in the US. Also, there's a difference in wiring betwen Sun, SGI, and IBM 13w3 connectors, specifically where they sync pins are. If you're using a system that has sync-on-green, it shouldn't be a problems. However, if you're trying to hook a monitor with a 13w3 to a PC, it gets more interesting. At one point I ended up taking a 13w3 male to male cable and splicing a HD15 on one end, so that I could hook my IBM monitor (which I'm using right now, actually) up to my desktop PC at work. Pat -- Purdue University ITAP/RCS Information Technology at Purdue Research Computing and Storage http://www.itap.purdue.edu/rcs/ From zmerch at 30below.com Mon Sep 8 12:00:01 2003 From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030908124639.02b8c960@mail.30below.com> Rumor has it that chris may have mentioned these words: >But I am curious what the Sun monitor connector is called (that one that >is a DB shell with 3 large barrel pins as well as some smaller pins). Dunno if it's totall "kosher" with the D[ABCDEF]# scheme, but Sun calls it (IIRC, it's just what I see in the catalogs... ;-) a 13W3 connector. DEC had a video connector that was *just* the "3 large barrel pins" as you called them, and it's called a 3W3, again IIRC. Please, gurus out there, correct me if I'm wrong... ;-) HTH, Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers zmerch@30below.com What do you do when Life gives you lemons, and you don't *like* lemonade????????????? From sanepsycho at globaldialog.com Mon Sep 8 13:14:00 2003 From: sanepsycho at globaldialog.com (Paul Berger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: Apple I replicas to be available In-Reply-To: <200309080907.42707.jcwren@jcwren.com> References: <200309080907.42707.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: <1063044193.3145.0.camel@azure.subsolar.com> Apparently the site has gotten slashdotted and has melted down... On Mon, 2003-09-08 at 08:07, J.C. Wren wrote: > http://www.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,60329,00.html - Story > http://www.vintagecomputer.tk/ - Replica site > > --John From cisin at xenosoft.com Mon Sep 8 13:23:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030908111017.T70117@newshell.lmi.net> On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, chris wrote: > I have two rather old monitors marked as "Sabre" on the front. They have > a DE9 female socket on the back, but also carry a label claiming the > monitors to be SVGA. I've never seen SVGA use DE9 connectors, I've always > seen them with the high densitry 15 pin connectors (as commmonly seen on > current PC monitors). > Anyone know the pinout for an adaptor? Anyone have a particular desire > for these monitors? Both Sony and NEC had VGA with 9 pin connectors. Adapters, and adapter cables were readily available. Q: Did Sony and NEC have the same pinout? Would it be reasonable to expect these to match those pinouts? From cisin at xenosoft.com Mon Sep 8 13:30:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030908111307.T70117@newshell.lmi.net> On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, chris wrote: > I might have a cable or two like that for the Mac. I have some that are > 15 pin like the Mac RGB connector, Was that a DA15 connector? DE9: used for "modern" serial ports, CGA, MDA, etc. DE15: aka HD15, same shell as DE9, but with 3 rows of pins, used for common VGA DA15: used for PC joystick, some network card, some Apple monitors DB25: used for "old-style" (REAL) serial ports, also for PC parallel port, and some SCSI ports DB9: commonly misused for DE9. VALID use is for common implementation of RS232 using a DB25 connector with only pins 1 through 8 and 20. From cisin at xenosoft.com Mon Sep 8 13:45:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: <162701c37617$05f0d320$6601a8c0@kc.rr.com> References: <162701c37617$05f0d320$6601a8c0@kc.rr.com> Message-ID: <20030908113224.R70117@newshell.lmi.net> On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, Douglas Wood wrote: > Do you mean "DB9" connectors? No. Although that is such a COMMON abuse that it has become accepted by most. It is almost as common an abuse as calling 1024000 (1000 * 1024) a "megabyte" From bpope at wordstock.com Mon Sep 8 13:51:00 2003 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: <20030908113224.R70117@newshell.lmi.net> from "Fred Cisin" at Sep 8, 03 11:34:51 am Message-ID: <200309081841.OAA30263@wordstock.com> And thusly Fred Cisin spake: > > On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, Douglas Wood wrote: > > Do you mean "DB9" connectors? > > No. > Although that is such a COMMON abuse that it has become > accepted by most. > > It is almost as common an abuse as > calling 1024000 (1000 * 1024) a "megabyte" > Don't you mean 1,000,000 (What hard drive manufacturers think of as a megabyte) as opposed to 1,048,576? Cheers, Bryan From cisin at xenosoft.com Mon Sep 8 13:55:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: IBM PC/XT 3.5" floppy drivers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030908114052.A70117@newshell.lmi.net> > >If your XT has IBM's BIOS, then you need to add DRIVER.SYS to your On Sun, 7 Sep 2003, Rich Beaudry wrote: > That did it! And a big "duh" on my part .... > The PC in question is an original IBM PC/XT 5160, and it has a 1/2 height > 360KB drive, and a hard drive (10MB full-height 5.25" w/ XEBEC Controller). > There was a hole above the 360KB drive dying to have a drive put in :-), so > I added the 720KB disk (an original IBM part). The hard drive boots IBM DOS > 3.30, so I gave DRIVER.SYS a try -- It worked first shot! Of course, I > could have looked in my IBM DOS 3.30 manual, but that would have been to > easy :-) > Thanks again! The most critical test is whether it will now FORMAT disks properly. The options for DRIVER.SYS, if the defaults don't work are /D:1 (PHYSICAL drive number 0=first,1=2nd,2=3rd,3=4th) and /F:2 (drive type 0=360?,1=1.2?, 2=720k, etc.) From cisin at xenosoft.com Mon Sep 8 14:14:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: YADAM (was: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: <200309081841.OAA30263@wordstock.com> References: <200309081841.OAA30263@wordstock.com> Message-ID: <20030908115251.U70117@newshell.lmi.net> > > > Do you mean "DB9" connectors? > > It is almost as common an abuse as > > calling 1024000 (1000 * 1024) a "megabyte" On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, Bryan Pope wrote: > Don't you mean 1,000,000 (What hard drive manufacturers think of as a > megabyte) as opposed to 1,048,576? Even that (which has a LITTLE justification) is nowhere near as offensive as IBM's use of 1,024,000 for "megabyte" for disks. A common 3.5" HD floppy has two sides, with 80 tracks per side, with 18 sectors per track, and with 512 bytes per sector. 2 * 80 * 18 * 512 gives 1,474,560 bytes. with 1,048,576 (2^20, 1024*1024) bytes per megabyte, that works out to 1.40625 In order to get "1.44", IBM creatively "defined" "megabyte" as being 1000K! NOTE: although an IBM "megabyte" of disk space is 1,024,000 an IBM "megabyte" of RAM is 1,048,576. Therefore, the contents of a "megabyte" of IBM RAM won't fit in an IBM "megabyte" of disk! From vance at neurotica.com Mon Sep 8 14:48:00 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: <162701c37617$05f0d320$6601a8c0@kc.rr.com> Message-ID: A DB9 would be a connector the size of a DB25, but with only nine pins. Peace... Sridhar On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, Douglas Wood wrote: > Do you mean "DB9" connectors? > > Douglas Wood > Software Engineer > dbwood@kc.rr.com > ICQ#: 143841506 > > Home of the EPICIS Development System for the PIC > http://epicis.piclist.com > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "chris" > To: "Classic Computer" > Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 8:45 AM > Subject: SVGA with DE9 > > > > I have two rather old monitors marked as "Sabre" on the front. They have > > a DE9 female socket on the back, but also carry a label claiming the > > monitors to be SVGA. I've never seen SVGA use DE9 connectors, I've always > > seen them with the high densitry 15 pin connectors (as commmonly seen on > > current PC monitors). > > > > Anyone know the pinout for an adaptor? Anyone have a particular desire > > for these monitors? > > > > -chris > > From vance at neurotica.com Mon Sep 8 14:52:00 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, chris wrote: > But I am curious what the Sun monitor connector is called (that one that > is a DB shell with 3 large barrel pins as well as some smaller pins). DB13W3. Peace... Sridhar From vance at neurotica.com Mon Sep 8 14:55:00 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030908124639.02b8c960@mail.30below.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, Roger Merchberger wrote: > Rumor has it that chris may have mentioned these words: > > >But I am curious what the Sun monitor connector is called (that one > >that is a DB shell with 3 large barrel pins as well as some smaller > >pins). > > Dunno if it's totall "kosher" with the D[ABCDEF]# scheme, but Sun calls > it (IIRC, it's just what I see in the catalogs... ;-) a 13W3 connector. > DEC had a video connector that was *just* the "3 large barrel pins" as > you called them, and it's called a 3W3, again IIRC. Please, gurus out > there, correct me if I'm wrong... ;-) I believe the 13W3 is the DB13W3, and the 3W3 is the DA3W3. I've seen them that way in catalogs. Peace... Sridhar From vance at neurotica.com Mon Sep 8 15:06:00 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Sep 2003 vance@neurotica.com wrote: > > DEC had a video connector that was *just* the "3 large barrel pins" as > > you called them, and it's called a 3W3, again IIRC. Please, gurus out > > there, correct me if I'm wrong... ;-) > > I believe the 13W3 is the DB13W3, and the 3W3 is the DA3W3. I've seen > them that way in catalogs. And, I might add, this catalog was put out in 1985, and I've never seen it better put since. Peace... Sridhar From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 8 15:34:01 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: <162701c37617$05f0d320$6601a8c0@kc.rr.com> from "Douglas Wood" at Sep 8, 3 09:39:31 am Message-ID: > Do you mean "DB9" connectors? No, I am sure he means DE9 connectors (and is using the term correctly). The second letter in the name gives the connector shell size (how big it is physcially). The only 'DB's are the DB25 (PC parallel port and _real_ RS232 port) and DB44 (the high deinsity version, not commonly used). The PC/AT serial port is a DE9, no matter what most PC-droids call it :-) Incidentally, I have a VGA monitor here with a DE15 socket (normal VGA connector) for the input. WIth it came a cable with a DE15 plug on each end. Only thing is, the pinout of the monitor connector is not even close to normal VGA, so the cable is not wired pin-pin. So far, so good. The problem is that the cable has to be used the right way round, and the _only_ visible difference between the ends is the colour of the insulation between the pins (the moulded connector covers are the same grey on each end). If you plug the wrong end of the cable into the monitor you get no display. It took me many minutes armed with a 'scope to figure out why I had a dark screen after connecting this thing to a known-good Xterminal box... I want to know what sort of idiot came up with that piece of design.... -tony From alhartman at yahoo.com Mon Sep 8 16:56:00 2003 From: alhartman at yahoo.com (Al Hartman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: cctalk digest, Vol 1 #750 - 35 msgs In-Reply-To: <20030907170001.38045.26746.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <20030908214739.12627.qmail@web13404.mail.yahoo.com> Your experience is not uncommon among customers of Darek's ("Idiots" as he likes to term them). Sorry to hear you also had a problem with him. You are in great company though. LOL!!! Regards, Al Hartman (Macintosh Emulation List Host) http://www.topica.com/lists/MacEmuList > From: > > Dennis- did anyone ever help you out? I'm far from > Atari these days, brain-dust at this point, but I > was trying to remember who made the Happy, and > your post was the first thing shown in the Google > search. I might have a copy of the manual > somewhere, buried in this house, if you still need > help. I decided a few nights ago to see what was > new in the emulator world, having briefly attempted > to convert over to that in the mid-90's, and had > such a hostile and arrogant reply from Darek > Mihocka, what a ******. It brought back memories > of other unpleasant individuals in this same genre > of the old Atari world from years past. > > best, > Rob From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Sep 8 17:53:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: info on Two Technologies device (hand held terminal?) Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030908184458.007cbbf0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I picked this up the other day. I THINK it's a hand held terminal. It was made by Two Technologies Inc of Horsham, Pa and it's model number is TT1-R2-2. It's a blue box slightly larger than a pack of cigarettes and has a LCD screen and a membrane type keyboard. The keyboard seems to have all the usually alphabetic, numeric and puctuation keys plys F1 to F5, Shift, Control, Space, Back Space and Enter. it has a curly cord on the bottom. The curly cord has RJ-11 six pin connector on each end. It does not have any batteries or power connection so it must get it's power from what ever it's plugged into. I searched the net but didn't find anything about Two Industries or this device. Is anyone familar with it? Joe From aek at spies.com Mon Sep 8 17:58:01 2003 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: ISO Corvus Omnidrive Service Manual Message-ID: <200309082250.h88MoKe7026707@spies.com> I've been able to locate almost all of the Corvus service manuals now to archive with the exception of this one. The frustrating thing is that I HAD one of these before I gave all of my Corvus stuff to Eric Lander (who I managed to trace down again but disappeared before I could get anything back from him). If someone has a copy of this that I could borrow to scan, please let me know. From tothwolf at concentric.net Mon Sep 8 18:42:00 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: Apple I replicas to be available In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030908114732.007b5940@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <3.0.6.32.20030908114732.007b5940@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: > He needs to find a web hosting site that works if he expects to sell > any! I tried over and over to look at his site and the only thing that > worked was the pop-up ads! I wonder if he will offer kits? I talked to Woz awhile back, and also got his blessing on making replicas. The only problem was that I did not have access to an Apple I to copy it's PC board. I'd wanted (and still would like to) create an exact reproduction of an Apple I. -Toth From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Mon Sep 8 18:43:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: Apple I programs Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908192847.00a66c30@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Hello Sellam, > However, Ismail warned the replica would not appeal to everyone. > There's a very limited library of software for the machine. > Most Apple I software was written by hobbyists and never published > commercially. And what programs there are will have to be typed in > by hand -- in Basic or assembly code. So perhaps you could put out a call to Apple I hobbyists that had written programs, and ask that they make them public domain, and host a library of them available for download on your web site? And/or if you'd like to generate a bit of revenue, perhaps you could get permission to sell CD's of the library, something like Walnut Creek did with shareware, for those that don't want to spend the time downloading, and would rather just purchase a CD full of them? Best Regards From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Mon Sep 8 18:45:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: Apple I replicas to be available In-Reply-To: <1063044193.3145.0.camel@azure.subsolar.com> References: <200309080907.42707.jcwren@jcwren.com> <200309080907.42707.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908193712.08cf3ec0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> It loads for me. At 01:03 PM 9/8/03 -0500, you wrote: >Apparently the site has gotten slashdotted and has melted down... > > >On Mon, 2003-09-08 at 08:07, J.C. Wren wrote: > > http://www.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,60329,00.html - Story > > http://www.vintagecomputer.tk/ - Replica site > > > > --John From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Mon Sep 8 18:48:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908193856.08cf49b0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> > So now I have at least one cable and can use that to make a 2nd if need be. You could instead make an adapter to go from the 9-pin to the 15-pin, then just continue using standard 15-pin to 15-pin cables, and just plug on the adapter when needed. At 10:34 AM 9/8/03 -0400, you wrote: > >I have a older Vox-On monitor that is configured like that. I also seem > >to remember some older NEC models that needed a HD15 to DE9 cable. I > >still have the cable, so I can look at it when I get home. As far as the > >Sabre label, American Airlines used to private label a lot of AST > >computers and monitors as Sabre for distribution to travel agencies for > >connection to the Sabre reservation network. There were a lot of P100 > >Sabre systems floating around DFW for a while. > >No sooner did I post the email than I found one DE9 to HD15 cable. It had >fallen behind the cabinet that one of the monitors was sitting on top of. > >So now I have at least one cable and can use that to make a 2nd if need >be. > >I think you might be right on the Sabre label. It does look like the >American Airlines Sabre system logo (although it has been a long time >since I have seen that logo so I might be wrong). I'm not sure how I >wound up with two monitors from their systems however. > >-chris > From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Mon Sep 8 18:51:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908194243.08cf03a0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> > But I am curious what the Sun monitor connector is called (that one that > is a DB shell with 3 large barrel pins as well as some smaller pins). 13W3 At 11:52 AM 9/8/03 -0400, you wrote: > >Do you mean "DB9" connectors? > >I was under the impression that the small D shell size was an "E" not a >"B". That "B" was the larger size commonly found on 25 pin connectors >(lets not split hairs here, everyone knows what I mean by 25 pin >connector... ie: a common PC parallel connector, or the larger serial >connector, or a Mac SCSI connector). > >I used to call it a DB9, but I was corrected many moons ago by others on >this list with FAR more knowledge on the topic than I have, so I took >them at their word, and have made an effort to always refer to it as a >DE9 now. > >I suppose the HD15 "VGA" connector would then be a DE15. And a DB9 would >be a "25 pin" shell with only 9 actual pins in it (9 pin spaces, as from >what I understand the count is based on number of spaces, not actual >number of pins present). > > >Hopefully we will avoid the whole "whats a >"centronics/amphenol/telco/SCSI" connector called" discussion. That one >really makes my head spin :-) > >But I am curious what the Sun monitor connector is called (that one that >is a DB shell with 3 large barrel pins as well as some smaller pins). > >-chris > From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Mon Sep 8 18:58:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: <048a01c37623$eada16c0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> References: <3.0.6.32.20030908112904.007b4480@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908194905.08cf3b40@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Hello John, There were at least two pin-outs that I was aware of. One was for NEC's and the other was for Sony's. Don't know where my notes are anymore, so finding them is left as an exercise for the reader. Best Regards At 12:11 PM 9/8/03 -0400, you wrote: >Just as a quick warning, I got magic zaps (bad electrical sounds in the >monitor) once when I used a random HD15/DE9 cable. Don't screw >things down on the first try. There are a *few* standards for DE9-VGA >apparently. It would be best to know the pinout of your monitor first. >I now will not "wing it" unless I'm willing to lose the monitor. > >John A. From eric at brouhaha.com Mon Sep 8 18:59:00 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: Apple I replicas to be available In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.6.32.20030908114732.007b5940@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <2113.4.20.168.210.1063065061.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "Tothwolf" wrote: > I wonder if he will offer kits? I talked to Woz awhile back, and also got > his blessing on making replicas. The only problem was that I did not have > access to an Apple I to copy it's PC board. I'd wanted (and still would > like to) create an exact reproduction of an Apple I. The PCB layout is copyrighted by Apple Computer. You'd need their permission as well, unless Apple has given the Apple 1 rights back to Woz. From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Mon Sep 8 19:01:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:44 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: <049001c37624$8ef7a380$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> References: Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908195116.08cf4ec0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Hello John, Get a 13W3 to HD15 adapter, then use a standard HD-15 to HD-15 cable. The 13W3 that works with Sun equipment doesn't work with SGI Indy's. I hear there is a different adapter for those. Best Regards At 12:16 PM 9/8/03 -0400, you wrote: > > (that one that is a DB shell with 3 large barrel > > pins as well as some smaller pins). > >two coax barrels, 10 pins, one barrel = 13w3 >three barrels = 3w3 > >BTW I'm looking for a 13w3 -> HD15 cable if someone >has one to spare. > >John A. From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Mon Sep 8 19:04:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: <00ae01c37627$3bd93a80$657ca418@neo.rr.com> References: <3.0.6.32.20030908112904.007b4480@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <048a01c37623$eada16c0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908195401.08cf4b20@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Hello TeoZ, > I think the commodore 128 had a digital output that went to a 9 pin > connection and probably would make a mess connected to a analog 9 pin cga > input. I think monochrome, and CGA were TTL on 9-pin connectors I know EGA was TTL on 9-pin. VGA ( analog ) was output on 9-pin in some instances, but either later on, or more commonly, on HD15 Best Regards At 12:35 PM 9/8/03 -0400, you wrote: >I think the commodore 128 had a digital output that went to a 9 pin >connection and probably would make a mess connected to a analog 9 pin cga >input. > >Most pc cables are idiot proof, its when your connecting a non PC (or older >almost PC compatible) to a PC monitor that you have to be carefull. I hate >companies like tandy that switched wires on their "standard" cables so you >HAD to buy their version. > >Even if they do mate correctly you have to worry about 15khz outputs (amiga, >atari st, c64 etc) that dont sync on modern 30+Khz monitors without some >kind of help in between. > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "John Allain" >To: >Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 12:11 PM >Subject: Re: SVGA with DE9 > > > > Just as a quick warning, I got magic zaps (bad electrical sounds in the > > monitor) once when I used a random HD15/DE9 cable. Don't screw > > things down on the first try. There are a *few* standards for DE9-VGA > > apparently. It would be best to know the pinout of your monitor first. > > I now will not "wing it" unless I'm willing to lose the monitor. > > > > John A. From cisin at xenosoft.com Mon Sep 8 19:05:01 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908193856.08cf49b0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908193856.08cf49b0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <20030908165323.R84202@newshell.lmi.net> > > So now I have at least one cable and can use that to make a 2nd if need be. > You could instead make an adapter to go from the 9-pin to the 15-pin, then > just continue using standard 15-pin to 15-pin cables, and just plug on the > adapter > when needed. Or, once the pinout is confirmed, open the case, and replace the DE9 with an HD15 connector. From jcwren at jcwren.com Mon Sep 8 19:40:01 2003 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Apple I replicas to be available In-Reply-To: <2113.4.20.168.210.1063065061.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> References: <2113.4.20.168.210.1063065061.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <200309082031.20614.jcwren@jcwren.com> Are you sure about this? From the Q&A: Q: Isn?t the Woz Monitor the property of Apple? A: More than likely yes. But Woz was contacted about this and gave his ok. He stated that he handed it out along with his schematics long before there was an Apple computer company. Apple also turned all hardware and software matters over to the Apple 1 club and this project started and is still under the club. Wouldn't the "hardware and software matters" cover the PCB? --John On Monday 08 September 2003 19:51 pm, Eric Smith wrote: > "Tothwolf" wrote: > > I wonder if he will offer kits? I talked to Woz awhile back, and also got > > his blessing on making replicas. The only problem was that I did not have > > access to an Apple I to copy it's PC board. I'd wanted (and still would > > like to) create an exact reproduction of an Apple I. > > The PCB layout is copyrighted by Apple Computer. You'd need their > permission as well, unless Apple has given the Apple 1 rights back > to Woz. From dholland at woh.rr.com Mon Sep 8 19:46:01 2003 From: dholland at woh.rr.com (David Holland) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908195116.08cf4ec0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908195116.08cf4ec0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <1063067926.17627.4.camel@crusader> On Mon, 2003-09-08 at 19:52, Mail List wrote: > Hello John, > > Get a 13W3 to HD15 adapter, then use a standard HD-15 to HD-15 cable. > The 13W3 that works with Sun equipment doesn't work with SGI Indy's. > I hear there is a different adapter for those. FWIW, My personal experience say Sun != SGI 13W3 isn't always true. The 21" dual input Sun monitor I've got on my desk has a standard 15 pin VGA input, and a 13W3. That 13W3 input (so far) has plugged successfully into every bit of Sun & SGI HW I've tried. (OT List: SS10, SS5, Ultra1, Indy, and Octane) Of course, YMMV, mebbe its a smart monitor :-) David > > Best Regards From owad at applefritter.com Mon Sep 8 20:18:00 2003 From: owad at applefritter.com (Tom Owad) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Apple I programs In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908192847.00a66c30@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908192847.00a66c30@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <20030909011043.19508@mail.lafayette.edu> >So perhaps you could put out a call to Apple I hobbyists that had written >programs, and ask that they make them public domain, and host a >library of them available for download on your web site? The Apple I Owners Club has software at: Tom Applefritter www.applefritter.com From owad at applefritter.com Mon Sep 8 20:23:01 2003 From: owad at applefritter.com (Tom Owad) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Apple I replicas to be available In-Reply-To: <200309082031.20614.jcwren@jcwren.com> References: <200309082031.20614.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: <20030909011325.22589@mail.lafayette.edu> >Q: Isn't the Woz Monitor the property of Apple? > > A: More than likely yes. But Woz was contacted about this and gave his >ok. He >stated that he handed it out along with his schematics long before there was >an Apple computer company. Apple also turned all hardware and software >matters over to the Apple 1 club and this project started and is still under >the club. > >Wouldn't the "hardware and software matters" cover the PCB? Here is the actual letter: . It reads: Dear Apple I Owner Good news. Joe Torzewski is starting an Apple I Owners Club. Since the Apple II has been introduced, interest in Apple I software has declined and we have been making tapes available on special order basis only. This has made support costly and difficult. Joe's Apple I Club will now provide a means of expanding your software bank and also in communicating with other Apple I owners. We will be supporting Apple I software through the club. He will be handling both hardware and software applications. Please feel free to contact him at: Apple I Owners Club 51525 Chestnut Road Granger, IN 46530 Applefritter www.applefritter.com From eric at brouhaha.com Mon Sep 8 20:25:00 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Apple I replicas to be available In-Reply-To: <200309082031.20614.jcwren@jcwren.com> References: <2113.4.20.168.210.1063065061.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> <200309082031.20614.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: <3347.4.20.168.210.1063070244.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> > Are you sure about this? From the Q&A: > > Q: Isn???t the Woz Monitor the property of Apple? > > A: More than likely yes. But Woz was contacted about this and gave his > ok. He > stated that he handed it out along with his schematics long before there > was > an Apple computer company. Apple also turned all hardware and software > matters over to the Apple 1 club and this project started and is still > under > the club. I'm skeptical. Even though the design predated the formation of the corporation, the ownership was likely transferred from the company (a partnership) to the corporation when the latter was formed. There's probably no way to get a guaranteed correct answer on this. If you were to ask Apple's legal department, they would probably claim they own it without doing any research. If anyone (even Woz) tells you that Apple doesn't own it, there's no way to be sure that they are correct (unless they have a signed release from Apple), and more importantly, there's no way to be sure you won't get sued over it. > Wouldn't the "hardware and software matters" cover the PCB? Not necessarily. They weren't licensing the club to manufacture the computers. IANAL, this is just my opinion. It's not a can of worms that I'd want to open. From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Mon Sep 8 23:12:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: <1063067926.17627.4.camel@crusader> References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908195116.08cf4ec0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030908195116.08cf4ec0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908235625.00a43040@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Hello David, There you go, Never say never. The monitor's I usually used for checking were the 5 BNC input Sony MultiSyncs. These monitors have worked with every type of system I had ever plugged up to them except the Indy ( with the adapter I had ). The types of systems it did work with were ... PC's DEC Alphas with 3W3 HP something or others with 3 BNC output Suns of all types that I ever had the occasion to try with the 13W3 to HD15 adapter Sounds like with your monitor having the 13W3 input, you might not have needed to be using an adapter, but just used a 13W3 to 13W3 cable? Best Regards At 08:38 PM 9/8/03 -0400, you wrote: >On Mon, 2003-09-08 at 19:52, Mail List wrote: > > Hello John, > > > > Get a 13W3 to HD15 adapter, then use a standard HD-15 to HD-15 cable. > > The 13W3 that works with Sun equipment doesn't work with SGI Indy's. > > I hear there is a different adapter for those. > >FWIW, My personal experience say Sun != SGI 13W3 isn't always true. > >The 21" dual input Sun monitor I've got on my desk has a standard 15 pin >VGA input, and a 13W3. That 13W3 input (so far) has plugged >successfully into every bit of Sun & SGI HW I've tried. (OT List: >SS10, SS5, Ultra1, Indy, and Octane) > >Of course, YMMV, mebbe its a smart monitor :-) > >David > > > > > Best Regards From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Mon Sep 8 23:20:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Apple I programs In-Reply-To: <20030909011043.19508@mail.lafayette.edu> References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908192847.00a66c30@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030908192847.00a66c30@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030909000553.089e8040@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Hello Tom, That's good. Perhaps the fellow making the Apple I replicas might put a link on his web page to your site, to help the people that might get a kit find the software to use on it. And you could reciprocate with a link to his site to help people find the hardware? Best Regards At 09:10 PM 9/8/03 -0400, you wrote: > >So perhaps you could put out a call to Apple I hobbyists that had written > >programs, and ask that they make them public domain, and host a > >library of them available for download on your web site? > >The Apple I Owners Club has software at: > >Tom > >Applefritter >www.applefritter.com From jos.mar at bluewin.ch Mon Sep 8 23:32:00 2003 From: jos.mar at bluewin.ch (Marian Capel / Jos Dreesen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Apple I replicas to be available In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <71EB6702-E27D-11D7-87B0-000A9585D8F6@bluewin.ch> > I wonder if he will offer kits? I talked to Woz awhile back, and also > got > his blessing on making replicas. The only problem was that I did not > have > access to an Apple I to copy it's PC board. I'd wanted (and still would > like to) create an exact reproduction of an Apple I. > Didt'n the Apple I have shiftregisters as displaymemory ? They surely are unobtainable by know. If not, a Kenbak replica would be my choice to be replicated. Jos Dreesen From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 8 23:57:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Apple I programs In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908192847.00a66c30@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, Mail List wrote: > > However, Ismail warned the replica would not appeal to everyone. > > There's a very limited library of software for the machine. > > Most Apple I software was written by hobbyists and never published > > commercially. And what programs there are will have to be typed in > > by hand -- in Basic or assembly code. > > So perhaps you could put out a call to Apple I hobbyists that had written > programs, and ask that they make them public domain, and host a > library of them available for download on your web site? I guess journalists learn in journalism school that they always have to throw in a caveat to make a story "balanced" or something. The reporter asked me what would be a downside of the replica and I had to make something up. The fact that there is no software is really not an issue. The reality is that if you find hacking on a primitive 6502 machine fun then you'll have fun. Otherwise, you'll play with it a few times, shrug off the novelty very quickly, and then put it up on your shelf where it will gather dust. This is really just one of those "cool for a few moments" sort of things, but I wasn't going to rain on Vince's parade by saying that for the article. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From owad at applefritter.com Tue Sep 9 10:51:00 2003 From: owad at applefritter.com (Tom Owad) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Apple I programs In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030909000553.089e8040@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030909000553.089e8040@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <20030909150810.2285@mail.lafayette.edu> >That's good. Perhaps the fellow making the Apple I replicas might >put a link on his web page to your site, to help the people that might >get a kit find the software to use on it. And you could reciprocate with >a link to his site to help people find the hardware? We're well acquainted and working to get everything set up properly. The Wired article came rather suddenly. Tom Applefritter www.applefritter.com From rhahm at nycap.rr.com Tue Sep 9 11:54:00 2003 From: rhahm at nycap.rr.com (RHahm) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: trouble interfacing an HP86B to an HP7040 plotter with a serial interface Message-ID: Hi, I am having trouble interfacing an HP86B to an HP7040 plotter with a serial interface. I have two HP serial interfaces: standard with male DB25 connector and 0pt.01 with female connector. The plotter has a male DB25 connector. I have connected the standard with with a gender changer and the opt. 01 directly without success. I typed PLOTTER IS 10 and (the baud rate on the plotter is set at 9600)I get an error message. This is the first time I have tried a serial connection and unfortunately I don't have any documentation for the HP serial interface. Do I need a null modem for the opt. 01 serial interface? What am I doing wrong? Thanks, Bob From dittman at dittman.net Tue Sep 9 12:16:00 2003 From: dittman at dittman.net (Eric Dittman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Ireland/UK VT510 source? Message-ID: <20030909170837.760E17F83@dittman.net> Does anyone know of a supplier in Ireland/UK that would have VT510 (or VT520) terminals available? I need one for a coworker in Cork. -- Eric Dittman dittman@dittman.net From jwest at classiccmp.org Tue Sep 9 12:29:01 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Ireland/UK VT510 source? References: <20030909170837.760E17F83@dittman.net> Message-ID: <012a01c376f6$ac5fd5a0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> So, is he currently/still in cork? I would suggest very carefully cutting away most of it with a sharp plaster knife. ----- Original Message ----- From: Eric Dittman To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2003 12:08 PM Subject: Ireland/UK VT510 source? Does anyone know of a supplier in Ireland/UK that would have VT510 (or VT520) terminals available? I need one for a coworker in Cork. -- Eric Dittman dittman@dittman.net From dittman at dittman.net Tue Sep 9 12:39:00 2003 From: dittman at dittman.net (Eric Dittman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Ireland/UK VT510 source? In-Reply-To: <012a01c376f6$ac5fd5a0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> from "Jay West" at Sep 09, 2003 12:20:32 PM Message-ID: <20030909173144.BE58D7F83@dittman.net> > So, is he currently/still in cork? I would suggest very carefully cutting away > most of it with a sharp plaster knife. Cork is in Ireland. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Eric Dittman > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2003 12:08 PM > Subject: Ireland/UK VT510 source? > > > Does anyone know of a supplier in Ireland/UK that would have VT510 (or > VT520) terminals available? I need one for a coworker in Cork. > -- > Eric Dittman > dittman@dittman.net > -- Eric Dittman dittman@dittman.net From cb at mythtech.net Tue Sep 9 14:01:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: VLB video card, VLB IO card Message-ID: I have a VLB VGA card and a VLB IO card (ID, FDC, Parallel, Serial, Game). Both are on their way to the trash unless claimed by someone. Actually, come to think of it, if someone wants, they can have the whole 486 logic board they are on as well. It has a 50 MHz 486/DX2 chip on it. That is also on the way to the trash. -chris From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Sep 9 14:03:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Ireland/UK VT510 source? In-Reply-To: <20030909173144.BE58D7F83@dittman.net> References: <012a01c376f6$ac5fd5a0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030909145342.008175d0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 12:31 PM 9/9/03 -0500, you wrote: >> So, is he currently/still in cork? I would suggest very carefully cutting away >> most of it with a sharp plaster knife. > >Cork is in Ireland. We also have cork here in America. I second the suggestion of using a sharp knife. Joe > >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Eric Dittman >> To: cctalk@classiccmp.org >> Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2003 12:08 PM >> Subject: Ireland/UK VT510 source? >> >> >> Does anyone know of a supplier in Ireland/UK that would have VT510 (or >> VT520) terminals available? I need one for a coworker in Cork. >> -- >> Eric Dittman >> dittman@dittman.net >> > > >-- >Eric Dittman >dittman@dittman.net From nospam at dadaboom.com Tue Sep 9 14:40:00 2003 From: nospam at dadaboom.com (William King) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Available for free: DEC BC06L-03 cable Message-ID: I'm wading through piles of junk in my garage and came across a DEC BC60L-03 cable. I'm not sure what it is for. The connector on one end is similar to a parallel printer port connector, but a few pins smaller. The other end has a 27 pin high density D shell (I think it's 27 pins, my eyes get a little fuzzy looking at it.) Available for free to a good home. All I ask is that you pay shipping which is probably about $3.00. If you live in the SF Bay area, you can stop by and pick it up for free. Bill From dave at mitton.com Tue Sep 9 14:40:33 2003 From: dave at mitton.com (Dave Mitton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: DEC Server & DECnet In-Reply-To: <20030907014548.30125.61075.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.2.20030906224944.02d67ec0@getmail.mitton.com> On 9/6/2003 08:45 PM -0500, cctech-request@classiccmp.org wrote: >From: "Antonio Carlini" >Subject: RE: DEC Server >Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2003 18:13:06 +0100 > > > No reason for a correction: it was indeed DECnet and LAT > >BTW: Someone else said that DS100 was the DEC first terminal >server. But the DECSA (PDP-11/24 based) preceded it. (I think >that was code named Pluto; if it wasn't, then there must have >been an even earlier one). Yes, that is correct. The Pluto was originally targeted to be the terminal front-end running CTERM for the Jupiter.... but that didn't happen. LAT was prototyped on one of those VT100s with an LSI-11 in it. >... > > > DECnet (MOP, to be more precise) was used for software download and > > from terminal ports to hosts on the net). LAT is *not* part of DECnet > > (which is often claimed), it's a separate protocol. However, it was > > common to run LAT on a host that also would run DECnet. > >MOP isn't part of DECnet either. Incorrect. Sort of like saying DHCP is not part of the TCP/IP stack, because it doesn't run UDP frames. MOP is the the Maintance Operations Protocol of the DECnet architecture. If you can find the spec (DECnet specs were published), it will say DECnet on it. (I have one in box somewhere) For that matter, LAT, while not developed as part of the traditional DECnet protocol set, but it was sold as a Digital networking product. A marketer would consider LAT part of the "DECnet" product set. (though it was a pure LAN protocol that was proprietary, private, and licensed - all things not done with other DECnet protocols.) Dave. From bear at typewritten.org Tue Sep 9 14:40:47 2003 From: bear at typewritten.org (r.stricklin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Closet sale - some stuff to go. In-Reply-To: <200309042141.QAA17586@cmmrboot.uah.edu> Message-ID: <92E248BE-E0F6-11D7-8A03-000A956C4CA0@typewritten.org> On Thursday, September 4, 2003, at 02:41 PM, Alex Fedoseyev wrote: > DO you have still this part: > > SGI - Onyx boards > IO4 (030-0646-105) - w/ vcam also SCSI differential, IOADAPT, and SCSI > SE > If he (who?) doesn't, I believe I have a spare. Contact me off-list if you haven't found what you're looking for yet. ok bear From keith at saracom.com Tue Sep 9 14:41:01 2003 From: keith at saracom.com (Maxwell K. Froedge) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: OT? - How to run a DOS BBS directly attached to a Terminal Server Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.1.20030907164731.0176b008@mail.saracom.com> Hello, This may be OFF TOPIC but I did run WWIV more than 10 years ago. My question is how to run a DOS BBS directly attached to a Terminal Server. That is without a modem. I have a PicoWeb server which basically allows one to connect a serial device directly to ethernet and comunicates via TCP/IP. It works and I can talk with it via Telnet. However I want to run a classic BBS such as WWIV. I have tried my backup copy from circa 1992 and it really wants a modem. I have tried the current version too without luck. So is there any old style BBSes which will work with a direct connection to a terminal (in my case a serial to ethernet convertor)? I would want chains.txt support so I could run the great online games. I could run WWIV with my two V.everything modems back to back but that IS overkill. Is there any other solution? Has anyone tried this? Thanks Max From nickmiller at charter.net Tue Sep 9 14:41:15 2003 From: nickmiller at charter.net (Nick Miller) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: PCjr goes for over $150 References: <200309072122.OAA13930@floodgap.com> <000e01c37586$9c0449a0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <00e301c37598$329af240$6401a8c0@themillers> The Tandy is more capable, the PC Jr is more interesting due to its compromises. Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeoZ" To: Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2003 4:25 PM Subject: Re: PCjr goes for over $150 > Which was the better machine, the pcjr or the tandy 1000 clone? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Cameron Kaiser" > To: > Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2003 5:22 PM > Subject: Re: PCjr goes for over $150 > > > > > I got about half that about 4 years ago from a complete pcjr package > deal > > > with some reference books. > > > guess I better email the winner and offer him a pcjr box that I found on > the > > > side of the road just last year and a jr monitor still in the box, > heh. > > > > Hey, my unit has some extra RAM and the parallel port expansion. Wonder > > what he'd pay for those? ;-) > > > > Never mind, I actually *like* the PCjr. It's an intriguing orphan. > > > > -- > > ---------------------------------- personal: > http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- > > Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * > ckaiser@floodgap.com > > -- Arguments with furniture are rarely productive. -- Kehlog > Albran ----------- From ATrotsenko at uosk.com.ua Tue Sep 9 14:41:29 2003 From: ATrotsenko at uosk.com.ua (=?ISO-8859-5?B?sN3U4NXZIMLg3ubV3dre?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: ENTERPRISE 128 Keyboard matrix repair (Attn Adrian Witchy) Message-ID: Has anyone spares for ENTERPRISE 128 computer ? My E128 has corrupted keyboard matrix which I want to exchange. To Adrian Witchy: I saw posting "Enterprise 64 and 128" from May 24, 2003, where You sad that You have factory machinery & returned machines. Can You help ? Best regards, Andy Trotsenko, Ukrainian Security Insurance Co From cbajpai at comcast.net Tue Sep 9 14:41:43 2003 From: cbajpai at comcast.net (Chandra Bajpai) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Another Apple 1 for sale Message-ID: <000201c37603$d3f787a0$6f7ba8c0@ne2.client2.attbi.com> Found this while searching around..I think he discounted the price to $20K -Chandra (A) Apple 1 computer in case. (B) Five (5) original manuals, a complete set, as of this time I know of no one else that has a complete set of manuals. (C) Three (3) original Apple 1 cassette tapes from Apple Computer Co. (D) The SWTPC PR-40 printer. This printer itself is an antique and hard to find. It is unique to the Apple 1 computer because of an article in InterFace Age magazine, Oct 1976 by Steven Jobs. (E) The InterFace Age magazine, dated Oct 1976. (F) The Nuts & Volts magazine, July 2002 issue. Has an article and pictures on the Apple 1 computer. (G) A+, an Apple magazine, dated Jan 1987. The 10 year anniversary of the Apple II but has pictures of the Apple 1. Done with Steve Wozniak. (H) The Brief Case, pictures on web site. (I) Last but not least, the postcard that was signed by Steve Wozniak, a prized possession. The cost of the Apple 1 system is thirty thousand ($30,000) US dollars. You must be able to pick up the system or arrange to have it picked up. Other conditions apply but will discuss with the buyer before agreeing on a deal for the Apple 1 system. I reserve the right to refuse any offer. If more that one party is interested, highest offer will get the Apple 1 system provided all conditions are meet. http://torzewski.tripod.com/apple1computer/id11.html From mrevill at aasb.com.au Tue Sep 9 14:41:57 2003 From: mrevill at aasb.com.au (Mark Revill) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: DOS 1.0... Message-ID: Hi, Found your post dated July 28th 2002 on classiccmp.org regarding whether your copy of DOS 1.0 is worth anything. I am just curious to know whether you still own it? Cheers, Mark. From davidmercier at newengleng.com Tue Sep 9 14:42:10 2003 From: davidmercier at newengleng.com (davidmercier@newengleng.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: (no subject) Message-ID: <20030908135031.ZZGP1380.lakecmmtao03.coxmail.com@lakecm2mtao03> I do have pinouts for eeco 9301 if you still need it. David A. Mercier New England Engineering Services 25 West Street Stafford Springs, Ct. 06076 (860) 684-5980 Fax: 684-5982 From george at rachors.com Tue Sep 9 14:42:24 2003 From: george at rachors.com (George Leo Rachor Jr.) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Apple I replicas to be available In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030908114732.007b5940@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: My guess is that the site has been slashdotted.... Googles popup stopper works great.... George Rachor ========================================================= George L. Rachor Jr. george@rachors.com Hillsboro, Oregon http://rachors.com United States of America Amateur Radio : KD7DCX On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: > He needs to find a web hosting site that works if he expects to sell > any! I tried over and over to look at his site and the only thing that > worked was the pop-up ads! > > Joe (an X-potential customer) > > > At 09:07 AM 9/8/03 -0400, you wrote: > >http://www.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,60329,00.html - Story > >http://www.vintagecomputer.tk/ - Replica site > > > >--John From kevan at heydon.org Tue Sep 9 14:42:37 2003 From: kevan at heydon.org (Kevan Heydon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Thinning out my collection - some machines available in the UK Message-ID: <20030908165116.V50348-100000@goliath.heydon.org> Hi all, Anybody in the UK interested in the following: A Whitechapel MG-1 Cpu, keyboard/mouse and 17" mono monitor. Since acquiring the machine it has always been on my todo list so has never been powered on. There are some manuals that go with it, but nothing really technical just user guides I think. An Apollo DN3000 Cpu, keyboard, 19" mono monitor. I have a couple of ethernet cards plus a color graphics card, none of these are plugged in. Worked last time it was used but that was probably before the clock rollover in '97! Agaim some manuals, I think mostly programming ones. I have quite a lot of Sun kit ranging from 2/120 stuff through to IPX's covering things like two 4/110's, a 3/60, a 3/50, a 386i, SS1+ etc. If there is any interest in these then let me know and I can give more details. Collection from the Cambridge area would be ideal, but I am quite flexible because I want to clear out this stuff pretty quickly. -- Kevan From steve.peddle at sympatico.ca Tue Sep 9 14:42:51 2003 From: steve.peddle at sympatico.ca (steve peddle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: 9000a pods Message-ID: <3F5CC992.8B042CF0@sympatico.ca> looking for a 8085 fluke pod..waz wondering if any to sell thanks steve From alan_geering at hotmail.com Tue Sep 9 14:43:05 2003 From: alan_geering at hotmail.com (Alan Geering) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: PAL RGB on Cub monitors Message-ID: Forgive me, I'm new to BBC computers and associated techology What I would like to know is whether the cube looking monitor (microvitech cub?) that came with BBC computers had the following: A scart input that took a PAL RGB 1v p-p signal that sync'd on green? If it did then can you please let me know which models. This is quite an urgent matter. Thanks, Alan Geering _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive larger attachments with Hotmail Extra Storage. http://join.msn.com/?PAGE=features/es From jwstephens_2000 at yahoo.com Tue Sep 9 14:43:19 2003 From: jwstephens_2000 at yahoo.com (jim stephens) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Apple 1 Replica Kit / board site scrape Message-ID: <20030908190007.61358.qmail@web80406.mail.yahoo.com> This is a scrape of the information from the Apple 1 replica site with a lot of info. ***************************** It is provided as a copy, and is not authorized, so if you want to get the real info, you will have to get to the site for the real deal. I am only copying it here for those who didn't get it to come up due to web traffic issues. I am not associated with the seller at all. ***************************** Welcome to the Replica 1 website. After over a year on this project the final touches are being applied and final beta testing is being done. Please note that the Replica 1 will not come with a keyboard, power supply or monitor. Most standard ps/2 pc keyboards should work as well as most standard AT style pc power supplies. You can use your NTSC compatible monitor like I use, or hook it up to your TV’s video input jack. Feel free to email me with any questions or comments you may have. I will be producing these on a limited production basis. The first set of boards will be available for sale October 11, 2003. Special thanks goes out to Greg Glawitsch for creating the video ATMEGA8 code which made everything possible. Coming soon, cassette interface! Thanks Achim, and Larry! Vince Briel Q: Why don’t you try and make it look like the Apple 1 and use the same parts as the Apple 1. A. Well, the primary reason I’m doing this is because people who own Apple 1’s are afraid to power them up to run their software. By me having a functional clone, they will be able to eventually back up their programs and archive them. In addition, some of the original IC’s are very rare and almost impossible to find. Q: Why don’t you design it to use modern type monitors like VGA? A: By using standard composite monitors or TV’s with composite in it retains the essence of old 8bit computing. Q: Is the video available in both NTSC and PAL? A: Sorry, at this time only NTSC is available. Q: Will all the Apple 1 software work on the Replica? A: In theory, yes. Everything address wise has been left the same. Unfortunately, I don’t have any real software to try out yet. I have run the sample code that Woz wrote in the owner’s manual and they work just as described. Q: Isn’t the Woz Monitor the property of Apple? A: More than likely yes. But Woz was contacted about this and gave his ok. He stated that he handed it out along with his schematics long before there was an Apple computer company. Apple also turned all hardware and software matters over to the Apple 1 club and this project started and is still under the club. Q: I don’t have an ASCII or Apple II keyboard, what do I do? A: One of my last additions to the Replica was to add a microcontroller to interpret a standard PS/2 keyboard. So, you can use either a PS/2 keyboard or an Apple II/II+ keyboard. I did this because it is becoming harder to find ASCII keyboards to use. ********************* I am now taking pre-orders. If you want to reserve a Replica I please email me. mailto: Replica I preorder request/ vbr<>iel@yahoo.com The official selling start date is October 11, 2003. The price will be $199 plus shipping. Assembled version $199 plus shipping: What’s included: Replica 1 board fully assembled and tested. Instruction and setup manual Links to Apple 1 sites of interest. Warranty: 30 Day warranty will be given on all boards. Unassembled (kit) version $150 plus shipping: What’s included: Replica 1 board unassembled. Instruction and setup manual for assembled version. Links to Apple 1 sites of interest. Warranty: No warranty given on kits. Bare kit version $99 plus shipping: What’s included: Replica I pcb board video IC and keyboard encoder IC. Instruction and setup manual for assembled version. Links to Apple 1 sites of interest. Warranty: No warranty given on kits. From witchy at binarydinosaurs.co.uk Tue Sep 9 14:43:33 2003 From: witchy at binarydinosaurs.co.uk (Witchy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: CPT Corp. 8520 word processor In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi folks, Anyone have any info on the subject beast here? In fact, does anybody want one? I've got said twin 8" floppy drive monster here and it doesn't fit in with my museum since it isn't a home computer. It also doesn't have a keyboard, but it powers up and asks nicely for a program disk. All I can find is that CPT Corp were based in Eden Prairie, Michigan, were founded in 1971 by Dick Eichhorn and ceased to exist in the early 1990s. The Babbage institute has a CPT 8000 and the picture there is pretty much what the 8520 looks like. Only it has a keyboard :) The 8520 is an Intel 8080-powered machine, and I only know that because I took it apart. Google searches only turn up people offering a data transfer service, so either there aren't many left or it's just not a very interesting machine! Like I say, free to a good home but it's HEAVY, maybe 50-60lbs heavy. I could sure use the space it takes up and I don't want to put it back in the tip.... cheers -- adrian/witchy www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the online computer museum www.snakebiteandblack.co.uk - ex-monthly gothic shenanigans :o( From john at farwestdesigns.com Tue Sep 9 14:43:47 2003 From: john at farwestdesigns.com (John Oldenkamp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Genrad FutureData Message-ID: <000001c37689$bd42bad0$630a030a@DOGBERT> Hey, Don't know if you are still interested in info about the GenRad Futuredata 2300 but I spent a long time in front of one and still have access to it for (very) occasional support. We bought it in 1980 and used it to develop a MagCard debit system based on the 8085. Used it for 6 years before transitioning to a PC environment. Observations: Extremely slick. RDOS II was spectacular for what it was intended for. Assembly, linking and loading always went without a hitch. Ours had a whopping 48K, 2 x 128K 8" Shugart drives and all the emulator stuff. You could buy memory to take it past 48K but it only gave you a few more K since RDOS II had to live in the upper memory. We did not use the emu too much as we had a resident monitor that was specifically tailored to debugging what we had to do. I did incorporate a PAL into a new design and when I discovered that all the PAL cross-compiler stuff ran on PDPs and other expensive machines that I did not have access to, wrote a PAL cross compiler that ran under RDOS II that drove a ProLog blaster to get us through. This was in 1981. All in all, a fantastic system. Even with the PC onslaught, it took a 486/33 with a HDD to finally beat the assembly/link speeds of that sorry, floppy-based FutureData unit. I returned to school after all this to complete the degree in computer science and was appalled at the sorry algorithms presented in the lower division. The FutureData used full track buffering, double hashing and more to make the most of limited hardware resources. Different than the current crop of VBASIC hacks. *sigh* As an aside. Back in those days, Intel, National and others sold their chips with the development systems (Intellec, StarLink etc.l) like a hook. Once you had put $20K into the development system (sometimes rack mounted!) they figured they could hose you on their single board computers etc. at whatever cost. With the GenRad, we could listen to them say how much more expensive it would be to move to the next board and then watch them crater when we told them that for less than $1K we could completely re-tool our development hardware and .. would have! Heady times, for sure. RJO From cbajpai at comcast.net Tue Sep 9 14:44:01 2003 From: cbajpai at comcast.net (Chandra Bajpai) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Apple I replicas to be available (real Apple1 for sale) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000201c376c9$2da380e0$6f7ba8c0@ne2.client2.attbi.com> If you want a real Apple 1 I found this one for sale. I think he discounted the price to $20K. If you don't have $20-$30K I think the replicas are a good deal. -Chandra (A) Apple 1 computer in case. (B) Five (5) original manuals, a complete set, as of this time I know of no one else that has a complete set of manuals. (C) Three (3) original Apple 1 cassette tapes from Apple Computer Co. (D) The SWTPC PR-40 printer. This printer itself is an antique and hard to find. It is unique to the Apple 1 computer because of an article in InterFace Age magazine, Oct 1976 by Steven Jobs. (E) The InterFace Age magazine, dated Oct 1976. (F) The Nuts & Volts magazine, July 2002 issue. Has an article and pictures on the Apple 1 computer. (G) A+, an Apple magazine, dated Jan 1987. The 10 year anniversary of the Apple II but has pictures of the Apple 1. Done with Steve Wozniak. (H) The Brief Case, pictures on web site. (I) Last but not least, the postcard that was signed by Steve Wozniak, a prized possession. The cost of the Apple 1 system is thirty thousand ($30,000) US dollars. You must be able to pick up the system or arrange to have it picked up. Other conditions apply but will discuss with the buyer before agreeing on a deal for the Apple 1 system. I reserve the right to refuse any offer. If more that one party is interested, highest offer will get the Apple 1 system provided all conditions are meet. http://torzewski.tripod.com/apple1computer/id11.html -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Tothwolf Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 7:53 PM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: Re: Apple I replicas to be available On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: > He needs to find a web hosting site that works if he expects to sell > any! I tried over and over to look at his site and the only thing that > worked was the pop-up ads! I wonder if he will offer kits? I talked to Woz awhile back, and also got his blessing on making replicas. The only problem was that I did not have access to an Apple I to copy it's PC board. I'd wanted (and still would like to) create an exact reproduction of an Apple I. -Toth From jwest at kwcorp.com Tue Sep 9 14:44:15 2003 From: jwest at kwcorp.com (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: HP-85 item wanted Message-ID: <01cf01c37707$932d45c0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Ok, I know no one has one or will let it go if they do, but I'll ask.... Looking for the HP-85 accessory 82929A Programmable ROM drawer I'll trade unusually high for it... Jay West From aek at spies.com Tue Sep 9 15:02:00 2003 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: 9000a pods Message-ID: <200309091953.h89JrCsn027034@spies.com> > looking for a 8085 fluke pod I have one available. Contact me off-list. From jwest at classiccmp.org Tue Sep 9 15:06:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: another few wanted items Message-ID: <022401c3770c$b66e4a20$033310ac@kwcorp.com> I need the rackmount rails for an RK05J. The drive still has it's "inner" rails, the ones that bolt onto the drives. But I need the mating ones that go in the rack. Also, need a complete set of rails for the 11/34 cpu... or... can I use 11/44 rails for it? Jay West From aek at spies.com Tue Sep 9 15:11:00 2003 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: another few wanted items Message-ID: <200309092003.h89K3G2Z028517@spies.com> Also, need a complete set of rails for the 11/34 cpu... or... can I use 11/44 rails for it? -- 34's use the same Chassis-Trak slides that were used on RK05's. 44 rails are quite unique, and are actually hard to find, since most systems were sold in corporate cabs which had another unique set of top extending slides. From ghldbrd at ccp.com Tue Sep 9 15:14:01 2003 From: ghldbrd at ccp.com (ghldbrd@ccp.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Another Apple 1 for sale In-Reply-To: <000201c37603$d3f787a0$6f7ba8c0@ne2.client2.attbi.com> References: <000201c37603$d3f787a0$6f7ba8c0@ne2.client2.attbi.com> Message-ID: <3896.65.123.179.135.1063137963.squirrel@webmail.ccp.com> He should sell it to those guys in Nigeria, the 419 boys. Let me know when the price drops to just ludicrous. Gary Hildebrand St. Joseph, MO > Found this while searching around..I think he discounted the price to > $20K > > -Chandra > > > (A) Apple 1 computer in case. > (B) Five (5) original manuals, a complete set, as of this time I > know of no one else that has a complete set of manuals. > (C) Three (3) original Apple 1 cassette tapes from Apple Computer > Co. > (D) The SWTPC PR-40 printer. This printer itself is an antique and > hard to find. It is unique to the Apple 1 computer because of an article > in InterFace Age magazine, Oct 1976 by Steven Jobs. > (E) The InterFace Age magazine, dated Oct 1976. > (F) The Nuts & Volts magazine, July 2002 issue. Has an article and > pictures on the Apple 1 computer. > (G) A+, an Apple magazine, dated Jan 1987. The 10 year anniversary > of the Apple II but has pictures of the Apple 1. Done with Steve > Wozniak. > (H) The Brief Case, pictures on web site. > (I) Last but not least, the postcard that was signed by Steve > Wozniak, a prized possession. > > The cost of the Apple 1 system is thirty thousand ($30,000) US > dollars. You must be able to pick up the system or arrange to have it > picked up. Other conditions apply but will discuss with the buyer before > agreeing on a deal for the Apple 1 system. I reserve the right to refuse > any offer. If more that one party is interested, highest offer will get > the Apple 1 system provided all conditions are meet. > > > > http://torzewski.tripod.com/apple1computer/id11.html From jack.rubin at ameritech.net Tue Sep 9 15:53:00 2003 From: jack.rubin at ameritech.net (Jack Rubin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: CGRS 6502 card for Altair bus Message-ID: <000001c3770c$e0fd85d0$1f6fa8c0@eths.k12.il.us> I've got a bare S100 board labeled "CGRS 6502 Computer Board, Rev A 7/77 WMS". The only reference I can find to CGRS is in the What's New column of Byte 2:7(115)- July, 1977 - "A New Microcomputer Series from CGRS" which describes three boards in the 6000 Series of Altair bus compatible cards based on the MOS 6502 processor. Manufacturer is listed as CGRS Microtech of Southhampton, PA. Other refs to CGRS Microtech point to Commodore PET products including RAM upgrades and an S100 interface card. Anyone know anything more? Jack Rubin Wilmette, Illinois USA From witchy at binarydinosaurs.co.uk Tue Sep 9 15:54:37 2003 From: witchy at binarydinosaurs.co.uk (Witchy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: PAL RGB on Cub monitors In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Alan, I haven't come across a CUB monitor that accepted SCART, particularly the cube style (ie 1431 TTL and 3000 RGB), but that doesn't mean to say they didn't exist. The only monitor from that era I've come across that had SCART was the good ol' Philips CM8833. cheers -- adrian/witchy www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the online computer museum www.snakebiteandblack.co.uk - ex-monthly gothic shenanigans :o( > -----Original Message----- > From: cctech-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctech-admin@classiccmp.org]On > Behalf Of Alan Geering > Sent: 08 September 2003 19:54 > To: cctech@classiccmp.org > Subject: PAL RGB on Cub monitors > > > Forgive me, I'm new to BBC computers and associated techology > > What I would like to know is whether the cube looking monitor > (microvitech > cub?) that came with BBC computers had the following: > > A scart input that took a PAL RGB 1v p-p signal that sync'd on green? > > If it did then can you please let me know which models. This is quite an > urgent matter. > > Thanks, > Alan Geering > > _________________________________________________________________ > Send and receive larger attachments with Hotmail Extra Storage. > http://join.msn.com/?PAGE=features/es From jimcox at miba51.com Tue Sep 9 15:56:01 2003 From: jimcox at miba51.com (jimcox@miba51.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Free: HP 64000 Message-ID: Hello: I was searching Google for anyone interested in a HP 64000 that I adopted (more like left on my porch :) and came a cross an newgroup posting you had made and was wondering if you could help me out. The system was given to me under the pretext that it would come with a a 6809 pod, but alas it only has a Z80 Pod and something like an 8047 Pod. It did come with all the docs. plus extra components. Do you know where I could find a 6809 Pod for this beatie. If you do know where I can get a 6809 pod for free or very cheap, I would appreciate knowing about it. If not, do you know of anyone interested in taking the system for free. I live in the Seattle area, so it's free to anyone willing to pick it up. Thanks! Jim Cox From geoffr at zipcon.net Tue Sep 9 16:18:00 2003 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Anyone have a CPU board for an OSI Challenger II ? Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030909141048.064b88d0@mail.zipcon.net> our roommate here has an old OSI challenger II that someone was kind enough to break into his storage unit and tear apart, we found all of it's guts except the CPU board :( does anyone happen to have one? or is anyone interested in the rest of it? From wh.sudbrink at verizon.net Tue Sep 9 16:30:00 2003 From: wh.sudbrink at verizon.net (Bill Sudbrink) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: Anyone have a CPU board for an OSI Challenger II ? In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030909141048.064b88d0@mail.zipcon.net> Message-ID: Let's see... That's an OSI 500 if memory serves. I might have a spare... Will have to look through a few boxes tonight. Is it in a blue/black case? With a paper or metal label? -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Geoff Reed Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2003 5:13 PM To: cctech@classiccmp.org Subject: Anyone have a CPU board for an OSI Challenger II ? our roommate here has an old OSI challenger II that someone was kind enough to break into his storage unit and tear apart, we found all of it's guts except the CPU board :( does anyone happen to have one? or is anyone interested in the rest of it? From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Sep 9 16:32:01 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:45 2005 Subject: PAL RGB on Cub monitors In-Reply-To: from "Alan Geering" at Sep 8, 3 06:54:13 pm Message-ID: > Forgive me, I'm new to BBC computers and associated techology > > What I would like to know is whether the cube looking monitor (microvitech > cub?) that came with BBC computers had the following: > > A scart input that took a PAL RGB 1v p-p signal that sync'd on green? No Microvitec cub ever had a SCART socket. There were serveral models. Most has RGB inputs, which were internally link-selectable to be either TTL level digital (giving 8 colours on the screen), or 1V analogue. I think all models had separate sync inputs. There was a model (which I have never seen!) which had a built-in PAL decoder. This took 1V composite video. The input was a BNC socket IIRC. I don't know what a 'PAL RGB' signal is. PAL is a method of colour encoding, RGB implies separate signals for the 3 primary colours. One signal can't be both! -tony From geoffr at zipcon.net Tue Sep 9 16:40:00 2003 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Anyone have a CPU board for an OSI Challenger II ? In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030909141048.064b88d0@mail.zipcon.net> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030909143427.05900b30@mail.zipcon.net> black and blue case and a metal label IIRC At 05:22 PM 9/9/03 -0400, you wrote: >Let's see... That's an OSI 500 if memory serves. I might have >a spare... Will have to look through a few boxes tonight. Is it >in a blue/black case? With a paper or metal label? > >-----Original Message----- >From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]On >Behalf Of Geoff Reed >Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2003 5:13 PM >To: cctech@classiccmp.org >Subject: Anyone have a CPU board for an OSI Challenger II ? > > >our roommate here has an old OSI challenger II that someone was kind enough >to break into his storage unit and tear apart, we found all of it's guts >except the CPU board :( > > does anyone happen to have one? > > or is anyone interested in the rest of it? From teoz at neo.rr.com Tue Sep 9 17:07:01 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Help with a eprom Message-ID: <004301c3771d$9075c4e0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Would anybody with an eprom burner be willing to burn a 27c128 rom (I have the code) to update an apple scsi card rom from revision B to C so it will work with my IIgs? From shirsch at adelphia.net Tue Sep 9 17:20:00 2003 From: shirsch at adelphia.net (Steven N. Hirsch) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: ISO Corvus Omnidrive Service Manual In-Reply-To: <200309082250.h88MoKe7026707@spies.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, Al Kossow wrote: > I've been able to locate almost all of the Corvus > service manuals now to archive with the exception > of this one. The frustrating thing is that I HAD > one of these before I gave all of my Corvus stuff > to Eric Lander (who I managed to trace down again > but disappeared before I could get anything back > from him). > > If someone has a copy of this that I could borrow > to scan, please let me know. > Do you have the service manual for the Bank tape drive? Steve From dan at ekoan.com Tue Sep 9 17:24:00 2003 From: dan at ekoan.com (Dan Veeneman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Help with a eprom In-Reply-To: <004301c3771d$9075c4e0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030909181619.04740610@enigma> Hi, At 05:58 PM 9/9/03 -0400, you wrote: >Would anybody with an eprom burner be willing to burn a 27c128 rom (I have the >code) to update an apple scsi card rom from revision B to C so it will work >with my IIgs? If no one else pipes up, I'll be happy to burn it for you. My IIgs boxes are in storage at the moment, so I'm not sure how fast the EPROM needs to be. Do you have a blank, or should I start digging around for one? Cheers, Dan http://www.decodesystems.com/wanted.html From aek at spies.com Tue Sep 9 18:20:00 2003 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: ISO Corvus Omnidrive Service Manual Message-ID: <200309092312.h89NCdl0019319@spies.com> > Do you have the service manual for the Bank tape drive? www.spies.com/aek/pdf/corvus/7100-05219_CorvusBankSvc.pdf From vcf at siconic.com Tue Sep 9 18:49:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Another Apple 1 for sale In-Reply-To: <3896.65.123.179.135.1063137963.squirrel@webmail.ccp.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Sep 2003 ghldbrd@ccp.com wrote: > He should sell it to those guys in Nigeria, the 419 boys. > > Let me know when the price drops to just ludicrous. On the contrary, $20K is the going rate for a typical Apple-1. With all that he's offering, it's actually a good deal. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Tue Sep 9 18:54:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: CGRS 6502 card for Altair bus In-Reply-To: <000001c3770c$e0fd85d0$1f6fa8c0@eths.k12.il.us> Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Sep 2003, Jack Rubin wrote: > I've got a bare S100 board labeled "CGRS 6502 Computer Board, Rev A 7/77 > WMS". The only reference I can find to CGRS is in the What's New column > of Byte 2:7(115)- July, 1977 - "A New Microcomputer Series from CGRS" > which describes three boards in the 6000 Series of Altair bus compatible > cards based on the MOS 6502 processor. Manufacturer is listed as CGRS > Microtech of Southhampton, PA. > > Other refs to CGRS Microtech point to Commodore PET products including > RAM upgrades and an S100 interface card. > > Anyone know anything more? No, but please share what you do find out. This sounds very cool. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From dholland at woh.rr.com Tue Sep 9 19:12:00 2003 From: dholland at woh.rr.com (David Holland) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908235625.00a43040@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030908195116.08cf4ec0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030908195116.08cf4ec0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030908235625.00a43040@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Message-ID: <1063152302.22995.1.camel@crusader> On Tue, 2003-09-09 at 00:04, Mail List wrote: > Hello David, Howdy >snip< > Sounds like with your monitor having the 13W3 input, you might not have > needed to be using an adapter, but just used a 13W3 to 13W3 cable? Well, the 13W3 cable is attached in back of the monitor permn, but yeah... no adapters needed for anything I've plugged it into so far. David From bshannon at tiac.net Tue Sep 9 19:16:00 2003 From: bshannon at tiac.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Help with a eprom References: <004301c3771d$9075c4e0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <3F5E6BC6.2010507@tiac.net> No problem, can you send me a .hex file? TeoZ wrote: >Would anybody with an eprom burner be willing to burn a 27c128 rom (I have the >code) to update an apple scsi card rom from revision B to C so it will work >with my IIgs? From teoz at neo.rr.com Tue Sep 9 19:30:01 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Another Apple 1 for sale References: Message-ID: <002501c37731$a7d89e00$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Compared to rare stamp and coin collecting its a drop in the bucket for something thats very rare (but not 1 of a kind) Since I am curious whats the rarest/most expensive computer? I assume its a one of a kind that has some major historical value. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vintage Computer Festival" To: Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2003 11:44 AM Subject: Re: Another Apple 1 for sale > On Tue, 9 Sep 2003 ghldbrd@ccp.com wrote: > > > He should sell it to those guys in Nigeria, the 419 boys. > > > > Let me know when the price drops to just ludicrous. > > On the contrary, $20K is the going rate for a typical Apple-1. With all > that he's offering, it's actually a good deal. > > -- > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage mputers ] > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From geoffr at zipcon.net Tue Sep 9 19:44:00 2003 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: OSI Challenger II Docs. Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030909173842.029bb1a0@mail.zipcon.net> are there any Challenger II docs out there in PDF format? From cmcnabb at 4mcnabb.net Tue Sep 9 19:48:00 2003 From: cmcnabb at 4mcnabb.net (Christopher McNabb) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: PDP-11/83 Power Supply Wierdness In-Reply-To: <3F58D119.3000704@srv.net> References: <1062716122.23367.8.camel@unix> <3F58D119.3000704@srv.net> Message-ID: <1063154427.6305.2.camel@unix> On Fri, 2003-09-05 at 14:08, Kevin Handy wrote: > Christopher McNabb wrote: > > >My PDP-11/83 has recently (past few weeks) been displaying some odd > >symptoms. The system is a PDP-11/83 in a "Corporate Cabinet". Most of > >the time, when the power switch is turned on, the "run", "halt", "ready" > >lights blink on then go off. Also, the Red light on the TK-50 will come > >on then go off. You also hear a relay closing and opening in the rack > >power supply. > > OK, after playing around with it tonight it looks like the problem is in the on/off switch on the BA-23 box. If I push on the switch REALLY hard then the system will stay on. If I let the pressure off the switch it almost immediatly shuts off. So, anyone know where I can get a replacement switch? Does anyone know how the switch is wired so that I can jumper it should a replacement not be available? -- Christopher McNabb The McNabb Family From geneb at deltasoft.com Tue Sep 9 20:43:01 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: OT? - How to run a DOS BBS directly attached to a Terminal Server In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.1.20030907164731.0176b008@mail.saracom.com> Message-ID: > I could run WWIV with my two V.everything modems back to back but that > IS overkill. Is there any other solution? Has anyone tried this? > Max, there is a product called NetModem that should do what you want. It's a commercial application, but there are free work-alikes available. Check out http://www.thebbs.org - the file area should turn up something. g. From ceby2 at csc.com Tue Sep 9 21:28:01 2003 From: ceby2 at csc.com (Colin Eby) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Needed: IBM 5364 PC Console Attachment Programs Message-ID: Question... this one probably goes to Sellam, but the field's open... I have an IBM PC/36, the baby System/36. Silly thing's sitting on my desk daring me to power it up, but without a critical bit of code I can't. To operate a 5364 you need a PC attached and running the "Attachment Programs". They act like a control panel for the server -- controlling the whole IPL and diagnostic process. As you may have guessed, I haven't got them. Would anyone on the list have such a set of disks around somewhere? -Colin Eby ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is a PRIVATE message. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete without copying and kindly advise us by e-mail of the mistake in delivery. NOTE: Regardless of content, this e-mail shall not operate to bind CSC to any order or other contract unless pursuant to explicit written agreement or government initiative expressly permitting the use of e-mail for such purpose. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From vcf at siconic.com Tue Sep 9 22:04:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Another Apple 1 for sale In-Reply-To: <002501c37731$a7d89e00$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Sep 2003, TeoZ wrote: > Since I am curious whats the rarest/most expensive computer? I assume its a > one of a kind that has some major historical value. Only 200 were ever made, and most were destroyed when Apple had a 2-for-1 trade in offer when they came out with the Apple ][. Rumor has it that only one of the trade-ins was kept. So I estimate that less than 50 still exist. I've physically been in the presence of about 10 myself, and have a private registry consisting of about 28 that are accounted for so far (and another one just came to my attention yesterday, so that makes 29). It's a computer that represents a significant development in the timeline of the history of computing on several different fronts, not the least of which being that it represents the beginnings of Apple Computer. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Tue Sep 9 22:06:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Needed: IBM 5364 PC Console Attachment Programs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Sep 2003, Colin Eby wrote: > Question... this one probably goes to Sellam, but the field's open... > > I have an IBM PC/36, the baby System/36. Silly thing's sitting on my desk > daring me to power it up, but without a critical bit of code I can't. To > operate a 5364 you need a PC attached and running the "Attachment > Programs". They act like a control panel for the server -- controlling the > whole IPL and diagnostic process. As you may have guessed, I haven't got > them. Would anyone on the list have such a set of disks around somewhere? I am pretty sure I don't have this software :( -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com Tue Sep 9 22:16:00 2003 From: Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com (Andreas Freiherr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Flex mailing list? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Tony Duell wrote: I've only used (6809) flex briefly, on an Acorn System of all things, but I don't remember it as being very unix-like. I remember it as being single-tasking with no I/O ridirection, pipes, or anything like that. OS-9 was much more like '6809 unix' (to the user, internally it's very different!) -tony Yes, having seen OS-9 briefly, too: behaviour was very predictable with a bit of Unix knowledge, but, for example, implementing an "echo" command needed something like four machine instructions. Andreas From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Tue Sep 9 22:21:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Pro-Log M822A 8080A System Analyzer and PDP/8E Drawings Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030909223603.009d18a0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Hello 8080 and 8080A and DEC PDP/8E fans, I bought some stuff from a guy just north of Sacramento, and he had a couple of other things for sale that I didn't need, but some of you might want. He had sent me pictures, so I uploaded them for viewing. Pro-Log M822A 8080A System Analyzer ... he had said he only wanted $25.00 for this 8.5" x 11" x 2" will work for the 8080 and the 8080A clips over 8080A CPU chip and is used for debuging programs and hardware system design 8080A first process authorized for military applications 8080 ... Altair, IMSAI, SOL, Poly88 http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze2mj6m/pics/Z_Pro-Log_System_Analyzer_020.jpg Original PDP8/E Computer Engineering Drawings ... he had said he wanted $50.00 for these http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze2mj6m/pics/DEC_PDP8-E_Computer_Engineering_Drawings_024.jpg If anyone wants either of these, send me an email and I will forward it on to him. I will not be involved past that point, and accept no responsibility for the outcome. Best Regards From SUPRDAVE at aol.com Tue Sep 9 22:37:00 2003 From: SUPRDAVE at aol.com (SUPRDAVE@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Needed: IBM 5364 PC Console Attachment Programs Message-ID: <1f0.f80b647.2c8ff45a@aol.com> In a message dated 9/9/2003 10:21:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ceby2@csc.com writes: Question... this one probably goes to Sellam, but the field's open... I have an IBM PC/36, the baby System/36. Silly thing's sitting on my desk daring me to power it up, but without a critical bit of code I can't. To operate a 5364 you need a PC attached and running the "Attachment Programs". They act like a control panel for the server -- controlling the whole IPL and diagnostic process. As you may have guessed, I haven't got them. Would anyone on the list have such a set of disks around somewhere? -Colin Eby yea, I have one. you talking about the AT size mainframe with the single floppy drive? I got one about 2 years ago along with the dual floppy 5150 that runs it I guess and a terminal connected via twinax. I managed to IPL the system, but that's it, not knowing how to operate it any further. Mine just uses a single floppy. Is that what's needed? From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Tue Sep 9 22:48:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Correction: PDP8/E now on eBay Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030909233033.009d1210@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Oops, Took me a while to get to getting those pictures up and in the meantime he put the PDP8/E schematics on eBay There currently at only $26.00 with almost two days to go. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=41519&item=2556402557 Best Regards From jrkeys at concentric.net Tue Sep 9 23:02:00 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Two 3Com finds today Message-ID: <022e01c3774f$2a632c10$2b0cdd40@oemcomputer> At an auction today I picked up an 3Com #Server3 and a 3Com 3Station hooked to a WYSE WY-530-02 and the KB for it. From vcf at siconic.com Wed Sep 10 00:12:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Trouble with Magnavox Odyssey Message-ID: Has anyone here ever tinkered with a Magnavox Odyssey and got it to work? I have four of these dang things and have not gotten one of them to fire up. I can't imagine that they are all bad. I am pretty sure that the video connection from the unit to the screen is solid as I tested it with an Atari Pong console and got video. I'm using a 9 volt adapter and have tested the voltage and have also tested that voltage is getting to the unit and that is all working. The unit gets turned on when you insert a carthridge. I've inserted and re-inserted the carthridge several times but there is nothing on the display, not even a glitch or flicker in the background noise. I've used contact cleaner on the carthridge and inside the slot but that hasn't helped. Has anyone else ever played with one of these and gotten it to work? -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From drido at optushome.com.au Wed Sep 10 00:49:00 2003 From: drido at optushome.com.au (Dr. Ido) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Trouble with Magnavox Odyssey In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.20030910153506.0125d4dc@mail.optushome.com.au> At 03:27 PM 9/10/03, you wrote: >Has anyone here ever tinkered with a Magnavox Odyssey and got it to work? >I have four of these dang things and have not gotten one of them to fire >up. I can't imagine that they are all bad. I am pretty sure that the >video connection from the unit to the screen is solid as I tested it with >an Atari Pong console and got video. I'm using a 9 volt adapter and have >tested the voltage and have also tested that voltage is getting to the >unit and that is all working. > >The unit gets turned on when you insert a carthridge. I've inserted and >re-inserted the carthridge several times but there is nothing on the >display, not even a glitch or flicker in the background noise. I've used >contact cleaner on the carthridge and inside the slot but that hasn't >helped. > >Has anyone else ever played with one of these and gotten it to work? I've never had an Odyssey, but I've had similar problems with some other old consoles (RCA studio 2, Radofin 1392 and various pong clones come to mind). What I found is the RF signal from the console is either too weak or to far off spec for a TV with auto tuning to pick it up. On the relatively modern TVs that I tried I either got no signal, a black screen or a distorted picture that won't lock on. It wasn't until I'd had the same problem with several consoles that I tried a different TV. On an older TV with manual tuning I was able get a good stable picture from all the consoles that I thought had problems. From vcf at siconic.com Wed Sep 10 03:14:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! Message-ID: I just found out that two of my magazine boxes were attacked by some damn little wormy things. They were white and about a quarter inch in length. They'd come up through a crack in the foundation of my warehouse and started eating away at the file boxes. Fortunately, they seemed to like the cardboard way more than the magazines, though they did take out significant chunks of a couple issues of Kilobaud Computing from 1979 (bastards!) They also left a lot of wormy poop behind, and unless I'm smelling the acid from the paper breaking down, they left a stink too. Damn punk-ass bitch wormy things. Has anyone else had issues like this? How did these fuckers find my boxes out of all the damn cracks they could have crawled out of? What are they? Termites? Now I have to waste time filling in the cracks so this doesn't happen again. I can't have gawd damn wormy things eating my damn computer stuff! -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From mikeford at socal.rr.com Wed Sep 10 03:20:00 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: SVGA with DE9 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030910010122.00a3fda0@pop-server.socal.rr.com> At 10:38 AM 9/8/03 -0400, chris wrote: > >I have a Sony CPD-1304 VGA/SVGA monitor that has a 9-pin connector as > >well. I have a 9-15 pin adapter cable to use it on a PC, and they also > >supposedly made (but I never got one) a cable to use it with a Mac II > >class computer. > >I might have a cable or two like that for the Mac. I have some that are >15 pin like the Mac RGB connector, and go to a 9 pin like a CGA >connector. I don't know what they go to, they were just in a box of >cables that I aquired. First look carefully for a brand or part number, otherwise may be pretty hard to figure out what they work with. You might be able to plug them into a second video card on a old mac and use a Griffin utility to list all the monitor sense results (as available resolutions). Cornerstone, and a bunch of the smaller monitor brands for mac used that type of cable in the old days. From llyon at commodore.thebbs.org Wed Sep 10 03:40:00 2003 From: llyon at commodore.thebbs.org (Lance Lyon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: MOS operating System? References: Message-ID: <005301c3743d$796cb3e0$0100a8c0@LANCE> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fred N. van Kempen" > MOS (also called PC/MOS, and the later PC/MOS-386) were multi-user, > single-tasking versions of a DOS, more or less compatible with the > MS- and PC-DOS systems. MOS ran on the larger 286 and 386 systems, > and DID use their hardware segmentation (286) and protection (386) > support. And bloody difficult to find - been after it for years :-( cheers, Lance // http://commodore.thebbs.org telnet://commodore.thebbs.org Since 1987 - Australia's oldest Amiga BBS // From vance at neurotica.com Wed Sep 10 04:39:00 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Another Apple 1 for sale In-Reply-To: <002501c37731$a7d89e00$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: There are plenty of 1950's era computers which are one-of-a-kind. Sadly, many of them went to the scrapper. Peace... Sridhar On Tue, 9 Sep 2003, TeoZ wrote: > Compared to rare stamp and coin collecting its a drop in the bucket for > something thats very rare (but not 1 of a kind) > Since I am curious whats the rarest/most expensive computer? I assume its a > one of a kind that has some major historical value. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Vintage Computer Festival" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2003 11:44 AM > Subject: Re: Another Apple 1 for sale > > > > On Tue, 9 Sep 2003 ghldbrd@ccp.com wrote: > > > > > He should sell it to those guys in Nigeria, the 419 boys. > > > > > > Let me know when the price drops to just ludicrous. > > > > On the contrary, $20K is the going rate for a typical Apple-1. With all > > that he's offering, it's actually a good deal. > > > > -- > > > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer > Festival > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ---- > > International Man of Intrigue and Danger > http://www.vintage.org > > > > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage > mputers ] > > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at > http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From dholland at woh.rr.com Wed Sep 10 05:11:01 2003 From: dholland at woh.rr.com (David Holland) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > I just found out that two of my magazine boxes were attacked by some damn > little wormy things. They were white and about a quarter inch in length. Termites have legs. (At least every one I've seen did.) Do these have legs? I've heard termites will eat paper/cardboard, so I wouldn't be terribly surprised if they were termites. You could stick the magazines in little plastic baggies, sorta like what the comic book ppl do, and that'd keep bugs (and a number of other things) away from the magazines. YMMV, Std. Disclaimers apply. (Of course. :-) ) David From Paul.HILLS at uk.landisgyr.com Wed Sep 10 06:13:01 2003 From: Paul.HILLS at uk.landisgyr.com (Hills, Paul) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Another Apple 1 for sale Message-ID: <5B835935122FD411845C0800060DDD3901C08B2F@ohm1003a.uk.landisgyr.com> I liked the Steve Jobs quote from one of the links off that URL (http://www.wired.com/news/print/0,1294,20271,00.html)... "It's the first Apple I built and sold by Apple," claims auctioneer Risley Sams, who will open the bidding on Tuesday 29 June at 11 a.m. "We offered it to Steve Jobs, but he said he had such a hard time selling it in the first place that he didn't really want it. Paul http://www.landisgyr.com/ This communication contains information which is confidential and may be privileged and is for the exclusive use of the addressee(s). If you are not a named addressee please contact the sender immediately, and delete/destroy this communication. You are hereby notified that any disclosure, distribution or copying of this communication, in whole or in part, is strictly prohibited. Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of the Company, its directors or officers unless otherwise specifically stated. The Company is not responsible for any reliance placed on the information contained herein and excludes all liability. (c)Copyright 2003 Landis+Gyr Ltd UK All Rights Reserved. From bpope at wordstock.com Wed Sep 10 06:45:00 2003 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: from "Vintage Computer Festival" at Sep 9, 03 05:08:54 pm Message-ID: <200309101134.HAA32746@wordstock.com> And thusly Vintage Computer Festival spake: > > I just found out that two of my magazine boxes were attacked by some damn > little wormy things. They were white and about a quarter inch in length. > They'd come up through a crack in the foundation of my warehouse and > started eating away at the file boxes. Fortunately, they seemed to like > the cardboard way more than the magazines, though they did take out > significant chunks of a couple issues of Kilobaud Computing from 1979 > (bastards!) They also left a lot of wormy poop behind, and unless I'm > smelling the acid from the paper breaking down, they left a stink too. > > Damn punk-ass bitch wormy things. > > Has anyone else had issues like this? How did these fuckers find my boxes > out of all the damn cracks they could have crawled out of? What are they? > Termites? > > Now I have to waste time filling in the cracks so this doesn't happen > again. I can't have gawd damn wormy things eating my damn computer stuff! > It is ironic you posted this message on the anniversary of the first computer bug... Cheers, Bryan P.S. For more info check out http://slashdot.org/articles/03/09/09/1631250.shtml?tid=126&tid=128 From luc at e2t.be Wed Sep 10 07:00:01 2003 From: luc at e2t.be (Luc Vande Velde) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Free: HP 64000 In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720ED530@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD6D4@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Jim, Sorry but I can't help you with the 6809 pod. But if you intend to do it away I am very interested. I used it for years on Z80 development. Actually I have one, but very incomplete - no pods, no doc... I have no problems in paying shipping cost in advance (I know it's heavy) gr. Luc Belgium -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]Namens jimcox@miba51.com Verzonden: dinsdag 9 september 2003 22:18 Aan: cctech@classiccmp.org Onderwerp: Free: HP 64000 Hello: I was searching Google for anyone interested in a HP 64000 that I adopted (more like left on my porch :) and came a cross an newgroup posting you had made and was wondering if you could help me out. The system was given to me under the pretext that it would come with a a 6809 pod, but alas it only has a Z80 Pod and something like an 8047 Pod. It did come with all the docs. plus extra components. Do you know where I could find a 6809 Pod for this beatie. If you do know where I can get a 6809 pod for free or very cheap, I would appreciate knowing about it. If not, do you know of anyone interested in taking the system for free. I live in the Seattle area, so it's free to anyone willing to pick it up. Thanks! Jim Cox From luc at e2t.be Wed Sep 10 07:02:00 2003 From: luc at e2t.be (Luc Vande Velde) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Help with a eprom In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720ED539@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD6D5@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> I can program almost anything there is and was to program... If nobody closer then me can help you - send me the code Luc Belgium -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]Namens TeoZ Verzonden: dinsdag 9 september 2003 23:59 Aan: cctalk@classiccmp.org Onderwerp: Help with a eprom Would anybody with an eprom burner be willing to burn a 27c128 rom (I have the code) to update an apple scsi card rom from revision B to C so it will work with my IIgs? From ceby2 at csc.com Wed Sep 10 07:31:00 2003 From: ceby2 at csc.com (Colin Eby) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Needed: IBM 5364 PC Console Attachment Programs Message-ID: Martin -- Thanks so much! This looks like just the right stuff to get me going. I'll give a try as soon as I get a chance today. Now, as to S/36 information for the beginner... truth is the publicly accessible material's a little thin on the ground. It pre-dates IBMs electronic documentation distribution. Being old hard copy, a lot of it's been pulped at this point. I've managed to assemble a pretty fair bookshelf of hardcopy, and I've scanned two of the manuals to at least a readable level. They're big though. The Operator's manual for ht 5362/60 I scanned is 100 MB. You're very welcome to it of course. That's why I scanned it in the first place. But I'll need an ftp site or some such to send it to. I do have the operator's manual for the 5364 and some other goodies, but I got them so recently nothing's scanned yet. As a quick entre you might want to read the AS/400 reference for the S/36 environment (IBM Bookshelf: http://publib.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr/BOOKS/QBKAUR00/CCONTENTS?SHELF=qbkayc02&DN=SC41-3731-00&DT=19940427134655). That's the compatibility mode they continue to support. The link takes you to the earliest version I could find. It should give you a good intro to the command structures and concepts. Or you could look at the documentation for Advance System/36. I don't know if they sell that at more, but that was basically an AS/400 running S/36 with some enhancements (IBM Bookshelf: http://publib.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr/Shelves/qbja8n03) . I don't know how close AS/36 and S/36 are. If those links aren't helpful, let me know a the location of your favorite bit-bucket, and I'll pass on what I've scanned so far. Thanks again, Colin ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is a PRIVATE message. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete without copying and kindly advise us by e-mail of the mistake in delivery. NOTE: Regardless of content, this e-mail shall not operate to bind CSC to any order or other contract unless pursuant to explicit written agreement or government initiative expressly permitting the use of e-mail for such purpose. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 10 07:50:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Pro-Log M822A 8080A System Analyzer and PDP/8E Drawings Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030910084212.0079bdb0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I'm intersted in the Pro-Log unit. Can you send me his address? A friend of mine has one and I narrowly missed one a couple of years ago. Joe At 10:45 PM 9/9/03 -0400, you wrote: >Hello 8080 and 8080A and DEC PDP/8E fans, > > >I bought some stuff from a guy just north of Sacramento, and he had >a couple of other things for sale that I didn't need, but some of you might >want. He had sent me pictures, so I uploaded them for viewing. > > >Pro-Log M822A 8080A System Analyzer ... he had said he only wanted $25.00 >for this >8.5" x 11" x 2" >will work for the 8080 and the 8080A >clips over 8080A CPU chip and is used for >debuging programs and hardware system design >8080A first process authorized for military applications >8080 ... Altair, IMSAI, SOL, Poly88 > >http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze2mj6m/pics/Z_Pro-Log_System_Analyzer_02 0.jpg > > >Original PDP8/E Computer Engineering Drawings ... he had said he wanted >$50.00 for these > >http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze2mj6m/pics/DEC_PDP8-E_Computer_Engineer ing_Drawings_024.jpg > > >If anyone wants either of these, send me an email and I will forward it on >to him. >I will not be involved past that point, and accept no responsibility for >the outcome. > > >Best Regards From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 10 08:24:01 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030910085152.00906990@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Dammed shame, man! I've had paper that bugs, termites and moisture have gotten into. (Bugs and moisture are a fact of life here in Florida!) I put some baking soda in a large salt shaker and sprinkle it between all the pages. It helps dry out the paper and get rid of the smell. Close the books up for a while with the baking soda in it then open them later and shake the stuff out. It might help neutralize the acidity too. Joe At 05:08 PM 9/9/03 -0700, you wrote: >I just found out that two of my magazine boxes were attacked by some damn >little wormy things. They were white and about a quarter inch in length. >They'd come up through a crack in the foundation of my warehouse and >started eating away at the file boxes. Fortunately, they seemed to like >the cardboard way more than the magazines, though they did take out >significant chunks of a couple issues of Kilobaud Computing from 1979 >(bastards!) They also left a lot of wormy poop behind, and unless I'm >smelling the acid from the paper breaking down, they left a stink too. > >Damn punk-ass bitch wormy things. > >Has anyone else had issues like this? How did these fuckers find my boxes >out of all the damn cracks they could have crawled out of? What are they? >Termites? > >Now I have to waste time filling in the cracks so this doesn't happen >again. I can't have gawd damn wormy things eating my damn computer stuff! > >-- > >Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- >International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > >[ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] >[ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 10 08:24:28 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: MOS operating System? In-Reply-To: <005301c3743d$796cb3e0$0100a8c0@LANCE> References: Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030910085322.009076f0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I know where there's a new sealed box of MOS. Do you want it? Joe At 04:09 PM 9/6/03 +1000, you wrote: >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Fred N. van Kempen" > >> MOS (also called PC/MOS, and the later PC/MOS-386) were multi-user, >> single-tasking versions of a DOS, more or less compatible with the >> MS- and PC-DOS systems. MOS ran on the larger 286 and 386 systems, >> and DID use their hardware segmentation (286) and protection (386) >> support. > >And bloody difficult to find - been after it for years :-( > >cheers, > >Lance > >// http://commodore.thebbs.org > telnet://commodore.thebbs.org > Since 1987 - Australia's oldest Amiga BBS // From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 10 08:24:42 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Another Apple 1 for sale In-Reply-To: References: <002501c37731$a7d89e00$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030910090215.0079c210@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 05:30 AM 9/10/03 -0400, you wrote: >There are plenty of 1950's era computers which are one-of-a-kind. Sadly, >many of them went to the scrapper. The ironic thing is that the truely one of a kind (or very limited production) computers aren't very collectable since few people know of them. I'm sure the people on this list can name lots of computers that were had less than 200 produced. And none of them would command the kind of price thaat the Apple I's do. I ran into the same thing when collecting cars. I have a 1970 Dodge Challanger RT convertible. The Challangers were only built for 3 years, convertibles only built for 2 years, only 269 RT convertibles were ever built. It's a LOT rarer than the Mustangs but everyone knows about the Mustangs and that's what everyone wants so the Mustangs are worth more than the Challangers. Joe > >Peace... Sridhar > >On Tue, 9 Sep 2003, TeoZ wrote: > >> Compared to rare stamp and coin collecting its a drop in the bucket for >> something thats very rare (but not 1 of a kind) >> Since I am curious whats the rarest/most expensive computer? I assume its a >> one of a kind that has some major historical value. >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Vintage Computer Festival" >> To: >> Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2003 11:44 AM >> Subject: Re: Another Apple 1 for sale >> >> >> > On Tue, 9 Sep 2003 ghldbrd@ccp.com wrote: >> > >> > > He should sell it to those guys in Nigeria, the 419 boys. >> > > >> > > Let me know when the price drops to just ludicrous. >> > >> > On the contrary, $20K is the going rate for a typical Apple-1. With all >> > that he's offering, it's actually a good deal. >> > >> > -- >> > >> > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer >> Festival >> > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> ---- >> > International Man of Intrigue and Danger >> http://www.vintage.org >> > >> > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage >> mputers ] >> > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at >> http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 10 08:24:57 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030910090932.009087e0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I should have mentioned that. A friend of mine is a REAL pack-rat. He has books that he's had in storage for many years with no damage. He uses tomato boxs from the grocery store. They're fairly small so they're easy to handle when filled with books and they're sturdy. He puts a heavy duty plastic trash bag in the box and then puts his books inside that and then closes the bag and seals it with a twist tie. So far we haven't seen any moisture or bug damage to any of them. (We've opened up at least 100 boxs and put them up on shelves.) A couple of years ago he gave me a box full of NorthStar manuals that had been in storage for 12 or 13 years. They were all completely undamaged when when I opened them up. Joe At 06:03 AM 9/10/03 -0400, you wrote: >On Tue, 9 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > >> I just found out that two of my magazine boxes were attacked by some damn >> little wormy things. They were white and about a quarter inch in length. > >Termites have legs. (At least every one I've seen did.) > >Do these have legs? I've heard termites will eat paper/cardboard, so >I wouldn't be terribly surprised if they were termites. > >You could stick the magazines in little plastic baggies, sorta like >what the comic book ppl do, and that'd keep bugs (and a number of other >things) away from the magazines. > >YMMV, Std. Disclaimers apply. (Of course. :-) ) > >David From teoz at neo.rr.com Wed Sep 10 09:32:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Help with a eprom References: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD6D5@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <003501c377a7$24c77100$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Will let you know, hoping to find somebody in the USA Thanks ----- Original Message ----- From: "Luc Vande Velde" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 7:54 AM Subject: RE: Help with a eprom > I can program almost anything there is and was to program... > If nobody closer then me can help you - send me the code > > Luc > Belgium > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org > [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]Namens TeoZ > Verzonden: dinsdag 9 september 2003 23:59 > Aan: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Onderwerp: Help with a eprom > > > Would anybody with an eprom burner be willing to burn a 27c128 rom (I have > the > code) to update an apple scsi card rom from revision B to C so it will work > with my IIgs? From vcf at siconic.com Wed Sep 10 09:35:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, David Holland wrote: > Termites have legs. (At least every one I've seen did.) > > Do these have legs? I've heard termites will eat paper/cardboard, so > I wouldn't be terribly surprised if they were termites. I couldn't see clearly enough what I was looking at because there wasn't good light between the stacks of boxes, and I was too tired to do much investigating (this was very late last night). I just used my foot to smear them into the pavement. But my impression was that they were worms from the way they moved, though I'm not ruling out the possibility that they were termites. > You could stick the magazines in little plastic baggies, sorta like > what the comic book ppl do, and that'd keep bugs (and a number of other > things) away from the magazines. I'm very close to putting a lot of the magazines up on bookshelves, but I just wanted to find out what was going on so I can take appropriate remedial action so I don't have this problem in the future with other materials. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Wed Sep 10 09:36:01 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Another Apple 1 for sale In-Reply-To: <5B835935122FD411845C0800060DDD3901C08B2F@ohm1003a.uk.landisgyr.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Hills, Paul wrote: > I liked the Steve Jobs quote from one of the links off that URL > (http://www.wired.com/news/print/0,1294,20271,00.html)... > > "It's the first Apple I built and sold by Apple," claims auctioneer Risley > Sams, who will open the bidding on Tuesday 29 June at 11 a.m. "We offered it > to Steve Jobs, but he said he had such a hard time selling it in the first > place that he didn't really want it. And actually, the Apple-1 of that auction was not in fact the first. The first was given to Lisa Loop by Woz to use in her classroom. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From teoz at neo.rr.com Wed Sep 10 09:38:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Another Apple 1 for sale References: <002501c37731$a7d89e00$657ca418@neo.rr.com> <3.0.6.32.20030910090215.0079c210@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <004501c377a8$1af85800$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 9:02 AM Subject: Re: Another Apple 1 for sale > At 05:30 AM 9/10/03 -0400, you wrote: > >There are plenty of 1950's era computers which are one-of-a-kind. Sadly, > >many of them went to the scrapper. > > The ironic thing is that the truely one of a kind (or very limited > production) computers aren't very collectable since few people know of > them. I'm sure the people on this list can name lots of computers that were > had less than 200 produced. And none of them would command the kind of > price thaat the Apple I's do. I ran into the same thing when collecting > cars. I have a 1970 Dodge Challanger RT convertible. The Challangers were > only built for 3 years, convertibles only built for 2 years, only 269 RT > convertibles were ever built. It's a LOT rarer than the Mustangs but > everyone knows about the Mustangs and that's what everyone wants so the > Mustangs are worth more than the Challangers. > > Joe > As far as the car goes write and article and try to get it published with pictures of your vehicle (if its mint) and you will generate alot of interest in that model which will drive the value up. Cars are different from most collectibles because you can drive them around where they can be seen and apreciated. Stamps, coins, baseball cards just sit in vaults while computers are locked away in storage or somebodies basement shrine. The older computers tended to intimidate most people while the priceless deusenbergs were always works of art in sheetmetal. From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 10 09:44:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Another Apple 1 for sale Message-ID: >And actually, the Apple-1 of that auction was not in fact the first. The >first was given to Lisa Loop by Woz to use in her classroom. You need to learn to read "marketing speak". They did specify that it was the first built AND SOLD by Apple. If Woz gave away the first built, that doesn't make it the first build AND SOLD. Its all in the twist of marketing :-) (Of course, that doesn't mean I believe it anyway... I've personally come to expect that 90% of what anyone selling an items says is probably BS) -chris From uban at ubanproductions.com Wed Sep 10 09:53:00 2003 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Help with a eprom In-Reply-To: <003501c377a7$24c77100$657ca418@neo.rr.com> References: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD6D5@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20030910094447.0201fe50@mail.ubanproductions.com> I can program that for you. --tom At 10:23 AM 9/10/2003 -0400, you wrote: >Will let you know, hoping to find somebody in the USA >Thanks > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Luc Vande Velde" >To: >Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 7:54 AM >Subject: RE: Help with a eprom > > > > I can program almost anything there is and was to program... > > If nobody closer then me can help you - send me the code > > > > Luc > > Belgium > > > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > > Van: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org > > [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]Namens TeoZ > > Verzonden: dinsdag 9 september 2003 23:59 > > Aan: cctalk@classiccmp.org > > Onderwerp: Help with a eprom > > > > > > Would anybody with an eprom burner be willing to burn a 27c128 rom (I have > > the > > code) to update an apple scsi card rom from revision B to C so it will >work > > with my IIgs? From TRASIOL at cs.com Wed Sep 10 10:23:00 2003 From: TRASIOL at cs.com (TRASIOL@cs.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! Message-ID: <5b.3e0ff9c5.2c9099e6@cs.com> Sellam: I'll bet my last dollar that you've got termites - or maybe they've got you! They love corrugated board and paper. I've had them bore holes right through books, from cover to cover. I suggest you get help!! Art Hill From jwest at classiccmp.org Wed Sep 10 10:26:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:46 2005 Subject: RK05 rails & TU10/TM11/PDP8E References: <200309092003.h89K3G2Z028517@spies.com> Message-ID: <018c01c377ae$a2ea8840$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Al Kossow wrote... >34's use the same Chassis-Trak slides that were used on RK05's. Anyone know the exact model or part number of the Chassis-Trak slides for the RK05 & 11/34? If I have to order them I want to make sure I get the right ones. Also, I was hoping to hook up my TU10 to my 8E. The TU10 I got was (is) hooked up to a TM11 and then to a PDP11. If I want to hook up the TU10 to the 8E (posibus & data break cards I have been told), do any changes have to be made to the TU10 because it was hooked up to a TM11? I have no need for the TM11 if anyone wants it, I have a posibus card but no data break card so I'm looking for the data break card too. Thanks for any advice! Jay West From gksloane at hotmail.com Wed Sep 10 10:28:00 2003 From: gksloane at hotmail.com (Gary Sloane) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: help with corvus concept Message-ID: I am trying (so far in vain) to find keyboards and monitors for a Corvus concept. I have three concepts - but no monitors and only 1 keyboard! Got any ideas where I might look? Got an old one in your garage? Gary Sloane SB/US Engineering Inc. gksloane@hotmail.com _________________________________________________________________ Use custom emotions -- try MSN Messenger 6.0! http://www.msnmessenger-download.com/tracking/reach_emoticon From mikelait at magasec.com Wed Sep 10 10:28:15 2003 From: mikelait at magasec.com (Jim Mikelait) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: image software for 700 Message-ID: <028101c377a4$389d4a40$0600000a@jeff> I got some too. ever find out about the image software? Jim From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Wed Sep 10 10:28:31 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Help with a eprom Message-ID: <030910111412.c536@splab.cas.neu.edu> Yes, I can also do it, either duplicate a current prom, or use a bin or hex file on a PC. Near Boston and Providence Joe Heck From marvin at rain.org Wed Sep 10 10:42:01 2003 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! References: Message-ID: <3F5F445D.BA922317@rain.org> Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > I couldn't see clearly enough what I was looking at because there wasn't > good light between the stacks of boxes, and I was too tired to do much > investigating (this was very late last night). I just used my foot to > smear them into the pavement. But my impression was that they were worms > from the way they moved, though I'm not ruling out the possibility that > they were termites. They sound like subterrainian termites. They have sometimes been described as about the size of a grain of rice, and have "mud" tunnels in the areas they are damaging. In my experience, they will tend to go for the cardboard and softer woods. I had a number of books, magazines, and docs destroyed by them a few years ago. I had a termite inspector come in, and they were all over one side of the house. While the house was also fumigated, some type of chemical was also put onto the ground to discourage them. The best treatment I've heard was to make your house unattractive to them so they will go after your neighbors house :). From teoz at neo.rr.com Wed Sep 10 10:48:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Help with a eprom References: <030910111412.c536@splab.cas.neu.edu> Message-ID: <010001c377b1$e3c410e0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Here is the file, let me know if you can burn it ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 11:14 AM Subject: Re: Help with a eprom > Yes, I can also do it, either duplicate a current prom, or use a bin or > hex file on a PC. Near Boston and Providence > > Joe Heck [demime 1.01a removed an attachment of type application/octet-stream which had a name of scsirevc.bin] From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 10 10:52:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Another Apple 1 for sale In-Reply-To: References: < <5B835935122FD411845C0800060DDD3901C08B2F@ohm1003a.uk.landisgyr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030910113437.007bba80@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 07:31 AM 9/10/03 -0700, you wrote: >On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Hills, Paul wrote: > >> I liked the Steve Jobs quote from one of the links off that URL >> (http://www.wired.com/news/print/0,1294,20271,00.html)... >> >> "It's the first Apple I built and sold by Apple," claims auctioneer Risley >> Sams, who will open the bidding on Tuesday 29 June at 11 a.m. "We offered it >> to Steve Jobs, but he said he had such a hard time selling it in the first >> place that he didn't really want it. > >And actually, the Apple-1 of that auction was not in fact the first. The >first was given to Lisa Loop by Woz to use in her classroom. There's an Apple I circuit board on display at Apple's offices that is supposed to be the first Apple I. Apple says that it is "the original Apple I circuit board." It has the legend "our founder" displayed on the bottom of the display. There's a picture of it at about page 354 in 'Fire in the Valley'. The facing page has a copy of Woz's schematic for the Apple I. Joe > >-- > >Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- >International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > >[ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] >[ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Wed Sep 10 11:10:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <3F5F445D.BA922317@rain.org> Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Marvin Johnston wrote: > They sound like subterrainian termites. They have sometimes been > described as about the size of a grain of rice, and have "mud" tunnels > in the areas they are damaging. YES! Exactly! > In my experience, they will tend to go > for the cardboard and softer woods. I had a number of books, magazines, > and docs destroyed by them a few years ago. I had a termite inspector > come in, and they were all over one side of the house. While the house > was also fumigated, some type of chemical was also put onto the ground > to discourage them. The best treatment I've heard was to make your house > unattractive to them so they will go after your neighbors house :). This is my landlord's problem. I'm sure other businesses in the complex might be having similar problems. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From uban at ubanproductions.com Wed Sep 10 11:18:00 2003 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Help with a eprom In-Reply-To: <010001c377b1$e3c410e0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> References: <030910111412.c536@splab.cas.neu.edu> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20030910110635.01fcaec0@mail.ubanproductions.com> I don't intend to waste time duplicating effort. If someone else has a 27c128 ready to burn, then that will save me hunting through my box of old proms. I know that I have a 27c256 and am guessing that by burning the code into both halves of the 27c256, it will work just fine. TeoZ needs to coordinate this effort a bit... --tom At 11:40 AM 9/10/2003 -0400, you wrote: >Here is the file, let me know if you can burn it > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: >To: >Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 11:14 AM >Subject: Re: Help with a eprom > > > > Yes, I can also do it, either duplicate a current prom, or use a bin or > > hex file on a PC. Near Boston and Providence > > > > Joe Heck > >[demime 1.01a removed an attachment of type application/octet-stream which >had a name of scsirevc.bin] From kth at srv.net Wed Sep 10 11:34:00 2003 From: kth at srv.net (Kevin Handy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: PDP-11/83 Power Supply Wierdness In-Reply-To: <1063154427.6305.2.camel@unix> References: <1062716122.23367.8.camel@unix> <3F58D119.3000704@srv.net> <1063154427.6305.2.camel@unix> Message-ID: <3F5F5B7A.9030707@srv.net> Christopher McNabb wrote: >On Fri, 2003-09-05 at 14:08, Kevin Handy wrote: > > >>Christopher McNabb wrote: >> >> >> >>>My PDP-11/83 has recently (past few weeks) been displaying some odd >>>symptoms. The system is a PDP-11/83 in a "Corporate Cabinet". Most of >>>the time, when the power switch is turned on, the "run", "halt", "ready" >>>lights blink on then go off. Also, the Red light on the TK-50 will come >>>on then go off. You also hear a relay closing and opening in the rack >>>power supply. >>> >>> >>> > >OK, after playing around with it tonight it looks like the problem is in >the on/off switch on the BA-23 box. If I push on the switch REALLY hard >then the system will stay on. If I let the pressure off the switch it >almost immediatly shuts off. > >So, anyone know where I can get a replacement switch? > >Does anyone know how the switch is wired so that I can jumper it should >a replacement not be available? > > > Until you can do a proper repair, I think you can just unplug the connectors on the back of the switch and short them together to have an always-on setup. Make sure to cover them with electrical tape to keep them from shorting to the case. (I think there are only two wires on the switch.) You can then turn on/off the machine at the distributation panel in the bottom of the case (flip the big ganged black switch). The switch should be the same as the one used in the BA23 boxes. There should still be a lot of those boxes around, so someone should have a dead box that they could scrounge a switch for you. Anyone have the proper part number? I'd guess you should still be able to order one from somewhere. Maybe also ask on alt.sys.pdp11. From teoz at neo.rr.com Wed Sep 10 11:37:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Help with a eprom References: <030910111412.c536@splab.cas.neu.edu> <5.2.0.9.0.20030910110635.01fcaec0@mail.ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <02ab01c377b8$a1af1680$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Uban" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 12:10 PM Subject: Re: Help with a eprom > I don't intend to waste time duplicating effort. If someone else > has a 27c128 ready to burn, then that will save me hunting through > my box of old proms. I know that I have a 27c256 and am guessing > that by burning the code into both halves of the 27c256, it will > work just fine. > > TeoZ needs to coordinate this effort a bit... > > --tom > I dont want to waste anybodies time either, I told a few people out of the country that I was looking for somebody in the US since postage is more expensive and shipping takes alot longer. A couple people have replied in the US but havnt heard from anybody that has found the desired chip and can use the file I sent. I have no idea if a 27c256 would work on the old card. From eric at brouhaha.com Wed Sep 10 11:40:00 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2085.64.169.63.74.1063211535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Sellam Ismail wrote: > I just found out that two of my magazine boxes were attacked by some damn > little wormy things. That's part of why I try to store all my stuff in plastic Contico storage containers (available at Costco) rather than boxes. They aren't airtight, but they do make it a little harder for insects to find their way to the paper. I've been told by an archivist that you actually do NOT want to store books and such in an airtight container. They need to breathe. I have no idea why. Eric From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Sep 10 11:41:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <5b.3e0ff9c5.2c9099e6@cs.com> References: <5b.3e0ff9c5.2c9099e6@cs.com> Message-ID: <20030910092539.G22785@newshell.lmi.net> On Wed, 10 Sep 2003 TRASIOL@cs.com wrote: > Sellam: I'll bet my last dollar that you've got termites - or maybe they've > got you! They love corrugated board and paper. I've had them bore holes right > through books, from cover to cover. I suggest you get help!! Art Hill Q: If such a critter were to start at page one of volume 1 of Knuth ("Numerical Algorithms"?) and eat straight through to the last page of volume 3 ("Sorting and Searching"), how far would he go? To simplify the arithmetic, we'll adjust the dimensions and say that each cover is 1/8 inch thick, and the paper of each volume is 1 inch thick. From esharpe at uswest.net Wed Sep 10 11:49:00 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! References: Message-ID: <004601c377c2$9f0e9680$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> there are new bait systems now for treatment, but one wonders if the extermination companies really want to get rid of what they can charge you a yearly maint. contract for. Thanks! Ed Sharpe Archivist for SMECC See the Southwest Museum of Engineering, Communications and Computation online at: http://www.smecc.org ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vintage Computer Festival" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 9:05 AM Subject: Re: Gawd damn bugs! > On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Marvin Johnston wrote: > > > They sound like subterrainian termites. They have sometimes been > > described as about the size of a grain of rice, and have "mud" tunnels > > in the areas they are damaging. > > YES! Exactly! > > > In my experience, they will tend to go > > for the cardboard and softer woods. I had a number of books, magazines, > > and docs destroyed by them a few years ago. I had a termite inspector > > come in, and they were all over one side of the house. While the house > > was also fumigated, some type of chemical was also put onto the ground > > to discourage them. The best treatment I've heard was to make your house > > unattractive to them so they will go after your neighbors house :). > > This is my landlord's problem. I'm sure other businesses in the complex > might be having similar problems. > > -- > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage mputers ] > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Sep 10 12:02:54 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <200309101134.HAA32746@wordstock.com> References: <200309101134.HAA32746@wordstock.com> Message-ID: <20030910094324.D22785@newshell.lmi.net> > It is ironic you posted this message on the anniversary of the first > computer bug... > P.S. For more info check out > http://slashdot.org/articles/03/09/09/1631250.shtml?tid=126&tid=128 On a dial-up line, I do not have the time now to wait for that to finish loading. (It's been at it for a while) If you are referring to the much vaunted Grace Hopper story, it is FAR from being the "FIRST". Much as we like to deify our cultural icons, the amusing entry was NOT the first use of "bug". "Bug" to refer to a glitch was in common usage in Edison's time, and was used for negative things other than insects since before Shakespeare. The infamous log entry was simply saying basically, "Hey! THIS 'bug' was really a real bug!" Humorous, but not historical. It had nothing to do with the ORIGIN of "bug" as a term for a glitch. http://www.maxmon.com/1945ad.htm is one of MANY accounts debunking that particular urban legend. From wpointon at earthlink.net Wed Sep 10 12:17:00 2003 From: wpointon at earthlink.net (william pointon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <20030910092539.G22785@newshell.lmi.net> Message-ID: <65CD2D98-E3B1-11D7-B440-003065ED7126@earthlink.net> On Wednesday, Sep 10, 2003, at 12:31 US/Eastern, Fred Cisin wrote: > Q: If such a critter were to start at page one of volume 1 of Knuth > ("Numerical Algorithms"?) and eat straight through to the last page of > volume 3 ("Sorting and Searching"), how far would he go? To simplify > the > arithmetic, we'll adjust the dimensions and say that each cover is 1/8 > inch thick, and the paper of each volume is 1 inch thick. > easy - assuming normal arrangement of the volumes on a shelf - 1 1/2" - billp From drido at optushome.com.au Wed Sep 10 12:21:00 2003 From: drido at optushome.com.au (Dr. Ido) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: MOS operating System? In-Reply-To: <005301c3743d$796cb3e0$0100a8c0@LANCE> References: Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.20030911030716.012671bc@mail.optushome.com.au> At 04:09 PM 9/6/03 +1000, you wrote: >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Fred N. van Kempen" > >> MOS (also called PC/MOS, and the later PC/MOS-386) were multi-user, >> single-tasking versions of a DOS, more or less compatible with the >> MS- and PC-DOS systems. MOS ran on the larger 286 and 386 systems, >> and DID use their hardware segmentation (286) and protection (386) >> support. > >And bloody difficult to find - been after it for years :-( I have Digital Research Concurrent DOS/386. I've never installed it, but from the .NFO file it sounds like a similar system. From zmerch at 30below.com Wed Sep 10 12:30:00 2003 From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <20030910092539.G22785@newshell.lmi.net> References: <5b.3e0ff9c5.2c9099e6@cs.com> <5b.3e0ff9c5.2c9099e6@cs.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030910131841.025e7e48@mail.30below.com> Rumor has it that Fred Cisin may have mentioned these words: >Q: If such a critter were to start at page one of volume 1 of Knuth >("Numerical Algorithms"?) and eat straight through to the last page of >volume 3 ("Sorting and Searching"), how far would he go? To simplify the >arithmetic, we'll adjust the dimensions and say that each cover is 1/8 >inch thick, and the paper of each volume is 1 inch thick. 1.5 inches... What did I win??? :-P ;-) Laterz, "Merch" -- Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers zmerch@30below.com What do you do when Life gives you lemons, and you don't *like* lemonade????????????? From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Wed Sep 10 12:37:01 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Help with a eprom Message-ID: <030910131558.c536@splab.cas.neu.edu> O.K., I have the bin file in my briefcase. Tonight I will try to burn a 27c128 at home. I have the chips, I just don't know if they are verifiable. I'll post tomorrow. So, nobody else need kill time until I fail. I have 4 programmers, I suspect I won't have a problem, but who knows. Joe Heck From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Wed Sep 10 13:40:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Pro-Log M822A 8080A System Analyzer and PDP/8E Drawings In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030910084212.0079bdb0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030910142607.08e1cac0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> I don't know if I can Joe. Last time I'd tried, your infamous "kill file" prevented me from warning you about a technology request from a country on the Treasury Department's OFAC's Sanctions List that it seemed you might have been about to involve yourself in. http://www.treas.gov/offices/eotffc/ofac/sanctions/t11iran.pdf At 08:42 AM 9/10/03 -0400, you wrote: >I'm intersted in the Pro-Log unit. Can you send me his address? A friend of >mine has one and I narrowly missed one a couple of years ago. > > > Joe > >At 10:45 PM 9/9/03 -0400, you wrote: > >Hello 8080 and 8080A and DEC PDP/8E fans, > > > > > >I bought some stuff from a guy just north of Sacramento, and he had > >a couple of other things for sale that I didn't need, but some of you might > >want. He had sent me pictures, so I uploaded them for viewing. > > > > > >Pro-Log M822A 8080A System Analyzer ... he had said he only wanted $25.00 > >for this > >8.5" x 11" x 2" > >will work for the 8080 and the 8080A > >clips over 8080A CPU chip and is used for > >debuging programs and hardware system design > >8080A first process authorized for military applications > >8080 ... Altair, IMSAI, SOL, Poly88 > > > >http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze2mj6m/pics/Z_Pro-Log_System_Analyzer_02 >0.jpg > > > > > >Original PDP8/E Computer Engineering Drawings ... he had said he wanted > >$50.00 for these > > > >http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze2mj6m/pics/DEC_PDP8-E_Computer_Engineer >ing_Drawings_024.jpg > > > > > >If anyone wants either of these, send me an email and I will forward it on > >to him. > >I will not be involved past that point, and accept no responsibility for > >the outcome. > > > > > >Best Regards From patrick at evocative.com Wed Sep 10 13:58:00 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030910131841.025e7e48@mail.30below.com> Message-ID: > each volume is 1 inch thick. :-) From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Sep 10 14:03:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030910131841.025e7e48@mail.30below.com> References: <5b.3e0ff9c5.2c9099e6@cs.com> <5b.3e0ff9c5.2c9099e6@cs.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030910131841.025e7e48@mail.30below.com> Message-ID: <20030910114702.G28032@newshell.lmi.net> > >Q: If such a critter were to start at page one of volume 1 of Knuth > >("Numerical Algorithms"?) and eat straight through to the last page of > >volume 3 ("Sorting and Searching"), how far would he go? To simplify the > >arithmetic, we'll adjust the dimensions and say that each cover is 1/8 > >inch thick, and the paper of each volume is 1 inch thick. On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Roger Merchberger wrote: > 1.5 inches... > What did I win??? :-P ;-) NOT my copy of Knuth. I still have a LONG way to go before I get to the end of Sorting and Searching. If you make it to VCF, see me, and I'll probably have some stuff to part with. Hmmmm. maybe it's a trick question: 1) NO living being can go "straight through" Knuth! (information density is pretty high) 2) How often are the 3 volumes sitting on the shelf together? From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Sep 10 14:04:00 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > I just found out that two of my magazine boxes were attacked by some > damn little wormy things. They were white and about a quarter inch in > length. They'd come up through a crack in the foundation of my warehouse > and started eating away at the file boxes. Fortunately, they seemed to > like the cardboard way more than the magazines, though they did take out > significant chunks of a couple issues of Kilobaud Computing from 1979 > (bastards!) They also left a lot of wormy poop behind, and unless I'm > smelling the acid from the paper breaking down, they left a stink too. > > Damn punk-ass bitch wormy things. > > Has anyone else had issues like this? How did these fuckers find my > boxes out of all the damn cracks they could have crawled out of? What > are they? Termites? > > Now I have to waste time filling in the cracks so this doesn't happen > again. I can't have gawd damn wormy things eating my damn computer > stuff! Ouch, termites... I've had problems with some little silver looking bugs I was told were 'silverfish'. They eat *anything* that is paper, including but not limited to; boxes, notebooks, and even the paper labels on pc boards and ICs! I'd love to know of a way to get rid of them, but since my garage is not 100% sealed, I dunno how effective anything would be. -Toth From teoz at neo.rr.com Wed Sep 10 14:15:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! References: Message-ID: <002f01c377ce$b3cc8800$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tothwolf" To: "Classic Computers Mailing List" Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 3:14 PM Subject: Re: Gawd damn bugs! > On Tue, 9 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > > I just found out that two of my magazine boxes were attacked by some > > damn little wormy things. They were white and about a quarter inch in > > length. They'd come up through a crack in the foundation of my warehouse > > and started eating away at the file boxes. Fortunately, they seemed to > > like the cardboard way more than the magazines, though they did take out > > significant chunks of a couple issues of Kilobaud Computing from 1979 > > (bastards!) They also left a lot of wormy poop behind, and unless I'm > > smelling the acid from the paper breaking down, they left a stink too. > > > > Damn punk-ass bitch wormy things. > > > > Has anyone else had issues like this? How did these fuckers find my > > boxes out of all the damn cracks they could have crawled out of? What > > are they? Termites? > > > > Now I have to waste time filling in the cracks so this doesn't happen > > again. I can't have gawd damn wormy things eating my damn computer > > stuff! > > Ouch, termites... > > I've had problems with some little silver looking bugs I was told were > 'silverfish'. They eat *anything* that is paper, including but not limited > to; boxes, notebooks, and even the paper labels on pc boards and ICs! I'd > love to know of a way to get rid of them, but since my garage is not 100% > sealed, I dunno how effective anything would be. > > -Toth I am sure there are alot of chemicals made from natural material that keep bugs away (like citronella candles keep insects away at outdoor parties. From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Sep 10 14:18:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030910120452.N28032@newshell.lmi.net> On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Patrick Rigney wrote: > > each volume is 1 inch thick. > :-) Actually, what I had said was: > To simplify the arithmetic, we'll adjust the dimensions and say that > each cover is 1/8 inch thick, and the paper of each volume is 1 inch > thick. Which is not THAT far off for the earlier editions. The second edition (copyright 1973) is less than 1.5" thick, INCLUDING covers for "Fundamental Algorithms" (the correct title for the first volume) From dogas at bellsouth.net Wed Sep 10 14:26:01 2003 From: dogas at bellsouth.net (Mike) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: bugs! References: <65CD2D98-E3B1-11D7-B440-003065ED7126@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <003001c377ce$cd6a9b30$7edb3fd0@DOMAIN> From: william pointon > > > Q: If such a critter were to start at page one of volume 1 of Knuth > > ("Numerical Algorithms"?) and eat straight through to the last page of > > volume 3 ("Sorting and Searching"), how far would he go? To simplify > > the > > arithmetic, we'll adjust the dimensions and say that each cover is 1/8 > > inch thick, and the paper of each volume is 1 inch thick. > > > 3 + 5/8 if you're going to start inside V1 and they're all 1" thick and 5 covers to go through. But V3, the only one I have, is at least 1.5" by itself. Maybe indeed reincarnation is the true cosmology and what Sallam encountered some early pioneer catching up on some great reading. Karma would seem to indicate some early IBMer. :) - Mike: dogas@bellsouth.net From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 10 14:35:01 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: bugs! Message-ID: >3 + 5/8 if you're going to start inside V1 and they're all 1" thick and 5 >covers to go through. wouldn't it be 3.5 inches? Starts page 1 vol 1, ends last page vol 3, so that's only 4 covers to go thru (back of vol 1, front of vol 2, back of vol 2, front vol 3). So that's 3 books of pages at 1 inch per book, 3 * 1 = 3 4 covers at 1/8 per cover is 4 * 1/8 = 4/8 = 1/2 3 inches of text + 1/2 inch of covers = 3.5 inches that the worm travels. -chris From waltje at pdp11.nl Wed Sep 10 14:46:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: DPMI, Multiuser DOS, etc (was: Re: MOS operating System?) In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20030911030716.012671bc@mail.optushome.com.au> Message-ID: > >> MOS (also called PC/MOS, and the later PC/MOS-386) were multi-user, > >> single-tasking versions of a DOS, more or less compatible with the > >> MS- and PC-DOS systems. MOS ran on the larger 286 and 386 systems, > >> and DID use their hardware segmentation (286) and protection (386) > >> support. > > > >And bloody difficult to find - been after it for years :-( > > I have Digital Research Concurrent DOS/386. I've never installed it, but > from the .NFO file it sounds like a similar system. Which reminds me. I am still looking for a copy of 386MAX, or anything like it... it's a 32-bit DPMI memory manager for DOS systems. If anyone here has it, please.. contact me offline! Thanks, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From dittman at dittman.net Wed Sep 10 14:48:00 2003 From: dittman at dittman.net (Eric Dittman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: bugs! In-Reply-To: <003001c377ce$cd6a9b30$7edb3fd0@DOMAIN> from "Mike" at Sep 10, 2003 03:07:37 PM Message-ID: <20030910194056.D97E97F83@dittman.net> > > > Q: If such a critter were to start at page one of volume 1 of Knuth > > > ("Numerical Algorithms"?) and eat straight through to the last page of > > > volume 3 ("Sorting and Searching"), how far would he go? To simplify > > > the > > > arithmetic, we'll adjust the dimensions and say that each cover is 1/8 > > > inch thick, and the paper of each volume is 1 inch thick. > > 3 + 5/8 if you're going to start inside V1 and they're all 1" thick and 5 > covers to go through. But V3, the only one I have, is at least 1.5" by > itself. Maybe indeed reincarnation is the true cosmology and what Sallam > encountered some early pioneer catching up on some great reading. Karma > would seem to indicate some early IBMer. What you need to remember is that page one of volume 1 is on the side next to volume 2, and the last page of volume 3 is also next to volume 2 when books are normally stored in order from left to right: Vol. 1 Vol. 2 Vol. 3 ||xxxxxx||||xxxxxx||||xxxxxx|| A B || are the covers (1/8" thick) and xxxxxx are the pages (1" thick). A is page 1 of volume 1, and B is the last page of volume 3. That gives four covers and all the pages in volume 2 to eat through: 4x(.125)+1=1.5 -- Eric Dittman dittman@dittman.net From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Sep 10 14:53:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: bugs! In-Reply-To: <003001c377ce$cd6a9b30$7edb3fd0@DOMAIN> References: <65CD2D98-E3B1-11D7-B440-003065ED7126@earthlink.net> <003001c377ce$cd6a9b30$7edb3fd0@DOMAIN> Message-ID: <20030910123432.N28032@newshell.lmi.net> > > > Q: If such a critter were to start at page one of volume 1 of Knuth > > > ("Numerical Algorithms"?) and eat straight through to the last page of > > > volume 3 ("Sorting and Searching"), how far would he go? To simplify > > > the > > > arithmetic, we'll adjust the dimensions and say that each cover is 1/8 > > > inch thick, and the paper of each volume is 1 inch thick. On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Mike wrote: > 3 + 5/8 if you're going to start inside V1 and they're all 1" thick and 5 > covers to go through. But V3, the only one I have, is at least 1.5" by > itself. Maybe indeed reincarnation is the true cosmology and what Sallam > encountered some early pioneer catching up on some great reading. Karma > would seem to indicate some early IBMer. How did you get FIVE covers?? Actually, if you look carefully at how the boks are [normally] placed on a shelf, page one of volume one ends up at the RIGHT HAND SIDE of the volume! Therefore, the bug only needs to go through the cover to get out of volume one and start on volume two. (We shall ignore the fact that there are prefaces, title pages, etc. betwwen pagone and the "front" cover (which is at the RIGHT hand side when on the shelf). So far, 1/8". Then we have both covers and the full contents of volume two. So far, 1 3/8". Then, notice that the "normal" shelving of books would place the LAST page, and back cover of volume three at the LEFT side, resulting in only 1/8" to travel to get to the last page of volume three when entering from the left. Thus, the total distance (IFF we assume canonical shelving) would be 4 covers and one book, for a grand total of 1.5". The later editions are indeed thicker than the earlier ones, but the alteration of the dimensions was explicitly stated - for the purpose of simplifying the arithmetic. From Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com Wed Sep 10 14:53:08 2003 From: Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com (Feldman, Robert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: bugs! Message-ID: No, because as William said "assuming normal arrangement of the volumes on a shelf", volume 1 is to the left of Volume 2, which is left of Volume 3. So only the front cover of Volume 1, all of Volume 2, and the back cover of Volume 3 need be traversed. -----Original Message----- From: chris [mailto:cb@mythtech.net] Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 2:27 PM To: Classic Computer Subject: Re: bugs! >3 + 5/8 if you're going to start inside V1 and they're all 1" thick and 5 >covers to go through. wouldn't it be 3.5 inches? Starts page 1 vol 1, ends last page vol 3, so that's only 4 covers to go thru (back of vol 1, front of vol 2, back of vol 2, front vol 3). So that's 3 books of pages at 1 inch per book, 3 * 1 = 3 4 covers at 1/8 per cover is 4 * 1/8 = 4/8 = 1/2 3 inches of text + 1/2 inch of covers = 3.5 inches that the worm travels. -chris From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 10 14:58:01 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: bugs! Message-ID: >No, because as William said "assuming normal arrangement of the volumes on >a shelf", volume 1 is to the left of Volume 2, which is left of Volume 3. >So only the front cover of Volume 1, all of Volume 2, and the back cover >of Volume 3 need be traversed. Yeah, as soon as I read his post, I slapped my forehead for having over looked that fact. -chris From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 10 15:00:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <20030910092539.G22785@newshell.lmi.net> References: <5b.3e0ff9c5.2c9099e6@cs.com> <5b.3e0ff9c5.2c9099e6@cs.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030910153453.007d6100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I don't know how far they'd get in Knuth's books but they will completely riddle a 2" x 4" and I have 1/2" thick computer manuals that they've gone all the way through. In fact the manuals were probably stacked up so they most likely went a lot further than 1/2". (It happened before I got them.) FWIW my sister's house was recently found to be infested along one wall. The house is about 18" off the ground. The termites built a mud tunnel up the supporting blocks and then got into the floor, one wall and INTO THE ROOF! They had to replace a large part of the floor, one wall and a large portion of the roof trusses. As long as termites can built a wood or mud tunnel that connects them to the ground they can keep going. Joe from Florida, the bug capital of the world! At 09:31 AM 9/10/03 -0700, you wrote: >On Wed, 10 Sep 2003 TRASIOL@cs.com wrote: >> Sellam: I'll bet my last dollar that you've got termites - or maybe they've >> got you! They love corrugated board and paper. I've had them bore holes right >> through books, from cover to cover. I suggest you get help!! Art Hill > >Q: If such a critter were to start at page one of volume 1 of Knuth >("Numerical Algorithms"?) and eat straight through to the last page of >volume 3 ("Sorting and Searching"), how far would he go? To simplify the >arithmetic, we'll adjust the dimensions and say that each cover is 1/8 >inch thick, and the paper of each volume is 1 inch thick. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 10 15:00:05 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Help with a eprom In-Reply-To: <02ab01c377b8$a1af1680$657ca418@neo.rr.com> References: <030910111412.c536@splab.cas.neu.edu> <5.2.0.9.0.20030910110635.01fcaec0@mail.ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030910153800.007d9100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I have a GOOD stock of 27128s. I can attempt to burn the EPROM or I can send someone else a couple of EPROMs if they want to do it. However there's a big hamfest coming up this weekend so I won't have time to do anything before next week. Where are you at TeoZ? Joe At 12:28 PM 9/10/03 -0400, you wrote: >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Tom Uban" >To: >Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 12:10 PM >Subject: Re: Help with a eprom > > >> I don't intend to waste time duplicating effort. If someone else >> has a 27c128 ready to burn, then that will save me hunting through >> my box of old proms. I know that I have a 27c256 and am guessing >> that by burning the code into both halves of the 27c256, it will >> work just fine. >> >> TeoZ needs to coordinate this effort a bit... >> >> --tom >> >I dont want to waste anybodies time either, I told a few people out of the >country that I was looking for somebody in the US since postage is more >expensive and shipping takes alot longer. A couple people have replied in >the US but havnt heard from anybody that has found the desired chip and can >use the file I sent. I have no idea if a 27c256 would work on the old card. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 10 15:00:10 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <004601c377c2$9f0e9680$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> References: Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030910154158.007bd7c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I have a couple of close friends in the exterminating business. Let me tell you, there's NOTHING that's truely effective on termites anymore since the EPA took Clorodane off the market. The replacement chemicals costs over $80/gallon (wholesale!) and you have to use it full strength instead of dilluting it. Even then it is marginal and the area has to be retreated every two years. Score another success for the bugs and the EPA! Joe At 10:40 AM 9/10/03 -0700, you wrote: >there are new bait systems now for treatment, but one wonders if the >extermination companies really want to get rid of what they can charge you a >yearly maint. contract for. > >Thanks! > >Ed Sharpe Archivist for SMECC > >See the Southwest Museum of Engineering, Communications and Computation >online at: >http://www.smecc.org >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Vintage Computer Festival" >To: >Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 9:05 AM >Subject: Re: Gawd damn bugs! > > >> On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Marvin Johnston wrote: >> >> > They sound like subterrainian termites. They have sometimes been >> > described as about the size of a grain of rice, and have "mud" tunnels >> > in the areas they are damaging. >> >> YES! Exactly! >> >> > In my experience, they will tend to go >> > for the cardboard and softer woods. I had a number of books, magazines, >> > and docs destroyed by them a few years ago. I had a termite inspector >> > come in, and they were all over one side of the house. While the house >> > was also fumigated, some type of chemical was also put onto the ground >> > to discourage them. The best treatment I've heard was to make your house >> > unattractive to them so they will go after your neighbors house :). >> >> This is my landlord's problem. I'm sure other businesses in the complex >> might be having similar problems. >> >> -- >> >> Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer >Festival >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------- >---- >> International Man of Intrigue and Danger >http://www.vintage.org >> >> [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage >mputers ] >> [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at >http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From patrick at evocative.com Wed Sep 10 15:00:14 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:47 2005 Subject: Vintage Computer Marketplace gets WIRED! Message-ID: Our first mention: http://wired.com/news/culture/0,1284,60349,00.html Thanks to everyone for your support! --Patrick From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 10 15:02:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <002f01c377ce$b3cc8800$657ca418@neo.rr.com> References: Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030910155400.007dc9b0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 03:06 PM 9/10/03 -0400, you wrote: >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Tothwolf" >To: "Classic Computers Mailing List" >Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 3:14 PM >Subject: Re: Gawd damn bugs! > > >> On Tue, 9 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: >> >> > I just found out that two of my magazine boxes were attacked by some >> > damn little wormy things. They were white and about a quarter inch in >> > length. They'd come up through a crack in the foundation of my warehouse >> > and started eating away at the file boxes. Fortunately, they seemed to >> > like the cardboard way more than the magazines, though they did take out >> > significant chunks of a couple issues of Kilobaud Computing from 1979 >> > (bastards!) They also left a lot of wormy poop behind, and unless I'm >> > smelling the acid from the paper breaking down, they left a stink too. >> > >> > Damn punk-ass bitch wormy things. >> > >> > Has anyone else had issues like this? How did these fuckers find my >> > boxes out of all the damn cracks they could have crawled out of? What >> > are they? Termites? >> > >> > Now I have to waste time filling in the cracks so this doesn't happen >> > again. I can't have gawd damn wormy things eating my damn computer >> > stuff! >> >> Ouch, termites... >> >> I've had problems with some little silver looking bugs I was told were >> 'silverfish'. They eat *anything* that is paper, including but not limited >> to; boxes, notebooks, and even the paper labels on pc boards and ICs! I'd >> love to know of a way to get rid of them, but since my garage is not 100% >> sealed, I dunno how effective anything would be. >> >> -Toth > >I am sure there are alot of chemicals made from natural material that keep >bugs away (like citronella candles keep insects away at outdoor parties. > Ha!, ha!, ha!, ha! You want to come down here to Florida and prove it? I have Citronella plants growing all around my house and they don't even slow the bugs down. ditto marigolds, penny royal, etc. Furthermore the termites only live in the ground or inside of mud tunnels that connect to the ground. The only way to kill them is to saturate the ground with pesticide BEFORE you built on it. You can built an airtight tent over a house and fumigate it but that will only kill the bugs that are in the house (and not even all of them). It won't touch the ones that in still in the ground. As if things weren't bad enough, there's a new termite here in Florida that I've been told came from Formosa. It can actually chew through concrete to get to wood! Joe From geneb at deltasoft.com Wed Sep 10 15:10:01 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: DPMI, Multiuser DOS, etc (was: Re: MOS operating System?) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > >And bloody difficult to find - been after it for years :-( > > > > I have Digital Research Concurrent DOS/386. I've never installed it, but > > from the .NFO file it sounds like a similar system. > Which reminds me. I am still looking for a copy of 386MAX, or > anything like it... it's a 32-bit DPMI memory manager for DOS > systems. > > If anyone here has it, please.. contact me offline! > Would QEMM work? g. From wpointon at earthlink.net Wed Sep 10 15:11:00 2003 From: wpointon at earthlink.net (william pointon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: bugs! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wednesday, Sep 10, 2003, at 15:26 US/Eastern, chris wrote: >> 3 + 5/8 if you're going to start inside V1 and they're all 1" thick >> and 5 >> covers to go through. > > wouldn't it be 3.5 inches? Starts page 1 vol 1, ends last page vol 3, > so > that's only 4 covers to go thru (back of vol 1, front of vol 2, back of > vol 2, front vol 3). > > So that's 3 books of pages at 1 inch per book, 3 * 1 = 3 > 4 covers at 1/8 per cover is 4 * 1/8 = 4/8 = 1/2 > > 3 inches of text + 1/2 inch of covers = 3.5 inches that the worm > travels. > > -chris > > > if the books are in normal array on a shelf: back cover of vol1 | last page of vol1 | vol1 | START = 1st page of vol1 -> front cover of vol1 -> back cover of vol2 -> vol2 -> front cover of vol2 -> back cover of vol3 -> last page of vol3 = END | vol3 | front cover of vol3 ----- so 4 covers and i volume for the journey - billp From allain at panix.com Wed Sep 10 15:23:01 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: bugs! References: <20030910194056.D97E97F83@dittman.net> Message-ID: <008001c377d7$d75d5d40$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Surely better uses of Knuth remain today. John A. From aek at spies.com Wed Sep 10 15:32:00 2003 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: bugs! Message-ID: <200309102024.h8AKOvW0014646@spies.com> > Surely better uses of Knuth remain today. He plays piano pretty well. From waltje at pdp11.nl Wed Sep 10 15:35:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: DPMI, Multiuser DOS, etc (was: Re: MOS operating System?) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Gene Buckle wrote: > > If anyone here has it, please.. contact me offline! > > > > Would QEMM work? Most probably... I have a program that either requires no "emm386" be present (so it can handle that stuff itself), or one that does full DPMI (32-bit) so it can use that... from what I have been told, that means something like 386MAX, or QEMM, or something to that liking.... Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Sep 10 16:56:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: bugs! In-Reply-To: <008001c377d7$d75d5d40$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> References: <20030910194056.D97E97F83@dittman.net> <008001c377d7$d75d5d40$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <20030910144447.Q31431@newshell.lmi.net> On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, John Allain wrote: > Surely better uses of Knuth remain today. > John A. > This has been a hypothetical question. No actual copies of Knuth were damaged in its production. From dogas at bellsouth.net Wed Sep 10 19:48:00 2003 From: dogas at bellsouth.net (Mike) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: bugs! References: <20030910194056.D97E97F83@dittman.net> <008001c377d7$d75d5d40$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <001801c377fb$c6c59500$dc881442@DOMAIN> 1.5... ;) Must cut down on the crack... I came across two CC references to Knuth's series lately. 1) 'Bill Gates Speaks Out' Janet Lowe somewhere talked about early programmer position considerations being positively slanted to candidates who have been through the series, as Bill himself has been and 2) in 'Accidential Empires', Robert Cringely tells about Knuth deciding to take a 'little' time out to invent TeX so that digitally published Vol 3 would look as good as linotyped Vol 1. Still looking for Vol 1 and 2 here. ;) - Mike: dogas@bellsouth.net From dogas at bellsouth.net Wed Sep 10 19:50:01 2003 From: dogas at bellsouth.net (Mike) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: bugs! References: <20030910194056.D97E97F83@dittman.net> <008001c377d7$d75d5d40$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> <20030910144447.Q31431@newshell.lmi.net> Message-ID: <002201c377fc$1030e690$dc881442@DOMAIN> 'Bill Gates Speaks' Janet Lowe should have been the first reference in last msg. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 10 19:56:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: FA: HEWLETT-PACKARD 1000 E-SERIES COMPUTER(2720) Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030910204730.007aec90@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Spotted on E-bay Joe From vance at neurotica.com Wed Sep 10 19:59:00 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Another Apple 1 for sale In-Reply-To: <004501c377a8$1af85800$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, TeoZ wrote: > Cars are different from most collectibles because you can drive them > around where they can be seen and apreciated. Stamps, coins, baseball > cards just sit in vaults while computers are locked away in storage or > somebodies basement shrine. The older computers tended to intimidate > most people while the priceless deusenbergs were always works of art in > sheetmetal. I think S/360's are works of art. I think the Cray 1 is a work of art. There are plenty who would agree with me. Peace... Sridhar From blstuart at bellsouth.net Wed Sep 10 20:40:00 2003 From: blstuart at bellsouth.net (Brian L. Stuart) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: YADA10YR (Yet Another Discussion About the 10 Year Rule) Message-ID: <3F5FC1AC.2BB87248@bellsouth.net> On Thu, 4 Sep 2003 Tony Duell wrote: > And of course the Sequent machines that were boxes of 386s running in > parallel IIRC. That's right. Their symmetry series were 386 based and the earlier balance series were based on the 32016 (or maybe the 32032). I'm not sure if there were any other OSs, but the ones we had at Purdue ran Dynix, their version of UNIX for these parallel machines. Now if I could just find one for my collection... Brian L. Stuart From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Sep 10 20:47:00 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030910154158.007bd7c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <3.0.6.32.20030910154158.007bd7c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: > I have a couple of close friends in the exterminating business. Let me > tell you, there's NOTHING that's truely effective on termites anymore > since the EPA took Clorodane off the market. The replacement chemicals > costs over $80/gallon (wholesale!) and you have to use it full strength > instead of dilluting it. Even then it is marginal and the area has to be > retreated every two years. > > Score another success for the bugs and the EPA! And the lumber industry...gotta keep us buying more wood... Maybe the lumber industry paid for the EPA studies? ;) I think my next home will be made of concrete block. -Toth From teoz at neo.rr.com Wed Sep 10 20:56:01 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! References: <3.0.6.32.20030910154158.007bd7c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <005a01c37806$d1a82360$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tothwolf" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 9:58 PM Subject: Re: Gawd damn bugs! > On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: > > > I have a couple of close friends in the exterminating business. Let me > > tell you, there's NOTHING that's truely effective on termites anymore > > since the EPA took Clorodane off the market. The replacement chemicals > > costs over $80/gallon (wholesale!) and you have to use it full strength > > instead of dilluting it. Even then it is marginal and the area has to be > > retreated every two years. > > > > Score another success for the bugs and the EPA! > > And the lumber industry...gotta keep us buying more wood... Maybe the > lumber industry paid for the EPA studies? ;) > > I think my next home will be made of concrete block. > > -Toth Dont worry when the fire ants make it to your side of the country you wont be worried about termites anymore. From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Wed Sep 10 22:34:00 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Help with a eprom Message-ID: <030910231947.c71d@splab.cas.neu.edu> Eprom is all done. I burned two of them onto TMS27c128 28 pin chips. verified fine. Just need a ship to address. Joe Heck (trash3 at splab . cas . neu . edu) From vcf at siconic.com Wed Sep 10 23:09:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <2085.64.169.63.74.1063211535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Eric Smith wrote: > That's part of why I try to store all my stuff in plastic Contico storage > containers (available at Costco) rather than boxes. They aren't airtight, > but they do make it a little harder for insects to find their way to the > paper. Speaking of which, I'm finally going to byte the bullet and take long since administered advice from Frank McConnell to go this route. I discovered that Orchard Supply Hardware will negotiate bulk sales of these things if you're a business, so I'm going to purchase a minimum of 50 (perhaps as many as 100) to start storing all my kak. > I've been told by an archivist that you actually do NOT want to store > books and such in an airtight container. They need to breathe. I have > no idea why. All my books and magazines and manuals and software are finally going up on my nice bookshelves. Pictures forthcoming once the transformation has reached a satisfactory stage for public exposure. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Wed Sep 10 23:13:01 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Tothwolf wrote: > I've had problems with some little silver looking bugs I was told were > 'silverfish'. They eat *anything* that is paper, including but not limited > to; boxes, notebooks, and even the paper labels on pc boards and ICs! I'd > love to know of a way to get rid of them, but since my garage is not 100% > sealed, I dunno how effective anything would be. Yeah, I saw one of those bastards roaming around my office as well, but I don't think I successfully smushed it. I've heard that they eat paper too but I haven't seen any damage in particular that I can attribute to one (or a colony) of them. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Wed Sep 10 23:15:01 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: bugs! In-Reply-To: <003001c377ce$cd6a9b30$7edb3fd0@DOMAIN> Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Mike wrote: > 3 + 5/8 if you're going to start inside V1 and they're all 1" thick and 5 > covers to go through. But V3, the only one I have, is at least 1.5" by > itself. Maybe indeed reincarnation is the true cosmology and what Sallam > encountered some early pioneer catching up on some great reading. Karma > would seem to indicate some early IBMer. Whoever he is, he likes to eat rather than read. He needs to get the hell out of my warehouse and go find a Burger King or something. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From llyon at commodore.thebbs.org Thu Sep 11 01:11:01 2003 From: llyon at commodore.thebbs.org (Lance Lyon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: MOS operating System? References: <3.0.6.32.20030910085322.009076f0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <014801c3782a$65c7d360$0100a8c0@LANCE> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 10:53 PM Subject: Re: MOS operating System? > I know where there's a new sealed box of MOS. Do you want it? Please! cheers, Lance From esharpe at uswest.net Thu Sep 11 01:14:00 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (ed sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! References: Message-ID: <016701c3782a$c45043e0$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> silver fish enjoy moist air..... anything that is incoming here at the museum gets either bagged and fumed or is set out in the 115 degree heat. either way kills the little bastards, Thanks Ed Sharpe archivist for SMECC Please check our web site at http://www.smecc.org to see other engineering fields, communications and computation stuff we buy, and by all means when in Arizona drop in and see us. address: coury house / smecc 5802 w palmaire ave glendale az 85301 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vintage Computer Festival" To: "Classic Computers Mailing List" Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 1:08 PM Subject: Re: Gawd damn bugs! > On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Tothwolf wrote: > > > I've had problems with some little silver looking bugs I was told were > > 'silverfish'. They eat *anything* that is paper, including but not limited > > to; boxes, notebooks, and even the paper labels on pc boards and ICs! I'd > > love to know of a way to get rid of them, but since my garage is not 100% > > sealed, I dunno how effective anything would be. > > Yeah, I saw one of those bastards roaming around my office as well, but I > don't think I successfully smushed it. I've heard that they eat paper too > but I haven't seen any damage in particular that I can attribute to one > (or a colony) of them. > > -- > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage mputers ] > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From llyon at commodore.thebbs.org Thu Sep 11 01:26:00 2003 From: llyon at commodore.thebbs.org (Lance Lyon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: MOS operating System? References: <3.0.3.32.20030911030716.012671bc@mail.optushome.com.au> Message-ID: <013401c3782a$53f68410$0100a8c0@LANCE> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dr. Ido" To: Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2003 2:07 AM Subject: Re: MOS operating System? > I have Digital Research Concurrent DOS/386. I've never installed it, but > from the .NFO file it sounds like a similar system. Any chance of getting a copy ? cheers, Lance From nico at farumdata.dk Thu Sep 11 03:54:00 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Clean-up Message-ID: <000f01c37840$90991f20$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> I have now finished my annual stocktaking, and the following obsolete/surplus items have popped up. It would be appreciated if they could be used in restoration projects, as long as my P&P is covered. Postage from Denmark depends on weight and/or size, so please ask first. A very short description is included, but you can mail me directly at nico@farumdata.dk for more info (1) Qualstar 1052 R/W formatter. 1 new, 1 slightly used (2) SMS SCSI controllers. 5x SMS-512, 8x SMS-7250. The 512 is an 8-bit ISA controller, talking to the 7250 which can address 4x floppy disc and 7 50-pin SCSI devices. (3) Digital 8-bit net adapter, FCC-id AO9-DE100 (4) 2x IBM adapters as described in an earlier message. 9-pin output, probably network adapters. Marked 16/4 on a green sticker with white border. (5) 1x MFM disccontroller, 2x HD Nico From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Sep 11 07:52:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: MOS operating System? In-Reply-To: <014801c3782a$65c7d360$0100a8c0@LANCE> References: <3.0.6.32.20030910085322.009076f0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030911083819.007d1470@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> OK I'll pick it up tomorrow if it's still there. (I expect that it is). Shoot me your address and I'll let you know how much postage is. Joe At 04:03 PM 9/11/03 +1000, you wrote: >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Joe" >To: >Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 10:53 PM >Subject: Re: MOS operating System? > > >> I know where there's a new sealed box of MOS. Do you want it? > >Please! > >cheers, > >Lance From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Sep 11 07:53:25 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <005a01c37806$d1a82360$657ca418@neo.rr.com> References: <3.0.6.32.20030910154158.007bd7c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030911083554.007ac550@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 09:48 PM 9/10/03 -0400, you wrote: >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Tothwolf" >To: >Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 9:58 PM >Subject: Re: Gawd damn bugs! > > >> On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: >> >> > I have a couple of close friends in the exterminating business. Let me >> > tell you, there's NOTHING that's truely effective on termites anymore >> > since the EPA took Clorodane off the market. The replacement chemicals >> > costs over $80/gallon (wholesale!) and you have to use it full strength >> > instead of dilluting it. Even then it is marginal and the area has to be >> > retreated every two years. >> > >> > Score another success for the bugs and the EPA! >> >> And the lumber industry...gotta keep us buying more wood... Maybe the >> lumber industry paid for the EPA studies? ;) >> >> I think my next home will be made of concrete block. >> >> -Toth > >Dont worry when the fire ants make it to your side of the country you wont >be worried about termites anymore. What do mean "when"? They've been here since the 60s at least. I gotta say they sure named 'em right! Just step on a nest of them if you don't know what I mean! We're just waiting for the killer bees now. We've had a few colonies of them but so far they've managed to wipe them out as they appeared. And don't forget the Mediterrranian Fruit Flies and all the other "interesting" bugs that are appearing everyday. Joe From waltje at pdp11.nl Thu Sep 11 07:55:01 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Sudden death in the family :( In-Reply-To: <000f01c37840$90991f20$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: Hi all, Today is a sad day. For obvious reasons, it already was (no, let us NOT start that topic [again] .. tis a sad day, period), but now it's even more so. I just powered up a friend's PDP-11/53, which had been sitting in my living room for, er, quite a while, and... nada. Fans dont start up, not the usual racket when one powers up a BA23. The light in the power switch turns on, though. I can hear a very soft "tick-tick, tick-tick" sound in the power supply, and I do see how the fans get started, but very quickly die down. Likewise, I see several LED's very briefly turn on, and then die off again. So.. looks like the power supply died on me, just while sitting there. Is this a "known symptom" with the BA23 power supplies? It's a newer one, with the colored wires. If anyone near me has a spare BA23 they'd be willing to part from, or at least the power supply, that would be heaven... my friend's gonna have my liver for lunch for nuking his system.... Cheers, sortof, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From llyon at commodore.thebbs.org Thu Sep 11 08:02:00 2003 From: llyon at commodore.thebbs.org (Lance Lyon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: MOS operating System? References: <3.0.6.32.20030910085322.009076f0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <3.0.6.32.20030911083819.007d1470@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <022001c37863$c2269630$0100a8c0@LANCE> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe" To: Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2003 10:38 PM Subject: Re: MOS operating System? > OK I'll pick it up tomorrow if it's still there. (I expect that it is). > Shoot me your address and I'll let you know how much postage is. 4 Pioneer St Bathurst NSW 2795 Australia From waltje at pdp11.nl Thu Sep 11 08:03:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030911083554.007ac550@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 11 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: > bug reports [CC style] Worms, termites, fire ants, crawling gizmos.... gawd, when will the Americans learn that a house'd be better built on top of a concrete slab, or concrete foundation, and then built up with stone? SIWWY MEWICANS ! There. Yes. My place in the U.S. is also being crawled upon. Which is why we're going to take it down, and rebuild Dutch-style.... ["concrete inside, do not bite"] Cheers, Fred (bugfree, esp. after showering) -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From gmanuel at gmconsulting.net Thu Sep 11 08:31:01 2003 From: gmanuel at gmconsulting.net (G Manuel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: MOS operating System? In-Reply-To: <005301c3743d$796cb3e0$0100a8c0@LANCE> Message-ID: > MOS (also called PC/MOS, and the later PC/MOS-386) were multi-user, > single-tasking versions of a DOS, more or less compatible with the > MS- and PC-DOS systems. MOS ran on the larger 286 and 386 systems, > and DID use their hardware segmentation (286) and protection (386) > support. >And bloody difficult to find - been after it for years :-( >cheers, >Lance >// http://commodore.thebbs.org > telnet://commodore.thebbs.org > Since 1987 - Australia's oldest Amiga BBS // Are you looking for PC-MOS? I have a boxed copy of PC-MOS/386 here with manuals and disks. Contact me off list if interested. I am in the US but will ship it anywhere. It shouldn't be to much to ship, it come in one slipcase binder. Greg Manuel gmanuel at gmconsulting.net >>> Download free spam killer at http://eliminatespam.com [demime 1.01a removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] From waltje at pdp11.nl Thu Sep 11 08:54:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: MOS operating System? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 11 Sep 2003, G Manuel wrote: > > MOS (also called PC/MOS, and the later PC/MOS-386) were multi-user, > > single-tasking versions of a DOS, more or less compatible with the > > MS- and PC-DOS systems. MOS ran on the larger 286 and 386 systems, > > and DID use their hardware segmentation (286) and protection (386) > > support. > > >And bloody difficult to find - been after it for years :-( > > >cheers, > > >Lance > > >// http://commodore.thebbs.org > > telnet://commodore.thebbs.org > > Since 1987 - Australia's oldest Amiga BBS // > > Are you looking for PC-MOS? I have a boxed copy of PC-MOS/386 here with > manuals and disks. Contact me off list if interested. I am in the US but > will ship it anywhere. It shouldn't be to much to ship, it come in one > slipcase binder. Oooh! See, Lance? Sometimes, just mentioning it will get you what you were looking for... everyone here has boxes full of stuff they pretty much forgot (or wan to forget) about ;-) --fred From asholz at topinform.com Thu Sep 11 10:15:00 2003 From: asholz at topinform.com (Andreas Holz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Symbolics Maintenance and repair information/manuals In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030910084212.0079bdb0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <3.0.6.32.20030910084212.0079bdb0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3F608F79.90907@topinform.com> Hello all, I'm interested in or a pointer to maintenace manual and repair informations for Symbolics computers. I've got a Symbolics 3645 some times ago and was able to power up the thing yesterday. I found that the sequencer board seems to be defective and I'm looking for all kind of informations to repair this stuff. Andreas From jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de Thu Sep 11 10:30:00 2003 From: jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de (Jochen Kunz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Sudden death in the family :( In-Reply-To: ; from waltje@pdp11.nl on Thu, Sep 11, 2003 at 14:45:43 CEST References: <000f01c37840$90991f20$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: <20030911171154.A41939@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> On 2003.09.11 14:45 Fred N. van Kempen wrote: > Is this a "known symptom" with the BA23 power supplies? It's a newer > one, with the colored wires. I had this sudden PSU death with a BA23 and a SGI Personal Iris 4D35. I heard that electrolytic capacitors can cause this but I have no detailed knowledge about this. :-( Remove everything from the machine that is not essential for basic operation. Keep only CPU, RAM, SLU. No drives etc. and retry. Try with different boards if it does not work. I had the same with my PDP-11/73 in a BA23 and it was a dead TK50 that caused a short. Have a look at the power wires / plugs at the PSU. Sometimes they get corroded. Have a look at the cards. Are there any wires from the components bent and shortened? A friend had a "dead" PDP-11/53 CPU that had some strange bus errors. (A bit was allways "1".) On carefull inspection of the PCB we found a wire from a resistor that was bent and connected to a pin from a bus driver IC... -- tsch??, Jochen Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/ From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 11 11:26:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 11 Sep 2003, Fred N. van Kempen wrote: > Worms, termites, fire ants, crawling gizmos.... gawd, when will the > Americans learn that a house'd be better built on top of a concrete > slab, or concrete foundation, and then built up with stone? Well, at least here in California, when a big earthquake hits you do not want to be inside a concrete or stone box. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From kittstr at access-4-free.com Thu Sep 11 12:21:00 2003 From: kittstr at access-4-free.com (Andrew Strouse) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Trouble with Magnavox Odyssey References: <3.0.3.32.20030910153506.0125d4dc@mail.optushome.com.au> Message-ID: <000201c37887$cf1cb8f0$e74d4a43@amscomputer> I got my Oddessy 1 to work. I had to clean the cartridge contacts and wiggle it a bit until the TV went black. Don't expect anything really spectacular to appear on the screen. It will just be black with a few white dots (an maybe a number?). It's been a while since I used it. Isn't there an adjustment knob for different size TV's on the deck so you don't lose the dot? I can dig it up and check exactly what you should see when you get the cartridge in correctly. Stay Tuned.... Andrew Strouse ( kittstr@access-4-free.com ) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dr. Ido" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 12:35 AM Subject: Re: Trouble with Magnavox Odyssey > At 03:27 PM 9/10/03, you wrote: > >Has anyone here ever tinkered with a Magnavox Odyssey and got it to work? > >I have four of these dang things and have not gotten one of them to fire > >up. I can't imagine that they are all bad. I am pretty sure that the > >video connection from the unit to the screen is solid as I tested it with > >an Atari Pong console and got video. I'm using a 9 volt adapter and have > >tested the voltage and have also tested that voltage is getting to the > >unit and that is all working. > > > >The unit gets turned on when you insert a carthridge. I've inserted and > >re-inserted the carthridge several times but there is nothing on the > >display, not even a glitch or flicker in the background noise. I've used > >contact cleaner on the carthridge and inside the slot but that hasn't > >helped. > > > >Has anyone else ever played with one of these and gotten it to work? > > I've never had an Odyssey, but I've had similar problems with some other old > consoles (RCA studio 2, Radofin 1392 and various pong clones come to mind). > What I found is the RF signal from the console > is either too weak or to far off spec for a TV with auto tuning to pick it > up. On the relatively modern TVs that I tried I either got no signal, a > black screen or a distorted picture that won't lock on. It wasn't until > I'd had the same problem with several consoles that I tried a different TV. > On an older TV with manual tuning I was able get a good stable picture > from all > the consoles that I thought had problems. From waltje at pdp11.nl Thu Sep 11 12:26:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 11 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > On Thu, 11 Sep 2003, Fred N. van Kempen wrote: > > > Worms, termites, fire ants, crawling gizmos.... gawd, when will the > > Americans learn that a house'd be better built on top of a concrete > > slab, or concrete foundation, and then built up with stone? > > Well, at least here in California, when a big earthquake hits you do not > want to be inside a concrete or stone box. You dont want to be in any building when that happens. Been there, dunnit, tho that was a light one, fortunately.. --f From teoz at neo.rr.com Thu Sep 11 12:46:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! References: Message-ID: <001801c3788b$7be1f8e0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> People living is deserts should not complain about the heat , lack of food and lack of water. People living at the base of an active volcano should not complain about lava in their living rooms. People who buy trailer homes and park them in tornado alley should not complain when their homes are stuck up in a tree. People who live next to a river the floods every year should not complain when the water rises and floods their property. People who live on a major fault line should not complain about an ocasional earthquake. You make choices in life that affect you down the road. You take your chances and some gambles pay off , others dont. Having said that the part of cali that broke off of another continent and is green is very nice to look at (coastal part). The fault line that made all those scenic mountains pretty is the same one that knocks your house over every 10 years. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fred N. van Kempen" To: Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2003 1:16 PM Subject: Re: Gawd damn bugs! > On Thu, 11 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > > On Thu, 11 Sep 2003, Fred N. van Kempen wrote: > > > > > Worms, termites, fire ants, crawling gizmos.... gawd, when will the > > > Americans learn that a house'd be better built on top of a concrete > > > slab, or concrete foundation, and then built up with stone? > > > > Well, at least here in California, when a big earthquake hits you do not > > want to be inside a concrete or stone box. > You dont want to be in any building when that happens. Been there, > dunnit, tho that was a light one, fortunately.. > > --f From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 11 13:03:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Trouble with Magnavox Odyssey In-Reply-To: <000201c37887$cf1cb8f0$e74d4a43@amscomputer> Message-ID: On Thu, 11 Sep 2003, Andrew Strouse wrote: > I got my Oddessy 1 to work. I had to clean the cartridge contacts and > wiggle it a bit until the TV went black. Don't expect anything really > spectacular to appear on the screen. It will just be black with a few > white dots (an maybe a number?). It's been a while since I used it. > Isn't there an adjustment knob for different size TV's on the deck so > you don't lose the dot? I can dig it up and check exactly what you > should see when you get the cartridge in correctly. So far I'm not getting any signal whatsoever. Even a black screen would be a success at this point. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From bill at timeguy.com Thu Sep 11 14:27:00 2003 From: bill at timeguy.com (Bill Richman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Trouble with Magnavox Odyssey In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030910103645.Q13926-100000@outpost.timeguy.com> I don't know if it was an endemic problem or if it was just something that happened to the one we had, but our Odyssey had some really nasty corrosion on the sockets and PCB traces for the external connectors (video, controllers, etc.). It almost looked like they had used acid-core solder by accident or something. We cleaned it all up, resoldered the connections with rosin-core solder, and installed a jumper to replace one of the damaged traces, and that fixed it right up. I don't remember if it was totally dead before that, or if it just had some weird symptoms, but it's something to check, if you haven't already. From bill at timeguy.com Thu Sep 11 14:28:00 2003 From: bill at timeguy.com (Bill Richman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Trouble with Magnavox Odyssey In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030910104021.O13926-100000@outpost.timeguy.com> Um - you _are_ using a tuner and not a composite video input on the monitor, right? There's a "channel select" switch on the bottom of the console that lets you pick something like channel 3 or 4. You can safely leave out the little box with the slide switch on it, as it's just there to let you select the antenna input or the Odyssey to your TV without moving wires. From witchy at binarydinosaurs.co.uk Thu Sep 11 14:28:05 2003 From: witchy at binarydinosaurs.co.uk (Witchy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Trouble with Magnavox Odyssey In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > -----Original Message----- > From: cctech-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctech-admin@classiccmp.org]On > Behalf Of Vintage Computer Festival > Sent: 09 September 2003 22:07 > To: Classic Computers Mailing List > Subject: Trouble with Magnavox Odyssey > > > Has anyone here ever tinkered with a Magnavox Odyssey and got it to work? At sometime in the very near future I'll be tinkering with mine now that I've found it again :) I have to make assumptions that the 'game cable' is actually kicking out standard NTSC video though, since I have no easy way of connecting the switchbox to an old UK B&W PAL TV. Some kind soul cut off 95% of the game cable so I'll have to cobble one together using a standard RF lead....I won't be at all surprised if I get nothing as well..... cheers -- adrian/witchy www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the online computer museum www.snakebiteandblack.co.uk - ex-monthly gothic shenanigans :o( From bbehr at pacbell.net Thu Sep 11 14:28:10 2003 From: bbehr at pacbell.net (Bill Behr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: EXO Corporation singleboard? Message-ID: <000601c3785a$0da34720$f47afea9@33host> Are you still seeking info about EXO Corp. computers? I worked for them, call me at 530-544-8262, don't email me. Bill From billdeg at degnanco.com Thu Sep 11 14:28:15 2003 From: billdeg at degnanco.com (B.Degnan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: trouble interfacing an HP86B to an HP7040 plotter with a serial interface Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030911085916.00abfcf0@mail.degnanco.net> I recall that with a new plotter of that era I had to initiate the plotter by hooking everything up and then typing and running a basic program from the PC to the plotter through the serial cable. The program initiates the plotter for use. If this is not a new plotter, it may have been set up for a different PC/desktop calculator in which case you'd need to re-initialize it. If that's not the case, maybe the ROM(?) that held the original configuration is bad. Do you have the manual for the plotter? The program should be in there. Sorry..I do not remember the program, it's been almost 20 years! Maybe someone has a HP7040 plotter manual out there in this group. The basic program should be only 3-5 lines. bd From FunToGoFast at aol.com Thu Sep 11 14:28:20 2003 From: FunToGoFast at aol.com (FunToGoFast@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: For Sale: Omnibot 2000 Robot Message-ID: <3d.34b53cb5.2c920c7e@aol.com> FOR SALE: A rare original robot by Tomy, Omnibot 2000. Included is the auto tray and remote control. Please email me with any questions and pictures if needed. Also we have two used Rad 2.0 robots with remotes... And a Cybie dog, color is blue, in orig box with all papers, remote, charger, battery, used cond... Email: freedmaneric@hotmail.com Thank you. Eric Eric From FunToGoFast at aol.com Thu Sep 11 14:28:25 2003 From: FunToGoFast at aol.com (FunToGoFast@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Omnibot 2000 Robot For Sale Message-ID: <11d.25e49f84.2c920cd1@aol.com> FOR SALE: A rare original robot by Tomy, Omnibot 2000. Included is the auto tray and remote control. Please email me with any questions and pictures if needed. Also we have two used Rad 2.0 robots with remotes... And a Cybie dog, color is blue, in orig box with all papers, remote, charger, battery, used cond... freedmaneric@hotmail.com Thank you. Eric From wgungfu at csd.uwm.edu Thu Sep 11 14:44:00 2003 From: wgungfu at csd.uwm.edu (Martin Scott Goldberg) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Trouble with Magnavox Odyssey In-Reply-To: <000201c37887$cf1cb8f0$e74d4a43@amscomputer> from "Andrew Strouse" at Sep 11, 2003 02:29:08 AM Message-ID: <200309111936.h8BJaTUi001297@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu> Andrew Strouse says: > >I got my Oddessy 1 to work. I had to clean the cartridge contacts and >wiggle it a bit until the TV went >black. Don't expect anything really spectacular to appear on the screen. >It will just be black with a few white dots (an maybe a number?). That's what the overlays are for. :) Marty From TRASIOL at cs.com Thu Sep 11 15:05:00 2003 From: TRASIOL at cs.com (TRASIOL@cs.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: bugs! Message-ID: <1de.f336d45.2c922d88@cs.com> Sellam: You really opened the proverbial 'bag of worms' (your own description). I suggest again - get advice from a professional exterminator. I've had termites in my house, my garage, in storage rooms, etc., and I assure you they will go right through plastic wraps, plastic sheets, plastic curtains, and anything made of wood or wood fibres (like paper). Defeating them is not a "game" that most of us are prepared or equipped to play, and, yes, I have a contract (perpetual) that guarantees the protection of my home and all I have in it. Saying you don't need it is like saying you don't need any kind of insurance - life or otherwise.. Protect your investments! Art From mikeford at socal.rr.com Thu Sep 11 15:55:00 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <002f01c377ce$b3cc8800$657ca418@neo.rr.com> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030911132616.031026f0@pop-server.socal.rr.com> >I am sure there are alot of chemicals made from natural material that keep >bugs away (like citronella candles keep insects away at outdoor parties. I dust with Boric Acid, and leave packets of poison bait; one for rodents, one for insects. From mross666 at hotmail.com Thu Sep 11 15:59:00 2003 From: mross666 at hotmail.com (Mike Ross) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Setasi/DEC RP12 Message-ID: Folks, Recently was lucky enough to pick up one of these, brand new never used. http://www.corestore.org/rp12.htm Unfortunately it came without any media. Questions: 1. Can anyone confirm they used 'standard' Quantum Passport XL media, without any wierd & wonderful DEC factory formatting? 2. Can anyone provide copies of the vital personality diskettes? Without those, it's a lump of iron :( Thanks Mike http://www.corestore.org _________________________________________________________________ Use custom emotions -- try MSN Messenger 6.0! http://www.msnmessenger-download.com/tracking/reach_emoticon From tothwolf at concentric.net Thu Sep 11 16:53:00 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:48 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Tothwolf wrote: > > > I've had problems with some little silver looking bugs I was told were > > 'silverfish'. They eat *anything* that is paper, including but not > > limited to; boxes, notebooks, and even the paper labels on pc boards > > and ICs! I'd love to know of a way to get rid of them, but since my > > garage is not 100% sealed, I dunno how effective anything would be. > > Yeah, I saw one of those bastards roaming around my office as well, but > I don't think I successfully smushed it. I've heard that they eat paper > too but I haven't seen any damage in particular that I can attribute to > one (or a colony) of them. They move very fast, and seem to be very tough to kill. They really do eat anything made of paper, and they can do major damage to stuff. Their damage looks similar to what a common roach will do to paper. If you see one, you probably have a good sized colony somewhere... -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Thu Sep 11 16:55:00 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <005a01c37806$d1a82360$657ca418@neo.rr.com> References: <3.0.6.32.20030910154158.007bd7c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <005a01c37806$d1a82360$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, TeoZ wrote: > From: "Tothwolf" > > On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: > > > > > I have a couple of close friends in the exterminating business. Let > > > me tell you, there's NOTHING that's truely effective on termites > > > anymore since the EPA took Clorodane off the market. The replacement > > > chemicals costs over $80/gallon (wholesale!) and you have to use it > > > full strength instead of dilluting it. Even then it is marginal and > > > the area has to be retreated every two years. > > > > > > Score another success for the bugs and the EPA! > > > > And the lumber industry...gotta keep us buying more wood... Maybe the > > lumber industry paid for the EPA studies? ;) > > > > I think my next home will be made of concrete block. > > Dont worry when the fire ants make it to your side of the country you > wont be worried about termites anymore. Hah! They are already here (Texas) and have been here for quite awhile. It tends to be much easier to kill those bastards than termites... -Toth From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Sep 11 17:06:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Sudden death in the family :( In-Reply-To: from "Fred N. van Kempen" at Sep 11, 3 02:45:43 pm Message-ID: > I just powered up a friend's PDP-11/53, which had been sitting in my > living room for, er, quite a while, and... nada. Fans dont start up, > not the usual racket when one powers up a BA23. The light in the power > switch turns on, though. I can hear a very soft "tick-tick, tick-tick" > sound in the power supply, and I do see how the fans get started, but > very quickly die down. Likewise, I see several LED's very briefly > turn on, and then die off again. THis is the classic sound of a SMPSU that's detecting a problem and then shutting down to protect itself and/or the load. The fault may not be in the PSU -- it could be a short on one of the outputs -- say a shorted decoupling capactior on one of the boards or something. I think I'd start by putting the supply on a dummy load (at least on the +5V and +12V rails), with all the logic boards pulled. See if the supply works OK on its own. If not, then you need to troubleshoot the supply (it's probably a defective capacitor!). If the supply works on dummy load, then put (say) the CPU and memory boards back and see what happens. Add boards one at a time until the PSU shuts down, then find the short on the last board you added. -tony From Lee.Davison at merlincommunications.com Thu Sep 11 18:01:00 2003 From: Lee.Davison at merlincommunications.com (Davison, Lee) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: PAL RGB on Cub monitors Message-ID: <8B39793544120140B253EFE052E7ED0A0171DCC1@nbulif015> > There was a model (which I have never seen!) which had a built-in PAL > decoder. This took 1V composite video. The input was a BNC socket IIRC. There is more than one model that has the PAL board and may also have the audio board or even the stereo audio board. I have the beige cube shaped CUB with the PAL board, a black 'D' series CUB (more conventional monitor shape) with both the PAL board and a stereo audio board and three beige CUB monitors in chunky plastic cases that have the PAL board but without the decoder section being populated, they also lack an audio section. The inputs on the beige cube and the black 'D' series are the standard CUB DIN socket and a BNC socket. The BNC is for 1v PAL or .3v sync and the DIN socket is either .7v RGB or digital RGBS. The chunky plastic beige CUBs all have four BNC sockets, RGB and Sync. Lee. ________________________________________________________________________ This e-mail has been scanned for all viruses by Star Internet. The service is powered by MessageLabs. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working around the clock, around the globe, visit: http://www.star.net.uk ________________________________________________________________________ From llyon at commodore.thebbs.org Thu Sep 11 18:11:00 2003 From: llyon at commodore.thebbs.org (Lance Lyon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: New "vintage computers" forum References: Message-ID: <029501c378b6$ae95cde0$0100a8c0@LANCE> A new forum page, based on phpBB2 has been set up with (moderated) forums devoted to "classic vintage computers", check them out at http://commodore.thebbs.org/phpBB2/index.php Although I've only just set this up, I plan on developing this & expanding it. Mostly in testing at the moment, appreciate it if people would drop by & leave me some feeback (ie improvements etc). cheers & thanks, Lance From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Thu Sep 11 18:17:01 2003 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (ben franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: bugs! References: Message-ID: <3F60FF62.6070405@jetnet.ab.ca> chris wrote: >>3 + 5/8 if you're going to start inside V1 and they're all 1" thick and 5 >>covers to go through. > > > wouldn't it be 3.5 inches? Starts page 1 vol 1, ends last page vol 3, so > that's only 4 covers to go thru (back of vol 1, front of vol 2, back of > vol 2, front vol 3). > > So that's 3 books of pages at 1 inch per book, 3 * 1 = 3 > 4 covers at 1/8 per cover is 4 * 1/8 = 4/8 = 1/2 > > 3 inches of text + 1/2 inch of covers = 3.5 inches that the worm travels. Unless the worm turns. :) Btw the next volume is due around 2007. > -chris > From geoffr at zipcon.net Thu Sep 11 18:35:01 2003 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Sudden death in the family :( In-Reply-To: References: <000f01c37840$90991f20$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030911163101.05ad1ce0@mail.zipcon.net> At 02:45 PM 9/11/03 +0200, you wrote: >Hi all, > >Today is a sad day. For obvious reasons, it already was (no, let us NOT >start that topic [again] .. tis a sad day, period), but now it's even >more so. Fred where are you located, I may have a powersupply from a BA23 that housed a MicrovaxII (Least I think it was a BA23) .... From geneb at deltasoft.com Thu Sep 11 21:10:01 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Cable wanted... In-Reply-To: <029501c378b6$ae95cde0$0100a8c0@LANCE> Message-ID: I'm in need of a C-64 video cable - it's got a 5 pin din on one end, and 3 RCA plugs on the other (luma, chroma and sound). Anyone here have one they'd like to part with? Tnx! g. From dlw at trailingedge.com Thu Sep 11 23:12:00 2003 From: dlw at trailingedge.com (David Williams) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Apple II SCSI card upgrade? In-Reply-To: References: <029501c378b6$ae95cde0$0100a8c0@LANCE> Message-ID: <3F60FF86.17003.13EC79E7@localhost> I picked up an Apple II SCSI card which the box said Rev C. Looking the card over it looks to me like it's a Rev A board. Anyone know where I can get the Rev C rom so I can use it? Thanks. ----- "If you want to see it, see into it directly; but when you stop to think about it, it is altogether missed." "When the mind is free of any thought or judgement, then and only then can we know things as they are." David Williams - Computer Packrat dlw@trailingedge.com http://www.trailingedge.com From teoz at neo.rr.com Thu Sep 11 23:53:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Apple II SCSI card upgrade? References: <029501c378b6$ae95cde0$0100a8c0@LANCE> <3F60FF86.17003.13EC79E7@localhost> Message-ID: <001601c378e8$afd62a60$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Williams" To: Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 12:04 AM Subject: Apple II SCSI card upgrade? > I picked up an Apple II SCSI card which the box said Rev C. Looking > the card over it looks to me like it's a Rev A board. Anyone know where > I can get the Rev C rom so I can use it? > > Thanks. > ----- > "If you want to see it, see into it directly; > but when you stop to think about it, it is > altogether missed." > > "When the mind is free of any thought or judgement, > then and only then can we know things as they are." > > David Williams - Computer Packrat > dlw@trailingedge.com > http://www.trailingedge.com Whats the rom chip say on it (this assumes its just the standard scsi card and not the high speed card with dma)? 341-0112A is revision A 341-0112B is revision B 341-0437-A is revision C This should clear up what you have. From esharpe at uswest.net Fri Sep 12 01:05:00 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (ed sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! References: <3.0.6.32.20030910154158.007bd7c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <3.0.6.32.20030911083554.007ac550@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <009401c378f2$a9c2a3b0$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> actually ants are the termites worst enemy! encourage ant colonies near termite infestations < yes entomology is another interest of mine!> Thanks Ed Sharpe archivist for SMECC Please check our web site at http://www.smecc.org to see other engineering fields, communications and computation stuff we buy, and by all means when in Arizona drop in and see us. address: coury house / smecc 5802 w palmaire ave glendale az 85301 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe" To: Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2003 5:35 AM Subject: Re: Gawd damn bugs! > At 09:48 PM 9/10/03 -0400, you wrote: > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Tothwolf" > >To: > >Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 9:58 PM > >Subject: Re: Gawd damn bugs! > > > > > >> On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: > >> > >> > I have a couple of close friends in the exterminating business. Let me > >> > tell you, there's NOTHING that's truely effective on termites anymore > >> > since the EPA took Clorodane off the market. The replacement chemicals > >> > costs over $80/gallon (wholesale!) and you have to use it full strength > >> > instead of dilluting it. Even then it is marginal and the area has to be > >> > retreated every two years. > >> > > >> > Score another success for the bugs and the EPA! > >> > >> And the lumber industry...gotta keep us buying more wood... Maybe the > >> lumber industry paid for the EPA studies? ;) > >> > >> I think my next home will be made of concrete block. > >> > >> -Toth > > > >Dont worry when the fire ants make it to your side of the country you wont > >be worried about termites anymore. > > What do mean "when"? They've been here since the 60s at least. I gotta > say they sure named 'em right! Just step on a nest of them if you don't > know what I mean! We're just waiting for the killer bees now. We've had a > few colonies of them but so far they've managed to wipe them out as they > appeared. And don't forget the Mediterrranian Fruit Flies and all the > other "interesting" bugs that are appearing everyday. > > Joe From dlw at trailingedge.com Fri Sep 12 01:07:00 2003 From: dlw at trailingedge.com (David Williams) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Apple II SCSI card upgrade? In-Reply-To: <001601c378e8$afd62a60$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <3F611A9F.7823.14565344@localhost> Oh I've already determined it is the Rev A. Found the FAQ and my chip has a 341-0112A sticker on it. The box it came in says Rev B but I'll trust the chip over the box. I read that to use the current Apple software I need a Rev C so since I really want to use this in my IIgs I'm looking for a way to upgrade it. On 12 Sep 2003 at 0:45, TeoZ wrote: > Whats the rom chip say on it (this assumes its just the standard scsi card > and not the high speed card with dma)? > > 341-0112A is revision A > 341-0112B is revision B > 341-0437-A is revision C > > This should clear up what you have. > ----- "If you want to see it, see into it directly; but when you stop to think about it, it is altogether missed." "When the mind is free of any thought or judgement, then and only then can we know things as they are." David Williams - Computer Packrat dlw@trailingedge.com http://www.trailingedge.com From vcf at siconic.com Fri Sep 12 01:23:01 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <009401c378f2$a9c2a3b0$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> Message-ID: On Thu, 11 Sep 2003, ed sharpe wrote: > actually ants are the termites worst enemy! > encourage ant colonies near termite infestations > < yes entomology is another interest of mine!> Great. Then what do you introduce to the ants when they start invading your potato chips? -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From e.huininga at sozawe.groningen.nl Fri Sep 12 02:21:00 2003 From: e.huininga at sozawe.groningen.nl (Eelco Huininga) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Betr.: (no subject) Message-ID: Can you remind me what this thread was about? I can't remember :-) Cheers, Eelco >>> 09/08 3:50 >>> I do have pinouts for eeco 9301 if you still need it. David A. Mercier New England Engineering Services 25 West Street Stafford Springs, Ct. 06076 (860) 684-5980 Fax: 684-5982 From nico at farumdata.dk Fri Sep 12 02:26:00 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: CCCP Message-ID: <002d01c378fd$83dd8e20$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> I just found a paper "The Soviet Bloc's Unified System of Computers", written by N.C.Davis and S.E.Goodman, published in "computing Surveys, Vol. 10, no.2, Juni 1978" Depending on how many people are interested in this piece of history, I can make up a Word document, including a scan of the tables and figures prevented. Nico From nico at farumdata.dk Fri Sep 12 02:40:01 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: CCCP References: <002d01c378fd$83dd8e20$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: <000a01c378ff$712a5860$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> > Depending on how many people are interested in this piece of history, I can make up a Word document, including a scan of the tables and figures prevented. > Nico ... figures presented :-( From llyon at commodore.thebbs.org Fri Sep 12 03:31:00 2003 From: llyon at commodore.thebbs.org (Lance Lyon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Cable wanted... References: Message-ID: <031301c37907$17946900$0100a8c0@LANCE> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gene Buckle" To: Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 12:13 PM Subject: Cable wanted... > I'm in need of a C-64 video cable - it's got a 5 pin din on one end, and 3 > RCA plugs on the other (luma, chroma and sound). Anyone here have one > they'd like to part with? Sure - I'm in Oz though, but I do have spares. // http://commodore.thebbs.org telnet://commodore.thebbs.org Classic computer discussion forums : http://commodore.thebbs.org/phpbb2/index.php Since 1987 - Australia's oldest Amiga BBS // From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Fri Sep 12 05:10:00 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals In-Reply-To: <000a01c378ff$712a5860$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: <20030912100136.60114.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com> Hi, Any recommendations for OCR software (preferably Windows 2000 - spit!) that'll allow the user to read from a image file rather than the software being incorporated with scanner software? Pete kindly loaned me a whole pile of documentation, and I can get it back to him far quicker if I can just scan all the pages as TIFF images for now and worry about passing it through OCR software at a later date! It would also be nice if said software was a) free :) and b) able to automatically recurse through a directory tree (or at least run from the command line without user input so that I can script that) cheers Jules ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Fri Sep 12 05:20:00 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: New "vintage computers" forum In-Reply-To: <029501c378b6$ae95cde0$0100a8c0@LANCE> Message-ID: <20030912101148.29822.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com> --- Lance Lyon wrote: > A new forum page, based on phpBB2 has been set up with (moderated) forums > devoted to "classic vintage computers" > Mostly in testing at the moment, appreciate it if people would drop by & > leave me some feeback (ie improvements etc). You're going to hate me for this... but... why? There are already usenet groups for different machines which work perfectly well. There's classiccmp as a central resource for questions. Doesn't another forum just dilute things even further? I certainly don't have time to read classiccmp, newsgroups, and several web forums as I doubt do many others. If you must run a forum too, I suggest you make sure that posts to your forums are mirrored on the classicmp list and vice-versa automatically - for the good of the hobby and all that. Although given the way the web forum is split up into different sections I'm not sure how you'd do that without user intervention :-( My 2 cents worth anyway... (Yes, I am having a bad day :-) cheers Jules ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Sep 12 07:09:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <009401c378f2$a9c2a3b0$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> References: <3.0.6.32.20030910154158.007bd7c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <3.0.6.32.20030911083554.007ac550@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030912075707.007a9d70@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 10:49 PM 9/11/03 -0700, you wrote: >actually ants are the termites worst enemy! >encourage ant colonies near termite infestations >< yes entomology is another interest of mine!> Oh great! I get a choice of something that eats my house or something that eats me! Joe > >Thanks Ed Sharpe archivist for SMECC > >Please check our web site at > http://www.smecc.org >to see other engineering fields, communications and computation stuff we >buy, and by all means when in Arizona drop in and see us. > >address: > > coury house / smecc >5802 w palmaire ave >glendale az 85301 > > > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Joe" >To: >Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2003 5:35 AM >Subject: Re: Gawd damn bugs! > > >> At 09:48 PM 9/10/03 -0400, you wrote: >> >----- Original Message ----- >> >From: "Tothwolf" >> >To: >> >Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 9:58 PM >> >Subject: Re: Gawd damn bugs! >> > >> > >> >> On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: >> >> >> >> > I have a couple of close friends in the exterminating business. Let >me >> >> > tell you, there's NOTHING that's truely effective on termites anymore >> >> > since the EPA took Clorodane off the market. The replacement >chemicals >> >> > costs over $80/gallon (wholesale!) and you have to use it full >strength >> >> > instead of dilluting it. Even then it is marginal and the area has to >be >> >> > retreated every two years. >> >> > >> >> > Score another success for the bugs and the EPA! >> >> >> >> And the lumber industry...gotta keep us buying more wood... Maybe the >> >> lumber industry paid for the EPA studies? ;) >> >> >> >> I think my next home will be made of concrete block. >> >> >> >> -Toth >> > >> >Dont worry when the fire ants make it to your side of the country you >wont >> >be worried about termites anymore. >> >> What do mean "when"? They've been here since the 60s at least. I gotta >> say they sure named 'em right! Just step on a nest of them if you don't >> know what I mean! We're just waiting for the killer bees now. We've had a >> few colonies of them but so far they've managed to wipe them out as they >> appeared. And don't forget the Mediterrranian Fruit Flies and all the >> other "interesting" bugs that are appearing everyday. >> >> Joe From llyon at commodore.thebbs.org Fri Sep 12 07:11:00 2003 From: llyon at commodore.thebbs.org (Lance Lyon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: New "vintage computers" forum References: <20030912101148.29822.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <003201c37925$e74b2bc0$0100a8c0@LANCE> Hi Jules, > You're going to hate me for this... but... why? There are already usenet groups > for different machines which work perfectly well. There's classiccmp as a > central resource for questions. Doesn't another forum just dilute things even > further? I certainly don't have time to read classiccmp, newsgroups, and > several web forums as I doubt do many others. True there are NG's & lists like these, but NG's are mostly unmoderated & oft times conversations degenerate into flame wars & name calling. The problem with a general-purpose list (like classiccmp) is that sometimes you have to wade thru a lot of posts to find something you're interested in. For example, there's a lot of discussion on PDP's on this list, a machine that I have no interest in, and I spend quite some time culling these posts out to find the ones I'm interested in (for the record: CP/M, obscure operating systems, CBM PETs & MSX machines). The gems do turn up from time to time in amongst all the other stuff :-) > > If you must run a forum too, I suggest you make sure that posts to your forums > are mirrored on the classicmp list and vice-versa automatically - for the good > of the hobby and all that. Although given the way the web forum is split up > into different sections I'm not sure how you'd do that without user > intervention :-( Not a good idea - think of the moderation problems :-) cheers, Lance // http://commodore.thebbs.org telnet://commodore.thebbs.org Classic computer discussion forums : http://commodore.thebbs.org/phpbb2/index.php Since 1987 - Australia's oldest Amiga BBS // From RCini at congressfinancial.com Fri Sep 12 07:59:00 2003 From: RCini at congressfinancial.com (Cini, Richard) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: TI FD1000 dual 8" disk array available Message-ID: <69DBC74E5784D6119BEA0090271EB8E5FA3D20@MAIL10> Please respond directly to Ryan about this item. Physically its in good shape, the only consmetics are a few scuffs and some of the "filter" has been removed. I was planning on ebaying it starting bids around $5-10 sometimes they take off that way, sometimes not. I originally bought the unit at an auction figuring I could get the pinout of the unit and attach to my old PC5150 but the interface seems to be scsi'ish and totally incompatible. I am located in Weston (Wausau) Wisconsin near the center of the state, shipping on the unit would probably be $30-$60 as it weighs a lot 50-60lbs unless there is someone nearby to pick it up at my house. Cheers Ryan May In a message dated 9/11/2003 8:00:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time, rcini@msn.com writes: > Subj: Re: Old miniframe TI FD1000 dual 8" disk array > Date: 9/11/2003 8:00:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time > From: "Richard A. Cini, Jr." > > To: RMay635703@aol.com > Sent from the Internet (Details) > > > > > Ryan: > > I do not know anyone off hand. But, I can share this info with a group of > computer collectors to which I belong. It would help me if you could tell me > where the unit is located, its condition and how much, if anything, you are > looking to be paid for the unit. > > Rich > > > >From: RMay635703@aol.com > >To: rcini@msn.com > >Subject: Old miniframe TI FD1000 dual 8" disk array > >Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 15:48:19 -0400 > > > >Hi, if you or anyone you know is interested in a TI 960? Floppy disk array > >FD1000 email me back. > > > >Cheers > >Ryan From jbmcb at hotmail.com Fri Sep 12 08:11:01 2003 From: jbmcb at hotmail.com (Jason McBrien) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals References: <20030912100136.60114.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Omnipage Pro works nicely, will read/scan just about anything ( I'm using it to slowly OCR stuff the PDFs from the SPIES archive ) Unfortunatly it costs a bundle. You gets what you pay for. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jules Richardson" To: Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 6:01 AM Subject: OCR'ing old manuals > Hi, > > Any recommendations for OCR software (preferably Windows 2000 - spit!) that'll > allow the user to read from a image file rather than the software being > incorporated with scanner software? > > Pete kindly loaned me a whole pile of documentation, and I can get it back to > him far quicker if I can just scan all the pages as TIFF images for now and > worry about passing it through OCR software at a later date! > > It would also be nice if said software was a) free :) and b) able to > automatically recurse through a directory tree (or at least run from the > command line without user input so that I can script that) > > cheers > > Jules > > > > ===== > Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! > Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From curt at atarimuseum.com Fri Sep 12 08:12:00 2003 From: curt at atarimuseum.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Cable wanted... Message-ID: <200309121311.h8CDBj387017@huey.classiccmp.org> The C64 shares the same pins outs as the Atari 800 video, so you can use the same cables, try redmondcable.com and www.myatari.com which both sell Atari Composite 5 pin din cables. Curt > I'm in need of a C-64 video cable - it's got a 5 pin din on one end, and 3 > RCA plugs on the other (luma, chroma and sound). Anyone here have one > they'd like to part with? > > Tnx! > > g. From prk at iespana.es Fri Sep 12 08:20:00 2003 From: prk at iespana.es (Prk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Looking for IBM Technical Reference Manual Message-ID: <1063372264.963.1.camel@prk> Hello all! I have been searching the web looking for the original IBM PC/XT schematics. I read on some post that they were published in the "IBM Technical Reference Manual" and in the "Microcornucopia" magazine, but I couldn't find it anywhere. Please, could you tell me where can I find those schemes? Please, if anyone has it, can you make a scan and post it? Thank you. Luis G. "Prk" ---Publicidad-------------------------------------------------------- Juega con Ventura24.es, lotería inteligente y multiplica tus posibilidades!! http://www.iespana.es/_reloc/email.ventura From teoz at neo.rr.com Fri Sep 12 08:36:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! References: Message-ID: <004401c37931$c7d836a0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vintage Computer Festival" To: Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2003 6:18 PM Subject: Re: Gawd damn bugs! > On Thu, 11 Sep 2003, ed sharpe wrote: > > > actually ants are the termites worst enemy! > > encourage ant colonies near termite infestations > > < yes entomology is another interest of mine!> > > Great. Then what do you introduce to the ants when they start invading > your potato chips? > > -- > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival I would rather have ants as a pest then termites eating my house away. From teoz at neo.rr.com Fri Sep 12 08:48:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Apple II SCSI card upgrade? References: <3F611A9F.7823.14565344@localhost> Message-ID: <007601c37933$56a12440$657ca418@neo.rr.com> You need to get the rom burned if you have a programmer or have somebody do it. I have the rom file available but didnt have the burner so I asked around and a kind person made me a copy (awaiting delivery). If you need the rom file http://homepage.mac.com/WebObjects/FileSharing.woa/2/wo/RyPj4BJm3ZljFod0.1/0.2.1.2.19.31.97.0.35.0.1.1.1?user=wayne_stewart&fpath=eproms&templatefn=FileSharing1.html get it there (scsi_rev_c.bin.zip). ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Williams" To: Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 2:00 AM Subject: Re: Apple II SCSI card upgrade? > Oh I've already determined it is the Rev A. Found the FAQ and my chip > has a 341-0112A sticker on it. The box it came in says Rev B but I'll > trust the chip over the box. I read that to use the current Apple software > I need a Rev C so since I really want to use this in my IIgs I'm looking > for a way to upgrade it. > > On 12 Sep 2003 at 0:45, TeoZ wrote: > > Whats the rom chip say on it (this assumes its just the standard scsi card > > and not the high speed card with dma)? > > > > 341-0112A is revision A > > 341-0112B is revision B > > 341-0437-A is revision C > > > > This should clear up what you have. > > > > ----- > "If you want to see it, see into it directly; > but when you stop to think about it, it is > altogether missed." > > "When the mind is free of any thought or judgement, > then and only then can we know things as they are." > > David Williams - Computer Packrat > dlw@trailingedge.com > http://www.trailingedge.com From geneb at deltasoft.com Fri Sep 12 09:02:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Cable wanted... In-Reply-To: <031301c37907$17946900$0100a8c0@LANCE> Message-ID: > > I'm in need of a C-64 video cable - it's got a 5 pin din on one end, and 3 > > RCA plugs on the other (luma, chroma and sound). Anyone here have one > > they'd like to part with? > > > Sure - I'm in Oz though, but I do have spares. > Thanks Lance, but I'd like to find one a bit closer to Washington State. ;) Shipping charges across the pond are murder. g. From geneb at deltasoft.com Fri Sep 12 09:16:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Cable wanted... In-Reply-To: <200309121311.h8CDBj387017@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: > The C64 shares the same pins outs as the Atari 800 video, so you can use > the same cables, try redmondcable.com and www.myatari.com which both > sell Atari Composite 5 pin din cables. Thanks for the tip Curt. I'd rather not get an Atari cable though. *grin* g. From bpope at wordstock.com Fri Sep 12 09:29:00 2003 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Cable wanted... In-Reply-To: from "Gene Buckle" at Sep 12, 03 07:19:13 am Message-ID: <200309121418.KAA03013@wordstock.com> And thusly Gene Buckle spake: > > > The C64 shares the same pins outs as the Atari 800 video, so you can use > > the same cables, try redmondcable.com and www.myatari.com which both > > sell Atari Composite 5 pin din cables. > > > Thanks for the tip Curt. I'd rather not get an Atari cable though. *grin* > > g. > There is also Centsible Software... I know he just had a special on video cables... His email address is Bill Griffin Cheers, Bryan Pope From llyon at commodore.thebbs.org Fri Sep 12 09:53:01 2003 From: llyon at commodore.thebbs.org (Lance Lyon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Cable wanted... References: <200309121418.KAA03013@wordstock.com> Message-ID: <009d01c3793c$6c3028c0$0100a8c0@LANCE> > There is also Centsible Software... I know he just had a special on > video cables... His email address is Bill Griffin Currently he's begging people for funds to keep the business afloat....... From dave at undertheoaks.net Fri Sep 12 10:12:00 2003 From: dave at undertheoaks.net (Dave C.) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: HP 85B Schematics wanted Message-ID: <3F61E060.1060405@undertheoaks.net> I am working on a HP 85B with a dead power supply. No +5, +12 just 37volts on the large cap on the power supply board. Can anyone please help. Schmatics would be great! - Dave From vcf at siconic.com Fri Sep 12 10:19:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <004401c37931$c7d836a0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Sep 2003, TeoZ wrote: > I would rather have ants as a pest then termites eating my house away. You haven't had ants like I've had ants. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From geneb at deltasoft.com Fri Sep 12 10:27:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Cable wanted... In-Reply-To: <200309121418.KAA03013@wordstock.com> Message-ID: > There is also Centsible Software... I know he just had a special on > video cables... His email address is Bill Griffin > > Cheers, > > Bryan Pope > Thanks Bryan. I'll give him a shot, but I don't hold out much hope considering the discussions going on in comp.sys.cbm about his reponse times... g. From geneb at deltasoft.com Fri Sep 12 10:34:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > On Fri, 12 Sep 2003, TeoZ wrote: > > > I would rather have ants as a pest then termites eating my house away. > > You haven't had ants like I've had ants. > I had the flash of a guy in a 10 gallon hat jutting out his chin and tugging on his pants after delivering that line. God, I _really_ need a vacation. g. From teoz at neo.rr.com Fri Sep 12 10:36:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! References: Message-ID: <002601c37942$879076a0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> I had a few of the larger black ones during the summer, nothing major just annoying (you see maybe 1 crawling around a room) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vintage Computer Festival" To: Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 3:14 AM Subject: Re: Gawd damn bugs! > On Fri, 12 Sep 2003, TeoZ wrote: > > > I would rather have ants as a pest then termites eating my house away. > > You haven't had ants like I've had ants. > > -- > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage mputers ] > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From teoz at neo.rr.com Fri Sep 12 10:39:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Cable wanted... References: Message-ID: <002f01c37942$f6154f60$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gene Buckle" To: Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 11:29 AM Subject: Re: Cable wanted... > > There is also Centsible Software... I know he just had a special on > > video cables... His email address is Bill Griffin > > > > Cheers, > > > > Bryan Pope > > > > Thanks Bryan. I'll give him a shot, but I don't hold out much hope > considering the discussions going on in comp.sys.cbm about his reponse > times... > > g. Does he own the inventory? I dont see why he doesnt pick a big box in front of him, lower prices, and sell them all for a little profit. I read about him getting kicked off of ebay and his problems with server company etc but just sounds like he isnt paying his bills and shipping product. From allain at panix.com Fri Sep 12 10:49:00 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: New "vintage computers" forum References: <20030912101148.29822.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <009e01c37943$e79865c0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> > Doesn't another forum just dilute things even further? > I certainly don't have time to read classiccmp, newsgroups, and... I don't believe it is physically possible to dilute information further than it is diluted here. Joking, but only in part unfortunately. If someone wants to suffer through moderating his own forum, then more power to him. The ''free market economy'' will decide who wins. John A. From geneb at deltasoft.com Fri Sep 12 10:56:01 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Cable wanted... In-Reply-To: <002f01c37942$f6154f60$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: > > Thanks Bryan. I'll give him a shot, but I don't hold out much hope > > considering the discussions going on in comp.sys.cbm about his reponse > > times... > > > > g. > > Does he own the inventory? I dont see why he doesnt pick a big box in front > of him, lower prices, and sell them all for a little profit. I read about > him getting kicked off of ebay and his problems with server company etc but > just sounds like he isnt paying his bills and shipping product. > I'll probably just solder up the silly cable myself. I was trying to save myself some time... g. From feldte at cox.net Fri Sep 12 11:04:00 2003 From: feldte at cox.net (Everett Feldt) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Intel ISIS OS for an IPDS Message-ID: I am desperately looking for a copy of the Intel ISIS OS for an IPDS (Intel Personal Development System). Can anyone help me? Everett Feldt feldte@cox.net From feldte at cox.net Fri Sep 12 11:04:15 2003 From: feldte at cox.net (Everett Feldt) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Prolog Corporation CPU Manual In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I am looking for a copy of a Prolog Manual (or just the schematic) for a RS422 CPU Card Prolog Part Number 7842. Can anyone help me? Everett Feldt feldte@cox.net From gando at t-online.de Fri Sep 12 11:04:20 2003 From: gando at t-online.de (Gerold Pauler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Sudden death in the family :( References: Message-ID: <3F60DBE6.9000201@pdp8.de> Fred N. van Kempen schrieb: > Hi all, > > Today is a sad day. For obvious reasons, it already was (no, let us NOT > start that topic [again] .. tis a sad day, period), but now it's even > more so. Sorry about that. > > I just powered up a friend's PDP-11/53, which had been sitting in my > living room for, er, quite a while, and... nada. Fans dont start up, > not the usual racket when one powers up a BA23. The light in the power > switch turns on, though. I can hear a very soft "tick-tick, tick-tick" > sound in the power supply, This sound is very familiar for me at least after last week my ethernet switch, my ADSL modem and my private branch exchange died of overvoltage. All three had one defect capacitor in the psu and all three capacitors made different variants of very soft "tick, tick, tick-tick-tick, ..." So I would look for a defect capacitor in the power supply. and I do see how the fans get started, but > very quickly die down. Likewise, I see several LED's very briefly > turn on, and then die off again. Hope this helps -- Gerold Pauler pxgNoxyz@pdp8.de remove Noxyz to answer or look at http://pdp8.de From swtpc at attbi.com Fri Sep 12 11:04:25 2003 From: swtpc at attbi.com (Michael Holley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Subject: trouble interfacing an HP86B to an HP7040 plotter with a serial References: <20030909170001.54954.48155.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <001c01c378c9$6ea061b0$9865fea9@hslckirkland.org> I still have the homemade cable I used to connect a HP7040 to my original IBM PC in 1983. It is a DB-25S (PC end) to DB25P (plotter end). Plotter PC 1 1 2 3 3 2 4 5 5 4 6 20 7 7 20 6 This would be a null modem cable. I also found this HP link for a newer plotter http://www.hp.com/cposupport/plotters/support_doc/bpp01379.html Michael Holley www.swtpc.com/mholley > From: "RHahm" > To: > Cc: "Vassilis Prevelakis" , > "John Shadbolt" > > Subject: trouble interfacing an HP86B to an HP7040 plotter with a serial > interface > Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2003 12:51:44 -0400 > Reply-To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > > Hi, > > I am having trouble interfacing an HP86B to an HP7040 plotter with a serial > interface. > > I have two HP serial interfaces: standard with male DB25 connector and > 0pt.01 with female connector. > > The plotter has a male DB25 connector. > > I have connected the standard with with a gender changer and the opt. 01 > directly without success. > > I typed PLOTTER IS 10 and (the baud rate on the plotter is set at 9600)I get > an error message. > > > This is the first time I have tried a serial connection and unfortunately I > don't have any > documentation for the HP serial interface. > > Do I need a null modem for the opt. 01 serial interface? > > What am I doing wrong? > > Thanks, > > Bob From alan_geering at hotmail.com Fri Sep 12 11:04:30 2003 From: alan_geering at hotmail.com (Alan Geering) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: PAL & RGB on Cub monitors - a partial answer, and more questions Message-ID: OK, I've managed to find a part answer to the question I asked a while back. (What inputs did the Microvitec Cub Monitors have?) Microvitec 653 cub monitors came in a few flavours: Shape: MS = the cub in metal case as most people are used to LS/LI = plastic casing ("structured foam" case) Input: 1451 = standard monitor with TTL inputs (BBC B, RM 480Z, Electron & Oric) 1455 = dual standard monitor TTL or 1v/75ohm video (BBC, Oric, Electron, RM 480Z, RM 380Z) 1459 = 1v p-p/75ohm video input (RM 380Z, DEC Rainbow, Crommenco 501) 1456 = Mac & IBM versions differing only in color sets There was however a Triple Standard monitor - which I would like to track down - the brochure for which statesinputs as: PAL/TTL/Analogue (1v/75ohm). This was a 20" version. Looking at the circuit diagrams for the triple standard interface I can see that what it means by PAL & 1v/75ohm Video is the following: PAL = what I would call composite video with colors encoded as PAL 1v/75ohm video = RGBS, BNC sockets for RGB and BNC socket for S which is also the PAL/Composite input (cunningly the monitor circuits also alow for RGsB) I've not managed to find a diagram of the Dual Standard interface so I can't say what the connectors look like on the back. For now I'm assuming they were just BNC sockets. Does anyone have the 1459 version of the Cub? Can they please let me know what the rear looks like. Does anyone have the 1455 Dual Standard version of the Cub? same info would be useful. Finally: Does anyone know where I could find 1455 & 1459 versions? Thanks again, Alan geering >From: ard@p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) >Reply-To: cctech@classiccmp.org >To: cctalk@classiccmp.org >Subject: Re: PAL RGB on Cub monitors >Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2003 21:52:49 +0100 (BST) > > > Forgive me, I'm new to BBC computers and associated techology > > > > What I would like to know is whether the cube looking monitor >(microvitech > > cub?) that came with BBC computers had the following: > > > > A scart input that took a PAL RGB 1v p-p signal that sync'd on green? > >No Microvitec cub ever had a SCART socket. > >There were serveral models. Most has RGB inputs, which were internally >link-selectable to be either TTL level digital (giving 8 colours on the >screen), or 1V analogue. I think all models had separate sync inputs. > >There was a model (which I have never seen!) which had a built-in PAL >decoder. This took 1V composite video. The input was a BNC socket IIRC. > >I don't know what a 'PAL RGB' signal is. PAL is a method of colour >encoding, RGB implies separate signals for the 3 primary colours. One >signal can't be both! > >-tony From kenacms at ngatoro.terrigal.net.au Fri Sep 12 11:04:36 2003 From: kenacms at ngatoro.terrigal.net.au (Ken Kirkby (ACMS)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: OT? - How to run a DOS BBS directly attached to a Terminal In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.1.20030907164731.0176b008@mail.saracom.com> from "Maxwell K. Froedge" at Sep 7, 3 04:55:13 pm Message-ID: <200309121220.h8CCKNl28313@ngatoro.terrigal.net.au> Hi there, > > Hello, > > This may be OFF TOPIC but I did run WWIV more than 10 years ago. > > My question is how to run a DOS BBS directly attached to a Terminal Server. > That is without a modem. I have a PicoWeb server which basically allows one > to connect a serial device directly to ethernet and comunicates via TCP/IP. > > It works and I can talk with it via Telnet. However I want to run a classic > BBS such as WWIV. I have tried my backup copy from circa 1992 and > it really wants a modem. I have tried the current version too without luck. > > So is there any old style BBSes which will work with a direct connection to > a terminal (in my case a serial to ethernet convertor)? I would want > chains.txt > support so I could run the great online games. Well you could look at Fido12w which I think was the last release of Fido, the bulletin board software which inspired fido net. > > I could run WWIV with my two V.everything modems back to back but that > IS overkill. Is there any other solution? Has anyone tried this? > > Thanks > Max > Ken Kirkby From chrisc at addpower.com Fri Sep 12 11:04:42 2003 From: chrisc at addpower.com (Christopher Cureau) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: Needed - VT terminal Message-ID: Does anyone have a spare VT220, 320 or 420 that they'd be willing to part with? My 320 just bit the dust...very inconvenient time, too, since I was about to install my brand new OpenVMS hobbyist... :( Failing that, does anyone know how I can interface another kind of terminal to my MicroVAX 3100? It's got the MMJ connector on it...maybe if I could send the output to a wyse 60 that I have lying around... Cheers, Chris Cureau From mikelait at magasec.com Fri Sep 12 11:04:47 2003 From: mikelait at magasec.com (Jim Mikelait) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:49 2005 Subject: software for the decserver Message-ID: <02f401c3793f$03f53d10$0600000a@jeff> did you ever find out where to get the software for the decserver 700? I have some as well. jim From james at cs.york.ac.uk Fri Sep 12 11:04:53 2003 From: james at cs.york.ac.uk (James Carter) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: bbc radio programme about leo computers Message-ID: <1063378674.8791.62.camel@pc004> this week's "book of the week" has been "a computer called leo" which tells the story of the world's first business computer and the company, more famous for their tea shops and ice cream, who produced it. it's a little short on technical detail, but well worth a listen. this weeks programmes will be available online until at least 0900GMT on monday. http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/arts/book_of_the_week.shtml?focuswin -- James F. Carter http://www.jfc.org.uk/ From jwest at classiccmp.org Fri Sep 12 11:21:01 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Intel ISIS OS for an IPDS (another wanted item) References: Message-ID: <00b501c37947$dfddcd80$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Everett wrote.... > I am desperately looking for a copy of the Intel ISIS OS for an IPDS (Intel > Personal Development System). Can anyone help me? Does anyone have a spare user/reference manual for ISIS? Or as a second solution, something in electronic format? Jay West From dwoyciesjes at comcast.net Fri Sep 12 11:22:08 2003 From: dwoyciesjes at comcast.net (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Needed - VT terminal References: Message-ID: <3F61EF72.FEB9808F@comcast.net> Christopher Cureau wrote: > > Does anyone have a spare VT220, 320 or 420 that they'd be willing to part > with? My 320 just bit the dust...very inconvenient time, too, since I was > about to install my brand new OpenVMS hobbyist... :( > > Failing that, does anyone know how I can interface another kind of terminal > to my MicroVAX 3100? It's got the MMJ connector on it...maybe if I could > send the output to a wyse 60 that I have lying around... > > Cheers, > Chris Cureau Yeah, a VT420... Where are you though? -- --- Dave Woyciesjes --- ICQ# 905818 From cb at mythtech.net Fri Sep 12 11:23:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Value of Adds Viewpoint terminals Message-ID: Do Adds Viewpoint terminals have any value? I have 8 of them I no longer use or need. Cosmetically they are all rather beat. All are yellowed and dirty, with lots of pen or pencil marks on the cases and keyboards. All keyboards have all their keys, and to the best of my knowledge all 8 are in good working order (they all worked when they were last used, but that was a number of years ago). The cosmetic issues are probably nothing a good scrubbing can't improve. I don't believe any have physical damage to them. I'm just curious if these are something I should try selling, or just give/throw away. -chris From classiccmp at vintage-computer.com Fri Sep 12 11:24:00 2003 From: classiccmp at vintage-computer.com (Erik Klein) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: New "vintage computers" forum Message-ID: > > Doesn't another forum just dilute things even further? > > I certainly don't have time to read classiccmp, newsgroups, and... > > I don't believe it is physically possible to dilute information > further than it is diluted here. Joking, but only in part unfortunately. > > If someone wants to suffer through moderating his own forum, then > more power to him. The ''free market economy'' will decide who wins. There are a number of advantages to the web based forum over news groups and mail lists which is the reason I started the Vintage Computer Forum a while back. Of course, these other technologies are simpler and require far less bandwidth then the more graphical web forums for those that prefer to use vintage equipment to talk about vintage equipment. I'm convinced that there's room for everyone in the "free market economy" and that, in the end, everyone is a winner. Maybe I'm naive, but just I don't think it's a zero sum game. I'll mirror Jules question of "but... why?" only because the VC Forum I've been hosting is already mature, has nearly 200 registered users and appears to have almost exactly the same content as Lance's effort. In the end, though, Lance is adding to the community just like ccTalk, the VC Forum and the wide variety of other discussions out there. Congratulations, Lance, and more power to you! :) Erik Klein www.vintage-computer.com/vcforum The Vintage Computer Forum From kth at srv.net Fri Sep 12 11:34:00 2003 From: kth at srv.net (Kevin Handy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals In-Reply-To: <20030912100136.60114.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030912100136.60114.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3F61FE77.6080600@srv.net> Jules Richardson wrote: >Hi, > >Any recommendations for OCR software (preferably Windows 2000 - spit!) that'll >allow the user to read from a image file rather than the software being >incorporated with scanner software? > >Pete kindly loaned me a whole pile of documentation, and I can get it back to >him far quicker if I can just scan all the pages as TIFF images for now and >worry about passing it through OCR software at a later date! > >It would also be nice if said software was a) free :) and b) able to >automatically recurse through a directory tree (or at least run from the >command line without user input so that I can script that) > > Distributed Proofers seems to prefer Abbey Finereader, but it also costs money. It apparently does very well with images that others choke on. From kth at srv.net Fri Sep 12 11:41:00 2003 From: kth at srv.net (Kevin Handy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Needed - VT terminal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F620007.2090103@srv.net> Christopher Cureau wrote: >Does anyone have a spare VT220, 320 or 420 that they'd be willing to part >with? My 320 just bit the dust...very inconvenient time, too, since I was >about to install my brand new OpenVMS hobbyist... :( > > > Burned out the flyback transformer, I'll bet. Most common failure I saw on those. Apparently they used a really cheap transformer. >Failing that, does anyone know how I can interface another kind of terminal >to my MicroVAX 3100? It's got the MMJ connector on it...maybe if I could >send the output to a wyse 60 that I have lying around... > > > MMJ is just another RS-232 connector. You can easily buy/build adapters to connect up a 25-pin connector. BlackBox sells them, for example, but they are more expensive there than from other places. VT terminals are also available from many places for very little. Just check ebay for example. From paul at frixxon.co.uk Fri Sep 12 12:05:01 2003 From: paul at frixxon.co.uk (Paul Williams) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals In-Reply-To: References: <20030912100136.60114.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3F61F9D2.8050101@frixxon.co.uk> Jason McBrien wrote: > Omnipage Pro works nicely, will read/scan just about anything Seconded. It'll quite happily run from a watched directory and will work its way through almost any type of file, including PDFs, and dump the results to another directory in whatever form you want. I'm very pleased with the quality of the output text. It will cough and die if you accidentally pass it some large schematics and you may then have to go and manually delete its temporary files before it'll start up again, but other than that it'll quite happily run unattended on a spare PC. > ( I'm using it to slowly OCR stuff the PDFs from the SPIES archive ) Snap! (Though only the DEC stuff for now.) If only Omnipage Pro was available for Linux, I'd be shot of Windows for good. - Paul From geneb at deltasoft.com Fri Sep 12 12:05:13 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals In-Reply-To: <3F61FE77.6080600@srv.net> Message-ID: > >Pete kindly loaned me a whole pile of documentation, and I can get it back to > >him far quicker if I can just scan all the pages as TIFF images for now and > >worry about passing it through OCR software at a later date! > > > >It would also be nice if said software was a) free :) and b) able to > >automatically recurse through a directory tree (or at least run from the > >command line without user input so that I can script that) > > > > > Distributed Proofers seems to prefer Abbey Finereader, but it also costs > money. It apparently does very well with images that others choke on. > It's actually called Abbyy Finereader. It's amazingly good at what it does, but it does cost. g. From jpl15 at panix.com Fri Sep 12 12:27:00 2003 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Needed - VT terminal In-Reply-To: <3F620007.2090103@srv.net> References: <3F620007.2090103@srv.net> Message-ID: I use VanDyke's CRT, on a n IBM Thinkpad laptop, as a console for my 11/44. I have a few VT220s and a re-badged Televideo VT100 lookalike, but when I'm just mucking about as a 'single user', then I generally connect the PC to the PDP via a funky adapter cable I cobbled together one dark and stormy night. BTW: I use pins 2,3 and 7, and map them to the appropriate 9-pin pins on the laptop side, whose exact pin numbers escape at the moment, but it's too easy to find them out. Until you get a replacement 'tube', perhaps a nice terminal emulator on your PC or Mac might get you going. There was a long thread recently on Emulators for this purpose - a lot of us here use and like 'CRT', but there are other products. FWIW, I have *never* had anything other than horrible experiences with 'Hyperterm' that comes bundled in all Windows, but YMMV. Cheers John From paul at frixxon.co.uk Fri Sep 12 13:17:00 2003 From: paul at frixxon.co.uk (Paul Williams) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Needed - VT terminal In-Reply-To: References: <3F620007.2090103@srv.net> Message-ID: <3F620B6F.5050407@frixxon.co.uk> John Lawson wrote: > I have a few VT220s and a re-badged Televideo VT100 lookalike Did you manage to confirm that your Covalent 1410 is actually a TeleVideo 950 then? - Paul From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Fri Sep 12 13:21:00 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Looking for IBM Technical Reference Manual Message-ID: <030912140928.cc38@splab.cas.neu.edu> I have in hardcopy the "IBM Technical Reference Personal Computer XT and Portable Personal Computer, 6361459. It is in a mini 3 ring binder. I don't have it scanned, nor am I willing to scan it. However, if you cannot find electronic versions, perhaps there are parts of the manual you want. If you want JUST the system board schematics, then I will scan the 20 or so pages, but it might take a while. It would be easier for me to photocopy the 20 or so pages and send them along. regards, Joe Heck From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Fri Sep 12 14:00:00 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Looking for IBM Technical Reference Manual Message-ID: <030912140928.cc38@splab.cas.neu.edu> I have in hardcopy the "IBM Technical Reference Personal Computer XT and Portable Personal Computer, 6361459. It is in a mini 3 ring binder. I don't have it scanned, nor am I willing to scan it. However, if you cannot find electronic versions, perhaps there are parts of the manual you want. If you want JUST the system board schematics, then I will scan the 20 or so pages, but it might take a while. It would be easier for me to photocopy the 20 or so pages and send them along. regards, Joe Heck From jpl15 at panix.com Fri Sep 12 14:17:00 2003 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Needed - VT terminal In-Reply-To: <3F620B6F.5050407@frixxon.co.uk> References: <3F620007.2090103@srv.net> <3F620B6F.5050407@frixxon.co.uk> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Sep 2003, Paul Williams wrote: > John Lawson wrote: > > > I have a few VT220s and a re-badged Televideo VT100 lookalike > > Did you manage to confirm that your Covalent 1410 is actually a > TeleVideo 950 then? From observation (and ancient memory) - I think you're exactly right. Been too busy to actually make the dispswitch test, but the Weekend Looms... Thanks! Cheers John From cisin at xenosoft.com Fri Sep 12 14:27:01 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Looking for IBM Technical Reference Manual In-Reply-To: <1063372264.963.1.camel@prk> References: <1063372264.963.1.camel@prk> Message-ID: <20030912120931.L76684@newshell.lmi.net> On Fri, 12 Sep 2003, Prk wrote: > Hello all! > I have been searching the web looking for the original IBM PC/XT > schematics. I read on some post that they were published in the "IBM > Technical Reference Manual" until the PS/2 (real one from IBM, NOT SONY!), ALL of the IBM hardware technical reference manuals had full schematics and source code for the BIOS. > and in the "Microcornucopia" magazine, but I Not IN "Microcornucopia". Dave Thompson (the publisher) redrew the XT schematics to combine the multiple pages into a single poster sized one, that they sold. Because they were redrawn from the Tech Ref, any errors in the original should be replicated. One of my copies was sold along with the cabinet that it was taped to. The other is unaccounted for. From kth at srv.net Fri Sep 12 14:56:00 2003 From: kth at srv.net (Kevin Handy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Needed - VT terminal In-Reply-To: References: <3F620007.2090103@srv.net> Message-ID: <3F622DCC.4050106@srv.net> John Lawson wrote: > I use VanDyke's CRT, on a n IBM Thinkpad laptop, as a console for my >11/44. > > I have a few VT220s and a re-badged Televideo VT100 lookalike, but when >I'm just mucking about as a 'single user', then I generally connect the PC >to the PDP via a funky adapter cable I cobbled together one dark and >stormy night. > > BTW: I use pins 2,3 and 7, and map them to the appropriate 9-pin pins on >the laptop side, whose exact pin numbers escape at the moment, but it's >too easy to find them out. > > Until you get a replacement 'tube', perhaps a nice terminal emulator on >your PC or Mac might get you going. There was a long thread recently on >Emulators for this purpose - a lot of us here use and like 'CRT', but >there are other products. FWIW, I have *never* had anything other than >horrible experiences with 'Hyperterm' that comes bundled in all Windows, >but YMMV. > > > NEVER try to do anything useful with HyperTerm. You will quickly find that it is the WORST vt100 emulator available. Besides starting up at 80x23, strange implementation of some of the basic escape sequences, and overall flakiness; the keyboard mapping is horrible. You can get either one backspace, or two or more deletes. You cannot send a single delete. 80/132 mode is non-existant. Gah! don't get me started! For a decent VT220 emulation, Kermit-95 on Windows, or even xterm on a recent version of Linux is MUCH nicer. ANYTHING else is better than HyperTerm. Others at least try to follow the stantards. From waltje at pdp11.nl Fri Sep 12 15:16:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: software for the decserver In-Reply-To: <02f401c3793f$03f53d10$0600000a@jeff> Message-ID: Jim, (and others) > did you ever find out where to get the software for the decserver 700? I have > some as well. See http://www.pdp1l.nl/Hardware/DECserver/ for a list ;-) Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From jpl15 at panix.com Fri Sep 12 15:35:00 2003 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: PCMCIA SCSI cards advice Message-ID: I was wondering if anyone had some experience and/or preferences with SCSI cards for laptops - specifically I want to hook my M4 Data 9914 9trk drive up to one of my laptop PCs (IBM or Dell) to archive/transport/backup tape images to-from the 11/44. Speaking of the 11/44 - I'm in the market for one or a couple of Pertec foramtter cards to fit the Kenedy 9100.. I have a Pertec Unibus card, just need the interface cards for the machines themselves. Also cables for same... ALSO: still looking for an (H960?) tall DEC rack to buy. Must have casters, would like to have the anti-tip legs, all other acoutrements unimportant. (power controller, logos, sides, etc). I will be at VCF 6 in October, and can pick up these items in that general area then. Cheerz John PS: yes, yes, I know - Marketplace!! Okay, already.... From vance at neurotica.com Fri Sep 12 15:49:01 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030911132616.031026f0@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 11 Sep 2003, Mike Ford wrote: > >I am sure there are alot of chemicals made from natural material that > >keep bugs away (like citronella candles keep insects away at outdoor > >parties. > > I dust with Boric Acid, and leave packets of poison bait; one for > rodents, one for insects. For insects, you can use chili powder. They love to eat it, and the capsaicin kills them. Peace... Sridhar From vance at neurotica.com Fri Sep 12 16:00:00 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: CCCP In-Reply-To: <002d01c378fd$83dd8e20$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: I'm interested, but Word won't be readable here. Peace... Sridhar On Fri, 12 Sep 2003, Nico de Jong wrote: > I just found a paper "The Soviet Bloc's Unified System of Computers", > written by N.C.Davis and S.E.Goodman, published in "computing Surveys, > Vol. 10, no.2, Juni 1978" Depending on how many people are interested in > this piece of history, I can make up a Word document, including a scan > of the tables and figures prevented. Nico From eric at brouhaha.com Fri Sep 12 16:13:01 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: PCMCIA SCSI cards advice In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4189.4.20.168.129.1063400722.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> > I was wondering if anyone had some experience and/or preferences with > SCSI cards for laptops - specifically I want to hook my M4 Data 9914 > 9trk drive up to one of my laptop PCs (IBM or Dell) to archive/ > transport/backup tape images to-from the 11/44. I use an Adaptec APA-1480 (32-bit Cardbus) with an HP 88780 9-track drive. Back when I was using an older laptop that didn't support Cardbus, I used the APA-1460 (16-bit PCMCIA). I use them with Linux, but of course they work with Windows as well. The 1460 works with DOS, but the 1480 does not. From waltje at pdp11.nl Fri Sep 12 16:35:01 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: PCMCIA SCSI cards advice In-Reply-To: <4189.4.20.168.129.1063400722.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Sep 2003, Eric Smith wrote: > I use an Adaptec APA-1480 (32-bit Cardbus) with an HP 88780 9-track > drive. Back when I was using an older laptop that didn't support Cardbus, > I used the APA-1460 (16-bit PCMCIA). > > I use them with Linux, but of course they work with Windows as well. > The 1460 works with DOS, but the 1480 does not. Same here, I grabbed a 1460, which works fine with both DOS and Win32, and probably the BSD's and Linux as well, for those who care. Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From patrick at evocative.com Fri Sep 12 17:37:01 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Heathkit 4801 EPROM Programmer Message-ID: Does anyone have a Heathkit 4801 EPROM programmer? Please contact me off list... --Patrick From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Fri Sep 12 17:41:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Looking for IBM Technical Reference Manual In-Reply-To: <1063372264.963.1.camel@prk> from "Prk" at Sep 12, 3 03:11:05 pm Message-ID: > Hello all! > > I have been searching the web looking for the original IBM PC/XT > schematics. I read on some post that they were published in the "IBM > Technical Reference Manual" and in the "Microcornucopia" magazine, but I Indeed the motherboard and keyboard schematics are in the IBM PC/XT (and Portable PC) TechRef. The I/O cards, drives, monitors, etc are in early versions of that manual, but later they were all moved into the Options and Adapters TechRef. > couldn't find it anywhere. Please, could you tell me where can I find > those schemes? Please, if anyone has it, can you make a scan and post > it? I have a shelf of TechRefs (include the XT one), but no scanner :-( -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Fri Sep 12 17:41:07 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: HP 85B Schematics wanted In-Reply-To: <3F61E060.1060405@undertheoaks.net> from "Dave C." at Sep 12, 3 08:04:00 am Message-ID: > I am working on a HP 85B with a dead power supply. No +5, +12 just > 37volts on the large cap on the power supply board. Can anyone please > help. Schmatics would be great! - Dave How different is the PSU to the HP85 PSU? The schematics for that are in the HP85 'Assembly Level Service Manual' (yes, it sounds like a board-swapper guide, but there are full schematics in the back). That's on the MoHPC CD-ROMs... -tony From dave at undertheoaks.net Fri Sep 12 18:07:00 2003 From: dave at undertheoaks.net (Dave C.) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: HP 85B Schematics wanted In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F624FC3.4060403@undertheoaks.net> Thanks Tony. I now have that schematic in PDF format. - Dave Tony Duell wrote: >>I am working on a HP 85B with a dead power supply. No +5, +12 just >>37volts on the large cap on the power supply board. Can anyone please >>help. Schmatics would be great! - Dave >> >> > >How different is the PSU to the HP85 PSU? The schematics for that are in >the HP85 'Assembly Level Service Manual' (yes, it sounds like a >board-swapper guide, but there are full schematics in the back). That's >on the MoHPC CD-ROMs... > >-tony From geoffr at zipcon.net Fri Sep 12 19:41:00 2003 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals In-Reply-To: <20030912100136.60114.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com> References: <000a01c378ff$712a5860$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> <20030912100136.60114.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.2.20030912173703.05fd55e0@mail.zipcon.net> Omnipage Pro At 03:01 AM 9/12/03, you wrote: >Hi, > >Any recommendations for OCR software (preferably Windows 2000 - spit!) that'll >allow the user to read from a image file rather than the software being >incorporated with scanner software? > >Pete kindly loaned me a whole pile of documentation, and I can get it back to >him far quicker if I can just scan all the pages as TIFF images for now and >worry about passing it through OCR software at a later date! > >It would also be nice if said software was a) free :) and b) able to >automatically recurse through a directory tree (or at least run from the >command line without user input so that I can script that) > >cheers > >Jules > > > >===== >Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to >make a bell ring. > >________________________________________________________________________ >Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! >Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From hansp at citem.org Fri Sep 12 20:39:00 2003 From: hansp at citem.org (Hans B Pufal) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: CCCP In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F6273B2.4000002@citem.org> vance@neurotica.com wrote: >I'm interested, but Word won't be readable here. > > I'm interested also. I'd be happy to post a PDF version of the word doc. -- hbp From fernande at internet1.net Fri Sep 12 21:07:00 2003 From: fernande at internet1.net (Chad Fernandez) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Gawd damn bugs! In-Reply-To: <002601c37942$879076a0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> References: <002601c37942$879076a0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <3F6279EB.7040205@internet1.net> About 1/2" long? Those are wood ants..... at least thats what we call them around here. Chad Fernandez Michigan, USA TeoZ wrote: > I had a few of the larger black ones during the summer, nothing major just > annoying (you see maybe 1 crawling around a room) From fernande at internet1.net Fri Sep 12 21:10:00 2003 From: fernande at internet1.net (Chad Fernandez) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Looking for IBM Technical Reference Manual In-Reply-To: <20030912120931.L76684@newshell.lmi.net> References: <1063372264.963.1.camel@prk> <20030912120931.L76684@newshell.lmi.net> Message-ID: <3F627A9B.6080509@internet1.net> Sony never made a PS/2, they only make a PS2 :-) I think I heard that Sony has made something like 60 million of them, now. Has that passed IBM PS/2 numbers yet? Chad Fernandez Michigan, USA Fred Cisin wrote: > until the PS/2 (real one from IBM, NOT SONY!), ALL of the IBM hardware > technical reference manuals had full schematics and source code for the > BIOS. From cisin at xenosoft.com Fri Sep 12 22:30:01 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Looking for IBM Technical Reference Manual In-Reply-To: <3F627A9B.6080509@internet1.net> References: <1063372264.963.1.camel@prk> <20030912120931.L76684@newshell.lmi.net> <3F627A9B.6080509@internet1.net> Message-ID: <20030912201816.R89044@newshell.lmi.net> On Fri, 12 Sep 2003, Chad Fernandez wrote: > Sony never made a PS/2, they only make a PS2 :-) Thanks I'm very ignorant about those "new" machines. Some people pronounced IBM's offerings as "PS over 2", as in "why would anybody want a half a personal system, or half an OS?" From dlw at trailingedge.com Fri Sep 12 23:21:00 2003 From: dlw at trailingedge.com (David Williams) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Apple II SCSI card upgrade? In-Reply-To: <007601c37933$56a12440$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <3F62532D.6883.191B4105@localhost> Thanks. Now is there someone out there that can help me burn a rom? Don't have a burner here. On 12 Sep 2003 at 9:39, TeoZ wrote: > You need to get the rom burned if you have a programmer or have somebody do > it. > I have the rom file available but didnt have the burner so I asked around > and a kind person made me a copy (awaiting delivery). > > If you need the rom file > > http://homepage.mac.com/WebObjects/FileSharing.woa/2/wo/RyPj4BJm3ZljFod0.1/0.2.1.2.19.31.97.0.35.0.1.1.1?user=wayne_stewart&fpath=eproms&templatefn=FileSharing1.html > > get it there (scsi_rev_c.bin.zip). ----- "If you want to see it, see into it directly; but when you stop to think about it, it is altogether missed." "When the mind is free of any thought or judgement, then and only then can we know things as they are." David Williams - Computer Packrat dlw@trailingedge.com http://www.trailingedge.com From nico at farumdata.dk Sat Sep 13 01:37:01 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: PCMCIA SCSI cards advice References: Message-ID: <002201c379bf$eb051880$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> From: "John Lawson" To: Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 10:27 PM Subject: PCMCIA SCSI cards advice > I was wondering if anyone had some experience and/or preferences with > SCSI cards for laptops - specifically I want to hook my M4 Data 9914 9trk > drive up to one of my laptop PCs (IBM or Dell) to archive/transport/backup > tape images to-from the 11/44. > The Adaptec 1460 (if I remember the number correctly, or was it 1640?) will do just fine. Nico From vance at neurotica.com Sat Sep 13 01:52:01 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: PCMCIA SCSI cards advice In-Reply-To: <002201c379bf$eb051880$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: On Sat, 13 Sep 2003, Nico de Jong wrote: > > I was wondering if anyone had some experience and/or preferences > > with SCSI cards for laptops - specifically I want to hook my M4 Data > > 9914 9trk drive up to one of my laptop PCs (IBM or Dell) to > > archive/transport/backup tape images to-from the 11/44. > > The Adaptec 1460 (if I remember the number correctly, or was it 1640?) > will do just fine. Nico It's 1460. The 1640 is a MicroChannel SCSI card. Peace... Sridhar From waltje at pdp11.nl Sat Sep 13 04:03:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: software for the decserver In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I wrote: > See http://www.pdp1l.nl/Hardware/DECserver/ for a list ;-) We probably want to make that http://www.pdp11.nl/Hardware/Network/DECserver since that's where it is. Add a /default.htm if your browser is hardwired to request "index.htm(l)" files. Thanks to Shridhar.. I promise that next time, I'll sleep BEFORE posting ;-) Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From arcarlini at iee.org Sat Sep 13 09:22:00 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.22.2.20030912173703.05fd55e0@mail.zipcon.net> Message-ID: <004301c37a01$45b56e60$5b01a8c0@athlon> I used OmniPage Pro (11 I think, but there are newer versions now). I also tried FineReader V4 or V5 (whichever turned up on the front of PC Plus one month) and it was OK too (at that time V6 was current). Neither of them could cope with the Options/Module list that Eric Smith posted some time back so I've only made very limited use of them. As long as you scan the stuff now while you have it, you can OCR at your leisure when the technology improves (and requires far less proof-reading). Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From jpl15 at panix.com Sat Sep 13 09:58:00 2003 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Thanks all for SCSI PCMCIA card advice Message-ID: I have an Adaptec 1460D on order, will pick it up Monday - under $100, too. Hmmmm... I wonder what a SCSI-to-ESDI converter would entail.... that might be fun. Cheers, and thanks to everyone for the nearly unanimous helpful advice! John From vcf at siconic.com Sat Sep 13 11:16:01 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Aries Research Marix MS Message-ID: I have just recently come into several Aries Research Marix MS workstations completely with keyboard, mouse, optical mousepad and monitor. This is some sort of Sun Sparc clone. I haven't tested them but if there is significant interest then I will do so and come up with a reasonable price for each. The shipping on the monitor may be a tad high as they are all about 19". Please let me know... -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From eric at brouhaha.com Sat Sep 13 11:58:00 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals In-Reply-To: <004301c37a01$45b56e60$5b01a8c0@athlon> References: <6.0.0.22.2.20030912173703.05fd55e0@mail.zipcon.net> <004301c37a01$45b56e60$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: <3169.4.20.168.129.1063471822.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "Antonio Carlini" wrote: > As long as you scan the stuff now while you have it, you can OCR at your > leisure when the technology improves (and requires far less > proof-reading). Note that you should NEVER save scans of text and line art in a lossy form such as JPEG. JPEG works for continuous-tone images such as photographs by deliberately throwing away high-frequency components. Test and line art contain sharp black-to-white transitions (and vice versa, of course) which get smeared by this compression, resulting in a blurry image. For text and line art, a lossless bilevel compression such as G3 or G4 fax format (used in some TIFF files), JBIG, JBIG2, Flate (used in some PNG files). You can't assume that because you save in TIFF or PNG that you get a specific form of compression, since they are very broad standards that support multiple compression types. Sometimes people tell me that JPEG is alright if you only compress slightly. The edges still get blurry, and the resulting file size is generally *MUCH* larger than if you use G4 or JBIG. JBIG gets 10-20% better compression than G4, but it is patented, so I don't use it. Flate usually compresses somewhat better than G4, and is not patented, but I'm not sure how it compares to JBIG. I'm not using it because support is not widespread yet. G4 works well because it can be wrapped in PDF and used by any PDF viewer. Bilevel compression doesn't work well on continuous tone images, so JPEG should be used for those. The main dilemma for scanning is pages that contain a mix of text/ line art and continuous tone images. My personal reccomendation for these is to either scan the page twice, in B&W and color (or gray scale), or to scan it once to uncompressed color (or gray scale) then convert to both bilevel and JPEG in software. Apparently some "best practice" policies for document archiving specifically state that a document should only be scanned once. I think they're just trying to minimize handling of fragile documents, so I don't think they really mean that taking two scans of a page (consecutively without manipulating the physical document) is bad. These "best practice" policies also recommend a minimum of 600 DPI, which is reasonable for continuous tone images but is normally overkill for text and line art. I typically use 300 or 400 DPI. I've written a program to take B&W TIFF files and color or B&W JPEG files and produce a PDF file: http://tumble.brouhaha.com/ My future plans for tumble include compositing text and line art with continuous tone images on a single page. I've got a script for GIMP to take an uncompressed color or gray scale scan (in PGM or PPM format), allow manual selection of the continuous tone images, then save two separate files. I've been thinking about trying to automate this by having the filter use histograms and FFT to locate the images. I'm not sure when I'll have time to work on this further, though. Eric From healyzh at aracnet.com Sat Sep 13 12:02:24 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: DEC BA356 question Message-ID: I need my memory refreshed. Recently I *FINALLY* obtained a pair of BA356 shelves, one of which has the Wide personality module (I've also got a pair of narrow modules sitting on a shelf, that are still in the box, that I've had for years). So, my question is this, is it safe to have the Wide personality module in the shelf, and mix narrow and wide drives? My memory says that it is, but.... I'll only be doing this long enough to transfer data off of three Narrow drives onto Wide drives. Now to see if the stars are truly right and I'll be able to do this upgrade this weekend... Zane -- -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From jrkeys at concentric.net Sat Sep 13 12:05:00 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Amiga 4000 asking $7000 on eBay Message-ID: <009201c37a17$b808b240$eb0cdd40@oemcomputer> Check out this system. I have nothing to do with the sale. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3430659156&category=4598 From bshannon at tiac.net Sat Sep 13 12:06:42 2003 From: bshannon at tiac.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: FA: HEWLETT-PACKARD 1000 E-SERIES COMPUTER(2720) References: <3.0.6.32.20030910204730.007aec90@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3F634C73.9050006@tiac.net> Tempting! Its clearly got a good power supply and CPU, from the state of the front panel lights. But I do have a decent stack of machines now, and a spare power supply due from Crisis. With that power supply, I'd be able to build another working machine from tested spares. So if I get another CPU, its got to be an F-series machine. Want to make a deal on the F-series you told me about (when asking about the Imsai)? Joe wrote: >Spotted on E-bay > > > Joe From teoz at neo.rr.com Sat Sep 13 12:15:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Amiga 4000 asking $7000 on eBay References: <009201c37a17$b808b240$eb0cdd40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <01a601c37a19$7f3d4a00$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Keys" To: "cctalk@classiccmp" Sent: Saturday, September 13, 2003 12:54 PM Subject: Amiga 4000 asking $7000 on eBay > Check out this system. I have nothing to do with the sale. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3430659156&category=4598 Kind of overpriced unless it contains Jessica Simpsons honeymoon XXX video on the HD. From healyzh at aracnet.com Sat Sep 13 12:44:01 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Amiga 4000 asking $7000 on eBay In-Reply-To: <009201c37a17$b808b240$eb0cdd40@oemcomputer> References: <009201c37a17$b808b240$eb0cdd40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: >Check out this system. I have nothing to do with the sale. >http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3430659156&category=4598 You have *GOT* to be kidding! Is there anything there: "Commodore Amiga 4000 CPU in a HighFlyer expansion with Newtek-Video Toaster 4000, (3) hard drives=15 gigs., Piccasso graphic board, (2) TBCIII (time base corrector), Emplant (Mac Emulator) board, Studio 16 sound board, Commodore 1084s color Monitor, Panasonic 7750 SVHS with frame advance chip " that warrents this kind of a price? Yes, it's a nice system, however, it doesn 't say anything about an accelerator, or a way of allowing extra RAM, and it just says Piccasso, not Piccasso IV. I can't imagine the video specific HW being worth anywhere near $7000. For that price I can get a brand new, decked out G5 that can do the same kind of work, only better. Zane -- -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From als at thangorodrim.de Sat Sep 13 13:08:01 2003 From: als at thangorodrim.de (Alexander Schreiber) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals In-Reply-To: <3169.4.20.168.129.1063471822.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> References: <6.0.0.22.2.20030912173703.05fd55e0@mail.zipcon.net> <004301c37a01$45b56e60$5b01a8c0@athlon> <3169.4.20.168.129.1063471822.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <20030913175739.GA10085@mordor.angband.thangorodrim.de> On Sat, Sep 13, 2003 at 09:50:22AM -0700, Eric Smith wrote: > "Antonio Carlini" wrote: > > As long as you scan the stuff now while you have it, you can OCR at your > > leisure when the technology improves (and requires far less > > proof-reading). > > Note that you should NEVER save scans of text and line art in a lossy > form such as JPEG. JPEG works for continuous-tone images such as > photographs by deliberately throwing away high-frequency components. > Test and line art contain sharp black-to-white transitions (and vice > versa, of course) which get smeared by this compression, resulting in > a blurry image. I can only second that. I've cursed times and again at some fools who decided to scan some paper documents (fine so far) and use JPEG (lossy compressing intended for continous tone stuff like photo images) on black and white scans. The results are ugly, sometimes hard to read and a bitch to print properly. Oh, and this just made the work of OCRing this a _lot_ harder. > For text and line art, a lossless bilevel compression such as G3 or > G4 fax format (used in some TIFF files), JBIG, JBIG2, Flate (used in > some PNG files). You can't assume that because you save in TIFF or PNG > that you get a specific form of compression, since they are very > broad standards that support multiple compression types. > > Sometimes people tell me that JPEG is alright if you only compress > slightly. The edges still get blurry, and the resulting file size > is generally *MUCH* larger than if you use G4 or JBIG. Of course the files are bigger. The lossy algorithm for JPEG was designed to work on continous toned images (where it works fine) and just runs into the wall with black and white stuff. Where the algorithm expects to find lots of low/middle frequency and some high frequency data, it suddenly is faced with high frequency data alone. No smooth color value curves that can be nicely compressed. Using JPEG for compressing black and white is like using a Ferrari for pulling a trailer full of grain - it gets the stuff moving, but you really, really should use a proper truck for this job. > I've written a program to take B&W TIFF files and color or B&W JPEG > files and produce a PDF file: > http://tumble.brouhaha.com/ Thanks for writing this program. I'm in the process of archiving the interesting articles from a stack of computer magazines and am currently experimenting with the best way to convert dead trees to PDF files. So far, scanning the paper as lineart at 600 dpi, saving as fax G4 compressed tiff and using tumble to combine those into PDF files yields the best (best quality, smallest files) results. Regards, Alex. -- "Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work." -- Thomas A. Edison From ghldbrd at ccp.com Sat Sep 13 13:42:00 2003 From: ghldbrd at ccp.com (ghldbrd@ccp.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Amiga 4000 asking $7000 on eBay In-Reply-To: References: <009201c37a17$b808b240$eb0cdd40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <4100.65.123.179.185.1063478010.squirrel@webmail.ccp.com> Verrrrrrry interesting, but who in h*!! came up with that as a price? I've been looking at toasters/fliers off and on, and seen similar setups asking a grand, and getting NO bids. Caveat emptor. Then again, this is e-pay/e-greed so anything might happen. Gary Hildebrand St. Joseph, MO >>Check out this system. I have nothing to do with the sale. >>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3430659156&category=4598 > > You have *GOT* to be kidding! Is there anything there: > "Commodore Amiga 4000 CPU in a HighFlyer expansion with Newtek-Video > Toaster 4000, (3) hard drives=15 gigs., Piccasso graphic board, (2) TBCIII > (time base corrector), Emplant (Mac Emulator) board, Studio 16 sound > board, Commodore 1084s color Monitor, Panasonic 7750 SVHS with frame > advance chip " > that warrents this kind of a price? Yes, it's a nice system, however, it > doesn 't say anything about an accelerator, or a way of allowing extra > RAM, and it just says Piccasso, not Piccasso IV. I can't imagine the > video specific HW being worth anywhere near $7000. > > For that price I can get a brand new, decked out G5 that can do the same > kind of work, only better. > > Zane > > -- > -- > | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | > | healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | > | | Classic Computer Collector | > +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ > | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | > | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | > | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From allain at panix.com Sat Sep 13 13:52:00 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals References: <004301c37a01$45b56e60$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: <003b01c37a26$bc0fbdc0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> > Neither of them could cope with the Options/Module list that > Eric Smith posted some time back... Somebody re-post this URL and I give a try at it with what I've got here, a conjoined image editor/OCR suite. John A. From healyzh at aracnet.com Sat Sep 13 14:43:00 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:50 2005 Subject: Amiga 4000 asking $7000 on eBay In-Reply-To: <4100.65.123.179.185.1063478010.squirrel@webmail.ccp.com> References: <009201c37a17$b808b240$eb0cdd40@oemcomputer> <4100.65.123.179.185.1063478010.squirrel@webmail.ccp.com> Message-ID: >Verrrrrrry interesting, but who in h*!! came up with that as a price? >I've been looking at toasters/fliers off and on, and seen similar setups >asking a grand, and getting NO bids. > >Caveat emptor. Then again, this is e-pay/e-greed so anything might happen. > >Gary Hildebrand >St. Joseph, MO Well... The seller also has ZERO feedback, so part of this might be that he's just some eBay newby looking to get rid of a system that he spent a fortune on about 10 years ago, and really has no clue as to the current value, or lack there of. Zane -- -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From doc at mdrconsult.com Sat Sep 13 14:52:00 2003 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: DEC BA356 question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F637374.7060509@mdrconsult.com> Zane H. Healy wrote: > I need my memory refreshed. Recently I *FINALLY* obtained a pair of BA356 shelves, one of which has the Wide personality module (I've also got a pair of narrow modules sitting on a shelf, that are still in the box, that I've had for years). > > So, my question is this, is it safe to have the Wide personality module in the shelf, and mix narrow and wide drives? My memory says that it is, but.... I'll only be doing this long enough to transfer data off of three Narrow drives onto Wide drives. Works just fine in the AS2100, though it naturally slows things down quite a bit. Doc From healyzh at aracnet.com Sat Sep 13 15:14:01 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: DEC BA356 question In-Reply-To: <3F637374.7060509@mdrconsult.com> References: <3F637374.7060509@mdrconsult.com> Message-ID: > Works just fine in the AS2100, though it naturally slows things down quite a bit. Speed isn't an issue, transferring the data to the Wide drives is. Once I get the data transferred the system will be shut down and the Narrow drives will be pulled to make room for further Wide drives. I'm planning as part of the upgrade to finally start using Volume Shadowing on this system! Zane -- -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From emu at ecubics.com Sat Sep 13 16:40:00 2003 From: emu at ecubics.com (emanuel stiebler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: MacOS 8.6 or 9.1 Message-ID: <3F638EEB.30800@ecubics.com> Anybody has a good Source for them ? My hardrive crashed, and I got the machine with the OS installed :( Checking ebay already regularly, but no luck there :( cheers & thanks From jwest at classiccmp.org Sat Sep 13 18:33:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: FA: HEWLETT-PACKARD 1000 E-SERIES COMPUTER(2720) References: <3.0.6.32.20030910204730.007aec90@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <3F634C73.9050006@tiac.net> Message-ID: <001901c37a4e$4e9e49a0$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Bob Shannon wrote... > Tempting! > > Its clearly got a good power supply and CPU, from the state of the front > panel lights. > Never thought I'd say this... but I've finally got way too many HP1000 E series machines. I'll trade anyone E series machines for M series machines.... Jay West From eric at brouhaha.com Sat Sep 13 19:14:00 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals In-Reply-To: <003b01c37a26$bc0fbdc0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> References: <004301c37a01$45b56e60$5b01a8c0@athlon> <003b01c37a26$bc0fbdc0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <33348.64.169.63.74.1063497964.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> >> Neither of them could cope with the Options/Module list that >> Eric Smith posted some time back... > > Somebody re-post this URL and I give a try at it with what > I've got here, a conjoined image editor/OCR suite. http://www.brouhaha.com/~eric/retrocomputing/dec/doc/oml/ Personally, I don't think OCR for this will be of even the slightest use, but you are of course welcome to try. From netsurfer_x1 at fastmailbox.net Sun Sep 14 02:07:00 2003 From: netsurfer_x1 at fastmailbox.net (David Vohs) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: (Ping) Paging Jim Willing, paging Jim Willing. Message-ID: <20030914065853.023CC1D47F@www.fastmail.fm> I'm looking fo Jim Willing. I need to talk to him ASAP. -- David Vohs netsurfer_x1@fastmailbox.net -- http://www.fastmail.fm - Sent 0.000002 seconds ago From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Sun Sep 14 06:50:00 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals In-Reply-To: <3169.4.20.168.129.1063471822.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <20030914114233.86988.qmail@web21103.mail.yahoo.com> --- Eric Smith wrote: > > Note that you should NEVER save scans of text and line art in a lossy > form such as JPEG. Absolutely - I tend to save everything as TIFF format and in as high a resolution as seems practical (occasionally I'll use Paint Shop Pro's format if I need something with layer support). I'm not a big fan of JPEG images... I'm hoping to get away with scanning things at 300dpi (in this case it's all printed documentation with a few diagrams, rather than colour images). Not only will that save space but I can also use my older scanner (which won't do more than 300dpi I believe, but is at least SCSI and so should transfer data to the host a little quicker). I'm a little wary of saving things in mono as somebody else mentioned - I'm sure that could have a negative effect on the OCR process at a later date. Greyscale (8 bit) I expect is fine though. > I've written a program to take B&W TIFF files and color or B&W JPEG > files and produce a PDF file: > http://tumble.brouhaha.com/ I'll have a look at that - might come in handy. :-) Image processing/manipulation I do find pretty interesting.,,, cheers Jules ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From pdm4606 at sbcglobal.net Sun Sep 14 09:05:00 2003 From: pdm4606 at sbcglobal.net (Paul Mika) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: MacOS 8.6 or 9.1 In-Reply-To: <3F638EEB.30800@ecubics.com> Message-ID: > Anybody has a good Source for them ? > My hardrive crashed, and I got the machine with the OS installed :( > Checking ebay already regularly, but no luck there :( > > cheers & thanks emanual steibler; I use the mac 8.5 cd then download the 8.6 update from apple. It seems to work good until lately. Now have reinstalled several times with the same settings on the same machine (mac 8600) and in a few weeks must do it all over again. A mac bug somewhere??? I think you can get 8.5 from apple, if your machine can get working at all. wanna try transfer at e-mail speeds? will take forever. paul mika From cheri-post at web.de Sun Sep 14 09:16:00 2003 From: cheri-post at web.de (Pierre Gebhardt) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: specifications for IBM XT-286 Message-ID: <200309141407.h8EE7SQ10818@mailgate5.cinetic.de> Hi all, can anybody tell me, what harddrive and disk drives (modelnumber and company) are built in a IBM XT-286 ? I found such a machine 2 months ago. Unfortunately, all the drives are missing. The machine itself semms to be in a godd condition. Thanks alot in advance for your help! Pierre ______________________________________________________________________________ 38xTestsieger - WEB.DE FreeMail - Deutschlands beste E-Mail Jeden Monat mit 10% mehr Leistung! http://f.web.de/?mc=021138 From arcarlini at iee.org Sun Sep 14 09:25:01 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals In-Reply-To: <20030914114233.86988.qmail@web21103.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000c01c37aca$efdd8340$5b01a8c0@athlon> > I'm a little wary of saving things in mono as somebody else > mentioned - I'm sure that could have a negative effect on the > OCR process at a later date. Greyscale (8 bit) I expect is > fine though. I've not found OCR to perform any better on greyscale than 1-bit per pixel. IIRC you also cannot use G4 with greyscale, although my memory may be wrong on this. Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From paul at frixxon.co.uk Sun Sep 14 09:30:01 2003 From: paul at frixxon.co.uk (Paul Williams) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals In-Reply-To: <000c01c37aca$efdd8340$5b01a8c0@athlon> References: <000c01c37aca$efdd8340$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: <3F647951.3000309@frixxon.co.uk> Antonio Carlini wrote: > IIRC you also cannot use G4 with greyscale > although my memory may be wrong on this. Correct. - Paul From gehrich at tampabay.rr.com Sun Sep 14 09:34:00 2003 From: gehrich at tampabay.rr.com (Gene Ehrich) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: specifications for IBM XT-286 In-Reply-To: <200309141407.h8EE7SQ10818@mailgate5.cinetic.de> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20030914102439.020e54b0@pop-server> At 04:07 PM 9/14/2003 +0200, you wrote: >Hi all, > >can anybody tell me, what harddrive and disk drives (modelnumber and >company) are built in a IBM XT-286 ? >I found such a machine 2 months ago. Unfortunately, all the drives are >missing. >The machine itself semms to be in a godd condition. I had one and it came with a 10MB hard drive which failed after a year or so and I replaced it with a 20mb one for $800 way back then From teoz at neo.rr.com Sun Sep 14 10:24:01 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals References: <000c01c37aca$efdd8340$5b01a8c0@athlon> <3F647951.3000309@frixxon.co.uk> Message-ID: <002301c37ad3$1c2b6540$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Williams" To: Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2003 10:21 AM Subject: Re: OCR'ing old manuals > Antonio Carlini wrote: > > > IIRC you also cannot use G4 with greyscale > > although my memory may be wrong on this. > > Correct. > > - Paul Does somebody have an ftp or website with manuals scanned to pdfs? Anybody ever see the extended manuals for Apple A/UX 2 or 3 in pdf format? From Innfogra at aol.com Sun Sep 14 10:29:00 2003 From: Innfogra at aol.com (Innfogra@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: specifications for IBM XT-286 Message-ID: <8f.31d640bc.2c95e151@aol.com> According to my records the XT/286 (5162-286) came with a std 20 Meg HD, a MFM drive with 4 heads, 615 Cyl, 17 sectors, a 65 ms Drive. AT type 2. Came with one 1.2 Meg floppy and could take an additional floppy or tape drive. Paxton From allain at panix.com Sun Sep 14 10:34:00 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: OCR'ing old manuals References: <000c01c37aca$efdd8340$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: <003501c37ad4$37956960$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> > I'm a little wary of saving things in mono as somebody else > mentioned - I'm sure that could have a negative effect on the > OCR process at a later date. Greyscale (8 bit) I expect is > fine though. I usually use greyscale with a good interpolator to increase my dpi 2 to 3x linearly (increasing the dotcount 4 to 9x overall) and Then cast it to 1 bit. Works great. Just going directly from 8 bit to 1 bit at the same dpi is a waste of good information. John A. From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Sun Sep 14 11:41:00 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Dilog DQ100 support Message-ID: <030914114632.d19b@splab.cas.neu.edu> I am going to try to find a Dilog DQ100 board to use with some diablo 31 drives I have in order to read some DEC RK05s I have. Before I waste my time, does anybody have either a board or the documents for the controller? If I find a controller, I have no Idea how to set it up. Thanks Joe Heck From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Sun Sep 14 11:42:01 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Manuals for the postage Message-ID: <030914123017.d19b@splab.cas.neu.edu> I'm cleaning out. Here are the manuals going into the recycling bin in the next week or two. If you want them, ask now... Able Computer Q/DH controller user guide,10177x07, oct 1982 Monolithic Systems Corp, MSC 4604 LSI-11 dual-high memory system, 100-0093-0000, 1978 Cambex microstor-1123 256 K-words users manual 207-105-460 rev D, MDB systems product brochure , BA11, RK, RM (SMD) TM11, etc. Data Translation DT3362 series A/D subsystems, UM-00070-f, 1986 MDB-DZ11 asyncronous mux, for pdp11 and vax, 1981 Clearpoint QRAM 22B user manual Control Data Corp PBS and PB-1130 band printer operating and maintaining about 1982 National Semiconductor product spec and installation NS11/2P 32K max x 18 MAX 4230007, 1978 National Semiconductor install guide NS23M 256k byte memory 1984 Datacube VG-150 bitmap graphics controller software, UM0020-1, feb 1985 Datacube VG-150 bitmap graphics controller hardware, UM0019-1, Feb 1985 Ciprico Rimfire 44 product spec, 210100444, Sept 1982 Computer Dynamics Win-358 winchester controller board users manual 1985 MDB systems computer interface products for 11/2 and 11/23 computers and price list, late 1981 MDB systems MLSI-DZ11 async mux for lsi-11, instruction manual, 80040359, 1982 Ciprico quartermaster multibus quarter inch mag tape adapter product spec 21010079, july 1984 DEC vt103 system configuration guide, ek-vt103-cg-001, 1981 Ciprico tapemaster multibus 1/2 inch tape adapteor, product spec,21010011 septermger 1985 try that again september 1985 Ciprico tapemaster multibus 1/2 inch tape adaptor application note, 21010001, july 1985 National semiconductor NS44F 512k byte ecc memory installation guide, 1983 Ciprico rimfire 50 multibus SMD disk controller product specification, 21010050, feb 1985 MDB MLSI-DLV11 async serial line interface instruction manual, 1978 ( I probably have boards as well) DATACUBE CM-169 writable control store users manual UM0021-1, feb 1985 ADAC model 1900 LSI-11 to Unibus translator instruction manual GTSC model 309 async mux model 309 instruction manual, IM1284 (might have boards) GTSC models 364-369 ditital I/O boards im 1182 GTSC model 306 RTC and clock Calendar, 979-0021-306, sept 1986 (might have board) GTSC model 304 serial I/O board, IM-983 (older manual) GTSC model 304 schematics, 1982 GTSC model 304 serial I/O board, 12/84, newer manual Clearpoint DCME-Q user manual rev 1.03, 1988 Heathkit H11-2 parallel interface module schematic Heathkit WH9-1, WH8-51, WH11-51, WH8-41 adapter cables instructions Heathkit H11-2 illistration booklet Heathkit WHA11-5 serial interface module schematic Heathkit H11-5 illistration booklet Heath/Zenith model WHA11-5 serial interface module operation/service manual 1979 Heathkit H11-5 serial interface module 1977 Heathkit H11-2 parallel interface module 1977 Heathkit H11-5 schematic I have a 6 inch stack of AFDAC manuals, way too many thing to list. If you have any interest in the aADAC stuff, let me know, I'll figure something out. I also have a photocopy of (almost) the whole HP-PLOT/21 manual. Regards, Joe Heck From jpl15 at panix.com Sun Sep 14 12:07:00 2003 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Manuals for the postage In-Reply-To: <030914123017.d19b@splab.cas.neu.edu> References: <030914123017.d19b@splab.cas.neu.edu> Message-ID: On Sun, 14 Sep 2003 TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu wrote: > I'm cleaning out. Good: I'm accreting again. sigh... > > Here are the manuals going into the recycling bin in the next week or two. > If you want them, ask now... > I would like the acquire the following, if not already Spoken For: > MDB systems product brochure , BA11, RK, RM (SMD) TM11, etc. > Data Translation DT3362 series A/D subsystems, UM-00070-f, 1986 > MDB-DZ11 asyncronous mux, for pdp11 and vax, 1981 > MDB systems computer interface products for 11/2 and 11/23 computers > and price list, late 1981 > MDB systems MLSI-DZ11 async mux for lsi-11, instruction manual, 80040359, > 1982 > 21010079, july 1984 > DEC vt103 system configuration guide, ek-vt103-cg-001, 1981 > MDB MLSI-DLV11 async serial line interface instruction manual, 1978 > ( I probably have boards as well) > ADAC model 1900 LSI-11 to Unibus translator instruction manual Let me know; shipping to zip 89706 (Carson City, NV) Thanks!! John From vcf at siconic.com Sun Sep 14 12:19:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Trouble with Magnavox Odyssey In-Reply-To: <20030910104021.O13926-100000@outpost.timeguy.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Sep 2003, Bill Richman wrote: > Um - you _are_ using a tuner and not a composite video input on the Yes. > monitor, right? There's a "channel select" switch on the bottom of the > console that lets you pick something like channel 3 or 4. You can safely The switch is actually somewhat hidden inside the battery compartment. You need a long, thin tool to get to it. > leave out the little box with the slide switch on it, as it's just there > to let you select the antenna input or the Odyssey to your TV without > moving wires. Sure, but the connector in the end of the cable is exceedingly funky. You really need the switchbox just to convert the cable end into something more adaptable. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vance at neurotica.com Sun Sep 14 12:57:00 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: specifications for IBM XT-286 In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.2.20030914102439.020e54b0@pop-server> Message-ID: When I bought one way back then, it didn't come with a hard drive. Just two floppies. Peace... Sridhar On Sun, 14 Sep 2003, Gene Ehrich wrote: > At 04:07 PM 9/14/2003 +0200, you wrote: > >Hi all, > > > >can anybody tell me, what harddrive and disk drives (modelnumber and > >company) are built in a IBM XT-286 ? > >I found such a machine 2 months ago. Unfortunately, all the drives are > >missing. > >The machine itself semms to be in a godd condition. > > I had one and it came with a 10MB hard drive which failed after a year or > so and I replaced it with a 20mb one for $800 way back then From waltje at pdp11.nl Sun Sep 14 15:18:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: DSM-11 (Digital Std MUMPS) info needed In-Reply-To: Message-ID: All, I'm finally done reading Luc VanElst's DSM-11 tapes. We now have working copies of DSM-11 V3.3 and V4.1 available. Does anyone have stuff like documentation, snippets, SPD's, etc with which I can liven up its website pages a bit? Right now, I pretty much know nothing about DSM ... ;-) Thnx, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From macfan at realdsl.com Sun Sep 14 16:03:00 2003 From: macfan at realdsl.com (macfan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Wanted to Buy or Trade for, Apple II/II+ ASSCII Keyboards Message-ID: <200309142102.h8EL27312103@huey.classiccmp.org> I am restoring some Apple II computers and in need of at least two, Apple II/II+ ASCII keyboards. If you have any that you would like to sell / trade to me or know of a source for these, please email me. Thank you in advance for any and all help Bob K. macfan macfan601 (eBay) From jrkeys at concentric.net Sun Sep 14 16:23:00 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Kaypro 10 goes for $355 Message-ID: <018b01c37b05$4706d970$ac0add40@oemcomputer> Check it out http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2752237662 From pat at purdueriots.com Sun Sep 14 17:24:01 2003 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: FS: DEC machines + Parts Message-ID: I've got more machines and parts to clear out to make room. Prices listed are per item, shipping is extra, I can ship via FEDEX ground express from West Lafayette, IN. 2ea - DECstation 5000/240, 32MB Ram, PMAGB-B framebuffer, LK-401 keyboard, VSXXX-GA mouse, console breakout cable, video cable. $20 - LK-401 keyboard $10 1ea - DEC BC29G-09 3W3 to 3xBNC video cable $10 - DEC BC13M-10 DA15S to keyboard/mouse (17-02640-01) - same as used with DECstation 5000's above $10 3ea - DEC VSXXX-GA mouse $10 I've got more things that I'll be posting as I sort through them. Pat -- Purdue University ITAP/RCS Information Technology at Purdue Research Computing and Storage http://www.itap.purdue.edu/rcs/ From kenziem at sympatico.ca Sun Sep 14 17:43:00 2003 From: kenziem at sympatico.ca (Mike) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Wanted to Buy or Trade for, Apple II/II+ ASSCII Keyboards In-Reply-To: <200309142102.h8EL27312103@huey.classiccmp.org> References: <200309142102.h8EL27312103@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <200309141834.19624.kenziem@sympatico.ca> On Sunday 14 September 2003 16:54, macfan wrote: > I am restoring some Apple II computers and in need of at least two, > Apple II/II+ ASCII keyboards. If you have any that you would like to > sell / trade to me or know of a source for these, please email me. Thank > you in advance for any and all help I have a few machines in my garage at the moment. They came from the local school board. Where are you located? What do you have to trade? mike -- Ottawa, Canada Collector of vintage computers http://www.ncf.ca/~ba600 From vcf at siconic.com Sun Sep 14 19:05:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Kaypro 10 goes for $355 In-Reply-To: <018b01c37b05$4706d970$ac0add40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: On Sun, 14 Sep 2003, Keys wrote: > Check it out > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2752237662 It's actually not *that* bad of a buy since it seems to be in very nice cosmetic condition, works, and has a lot of software and manuals. A fairly complete system. Still, a bit inflated. $150 would've been more appropriate, though perhaps still a tad high. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From esharpe at uswest.net Sun Sep 14 19:35:01 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Kaypro 10 goes for $355 References: <018b01c37b05$4706d970$ac0add40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <013201c37b28$7cbee760$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> It may be time to dig our extra one out of the closet. of course we would probably want to trade it for something else to fit in a display rather than money though..;....' Thanks! Ed Sharpe Archivist for SMECC See the Southwest Museum of Engineering, Communications and Computation online at: http://www.smecc.org----- Original Message ----- From: "Keys" To: "cctalk@classiccmp" Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2003 2:15 PM Subject: Kaypro 10 goes for $355 > Check it out > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2752237662 From rdd at rddavis.org Sun Sep 14 19:48:00 2003 From: rdd at rddavis.org (R. D. Davis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Needed - VT terminal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030915004313.GP21282@rhiannon.rddavis.org> Quothe Christopher Cureau, from writings of Fri, Sep 12, 2003 at 08:23:13AM -0500: > Does anyone have a spare VT220, 320 or 420 that they'd be willing to part > with? My 320 just bit the dust...very inconvenient time, too, since I was Wouldn't you rather repair it than replace it? What went wrong with it? Did the fuse blow? Is there high voltage on the CRT? Did part if the PSU fail? Is there anything displayed on the screen? -- Copyright (C) 2003 R. D. Davis The difference between humans & other animals: All Rights Reserved an unnatural belief that we're above Nature & rdd@rddavis.org 410-744-4900 her other creatures, using dogma to justify such http://www.rddavis.org beliefs and to justify much human cruelty. From patrick at evocative.com Sun Sep 14 20:53:00 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Cables Offered - Just Pay Postage Message-ID: I have four cables for anyone who wants them, for the price of postage ($3.85 for priority mail in US 48+DC, others inquire)... 1) Sony SMF-400 15-pin (HD-15M) VGA to five BNC connectors (wire colors black, grey, and red, green, and blue of course); 2) Three SGI (Sun too?) Video Cable 018-8219-001 13W3 (take one, two, or all three). First come, first served. --Patrick From jwest at classiccmp.org Sun Sep 14 21:23:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: HP 2895 (paper tape punch, facit 4070) assistance sought Message-ID: <001f01c37b2f$39ff2e10$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> This weekend I actually got around to building my final HP2000/Access system. Today was spent completely disassembling the dual bay rack, cleaning, touchup painting, and reassembling. I finally have the "right" racks that HP2000 was usually sold in, so everything matches the HP2000 site preparation and installation guide. I'm taking large amount of pictures of the restoration, and at some point I'll get them up on the web along with descriptions. I'm doing it with 2100's again, but I'm trying to come up with a way to use E series machines. One thing I was looking at... HP has a 2895 paper tape punch, which is actually a facit 4070 bit with a totally custom drawer/slide thing. I can not figure out how this thing is supposed to contact/mount with the rails in the rack to save my life. Does anyone have the 2895 rackmounted, who could offer a few key clues as to how it's mounted in their rack? The installation guide doesn't address rackmounting. Thanks for any help! Jay West From curt at atarimuseum.com Sun Sep 14 21:58:00 2003 From: curt at atarimuseum.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Wanted: Decmate or Pro350 Message-ID: <200309150257.h8F2vu314626@huey.classiccmp.org> Anybody have either/or working condition and want to sell? Curt From luc at e2t.be Mon Sep 15 07:08:00 2003 From: luc at e2t.be (Luc Vande Velde) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: DSM-11 (Digital Std MUMPS) info needed In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720EE0A2@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD6E9@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Fred and all other DSM lovers, First of all a tiny little correction: the name is Luc Vande Velde ;) I 'll contact my ex-colleages to see if if I can find the original DEC manuals. The language reference manuals I have (Mumps or M is an ANSI language and is system independant) To give you a quick start: Once you load the system from tape(image) it will start in baseline mode (=single user)and goes to sysgen. On every question asked you can type ? to get a bit more info. gr. Luc -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]Namens Fred N. van Kempen Verzonden: zondag 14 september 2003 22:09 Aan: cctalk@classiccmp.org Onderwerp: DSM-11 (Digital Std MUMPS) info needed All, I'm finally done reading Luc VanElst's DSM-11 tapes. We now have working copies of DSM-11 V3.3 and V4.1 available. Does anyone have stuff like documentation, snippets, SPD's, etc with which I can liven up its website pages a bit? Right now, I pretty much know nothing about DSM ... ;-) Thnx, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From pat at purdueriots.com Mon Sep 15 08:13:00 2003 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: FS: DEC machines + Parts In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The DECstations have been claimed. Pat -- Purdue University ITAP/RCS Information Technology at Purdue Research Computing and Storage http://www.itap.purdue.edu/rcs/ On Sun, 14 Sep 2003, Patrick Finnegan wrote: > I've got more machines and parts to clear out to make room. > Prices listed are per item, shipping is extra, I can ship via FEDEX > ground express from West Lafayette, IN. > > 2ea - DECstation 5000/240, 32MB Ram, PMAGB-B framebuffer, LK-401 keyboard, > VSXXX-GA mouse, console breakout cable, video cable. $20 > - LK-401 keyboard $10 > 1ea - DEC BC29G-09 3W3 to 3xBNC video cable $10 > - DEC BC13M-10 DA15S to keyboard/mouse (17-02640-01) - same as > used with DECstation 5000's above $10 > 3ea - DEC VSXXX-GA mouse $10 > > I've got more things that I'll be posting as I sort through them. > > Pat > -- > Purdue University ITAP/RCS > Information Technology at Purdue > Research Computing and Storage > http://www.itap.purdue.edu/rcs/ From railside at frontiernet.net Mon Sep 15 09:33:00 2003 From: railside at frontiernet.net (Richard Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Ansley connectors Message-ID: <001201c37973$4caf1b50$1bdc82d1@DHGTTY01> To Whom it may concern. I am currently trying to catoluge an obsolete electric car program. One of things I have come across are boxes of Ansley connectors (cat. # 612-1604). I am sure there are other types of connectors too. Is this something you or someone you know might be interested. Thank You, Don Parnell / railsidellc From fritz_aus_dem_hause_chwolka at t-online.de Mon Sep 15 09:33:57 2003 From: fritz_aus_dem_hause_chwolka at t-online.de (Fritz Chwolka) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Intel ISIS OS for an IPDS In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <19xwYH-0rugW80@fwd02.sul.t-online.com> On Thu, 11 Sep 2003 16:00:25 -0400, Everett Feldt wrote: >I am desperately looking for a copy of the Intel ISIS OS for an IPDS (Intel >Personal Development System). Can anyone help me? > >Everett Feldt >feldte@cox.net Look here http://oldcomputers.dyndns.org/public/pub/rechner/intel/mds-ii_series-iv /manuals/ Greetings from Fritz Chwolka > www.alterechner.de < From agblood at hotmail.com Mon Sep 15 09:34:04 2003 From: agblood at hotmail.com (Gary French) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: newbie Message-ID: greetings all, I'm agblood. I've got a c128, a trs-80 mc-10, several XTs and ATs, and a TP-340, (there's more but that is the basics). Does anyone have any info on the power supply for a Grid 1755/486slc (beyond 16vac, 1.25 a)? _________________________________________________________________ Use custom emotions -- try MSN Messenger 6.0! http://www.msnmessenger-download.com/tracking/reach_emoticon From CribbReeper at aol.com Mon Sep 15 09:34:10 2003 From: CribbReeper at aol.com (CribbReeper@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: kaypro 2 cables (question) Message-ID: <3f.2205c16d.2c94ea89@aol.com> hi, do you know where i can get ahold of a kaypro 2 keyboard cable, it looks like a telephone cord connection, (knoe what i mean) and i cant find one any where, i really need to get some advice, is it hidden in the computer somewhere?? thanx. sincerely, t.w. From jack.rubin at ameritech.net Mon Sep 15 09:34:16 2003 From: jack.rubin at ameritech.net (Jack Rubin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: need HP 9121D cabinet/circuit board Message-ID: <000001c37a69$b9a726c0$1f6fa8c0@eths.k12.il.us> I've got a 9121D floppy subsystem that fails to pass POST. Drives wink on power up, fan turns, fuses check out ok, but indicator LED on circuit board never comes on and drives remain invisible to IB controller (1630G logic analyzer). I've blown out the dust, reseated cables and the one socketed PROM and that's all I can figure out to do. Nothing seems obviously damaged or smoked. I didn't have the unit a couple of months ago when people were tossing these things into dumpsters, but hopefully someone still has a known (or possibly) good cabinet/circuit board sitting on the shelf at some reasonable price. I guess I'd also consider buying another complete subsystem if necessary. Obviously, service data or trouble-shooting ideas would be welcome Thanks. Jack Rubin Wilmette, Illinois USA From ran at netgate.net Mon Sep 15 09:34:22 2003 From: ran at netgate.net (Ran Talbott) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: More Goodies from the Silicon Valley Refugee Message-ID: <03091320371915.01584@drako> Thanks for your replies to my previous posting: I managed to find homes for almost everything. I've been going through the boxes in the garage, and found a surprising assortment of little tidbits left over from my old computers. Except as otherwise noted, the hardware is used, in "excellent" or "like-new" cosmetic condition. I say "probably working" a lot, but it has a better than 90% chance of being fully functional. The paper stuff is generally is "visibly used, but not abused" condition. All prices are "plus postage". Yes, I know that the shipping cost will often be more than what I'm asking for the goods, but I don't get to set the rates. If this *really* bothers you, let me know: I'll be happy to raise the price to correct the imbalance ;-) I'd prefer PayPal, but any form of payment that doesn't cost me money in bank fees is fine. Ran Here's the list: Pet Pack - $5 Osborne's PET User Guide Osborne's "PET and the IEEE-488 Bus" VIC-20 Pack - $12 Original user manual (cover somewhat scuffed, "good+" condition) Commodore's programmer's guide Osborne's VIC-20 User Guide (you can have this "semi-autographed" if you want, but I lost touch with my co-author about 15 years ago, so you'll have to settle for "semi-", unless you want to track him down). Compute's "Gazette" for the VIC and C-64, first issue A VICModem (probably 300 baud, probably working. No labels on it, though. This might've been a prototype or pilot unit, and is cosmetically only somewhat better than "good"). A 3-slot backplane board from Atari Pack - $5 Star Raiders cartridge Telink II cartridge (modem program??) No docs or box with these. I'd say the odds are better than 95% that both are good. I *think* I still have a couple of cassette apps (probably games) from the Atari Program Exchange hanging around. I'll throw those in if they turn up, and you want them. PCjr Pack - $25 IBM Tech Reference (in the slipcase, in "as-new" condition) Floppy controller board (should be working: as I recall, I pulled this to install a Tecmar add-on with better features) Modem board (probably 1200 baud. Enough chips are socketed that it's probably feasible to hack this into a serial card) 3 cordless keyboards 1 keyboard IR receiver module (dealer spare) 1 pack of 5 overlays for the keyboards (sealed) First issues of "PCjr" and "Peanut" magazines My (possibly incorrect) recollection is that one keyboard is the original from my PCjr (little-used, because I upgraded to the more-normal one almost immediately), one was a dealer spare that I bought along with the receiver, and the third was a swapmeet buy. So there should be at least two in (like-)new working condition. C-64 Speech synthesizer cartridge - $5 each "Voice Messenger", by Currah Technologies. I have 2 of these, still shrinkwapped. Uses a hardware synthesizer chip (SSI263??), and has an extension ROM that adds speech functions to the built-in BASIC. The first buyer gets a free light pen that plugs into the joystick port, but has no docs or software unless I get a surprise while sorting through my old files. My recollection is that there's a photodiode in it that generates an interrupt when the CRT beam sweeps past it. Fat Mac Pack - $2 (Or "Skinny Mac Pack", if that's what you've got. But that didn't rhyme ;-). I have a numeric keypad for the original Macs, in the original packaging. The box looks a *bit* shelfworn, but surprisingly good, considering its age. The most likely story is that it's a working unit that the buyers of my early Macs didn't want, because it's unlikely that I would have packed it and kept it if it weren't. But I honestly don't know its real status. Mac II Pack - $5 Nobody wanted the Mac II, so it's doomed to be recycled. But the Enhanced keyboard and the mouse are in excellent shape, since I used the Mac only moderately for a few years, and more-or-less retired it when OS/2 got to the point where it would fill my GUI needs. Sony Laser Library - $20 Sony-proprietary-interface 1X CD-ROM drive, bundled with Compton's Family Encyclopedia, MS Bookshelf 1991 Edition, Languages of the World, National Geographic Mammals, Mixed-Up Mother Goose, and a World Atlas (I've forgotten whose). There was a 1.1 update to the encyclopedia that Sony sent out due to some sort of complaints about the 1.0, and that's included. I'll also include a half-dozen or so caddies. This was one of the first CD-ROM drives to get drivers for OS/2 and Linux, so it may be of interest to someone wanting to run early versions of those, as well as DOS fans. I put relatively few hours on the drive before I switched my system to all-SCSI, so it should be good for a lot more use. I'll give you a 90-day warranty on it: if it fails, I'll refund the $20 (but not the shipping), and you get to keep the CDs and caddies. I might actually have the original box up in the attic (but it may not be suitable for re-use after being there for so many years). The docs are probably complete: I can't swear to them being fully complete, because I don't remember what was included. From lbickley at bickleywest.com Mon Sep 15 09:34:28 2003 From: lbickley at bickleywest.com (Lyle Bickley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: HP 5423A analyzer Message-ID: <200309132124.32024.lbickley@bickleywest.com> Bob, I saw a thread in classiccmp.org where you said "Its quite easy to 'unmodify' the customized 21MX and turn it back into a normal E-series. I've done this modification several times, contact me off-list if you want the details." I've got a HP 5423A and I'd sure like the details!!!! Cheers, Lyle -- Lyle Bickley Bickley Consulting West Inc. Mountain View, CA 94040 "Black holes are where God is dividing by zero" From freddy at kotelna.sk Mon Sep 15 09:34:35 2003 From: freddy at kotelna.sk (Adrien Farkas) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: wanted: C64 sound chip (SID) Message-ID: <20030914185524.GA19166@kotol.kotelna.sk> folks, anyone has spare SID (sound chip used id C64s, perhaps others) willing to sell? shipment would be to Slovak Republic (Slovakia, Europe), payment via BidPay (Western Union) money orders for the US, Western Union MO to other countries. other ways to pay? just tell me. these are those I've good experience with. anyone willing to support an electronic hobbyist this way? :) thanks in advance, -- freddy ...for more info 'finger freddy@kotol.kotelna.sk' From HLRJR at aol.com Mon Sep 15 09:34:43 2003 From: HLRJR at aol.com (HLRJR@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: trs-80 Model II keyboard Message-ID: <187.1f225504.2c961ad9@aol.com> I am interested in the Keyboard (If you still have it). Harold From Joeydoe4 at aol.com Mon Sep 15 09:34:49 2003 From: Joeydoe4 at aol.com (Joeydoe4@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: keyboard Message-ID: HI John I might be interested in the vintage keyboard you are giving away. If you could please write back and let me know more details i would be very happy thank you Joe From begoorgv at myrealbox.com Mon Sep 15 09:34:56 2003 From: begoorgv at myrealbox.com (Girish) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: IBM manuals Message-ID: <00c901c37b84$7ec3da50$1200a8c0@bluetooth> Hi Tony, I was searching for some of the IBM manuals and could not find the same. As i was searching on the web, i got ur messages from it http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2003-February/017611.html. Please send me those manual part numbers / form numbers so that i can contact my local IBM office. Actually im Looking at the manuals that has been released in 1981. that is "PC Technical Reference Manual" and other similar ones. Thanking you in advance Girish From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Mon Sep 15 10:07:00 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: collection organising In-Reply-To: <00c901c37b84$7ec3da50$1200a8c0@bluetooth> Message-ID: <20030915145935.86603.qmail@web21104.mail.yahoo.com> OK, current situation: Everything spread to hell and back in several different rooms. Although I do seem to know where things are! Desired situation: Something a little more organised :-) I can't decide whether to try and keep things related to each manufacturer together (hardware, manuals, software, cables, spares etc.), or to keep like objects together (cables regardless of what machine they're for, spares all in one place etc.). Both systems seem to have adantages and drawbacks (obviously there are some size constraints for storage, software I want to keep away from dust, and cables, spare floppy drives etc. might be the same for more than one manufacturer) Any thoughts? cheers Jules ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From jrkeys at concentric.net Mon Sep 15 10:30:00 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Omnibot 2000 goes for over$400 Message-ID: <00ef01c37b9d$0cb53530$2b0bdd40@oemcomputer> With the box it went for $405 on ebay. It making it very hard to get the tray and remote that I need for mine.:-( http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?viewitem&item=3144773461 From waltje at pdp11.nl Mon Sep 15 10:56:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: DSM-11 (Digital Std MUMPS) info needed In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD6E9@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Luc Vande Velde wrote: > Fred and all other DSM lovers, > > First of all a tiny little correction: the name is Luc Vande Velde ;) > I 'll contact my ex-colleages to see if if I can find the original DEC Whoooops. Sowwy! > sysgen. On every question asked you can type ? to get a bit more info. Heh, and then... it asks me for a UIC. I dont have one, and the silly system doesn't understand 'root' either... :) But: they're saved. Yay! Luc: the V3.3 tape is *bad* ... took me 3 hours and many cycles of cleaning, rewinding and retrying to get it "in" ... --f From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 15 11:09:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 Message-ID: Where is a good resource to find out saleable values of classic computer hardware? I know eBay isn't really all that great because it isn't consistent enough. What goes for $5 today may go for $500 tomorrow, and then not sell at all the next day. Like many others, I'm painfully short on money right now, and I've just lost my storage area, so I can't hang on to things much longer. So I'm trying to find out what is worth what, so I know what to try to sell, versus give away, versus throw away (I'm already making the tough decision on what to keep, but that's not really based on monetary value so much as personal value to me). Is there a good place to check for the value of some of this stuff? And not just the value in terms of what its worth IF you can find a buyer... but also value in terms of will it sell at all? (It doesn't do me much good if something is "worth" $100, but no one really wants to buy it right now). -chris From waltje at pdp11.nl Mon Sep 15 11:20:01 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Chris, > Where is a good resource to find out saleable values of classic computer > hardware? I know eBay isn't really all that great because it isn't > consistent enough. What goes for $5 today may go for $500 tomorrow, and > then not sell at all the next day. Sadly, that IS the reality of things. Retro computing seems to be the ultimate in terms of 'market working'... things many collectors want, but only few seem to have, can, and, quite often, will get, insane price tags. > Like many others, I'm painfully short on money right now, and I've just > lost my storage area, so I can't hang on to things much longer. So I'm > trying to find out what is worth what, so I know what to try to sell, > versus give away, versus throw away (I'm already making the tough > decision on what to keep, but that's not really based on monetary value > so much as personal value to me). Although I am fortunate enough to be mostly a buyer, I too decided to get rid of some of it- mostly because it's either not my "core" stuff (DEC PDP11-VAX-MIPS-ALPHA and stuff linked to it), or I have too much of the same stuff, which takes up too much space. Sad :( > not just the value in terms of what its worth IF you can find a buyer... > but also value in terms of will it sell at all? (It doesn't do me much > good if something is "worth" $100, but no one really wants to buy it > right now). Worth is defined by how many people want it. I have several nice DSSI tape drives and library systems here, which are worth a lot, but so far, nobody was willing to wheel 'em outta here... so.. their value currently is (EURO *)NULL. Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From gkicomputers at yahoo.com Mon Sep 15 11:24:00 2003 From: gkicomputers at yahoo.com (steve) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:51 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030915161627.70360.qmail@web12405.mail.yahoo.com> --- chris wrote: > Is there a good place to check for the value of some > of this stuff? And > not just the value in terms of what its worth IF you > can find a buyer... > but also value in terms of will it sell at all? (It > doesn't do me much > good if something is "worth" $100, but no one really > wants to buy it > right now). You have conflicting requirements, if you are interested in the price it will get today, then thats an auction price which varies day by day. If you are interested in what the price would be if it were, say, for sale in an online antique store, thats a different, but generally more stable (and higher) price. But you couldn't sell it today. You are asking for a stable price that can sell today, sorry, that doesn't exist. From teoz at neo.rr.com Mon Sep 15 11:31:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:52 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 References: Message-ID: <008e01c37ba5$b2dc2ce0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "chris" To: "Classic Computer" Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 12:01 PM Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 > Where is a good resource to find out saleable values of classic computer > hardware? I know eBay isn't really all that great because it isn't > consistent enough. What goes for $5 today may go for $500 tomorrow, and > then not sell at all the next day. > > Like many others, I'm painfully short on money right now, and I've just > lost my storage area, so I can't hang on to things much longer. So I'm > trying to find out what is worth what, so I know what to try to sell, > versus give away, versus throw away (I'm already making the tough > decision on what to keep, but that's not really based on monetary value > so much as personal value to me). > > Is there a good place to check for the value of some of this stuff? And > not just the value in terms of what its worth IF you can find a buyer... > but also value in terms of will it sell at all? (It doesn't do me much > good if something is "worth" $100, but no one really wants to buy it > right now). > > -chris > From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 15 11:32:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:52 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 Message-ID: >Worth is defined by how many people want it. I have several nice >DSSI tape drives and library systems here, which are worth a lot, >but so far, nobody was willing to wheel 'em outta here... so.. their >value currently is (EURO *)NULL. yeah, this is where I am running into a problem. Price Guides are only useful IF you have a buyer. I don't want to hold onto to items I don't want, because a price guide said it is worth $100 if I can't find a buyer for it. BUT, I do want to know that the item is worth $100, because then I might hold it long enough to find a give away home for it (there are always more people willing to take items for free then to pay for them). But on the other hand, if I find something is worth nothing AND I can't find an immediate buyer or taker... then my dumpster will receive it. -chris From esharpe at uswest.net Mon Sep 15 11:41:00 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:52 2005 Subject: CCCP References: <3F6273B2.4000002@citem.org> Message-ID: <001101c37baf$54fd8560$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> good project go for it! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Hans B Pufal" To: Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 6:32 PM Subject: Re: CCCP > vance@neurotica.com wrote: > > >I'm interested, but Word won't be readable here. > > > > > I'm interested also. I'd be happy to post a PDF version of the word doc. > > -- hbp From allain at panix.com Mon Sep 15 11:50:00 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:52 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 References: Message-ID: <073301c37ba7$f18b50e0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> I made a good sum by knowing the resellers in my area of speciality and then contacting them carefully, for example not dumping my whole list on them, but just starting with the one thing they liked the most. ...and eBay is just too useful to ignore. Offering on eBay with a reserve set is a way of asking the world for a price on a thing. Here's a nice reseller listing site http://www.processor.com/ I for one would not find a list for sale posted to classiccmp as offensive, especially from regular members, at not-frequent intervals. Jim and Pat have done it, for example. I think priceguides per se. are nuts. I have a HotWheels that's supposed to be worth $250 according to one of them. But think about where price guides are best used, on the table at the big sale so you can open it up and show an otherwise unknowing buyer what all the sellers want him to hear. "Hey, it's not me, the price is right here in this book.", the book being published by the sellers of course. John A. From teoz at neo.rr.com Mon Sep 15 12:06:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:52 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 References: <073301c37ba7$f18b50e0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <00c301c37baa$941d22a0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Allain" To: "CCTalk" Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 12:39 PM Subject: Re: Price Check on Aisle 5 > I made a good sum by knowing the resellers in my area of speciality > and then contacting them carefully, for example not dumping my whole > list on them, but just starting with the one thing they liked the most. > ...and eBay is just too useful to ignore. Offering on eBay with a reserve > set is a way of asking the world for a price on a thing. > Here's a nice reseller listing site http://www.processor.com/ > > I for one would not find a list for sale posted to classiccmp as offensive, > especially from regular members, at not-frequent intervals. Jim and > Pat have done it, for example. > > I think priceguides per se. are nuts. I have a HotWheels that's supposed > to be worth $250 according to one of them. But think about where price > guides are best used, on the table at the big sale so you can open it up > and show an otherwise unknowing buyer what all the sellers want him to > hear. "Hey, it's not me, the price is right here in this book.", the book > being > published by the sellers of course. > > John A. I remember a story about a collector of the old metal lunch boxes that had 1000's of them. he then decided to publich a catalog with some prices in it and started a new collecting craze that made him a bunch of cash. Most people will toss anything they dont want unless of couse there is a catalog for the item out and then they want to get its "real worth". If you want to see something funny take a few $250 baeball cards into a store selling them and see if they want to buy any even for $20. Something made in the millions that every collector has one of cant be worth anywhere near $250 that some company making catalogs says it is. I personally know what I want and how much I want to spend on an item and wait patiently untill I find it in the condition and price I like. I hit eba y maybe 2 times a day and see what prices are like for the items I still want. One week it might go for $100, next month I pay $15 for one in better condition. Some people get caught up in bidding (and I would bet they are competing with the sellers brother pumping the price up for something he wont buy) or just buy the first item they see that they want. From cheri-post at web.de Mon Sep 15 12:12:00 2003 From: cheri-post at web.de (Pierre Gebhardt) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:52 2005 Subject: specifications for IBM XT-286 Message-ID: <200309151703.h8FH3gQ18965@mailgate5.cinetic.de> > According to my records the XT/286 (5162-286) came with a std 20 Meg HD, a > MFM drive with 4 heads, 615 Cyl, 17 sectors, a 65 ms Drive. AT type 2. Thanks alot for your answer ! It shouldn't be a problem to find out what kind of drive it is. Do you have an idea if it's a full height - or half height-built drive ? Pierre ______________________________________________________________________________ Die Besten ihrer Klasse! WEB.DE FreeMail (1,7) und WEB.DE Club (1,9) - bei der Stiftung Warentest - ein Doppelsieg! http://f.web.de/?mc=021184 From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 15 12:30:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:52 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 In-Reply-To: <073301c37ba7$f18b50e0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, John Allain wrote: > I made a good sum by knowing the resellers in my area of speciality > and then contacting them carefully, for example not dumping my whole > list on them, but just starting with the one thing they liked the most. > ...and eBay is just too useful to ignore. Offering on eBay with a reserve > set is a way of asking the world for a price on a thing. And the Vintage Computer Marketplace is even better, because listings are still free. So you can experiment without incurring any costs. You can also try out different sale formats (straight sale, auction, even give-away), something other sites cannot offer. http://marketplace.vintage.org If you haven't visited yet then you're missing out on a lot of good stuff that's currently listed for for great prices. Here's a link to all the currently listed free stuff: http://marketplace.vintage.org/search.cfm?adtype=G&restart=1 -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 15 12:39:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:52 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 Message-ID: >You have conflicting requirements, if you are >interested in the price it will get today, then thats >an auction price which varies day by day. > >If you are interested in what the price would be if it >were, say, for sale in an online antique store, thats >a different, but generally more stable (and higher) >price. But you couldn't sell it today. > >You are asking for a stable price that can sell today, >sorry, that doesn't exist. Yes, I understand what I want is rather conflicting. I think what I want is really two things. 1: a way to find a "value", kind of like a price guide... and 2: a way to know if its a selling item. Once I know both, I can then make the decisions if I want to sell it, keep it for sale later, keep it until it sells, or give/throw it away. What I am trying to avoid is throwing out stuff that I think is worthless, only to find later that someone really needed it, or that it was worth a lot of money. -chris From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 15 12:42:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:52 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 Message-ID: >http://marketplace.vintage.org > >If you haven't visited yet then you're missing out on a lot of good stuff >that's currently listed for for great prices. Here's a link to all the >currently listed free stuff: I stopped by there right before posting my email. I do plan to test the waters there to see what happens. What made me decide to post the email was because I have someone interested in one of my 128k Macs, but I have zero idea what the value is. eBay shows none for sale, or sold recently, and nothing turned up on the vintage market place either (although it is my first look there, so I've not figured out all the search nuances yet). I could have simply asked what is a 128k Mac worth, but since that is just the item of *right now* and I have 4 offices full of similar items I need to do something with, I figured it was easier to see where people used to find the value of stuff. -chris From RMaxwell at atlantissi.com Mon Sep 15 12:54:00 2003 From: RMaxwell at atlantissi.com (Robert Maxwell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:52 2005 Subject: Orphaned PPC640 Message-ID: <9726BA9DE867D51183B900B0D0AB85F8013E484D@INETMAIL> Hello, Keith: My PPC512 was a tad more expensive, 50 cents at a ham flea market. Dead, it only needed a fuse. From teoz at neo.rr.com Mon Sep 15 13:05:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:52 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 References: Message-ID: <001501c37bb2$ce8dcae0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Your best bet for mac stuff is the swap list from www.lowendmac.com, its very active and if you can check out the archive it would give you a good idea what stuff sells for. ----- Original Message ----- From: "chris" To: "Classic Computer" Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 1:34 PM Subject: Re: Price Check on Aisle 5 > >http://marketplace.vintage.org > > > >If you haven't visited yet then you're missing out on a lot of good stuff > >that's currently listed for for great prices. Here's a link to all the > >currently listed free stuff: > > I stopped by there right before posting my email. I do plan to test the > waters there to see what happens. > > What made me decide to post the email was because I have someone > interested in one of my 128k Macs, but I have zero idea what the value > is. eBay shows none for sale, or sold recently, and nothing turned up on > the vintage market place either (although it is my first look there, so > I've not figured out all the search nuances yet). > > I could have simply asked what is a 128k Mac worth, but since that is > just the item of *right now* and I have 4 offices full of similar items I > need to do something with, I figured it was easier to see where people > used to find the value of stuff. > > -chris > From healyzh at aracnet.com Mon Sep 15 13:11:01 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:52 2005 Subject: Disposing of a Collection Message-ID: Does anyone here have any advice on how to go about disposing of a computer collection? The time is well past for me to get serious about it. I want to keep a lot of my DEC gear, but even some of the VMS and PDP-11 related stuff will be going. I don't have time to do anything with most of the stuff I've got, and it's become an anchor around my neck. Ideally I'd like to recover some of the money I've got into the collection, as I've sunk a LOT of money over the past few years into it. One obvious solution is selling the stuff on eBay, but that would take a lot more time than I have. Another would be to call a scrapper that I know, but that doesn't get recover any of the money that I've got into stuff. Ideally I'd like to find someone that would be interested in buying the collection off of me. Zane -- -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 15 13:18:01 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:52 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, chris wrote: > What I am trying to avoid is throwing out stuff that I think is > worthless, only to find later that someone really needed it, or that it > was worth a lot of money. That's totally subjective and can never been truly "known". What you're struggling with is symptomatic of packratitis. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From pat at purdueriots.com Mon Sep 15 13:22:00 2003 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:52 2005 Subject: Disposing of a Collection In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Zane H. Healy wrote: > Does anyone here have any advice on how to go about disposing of a > computer collection? The time is well past for me to get serious about > it. I want to keep a lot of my DEC gear, but even some of the VMS and > PDP-11 related stuff will be going. I don't have time to do anything > with most of the stuff I've got, and it's become an anchor around my > neck. > > Ideally I'd like to recover some of the money I've got into the > collection, as I've sunk a LOT of money over the past few years into it. What I'd suggest is putting a description of what you have up on the list, and see if people are interested in it. I'm sure there's a fair number of people that'd be interested in large chunks of your collect, and might even be willing to drive to where you are, if they know. I know I'd probably be game if you were within a 6-8 hour drive. Pat -- Purdue University ITAP/RCS Information Technology at Purdue Research Computing and Storage http://www.itap.purdue.edu/rcs/ From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 15 13:25:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, chris wrote: > I could have simply asked what is a 128k Mac worth, but since that is > just the item of *right now* and I have 4 offices full of similar items I Michael Nadeau's book lists it anywhere from $50 to $700. It depends on what it has with it. Is it in good cosmetic condition? Does it work? Flawlessly? What software does it come with? The original system disks? The original manuals? In good condition? Does it still have the original box? In good condition? And all the packaging material? How about cables? The last consideration is, what is the significance of this historically, and how should that translate into dollars? I would say a nice, fully functional original Mac with all the original manuals, software and components, is worth around $250-$300. They are not all that rare, but are becoming harder to find, especially in working condition. As I start to put together more and more displays of working old computers for various functions, I am really starting to appreciate the rarity of a nice system in fully functioning condition, and the effort involved in bringing together all the parts to make a complete, working display. It takes a lot of time, especially if something is dodgy, like the disk drive. Add the original box and packaging and the price would definitely go to $500 to a buyer who was interested in a very nice example for their collection to preserve and cherish. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 15 13:25:09 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 Message-ID: >Your best bet for mac stuff is the swap list from www.lowendmac.com, its >very active and if you can check out the archive it would give you a good >idea what stuff sells for. Already on that list. And it is one of the places that some of my stuff will start to show up. I just like to have all my ducks in a row before I start trying to sell things. I don't have the time to really drag it out with guesses. -chris From uban at ubanproductions.com Mon Sep 15 13:26:00 2003 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Disposing of a Collection In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20030915131611.03354808@mail.ubanproductions.com> Hi Zane, Sorry to hear that you are selling off your collection. I am looking for a couple of items, which if you have, I would be happy to pay you for. I want to find an Emulex SC72 or SC71 board set, which is an 11/70 specific massbuss to SMD controller. And I am looking for any documentation on the 11/55 (printset, manuals, etc.) that I can find. Where are you located, what is in the portion of your collection which you want to sell off, and how much do you want. Since it sounds like you are keeping your DEC gear, and because I mostly collect DEC gear, I am probably not the guy... --tnx --tom At 11:03 AM 9/15/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Does anyone here have any advice on how to go about disposing of a >computer collection? The time is well past for me to get serious about >it. I want to keep a lot of my DEC gear, but even some of the VMS and >PDP-11 related stuff will be going. I don't have time to do anything with >most of the stuff I've got, and it's become an anchor around my neck. > >Ideally I'd like to recover some of the money I've got into the >collection, as I've sunk a LOT of money over the past few years into it. > >One obvious solution is selling the stuff on eBay, but that would take a >lot more time than I have. Another would be to call a scrapper that I >know, but that doesn't get recover any of the money that I've got into >stuff. Ideally I'd like to find someone that would be interested in >buying the collection off of me. > > Zane > >-- >-- >| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | >| healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | >| | Classic Computer Collector | >+----------------------------------+----------------------------+ >| Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | >| PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | >| http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 15 13:28:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Disposing of a Collection In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Zane H. Healy wrote: > Does anyone here have any advice on how to go about disposing of a > computer collection? The time is well past for me to get serious about > it. I want to keep a lot of my DEC gear, but even some of the VMS and > PDP-11 related stuff will be going. I don't have time to do anything > with most of the stuff I've got, and it's become an anchor around my > neck. Two suggestions: 1) Post the entire list here and see what comes of it 2) Post either the entire lot on the Vintage Computer Marketplace or list each item individually using the inventory features. This would certainly help you organize what you have and help you determine what you would want to ask for either the entire lot in one sale or as individual pieces. Then, when you're ready to sell, you can easily post everything for sale either individually or as one lot. E-mail me and I'll tell you how. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From emu at ecubics.com Mon Sep 15 13:34:01 2003 From: emu at ecubics.com (emanuel stiebler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Disposing of a Collection In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F660688.8050009@ecubics.com> Zane H. Healy wrote: > Does anyone here have any advice on how to go about disposing of a ... > Ideally I'd like to recover some of the money I've got into the col ... > One obvious solution is selling the stuff on eBay, but that would ta... > > Zane What about sending a list here and enjoy the offers ? You can start selleing it as a whole lot, but I guess some people would make offer for specific parts anyway. cheers, P.S. Sorry, I just cut your email somewhere around column 72 ;-) From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 15 13:42:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 Message-ID: >I would say a nice, fully functional original Mac with all the original >manuals, software and components, is worth around $250-$300. They are >not all that rare, but are becoming harder to find, especially in working >condition. Because people like me have too many. :-) At last count, I have 5... 4 working, with one that has an accelertor installed (and the non working one I know what is wrong. It is missing a diode that was removed to get a mac Plus working at one point. In theory, if I replace the diode, it should work again. I may just remove it from the Plus it was put into, since I have way to many of those as well) All 5 have mouse and keyboard. But I don't have manuals or software for all 5 (either 2 or 3 sets, including audio Guided Tour tape). I think I *might* have one box, can't be sure until I can get into my parents basement again. I have someone on the line for one of them. He doesn't want keyboard or mouse or manuals. I told him I was looking for $50 when I planned on him taking keyboard and mouse (never offered manuals to him at all). And now would take less since he only wants the Mac itself. So it looks like I wasn't too far off on what it was worth. -chris From healyzh at aracnet.com Mon Sep 15 13:54:00 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Disposing of a Collection In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >What I'd suggest is putting a description of what you have up on the list, >and see if people are interested in it. I'm sure there's a fair number of >people that'd be interested in large chunks of your collect, and might >even be willing to drive to where you are, if they know. I know I'd >probably be game if you were within a 6-8 hour drive. Good point, unfortunately Purdue is a long way from me. I'm located in Oregon. I'm not really interested in shipping stuff, I don't really have time to deal with shipping. The following is a pretty good list of what should be available. Not everything on the DEC list is available, unless the price is right. I'm not really looking to get rid of the PDP-8's, PDP-11/44, or MV2 stuff (the MV2 stuff is spares basically chassis spares for my PDP-11's). If the price was right, there could be even more stuff than is listed here. The list also doesn't cover all the software and documentation that I have (I probably have almost as much volume in doc's as I do in hardware). http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/comp.txt Zane -- -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From Innfogra at aol.com Mon Sep 15 14:08:01 2003 From: Innfogra at aol.com (Innfogra@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: specifications for IBM XT-286 Message-ID: In a message dated 9/15/03 10:05:27 AM Pacific Daylight Time, cheri-post@web.de writes: > It shouldn't be a problem to find out what kind of drive it is. > Do you have an idea if it's a full height - or half height-built drive ? > My book says originally it came with a Full Height 20 meg HD and a single 1/2 Height 1.2 Meg DSHD floppy. You could add another 5 1/4 inch 1/2HT floppy or a 1/2 ht Tape drive. You could also order it in several configurations. Recommended was the 3 1/2 inch 1.44 meg floppy drive. Info is coming from a third edition of Que's Upgrading and repairing PCs. I think you could use any 20 meg half height HD that meets the same configuration, i.e., Seagate ST 225 or similar. IIRC the original 20 Meg FH HD for the AT was an abysmal failure, a CMI or something like that. Very high failure rate. Paxton Astoria, OR From patrick at evocative.com Mon Sep 15 14:18:00 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > And the Vintage Computer Marketplace is even better, because listings are The other thing about the VCM that's worth noting is that it's specifically our intention to create a framework for establishing the prices and trends of these "commodities." That's one of the reasons we have structure around the brand and model names that other sites don't have. Eventually, after a good solid history of data has been accumulated in the system, we'll be able to tell you the high/low/average/etc price for items over time. Patrick From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 14:33:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: <001501c37bb2$ce8dcae0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: I know this is off topic for the list, but you folks are my best choice for the kind of knowledge I'm after. :) The task at hand is driving a 4" diameter vector CRT. _Any_ 4" vector CRT would work, but it has to be round. I have to be able to drive this from a PC. I'm building an F-15C flight simulator out of real parts - one of which is the mortal remains of an ALR/56C electronic countermeasures display. The original electronics are basically junk due to excessive shock from ground impact. This leaves me with a nice shell that a 4" round CRT is needed for. It's my understanding that it's possible to drive a CRT like this "oscilloscope style". Where can I find out information on how to do this? Is there any kind of black box that I can buy or build that will allow me to feed an NTSC or VGA signal in one end and get a correct vector signal out the other? For those interested, you can see my project at http://www.f15sim.com. Thanks all! g. From bpope at wordstock.com Mon Sep 15 14:38:01 2003 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: from "Gene Buckle" at Sep 15, 03 12:35:50 pm Message-ID: <200309151926.PAA20971@wordstock.com> And thusly Gene Buckle spake: > > I know this is off topic for the list, but you folks are my best choice > for the kind of knowledge I'm after. :) > > The task at hand is driving a 4" diameter vector CRT. _Any_ 4" vector CRT > would work, but it has to be round. I have to be able to drive this from > a PC. I'm building an F-15C flight simulator out of real parts - one of > which is the mortal remains of an ALR/56C electronic countermeasures > display. The original electronics are basically junk due to excessive > shock from ground impact. This leaves me with a nice shell that a 4" > round CRT is needed for. It's my understanding that it's possible to > drive a CRT like this "oscilloscope style". Where can I find out > information on how to do this? Is there any kind of black box that I can > buy or build that will allow me to feed an NTSC or VGA signal in one end > and get a correct vector signal out the other? > At http://www.xgamestation.com/view_product.php?id=2 about a vector display interface coming soon. Maybe emailing Andre will get you some information about it. Cheers, Bryan > For those interested, you can see my project at http://www.f15sim.com. > > Thanks all! > > g. From teoz at neo.rr.com Mon Sep 15 14:40:01 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 References: Message-ID: <000c01c37bc0$09d69160$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patrick Rigney" To: Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 3:10 PM Subject: RE: Price Check on Aisle 5 > > And the Vintage Computer Marketplace is even better, because listings are > > The other thing about the VCM that's worth noting is that it's specifically > our intention to create a framework for establishing the prices and trends > of these "commodities." That's one of the reasons we have structure around > the brand and model names that other sites don't have. > > Eventually, after a good solid history of data has been accumulated in the > system, we'll be able to tell you the high/low/average/etc price for items > over time. > > Patrick > How would you get a reliable price range from such a small group of collector with such a wide range of systems they collect? Apple I's cost a few bucks but there is only a few around only a few people willing to spend the cash to buy one (not even taking into account the economy being good or bad). How will you take into account a system that 5 people might pay $300 but dozens are just given away every year just to have their space back? It works better when a large volume of collectors are involved and items change hands alot or at least have a greater liquidity. From arcarlini at iee.org Mon Sep 15 14:45:01 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Disposing of a Collection In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030915131611.03354808@mail.ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <000001c37bc0$bd74c6b0$5b01a8c0@athlon> > I am looking for a couple of items, which if you have, I > would be happy to pay you for. I want to find an Emulex SC72 > or SC71 board set, which is an 11/70 specific massbuss to SMD > controller. And I am looking for any documentation on the > 11/55 (printset, manuals, etc.) that I can find. Al Kossow's site has a couple of manuals. You can find stuff like this using Manx: http://vt100.net/manx/ and putting 11/55 into the search box. Manx doesn't (yet) cover 3rd party stuff so the Emulex stuff doesn't show up but there are bits on the web. In this case Al's site also has some SC72 stuff: http://www.spies.com/~aek/pdf/emulex/ Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From gesar at tiscalinet.ch Mon Sep 15 14:54:00 2003 From: gesar at tiscalinet.ch (Stefan Daehler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: MS-WORKS 2.0/Monitor Driver Message-ID: <200309151946.h8FJkHg23855@smtp.tiscali.ch> I got this application on my 286 AT. It's running fine with a color-monitor connected, but when I try to start Works on a monochrome monitor, I get the warning: "Non-valid or missing Monitor-Driver-File" (originally in German). Can this obstacle be overcome and what exactly should I look for? Thanks for caring! Steff From luc at e2t.be Mon Sep 15 14:58:01 2003 From: luc at e2t.be (Luc Vande Velde) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: DSM-11 (Digital Std MUMPS) info needed In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720F0440@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD6EA@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> This is not UNIX man ;) The factory default UCI (user class identifier) is MGR and this should be follwed by a semicolon and the name of the program to execute or, in your case the PAC code (programmer access code) - this code was asked during sysgen and is by default XXX So you enter ....UCI:MGR:XXX and should be in. at the prompt you type: >w "Hello World",! So, the V4.1 was OK, after being for 15 years in my "blockhaus" in the garden???? The V3.3 I got from a friend - het got it for the same number of years in a drawer of his desk??? Luc -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]Namens Fred N. van Kempen Verzonden: maandag 15 september 2003 17:46 Aan: cctalk@classiccmp.org Onderwerp: RE: DSM-11 (Digital Std MUMPS) info needed On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Luc Vande Velde wrote: > Fred and all other DSM lovers, > > First of all a tiny little correction: the name is Luc Vande Velde ;) > I 'll contact my ex-colleages to see if if I can find the original DEC Whoooops. Sowwy! > sysgen. On every question asked you can type ? to get a bit more info. Heh, and then... it asks me for a UIC. I dont have one, and the silly system doesn't understand 'root' either... :) But: they're saved. Yay! Luc: the V3.3 tape is *bad* ... took me 3 hours and many cycles of cleaning, rewinding and retrying to get it "in" ... --f From jwstephens at msm.umr.edu Mon Sep 15 15:01:00 2003 From: jwstephens at msm.umr.edu (jim) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... References: Message-ID: <3F661881.AA5BCE92@msm.umr.edu> there is a arcade game emulator called "mame" that has emulation of vector graphic but uses ordinary raster scanned (runs on normal vga). You'd have a lot better maintainability and quality if you took a regular vga monitor and wrote code to take in your vector plot data and made a custom driver for a "game" that mame could run which would paint your vector stuff on the screen. You would use a 5": vga color painting green lines, and would restrict the thing with a mask in the software to keep it in the confines of the console punchout's geometry. I would think that even the air force might options such a product to replace their units... Jim Gene Buckle wrote: > I know this is off topic for the list, but you folks are my best choice > for the kind of knowledge I'm after. :) > > The task at hand is driving a 4" diameter vector CRT. _Any_ 4" vector CRT > would work, but it has to be round. I have to be able to drive this from > a PC. I'm building an F-15C flight simulator out of real parts - one of > which is the mortal remains of an ALR/56C electronic countermeasures > display. The original electronics are basically junk due to excessive > shock from ground impact. This leaves me with a nice shell that a 4" > round CRT is needed for. It's my understanding that it's possible to > drive a CRT like this "oscilloscope style". Where can I find out > information on how to do this? Is there any kind of black box that I can > buy or build that will allow me to feed an NTSC or VGA signal in one end > and get a correct vector signal out the other? > > For those interested, you can see my project at http://www.f15sim.com. > > Thanks all! > > g. From waltje at pdp11.nl Mon Sep 15 15:04:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: DSM-11 (Digital Std MUMPS) info needed In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD6EA@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Luc Vande Velde wrote: > This is not UNIX man ;) Yeah, I, uhh, noticed. Silly people... why bother with Another OS when ya can have the Real Thing(tm) ? [ok, that was flame bait.. *grin*] > >w "Hello World",! Yay! That worked. > So, the V4.1 was OK, after being for 15 years in my "blockhaus" in the > garden???? Yup... twas moist, but a night in my climate-controlled machine room fixed that. The V3.3 tape had a physical dent about halfway through the DSM data, so, roughly around 1.2MB of the tape. We probably shouldn't tell the people here about your, uhh, garden, Luc... as far as I know, sheep are made for shoarma, not for keeping PDP-11's company... *evil grin* Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 15:05:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: <200309151926.PAA20971@wordstock.com> Message-ID: > At http://www.xgamestation.com/view_product.php?id=2 about a vector display > interface coming soon. Maybe emailing Andre will get you some information > about it. > That's interesting Bryan, but I need something a bit less in the vaporware category. :( I'll keep it mind though... g. From uban at ubanproductions.com Mon Sep 15 15:18:00 2003 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Disposing of a Collection In-Reply-To: <000001c37bc0$bd74c6b0$5b01a8c0@athlon> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030915131611.03354808@mail.ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20030915150819.033367d8@mail.ubanproductions.com> Hi Antonio, Yep. I'm quite familiar with Al's site and great work, but I missed seeing the 11/55 stuff until I used the manx search. There does not seem to be a KB11-D printset there. I have the SC72 manual from Al's site as well, but I want to find the hardware to go with it:-) --tom At 08:37 PM 9/15/2003 +0100, Antonio Carlini wrote: > > I am looking for a couple of items, which if you have, I > > would be happy to pay you for. I want to find an Emulex SC72 > > or SC71 board set, which is an 11/70 specific massbuss to SMD > > controller. And I am looking for any documentation on the > > 11/55 (printset, manuals, etc.) that I can find. > >Al Kossow's site has a couple of manuals. You can find >stuff like this using Manx: > >http://vt100.net/manx/ > >and putting 11/55 into the search box. > >Manx doesn't (yet) cover 3rd party stuff so the >Emulex stuff doesn't show up but there are bits >on the web. In this case Al's site also has >some SC72 stuff: > >http://www.spies.com/~aek/pdf/emulex/ > > >Antonio > > >-- > >--------------- >Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 15:29:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: <3F661881.AA5BCE92@msm.umr.edu> Message-ID: > there is a arcade game emulator called "mame" that has emulation of > vector graphic but uses ordinary raster scanned (runs on normal vga). > > You'd have a lot better maintainability and quality if you took a regular > vga monitor and wrote code to take in your vector plot data and made > a custom driver for a "game" that mame could run which would paint > your vector stuff on the screen. > > You would use a 5": vga color painting green lines, and would restrict > the thing with a mask in the software to keep it in the confines of the > console punchout's geometry. I would think that even the air force > might options such a product to replace their units... > Jim, the vector requirement is one of hardware, not software. Trust me, if I could buy a 4" round raster CRT, I'd jump on it. The whole problem is due to the size constraints. that I'm faced with. A 5" CRT is actually too large to be properly fit within the confines of the original enclosure. I therefore have to use a 4" tube from an oscilloscope as a replacement. To my (limited!) knowledge, no one makes such a thing in a raster drive configuration. If you look at http://www.f15sim.com/images/tews_teardown_sm.jpg (view tews_teardown.jpg for a much larger image) you'll see what I have to work with. Due to screen burn on the CRT, I've discovered that there are quadrant marks that are painted along the edge of the CRT circumference, much like a clock. This means that for my simulation to be correct, the replacement must be round. A square tube or LCD would give far too small an image. I'm going to write the driver software myself, but I have to be able to drive the screen first. :) If I could find a ready-made NTSC or VGA to vector converter, I'd be set. Thanks! g. From jpl15 at panix.com Mon Sep 15 15:37:01 2003 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: A thought occurs to me: there is a piece of video test gear called a Vectorscope - used to determine the proper alignment of the TV color signal phase vectors... anyway, a lot of companies, from Heathkit to Tekronix, made these, and the older ones can be had at swpameets (or on eBay) for pretty cheap. Then, you'd have all the circuitry needed to drive the CRT (and quite possibly a 4" CRT in the bargain)... the interfacing task is redused to just DACs and opamps to feed the vectorscope guts.... I think if I had to produce a 'real' stroke display that's the route I'd investigate first. Cheers John From tlindner at ix.netcom.com Mon Sep 15 15:41:01 2003 From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1g1bxeb.fbc0dk6tuu4gM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com> Gene Buckle wrote: > I know this is off topic for the list, but you folks are my best choice > for the kind of knowledge I'm after. :) > > The task at hand is driving a 4" diameter vector CRT. _Any_ 4" vector CRT > would work, but it has to be round. I have to be able to drive this from > a PC. I'm building an F-15C flight simulator out of real parts - one of > which is the mortal remains of an ALR/56C electronic countermeasures > display. The original electronics are basically junk due to excessive > shock from ground impact. This leaves me with a nice shell that a 4" > round CRT is needed for. It's my understanding that it's possible to > drive a CRT like this "oscilloscope style". Where can I find out > information on how to do this? Is there any kind of black box that I can > buy or build that will allow me to feed an NTSC or VGA signal in one end > and get a correct vector signal out the other? > > For those interested, you can see my project at http://www.f15sim.com. Maybe this is what you are looking for: http://www.zektor.com/zvg/index.htm -- The ears are too length. -------------------------------------------------------- tim lindner tlindner@ix.netcom.com From alhartman at yahoo.com Mon Sep 15 15:44:00 2003 From: alhartman at yahoo.com (Al Hartman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Where to get MacOS In-Reply-To: <20030914170000.10478.216.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <20030915203625.61950.qmail@web13406.mail.yahoo.com> Try: http://www.purplus.com MacOS 8.1 and 7.6 cheaply. They might also have 8.6 and 9.x, though I haven't checked recently. Al > Subject: MacOS 8.6 or 9.1 > > Anybody has a good Source for them ? > My hardrive crashed, and I got the machine with the > OS installed :( > Checking ebay already regularly, but no luck there > :( > > cheers & thanks From allain at panix.com Mon Sep 15 15:55:01 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: HPGL on Mac References: Message-ID: <007c01c37bca$318adc20$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Supposing I have a HP LaserJet II (non-P) that doesn't have Postscript but does have HPGL. Can someone tell me where to get software to allow WYSIWYG printing off of (appropriately old) MacOS? This printer also supports RS232. John A. From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 16:04:01 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: <1g1bxeb.fbc0dk6tuu4gM%tlindner@ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: > > For those interested, you can see my project at http://www.f15sim.com. > > Maybe this is what you are looking for: > > http://www.zektor.com/zvg/index.htm > Now see, this is why I asked here. I _knew_ one of you had the exact answer I needed. *Huge Grin* Thanks a lot Tim! g. From pcw at mesanet.com Mon Sep 15 16:07:00 2003 From: pcw at mesanet.com (Peter C. Wallace) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Gene Buckle wrote: > > there is a arcade game emulator called "mame" that has emulation of > > vector graphic but uses ordinary raster scanned (runs on normal vga). > > > > You'd have a lot better maintainability and quality if you took a regular > > vga monitor and wrote code to take in your vector plot data and made > > a custom driver for a "game" that mame could run which would paint > > your vector stuff on the screen. > > > > You would use a 5": vga color painting green lines, and would restrict > > the thing with a mask in the software to keep it in the confines of the > > console punchout's geometry. I would think that even the air force > > might options such a product to replace their units... > > > > Jim, the vector requirement is one of hardware, not software. Trust me, > if I could buy a 4" round raster CRT, I'd jump on it. The whole problem > is due to the size constraints. that I'm faced with. A 5" CRT is actually > too large to be properly fit within the confines of the original > enclosure. I therefore have to use a 4" tube from an oscilloscope as a > replacement. To my (limited!) knowledge, no one makes such a thing in a > raster drive configuration. When you say CRT do you mean just the tube or the whole display system? There is no such thing as a raster CRT if you are only talking about the tube. The raster aspect concerns the surrounding electronics and deflection yoke (if magnetic) If you have to drive a 4" round tube and you need to make the electronics then why not just raster scan an electrostatic CRT with VGA timing. No need to do the vector hardware, as the sweep generators to do raster scan would be easier to do than the vector generator, and you would be VGA compatible on the computer side. > > If you look at http://www.f15sim.com/images/tews_teardown_sm.jpg (view > tews_teardown.jpg for a much larger image) you'll see what I have to work > with. Due to screen burn on the CRT, I've discovered that there are > quadrant marks that are painted along the edge of the CRT circumference, > much like a clock. This means that for my simulation to be correct, the > replacement must be round. A square tube or LCD would give far too small > an image. I'm going to write the driver software myself, but I have to be > able to drive the screen first. :) If I could find a ready-made NTSC or > VGA to vector converter, I'd be set. > > Thanks! > > g. > Peter Wallace From arcarlini at iee.org Mon Sep 15 16:11:00 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Disposing of a Collection In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030915150819.033367d8@mail.ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <000001c37bcc$c36cd420$5b01a8c0@athlon> > There does not seem to be a KB11-D printset there. I have the KB-11 and KB11 searches turn up a few more manuals, including: "EK-KB11A-MM-004 KB11-A,D Central Processor Unit Maintenance Manual" which *might* have schematics in it (some of the PDP/LSI manuals do, most don't). > SC72 manual from Al's site as well, but I want to find the > hardware to go with it:-) Downloading the h/w is not yet an option :-) Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From waltje at pdp11.nl Mon Sep 15 16:14:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Damn HP! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Damn HP ! I'm (still) the proud owner of a HP 7980S SCSI 9-track magtape drive, and dammit, I need some config info for that thing.. it WILL NOT write tapes at 1600bpi. Does anyone here have a tip, or, better, a manual for that thing?? (no, CONF 46 wont force it to 1600...) --fred (*grunt*) From jwest at classiccmp.org Mon Sep 15 16:17:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Disposing of a Collection (11/44) schtuff References: <000001c37bcc$c36cd420$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: <018101c37bcd$89a7e620$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Speaking of which... I have a SM-144 memory board that goes in an 11/44. I have NO docs as to jumper settings and such. Anyone know, or know where there is a manual for said board? I think the manufacturer is "Standard Memories". Jay West From jwest at classiccmp.org Mon Sep 15 16:21:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Damn HP! References: Message-ID: <019c01c37bce$2b9d14a0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> We have a bunch of those here. As I recall, when you load the tape it will read what's on it and set the density automatically to match what is already on it. I think there's a way to override that... let me check with the people here that use them. Jay West ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fred N. van Kempen" To: Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 4:04 PM Subject: Damn HP! > Damn HP ! > > I'm (still) the proud owner of a HP 7980S SCSI 9-track magtape > drive, and dammit, I need some config info for that thing.. it > WILL NOT write tapes at 1600bpi. Does anyone here have a tip, > or, better, a manual for that thing?? > > (no, CONF 46 wont force it to 1600...) > > --fred (*grunt*) From mikeford at socal.rr.com Mon Sep 15 16:24:00 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Junkbox to the rescue In-Reply-To: <3F620007.2090103@srv.net> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030915122857.0306fa20@pop-server.socal.rr.com> I was pretty disappointed with a box of misc I bought last week, nice looking stuff, that does not work. A 1.2 GB drive, but aack, its a Conner CPF1275A, and I had no luck making it appear to any computer (Seagate remembers it, but their install tool doesn't support it. Essentially for $40 I got a sink for about 10 hours of my time. Good news Two of the funky CD drives were the same brand, so I started looking for the problems. Both had stuck doors, and one even turned out to be a DVD drive. I took them apart, and turns out most of the drive mechanism is the same, and while one had a broken lever, the DVD only had a bad gear which I managed to swap. End result, one working drive, one still in the parts donor bin. From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 16:24:12 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > If you have to drive a 4" round tube and you need to make the electronics then > why not just raster scan an electrostatic CRT with VGA timing. No need to do > the vector hardware, as the sweep generators to do raster scan would be easier > to do than the vector generator, and you would be VGA compatible on the > computer side. > My problem is that my electronics ability is far outstripped by my requirements. :) I have _no_ clue how to actually implment what you just described. g. From patrick at evocative.com Mon Sep 15 16:26:00 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 In-Reply-To: <000c01c37bc0$09d69160$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: > > Eventually, after a good solid history of data has been > accumulated in the > > system, we'll be able to tell you the high/low/average/etc > price for items > > over time. > > > > Patrick > > > > How would you get a reliable price range from such a small group of > collector with such a wide range of systems they collect? It takes time. And, I'm not talking about publishing an absolute reference for pricing, I'm talking about having a historical record of transactions and being able to make inquiries of that data. How you interpret the results is up to you. And, maybe we won't have price information for a large number of items; that doesn't mean we shouldn't try to gather it for any of them. > Apple I's cost a few bucks but there is only a few around only a > few people > willing to spend the cash to buy one (not even taking into account the > economy being good or bad). And so, is it not useful to know either as a buyer or seller, that (pulling random numbers for example) five such systems have sold in the last two years, and that the high sale price was $25,000, and the low was $8,000, and what the condition of the items was? I think so. > How will you take into account a system that 5 > people might pay $300 but dozens are just given away every year > just to have > their space back? You're reading way to much into my statement. We're documenting the past, not predicting the future. If the system reports back that 5 sold at $300 and 50 were give-aways, it's up to you to make a judgement on your own sensibilities (I know what I'd decide). > It works better when a large volume of collectors are involved and items > change hands alot or at least have a greater liquidity. If your goal is to establish an instantaneous price for an item, and the buyer and seller don't expect much variance, that's probably true. But, I don't think that's the physchology of the collector (the general term, speaking not just of computers, but any collectible item). This isn't the stock market, and although "supply and demand" is hard at work in both worlds, the driving physchology is different. At least, I don't buy stocks the way I buy computers. Not even close. I've never bought a stock because I had it as a kid. :-) But when I buy either, I do my research. Patrick From aw288 at osfn.org Mon Sep 15 16:52:00 2003 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > The task at hand is driving a 4" diameter vector CRT. _Any_ 4" vector CRT > would work, but it has to be round. As you have probably found out by now, 4 inch CRTs are real oddballs. The only "production" (that is "over the counter") CRTs of this size I know of are the 4AP1 and 4AP10, and they are almost nonexistant. > I have to be able to drive this from > a PC. I'm building an F-15C flight simulator out of real parts - one of > which is the mortal remains of an ALR/56C electronic countermeasures > display. Frankly, your best bet is to find another AN/ALR-56 display. One should turn up eventually. What is the IP- number of the box? > The original electronics are basically junk due to excessive > shock from ground impact. Crash? William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 15 17:09:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: <200309151926.PAA20971@wordstock.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Bryan Pope wrote: > At http://www.xgamestation.com/view_product.php?id=2 about a vector display > interface coming soon. Maybe emailing Andre will get you some information > about it. You'll still have to design and build a doohickey to take an NTSC or VGA input signal and convert it to a vector signal, if that's even feasible. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 15 17:12:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Price Check on Aisle 5 In-Reply-To: <000c01c37bc0$09d69160$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, TeoZ wrote: > How would you get a reliable price range from such a small group of > collector with such a wide range of systems they collect? In time your characterization of "a small group of collectors" won't apply because the idea is to make it THE place for people to trade vintage computers. Either way, as data points add up over time it'll definitely show useful trends. > Apple I's cost a few bucks but there is only a few around only a few people > willing to spend the cash to buy one (not even taking into account the > economy being good or bad). Ok, and so of all the sales that take place, each is a valid data point. Over the past 5 years there have been about a dozen Apple-1 sales, with the average price coming out to between $18-20K. > How will you take into account a system that 5 people might pay $300 but > dozens are just given away every year just to have their space back? There's a thing in mathematics called "average", and "mean". Check them out. > It works better when a large volume of collectors are involved and items > change hands alot or at least have a greater liquidity. You're right. So why haven't you signed up for an account yet? http://marketplace.vintage.org ;) -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 15 17:15:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Gene Buckle wrote: > > At http://www.xgamestation.com/view_product.php?id=2 about a vector display > > interface coming soon. Maybe emailing Andre will get you some information > > about it. > > That's interesting Bryan, but I need something a bit less in the vaporware > category. :( Gene, It's not vaporware. It's a real, working circuit. I've seen it. It works. It's very cool. Andre' is just not sure if it will become a product or not...it depends on demand. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 17:17:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > As you have probably found out by now, 4 inch CRTs are real oddballs. The > only "production" (that is "over the counter") CRTs of this size I know of > are the 4AP1 and 4AP10, and they are almost nonexistant. > I may find one at http://www.russiantubes.com. If not, I can suffer with a 3" crt. > > I have to be able to drive this from > > a PC. I'm building an F-15C flight simulator out of real parts - one of > > which is the mortal remains of an ALR/56C electronic countermeasures > > display. > > Frankly, your best bet is to find another AN/ALR-56 display. One should > turn up eventually. What is the IP- number of the box? > I'd have to look on the tag. I actually did find another display shortly after I obtained the first one. My hope is to fine a new CRT just to avoid all the potting compound on the plug end of the CRT. That and getting hook up data on the original CRT would be next to impossible. > > The original electronics are basically junk due to excessive > > shock from ground impact. > > Crash? > Yep. The jet had a flameout on take off and since it was too heavy to horse into the air safely on one engine, the pilot punched out. The jet hit the ground at 300Kts+ and the cockpit section broke free of the main fuselage which burned. This happened in 1996. I managed to get the HUD, MPCD, TEWS and VSD plus other sundry parts out of the wreck. It was the ultimate find for my project for sure. Every one of those boxes are made of 100% pure Unobtainum. (they also happent to be filled with glass shards. :) ) g. From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 17:27:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > At http://www.xgamestation.com/view_product.php?id=2 about a vector display > > interface coming soon. Maybe emailing Andre will get you some information > > about it. > > You'll still have to design and build a doohickey to take an NTSC or VGA > input signal and convert it to a vector signal, if that's even feasible. > With the ZVG board that Tim pointed me to, it's a moot point fortunately. I was hammering Google pretty hard and found a really cool site that shows how to build a 'scope tube clock: http://www.webx.dk/oz2cpu/clock-scope/scope.htm ..that in turn lead me here: http://www.sphere.bc.ca/test/crts.html So I'm a pretty happy geek right now. :) g. From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 17:36:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > > At http://www.xgamestation.com/view_product.php?id=2 about a vector display > > > interface coming soon. Maybe emailing Andre will get you some information > > > about it. > > > > That's interesting Bryan, but I need something a bit less in the vaporware > > category. :( > > Gene, > > It's not vaporware. It's a real, working circuit. I've seen it. It > works. It's very cool. Andre' is just not sure if it will become a > product or not...it depends on demand. > Ahh, ok. My mistake. g. From donm at cts.com Mon Sep 15 18:18:00 2003 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: kaypro 2 cables (question) In-Reply-To: <3f.2205c16d.2c94ea89@aol.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 CribbReeper@aol.com wrote: > hi, do you know where i can get ahold of a kaypro 2 keyboard cable, it > looks like a telephone cord connection, (knoe what i mean) and i cant find one any > where, i really need to get some advice, is it hidden in the computer > somewhere?? thanx. > > > sincerely, > > t.w. A telephone handset cord makes a very good replacement provided you can find a convenient length and a color that you like :) - don From zmerch at 30below.com Mon Sep 15 18:45:00 2003 From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: Help on a few fronts... Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030915182209.030c4748@mail.30below.com> Otay, I need a little personal help, and help for a couple of friends, so I'll lump them all into a single message, to minimize the s:n ratio... 1) For me: This may actually be on-topic, but if not, it's close. I have a from-scratch linux installation, and I'm trying to find the source code for the (original) X-windows solitare game of Spider. I don't have Gnome or KDE running (Actually, it's FVWM2... ;-) and so many of the newer games won't compile unless I add .5G of libraries... which I'm unwilling to add for 1 frelling game. Anyone have the source tarball on an ancient linux distro somewhere? (I tried all mine, and couldn't find it... :-( ) 2) Off-topic, but hackerdom-based... I have a friend that has an AMD "Super-Socket-7" pentium based motherboard - model: Micronics C200. It has a fragged BIOS. He gave me the "correct" .bin file that I burned onto a provided EEPROM - but it 1) wasn't the right file, or 2) wasn't the right format for burning. Does anyone have that board that could get me a workable BIOS dump? 3) Off-topic, but it's for a *really* good friend of mine... he an Agfa Snapscan 1236 SCSI scanner, and would like the transparency / slide add-on gizmo for it. I've googled & ebayed... no useful hits... :-( Anyone here know where to get one for sale? As always, all replies offlist, please, and thanks for any and all help anyone could provide... Thanks! Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers zmerch@30below.com What do you do when Life gives you lemons, and you don't *like* lemonade????????????? From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 15 19:09:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Gene Buckle wrote: > Yep. The jet had a flameout on take off and since it was too heavy to > horse into the air safely on one engine, the pilot punched out. The jet > hit the ground at 300Kts+ and the cockpit section broke free of the main > fuselage which burned. This happened in 1996. I managed to get the HUD, > MPCD, TEWS and VSD plus other sundry parts out of the wreck. It was the > ultimate find for my project for sure. Every one of those boxes are made > of 100% pure Unobtainum. (they also happent to be filled with glass > shards. :) ) Somewhat on the same subject, what would be the chances of obtaining a flight computer from the F14A? I would REALLY like to get my hands on one. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 19:22:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Frankly, your best bet is to find another AN/ALR-56 display. One should > turn up eventually. What is the IP- number of the box? > Here's the IP number: IP-1164B/ALR-56C The NSN is 5865-01-289-9651EW and it's made by Loral Electronic Systems. I did verify that the tube is indeed a 4" tube. The 4AP10 CRT number that you mentioned I found online for $85. If you have access to the documentation on the unit I've got, I would _love_ to get the tube specs and pinouts. It also has a set of symbols like this: [O] burned into the 12 o'clock position. Any idea what that's for? Thanks! g. From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 19:27:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Somewhat on the same subject, what would be the chances of obtaining a > flight computer from the F14A? > I would guess zero. Something like that would be on the destroy list. (Class C or D I think - it's been too long since I investigated such things). Basically the only chance you've got is finding one that escaped the system sideways and wasn't destroyed by the DRMO folks. For instance, the 2nd AN/ALR-56C display I have I bought off of eBay from a surplus dealer that got it in an Estate Sale. Do you happen to have an F-14A that needs one? :) g. From bshannon at tiac.net Mon Sep 15 19:35:00 2003 From: bshannon at tiac.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: Omnibot 2000 goes for over$400 References: <00ef01c37b9d$0cb53530$2b0bdd40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <3F665956.8010704@tiac.net> Hmmm, I wonder what someone might pay for my HERO 2000? Keys wrote: >With the box it went for $405 on ebay. It making it very hard to get the >tray and remote that I need for mine.:-( >http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?viewitem&item=3144773461 From vance at neurotica.com Mon Sep 15 19:40:00 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:53 2005 Subject: OT: Help on a few fronts... In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030915182209.030c4748@mail.30below.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Roger Merchberger wrote: > Otay, I need a little personal help, and help for a couple of friends, > so I'll lump them all into a single message, to minimize the s:n > ratio... > > 1) For me: This may actually be on-topic, but if not, it's close. I have > a from-scratch linux installation, and I'm trying to find the source > code for the (original) X-windows solitare game of Spider. I don't have > Gnome or KDE running (Actually, it's FVWM2... ;-) and so many of the > newer games won't compile unless I add .5G of libraries... which I'm > unwilling to add for 1 frelling game. Anyone have the source tarball on > an ancient linux distro somewhere? (I tried all mine, and couldn't find > it... :-( ) I believe this game is in the sample code for the XView toolkit. If you can find that toolkit's source, it should have that game's. Peace... Sridhar From bshannon at tiac.net Mon Sep 15 19:48:00 2003 From: bshannon at tiac.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... References: Message-ID: <3F665C2F.2080200@tiac.net> Try to get an HP1350 or HP 1351 graphics translator, or graphics generator. These are not all that hard to find, and they generate excellent quality vectors, driven by a GPIB interface. Very cool, real vintage vector hardware! And by the way, NO raster based display can ever do a credible job of simulating a 'real' vector display. The aircraft cockpit had ~real~ vectors, not a raster display, and for a good reason. Use real vectors, accept no substitutes. John Lawson wrote: > A thought occurs to me: there is a piece of video test gear called a >Vectorscope - used to determine the proper alignment of the TV color >signal phase vectors... anyway, a lot of companies, from Heathkit to >Tekronix, made these, and the older ones can be had at swpameets (or on >eBay) for pretty cheap. > > Then, you'd have all the circuitry needed to drive the CRT (and quite >possibly a 4" CRT in the bargain)... the interfacing task is redused to >just DACs and opamps to feed the vectorscope guts.... > > I think if I had to produce a 'real' stroke display that's the route I'd >investigate first. > > > Cheers > >John From bshannon at tiac.net Mon Sep 15 19:53:00 2003 From: bshannon at tiac.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... References: Message-ID: <3F665D8D.6070806@tiac.net> Yep, but I can't tell ya! (ex USAF vector-pusher) Gene Buckle wrote: >>Frankly, your best bet is to find another AN/ALR-56 display. One should >>turn up eventually. What is the IP- number of the box? >> >Here's the IP number: > >IP-1164B/ALR-56C > >The NSN is 5865-01-289-9651EW and it's made by Loral Electronic Systems. > >I did verify that the tube is indeed a 4" tube. The 4AP10 CRT number that >you mentioned I found online for $85. > >If you have access to the documentation on the unit I've got, I would >_love_ to get the tube specs and pinouts. > >It also has a set of symbols like this: [O] burned into the 12 o'clock >position. Any idea what that's for? > >Thanks! > >g. From patrick at evocative.com Mon Sep 15 20:06:00 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: Omnibot 2000 goes for over$400 In-Reply-To: <3F665956.8010704@tiac.net> Message-ID: Bob, Check out these closed auctions: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3044698246&category=294 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2751219649&category=1247 Patrick :-) > -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]On > Behalf Of Bob Shannon > Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 5:29 PM > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: Omnibot 2000 goes for over$400 > > > Hmmm, I wonder what someone might pay for my HERO 2000? > > Keys wrote: > > >With the box it went for $405 on ebay. It making it very hard to get the > >tray and remote that I need for mine.:-( > >http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?viewitem&item=3144773461 From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 20:19:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: <3F665C2F.2080200@tiac.net> Message-ID: > Try to get an HP1350 or HP 1351 graphics translator, or graphics > generator. These are not all that > hard to find, and they generate excellent quality vectors, driven by a > GPIB interface. > > Very cool, real vintage vector hardware! > Thanks Bob. If the ZVG board doesn't work out for some reason, I'll check that out. > And by the way, NO raster based display can ever do a credible job of > simulating a 'real' vector > display. The aircraft cockpit had ~real~ vectors, not a raster display, > and for a good reason. > > Use real vectors, accept no substitutes. > Well, when a 5"x5" color CRT would set me back $5300.00 for *one*, I'll accept whatever substitution I can get my paws on. :) Square CRTs are priced _way_ out of the hobbiest budget. They're flight certified, ruggedized, etc. Hell the jettison selector switch in the MPCD is $1300 a pop. It's built with anti-corrosion coating, etc. on it. WAY too much for my meager needs. g. From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 20:22:01 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: <3F665D8D.6070806@tiac.net> Message-ID: > Yep, but I can't tell ya! > You have no idea how tired I get of that answer. :) With this project, I get it a _lot_. I'm surprised I haven't gone nuts and thrown some poor crew chief into a pillory and beat him with a hose until he coughed up some obscure bit of data I needed. *grin* Can you tell me what the doc # is that describes it? I'm not beyond beating some poor civil servant about the head and shoulders with a FOIA request. :) g. From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 15 20:25:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: need HP 9121D cabinet/circuit board In-Reply-To: <000001c37a69$b9a726c0$1f6fa8c0@eths.k12.il.us> from "Jack Rubin" at Sep 13, 3 09:41:37 pm Message-ID: > I've got a 9121D floppy subsystem that fails to pass POST. Drives wink > on power up, fan turns, fuses check out ok, but indicator LED on circuit > board never comes on and drives remain invisible to IB controller (1630G > logic analyzer). I've blown out the dust, reseated cables and the one > socketed PROM and that's all I can figure out to do. Nothing seems > obviously damaged or smoked. [...] > Obviously, service data or trouble-shooting ideas would be welcome From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 15 20:25:41 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: Needed - VT terminal In-Reply-To: <20030915004313.GP21282@rhiannon.rddavis.org> from "R. D. Davis" at Sep 14, 3 08:43:13 pm Message-ID: > Quothe Christopher Cureau, from writings of Fri, Sep 12, 2003 at > 08:23:13AM -0500: > > Does anyone have a spare VT220, 320 or 420 that they'd be willing to part > > with? My 320 just bit the dust...very inconvenient time, too, since I was > > Wouldn't you rather repair it than replace it? What went wrong with it? It's a VT320... 99.9% fo the time the failure with these is the flyback transformer which develops shorted turns (and then fails visibly, with 'gunge' leaking out). Sometimes it takes the horizontal output transistor with it as well, or maybe even bits of the PSU. If the power indicator is flashing on/off, then it's the flyback, period (well, it _might_ be something else, but it's a fairly safe bet it's the flyback). -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 15 20:26:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: from "Gene Buckle" at Sep 15, 3 12:35:50 pm Message-ID: > I know this is off topic for the list, but you folks are my best choice > for the kind of knowledge I'm after. :) > > The task at hand is driving a 4" diameter vector CRT. _Any_ 4" vector CRT What the heck is a 'vector CRT'? AFAIK such things don't exist. whether a CRT displays 'vectors' (meaning you deflect the electron beam to a point, turn it on, then move it along a line to display that line), or a 'raster' (meaning you scan out a series of lines and modulate the beam to display an image) depends on the external circuitry, not the CRT itself. Magnetically-deflected CRTs (like those in most monitors and TVs) are generally easier to use to display a raster, but electrostatically-deflected CRTs ('scopes, 'vector displays', etc) can be used for either. > round CRT is needed for. It's my understanding that it's possible to > drive a CRT like this "oscilloscope style". Where can I find out Yes. It's alos possible to display a raster on it. In fact I've _seen_ a good 'scope (with 2 timebases) be used to display a TV-rate image. > information on how to do this? Is there any kind of black box that I can > buy or build that will allow me to feed an NTSC or VGA signal in one end > and get a correct vector signal out the other? It's non-trivial to turn a raster image into an optimised vector image (which would involve finding lines in the image, and then drawing them). It's not as hard to make a framestore that outputs the 2 deflection signals and intensity to drive a 'scope-like CRT in raster mode. The problem with doing this is that you might not be able to get enough intenstity out of the CRT to display a raster in a useable manner... -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 15 20:26:08 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: from "John Lawson" at Sep 15, 3 04:29:31 pm Message-ID: > A thought occurs to me: there is a piece of video test gear called a > Vectorscope - used to determine the proper alignment of the TV color A 'vectorscope' has nothing to do with a vector display. A vectorscope is a device used to display the amplitude and phase of a waveform, often the colour part of a video signal. A normal oscilloscope, in XY mode, is almost the same thing as a vector display, and is much more likely to be what you need.... And yes, then, DACs to feed the X,Y and Z (intensity) inputs are basically what you need. -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 15 20:26:15 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: collection organising In-Reply-To: <20030915145935.86603.qmail@web21104.mail.yahoo.com> from "=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=" at Sep 15, 3 03:59:35 pm Message-ID: > OK, current situation: Everything spread to hell and back in several different > rooms. Although I do seem to know where things are! > > Desired situation: Something a little more organised :-) I have found that 'being organised' is incompatable with being a 'hacker' ;-) > > I can't decide whether to try and keep things related to each manufacturer > together (hardware, manuals, software, cables, spares etc.), or to keep like > objects together (cables regardless of what machine they're for, spares all in > one place etc.). I tend to mix the 2 schemes. Generic parts (resistors, TTL chips, RS232 cables, etc) are kept 'like with like'. Specific parts (complete/bare PCBs, chassis parts, etc) are kept by machine. -tony From jpl15 at panix.com Mon Sep 15 20:41:00 2003 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 16 Sep 2003, Tony Duell wrote: > > A 'vectorscope' has nothing to do with a vector display. A vectorscope is > a device used to display the amplitude and phase of a waveform, often the > colour part of a video signal. Quite right, TD, but... I specifically mentioned this type of instrument because I felt that it would already have a good deal of the basic electronic requirements in place. Yes, a regular 'scope would also suffice, perhaps cheaper, but an old Vectorscope would come without the 'baggage' of sweep and trigger circuits... viewing the Project from a K.I.S.S. standpoint, there is a decision tree to be followed.... Cheers John From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 15 20:47:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: from "John Lawson" at Sep 15, 3 09:33:29 pm Message-ID: > Quite right, TD, but... I specifically mentioned this type of > instrument because I felt that it would already have a good deal of the > basic electronic requirements in place. Yes, a regular 'scope would also > suffice, perhaps cheaper, but an old Vectorscope would come without the > 'baggage' of sweep and trigger circuits... viewing the Project from a Eh? A vectorscope is a lot more than just an XY display. In fact it's got more 'baggage' than a normal 'scope I think. A 'scope with XY mode is really what you need.... -tony From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 15 20:48:01 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Gene Buckle wrote: > I would guess zero. Something like that would be on the destroy list. Hmmm... > (Class C or D I think - it's been too long since I investigated such > things). Basically the only chance you've got is finding one that escaped > the system sideways and wasn't destroyed by the DRMO folks. For instance, > the 2nd AN/ALR-56C display I have I bought off of eBay from a surplus > dealer that got it in an Estate Sale. So there are no graveyards somewhere in Arizona with decommissioned planes waiting to be scrapped as I've heard? > Do you happen to have an F-14A that needs one? :) No, but the computer is significant in many, many ways, not the least of which is that it contains a microprocessor that predates the Intel 4004: http://www.microcomputerhistory.com -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 20:56:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > The task at hand is driving a 4" diameter vector CRT. _Any_ 4" vector CRT > > What the heck is a 'vector CRT'? AFAIK such things don't exist. whether a > CRT displays 'vectors' (meaning you deflect the electron beam to a point, > turn it on, then move it along a line to display that line), or a > 'raster' (meaning you scan out a series of lines and modulate the beam to > display an image) depends on the external circuitry, not the CRT itself. > > Magnetically-deflected CRTs (like those in most monitors and TVs) are > generally easier to use to display a raster, but > electrostatically-deflected CRTs ('scopes, 'vector displays', etc) can be > used for either. > I know that now, but not before I posted the original message. This list is nearly always a worthwhile education. :) g. From redodd at comcast.net Mon Sep 15 21:00:00 2003 From: redodd at comcast.net (Ralph E. Dodd) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: specifications for IBM XT-286 References: <20030914170000.10478.216.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <009d01c37bf5$35aab610$98fa2544@MAINPC> ----- Original Message ----- > Message: 18 > Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2003 16:07:32 +0200 > Organization: http://freemail.web.de/ > From: "Pierre Gebhardt" > To: cctech@classiccmp.org > Subject: specifications for IBM XT-286 > Reply-To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > > Hi all, > > can anybody tell me, what harddrive and disk drives (modelnumber and company) are built in a IBM XT-286 ? > I found such a machine 2 months ago. Unfortunately, all the drives are missing. > The machine itself semms to be in a godd condition. > > Thanks alot in advance for your help! > > Pierre > ____________________________________________________________________________ __ > 38xTestsieger - WEB.DE FreeMail - Deutschlands beste E-Mail > Jeden Monat mit 10% mehr Leistung! http://f.web.de/?mc=021138 > > --__--__-- Pierre, Here are 2 links concerning the XT-286. http://www.uncreativelabs.org/~matt/classic/5162.html http://safariexamples.informit.com/0789725428/Reference%5Chardware.pdf Hope this helps. Ralph From jpl15 at panix.com Mon Sep 15 21:03:00 2003 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: Interesting Atari/Tandy archive site Message-ID: Y'all might want to check these guys out: http://www.atarimagazines.com/ An awful lot of work went into this... Cheerz John From aw288 at osfn.org Mon Sep 15 21:19:00 2003 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > IP-1164B/ALR-56C > > The NSN is 5865-01-289-9651EW and it's made by Loral Electronic Systems. OK. I know I don't have one, but I can put it on my watch list. > I did verify that the tube is indeed a 4" tube. The 4AP10 CRT number that > you mentioned I found online for $85. The problem is that the 4AP10 is the one you simply can't use. P10 is a bizarre dark phosphor, with a very VERY long persistance. > If you have access to the documentation on the unit I've got, I would > _love_ to get the tube specs and pinouts. I'll post a query on the TCA list. Tube geeks, basically... > It also has a set of symbols like this: [O] burned into the 12 o'clock > position. Any idea what that's for? My guess is "no threat". William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 21:21:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > (Class C or D I think - it's been too long since I investigated such > > things). Basically the only chance you've got is finding one that escaped > > the system sideways and wasn't destroyed by the DRMO folks. For instance, > > the 2nd AN/ALR-56C display I have I bought off of eBay from a surplus > > dealer that got it in an Estate Sale. > > So there are no graveyards somewhere in Arizona with decommissioned planes > waiting to be scrapped as I've heard? > Oh there certainly are. However, nothing on the DOD destroy list is supposed to leave the facility. Even things not on the list must go through a "demil" process first. In the case of the DFCS computer in the Tomcat, that would consist of either punching holes through the boards or more likely running them through a material grinder somewhat like a wood chipper. Currently there is one F-14A at AMARC[*] is S/N 160378. It's AMARC inventory # is AN1K0119 and the construction number is H80. It arrived at AMARC August 21st, 2000. It was the last of a lot to be delivered to Iran, but delivery never took place. It was converted to be an NF-14 testbed aircraft. [*]Aerospace Maintenance And Regeneration Center > > Do you happen to have an F-14A that needs one? :) > > No, but the computer is significant in many, many ways, not the least of > which is that it contains a microprocessor that predates the Intel 4004: > > http://www.microcomputerhistory.com > That is very cool. Unfortunately, I don't think you'll ever get one. You might be able to get your hands on some pictures possibly. You should check with the public relations dept. of the Navy and see if their historical research branch can help you out. If this was a USAF bird, I could tell you exactly who to talk to... g. From aw288 at osfn.org Mon Sep 15 21:23:00 2003 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > Somewhat on the same subject, what would be the chances of obtaining a > > flight computer from the F14A? > > > I would guess zero. Something like that would be on the destroy list. If you are talking about the AN/AWG-9, basically ZERO. You must remember that Iran has a bunch of neutered F-14s. One of the things they really need to get them flying is a bunch of /AWG-9 parts. There are a lot of people that would really like those F-14s to stay on the ground. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From mtapley at swri.edu Mon Sep 15 21:30:01 2003 From: mtapley at swri.edu (Mark Tapley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: MacOS 8.6 or 9.1 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > > Anybody has a good Source for them ? For OS 9.1 @ $45 + shipping: Other World Computing Satisfied customer, no other affiliation. -- - Mark 210-522-6025, page 888-733-0967 From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 21:44:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > IP-1164B/ALR-56C > > > > The NSN is 5865-01-289-9651EW and it's made by Loral Electronic Systems. > > OK. I know I don't have one, but I can put it on my watch list. > I'd be surprised if you found one. > The problem is that the 4AP10 is the one you simply can't use. P10 is a > bizarre dark phosphor, with a very VERY long persistance. > What was it originally used for? Is the 4AP1 usable? > > If you have access to the documentation on the unit I've got, I would > > _love_ to get the tube specs and pinouts. > > I'll post a query on the TCA list. Tube geeks, basically... > Thanks! g. From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 21:48:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > > Somewhat on the same subject, what would be the chances of obtaining a > > > flight computer from the F14A? > > > > > I would guess zero. Something like that would be on the destroy list. > > If you are talking about the AN/AWG-9, basically ZERO. You must remember > that Iran has a bunch of neutered F-14s. One of the things they really > need to get them flying is a bunch of /AWG-9 parts. There are a lot of > people that would really like those F-14s to stay on the ground. > That's right. I'd totally forgotten about that. When the MACDAC employees left, a whole bunch of critical boxes vanished about the same time. Iran was _not_ amused. MACDAC played a very good game of "What parts?" As far as I'm concerned, they can go back up. I have a friend that flies the F-15E that would be more than happy to make it rain scrap metal all over the desert. :) g. From vance at neurotica.com Mon Sep 15 22:06:00 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Gene Buckle wrote: > As far as I'm concerned, they can go back up. I have a friend that > flies the F-15E that would be more than happy to make it rain scrap > metal all over the desert. :) Iran isn't a desert. 8-) Peace... Sridhar From aw288 at osfn.org Mon Sep 15 22:28:00 2003 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > I'd be surprised if you found one. Hope springs eternal. That, and I am in the surplus business. > What was it originally used for? Very odd physics experiments. > Is the 4AP1 usable? Yes, P1 is basically green, like many old radar scopes. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From teoz at neo.rr.com Mon Sep 15 22:31:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: Help with a eprom References: <030910231947.c71d@splab.cas.neu.edu> Message-ID: <005401c37c01$ec6ec600$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 11:19 PM Subject: Re: Help with a eprom > Eprom is all done. I burned two of them onto TMS27c128 28 pin chips. > verified fine. Just need a ship to address. > > Joe Heck (trash3 at splab . cas . neu . edu) > Got the rom today and it looks like its working fine, thanks for the help with the roms Joe, and thanks to everybody who replied to my request for help. TZ From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 22:42:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003 vance@neurotica.com wrote: > On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Gene Buckle wrote: > > > As far as I'm concerned, they can go back up. I have a friend that > > flies the F-15E that would be more than happy to make it rain scrap > > metal all over the desert. :) > > Iran isn't a desert. 8-) > See? More edumakation. :) g. From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Sep 15 22:47:00 2003 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > I'd be surprised if you found one. > > Hope springs eternal. That, and I am in the surplus business. > Very good. If you'd be so kind as to check out the Misc link at http://www.f15sim.com and take a look at the "Left Console", "Instrument Panel" and "Right Console" pictures and let me know if you've got or run across anything show, I'd be eternally grateful. :) > > Is the 4AP1 usable? > > Yes, P1 is basically green, like many old radar scopes. > Ok. Any known source for these? g. From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 15 22:55:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Gene Buckle wrote: > > http://www.microcomputerhistory.com > > > > That is very cool. Unfortunately, I don't think you'll ever get one. You > might be able to get your hands on some pictures possibly. You should That site was built by Ray Holt who was featured at VCF 2.0 where he first revealed this information. I've gotten a lot of great stuff from him, including photos of the chip masks, photos of the prototype computer, and other interesting things. Ray's got the original first fab prototype chips. It would be great--nay, it is imperative--to get an actual instance of the computer for preservation. > check with the public relations dept. of the Navy and see if their > historical research branch can help you out. If this was a USAF bird, I > could tell you exactly who to talk to... It was Navy. But perhaps your contact might be useful nonetheless? Please e-mail me privately. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 15 22:58:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:54 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, William Donzelli wrote: > > > Somewhat on the same subject, what would be the chances of obtaining a > > > flight computer from the F14A? > > > > > I would guess zero. Something like that would be on the destroy list. > > If you are talking about the AN/AWG-9, basically ZERO. You must remember > that Iran has a bunch of neutered F-14s. One of the things they really > need to get them flying is a bunch of /AWG-9 parts. There are a lot of > people that would really like those F-14s to stay on the ground. Nope, it's not the AN/AWG-9: http://www.raytheon.com/products/awg9_apg71/ ...which is the weapon control computer. What I'm after is the flight control computer. Any chance you might know the part number for that? -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From jwest at classiccmp.org Mon Sep 15 23:51:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: HP cabinet keys sought Message-ID: <000701c37c0c$f052dd00$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> The new rack I am building into has locks on the back doors. I have a pretty large ring of HP keys, and none of them fit. All the HP racks I have thus far use the same back door key, except this one. I believe the lock is marked 2097. Any chance someone may have a key for this and could get me a copy? This key appears to be the kind where the "main channel" on the key is down the center, not on one side. Thanks in advance! Jay West From esharpe at uswest.net Tue Sep 16 01:22:00 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (ed sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: Omnibot 2000 goes for over$400 References: <00ef01c37b9d$0cb53530$2b0bdd40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <002901c37c19$c3ad7fa0$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> have the one smaller than the 2000, it is a stubby little driod and also an hero jr. and a lost in space robot... we need some nice cheesy metal painted and decaled 50s-60-s metal robots though to add to the museum's collection... any one have any they can spare? Thanks Ed Sharpe archivist for SMECC Please check our web site at http://www.smecc.org to see other engineering fields, communications and computation stuff we buy, and by all means when in Arizona drop in and see us. address: coury house / smecc 5802 w palmaire ave glendale az 85301 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Keys" To: "cctalk@classiccmp" Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 8:21 AM Subject: Omnibot 2000 goes for over$400 > With the box it went for $405 on ebay. It making it very hard to get the > tray and remote that I need for mine.:-( > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?viewitem&item=3144773461 From asholz at topinform.com Tue Sep 16 02:17:00 2003 From: asholz at topinform.com (Andreas Holz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: HP 85B Schematics wanted In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F66B70B.1030903@topinform.com> Tony, what are the 'MoHPC' CD-Roms? Andreas Tony Duell wrote: >>I am working on a HP 85B with a dead power supply. No +5, +12 just >>37volts on the large cap on the power supply board. Can anyone please >>help. Schmatics would be great! - Dave >> >> > >How different is the PSU to the HP85 PSU? The schematics for that are in >the HP85 'Assembly Level Service Manual' (yes, it sounds like a >board-swapper guide, but there are full schematics in the back). That's >on the MoHPC CD-ROMs... > >-tony From mattis at mattisborgen.org Tue Sep 16 02:55:00 2003 From: mattis at mattisborgen.org (Mattis Lind) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: HP54615B powersupply? Message-ID: Hi! Maybe not really classic computers, but one need a good oscillioscope to fix problems in old computers... My HP54615B has a dead powersupply. It just ticks once a second or so. The fan just rotates slowly. Does anyone has an idea what component has failed? I have checked som transistores and diodes, they all seem to be fine. I am about to replace som capacitors now. Maybe there are someone out there that has the schematic for this scope??? /Mattis Lind From healyzh at aracnet.com Tue Sep 16 02:59:00 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: Disposing of Collection (Part 2) Message-ID: Well, several people are interested in a few different items. The best advice I've gotten from some people is to get someone else to dispose of the stuff on eBay. I think this is the route that I'm going to take. Or at least I'll try it out and see how it works. OTOH, if someone offers sufficient money for a significant chunk of the collection and comes with a large truck to pick it up, I'll sell it to them. So if there is something you really want, why risk eBay, just offer a huge pile of cash for my collection :^) Zane -- -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From hansp at citem.org Tue Sep 16 03:01:00 2003 From: hansp at citem.org (hansp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: HP 85B Schematics wanted In-Reply-To: <3F66B70B.1030903@topinform.com> References: <3F66B70B.1030903@topinform.com> Message-ID: <3F66C133.4090001@citem.org> Andreas Holz wrote: > what are the 'MoHPC' CD-Roms? Museum of HP Calculators. On the web at http://www.hpmuseum.org/ -- hbp From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Tue Sep 16 03:18:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: Books and Manuals, FREE or very inexpensive Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030916035621.057baec0@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> I was doing some searching for Pro-Log manuals on the internet, and I ran across this web page from ADVANCED VEHICLE TECHNOLOGIES, Inc. where they have some books and manuals that they didn't want to throw out, so they are giving some of it away, or selling some of it very inexpensively http://www.avt-hq.com/books_01.htm http://www.avt-hq.com/contact.htm I've already gotten just the two Pro-Log manuals. They also have some surplus hardware for sale. Some of it is inexpensive. http://www.avt-hq.com/surplus.htm Best Regards From luc at e2t.be Tue Sep 16 04:31:01 2003 From: luc at e2t.be (Luc Vande Velde) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: DSM-11 (Digital Std MUMPS) info needed In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720F046C@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD6EB@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Waw, I checked the DSM images on a PDP11 simulator and it runs like in the good old days... Even the automatic hardware detection is working during sysgen. I 'll give those who want to play with it a few programs: To stop the system in a civilized manner: >D ^SSD To configure the system: >D ^%UTL To copy tapes if you have 2 tape drives >D ^TAPECOPY To build a new distribution tape: >D ^SYTOTAPE A very quick introduction to M(umps) M is an interpreter so you can enter commands in immediate mode if you don't start with a TAB syntax is: ,,... there must be a space between the command and the arguments. You can have as many commands on a line as you want if you separate them with a space. Most commands can be abbrev. to the first letter (there are less then 26 commands in M) so WRITE "HELLO" and W "HELLO" are identical. Commands without arguments must be separated from the next command by 2 spaces. All variables types are string (no panic you can do math on it)and does not exist by default as in basic. so W X give an error but SET X=3 W X is fine. the READ command reads from stdio (=current terminal) unless otherwise defined so R X W !,X reads from the keyboard and prints it back on the screen after you push enter. (the ! mark give a CRLF on the screen) the DO command starts execution of a program. The ^ indicates that the program is to be loaded from disk so D ^%UTL loads program %UTL from disk and starts execution at the first line. P(RINT) without arguments lists the program in memory (it's an interpreter so all code is visible) W(RITE) without arguments lists all variables in memory to load a program without executing it just use ZL(OAD) programname ex.: ZL SYTOTAPE P loads the program SYTOTAPE in memory and lists it on the console device. If you want to have the listing on a printer and you have a LP11 in your system, you can redirect the output to this printer. The first LP11 device has port number 3 in DSM so typing: O(PEN) 3 U(SE) 3 P C(LOSE) 3 - notice 2 spaces between the P and the C as P has no arguments! Don't forget this C command or your I/O is redirected to the printer and the console looks dead (you can solve this by typing Ctl C) And finally for this first intro: to have a directory listing of all the programs on disk: D ^%RD (in M a program is called a routine and %RD means routinedirectory ;)) Luc From tothwolf at concentric.net Tue Sep 16 04:37:00 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: OT: Help on a few fronts... In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030915182209.030c4748@mail.30below.com> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030915182209.030c4748@mail.30below.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Roger Merchberger wrote: > 2) Off-topic, but hackerdom-based... I have a friend that has an AMD > "Super-Socket-7" pentium based motherboard - model: Micronics C200. > It has a fragged BIOS. He gave me the "correct" .bin file that I > burned onto a provided EEPROM - but it 1) wasn't the right file, or > 2) wasn't the right format for burning. Does anyone have that board > that could get me a workable BIOS dump? I think I can do one better... Micronics was bought up by S3 around the time they bought up Diamond Multimedia and then changed their name to SonicBlu. I managed to archive all of the Micronics files when I was rebuilding a copy of the Diamond Multimedia archive, and I think I have the BIOS files you need. I may also have copies of the manuals and/or instructions for flashing the BIOS. All of the S3/Diamond/Micronics/Supra/etc files *except* for the Rio and a couple of other related products were "purged" from the Diamond/S3 ftp server not too long ago. When I called S3 about it, I found that my call was being routed to a call center in India, where the staff couldn't help me at all. Most of S3's assets were sold off to another company just before the big purge of files, and they didn't buy the S3/Diamond/Micronics/Supra stuff, including S3's video chipset division. (I'm not currently sure how I'm going to obtain programming docs for the S3 video chipsets now, and XFree86 needs lots of porting work done on the S3 server.) -Toth From luc at e2t.be Tue Sep 16 05:59:00 2003 From: luc at e2t.be (Luc Vande Velde) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: DSM-11 (Digital Std MUMPS) info needed In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720F046C@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD6EE@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Hi Folks, I found a description of the M Language on the following site: http://207.224.6.57 M(umps) by Example gr. Luc From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 16 06:00:02 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: DEC Server In-Reply-To: <000a01c37307$ceaaa100$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Antonio Carlini wrote: > BTW: Someone else said that DS100 was the DEC first terminal > server. That was me. > But the DECSA (PDP-11/24 based) preceded it. (I think > that was code named Pluto; if it wasn't, then there must have > been an even earlier one). Yes, they prototyped the DS100 "idea" on a bare 11/24, which is why the DS100/200/300/500 code still has the DE (DEUNA/DELUA) driver (== Unibus eth. controller.) - the DS series have chips that are DQ (DEQNA/DELQA) compatible. Still, the DECSA was not intened for mass production [use], so, I'd say the DS100 was the first "for mass use" DEC terminal server.. > The DS100 and DS200 didn't do telnet, at least none o fmine ever did > and I think I had the latest download code for both of them. The > DS300 did, and you may be right about V2.0 firmware being required. Correct. DS100 and DS200 are LAT-only, DS300 V1.x was LAT-only, and DS300 V2.x (and up) and others had IP support as well. > Thickwire was common, but Thinwire was certainly on the up and up. From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 16 06:03:01 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: Netbooting Sun 3 In-Reply-To: <20030907183144.GC1459@oblina.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Sep 2003, Jochen Kunz wrote: > > root on le0 > > nfs_boot: trying RARP (and RFC/bootparam) > > nfs_boot: client_addr=192.0.0.10 (RARP from 192.0.0.1) > > nfs_boot: timeout > I had (possibly) the same error when I netbooted a SPARCstation 1+ from > a FreeBSD machine. It was quite simple. The primitive IP stack of the > netloader on the client machine can't answer arp requests. But the > server broadcasts a arp (arp, not rarp) when the tftp or NFS action is > starting. Solution was simple: Set the arp information for the client > on the host paermanent. Somthing like > arp -s 192.0.0.10 00:11:22:33:44:55 permanent > on the boot server. This is why non-broken rarpd servers do this themselves :) --f From bpope at wordstock.com Tue Sep 16 07:05:00 2003 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: Help for a Brother! (fwd) Message-ID: <200309161153.HAA07121@wordstock.com> All, Can anyone help this person? I am forwarding this message from a fido mailing list gateway. Any responses I will forward to the fidoclassic mailing list. Cheers, Bryan Pope And thusly Mike Luther spake: > > Subject sorta says it all! > > A friend was still keeping tons of correspondence on a Brother Word Processor > even up until a year or so, until the Windows Genie showed up. You know, one of > the ones with the old fashioned LCD screen and so on, the integrated > Brotherhood! Grin. You know, the one which only stored whatever you wrote on > floppy disks, I think 3-1/2 inch stuff if my memory is correct. > > Well, the Great God of Fire settled on the building into which she had taken > refuge up in Idaho, not too long ago. And with it .. to wherever good Brothers > go when consumed, went the Brother Word Processor. So now she is faced with a > whole box full of floppy disks with all the correspondence. The consumate > backup, if you will. And as luck would have it, she needs .. for tax purposes, > copies of some of the letters that were all put together on this ingenious > all-in-one member of the Order of the Benevolent Infiniture of Brothers! > > Sigh .. What now? > > Does anyone here know about operating system, word processing format, any of > this for this Order? I've nver seen anything about how the scribes stored this > stuff. Heck, I don't even know if I can mount one of these diskettes on my OS/2 > Warp MCP2 level system, much less translate the dialect? Heck, it might be an > evil byte of an Apple clone for all I know! > > Ideas? > > > --> Sleep well; OS/2's still awake! ;) > > Mike @ 1:117/3001 > > _______________________________________________ > FidoClassic mailing list > FidoClassic@videocam.net.au > http://lists.videocam.net.au/mailman/listinfo/fidoclassic From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Sep 16 08:18:01 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030916090426.007ffaf0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 10:57 PM 9/15/03 -0400, you wrote: >On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Gene Buckle wrote: > >> As far as I'm concerned, they can go back up. I have a friend that >> flies the F-15E that would be more than happy to make it rain scrap >> metal all over the desert. :) > >Iran isn't a desert. 8-) Yes but we can change that! Joe From luc at e2t.be Tue Sep 16 08:52:00 2003 From: luc at e2t.be (Luc Vande Velde) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: Help for a Brother! (fwd) In-Reply-To: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720F04C3@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> Message-ID: <315050836049D511BD020090276C4E720BD6F2@e2t_server_3.e2t.be> I am not sure it's the correct version but I have a converter for "Brother Typewriter" disks to Word format As I am not allowed to make large attachments here, I've put it on the web. www.e2t.be/brother I hope it helps you... Luc -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]Namens Bryan Pope Verzonden: dinsdag 16 september 2003 13:54 Aan: cctalk@classiccmp.org CC: FidoClassic@videocam.net.au Onderwerp: Help for a Brother! (fwd) All, Can anyone help this person? I am forwarding this message from a fido mailing list gateway. Any responses I will forward to the fidoclassic mailing list. Cheers, Bryan Pope And thusly Mike Luther spake: > > Subject sorta says it all! > > A friend was still keeping tons of correspondence on a Brother Word Processor > even up until a year or so, until the Windows Genie showed up. You know, one of > the ones with the old fashioned LCD screen and so on, the integrated > Brotherhood! Grin. You know, the one which only stored whatever you wrote on > floppy disks, I think 3-1/2 inch stuff if my memory is correct. > > Well, the Great God of Fire settled on the building into which she had taken > refuge up in Idaho, not too long ago. And with it .. to wherever good Brothers > go when consumed, went the Brother Word Processor. So now she is faced with a > whole box full of floppy disks with all the correspondence. The consumate > backup, if you will. And as luck would have it, she needs .. for tax purposes, > copies of some of the letters that were all put together on this ingenious > all-in-one member of the Order of the Benevolent Infiniture of Brothers! > > Sigh .. What now? > > Does anyone here know about operating system, word processing format, any of > this for this Order? I've nver seen anything about how the scribes stored this > stuff. Heck, I don't even know if I can mount one of these diskettes on my OS/2 > Warp MCP2 level system, much less translate the dialect? Heck, it might be an > evil byte of an Apple clone for all I know! > > Ideas? > > > --> Sleep well; OS/2's still awake! ;) > > Mike @ 1:117/3001 > > _______________________________________________ > FidoClassic mailing list > FidoClassic@videocam.net.au > http://lists.videocam.net.au/mailman/listinfo/fidoclassic From quapla at xs4all.nl Tue Sep 16 11:22:00 2003 From: quapla at xs4all.nl (Ed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: need some info on some sort of pocket terminal Message-ID: <3F6736DF.63F28E7A@xs4all.nl> Hello All, I found an unusual handhel pocket terminal. It's housing is the same as the older LED pocket calculators used by Texas Intruments, but is is not the TM990/xxx terminal as used for Texas own PLC's or TMS9900 based computers. This one is apparently made by Gr Electronics, who were based in the UK and in the US. This is based on the fact that is says 'GR 185-2' on the board. I searched Google, but I couldn't find any info. As the housing was loose, I opened it, and it uses an Intel 8048 microcontroller, has 8 character and has a curled cable which has a DB25 connector at the end. The cable has 7 wires, and when the battery door is opened (this device get's it power via the cable), a 6 position dip switch is revealed. There is also a little plastic block which does do some power conversion (i.e. +5V into + and - 12V)? and a little buzzer. The crystal on the board has a value of 6.144 (Mhz?). What I would like to find out is some kind of information/usage/whatever of this device. It would be great if this device just acts like a plain RS-232 terminal. Thanks, Ed -- From classiccmp at vintage-computer.com Tue Sep 16 11:47:00 2003 From: classiccmp at vintage-computer.com (Erik Klein) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: (Ping) Paging Jim Willing, paging Jim Willing. Message-ID: > I'm looking fo Jim Willing. I need to talk to him ASAP. Was there any response to this? I've been trying to reach Jim myself with no luck. Erik Klein www.vintage-computer.com/vcforum The Vintage Computer Forum From vcf at siconic.com Tue Sep 16 12:05:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030916090426.007ffaf0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 16 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: > At 10:57 PM 9/15/03 -0400, you wrote: > >On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Gene Buckle wrote: > > > >> As far as I'm concerned, they can go back up. I have a friend that > >> flies the F-15E that would be more than happy to make it rain scrap > >> metal all over the desert. :) > > > >Iran isn't a desert. 8-) > > Yes but we can change that! Not cool. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From marvin at rain.org Tue Sep 16 12:41:00 2003 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: need some info on some sort of pocket terminal References: <3F6736DF.63F28E7A@xs4all.nl> Message-ID: <3F674962.4355D513@rain.org> Ed wrote: > > Hello All, > > I found an unusual handhel pocket terminal. > > It's housing is the same as the older LED pocket calculators used by Texas Intruments, > but is is not the TM990/xxx terminal as used for Texas own PLC's or TMS9900 based > computers. I've seen a number of similar units and I was told these were indeed handheld terminals for the older network equipment. I have one that sounds just like yours that was made by Gould, and just picked up one made by Codex that is similar. From vcf at siconic.com Tue Sep 16 13:01:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: Early issues (1983-1986) of InfoWorld and PC Week wanted Message-ID: I'm looking to buy early issues of PC Week and InfoWorld, specifically from the 1983-1986 timeframe but any time before that time period would also be good. If you've got some taking up space then please get back to me. Thanks! -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From healyzh at aracnet.com Tue Sep 16 13:17:00 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: (Ping) Paging Jim Willing, paging Jim Willing. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > > I'm looking fo Jim Willing. I need to talk to him ASAP. > >Was there any response to this? I've been trying to reach Jim myself >with no luck. Keep in mind Jim is having a rough time. He might not have money at the moment for internet access. I've always found him a good person to deal with. Zane -- -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From cisin at xenosoft.com Tue Sep 16 13:31:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: Help for a Brother! (fwd) In-Reply-To: <200309161153.HAA07121@wordstock.com> References: <200309161153.HAA07121@wordstock.com> Message-ID: <20030916110805.N49085@newshell.lmi.net> Which model is/was it? There are several different formats that were used, some of which can be read by some MS-DOS machines. (a little harder with Windoze) > And thusly Mike Luther spake: > > > > Subject sorta says it all! no, more FACTUAL detail would help. > > A friend was still keeping tons of correspondence on a Brother Word Processor > > even up until a year or so, > > until the Windows Genie showed up. You know, one of > > the ones with the old fashioned LCD screen and so on, the integrated > > Brotherhood! Grin. Is "Windows Genie" the model name for her machine? > > You know, the one which only stored whatever you wrote on > > floppy disks, I think 3-1/2 inch stuff if my memory is correct. > > > > Well, the Great God of Fire settled on the building into which she had taken > > refuge up in Idaho, not too long ago. And with it .. to wherever good Brothers > > go when consumed, went the Brother Word Processor. So now she is faced with a > > whole box full of floppy disks with all the correspondence. The consumate > > backup, if you will. And as luck would have it, she needs .. for tax purposes, > > copies of some of the letters that were all put together on this ingenious > > all-in-one member of the Order of the Benevolent Infiniture of Brothers! Is THAT the model name? or just more flowery language to wade through > > Sigh .. What now? > > > > Does anyone here know about operating system, word processing format, any of > > this for this Order? I've nver seen anything about how the scribes stored this > > stuff. Heck, I don't even know if I can mount one of these diskettes on my OS/2 > > Warp MCP2 level system, much less translate the dialect? Have you TRIED?? > > Heck, it might be an > > evil byte of an Apple clone for all I know! doubtful, but hard to tell with no information > > Ideas? > > --> Sleep well; OS/2's still awake! ;) same shut-down problems as Windoze98? From cb at mythtech.net Tue Sep 16 15:15:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: Open House Message-ID: Well, I had planned to do this next month, as I'm not *really* ready for it yet, but I was just informed that our sublet is going thru on Oct 1st. So... provided the hurricane doesn't hit this weekend (Sept 20,21) I'm having an open house for anyone that wants to stop in and pick thru what I have to get rid of. Not everything you will see is available, but a very large portion of it is (if you want it, ask). And most of what is available is either really really cheap, or totally free. I have to have it all out before the last week of September. A small sample of what I have: IBM System 23's small IDE drives (less than 500 MB) 5.25 floppy drives (1.2's and 360's) CGA monitors VGA monitors (640x480 only) IBM AT's Leading Edge PCs Ads ViewPoint terminals cables, cables, cables AT Keyboards Mac ADB keyboards 68k Macs (desktop and All-In-One) Assorted cards (ISA, MCA, sound, maynard, risers, token ring, et al) A/V equipment (tape decks mostly) ASR 33 Teletype AT&T Unix machines (63?? runs System V and has some kind of DOS card in them) IBM PS/1 IBM PCjr with parallel side car (PCjr, screen, keyboard, power brick) Some software and manuals Some Apple II odds and ends (drive, IIe logic board, other stuff) Printers (Dot Matrix, Ink Jet, Laser) And lots and lots of other assorted computer and A/V stuff (as well as some general office furniture) that I haven't mentioned. Lots of it is probably worth money, which I have zero of right now, so if you want something and you know its worth money, feel free to be nice and pay me for it. I lack the time to try and sell any of it, so if you aren't nice, I'm getting exactly what I would get for it if you don't take it... NOTHING! I'm already pissed at how much of the stuff I spent money on, and is now going to be thrown out before I got to play with it. A good chunk of the stuff is still untested. Could be good, could be bad. Anything known good is labeled as such, but I've spent the last month testing and haven't made much of a dent. (limited testing will be available on site, it will depend on what it is that needs to be tested) The open house is at my office in Ridgwood New Jersey (07450). Email me for directions and any questions. Time is flexible, I'll probably be here most of the weekend anyway, but chances are I'll be the only one, so please let me know in advance if you want to stop in so I can leave doors unlocked and notes as where to find me. In the event that Hurricane Isabelle hits this weekend, I'll postpone until during the week... but there is a very good chance I can't keep things until the following weekend. Of course, anyone that wants to stop in before or after this weekend, that's fine too... first come first served. I don't have the time to ship anything, so if there is something you know I have, and you want it shipped, you better be able to make it worth my time ($$$). Nothing will be held for later pickup. If you can't take it when you are here, then someone else can, or you'd better be back before it hits the dumpster. Sorry to seem like a PITA about this, but my deadline came faster than I expected, and right in the middle of me doing other jobs I can't put off. If I don't have things cleared out before the end of the month, it will be done for me, which means EVERYTHING will be thrown out (and there is some stuff I need to keep, so I'm fighting a fast moving clock). -chris From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Sep 16 15:21:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: HP 85B Schematics wanted In-Reply-To: <3F66B70B.1030903@topinform.com> from "Andreas Holz" at Sep 16, 3 09:08:59 am Message-ID: > Tony, > > what are the 'MoHPC' CD-Roms? MoHPC == Museum of Hewlett-Packard Calculators. The URL is http://www.hpmuseum.org (and it's a lynx-friendly site :-)). It's run by David Hicks, who has got permission from HP to scan manuals for obsolete HP calculators (and computers? certainly the HP71, 75 and 85 are on the list) and sell CD-ROMs/DVD-ROMs containing said scans. The CD-ROMs cost me something like $42 for the set of 7 disks (including postage to the UK). They contain a _lot_ of manuals as .pdf files (but just images, not OCRed, so you can't search them). I regard this as _spectacularly_ good value. Most of the manuals are user manuals, but there are a few service manuals too, including the HP85 one. There are also software Pac manuals, solution books, etc. Poke around on his site -- I think there's a list of what's on the disks. Basically, if you are interested in old HP calculators and have a way to read CD-ROMs and view/print .pdf files, you _want_ these disks. -tony From jwest at classiccmp.org Tue Sep 16 18:44:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: Anyone have older HP rack nuts? Message-ID: <002301c37cab$5889e5f0$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> I'm looking for 4 particular rack nuts for an older HP rack. These are the nuts that are trapezoid shaped, and have a spring on the back. Not a tension/flat spring, a coiled spiral spring. In addition, these racks use two different size nuts. One size hole (larger) for the L angle brackets, and a different size (smaller) for the rails that mount a 2100 cpu because the (different) bolts have to clear the inside of the rails. I am guessing these are not a common item that I could find at a hardware store. Would anyone have 4 to spare? Is there possibly a source for these still? Jay West From cvs at charter.net Tue Sep 16 18:57:00 2003 From: cvs at charter.net (Commercial Video Services, Inc.) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: amiga 4000 repair / replacement Message-ID: <010601c37b96$1ee2d980$6401a8c0@Dell8250> Hello, I found you on the web. I have a Amiga 4000 toaster/flyer system. When booting the flyer, I get a "cannot load toaster screen" error message. I used my second system to switch out toaster, flyer daughter and cpu cards. I also swapped system drives and power supplies. The problem remains on the suspect Amiga, so it must be motherboard related. I understand that dead Lisa or Buster chips can be the cause? I guess I have three options: Can you repair my Amiga 4000? Do you have a working A4000 for sale? Do you have a known good motherboard I can purchase (possibly with my old MB in trade as a core)? Please let me know, Thanks, Greg From keithhymas at hotmail.com Tue Sep 16 18:57:22 2003 From: keithhymas at hotmail.com (Keith Hymas) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:55 2005 Subject: Orpahaned PPC640 Message-ID: Hi, I have found a PPC640 abandoned and homeless, just the PPC nothing else. Plugged in a power supply and turned on. Lights, camera, action. Sort off. The yellow LED beside the CRT label is on and steady and the red power LED is on and steady also. The built-in speaker however is continuously beeping. The volume control has no effect, surprise, during the attempted boot up. That's it nothing else. No LEDs turn on for drives A or B. No display changes on the built in monitor. I have set the DIP switches as you have recommended, in your answer to an inquiry dated Fri July 21:04:02, but no change from either option. A lost course perhaps? I only have knowledge of the Amstrad range via my old 286 but was intrigued when I saw this 'laptop' all alone in a parking bay. Any directions would be greatly appreciated Keith From greyeyz at sc.rr.com Tue Sep 16 18:57:39 2003 From: greyeyz at sc.rr.com (Dena Phillips) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: (no subject) Message-ID: We were Kaypro dealers back in the 1980's. It's neat to know someone is still using that wonderful, first (albeit heavy), portable computer. From bshannon at tiac.net Tue Sep 16 19:32:00 2003 From: bshannon at tiac.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Anyone have older HP rack nuts? References: <002301c37cab$5889e5f0$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Message-ID: <3F67AA2D.9050507@tiac.net> I got 'em! Jay West wrote: >I'm looking for 4 particular rack nuts for an older HP rack. These are the >nuts that are trapezoid shaped, and have a spring on the back. Not a >tension/flat spring, a coiled spiral spring. In addition, these racks use >two different size nuts. One size hole (larger) for the L angle brackets, >and a different size (smaller) for the rails that mount a 2100 cpu because >the (different) bolts have to clear the inside of the rails. > >I am guessing these are not a common item that I could find at a hardware >store. Would anyone have 4 to spare? Is there possibly a source for these >still? > >Jay West From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Sep 16 19:51:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Melbourne hamfest report and the Lucky SOB! Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030916204320.007d9ac0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> They held the Melbourne Fla hamfest this part weekend. This is the first hamfest of the season and it's always one of the best. One of our fellow CC Listers was visiting from out of state and I invited him to go along. (Now I wish I hadn't!) I arrived at the crack of dawn Saturday morning. Almost immediately I found a big cardboard box full of plastic parts bins filled with ICs and other parts from the late '60s for $5. Later found the accessory kit for the Tektronix Engine Analyzer. I'd heard of these but never seen one before. It has a rotary motion sensor, several pressure sensors (5,000 and 45,000 PSI!) and sensors for both horizontal and vertical acceleration. They connect to a specail time base and four channel amplifier for the 561 O'scope. You can use them to monitor cylinder head pressure, combustion chamber pressure, knock, engine pinging, vibrations, bearing wear and all kinds of other engine parameters. I also got a Pro-Log Z-80 front panel similar to the 8080 one that was offered on this list a couple of weeks ago. Meet up with Steve Robertson and got a huge stack of 8" floppy disks and six drives. He was cleaning out and wanted them gone. Found lots of nice stuff in the stack including many original disks for CPM, WordStar, Dbase II and others. But the real find of the day was made by the visiting CC Lister. He didn't even show up till after 12 and by then many of the vendors had packed up and gone home. BUT, this lucky SOB walked down the FIRST row and before he got to the end, he'd found a mint Hero Jr with all the manuals and a mint Heathkit ET-3400 with the manuals and in the original box! For obvious reasons he prefers to remain nameless! Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Sep 16 19:51:36 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Anyone have older HP rack nuts? In-Reply-To: <002301c37cab$5889e5f0$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030916202438.007af6a0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 06:36 PM 9/16/03 -0500, you wrote: > >I am guessing these are not a common item that I could find at a hardware >store. Would anyone have 4 to spare? Is there possibly a source for these >still? Yeah, other HP racks. Or the bottom of my tool box! I'll see if I can dig out soem for you. Shoot me your address. You do realize that they're trapazoid shaped so that you can put them into the channel and then turn them CW to lock the in place don't you? Other than that there's nothing specail about them. Joe > >Jay West From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Sep 16 20:20:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Melbourne hamfest report and the Lucky SOB! Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030916210755.007ae730@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> OH SHIT! How could I forget? I got a SWTPC Function Generator too. Looks like this . Joe From jrkeys at concentric.net Tue Sep 16 20:42:00 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Two great finds today Message-ID: <015b01c37cbb$c8529610$9609dd40@oemcomputer> Today I was given a Dolch ADD-In computer C-P.A.C. it was a 386DX-33C and has been upgraded to a 486 it's a cool looking color portable lunchbox. I also picked up a monorail model 133 that works great but is missing the stand, keyboard, and mouse. I talked with a guy at the thrift who claims to have a monorail kb and mouse for these systems and is willing to sale them to me. I will have to see what he has next week. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Sep 16 20:54:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Poynting Products SS-50 boards? Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030916214625.007a9cc0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Hi, I found some more cards that I THINK are SS-50 cards. Two of them were made by Poynting Products. Does anyone know anything about them? No idea what the cards are for, there are no identifying marks other than model numbers and no unique connectors and all the ICs are 74xx SSI ICs. One is marked "model VB8 Rev B" and the other is marked "Model 505 Rev B". Both of these cards are marked "(C) 1983 Poynting Products Inc." and appear to be for the SS-50 computer bus as used in the SWTPC computers. In the same lot I also found a Tanner SS 50 64K memory card. That's what makes me pretty certain the others actually are SS 50 cards. The tanner card is filled with Hitachi HM 6116s (Static Rams). Does any one know anything about Poynting Products or what these might be? Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Sep 16 21:06:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Poynting Products SS-50 boards? Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030916215811.007e0b80@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I just checked my Tanner memory card against the photos on Michael Holley's SWTPC site and realized that (1) mine uses jumpers instead of DIP switches and (2) mine has no voltage regulators! The regulars were left off of it and the regulator inputs are jumpered directly to the outputs. Good thing I didn't plug them into a system and try to use them! Joe > > Hi, > > I found some more cards that I THINK are SS-50 cards. Two of them were made by Poynting Products. Does anyone know anything about them? No idea what the cards are for, there are no identifying marks other than model numbers and no unique connectors and all the ICs are 74xx SSI ICs. One is marked "model VB8 Rev B" and the other is marked "Model 505 Rev B". Both of these cards are marked "(C) 1983 Poynting Products Inc." and appear to be for the SS-50 computer bus as used in the SWTPC computers. > > In the same lot I also found a Tanner SS 50 64K memory card. That's what makes me pretty certain the others actually are SS 50 cards. The tanner card is filled with Hitachi HM 6116s (Static Rams). > > Does any one know anything about Poynting Products or what these might be? > > Joe From teoz at neo.rr.com Tue Sep 16 21:06:25 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Two great finds today References: <015b01c37cbb$c8529610$9609dd40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <000801c37cbf$33cd5bc0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Keys" To: "cctalk@classiccmp" Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2003 9:32 PM Subject: Two great finds today > Today I was given a Dolch ADD-In computer C-P.A.C. it was a 386DX-33C and > has been upgraded to a 486 it's a cool looking color portable lunchbox. I > also picked up a monorail model 133 that works great but is missing the > stand, keyboard, and mouse. I talked with a guy at the thrift who claims to > have a monorail kb and mouse for these systems and is willing to sale them > to me. I will have to see what he has next week. Cool, how much was the DOLCH? Those are rugged computers I believe From jrkeys at concentric.net Tue Sep 16 21:16:01 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Two great finds today References: <015b01c37cbb$c8529610$9609dd40@oemcomputer> <000801c37cbf$33cd5bc0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <018301c37cc0$92128c40$9609dd40@oemcomputer> The guy gave it to me for free, he said it was laying around he his storage and he was going to scrap it but remembered me wanting old computers. He told me to go look in the back of his pickup and if I wanted it I could have it. ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeoZ" To: Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2003 8:58 PM Subject: Re: Two great finds today > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Keys" > To: "cctalk@classiccmp" > Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2003 9:32 PM > Subject: Two great finds today > > > > Today I was given a Dolch ADD-In computer C-P.A.C. it was a 386DX-33C and > > has been upgraded to a 486 it's a cool looking color portable lunchbox. I > > also picked up a monorail model 133 that works great but is missing the > > stand, keyboard, and mouse. I talked with a guy at the thrift who claims > to > > have a monorail kb and mouse for these systems and is willing to sale them > > to me. I will have to see what he has next week. > > Cool, how much was the DOLCH? Those are rugged computers I believe From ghldbrd at ccp.com Tue Sep 16 21:18:00 2003 From: ghldbrd at ccp.com (ghldbrd@ccp.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: amiga 4000 repair / replacement In-Reply-To: <010601c37b96$1ee2d980$6401a8c0@Dell8250> References: <010601c37b96$1ee2d980$6401a8c0@Dell8250> Message-ID: <2894.65.123.179.130.1063764597.squirrel@webmail.ccp.com> > Hello, > > I found you on the web. > I have a Amiga 4000 toaster/flyer system. When booting the flyer, I get a > "cannot load toaster screen" error message. > I used my second system to switch out toaster, flyer daughter and cpu > cards. I > also swapped system drives and power supplies. The problem remains on the > suspect Amiga, so it must be motherboard related. I understand that dead > Lisa > or Buster chips can be the cause? Well if you are getting error messages on the screen you're pretty much okay to begin with. You might have a corrupt file on the HD somewhere that's not letting things go ahead. Or you might have a dead Flyer card -- they were somewhat tempermental in that regard. I have four dead Flyers myself. > > I guess I have three options: > Can you repair my Amiga 4000? Nope, sorry. > Do you have a working A4000 for sale? Same answer. > Do you have a known good motherboard I can purchase (possibly with my old > MB > in trade as a core)? Those things were always in very short supply. The subcontractors held back on any spare parts as Commodore was going into bankruptcy, to cover their losses. We had an A4000 at the local TV station with a Toaster 4k, and when it got taken out by lightning, we had to buy a COMPLETE new computer, and that was when Commode Door was still (?) in business. You might look up Censible Software in Michigan -- he might have something handy. And there's always Software Hut in PA, the last holdout Amiga dealer. I do have a friend in KC who might have a mobo or something handy. I'll give him a call and see what he's got. > > Please let me know, No problem. Gary Hildebrand From vcf at siconic.com Tue Sep 16 21:22:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: 128 Byte issues on VCM Message-ID: Someone just posted 128 issues of Byte from 1977 through 1988 for $250 (a pretty good deal): http://marketplace.vintage.org/view.cfm?ad=156 -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vance at neurotica.com Tue Sep 16 23:27:01 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 16 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > > > As far as I'm concerned, they can go back up. I have a friend > > > > that flies the F-15E that would be more than happy to make it rain > > > > scrap metal all over the desert. :) > > > > > > Iran isn't a desert. 8-) > > > > Yes but we can change that! > > Not cool. *So* not cool. Peace... Sridhar From Edward.Tillman at valero.com Tue Sep 16 23:39:01 2003 From: Edward.Tillman at valero.com (Tillman, Edward) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... Message-ID: Why are we so far OT...? Cheers... Ed Tillman Store Automation Tech Support Specialist Valero Energy Corporation San Antonio, Texas, USA Office: (210)592-3110, Fax (210)592-2048 Email: edward.tillman@valero.com -----Original Message----- From: vance@neurotica.com [mailto:vance@neurotica.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2003 11:18 PM To: Vintage Computer Festival Cc: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: Re: OT: need to drive a vector CRT... On Tue, 16 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > > > As far as I'm concerned, they can go back up. I have a friend > > > > that flies the F-15E that would be more than happy to make it rain > > > > scrap metal all over the desert. :) > > > > > > Iran isn't a desert. 8-) > > > > Yes but we can change that! > > Not cool. *So* not cool. Peace... Sridhar From cisin at xenosoft.com Tue Sep 16 23:41:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Anyone have older HP rack nuts? In-Reply-To: <002301c37cab$5889e5f0$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> References: <002301c37cab$5889e5f0$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Message-ID: <20030916213014.C63009@newshell.lmi.net> On Tue, 16 Sep 2003, Jay West wrote: > I'm looking for 4 particular rack nuts for an older HP rack. These are the > nuts that are trapezoid shaped, and have a spring on the back. Not a > tension/flat spring, a coiled spiral spring. In addition, these racks use > two different size nuts. One size hole (larger) for the L angle brackets, > and a different size (smaller) for the rails that mount a 2100 cpu because > the (different) bolts have to clear the inside of the rails. > I am guessing these are not a common item that I could find at a hardware > store. Would anyone have 4 to spare? Is there possibly a source for these > still? What you are describing sounds like "Unistrut". From netsurfer_x1 at fastmailbox.net Tue Sep 16 23:43:01 2003 From: netsurfer_x1 at fastmailbox.net (David Vohs) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: (Ping) Paging Jim Willing, paging Jim Willing. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030917043532.09E243BF06@www.fastmail.fm> Nope. I have no clue what's going on. In all reality it's kinda starting to P**S me off, I've been waiting for over 3 months for my Apple LISA. > > Was there any response to this? I've been trying to reach Jim myself > with no luck. > > Erik Klein > www.vintage-computer.com/vcforum > The Vintage Computer Forum -- David Vohs netsurfer_x1@fastmailbox.net -- http://www.fastmail.fm - A no graphics, no pop-ups email service From vance at neurotica.com Tue Sep 16 23:52:00 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Two great finds today In-Reply-To: <000801c37cbf$33cd5bc0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 16 Sep 2003, TeoZ wrote: > > Today I was given a Dolch ADD-In computer C-P.A.C. it was a 386DX-33C > > and has been upgraded to a 486 it's a cool looking color portable > > lunchbox. I also picked up a monorail model 133 that works great but > > is missing the stand, keyboard, and mouse. I talked with a guy at the > > thrift who claims to have a monorail kb and mouse for these systems > > and is willing to sale them to me. I will have to see what he has next > > week. > > Cool, how much was the DOLCH? Those are rugged computers I believe Dolch also made some of the first portable PC's with NTSC video I/O capabilities. Peace... Sridhar From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 17 00:47:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies Message-ID: Is it safe to use a Bulk Tape Eraser on 8" floppies? I don't see why not, but I figured I'd ask the pros before I did it. I have a case load of 8" floppies that will be in the piles of stuff to be gotten rid of at my "Open House". The problem is, almost all of them carry accounting records on them (payroll, and stuff like that). Granted they are years old, but some of the people on the disks still work for us (and most of them are still alive). Naturally I want to erase them before they leave my custody, but I don't have the time to format each one. And don't anyone panic... the case of disks are NOT on the list headed to the dumpster. If they aren't sold/taken over the weekend, I plan to try to sell them off in small bundles (and probably trade/give away the ones that carry actual software to other people that have System 23s) I also forgot to mention, 3/4" UMatic VCRs will be available here as well. Many are older top loading, but a few are newer front loading Sony units. -chris From nico at farumdata.dk Wed Sep 17 01:27:00 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies References: Message-ID: <002201c37ce3$0be9d4c0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> From: "chris" To: "Classic Computers" Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 7:38 AM Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies > Is it safe to use a Bulk Tape Eraser on 8" floppies? I don't see why not, > but I figured I'd ask the pros before I did it. > In principle, yes, as there is no information "outside" what the user can see / use. However, some systems do not have the capability to format discs, but they would buy used floppies in the first place, I guess. A hint : sort the floppies according to density. I would be rather p..... if I bought a stack of 20 floppies, believing they were DSDD, and I got some SSSD ones. Nico From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 17 01:40:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies Message-ID: >A hint : sort the floppies according to density. I would be rather p..... >if I bought a stack of 20 floppies, believing they were DSDD, and I got >some SSSD ones. Is there a way to tell visually if they are DS vs SS? Not all the floppies have their original factory labels on them any more, and I know there are some of each. If not, I'll make 3 groups. DSDD, SSSD, and "Pot Luck" -chris From nico at farumdata.dk Wed Sep 17 02:03:00 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies References: Message-ID: <000801c37ce8$2ff443a0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> > >A hint : sort the floppies according to density. I would be rather p..... > >if I bought a stack of 20 floppies, believing they were DSDD, and I got > >some SSSD ones. > > Is there a way to tell visually if they are DS vs SS? Not all the > floppies have their original factory labels on them any more, and I know > there are some of each. I just checked some of mine, and there is not really "conclusive evidence". On top of that, some SSSD floppies were rejected DSDD's. The good thing is, that I've never seen a double sided that couldnt be used as single sided. The story behind this is rather remarkable: when we talk about 3740 floppies (i.e. IBM labelled), the f?rst track is always written as single-side single-density, as some drives and/or systems can detect the disk format and/or re-assign defective tracks. So, selling "unknowns" as SSSD should be safe, and if they get a DSSD or DSDD (yes, they exist!), they were just lucky. Nico From Edward.Tillman at valero.com Wed Sep 17 02:15:01 2003 From: Edward.Tillman at valero.com (Tillman, Edward) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies Message-ID: If you happen to have an old x86 laying around (286sx - 486dx), with DOS 5 or earlier, your format command will tell you the types/capacities of floppies available, and the switches required to format them properly. A simple chkdsk command run on the FD will tell you what you actually have. Prior to HD, I don't believe any of the disks were marked with type/size. However, HD and DD (DSHD 720Kb & DSDD 1.44Mb) are both marked on the disk housing on the top foreward right corner -- top foreward right as inserted into the drive -- right next to the spring-loaded media cover. The cover, itself, may also contain the disk capacity in KB or MB, but that's also usually found in later model disks... Cheers... Ed Tillman Store Automation Tech Support Specialist Valero Energy Corporation San Antonio, Texas, USA Office: (210)592-3110, Fax (210)592-2048 Email: edward.tillman@valero.com -----Original Message----- From: chris [mailto:cb@mythtech.net] Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 1:32 AM To: Classic Computers Subject: Re: Bulk Erase 8" floppies >A hint : sort the floppies according to density. I would be rather p..... >if I bought a stack of 20 floppies, believing they were DSDD, and I got >some SSSD ones. Is there a way to tell visually if they are DS vs SS? Not all the floppies have their original factory labels on them any more, and I know there are some of each. If not, I'll make 3 groups. DSDD, SSSD, and "Pot Luck" -chris From nico at farumdata.dk Wed Sep 17 02:22:00 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies References: Message-ID: <002801c37cea$c5649280$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Hi Ed I think you missed the part saying we talk about 8" floppies ... Nico ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tillman, Edward" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 9:06 AM Subject: RE: Bulk Erase 8" floppies > If you happen to have an old x86 laying around (286sx - 486dx), with DOS 5 > or earlier, your format command will tell you the types/capacities of > floppies available, and the switches required to format them properly. A > simple chkdsk command run on the FD will tell you what you actually have. > Prior to HD, I don't believe any of the disks were marked with type/size. > However, HD and DD (DSHD 720Kb & DSDD 1.44Mb) are both marked on the disk > housing on the top foreward right corner -- top foreward right as inserted > into the drive -- right next to the spring-loaded media cover. The cover, > itself, may also contain the disk capacity in KB or MB, but that's also > usually found in later model disks... > > Cheers... > > Ed Tillman > Store Automation Tech Support Specialist > Valero Energy Corporation > San Antonio, Texas, USA > Office: (210)592-3110, Fax (210)592-2048 > Email: edward.tillman@valero.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: chris [mailto:cb@mythtech.net] > Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 1:32 AM > To: Classic Computers > Subject: Re: Bulk Erase 8" floppies > > > >A hint : sort the floppies according to density. I would be rather p..... > >if I bought a stack of 20 floppies, believing they were DSDD, and I got > >some SSSD ones. > > Is there a way to tell visually if they are DS vs SS? Not all the > floppies have their original factory labels on them any more, and I know > there are some of each. > > If not, I'll make 3 groups. DSDD, SSSD, and "Pot Luck" > > -chris > From mikeford at socal.rr.com Wed Sep 17 03:26:00 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Making the save at the scrappers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030916233958.02f04d50@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Weird, good day at a scrapper today. I got the chance to literally rescue some goodies as they were being tossed in the breakage bin, and found some curious stuff. 4 person sized IBM rolling storage racks, and a pallet stacked as high as my head of old servers from UCLA, plus a bin of misc from the same place. Sadly I can't take anything big and ALL the hard drives were pulled, but anybody interested that can hook up in SoCal/Corona very very soon email me asap. Curious stuff I found are stacks of floppies that claim to be S/390 microcode from 1991, a dozen maybe 3363 optical discs, a stamped metal wrench with an IBM part number, PowerPC diagnostic CDs, and piles of misc parts and optical cable. Most of the servers were the big double wide chassis monsters, but I did put my name on a couple of the smaller ones, a C20 and I think its called a WorkStation 400 (desktop PC sized with a odd flip up visor type thing on the front. The C20 I think is the last of the MCA designs from IBM, and it doesn't look like AIX will be too hard to get, even if I have to buy a legal copy. Opto22 modules were the literal grab from the breakage bin. Maybe a dozen pc boards, half with modules (like logic to 240 vac) and screw down connectors, half Sensory Input boards with just screw downs and a ribbon connector on the back. Quick check on ebay and looks like my retirement plans are on hold, but in a way thats good news since its all cheap enough that I can afford to play with it, instead of greedily selling it. I found about half a dozen Sony optical discs, I can't remember the exact model letters, but Sxx501-21, and the connectors are kind of like old style floppy PC board fingers. Condition unfortunately unknown, and they were too expensive for me to speculate on. Simpson multimeter in a rough but intact leather case, looked to me kind of like a big 360, but I think it said 730 and was not in greatest condition. I didn't take the leather case, but stuck the meter in a box to haggle over tomorrow. Anyway its good to be up to my armpits in a junk bin for a couple hours. From mikeford at socal.rr.com Wed Sep 17 04:22:00 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: collection organising In-Reply-To: References: <20030915145935.86603.qmail@web21104.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030917014042.00a1a320@pop-server.socal.rr.com> One big problem with organizing your collection is that it is too easy to tell when you have way too many of some item and should really stop getting more. For example when everything is scattered around the house, garage, and storage, one can never have too many Apple logo power cords, but once you start putting them in a box and it fills up the fun kind of goes out of it. Also with a tidy collection you never get the thrill of finding some item again while moving stuff around. OTOH if the working portion, not just the functional stuff, but the stuff you need to play with your toys, isn't where you can find it, playtime is reduced, plus a lot of wandering around to find stuff and you look senile. Two tips Forget rubber bands, they don't last the sort of time we tend to let things sit on the shelf, plus twist ties are generally free excepting the labor of plucking them apart. Clear storage, bins or ziplock bags, and you can be lazy and never label anything. From mikeford at socal.rr.com Wed Sep 17 04:22:57 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: need some info on some sort of pocket terminal In-Reply-To: <3F6736DF.63F28E7A@xs4all.nl> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030917020124.00a0cba0@pop-server.socal.rr.com> At 06:14 PM 9/16/03 +0200, Ed wrote: >This one is apparently made by Gr Electronics, who were based in the UK >and in the US. >This is based on the fact that is says 'GR 185-2' on the board. >I searched Google, but I couldn't find any info. > >As the housing was loose, I opened it, and it uses an Intel 8048 >microcontroller, has 8 >character and has a curled cable which has a DB25 connector at the end. >The cable has 7 wires, and when the battery door is opened (this device >get's it power Sounds like a device that I have seen for doing inventory and stock checking, db25 could be for a bar code or? Anyway people go up and down the aisles in markets with them filling in sku and quantity, periodically docking to download the data into some host. From vance at neurotica.com Wed Sep 17 04:36:01 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Making the save at the scrappers In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030916233958.02f04d50@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Mike Ford wrote: > 4 person sized IBM rolling storage racks, and a pallet stacked as high > as my head of old servers from UCLA, plus a bin of misc from the same > place. Sadly I can't take anything big and ALL the hard drives were > pulled, but anybody interested that can hook up in SoCal/Corona very > very soon email me asap. Curious stuff I found are stacks of floppies > that claim to be S/390 microcode from 1991, a dozen maybe 3363 optical > discs, a stamped metal wrench with an IBM part number, PowerPC > diagnostic CDs, and piles of misc parts and optical cable. Most of the > servers were the big double wide chassis monsters, but I did put my name > on a couple of the smaller ones, a C20 and I think its called a > WorkStation 400 (desktop PC sized with a odd flip up visor type thing on > the front. The C20 I think is the last of the MCA designs from IBM, and > it doesn't look like AIX will be too hard to get, even if I have to buy > a legal copy. There were quite a few MCA RS/6000's after the C20. > Opto22 modules were the literal grab from the breakage bin. Maybe a > dozen pc boards, half with modules (like logic to 240 vac) and screw > down connectors, half Sensory Input boards with just screw downs and a > ribbon connector on the back. Quick check on ebay and looks like my > retirement plans are on hold, but in a way thats good news since its all > cheap enough that I can afford to play with it, instead of greedily > selling it. That Opto stuff should come in handy. Feel like tossing me a few? Do you have any of the boards, or just the modules? Peace... Sridhar From quapla at xs4all.nl Wed Sep 17 05:29:01 2003 From: quapla at xs4all.nl (Ed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: need some info on some sort of pocket terminal References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030917020124.00a0cba0@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: <3F6835AB.266CBA34@xs4all.nl> Mike Ford wrote: > > At 06:14 PM 9/16/03 +0200, Ed wrote: > > >This one is apparently made by Gr Electronics, who were based in the UK > >and in the US. > >This is based on the fact that is says 'GR 185-2' on the board. > >I searched Google, but I couldn't find any info. > > > >As the housing was loose, I opened it, and it uses an Intel 8048 > >microcontroller, has 8 > >character and has a curled cable which has a DB25 connector at the end. > >The cable has 7 wires, and when the battery door is opened (this device > >get's it power > > Sounds like a device that I have seen for doing inventory and stock > checking, db25 could be for a bar code or? Anyway people go up and down the > aisles in markets with them filling in sku and quantity, periodically > docking to download the data into some host. Not likely in this case, 2 of the wires must carry the power, as there is no own powersource in the terminal. I picked it up when collecting 4 11/34's at Shell, and in one of the cupboard I found this pocket terminal. I have opened the db25 plug, and pins 2 & 3 are wired, suggesting it is at least RS232. Other pins are 4 (RTS, wired also to pin 20), pin 7 (GND) and pin 9 (+ voltage). The pin assignment is according to the rs232 description. There is an N8T15 & N8T16 chip on the board, are these similar to the M1488 & M1489 rs232 line driver chips? Ed -- From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 17 05:57:01 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Two great finds today In-Reply-To: References: <000801c37cbf$33cd5bc0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030917064841.007e99e0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> >On Tue, 16 Sep 2003, TeoZ wrote: > >> > Today I was given a Dolch ADD-In computer C-P.A.C. it was a 386DX-33C >> > and has been upgraded to a 486 it's a cool looking color portable >> > lunchbox. I also picked up a monorail model 133 that works great but >> > is missing the stand, keyboard, and mouse. I talked with a guy at the >> > thrift who claims to have a monorail kb and mouse for these systems >> > and is willing to sale them to me. I will have to see what he has next >> > week. >> >> Cool, how much was the DOLCH? Those are rugged computers I believe > They also made Logic Analyzers. I have a Dolch 300 Colt. It's computer operated and runs MP/M. It ha 256k of RAM and at least five Z-80s CPUs. There are several different devices that plug into th emainframe. I have both LA and pattern generator. There are a couple of others including an EPROM burner. Anybody have manuals for one of these? Joe From cheri-post at web.de Wed Sep 17 11:26:01 2003 From: cheri-post at web.de (Pierre Gebhardt) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: specifications for IBM XT-286 Message-ID: <200309171617.h8HGHpQ31215@mailgate5.cinetic.de> Thanks alot Ralph, this is enough information about this machine :) Paxton, the CMI drives as the 6426S were real crap, you're absolutely right. A Seagate drive should be ok. 1.2 Meg 5.25 inch drives are easy to find. Thanks to you, too. Pierre > Pierre, > > Here are 2 links concerning the XT-286. > > http://www.uncreativelabs.org/~matt/classic/5162.html > > http://safariexamples.informit.com/0789725428/Reference%5Chardware.pdf > > Hope this helps. > > Ralph ______________________________________________________________________________ Die Besten ihrer Klasse! WEB.DE FreeMail (1,7) und WEB.DE Club (1,9) - bei der Stiftung Warentest - ein Doppelsieg! http://f.web.de/?mc=021184 From paulpenn at knology.net Wed Sep 17 12:04:00 2003 From: paulpenn at knology.net (Paul Pennington) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: kaypro 2 cables (question) References: Message-ID: <00b201c37d3c$8bbc7780$6401a8c0@knology.net> Don Maslin wrote about Kaypro II keyboard cables: >A telephone handset cord makes a very good replacement provided > you can find a convenient length and a color that you like :) Not really. The wire in the telephone handset cords has a higher resistance than the original Kaypro cords and won't work reliably. They will sometimes work for a while. You can try it yourself by checking with an ohmmeter. I used to be a Kaypro dealer and this was a frequent problem when customers replaced the cord with one that looked the same. Paul Pennington Augusta, Georgia From paulpenn at knology.net Wed Sep 17 12:04:24 2003 From: paulpenn at knology.net (Paul Pennington) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: kaypro 2 cables (question) References: Message-ID: <00b201c37d3c$8bbc7780$6401a8c0@knology.net> Don Maslin wrote about Kaypro II keyboard cables: >A telephone handset cord makes a very good replacement provided > you can find a convenient length and a color that you like :) Not really. The wire in the telephone handset cords has a higher resistance than the original Kaypro cords and won't work reliably. They will sometimes work for a while. You can try it yourself by checking with an ohmmeter. I used to be a Kaypro dealer and this was a frequent problem when customers replaced the cord with one that looked the same. Paul Pennington Augusta, Georgia From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Sep 17 13:22:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies In-Reply-To: <000801c37ce8$2ff443a0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> References: <000801c37ce8$2ff443a0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: <20030917110035.L71839@newshell.lmi.net> SORT by INDEX HOLE POSITION! On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Nico de Jong wrote: > > >A hint : sort the floppies according to density. I would be rather p..... > > >if I bought a stack of 20 floppies, believing they were DSDD, and I got > > >some SSSD ones. > > Is there a way to tell visually if they are DS vs SS? Not all the > > floppies have their original factory labels on them any more, and I know > > there are some of each. > I just checked some of mine, and there is not really "conclusive evidence". > On top of that, some SSSD floppies were rejected DSDD's. The good thing > is, that I've never seen a double sided that couldnt be used as single > sided. The story behind this is rather remarkable: when we talk about > 3740 floppies (i.e. IBM labelled), the f?rst track is always written as > single-side single-density, as some drives and/or systems can detect the > disk format and/or re-assign defective tracks. So, selling "unknowns" as > SSSD should be safe, and if they get a DSSD or DSDD (yes, they exist!), > they were just lucky. ALMOST. There is no visible difference between SD single density v DD Double density. But, if you take a look at SS Single sided v DS double sided, the index hole is in a different place! Most double sided drives have BOTH sets of index holes, and therefore can format a DS disk as single sided, if so requested. BUT, some single sided drives can NOT format a disk that only has the DS index holes. That is further complicated by the fact that after a disk has been formatted (or reformatted after you bulk-erase them) that the index hole can then be ignored, permitting using disks with index holes that don't match the drive! (after they were formatted on a different drive) Therefore, sort them by the index hole position, and you will have successfully identified which ones can be formatted as SS v DS in the appropriate drives. -- Fred Cisin cisin@xenosoft.com XenoSoft http://www.xenosoft.com PO Box 1236 (510) 558-9366 Berkeley, CA 94701-1236 From bpope at wordstock.com Wed Sep 17 13:38:00 2003 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies In-Reply-To: <20030917110035.L71839@newshell.lmi.net> from "Fred Cisin" at Sep 17, 03 11:11:34 am Message-ID: <200309171826.OAA21661@wordstock.com> And thusly Fred Cisin spake: > > > ALMOST. > There is no visible difference between SD single density v DD Double > density. > But, if you take a look at SS Single sided v DS double sided, the index > hole is in a different place! In relation to what? How is the index hole in a different place? (I have only *seen* 8" floppies and drive, never actually used one) Cheers, Bryan From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Sep 17 13:51:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030917111155.T71839@newshell.lmi.net> On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Tillman, Edward wrote: > If you happen to have an old x86 laying around (286sx - 486dx), with DOS 5 > or earlier, your format command will tell you the types/capacities of > floppies available, and the switches required to format them properly. A Other than AFTER-MARKET add-ons, the only versions of MS-DOS that I have seen that support 8" disks were SB-86 v 1.x (a rare version of MS-DOS distributed on 8" by Lifeboat), NEC APC and 9801, and some OEM versions of MS-DOS 1.25, 2.11 and 3.31. (those were the versions of MS-DOS that actively supported customization) 'course you COULD use 8" DSDD from MS-DOS AND PC-DOS 3.00 on by lying to it and calling your 8" drive a 5.25" 1.2M. > simple chkdsk command run on the FD will tell you what you actually have. That will identify which MS-DOS format a given disk has on it. HIS disks will resond with "Probable Non-DOS Disk", "Sector Not Found", "Address Mark Not Found", or "General Failure", since they are presumably NOT MS-DOS formatted. "Probable Non-DOS Disk" means that it is MFM with 512 bytes per sector, but does not have valid MS-DOS structures found on it. "Sector Not Found" means that it is MFM, but the sectors are not 512 bytes, or not numbered the way MS-DOS expects them to be ("there ain't no sector #1!") "Address Mark Not Found" usually means that it is NOT MFM (such as unformatted, GCR, FM, etc.), or is MFM at a density that is not recognized. "General Failure" means "none of the above". An error that wasn't successfully identified. Contrary to popular belief, it was NOT a reference to Nam. > Prior to HD, I don't believe any of the disks were marked with type/size. Most of the better manufacturers put that info on the label. With unlabelled 8" diskettes, look at the index hole position. With unlabelled 5.25" disks, the only thing that could be readily determined was a difference in color between the media of "HD" v LD; and if whether there was a hub reinforcer (not present on early SD and on HD unless added by the user) > However, HD and DD (DSHD 720Kb & DSDD 1.44Mb) are both marked on the disk > housing on the top foreward right corner -- top foreward right as inserted > into the drive -- right next to the spring-loaded media cover. The cover, I have never seen an 8" diskette with a spring loaded media cover. MANY manufacturers of 3.5" diskettes did NOT mark the disk. (Shall we get into the "PINCH" arrow?) > itself, may also contain the disk capacity in KB or MB, but that's also > usually found in later model disks... Later model 8" disks are often marked. If not, the index hole position identifies whether it is single or double SIDED. Being rated for single v double DENSITY was an issue of "fidelity", and not visible unless marked. From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 17 13:53:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: IBM 5110 floppy Message-ID: Thinking of this 8" floppy business... what density and side count does an IBM 5110's external floppy drive use? Since I'm not getting rid of my 5110, I want to be sure to keep a small stack of the correct floppies to use with it. -chris From vcf at siconic.com Wed Sep 17 14:07:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Commodore Plus/4 free for shipping on VCM Message-ID: Someone just posted a Commodore Plus/4 on the Vintage Computer Marketplace. Free (just pay shipping). http://marketplace.vintage.org/view.cfm?ad=157 -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From eric at brouhaha.com Wed Sep 17 14:19:00 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: IBM 5110 floppy In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1756.4.20.168.219.1063825843.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "chris" wrote: > what density and side count does > an IBM 5110's external floppy drive use? SS/SD, SS/DD, and DS/DD. With various sector sizes. See the Customer Support Functions manual and the 5114 Maintenance Information Manual. From paul at frixxon.co.uk Wed Sep 17 14:21:01 2003 From: paul at frixxon.co.uk (Paul Williams) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Commodore Plus/4 free for shipping on VCM In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F68B1E3.6000905@frixxon.co.uk> Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > Someone just posted a Commodore Plus/4 on the Vintage Computer > Marketplace. Free (just pay shipping). > > http://marketplace.vintage.org/view.cfm?ad=157 Please reassure me that you're *not* going to post on this list every time there's a new item on VCM? From patrick at evocative.com Wed Sep 17 14:23:00 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: (Ping) Paging Jim Willing, paging Jim Willing. In-Reply-To: <20030917043532.09E243BF06@www.fastmail.fm> Message-ID: I'm in the same boat. The positive assurances with respect to Jim's follow-through are great, but life circumstances can change people's behavior, and I think as a group those of us who are expecting items from Jim are justified in our discomfort. If someone knows how to get ahold of him by means other than email, it would be appreciated. It sounds like he's on his way to seriously damaging his reputation and heaping all kinds of trouble on top of an already uncomfortable situation. If something life-threatening has happened, I'm sure we'll all be willing to give him room, but right now we're just in the dark. Patrick > -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]On > Behalf Of David Vohs > Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2003 9:36 PM > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: (Ping) Paging Jim Willing, paging Jim Willing. > > > Nope. I have no clue what's going on. In all reality it's kinda starting > to P**S me off, I've been waiting for over 3 months for my Apple LISA. > > > > > Was there any response to this? I've been trying to reach Jim myself > > with no luck. > > > > Erik Klein > > www.vintage-computer.com/vcforum > > The Vintage Computer Forum > -- > David Vohs > netsurfer_x1@fastmailbox.net From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Sep 17 14:26:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies In-Reply-To: <200309171826.OAA21661@wordstock.com> References: <200309171826.OAA21661@wordstock.com> Message-ID: <20030917120130.M71839@newshell.lmi.net> On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Bryan Pope wrote: > > But, if you take a look at SS Single sided v DS double sided, the index > > hole is in a different place! > In relation to what? How is the index hole in a different place? (I have > only *seen* 8" floppies and drive, never actually used one) Examine an 8" diskette. Draw an imaginary line on it, to check for symmetry - if you were to put the disk in upside down, would the holes line up? You will find that the write-access slot is symmetrical, but the write protect notch is NOT symmetrically placed, nor is the position of the index hole. IIRC, (unless I just got it backwards!) the index hole of the SINGLE sided disk is CLOSE to the center line, but the index hole of the DOUBLE sided disk is visibly substantially further away from the center line. It is possible to punch additional holes to convert a SS diskette into a DS, or to convert a SS into a "flippy". The 8" version of the "Berkeley Microcomputer Flip-Jig" is substantially rarer than the 5.25' version. Useless trivia: in an episode of the "Computer Bowl" quiz show, NOBODY on Bill Gates' team had any idea where the write protect notch is on an 8" diskette! Hint: where would be the worst place for it to be to cause problems when the write-enable tab falls off in the drive? NB: 8" has a write protect notch that can be covered with a write-enable tab, v 5.25" has a write enable notch that can be covered with a write protect tab. Some drives (SA455) have jumpers to permit reversing that! From bpope at wordstock.com Wed Sep 17 14:36:00 2003 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies In-Reply-To: <20030917120130.M71839@newshell.lmi.net> from "Fred Cisin" at Sep 17, 03 12:16:02 pm Message-ID: <200309171924.PAA31809@wordstock.com> And thusly Fred Cisin spake: > > On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Bryan Pope wrote: > > > But, if you take a look at SS Single sided v DS double sided, the index > > > hole is in a different place! > > In relation to what? How is the index hole in a different place? (I have > > only *seen* 8" floppies and drive, never actually used one) > > Examine an 8" diskette. Draw an imaginary line on it, to check for > symmetry - if you were to put the disk in upside down, would the holes > line up? You will find that the write-access slot is symmetrical, but the > write protect notch is NOT symmetrically placed, nor is the position of > the index hole. Oh! I thought you were talking about about the hole in the floppy disk.. I didn't think about the position of the hole in its jacket. Thank-you for the clarification! :) Bryan From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 17 14:38:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: IBM 5110 floppy Message-ID: >> what density and side count does >> an IBM 5110's external floppy drive use? > >SS/SD, SS/DD, and DS/DD. With various sector sizes. See >the Customer Support Functions manual and the 5114 Maintenance >Information Manual. Thanks muchly! -chris From marvin at rain.org Wed Sep 17 14:40:00 2003 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Commodore Plus/4 free for shipping on VCM References: <3F68B1E3.6000905@frixxon.co.uk> Message-ID: <3F68B66B.2CB862CE@rain.org> Paul Williams wrote: > > Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > Someone just posted a Commodore Plus/4 on the Vintage Computer > > Marketplace. Free (just pay shipping). > > > > http://marketplace.vintage.org/view.cfm?ad=157 > > Please reassure me that you're *not* going to post on this list every > time there's a new item on VCM? Would that necessarily be bad? A short notice such as he is doing is the same thing that has been done for a long time and is still being done for interesting items on Ebay. From paul at frixxon.co.uk Wed Sep 17 14:58:00 2003 From: paul at frixxon.co.uk (Paul Williams) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Commodore Plus/4 free for shipping on VCM In-Reply-To: <3F68B66B.2CB862CE@rain.org> References: <3F68B1E3.6000905@frixxon.co.uk> <3F68B66B.2CB862CE@rain.org> Message-ID: <3F68BAC0.303@frixxon.co.uk> Marvin Johnston wrote: > Paul Williams wrote: > >> >>Please reassure me that you're *not* going to post on this list every >>time there's a new item on VCM? > > > Would that necessarily be bad? A short notice such as he is doing is the > same thing that has been done for a long time and is still being done > for interesting items on Ebay. eBay has an enormous number of categories, and it is amazing how often a search finds things in the most bizarre of places (ie. not in the categories on my "Favourites" list.) However, VCM only deals with vintage computers, so it is much easier to find items. - Paul From geoffr at zipcon.net Wed Sep 17 15:00:00 2003 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Compaticard IV- Geoff Does Happy Happy joy joy dance... In-Reply-To: <20030917111155.T71839@newshell.lmi.net> References: <20030917111155.T71839@newshell.lmi.net> Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.2.20030917125353.030ea040@mail.zipcon.net> I was digging through storage boxes of cruft here and what should I happen upon.... a Compaticard IV... YAY! however the disks that came with it are gone :( so.... does anyone have the software for it? and can I get a copy? and is uniform still available? also, what do I need to do to be able to do single density disks? is the Catweasel the only option on a PeeCee? From spectre at floodgap.com Wed Sep 17 15:05:00 2003 From: spectre at floodgap.com (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Commodore Plus/4 free for shipping on VCM In-Reply-To: <3F68B1E3.6000905@frixxon.co.uk> from Paul Williams at "Sep 17, 3 08:11:31 pm" Message-ID: <200309172009.NAA15554@floodgap.com> > > Someone just posted a Commodore Plus/4 on the Vintage Computer > > Marketplace. Free (just pay shipping). > > > > http://marketplace.vintage.org/view.cfm?ad=157 > > Please reassure me that you're *not* going to post on this list every > time there's a new item on VCM? Why not? Particularly for free items, I think a lot of people would be interested. -- ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com -- Death to spammers! http://spam.abuse.net/spam/ ----------------------------- From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Sep 17 15:12:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:56 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies In-Reply-To: <200309171924.PAA31809@wordstock.com> References: <200309171924.PAA31809@wordstock.com> Message-ID: <20030917125342.X71839@newshell.lmi.net> On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Bryan Pope wrote: > > line up? You will find that the write-access slot is symmetrical, but the > > write protect notch is NOT symmetrically placed, nor is the position of > > the index hole. > Oh! I thought you were talking about about the hole in the floppy disk.. > I didn't think about the position of the hole in its jacket. > Thank-you for the clarification! :) Even then, the terminology can be ambiguous. "Jacket" is sometimes used to refer to the "sleeve", or "pocket" that the disk is stored in. I was, indeed, referring to the felt? lined cardboard? in which the mylar? spins. I remember, years ago, a student in the college lab removed the round mylar to put it in the drive. When questioned, she showed instructions from her instructor to "remove the disk from its cover". When further questioned about why she didn't realize the error based on the difficulty, she pointed out that modern potato chip bags can be equally stubborn. A few years ago, the lab staff insisted on removing ALL 5.25" drives from the lab, because students (and even one instructor!) were trying to put CD-ROMs into them! From teoz at neo.rr.com Wed Sep 17 15:14:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Commodore Plus/4 free for shipping on VCM References: <200309172009.NAA15554@floodgap.com> Message-ID: <003101c37d57$292197c0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cameron Kaiser" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 4:09 PM Subject: Re: Commodore Plus/4 free for shipping on VCM > > > Someone just posted a Commodore Plus/4 on the Vintage Computer > > > Marketplace. Free (just pay shipping). > > > > > > http://marketplace.vintage.org/view.cfm?ad=157 > > > > Please reassure me that you're *not* going to post on this list every > > time there's a new item on VCM? > > Why not? Particularly for free items, I think a lot of people would be > interested. > > -- > ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- > Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com > -- Death to spammers! http://spam.abuse.net/spam/ ----------------------------- Too bad its missing a few keys. I agree that free items are worth a post here since they wont last for long. From donm at cts.com Wed Sep 17 15:25:01 2003 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies In-Reply-To: <000801c37ce8$2ff443a0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Nico de Jong wrote: > > >A hint : sort the floppies according to density. I would be rather p..... > > >if I bought a stack of 20 floppies, believing they were DSDD, and I got > > >some SSSD ones. > > > > Is there a way to tell visually if they are DS vs SS? Not all the > > floppies have their original factory labels on them any more, and I know > > there are some of each. > > I just checked some of mine, and there is not really "conclusive evidence". On top of that, some SSSD floppies were rejected DSDD's. The good thing is, that I've never seen a double sided that couldnt be used as single sided. The story behind this is rather remarkable: when we talk about 3740 floppies (i.e. IBM labelled), the f?rst track is always written as single-side single-density, as some drives and/or systems can detect the disk format and/or re-assign defective tracks. So, selling "unknowns" as SSSD should be safe, and if they get a DSSD or DSDD (yes, they exist!), they were just lucky. > > Nico Quite the contrary! A quick glance at an 8" disk will tell you its density by the position of the index aperature in the disk jacket. A Single Sided disk has the aperature 7 degrees clockwise of the 12 o'clock position, while a Double Sided disk has it located 26 degrees clockwise of the 12 o'clock position. In other words, SS is at about 1202 and DS is about 1307 hours. - don From donm at cts.com Wed Sep 17 15:29:00 2003 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, chris wrote: > Is it safe to use a Bulk Tape Eraser on 8" floppies? I don't see why not, > but I figured I'd ask the pros before I did it. It works just fine, Chris! - don > I have a case load of 8" floppies that will be in the piles of stuff to > be gotten rid of at my "Open House". The problem is, almost all of them > carry accounting records on them (payroll, and stuff like that). Granted > they are years old, but some of the people on the disks still work for us > (and most of them are still alive). > > Naturally I want to erase them before they leave my custody, but I don't > have the time to format each one. > > And don't anyone panic... the case of disks are NOT on the list headed to > the dumpster. If they aren't sold/taken over the weekend, I plan to try > to sell them off in small bundles (and probably trade/give away the ones > that carry actual software to other people that have System 23s) > > > I also forgot to mention, 3/4" UMatic VCRs will be available here as > well. Many are older top loading, but a few are newer front loading Sony > units. > > -chris > From Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com Wed Sep 17 15:31:00 2003 From: Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com (Feldman, Robert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies Message-ID: Which reminds me of the story of the person who called tech support to say that the cup holder on their computer had broken. On further questioning, he revealed that the cup holder, when retracted, had "2x" on the door that covered it :) -----Original Message----- From: Fred Cisin [mailto:cisin@xenosoft.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 3:02 PM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: Re: Bulk Erase 8" floppies A few years ago, the lab staff insisted on removing ALL 5.25" drives from the lab, because students (and even one instructor!) were trying to put CD-ROMs into them! From donm at cts.com Wed Sep 17 15:56:00 2003 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Compaticard IV- Geoff Does Happy Happy joy joy dance... In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.22.2.20030917125353.030ea040@mail.zipcon.net> Message-ID: On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Geoff Reed wrote: > I was digging through storage boxes of cruft here and what should I happen > upon.... a Compaticard IV... YAY! however the disks that came with it are > gone :( so.... does anyone have the software for it? and can I get a > copy? and is uniform still available? Attached is the software that you need. It will get 'scraped off' for list consumption. Uniform is only available if you can find someone with a copy and manual. MicroSolutions does not support either CompatiCard or Uniform any more. > also, what do I need to do to be able to do single density disks? is the > Catweasel the only option on a PeeCee? FDC's with the 37C65 or 8473N chips are oftimes SD capable. - don [demime 1.01a removed an attachment of type APPLICATION/ZIP which had a name of compatic.Zip] From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 17 16:19:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Compaticard IV- Geoff Does Happy Happy joy joy dance... In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.22.2.20030917125353.030ea040@mail.zipcon.net> References: <20030917111155.T71839@newshell.lmi.net> <20030917111155.T71839@newshell.lmi.net> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030917170819.007e7e20@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I have the driver files already ZIPPED. I'll send them directly to you. I think the Compaticard will do SD. Joe At 12:56 PM 9/17/03 -0700, you wrote: >I was digging through storage boxes of cruft here and what should I happen >upon.... a Compaticard IV... YAY! however the disks that came with it are >gone :( so.... does anyone have the software for it? and can I get a >copy? and is uniform still available? > > also, what do I need to do to be able to do single density disks? is the >Catweasel the only option on a PeeCee? From allain at panix.com Wed Sep 17 16:20:00 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: (Ping) Paging Jim Willing, paging Jim Willing. References: Message-ID: <003d01c37d60$018917c0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> > If someone knows how to get ahold of him by means other > than email, it would be appreciated. This posting: >> Friday, October 04, 2002 1:03 PM << Had Jim's Address on it. John A. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Sep 17 16:23:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Micro/Sys CPM systems? Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030917171501.007d7e60@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Anybody know anything about any CPM sstems made by Micro/Sys? I think they used STD bus cards. I have a big pile of 8" floppy disks for the M/S systems including a lot of them with source code. I think M/S is the same company that now uses the name Embedded Systems. They're website says that they still make STD bus cards but no mention of CPM OS. Joe From healyzh at aracnet.com Wed Sep 17 16:32:00 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: (Ping) Paging Jim Willing, paging Jim Willing. In-Reply-To: from "Patrick Rigney" at Sep 17, 2003 12:15:00 PM Message-ID: <200309172122.h8HLMwat029615@onyx.spiritone.com> > If someone knows how to get ahold of him by means other than email, it would > be appreciated. It sounds like he's on his way to seriously damaging his Didn't he post this information a while back? Have you checked the mailing list archives? OK, I just tried, let me put it another way, is there a way to search the archives, and does anyone remember? I'm pretty sure he posted a phone number for the Bowling Center at some point. OK, I think this might be current... 620-924-1305 At least it was in March when he posted it. There is a web page, but when he posted the above number he noted that the number on the web page http://www.yatescenterbowl.com/ was no longer valid. Also it looks like the last post from him was on August 12th. In it he talks about the current state of his troubles. Zane From arcarlini at iee.org Wed Sep 17 16:40:01 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: DEC Server In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000201c37d63$16e3fba0$5b01a8c0@athlon> > Yea. I have seen the DS500 source code, and it looks like that has > actually evolved from the earlier DS100 and DS200 systems. This I find surprising since, like PLUTO, the DS500 was PDP-11 based ans the DS100 and DS200 (and the 300 & too AFAIK) were 68000-based (maybe moving to some 68K variant in the later lines). The DECserver series came out of LKG (Littleton) - the folks that bounced through the Cabletron acquisition and came out the other side as DNPG - and they tended to use 68K variants wherever possible. The UK side did use 68K variants for some of the synch adapters but tended to use VAX processors for the network boxes (DECnis, DEMSA). Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From arcarlini at iee.org Wed Sep 17 16:48:01 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: HP 85B Schematics wanted In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000301c37d64$42a66ab0$5b01a8c0@athlon> > Basically, if you are interested in old HP calculators and > have a way to > read CD-ROMs and view/print .pdf files, you _want_ these disks. I thought you didn't like pdf docs? I guess at least it's not all on a single DVD :-) Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Sep 17 16:59:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Compaticard IV- Geoff Does Happy Happy joy joy dance... In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.22.2.20030917125353.030ea040@mail.zipcon.net> References: <20030917111155.T71839@newshell.lmi.net> <6.0.0.22.2.20030917125353.030ea040@mail.zipcon.net> Message-ID: <20030917144202.E77732@newshell.lmi.net> On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Geoff Reed wrote: > I was digging through storage boxes of cruft here and what should I happen > upon.... a Compaticard IV... YAY! however the disks that came with it are > gone :( so.... does anyone have the software for it? and can I get a > copy? and is uniform still available? Retail sales of Uniform are LONG gone. But it was common enough that used copies will probably show up, and many people have various versions of it. > also, what do I need to do to be able to do single density disks? is the > Catweasel the only option on a PeeCee? In addition to the Catweasel, (for which always be VERY clear on whether you want to make images, or transfer files ("read xxx" is NOT always clear)), similar hardware capabilities (but not necessarily with software available) exist in the Central Point Deluxe Option Board. Tim Mann seems to be THE expert on Catweasel. And MANY FDC boards (probably including the Compaticard) CAN do single density (with the right software). Does it use a 37C65 chip? -- Fred Cisin cisin@xenosoft.com XenoSoft http://www.xenosoft.com PO Box 1236 (510) 558-9366 Berkeley, CA 94701-1236 From pljones at earthling.net Wed Sep 17 17:00:01 2003 From: pljones at earthling.net (Peter L Jones) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Digging up Gnomes [OT thread resurrection] Message-ID: <000501c37d65$e7eb9210$0400a8c0@drealm.org.uk> Oh dear, I'm always late... Anyway, I thought I'd wave in passing. Hi TMS, hi Gnomey! Say hi (and where on earth did 8888815 disappear to?) to Glyn if you see him. -- Just another Autognomic Host purchaser with VWDB, VWDBB and VWDBBB directories just waiting for an opportunity to fly again. (also known in those days as Thanatos and possessing more hair...) PS: Of course, it's about getting the feel of the software: the autognome and the occasional *FOD, they'd be essential features... PPS: And dammit why did no one call..? Stn. 250, Caller nr. 487 was +++WBe0036, Line drop. Logged on at 20:40:32 29.10.90 for 0 minutes. Stn. 250, Caller nr. 488 was 1111'rd, GUESTUBBER. Logged on at 20:43:09 29.10.90 for 0 minutes. From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Sep 17 17:08:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030917145458.T77732@newshell.lmi.net> On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Don Maslin wrote: > Quite the contrary! A quick glance at an 8" disk will tell you > its density by the position of the index aperature in the disk ^^^^^^^ That should be number of SIDES. I do not know of ANY way to differentiate SD v DD other than manufacturer's label, or pre-existing format. > jacket. A Single Sided disk has the aperature 7 degrees clockwise > of the 12 o'clock position, while a Double Sided disk has it > located 26 degrees clockwise of the 12 o'clock position. > In other words, SS is at about 1202 and DS is about 1307 hours. From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Sep 17 17:39:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Compaticard IV- Geoff Does Happy Happy joy joy dance... In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030917170819.007e7e20@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <20030917111155.T71839@newshell.lmi.net> <20030917111155.T71839@newshell.lmi.net> <3.0.6.32.20030917170819.007e7e20@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <20030917152459.X77732@newshell.lmi.net> On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: > I think the Compaticard will do SD. Which version of Uniform can also make a difference! In addition to ADDING new formats, in some later versions they DROPPED some formats that they had previously supported that were particularly prone to problems, particularly single density ones, some 8", and some with non-standard header fields (such as DS Kaypro!) From donm at cts.com Wed Sep 17 17:57:00 2003 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies In-Reply-To: <20030917145458.T77732@newshell.lmi.net> Message-ID: On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Fred Cisin wrote: > On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Don Maslin wrote: > > Quite the contrary! A quick glance at an 8" disk will tell you > > its density by the position of the index aperature in the disk > ^^^^^^^ > That should be number of SIDES. Quite so! Brain fart. > I do not know of ANY way to differentiate SD v DD other than > manufacturer's label, or pre-existing format. And I have never experienced any problem considering them to be interchangeable in 8" usage. - don > > jacket. A Single Sided disk has the aperature 7 degrees clockwise > > of the 12 o'clock position, while a Double Sided disk has it > > located 26 degrees clockwise of the 12 o'clock position. > > In other words, SS is at about 1202 and DS is about 1307 hours. From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 17 18:01:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: 128 Byte issues on VCM In-Reply-To: from "Vintage Computer Festival" at Sep 16, 3 07:16:41 pm Message-ID: You know you've been hacking too long when you read the Subject: line of this message and think it means there's a problem with messages of exactly 128 bytes on the VCM.... -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 17 18:01:10 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies In-Reply-To: from "chris" at Sep 17, 3 01:38:50 am Message-ID: > Is it safe to use a Bulk Tape Eraser on 8" floppies? I don't see why not, > but I figured I'd ask the pros before I did it. Yes, it's perfectly safe (for the disks and the eraser, it's not safe for the data, but that's what you want :-)). There are no impossible-to-rewrite tracks on a normal 8" disk (unlike, say, the servo information on some hard disk packs) so bulk-erased disks can be reformatted and used. -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 17 18:01:18 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies In-Reply-To: from "chris" at Sep 17, 3 02:32:25 am Message-ID: > Is there a way to tell visually if they are DS vs SS? Not all the For 8" disks, yes. The index hole is in a different place (not very different, but noticeable if you have the disks next to each other) on the 2 types. You could compare your unknown disks with the ones you know to figure out what they are. -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 17 18:02:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: HP 85B Schematics wanted In-Reply-To: <000301c37d64$42a66ab0$5b01a8c0@athlon> from "Antonio Carlini" at Sep 17, 3 10:40:02 pm Message-ID: > > Basically, if you are interested in old HP calculators and > > have a way to > > read CD-ROMs and view/print .pdf files, you _want_ these disks. > > I thought you didn't like pdf docs? I guess at least it's not I don't, I much prefer paper. But a mad friend gave me a Mac Quadra 610 (off-topic, I guess), with a CD-ROM drive that can at least view and print such files from CD-ROMs (even if somewhat slowly), so I can make use of such stuff now... This machine is not on the net, so please don't fill up my mailbox with pdf files... -tony From gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org Wed Sep 17 18:28:00 2003 From: gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org (Gunther Schadow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Anyone interested in an AT&T mainframe? Message-ID: <3F68EC2A.7030308@aurora.regenstrief.org> Hello, I just came back from Boston where I packed all that I could take off that VAX 11/785 carcass that I bought earlier this year on ebay. Unfortunately I had to leave cabinets behind, I had word that U.S.Airways would not had let me check that kind of baggage :-). But I managed to get the whole KA785 backplane assembly with all the boards plus a memory backplane on the flight and home. I had to leave 2 H7100 PSUs behind and two MBA backplanes. If anyone is looking for SBI/MBA backplanes, holler ASAP! They might get lost otherwise. Joe, who is the keeper of that shop (and who frequently sells good stuff on ebay) told me about an AT&T mainframe system he has available. So, if you are interested in an AT&T mainframe system (I haven't had the time to see it) you want to let him know. (For privacy reasons I have left his address off, but let me know and I will Fwd to him.) regards, -Gunther PS: just in case you are in Boston and so inclined: there is still a nice Unibus cabinet out there, together with the remains of the VAX one could build a CPU extension cabinet, which is what one would need to turn a VAX 11/78x into a dual-processor machine according to the Purdue recipe. Something I would have loved to try if I could have found a way to take that cabinet home. From gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org Wed Sep 17 18:42:00 2003 From: gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org (Gunther Schadow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: at&t mainframe References: <3F68EE5B.F340236B@msm.umr.edu> Message-ID: <3F68EF66.8050507@aurora.regenstrief.org> Hm, that's a good point. You know, I don't know. I have not seen this thing. It sounded to me like it was something big. So, may be it is an IBM with some AT&T label on it? I don't know. -Gunther jim wrote: > what is an at&t mainframe? one they owned, or manufactured? > > if it is one of the 3B's it probably wont get me interested, but if it > is > an IBM mainframe from a datacenter that is old, I am very interested. > > I just have not heard the term "mainframe" applied to any 3B's and > don't know what else they may have. > > if these are switching systems, I assume they are of the 3, 4 or 5ESS > classes? > > Jim From waltje at pdp11.nl Wed Sep 17 19:29:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: DEC Server In-Reply-To: <000201c37d63$16e3fba0$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Antonio Carlini wrote: > > Yea. I have seen the DS500 source code, and it looks like that has > > actually evolved from the earlier DS100 and DS200 systems. > > This I find surprising since, like PLUTO, the DS500 was PDP-11 based > ans the DS100 and DS200 (and the 300 & too AFAIK) were 68000-based The DS200 sure is PDP-11 based. Dunno 'bout the 100, since I dont have that one. Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From eric at brouhaha.com Wed Sep 17 19:56:00 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: DEC Server In-Reply-To: References: <000201c37d63$16e3fba0$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: <2305.4.20.168.219.1063846072.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Antonio Carlini wrote: > This I find surprising since, like PLUTO, the DS500 was PDP-11 based > ans the DS100 and DS200 (and the 300 & too AFAIK) were 68000-based "Fred N. van Kempen" wrote: > The DS200 sure is PDP-11 based. Dunno 'bout the 100, since I dont > have that one. Just had a DS200 open a few months ago, and there was a 68000 in it, with no PDP-11 of any sort (not even a T11). Also, if you look at the contents of the ROMs or the MOP download code, they are full of 68K code. For instance, there are lots of hex 4E75 words, which is a 68000 RTS instruction. Shows up as "Nu" in ASCII, or "uN" if your byte order is different. From waltje at pdp11.nl Wed Sep 17 20:10:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: DEC Server In-Reply-To: <2305.4.20.168.219.1063846072.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Eric Smith wrote: > Just had a DS200 open a few months ago, and there was a 68000 in it, > with no PDP-11 of any sort (not even a T11). Also, if you look at > the contents of the ROMs or the MOP download code, they are full of > 68K code. For instance, there are lots of hex 4E75 words, which is a > 68000 RTS instruction. Shows up as "Nu" in ASCII, or "uN" if your byte > order is different. Hrrm. Thats weird. I could've sworn they were F11 based. Also, they used RSX taskbuilder images. Guess they were using an 68K cross-assembler setup then.... Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From jpl15 at panix.com Wed Sep 17 20:27:00 2003 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Ping Eric Smith Message-ID: Panix on your shit-list? Drop me a line, if possble... Cheerz John From vcf at siconic.com Wed Sep 17 20:52:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Commodore Plus/4 free for shipping on VCM In-Reply-To: <3F68B1E3.6000905@frixxon.co.uk> Message-ID: On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Paul Williams wrote: > Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > Someone just posted a Commodore Plus/4 on the Vintage Computer > > Marketplace. Free (just pay shipping). > > > > http://marketplace.vintage.org/view.cfm?ad=157 > > Please reassure me that you're *not* going to post on this list every > time there's a new item on VCM? Only free items. And not all the time. If I did then there'd be no point in your visiting, which would defeat the purpose. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Sep 17 22:38:00 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: 3 Phase converter Message-ID: I came across this on eBay and figured there might be some interest in such a unit here. The seller does recommend against using the unit for three phase electronics, but I dunno if he would consider big-iron to be in that category or not ;) http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2558575867 Not affiliated with seller, etc, etc... -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Sep 17 23:04:00 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Replacing VT flybacks (was: Re: Needed - VT terminal) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 16 Sep 2003, Tony Duell wrote: > > Quothe Christopher Cureau, from writings of Fri, Sep 12, 2003 at > > 08:23:13AM -0500: > > > > > Does anyone have a spare VT220, 320 or 420 that they'd be willing to > > > part with? My 320 just bit the dust...very inconvenient time, too, > > > since I was > > > > Wouldn't you rather repair it than replace it? What went wrong with > > it? > > It's a VT320... 99.9% fo the time the failure with these is the flyback > transformer which develops shorted turns (and then fails visibly, with > 'gunge' leaking out). Sometimes it takes the horizontal output > transistor with it as well, or maybe even bits of the PSU. > > If the power indicator is flashing on/off, then it's the flyback, period > (well, it _might_ be something else, but it's a fairly safe bet it's the > flyback). Is there a commonly available flyback that will work in the VT340? I've been unable to locate a service manual for that model terminal, and don't really know much about the flyback that it uses. Mine let out its magic smoke some time back, and I'm really starting to miss that color VT. -Toth From rdd at rddavis.org Wed Sep 17 23:08:00 2003 From: rdd at rddavis.org (R. D. Davis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: at&t mainframe In-Reply-To: <3F68EF66.8050507@aurora.regenstrief.org> References: <3F68EE5B.F340236B@msm.umr.edu> <3F68EF66.8050507@aurora.regenstrief.org> Message-ID: <20030918040401.GA38946@rhiannon.rddavis.org> > jim wrote: > >what is an at&t mainframe? one they owned, or manufactured? Perhaps it's a largish AT&T minicomputer, like the multi-processor 3B4000. > >if it is one of the 3B's it probably wont get me interested, but if it AT&T 3Bxxxx systems are not all alike... some are little tiny machines like the 3B1 (which is totally different from the other 3Bx and 3Bxxxx systems... not sure why they called it a 3Banything, except for marketing purposes... it's more like a re-engineered CT miniframe with built-in video), then there are the vastly larger multi-processor machines that are of an entirely different design. > >I just have not heard the term "mainframe" applied to any 3B's and > >don't know what else they may have. Let's just say that some 3Bxxxx systems are not at all small, but I would guess that they're still classified as minicomputers, not mainframes... depending upon one's definition of mainframe. > >if these are switching systems, I assume they are of the 3, 4 or 5ESS > >classes? Probably unlikely... more like one, or more, WE[something] proessors, IIRC. -- Copyright (C) 2003 R. D. Davis The difference between humans & other animals: All Rights Reserved an unnatural belief that we're above Nature & rdd@rddavis.org 410-744-4900 her other creatures, using dogma to justify such http://www.rddavis.org beliefs and to justify much human cruelty. From nico at farumdata.dk Wed Sep 17 23:17:00 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Bulk Erase 8" floppies References: <200309171826.OAA21661@wordstock.com> Message-ID: <001d01c37d9a$22546e20$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> > And thusly Fred Cisin spake: > > > > > > ALMOST. > > There is no visible difference between SD single density v DD Double > > density. > > But, if you take a look at SS Single sided v DS double sided, the index > > hole is in a different place! > > In relation to what? How is the index hole in a different place? (I have > only *seen* 8" floppies and drive, never actually used one) > I must humbly admit that Fred is right. It just never occurred to me to look at the index holes. Probably because of the drives I'm using. When you have the floppy in front of you, with the label in the upper left corner, the index hole for SSSD disks is offset about 10 degrees from the center, on the right side. If you imagene a watch (with hands), and the long hand is at twelve, the index hole would be at half past 12 or so. The hole for DSDD is at about 1 o'clock Jeez, how embarrassing, and I am supposed to be a media expert... Nico From nico at farumdata.dk Wed Sep 17 23:26:00 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Compaticard IV- Geoff Does Happy Happy joy joy dance... References: Message-ID: <004b01c37d9b$63763540$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> > > I was digging through storage boxes of cruft here and what should I happen > > upon.... a Compaticard IV... YAY! however the disks that came with it are > > gone :( so.... does anyone have the software for it? and can I get a > > copy? and is uniform still available? > > Attached is the software that you need. It will get 'scraped off' > for list consumption. Uniform is only available if you can find > someone with a copy and manual. MicroSolutions does not support > either CompatiCard or Uniform any more. > Could I talk one of you to mail me the software too ? To be real folkloristic, I can tell you that I once made up a bootable MS-DOS 3.something 8" SSSD floppy. I could also read SSSD 3740 disks. Formatting (3740) was a different kettle of fish. I never succeeded Nico From gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org Thu Sep 18 00:00:00 2003 From: gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org (Gunther Schadow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Help! Too much stuff, but love all of it :-) Message-ID: <3F6939F4.8030504@aurora.regenstrief.org> Help! I can't work with any of my gear any more because it's all in the way! But I really do like it all. Anyway, I will have to let go of something. There is that HP 9000 K class machine with Ethernet, FDDI, dual DDS2 tape drive and RAID disk array, all in a nice setup, original with HP-UX and an HP term. Not too loud and not too slow. Nice useable UNIX system. So beautiful, but I don't know where to put it and be able to do something with it. Then the DEC 7000. What a beautiful machine! What a nice sound! It's got plenty of CPU and memory and SCSI and all but still I can't use it, or if I do I can't work on my VAX 11/780, which is the main thing I want to do. I am thinking about selling to recoup some of my costs, but then, before I sell for a rediculously low price I'd rather give it away or trade. I still want a VAX 4000 - 700 or 105A in a pedestal as my last addition to the family. That would be a trade. If you want some of it, make an offer in $$ or machine or parts. I still need some PDP-8/A parts, memory, power supply, or an RA60 drive, or VAX 11/780 cabinet remains (delivered to my door.) This is not a OBO by next Saturday kind of sale, but if you are interested you're welcome to make an offer. I am in Indianapolis. -Gunther From donm at cts.com Thu Sep 18 00:42:00 2003 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Compaticard IV- Geoff Does Happy Happy joy joy dance... In-Reply-To: <004b01c37d9b$63763540$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Nico de Jong wrote: > > > I was digging through storage boxes of cruft here and what should I happen > > > upon.... a Compaticard IV... YAY! however the disks that came with it are > > > gone :( so.... does anyone have the software for it? and can I get a > > > copy? and is uniform still available? > > > > Attached is the software that you need. It will get 'scraped off' > > for list consumption. Uniform is only available if you can find > > someone with a copy and manual. MicroSolutions does not support > > either CompatiCard or Uniform any more. > > > Could I talk one of you to mail me the software too ? To be real Here it is. - don > folkloristic, I can tell you that I once made up a bootable > MS-DOS 3.something 8" SSSD floppy. I could also read SSSD 3740 > disks. Formatting (3740) was a different kettle of fish. I never > succeeded > > Nico [demime 1.01a removed an attachment of type APPLICATION/ZIP which had a name of compatic.Zip] From geoffr at zipcon.net Thu Sep 18 01:13:00 2003 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: Uniform - PeeCee Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.2.20030917230735.030f4e30@mail.zipcon.net> Ok, now I am on a quest for Uniform for the PC. (to go along with my compaticard) am looking for different versions :) since the disk support varied (thanks for reminding me of this guys) From wmsmith at earthlink.net Thu Sep 18 01:52:00 2003 From: wmsmith at earthlink.net (Wayne M. Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:57 2005 Subject: (Ping) Paging Jim Willing, paging Jim Willing. In-Reply-To: <200309172122.h8HLMwat029615@onyx.spiritone.com> Message-ID: <002801c37db0$35d6ede0$2cb2d642@WaynePC> From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Thu Sep 18 06:17:00 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: 128 Byte issues on VCM In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030918110942.36567.qmail@web21103.mail.yahoo.com> --- Tony Duell wrote: > You know you've been hacking too long when you read the Subject: line of > this message and think it means there's a problem with messages of > exactly 128 bytes on the VCM.... Well, at least I wasn't alone, then... :-) ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From geoffreythomas at onetel.net.uk Thu Sep 18 06:58:00 2003 From: geoffreythomas at onetel.net.uk (Geoffrey Thomas) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: IBM 5324 Message-ID: <00f101c37dda$b545d120$e44e4ed5@geoff> I sent a post for this item some time back but haven't seen it on the forum. Perhaps it got lost. Anyway I have a complete system - Ibm 5324, keyboard,monitor, 5242 printer and a stack of manuals and 8" floppies taking up room in my shed. Does anyone want any of these before I dispose of them - I know Tarsi posted in June for info but he didn't reply to my email - assuming my email got there. Geoff. From gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org Thu Sep 18 08:45:01 2003 From: gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org (Gunther Schadow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: [Fwd: Re: [Fwd: Re: Anyone interested in an AT&T mainframe?]] Message-ID: <3F69B4CB.7000607@aurora.regenstrief.org> Here is more about that AT&T mainframe. > It's a 3B20 mainframe. Probably missing a few things. It was a testbed > that we used. Hasn't been run in maybe 5 years and may have had some boards > stolen for orders along the way. regards, -Gunther Received: from pimout1-ext.prodigy.net (pimout1-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.77]) by aurora.regenstrief.org (8.12.3/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h8IC28qK014690 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 2003 07:02:09 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from PPSJM@prodigy.net) Received: from wh3 (dialup-67.75.35.59.Dial1.Boston1.Level3.net [67.75.35.59]) by pimout1-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.9/8.12.3) with SMTP id h8IC4hou176680 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 2003 08:04:43 -0400 Message-ID: <006501c37ddd$09c8b9e0$3b234b43@wh3> From: "Joe Moir" To: "Gunther Schadow" References: <3F692ABD.5040304@aurora.regenstrief.org> Subject: Re: [Fwd: Re: Anyone interested in an AT&T mainframe?] Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 08:04:38 -0400 Organization: Prodigy Internet MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.8 required=5.0 tests=FWD_MSG,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES version=2.55 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/mixed by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain It's huge. THIS IS NOT THE ONE I HAVE FO R SALE BUT at least you get the idea of what I'm talking about. Seen Attached ----- Original Message ----- From: Gunther Schadow To: Joe Moir Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 11:47 PM Subject: [Fwd: Re: Anyone interested in an AT&T mainframe?] > Joe, Sellam Ismail here is interested in the AT&T machine. May > be I misunderstood and this isn't a big mainframe. May be it's > an IBM? You can clarify. > > thanks > -Gunther [demime 1.01a removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of att-3b20d-1s.jpg] [demime 1.01a removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of att-3b20d-3s.jpg] From cb at mythtech.net Thu Sep 18 08:45:39 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: Apple II floppy substitute Message-ID: I know the Apple II series used something like 140k single sided floppies. What is a compatible substitute? Double Sided Double Density? I would assume side count doesn't matter and in fact DS might be be preferable as then I can just notch the other side and safely flip the disk. But what about density? I know in 3.5 disks, you can't safely interchange DD and HD disks and expect them to work for long. But what about with 5.25 disks? Can I use DD or even HD disks with an Apple II? Again this is so I make sure I keep a healthy supply of floppies when I am done cleaning house (I have a case of 5.25 disks also to get rid of, and they are a mix of DSDD and DSHD). -chris From cb at mythtech.net Thu Sep 18 08:49:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: Apple IIgs ROM differences Message-ID: Is there any reason to keep ROM 01 IIgs units? I have both ROM 01 and ROM 03 units. I know the ROM 03 has advantages over the ROM 01, so given that I have both, is there a reason to keep a ROM 01? Is there anything a ROM 01 can do or is needed for that can't be done on a ROM 03? Of course, I am keeping my ROM 00 unit... just because. -chris From gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org Thu Sep 18 08:53:00 2003 From: gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org (Gunther Schadow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: So what's the definition of a "mainframe" (Re: at&t mainframe) References: <3F68EE5B.F340236B@msm.umr.edu> <3F68EF66.8050507@aurora.regenstrief.org> <20030918040401.GA38946@rhiannon.rddavis.org> Message-ID: <3F69B6E8.4080900@aurora.regenstrief.org> R. D. Davis wrote: > Let's just say that some 3Bxxxx systems are not at all small, but I > would guess that they're still classified as minicomputers, not > mainframes... depending upon one's definition of mainframe. So, let's clarify the terminology: what's a mainframe anyway? Webster's is particularly unhelpful: Main Entry: main?frame Pronunciation: 'mAn-"frAm Function: noun Date: circa 1964 : a computer with its cabinet and internal circuits; also : a large fast computer that can handle multiple tasks concurrently haha, so my Laptop is a mainframe :-) :-) What they're missing is that the term "mainframe" is sometimes applied to Oscilloscopes that come with many open slots where you plug in special circuitry. So, a mainframe to me is a system that consists of backplane and lots of modules, particularly CPU modules. That would make all the VAXen takeaway VAXstations to be mainframes. Another definition could be: "mainframe is a large IBM computer" whereas "big VAXen are always called 'minicomputer', even a complete VAX 9000 system." (Whereas pre VAX computers are not computers at all, but 'programmed data processor', but I digress :-) regards, -Gunther From vance at neurotica.com Thu Sep 18 09:08:00 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: So what's the definition of a "mainframe" (Re: at&t mainframe) In-Reply-To: <3F69B6E8.4080900@aurora.regenstrief.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Gunther Schadow wrote: > > Let's just say that some 3Bxxxx systems are not at all small, but I > > would guess that they're still classified as minicomputers, not > > mainframes... depending upon one's definition of mainframe. > > So, let's clarify the terminology: what's a mainframe anyway? I think a mainframe probably needs it's I/O to be coprocessed to qualify these days. Many supercomputers must qualify on that factor. Computers I would consider to be a mainframe tend to have a lot more I/O horsepower than processor horsepower. I don't think that applies to supercomputers. Peace... Sridhar From spectre at floodgap.com Thu Sep 18 09:55:00 2003 From: spectre at floodgap.com (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: Apple IIgs ROM differences In-Reply-To: from chris at "Sep 18, 3 09:40:45 am" Message-ID: <200309181459.HAA10692@floodgap.com> > Is there any reason to keep ROM 01 IIgs units? I have both ROM 01 and ROM > 03 units. I know the ROM 03 has advantages over the ROM 01, so given that > I have both, is there a reason to keep a ROM 01? Is there anything a ROM > 01 can do or is needed for that can't be done on a ROM 03? AFAIK, no. I only keep ROM 03's in stock, myself; in fact, my Woz 00 was replaced with a ROM 03 mo'bo'. -- ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com -- I used to miss my ex-girlfriend, but then my aim improved. ----------------- From spectre at floodgap.com Thu Sep 18 10:01:00 2003 From: spectre at floodgap.com (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: Apple II floppy substitute In-Reply-To: from chris at "Sep 18, 3 09:37:32 am" Message-ID: <200309181505.IAA14170@floodgap.com> > But what about density? I know in 3.5 disks, you can't safely interchange > DD and HD disks and expect them to work for long. But what about with > 5.25 disks? Can I use DD or even HD disks with an Apple II? I don't know the specs of the disk ][ drive head, but I do know that, for example, the Commodore 1541 and 1571 drives object to HD disks because they lack the proper magnetic properties. They only tolerate DD. I would expect disk ]['s to dislike HD as well. -- ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com -- Good times, noodle salad. -- "As Good As It Gets" -------------------------- From jwest at classiccmp.org Thu Sep 18 10:05:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: $$$ BOUNTY : HP 2895B paper tape punch racking info Message-ID: <00db01c37df5$0f5cb7e0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> I'm offering a cash bounty for information on rackmounting the HP 2895B paper tape punch. I have this gorgeous 2895B on a nice sliding tray with telescoping slides. The telescoping slides then mount to other stationary rails inside the HP cabinet. This is all standard-issue HP stuff. However, I can find no way that this drawer will mount to standard HP stationary rails (L brackets). This means one of two things... either the hardware on the sides of the tray was put together wrong by the previous owner and I can't figure out for the life of me how the pieces should be assembled, or, the 2895B rackmount drawer requires special (different) stationary rails inside the HP rack that I don't have. The bounty is for information as to either how to correctly rackmount what I have, or, acquiring the correct stationary rails. I know this sounds picky, but everything in this particular restoration is completely "authentic", and I don't want to mess that up with "jerry-rigging" a non-standard mount for this one item. The 12926A (the HP part number for the whole 2895B kit, including interface card, cables, diagnostics, etc.) manual does show the 2895B racked with a side view. However, this picture shows the punch, drawer, and slides but does not show how that assembly is bolted to the inside of the HP rack. As to where to look, the 12926A manual lists another manual which MAY contain the sought after information. This manual is: HP 2985B Tape Punch Operating and Service Manual, part number 02895-90008 However, I seem to recall that this manual above only says "For rackmounting instructions, see the instructions that came with your rackmount kit". In addition, the actual rack mount kit for the punch is part number 02895-60002 (light grey) or 02895-60003 (moss grey). This kit would surely have the instructions for assembly in it. Can anyone help? Jay West From kth at srv.net Thu Sep 18 10:21:01 2003 From: kth at srv.net (Kevin Handy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: Replacing VT flybacks In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F69D68C.2090102@srv.net> Tothwolf wrote: >Is there a commonly available flyback that will work in the VT340? I've >been unable to locate a service manual for that model terminal, and don't >really know much about the flyback that it uses. Mine let out its magic >smoke some time back, and I'm really starting to miss that color VT. > > > When I fixed several VT220's/320's, I just read the part number off the flyback itself, and went to a local electronics shop and ordered a replacement based on that. Bought the transisters from Radio Shack, and replaced them without testing the original, since they were probably stressed out from the fried flyback and I didn't want to see those terminals come back again. I quit repairing them when replacements became cheaper to buy than the transformer. From doug at blinkenlights.com Thu Sep 18 10:25:01 2003 From: doug at blinkenlights.com (Doug Salot) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: (Ping) Paging Jim Willing, paging Jim Willing. In-Reply-To: <002801c37db0$35d6ede0$2cb2d642@WaynePC> Message-ID: I'm in the same boat (sent him money, no response to inquiries for months), so I talked to the chief of police in Yates Center. He indicates that the Fredonia address is probably for a farm he rented when he first moved to KS, but he's since moved into Yates Center. Jim's financial problems are apparently well known in town (it's a small town), and the police (there's just one) didn't sound optimistic about our chances of getting our stuff. FWIW, I have no interest in pursuing this as a criminal matter, but if you're out more than $500, that could make it a felony in KS. The chief offered to ping Jim in person. I'll send an update if I hear anything back. -- Doug On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Wayne M. Smith wrote: > >From the voter registration rolls: > > WILLING, CAROLE > WILLING, JAMES > 227 HAWK ROAD > FREDONIA, KS 66736 > Telephone: (620) 625-2225 > > According to Mapquest this address is 37 miles from the Yates Center > Bowl address, but it's probably worth a shot. > > -W > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org > > [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Zane H. Healy > > Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 2:23 PM > > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > > Subject: Re: (Ping) Paging Jim Willing, paging Jim Willing. > > > > > > > If someone knows how to get ahold of him by means other > > than email, it > > > would be appreciated. It sounds like he's on his way to seriously > > > damaging his > > > > Didn't he post this information a while back? Have you > > checked the mailing list archives? OK, I just tried, let me > > put it another way, is there a way to search the archives, > > and does anyone remember? I'm pretty sure he posted a phone > > number for the Bowling Center at some point. > > > > OK, I think this might be current... 620-924-1305 At least > > it was in March when he posted it. There is a web page, but > > when he posted the above number he noted that the number on > > the web page http://www.yatescenterbowl.com/ was no longer valid. > > > > Also it looks like the last post from him was on August 12th. > > In it he talks about the current state of his troubles. > > > > Zane From teoz at neo.rr.com Thu Sep 18 10:30:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: Apple IIgs ROM differences References: <200309181459.HAA10692@floodgap.com> Message-ID: <003301c37df8$b46b5400$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cameron Kaiser" To: Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2003 10:59 AM Subject: Re: Apple IIgs ROM differences > > Is there any reason to keep ROM 01 IIgs units? I have both ROM 01 and ROM > > 03 units. I know the ROM 03 has advantages over the ROM 01, so given that > > I have both, is there a reason to keep a ROM 01? Is there anything a ROM > > 01 can do or is needed for that can't be done on a ROM 03? > > AFAIK, no. I only keep ROM 03's in stock, myself; in fact, my Woz 00 was > replaced with a ROM 03 mo'bo'. > > -- > ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- > Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com > -- I used to miss my ex-girlfriend, but then my aim improved. ----------------- Besides having 1mb memory on board instead of 256k, whats the advantage of the 03? From Hans.Franke at mch20.sbs.de Thu Sep 18 10:35:01 2003 From: Hans.Franke at mch20.sbs.de (Hans Franke) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: Apple IIgs ROM differences In-Reply-To: <200309181459.HAA10692@floodgap.com> References: from chris at "Sep 18, 3 09:40:45 am" Message-ID: <3F69EAD5.4870.23B2691B@localhost> > > Is there any reason to keep ROM 01 IIgs units? I have both ROM 01 and ROM > > 03 units. I know the ROM 03 has advantages over the ROM 01, so given that > > I have both, is there a reason to keep a ROM 01? Is there anything a ROM > > 01 can do or is needed for that can't be done on a ROM 03? > AFAIK, no. I only keep ROM 03's in stock, myself; in fact, my Woz 00 was > replaced with a ROM 03 mo'bo'. There are supposed to be a few programs in existance that hat problems with ROM 03 ... But I think these are rather exotic variations. If you want to use an Apple II, then a ROM 03 GS is the only logical coice. Now, if you are realy throwing out ROM 00 or 01 IIgs, I would be interested in the boards (including the parts). Gruss H. -- VCF Europa 5.0 am 01./02. Mai 2004 in Muenchen http://www.vcfe.org/ From cb at mythtech.net Thu Sep 18 10:39:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:58 2005 Subject: Apple IIgs ROM differences Message-ID: >Besides having 1mb memory on board instead of 256k, whats the advantage of >the 03? From mike-cc at msdsite.com Thu Sep 18 10:54:00 2003 From: mike-cc at msdsite.com (Mike Davis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: NEC Drive Problem (CP/M System) In-Reply-To: <3F69D68C.2090102@srv.net> References: Message-ID: <3F697049.12469.9B6E085@localhost> Ok, I have a puzzle that I need help on. I have an NEC Dual 8" Drive System. This is a CP/M system. But my drive #2 has a problem. Drive #1 works fine. Symptoms: Can't boot from drive #2 Can't read files from drive #2 Can't write files to drive #2 CAN get a directory listing from drive #2 CAN write to FAT, as when trying to copy files If I try to load files from drive #2, I get a failure with the following error: "Bdos Err On B: Bad Sector" If I try to write files to drive #2, the directory entry is written (except that it is TEST.$$$ instead of the correct extension). But the data for the file is apparently NOT written. I get the same error. I see attempts to read and write but these always end with the error above. It looks like the write head must be good, as a filename is saved to disk. It looks like the read head must be good, as the directory can be listed. Any suggestions as to what could be causing this? Could it have something with head movement? Perhaps the directory storage is on a track (sector) that can be reached and the others can't? I'm stumped. Note: I have not actually looked inside to see if the head is moving properly (that may be next but I know it does move some.) but I have reattached all the connectors to the drive and controller. SECOND QUESTION: The drive is an FD1165-A. I can't locate such a drive. But I have located an FD1165-FQ. I wonder how compatible the FQ version is with the A version. Can parts be exchanged? From cb at mythtech.net Thu Sep 18 11:16:00 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Apple IIgs ROM differences Message-ID: >Now, if you are realy throwing out ROM 00 or 01 IIgs, I would >be interested in the boards (including the parts). I only have one ROM 00 unit, which I am keeping. I have at least one ROM 01 unit, plus I have 4 or 5 other IIgs units that I don't know the ROM version. I also have one ROM 03 complete system which I am keeping. Although I have no objection to shipping things, I have no time to do it. And I don't mean that in the sense that I am busy... I mean that in the sense that I am being evicted from my storage area, and have no where to move things until they can be shipped. Monday, everything that isn't claimed this weekend, hits the dumpster. My Oct 1st deadline was just moved forward to Saturday. I just had to beg and plead to keep the space until Monday because I have some people lined up to stop in over the weekend. If you want to make arrangements with someone that is stopping in, and have them take things for shipping, that's fine with me Now I just have to figure out how to get them around the painting that will be starting on Saturday. Full construction and moving starts Monday... when the movers show up, all my stuff is being removed and I can't stop it. -chris From nico at farumdata.dk Thu Sep 18 11:23:00 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: NEC Drive Problem (CP/M System) References: <3F697049.12469.9B6E085@localhost> Message-ID: <000a01c37dff$7c96dca0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> From: "Mike Davis" To: Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2003 5:43 PM Subject: NEC Drive Problem (CP/M System) > Ok, I have a puzzle that I need help on. I have an NEC Dual 8" Drive System. This is a > FD1165-A. I can't locate such a drive. But I have located an FD1165-FQ. I > wonder how compatible the FQ version is with the A version. Can parts be exchanged? > Gigabite.com has the -A drive, according to http://www.gigabite.com/floppy.html In my conversion systems, I use a mix of FD1165-FQ, YD-180 and shugart 860-1. The only problem is the power plug, they are all different. Nico From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 18 11:41:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Apple II floppy substitute In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, chris wrote: > I know the Apple II series used something like 140k single sided floppies. 140K per side. > But what about density? I know in 3.5 disks, you can't safely interchange > DD and HD disks and expect them to work for long. But what about with > 5.25 disks? Can I use DD or even HD disks with an Apple II? HD disks do not work in Apple ][ drives. Apple drives are OK with single density or double density disks, and you can notch single-sided disks to make them double-sided. The Apple is easy when it comes to disks. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From cb at mythtech.net Thu Sep 18 11:53:01 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Apple II floppy substitute Message-ID: >Apple drives are OK with single density or double density disks, and you >can notch single-sided disks to make them double-sided. The Apple is easy >when it comes to disks. Oh good, that makes my life easy. I have a half dozen unopened boxes of 5.25 DSDD floppies. Now I don't have to dig thru or sort all the used ones. -chris From r_beaudry at hotmail.com Thu Sep 18 12:12:00 2003 From: r_beaudry at hotmail.com (Rich Beaudry) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Loutus 123 "Government Edition"? Message-ID: Hello all, I recently got a copy of Lotus 1-2-3 (on topic! Dates on disks are 1989), Release 2.2. The disks, and the box the disks were in say "Government Edition". There is a barcode label on the bottom that says "3.5 Govt Upgrd", and the disks have a cool logo of the American Eagle, with a floppy disk over it, and the words "Government Edition". My question is: Is there any real difference between this and any other 123 R2.2, or is this just fancy labeling? Thanks! Rich B. From spectre at floodgap.com Thu Sep 18 12:44:00 2003 From: spectre at floodgap.com (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Apple IIgs ROM differences In-Reply-To: <003301c37df8$b46b5400$657ca418@neo.rr.com> from TeoZ at "Sep 18, 3 11:22:36 am" Message-ID: <200309181749.KAA14962@floodgap.com> > > AFAIK, no. I only keep ROM 03's in stock, myself; in fact, my Woz 00 was > > replaced with a ROM 03 mo'bo'. > Besides having 1mb memory on board instead of 256k, whats the advantage of > the 03? Larger Toolbox ROM as well (required, I think, for certain higher versions of GS/OS). ROM 03 IIgses can also netboot over LocalTalk from an appropriately configured server. -- ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com -- Don't wear rollerskates to a tug-of-war. -- Larry Wall --------------------- From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 18 12:45:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Suggested solution regarding Jim Willing Message-ID: Hello All. I've been keeping tabs on the complaints regard Jim Willing. I'm also someone who has items owed to me by Jim. Unfortunately, I just don't see this situation being resolved by Jim anytime soon. I consider Jim a friend, and I know that if it was within his means he would take care of this immediately. I've only known him to be honorable. However, he seems to be compounding one bad move with another, and the last thing I want to see is more trouble for Jim that he just won't be able to handle. As much as it sucks to get stiffed, getting the police involved or filing lawsuits won't make the situation any better. Jim apparently just doesn't have the resources to follow through on his commitments. The economy has ruined a lot of people, and it hit Jim hard, perhaps harder than most. Keep that in mind. That being said, I think the best way to go would be as follows: one or two people who are close to Yates Center, Kansas, should arrange a visit with Jim. They should bring boxes and packaging materials (tape, foam peanuts, etc.) Anything that can be packed and shipped should be packed up with Jim's help. Those packages and the remaining items should then be loaded into the vehicle and driven off. Jim is no longer in the picture and he can try to deal with life free from this burden. The packed items can be taken to the local UPS or Fedex center and sent off. The rest of the items can be distributed based on specific arrangements to be decided. I'm assuming that whatever money Jim received for both the items and shipping has been spent on bills, so it would be wise to simply write this off. Those folks who have already paid for shipping have two options: either send more money for shipping (to the persons who are handling the pickup) or try to arrange some way for items to be brought to them through some relay mechanism. I would also call on Jim to relinquish anything else of value that can be added to the load when it's picked up. These items can be sold off by a neutral party and the funds distributed proportionally to those folks who are owed money for shipping. I think the best way to coordinate this will be to have everyone who is owed something write to me, and I'll form a small mailing list so we can figure everything out. None of this is to be construed as my acquiring responsibility for this. I am just trying to find a solution that will remove Jim from the picture and get everyone their stuff. Everyone will lose from this, unfortunately. Jim stiffed a lot of people. However, there's no point in trying to "ruin" Jim. That's already happened. Getting him in trouble will most likely only guarantee that you'll never get what you paid for. The best solution at this point is to work together to resolve the issue in a manner that gets everyone what they are owed. This is just a suggestion. No one is obligated to adhere to it. Anyone is free to take their own independent course of action. That being said, anyone who is interested please e-mail me and I'll coordinate the effort. But this all rests on having at least two people near Kansas who can take on the burden of the drive and the effort required to retrieve the items. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From dogas at bellsouth.net Thu Sep 18 12:47:00 2003 From: dogas at bellsouth.net (Mike) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Basic Four mini available in AL. References: Message-ID: <001b01c37e0a$4355e020$6fdb3fd0@DOMAIN> Hi all, Anita at Crappiefishinusa@aol.com wants to find a good home for her Basic Four minicomputer. She is located in N. Alabama near the Georgia line and would like to hear from anyone interested. I might be able to help anyone going for this in terms of some software (disk packs of BOSS, Business Basic, and some accounting crap) and documentation that I have with mine, though her's seems to include 'stuff' too... ;) - Mike: dogas@bellsouth.net Hello Mike, As far as I know it works, I have books and disc with it but the person who worked with this computer is no longer around, no I would not trash it as I know it is old and yes it is really BIG. I would like it to go to someone who might know how to use it. Thank you for asking around. Anita Hi Anita, > Hello I have an old basic four computer can you tell me where I can sell it, > what it might be worth? Thank You Anita I have one of those too. Mine was given to me for free for simply relieving the owner of the 'burden' because it was a big and heavy old minicomputer and too much in his way. If you want to sell it, I'd suggest getting the model numbers on everything that you can see, describing the parts and condition (software and documentation too) as well as you can, and even posting some digital pictures of the system and then either using http://ebay.com or http://marketplace.vintage.org for the best financial results, but shipping can be a real pain and expensive for these large systems though. As far as worth... Technically, I'd say the machine is worth saving for historical reasons so please don't trash it if you have trouble selling it now. Worth is pretty subjective and sporadic these days. Prices seem to be on the low side watching eBay. So guessing anywhere from $0 to a few hundred. High side if working. If you were close and I was less poor right now I'd be more interested in it myself. There is a internet-list of classic computer enthusiasts that I could ask for you and maybe find someone locally interested, but those folks like there old systems cheap, but care for them deeply. Good luck - Mike From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Thu Sep 18 12:58:00 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Loutus 123 "Government Edition"? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030918134920.00a72030@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> > My question is: Is there any real difference between this and any other 123 > R2.2, or is this just fancy labeling? Pricing and licensing issues covered under a GSA schedule? At 01:05 PM 9/18/03 -0400, you wrote: >Hello all, > >I recently got a copy of Lotus 1-2-3 (on topic! Dates on disks are 1989), >Release 2.2. The disks, and the box the disks were in say "Government >Edition". There is a barcode label on the bottom that says "3.5 Govt >Upgrd", and the disks have a cool logo of the American Eagle, with a floppy >disk over it, and the words "Government Edition". > >My question is: Is there any real difference between this and any other 123 >R2.2, or is this just fancy labeling? > >Thanks! > >Rich B. From arcarlini at iee.org Thu Sep 18 13:08:00 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Replacing VT flybacks (was: Re: Needed - VT terminal) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <003901c37e0e$b2a81e30$5b01a8c0@athlon> > Is there a commonly available flyback that will work in the > VT340? I've been unable to locate a service manual for that > model terminal, and don't really know much about the flyback > that it uses. Mine let out its magic smoke some time back, > and I'm really starting to miss that color VT. You'll find a VT330 Pocket Service guide if you look here: http://vt100.net/docs/vt330-ps/ I don't recall how close that is to a VT340. I also have Illustrated Parts Breakdowns for both the 330 and 340 which may help. If all you want to do is replace the flyback, then I assume that it is easily identified and all you want is an available replacement part number - the manuals are unlikely to help there. Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From jcwren at jcwren.com Thu Sep 18 13:10:01 2003 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Basic Four mini available in AL. In-Reply-To: <001b01c37e0a$4355e020$6fdb3fd0@DOMAIN> References: <001b01c37e0a$4355e020$6fdb3fd0@DOMAIN> Message-ID: <200309181402.05852.jcwren@jcwren.com> If it's an emergency rescue, I can probably pick this unit up for someone and hold in my warehouse until it can be picked up from me. I have no interest in the unit myself. I'm about 2 hours away from her location. --John On Thursday 18 September 2003 13:28 pm, Mike wrote: > Hi all, > > Anita at Crappiefishinusa@aol.com wants to find a good home for her Basic > Four minicomputer. She is located in N. Alabama near the Georgia line and > would like to hear from anyone interested. I might be able to help anyone > going for this in terms of some software (disk packs of BOSS, Business > Basic, and some accounting crap) and documentation that I have with mine, > though her's seems to include 'stuff' too... > > ;) > - Mike: dogas@bellsouth.net > > > > Hello Mike, As far as I know it works, I have books and disc with it but > the person who worked with this computer is no longer around, no I would > not trash it as I know it is old and yes it is really BIG. I would like it > to go to someone who might know how to use it. Thank you for asking around. > Anita > > Hi Anita, > > > Hello I have an old basic four computer can you tell me where I can sell > > it, > > > what it might be worth? Thank You Anita > > I have one of those too. Mine was given to me for free for simply > relieving the owner of the 'burden' because it was a big and heavy old > minicomputer and too much in his way. > > If you want to sell it, I'd suggest getting the model numbers on everything > that you can see, describing the parts and condition (software and > documentation too) as well as you can, and even posting some digital > pictures of the system and then either using http://ebay.com or > http://marketplace.vintage.org for the best financial results, but shipping > can be a real pain and expensive for these large systems though. > > As far as worth... Technically, I'd say the machine is worth saving for > historical reasons so please don't trash it if you have trouble selling it > now. Worth is pretty subjective and sporadic these days. Prices seem to > be on the low side watching eBay. So guessing anywhere from $0 to a few > hundred. High side if working. > > If you were close and I was less poor right now I'd be more interested in > it myself. There is a internet-list of classic computer enthusiasts that I > could ask for you and maybe find someone locally interested, but those > folks like there old systems cheap, but care for them deeply. > > Good luck > - Mike From healyzh at aracnet.com Thu Sep 18 13:10:12 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Apple IIgs ROM differences In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >From what I understand, some of the new code in the ROM 03 is needed to >run some applications, and the GS/OS (the GUI OS for the GS as compared >to ProDOS) I'm able to run System 6.0.1 (I assume this is what you're referring to as GS/OS) on ROM 01 systems (I don't have a ROM 03 system, only ROM 01's and maybe a Woz). Zane -- -- | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | | healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | | | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From teoz at neo.rr.com Thu Sep 18 13:14:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Apple IIgs ROM differences References: <200309181749.KAA14962@floodgap.com> Message-ID: <00d301c37e0f$8bb65f20$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cameron Kaiser" To: Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2003 1:49 PM Subject: Re: Apple IIgs ROM differences > > > AFAIK, no. I only keep ROM 03's in stock, myself; in fact, my Woz 00 was > > > replaced with a ROM 03 mo'bo'. > > > Besides having 1mb memory on board instead of 256k, whats the advantage of > > the 03? > > Larger Toolbox ROM as well (required, I think, for certain higher versions > of GS/OS). ROM 03 IIgses can also netboot over LocalTalk from an > appropriately configured server. > > -- > ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- > Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com > -- Don't wear rollerskates to a tug-of-war. -- Larry Wall --------------------- So a rom1 cant netboot over localtalk? I was under the assumption that GS/OS 6.01 used an updated toolbox from disk rather then the rom routines. I have a 01 rom , was thinking about getting an 03 just for the extra memory. TZ From Hans.Franke at mch20.sbs.de Thu Sep 18 13:19:00 2003 From: Hans.Franke at mch20.sbs.de (Hans Franke) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Apple IIgs ROM differences In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F6A114D.10381.2448AA7F@localhost> > >From what I understand, some of the new code in the ROM 03 is needed to > >run some applications, and the GS/OS (the GUI OS for the GS as compared > >to ProDOS) > I'm able to run System 6.0.1 (I assume this is what you're referring > to as GS/OS) on ROM 01 systems (I don't have a ROM 03 system, only > ROM 01's and maybe a Woz). Jup, GS/OS runs fine on all IIgs ... just a bit faster on a 03, and more important, you get way more free memory, since the 03 has most of the updated Toolbox functions already in ROM, while on a 00 or 01 they will be loaded into RAM ... and eat up a lot of the rare resource. Gruss H. -- VCF Europa 5.0 am 01./02. Mai 2004 in Muenchen http://www.vcfe.org/ From Hans.Franke at mch20.sbs.de Thu Sep 18 13:22:00 2003 From: Hans.Franke at mch20.sbs.de (Hans Franke) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Apple IIgs ROM differences In-Reply-To: <00d301c37e0f$8bb65f20$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <3F6A11E2.4982.244AF21D@localhost> > > > Besides having 1mb memory on board instead of 256k, whats the advantage > > > of the 03? > > Larger Toolbox ROM as well (required, I think, for certain higher versions > > of GS/OS). ROM 03 IIgses can also netboot over LocalTalk from an > > appropriately configured server. > So a rom1 cant netboot over localtalk? > I was under the assumption that GS/OS 6.01 used an updated toolbox from disk > rather then the rom routines. Shure, but then you have already Booted :)) > I have a 01 rom , was thinking about getting an 03 just for the extra > memory. Well, plug in a Sirius, and you get more Mem then you'll ever use. Gruss H. P.S.: Could you try to quote only the Message and not all headers etc.? -- VCF Europa 5.0 am 01./02. Mai 2004 in Muenchen http://www.vcfe.org/ From arcarlini at iee.org Thu Sep 18 13:24:00 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: DEC Server In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <003a01c37e10$de9885a0$5b01a8c0@athlon> > Also, they used RSX taskbuilder images. Guess they were > using an 68K cross-assembler setup then.... IIRC the last stage of producing a downloadable image for the various DEMSA images involved sticking a header on the front which the code referred to as RSX-style or some such. Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From eric at brouhaha.com Thu Sep 18 13:38:01 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Apple II floppy substitute In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3458.4.20.168.245.1063909821.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> > I know the Apple II series used something like 140k single sided floppies. > > What is a compatible substitute? Double Sided Double Density? I would > assume side count doesn't matter and in fact DS might be be preferable as > then I can just notch the other side and safely flip the disk. DS/DD is fine. > But what about density? I know in 3.5 disks, you can't safely interchange > DD and HD disks and expect them to work for long. But what about with > 5.25 disks? Can I use DD or even HD disks with an Apple II? Don't use HD (1.2M), they won't work reliably. Stick to DD (typically called 360K in recent years). "QD" (96 TPI DD) will also work fine. From jwstephens at msm.umr.edu Thu Sep 18 13:42:00 2003 From: jwstephens at msm.umr.edu (jim) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Basic Four mini available in AL. References: <001b01c37e0a$4355e020$6fdb3fd0@DOMAIN> Message-ID: <3F69F9E3.1D5A7E33@msm.umr.edu> I have some interest in the unit. Is it a classic Blue unit, 4' tall, etc with external 50mb drive or internal 10? or is it one of the later MAI units? I am looking for any Blue units and software that I can find. I am in Orange county, near the home of Basic 4 in Tustin (my current office is about 1 block from the original B4 campus that they moved the company into in the late 70's when they were really roaring.). BTW the current descendant of Basic 4, which is still MAI is in the Hotel computing business, since the use of their software for third party applications is mostly gone. anyone know of any application systems based on business basic that are still in basic? Jim Jim Mike wrote: > Hi all, > > Anita at Crappiefishinusa@aol.com wants to find a good home for her Basic > Four minicomputer. She is located in N. Alabama near the Georgia line and > would like to hear from anyone interested. I might be able to help anyone > going for this in terms of some software (disk packs of BOSS, Business > Basic, and some accounting crap) and documentation that I have with mine, > though her's seems to include 'stuff' too... > > ;) > - Mike: dogas@bellsouth.net > > Hello Mike, As far as I know it works, I have books and disc with it but the > person who worked with this computer is no longer around, no I would not > trash it as I know it is old and yes it is really BIG. I would like it to go > to someone who might know how to use it. Thank you for asking around. Anita > > Hi Anita, > > > Hello I have an old basic four computer can you tell me where I can sell > it, > > what it might be worth? Thank You Anita > > I have one of those too. Mine was given to me for free for simply relieving > the owner of the 'burden' because it was a big and heavy old minicomputer > and too much in his way. > > If you want to sell it, I'd suggest getting the model numbers on everything > that you can see, describing the parts and condition (software and > documentation too) as well as you can, and even posting some digital > pictures of the system and then either using http://ebay.com or > http://marketplace.vintage.org for the best financial results, but shipping > can be a real pain and expensive for these large systems though. > > As far as worth... Technically, I'd say the machine is worth saving for > historical reasons so please don't trash it if you have trouble selling it > now. Worth is pretty subjective and sporadic these days. Prices seem to be > on the low side watching eBay. So guessing anywhere from $0 to a few > hundred. High side if working. > > If you were close and I was less poor right now I'd be more interested in it > myself. There is a internet-list of classic computer enthusiasts that I > could ask for you and maybe find someone locally interested, but those folks > like there old systems cheap, but care for them deeply. > > Good luck > - Mike From mike-cc at msdsite.com Thu Sep 18 13:46:01 2003 From: mike-cc at msdsite.com (Mike Davis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: NEC Drive Problem (CP/M System) In-Reply-To: <000a01c37dff$7c96dca0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: <3F69981E.15200.A527E66@localhost> I already spoke to GigaByte and they don't have the A drive any more. They do have the FQ, which is why I asked the question. BTW, I have tracked the problem down to a sticky head actuation part. I have seen this similar situation other devices. There is a white piece that rotates to place the heads on the disk. There is also a fiber baffle of sorts that is used to quiet this operation. This part has dissolved and left a black gooey residue. Consequently, this lever sticks and doesn't normally place the head onto the floppy. I cleaned this mess and did a test and now I can read and write as it should. Odd that I could get a directory listing but not read a file. But, now I can read, write and copy files between the drives. Still can't boot from B drive though. But that might be some sort of setup issue. The disks created on that drive do boot on the other drive. So, I'm getting close. Miike On 18 Sep 2003 at 18:11, Nico de Jong wrote: > From: "Mike Davis" > To: > Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2003 5:43 PM > Subject: NEC Drive Problem (CP/M System) > > > > Ok, I have a puzzle that I need help on. I have an NEC Dual 8" Drive System. This is a > FD1165-A. I can't locate such a drive. But I have located an FD1165-FQ. I > > wonder how compatible the FQ version is with the A version. Can parts be exchanged? > > > Gigabite.com has the -A drive, according to http://www.gigabite.com/floppy.html > In my conversion systems, I use a mix of FD1165-FQ, YD-180 and shugart 860-1. The only problem is the power plug, they are all different. > > Nico From mike-cc at msdsite.com Thu Sep 18 13:59:00 2003 From: mike-cc at msdsite.com (Mike Davis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: (PHOTOS) NEC Drive Problem (CP/M System) In-Reply-To: <3F69981E.15200.A527E66@localhost> References: <000a01c37dff$7c96dca0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: <3F699B96.8823.A600AC3@localhost> I have placed some photos at the site below to show the black goo, if anyone is interested. http://www.msdsite.com/vcomp/NEC/goo.html Mike On 18 Sep 2003 at 11:33, Mike Davis wrote: > I already spoke to GigaByte and they don't have the A drive any more. They > do have the FQ, which is why I asked the question. > > BTW, I have tracked the problem down to a sticky head actuation part. I > have seen this similar situation other devices. There is a white piece that > rotates to place the heads on the disk. There is also a fiber baffle of sorts > that is used to quiet this operation. > > This part has dissolved and left a black gooey residue. Consequently, this > lever sticks and doesn't normally place the head onto the floppy. I cleaned > this mess and did a test and now I can read and write as it should. Odd that > I could get a directory listing but not read a file. But, now I can read, write > and copy files between the drives. Still can't boot from B drive though. But > that might be some sort of setup issue. The disks created on that drive do > boot on the other drive. So, I'm getting close. > > Miike > > On 18 Sep 2003 at 18:11, Nico de Jong wrote: > > > From: "Mike Davis" > > To: > > Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2003 5:43 PM > > Subject: NEC Drive Problem (CP/M System) > > > > > > > Ok, I have a puzzle that I need help on. I have an NEC Dual 8" Drive System. This is a > FD1165-A. I can't locate such a drive. But I have located an FD1165-FQ. I > > > wonder how compatible the FQ version is with the A version. Can parts be exchanged? > > > > > Gigabite.com has the -A drive, according to http://www.gigabite.com/floppy.html > > In my conversion systems, I use a mix of FD1165-FQ, YD-180 and shugart 860-1. The only problem is the power plug, they are all different. > > > > Nico From cisin at xenosoft.com Thu Sep 18 14:13:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: So what's the definition of a "mainframe" (Re: at&t mainframe) In-Reply-To: <3F69B6E8.4080900@aurora.regenstrief.org> References: <3F68EE5B.F340236B@msm.umr.edu> <3F68EF66.8050507@aurora.regenstrief.org> <20030918040401.GA38946@rhiannon.rddavis.org> <3F69B6E8.4080900@aurora.regenstrief.org> Message-ID: <20030918115512.X97454@newshell.lmi.net> On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Gunther Schadow wrote: > So, let's clarify the terminology: what's a mainframe anyway? > Webster's is particularly unhelpful: > Date: circa 1964 > : a computer with its cabinet and internal circuits; also : a large fast > computer that can handle multiple tasks concurrently > haha, so my Laptop is a mainframe :-) :-) ANY performance spec based definition is a moving target. By some old definitions, my current wristwatch (Matsucom) is a mainframe. Even any definition based on characteristics is a crapshoot. Do you want to exclude a machine because it uses a DIFFERENT technology? PRICE is more stable, but still has a few exceptions, such as gold plated jewel encrusted calculators, and usually fails to take into account Moore's law (which has brought a lot of the prices down) An unpopular set of definitions that has a few exceptions, but has help up fairly well over time: "A microcomputer is one that you can pick up and carry." "A minicoputer requires a handtruck." (casters, anyone?) "A mainframe requires a forklift and a union moving crew." (several regulars here have proven exceptions to THAT!) From zmerch at 30below.com Thu Sep 18 14:20:00 2003 From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Stumbled across this link... Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030918150807.026c07b8@mail.30below.com> The things that some people will believe... enter at your own risk, however; there is some 'adult' rated stuff on there... http://www.funny-shit.com/view.php?current_page=pictures&id=1743&download=1 BTW, it's on topic, as the computer in the picture is over 10 years old... ;^> Laterz, Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- Roger "Merch" Merchberger --- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers Recycling is good, right??? Ok, so I'll recycle an old .sig. If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead disarmament should *not* be your first career choice. From cisin at xenosoft.com Thu Sep 18 14:23:01 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Apple II floppy substitute In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030918120450.Y97454@newshell.lmi.net> On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, chris wrote: > >Apple drives are OK with single density or double density disks, and you > >can notch single-sided disks to make them double-sided. The Apple is easy > >when it comes to disks. > Oh good, that makes my life easy. I have a half dozen unopened boxes of > 5.25 DSDD floppies. Now I don't have to dig thru or sort all the used > ones. The Apple ][ wants 300 Oerstedt diskettes. The most common of those are "360K" (DSDD). The data density is so low (barely more than FM/SD, that it can tolerate some fairly poor quality diskettes, such as the ones that were being manufactured at that time. "HD"/"1.2M" diskettes are 600 Oerstedt, and will not work reliably for it. Sometimes they will APPEAR to work, but be unreadable soon after. If you use an 8" drive on a ][ (Sorrento Valley Associates controller), then you need to look for SS or DS disks based on which drive you use - SD will be adequate. IF you use a 3.5" drive on a ][, then use "720k"/"DSDD" diskettes. I'm pretty sure that the 3" drive (Ampro) for it was single sided. -- Fred Cisin cisin@xenosoft.com XenoSoft http://www.xenosoft.com PO Box 1236 (510) 558-9366 Berkeley, CA 94701-1236 From cisin at xenosoft.com Thu Sep 18 14:30:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Suggested solution regarding Jim Willing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030918121429.O97454@newshell.lmi.net> I have never met him nor done business with him, but this has become a recurring topic. If newbies to the list were to read a FAQ, then there should probably be an entry saying that when doing business with Jim Willing, one must be spectacularly patient, because although he is a good person and honest with no evil intent, due to circumstances beyond his control, or personal flakiness, he is incapable of completing transactions in a timely manner. From cisin at xenosoft.com Thu Sep 18 14:36:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Apple II floppy substitute In-Reply-To: <200309181505.IAA14170@floodgap.com> References: <200309181505.IAA14170@floodgap.com> Message-ID: <20030918122030.X97454@newshell.lmi.net> > > But what about density? I know in 3.5 disks, you can't safely interchange > > DD and HD disks and expect them to work for long. But what about with > > 5.25 disks? Can I use DD or even HD disks with an Apple II? 5.25" DD and HD diskettes are significantly LESS interchangable than DD/HD 3.5"! 3.5" DD and HD diskettes are 600 and 7xx Oerstedts respectively, and are close enough to ALMOST work reliably. 5.25" are 300 and 600, and are far enough apart to thoroughly NOT WORK RIGHT! On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Cameron Kaiser wrote: > I don't know the specs of the disk ][ drive head, but I do know that, for The original disk ][ used a Shugart SA390 drive, which has the same head as the Shugart SA400. It wants a 300 Oersted diskette. The "NEW" drives have the same media spec, but I have no idea what drive they use. > example, the Commodore 1541 and 1571 drives object to HD disks because they > lack the proper magnetic properties. They only tolerate DD. I would expect > disk ]['s to dislike HD as well. RIGHT From Hans.Franke at mch20.sbs.de Thu Sep 18 14:46:00 2003 From: Hans.Franke at mch20.sbs.de (Hans Franke) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Suggested solution regarding Jim Willing In-Reply-To: <20030918121429.O97454@newshell.lmi.net> References: Message-ID: <3F6A25A1.27394.249813E7@localhost> > I have never met him nor done business with him, but this has become a > recurring topic. > If newbies to the list were to read a FAQ, then there should probably be > an entry saying that [...] I second that ... > when doing business with Jim Willing, one must be > spectacularly patient, because although he is a good person and honest > with no evil intent, > due to circumstances beyond his control, or personal flakiness, he is > incapable of completing transactions in a timely manner. He is most definitly a great guy, and quite honest, but also not your average ant :) Gruss H. -- VCF Europa 5.0 am 01./02. Mai 2004 in Muenchen http://www.vcfe.org/ From robert_little_2000 at yahoo.com Thu Sep 18 14:49:22 2003 From: robert_little_2000 at yahoo.com (Robert Little) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Old Computer Usage In-Reply-To: <20030917001534.34291.17736.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <20030917023425.42900.qmail@web20610.mail.yahoo.com> Okay, just a quick show of hands... How many of us out there actually use the systems we have on a fairly regular basis? Personally, all of my systems are used regularly. For instance, my Toshiba T1800 has software that can only run at a useful speed on a 386, my battery of Macs are dedicated astronomy and graphics machines and I even use an Apple IIgs for planetarium programming, not counting the Tandy Model 102 that I use as my erstwhile PDA. Curious, Rob ===== Robert Little Astronomy & Space Educator Talcott Mountain Science Center Avon, CT "I have loved the stars too dearly to be fearful of the night..." Sarah Williams "The Old Astronomer to His Pupil" From chrisc at addpower.com Thu Sep 18 14:52:14 2003 From: chrisc at addpower.com (Christopher Cureau) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Needed - VT terminal Message-ID: I'm in Metairie, LA, near New Orleans. David Woyciesjes Sent by: cctech-admin@classiccmp.org 09/12/2003 11:08 AM Please respond to cctech To: cctalk@classiccmp.org cc: Subject: Re: Needed - VT terminal Christopher Cureau wrote: > > Does anyone have a spare VT220, 320 or 420 that they'd be willing to part > with? My 320 just bit the dust...very inconvenient time, too, since I was > about to install my brand new OpenVMS hobbyist... :( > > Failing that, does anyone know how I can interface another kind of terminal > to my MicroVAX 3100? It's got the MMJ connector on it...maybe if I could > send the output to a wyse 60 that I have lying around... > > Cheers, > Chris Cureau Yeah, a VT420... Where are you though? -- --- Dave Woyciesjes --- ICQ# 905818 From billdeg at degnanco.com Thu Sep 18 14:55:05 2003 From: billdeg at degnanco.com (B.Degnan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Commodore B128 with I/O issue Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030917082350.00aa2d40@mail.degnanco.net> I have a Commodore 600 series B128 (low profile version similar to the European 610) and I have been trying to diagnose a problem and fix. I do not have diagnositcs for one of these guys to check the chips automatically. When I power on the machine, it reports to be READY with BASIC version 4. I can type one line of code (for example: 10 PRINT"TEST"), but when I hit enter, the cursor disappears and no more screen IO can be generated. In other words, the cursor does not jump down to the next line so that I may proceed with another line of code, it just disappears. If I reset the computer and type "LOAD" at the prompt and then hit enter, I am not asked to start the tape drive. There is also a return key associated with the numeric keypad but this does not generate different results than the Enter key. I am guessing that I need to replace a chip or two someplace. I would like to know if any of you have an opinion/suggestions. I have found one interesting web page, http://www.funet.fi/pub/cbm/firmware/computers/b/ that links to schematics, etc. I am curious if anyone has had a similar experience with any Commodore of this era. I am sure the cause of the problem is not unique to the 600 series. Once I have a better idea what the problem is, I can start replacing the appropriate chips. If I can find any (!) Thanks Bill Wilmington, Delaware From meltie at meltie.com Thu Sep 18 14:57:55 2003 From: meltie at meltie.com (Alex White) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: DEC MicroVAX-II/BA123 Q In-Reply-To: <3F64DA7E.4010607@nktelco.net> References: <3F64DA7E.4010607@nktelco.net> Message-ID: <200309171635.04643.meltie@meltie.com> Hi guys Does anyone know what the two small switches and two large red LEDs on the BACK of the ba123's CPU control panel are for? I'd look at the MV-II/BA123 Tech Man but I can't seem to get to the DFWCUG to get them... alex/melt -- Dance like no-one's watching, sing like no-one can hear you, love like you've never been hurt, wash like everyone has a nose, eat like cholesterol is a myth. From mowerman at erols.com Thu Sep 18 15:00:49 2003 From: mowerman at erols.com (Kev) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Fluke 9010A or 9100 equipment Message-ID: <00fd01c37d5a$bce29380$0401a8c0@calvin> Can anyone help me find Fluke 9010A or 9100 equipment, manuals, software, etc? Thanks, Kev mowerman@erols.com From spc at conman.org Thu Sep 18 15:20:01 2003 From: spc at conman.org (Sean 'Captain Napalm' Conner) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: So what's the definition of a "mainframe" (Re: at&t In-Reply-To: <20030918115512.X97454@newshell.lmi.net> from "Fred Cisin" at Sep 18, 2003 12:02:57 PM Message-ID: <20030918195909.3E4F8140DF06@swift.conman.org> It was thus said that the Great Fred Cisin once stated: > > ANY performance spec based definition is a moving target. > By some old definitions, my current wristwatch (Matsucom) is a mainframe. > Even any definition based on characteristics is a crapshoot. Do you want > to exclude a machine because it uses a DIFFERENT technology? > > PRICE is more stable, but still has a few exceptions, such as > gold plated jewel encrusted calculators, and usually fails to take into > account Moore's law (which has brought a lot of the prices down) > > An unpopular set of definitions that has a few exceptions, but has help up > fairly well over time: > "A microcomputer is one that you can pick up and carry." > "A minicoputer requires a handtruck." (casters, anyone?) > "A mainframe requires a forklift and a union moving crew." (several > regulars here have proven exceptions to THAT!) How about: Supercomputer: A specialized computer dedicated to running very heavy mathematical simulations as fast as possible. Such machines are typically standalone, or standalone with another computer as a frontend. Such machines are compute bound and are generally only affordable to governments, large corporations or universities. Mainframe: A specialized computer for handling administrative or business tasks. While not as fast as other computers, it does handle a large volume of IO transactions per second, retrieving, sorting, storing and otherwise manipulating data. Such machines are IO bound (typically) and are generally affordable for governments, most mid to large sized companies and universities. Seems to cover what supercomputers and mainframes are pretty well, and in a technology-independent way. -spc (Anyone?) From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 18 15:54:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Stumbled across this link... In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030918150807.026c07b8@mail.30below.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Roger Merchberger wrote: > The things that some people will believe... enter at your own risk, > however; there is some 'adult' rated stuff on there... > > http://www.funny-shit.com/view.php?current_page=pictures&id=1743&download=1 > > BTW, it's on topic, as the computer in the picture is over 10 years old... ;^> Well, look at the source: The Weekly World News has never been known to be a paragon of journalistic integrity. It's what you read while waiting in line at the grocery store when you want a quick chuckle. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 18 15:57:23 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Suggested solution regarding Jim Willing In-Reply-To: <20030918121429.O97454@newshell.lmi.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Fred Cisin wrote: > If newbies to the list were to read a FAQ, then there should probably be > an entry saying that when doing business with Jim Willing, one must be > spectacularly patient, because although he is a good person and honest > with no evil intent, due to circumstances beyond his control, or > personal flakiness, he is incapable of completing transactions in a > timely manner. It's no so much that. I believe it is an endemic issue that has gotten progressively worse and that now he may well be in a hole that he won't be able to get out of. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From cb at mythtech.net Thu Sep 18 17:00:01 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: My IIgs machines Message-ID: Just to ease everyones minds. My IIgs computers are safe. There was a tremendous response on these when I said I would be throwing any away that weren't claimed. I had no idea they were such a popular computer. As a result, I have reprioritized them to a higher level, and they will survive the great cleanout. Any that are not claimed will not be thrown out, but will be made available to others at a future date. It will take me a while before I have some free time to deal with shipping them, but I will find a corner to tuck them into until that time. I just figured I would let everyone know since I got so many emails about them. -chris From lemay at mail.cs.umn.edu Thu Sep 18 17:03:35 2003 From: lemay at mail.cs.umn.edu (Lawrence LeMay) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Old Computer Usage In-Reply-To: <20030917023425.42900.qmail@web20610.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200309182139.QAA01175@caesar.cs.umn.edu> Well, I use a genuine IBM Pentium 75 system to hold up my monitor. And I regularly use a Mac IIci, as a step stool to replace light bulbs in the kitchen and entryway... -Lawrence LeMay > Okay, just a quick show of hands... > How many of us out there actually use the systems we > have on a fairly regular basis? Personally, all of my > systems are used regularly. For instance, my Toshiba > T1800 has software that can only run at a useful speed > on a 386, my battery of Macs are dedicated astronomy > and graphics machines and I even use an Apple IIgs for > planetarium programming, not counting the Tandy Model > 102 that I use as my erstwhile PDA. > Curious, > > Robert Little From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Thu Sep 18 17:33:00 2003 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: More new toys! Message-ID: <2af512344c.philpem@dsl.pipex.com> Hi all, Just for those who are interested, I've recently had my first really good find. Two Acorn A4 laptops, in good working order, complete with three batteries, two power supply modules and a set of manuals (Acorn A4 Welcome Guide, RISC OS 3 manual and Acorn A4 Pocket Reference). One machine seems to suffer from the infamous "slow-down-and-crash" problem. Strangely enough, moving the machine up and down a bit seems to get rid of the problem. Go figure. All three nicad packs are fried and need rebuilding and aside from a bit of cosmetic damage (and a bit of stubborn dirt) both machines are in nearly-new condition. All in, I ended up spending ?80 (including shipping) on the full set. ANC managed to misdeliver them, though - how the heck they managed to deliver my parcel to the wrong person and the wrong _street_ I may never know. For those who are interested, the A4 is (or rather was) one of Acorn's RISC computers. It was the first (and last) laptop Acorn designed, unless you count the "Stork" prototype. The A4 is fitted with 4MB of RAM as standard, runs Acorn RISC OS 3.1 on an ARM CPU (ARM3 IIRC), 60MB 2.5" IDE hard disc, 3.5" 1.6MB high-density floppy drive and a cute little 16-greyscale backlit LCD display. In essence, it's an Acorn A5000 in a laptop case with a battery charger and battery management circuit fitted. A "5th Column" ROM contains a rudimentary battery meter applet that sits in the icon bar. There's also a small LCD battery meter next to the power button on the front of the A4. Both machines are a fairly nice grey colour, the casing appears to be rubberised metal (probably stronger than ABS plastic). None of these machines are for sale, nor is it likely that I ever will sell them - I've been looking for an Acorn A4 for over three years and I don't intend to let these two leave my sight :-) Anyway, I think I've said enough for tonight. We now return you to your regularly scheduled classiccmp-ing and all that :-) Later. -- Phil. | Acorn Risc PC600 Mk3, SA202, 64MB, 6GB, philpem@dsl.pipex.com | ViewFinder, Ethernet (Acorn AEH62), http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ | 8xCD, framegrabber, Teletext ... Acme Corp: Unlimited credit for disadvantaged coyotes. From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Sep 18 17:50:00 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Replacing VT flybacks (was: Re: Needed - VT terminal) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Sep 17, 3 11:15:45 pm Message-ID: > Is there a commonly available flyback that will work in the VT340? I've > been unable to locate a service manual for that model terminal, and don't > really know much about the flyback that it uses. Mine let out its magic > smoke some time back, and I'm really starting to miss that color VT. I was under the impression that the colour monitors on VT terminals were not DEC designs (the VR241 is _certainly_ a Hitachi chassis!). In which case you might find a 'standard' flyback is available. Does the monitor chassis have any clues as to its origins? -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Sep 18 17:53:05 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: Old Computer Usage In-Reply-To: <20030917023425.42900.qmail@web20610.mail.yahoo.com> from "Robert Little" at Sep 16, 3 07:34:25 pm Message-ID: > Okay, just a quick show of hands... > How many of us out there actually use the systems we > have on a fairly regular basis? Personally, all of my I don't even own a 'modern' computer, so all my work is done on classics (this is being typed on a much-hacked IBM PC/AT, still with the original motherboard, albeit modified with extra chips and kludge-wires)... -tony From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 18 18:07:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:39:59 2005 Subject: More new toys! In-Reply-To: <2af512344c.philpem@dsl.pipex.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Philip Pemberton wrote: > Guide, RISC OS 3 manual and Acorn A4 Pocket Reference). One machine seems to > suffer from the infamous "slow-down-and-crash" problem. Strangely enough, > moving the machine up and down a bit seems to get rid of the problem. Go > figure. What's happening here is that the little gnome inside the computer that powers the CPU by running on a treadmill has gotten tired (and in some cases falls asleep, causing the crash!) By jogging the machine what you are actually doing is waking up the gnome and getting him back to work. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 18 18:10:22 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans Message-ID: I'm being totally bombarded by those damn trojan horse e-mails purporting to be from Microsoft security, each averaging 150K. Is anyone else experiencing this? I must've received over 150 today so far (starting this morning). Is there any quick filter I can add to sendmail to thwart their delivery? This is becoming highly annoying. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From spectre at floodgap.com Thu Sep 18 18:40:01 2003 From: spectre at floodgap.com (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: from Vintage Computer Festival at "Sep 18, 3 03:59:28 pm" Message-ID: <200309182337.QAA14416@floodgap.com> > I'm being totally bombarded by those damn trojan horse e-mails purporting > to be from Microsoft security, each averaging 150K. > > Is anyone else experiencing this? I must've received over 150 today so > far (starting this morning). > > Is there any quick filter I can add to sendmail to thwart their delivery? > This is becoming highly annoying. I'm getting smashed with them myself. It seems to be variants on W32.Swen.A@mm and cogeners. Added a quick filter rule to my secretary bot to bounce away mail with application/x-msdownload attachments. -- ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com -- Jesus at a disco: "Help! I've risen and I can't get down!" ----------------- From healyzh at aracnet.com Thu Sep 18 18:43:08 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: More new toys! In-Reply-To: <2af512344c.philpem@dsl.pipex.com> from "Philip Pemberton" at Sep 18, 2003 11:08:41 PM Message-ID: <200309182329.h8INTLeP030891@onyx.spiritone.com> > Just for those who are interested, I've recently had my first really good > find. Two Acorn A4 laptops, in good working order, complete with three > batteries, two power supply modules and a set of manuals (Acorn A4 Welcome > Guide, RISC OS 3 manual and Acorn A4 Pocket Reference). One machine seems to > suffer from the infamous "slow-down-and-crash" problem. Strangely enough, > moving the machine up and down a bit seems to get rid of the problem. Go > figure. OK, even with me looking to get rid of most of my collection, I'm incredibly GREEN with ENVY! I'd be happy just to be able to get my hands on a nice RISC OS machine, a Laptop would be *really* cool! I've been wanting to play with RISC OS for years, but you just don't see the systems in the US. Zane From arcarlini at iee.org Thu Sep 18 18:53:30 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: DEC MicroVAX-II/BA123 Q In-Reply-To: <200309171635.04643.meltie@meltie.com> Message-ID: <005101c37e21$221b9780$5b01a8c0@athlon> > Does anyone know what the two small switches and two large > red LEDs on the > BACK of the ba123's CPU control panel are for? Where is this panel? The CPU patch panel has a switch to control halts enabled/disabled, a 3-position rotary switch with an arrow, a face and a T in a circle and a rotary switch to control the baud rate. There's a 7-segment LED too. The back of that panel does not have any LEDs that I know of. Try describing exactly where this is in relation to the rest of the box and what bits are on it that you do know and where it connects. > I'd look at the MV-II/BA123 Tech Man but I can't seem to get > to the DFWCUG to > get them... That's why you pick them up first time you see them and then keep them handy! Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From kth at srv.net Thu Sep 18 18:57:00 2003 From: kth at srv.net (Kevin Handy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: DEC MicroVAX-II/BA123 Q In-Reply-To: <200309171635.04643.meltie@meltie.com> References: <3F64DA7E.4010607@nktelco.net> <200309171635.04643.meltie@meltie.com> Message-ID: <3F6A4E60.20109@srv.net> Alex White wrote: >Hi guys > >Does anyone know what the two small switches and two large red LEDs on the >BACK of the ba123's CPU control panel are for? > >I'd look at the MV-II/BA123 Tech Man but I can't seem to get to the DFWCUG to >get them... > >alex/melt > > This is from memory, so may be wrong... Are you talking about the paddle switch with funny symbols next to it? It tells if it should continuously cycle through the tests. Or are you talking about the rotery switches? One decides if it should do a conversational boot (where you must answer assorted questions), or to just boot up. Other one controlls the baud rate of the console terminal. I think there were some versions that used a 3-position paddle switch instead of the rotary dial for the conversational boot option. Are the led's you are talking about the 7 segment displays? Those are used to tell you where the system is in the boot process on a VAX. Should count down from FF to 00 during boot (same info as displayed on the console terminal). From doug at blinkenlights.com Thu Sep 18 18:59:50 2003 From: doug at blinkenlights.com (Doug Salot) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: Suggested solution regarding Jim Willing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > This is just a suggestion. No one is obligated to adhere to it. Anyone > is free to take their own independent course of action. I'm all for your suggestion, but it kind of requires Jim's cooperation. Have you talked to him about it? What pisses me off is that he didn't bother to communicate status. If I were in the apparently sad situation Jim is in, I certainly wouldn't want to piss off the one community that had supported him in the past. I would have been much more willing to write it off as a loss if he had merely let me know personally that he couldn't ship anytime soon (or ever) and that he was using my money for a good cause (like rent). I believe that Jim's intentions were probably good and that he's just become incredibly irresponsible as well as in deep financial shit, but just in case he really decided to turn to a life of crime, let me ask this... Did anybody else "buy" the Sol-20 he had listed for sale? -- Doug From spectre at floodgap.com Thu Sep 18 19:02:50 2003 From: spectre at floodgap.com (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: My IIgs machines In-Reply-To: from chris at "Sep 18, 3 05:39:04 pm" Message-ID: <200309182226.PAA15532@floodgap.com> > My IIgs computers are safe. There was a tremendous response on these when > I said I would be throwing any away that weren't claimed. I had no idea > they were such a popular computer. Myself, I like them a lot. Other than the Super NES and the CMD SuperCPU for the C64, they're the only widespread implementation of the 65816. Plus, it's a darn fine computer with good compatibility with its older brethren but nice graphics and sound as well, something you don't see on the Atari ST or the Amiga. Just wish the clock speed were better. Freaking Apple. -- ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com -- I am the mother of all things, and all things must wear a sweater. --------- From spectre at floodgap.com Thu Sep 18 19:05:42 2003 From: spectre at floodgap.com (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: Old Computer Usage In-Reply-To: <200309182139.QAA01175@caesar.cs.umn.edu> from Lawrence LeMay at "Sep 18, 3 04:39:25 pm" Message-ID: <200309182231.PAA15386@floodgap.com> > Okay, just a quick show of hands... > How many of us out there actually use the systems we > have on a fairly regular basis? Personally, all of my > systems are used regularly. For instance, my Toshiba > T1800 has software that can only run at a useful speed > on a 386, my battery of Macs are dedicated astronomy > and graphics machines and I even use an Apple IIgs for > planetarium programming, not counting the Tandy Model > 102 that I use as my erstwhile PDA. I use my Commodore 128 all the time, and a IIci runs the apartment DNS, portions of the AppleShare network, and emergency power notify services. There's another in the bedroom I use as a backup workstation. -- ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com -- CONJUGATION OF THE HULKING ENTOMOLOGIST: I big / I bag / I have bug -------- From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Sep 18 19:08:37 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: Commodore B128 with I/O issue In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030917082350.00aa2d40@mail.degnanco.net> from "B.Degnan" at Sep 17, 3 08:57:17 am Message-ID: > I have a Commodore 600 series B128 (low profile version similar to the > European 610) and I have been trying to diagnose a problem and fix. I do > not have diagnositcs for one of these guys to check the chips > automatically. When I power on the machine, it reports to be READY with > BASIC version 4. I can type one line of code (for example: 10 > PRINT"TEST"), but when I hit enter, the cursor disappears and no more > screen IO can be generated. In other words, the cursor does not jump down I had a C128 that behaved strangely -- generated random error mesasges, moving the cursor around did very odd things,etc. It turned out to be a bad DRAM chip in the first half of the memory map. I know it's not exactly the same fault, but it could be related, and at least the RAMs are easy to get... -tony From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Sep 18 19:11:40 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: Apple II floppy substitute In-Reply-To: from "chris" at Sep 18, 3 09:37:32 am Message-ID: > I know the Apple II series used something like 140k single sided floppies. > > What is a compatible substitute? Double Sided Double Density? I would > assume side count doesn't matter and in fact DS might be be preferable as > then I can just notch the other side and safely flip the disk. > > But what about density? I know in 3.5 disks, you can't safely interchange > DD and HD disks and expect them to work for long. But what about with > 5.25 disks? Can I use DD or even HD disks with an Apple II? You can use DD disks (you can always use DD in place of SD on any machine -- the media is the same spec, just better). You can't use HD disks -- the media has a higher coercivity and can't be written to properly. -tony From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Thu Sep 18 19:15:01 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: Old Computer Usage Message-ID: <030918193956.e04a@splab.cas.neu.edu> We run a speech perception lab at Northeastern University with a microvax II with custom software from haskins labs/yale and also two 11/23 systems again with custom software. I am finally pulling the plug on the 11/23 systems, but the microvaxes still run. on the pc side, my eprom programmer runs on a 386, and some of my home control stuff runs on a 486. Joe Heck From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Thu Sep 18 19:17:51 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: DEC MicroVAX-II/BA123 Q Message-ID: <030918195050.e051@splab.cas.neu.edu> I was reading out of the operation guides for the MVII when I responded. joe heck From allain at panix.com Thu Sep 18 19:20:43 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: Suggested solution regarding Jim Willing References: Message-ID: <001701c37e3f$67fed820$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Time for someone to thank Sellam for his great suggestion. ** Thank-You ** John A. From patrick at evocative.com Thu Sep 18 19:23:33 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Is there any quick filter I can add to sendmail to thwart their delivery? > This is becoming highly annoying. Sellam, we use MimeDefang, which strips potentially harmful attachments. We turn ours up a notch and just have it bounce emails with PIF, SCR, VBS, and other attachments that pretty much only get emailed by viruses. We also use SpamAssassin. Another cool thing I've seen lately is KnowSpam. http://knowspam.net/ --Patrick From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Sep 18 19:26:24 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: So what's the definition of a "mainframe" (Re: at&t In-Reply-To: <20030918115512.X97454@newshell.lmi.net> from "Fred Cisin" at Sep 18, 3 12:02:57 pm Message-ID: > An unpopular set of definitions that has a few exceptions, but has help up > fairly well over time: > "A microcomputer is one that you can pick up and carry." > "A minicoputer requires a handtruck." (casters, anyone?) > "A mainframe requires a forklift and a union moving crew." (several > regulars here have proven exceptions to THAT!) Also : If you lost a screwdriver inside it, it's a micro If you lost a 'scope inside it, it's a mini If you lost yourself inside it, it's a mainframe :-) -tony From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Thu Sep 18 19:29:36 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: DEC MicroVAX-II/BA123 Q Message-ID: <030918194606.e04a@splab.cas.neu.edu> lower left is console terminal connector, db9, to the right is two digit display for power-on self test progress, upper left is rotary switch for baud rate, middle rotary switch is power up mode switch, 3 position, run mode (arrow), language inquire (human profile) asks for which language you want, loopback test mode is third mode (with t in the middle) i think last switch is halt enable/disable, that allows halt button front or break key on terminal to halt system joe heck From teoz at neo.rr.com Thu Sep 18 19:33:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans References: <200309182337.QAA14416@floodgap.com> Message-ID: <00a301c37e43$c0aa4a00$657ca418@neo.rr.com> I got nailed with about 50 so far today, sucks. One type is a fake MS internet security update patch, other type is a fake undeliverable mail with attachment. TZ From teoz at neo.rr.com Thu Sep 18 19:37:01 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: Old Computer Usage References: <030918193956.e04a@splab.cas.neu.edu> Message-ID: <010e01c37e44$f02f1840$657ca418@neo.rr.com> I use my amiga 500 and 1200 maybe a few times a week for games, atari 1040 st once every 2 weeks, the IIgs alot lately since its my current project setting up the scsi card, tandy 1000 HX not much after I verified it worked (monitor is DOA), C64/128 not much since I dont have the space to set it up at the moment (they got used alot earlier in the year), old 386 game rig a few times a month when I play older dos games. Everything gets used except the Timex 2068 because I forgot where I stored it. The other systems are setup with their own monitors and are ready to run with the flick of a surge strip. I also fire up the old 68k macs (IIfx, 840av, 950aws) when I need to make IIgs disks, setup some new hardware, capture video, or just mess around with the old boxed apps I have collected. I dont see the point of getting older systems if you dont use them on ocassion, I have enough stuff that collects dust dont need more. TZ From esharpe at uswest.net Thu Sep 18 19:48:00 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: collection organising References: <20030915145935.86603.qmail@web21104.mail.yahoo.com> <5.1.0.14.0.20030917014042.00a1a320@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: <005d01c37e4e$e324e260$37818eac@aoldsl.net> beware of how certain types of plastic react with the case of computers... I have seen things stored in hot areas and the plastic on the cords sortta reacts and eats a grove in the plastic computer case..... Thanks! Ed Sharpe Archivist for SMECC See the Southwest Museum of Engineering, Communications and Computation online at: http://www.smecc.org ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Ford" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 1:51 AM Subject: Re: collection organising > One big problem with organizing your collection is that it is too easy to > tell when you have way too many of some item and should really stop getting > more. For example when everything is scattered around the house, garage, > and storage, one can never have too many Apple logo power cords, but once > you start putting them in a box and it fills up the fun kind of goes out of > it. Also with a tidy collection you never get the thrill of finding some > item again while moving stuff around. > > OTOH if the working portion, not just the functional stuff, but the stuff > you need to play with your toys, isn't where you can find it, playtime is > reduced, plus a lot of wandering around to find stuff and you look senile. > > Two tips > Forget rubber bands, they don't last the sort of time we tend to let things > sit on the shelf, plus twist ties are generally free excepting the labor of > plucking them apart. > > Clear storage, bins or ziplock bags, and you can be lazy and never label > anything. From teoz at neo.rr.com Thu Sep 18 19:52:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: My IIgs machines References: <200309182226.PAA15532@floodgap.com> Message-ID: <013d01c37e47$34d41d40$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cameron Kaiser" > > My IIgs computers are safe. There was a tremendous response on these when > > I said I would be throwing any away that weren't claimed. I had no idea > > they were such a popular computer. > > Myself, I like them a lot. Other than the Super NES and the CMD SuperCPU > for the C64, they're the only widespread implementation of the 65816. > > Plus, it's a darn fine computer with good compatibility with its older > brethren but nice graphics and sound as well, something you don't see on > the Atari ST or the Amiga. > > Just wish the clock speed were better. Freaking Apple. While being compatible with the older generation might be desirable you also have to keep the old baggage that went along with the earlier design even if its out of date (x86 architecture we have now isnt optimal because of compatibility). I like my IIgs but dont have no desire for the older apple II. Besides I think the Amiga was miles ahead of the C64 and the ST was a decent jump ahead of the 800xl. TZ From eric at brouhaha.com Thu Sep 18 20:06:00 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: collection organising In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030917014042.00a1a320@pop-server.socal.rr.com> References: <20030915145935.86603.qmail@web21104.mail.yahoo.com> <5.1.0.14.0.20030917014042.00a1a320@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: <4295.4.20.168.178.1063933102.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> > Clear storage, bins or ziplock bags, and you can be lazy and never label > anything. Doesn't scale. I use Contico 12-gallon storage bins that are, if not clear, at least reasonably translucent. But I have hundreds of them, so even though I can see into them, I still can't find anything. From doug at blinkenlights.com Thu Sep 18 20:32:00 2003 From: doug at blinkenlights.com (Doug Salot) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: collection organising In-Reply-To: <4295.4.20.168.178.1063933102.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Eric Smith wrote: > I use Contico 12-gallon storage bins that are, if not clear, at least > reasonably translucent. But I have hundreds of them, so even though I > can see into them, I still can't find anything. I want my RFID. Anybody played with this stuff? http://www.ti.com/tiris/docs/products/products.shtml -- Doug From thompson at new.rr.com Thu Sep 18 20:50:00 2003 From: thompson at new.rr.com (Paul Thompson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: Old Computer Usage In-Reply-To: <200309182139.QAA01175@caesar.cs.umn.edu> Message-ID: In that case; I have a DECserver 300 as a shelf for a UPS for a Xylogics terminal server at work. :-) My VAXstation 3100 M76 monitors the termperature of a hot tub in winter and other misc odds and ends. Although not graphing now, see http://home.new.rr.com/pt3 On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Lawrence LeMay wrote: > Well, I use a genuine IBM Pentium 75 system to hold up my monitor. And I > regularly use a Mac IIci, as a step stool to replace light bulbs in the > kitchen and entryway... > > -Lawrence LeMay From jcwren at jcwren.com Thu Sep 18 21:22:00 2003 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: Old Computer Usage In-Reply-To: <030918193956.e04a@splab.cas.neu.edu> References: <030918193956.e04a@splab.cas.neu.edu> Message-ID: <200309182214.13097.jcwren@jcwren.com> And what will happen to this poor little 11/23? Does it need a home? --John On Thursday 18 September 2003 19:39 pm, TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu wrote: > We run a speech perception lab at Northeastern University with > a microvax II with custom software from haskins labs/yale and also two > 11/23 systems again with custom software. I am finally pulling the > plug on the 11/23 systems, but the microvaxes still run. > > on the pc side, my eprom programmer runs on a 386, and some of my home > control stuff runs on a 486. > > Joe Heck From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 18 21:27:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: <200309182337.QAA14416@floodgap.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Cameron Kaiser wrote: > I'm getting smashed with them myself. It seems to be variants on > W32.Swen.A@mm and cogeners. Ok, good (er, bad). I'm glad it's not just me. > Added a quick filter rule to my secretary bot to bounce away mail with > application/x-msdownload attachments. I wish PINE were so adaptable. I had to filter on the sender name but at least I'll block 99% of them. Fuck, when are they going to come out with email2? -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 18 21:32:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: Suggested solution regarding Jim Willing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Doug Salot wrote: > I'm all for your suggestion, but it kind of requires Jim's cooperation. > Have you talked to him about it? Not yet. As with everyone else, I've been having trouble raising him. But considering the alternatives, I don't think he has any choice in the matter, or really any say at all. > What pisses me off is that he didn't bother to communicate status. If I > were in the apparently sad situation Jim is in, I certainly wouldn't want > to piss off the one community that had supported him in the past. I would > have been much more willing to write it off as a loss if he had merely let > me know personally that he couldn't ship anytime soon (or ever) and that > he was using my money for a good cause (like rent). Yeah, me too. It's too bad he chose this route. Most everyone has been in this situation before. You just have to communicate. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 18 21:36:18 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: My IIgs machines In-Reply-To: <200309182226.PAA15532@floodgap.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Cameron Kaiser wrote: > Just wish the clock speed were better. Freaking Apple. I remember a lot of people doing homebrew mods back in the late 1980s to boost the clock speed by soldering in a new crystal to overclock it. You had to be careful because if you didn't cool it properly you'd burn out the CPU (and possibly other components). -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From tothwolf at concentric.net Thu Sep 18 23:00:01 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: collection organising In-Reply-To: <4295.4.20.168.178.1063933102.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> References: <20030915145935.86603.qmail@web21104.mail.yahoo.com> <5.1.0.14.0.20030917014042.00a1a320@pop-server.socal.rr.com> <4295.4.20.168.178.1063933102.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Eric Smith wrote: > > Clear storage, bins or ziplock bags, and you can be lazy and never > > label anything. > > Doesn't scale. I use Contico 12-gallon storage bins that are, if not > clear, at least reasonably translucent. But I have hundreds of them, so > even though I can see into them, I still can't find anything. Maybe assign each bin a barcode and have a lookup database that lists what each bin contains? :) Thats one of my goals anyway... -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Thu Sep 18 23:10:00 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: collection organising In-Reply-To: <005d01c37e4e$e324e260$37818eac@aoldsl.net> References: <20030915145935.86603.qmail@web21104.mail.yahoo.com> <5.1.0.14.0.20030917014042.00a1a320@pop-server.socal.rr.com> <005d01c37e4e$e324e260$37818eac@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Ed Sharpe wrote: > From: "Mike Ford" > > > Two tips Forget rubber bands, they don't last the sort of time we tend > > to let things sit on the shelf, plus twist ties are generally free > > excepting the labor of plucking them apart. > > > > Clear storage, bins or ziplock bags, and you can be lazy and never > > label anything. > > beware of how certain types of plastic react with the case of > computers... I have seen things stored in hot areas and the plastic on > the cords sortta reacts and eats a grove in the plastic computer > case..... Rubber bands and just about any type of tape should never be used to bundle cords. Twist-ties, zip-ties, and even string are much better alternatives. Beware of cheap dyed paper type twist-ties though, as they can stain PVC jacketed cables. PVC jacketed cables will react with both styrene and ABS. Many computer cases are made of an ABS blend, and of course the bulk of the form fitting packing materials used for computers is made of styrene. This is why manufacturers put all the cables in poly bags before boxing and shipping. In some cases, certain ABS blends can also react with styrene, which is why you also see many devices bagged before being packed. Higher temperatures speed up the reaction of PVC with styrene and ABS. For those of us with large cable collections, a supply of poly bags on spools and a heat sealer tend to be a good investment... -Toth From donm at cts.com Thu Sep 18 23:26:00 2003 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: Suggested solution regarding Jim Willing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Doug Salot wrote: > On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > > This is just a suggestion. No one is obligated to adhere to it. Anyone > > is free to take their own independent course of action. > > I'm all for your suggestion, but it kind of requires Jim's cooperation. > Have you talked to him about it? > > What pisses me off is that he didn't bother to communicate status. If I > were in the apparently sad situation Jim is in, I certainly wouldn't want > to piss off the one community that had supported him in the past. I would > have been much more willing to write it off as a loss if he had merely let > me know personally that he couldn't ship anytime soon (or ever) and that > he was using my money for a good cause (like rent). My recollection is that he did, in fact, put out email that seemed to rather fully explain the debacle in which he was caught up. It was to the list, however, and not to individuals as far as I know. Does my memory fail me? - don > I believe that Jim's intentions were probably good and that he's just > become incredibly irresponsible as well as in deep financial shit, but > just in case he really decided to turn to a life of crime, let me ask > this... > > Did anybody else "buy" the Sol-20 he had listed for sale? > > -- Doug From wmsmith at earthlink.net Thu Sep 18 23:50:00 2003 From: wmsmith at earthlink.net (Wayne M. Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: Suggested solution regarding Jim Willing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <001401c37e68$6fab6d30$2cb2d642@WaynePC> > My recollection is that he did, in fact, put out email that > seemed to rather fully explain the debacle in which he was > caught up. It was to the list, however, and not to > individuals as far as I know. > > Does my memory fail me? > > - don > Your memory's fine - it's reproduced below: Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 2003 9:40 AM To: classiccmp@classiccmp.org Cc: James Willing Subject: Updates in general... Before everyone thinks I've fallen off the edge of the world (tempting tho it is some days) a brief status. I'm behind on everything (short and to the point). I ended up having to move on a house deal a few weeks ago unexpectedly. It was that, or lose the house and probably be unable to reopen the bowling center for a month or more. And seeing as that is my major source of income... But doing this took all the money I had on hand. So I'm in day to day scrounge mode until the end of this week when I finally reopen. Then I can start catching up on shipping, updates, etc... In general, the 'Garage' sale is on hold until I get shipping caught up. Kinda like cutting off the leg to spite the face, but... Hell, by the end of the year I may even have a life again... Of course then there are added little amusements like the 'rocket scientists' at Register.Com who are unable to process a domain renewal in less than "6 to 8 weeks" (their words) unless paid thru the blessed 'credit card'. So the web site and email for the center have been killed... Even a USPS Money Order does not count for anything anymore! Is it just me, or does it seem that the more 'hi-tech' that things become, the stupider the people behind them seem to get??? Surviving... (barely) -jim From geoffrob at stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au Fri Sep 19 00:02:00 2003 From: geoffrob at stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au (Geoff Roberts) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: Old Computer Usage References: <20030917023425.42900.qmail@web20610.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <03c201c37e6a$019745b0$4000a8c0@helpdesk> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Little" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 12:04 PM Subject: Old Computer Usage > Okay, just a quick show of hands... > How many of us out there actually use the systems we > have on a fairly regular basis? Well, me. > Personally, all of my > systems are used regularly. For instance, my Toshiba > T1800 has software that can only run at a useful speed > on a 386, I have a T1200 that gets some work from time to time. It runs a dos version of an Enigma simulator. > my battery of Macs are dedicated astronomy > and graphics machines Hmm, have some early macs, what s/w have you got for them. > and I even use an Apple IIgs for > planetarium programming, not counting the Tandy Model > 102 that I use as my erstwhile PDA. I also work with a Vax 6000. (circa 1990) Cheers Geoff in Oz From mikeford at socal.rr.com Fri Sep 19 01:11:00 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: specifications for IBM XT-286 In-Reply-To: <200309171617.h8HGHpQ31215@mailgate5.cinetic.de> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030918170930.00a204c0@pop-server.socal.rr.com> >A Seagate drive should be ok. 1.2 Meg 5.25 inch drives are easy to find. >Thanks to you, too. Smaller drives don't seem to have enough value to be marketable anymore. The scrap place I was at the other day was sorting drives, all tested bad from some rma type place, and anything smaller than 3 GB was going in a gaylord (heavy corrigated paper box that just fits on a pallet). It was almost completely filled by the end of the day, and that is one heck of a lot of drives, a rough guess is about 4,000, so it must have weighed more than a ton. From teoz at neo.rr.com Fri Sep 19 01:39:01 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: specifications for IBM XT-286 References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030918170930.00a204c0@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: <000801c37e77$9ae039e0$657ca418@neo.rr.com> > Smaller drives don't seem to have enough value to be marketable anymore. > The scrap place I was at the other day was sorting drives, all tested bad > from some rma type place, and anything smaller than 3 GB was going in a > gaylord (heavy corrigated paper box that just fits on a pallet). It was > almost completely filled by the end of the day, and that is one heck of a > lot of drives, a rough guess is about 4,000, so it must have weighed more > than a ton. You can find 5.25 FH scsi 47GB Seagate for $19.99 here NEW http://www.surpluscomputers.com/h_hd_ST446442W.html So the smaller drives must have no value at all except for collectors who want a stock drive in their machine. From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Fri Sep 19 01:51:00 2003 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: More new toys! In-Reply-To: <200309182329.h8INTLeP030891@onyx.spiritone.com> References: <200309182329.h8INTLeP030891@onyx.spiritone.com> Message-ID: <9b0242344c.philpem@dsl.pipex.com> In message <200309182329.h8INTLeP030891@onyx.spiritone.com> "Zane H. Healy" wrote: > OK, even with me looking to get rid of most of my collection, I'm incredibly > GREEN with ENVY! Heh. Incidentally, Acorn's logo is/was green (well, the "Acorn" text was black, but the actual acorn "nut" was green). They are incredibly nice machines - I'm using an Acorn StrongARM RiscPC to type this message. Aside from the occasional bit of lag, the SARPC "feels" as fast as a Pentium-233. > I'd be happy just to be able to get my hands on a nice RISC OS machine, I might be able to get you an A3010 or an A3020 ("all in one" machines, the "keyboard" contains all the circuitry). They cost around ?20 over here, but shipping would be a bit expensive. I'd be tempted to put some ESD-proof bubblewrap inside the casing (to stop it getting smashed), put the case cover back on, then put a few layers of normal bubblewrap on the keyboard and cover the whole lot in a few more layers of... You guessed it, bubble wrap. Drop the box on the floor. If the machine survived, send it on its merry way. > a Laptop would be *really* cool! I've been wanting to play > with RISC OS for years, but you just don't see the systems in the US. If you want a RISC OS system, you could try asking in the comp.sys.acorn.hardware newsgroup - there are a few RISC OS users in the USA, one of them might have a spare machine for sale. Failing that, there's always Ebay. IMHO, an ARM610 RiscPC is about the minimum you should consider. Make sure it comes with a mouse, otherwise you'll need to shell out another ?20 for an adapter. Power cables, monitor cables, etc. are all standard, just plug in a standard PS/2 keyboard and monitor, plug it in and hit the power button. One gotcha that might catch you out is that most of the newer CDROMs won't work on the internal IDE interface. Most 24x (and slower) IDE/ATAPI drives will. I had a Samsung CD-Master 24E in my RiscPC for a while; a Panasonic CR-583 works just as well (if a little slower). Later. -- Phil. | Acorn Risc PC600 Mk3, SA202, 64MB, 6GB, philpem@dsl.pipex.com | ViewFinder, Ethernet (Acorn AEH62), http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ | 8xCD, framegrabber, Teletext ... The current limits placed are based on resistance From waltje at pdp11.nl Fri Sep 19 02:11:00 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > I'm being totally bombarded by those damn trojan horse e-mails purporting > to be from Microsoft security, each averaging 150K. > > Is anyone else experiencing this? I must've received over 150 today so > far (starting this morning). The "New patch" crap? Yes, same here. --f -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From cvisors at carnagevisors.net Fri Sep 19 04:00:01 2003 From: cvisors at carnagevisors.net (Benjamin Gardiner) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F6AC3C1.6040308@carnagevisors.net> Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > I'm being totally bombarded by those damn trojan horse e-mails purporting > to be from Microsoft security, each averaging 150K. > > Is anyone else experiencing this? I must've received over 150 today so > far (starting this morning). > > Is there any quick filter I can add to sendmail to thwart their delivery? > This is becoming highly annoying. > Your not the only one, I have had about 300 or so, also some people I know on an sgi irc channel have also been hit by it. Benjamin -- one you lock the target two you bait the line three you slowly spread the net and four you catch the man Front 242 Headhunter From ronbain at ix.netcom.com Fri Sep 19 04:30:00 2003 From: ronbain at ix.netcom.com (ronbain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: how to unsubscribe In-Reply-To: <015b01c37cbb$c8529610$9609dd40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <000501c37e8f$918520f0$2af9fea9@D4VMS431> How do I unsubscribe from this list -----Original Message----- From: cctech-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctech-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Keys Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2003 6:32 PM To: cctalk@classiccmp Subject: Two great finds today Today I was given a Dolch ADD-In computer C-P.A.C. it was a 386DX-33C and has been upgraded to a 486 it's a cool looking color portable lunchbox. I also picked up a monorail model 133 that works great but is missing the stand, keyboard, and mouse. I talked with a guy at the thrift who claims to have a monorail kb and mouse for these systems and is willing to sale them to me. I will have to see what he has next week. From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Fri Sep 19 05:00:00 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: More new toys! In-Reply-To: <200309182329.h8INTLeP030891@onyx.spiritone.com> Message-ID: <20030919095234.34800.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com> > OK, even with me looking to get rid of most of my collection, I'm incredibly > GREEN with ENVY! I'd be happy just to be able to get my hands on a nice > RISC OS machine, a Laptop would be *really* cool! I've been wanting to play > with RISC OS for years, but you just don't see the systems in the US. They're incredibly common here in the UK right now; lots of schools here seem to have been going through a phase of dumping their RISC OS machines this year. There's still quite a few holding out though, so they'll continue to be quite easy to find for several years to come I expect. Acorn laptops are a little more tricky to track down... cheers Jules ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Fri Sep 19 05:09:01 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:00 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030919100134.69485.qmail@web21109.mail.yahoo.com> --- Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > I'm being totally bombarded by those damn trojan horse e-mails purporting > to be from Microsoft security, each averaging 150K. > > Is anyone else experiencing this? I must've received over 150 today so > far (starting this morning). I woke up to find over 30 of them lurking in my Yahoo account. Yahoo only give you 6MB quota, the messages are around 150KB each, and whilst Yahoo do provide a filtering system there's no option to completely delete a message - only to move it to trash, which still counts as part of your quota. More than a little annoying, to say the least... My other non-web-based accounts seem to have escaped remarkably well however. cheers Jules ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From jcwren at jcwren.com Fri Sep 19 07:14:01 2003 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200309190806.31178.jcwren@jcwren.com> You realize this is mostly likely because of the way Verisign is violating the RFCs, and screwing over the 'net? Those people need to be put out of business. --John On Friday 19 September 2003 03:01 am, Fred N. van Kempen wrote: > On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > I'm being totally bombarded by those damn trojan horse e-mails purporting > > to be from Microsoft security, each averaging 150K. > > > > Is anyone else experiencing this? I must've received over 150 today so > > far (starting this morning). > > The "New patch" crap? Yes, same here. > > --f From mikeford at socal.rr.com Fri Sep 19 07:44:01 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: IBM 129 keypunch in Orange Calif In-Reply-To: References: <001001c37313$4a82e110$0301010a@thecoolbears.org> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030919053309.00a25420@pop-server.socal.rr.com> I am just passing this on, please contact the Bruce directly, the items are located in Orange, Calif. From: Bruce Pilch >>Do you have any interest in an IBM 129 keypunch in working order; >>also, new/boxed 5081 keypunch cards. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Sep 19 07:52:00 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: NEC Drive Problem (CP/M System) In-Reply-To: <3F697049.12469.9B6E085@localhost> References: <3F69D68C.2090102@srv.net> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030919084243.007af5e0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 08:43 AM 9/18/03 -0700, you wrote: >Ok, I have a puzzle that I need help on. I have an NEC Dual 8" Drive System. This is a >CP/M system. But my drive #2 has a problem. Drive #1 works fine. Is this one a NEC APC? I'm having similar problems with my APC but not as bad and on BOTH drives. I've cleaned the drives but it didn't help. I opened the APC up but the drives are completely enclosed and I can't see anything including the drive model numbers. Next step is to remove the drives and take them apart and see if I can find out what's going on. Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Sep 19 07:54:53 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: NEC Drive Problem (CP/M System) In-Reply-To: <000a01c37dff$7c96dca0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> References: <3F697049.12469.9B6E085@localhost> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030919084131.007af7c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 06:11 PM 9/18/03 +0200, you wrote: >From: "Mike Davis" >To: >Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2003 5:43 PM >Subject: NEC Drive Problem (CP/M System) > > >> Ok, I have a puzzle that I need help on. I have an NEC Dual 8" Drive System. This is a > FD1165-A. I can't locate such a drive. But I have located an FD1165-FQ. I >> wonder how compatible the FQ version is with the A version. Can parts be exchanged? >> >Gigabite.com has the -A drive, according to http://www.gigabite.com/floppy.html >In my conversion systems, I use a mix of FD1165-FQ, YD-180 and shugart 860-1. The only problem is the power plug, they are all different. If this is for a NEC APC then the other drives won't work. The front of the drive is part of the computer case, similar to the way that IBM built the PS/2s. Joe > >Nico From vance at neurotica.com Fri Sep 19 07:59:00 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: IBM 129 keypunch in Orange Calif In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030919053309.00a25420@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: If that weren't so far for me, I'd pick it up. Peace... Sridhar On Fri, 19 Sep 2003, Mike Ford wrote: > I am just passing this on, please contact the Bruce directly, the items are > located in Orange, Calif. > > From: Bruce Pilch > > >>Do you have any interest in an IBM 129 keypunch in working order; > >>also, new/boxed 5081 keypunch cards. From jwest at classiccmp.org Fri Sep 19 08:31:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans References: <200309190806.31178.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: <003d01c37eb1$1fe1aaa0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> It was written... > > > I'm being totally bombarded by those damn trojan horse e-mails purporting > > > to be from Microsoft security, each averaging 150K. > > > > > > Is anyone else experiencing this? I must've received over 150 today so > > > far (starting this morning). I generally discard about 20 emails a day from the list via moderation that are this trojan horse. It's noticeably stepped up in the past month. J From jwest at classiccmp.org Fri Sep 19 08:36:00 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: ADMIN: possible list maintenance window Message-ID: <006801c37eb1$e27a8fa0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> There is a 50/50 chance that I will have time tonight to go down to the datacenter late afternoon/early evening to do the next part of the list server upgrade. If so, the list server (and the classic computer related websites it also hosts) would be down hard for at least an hour. After it comes back up, there will likely be a lot of squirrelyness (is that a word?) for a few hours afterwards as I find all the little gotchas I forgot to address. May not do it tonight, kinda depends on some other variables, but if I DO get to do it tonight I wanted to let folks know. Damn upgrade is taking time away from my HP2000 restoration *GRIN* Jay West From hilpert at cs.ubc.ca Fri Sep 19 08:49:00 2003 From: hilpert at cs.ubc.ca (Brent Hilpert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: need some info on some sort of pocket terminal References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030917020124.00a0cba0@pop-server.socal.rr.com> <3F6835AB.266CBA34@xs4all.nl> Message-ID: <3F6A234B.EBBD48C1@cs.ubc.ca> Ed wrote: > > Not likely in this case, 2 of the wires must carry the power, as there is no > own powersource in the terminal. I picked it up when collecting 4 11/34's at Shell, > and in one of the cupboard I found this pocket terminal. > I have opened the db25 plug, and pins 2 & 3 are wired, suggesting it is at least RS232. > Other pins are 4 (RTS, wired also to pin 20), pin 7 (GND) and pin 9 (+ voltage). > The pin assignment is according to the rs232 description. > > There is an N8T15 & N8T16 chip on the board, are these similar to the M1488 & M1489 > rs232 line driver chips? ... found listings in an IC Master (1982) (sorry no pinouts): N8T15 (Signetics): Line drivers, single-ended (2 per device) / 4-input; RS232B,C; MIL188 / Output +-6V / Power Supply +-12V N8T16 (Signetics): Line receivers (2 per device) / hysteresis EIA/MIL / Input Threshold +-2V / Supply Voltage 5V From meltie at meltie.com Fri Sep 19 08:52:01 2003 From: meltie at meltie.com (Alex White) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: DEC Server In-Reply-To: <2305.4.20.168.219.1063846072.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> References: <000201c37d63$16e3fba0$5b01a8c0@athlon> <2305.4.20.168.219.1063846072.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <200309182319.22609.meltie@meltie.com> On Thursday 18 Sep 2003 12:47 am, Eric Smith wrote: > Antonio Carlini wrote: > > This I find surprising since, like PLUTO, the DS500 was PDP-11 based > > ans the DS100 and DS200 (and the 300 & too AFAIK) were 68000-based > > "Fred N. van Kempen" wrote: > > The DS200 sure is PDP-11 based. Dunno 'bout the 100, since I dont > > have that one. > > Just had a DS200 open a few months ago, and there was a 68000 in it, > with no PDP-11 of any sort (not even a T11). Also, if you look at > the contents of the ROMs or the MOP download code, they are full of > 68K code. For instance, there are lots of hex 4E75 words, which is a > 68000 RTS instruction. Shows up as "Nu" in ASCII, or "uN" if your byte > order is different. I'll confirm this, both the ds200 and the ds300 have 68k's in 'em... alex/melt -- Dance like no-one's watching, sing like no-one can hear you, love like you've never been hurt, wash like everyone has a nose, eat like cholesterol is a myth. From witchy at binarydinosaurs.co.uk Fri Sep 19 08:54:56 2003 From: witchy at binarydinosaurs.co.uk (Witchy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: cpt 8520 In-Reply-To: <20030908165116.V50348-100000@goliath.heydon.org> Message-ID: I'm guessing that's a 'no' to anyone wanting said machine.....it's screen display is lovely, in a 'please insert program disk' type of way....I really don't want to skip it but I need the room.....anyone? cheers -- adrian/witchy www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the online computer museum www.snakebiteandblack.co.uk - ex-monthly gothic shenanigans :o( From jeh at naviair.dk Fri Sep 19 08:57:51 2003 From: jeh at naviair.dk (Hartmann, Jan Erik OTV) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: LP 25 DIGITAL Message-ID: <4C6918611B93D5119E0A00306E01F6A32E81DF@chmail01.naviair.dk> He MATT Please inform from where you have obtained the service manual for this printer, as I need one to get spare parts numbers for PIVOT ARM ROLLER and RIBBON DRIVE ROLLER Regards -- Jan E Hartmann Engineer Voice Communication, OTVm D +45 3247 8463 * Email: mailto:jeh@naviair.dk Naviair * Naviair All? 1 * DK 2770 Kastrup * Danmark T: +45 3247 8000 * F: +45 3247 8817 * naviair@naviair.dk * www.naviair.dk A State enterprise under the Danish Ministry of Transport From jpl15 at panix.com Fri Sep 19 09:34:00 2003 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: [GreenKeys] Major Cleanout 3 (fwd) Message-ID: Even though there are several of us subscribed to the Greenkeys List (for mechanical teletypes), I have forwarded this because of the fan-fold paper tape (among the other goodies here) I recently bought several pieces from Tom (from an earlier offering of his) and it was packed very well, delivered quickly and in perfect shape, including the 100-pound Model 28 KSR desk-mount. He's a Good Guy to deal with... Cheerz John ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 12:41:47 -0500 From: Tom Kleinschmidt To: greenkeys@mailman.qth.net Cc: Tom Kleinschmidt Subject: [GreenKeys] Major Cleanout 3 Hi: A few more pieces of equipment and expansion on paper products. If you want me to reserve something for you: 1) I need your shipping address in your reply email 2) Copy and Paste the item(s) you want in your reply Thanks! 5) KL TT-98 family in good shape, these are basically what a M15 would have become, they have built in loop supplies 2 in good shape for $50 ea, 3 in ok shape $20 each 8) New type baskets for Kl page printers most still in the military packaging. $5 each 1) Terminal telegraph TH-22/TG about the size of a toaster. Now outer case made by Stelma. $10 ****Here is the paper: All $1 a roll**** ***Paper tape ROLLS 1": 6 rolls) New in wrapper "plastic" tape dark blue Marked " Arvey Computer Tape R-V-CT. 52H Blue Size 1" x 1000' 14 rolls) buff/ cream/ natural 2 rolls) new in box light blue 3 rolls) green with Arrows and Top marking 8 boxes / 80 rolls) new buff / cream paper tape. *** Paper tape 1" FANFOLD: 2) Black in box 3) Gray box *** lots an lots (most in boxes of 10) 11/16" Paper Tape ROLLS **** Page Printer Roll Paper **** 16) 2 Copy W/ Carbon 3) 3 Copy W/ Carbon 20) 2 Copy No Carbon 13) 4 Copy No Carbon 8) 6 Copy No Carbon 13) 2 Copy Western Union Telex along edge 17) Single Copy Tractor feed! Plenty Single copy in 12 roll boxes and less Tom _______________________________________________ GreenKeys mailing list GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys From jwest at classiccmp.org Fri Sep 19 09:40:44 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: RFC: newmember list policy? Message-ID: <00c201c37eb8$092667e0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Question: Anyone can join the list (cctalk or cctech) without moderation, automatically. I was wondering if it might not be good to require an email from people wanting to join the list - kind of a "letter of introduction" if you will. Something to give them an opportunity to say what they collect, what type of systems they are interested in, that kinda thing. This would serve two purposes. First, this email would be forwarded to the list as an introduction to everyone (not for a vote or anything like that). Second, it would give me a fairly reasonable way to make sure people who join the list are real collectors, or people with a real interest anyway, and not some schmoe wanting to post ads for modern equipment, or harvest list addresses by receiving the traffic. Sure this is not a fool proof thing, but might help alleviate that. In addition, I was considering no longer allowing posts to the list (cctalk) from unsubscribers. Currently anytime a non member posts to the list it gets flagged for moderation. However, this is taking more and more time of mine to read and approve (reject most) of those. Thus, I was considering making someone join the list before they can post at all, even with moderation of their posts. The downside of this, is on rare occasion, someone (not a collector) posts to the list that they have interesting equipment available, and I don't want to have to make them join the list. Their post would be silently rejected. This doesn't happen often, but who wants to miss a real gem. Please email responses to this directly to me instead of the list. Jay West From spectre at floodgap.com Fri Sep 19 10:36:00 2003 From: spectre at floodgap.com (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: My IIgs machines In-Reply-To: from Vintage Computer Festival at "Sep 18, 3 07:24:05 pm" Message-ID: <200309191540.IAA15562@floodgap.com> > > Just wish the clock speed were better. Freaking Apple. > > I remember a lot of people doing homebrew mods back in the late 1980s to > boost the clock speed by soldering in a new crystal to overclock it. You > had to be careful because if you didn't cool it properly you'd burn out > the CPU (and possibly other components). I'm probably going to track down a Zip Chip or Transwarp, or the equivalent, and stick it in my ROM 03 Woz. I want to play Wolfenstein on the IIgs in all its glory. ;-) -- ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com -- 10% of computer users [use] Mac ... the top 10 percent. -- Douglas Adams --- From teoz at neo.rr.com Fri Sep 19 11:13:00 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans References: <200309190806.31178.jcwren@jcwren.com> <003d01c37eb1$1fe1aaa0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Message-ID: <006101c37ec7$c72b4800$657ca418@neo.rr.com> I woke up today to find 300 trojans in my inbox along with a note from my internet provider saying my mailbox was full. Bad enough getting spam now I cant even get all my real email. From eric at brouhaha.com Fri Sep 19 11:17:00 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: <3F6AC3C1.6040308@carnagevisors.net> References: <3F6AC3C1.6040308@carnagevisors.net> Message-ID: <32830.64.169.63.74.1063987589.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> > Your not the only one, I have had about 300 or so, also some people I > know on an sgi irc channel have also been hit by it. I dream of the days when I only got 300/day of each virus going around. Fortunately, a combination of SpamAssassin and a filter that intercepts all email with attached execututables (anything base-64 encoded with an EXE file signature ("MZ")) has dramatically reduced how many of these things make it to my inbox. From esharpe at uswest.net Fri Sep 19 11:43:00 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: More new toys! References: <20030919095234.34800.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <00e801c37ed4$5b39ff80$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> sounds like a neat laptop... speaking of laptops I have an odd one here that is an APL laptop.. Japanese made.. without running across the building can't remember the name... anyway we need manuals for it .... if that rings a bell! Thanks! Ed Sharpe Archivist for SMECC See the Southwest Museum of Engineering, Communications and Computation online at: http://www.smecc.org ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jules Richardson" To: Sent: Friday, September 19, 2003 2:52 AM Subject: Re: More new toys! > > OK, even with me looking to get rid of most of my collection, I'm incredibly > > GREEN with ENVY! I'd be happy just to be able to get my hands on a nice > > RISC OS machine, a Laptop would be *really* cool! I've been wanting to play > > with RISC OS for years, but you just don't see the systems in the US. > > They're incredibly common here in the UK right now; lots of schools here seem > to have been going through a phase of dumping their RISC OS machines this year. > There's still quite a few holding out though, so they'll continue to be quite > easy to find for several years to come I expect. > > Acorn laptops are a little more tricky to track down... > > cheers > > Jules > > > ===== > Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! > Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From acme at ao.net Fri Sep 19 12:25:00 2003 From: acme at ao.net (Glen Goodwin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT -- Re: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans Message-ID: <200309191602.h8JG28UZ024984@mail.ao.net> > From: Vintage Computer Festival > To: Classic Computers Mailing List > Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans > Date: Thursday, September 18, 2003 6:59 PM > > I'm being totally bombarded by those damn trojan horse e-mails purporting > to be from Microsoft security, each averaging 150K. > > Is anyone else experiencing this? I must've received over 150 today so > far (starting this morning). I'm getting a couple of dozen every day on our AOL account, as well as a ton of "returned mail" notices regarding mail *I* never sent . . . either it's an attempted attack or someone is spoofing our AOL address. > Is there any quick filter I can add to sendmail to thwart their delivery? > This is becoming highly annoying. > > -- > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival Don't know about that, but I just received a notice from CERT regarding a buffer overflow bug in sendmail, so best beware . . . Glen 0/0 From stanb at dial.pipex.com Fri Sep 19 12:46:00 2003 From: stanb at dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: Old Computer Usage In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 16 Sep 2003 19:34:25 PDT." <20030917023425.42900.qmail@web20610.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200309190814.JAA10630@citadel.metropolis.local> Hi, Robert Little said: > Okay, just a quick show of hands... > How many of us out there actually use the systems we > have on a fairly regular basis? The only ones I use regularly are my Mac SE, which is mostly used as a terminal on this Linux box, and a 386 with multi A2D inputs and assorted in/out ports - runs headless and multi-tasking Forth. Oh, and a 486 that pretends to be a PDP-11 complete with blinkenlites but that's quite modern. -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com The future was never like this! From vcf at siconic.com Fri Sep 19 12:50:01 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: Anyone need 2,400 foot reel-to-reel tape? Message-ID: A company just contacted me and said they have 12,000(!) reel-to-reel mag-tapes that they want to dump. They are interested in finding people who want some. I don't believe they want any money, probably just shipping. They are all used but erased. If interested then please get back to me in private and I'll pass on the contact info. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From spectre at floodgap.com Fri Sep 19 12:59:00 2003 From: spectre at floodgap.com (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT -- Re: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: <200309191602.h8JG28UZ024984@mail.ao.net> from Glen Goodwin at "Sep 19, 3 09:00:44 am" Message-ID: <200309191803.LAA15784@floodgap.com> > Don't know about that, but I just received a notice from CERT regarding a > buffer overflow bug in sendmail, so best beware . . . Fortunately, the patch is trivial (all of a few lines), and requires a non-standard configuration to even have a hint of exploitability. -- ---------------------------------- personal: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Floodgap Systems Ltd * So. Calif., USA * ckaiser@floodgap.com -- TRUE HEADLINE: Prostitutes Appeal to Pope ---------------------------------- From pete at dunnington.u-net.com Fri Sep 19 13:02:00 2003 From: pete at dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: "Fred N. van Kempen" "Re: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans" (Sep 19, 9:01) References: Message-ID: <10309191815.ZM25675@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> On Sep 19, 9:01, Fred N. van Kempen wrote: > On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > > I'm being totally bombarded by those damn trojan horse e-mails purporting > > to be from Microsoft security, each averaging 150K. > > > > Is anyone else experiencing this? I must've received over 150 today so > > far (starting this morning). > The "New patch" crap? Yes, same here. My work email account was up to 250 or more by the time I left work about 20 minutes ago. Our mail server handled about 3500 today, making it the largest single virus/trojan, by an order of magnitude. Mailscanner (see http://www.sng.ecs.soton.ac.uk/mailscanner/ if you don't know about it) is now set to drop them silently. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York From mmcfadden at cmh.edu Fri Sep 19 13:05:01 2003 From: mmcfadden at cmh.edu (McFadden, Mike) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: Suggested solution regarding Jim Willing Message-ID: <958B228E6A626242A3FEAB621C4C933550A9FC@exch2000.cmh.internal> I'm in the area near Kansas City, MO. I'm about 130 miles away according to mapquest. I'm willing to help if it can be arranged. If there were a master list of the stuff and where it's supposed to go then that would be helpful. I have a few advantages I work for a hospital and we have lots of packing and boxes left over from computers and biomedical equipment. I also pick up and drop off stuff at the Surplus Exchange in Kansas City occasionally. I also have a garage, however I am limited to one of the two bays since my wife's car has to go in. I have a 17 year old son interested in computers. I have an oversized ford aerostar van or could borrow a flat bed trailer I may be able to arrange some time early in October. The most important thing that I see is that Jim willingly agrees to this and there is not lots of bad feelings involved. I don't want to get in the middle of a bunch of irate people. Mike McFadden m m c f a d d e n @ c m h . e d u From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Fri Sep 19 13:13:01 2003 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: More new toys! In-Reply-To: <20030919095234.34800.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030919095234.34800.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <465580344c.philpem@dsl.pipex.com> In message <20030919095234.34800.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com> Jules Richardson wrote: > Acorn laptops are a little more tricky to track down... Spare parts are even more difficult to track down. If anyone here has (or sees) a broken Acorn A4 (i.e. smashed screen or something like that), then I need a new mainboard for one of mine. The accursed keyboard microcontroller seems to have gone bang :-/ Even more useful would be a photocopy of the schematics and mechanical drawings from the Acorn A4 Technical Reference Manual. Later. -- Phil. | Acorn Risc PC600 Mk3, SA202, 64MB, 6GB, philpem@dsl.pipex.com | ViewFinder, Ethernet (Acorn AEH62), http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ | 8xCD, framegrabber, Teletext Never underestimate the power of human stupidity -- Robert A. Heinlein From mmcfadden at cmh.edu Fri Sep 19 13:26:00 2003 From: mmcfadden at cmh.edu (McFadden, Mike) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: collection organising Message-ID: <958B228E6A626242A3FEAB621C4C933550A9FD@exch2000.cmh.internal> Regarding RFID tags to organize collections Our x-ray film printers use the tags in the film magazines to identify the film type. There is an evaluation kit from TI available that lets you read out the unique long integer stored in each tag and you can program several other user available locations. I think if connects to the serial port of a PC. I have "salvaged" several tags and tested them with our ID badge readers, no response. Each tag is about 2" by 4" and looks like a chip and antenna printed on clear mylar carrier. Mike McFadden From vcf at siconic.com Fri Sep 19 13:35:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: <200309190806.31178.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Sep 2003, J.C. Wren wrote: > You realize this is mostly likely because of the way Verisign is violating the > RFCs, and screwing over the 'net? Those people need to be put out of > business. God damn it. I'm ready to sue. I think I have an actionable claim against them (as does everyone else who is trying to run a business). This is really slowing me down. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Fri Sep 19 13:37:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: IBM 129 keypunch in Orange Calif In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030919053309.00a25420@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Sep 2003, Mike Ford wrote: > I am just passing this on, please contact the Bruce directly, the items are > located in Orange, Calif. I've already been in touch with Bruce (he contacted me directly) and am making arrangements to pick it up ;) -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From jcwren at jcwren.com Fri Sep 19 13:39:00 2003 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: Help identifying some Mostek parts In-Reply-To: <465580344c.philpem@dsl.pipex.com> References: <20030919095234.34800.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com> <465580344c.philpem@dsl.pipex.com> Message-ID: <200309191426.53699.jcwren@jcwren.com> I have some Mostek ICs that were part of a batch of other chips I picked up from someone. These are 40 pin parts from 1984 and 1985. Part numbers are DC10112A, DC10113A, and DC10114A. I can't find anything on the web in my standard part number searchs for these. I suspect they are second source parts for someone, probably Zilog. Can anyone tell me what these correlate to? --John From patrick at evocative.com Fri Sep 19 13:47:00 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT -- Re: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: <200309191803.LAA15784@floodgap.com> Message-ID: > > Don't know about that, but I just received a notice from CERT > regarding a > > buffer overflow bug in sendmail, so best beware . . . > > Fortunately, the patch is trivial (all of a few lines), and requires a > non-standard configuration to even have a hint of exploitability. Just to take this OT-squared, my biz has gotten two phone calls with week for the old copier/fax toner telephone scam: "Hi, this is Christy with , can you confirm the model number on your copier for me?" and a week later you get a huge invoice and a pallete of second-rate toner cartridges, with no return address, and they put you into collections if you don't pay. The sad thing is I'm sure works for them. The easiest and most effective exploits always seem to rely on simple social engineering. --Patrick From jcwren at jcwren.com Fri Sep 19 14:05:00 2003 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200309191457.29106.jcwren@jcwren.com> http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/09/19/039214 Already starting to happen. --John On Friday 19 September 2003 14:30 pm, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > On Fri, 19 Sep 2003, J.C. Wren wrote: > > You realize this is mostly likely because of the way Verisign is > > violating the RFCs, and screwing over the 'net? Those people need to be > > put out of business. > > God damn it. I'm ready to sue. I think I have an actionable claim > against them (as does everyone else who is trying to run a business). > This is really slowing me down. From patrick at evocative.com Fri Sep 19 14:31:00 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: <200309190806.31178.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: > You realize this is mostly likely because of the way Verisign is > violating the > RFCs, and screwing over the 'net? Those people need to be put out of > business. Specifically...? From mikeford at socal.rr.com Fri Sep 19 15:06:00 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: collection organising In-Reply-To: <4295.4.20.168.178.1063933102.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030917014042.00a1a320@pop-server.socal.rr.com> <20030915145935.86603.qmail@web21104.mail.yahoo.com> <"Jules Richardson"@Sep> <5.1.0.14.0.20030917014042.00a1a320@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030919124319.00a26150@pop-server.socal.rr.com> At 05:58 PM 9/18/03 -0700, Eric Smith wrote: > > Clear storage, bins or ziplock bags, and you can be lazy and never label > > anything. > >Doesn't scale. I use Contico 12-gallon storage bins that are, if not >clear, at least reasonably translucent. But I have hundreds of them, >so even though I can see into them, I still can't find anything. I use a sheet of paper dropped in so I can read it thru the plastic wall, but I am thinking about going to dry erase markers. Its labeling, but still lazy since you can dump a LOT of stuff in each container. From mikeford at socal.rr.com Fri Sep 19 15:07:01 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: Old Computer Usage In-Reply-To: <200309182139.QAA01175@caesar.cs.umn.edu> References: <20030917023425.42900.qmail@web20610.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030919123419.02ff2440@pop-server.socal.rr.com> My wife assures me that my computer collection is driving her insane, thats a use isn't it? From Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com Fri Sep 19 15:09:00 2003 From: Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com (Feldman, Robert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans Message-ID: More on Verisign: They have embed a cookie-placing "web bug" in their page that can relay back info http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/32926.html -----Original Message----- From: J.C. Wren [mailto:jcwren@jcwren.com] Sent: Friday, September 19, 2003 1:57 PM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org; Vintage Computer Festival Subject: Re: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/09/19/039214 Already starting to happen. --John On Friday 19 September 2003 14:30 pm, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > On Fri, 19 Sep 2003, J.C. Wren wrote: > > You realize this is mostly likely because of the way Verisign is > > violating the RFCs, and screwing over the 'net? Those people need to be > > put out of business. > > God damn it. I'm ready to sue. I think I have an actionable claim > against them (as does everyone else who is trying to run a business). > This is really slowing me down. From jhfinexgs2 at compsys.to Fri Sep 19 15:22:00 2003 From: jhfinexgs2 at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans References: <200309191457.29106.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: <3F6B6371.BDAD88D5@compsys.to> >"J.C. Wren" wrote: > http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/09/19/039214 > Already starting to happen. > --John > On Friday 19 September 2003 14:30 pm, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > > On Fri, 19 Sep 2003, J.C. Wren wrote: > > > You realize this is mostly likely because of the way Verisign is > > > violating the RFCs, and screwing over the 'net? Those people need to be > > > put out of business. > > God damn it. I'm ready to sue. I think I have an actionable claim > > against them (as does everyone else who is trying to run a business). > > This is really slowing me down. Jerome Fine replies: The following was in one of the posts to slashdot from the above link: ================================================= In addition to a number of already posted suggestions, I recommend that you call Verisign and file a complaint: +1 703-742-0914 (worldwide) +1 888-642-9675 (toll free US/Canada) When you call, select: * 1 (purchase an product or renew an exist product) * then 7 (all other questions) I recommend that you be patient with the Verisign rep that answers the phone. That person may not fully understand the issue / problem, and they are unlikely to personally be responsible for the Verisign decision. Remember that you are objecting what Verisign as a company is doing. Don't yell at the rep. Be polite but firm. Ask Verisign to stop the wildcarding now. Explain why what they are doing is wrong (such as being unable to determine of a EMail message is being sent from a bogus / non-existent domain because thisdomaindoesnotexist.com resolves to 64.94.110.11). If you do business with Verisign now, tell them that you will switch vendors unless Verisign stops this practice in X weeks. (fill in the X) You might want to leave your phone number and request a callback. Anonymous complaints do not go as far. If you are in the US, you might want to contact your local member of congress and object about what Verisign is doing. Let Verisign know that you are doing this when you call. Yes, they might flush your complaint down /dev/null. But I suspect that pressure from all fronts might help. I have been told (off the record) that some people within Verisign are not happy with their wildcarding. Complaints get logged into a database that these people can review. Your complaints, in volume, might help those folks make a stronger case against top-level wildcarding. ================================================== If enough people in the USA and Canada call the free 800 number (like a million - would that not be nice), perhaps Verisign might decide that it is too expensive to disrupt the 800 number with a lot of (from the point of view of Verisign) non-revenue producing calls! Please suggest if I might be correct! Most of the time the ideas I advance seem to be ignored. If this is a good idea, then send it on the other lists and news groups! Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From pete at dunnington.u-net.com Fri Sep 19 15:50:00 2003 From: pete at dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT -- Re: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: "Glen Goodwin" "OT -- Re: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans" (Sep 19, 9:00) References: <200309191602.h8JG28UZ024984@mail.ao.net> Message-ID: <10309192129.ZM25925@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> On Sep 19, 9:00, Glen Goodwin wrote: > I'm getting a couple of dozen every day on our AOL account, as well as a > ton of "returned mail" notices regarding mail *I* never sent . . . either > it's an attempted attack or someone is spoofing our AOL address. That's because the Sobig-F virus spoofs sender addresses. People who have your email address somewhere on their Windows machine (not necessarily in their address book, either!) and have the virus, will unwittingly be sending our copies of the virus that claim to be from you --and many ISPs and filter programs don't check the headers properly. > > Is there any quick filter I can add to sendmail to thwart their delivery? > > This is becoming highly annoying. > Don't know about that, but I just received a notice from CERT regarding a > buffer overflow bug in sendmail, so best beware . . . That won't affect spam, particularly. The patch has been out for a few days, actually, and our systems were patched a while ago :-) -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York From patrick at evocative.com Fri Sep 19 16:39:00 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]On > Behalf Of Feldman, Robert > Sent: Friday, September 19, 2003 12:38 PM > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: RE: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans > > > More on Verisign: > They have embed a cookie-placing "web bug" in their page that can > relay back info > > http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/32926.html This is an old, common trick that many marketing companies have used for years to gather statistical information about their clients' web sites. You may not like it, but it isn't specific to VeriSign and isn't new news. If you're using one of the more recent browsers, you can befuddle this effort by turning off "third-party cookies". Patrick From shirsch at adelphia.net Fri Sep 19 16:58:00 2003 From: shirsch at adelphia.net (Steven N. Hirsch) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: My IIgs machines In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Cameron Kaiser wrote: > > > Just wish the clock speed were better. Freaking Apple. > > I remember a lot of people doing homebrew mods back in the late 1980s to > boost the clock speed by soldering in a new crystal to overclock it. You > had to be careful because if you didn't cool it properly you'd burn out > the CPU (and possibly other components). ??? I think you may be mixing this up with the well-known IBM AT '286 mod. AFAIK, it's just not possible to do this with an Apple 2 family machine. The video generation is too closely tied with the system clock. Steve From jcwren at jcwren.com Fri Sep 19 16:58:53 2003 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200309191750.24533.jcwren@jcwren.com> That's not the point. The point is Verisign has broken the RFC by not returning NXDOMAIN for the lookup of an invalid domain. Which means that all the email systems that use reverse DNS lookup to validate a domain now think every domain in existence is valid. It's fine if the person who owns the site does this, but these are UNREGISTERED domains with non-existent IP addresses. Verisgn is fixing to get bitch-slapped in a hard way, and if we're *really* lucky, they'll be driven out of business. This kind of crap is not in their charter. --John On Friday 19 September 2003 17:31 pm, Patrick Rigney wrote: > > -----Original Message----- > > From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]On > > Behalf Of Feldman, Robert > > Sent: Friday, September 19, 2003 12:38 PM > > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > > Subject: RE: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans > > > > > > More on Verisign: > > They have embed a cookie-placing "web bug" in their page that can > > relay back info > > > > http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/32926.html > > This is an old, common trick that many marketing companies have used for > years to gather statistical information about their clients' web sites. > You may not like it, but it isn't specific to VeriSign and isn't new news. > > If you're using one of the more recent browsers, you can befuddle this > effort by turning off "third-party cookies". > > Patrick From jwest at classiccmp.org Fri Sep 19 22:51:18 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:01 2005 Subject: testing testing testing Message-ID: <004d01c37f2a$72f88730$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> more tests From vcf at siconic.com Fri Sep 19 22:56:27 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: <200309191750.24533.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Sep 2003, J.C. Wren wrote: > That's not the point. The point is Verisign has broken the RFC by not > returning NXDOMAIN for the lookup of an invalid domain. Which means that all > the email systems that use reverse DNS lookup to validate a domain now think > every domain in existence is valid. Ok, this is all making sense now. I can't believe they fucking did this. They have just unleashed an avalanche of spam onto my and every other server in existence and my business is suffering because of it. Thanks to these fucking assholes, it now takes me about 5 times longer to delete through spam in my inbox. > Verisgn is fixing to get bitch-slapped in a hard way, and if we're > *really* lucky, they'll be driven out of business. This kind of crap is > not in their charter. I'm calling my Congresswhore on Monday, and on Tueday, if this keeps up, I'm calling an attorney. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From yakowenk at cs.unc.edu Fri Sep 19 23:11:51 2003 From: yakowenk at cs.unc.edu (Bill Yakowenko) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: NEC Drive Problem (CP/M System) Message-ID: <3F6BD387.B0B71CFE@cs.unc.edu> Sounds like a "seek" problem to me. If it uses the old Western Digital floppy controller, you could issue seek instructions pretty easily to test that. I suppose other controllers might be similar. I'd have to hit the WD databook for details, but it was something like writing a track number into one register, then writing the "seek" command into another, then sitting back and enjoying the whir-click sound of a seek. Then a "restore" command would get it back to track 0. I've done it on TRS-80's; not sure if it would be quite so easy under CP/M.  Cautionary note though: the OS probably remembers what track it last positioned the drive to, and may be confused if you leave it at a different track. I *think* any attempted read/write would then fail with a "no such sector found" error, after which the OS would probably just automatically re-seek & re-try, resulting in no problem. But I wouldn't bet my last bootable floppy on it. I've seen a seek mechanism stuck - refused to move until I powered the thing down, opened it up, & physically slid the head back and forth along the rails a few times. After which it worked. YMMV, of course. One other possibility, I've seen (somewhere) a disk format in which track 0 was always written in single density for compatibility with older drives, while the rest of the disk could be SD or DD. So an older system could give the appropriate error message when failing to read a DD disk (more specific than just "unreadable"). Was that CP/M? If so, then the problem could be a failure in handling DD data. And it seems to me CP/M used "$$$" as some kind of temporary file extension, renaming files to their proper extension at the end of the operation...? Which would indicate again that the track-0 commands succeeded, but the other-track commands failed, leaving the disk op incomplete. Cheers, Bill. > From: "Mike Davis" > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 08:43:53 -0700 > Subject: NEC Drive Problem (CP/M System) > Reply-To: cctech@classiccmp.org > > Ok, I have a puzzle that I need help on. I have an NEC Dual 8" > Drive System. This is a CP/M system. But my drive #2 has a problem. > Drive #1 works fine. > > Symptoms: > > Can't boot from drive #2 > Can't read files from drive #2 > Can't write files to drive #2 > CAN get a directory listing from drive #2 > CAN write to FAT, as when trying to copy files > > If I try to load files from drive #2, I get a failure with the > following error: "Bdos Err On B: Bad Sector" > > If I try to write files to drive #2, the directory entry is written > (except that it is TEST.$$$ instead of the correct extension). But > the data for the file is apparently NOT written. I get the same > error. > > I see attempts to read and write but these always end with the error > above. > > It looks like the write head must be good, as a filename is saved to > disk. It looks like the read head must be good, as the directory can > be listed. > > Any suggestions as to what could be causing this? Could it have > something with head movement? Perhaps the directory storage is on a > track (sector) that can be reached and the others can't? I'm stumped. > > Note: I have not actually looked inside to see if the head is moving > properly (that may be next but I know it does move some.) but I have > reattached all the connectors to the drive and controller. > > SECOND QUESTION: > > The drive is an FD1165-A. I can't locate such a drive. But I have > located an FD1165-FQ. I wonder how compatible the FQ version is with > the A version. Can parts be exchanged? From jwest at classiccmp.org Fri Sep 19 23:25:56 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: test, please reply OFF LIST Message-ID: <008101c37f2f$49802070$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> If people get this, can you please reply to jwest@classiccmp.org so I know it's going out ok. PLEASE do not reply to the list about getting this email, just send direct to me. Thanks Jay West From oldcomp at cox.net Fri Sep 19 23:45:10 2003 From: oldcomp at cox.net (Bryan Blackburn) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: Old Computer Usage References: <20030917023425.42900.qmail@web20610.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3F6BDB56.8070004@cox.net> My Mark 8 and Kim-1 computers run 24/7 doing fun stuff, and I have a Digital Group computer that I use for games and a little programming. My 286 AT clone does chip programming. -Bryan Robert Little wrote: > Okay, just a quick show of hands... > How many of us out there actually use the systems we > have on a fairly regular basis? Personally, all of my > systems are used regularly. For instance, my Toshiba > T1800 has software that can only run at a useful speed > on a 386, my battery of Macs are dedicated astronomy > and graphics machines and I even use an Apple IIgs for > planetarium programming, not counting the Tandy Model > 102 that I use as my erstwhile PDA. > Curious, > > Rob > > ===== > Robert Little > Astronomy & Space Educator > Talcott Mountain Science Center > Avon, CT > > "I have loved the stars too dearly to be fearful of the night..." > Sarah Williams > "The Old Astronomer to His Pupil" > From jwest at classiccmp.org Fri Sep 19 23:55:08 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: LIST ADMIN Message-ID: <00bf01c37f33$5f534c20$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Ok, the upgrade took a LOT longer than I thought. I'm still not certain I have everything right. But, I do see emails getting through at least. I'm heading off to get sleep. I will do a little testing tomorrow. As people notice problems, please email me directly. Also - I got enough responses to "Please reply offlist" so no more are needed (and messages with that subject are temporarily dev/nulled) :) Jay From wmsmith at earthlink.net Sat Sep 20 00:09:08 2003 From: wmsmith at earthlink.net (Wayne M. Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: DEC TS-11s In-Reply-To: <00c201c37eb8$092667e0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Message-ID: <001a01c37f35$55598430$2cb2d642@WaynePC> There's two DEC TS-11 tape drives up for auction at the gov't liquidation site. They're located in beautiful Barstow, CA in case anyone's interested. 2 days, 18 hours to go and no bid yet. http://web.govliquidation.com/auction/view?auctionId=258037&convertTo=US D -W From jwest at classiccmp.org Sat Sep 20 08:21:08 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: current status Message-ID: <007f01c37f7a$0eaf6820$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Geeze, the upgrade was certainly more painful than I expected. There were definitely a few gotcha's that weren't really documented. It would appear that a lot of list traffic used to show with an address of cctalk-admin and cctech-admin. This has apparently changed to cctalk-bounces and cctech-bounces. Please adjust any filters or mail rules that you may have on your end accordingly. The above change caused a problem with the way the two views (cctalk and cctech) of the list were cross-linked. I *THINK* I have this problem fixed, can anyone let me know if they see strangeness in this area directly (offlist). I fixed this about 8:15 CST, so only for posts sent well after that. I'm still wading through things looking for issues (I am sure there is some). Let me know if you see anything! Jay From patrick at evocative.com Sat Sep 20 12:44:35 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > On Fri, 19 Sep 2003, J.C. Wren wrote: > > > That's not the point. The point is Verisign has broken the > RFC by not I think my earlier message may have not made it through the night's maintenance, so I apologize if I'm repeating myself. I wasn't responding to the NXDOMAIN issue, John. I was responding to the "hype" about the use of a third-party cookie (Overture) and a one-pixel image for tracking. That said... > [And Sellam responded:] > Ok, this is all making sense now. I can't believe they fucking did this. > They have just unleashed an avalanche of spam onto my and every other > server in existence and my business is suffering because of it. Thanks to > these fucking assholes, it now takes me about 5 times longer to delete > through spam in my inbox. > > > Verisgn is fixing to get bitch-slapped in a hard way, and if we're > > *really* lucky, they'll be driven out of business. This kind of crap is > > not in their charter. > > I'm calling my Congresswhore on Monday, and on Tueday, if this keeps up, > I'm calling an attorney. I think the call to your congressperson is more meaningful than the attorney. And if that's your timetable, don't bother waiting. It isn't going to stop. It's clear that VeriSign is contributing to the spam problem by their actions, but what happens when they cease and desist? Everything goes back to the way it was yesterday. Spammers continue to use forged email addresses in legitimate domains, and our mailboxes continue to be choked with an ever-increasing amount of spam. Every day I get bounces for messages never sent from my domain... someone simply hijacked it to send their spam. Checking for the existence of a valid domain name has been a long-standing filter, but it has always been a weak one that spammers have easily worked around, and only the stupid and inexperienced ones bother. IIRC, this whole discussion started with the problem of a mass-mailing worm sending volumes of mail with a large attachment, and got onto this. This problem is also not solved by RFC compliance. A mass-mailing worm typically forges its source identity by using addresses in the infected party's address book, which are generally going to be valid addresses in valid domains, and possibly even people you may know as well. They do this to capitalize on your implicit trust. In any case, VeriSign's actions probably made no contribution to this problem. I'm not trying to defend VeriSign here. They are contributing to a problem, that is clear. I'm trying to point out that the spammers are the real offenders and their activities predate both SiteFinder and VeriSign, so while slapping VeriSign to bring them into compliance with the RFCs may be just, right, and necessary, it is far from solving the problem of spam. VeriSign's actions are offensive and demonstrate that they are poor custodians of the responsibility they carry, so it's easy to focus on it, but it remains only a very small part of the Big Picture. On The Screensavers (a TechTV show), this 17-year old kid called in and argued with Pat and Leo over spam, claiming that anything we do to block it he can work around, and it's worth the effort because he can make $1,000 a day easily sending bulk advertisements for his clients (see link to their show notes at the bottom of this message). With that kind of money and no meaningful consequences, is it any wonder we get this crap in volume? Is it any wonder that today I am defenseless against my future teenage daughter opening her email to see things like "Watch me and my teen slut friends **ck and **ck huge **cks"?!??!? Damage is done on delivery, and God forbid she opens that message and sees the attached picture. I get emails like this every day, lots of them. Don't our congressional representatives as well? Are they awake?!? "Just delete it" isn't an answer. This kind of crap needs to be illegal, meaningfully punishable, and crisply enforced. Congress has done an embarrassingly bad job of addressing the spam issue meangingfully so far--pretty much useless, IMO. They need to be informed, they need to open their minds and really understand the issues, and they need to understand why what they have done so far isn't effective, and that technical solutions alone will not address the problem. And, enforcement and prosecution needs to be handled as a criminal matter, with real interest and urgency on the part of law enforcement, not a civil matter that's so potentially burdensome on the complainant that it's not worth the effort. One more thing to add... I personally do not believe it is appropriate for any for-profit company to be in the role VeriSign is in with respect to domains. I also believe that putting VeriSign out of business at this stage would be very harmful to the 'net economy and the economy in general. For better or worse, VeriSign provides a breadth of services upon which a huge number of businesses relies, and their absence would leave a gaping hole and huge mess to straighten out. The interruption or absence of these services, even temporarily, would drive many businesses under, especially in these delicate, not-quite-recovery-for-everyone times. It is a huge error that VeriSign has ended up in this role with relatively little supervision, and reversing that without making a bigger mess of it and killing a lot of innocent bystanders would take a lot of very delicate, well-planned dismantling. MO. John Postel, you are missed. --Patrick Ref: http://www.techtv.com/screensavers/shownotes/story/0,24330,3425430,00.html Scroll down to bottom of page to find "In defense of spam" From jcwren at jcwren.com Sat Sep 20 13:15:37 2003 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200309201415.37102.jcwren@jcwren.com> I fail to understand how anyone with half a neuron, or even a congresscritter, can think that spammers have rights that need to be protected. They operate on the grace of a federally and privately funded networks, and never pay the true cost of what spamming costs. It's also one more clear point why lobby groups should be illegal. I can't even think of a good example to compare these spamming morons to. Personally, I think CNN Headline News should run "Executions @ 8", where we line up the spammers, walk down the line with a Colt .45, and put a round through their face. And you get to enter a lottery for $2 if you want to be the triggerman. If that doesn't slow them down, it's hard to imagine what else will. There's just NO justification for their existence, past, present or future. And only a crongresscritter could fail to understand that. --John On Saturday 20 September 2003 13:44 pm, Patrick Rigney wrote: [ much snippage ] > > Congress has done an embarrassingly bad job of addressing the spam issue > meangingfully so far--pretty much useless, IMO. They need to be informed, > they need to open their minds and really understand the issues, and they > need to understand why what they have done so far isn't effective, and that > technical solutions alone will not address the problem. And, enforcement > and prosecution needs to be handled as a criminal matter, with real > interest and urgency on the part of law enforcement, not a civil matter > that's so potentially burdensome on the complainant that it's not worth the > effort. [ more snippage ] From patrick at evocative.com Sat Sep 20 13:36:05 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: <200309201415.37102.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: John, We agree. If you're not in California, please come, so I can vote for you for Governor. Patrick > -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-bounces@classiccmp.org > [mailto:cctalk-bounces@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of J.C. Wren > Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2003 11:16 AM > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts > Subject: Re: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans > > > I fail to understand how anyone with half a neuron, or even a > congresscritter, can think that spammers have rights that need to be > protected. They operate on the grace of a federally and privately funded > networks, and never pay the true cost of what spamming costs. > It's also one > more clear point why lobby groups should be illegal. > > I can't even think of a good example to compare these > spamming morons to. > Personally, I think CNN Headline News should run "Executions @ > 8", where we > line up the spammers, walk down the line with a Colt .45, and put a round > through their face. And you get to enter a lottery for $2 if you > want to be > the triggerman. If that doesn't slow them down, it's hard to > imagine what > else will. > > There's just NO justification for their existence, past, > present or future. > And only a crongresscritter could fail to understand that. > > --John > > On Saturday 20 September 2003 13:44 pm, Patrick Rigney wrote: > > [ much snippage ] > > > > > Congress has done an embarrassingly bad job of addressing the spam issue > > meangingfully so far--pretty much useless, IMO. They need to > be informed, > > they need to open their minds and really understand the issues, and they > > need to understand why what they have done so far isn't > effective, and that > > technical solutions alone will not address the problem. And, > enforcement > > and prosecution needs to be handled as a criminal matter, with real > > interest and urgency on the part of law enforcement, not a civil matter > > that's so potentially burdensome on the complainant that it's > not worth the > > effort. > > [ more snippage ] > > From n8uhn at yahoo.com Sat Sep 20 14:40:03 2003 From: n8uhn at yahoo.com (Bill Allen Jr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: Old Computer Usage Message-ID: <20030920194003.10022.qmail@web40702.mail.yahoo.com> My Ibm ps/2 286 desktop and gateway 2000 486 laptop are used on a regular basis to program motorola two way radios and plc's. the laptop is used in the field also. alot of the early plc's (programable logic controller) and programable radios (from ge and motorola) use software from the pre 486 era and cannot run on a pc faster then a 486 - some won't run on anything faster the a 386. the i/o and proc speed on a 486 and up is just too fast for the software and the "slowdown" software that put's the cpu into a time wasting loop causes even more prob's. i also dust off the ibm pc/xt every now and then to play all the early games and game clones that wont run on anything faster in it's orignal release. Bill Message: 4 Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 21:45:10 -0700 From: Bryan Blackburn Subject: Re: Old Computer Usage To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Message-ID: <3F6BDB56.8070004@cox.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed My Mark 8 and Kim-1 computers run 24/7 doing fun stuff, and I have a Digital Group computer that I use for games and a little programming. My 286 AT clone does chip programming. -Bryan Robert Little wrote: > Okay, just a quick show of hands... > How many of us out there actually use the systems we > have on a fairly regular basis? Personally, all of my > systems are used regularly. For instance, my Toshiba > T1800 has software that can only run at a useful speed > on a 386, my battery of Macs are dedicated astronomy > and graphics machines and I even use an Apple IIgs for > planetarium programming, not counting the Tandy Model > 102 that I use as my erstwhile PDA. > Curious, > > Rob > > ===== > Robert Little > Astronomy & Space Educator > Talcott Mountain Science Center > Avon, CT > > "I have loved the stars too dearly to be fearful of the night..." > Sarah Williams > "The Old Astronomer to His Pupil" > ------------------------------ __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sat Sep 20 15:00:07 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: ACW and user ports Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1544 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030920/113b58f4/attachment.ksh From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sat Sep 20 15:47:41 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: SEL Lo2000 teleprinter ? Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030920164741.007bc280@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Found one of these today. Can anyone tell me about this teleprinter? I found DF3OE'S TELEPRINTER MUSEUM at and it seems to have a lot of information about it but IE locks up EVERYTIME that I connect to his site. Joe From tponsford at theriver.com Sat Sep 20 15:54:57 2003 From: tponsford at theriver.com (Tom Ponsford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: [Fwd: DEC TS-11s] Message-ID: <3F6CBEA1.6090007@theriver.com> -------- Original Message -------- Subject: DEC TS-11s Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 22:09:08 -0700 From: Wayne M. Smith Reply-To: General Discussion: On-Topic Posts Only To: There's two DEC TS-11 tape drives up for auction at the gov't liquidation site. They're located in beautiful Barstow, CA in case anyone's interested. 2 days, 18 hours to go and no bid yet. http://web.govliquidation.com/auction/view?auctionId=258037&convertTo=US D -W From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Sat Sep 20 16:38:58 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: ACW and user ports In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030920213858.80464.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com> Hi Tony, > One thing that suprised me when I opened it up was that the user port > connector isn't used. Whereabouts is the blanked-off port on your machine? Above the keyboard connector on my machine I have a printer port; above that there's markings for a modem ("BT Link") socket, but this isn't fitted in my machine. I'm just going from photos at the moment but I'll dig the machine itself out tomorrow and take a look. My machine's a little earlier than yours, and I don't know if they were ever produced in significant enough numbers for there to be a totally standard design. It's possible some machines had the port and others didn't. AFAIK, the B+ board itself is totally standard, with only extra ROMs to support the 32016 coprocessor and the hard disk. I don't know of any reason why the user port wouldn't work. I do like the way everything folds out once the lid is taken off, even if the engineering is a little flimsy. Can you do me a favour sometime and tell me the hard disk model in your machine? I'd like to fit the correct hard drive to mine sometime (and certainly one that has a black front rather than the current grey :-) cheers Jules ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From cb at mythtech.net Sat Sep 20 17:23:03 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: FS: NorthStar Software Message-ID: I found a black boxed set of NorthStar software. The box it marked InfoStar System, with three binders in it, DataStar, ReportStar, and ReportStar Reference Manual. It appears to be complete, manuals and software. I'm guessing it is some kind of database and reporting system. I don't know exactly what it is as it has been years since I've even had a NorthStar computer. Its available if anyone wants it. Just send me any offer over the cost of shipping (must be higher than shipping cost... basically, I've got no spare time to do things for free). If it doesn't sell here, I'll try it on ebay, and then it goes to the dumpster. -chris From jpl15 at panix.com Sat Sep 20 17:36:07 2003 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: SEL Lo2000 teleprinter ? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030920164741.007bc280@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <3.0.6.32.20030920164741.007bc280@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: > Found one of these today. Can anyone tell me about this teleprinter? I > found DF3OE'S TELEPRINTER MUSEUM at and it seems to > have a lot of information about it but IE locks up EVERYTIME that I connect > to his site. Works fine for me (IE v5.5) ya just have to edit off the carets and the backslash.... Here's the blurb from the photo: >Lo 2000/2001 1976 - 1985 >5 level (bit) Baudot code >page printer >speed 50 - 100 bauds (switchable) >metal type wheel printing mechanism >first fully electronic teleprinter, available as ASR, KSR and ESR version >ESR=Electronic Send and Receive, 4 kbyte memory >microprozessor controlled machine from the peak of the TELEX era And a damn fine-looking machine it is, too! Very nice cosmetic design... Cheers John From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sat Sep 20 17:38:41 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: FS: NorthStar Software In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030920183841.007b9b40@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 06:23 PM 9/20/03 -0400, you wrote: >I found a black boxed set of NorthStar software. The box it marked >InfoStar System, with three binders in it, DataStar, ReportStar, and >ReportStar Reference Manual. > >It appears to be complete, manuals and software. I'm guessing it is some >kind of database and reporting system. These are companion products to WordStar. They use wordstar files and are used for keeping databases and generating reports. There are a couple of othe related products; Mail-Merge and CalcStar (IIRC). Keep in mind that these are HARD SECTORED floppy disks! I don't think they're readable on any system except those that have a NS disk system. I have a couple of NIB NS WordStar packages around here somewhere. If no one else wants them I'll add these to the collection. Joe I don't know exactly what it is as >it has been years since I've even had a NorthStar computer. > >Its available if anyone wants it. Just send me any offer over the cost of >shipping (must be higher than shipping cost... basically, I've got no >spare time to do things for free). > >If it doesn't sell here, I'll try it on ebay, and then it goes to the >dumpster. > >-chris > > > From Daniel.Harris at cliffordchance.com Sat Sep 20 19:22:23 2003 From: Daniel.Harris at cliffordchance.com (Daniel.Harris@cliffordchance.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: GEM Message-ID: Do you still have the old copy of GEM? I'm most interested in packaging, manuals, etc. that refer to it as a windowing environment (as you did in your message). Daniel R. Harris Clifford Chance US, LLP daniel.harris@cliffordchance.com 650.858.4373 (direct dial) 650.858.4399 (fax) 650.278.6414 (mobile) ******* This message and any attachment are confidential and may be privileged or otherwise protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended recipient, please telephone or email the sender and delete this message and any attachment from your system. If you are not the intended recipient you must not copy this message or attachment or disclose the contents to any other person. For further information about Clifford Chance please see our website at http://www.cliffordchance.com or refer to any Clifford Chance office. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030920/36f67b89/attachment.html From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sat Sep 20 19:28:17 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: ACW and user ports In-Reply-To: <20030920213858.80464.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com> from "=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=" at Sep 20, 3 10:38:58 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 3093 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030921/dc13bfee/attachment.ksh From vze2wsvr at verizon.net Sat Sep 20 19:56:55 2003 From: vze2wsvr at verizon.net (Eric Chomko) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: UNSUBSCRIBE CLASSICCMP pne.chomko@verizon.net References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030203000105.00d69c70@127.0.0.1> Message-ID: <3F6CF757.B13A96D8@verizon.net> UNSUBSCRIBE CLASSICCMP pne.chomko@verizon.net From jwwrightstone at worldnet.att.net Sat Sep 20 21:08:32 2003 From: jwwrightstone at worldnet.att.net (J Wayne Wrightstone) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: Apple Lisa Computers Message-ID: <000c01c37fe5$4d604920$6401a8c0@WAYNE8300> Is anyone in the NJ-NY area interested in buying two Apple Lisa Computers (Vintage about 1985-6). I have two computers with external hard disk, printer, software. They are in working condition. If you have any interest in these, please contact me. Wayne From mikeford at socal.rr.com Sat Sep 20 21:35:53 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: Mountain Hardware expansion chassis In-Reply-To: <20030920194003.10022.qmail@web40702.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030920192841.02bce370@pop-server.socal.rr.com> I found a courious item today, a Mountain Hardware expansion chassis for the Apple II. Its about the same foot print as a Apple II, but its taller and has a card that plugs into the host apple and provides like half a dozen slots. No clue what I may do with it, but had to grab it when I saw it at the swapmeet today. Another curious thing, a load of calculator sized terminals from Pacific Bell, but no clue about what exactly they do, so I didn't buy any (should be at swapmeet next week too). Nothing was obvious about the function, small 4 line lcd display, alphanumeric keypad, and from looking at a larger similar unit they attech to a typical POTS phone wire. From tothwolf at concentric.net Sat Sep 20 22:47:07 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: Mountain Hardware expansion chassis In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030920192841.02bce370@pop-server.socal.rr.com> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030920192841.02bce370@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Sep 2003, Mike Ford wrote: > Another curious thing, a load of calculator sized terminals from Pacific > Bell, but no clue about what exactly they do, so I didn't buy any > (should be at swapmeet next week too). Nothing was obvious about the > function, small 4 line lcd display, alphanumeric keypad, and from > looking at a larger similar unit they attech to a typical POTS phone > wire. Sounds like either a POTS line tester of some sort or a terminal for the old AT&T craft access system. Most likely the later. -Toth From cisin at xenosoft.com Sat Sep 20 22:42:20 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: Mountain Hardware expansion chassis In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030920192841.02bce370@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: <20030920204109.F46819@newshell.lmi.net> > > Another curious thing, a load of calculator sized terminals from Pacific > > Bell, but no clue about what exactly they do, so I didn't buy any > > (should be at swapmeet next week too). Nothing was obvious about the > > function, small 4 line lcd display, alphanumeric keypad, and from > > looking at a larger similar unit they attech to a typical POTS phone > > wire. > Sounds like either a POTS line tester of some sort or a terminal for the > old AT&T craft access system. Most likely the later. Did they appear to be MANUFACTURED by pacBell? There were also some TDDs in that size. From netsurfer_x1 at fastmailbox.net Sat Sep 20 23:23:09 2003 From: netsurfer_x1 at fastmailbox.net (David Vohs) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: Dinosaur Computer Company? Message-ID: <20030921042309.C49A43C3D0@www.fastmail.fm> I've posted this before, but got no answers. I'm trying again. Has anyone ever heard of a computer company called Dinosaur Computers? I had a friend tell me that such a company existed (with the same name, no less!), but I never found anything. Anyone ever heard of this company? -- David Vohs netsurfer_x1@fastmailbox.net -- http://www.fastmail.fm - The professional email service From nico at farumdata.dk Sat Sep 20 23:40:15 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: FS: NorthStar Software References: <3.0.6.32.20030920183841.007b9b40@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <002b01c37ffa$741fd2a0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> > > Keep in mind that these are HARD SECTORED floppy disks! I don't think > they're readable on any system except those that have a NS disk system. > > I have a couple of NIB NS WordStar packages around here somewhere. If no > one else wants them I'll add these to the collection. I've successfully read a number of hard sectored disks, even a C-64 on my conversion system, so if you need them converted, let me give it a try Nico From nico at farumdata.dk Sat Sep 20 23:42:42 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: Dinosaur Computer Company? References: <20030921042309.C49A43C3D0@www.fastmail.fm> Message-ID: <004a01c37ffa$cba2c6e0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> > Has anyone ever heard of a computer company called Dinosaur Computers? I > had a friend tell me that such a company existed (with the same name, no > less!), but I never found anything. Well I dont think you would appreciate 20.000 NO's in your mailbox, so presumable nobody in CC heard of it. I havnt, anyway Nico From evan947 at yahoo.com Sun Sep 21 00:24:31 2003 From: evan947 at yahoo.com (evan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: current status In-Reply-To: <007f01c37f7a$0eaf6820$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Message-ID: <20030921052431.20902.qmail@web14002.mail.yahoo.com> Jay, For the past month or so, I've been getting big bunches of messages every couple of days. It's quite frustrating. How do I change/fix this, so I get the messages in real-time? Have I accidentally signed up to get messages only after X amount of new ones exist? Thanks, Evan Koblentz --- Jay West wrote: > Geeze, the upgrade was certainly more painful than I > expected. There were > definitely a few gotcha's that weren't really > documented. > > It would appear that a lot of list traffic used to > show with an address of > cctalk-admin and cctech-admin. This has apparently > changed to cctalk-bounces > and cctech-bounces. Please adjust any filters or > mail rules that you may > have on your end accordingly. > > The above change caused a problem with the way the > two views (cctalk and > cctech) of the list were cross-linked. I *THINK* I > have this problem fixed, > can anyone let me know if they see strangeness in > this area directly > (offlist). I fixed this about 8:15 CST, so only for > posts sent well after > that. > > I'm still wading through things looking for issues > (I am sure there is > some). Let me know if you see anything! > > Jay > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com From zmerch at 30below.com Sun Sep 21 00:59:30 2003 From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: OT: Being bombarded by e-mail trojans In-Reply-To: <200309201415.37102.jcwren@jcwren.com> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030921015043.02a0c200@mail.30below.com> At 14:15 09/20/2003 -0400, you wrote: [snip] > I can't even think of a good example to compare these spamming > morons to. >Personally, I think CNN Headline News should run "Executions @ 8", where we >line up the spammers, walk down the line with a Colt .45, and put a round >through their face. Now waitaminit... I disagree... *some* folks might prefer a 9mm... if so, they should be given the chance to use that instead. Also, I could think of 1 target area that might be preferable than what you suggested... > And you get to enter a lottery for $2 if you want to be >the triggerman. That would be the first lottery I ever put money into... and methinks we could put quite a dent in the national debt... > If that doesn't slow them down, it's hard to imagine what >else will. Ditching SMTP for a totally secure (including accountability) protocol is the *only* way to bring the spam problem under control. A good start is here: http://cr.yp.to/im2000.html but it's far from complete; and it would take years to implement fully. Methinks some federal funding should be allocated -> IMHO it would be better spent there than $400 hammers... > There's just NO justification for their existence, past, present > or future. >And only a crongresscritter could fail to understand that. And you expected what? Par for the course, IMNSHO... > --John Roger "Merch" Merchberger From arcarlini at iee.org Sun Sep 21 04:45:17 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: SEL Lo2000 teleprinter ? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030920164741.007bc280@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <096701c38025$13e277a0$5b01a8c0@athlon> > Found one of these today. Can anyone tell me about this > teleprinter? I found DF3OE'S TELEPRINTER MUSEUM at > and it seems to have a lot of > information about it but IE locks up EVERYTIME that I connect > to his site. Seems to work fine using NS6: "Lo 2000/2001 1976 - 1985 5 level (bit) Baudot code page printer speed 50 - 100 bauds (switchable) metal type wheel printing mechanism first fully electronic teleprinter, available as ASR, KSR and ESR version ESR=Electronic Send and Receive, 4 kbyte memory microprozessor controlled machine from the peak of the TELEX era" Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From arcarlini at iee.org Sun Sep 21 06:29:25 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: Research Machines network? In-Reply-To: <20030801143910.60949.qmail@web21104.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <09bc01c38033$9fc6d000$5b01a8c0@athlon> > From: Jules Richardson > I don't suppose anybody happens to know the right value of > terminating resistors to use on a Research Machines network? > I was thinking of doing a health check on my old 480Z > fileserver, but can't remember what values I used last time. > I'm almost certain they were 50 ohm, but it'd be nice to know > for sure. You've just asked in some newsgroup or other for RML docs and software. I sent an email but your account seems to be over quota (maybe lost of people are offering you docs :-)). Anyway, I have a bunch of RML docs (service manuals and also random software docs). If you (or indeed anyone else) has somewhere I can ftp them too, let me know and I'll dig them out. It would be great if someone would host them and make them available for the world. Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From vcf at siconic.com Sun Sep 21 07:04:42 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: Research Machines network? In-Reply-To: <09bc01c38033$9fc6d000$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: On Sun, 21 Sep 2003, Antonio Carlini wrote: > You've just asked in some newsgroup or other for RML docs and > software. I sent an email but your account seems to be over > quota (maybe lost of people are offering you docs :-)). Nope, he's probably been spammed to death like the rest of the Internet. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Sun Sep 21 07:35:45 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: OT: Need HP PhotoSmart 215 driver CD Message-ID: Stupid, stupid, stupid. In this day and age, it's really lame when a company requires you to order a CD to get your hands on the drivers you need because of "licensing restrictions". It's even more lame when you try to enter your ZIP code to order the CD and the website comes back telling you that you've entered and invalid ZIP code (for any ZIP code entered). HP, I fart in your general direction. That being said, does ANYONE have the driver CD for the HP PhotoSmart 215? If so, please contact me. I haven't had any luck finding anything relevant on the web. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Sun Sep 21 07:42:42 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: Research Machines network? In-Reply-To: <09bc01c38033$9fc6d000$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: <20030921124242.83122.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com> Hiya, > You've just asked in some newsgroup or other for RML docs and > software. I sent an email but your account seems to be over > quota (maybe lost of people are offering you docs :-)). Sellam was exactly right - I'm drowning in a sea of 150KB virus emails here :\ (So far they don't seem to be showing any sign of slowing down either, so I'm semi-unobtainable until things die down a little) Thanks for thinking of posting here. > Anyway, I have a bunch of RML docs (service manuals and also > random software docs). If you (or indeed anyone else) has somewhere > I can ftp them too, let me know and I'll dig them out. It would > be great if someone would host them and make them available for > the world. Very much interested; those would be great. I don't have any 380Z or 480Z docs at all other than a 3rd party BASIC manual for the 480Z. Been searching for quite a few years too! Do you have an estimate for how much storage space would be needed? I can likely sort something out; certainly a temporary home until I can put something permanent together. cheers Jules ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From vcf at siconic.com Sun Sep 21 08:03:46 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: OT: Need P/S specs for Power Sentry USB hub (was OT: Need HP PhotoSmart 215 driver CD) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Nevermind. I found it at DriverGuide.com (I should've checked there first...DOH!) Ok, next question, I need the power supply specs for the Power Sentry USB hub. I opened it up to try to determine what it wants but am not savvy enough I guess. It has a 278R05 voltage regulator on it (listed here: http://www.lekwong.com/product_infor.htm#ic04 but no specs) but I have no data for it. I took a chance and tried a 4.5V DC supply but it didn't light up so I'm assuming either a) I killed it or b) that wasn't what it was looking for. Anyone know? Thanks! -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sun Sep 21 09:08:09 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: OT: Need P/S specs for Power Sentry USB hub (was OT: Need HP In-Reply-To: from "Vintage Computer Festival" at Sep 21, 3 06:03:46 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1048 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030921/c0965afc/attachment.ksh From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sun Sep 21 10:11:28 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: FS: NorthStar Software In-Reply-To: <002b01c37ffa$741fd2a0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> References: <3.0.6.32.20030920183841.007b9b40@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030921111128.007b3ad0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 06:40 AM 9/21/03 +0200, Nico wrote: >> >> Keep in mind that these are HARD SECTORED floppy disks! I don't think >> they're readable on any system except those that have a NS disk system. >> >> I have a couple of NIB NS WordStar packages around here somewhere. If no >> one else wants them I'll add these to the collection. > >I've successfully read a number of hard sectored disks, even a C-64 on my conversion system, so if you need them converted, let me give it a try Thanks for the offer but I doubt it's worth the effort. The complete WordStar package including all the xxxxStar companion programs were included with many early PCs and should still be relatively easy to find. I had (have?) the complete set with a Sanyo 550 that I bought in 1983. (I won't even talk about what a piece of crap the Sanyo was!) Joe > From vcf at siconic.com Sun Sep 21 10:27:00 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: OT: Need P/S specs for Power Sentry USB hub (was OT: Need HP In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sun, 21 Sep 2003, Tony Duell wrote: > >From the part number of the regulator I'd assume it was a 5V output part > (that would make snese -- a lot of electronics runs at 5V). In which case > the input voltage to the regulator is going to be a bit more than that -- > say 7-9V. Ok. > Of course you also need to determine if the thing wants AC or DC (is > there a bridge rectifier connected to the input socket), and if it's DC, > the polarity (Does one of the input socket pins go to the 0V rail, if so, > it's the -ve one). It's hard to tell. There's a diode from the center conductor to pin 1 of the regulator. The outer conductor (don't know the proper name) connects through another (much smaller, surface-mount type) diode, that then goes off to pin 4 of the regulator. Pin 2 of the regulator connects to some (again, very small) surface mount transistors. I can make a JPEG available if that would help. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From mbg at TheWorld.com Sun Sep 21 10:40:25 2003 From: mbg at TheWorld.com (Megan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: OT: Need HP PhotoSmart 215 driver CD Message-ID: <200309211540.LAA18604390@shell.TheWorld.com> >In this day and age, it's really lame when a company requires you to >order a CD to get your hands on the drivers you need because of >"licensing restrictions". It's even more lame when you try to enter your >ZIP code to order the CD and the website comes back telling you that >you've entered and invalid ZIP code (for any ZIP code entered). No kidding... my windows machine (the only machine I have running windows) recently ate itself and got so corrupted that I could no longer boot. I have backups of my own stuff, but needed to re-install W/ME. I pulled out the Recovery CD and booted it, expecting it to do something. Lo and behold it did nothing. I tried it several times, no joy. I called up Compaq (HP) support about it and ultimately found out that the recovery CD requires a partition on the machine to be usable (I knew it was there and had never touched it myself, but apparently it was too corrupted for the Recovery CD to use). I was totally blown away by the fact that I have a valid license for W/ME, but due to some lame decisions on either Compaq's part, or requirements for M$, no copy of Windows on a CD comes with my machine. So, I had to spend more money (only $18, but it is the principle of the thing) to get what they call the 'quickrestore' CD set. So I get that, and use it to restore the disk to from-factory condition (here's another gripe -- the 'from factory' condition requires the W/ME partition to be most of the disk, with the 2nd partition being an extended partition into which some recovery files are placed. Since it forces this and apparently checks for it, I don't see a way of partitioning the disk such that I can also have Linux). ... where was I ... Oh yeah... now the machine is in 'from-factory' condition, and I have to go through the welcome and setup screens to get to use it. But, the welcome screen doesn't display properly. Parts of it overlay other parts in such a way that I cannot read questions, find buttons to be clicked on, or field names to fill in a registration form. I remember this happening when I first got the machine, and a call to customer support eventually solved it, but since it is several years out of warrantee now, I cannot go that route (without paying for another year's support). I've been using the email support option, but so far all the suggestions (from a support center in India) have not resolved the problem. In fact, they have done little more than suggest I do the same things I've already done... I'm up to 'quick-restoring' the machine 5 times now. Personally, I'd like to see all companies who play such games be the target of a class action suit which would require them to supply to all original purchasers of computer systems true copies of the software which was 'factory installed', and for which the customer supposedly has a license. And if M$ has had anything to do with making them do it, then they should be included in the suit. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | email: mbg at world.std.com | | Member of Technical Staff | megan at savaje.com | | SavaJe Technologies, Inc. | (s/ at /@/) | | 100 Apollo Drive | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Chelmsford, MA 01824 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (978) 256 6521 (DEC '77-'98) | required." - mbg KB1FCA | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ From arcarlini at iee.org Sun Sep 21 11:36:12 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: Research Machines network? In-Reply-To: <20030921124242.83122.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <0b2d01c3805e$9cfe2b90$5b01a8c0@athlon> >Sellam was exactly right - I'm drowning in a sea of 150KB >virus emails here :\ (So far they don't seem to be showing >any sign of slowing down either, so I'm semi-unobtainable >until things die down a little) http://popfile.sourceforge.net has been a tremendous help since Friday (nearly 2000 of the bl**dy things!). Be careful when setting it up during the current flood - without some non-spam emails it can easily get to think that it's ALL spam! (So if the rest of you wouldn't mind upping the posting rate it would be very much appreciated .. :-)) > Very much interested; those would be great. I don't have any > 380Z or 480Z docs at all other than a 3rd party BASIC manual > for the 480Z. Been searching for quite a few years too! Two people have piped up so far so they'll be heading there first (see what happens when you don't sit in fron of the computer 24/7 :-)) so they'll be on the net soon, but I can upload directly to you once those transfers are done. > Do you have an estimate for how much storage space would be > needed? I can likely sort something out; certainly a > temporary home until I can put something permanent together. 525MB for the RM stuff. There's also 160+MB of Compaq 286 era (Tech Reference vols 1 & 2) if you want it. Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From Lee.Davison at merlincommunications.com Sun Sep 21 12:39:26 2003 From: Lee.Davison at merlincommunications.com (Davison, Lee) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: More new toys! Message-ID: <8B39793544120140B253EFE052E7ED0A0171DCCA@nbulif015> Yet another Commodore calculator for exactly the right price. This time it's a 796M mint in box (not even dusty) and working fully. Just the basic four function, % and memory but in black with 'chrome' highlight on the C= logo and the word Commodore. That's three so far this year for a total of $0.00 8^)= Lee. ________________________________________________________________________ This e-mail has been scanned for all viruses by Star Internet. The service is powered by MessageLabs. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working around the clock, around the globe, visit: http://www.star.net.uk ________________________________________________________________________ From cisin at xenosoft.com Sun Sep 21 15:22:29 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:02 2005 Subject: FS: NorthStar Software In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030921111128.007b3ad0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <3.0.6.32.20030920183841.007b9b40@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <3.0.6.32.20030921111128.007b3ad0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <20030921131719.H54411@newshell.lmi.net> > >> I have a couple of NIB NS WordStar packages around here somewhere. If no > >> one else wants them I'll add these to the collection. On Sun, 21 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: > Thanks for the offer but I doubt it's worth the effort. The complete > WordStar package including all the xxxxStar companion programs were > included with many early PCs and should still be relatively easy to find. I > had (have?) the complete set with a Sanyo 550 that I bought in 1983. (I > won't even talk about what a piece of crap the Sanyo was!) But the package sold for PC (and Sanyo) was MS-DOS 8088. The Northstar package was Z80. Was it CP/M or N*-DOS? Should I even bother bringing boxes of MicroPro diskettes to VCF? From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sun Sep 21 19:23:54 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: FS: NorthStar Software In-Reply-To: <20030921131719.H54411@newshell.lmi.net> References: <3.0.6.32.20030921111128.007b3ad0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <3.0.6.32.20030920183841.007b9b40@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <3.0.6.32.20030921111128.007b3ad0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030921202354.007ab6a0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 01:22 PM 9/21/03 -0700, you wrote: >> >> I have a couple of NIB NS WordStar packages around here somewhere. If no >> >> one else wants them I'll add these to the collection. >On Sun, 21 Sep 2003, Joe wrote: >> Thanks for the offer but I doubt it's worth the effort. The complete >> WordStar package including all the xxxxStar companion programs were >> included with many early PCs and should still be relatively easy to find. I >> had (have?) the complete set with a Sanyo 550 that I bought in 1983. (I >> won't even talk about what a piece of crap the Sanyo was!) > >But the package sold for PC (and Sanyo) was MS-DOS 8088. >The Northstar package was Z80. Was it CP/M or N*-DOS? I don't remember. It's been a while since I've seen it. It was on hard sectored disks for the NS so I'm guessing that it was for the NS OS. I think I had it for CM at one time, probably for the Osborne or Kaypro. Hmm, now that I think about it I'm pretty sure that I have it on the hard drive of my SB-180. > > >Should I even bother bringing boxes of MicroPro diskettes to VCF? You bet! > From ian_primus at yahoo.com Sun Sep 21 20:42:16 2003 From: ian_primus at yahoo.com (Ian Primus) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 Message-ID: Yesterday, I got an ASR33 teletype machine. So far, I have cleaned it a little, checked that everything seems to be oiled well, and fired it up. It seems to work well. All the characters print, and the type seems clear, although I need to clean the type assembly. The rubber hammer is still intact, but it is very soft, almost like a blob of silly putty. It held up well enough for testing, but I will soon replace that with a rubber foot as someone else on the list suggested. The tape punch seems to work fine too, I don't have any paper tape, so I trimmed some computer paper into strips for testing. I am having a couple of problems with it though: The paper tape reader doesn't seem to work. There is also a good chance that I don't know how to operate the paper tape reader... I punched a strip of paper with a string of text, then put it into the reader, and threw the switch next to the reader into the "Start" position. The teletype makes a lot of rattleing, but the tape doesn't run through the reader, and nothing prints. Some of the keys are cracked. A couple of the keytops have cracked out from the lettering, most notably the "Break" key, which gets stuck down because it is now slightly wider. The space bar sticks a little, and occasionally gets stuck down. Not far enough to jam, but far enough that hitting it again won't make a space, but typing other keys seems to jiggle it loose. It's like the spring or whatever recoil mechanism is loose or broken. The paper advance knob is cracked. I think I can glue it, but otherwise I will need to track down another. The cover is cracked, but that isn't really a big deal. I should be able to glue it back together. What type of glue is recommended for teletype plastic? Just regular wacky glue, or some sort of epoxy? The paper tape punch has quite a buildup of chad above the punch. It doesn't seem to be going down into the black tube at all. Is this normal? Also, what can I do about the chad, since I don't have the stand. I have the chad box, but I can't really attach it without the stand. I'll probably end up building something for it, or maybe propping it up with some blocks of wood so I can fit something under there, but weren't there desk models of the ASR33? What did they do with the chad? I also have some general teletype questions: What can I use for tape? I have access to a very powerful paper cutter, the kind that can cut a ream of paper cleanly in half. Can I just take some junk fanfold computer paper and cut it into strips? I know that some paper tape was fanfold like that, but I don't know if the perforations would tear apart too easily or not Likewise, what can I use for paper? Right now, I have just been loading single sheets of computer paper in, but I should just be able to remove the tractor holes from fanfold computer paper and run that through, right? Is the teletype capable of moving back a space? "Rubout" doesn't move the print head back, but I don't know if it should. I know the teletype can't erase, but I don't know if it can move backward. Where should I oil the mechanism? Right now, everything looks OK, but I should probably lubricate it someplace periodically, right? Similarly, what sort of oil should I use? Just regular household oil, or something lighter/heavier? Obviously not WD-40, however... What's the best way to clean the type cylinder? It is pretty dirty, but I am almost afraid to take it off to clean it, lest I get it on crooked or backward. I know I have cleaned the type bars on typewriters by just using an old toothbrush and some toothpicks to get the gunk out of the "O", etc. I would assume the same principle applies here, too. The platten is pretty hard. It works, but is there a way of replacing it, or maybe a way of reviving the rubber? I have heard of people reviving the plattens on old typewriters with some method. It's probably more trouble that it's worth, but I would like to hear what people have to say. And, of course, the inevitable question, how do I connect it to something? It has a cable fitted to it which I understand should be a current loop interface. It is a funny little six pin rectangular connector. I have found information on how to connect current loop to RS-232, but what pin does what? Was there a standard? I would very much like to be able to plug the teletype into a UNIX box or something, or maybe the Prime, but for any of those, I would need RS-232. Also, since the teletype can only print upper case, how does it render incoming text? Does it just ignore all lowercase characters, or does it print them uppercase? Does it send all uppercase or all lowercase? I have a Teleray terminal that renders all lowercase characters as uppercase, and uppercase as weird symbols, so I'm not sure what the teletype does. Thanks in advance! Ian Primus ian_primus@yahoo.com From aek at spies.com Sun Sep 21 20:58:34 2003 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 Message-ID: <200309220158.h8M1wYuw011784@spies.com> > What can I use for tape? oiled paper tape is still available from companies selling numerical control supplies. I'd bought from western numerical controls before: http://www.westnc.com/paptape.html From tothwolf at concentric.net Mon Sep 22 03:14:12 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sun, 21 Sep 2003, Ian Primus wrote: > Some of the keys are cracked. A couple of the keytops have cracked out > from the lettering, most notably the "Break" key, which gets stuck down > because it is now slightly wider. > The paper advance knob is cracked. I think I can glue it, but otherwise > I will need to track down another. > > The cover is cracked, but that isn't really a big deal. I should be able > to glue it back together. What type of glue is recommended for teletype > plastic? Just regular wacky glue, or some sort of epoxy? It all depends on what kind of plastics need to be bonded. For ABS plastics, a Methylene Chloride based solvent works very very well. (It does not work very well for ABS+PC blends, however. I seriously doubt you have any ABS+PC in the ARS33 though, since it is a pretty modern plastic.) Plastic model cement is pretty much useless these days, as they have removed nearly all of the solvent type chemicals from the product. Superglue/wacky glue/etc tend to be a very bad idea for most plastics, as they don't bond to it well and cause major cosmetic damage. If the keys/knob are bakelite, you might want to talk to folks who repair old radios, as cracked knobs are a common problem. I've not had to repair bakelite yet, so I can't recommend a specific method. I do know that you can't bond bakelite with a solvent as you would more modern plastics. Some type of epoxy might be the best method for bakelite. -Toth From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 22 03:26:16 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Kennedy 9610 manual needed (fwd) Message-ID: Can anyone help this guy out? See below. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 19:11:28 +0100 From: "Davis, Duane -Gil" To: Vintage Computer Festival Subject: RE: Kennedy 9610 manual Hi, Thank you for your quick response. I need the manual yesterday. Actually, I have a tape drive that I don't know if the drive is bad, or I have a BIG batch of bad tapes. There are buttons on the front of the drive that are for diagnostics, but I don't know how to run them. Again, thank you for the quick response. Duane Davis -----Original Message----- From: Vintage Computer Festival [mailto:vcf@siconic.com] Sent: Friday, September 19, 2003 11:03 AM To: Davis, Duane -Gil Subject: Re: Kennedy 9610 manual On Fri, 19 Sep 2003, Davis, Duane -Gil wrote: > I am trying to locate a manual for a Kennedy 9610 tape drive, hopefully in > pdf format. Hi Duane. I'm sorry but I don't have anything handy. I'm pretty sure I have this manual but it's tucked away in one of hundreds of boxes (I'm still unpacking after a move). How urgently do you need it? -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From RMaxwell at atlantissi.com Mon Sep 22 07:34:32 2003 From: RMaxwell at atlantissi.com (Robert Maxwell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: FS: NorthStar Software Message-ID: <9726BA9DE867D51183B900B0D0AB85F8013E4852@INETMAIL> Chris and Joe: I would like to express my interest in the NorthStar software, with this added little problem: the Horizon I have (free from a ham fleamarket) came with very little: no drives, one bootable disk, original owner's binder and some ACCPAC documentation. The drives were no problem, since the hardware accepted PC-leftover drives without issue. The bootable 5-1/4" floppy I carefully stored in such a safe place I can't find it anymore. I presume it's NDOS - I know it's not CP/M. I'm running Word- and CalcStar on my Kaypro, and I'm presuming that the -Stars you folks have are also CP/M applications... So a bootable N*CP/M disk would be essential to let me get the olde beast back on its feet/wheels/whatever. I'm located in Southern Ontario, Canada (Toronto region), and I'm willing to finance travel arrangements for disks and books - they're probably lighter than the computer itself! Let me know if you can help me out. If not, anybody local interested in a used NorthStar Horizon? I'm already running: Osborne-1 (not doing much since it was the Vancouver TurboBBS 1984-86), Kaypro 2-84 (general purpose terminal, floppy format converter and Ladder game), OSI Superboard (6502 development base for homebrew box), Amstrad PPC512 (packet radio terminal), 6502 homebrew (house watcher, soon to learn X-10), Sharp PC-1211 (BASIC calculator), Macintosh (another free box, previous owner wiped everything, including Netscape) and two '486 PeeCees... (I don't have spare room for non-working boxen :-) Regards, Bob > Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 18:23:03 -0400 > From: chris > Subject: FS: NorthStar Software > > I found a black boxed set of NorthStar software. The box it marked > InfoStar System, with three binders in it, DataStar, ReportStar, and > ReportStar Reference Manual. > > It appears to be complete, manuals and software. I'm guessing > it is some > kind of database and reporting system. I don't know exactly > what it is as > it has been years since I've even had a NorthStar computer. > > Its available if anyone wants it. Just send me any offer over > the cost of > shipping (must be higher than shipping cost... basically, I've got no > spare time to do things for free). > > If it doesn't sell here, I'll try it on ebay, and then it goes to the > dumpster. > > -chris > > > > Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 18:38:41 -0400 > From: Joe > Subject: Re: FS: NorthStar Software > >... > These are companion products to WordStar. They use wordstar > files and are > used for keeping databases and generating reports. There are > a couple of > othe related products; Mail-Merge and CalcStar (IIRC). > > Keep in mind that these are HARD SECTORED floppy disks! I > don't think > they're readable on any system except those that have a NS > disk system. > > I have a couple of NIB NS WordStar packages around here > somewhere. If no > one else wants them I'll add these to the collection. > > Joe > > > From jwest at classiccmp.org Mon Sep 22 08:16:11 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: HP2000 progress Message-ID: <003a01c3810b$b1cc85a0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> In the great HP2000 rebuild project, thanks to a huge bevy of spare parts from Bill, the IOP is now again singing with 32Kw! Yes, a happy snoopy dance was performed :) Now it's on to resurrecting a 7905 in a lowboy cabinet. Can't decide if I will use only 13037 style drives, or stick with multiple 7900's (or both). That should pretty much finish the runnable system restoration. Then the only thing left will be the refurb of the 2610 printer, and the 7261 mark sense card reader, but those certainly aren't required to run the system. Thanks Bill!!! Jay West --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] From Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com Mon Sep 22 09:09:31 2003 From: Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com (Feldman, Robert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 Message-ID: For styrene, butyrate, and ABS (and the plastics in HP -- at least calculators and 95/200LX -- and grey Toshiba laptop cases), try Tenax 7R, available at well-supplied hobby shops or mailorder from Micro-Mark (www.micromark.com). It's a water-thin solvent. For wider cracks, you can disolve some plastic in a small amount of solvent and flow that into the crack. -----Original Message----- From: Tothwolf [mailto:tothwolf@concentric.net] Sent: Monday, September 22, 2003 3:14 AM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: Re: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 Plastic model cement is pretty much useless these days, as they have removed nearly all of the solvent type chemicals from the product. From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 22 10:16:45 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: ISO: Cheap/Free rack cabinet Message-ID: Anyone in the NJ area have a spare rack cabinet they want to part with for cheap or free? I have to consolidate three different groups of servers all into one closet, and I think a rack cabinet may make my life easiest. -chris From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 22 12:10:37 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Digital Celbris XL5100DP computer Message-ID: I'm not sure this is really on topic yet, but I know there are a bunch of DEC fans on the list. I have a Digital Celbris XL5100DP computer here. It looks to be a fairly standard Pentium PC, except that its processor daughtercard has room for a 2nd CPU (I'm assuming the DP in the name is Dual Processor). Its currently untested, but I believe that it works (IIRC, the person that gave it to me said it works, I've never done anything with it since I got it) Is this something anyone is interested in? Being that it is dual processor and DEC, I felt I should specifically list it and offer it before I toss it. Its a mini tower case, and weighs about the same as a normal WinTel mini tower PC. I'd rather it be a pickup item, but if there is a DEC fan that *simply has to have it*, I'm sure we can work something out with shipping. -chris From dwoyciesjes at comcast.net Mon Sep 22 12:31:37 2003 From: dwoyciesjes at comcast.net (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Digital Celbris XL5100DP computer References: Message-ID: <3F6F31F9.87383EEB@comcast.net> chris wrote: > > I'm not sure this is really on topic yet, but I know there are a bunch of > DEC fans on the list. > > I have a Digital Celbris XL5100DP computer here. It looks to be a fairly > standard Pentium PC, except that its processor daughtercard has room for > a 2nd CPU (I'm assuming the DP in the name is Dual Processor)... > >... > I'd rather it be a pickup item, but if there is a DEC fan that *simply > has to have it*, I'm sure we can work something out with shipping. > I would say yes, but since that's probably only a Pentium 100, my Prioris 5100 HX MP/4 beats that. Double the (possible) CPU, and twice as wide. :) BTW, does anybody have 2 Pentium 150 CPUs running around? Hopefully a matched pair for a dual CPU setup. Even better, does anyone have 4 matched P-150 CPUs? I have one pair so far, but I'd like to upgrade my quad CPU box from a 5100 to a 5150... -- --- Dave Woyciesjes --- ICQ# 905818 From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 22 12:50:57 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Digital Celbris XL5100DP computer Message-ID: > I would say yes, but since that's probably only a Pentium 100, my >Prioris 5100 HX MP/4 beats that. Double the (possible) CPU, and twice as >wide. :) Yes, it may be a P100. IIRC, when I was given it, I was told it was a dual 100 MHz Pentium Pro. However, when I checked just before there is only one chip in it, and although I myself have not checked, Sridhar looked at it when taking other stuff over the weekend and said it was not a Pentium Pro chip (maybe he remembers what the speed was). BTW: Dave, I have your tape decks, plus the 2nd matching Sony (so 3 decks total), plus I'm going to test one of the 13" TV/VCR's for you and bring you one with a working TV (none have working VCRs). Looks like I'll be bringing the stuff up some time in Oct... the wife wants to hit Mystic Seaport, and when I was talking about it in front of my brother, he wants to take his kids as well... so it will be a day trip and I'll just swing by to hand you the stuff. (and yes, the 2nd paragraph should be off-list, but I'm too damn lazy to start a different email) -chris From pete at dunnington.u-net.com Mon Sep 22 12:52:54 2003 From: pete at dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 In-Reply-To: Tothwolf "Re: Reviving and connecting an ASR33" (Sep 22, 3:14) References: Message-ID: <10309221852.ZM3922@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> On Sep 22, 3:14, Tothwolf wrote: > On Sun, 21 Sep 2003, Ian Primus wrote: > > > The cover is cracked, but that isn't really a big deal. I should be able > > to glue it back together. What type of glue is recommended for teletype > > plastic? Just regular wacky glue, or some sort of epoxy? > > For ABS plastics, a Methylene Chloride based solvent works very very well. > (It does not work very well for ABS+PC blends, however. I seriously doubt > you have any ABS+PC in the ARS33 though, since it is a pretty modern > plastic.) I repaired mine with MEK. I believe Tenax 7R (which Robert Feldman mentioned) is based on acetone, so it should be fairly similar. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York From jrkeys at concentric.net Mon Sep 22 13:10:27 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Weekend finds in Tulsa and St. Louis Message-ID: <006a01c38134$ce96d5e0$d20add40@oemcomputer> Stopped in Tulsa Saturday for their first annual Gamer show and it was small but fun. Picked up a few items for the gaming collection. Also Sunday as we were leaving we stopped at 2 flea markets and a thrift store there in Tulsa. Here's a short list: 2- Neo Geo's one black and one blue, I left a silver one as it was damaged. Got one game cartridge. A new still sealed copy of Custer's Revenge by Mystique. A Timex Sinclair 1500. A handheld game called baseball2 by Entex from 1979. A Sears electronic Basketball handheld from 1980. A MERLIN handheld. Many cartridges for various machines like the Vic 20, 2600, Atari 400, N64, Talking Whiz-Kid, NES, PSOne, and others. A Compaq C120+ PDA with everything. Many more items then can be listed for now as I have still not unpacked everything. While in St. Louis at a thrift there I got a new in the box Cisco 1700 router for $24.95 ( I did a Google and it goes from $600 to $950 used and $900+ to $1200+ new). Sorry off topic but it was a sweet deal. Picked up a few other items while in St. Louis also. From jrkeys at concentric.net Mon Sep 22 13:13:41 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Atari 2600 for $600 Message-ID: <008001c38135$4199e3c0$d20add40@oemcomputer> Check it out! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2753252186 From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Mon Sep 22 14:17:53 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: ACW and user ports In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030922191753.46036.qmail@web21106.mail.yahoo.com> --- Tony Duell wrote: > The user manual I have for the machine shows a back panel layout with a > user port connector (looks to be a DB25). Tony, I just got time to open up my machine - the user port isn't connected to anything on mine either. Maybe someone else has confirmed this as being the same on all the machines by now anyway - I'm still getting a fraction of the classiccmp messages I should be getting due to these darn virus emails. FYI, anyhow... If you can do the mod without damaging the back panel I'd say go for it; you're right about it being a likely period mod (or it would have been if the ACW production run had been higher!) cheers Jules ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From geoffreythomas at onetel.net.uk Mon Sep 22 14:57:25 2003 From: geoffreythomas at onetel.net.uk (Geoffrey Thomas) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 References: Message-ID: <002201c38143$bf640160$35494ed5@geoff> I find Loctite 406 superglue - for plastics and rubber - good for most plastics - sometimes you can get a damn near invisible mend with it. My local plastic upvc window centre sells it at about ?4 for a 20g bottle. Do you have this glue in the states ? Geoff. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tothwolf" To: Sent: Monday, September 22, 2003 9:14 AM Subject: Re: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 > On Sun, 21 Sep 2003, Ian Primus wrote: > > > Some of the keys are cracked. A couple of the keytops have cracked out > > from the lettering, most notably the "Break" key, which gets stuck down > > because it is now slightly wider. > > > The paper advance knob is cracked. I think I can glue it, but otherwise > > I will need to track down another. > > > > The cover is cracked, but that isn't really a big deal. I should be able > > to glue it back together. What type of glue is recommended for teletype > > plastic? Just regular wacky glue, or some sort of epoxy? > > It all depends on what kind of plastics need to be bonded. > > For ABS plastics, a Methylene Chloride based solvent works very very well. > (It does not work very well for ABS+PC blends, however. I seriously doubt > you have any ABS+PC in the ARS33 though, since it is a pretty modern > plastic.) Plastic model cement is pretty much useless these days, as they > have removed nearly all of the solvent type chemicals from the product. > Superglue/wacky glue/etc tend to be a very bad idea for most plastics, as > they don't bond to it well and cause major cosmetic damage. > > If the keys/knob are bakelite, you might want to talk to folks who repair > old radios, as cracked knobs are a common problem. I've not had to repair > bakelite yet, so I can't recommend a specific method. I do know that you > can't bond bakelite with a solvent as you would more modern plastics. Some > type of epoxy might be the best method for bakelite. > > -Toth From paul at frixxon.co.uk Mon Sep 22 15:24:57 2003 From: paul at frixxon.co.uk (Paul Williams) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Research Machines network? In-Reply-To: <0b2d01c3805e$9cfe2b90$5b01a8c0@athlon> References: <0b2d01c3805e$9cfe2b90$5b01a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: <3F6F5A99.6060106@frixxon.co.uk> Antonio Carlini wrote: > > Two people have piped up so far so they'll be heading there > first (see what happens when you don't sit in fron of the > computer 24/7 :-)) so they'll be on the net soon, but I > can upload directly to you once those transfers are done. The 21 manuals from Antonio are now online. Suck 'em up! http://vt100.net/rm/docs/ - Paul From healyzh at aracnet.com Mon Sep 22 15:30:16 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Weekend finds in Tulsa and St. Louis In-Reply-To: <006a01c38134$ce96d5e0$d20add40@oemcomputer> from "Keys" at Sep 22, 2003 01:10:27 PM Message-ID: <200309222030.h8MKUGFW008718@onyx.spiritone.com> > 2- Neo Geo's one black and one blue, I left a silver one as it was damaged. > Got one game cartridge. I take it that these are the Handhelds? When you say Neo Geo most of us that know what they are probably think of the AES (home) or MVS (arcade) systems. Any true gamer needs either an AES or a MVS system! The handhelds are pretty nice as well, they're actually better than the original Gameboy Advance systems (the ones that don't have the backlight). On a Neo Geo note, I finally got in my shipment of "Shock Boxes" for all my MVS carts! Now to get labels made for them for all the carts :^) Zane From tothwolf at concentric.net Mon Sep 22 15:55:37 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Sep 2003, Feldman, Robert wrote: > From: Tothwolf [mailto:tothwolf@concentric.net] > > > Plastic model cement is pretty much useless these days, as they have > > removed nearly all of the solvent type chemicals from the product. > > For styrene, butyrate, and ABS (and the plastics in HP -- at least > calculators and 95/200LX -- and grey Toshiba laptop cases), try Tenax > 7R, available at well-supplied hobby shops or mailorder from Micro-Mark > (www.micromark.com). It's a water-thin solvent. For wider cracks, you > can disolve some plastic in a small amount of solvent and flow that into > the crack. Have you tried that product on ABS+PC blends? I've not found anything suitable for those yet. All the solvents I've tried left the joint very brittle. The only plastics I've found to be more difficult are nylon and teflon (seemingly near impossible to bond back together). -Toth From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 22 15:38:21 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: 3Com EtherLink/MC Message-ID: Was someone on this list looking for a 3Com EtherLink/MC card? Its an MCA bus Ethernet card with BNC and AUI connectors. I have one. I'm taking offers for it (all offers must be at least $1.00 plus shipping). -chris From tothwolf at concentric.net Mon Sep 22 16:05:01 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Digital Celbris XL5100DP computer In-Reply-To: <3F6F31F9.87383EEB@comcast.net> References: <3F6F31F9.87383EEB@comcast.net> Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Sep 2003, David Woyciesjes wrote: > chris wrote: > > > I have a Digital Celbris XL5100DP computer here. It looks to be a > > fairly standard Pentium PC, except that its processor daughtercard has > > room for a 2nd CPU (I'm assuming the DP in the name is Dual > > Processor)... > > I would say yes, but since that's probably only a Pentium 100, my > Prioris 5100 HX MP/4 beats that. Double the (possible) CPU, and twice as > wide. :) > > BTW, does anybody have 2 Pentium 150 CPUs running around? Hopefully a > matched pair for a dual CPU setup. Even better, does anyone have 4 > matched P-150 CPUs? I have one pair so far, but I'd like to upgrade my > quad CPU box from a 5100 to a 5150... I'm still looking for a matched pair of 150s myself. I'm starting to wonder if I should just look for another single 150 to match the one I've already got. -Toth From Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com Mon Sep 22 15:46:01 2003 From: Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com (Feldman, Robert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 Message-ID: >> For ABS plastics, a Methylene Chloride based solvent works very very well. >> (It does not work very well for ABS+PC blends, however. I seriously doubt >> you have any ABS+PC in the ARS33 though, since it is a pretty modern >> plastic.) >I repaired mine with MEK. I believe Tenax 7R (which Robert Feldman >mentioned) is based on acetone, so it should be fairly similar. >-- >Pete Peter Turnbull > Network Manager > University of York I checked the MSDS online, and it's Methylene Chloride. Bob From tothwolf at concentric.net Mon Sep 22 16:10:42 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Atari 2600 for $600 In-Reply-To: <008001c38135$4199e3c0$d20add40@oemcomputer> References: <008001c38135$4199e3c0$d20add40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Sep 2003, Keys wrote: > Check it out! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2753252186 There is a ton of stuff included though. I'm really not too surprised that someone would fork over that much money to acquire such a complete collection in one go. -Toth From jwest at classiccmp.org Mon Sep 22 15:52:30 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Weekend finds in Tulsa and St. Louis References: <200309222030.h8MKUGFW008718@onyx.spiritone.com> Message-ID: <017f01c3814b$704360a0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> What?? You were in St. Louis and didn't stop by?? I could have used some help rackmounting stuff *G* --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] From gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org Mon Sep 22 15:52:50 2003 From: gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org (Gunther Schadow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: VAX 11/780 is getting ready to run, UDA50 diagnostics, how? Message-ID: <3F6F6122.4080705@aurora.regenstrief.org> Hi, with great pleasure I can announce that I have my VAX 11/780 almost running. If you search the archives you will recall that I got an error in the microdiagnostics at test 54. If I had only paid attention to what someone had written on the label of the micro diagnostics floppy label: "remove ethernet card or test 54 will fail!". With that card removed, the test succeeded. The basic CPU diagnostics fails since last winter though (failing module: M8230) but other tests are still passing, so I expect I can replace that module later. >From my selfmade DUABOO file the machine does run for a moment but then hangs during the boot and the disk is never accessed. My UDA50 card actually does something: the LED cycling pattern stops and the other LED set signals that it's stuck in phase 3 of something. But hey, that is good news, since it means that the boot process actually talks to the UDA50 on the UNIBUS!!!! Tonight I'm going to check the UNIBUS wiring in section C, where that special bridge needs to be interrupted. This could explain why the UDA50 isn't functioning properly. Now some question to you veterans: I actually have a UDA50 diagnostics floppy and also a DIAG SUPERVISOR floppy. Yet I don't know how to run any of those. Don't even know how to look at the directory of those floppies, because @DIR is a command file that is only on the console floppy. So, how is this diagnostics started? I even have a second RX01 floppy drive installed, just don't know how to use it with the console program (I guess I would like to make myself some copies of the critical floppies before bitrot sets in.) Finally, since I now have the 11/785 board set and KA785 backplane complete, does anyone have the console and diagnostics floppies for the 11/785? thanks,, -Gunther From julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk Mon Sep 22 15:54:27 2003 From: julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Research Machines network? In-Reply-To: <3F6F5A99.6060106@frixxon.co.uk> Message-ID: <20030922205427.95179.qmail@web21110.mail.yahoo.com> Guys, > > Two people have piped up so far so they'll be heading there > > first (see what happens when you don't sit in fron of the > > computer 24/7 :-)) so they'll be on the net soon, but I > > can upload directly to you once those transfers are done. > > The 21 manuals from Antonio are now online. Suck 'em up! > > http://vt100.net/rm/docs/ Fantastic!! :-) I take it they're all just straight image scans of pages, encapsulated in pdf files at present? I hope that's what accounts for the lare file sizes! Presumably the items in plain text with no link haven't been found yet? I wish the docs for the fileserver which I have hadn't been recycled by the school at which it lived before I got hold of the machine :-( Chances of finding those docs are pretty slim to say the least. Great effort though! cheers Jules ===== Backward conditioning: putting saliva in a dog's mouth in an attempt to make a bell ring. ________________________________________________________________________ Want to chat instantly with your online friends? Get the FREE Yahoo! Messenger http://mail.messenger.yahoo.co.uk From musicman38 at comcast.net Mon Sep 22 15:54:30 2003 From: musicman38 at comcast.net (musicman38) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Atari 2600 for $600 References: <008001c38135$4199e3c0$d20add40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <000901c3814b$b8c42b20$0200a8c0@alico01.fl.comcast.net> Wow ! Who would have thought someone would pay so much the that collection. Now if the seller had kept all the original boxes and manuals for each Cartridge, I would have been bidding on that collection. I bet if I dug through all my old Atari 2600 stuff, I could easly come up with 100 different cartridges. I used to buy these at yard sales everytime I saw then cheep. My last find at a yard sale was a mint 2600 still in the original box, and about 25 Carts all for $5.. He He !! > Check it out! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2753252186 From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 22 16:03:58 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 In-Reply-To: from "Ian Primus" at Sep 21, 3 09:42:16 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 6375 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030922/ac3a9843/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 22 16:22:11 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: ACW and user ports In-Reply-To: <20030922191753.46036.qmail@web21106.mail.yahoo.com> from "=?iso-8859-1?q?Jules=20Richardson?=" at Sep 22, 3 08:17:53 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1633 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030922/7a89f9bd/attachment.ksh From healyzh at aracnet.com Mon Sep 22 17:02:12 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Atari 2600 for $600 In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Sep 22, 2003 04:10:42 PM Message-ID: <200309222202.h8MM2C8U011884@onyx.spiritone.com> > On Mon, 22 Sep 2003, Keys wrote: > > > Check it out! > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2753252186 > > There is a ton of stuff included though. I'm really not too surprised that > someone would fork over that much money to acquire such a complete > collection in one go. > > -Toth It's worth noting that only two people went over $333. It's a nice collection, but I'm not convinced it warrents the price. Zane From dzubint at vcn.bc.ca Mon Sep 22 17:14:36 2003 From: dzubint at vcn.bc.ca (Thomas Dzubin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Old Computer Usage Message-ID: On Thu Sep 18 14:49:22 2003, Robert Little wrote: > Okay, just a quick show of hands... > How many of us out there actually use the systems we > have on a fairly regular basis? Personally, all of my ... (Sorry, I'm a bit late to this thread) This might be stretching the definition of "Old Computer", but... I use my 1978-era TI-57 programmable calculator daily and when I'm stressed out, I still pull out my circa-1989 GameBoy with Tetris or I head to my basement and plug in the Mattel Intellivision for a game or two. My 1989/1990 VAXen get regular use surfing the 'net (I use the Lynx text browser...I'm a die-hard text/command line guy) (although my VAX consoles are fairly new '386 laptops running MS-Kermit) Thomas Dzubin From jrkeys at concentric.net Mon Sep 22 17:17:32 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Weekend finds in Tulsa and St. Louis References: <200309222030.h8MKUGFW008718@onyx.spiritone.com> Message-ID: <010f01c38157$52af1690$d20add40@oemcomputer> Sorry, yes they are the pocket units. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Zane H. Healy" To: Sent: Monday, September 22, 2003 3:30 PM Subject: Re: Weekend finds in Tulsa and St. Louis > > 2- Neo Geo's one black and one blue, I left a silver one as it was damaged. > > Got one game cartridge. > > I take it that these are the Handhelds? When you say Neo Geo most of us > that know what they are probably think of the AES (home) or MVS (arcade) > systems. Any true gamer needs either an AES or a MVS system! The > handhelds are pretty nice as well, they're actually better than the original > Gameboy Advance systems (the ones that don't have the backlight). > > On a Neo Geo note, I finally got in my shipment of "Shock Boxes" for all my > MVS carts! Now to get labels made for them for all the carts :^) > > Zane > > From paul at frixxon.co.uk Mon Sep 22 17:52:01 2003 From: paul at frixxon.co.uk (Paul Williams) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Research Machines network? In-Reply-To: <20030922205427.95179.qmail@web21110.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030922205427.95179.qmail@web21110.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3F6F7D11.1010508@frixxon.co.uk> Jules Richardson wrote: > I take it they're all just straight image scans of pages, encapsulated in pdf > files at present? I hope that's what accounts for the lare file sizes! Yes. I forgot to mention that they are being OCRed overnight, and I'll link in the raw text later. > Presumably the items in plain text with no link haven't been found yet? I've just had a quick read of some of the manuals to find those other references. I'll try to make a list of the software I've got as well. I think it's mostly Heinemann titles, but I can't remember whether it's for the 380Z or 480Z. - Paul From ptremewe at bigpond.net.au Mon Sep 22 17:52:56 2003 From: ptremewe at bigpond.net.au (peter tremewen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Apple IIe 3.5 inch FDD References: <008001c38135$4199e3c0$d20add40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <02bd01c3815c$43bf7120$21378490@vic.bigpond.net.au> Hi all, Can anyone tell me the besat place to get info on the 3.5 inch FDD for the Apple IIe?? Is it possibl;e to modify a standard IBM 3.5 inch FDD to work with the apple?? Yes, I understand it would be a serious modification. Has anyonme heard of it being done?? I understand the Apple II uses a special drive interface, can this be conected up to the 3.5 inch drive hardware and be used to drive them?? It's just so much easier to obtain 3.5 inch disks nowdays that a bit of fiddling around seems worth it. Hope to hear from you all soon Peter T. From tothwolf at concentric.net Mon Sep 22 18:52:45 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Sep 2003, Feldman, Robert wrote: > > > For ABS plastics, a Methylene Chloride based solvent works very very > > > well. (It does not work very well for ABS+PC blends, however. I > > > seriously doubt you have any ABS+PC in the ARS33 though, since it is > > > a pretty modern plastic.) > > > > I repaired mine with MEK. I believe Tenax 7R (which Robert Feldman > > mentioned) is based on acetone, so it should be fairly similar. > > I checked the MSDS online, and it's Methylene Chloride. I guess that won't work for the ABS+PC blends either. I've got a couple of laptops with cracked shells that use that blend of plastic :/ -Toth From allain at panix.com Mon Sep 22 19:12:33 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Digital Celbris XL5100DP computer References: Message-ID: <000b01c38167$631a7a00$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> > (and yes, the 2nd paragraph should be off-list, but I'm too > damn lazy to start a different email) Yeah, and you were busy all _weekend_. Guess the least I can do is say thanks alot, nice sale, I had fun. John A. From allain at panix.com Mon Sep 22 19:13:30 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Digital Celbris XL5100DP computer References: <3F6F31F9.87383EEB@comcast.net> Message-ID: <001101c38167$858c87e0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Is this a native SCSI? If so I could probably take it. 50-50. John A. From ian_primus at yahoo.com Mon Sep 22 19:23:04 2003 From: ian_primus at yahoo.com (Ian Primus) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <19238DEE-ED5C-11D7-9D00-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> >> The paper tape reader doesn't seem to work. There is also a good >> chance >> that I don't know how to operate the paper tape reader... I punched a > > Do you have the reader PSU connected? This is a PCB in a metal box that > was often fitted in the stand. Sometimes it was fitted inside the > machine, on top of the 'call control unit' at the right hand side. But > if > your machine was removed from a stand, it's possible the reader PSU is > missing. > It looks like the reader PSU is there, I followed the wires from the reader unit, and they branch off into two smaller bundles at the back of the power supply, one which goes to a large molex connector on the back of the power supply/CCU, and one that leads near the front of the machine, to a metal plate with a board on it, that contains a couple large capacitors, a relay, a fuse, etc,. This plate is mounted behind the knob on the front, and bears the warning "Warning: High Voltage", so I am assuming that this is a power supply. Also, I would assume that this is taking up what space would otherwise have been used by an acoustic coupler or modem or similar device. >> strip of paper with a string of text, then put it into the reader, and >> threw the switch next to the reader into the "Start" position. The >> teletype makes a lot of rattleing, but the tape doesn't run through >> the >> reader, and nothing prints. > > OK, sounds as though the transmitter clutch is releasing, as it should > do. THen the contacts on top of the transmitter shaft (rear right > corner > of the 'typing unit', normally with white and black wires) should close > for every revoulution of the camshaft to energise the reader solenoid. > You might want to check these contacts (warning -- this is _NOT_ > isolated > from the mains!) > Everything appears fine back there, the little arm is hitting a leaf switch with a cover that says "Caution High Voltage". and it looks like it's making good contact. I haven't tested it with a multimeter though, right now I'm betting that the reader is waiting to be activated by the computer. >> The cover is cracked, but that isn't really a big deal. I should be >> able to glue it back together. What type of glue is recommended for >> teletype plastic? Just regular wacky glue, or some sort of epoxy? > > Get some 'plasic weld' or whatever it's called over there. It's > basically > dichloromethane (methylene chloride), and is a solvent for the plastic. > Put the broken bits together and run a brush dipped in said solvent > along > the crack. It'll disolve the plasic and fuse it together. if you want > to > make a really strong repair, get a piece of fabric (I am not sure what > I > used, ask your wife/girlfried/SO for an offcut of shirt, or something > :-)) and put it on the back of the join. Then brush more solvent onto > that and force it into the plastic. I haven't gotten around to tracking down any chemicals or glue yet, the cover is a minor priority, my main concern is getting it talking to something . That sounds like a good idea, I'll have to see if I can find some methylene chloride. What sort of plastic are teletype cases made of? I always assumed it would be a hard, brittle plastic like bakelite, but it is more resilient and lighter than that. I don't think it's ABS, maybe it's PVC? >> >> The paper tape punch has quite a buildup of chad above the punch. It >> doesn't seem to be going down into the black tube at all. Is this > > This is pretty normnal. In the end you get enough up there for the top > bits to fall off and go down the tube. OK, that makes sense. I think I need to clean the tube out though, I just noticed a gunky glob of oily sticky chad at the end of the tube, where it should dump into the chad box. > >> normal? Also, what can I do about the chad, since I don't have the >> stand. I have the chad box, but I can't really attach it without the >> stand. I'll probably end up building something for it, or maybe > > Run it with the punch overhanging the desk and arrange some kind of box > under it. That's what I did with my first ASR33 Good idea. I can't believe I didn't think of that... >> single sheets of computer paper in, but I should just be able to >> remove >> the tractor holes from fanfold computer paper and run that through, >> right? > > It should print on just about anything.... Hmm, maybe I should try using that roll towel they have in at work. It's more like writing paper than paper towel anyway, and I have used it to write down wire foot markings and stuff while running cable plenty of times. (there is never scrap paper around when you need it) As for paper tape, I should probably order some of the proper oiled tape, but will using unoiled tape damage the punch? Right now, I have been punching a couple strips of regular computer paper, trimmed down to an inch wide. Will this hurt the mechanism, or is it safe to use plain unoiled paper. I have access to equipment that can easily cut junk fanfold paper into one inch strips, and it can also cut a roll of adding machine tape down to size as well. This would be cheap and fast, but I wouldn't want to damage my machine to save a few bucks on paper tape. >> >> Where should I oil the mechanism? Right now, everything looks OK, but >> I >> should probably lubricate it someplace periodically, right? Similarly, >> what sort of oil should I use? Just regular household oil, or >> something >> lighter/heavier? Obviously not WD-40, however... > > Get the ASR33 maintenace manuals (I think Al Kossow has them on-line). > About half of one volume covers lubrication. For 'oil' use something > like > 3-in-1 or other light machine oil. For 'grease' use a normal high > melting > point grease like you use for general greasing on the car. I'll have to hunt for those on the 'net, the manual would be very useful. >> And, of course, the inevitable question, how do I connect it to >> something? It has a cable fitted to it which I understand should be a >> current loop interface. It is a funny little six pin rectangular > > Yes, either a 20mA or 60mA loop (this is selecatable in the call > control > unit). Again you want the manuals. The pinout of any external connector > is _not_ standard, but the wiring to the barrier strip on the back of > the > call control unit is. That will be a big help. > > Hang on, _6_ wires? That could mean you have remote reader control > (many > computer-interfaced teletypes had this), which could explain the reader > problems. Every manufacturer did this his own way, but they were > actually > all fairly similar, so if you get the docs for one (the DEC one is > probably the easiest to find), it will help in figuring out any mods > you > have. This teletype isn't a _true_ ASR-33. It is actually a rebadged ASR-33 called a General Electric Datanet 730. I kinda forgot about that earlier, I have been working with the cover off, and I always just think of it as an ASR-33. That, and all the internal parts say TeleType. I would assume that it is meant for computer control, and it appears to have the reader power supply mounted internally. If it is that the other two wires are meant to control the reader, what do I need to do to activate the reader. Since this will be connected to a PC running Linux initially, I don't think that there will be a convenient way to control the reader from the computer. Is there a way of just rigging up a switch, or temporarily disabling remote reader control? One of these days, I hope to get a computer that can talk to the teletype properly, but for the time being, it will have to be used with either a Linux based PC or eventually on my Prime 5340 once I get an OS to load on the Prime (another ongoing project...) >> connector. I have found information on how to connect current loop to >> RS-232, but what pin does what? Was there a standard? I would very >> much >> like to be able to plug the teletype into a UNIX box or something, or >> maybe the Prime, but for any of those, I would need RS-232. Also, >> since >> the teletype can only print upper case, how does it render incoming >> text? Does it just ignore all lowercase characters, or does it print >> them uppercase? Does it send all uppercase or all lowercase? I have a > > It prints lowercase characters as uppercase (basically, it ignores bit > 5 > for letters IIRC). It sends all characters as upper case from the > keyboard. > > The punch and reasder correctly handle all 8 bits, though, so you can > copy a tape with upper and lower case characters (or, indeed a binary > program tape) without problems. Hmm, if it sends all characters as uppercase, I will need some way to change the PC to recognize that and convert it all back to lowercase or something, since all of the UNIX commands are lower case. I assume there is probably a setting in Linux somewhere to do that. At least it's ASCII and not Baudot. That would be lots of fun... Ian Primus ian_primus@yahoo.com From ghldbrd at ccp.com Mon Sep 22 19:31:17 2003 From: ghldbrd at ccp.com (ghldbrd@ccp.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Apple IIe 3.5 inch FDD In-Reply-To: <02bd01c3815c$43bf7120$21378490@vic.bigpond.net.au> References: <008001c38135$4199e3c0$d20add40@oemcomputer> <02bd01c3815c$43bf7120$21378490@vic.bigpond.net.au> Message-ID: <1756.65.123.179.137.1064277077.squirrel@webmail.ccp.com> ISTR that the Apple drive is a DSDD mechanism, and that GCR encoding is used, not a standard FM/MFM. So you need the Apple drive no matter how you slice it. And you need another disk controller card to match it. I have a fist full of salvaged 3.5 drives, unknown condition that I know should work on my IIc+ or a IIgs, but I don't know of any other use for them. Maybe the IIe could only use the Unidrive 3.5. Help me out there, apple nuts . . . . Gary Hildebrand St. JOseph, MO > Hi all, > > Can anyone tell me the besat place to get info on the 3.5 inch FDD > for the Apple IIe?? Is it possibl;e to modify a standard IBM 3.5 inch FDD > to > work with the apple?? Yes, I understand it would be a serious > modification. > Has anyonme heard of it being done?? I understand the Apple II uses a > special drive interface, can this be conected up to the 3.5 inch drive > hardware and be used to drive them?? It's just so much easier to obtain > 3.5 > inch disks nowdays that a bit of fiddling around seems worth it. > > Hope to hear from you all soon > > Peter T. > > > > From ian_primus at yahoo.com Mon Sep 22 19:31:22 2003 From: ian_primus at yahoo.com (Ian Primus) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Apple IIe 3.5 inch FDD In-Reply-To: <02bd01c3815c$43bf7120$21378490@vic.bigpond.net.au> Message-ID: <42238316-ED5D-11D7-9D00-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> On Monday, September 22, 2003, at 06:52 PM, peter tremewen wrote: > Hi all, > > Can anyone tell me the besat place to get info on the 3.5 inch > FDD > for the Apple IIe?? Is it possibl;e to modify a standard IBM 3.5 inch > FDD to > work with the apple?? Yes, I understand it would be a serious > modification. > Has anyonme heard of it being done?? I understand the Apple II uses a > special drive interface, can this be conected up to the 3.5 inch drive > hardware and be used to drive them?? It's just so much easier to > obtain 3.5 > inch disks nowdays that a bit of fiddling around seems worth it. > > Hope to hear from you all soon > > Peter T. Using an IBM drive would be a serious undertaking, as the recording formats are totally different. Also, to talk to a 3.5 inch drive, you need a special controller card in the Apple, you can't plug the drive into a Disk II or Unidisk controller card. I have plenty of 800k Apple drives in working order, if you want one, I'll be happy to send you one for a few bucks plus shipping. As for the controller card, I _think_ I have one kicking around in the basement somewhere, I'll let you know if I find it, and someone else may be able to help you there if I can't find it. Also, keep in mind that you can't use high density disks with the Apple II - the drives are 800k, you need to use low density (720k in the PC world) diskettes. High density disks can be used in a pinch by taping over the hole, but it's not a good idea, as the media is different enough that it won't be reliable. Another thing to think about is that DOS 3.3 doesn't work with 3.5 inch floppy drives, only 5 1/4 drives. You will need to use ProDOS. Ian Primus ian_primus@yahoo.com From eric at brouhaha.com Mon Sep 22 19:43:19 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Apple IIe 3.5 inch FDD In-Reply-To: <02bd01c3815c$43bf7120$21378490@vic.bigpond.net.au> References: <008001c38135$4199e3c0$d20add40@oemcomputer> <02bd01c3815c$43bf7120$21378490@vic.bigpond.net.au> Message-ID: <3072.4.20.168.104.1064277799.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "peter tremewen" asks: > Is it possibl;e to modify a standard IBM 3.5 inch FDD to > work with the apple?? Yes, I understand it would be a serious > modification. > Has anyonme heard of it being done?? I understand the Apple II uses a > special drive interface, can this be conected up to the 3.5 inch drive > hardware and be used to drive them?? It's just so much easier to obtain > 3.5 > inch disks nowdays that a bit of fiddling around seems worth it. It's basically not possible. The Apple interface is not even similar to the industry-standard interface. And the Apple requires that 3.5-inch drives have a variable-speed motor, run at different speeds for different track groups. If you *must* connect a standard 3.5-inch floppy drive to a PC, there are third-party interface cards that can do it. They work with Prodos etc., but not with any software that expects direct control over the drive mechanism (e.g., copy protection). Can't you get Apple 3.5 drives at a flea market or something? From cisin at xenosoft.com Mon Sep 22 20:34:08 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Apple IIe 3.5 inch FDD In-Reply-To: <1756.65.123.179.137.1064277077.squirrel@webmail.ccp.com> References: <008001c38135$4199e3c0$d20add40@oemcomputer> <02bd01c3815c$43bf7120$21378490@vic.bigpond.net.au> <1756.65.123.179.137.1064277077.squirrel@webmail.ccp.com> Message-ID: <20030922182828.B81907@newshell.lmi.net> On Mon, 22 Sep 2003 ghldbrd@ccp.com wrote: > ISTR that the Apple drive is a DSDD mechanism, and that GCR encoding is > used, not a standard FM/MFM. So you need the Apple drive no matter how > you slice it. And you need another disk controller card to match it. ISTR that there was once an aftermarket disk controller for the ][ that did Apple GCR using "industry standard" drives! THAT, if any could be found, should work with a 720K 3.5" PC type drive. The last time that I saw one was 20 years ago, and the guy who had it is now dead. Finding the Apple drive would be a LOT easier. From witchy at binarydinosaurs.co.uk Sun Sep 21 05:40:59 2003 From: witchy at binarydinosaurs.co.uk (Witchy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: ACW and user ports In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > -----Original Message----- > From: cctech-bounces@classiccmp.org > [mailto:cctech-bounces@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Tony Duell > Sent: 20 September 2003 21:00 > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: ACW and user ports > > However, this is a somewhat rare machine, so I am a somewhat unwilling to > modify it without thought. > > A couple of questions, therefore. > > 1) Does anyone here have an ACW with the user port connector and can > confirm that it is a DB25? Is it a plug or a socket? How is it wired (I > assume straight-through ribbon cable to the 20 pin header on the B+ > board, is it pin 1 to pin 1) ? I only know one other person with an ACW so I'll chuck him a quick email to ask. He normally takes a few days to reply however :) cheers -- adrian/witchy www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the online computer museum www.snakebiteandblack.co.uk - ex-monthly gothic shenanigans :o( From jontitus at comcast.net Sun Sep 21 13:35:07 2003 From: jontitus at comcast.net (Jon Titus) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: SOL-20 on e-bay Message-ID: Folks, I just put a nice SOL-20 computer on e-bay as item #2754896139. I also put an original Microsoft 2-button mouse (circa 1983) on e-bay, item #2754897096. Jon Jon Titus Milford, MA E-mail: jontitus@comcast.net From adiez at dartec.com Sun Sep 21 19:03:54 2003 From: adiez at dartec.com (Angel Diez) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: hp 5036a TRAINER Message-ID: <001401c3809d$040e6960$1a0010ac@dartec.com> Hello, Do you still have this HP microprocessor trainer ? I am interested in learning basic microprocessors and would be interested in purchasing it. I think I can get a Sinclair ZX-80 from a friend, if that is what you absolutely want. Regards, Angel From TheLimey at aol.com Sun Sep 21 19:26:41 2003 From: TheLimey at aol.com (TheLimey@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:03 2005 Subject: Model 100 Disk/Video Interface CAT NO 26-3806 Message-ID: <187.1f5f9a62.2c9f9bc1@aol.com> I have the above item available for sale with the complete computer and software on ebay. The link is http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3432374645 From vp at mcs.drexel.edu Sun Sep 21 21:24:45 2003 From: vp at mcs.drexel.edu (Vassilis Prevelakis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: OT: Need HP PhotoSmart 215 driver CD Message-ID: <200309220224.h8M2Ojb7019740@king.mcs.drexel.edu> Megan wrote: > So, I had to spend more money (only $18, but it is the principle of the > thing) to get what they call the 'quickrestore' CD set. Its too late now for my advice, but here it is for future reference. Whenever I buy a PC I check to see if I can perform a full restore from the supplied CDs, if I cannot, I call customer support and tell them that the initial install (which happens when you first power up your new PC) failed and can I please have the CDs. If they ask for money, I tell them that I will rather return the entire PC for a refund since I have just purchased it and it is defective. Up till now HP, Compaq and IBM have sent me the CDs for free (IBM in particular sent me the CDs the following morning). BTW Dell sends the correct CDs with the machine. > (here's another gripe -- the 'from factory' condition requires the W/ME > partition to be most of the disk [...] Other install programs allocate the ENTIRE disk to Windows. I use Partition Magic to fix this stupidity. **vp From dave at mitton.com Sun Sep 21 22:53:26 2003 From: dave at mitton.com (Dave Mitton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: DEC Server In-Reply-To: <20030919151759.66096.11047.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.2.20030921234704.041febf0@getmail.mitton.com> On 9/19/2003 10:17 AM -0500, cctech-request@classiccmp.org wrote: >From: "Antonio Carlini" >To: >Subject: RE: DEC Server >Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 19:15:40 +0100 > > > Also, they used RSX taskbuilder images. Guess they were > > using an 68K cross-assembler setup then.... > >IIRC the last stage of producing a downloadable image for >the various DEMSA images involved sticking a header on >the front which the code referred to as RSX-style or some such. ... old random neurons fired and spat... That may have been for the benefit of the host server's MOP process. It already knew how to download DEC binary files, and someone figured out how to put the new 68K image in the same file format. Dave (a former LKG digit, but not on terminal server team). (this is not what I came to this list to remember...) From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 22 22:05:41 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 In-Reply-To: <19238DEE-ED5C-11D7-9D00-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> from "Ian Primus" at Sep 22, 3 08:23:04 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 4179 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030923/e956dd3f/attachment.ksh From SUPRDAVE at aol.com Mon Sep 22 22:31:31 2003 From: SUPRDAVE at aol.com (SUPRDAVE@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Atari 2600 for $600 Message-ID: <1d1.113c2b34.2ca11893@aol.com> In a message dated 9/22/2003 6:37:41 PM Eastern Daylight Time, musicman38@comcast.net writes: I bet if I dug through all my old Atari 2600 stuff, I could easly come up with 100 different cartridges. I used to buy these at yard sales everytime I saw then cheep. My last find at a yard sale was a mint 2600 still in the original box, and about 25 Carts all for $5.. He He !! speaking of such, anyone got an extra 2600 console? Mine died, and I want to play river raid pretty badly! From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 22 22:40:35 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Prototype Commodore 64 up for auction Message-ID: I got sick of auctioning off Apple-1's so I thought I'd come up with something else equally as interesting :) Check out this prototype Commodore 64 auction: http://www.vintage.org/special/2003/c64prototype/ -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From doc at mdrconsult.com Mon Sep 22 22:52:02 2003 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Digital Celbris XL5100DP computer In-Reply-To: References: <3F6F31F9.87383EEB@comcast.net> Message-ID: <3F6FC362.40700@mdrconsult.com> Tothwolf wrote: > On Mon, 22 Sep 2003, David Woyciesjes wrote: > >>chris wrote: >> >> >>>I have a Digital Celbris XL5100DP computer here. It looks to be a >>>fairly standard Pentium PC, except that its processor daughtercard has >>>room for a 2nd CPU (I'm assuming the DP in the name is Dual >>>Processor)... >> >>I would say yes, but since that's probably only a Pentium 100, my >>Prioris 5100 HX MP/4 beats that. Double the (possible) CPU, and twice as >>wide. :) >> >>BTW, does anybody have 2 Pentium 150 CPUs running around? Hopefully a >>matched pair for a dual CPU setup. Even better, does anyone have 4 >>matched P-150 CPUs? I have one pair so far, but I'd like to upgrade my >>quad CPU box from a 5100 to a 5150... > > > I'm still looking for a matched pair of 150s myself. I'm starting to > wonder if I should just look for another single 150 to match the one I've > already got. Get a matched pair of 133s and overclock them to 150. I've never seen one fail. Doc From tothwolf at concentric.net Mon Sep 22 23:17:06 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Atari 2600 for $600 In-Reply-To: <200309222202.h8MM2C8U011884@onyx.spiritone.com> References: <200309222202.h8MM2C8U011884@onyx.spiritone.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Sep 2003, Zane H. Healy wrote: > Tothwolf wrote: > > On Mon, 22 Sep 2003, Keys wrote: > > > > > Check it out! > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2753252186 > > > > There is a ton of stuff included though. I'm really not too surprised > > that someone would fork over that much money to acquire such a > > complete collection in one go. > > It's worth noting that only two people went over $333. It's a nice > collection, but I'm not convinced it warrents the price. True. And there is no way I'd pay that kind of price for a 2600, even as complete as that one is. Though, I really have no idea what my own 2600 and all the games/etc cost back when I originally bought them new. All totaled up, It very well may have been in the $400-500+ range. And yes, I still have my original 2600, though I had to replace the graphics processor back in the mid 1990s, as the old one died from over voltage. I wish I'd known the +5V adjustment was set a little high way back when, as it managed to kill probably 8-10 carts (all replaced) back in the 80s. I had the same problem with my old C64, which I also figured out much later. -Toth From curt at atarimuseum.com Mon Sep 22 23:13:49 2003 From: curt at atarimuseum.com (Curt vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Disposing of a Collection References: Message-ID: <008101c38189$47c56f90$1a02a8c0@starship1> Where are you located? Curt ----- Original Message ----- From: "Zane H. Healy" To: Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 2:46 PM Subject: Re: Disposing of a Collection > >What I'd suggest is putting a description of what you have up on the list, > >and see if people are interested in it. I'm sure there's a fair number of > >people that'd be interested in large chunks of your collect, and might > >even be willing to drive to where you are, if they know. I know I'd > >probably be game if you were within a 6-8 hour drive. > > Good point, unfortunately Purdue is a long way from me. I'm located in Oregon. I'm not really interested in shipping stuff, I don't really have time to deal with shipping. > > The following is a pretty good list of what should be available. Not everything on the DEC list is available, unless the price is right. I'm not really looking to get rid of the PDP-8's, PDP-11/44, or MV2 stuff (the MV2 stuff is spares basically chassis spares for my PDP-11's). If the price was right, there could be even more stuff than is listed here. The list also doesn't cover all the software and documentation that I have (I probably have almost as much volume in doc's as I do in hardware). > http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/comp.txt > > Zane > > -- > -- > | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Administrator | > | healyzh@aracnet.com (primary) | OpenVMS Enthusiast | > | | Classic Computer Collector | > +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ > | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | > | PDP-10 Emulation and Zane's Computer Museum. | > | http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/ | From curt at atarimuseum.com Mon Sep 22 23:14:58 2003 From: curt at atarimuseum.com (Curt vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: CGA monitors available for pickup References: Message-ID: <008201c38189$49a3cc80$1a02a8c0@starship1> Chris, You still have any CGA monitors left? I've got a stack of Atari PC-1's and I'd like to pair them up with some CGA/EGA monitors so I can sell/trade them more easily with people. Curt ----- Original Message ----- From: "chris" To: "Classic Computer" Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2003 1:04 PM Subject: CGA monitors available for pickup > I've got a few CGA monitors here that are available if anyone wants to > come pick them up. Northern NJ, (Ridgewood, 07450). > > Last I knew, they worked (there are at least 4, maybe more). > > -chris > From aw288 at osfn.org Mon Sep 22 23:47:12 2003 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: [TCA] 4AP1 specs? (fwd) Message-ID: For those interested... ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2003 21:30:10 -0700 From: Ludwell Sibley To: tubecollectorsassociation@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [TCA] 4AP1 specs? William Donzelli wrote: >I have a request for specs for the 4AP1 CRT. Certainly an oddball. > >Help? > >William Donzelli >aw288@osfn.org > > >Visit the TCA web page at: http://www.tubecollectors.org >Visit the TCA YahooGroups page at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tubecollectorsassociation/ > >To Post a message: tubecollectorsassociation@yahoogroups.com >To Subscribe: tubecollectorsassociation-subscribe@yahoogroups.com >To Unsubscribe: tubecollectorsassociation-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > > Yo - I have a data sheet, apparently a typed copy of an RCA 8-1/2" x 11" data sheet, on the 4AP10 Skiatron (dark-trace) radar version. The dirt is as follows: Heater 6.3 V @ 0.6 A Mag focus and 40-degree mag deflection Length 14-1/4" overall Anode voltage 9900 max., 8000 min., 9000 typical G2 voltage 500 max, 250 min., 300 typical G1 0 V to -125 V; cutoff to 2 microamps occurs at -45 V Heater-cathode voltage 125 V max Pinout per EIA is 5AN: H - 2 & 8 K - 7 G1 - 5 G2 - 3 Anode - Cap The electron gun is reportedly capable of an unusually fine spot. Lud ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~--> KnowledgeStorm has over 22,000 B2B technology solutions. The most comprehensive IT buyers' information available. Research, compare, decide. E-Commerce | Application Dev | Accounting-Finance | Healthcare | Project Mgt | Sales-Marketing | More http://us.click.yahoo.com/IMai8D/UYQGAA/cIoLAA/pFfwlB/TM ---------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Visit the TCA web page at: http://www.tubecollectors.org Visit the TCA YahooGroups page at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tubecollectorsassociation/ To Post a message: tubecollectorsassociation@yahoogroups.com To Subscribe: tubecollectorsassociation-subscribe@yahoogroups.com To Unsubscribe: tubecollectorsassociation-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org Tue Sep 23 00:06:12 2003 From: gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org (Gunther Schadow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Darnit! UDA50 problem. Message-ID: <3F6FD4C4.1070004@aurora.regenstrief.org> I wish the classiccmp archives were back online for in 1997 Daniel A. Seagraves has similar issues. My VAX 11/780 still hasn't booted, I just can't seem to be able to close the loop to proper UDA50 use. Today I checked the UNIBUS backplane NPG wiring and I found that the CA1-CA2 jumper was under slot 2,3,4,6 and 8 while there was no such jumper under slot 5. Since the first 4 slots were all full with those standard printer and serial interface I left those alone and placed M7485 in slot 5 and M7486 in slot 6. Before I had it reversed. My UDA50 user guide seems to imply that the usual arrangement is first M7486 and the M7485, however, this is not stated in writing (only in pictures.) What is stated in writing is that the M7485 absolutely must have that NPG jumper removed whereas for M7486 it didn't matter. They go on saying that if NPG jumper is removed for both slots, then the two cards can be swapped into either order. I concluded that I could swap them as long as M7485 has the NPG jumper removed, hence I could make that arrangement without having to actually cut a wire on the backplane. Both cards now show the idle cycling-pattern, no errors, but also no reaction to the host computer when I try to make it boot. I guess now the question is: is any of my assumptions wrong about the ordering of the two UDA50 modules? And: did I set the right UNIBUS address and does my DUABOO.CMD file actually use that same address. Is there any simple way of manually testing the UNIBUS address by DEPOSITing some machine program to read out some UNIBUS register so that I can scan the bus to check the right address rather than having to rely on me making no mistakes? thanks, -Gunther From tothwolf at concentric.net Tue Sep 23 00:37:19 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Atari 2600 for $600 In-Reply-To: <1d1.113c2b34.2ca11893@aol.com> References: <1d1.113c2b34.2ca11893@aol.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Sep 2003 SUPRDAVE@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 9/22/2003 6:37:41 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > musicman38@comcast.net writes: > > > I bet if I dug through all my old Atari 2600 stuff, I could easly come > > up with 100 different cartridges. I used to buy these at yard sales > > everytime I saw then cheep. My last find at a yard sale was a mint > > 2600 still in the original box, and about 25 Carts all for $5.. He He > > !! > > speaking of such, anyone got an extra 2600 console? Mine died, and I > want to play river raid pretty badly! I've got quite a few, but they are also easily repairable. I also don't have much of an incentive to help you with yours, since you never did respond to any of my emails about that shipping incident. -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Tue Sep 23 00:46:53 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Sep 2003, Tony Duell wrote: > > Hmm, if it sends all characters as uppercase, I will need some way to > > change the PC to recognize that and convert it all back to lowercase > > or something, since all of the UNIX commands are lower case. I assume > > Old unices (like PDP11 v7) have a way to use an upper-case only > terminal. I would have to check the details. I have no idea if linux > supports this. Try 'stty -F /dev/ttyS0 lcase' (replacing /dev/ttyS0 with the tty device name). It enables xcase, iuclc, and olcuc, which should make things much easier. -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Tue Sep 23 00:48:04 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Prototype Commodore 64 up for auction In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > I got sick of auctioning off Apple-1's so I thought I'd come up with > something else equally as interesting :) Then send one here...I'll pay postage :) -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Tue Sep 23 00:54:30 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Digital Celbris XL5100DP computer In-Reply-To: <3F6FC362.40700@mdrconsult.com> References: <3F6F31F9.87383EEB@comcast.net> <3F6FC362.40700@mdrconsult.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Sep 2003, Doc Shipley wrote: > Tothwolf wrote: > > On Mon, 22 Sep 2003, David Woyciesjes wrote: > > > > > BTW, does anybody have 2 Pentium 150 CPUs running around? Hopefully > > > a matched pair for a dual CPU setup. Even better, does anyone have 4 > > > matched P-150 CPUs? I have one pair so far, but I'd like to upgrade > > > my quad CPU box from a 5100 to a 5150... > > > > I'm still looking for a matched pair of 150s myself. I'm starting to > > wonder if I should just look for another single 150 to match the one > > I've already got. > > Get a matched pair of 133s and overclock them to 150. I've never seen > one fail. I may have to try that. Its currently one of those on-hold projects waiting for me to have more free time though. I'm also still somewhat hunting for a Supermicro P6DNH/P6DNH2 for a brand new matched pair of 256k PPro 200s I have sitting around. One of these days I'll find such a board at a *sane* price. Of course the minute I do, I'll also find an inexpensive set of 512k or 1MB chips, so then I'll be hunting for another board for the 256k chips... (I guess this is getting pretty OT for some folks, though SMP setups are still interesting IMO.) -Toth From ohh at drizzle.com Tue Sep 23 01:08:55 2003 From: ohh at drizzle.com (O. Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Suggestions On A PDP-12 Hunt? Message-ID: Hi, all. So it's like this: I've decided, for reasons which even I don't quite understand, that I should find a computer to restore to keep my old PDP-8/I from getting lonely, and (to keep things complicated) that the new machine should be a PDP-12. It's not _quite_ as involved as searching for the Holy Grail, but they're certainly not common. :) I've been going (by phone and e-mail) to check in a lot of the usual places - electronic surplus stores, university surplus, and so forth - and have also started checking around with neurologists and neurology departments, since I gather the -12s were popular choices in neurological research. So far I've had a few good-sounding leads which haven't gone anywhere useful. But it's still early in the search. I'm open to suggestions. :) Anyone have any good ideas, leads or recommendations on where else to look? (It need not be a working one, since I'm planning to restore it anyway.) (O'course, if anyone has a PDP-12 they're willing to consider parting with, I'd certainly be amenable to discussing it... ) Suggestions? -O.- From pete at dunnington.u-net.com Tue Sep 23 02:44:59 2003 From: pete at dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 In-Reply-To: Ian Primus "Re: Reviving and connecting an ASR33" (Sep 22, 20:23) References: <19238DEE-ED5C-11D7-9D00-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <10309230844.ZM4482@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> On Sep 22, 20:23, Ian Primus wrote: > Hmm, if it sends all characters as uppercase, I will need some way to > change the PC to recognize that and convert it all back to lowercase or > something, since all of the UNIX commands are lower case. I assume > there is probably a setting in Linux somewhere to do that. At least > it's ASCII and not Baudot. That would be lots of fun... On old versions of unix, if the username and password you typed was all upper-case, it assumed you were using an uppercase-only teletype and set things accordingly. I doubt if Lunix includes that code :-) However, you should be able to do "stty tty33" which should set xcase, iuclc, olcuc, the correct delays for carriage-return and linefeed, and allow mark parity. I'm not sure how you type the stty command in the first place, though :-) You'll probably have to change /etc/gettydefs. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York From mikeford at socal.rr.com Tue Sep 23 02:45:24 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Mountain Hardware expansion chassis In-Reply-To: <20030920204109.F46819@newshell.lmi.net> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030920192841.02bce370@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030923004206.02e6b650@pop-server.socal.rr.com> At 08:42 PM 9/20/03 -0700, Fred Cisin wrote: > > > Another curious thing, a load of calculator sized terminals from Pacific > > > Bell, but no clue about what exactly they do, so I didn't buy any > > > (should be at swapmeet next week too). Nothing was obvious about the > > > function, small 4 line lcd display, alphanumeric keypad, and from > > > looking at a larger similar unit they attech to a typical POTS phone > > > wire. > > Sounds like either a POTS line tester of some sort or a terminal for the > > old AT&T craft access system. Most likely the later. > >Did they appear to be MANUFACTURED by pacBell? > >There were also some TDDs in that size. No these were clearly "tools" for linemen type things, likely made exclusively for Pacific Bell, but not by them. I should have just bought one, maybe I will this weekend at the next swapmeet. From jhfinexgs2 at compsys.to Tue Sep 23 06:37:10 2003 From: jhfinexgs2 at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: V5.01A Distribution of RT-11 Message-ID: <3F703066.D457AFB0@compsys.to> Does anyone have access to V5.01A of RT-11? I would prefer the RL02 image which has a Volume ID / Owner of: BC-P607C-BC RL2 1/1 However, any other media would be great if the RL02 image is not available! I already have V5.00, V5.01, V5.01C (V5.01B does not exist) and V5.02 of RT-11. So it is ONLY V5.01A of RT-11 that I do not have. Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From r_beaudry at hotmail.com Tue Sep 23 06:46:47 2003 From: r_beaudry at hotmail.com (Rich Beaudry) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Apple IIe 3.5 inch FDD Message-ID: > Is it possibl;e to modify a standard IBM 3.5 inch FDD to > work with the apple?? As other pointed out, no.... > I understand the Apple II uses a > special drive interface, can this be conected up to the 3.5 inch drive > hardware and be used to drive them?? You can't hook up a Disk II or 5.25" controller to a 3.5" disk drive.. However, a 3.5" drive can be used in an Apple IIe (not sure about II, II+). There are two possible combinations: - Apple sold a drive called a UniDisk 3.5. This drive had a processor and buffer memory inside the case to allow it to buffer and effectively slow down the data transfer rate to the point where the Apple IIe could handle it. You still need to get a special controller card (often referred to as a "LIRON" card, because the word was silkscreened on the card). - Apple also sold a 3.5" drive controller card that had the processor/buffers/logic on the card, so you could use the standard 800KB drives from an Apple IIgs in an Apple IIe. This card also had the capability to drive Macintosh 1.44MB drives (so you could get 1.44MB on an Apple IIe!!). Coincidentally, I have one of these for auction on eBay right now (search for seller "rbeaudry") :-). You'd still need to get drives, but Apple IIgs 800KB drives are cheap and plentiful (in fact, I have several spares I could make available). Confusingly, both card were named by Apple as "3.5 controller cards", so be careful when looking fo rthem that you get the right card/drive combination.... Rich B. From james at jfc.org.uk Tue Sep 23 07:25:02 2003 From: james at jfc.org.uk (James Carter) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 In-Reply-To: <10309230844.ZM4482@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> References: <19238DEE-ED5C-11D7-9D00-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> <10309230844.ZM4482@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> Message-ID: <1064319901.1436.4.camel@pc004> On Tue, 2003-09-23 at 08:44, Pete Turnbull wrote: > On old versions of unix, if the username and password you typed was all > upper-case, it assumed you were using an uppercase-only teletype and > set things accordingly. I doubt if Lunix includes that code :-) it tries hard, but i expect you could only log in if your password was all upper case: root@pc004:/u5/james# agetty 9600 `tty` Welcome to Linux 2.4.22 (/dev/pts/1) pc004 login: JAMES PASSWORD: LOGIN INCORRECT PC004 LOGIN: -- James F. Carter http://www.jfc.org.uk/ From vance at neurotica.com Tue Sep 23 08:15:18 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Dual-Processor PCI/MCA PC's Message-ID: Anyone want these two dual-processor Pentium PCI/MCA servers I have here? They have some sort of TP ethernet on the motherboard, and they have some form of wide SCSI, along with hotswap drive cages, and I have a full load of trays for them. All in all, pretty nice systems. They are IBM PC Server 320's (8640-MDV). There's still reference disk and BIOS downloads available for them on ftp.pc.ibm.com. I'd hate to see these go to waste, but I need the space. If you feel like throwing a couple of dollars at me for them, it would be appreciated, as I am out of work right now, but it is not required nor expected. Peace... Sridhar From SUPRDAVE at aol.com Tue Sep 23 08:26:29 2003 From: SUPRDAVE at aol.com (SUPRDAVE@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Apple IIe 3.5 inch FDD Message-ID: In a message dated 9/23/2003 8:03:15 AM Eastern Daylight Time, r_beaudry@hotmail.com writes: << > Is it possibl;e to modify a standard IBM 3.5 inch FDD to > work with the apple?? As other pointed out, no.... > I understand the Apple II uses a > special drive interface, can this be conected up to the 3.5 inch drive > hardware and be used to drive them?? You can't hook up a Disk II or 5.25" controller to a 3.5" disk drive.. However, a 3.5" drive can be used in an Apple IIe (not sure about II, II+). There are two possible combinations: - Apple sold a drive called a UniDisk 3.5. This drive had a processor and buffer memory inside the case to allow it to buffer and effectively slow down the data transfer rate to the point where the Apple IIe could handle it. You still need to get a special controller card (often referred to as a "LIRON" card, because the word was silkscreened on the card). >> There was also a controller card called the UDC made by Laser computer (IIRC) that could run various combinations of 5.25 and 3.5 drives. Shouldve got one back then. From dwoyciesjes at comcast.net Tue Sep 23 08:29:26 2003 From: dwoyciesjes at comcast.net (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Digital Celbris XL5100DP computer References: <3F6F31F9.87383EEB@comcast.net> <3F6FC362.40700@mdrconsult.com> Message-ID: <3F704AB6.FB6D04C0@comcast.net> Tothwolf wrote: > > On Mon, 22 Sep 2003, Doc Shipley wrote: > > Tothwolf wrote: > > > On Mon, 22 Sep 2003, David Woyciesjes wrote: > > > > > > > BTW, does anybody have 2 Pentium 150 CPUs running around? Hopefully > > > > a matched pair for a dual CPU setup. Even better, does anyone have 4 > > > > matched P-150 CPUs? I have one pair so far, but I'd like to upgrade > > > > my quad CPU box from a 5100 to a 5150... > > > > > > I'm still looking for a matched pair of 150s myself. I'm starting to > > > wonder if I should just look for another single 150 to match the one > > > I've already got. That reminds me, I think I may have a single one sitting around... > > Get a matched pair of 133s and overclock them to 150. I've never seen > > one fail. > > I may have to try that. Its currently one of those on-hold projects > waiting for me to have more free time though. Okay, now where would I find 4 matched P-133s? ;-) > (I guess this is getting pretty OT for some folks, though SMP setups are > still interesting IMO.) I'll have to check, but I wonder just how old my Prioris is... -- --- Dave Woyciesjes --- ICQ# 905818 From cb at mythtech.net Tue Sep 23 09:03:18 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Digital Celbris XL5100DP computer Message-ID: >Is this a native SCSI? >If so I could probably take it. 50-50. It looks like it does have onboard SCSI. At least there is an external SCSI port, so I'm assuming there is probably an internal one as well. If you want it, its yours. -chris From cb at mythtech.net Tue Sep 23 09:12:42 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Atari 2600 for $600 Message-ID: >speaking of such, anyone got an extra 2600 console? Mine died, and I want to >play river raid pretty badly! There is at least one emulator for the 2600 that I know of. I tend to play all my favorite games that way. Its easier than chewing up space with the 2600 itself (and I have a MUCH bigger collection of game ROMS than I ever had of carts) -chris From cb at mythtech.net Tue Sep 23 09:15:02 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: CGA monitors available for pickup Message-ID: > You still have any CGA monitors left? I've got a stack of Atari PC-1's >and I'd like to pair them up with some CGA/EGA monitors so I can sell/trade >them more easily with people. Um... sort of. They are in the bottom of the dumpster outside. Its raining pretty heavy right now, and there is garbage and assorted other stuff on top. If you really want one, you are welcome to come dig thru the dumpster. -chris From dittman at dittman.net Tue Sep 23 09:50:31 2003 From: dittman at dittman.net (Eric Dittman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: HSJ50 Controllers Message-ID: <20030923145031.4B745801B@narnia.int.dittman.net> Does anyone have any HSJ50 controllers? I need to get new firmware for mine since I can't read either of the cards that came with them. If you have firmware and have access to a Windows 98/2000/XP system with a PCMCIA slot there's software that can read and write the cards. -- Eric Dittman dittman@dittman.net From Hans.Franke at mch20.sbs.de Tue Sep 23 10:01:56 2003 From: Hans.Franke at mch20.sbs.de (Hans Franke) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Apple IIe 3.5 inch FDD In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3F707C84.16589.3D5B7A70@localhost> > > Is it possibl;e to modify a standard IBM 3.5 inch FDD to > > work with the apple?? > As other pointed out, no.... Well, witrhout telling to much, there might be soon a way read/write standard 1.44 Meg HD disks on any Apple II with slots. Although it will not support MS-DOS file format ... So keep your eyes open for new hardware :) Gruss H. -- VCF Europa 5.0 am 01./02. Mai 2004 in Muenchen http://www.vcfe.org/ From bpope at wordstock.com Tue Sep 23 09:58:52 2003 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Atari 2600 for $600 In-Reply-To: from "chris" at Sep 23, 03 10:12:42 am Message-ID: <200309231458.KAA06970@wordstock.com> And thusly chris spake: > > There is at least one emulator for the 2600 that I know of. I tend to > play all my favorite games that way. Its easier than chewing up space > with the 2600 itself (and I have a MUCH bigger collection of game ROMS > than I ever had of carts) Are you talking about Stella? But one of the problems with playing on your computer is the screen size... Playing on a 31" TV or projection TV is *much* nicer. :) Plus it is easier to use a *real* joystick to paddle. (No adapter required). There is also the CuttleCart, which allows you to play downloaded ROMs on a real 2600. :) Cheers, Bryan From cb at mythtech.net Tue Sep 23 10:29:46 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Atari 2600 for $600 Message-ID: >Are you talking about Stella? Yup, thats the one I use >But one of the problems with playing on your computer is the screen size... >Playing on a 31" TV or projection TV is *much* nicer. :) Plus it is >easier to use a *real* joystick to paddle. Yes, these are two very good reasons to use the real thing. (and of course, its just cooler to use the real thing, but when space it tight, at least the emulator lets you play) >There is also the CuttleCart, which allows you to play downloaded ROMs on >a real 2600. Humm.... that sounds like something I want to locate. :-) -chris From teoz at neo.rr.com Tue Sep 23 10:43:24 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Atari 2600 for $600 References: <200309231458.KAA06970@wordstock.com> Message-ID: <003901c381e9$6feef440$657ca418@neo.rr.com> > Are you talking about Stella? > > But one of the problems with playing on your computer is the screen size... > Playing on a 31" TV or projection TV is *much* nicer. :) Plus it is > easier to use a *real* joystick to paddle. (No adapter required). > There is also the CuttleCart, which allows you to play downloaded ROMs on > a real 2600. :) > > Cheers, > > Bryan > Nothing beats playing the original games on the real hardware (wether its a 2600, amiga, c64, arcade game etc). I have an original 2600 with maybe 20 original carts, I also have the atari 2600 emu with every cart made on my dreamcast console. I like the real 2600 better because of the joystick and paddle control, but use the dreamcast for the games I dont have. From bpope at wordstock.com Tue Sep 23 11:17:26 2003 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Atari 2600 for $600 In-Reply-To: from "chris" at Sep 23, 03 11:29:46 am Message-ID: <200309231617.MAA12467@wordstock.com> And thusly chris spake: > > >There is also the CuttleCart, which allows you to play downloaded ROMs on > >a real 2600. > > Humm.... that sounds like something I want to locate. :-) > The homepage is at http://www.schells.com/index.html ... Unfortunately the 2600 version is sold out, but a 7800 one is one its way, which will also work with 2600 games. Cheers, Bryan From paulpenn at knology.net Tue Sep 23 11:29:24 2003 From: paulpenn at knology.net (Paul Pennington) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: SOL-20 on e-bay References: Message-ID: <007001c381ef$db6c98c0$6401a8c0@knology.net> Jon Titus wrote: > Folks, I just put a nice SOL-20 computer on e-bay as item #2754896139. I saw that -- wish I could afford it. Just out of curiosity, what is the "personality module" that's included? Does it have something to do with running CP/M? Also, how much memory is on the main board? Paul Pennington Augusta, Georgia From paulpenn at knology.net Tue Sep 23 11:29:24 2003 From: paulpenn at knology.net (Paul Pennington) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: SOL-20 on e-bay References: Message-ID: <007001c381ef$db6c98c0$6401a8c0@knology.net> Jon Titus wrote: > Folks, I just put a nice SOL-20 computer on e-bay as item #2754896139. I saw that -- wish I could afford it. Just out of curiosity, what is the "personality module" that's included? Does it have something to do with running CP/M? Also, how much memory is on the main board? Paul Pennington Augusta, Georgia From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 23 11:39:38 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: HSJ50 Controllers In-Reply-To: <20030923145031.4B745801B@narnia.int.dittman.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Sep 2003, Eric Dittman wrote: > Does anyone have any HSJ50 controllers? I need to get new firmware for mine > since I can't read either of the cards that came with them. If you have > firmware and have access to a Windows 98/2000/XP system with a PCMCIA slot > there's software that can read and write the cards. I have both HSJ40s and HSJ50s, about 200 cards (*grin*) and lappys with PC card slots. Contact me offlist to let me know what needs to be done.. Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From eric at brouhaha.com Tue Sep 23 12:15:44 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Apple IIe 3.5 inch FDD In-Reply-To: <3F707C84.16589.3D5B7A70@localhost> References: <3F707C84.16589.3D5B7A70@localhost> Message-ID: <32891.64.169.63.74.1064337344.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "Hans Franke" wrote: > Well, witrhout telling to much, there might be soon a way > read/write standard 1.44 Meg HD disks on any Apple II with > slots. There are already two ways to do that: * Apple SuperDrive controller w/ an Apple SuperDrive (AKA FDHD). * SHH BlueDsik Universal Floppy Disk Controller with a normal PC-style 3.5-inch floppy drive. > Although it will not support MS-DOS file format ... GS/OS includes an MS-DOS FST, but ISTR it being read-only. From Hans.Franke at mch20.sbs.de Tue Sep 23 12:48:34 2003 From: Hans.Franke at mch20.sbs.de (Hans Franke) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Apple IIe 3.5 inch FDD In-Reply-To: <32891.64.169.63.74.1064337344.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> References: <3F707C84.16589.3D5B7A70@localhost> Message-ID: <3F70A392.394.3DF40BB1@localhost> > > Well, witrhout telling to much, there might be soon a way > > read/write standard 1.44 Meg HD disks on any Apple II with > > slots. > There are already two ways to do that: > * Apple SuperDrive controller w/ an Apple SuperDrive (AKA FDHD). > * SHH BlueDsik Universal Floppy Disk Controller with a normal > PC-style 3.5-inch floppy drive. And both are quite rare to come by. > > Although it will not support MS-DOS file format ... > GS/OS includes an MS-DOS FST, but ISTR it being read-only. Exactly that's the point. Read Only in GS/OS, and no access for ProDOS or DOS ... But the main topic is to support actual drives (and Disks), and IIRC that has been the original question. Gruss H. -- VCF Europa 5.0 am 01./02. Mai 2004 in Muenchen http://www.vcfe.org/ From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 23 13:05:01 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Kennedy 9600 (A) woes Message-ID: Hiyas, Does anyone have experience with troubleshooting Kennedy tape drives? I have a 9600A here (still needed for reading in that darned UNIX tape...) and although it seems to work, it does fail one of its self tests (FAIL 153, second code is A50-NRZ1) and indeed does not read tapes, *nor* does it "see" the write enable rings. All other things seem to work fine. Any help would be muchly appreciated... if anyone has a scanned manual for it, that would even be better ! Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From SUPRDAVE at aol.com Tue Sep 23 13:12:06 2003 From: SUPRDAVE at aol.com (SUPRDAVE@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Atari 2600 for $600 Message-ID: <1a8.19c7a94b.2ca1e6f6@aol.com> In a message dated 9/23/2003 11:47:34 AM Eastern Daylight Time, teoz@neo.rr.com writes: << > Are you talking about Stella? > > But one of the problems with playing on your computer is the screen size... > Playing on a 31" TV or projection TV is *much* nicer. :) Plus it is > easier to use a *real* joystick to paddle. (No adapter required). > There is also the CuttleCart, which allows you to play downloaded ROMs on > a real 2600. :) > > Cheers, > > Bryan > Nothing beats playing the original games on the real hardware (wether its a 2600, amiga, c64, arcade game etc). I have an original 2600 with maybe 20 original carts, I also have the atari 2600 emu with every cart made on my dreamcast console. I like the real 2600 better because of the joystick and paddle control, but use the dreamcast for the games I dont have. >> ah, there's nothing like cursing out a flaky joystick in the heat of battle. ha ha. I've got several joysticks with much better action than the Atari ones. From Joel.E.Bradley at syntegra.com Tue Sep 23 13:18:55 2003 From: Joel.E.Bradley at syntegra.com (Joel.E.Bradley@syntegra.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: WTB - Nintendo & Punchout Message-ID: <41C19CA3B7CBD411B59200508B6CBBFF046ABF6E@ah-exchange-01.arh.cdc.com> Being that there was a recent discussion about 2600's (I have the 5800!), I am actually looking for an original working NES system with the game "Punchout" . I never had a NES growing up!!! :( e-mail me directly at joel.bradley@comcast.net Joel From tothwolf at concentric.net Tue Sep 23 13:44:18 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Atari 2600 for $600 In-Reply-To: <200309231617.MAA12467@wordstock.com> References: <200309231617.MAA12467@wordstock.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Sep 2003, Bryan Pope wrote: > And thusly chris spake: > > > > There is also the CuttleCart, which allows you to play downloaded > > > ROMs on a real 2600. > > > > Humm.... that sounds like something I want to locate. :-) > > The homepage is at http://www.schells.com/index.html ... Unfortunately > the 2600 version is sold out, but a 7800 one is one its way, which will > also work with 2600 games. I have also seen schematics for several home brew solutions. The simplest being EPROM based, and the fanciest having battery backed RAM. -Toth From cisin at xenosoft.com Tue Sep 23 13:59:52 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 In-Reply-To: <10309230844.ZM4482@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> References: <19238DEE-ED5C-11D7-9D00-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> <10309230844.ZM4482@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> Message-ID: <20030923115552.M99687@newshell.lmi.net> On Tue, 23 Sep 2003, Pete Turnbull wrote: > However, you should be able to do "stty tty33" which should set xcase, > iuclc, olcuc, the correct delays for carriage-return and linefeed, and > allow mark parity. I'm not sure how you type the stty command in the > first place, though :-) You'll probably have to change /etc/gettydefs. Log in once with a lower case capable terminal, and create an alias or a script that has an uppercase name. From arcarlini at iee.org Tue Sep 23 14:39:56 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: WTB - Nintendo & Punchout In-Reply-To: <41C19CA3B7CBD411B59200508B6CBBFF046ABF6E@ah-exchange-01.arh.cdc.com> Message-ID: <17ae01c3820a$89198220$5b01a8c0@athlon> > Being that there was a recent discussion about 2600's (I have > the 5800!), AFAIK, there's a 5200 and there's a 7800. But I've never heard of a 5800 ... did I miss one somewhere? (There were also the Atari 400 and Atari 800, did you mean one of these?) Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From cb at mythtech.net Tue Sep 23 15:01:16 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: WTB - Nintendo & Punchout Message-ID: >AFAIK, there's a 5200 and there's a 7800. But I've never >heard of a 5800 ... did I miss one somewhere? You know, I never realized that before. Atari had the 2600, then the 5200 (2600 x2) then the 7800 (2600 x3) Was the 2600 a number picked for a reason? Something that was doubled and then tripled in later models? Or were they just a bunch of phone phreaks that designed the first one :-) -chris From arcarlini at iee.org Tue Sep 23 15:28:14 2003 From: arcarlini at iee.org (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: WTB - Nintendo & Punchout In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <17cc01c38211$4580f500$5b01a8c0@athlon> > Was the 2600 a number picked for a reason? I'm sure I read an explanation of where it came from, but right now I cannot find it. Someone will doubtless chip in soon with an answer. I think the later models were deliberately multiples of the earlier ones (twice as good, etc.) > then tripled in later models? Or were they just a bunch of > phone phreaks that designed the first one :-) I don't know when phone freaking started in the US, probably the 1960s. It was certainly established early in the 1970s, which is when the "Cap'n Crunch" stuff happened. So it's possible, but I suspect that the explanation is more prosaic. Antonio -- --------------- Antonio Carlini arcarlini@iee.org From emu at ecubics.com Tue Sep 23 15:45:54 2003 From: emu at ecubics.com (emanuel stiebler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:04 2005 Subject: Unibus/Qbus board/edge connectors Message-ID: <3F70B102.7020800@ecubics.com> Hi all, Anybody knows, if they are still available somewhere ? Order number ? (I'm talking about the connectors on the backplanes, with .125" spacing) cheers & thanks From jcwren at jcwren.com Tue Sep 23 15:52:40 2003 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Weekend finds in Tulsa and St. Louis In-Reply-To: <006a01c38134$ce96d5e0$d20add40@oemcomputer> References: <006a01c38134$ce96d5e0$d20add40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <200309231652.40979.jcwren@jcwren.com> I'm jealous you found a sealed copy of Custer's Revenge. I've been looking for that. --John On Monday 22 September 2003 14:10 pm, Keys wrote: > Stopped in Tulsa Saturday for their first annual Gamer show and it was > small but fun. Picked up a few items for the gaming collection. Also > Sunday as we were leaving we stopped at 2 flea markets and a thrift store > there in Tulsa. > > Here's a short list: > > 2- Neo Geo's one black and one blue, I left a silver one as it was damaged. > Got one game cartridge. > > A new still sealed copy of Custer's Revenge by Mystique. > > A Timex Sinclair 1500. > > A handheld game called baseball2 by Entex from 1979. > > A Sears electronic Basketball handheld from 1980. > > A MERLIN handheld. > > Many cartridges for various machines like the Vic 20, 2600, Atari 400, N64, > Talking Whiz-Kid, NES, PSOne, and others. > > A Compaq C120+ PDA with everything. > > Many more items then can be listed for now as I have still not unpacked > everything. > > While in St. Louis at a thrift there I got a new in the box Cisco 1700 > router for $24.95 ( I did a Google and it goes from $600 to $950 used and > $900+ to $1200+ new). Sorry off topic but it was a sweet deal. Picked up a > few other items while in St. Louis also. From norm-classiccmp at docnorm.com Tue Sep 23 17:52:32 2003 From: norm-classiccmp at docnorm.com (Norm Aleks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Moving a System/34 Message-ID: Hi, folks. I just bought an IBM System/34 that's currently in Pennsylvania, and I need to move it to the Bay Area. Finding an appropriate shipper is not my problem (I've been through *that* enough). However, does anyone know what steps I should take to secure this system for shipping? I'm worried in particular about its hard disks -- it would seem very IBM-ish to have a manual way to park and secure the heads. I appreciate any help! Norm From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 23 18:47:13 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: SUMMARY: PC memory managers (was: PC/MOS et al) Message-ID: Hi all, Thanks to all who sent me their Complete Archives(tm) of whatever brand of PC DOS memory manager they were once using... I now have a fair selection of Qemm, 386MAX and whatnot :) The bad news was... it didn't work. Qemm6 would work, but make the box unstable. MAX and Qemm7 didnt work at all, they froze as soon as they were loaded. Not good. At some point I also noticed the box was acting strangely when heavy network traffic ocurred, *and* that it never showed me the Adaptec's BIOS banner. So... I decided to swap the (DOS) disk into another PC, and try again. Lo and behold... it works. Both Qemm7 and MAX work, and the network card behaves, AND the Adaptec lives :) Looks like I had a sick PC to work with... Said PC is now running DOS 6.22 with the memory manager, MS LANMAN client (using NDIS 2.0 driver and packet driver stub), with a full (licensed) copy of Ersatz-11 on top of that, emulating: - PDP-11/83, 4MB RAM - RQDX3 disk controller - 2x RD54 (160MB) disk - 1x RX50 diskette (emulated to 5.25" HD disk drive) - 1x RX33 diskette (emulated to same) - 1x TQK50 controller with TK50 drive, emulated to TZ30 drive on the Adaptec 1542CP. - 1x TSV05 tape drive, emuated to HP 7980S drive on Adaptec. - 1x DELQA ethernet controller, emulated to E100B through packet driver on top of NDIS stub (yay! ;-) - 1x DZV11 4-port async contr emulated by AST FourPort/XM ISA controller which I re-found in a box of crap ;-) The "machine" is now happily installing Ultrix-11 V3.2 from tape. Real tape, even. Yaaaay! Soon to be online as eagle.pdp11.nl. Cheers, and thanks to all who helped, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From lbickley at bickleywest.com Tue Sep 23 20:49:29 2003 From: lbickley at bickleywest.com (Lyle Bickley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: SGI Cable... Message-ID: <200309231849.29085.lbickley@bickleywest.com> Does anyone have the cable that goes from an Indy Presenter Adapter or an Octane Presenter Adapter to a Presenter 1280? [Technically it's an LVDS video cable, 68 pin, MDR to LDI, OEM'ed for SGI by a company called "SMS"]. I'd be glad to pay a modest sum and shipping for the critter. Thanks, Lyle -- Lyle Bickley Mountain View, CA 94040 "Black holes are where God is dividing by zero" From jrkeys at concentric.net Tue Sep 23 20:51:44 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Some of my other finds in St. louis Message-ID: <002001c3823e$69d58510$a90cdd40@oemcomputer> Got the following items various thrifts in St. Louis: HP 33C calculator with case and charger for $5 IBM guide to operations for the PC with two Persyst manuals in it, Time-Spectrum Multi-function Board and The COMPAK Module for the IBM PC hot to install. A Sun mouse model COMPACT1 Various cartridges and mousepads. From rdd at rddavis.org Tue Sep 23 21:42:40 2003 From: rdd at rddavis.org (R. D. Davis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Unibus/Qbus board/edge connectors In-Reply-To: <3F70B102.7020800@ecubics.com> References: <3F70B102.7020800@ecubics.com> Message-ID: <20030924023553.GD8274@rhiannon.rddavis.org> Quothe emanuel stiebler, from writings of Tue, Sep 23, 2003 at 02:45:54PM -0600: > Anybody knows, if they are still available somewhere ? > Order number ? > (I'm talking about the connectors on the backplanes, with .125" spacing) No idea what the commercial availability is, but why would they be that difficut to make with a double-sided unetched circuit board, thin band saw, ruler, fine-tipped marker, etc. and a template consisting of any DEC unibus, qbus or omnibus board? It may take a couple of tries to get it right, but I don't see why that wouldn't work. Basically, cut out the two corners on one side to create the outline of the connector, then, mark where the cut-outs are on the connector between the pins, use a saw to cut the cut-outs into the circuit board. -- Copyright (C) 2003 R. D. Davis The difference between humans & other animals: All Rights Reserved an unnatural belief that we're above Nature & rdd@rddavis.org 410-744-4900 her other creatures, using dogma to justify such http://www.rddavis.org beliefs and to justify much human cruelty. From cb at mythtech.net Tue Sep 23 21:41:40 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: New toys Message-ID: WOOHOOO!!! I just aquired two Apple Lisa 2 units. Both are complete with Profile drives and printers (as well as keyboard and mouse). Plus a spare Profile drive, and an assortment of software. I think this makes up for the otherwise crappy year I've been having!!! WOOHOO!!! -chris From vcf at siconic.com Tue Sep 23 21:50:45 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: SUMMARY: PC memory managers (was: PC/MOS et al) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, Fred N. van Kempen wrote: > The bad news was... it didn't work. Qemm6 would work, but make > the box unstable. MAX and Qemm7 didnt work at all, they froze > as soon as they were loaded. Not good. It sounds like you have bad RAM in that PC, or perhaps an upper memory conflict (perhaps you need to exclude certain memory ranges for the network card). -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From teoz at neo.rr.com Tue Sep 23 22:01:11 2003 From: teoz at neo.rr.com (TeoZ) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: New toys References: Message-ID: <01a801c38248$1c5fc340$657ca418@neo.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "chris" To: "Classic Computers" Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2003 10:41 PM Subject: New toys > WOOHOOO!!! > > I just aquired two Apple Lisa 2 units. Both are complete with Profile > drives and printers (as well as keyboard and mouse). > > Plus a spare Profile drive, and an assortment of software. > > I think this makes up for the otherwise crappy year I've been having!!! > > WOOHOO!!! > > -chris > > Started up the collection again huh From cb at mythtech.net Tue Sep 23 22:45:28 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: New toys Message-ID: >Started up the collection again huh Never really stopped collecting, just refocused by force (being evicted from your storage area tends to do that) I've abonded pretty much all non Apple stuff (except my IBM 5110), and in the Mac front, I'm going only with certain machines (rare, or interesting to me). Although even in the Apple end of things, I unloaded stuff that I figure will be a long time if ever before I can put them to use (like my Apple III software since I have no Apple III) I also couldn't pass up a deal on a Lisa... I've been after one for years, and now I have two! (no idea where I'm going to put them however... but I'll find somewhere) -chris From vcf at siconic.com Tue Sep 23 23:03:35 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: New toys In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Sep 2003, chris wrote: > WOOHOOO!!! > > I just aquired two Apple Lisa 2 units. Both are complete with Profile > drives and printers (as well as keyboard and mouse). > > Plus a spare Profile drive, and an assortment of software. > > I think this makes up for the otherwise crappy year I've been having!!! > > WOOHOO!!! Do they have both a "Reset" and "Interrupt" buttons in the back or just "Reset"? If the former it's a Lisa 2/10; the latter then it's a Lisa 2 (upgrade from a Lisa 1). -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From esharpe at uswest.net Tue Sep 23 22:49:33 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (ed sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: HP2000 progress References: <003a01c3810b$b1cc85a0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Message-ID: <007201c38253$94d8f9d0$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> what turned out to be the problem with the iop? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jay West" To: Sent: Monday, September 22, 2003 6:16 AM Subject: HP2000 progress > In the great HP2000 rebuild project, thanks to a huge bevy of spare parts > from Bill, the IOP is now again singing with 32Kw! Yes, a happy snoopy dance > was performed :) > > Now it's on to resurrecting a 7905 in a lowboy cabinet. Can't decide if I > will use only 13037 style drives, or stick with multiple 7900's (or both). > That should pretty much finish the runnable system restoration. Then the > only thing left will be the refurb of the 2610 printer, and the 7261 mark > sense card reader, but those certainly aren't required to run the system. > > Thanks Bill!!! > > Jay West > > --- > [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] > > > From esharpe at uswest.net Wed Sep 24 00:03:43 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (ed sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: HP2000 progress References: <003a01c3810b$b1cc85a0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> <007201c38253$94d8f9d0$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> Message-ID: <00ae01c38259$3b0af560$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> I would assume the data transfer rate on the 7905 is faster? remember there is a lot of swap action that goes on there... each user is swapped in and out of core to the drive... Thanks Ed Sharpe archivist for SMECC Please check our web site at http://www.smecc.org to see other engineering fields, communications and computation stuff we buy, and by all means when in Arizona drop in and see us. address: coury house / smecc 5802 w palmaire ave glendale az 85301 ----- Original Message ----- From: "ed sharpe" To: "General Discussion: On-Topic Posts Only" Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2003 8:49 PM Subject: Re: HP2000 progress > what turned out to be the problem with the iop? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jay West" > To: > Sent: Monday, September 22, 2003 6:16 AM > Subject: HP2000 progress > > > > In the great HP2000 rebuild project, thanks to a huge bevy of spare parts > > from Bill, the IOP is now again singing with 32Kw! Yes, a happy snoopy > dance > > was performed :) > > > > Now it's on to resurrecting a 7905 in a lowboy cabinet. Can't decide if I > > will use only 13037 style drives, or stick with multiple 7900's (or both). > > That should pretty much finish the runnable system restoration. Then the > > only thing left will be the refurb of the 2610 printer, and the 7261 mark > > sense card reader, but those certainly aren't required to run the system. > > > > Thanks Bill!!! > > > > Jay West > > > > --- > > [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] > > > > > > > > > > From n8uhn at yahoo.com Wed Sep 24 00:10:51 2003 From: n8uhn at yahoo.com (Bill Allen Jr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 Message-ID: <20030924051051.63590.qmail@web40704.mail.yahoo.com> If i remember right, only four wires are used in the current loop interface. two for xmit and two for rcve. most tty's did 180 baud or near it. the best way i have found to interface it, is to get one of the orignal ibm pc xt 8 bit, 1 port serial cards (the ones with the db-25 connector on the back). consult the instructions (i have a copy of those here somewhere) reverse the jumber pack for current loop and connect the proper pins for current loop too. that usually works for me. Bill __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com From pat at purdueriots.com Wed Sep 24 01:18:35 2003 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Unibus/Qbus board/edge connectors In-Reply-To: <20030924023553.GD8274@rhiannon.rddavis.org> Message-ID: On 23 Sep 2003, R. D. Davis wrote: > Quothe emanuel stiebler, from writings of Tue, Sep 23, 2003 at 02:45:54PM -0600: > > Anybody knows, if they are still available somewhere ? > > Order number ? > > (I'm talking about the connectors on the backplanes, with .125" spacing) > > No idea what the commercial availability is, but why would they be > that difficut to make with a double-sided unetched circuit board, thin I'm not the original author, but I think he's looking for the plastic connector that goes onto the backplane. That'd be much harder to come by (well, unsoldered, anyhow) than the connectors off of an etched circuit board; also it'd make more since than wanting the 'fingers' end of a PCB. Pat -- Purdue University ITAP/RCS Information Technology at Purdue Research Computing and Storage http://www.itap.purdue.edu/rcs/ From eric at brouhaha.com Wed Sep 24 01:50:08 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Lisa models (was Re: New toys) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <33117.64.169.63.74.1064386208.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Sellam wrote about the Lisa 2: > Do they have both a "Reset" and "Interrupt" buttons in the back or just > "Reset"? If the former it's a Lisa 2/10; the latter then it's a Lisa 2 > (upgrade from a Lisa 1). In the latter case it could either be an upgraded Lisa 1, or a Lisa 2/5. There are two different backplanes, the original for the Lisa 1 and later the 2/5, and a newer backplane for the Lisa 2/10 and Macintosh XL. The connectors for the I/O card and the disk cabling are different, so they are not interchangeable, nor are the I/O cards. But the CPU cards are interchangeable provided that you use the right boot EPROMs. Rev. H will work for the Lisa 1, Lisa 2/5, and Lisa 2/10. If you have a Mac XL or a Lisa 2 with a "screen kit", you need rev 3A. From frustum at pacbell.net Tue Sep 23 14:47:30 2003 From: frustum at pacbell.net (Jim Battle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: SOL-20 on e-bay In-Reply-To: <007001c381ef$db6c98c0$6401a8c0@knology.net> References: <007001c381ef$db6c98c0$6401a8c0@knology.net> Message-ID: <3F70A352.4030804@pacbell.net> Paul Pennington wrote: > Jon Titus wrote: > > >>Folks, I just put a nice SOL-20 computer on e-bay as item #2754896139. > > > I saw that -- wish I could afford it. Just out of curiosity, what is > the "personality module" that's included? Does it have something to do with > running CP/M? Also, how much memory is on the main board? > > Paul Pennington > Augusta, Georgia > Paul -- The personality module is a small plug in module with 1K or 2K of ROM/EPROM located between 0xC000 and 0xC7FF. On reset, the code would be executed there. The idea was that they you could plug in different ROMs for different situations -- say an assembler, and editor, a debugger, etc. In reality, it looks like they only made two monitors and one small variant -- called CONSOL (1K monitor), SOLOS (2K monitor), and BOOTLOAD (SOLOS minus the TERM command plus the BOOT command). Their literature talked about an editor module, but I've never seen one. The poor choice of the location for the personality module and the display RAM actually hampered CP/M since it put a hole in the middle of the 64K address space. Many applications used the personality module as a collection of routines that they could draw upon to make the application code smaller. From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Wed Sep 24 04:18:12 2003 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: New toys In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: In message chris wrote: > I just aquired two Apple Lisa 2 units. Both are complete with Profile > drives and printers (as well as keyboard and mouse). > Plus a spare Profile drive, and an assortment of software. You lucky devil. Have fun with your new toys :) Just remember - they weren't made to sit in a cupboard or garage propping up the roof - they were made to be used :) Oh, and be careful with them, what with their rarity and the coolness factor. Now I guess you could get some car window/bumper stickers made up - "My other computer is an Apple Lisa" :) > I think this makes up for the otherwise crappy year I've been having!!! I'll say... Later. -- Phil. | Acorn Risc PC600 Mk3, SA202, 64MB, 6GB, philpem@dsl.pipex.com | ViewFinder, Ethernet (Acorn AEH62), http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ | 8xCD, framegrabber, Teletext ... A fail-safe circuit will destroy others. From rws at ripco.com Wed Sep 24 07:32:12 2003 From: rws at ripco.com (Richard Schauer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Moving a System/34 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Sep 2003, Norm Aleks wrote: > Hi, folks. I just bought an IBM System/34 that's currently in > Pennsylvania, and I need to move it to the Bay Area. Finding an > appropriate shipper is not my problem (I've been through *that* enough). > However, does anyone know what steps I should take to secure this system > for shipping? I'm worried in particular about its hard disks -- it would > seem very IBM-ish to have a manual way to park and secure the heads. Boy, you must *really* want a System/34 to move it all that way. Then again, I suppose they're getting pretty hard to find. The one I have is the only one I've seen in person since I started collecting about 10 years ago. Yes, you need to park the drives. (Although more large drives that I can think of require manual parking/locking than do it automagically, so I can see where that's an IBM thing...) It's not hard, at least for the common drive used (that I can't remember the size of at the moment- it's an 8" drive, my unit has 4 of them). All you need is a long, fairly wide straight-blade screwdriver. My drives have a (yellow?) sticker showing exactly what to do. You stick it into a hole and give a slightly more than quarter turn in the direction it'll turn. If these directions are too vague (can you tell I haven't been inside the S/34 lately?) I can take some pictures and put them up on the Web. If your unit has the magazine feed floppy drive, you should probably remove the disks from it. Keep in mind, it holds 23 disks. (2 10-disk magazines plus 3 loose in the little wire racks) Richard Schauer rws@ripco.com From jwest at classiccmp.org Wed Sep 24 07:36:19 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: HP2000 progress References: <003a01c3810b$b1cc85a0$033310ac@kwcorp.com><007201c38253$94d8f9d0$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> <00ae01c38259$3b0af560$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> Message-ID: <005201c38298$749ea620$033310ac@kwcorp.com> The 7905 is bigger. That's the main plus. The OS will fit on a 7900, but not the entire contributed library. In addition, 7900 drives are extremely difficult to find. 7905's are almost, but not quite, as hard to come by. 7906's are technically not supported, but rumor has it they may work, just not at full capacity, and 7906 drives are pretty easy to find. 7920's... well, I've heard they exist. Last night my 2000/Access MCP (initial load) tape bit the dust.. it's my only copy. Not sure what to do there. In addition, this morning, the system cpu now developed parity errors. Very very demoralizing. The first 2000/Access build I had to move the paper tape reader from the IOP to the system processor, because I couldn't get the mag tape cross loader to load correctly. I have since found that this is because of an error in the 2000/Access operators manual. When using the loader loader, bits 14-12 get set to on, not clear, as stated in the manual. 14-12 on is what gets the special IOP BBL off the loader loader tape, thus letting the cross loader (& mag tape loader) work right. Jay ----- Original Message ----- From: "ed sharpe" To: "ed sharpe" ; "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2003 12:03 AM Subject: Re: HP2000 progress > I would assume the data transfer rate on the 7905 is faster? remember there > is a lot of swap action that goes on there... each user is swapped in and > out of core to the drive... > > Thanks Ed Sharpe archivist for SMECC > > Please check our web site at > http://www.smecc.org > to see other engineering fields, communications and computation stuff we > buy, and by all means when in Arizona drop in and see us. > > address: > > coury house / smecc > 5802 w palmaire ave > glendale az 85301 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "ed sharpe" > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic Posts Only" > Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2003 8:49 PM > Subject: Re: HP2000 progress > > > > what turned out to be the problem with the iop? > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Jay West" > > To: > > Sent: Monday, September 22, 2003 6:16 AM > > Subject: HP2000 progress > > > > > > > In the great HP2000 rebuild project, thanks to a huge bevy of spare > parts > > > from Bill, the IOP is now again singing with 32Kw! Yes, a happy snoopy > > dance > > > was performed :) > > > > > > Now it's on to resurrecting a 7905 in a lowboy cabinet. Can't decide if > I > > > will use only 13037 style drives, or stick with multiple 7900's (or > both). > > > That should pretty much finish the runnable system restoration. Then the > > > only thing left will be the refurb of the 2610 printer, and the 7261 > mark > > > sense card reader, but those certainly aren't required to run the > system. > > > > > > Thanks Bill!!! > > > > > > Jay West > > > > > > --- > > > [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] From allain at panix.com Wed Sep 24 08:01:43 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Unibus/Qbus board/edge connectors References: Message-ID: <003701c3829c$0130f2c0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> > ...the plastic connector that goes onto the backplane. If somebody is looking for DEC standard card sockets (plastic body, card slot on one side, wirewrap pins on the other side) let me know and I'll go check my supplier, who had some last time I visited. John A. From raymondsmith at telus.net Mon Sep 22 22:26:23 2003 From: raymondsmith at telus.net (Raymond Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Heathkit Audio Anlyzer Message-ID: <1064287583.3f6fbd5f2d7c1@webmail.telus.net> Hi, I came across your questions on the web! I am looking for a manual, or at least the Operators section - anychance you have scanned copy? The model is AA-1. Regards, Ray From t.stevens at stcs.de Tue Sep 23 09:04:25 2003 From: t.stevens at stcs.de (Theo Stevens) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: AD200 data aquisition card Message-ID: <00746568BA7DF24B87159BA0D3CBED8706B07B@mail.stcs.net> Hello Mr Brown, i just stumbled over your message about having an Infotek AD200 card from May 3 2003 i would be interested if you still have the card and if so, are willing to sell it to us. pls let us know what you think. best regards Theo Stevens -------------------------------------------------- STCS GmbH Neckarstr. 12-14 65239 Hochheim/Main Tel +49 6146 8219-6 Fax +49 6146 8219-99 email t.stevens@stcs.de From billdeg at degnanco.com Tue Sep 23 17:58:00 2003 From: billdeg at degnanco.com (B.Degnan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Seeking TRS 80 III cables Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030923185632.00a11a60@mail.degnanco.net> I am looking for the cables to attach a 180K internal diskette drive to a working TRS 80 model III computer. Anyone have one for sale/trade? I am also looking for schematic so I can follow during install process. All I have is the drive itself. Bill Wilmington, Delaware. From adamg at pobox.com Tue Sep 23 19:40:44 2003 From: adamg at pobox.com (Adam Goldman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Apple IIe 3.5 inch FDD Message-ID: <20030924004044.GA53086@silme.pair.com> SmartPort 3.5" drives aren't too hard to come by, but I believe the IIe can't use them, and requires UniDisk 3.5" drives instead. For technical information I would start with Apple's old Tech Notes, which are now available on the web. Some of Apple's Technical Reference Manuals might also help. Although DOS 3.3 can't support 3.5" drives out of the box, there are a number of hacks to add this capability (I think one of them was called Diversi-DOS?) To use a standard Shugart-interface 3.5" drive to read and write GCR format floppies on the Apple, you'd need to implement the whole disk controller from scratch. The Apple 3.5" drives had the controller inside the drive, like an IDE or SCSI hard drive does; you'd need to reimplement it. Much easier to just buy one :-). It _is_ possible to use a standard drive mech, though. To deal with the fact that the mech isn't designed for ZBR, you simply change the controller's clock speed as you seek. The next step down in terms of difficulty is to take an off-the-shelf NEC 765 based floppy controller, interface it to the Apple with a bit of glue logic, and write a ROM that talks to it. This means you'd be writing in MFM format, incompatible with real Apple drives. If you want to be really nasty, you could consider that the Apple 5.25" disk interface and the Shugart interface both are at the level of flux transitions and motor steps... The circuitry to make a Shugart interface 3.5" drive look like an Apple 5.25" drive would not be too complicated. You'd get 280K per 3.5" disk and the disks would be in a format totally incompatible with everything. Or you could just buy some 5.25" disks. -- Adam From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Sep 24 08:40:52 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Unibus/Qbus board/edge connectors In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, Patrick Finnegan wrote: > On 23 Sep 2003, R. D. Davis wrote: > > > No idea what the commercial availability is, but why would they be > > that difficut to make with a double-sided unetched circuit board, thin > > I'm not the original author, but I think he's looking for the plastic > connector that goes onto the backplane. That'd be much harder to come > by (well, unsoldered, anyhow) than the connectors off of an etched > circuit board; also it'd make more since than wanting the 'fingers' end > of a PCB. Didn't DEC have the backplane connectors custom made? -Toth From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 24 09:16:04 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: New toys Message-ID: >Now I guess you could get some car window/bumper stickers made up - "My other >computer is an Apple Lisa" :) oooh... I might just have to do that. :-) Anyone else want one? -chris From emu at ecubics.com Wed Sep 24 10:48:19 2003 From: emu at ecubics.com (emanuel stiebler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Unibus/Qbus board/edge connectors In-Reply-To: <003701c3829c$0130f2c0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> References: <003701c3829c$0130f2c0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <3F71BCC3.7050600@ecubics.com> John Allain wrote: >>...the plastic connector that goes onto the backplane. > If somebody is looking for DEC standard card sockets > (plastic body, card slot on one side, wirewrap pins on the > other side) let me know and I'll go check my supplier, > who had some last time I visited. Not neccassary the ones with wire-wrap, but ANY would be good already ;-) So, where did you get them ? cheers & thanks From dwoyciesjes at comcast.net Wed Sep 24 11:00:54 2003 From: dwoyciesjes at comcast.net (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: New toys References: Message-ID: <3F71BFB6.CD54042A@comcast.net> chris wrote: > > >Now I guess you could get some car window/bumper stickers made up - "My other > >computer is an Apple Lisa" :) > > oooh... I might just have to do that. :-) > > Anyone else want one? > > -chris > Or how about "My other computer was made in 1978" or "My other computer cost $4,000... in 1978"? -- --- Dave Woyciesjes --- ICQ# 905818 From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 24 12:09:50 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: New toys Message-ID: >Do they have both a "Reset" and "Interrupt" buttons in the back or just >"Reset"? If the former it's a Lisa 2/10; the latter then it's a Lisa 2 >(upgrade from a Lisa 1). They have both the Interrupt and Reset buttons. So I'm guessing they are the Lisa 2/10. The previous owner told me he thought they were 2/5 as he said there is no internal hard drives. I just opened the front of one, and there is a hard drive in it. So it really looks like they are in fact the 2/10 version. I also have two styles of mice. One is the screw on D shell like the 128 has (with the large fat connector), and the other is the Lisa 1 style spring clip D shell. He said he bought the machines from his company years ago, so I'm not too surprised that there are parts that might not have gone with these specific machines. Both machines have a parallel expansion card in them. Or at least I assume that is what the card is. The one that was hooked up had the Profile drive and printer connected to the two ports on the expansion card. And the ports are labeled with two parallel lines. Why does the Lisa have two serial ports on the machine if they planned on you using parallel ports for the drive and printer? I thought Apple at that time was in the "we give you exactly what you need and nothing more" mode? Or did that attitude go soley with the Mac line? Also, was it normal for there to be an anti-glare screen on the CRTs? Both screens have a fabric feel to them, and when I popped the front off one, it was this screen that sits on the CRT. Was this a normal part, or some extra that was added? And finally, anyone have any idea which power cords shipped with the Lisa 2/10? They came with generic black power cords. Is that what they shipped with, or did they use the beige right angle plug like the early Macs did? I have a box of Apple logo cords and if I have the right ones, I'd like to match them up. -chris From geoffr at zipcon.net Wed Sep 24 12:28:38 2003 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Seeking TRS 80 III cables In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030923185632.00a11a60@mail.degnanco.net> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030923185632.00a11a60@mail.degnanco.net> Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.2.20030924102721.049fdce0@mail.zipcon.net> At 03:58 PM 9/23/03, you wrote: >I am looking for the cables to attach a 180K internal diskette drive to a >working TRS 80 model III computer. Anyone have one for sale/trade? I am >also looking for schematic so I can follow during install process. All I >have is the drive itself. >Bill >Wilmington, Delaware. Does your Model III have a Disk controller in it? if there are currently no disk drives (casette model III) then you probably don't have a disk controller. If this is the case you are going to need a disk controller board AND the cable. From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 24 12:37:46 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: New toys Message-ID: > Or how about "My other computer was made in 1978" or "My other computer >cost $4,000... in 1978"? "I've got Lisa at home with a mouse in her ass"? :-) -chris From ian_primus at yahoo.com Wed Sep 24 14:14:58 2003 From: ian_primus at yahoo.com (Ian Primus) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: IBM System/23 problems Message-ID: <63BBC106-EEC3-11D7-9D00-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> My IBM System/23 doesn't work properly. When turned on, it displays a series of numbers on the screen, and stops at "FD". Of the numbers printed, "0B" is inverted and flashing. I found a listing of the error codes in google's cache of classiccmp.org (part of the archive seems to be down). http://216.239.51.104/search?q=cache:83dbK69EHG8J:www.classiccmp.org/ mail-archive/classiccmp/1997-07/0566.html+IBM+System/ 23+error+site:www.classiccmp.org&hl=en&ie=UTF-8 According to this, the error code "0B" indicates that one of the ROM chips on the logic board has failed. I looked at it, and it is soldered to the board. Desoldering and replacing it with a socket shouldn't be a problem, but I will need to find another ROM chip. Does anyone have a spare chip, or the ability to copy a good chip? Also, once I get this machine working again, I will need to find some software for it. I would assume that there is no place to download System/23 software, or even a way to get files to usable 8 inch floppies. I have a few disks given to me with the computer that may be bootable, but I don't know. I don't really know a lot about the System/23 other than the fact that it's really heavy. Any information would be appreciated. Thanks! Ian Primus ian_primus@yahoo.com From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Sep 24 14:28:31 2003 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Unibus questions Message-ID: <3F71F05F.6080209@mdrconsult.com> I'm going over the card configuration of a PDP11/84 and reading the online documents, and I'm confused about a couple of things. I need to get squared away on this, as I'm testing some drives needed in production and only have Unibus SDI adapters. Pardon the obvious lack of clue. I've never worked with a Unibus machine before, and don't know the terminology at all. Also, I have a hand-written diagram from someone even less educated than I, so if there isn't a board number with the description, I don't have it or can't clearly read it. I won't physically see the machine till this weekend. First, there's an expansion chassis. It has a terminator card (M9302) in row 7 (starting from 0) in what I assume is slots E-F (front of the rack is A?). OK, I get that, but theres a non-NPG single-slot grant card in row 7 slot C, and in succeeding rows, there are more boards - M9700 or M9100, M105, M7226 in row 8, power and M7821 in row 9, power and M117 in row 10, and M002 in row 11. How is this functional? Is there a reliable way to determine grant configuration without physical examination of the backplane? The machine was [allegedly] very recently running in this configuration, but I don't want to smoke something by counting on that. I'd like to strip the non-essentials for testing. A test setup in a single card cage - base boards plus SDI and RX02 controllers - would save a lot of juice and reduce points of failure. Last, the CPU is an M8190-AE, which lists in Megan Gentry's reference as 11/84 *or* 11/83? So I could drop this pup into a QBus chassis after the SDI drives are tested? What would be the relative merits of doing that? Doc From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 24 14:55:46 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: IBM System/23 problems Message-ID: > Also, once I get this machine working >again, I will need to find some software for it. I would assume that >there is no place to download System/23 software, I did just find yesterday another box of 8" disks. This box has the Customer Support Disks in it. That set of disks has assorted tools and software. They aren't original disks, but rather duplicates. I just have to find out if the System 23 software is usable on my 5110. If not, then I'll be offering up the remaining System 23 stuff (8" disks, and an almost complete set of manuals... one of the volume binders is missing its contents, and none of the original disks are to be found, but I think I have copies of all refered to disks in the box I just located. The remaining manuals appear to be complete). -chris From waltje at pdp11.nl Wed Sep 24 15:22:38 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: old shtuff Message-ID: Hiyas, While going through the (many, sigh) boxes of old crap, trying to find the manual for the AST FourPort card, I found my good old Irwin tape drive again... I already have about 120 tapes in the machine room (I always managed to keep those "with" all the other tapes..) which contain a lot of old software. So.. does anyone still have these drives? I can probably go and resurrect my old 286/20 machine (to which the drive was once connected ;) and install a fresh copy of DOS on that, but I probably also need the software for it... I remember I used both their "old" system (FIP, I believe) and their new stuff, EZ-TAPE I believe.... Oh.. and anyone able to feed me info on the (&(#$^(#^ AST card should report in for duty asap :) Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From waltje at pdp11.nl Wed Sep 24 15:36:03 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Unibus questions In-Reply-To: <3F71F05F.6080209@mdrconsult.com> Message-ID: Doc, > I'm going over the card configuration of a PDP11/84 and reading the > online documents, and I'm confused about a couple of things. I need to > get squared away on this, as I'm testing some drives needed in > production and only have Unibus SDI adapters. oooh. I'd kill for an UDA50. You lucky [nastiness suppressed] :) Unibus is a straight-through wiring, with the bus being on each slot on connectors A and B. C-F are for the boards. So, on any given backplane (such as a regular BA11-L 9-slot backplane), you will have "BUS-IN" (slot 0-AB), "BUS-OUT" (slot 8-AB), and "POWER" (the various power connections.) BUS-OUT can be another Unibus cable (the very wide white flatcable), or an M920 interconnect module which sits inbetween two backplanes to bridge them together, or anohther M-type module being the terminator (M913 I believe) of the bus. Sneaky detail: Unibus has DMA support, and the DMA (NPR - Non-Processor Request) lines are wired-through. The *grant* line, however, often gets broken by a card, to make sure cards "behind" it (on the bus) dont grab the request. After removing such a card (the UDA50 is an example) you have to either re-wire the NPG (Non-Proc Request Grant) lines (on the C block, I believe) or insert an NPG-bridge card which effectively does the same. > First, there's an expansion chassis. It has a terminator card > (M9302) in row 7 (starting from 0) in what I assume is slots E-F (front No, that is AB. So, yes, the 9302 is the unibus terminator board, the good one (with active termination.) > of the rack is A?). OK, I get that, but theres a non-NPG single-slot > grant card in row 7 slot C, and in succeeding rows, there are more Ahh, see above. > boards - M9700 or M9100, M105, M7226 in row 8, power and M7821 in row 9, > power and M117 in row 10, and M002 in row 11. How is this functional? See above :) Slots could be *empty*, as long as the NPG was not broken.. slots which had their NPG broken need to be either rewired, or have a G727 in row C to fix the NPG. > Is there a reliable way to determine grant configuration without > physical examination of the backplane? The machine was [allegedly] very > recently running in this configuration, but I don't want to smoke > something by counting on that. I'd like to strip the non-essentials for > testing. A test setup in a single card cage - base boards plus SDI and > RX02 controllers - would save a lot of juice and reduce points of failure. First, run ONLY the CPU with the terminator. The 11/83 CPU board already has console and such, so this is already a working system which displays output. If that works, add a simple board (RX11). Then add the UDA50, which is not simple.. > Last, the CPU is an M8190-AE, which lists in Megan Gentry's reference > as 11/84 *or* 11/83? So I could drop this pup into a QBus chassis after > the SDI drives are tested? What would be the relative merits of doing that? The 8190 indeed is an 11/83 CPU. The PDP-11/84 system is a Unibus based system, but with a Qbus core and a bridge inbetween- this is so DEC did not have to do another (unibus) CPU. So, the 11/83 + Qniverter = 11/84, which is why Megan's info is correct. On the Unibus subject: if anyone has a UDA50 and/or RL11 and/or DELUA available, let me know :) Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From geoffreythomas at onetel.net.uk Wed Sep 24 14:53:55 2003 From: geoffreythomas at onetel.net.uk (Geoffrey Thomas) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: IBM System/23 problems References: <63BBC106-EEC3-11D7-9D00-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <003301c382d5$972783a0$9e5c4ed5@geoff> I have a complete working system - at least it was last time I fired it up, other members of the list have expressed an interest in parts, software etc. Both are in the states , assume you are too ? Geoff. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ian Primus" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2003 8:14 PM Subject: IBM System/23 problems > My IBM System/23 doesn't work properly. When turned on, it displays a > series of numbers on the screen, and stops at "FD". Of the numbers > printed, "0B" is inverted and flashing. I found a listing of the error > codes in google's cache of classiccmp.org (part of the archive seems to > be down). > http://216.239.51.104/search?q=cache:83dbK69EHG8J:www.classiccmp.org/ > mail-archive/classiccmp/1997-07/0566.html+IBM+System/ > 23+error+site:www.classiccmp.org&hl=en&ie=UTF-8 According to this, > the error code "0B" indicates that one of the ROM chips on the logic > board has failed. I looked at it, and it is soldered to the board. > Desoldering and replacing it with a socket shouldn't be a problem, but > I will need to find another ROM chip. Does anyone have a spare chip, or > the ability to copy a good chip? Also, once I get this machine working > again, I will need to find some software for it. I would assume that > there is no place to download System/23 software, or even a way to get > files to usable 8 inch floppies. I have a few disks given to me with > the computer that may be bootable, but I don't know. I don't really > know a lot about the System/23 other than the fact that it's really > heavy. Any information would be appreciated. Thanks! > > Ian Primus > ian_primus@yahoo.com > From eric at brouhaha.com Wed Sep 24 15:49:00 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: New toys In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2691.4.20.168.151.1064436540.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "chris" wrote: > Why does the Lisa have two serial ports on the machine if they planned on > you using parallel ports for the drive and printer? For modems, plotters, serial printers, AppleBus (which turned into AppleTalk, then the physical layer was renamed LocalTalk), or whatever other serial devices you might care to attach. Back in those days no one would have taken a computer with no serial ports very seriously. Serial ports have only started disappearing from PCs in the last year or two. > I thought Apple at > that time was in the "we give you exactly what you need and nothing more" > mode? Or did that attitude go soley with the Mac line? That was a Mac thing. The Lisa was supposed to be a very high-end computer, with a price tag to match. > Also, was it normal for there to be an anti-glare screen on the CRTs? Yes. From eric at brouhaha.com Wed Sep 24 15:51:56 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Unibus questions In-Reply-To: <3F71F05F.6080209@mdrconsult.com> References: <3F71F05F.6080209@mdrconsult.com> Message-ID: <2700.4.20.168.151.1064436716.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "Doc Shipley" wrote: > Is there a reliable way to determine grant configuration without > physical examination of the backplane? You could pull the modules and use a multimeter or continuity tester. Usually physical inspection is easier, though an electrical test will be more reliable. I once had a wire-wrapped grant jumper in the backplane go bad. I'm not sure if the problem was a break in the conductor or a bad wrap, but it certainly looked like there was a jumper. From eric at brouhaha.com Wed Sep 24 15:53:51 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: IBM System/23 problems In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2724.4.20.168.151.1064436831.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "chris" wrote: > I just have to find out if the System 23 software is usable on my 5110. Nope. BASIC programs could possibly be translated, but the 5110 won't read them from disk so you'd have to either retype them or transfer them serially. From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Wed Sep 24 15:21:20 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: Manuals for the postage Message-ID: <030924162120.f16b@splab.cas.neu.edu> O.K. All the manuals went out Friday to Al to scan. With the exception of the heathkit manuals, a clearpoint manual and the vt103 configuration guide, each of the manuals were requested specifically by only one person, so we can send them out right after scanning. I have to go through my email, but I think that for the clearpoint and vt103 manuals, the second person said the electronic version would be o.k., so no copies are needed there either, unless somebody wants to make a paper copy. and finally, there was an offer to make 5 copies of all the heathkit stuff, so at least everybody will have a copy, and the first person on my list will get the original. I'll contact the interested people offline with the latest updates on where we stand on distribution. thanks joe heck From netsurfer_x1 at fastmailbox.net Wed Sep 24 16:03:24 2003 From: netsurfer_x1 at fastmailbox.net (David Vohs) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:05 2005 Subject: New toys In-Reply-To: <01a801c38248$1c5fc340$657ca418@neo.rr.com> References: <01a801c38248$1c5fc340$657ca418@neo.rr.com> Message-ID: <20030924210324.BBF253BF4A@www.fastmail.fm> Lucky bastards! I would have said the same thing about two months ago if a certain member of this list (*cough, cough, cough, Jim Willing, cough, cough*) would move has @$$ & send me the LISA 2 that I rightfully paid for. It's times like this that I wish I knew two nice Italian boys named Tony & Ceasar! On Tue, 23 Sep 2003 23:01:11 -0400, "TeoZ" said: > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "chris" > To: "Classic Computers" > Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2003 10:41 PM > Subject: New toys > > > > WOOHOOO!!! > > > > I just aquired two Apple Lisa 2 units. Both are complete with Profile > > drives and printers (as well as keyboard and mouse). > > > > Plus a spare Profile drive, and an assortment of software. > > > > I think this makes up for the otherwise crappy year I've been having!!! > > > > WOOHOO!!! > > > > -chris > > > > > > Started up the collection again huh > > -- David Vohs netsurfer_x1@fastmailbox.net -- http://www.fastmail.fm - The professional email service From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Sep 24 16:06:25 2003 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Unibus questions In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F720751.8090700@mdrconsult.com> Fred N. van Kempen wrote: > Doc, > > >> I'm going over the card configuration of a PDP11/84 and reading the >>online documents, and I'm confused about a couple of things. I need to >>get squared away on this, as I'm testing some drives needed in >>production and only have Unibus SDI adapters. > > oooh. I'd kill for an UDA50. You lucky [nastiness suppressed] :) > > Unibus is a straight-through wiring, with the bus being on each slot > on connectors A and B. C-F are for the boards. So, on any given > backplane (such as a regular BA11-L 9-slot backplane), you will > have "BUS-IN" (slot 0-AB), "BUS-OUT" (slot 8-AB), and "POWER" (the > various power connections.) BUS-OUT can be another Unibus cable > (the very wide white flatcable), or an M920 interconnect module > which sits inbetween two backplanes to bridge them together, or > anohther M-type module being the terminator (M913 I believe) of > the bus. OK. So the rearmost connector in the rackmount chassis is the A connector? > Sneaky detail: Unibus has DMA support, and the DMA (NPR - Non-Processor > Request) lines are wired-through. The *grant* line, however, often > gets broken by a card, to make sure cards "behind" it (on the bus) > dont grab the request. After removing such a card (the UDA50 is an > example) you have to either re-wire the NPG (Non-Proc Request Grant) > lines (on the C block, I believe) or insert an NPG-bridge card which > effectively does the same. OK. Sanity check. A slot with an adapter using DMA needs the NPG grant line *removed*, and if the board in place needs it in place. Does breaking the NPG grant for a DMA adapter break the grant for succeeding cards? > First, run ONLY the CPU with the terminator. The 11/83 CPU board already > has console and such, so this is already a working system which displays > output. If that works, add a simple board (RX11). Then add the UDA50, > which is not simple.. Maybe I need more info here, concerning the UDA50. I did find the UDA50 manuals - do I need more than that? > The 8190 indeed is an 11/83 CPU. The PDP-11/84 system is a Unibus based > system, but with a Qbus core and a bridge inbetween- this is so DEC did > not have to do another (unibus) CPU. So, the 11/83 + Qniverter = 11/84, > which is why Megan's info is correct. Cool. Assuming access to needed storage and communication, are there any significant pros or cons to running it in a QBus system, as opposed to Unibus? And, does that mean that all the 4x4 slots in the system chassis are Qbus, as in I can run an RQDX3? Doc From vcf at siconic.com Wed Sep 24 16:10:07 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Cool new bad with a vintage computing twist Message-ID: I just discovered one of the coolest new bands called The Polyphonic Spree, and after exploring their multi-faceted website I came across a cute little Easter Egg. Go to: http://www.thepolyphonicspree.com Once the Flash animation finishes coloring in all the sections, click on the bulbous red shape in the lower right hand corner of the screen. This will pull up a photo of a Sinclair ZX Spectrum. Each button you press on the keyboard takes you to a different photo. Check out the music too. It's pretty awesome. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 24 15:52:41 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Seeking TRS 80 III cables In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030923185632.00a11a60@mail.degnanco.net> from "B.Degnan" at Sep 23, 3 06:58:00 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1051 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030924/d03a6fa1/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 24 15:58:26 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Some of my other finds in St. louis In-Reply-To: <002001c3823e$69d58510$a90cdd40@oemcomputer> from "Keys" at Sep 23, 3 08:51:44 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1541 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030924/702c54ca/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 24 16:04:49 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Reviving and connecting an ASR33 In-Reply-To: <20030924051051.63590.qmail@web40704.mail.yahoo.com> from "Bill Allen Jr" at Sep 23, 3 10:10:51 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1037 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030924/7c2b3e38/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 24 16:12:37 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: New toys In-Reply-To: from "Philip Pemberton" at Sep 24, 3 10:18:12 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1652 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030924/dac1c3b7/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 24 16:16:09 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Unibus/Qbus board/edge connectors In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Sep 24, 3 08:40:52 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 538 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030924/757aa460/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 24 16:23:37 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: New toys In-Reply-To: <3F71BFB6.CD54042A@comcast.net> from "David Woyciesjes" at Sep 24, 3 12:00:54 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 643 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030924/dee40fe0/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 24 16:29:51 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Unibus questions In-Reply-To: <3F71F05F.6080209@mdrconsult.com> from "Doc Shipley" at Sep 24, 3 02:28:31 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1360 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030924/a76b5e71/attachment.ksh From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 24 17:01:37 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: IBM System/23 problems Message-ID: >Nope. BASIC programs could possibly be translated, but the 5110 won't >read them from disk so you'd have to either retype them or transfer them >serially. That's what I thought, but before I got rid of the System 23 software, I figured I'd check. Now I just have to figure out which disks of programs were for the 5110 and which were for the System 23. -chris From pcw at mesanet.com Wed Sep 24 17:05:26 2003 From: pcw at mesanet.com (Peter C. Wallace) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Bunch of junk In-Reply-To: <2724.4.20.168.151.1064436831.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: Trying to clean out some accumulation at work Free - you pick up (SFBA) 1 pile of very MISC cables, ICs, Connectors, Surface mount parts, DIP ICs (mostly HCMOS SSI) 1 pile of Mesas old Passive bus ISA stuff Disk emulators, parallel I/O, CPUs etc aopprox 100 cards ~10 HP712/60s most ok (Almost on-topic) 1 Mac performa 6400-180 Some other PPC MAC I cant read the lable on without digging 2 Mac 660av 1 box sun stuff (2 IPXs and about 10 sbus cards) 1 Disk Jocky S100 disk controller 1 Tek 4051 Manual (Eric S. if you still want this it yours) Probably more if the mood strikes Peter Wallace From dundas at caltech.edu Wed Sep 24 17:23:02 2003 From: dundas at caltech.edu (John A. Dundas III) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Unibus questions In-Reply-To: <3F720751.8090700@mdrconsult.com> References: Message-ID: At 2:06 PM -0700 9/24/03, Doc Shipley wrote: > And, does that mean that all the 4x4 slots in the system chassis are >Qbus, as in I can run an RQDX3? Ooh. I recently acquired a complete /84 system as well. I have the technical documentation, though haven't digested it entirely... Pretty sure the quad slots are NOT standard Qbus. I think there's enough there to supply power and some signals. Instead I believe it is PMI, so it accommodates PMI memory, UBA, load monitor, etc. I would not put any standard Qbus boards in there. John From ian_primus at yahoo.com Wed Sep 24 17:27:04 2003 From: ian_primus at yahoo.com (Ian Primus) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: IBM System/23 problems In-Reply-To: <003301c382d5$972783a0$9e5c4ed5@geoff> Message-ID: <39B82AD8-EEDE-11D7-9D00-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> Yeah, I'm here in the states, New York to be specific. I would be very interested in getting ahold of a copy of the ROM chip to replace the nonfunctional chip on my machine's board, as well as copies of whatever software I can find. I don't know what software was available for the System/23, probably mostly just business software, right? What operating system did it run, or was it just some flavor of BASIC with disk commands? Ian Primus ian_primus@yahoo.com On Wednesday, September 24, 2003, at 03:53 PM, Geoffrey Thomas wrote: > I have a complete working system - at least it was last time I fired > it up, > other members of the list have expressed an interest in parts, > software etc. > Both are in the states , assume you are too ? > > Geoff. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ian Primus" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2003 8:14 PM > Subject: IBM System/23 problems > > >> My IBM System/23 doesn't work properly. When turned on, it displays a >> series of numbers on the screen, and stops at "FD". Of the numbers >> printed, "0B" is inverted and flashing. I found a listing of the error >> codes in google's cache of classiccmp.org (part of the archive seems >> to >> be down). >> http://216.239.51.104/search?q=cache:83dbK69EHG8J:www.classiccmp.org/ >> mail-archive/classiccmp/1997-07/0566.html+IBM+System/ >> 23+error+site:www.classiccmp.org&hl=en&ie=UTF-8 According to this, >> the error code "0B" indicates that one of the ROM chips on the logic >> board has failed. I looked at it, and it is soldered to the board. >> Desoldering and replacing it with a socket shouldn't be a problem, but >> I will need to find another ROM chip. Does anyone have a spare chip, >> or >> the ability to copy a good chip? Also, once I get this machine >> working >> again, I will need to find some software for it. I would assume that >> there is no place to download System/23 software, or even a way to get >> files to usable 8 inch floppies. I have a few disks given to me with >> the computer that may be bootable, but I don't know. I don't really >> know a lot about the System/23 other than the fact that it's really >> heavy. Any information would be appreciated. Thanks! >> >> Ian Primus >> ian_primus@yahoo.com >> > From eric at brouhaha.com Wed Sep 24 17:31:23 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Unibus questions In-Reply-To: <3F720751.8090700@mdrconsult.com> References: <3F720751.8090700@mdrconsult.com> Message-ID: <3174.4.20.168.119.1064442683.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "Doc Shipley" wrote: > OK. Sanity check. A slot with an adapter using DMA needs the NPG > grant line *removed*, and if the board in place needs it in place. Does > breaking the NPG grant for a DMA adapter break the grant for succeeding > cards? There are three kinds of SPC modules: 1) Uses NGR - requires NPG jumper to be removed from backplane 2) Does not use NPR, and doesn't pass NPG via a trace - requires that the NPG jumper be installed in backplane 3) Does not use NPR, and passes NPG via a trace - doesn't matter whether NPG jumper is installed in backplane Empty slots require either the NPG jumper OR a G727 or G7273 grant module. If ANY slot in the backplane does not pass grant properly (either via a jumper or through a module), you will have problems. If you have a module that uses NPR, and also have an NPG jumper installed in the same backplane slot, you will have problems. > And, does that mean that all the 4x4 slots in the system chassis are > Qbus, as in I can run an RQDX3? Running Qbus devices in the 84 will interfere with the Unibus interface. The 84 doesn't use true Qbus; it is hardwired for a modified Qbus for use only with the Unibus interface. From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 24 17:16:40 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: New toys In-Reply-To: <2691.4.20.168.151.1064436540.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> from "Eric Smith" at Sep 24, 3 01:49:00 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 664 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030924/b08bada5/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Sep 24 17:35:30 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Unibus questions In-Reply-To: <3F720751.8090700@mdrconsult.com> from "Doc Shipley" at Sep 24, 3 04:06:25 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2091 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030924/95a4ba9c/attachment.ksh From jrkeys at concentric.net Wed Sep 24 18:29:37 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Some of my other finds in St. louis References: Message-ID: <01fc01c382f3$b96e4020$a20cdd40@oemcomputer> Thanks for the great tips. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Duell" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2003 3:58 PM Subject: Re: Some of my other finds in St. louis > > > > Got the following items various thrifts in St. Louis: > > > > HP 33C calculator with case and charger for $5 > > Nice, but a word of warning. > > DO NOT connect the charger to that machine unless there's a known-good > battery pack in it. The battery pack acts as a shunt regulator for the > PSU, and if it's missing/open circuit, the PSU rail will rise to about > 17V. > > If the calculator is turned on when this happens, not too much damage is > done, because the calculator draws enough current to pull the voltage > down. But if the calcualtor is turned off, and it's a -C (continuous > memory) model as here, the CMOS RAM chip gets the full 17V, and promptly > expires. It's HP custom, so you then have big problems. > > HP sold some things called 'reserve power packs' which were battery > holders without the rest of the calculator. You plugged the standard AC > adapter (charger) into that, and put the battery pack in. The idea was to > charger one pack while using another in the calculator, so you always had > a fully chargeed battery even if you used the calculator away from mains > power all the time. > > HP enthusiasts have found that these reserve power packs are also useful > for charging batteries with no risk to the calculator if the battery goes > open-circuit (if the AC adapter is never connected to the calculator, the > RAM can't get the overvoltage). Unfortunately for you, the reserve power > pack for the Spice series (HP3xE, HP3xC) is by far the rarest one, to the > extent that some say it never existed (it did, I have one). > > -tony > > From waltje at pdp11.nl Wed Sep 24 18:35:42 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Unibus questions In-Reply-To: <3F720751.8090700@mdrconsult.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, Doc Shipley wrote: > OK. So the rearmost connector in the rackmount chassis is the A > connector? I cant remember for sure, but, yes, if that is where the term is drawn or present, that is AB. We dont want a term in EF :) > OK. Sanity check. A slot with an adapter using DMA needs the NPG > grant line *removed*, and if the board in place needs it in place. Does > breaking the NPG grant for a DMA adapter break the grant for succeeding > cards? Check succeeded. > Maybe I need more info here, concerning the UDA50. I did find the > UDA50 manuals - do I need more than that? Nope, that is it... they will tell you how to install the thinginto a system, which will include any NPG tinkering. > Cool. Assuming access to needed storage and communication, are there > any significant pros or cons to running it in a QBus system, as opposed > to Unibus? Qbus is slightly slower than Unibus. Other than that, Unibus periphs are older, and, given technology, usually a bit larger than their Qbus variants. > And, does that mean that all the 4x4 slots in the system chassis are > Qbus, as in I can run an RQDX3? Although that is not what the Qbus part in the system was for (yes, those indeed are all Qbus Q22 slots, I assume slots 1-3 are Q-CD, slot 4 is Q-Q) there is no reason why this should not work.. I have seen an 11/84 which had a TQK50 controller to boot and install an OS, simply because its Unibus tape controller was hosed at the time. Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From dittman at dittman.net Wed Sep 24 18:42:52 2003 From: dittman at dittman.net (Eric Dittman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: New toys In-Reply-To: from "Tony Duell" at Sep 24, 2003 10:12:37 PM Message-ID: <20030924234252.A7567801B@narnia.int.dittman.net> > [1] 3 medium-size boards of TTL, a UART, a couple of 6264s, etc. I > couldn't use a microcontroller, how could I program the firmware ROM > without a programmer ;-) Hand-wire a ROM? -- Eric Dittman dittman@dittman.net From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Wed Sep 24 18:47:39 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Compaticard stuff Message-ID: <030924194739.f2ad@splab.cas.neu.edu> was somebody looking for microsolutions compaticard stuff? I found my software and manual. Probably the floppy drive is around here also, but my recollection was it had failed. Joe From cmcnabb at 4mcnabb.net Wed Sep 24 20:03:12 2003 From: cmcnabb at 4mcnabb.net (Christopher McNabb) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: PDP 11/83 Clock Error Message-ID: <1064451305.20621.6.camel@unix> Well, I seem to have gotten my power supply straightened out. It wasn't the switch after all, but the power supply itself. A different problem has now manifested itself. On power on I am getting this on the console: Error 61 M8190 Clock Error It then spits out the contents of various registers and asks if I want to run the test again. I couldn't find this particular error via the normal search engines. Does any have any ideas as to what the problem may be and how to correct it? -- Christopher McNabb The McNabb Family From ian_primus at yahoo.com Wed Sep 24 20:30:12 2003 From: ian_primus at yahoo.com (Ian Primus) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: New toys In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wednesday, September 24, 2003, at 06:16 PM, Tony Duell wrote: >> other serial devices you might care to attach. Back in those days >> no one would have taken a computer with no serial ports very >> seriously. > > Some of us still don't! 2 serial ports is barely enough anyway > (especially if you want to use the machine as a terminal to 2 or 3 > other > computers, link it to your (HP) calculator, etc). Definitely. Serial ports are always the first thing that I run out of on a computer, it seems, and when I got my new computer (Power Macintosh G4), it didn't even have one serial port! I have a USB to serial adapter, and it works, but I would rather get one of those multiport serial I/O boards, but they are more than $100 for one. You'd think that for such a nice computer, they could have at least tossed in a couple serial ports (and a floppy drive... and what happened to my SCSI!!!... grrr.....). At least my homemade PC clone running Linux still has two serial ports, as that was my major concern when purchasing the logic board, and even then, two isn't really enough, I have a VT100 connected to one port, and a switchbox on the other with my Palm Pilot sync cable, another computer, and a serial dot matrix printer connected to it. >> Serial ports have only started disappearing from PCs in the last year >> or two. > > To be replaced by that infernal USB internface. Which is not Universal, > since none of my machines have it or can have it added, and which is > not > a Bus (at least not electrically). OK, it is Serial, so one out of > three > is not too bad :-) Yeah, I hate USB as well. It is far from Universal, considering that very little USB hardware works on a Macintosh due to the lack of drivers, and even with the proper drivers, it seems to be flakey at best. Too many things these days are centered around the WinTel platform, thereby alienating everyone else that uses other systems. People like me that use Macintosh and Linux are too small of a market share I guess, but more and more people are starting to see the light and dump Windblows. Ian Primus ian_primus@yahoo.com From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 24 20:47:22 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: IBM System/23 problems Message-ID: >Yeah, I'm here in the states, New York to be specific. I would be very >interested in getting ahold of a copy of the ROM chip to replace the >nonfunctional chip on my machine's board, as well as copies of whatever >software I can find. I don't know what software was available for the >System/23, probably mostly just business software, right? What >operating system did it run, or was it just some flavor of BASIC with >disk commands? Although I don't know anything about System 23's, I am pretty sure that all my functioning ones also displayed the same codes across the top, with many hilited as well. I think the error may be the one it stops on, not anything prior. Of course, I could also be totally wrong. I would certainly double check with a System 23 expert before doing much work in replacing the ROMS. -chris From cb at mythtech.net Wed Sep 24 21:22:01 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: New toys Message-ID: >Yeah, I hate USB as well. It is far from Universal, considering that >very little USB hardware works on a Macintosh due to the lack of >drivers, and even with the proper drivers, it seems to be flakey at >best. What are you trying to run on the Mac via USB? If it is a mouse or joystick, have a look at USB Overdrive. That guy seems to support everything! -chris From jwstephens at msm.umr.edu Wed Sep 24 20:51:08 2003 From: jwstephens at msm.umr.edu (jim) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Card Reader Message-ID: <3F724A0C.AF4213FC@msm.umr.edu> I have a documation reader that had the classic meltdown of the rollers. Anyone work on those, want to quote a price for a fix? or have reasonable priced unit. I also wish to build up the USB interface for this as well, but that will wait till I have a working specimen in hand. Thanks Jim Stephens From gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org Wed Sep 24 22:36:10 2003 From: gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org (Gunther Schadow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: VAX 11/780 progress ... just a little Message-ID: <3F7262AA.7090005@aurora.regenstrief.org> Hi, I'm still wondering if I'm left the only one actively messing around with a VAX 11/780, because all the help I get comes from PDP-11 people ... but that's adequate since I am still debugging the UNIBUS. I now made sure the NPG line is interrupted under the M7486 part of the UDA50 adapter set. Now I no longer get a 3 on the M7485's LEDs but it properly goes up to the 4/5 blink. Even the port light on my RA90 lights up so that it feels like it's going to come up any minute. But it doesn't. The VAX console never shows any sign of life, the RUN light goes off and the M7485's LEDs show a constant 5 (no more blinking 4/5). Then the drive's port light goes off too. When I interrupt the console and UNJAM it says "HALTED AT 000007B7" The interesting thing is that I can set the R3 register (that indicates the device unit on the UDA50) to a different value (my drive is set as unit 0) and indeed the drive's port light never lights up, as it should. However, the machine hangs in the exact same way and when I interrupt it, it comes up at the exact same address 000007B7. Would that mean that we get stuck even before the boot sector is loaded from the disk? I have two straws of hope to hold on. One is that the basic diagnostics tells me that KA780 module M8230 fails. So I can replace that once I have a spare. The other hope is that my UNIBUS isn't properly terminated. I have what looks like a UNIBUS terminator card but whenever I plug that in, the UDA50 acts strangely and effectively never reacts to the host at all, just constant cycling pattern as if nothing ever happened. Also, my level 2 diagnostics fails when this terminator card in is. When I remove that terminator I see at least the UDA50 and host communicating a little as described above. And without terminator the diagnostics level 2 finishes flawlessly. How essential is the UNIBUS terminator? Does the missing terminator explain why the host hangs and silently stops during boot? I never get a machine check or anything. Or, am I just impatient??????? I do know from my other VAXen (6400) that they turn on all fail lights and make the drive's port LED go off during the first phase of the booting activity. Could it be that the VAX 11/780 just needs several minutes for this job? I don't think so... Who knows what the address 7B7 in Thanks, -Gunther PS: this is what the DUABOO.CMD does: EXAMINE SP ! SHOW ADDRESS OF WORKING MEMORY+^X200 G 0000000E 00000200 LOAD VMB.EXE/START:@ ! LOAD PRIMARY BOOTSTRAP LOAD DONE, 00004800 BYTES LOADED START @ ! AND START IT does that mean the VMB.EXE is loaded at 00000200, so that 00000747 is relative address 547 in VMB.EXE? Is there a commented disassembly listing for VMB.EXE somewhere? From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Sep 24 22:46:32 2003 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Unibus questions In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F726518.1080804@mdrconsult.com> John A. Dundas III wrote: > At 2:06 PM -0700 9/24/03, Doc Shipley wrote: > >> And, does that mean that all the 4x4 slots in the system chassis are >>Qbus, as in I can run an RQDX3? > > Ooh. I recently acquired a complete /84 system as well. I have the > technical documentation, though haven't digested it entirely... > > Pretty sure the quad slots are NOT standard Qbus. I think there's enough > there to supply power and some signals. Instead I believe it is PMI, so it > accommodates PMI memory, UBA, load monitor, etc. I would not put any > standard Qbus boards in there. Well, almost as soon as I posed the question, on my way oout the door, I realized that an RQDXx effectively terminates the bus anyway, so that particular answer would be "no". Doc From tothwolf at concentric.net Thu Sep 25 00:20:12 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: TRS-80 printer cable length? Message-ID: Does anyone know what the length of the original TRS-80 model 1/3/4 printer cable was? I am considering making some (some for my own systems, and a few to sell), but I don't know what the original length was. I'm also curious about the length of the model 2/12/16 printer cable, though I'd imagine it was the same length. -Toth From nico at farumdata.dk Thu Sep 25 00:32:14 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Compaticard stuff References: <030924194739.f2ad@splab.cas.neu.edu> Message-ID: <002701c38326$71474d40$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> > was somebody looking for microsolutions compaticard stuff? I found my > software and manual. Probably the floppy drive is around here also, > but my recollection was it had failed. > > Joe > Yes please, I would appreciate the software Nico From esharpe at uswest.net Thu Sep 25 00:52:33 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (ed sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: *****hayes modem history..... Message-ID: <00be01c38329$37d80e70$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> question: was the s100 board the first version of the Hayes micromodem with the at command set or was the standalone first? I also remember they made one for the apple too... came across the s100 and a standalone version and need to label up for one of the displays.... I should know the answer to this but alas the cob webs grow deep in my brain! Thanks Ed Sharpe archivist for SMECC Please check our web site at http://www.smecc.org to see other engineering fields, communications and computation stuff we buy, and by all means when in Arizona drop in and see us. address: coury house / smecc 5802 w palmaire ave glendale az 85301 From geoffr at zipcon.net Thu Sep 25 01:12:04 2003 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Compaticard stuff In-Reply-To: <030924194739.f2ad@splab.cas.neu.edu> References: <030924194739.f2ad@splab.cas.neu.edu> Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.2.20030924231157.04a4ad50@mail.zipcon.net> yup. moi.... At 04:47 PM 9/24/03, you wrote: >was somebody looking for microsolutions compaticard stuff? I found my >software and manual. Probably the floppy drive is around here also, >but my recollection was it had failed. > >Joe From tothwolf at concentric.net Thu Sep 25 01:30:12 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: *****hayes modem history..... In-Reply-To: <00be01c38329$37d80e70$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> References: <00be01c38329$37d80e70$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, ed sharpe wrote: > question: was the s100 board the first version of the Hayes micromodem > with the at command set or was the standalone first? I also remember > they made one for the apple too... came across the s100 and a > standalone version and need to label up for one of the displays.... I > should know the answer to this but alas the cob webs grow deep in my > brain! I have a couple of the Apple versions. Both are complete, and I even got books and software with one of them. Unfortunately, one has a broken plexi cover (which I hope to repair eventually). I've thought about making reproductions of that modem, as it is pretty simple, but I've not gotten very far with it yet. -Toth From eric at brouhaha.com Thu Sep 25 01:15:50 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: *****hayes modem history..... In-Reply-To: <00be01c38329$37d80e70$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> References: <00be01c38329$37d80e70$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> Message-ID: <33828.64.169.63.74.1064470550.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "ed sharpe" wrote: > question: was the s100 board the first version of the Hayes micromodem > with the at command set or was the standalone first? Neither of their S100 models had the AT command set, nor did the Micromodem for the Apple II. The AT command set was introduced with the Smartmodem, which was introduced in 1981 IIRC. From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 25 02:48:44 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: *****hayes modem history..... In-Reply-To: <00be01c38329$37d80e70$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, ed sharpe wrote: > question: was the s100 board the first version of the Hayes micromodem > with the at command set or was the standalone first? I also remember > they made one for the apple too... came across the s100 and a standalone > version and need to label up for one of the displays.... I should know > the answer to this but alas the cob webs grow deep in my brain! Did the S-100 modem even have the AT command set? -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From wmsmith at earthlink.net Thu Sep 25 03:09:07 2003 From: wmsmith at earthlink.net (Wayne M. Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: IBM System/23 problems In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <002d01c3833c$4b2b2120$2cb2d642@WaynePC> > > >Yeah, I'm here in the states, New York to be specific. I > would be very > >interested in getting ahold of a copy of the ROM chip to replace the > >nonfunctional chip on my machine's board, as well as copies > of whatever > >software I can find. I don't know what software was > available for the > >System/23, probably mostly just business software, right? What > >operating system did it run, or was it just some flavor of > BASIC with > >disk commands? > > Although I don't know anything about System 23's, I am pretty > sure that > all my functioning ones also displayed the same codes across the top, > with many hilited as well. > > I think the error may be the one it stops on, not anything prior. Of > course, I could also be totally wrong. > > I would certainly double check with a System 23 expert before > doing much > work in replacing the ROMS. > > -chris > > I pulled my maintenance manual but it wasn't of much help. If you have a diagnostic disk I can walk you through what to do to diagnose the problem. I suspect that the "0B" may mean that the unit is searching for an external disk unit (either a 5246 or 5247 because you have one of the I/O boards installed) and isn't finding one. If this is the case, you can simultaneously press the "Cmd" and "Error Reset" keys (or if that doesn't work, just "Error Reset"), and hopefully the computer will continue booting to the "READY INPUT" prompt. If this works, you can avoid the problem in the future by removing the offending board. I had a similar problem with the board for the 5247 hard drive, when I didn't have my 5247 hooked up. Good luck. -W From bqt at update.uu.se Thu Sep 25 05:14:13 2003 From: bqt at update.uu.se (Johnny Billquist) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: VAX 11/780 progress ... just a little In-Reply-To: <3F7262AA.7090005@aurora.regenstrief.org> Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, Gunther Schadow wrote: > Hi, I'm still wondering if I'm left the only one actively messing > around with a VAX 11/780, because all the help I get comes > from PDP-11 people ... but that's adequate since I am still > debugging the UNIBUS. Well, I don't have any 11/780, but I do run an 11/790. :-) But I'm also PDP-11 people, I guess... To make a short answer: the unibus termination is *vital*. If you fail diagnostics with it inserted, it's not because of the termination, but because some problem in your Unibus don't show up otherwise. The termination should be in the last slot, in AB. Then you should check the NPR-line all the way through the Unibus. Unless you have a card that uses DMA, or have the pins bridged, you should have the wire installed in the Unibus. All slots not occupied by something should have a Unibus grant card inserted in C. Johnny Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt@update.uu.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 25 05:38:53 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Vintage Computer Festival 6.0 Update Message-ID: -= Vintage Computer Festival =- -= Saturday, October 11 through Sunday, October 12 =- -= 10am until 6pm Daily =- -= Computer History Museum, Mountain View, California =- -= http://www.vintage.org/2003/main/ =- It's time to get OLD SCHOOL! __ __ _ _ _ _______ _______ _______ \ \ / / | | | \ | | |__ __| /\ / _____ \ | _____| \ \ / / | | | \ | | | | / \ | / \_| | | \ \ / / | | | \ | | | | / /\ \ | | _____ | |_____ \ \ / / | | | |\ \| | | | / / \ \ | | |____ | | _____| \ \/ / | | | | \ | | | / /____\ \ | | | | | | \ / | | | | \ | | | / ________ \ | \_____/ | | |_____ \/ |_| |_| \_| |_| /_/ \_\ \_______/ |_______| ______ ______ __________ ______ _ _ ________ ______ ______ | ____ || __ || ___ _ || ____ ||| |||___ ___|| _____|| ____ | || |_||| |_ ||| | | | ||| |||| || || || || || || || |||| | | | |||____|||| || || ||_____ ||____|| | \ || ||| \ | | | || ___|| \ || | \ | ___|| ___ \ | | _ || ||| | | | | || | | | || | | | | | | | | | |_| |||____||| | | | | || | | |__|| | | | |___ | | | | |______||______||__| |_| |_||__| |______| |__| |______||__| |_| _______ _______ ____ _______ _ __ __ _ | _____|| _____| / __ \ |__ __| | | \ \ / / /\ | | | | | | | | \_| | | | | \ \ / / / \ | | | |_____ | |_____ | \___ | | | | \ \ / / / /\ \ | | | _____|| _____| \___ \ | | | | \ \ / / / / \ \ | | | | | | _ | | | | | | \ \/ / / /____\ \ | | | | | |_____ | \__| | | | | | \ / / ________ \ | |____ |_| |_______| \____/ |_| |_| \/ /_/ \_\ |______| _______ _______ | ___ | | ___ | | | |_| | | / | | |_____ | | / | | ___ | | |/ /| | | | | | | / | | | |___| | _ | /__| | |_______| |_| |_______| [ best viewed with a fixed font, because in my day we didn't have these fancy proportional fonts, AND WE SURE AS HECK DIDN'T HAVE LOWERCASE EITHER DAGNABBIT! ] That's right! You know it's the Vintage Computer Festival littering your inbox when you get a message that looks like the intro screen to a BBS from the 1980s. The time has come for those who appreciate the more utilitarian uses of ASCII characters to celebrate another year gone by in computing history. The Vintage Computer Festival celebrates the passing of more great machines into the annals of history, and what better place to celebrate than at the Computer History Museum! The fine folks at the Museum have invited the VCF crew back again for a second year, but this time we get to invade their spacious new 119,000 square foot facility in Mountain View, California, home to the single largest computer history archive on the planet! This is what's happening at this year's Festival: -=[ Xerox Alto 30th Birthday Bash ]=- The Xerox Alto, the computer that introduced us to the Graphical User Interface (GUI) and forever aliented Command-Line Interface (CLI) programmers everywhere, has reached the ripe old age of 30. So we're celebrating it in grand style by having a panel of past and present Xerox PARC (Palo Alto Research Center, the place where the Alto was born) luminaries speak about the development of the Alto. We're also featuring a line-up of classic Xerox machines. The panel speakers so far include John Ellenby, Gary Starkweather, and Mark Bernstein. More panelists are to be announced. Stay tuned! A special Xerox Alto exhibit will accompany the presentation, courtesy of Bruce Damer of the DigiBarn and Xerox computer afficionado Don Woodward (winner of the Best of Show exhibit ribbon at VCF 5.0). The exhibit will include the original Alto, an Alto II XM, and later D* machines including the 8010 "Star", 6085 "Daybreak", and more! Many of these machines will be running, and you'll have a chance to demo them hands-on. You do not want to miss this event! It is not often that you have a chance to experiment with ancient computers that set the paradigm for modern computing and also meet the folks who designed them. -=[ Retro-Code Video Game Programming Challenge ]=- We tried this last year and the results were...interesting. This year we want some verve, some panache, some jois de vive, some ASS-KICKING video games, and we want YOU (yes, YOU) to be involved! Are you ready to take the Retro-Code Challege!? Here's the deal: We'll be providing three classic computers--an Apple //e, an Atari 800, and a Commodore 64. Each will be outfitted with the minimum tools required to design a video game from scratch, including technical reference manuals, general programming reference books, and a disk operating system. We'll turn them on and boot them up, and then turn them over to you. We're going to assemble three teams of programmers. Each team will have three hours to design, from scratch, the most inspiring video game their over-stressed neurons will be able to muster. The team with the best video game at the end of the competition will be awarded with fabulous prizes (OK, we'll give out some consolation prizes to the also-rans ;) The Retro-Code contest will be held on the Saturday of the event and will begin at 2:30PM. Teams will be chosen at 2:15PM, so arrive early if you wish to participate. For more contest details and information, go to: http://www.vintage.org/2003/main/retrocode.php -=[ Computer History Museum Mega Book Sale ]=- Our fabulous sponsors, the Computer History Museum, will be holding a huge book sale on Saturday, October 11, beginning at around 1:30pm. Over 1,000 books covering contemporary technical computer topics will be available. The books were donated to the Museum by a very well-known individual in the computer industry and are intended to be sold to raise money for the Museum's operations. The Museum is also culling duplicate titles from their own library to augment the sale. Many of the books being pulled are very interesting old (1970s and prior) texts on various computer-related topics. If you're a vintage computer bookworm then you won't want to miss this sale. Visit the Museum's website for more information: http://www.computerhistory.org You might also want to check out the Friends of the Palo Alto Library book sale, which features an excellent computer and technical section filled with many fine old computer related texts. Their sale is also on Saturday, October 11, and is being cross-advertised with the book sale at the Museum. Get more information here: http://www.friendspaloaltolib.org/booksale.htm -=[ IMSAI Series Two to be Debuted ]=- Tom Fischer of IMSAI will debut the IMSAI Series Two, a modern-day reincarnation of the venerable IMSAI 8080 computer. The new IMSAI Series Two features the classic IMSAI 8080 cabinet, a newly designed advanced IEEE-696 compatible Programmer's Front Panel, 10-slot active termination IEEE-696 motherboard and a 350 watt switching power supply. It's powered by a Zilog Z8S180 20Mhz microprocessor (backward compatible to the Intel 8080) with 32K Flash memory and 1MB static memory. IMSAI will be exhibiting the new IMSAI products, including a brand new Super I/O S-100 board (Serial, Parallel, IDE and much more!) in the main hall. Also, make sure you catch Tom's talk on Sunday. More information on the IMSAI Series Two can be found here: http://www.imsai.net/products/imsai_series_two.htm -=[ VCF 6.0 Speaker Schedule ]=- We always assemble the most eccelectic bunch of computer history experts and storytellers to entertain you during the morning hours of the event. This year we've really out-done ourselves. We've got THREE tracks of speakers, plus the APL Bay Area Users Group will be holding their October meeting on-site. Here's the current schedule: Saturday, October 11 Time Speaker Topic -------- ------------------- -------------------------------------- 10:00 AM Evan Koblentz History of the PDA 11:00 AM Zbigniew Stachniak Microcomputing in Canada 1973-1983 11:30 AM Christine Finn Collecting the Collectors 12:00 PM Len Shustek Keynote Speech 1:00 PM Xerox Alto Panel Xerox Alto 30th Birthday Bash Sunday, October 12 Time Speaker Topic -------- ------------------- -------------------------------------- 10:00 AM Joey Tuttle A Personal History of the IBM 5100 11:00 AM Forth Panel Using Forth with Vintage Computers 11:30 AM Todd Fischer IMSAI History & the New IMSAI Series 2 12:00 PM Sellam Ismail VCF Shenanigans 12:30 PM Jef Raskin The Humane Interface 01:00 PM Bruce Damer Joys and Trials of Computer Collecting More speakers are to be announced soon! Check the VCF 6.0 speaker's schedule for updates: http://www.vintage.org/2003/main/speaker.php -=[ Exhibit Your Vintage Computer ]=- We're aiming to have the largest number of exhibits ever at the VCF this year, and so we'd still like more! Consider exhibiting your favorite vintage computer at this year's Festival. You might say, "Well, Sellam, I've only got [such-n-such] computer and it's not really that very interesting," to which I would reply, "You're WRONG, fool!" Ok, I won't call you a fool, but you'll be pleasantly surprised at the reaction you'll get exhibiting what you may think to be simply a ho-hum computer, but that others will find pretty fascinating. Make new friends and strike up interesting conversations with people you don't even know. Heck, you may even meet the girl/guy of your dreams!* Exhibit entries will be judged and awarded ribbons in 12 different categories. We'll also award 1st, 2nd and 3rd place ribbons for the Best of Show exhibits, with fabulous prizes including a $100 cash award for the Best of Show exhibit! To register your exhibit, mosey on over to: http://www.vintage.org/2003/main/exhibit.php While there you can also see who else is exhibiting and what they're bringing. * No guarantees; bathe and brush your teeth for better results -=[ Buy, Sell and Trade at the VCF Marketplace ]=- As always, one of the most exciting aspects of the VCF is the Marketplace, where you can find a large and varied assortment of some of the most fantastical old computer thingies anywhere. Find that odd part you've been seeking out for your collection, then touch, smell, even taste it if you like, before haggling out a deal. There is simply no better place to buy and sell vintage computers than at the VCF Marketplace. For more information on selling at VCF 6.0, please visit: http://www.vintage.org/2003/main/vendor.php -=[ Commodore 64 Prototype Up for Auction ]=- VCF 6.0 will feature an auction for the only known prototype Commodore 64 in existence. The auction will be happening in the background on our Vintage Computer Marketplace and will culminate at 3:00 PM on the Sunday of the event. We'll announce the closing price at that time. In the meantime, to get information about this auction (and to participate in the bidding) go to: http://www.vintage.org/special/2003/c64prototype/ As mentioned, the auction is being held on the newly launched Vintage Computer Marketplace. Buy, Sell and Trade vintage computers on this innovative new service. Check it out at: http://marketplace.vintage.org -=[ VCF 6.0 Sponsored by the Computer History Museum ]=- The Vintage Computer Festival would like to extend it's fondest gratitude to the Computer History Museum for their fifth year of support and their second year of sponsoring the VCF directly by hosting VCF 6.0 at their facilities. The Museum is a fine organization with a mandate to preserve the history of computing far into the future. They depend on your support to carry on this legacy and we hope you'll do your part to help them with their mission. To make a tax-deductible contribution to the Computer History Museum, visit their website at: http://www.computerhistory.org/contribute/ So that's VCF 6.0 in a nutshell. For more information including admission, directions, etc., please visit the VCF 6.0 website: http://www.vintage.org/2003/main/ I'll see you at VCF 6.0! Best regards, Sellam Ismail Producer Vintage Computer Festival -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 25 06:31:39 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Cute auction ad Message-ID: Check out this auction for a TRS-80 Pocket Computer 2: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3048884954 -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Sep 25 07:26:20 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: ***CLEAR*** HP-85 FS on E-bay Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030925082620.007b5100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Joe From e.huininga at sozawe.groningen.nl Thu Sep 25 07:25:39 2003 From: e.huininga at sozawe.groningen.nl (Eelco Huininga) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Betr.: old shtuff Message-ID: Hi Fred, It sounds very familiar. I believe I used to have one too :-) Maybe I've still got the software, jumpersettings etc. somewhere. I'll take a look this evening.... Cheers, Eelco Met vriendelijke groet, Eelco Huininga Systeembeheer Dienst Sociale Zaken & Werkgelegenheid Eendrachtskade z.z. 2 9726 CW Groningen, The Netherlands tel: +31 50 367 5720 fax: +31 50 367 5731 e-mail: e.huininga@sozawe.groningen.nl >>> "Fred N. van Kempen" 09/24 10:22 >>> Hiyas, While going through the (many, sigh) boxes of old crap, trying to find the manual for the AST FourPort card, I found my good old Irwin tape drive again... I already have about 120 tapes in the machine room (I always managed to keep those "with" all the other tapes..) which contain a lot of old software. So.. does anyone still have these drives? I can probably go and resurrect my old 286/20 machine (to which the drive was once connected ;) and install a fresh copy of DOS on that, but I probably also need the software for it... I remember I used both their "old" system (FIP, I believe) and their new stuff, EZ-TAPE I believe.... Oh.. and anyone able to feed me info on the (&(#$^(#^ AST card should report in for duty asap :) Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From menadeau at comcast.net Thu Sep 25 03:41:11 2003 From: menadeau at comcast.net (Michael Nadeau) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: ***CLEAR*** HP-85 FS on E-bay References: <3.0.6.32.20030925082620.007b5100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <014201c38340$c7a91b40$0b01a8c0@michael> This is probably more aptly called a demo model rather than a prototype. Computer makers would sometimes create a handful of a model prior to launch to privately show it off to the press, retailers, investors, etc. Compaq once gave me a laptop to preview for BYTE that was in a clear case. It was essentially a production unit on the inside. My guess is that HP made fewer than 10 of these HP-85s in a clear case. This is a way cool find. --Mike Michael Nadeau Editor/Publisher Classic Tech, the Vintage Computing Resource www.classictechpub.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe" To: Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 12:26 PM Subject: ***CLEAR*** HP-85 FS on E-bay > > > Joe > From bill at timeguy.com Wed Sep 24 10:49:34 2003 From: bill at timeguy.com (Bill Richman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Geek Destinations in St. Louis? Message-ID: <20030924104819.L90389-100000@outpost.timeguy.com> We'll be in St. Louis this weekend. Any good museums, junk shops, or other recommended geek destinations in the area? GPS coordinates happily accepted. :-) From witchy at binarydinosaurs.co.uk Wed Sep 24 11:35:25 2003 From: witchy at binarydinosaurs.co.uk (Witchy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: New toys In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > -----Original Message----- > From: cctech-bounces@classiccmp.org > [mailto:cctech-bounces@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Philip Pemberton > Sent: 24 September 2003 10:18 > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: New toys > > You lucky devil. Have fun with your new toys :) > Just remember - they weren't made to sit in a cupboard or garage > propping up the roof - they were made to be used :) I'm scared to use mine 'cos it's only got the 110V PSU, and even though I've got a suitably beefy step-down transformer I'm still not convinced I'm not damaging it! cheers (See if this message gets through!) -- adrian/witchy www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the online computer museum www.snakebiteandblack.co.uk - ex-monthly gothic shenanigans :o( From tlindner at watermarkpress.com Wed Sep 24 19:20:47 2003 From: tlindner at watermarkpress.com (tim lindner) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Power Macintosh 6100/66 (with DOS compatibility card) Message-ID: <1g1sw48.17jczz9m7688wM%tlindner@watermarkpress.com> I am looking for a buyer for the above machine. It isn't ten years old yet, so I was hesisatant about listing it on vinatge.org Interested? -- tim lindner tlindner@watermarkpress.com Bright From jwest at classiccmp.org Thu Sep 25 08:19:50 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:06 2005 Subject: Geek Destinations in St. Louis? References: <20030924104819.L90389-100000@outpost.timeguy.com> Message-ID: <006b01c38367$b3789480$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Bill wrote... > We'll be in St. Louis this weekend. Any good museums, junk shops, or > other recommended geek destinations in the area? GPS coordinates happily > accepted. :-) Two surplus places that I know of... Gateway Electronics 314-427-6116 or (800-669-5810) 8123 Page Blvd. - St. Louis, MO 63130 Gateway is mostly modern stuff, but they have an isle or two that is quite old stuff. Not great, but worth a look-see. Electronics Exchange 314-426-4263 they moved, but are on St. Charles Rock Road in the St. Ann area. Electronics exchange is all surplus, never know what you'll find there. Inventory changes a lot so I go every 2 weeks. Museums - not a lot to speak of. St. Louis science center is cool, but mostly oriented for children. I have heard rumor of a museum of technology and engineering, NOT part of the St. Louis Science center, but I've never been able to find it. Then, if you're into mini's, you can see my junque heap sometime sunday if you'd like. Contact me off-list for number, etc. if you want to do that. Jay West --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] From bob_lafleur at technologist.com Thu Sep 25 09:41:57 2003 From: bob_lafleur at technologist.com (Bob Lafleur) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Cute auction ad In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000a01c38373$2c75c820$023ca8c0@blafleur> > Check out this auction for a TRS-80 Pocket Computer 2: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3048884954 Doesn't this thing have a BASIC interpreter built-in? The guy forgot to mention (or probably didn't know) that you can write rea, live, BASIC programs on it. Oh wow! From ggs at shiresoft.com Thu Sep 25 10:15:54 2003 From: ggs at shiresoft.com (Guy Sotomayor) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: IBM System/23 problems In-Reply-To: <39B82AD8-EEDE-11D7-9D00-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> References: <39B82AD8-EEDE-11D7-9D00-000393D7845A@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1064502953.4887.4.camel@nazgul.shiresoft.com> On Wed, 2003-09-24 at 15:27, Ian Primus wrote: > Yeah, I'm here in the states, New York to be specific. I would be very > interested in getting ahold of a copy of the ROM chip to replace the > nonfunctional chip on my machine's board, as well as copies of whatever > software I can find. I don't know what software was available for the > System/23, probably mostly just business software, right? What > operating system did it run, or was it just some flavor of BASIC with > disk commands? The ROM (ROS in IBM terminology) contained a flavor of BASIC (compatible with system/34). It was completely self contained (ie it doesn't boot from the floppies). The CSFs (Customer Support Functions) which are on diskette are utilities for managing among other things diskettes (like formatting them and copying them) but they were not standalone. They required/used many functions in the ROMs. They were written in 8085 assembly (as was the BASIC). > > Ian Primus > ian_primus@yahoo.com > > On Wednesday, September 24, 2003, at 03:53 PM, Geoffrey Thomas wrote: > > > I have a complete working system - at least it was last time I fired > > it up, > > other members of the list have expressed an interest in parts, > > software etc. > > Both are in the states , assume you are too ? > > > > Geoff. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Ian Primus" > > To: > > Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2003 8:14 PM > > Subject: IBM System/23 problems > > > > > >> My IBM System/23 doesn't work properly. When turned on, it displays a > >> series of numbers on the screen, and stops at "FD". Of the numbers > >> printed, "0B" is inverted and flashing. I found a listing of the error > >> codes in google's cache of classiccmp.org (part of the archive seems > >> to > >> be down). > >> http://216.239.51.104/search?q=cache:83dbK69EHG8J:www.classiccmp.org/ > >> mail-archive/classiccmp/1997-07/0566.html+IBM+System/ > >> 23+error+site:www.classiccmp.org&hl=en&ie=UTF-8 According to this, > >> the error code "0B" indicates that one of the ROM chips on the logic > >> board has failed. I looked at it, and it is soldered to the board. > >> Desoldering and replacing it with a socket shouldn't be a problem, but > >> I will need to find another ROM chip. Does anyone have a spare chip, > >> or > >> the ability to copy a good chip? Also, once I get this machine > >> working > >> again, I will need to find some software for it. I would assume that > >> there is no place to download System/23 software, or even a way to get > >> files to usable 8 inch floppies. I have a few disks given to me with > >> the computer that may be bootable, but I don't know. I don't really > >> know a lot about the System/23 other than the fact that it's really > >> heavy. Any information would be appreciated. Thanks! > >> > >> Ian Primus > >> ian_primus@yahoo.com > >> > > -- TTFN - Guy From kyrrin at bluefeathertech.com Thu Sep 25 10:20:29 2003 From: kyrrin at bluefeathertech.com (Bruce Lane) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Compaticard stuff In-Reply-To: <030924194739.f2ad@splab.cas.neu.edu> References: <030924194739.f2ad@splab.cas.neu.edu> Message-ID: <200309250820290951.0DD7705C@192.168.42.129> Joe, I'd like to archive that floppy, and make it available on my FTP server. Any way you can send me a Teledisk image of it? Yes, I also have one of the cards. It's one of the few pieces of "classic" computing stuff that I want to hang on to. Thanks much. *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 24-Sep-03 at 19:47 TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu wrote: >was somebody looking for microsolutions compaticard stuff? I found my >software and manual. Probably the floppy drive is around here also, >but my recollection was it had failed. > >Joe -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy, Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com ARS KC7GR (Formerly WD6EOS) since 12-77 -- kyrrin@bluefeathertech.com "Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati" (Red Green, aka Steve Smith) From vance at neurotica.com Thu Sep 25 11:04:38 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: New toys In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, chris wrote: > > Now I guess you could get some car window/bumper stickers made up - > > "My other computer is an Apple Lisa" :) > > oooh... I might just have to do that. :-) > > Anyone else want one? I might get one made that says, "My Other Computer is a VAX". Peace... Sridhar From tothwolf at concentric.net Thu Sep 25 12:06:49 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: ***CLEAR*** HP-85 FS on E-bay In-Reply-To: <014201c38340$c7a91b40$0b01a8c0@michael> References: <3.0.6.32.20030925082620.007b5100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <014201c38340$c7a91b40$0b01a8c0@michael> Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Michael Nadeau wrote: > This is probably more aptly called a demo model rather than a prototype. > Computer makers would sometimes create a handful of a model prior to > launch to privately show it off to the press, retailers, investors, etc. > Compaq once gave me a laptop to preview for BYTE that was in a clear > case. It was essentially a production unit on the inside. > > My guess is that HP made fewer than 10 of these HP-85s in a clear case. > This is a way cool find. Clear cases are usually made just prior to any texture being added to the production molds. Usually they are used for engineering purposes (making sure it all fits), but sometimes they will also use those cases for demo/promotional purposes too. -Toth From esharpe at uswest.net Thu Sep 25 13:08:43 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: *****hayes modem history..... References: Message-ID: <00a901c38390$0e891520$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> the computer museum says..... Hayes Micromodem 100 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- Hayes pioneered the 'Smart Modems'. These modems fit inside the computer and could be programmed to automatically dial a phone number or answer the phone. Hayes advertised: "Since it is a direct connect device, it has none of the losses and distortions associated with acoustic couplers. There are two program selectable speeds for the Micromodem 100-- a high speed of 300 BPS (baud) and a factory set low speed of 110 BPS. The low speed may be hardware adjusted from 45 to 300 BPS at http://www.syssrc.com/html/museum/html/modem_hayes100.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vintage Computer Festival" To: "Classic Computers Mailing List" Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 12:48 AM Subject: Re: *****hayes modem history..... > On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, ed sharpe wrote: > > > question: was the s100 board the first version of the Hayes micromodem > > with the at command set or was the standalone first? I also remember > > they made one for the apple too... came across the s100 and a standalone > > version and need to label up for one of the displays.... I should know > > the answer to this but alas the cob webs grow deep in my brain! > > Did the S-100 modem even have the AT command set? > > -- > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage mputers ] > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] > > > From gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org Thu Sep 25 12:37:19 2003 From: gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org (Gunther Schadow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: VAX 11/780 progress ... just a little In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F7327CF.10201@aurora.regenstrief.org> Johnny Billquist wrote: > To make a short answer: the unibus termination is *vital*. > If you fail diagnostics with it inserted, it's not because of the > termination, but because some problem in your Unibus don't show up > otherwise. The termination should be in the last slot, in AB. So, I need grants and NPG grants in front of the terminator? When I plug the terminator directly behind the UDA50 (which happens to be the last card) things are even worse. The reason I don't trust that terminator is that two of the 3 small capacitors seem to have been damaged on the edge. So, may be it creates noise on the bus? How can I test that the terminator works properly? Ahh, but that is not properly installed, right? If I have a 9 slot UNIBUS backplane, then only the last slot (A,B) can have the terminator, right? So, I should put in more cards and grants in slots 7 and 8, right? Do I need to put a grant also in slot 9C (since the terminator is only in 9A and B)? thanks for your help, -Gunther From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 25 12:41:37 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Power Macintosh 6100/66 (with DOS compatibility card) In-Reply-To: <1g1sw48.17jczz9m7688wM%tlindner@watermarkpress.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, tim lindner wrote: > I am looking for a buyer for the above machine. > > It isn't ten years old yet, so I was hesisatant about listing it on > vinatge.org Hi Tim. That would be sort of a gray-area type of machine, but the DOS compatibility card makes it barely acceptable to list on the VCM ;) -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From esharpe at uswest.net Thu Sep 25 13:44:37 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: *****hayes modem history..... References: <00a901c38390$0e891520$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: <00b901c38395$12c0d920$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> I have also found a reference in the old MicroAge 'byte shopper' catalog referring to automatic dialing... but for the life of me can not remember if this was done via at command set...... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ed Sharpe" To: "General Discussion: On-Topic Posts Only" Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 11:08 AM Subject: Re: *****hayes modem history..... > the computer museum says..... > Hayes Micromodem 100 > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- > ---- > > Hayes pioneered the 'Smart Modems'. These modems fit inside the computer and > could be programmed to automatically dial a phone number or answer the > phone. Hayes advertised: "Since it is a direct connect device, it has none > of the losses and distortions associated with acoustic couplers. > > There are two program selectable speeds for the Micromodem 100-- a high > speed of 300 BPS (baud) and a factory set low speed of 110 BPS. The low > speed may be hardware adjusted from 45 to 300 BPS > > at http://www.syssrc.com/html/museum/html/modem_hayes100.html > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Vintage Computer Festival" > To: "Classic Computers Mailing List" > Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 12:48 AM > Subject: Re: *****hayes modem history..... > > > > On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, ed sharpe wrote: > > > > > question: was the s100 board the first version of the Hayes micromodem > > > with the at command set or was the standalone first? I also remember > > > they made one for the apple too... came across the s100 and a standalone > > > version and need to label up for one of the displays.... I should know > > > the answer to this but alas the cob webs grow deep in my brain! > > > > Did the S-100 modem even have the AT command set? > > > > -- > > > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer > Festival > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ---- > > International Man of Intrigue and Danger > http://www.vintage.org > > > > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage > mputers ] > > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at > http://marketplace.vintage.org ] > > > > > > > > > From esharpe at uswest.net Thu Sep 25 13:44:37 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: *****hayes modem history..... References: <00a901c38390$0e891520$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: <00b901c38395$12c0d920$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> I have also found a reference in the old MicroAge 'byte shopper' catalog referring to automatic dialing... but for the life of me can not remember if this was done via at command set...... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ed Sharpe" To: "General Discussion: On-Topic Posts Only" Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 11:08 AM Subject: Re: *****hayes modem history..... > the computer museum says..... > Hayes Micromodem 100 > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- > ---- > > Hayes pioneered the 'Smart Modems'. These modems fit inside the computer and > could be programmed to automatically dial a phone number or answer the > phone. Hayes advertised: "Since it is a direct connect device, it has none > of the losses and distortions associated with acoustic couplers. > > There are two program selectable speeds for the Micromodem 100-- a high > speed of 300 BPS (baud) and a factory set low speed of 110 BPS. The low > speed may be hardware adjusted from 45 to 300 BPS > > at http://www.syssrc.com/html/museum/html/modem_hayes100.html > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Vintage Computer Festival" > To: "Classic Computers Mailing List" > Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 12:48 AM > Subject: Re: *****hayes modem history..... > > > > On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, ed sharpe wrote: > > > > > question: was the s100 board the first version of the Hayes micromodem > > > with the at command set or was the standalone first? I also remember > > > they made one for the apple too... came across the s100 and a standalone > > > version and need to label up for one of the displays.... I should know > > > the answer to this but alas the cob webs grow deep in my brain! > > > > Did the S-100 modem even have the AT command set? > > > > -- > > > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer > Festival > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ---- > > International Man of Intrigue and Danger > http://www.vintage.org > > > > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage > mputers ] > > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at > http://marketplace.vintage.org ] > > > > > > > > > From TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu Thu Sep 25 12:44:24 2003 From: TRASH3 at splab.cas.neu.edu (TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Compaticard stuff Message-ID: <030925134424.f54e@splab.cas.neu.edu> I have 3 requests for the compaticard floppy. I recall in the early days that some manufacturers put bad blocks on their floppies to prevent copying. If the floppy has no copy protection, then I'll make up a disk image and email it out to whomever asks. bear in mind the image is not really compressed and it will be over 1mb. If it is copy protected, then... I recall programs that copied them also, but I don't have them now. joe From bpope at wordstock.com Thu Sep 25 12:45:27 2003 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: ***CLEAR*** HP-85 FS on E-bay In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Sep 25, 03 12:06:49 pm Message-ID: <200309251745.NAA07574@wordstock.com> And thusly Tothwolf spake: > > On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Michael Nadeau wrote: > > > This is probably more aptly called a demo model rather than a prototype. > > Computer makers would sometimes create a handful of a model prior to > > launch to privately show it off to the press, retailers, investors, etc. > > Compaq once gave me a laptop to preview for BYTE that was in a clear > > case. It was essentially a production unit on the inside. > > > > My guess is that HP made fewer than 10 of these HP-85s in a clear case. > > This is a way cool find. > > Clear cases are usually made just prior to any texture being added to the > production molds. Usually they are used for engineering purposes (making > sure it all fits), but sometimes they will also use those cases for > demo/promotional purposes too. > Just a thought.... Is there any *other* way to tell that this is an original? What if somebody went and made a new clear plastic case and replaced a normal case? How much does a normal cased HP-85 go for? The 3D printers out there are getting cheaper... (relatively!) Cheers, Bryan Pope P.S. But I would like to see a device come out that could make exact copies of older computer chips... :) Great to keep our systems running. From cisin at xenosoft.com Thu Sep 25 12:58:00 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Compaticard stuff In-Reply-To: <200309250820290951.0DD7705C@192.168.42.129> References: <030924194739.f2ad@splab.cas.neu.edu> <200309250820290951.0DD7705C@192.168.42.129> Message-ID: <20030925105620.Y51351@newshell.lmi.net> On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Bruce Lane wrote: > Joe, I'd like to archive that floppy, and make it available on my FTP server. Any way you can send me a Teledisk image of it? > Yes, I also have one of the cards. It's one of the few pieces of "classic" computing stuff that I want to hang on to. > Thanks much. MicroSolutions is very much still around, although they no longer make and sell Uniform, MatchPoint, nor Compaticard. Can you get them to release the copyright? From cisin at xenosoft.com Thu Sep 25 13:05:07 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Betr.: old shtuff In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030925110146.W51351@newshell.lmi.net> "Fred N. van Kempen" 09/24 10:22 said: > Hiyas, > While going through the (many, sigh) boxes of old crap, trying > to find the manual for the AST FourPort card, I found my good > > Oh.. and anyone able to feed me info on the (&(#$^(#^ AST > card should report in for duty asap :) What do you want? ASTCLOCK.COM ? got it right here SETCLOCK.COM ? got it right here manuals? buried. might not be able to excavate until VCF From mikeford at socal.rr.com Thu Sep 25 12:44:29 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: New toys In-Reply-To: <3F71BFB6.CD54042A@comcast.net> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030925104340.00a20230@pop-server.socal.rr.com> > Or how about "My other computer was made in 1978" or "My other > computer >cost $4,000... in 1978"? My PS/2 doesn't just play games From tothwolf at concentric.net Thu Sep 25 14:27:02 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: ***CLEAR*** HP-85 FS on E-bay In-Reply-To: <200309251745.NAA07574@wordstock.com> References: <200309251745.NAA07574@wordstock.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Bryan Pope wrote: > And thusly Tothwolf spake: > > > Clear cases are usually made just prior to any texture being added to > > the production molds. Usually they are used for engineering purposes > > (making sure it all fits), but sometimes they will also use those > > cases for demo/promotional purposes too. > > Just a thought.... > > Is there any *other* way to tell that this is an original? What if > somebody went and made a new clear plastic case and replaced a normal > case? How much does a normal cased HP-85 go for? > > The 3D printers out there are getting cheaper... (relatively!) I seriously doubt someone (at this point) would make up a new case with a laser system. Making molds to create just a few cases the old fashioned way would also be extremely costly, so I don't think we have to worry about it just yet. Maybe in another 5-10 years though... -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Thu Sep 25 14:30:43 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: *****hayes modem history..... In-Reply-To: <00a901c38390$0e891520$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> References: <00a901c38390$0e891520$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Ed Sharpe wrote: > Hayes pioneered the 'Smart Modems'. These modems fit inside the computer > and could be programmed to automatically dial a phone number or answer > the phone. Hayes advertised: "Since it is a direct connect device, it > has none of the losses and distortions associated with acoustic > couplers. The Apple modems I have are made up of two parts. There is a card that goes into the computer, which is pretty much the modem's brains. There is also an external box that contains the telephone line interface circuitry and some other misc bits. They are connected by a ribbon cable, which I *think* is 16 conductor (I'd have to look). -Toth From vance at neurotica.com Thu Sep 25 14:46:47 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: New toys In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030925104340.00a20230@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: I like that a lot. 8-) But the Sony device is a PS2, not a PS/2. Peace... Sridhar On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Mike Ford wrote: > > > Or how about "My other computer was made in 1978" or "My other > > computer > >cost $4,000... in 1978"? > > > My PS/2 doesn't just play games > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Sep 25 15:36:05 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: ***CLEAR*** HP-85 FS on E-bay In-Reply-To: <014201c38340$c7a91b40$0b01a8c0@michael> References: <3.0.6.32.20030925082620.007b5100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030925163605.007cf100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 08:41 AM 9/25/03 +0000, you wrote: >This is probably more aptly called a demo model rather than a prototype. No it's a prototype. HP made clear models to test air flow (and heat dissapation), parts clearance, etc. It's mentioned in the HP Journal article for the HP 9845. I've had several clear HP calculators including a clear HP-35, a clear ***RED DOT*** model HP-35 and a clear HP 92, and a clear back for a HP-65 and I've seen a clear HP-41. I've only ever seen them demo a clear unit ONCE, that was a HP-42 IIRC. FWIW I have a demo unit HP-85. The label on it says "demo Unit, Not for Sale" and it has a 9999 date code. >Computer makers would sometimes create a handful of a model prior to launch >to privately show it off to the press, retailers, investors, etc. Compaq >once gave me a laptop to preview for BYTE that was in a clear case. It was >essentially a production unit on the inside. > >My guess is that HP made fewer than 10 of these HP-85s in a clear case. I don't think so. I've only heard or seen of ONE clear unit os any model so AFIK HP only built one of each. This >is a way cool find. Certainly is! That's why I posted it. I see the bidding is already up to $550. Joe > >--Mike > >Michael Nadeau >Editor/Publisher >Classic Tech, the Vintage Computing Resource >www.classictechpub.com > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Joe" >To: >Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 12:26 PM >Subject: ***CLEAR*** HP-85 FS on E-bay > > >> >> >> >> Joe >> > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Sep 25 15:39:31 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Is this worth picking up? MorrowDecision (LS ADM 20) Terminal Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030925163931.007d15a0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Spotted this in a scrap place today but didn't get it. Labeled as Morrow Decision but the back label says Lear Sigler ADM20. Should I go back and get it? Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Sep 25 15:49:36 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: ***CLEAR*** HP-85 FS on E-bay In-Reply-To: References: <200309251745.NAA07574@wordstock.com> <200309251745.NAA07574@wordstock.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030925164936.007d9760@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 02:27 PM 9/25/03 -0500, you wrote: >On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Bryan Pope wrote: >> And thusly Tothwolf spake: >> >> > Clear cases are usually made just prior to any texture being added to >> > the production molds. Usually they are used for engineering purposes >> > (making sure it all fits), but sometimes they will also use those >> > cases for demo/promotional purposes too. >> >> Just a thought.... >> >> Is there any *other* way to tell that this is an original? What if >> somebody went and made a new clear plastic case and replaced a normal >> case? How much does a normal cased HP-85 go for? >> >> The 3D printers out there are getting cheaper... (relatively!) > >I seriously doubt someone (at this point) would make up a new case with a >laser system. I've seen cases made with 3-D lasers (my old employer was a pioneer with the process). They're very rough. The process leaves DISTINCT ripples in the surfaces and it's obvious that they're not normal cases. The chemicals used in the process are VERY expensive. In addition you would need a 3-D CAD drawing to operate the lasers. The process is MUCH to difficult and expensive for use in making fake cases, especailly for something like an HP-85 that's usually cheap (<$100) to begin with. Joe Making molds to create just a few cases the old fashioned >way would also be extremely costly, so I don't think we have to worry >about it just yet. Maybe in another 5-10 years though... > >-Toth > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Sep 25 15:53:41 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Pinging Bruce Lane Re: Compaticard stuff Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030925165341.007c5840@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Bruce, I tried to e-mail the files to you but the message bounced. Joe >Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2003 16:42:14 -0400 >To: Bruce Lane >From: Joe >Subject: Re: Compaticard stuff >X-Attachments: C:\COMPTICA\VER_2_03\Compati.zip; >In-Reply-To: <200309250820290951.0DD7705C@192.168.42.129> >References: <030924194739.f2ad@splab.cas.neu.edu> <030924194739.f2ad@splab.cas.neu.edu> > > Teledisk? Bahhh! I still can't get it to work! > > Here's a zipped copy of the files for version 2.03. I also have the files for version 1 if you want them. > > Joe > > > >At 08:20 AM 9/25/03 -0700, you wrote: >>Joe, I'd like to archive that floppy, and make it available on my FTP server. Any way you can send me a Teledisk image of it? >> >>Yes, I also have one of the cards. It's one of the few pieces of "classic" computing stuff that I want to hang on to. >> >>Thanks much. >> >>*********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** >> >>On 24-Sep-03 at 19:47 TRASH3@splab.cas.neu.edu wrote: >> >>>was somebody looking for microsolutions compaticard stuff? I found my >>>software and manual. Probably the floppy drive is around here also, >>>but my recollection was it had failed. >>> >>>Joe >> >> >>-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- >>Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy, >>Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com >>ARS KC7GR (Formerly WD6EOS) since 12-77 -- kyrrin@bluefeathertech.com >>"Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati" (Red Green, aka Steve Smith) >> >> >> From eric at brouhaha.com Thu Sep 25 16:09:30 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: ***CLEAR*** HP-85 FS on E-bay In-Reply-To: <200309251745.NAA07574@wordstock.com> References: from"Tothwolf" at Sep 25, 03 12:06:49 pm <200309251745.NAA07574@wordstock.com> Message-ID: <2684.4.20.168.201.1064524170.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "Bryan Pope" wrote: > Is there any *other* way to tell that this is an original? What if > somebody went and made a new clear plastic case and replaced a normal > case? Are you seriously proposing that someone would spend upwards of $50K (probably closer to $100K) to make new molds to make a "fake" HP-85 case? I'd be delighted if I could afford the $5K or so it would cost for molds for a simple plastic case for one of my small projects. Sigh. From esharpe at uswest.net Thu Sep 25 17:12:59 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: *****hayes modem history..... References: <00a901c38390$0e891520$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: <017c01c383b2$2e72d200$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> yes the s 100 part is that way also... the separate chingus is the data access arrangement (DAA) that makes it legal for the board to hook to ma bell... for interesting trip google carterphone decision Thanks! Ed Sharpe Archivist for SMECC See the Southwest Museum of Engineering, Communications and Computation online at: http://www.smecc.org ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tothwolf" To: Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 12:30 PM Subject: Re: *****hayes modem history..... > On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Ed Sharpe wrote: > > > Hayes pioneered the 'Smart Modems'. These modems fit inside the computer > > and could be programmed to automatically dial a phone number or answer > > the phone. Hayes advertised: "Since it is a direct connect device, it > > has none of the losses and distortions associated with acoustic > > couplers. > > The Apple modems I have are made up of two parts. There is a card that > goes into the computer, which is pretty much the modem's brains. There is > also an external box that contains the telephone line interface circuitry > and some other misc bits. They are connected by a ribbon cable, which I > *think* is 16 conductor (I'd have to look). > > -Toth > > From arlen at acm.org Thu Sep 25 16:35:37 2003 From: arlen at acm.org (Arlen Michaels) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Compaticard stuff In-Reply-To: <002701c38326$71474d40$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: on 25/9/03 1:32 AM, Nico de Jong at nico@farumdata.dk wrote: >> was somebody looking for microsolutions compaticard stuff? I found my >> software and manual. Probably the floppy drive is around here also, >> but my recollection was it had failed. >> >> Joe >> > Yes please, I would appreciate the software > > Nico > This is probably what you're looking for: http://www.filelibrary.com:8080/cgi-bin/freedownload/DOS/h/54/compatic.zip Arlen Michaels From bqt at update.uu.se Thu Sep 25 17:08:26 2003 From: bqt at update.uu.se (Johnny Billquist) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: VAX 11/780 progress ... just a little In-Reply-To: <3F7327CF.10201@aurora.regenstrief.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Gunther Schadow wrote: > Johnny Billquist wrote: > > To make a short answer: the unibus termination is *vital*. > > If you fail diagnostics with it inserted, it's not because of the > > termination, but because some problem in your Unibus don't show up > > otherwise. The termination should be in the last slot, in AB. > > So, I need grants and NPG grants in front of the terminator? Yes. > When I plug the terminator directly behind the UDA50 (which > happens to be the last card) things are even worse. The reason > I don't trust that terminator is that two of the 3 small > capacitors seem to have been damaged on the edge. So, may be > it creates noise on the bus? How can I test that the terminator > works properly? Don't know the answer to that one, but the terminator cards are normally very sturdy, so a safe bet is that it's ok. > Ahh, but that is not properly installed, right? If I have a > 9 slot UNIBUS backplane, then only the last slot (A,B) can > have the terminator, right? So, I should put in more cards > and grants in slots 7 and 8, right? Do I need to put a grant > also in slot 9C (since the terminator is only in 9A and B)? Yes, yes and yes. Johnny Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt@update.uu.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol From kenziem at sympatico.ca Thu Sep 25 17:15:30 2003 From: kenziem at sympatico.ca (Mike) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Fwd: Canadian Collection Message-ID: <200309251815.30309.kenziem@sympatico.ca> Looks like York University has started a collection http://www.cs.yorku.ca/museum/collections/collection.htm http://www.yorku.ca/yfile/archive/index.asp?Article=758 -- Ottawa, Canada Collector of vintage computers http://www.ncf.ca/~ba600 From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Sep 25 17:20:16 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: VAX 11/780 progress ... just a little In-Reply-To: <3F7327CF.10201@aurora.regenstrief.org> from "Gunther Schadow" at Sep 25, 3 12:37:19 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 808 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030925/61efc788/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Sep 25 17:24:36 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: TRS-80 printer cable length? In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Sep 25, 3 00:20:12 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 395 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030925/22b7284b/attachment.ksh From kittstr at access-4-free.com Thu Sep 25 00:12:15 2003 From: kittstr at access-4-free.com (Andrew Strouse) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Cool new bad with a vintage computing twist References: Message-ID: <000201c383b9$25ff42a0$264e4a43@amscomputer> You finally figured out the iPod/New Beetle comercial? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vintage Computer Festival" To: "Classic Computers Mailing List" Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2003 5:10 PM Subject: Cool new bad with a vintage computing twist > > I just discovered one of the coolest new bands called The Polyphonic > Spree, and after exploring their multi-faceted website I came across a > cute little Easter Egg. > > Go to: > > http://www.thepolyphonicspree.com > > Once the Flash animation finishes coloring in all the sections, click on > the bulbous red shape in the lower right hand corner of the screen. This > will pull up a photo of a Sinclair ZX Spectrum. Each button you press on > the keyboard takes you to a different photo. > > Check out the music too. It's pretty awesome. > > -- > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage mputers ] > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] > > From rhudson at cnonline.net Thu Sep 25 18:15:42 2003 From: rhudson at cnonline.net (Ron Hudson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? Message-ID: <2F60C194-EFAE-11D7-AC5F-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> I would like to get an old single floppy DOS laptop machine on my local network. Anyone know how to get DOS to work with a PCMCIA card (uh too new?) It would be great to finally have this machine boot up as an emulated apple or PDP-8 or Atari or something. One of the floppyies makes it into a disk drive for my TRS-80 model 100 laptop. Ron. From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Thu Sep 25 18:18:30 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: SLA or stereolithography In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030925164936.007d9760@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <200309251745.NAA07574@wordstock.com> <200309251745.NAA07574@wordstock.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030925191214.00a75020@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> I believe that process is called stereolithography and also possibly fused-deposition-modeling as may be seen at ... http://www.edwardsind.com/models.htm http://www.quickparts.com/ http://www.fdm-modeling.com/ http://www.designinsite.dk/htmsider/p0051.htm http://www.rpi.on.ca/ http://rapid.lpt.fi/archives/rp-ml-current/0987.html At 04:49 PM 9/25/03 -0400, you wrote: >At 02:27 PM 9/25/03 -0500, you wrote: > >On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Bryan Pope wrote: > >> And thusly Tothwolf spake: > >> > >> > Clear cases are usually made just prior to any texture being added to > >> > the production molds. Usually they are used for engineering purposes > >> > (making sure it all fits), but sometimes they will also use those > >> > cases for demo/promotional purposes too. > >> > >> Just a thought.... > >> > >> Is there any *other* way to tell that this is an original? What if > >> somebody went and made a new clear plastic case and replaced a normal > >> case? How much does a normal cased HP-85 go for? > >> > >> The 3D printers out there are getting cheaper... (relatively!) > > > >I seriously doubt someone (at this point) would make up a new case with a > >laser system. > > > I've seen cases made with 3-D lasers (my old employer was a pioneer with >the process). They're very rough. The process leaves DISTINCT ripples in >the surfaces and it's obvious that they're not normal cases. The chemicals >used in the process are VERY expensive. In addition you would need a 3-D >CAD drawing to operate the lasers. The process is MUCH to difficult and >expensive for use in making fake cases, especailly for something like an >HP-85 that's usually cheap (<$100) to begin with. > > Joe > > >Making molds to create just a few cases the old fashioned > >way would also be extremely costly, so I don't think we have to worry > >about it just yet. Maybe in another 5-10 years though... > > > >-Toth > > From jdickens at ameritech.net Thu Sep 25 18:18:51 2003 From: jdickens at ameritech.net (James Dickens) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Latest finds in Milwaukee In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200309251818.51794.jdickens@ameritech.net> Sparcstaion 10.. 40mhz cpu, 128 megs ram, cg3 video card Sparcstation 10, 40mhz cpu, 208 megs ram, cg6 video card, 2x 1gig hd 20" sun greyscale monitor optical sun mouse complete with original mouse pad mystery sbus card, no expernal connectors. doesn't look like a 5x86 card, or a intel 486 card, of nfs accellerator card, no sun model numbers. 5 large chips, IAD-2 82229 30591A 74 IAC-I 733W94902 08491 74 AM95C71-16JC DV 131A4MB 1988 AMD J9142 SCX68150XEG /VL J9142 SCX68150XEF /VF3 Any body have any ideas James From fmc at reanimators.org Thu Sep 25 18:48:29 2003 From: fmc at reanimators.org (Frank McConnell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? References: <2F60C194-EFAE-11D7-AC5F-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> Message-ID: <200309252348.h8PNmTMr008093@daemonweed.reanimators.org> Ron Hudson wrote: > I would like to get an old single floppy DOS laptop machine > on my local network. Anyone know how to get DOS to work with > a PCMCIA card (uh too new?) It can be done, but you generally need the appropriate card and socket services software for the hardware in your laptop. Typically, this would have been supplied with the laptop (installed on the hard disk and/or on floppies). If you don't have those, but you do have a parallel port, you might find it easier to use something like a Xircom parallel-port Ethernet adapter. -Frank McConnell From healyzh at aracnet.com Thu Sep 25 19:16:54 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? In-Reply-To: <2F60C194-EFAE-11D7-AC5F-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> from "Ron Hudson" at Sep 25, 2003 06:15:42 PM Message-ID: <200309260016.h8Q0Gs2A003708@onyx.spiritone.com> > I would like to get an old single floppy DOS laptop machine > on my local network. Anyone know how to get DOS to work with > a PCMCIA card (uh too new?) Well.... One question comes to mind, if it's a single floppy laptop (I translate that as meaning it doesn't have a HD), does it even have a PCMCIA card slot? If it doesn't, does it have an bidirectional parallel port (isn't that called EPP?). If you have the PCMCIA slot, you'll need to find a card that is old enough that there was DOS support for it. Hopefully you can get one that includes the drivers and instructions. Warning, setting such a thing up is not fun. The next question is, what do you plan on using for networking software? Such things for DOS weren't exactly common either. Zane From jwstephens at msm.umr.edu Thu Sep 25 19:28:38 2003 From: jwstephens at msm.umr.edu (jim) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Geek Destinations in St. Louis? (Also San Diego [slightly different topic]) References: <20030924104819.L90389-100000@outpost.timeguy.com> <006b01c38367$b3789480$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Message-ID: <3F738836.FE97324B@msm.umr.edu> > Bill wrote... > > We'll be in St. Louis this weekend. Any good museums, junk shops, or > > other recommended geek destinations in the area? GPS coordinates happily > > accepted. :-) > > Two surplus places that I know of... > > Gateway Electronics 314-427-6116 or (800-669-5810) 8123 Page Blvd. - St. > Louis, MO 63130 > Gateway is mostly modern stuff, but they have an isle or two that is quite > old stuff. Not great, but worth a look-see. The guys at gateway have the building next door full of inventory, and if you get friendly with the right fellow at the counter, you can get a tour of that building, and see a bit of other stuff. Just ask what they have, and indicate you made a special trip in from some distance and I have found they accomodate me and dig a bit so that I don't miss any "new" stuff. but then I've been coming there since they were on Delmar and Stu had just started it (maybe 35 years ago). Sadly Stu passed away a couple of years ago, and is sorely missed. on a slightly different topic. Gateway has a San Diego outlet that has some stuff, and there is also a place nearby there worth seeing in San Diego called Industrial Liquidators. I also dig out the listings for the guys in El Cajon when I go down there junking. Any other San diego places to see? Jim From dholland at woh.rr.com Thu Sep 25 19:48:16 2003 From: dholland at woh.rr.com (David Holland) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Latest finds in Milwaukee In-Reply-To: <200309251818.51794.jdickens@ameritech.net> References: <200309251818.51794.jdickens@ameritech.net> Message-ID: <1064536835.2274.3.camel@crusader> On Thu, 2003-09-25 at 19:18, James Dickens wrote: > > > mystery sbus card, no expernal connectors. doesn't look like a 5x86 card, or > a intel 486 card, of nfs accellerator card, no sun model numbers. > 5 large chips, > IAD-2 82229 30591A 74 > IAC-I 733W94902 08491 74 > AM95C71-16JC DV 131A4MB 1988 AMD Some sort of JPEG compression coprocessor card? A quick google will turn up that a AM95C71 is some sort of jpeg compression chip. David > J9142 SCX68150XEG /VL > J9142 SCX68150XEF /VF3 > > Any body have any ideas > > James > From cisin at xenosoft.com Thu Sep 25 19:38:39 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? In-Reply-To: <2F60C194-EFAE-11D7-AC5F-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> References: <2F60C194-EFAE-11D7-AC5F-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> Message-ID: <20030925173510.A64458@newshell.lmi.net> On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Ron Hudson wrote: > I would like to get an old single floppy DOS laptop machine > on my local network. Anyone know how to get DOS to work with > a PCMCIA card (uh too new?) The Poqet computer came out just over ten years ago. It used two memory cards that were PCMCIA, but before the official PCMCIA standard was developed. Does anybody know offhand exactly when the PCMCIA standard came about? PCMCIA = "People Can't memorize Computer Industry Acronyms" The Toshiba 1100, and the Atari Portfolio wer out about that time, and like the Poqet, they had versions of DOS in ROM. (The Portfolio was a wannabe, Toshiba and Poqet were MS-DOS) From eric at brouhaha.com Thu Sep 25 19:54:32 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Latest finds in Milwaukee In-Reply-To: <1064536835.2274.3.camel@crusader> References: <200309251818.51794.jdickens@ameritech.net> <1064536835.2274.3.camel@crusader> Message-ID: <3715.4.20.168.201.1064537672.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "James Dickens" wrote: >> AM95C71-16JC DV 131A4MB 1988 AMD "David Holland" wrote: > Some sort of JPEG compression coprocessor card? A quick google will > turn up that a AM95C71 is some sort of jpeg compression chip. No JPEG. It does ITU-T T.6 "group 4" fax compression. This is a lossless bilevel compression not suited to photographs or other continuous-tone images. AMD transferred this part to Oak. The only reason I know about it is that it's used in my Ricoh IS520 scanner. From healyzh at aracnet.com Thu Sep 25 20:07:10 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? In-Reply-To: <20030925173510.A64458@newshell.lmi.net> from "Fred Cisin" at Sep 25, 2003 05:38:39 PM Message-ID: <200309260107.h8Q17Ajd004645@onyx.spiritone.com> > The Poqet computer came out just over ten years ago. It used two memory > cards that were PCMCIA, but before the official PCMCIA standard was > developed. Does anybody know offhand exactly when the PCMCIA standard > came about? > > PCMCIA = "People Can't memorize Computer Industry Acronyms" > > The Toshiba 1100, and the Atari Portfolio wer out about that time, and > like the Poqet, they had versions of DOS in ROM. (The Portfolio was a > wannabe, Toshiba and Poqet were MS-DOS) The Amiga 1200 uses PCMCIA cards and was released in 1993. Zane From rhudson at cnonline.net Thu Sep 25 20:23:24 2003 From: rhudson at cnonline.net (Ron Hudson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? In-Reply-To: <200309260016.h8Q0Gs2A003708@onyx.spiritone.com> Message-ID: <05C1EC5B-EFC0-11D7-AC5F-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> On Thursday, September 25, 2003, at 07:16 PM, Zane H. Healy wrote: >> I would like to get an old single floppy DOS laptop machine >> on my local network. Anyone know how to get DOS to work with >> a PCMCIA card (uh too new?) > > Well.... One question comes to mind, if it's a single floppy laptop (I > translate that as meaning it doesn't have a HD), does it even have a > PCMCIA > card slot? Yep, It has the slot, there is a place for an HD but I didn't get one. It's some sort of compaq. > If it doesn't, does it have an bidirectional parallel port > (isn't that called EPP?). If you have the PCMCIA slot, you'll need to > find > a card that is old enough that there was DOS support for it. > Hopefully you > can get one that includes the drivers and instructions. > > Warning, setting such a thing up is not fun. The next question is, > what do > you plan on using for networking software? Such things for DOS weren't > exactly common either. > Well, fun-ness for me is defined as am I being paid to do this thing or am I just doing cause I want to. I will probably want just some sort of telnet on it. I could just serial port it to the Linux machine and use a Terminal emulator of some sort I suppose. What I would really like to do is build up a single floppy (or two floppy) Linux that had vi and perl or python. Classiccomp is the wrong place to bark up that tree though. oooh! BBS? hmmm. > Zane > From lbickley at bickleywest.com Thu Sep 25 20:27:53 2003 From: lbickley at bickleywest.com (Lyle Bickley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? In-Reply-To: <2F60C194-EFAE-11D7-AC5F-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> References: <2F60C194-EFAE-11D7-AC5F-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> Message-ID: <200309251827.53354.lbickley@bickleywest.com> I use a technique to be able to select and load different network drivers and attach to a network using a single floppy. You should be able to modify it to work with PCMCIA. The file is a bit over a MB, so I can't post it to the list, but if you'd (or anyone else would like) I'll Email it directly to you. Here's the "instructions" for unpacking and using it: 1. gunzip network.tar.gz 2. tar xvf network.tar in a clean directory 3. create a clean MSDOS formatted diskette including the MSDOS system files. The system files in network.tar.gz are from Winslop, er, Windows 95 4. copy all of the files you've extracted from network.tar.gz to the diskette (except command.com - use the one that is already on the diskette from whatever version of MSDOS you are using). 5. boot the diskette and watch what happens, modify "stuff" and I'll betcha you can make it do PCMCIA on a single floppy. Cheers, Lyle On Thursday 25 September 2003 16:15, Ron Hudson wrote: > I would like to get an old single floppy DOS laptop machine > on my local network. Anyone know how to get DOS to work with > a PCMCIA card (uh too new?) > > It would be great to finally have this machine boot up as an > emulated apple or PDP-8 or Atari or something. > > One of the floppyies makes it into a disk drive for my TRS-80 model > 100 laptop. > > Ron. -- Lyle Bickley Bickley Consulting West Inc. Mountain View, CA 94040 "Black holes are where God is dividing by zero" From kyrrin at bluefeathertech.com Thu Sep 25 20:45:18 2003 From: kyrrin at bluefeathertech.com (Bruce Lane) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Compaticard Software Available Message-ID: <200309251845180370.021DE97E@192.168.42.129> With thanks to Don Maslin for providing the Zip archive, I have placed said ZIPfile, containing the driver software for the Compaticards, on my FTP site. You can retrieve it using standard anonymous signon in this path. Site: ftp.bluefeathertech.com Path: /pub/computing/hardware/legacy/DiskControllers/compaticard Enjoy! -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy, Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com ARS KC7GR (Formerly WD6EOS) since 12-77 -- kyrrin@bluefeathertech.com "Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati" (Red Green, aka Steve Smith) From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Sep 25 21:07:47 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? In-Reply-To: <200309260016.h8Q0Gs2A003708@onyx.spiritone.com> References: <2F60C194-EFAE-11D7-AC5F-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030925220747.007d9730@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 05:16 PM 9/25/03 -0700, you wrote: >> I would like to get an old single floppy DOS laptop machine >> on my local network. Anyone know how to get DOS to work with >> a PCMCIA card (uh too new?) > >Well.... One question comes to mind, if it's a single floppy laptop (I >translate that as meaning it doesn't have a HD), does it even have a PCMCIA >card slot? If it doesn't, does it have an bidirectional parallel port >(isn't that called EPP?). If you have the PCMCIA slot, you'll need to find >a card that is old enough that there was DOS support for it. Hopefully you >can get one that includes the drivers and instructions. > >Warning, setting such a thing up is not fun. The next question is, what do >you plan on using for networking software? Such things for DOS weren't >exactly common either. > > Zane > IIRC somewhere on the net is a HP 200LX palmtop that's operating as a server. IIRC it has one or two PCMCIA slots and 2Mb of RAM with MS-DOS 5 in ROM and NO disk drives. Don't recall what networking software it was using but it shouldn't be to hard to find if it's still on the net. Ah! Found it! it's at . It's now been taken off-line but the details are still posted. Joe From healyzh at aracnet.com Thu Sep 25 21:33:16 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? In-Reply-To: <05C1EC5B-EFC0-11D7-AC5F-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> from "Ron Hudson" at Sep 25, 2003 08:23:24 PM Message-ID: <200309260233.h8Q2XGQK005771@onyx.spiritone.com> > Well, fun-ness for me is defined as am I being paid to do this thing or > am I just doing cause I want to. I will probably want just some sort of > telnet on it. I could just serial port it to the Linux machine and > use a Terminal emulator of some sort I suppose. > > What I would really like to do is build up a single floppy (or two > floppy) > Linux that had vi and perl or python. Classiccomp is the wrong place to > bark up that tree though. OK, since it does in fact have PCMCIA, I'm going to *assume* that it's at least a 386sx, which means it can run Linux. I don't know how big Python is, but I'm going to guess you're not going to fit it onto a Linux floppy. It might actually make sense to run a *old* version of Linux. I can't remember when it got PCMCIA support (networking was around June of '92 as I recall). I do remember getting a PCMCIA SCSI card (and maybe modem) working in '95 or '96 under Linux. Do a Google search on floppy based Linux installs, there are a couple of cool things out there for doing them. I think I'd personally try to fit PC/TCP (I was lucky enough to get a brand new copy recently that I'm not about to part with) on an MS-DOS floppy. You can easily do a second bootable floppy with several different terminal emulators on it. You know, you're making me tempted to break out the P166 IBM Thinkpad I've got that I've been threatening to load MS-DOS onto. I've even got a copy of Desqview/X somewhere :^) Zane From jwest at classiccmp.org Thu Sep 25 21:49:22 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:07 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? References: <200309260233.h8Q2XGQK005771@onyx.spiritone.com> Message-ID: <001e01c383d8$ca28c530$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> > It might actually make sense to run a *old* version of Linux. I can't > remember when it got PCMCIA support (networking was around June of '92 as I > recall). I do remember getting a PCMCIA SCSI card (and maybe modem) working > in '95 or '96 under Linux. FreeBSD and Linux both will fit on a floppy, no problem. Check out "picoBSD". However, python? Not even a remote chance. Way too big. From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 25 21:57:20 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Fwd: Canadian Collection In-Reply-To: <200309251815.30309.kenziem@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Mike wrote: > Looks like York University has started a collection > > http://www.cs.yorku.ca/museum/collections/collection.htm > http://www.yorku.ca/yfile/archive/index.asp?Article=758 Zbigniew Stachniak, who was quoted in the article today regarding the MCM/70 and also curates the York University computer museum, is a speaker (again) at the VCF this year: http://www.vintage.org/2003/main/speaker.php#27 -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 25 21:58:08 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Cool new bad with a vintage computing twist In-Reply-To: <000201c383b9$25ff42a0$264e4a43@amscomputer> Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Andrew Strouse wrote: > You finally figured out the iPod/New Beetle comercial? Nope, I heard them on Fresh Air (National Public Radio program in the US). -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From vcf at siconic.com Thu Sep 25 22:00:44 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? In-Reply-To: <200309260016.h8Q0Gs2A003708@onyx.spiritone.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Zane H. Healy wrote: > Warning, setting such a thing up is not fun. The next question is, what do > you plan on using for networking software? Such things for DOS weren't > exactly common either. Microsoft LAN Manager is what's loaded on my DOS voicemail machine. I can access drives on my MS network (via TCP/IP) from the voicemail machine but not the other way around (one-way filesharing :) -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From pcw at mesanet.com Thu Sep 25 22:54:58 2003 From: pcw at mesanet.com (Peter C. Wallace) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Zane H. Healy wrote: > > > Warning, setting such a thing up is not fun. The next question is, what do > > you plan on using for networking software? Such things for DOS weren't > > exactly common either. > > Microsoft LAN Manager is what's loaded on my DOS voicemail machine. I can > access drives on my MS network (via TCP/IP) from the voicemail machine but > not the other way around (one-way filesharing :) There's a version of LAN Mangler that will serve shares from a DOS machine as well. I have a a copy if you want one... (I think its still available somewhere from MS's FTP site) > > -- > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] > Peter Wallace From go at ao.com Thu Sep 25 23:07:51 2003 From: go at ao.com (Gary Oliver) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: *****hayes modem history..... In-Reply-To: <017c01c383b2$2e72d200$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> References: <00a901c38390$0e891520$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> <017c01c383b2$2e72d200$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: <3F73BB97.7050601@ao.com> Yes, back in "those days" a DAA was required for connection to the precious phone circuits... I had one of these modems when they were new (still have it, in fact - I never throw anything away, alas.) While trying to establish a second line for data connections, I was repeatedly asked "what kind of business are you running?" Ma Bell had difficulty understanding a "hobby" use for a modem. After *many* phone calls, I was eventually assigned a "data account representative" and received the work order number and target installation date for my provisioning. The day came and *three* guys showed up with several boxes of equipment. They installed the extra line, made measurements and recorded the line quality to the central office and left me with a packet of paperwork. The installation charge was $0 and the monthly charge was the normal residential rate (they got quite a few more $$ from the commercial customers, most likely explaining the extra effort expended on getting things "just right.") While in school, I moved several times over the next few years and each time several people came out and reconnected everything and went through the same line tests. This for the 'data' line only - the voice line got the usual 15 second "it seems to work" treatment. I think I still have my cancelled check with Dennis' or his partner's signature on it... They were a small company back then - having just escaped from his garage. Those were the days! -Gary Ed Sharpe wrote: > yes the s 100 part is that way also... the separate chingus is the data > access arrangement (DAA) that makes it legal for the board to hook to ma > bell... > > for interesting trip google carterphone decision > > Thanks! > > Ed Sharpe Archivist for SMECC > > See the Southwest Museum of Engineering, Communications and Computation > online at: > http://www.smecc.org > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Tothwolf" > To: > Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 12:30 PM > Subject: Re: *****hayes modem history..... > From rhudson at cnonline.net Thu Sep 25 23:13:22 2003 From: rhudson at cnonline.net (Ron Hudson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thursday, September 25, 2003, at 10:54 PM, Peter C. Wallace wrote: > On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > >> On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Zane H. Healy wrote: >> >>> Warning, setting such a thing up is not fun. The next question is, >>> what do >>> you plan on using for networking software? Such things for DOS >>> weren't >>> exactly common either. >> >> Microsoft LAN Manager is what's loaded on my DOS voicemail machine. >> I can >> access drives on my MS network (via TCP/IP) from the voicemail >> machine but >> not the other way around (one-way filesharing :) > > > There's a version of LAN Mangler that will serve shares from a DOS > machine as > well. I have a a copy if you want one... (I think its still available > somewhere from MS's FTP site) Thanks, actually I want to go the other way... where the DOS machine is a client to the Linux machine. > >> >> -- >> >> Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer >> Festival >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> -------- >> International Man of Intrigue and Danger >> http://www.vintage.org >> >> [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage >> Computers ] >> [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at >> http://marketplace.vintage.org ] >> > > Peter Wallace > > From jrasite at eoni.com Thu Sep 25 23:35:59 2003 From: jrasite at eoni.com (Jim Arnott) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Fwd: Two complete Lisa 2's for sale Message-ID: <3F73C22F.6020705@eoni.com> I *know* that this will interest someone here.... From the LowEndMac swap list Jim -------- Original Message -------- Subject: [swap] Two complete Lisa 2's for sale Date: Thu, 25 Sep 2003 15:38:00 -0400 From: bktigger@copper.net To: LEM Swap List LEM-Swap is for buying & selling Mac stuff. It is not a discussion list. See the FAQ for guidelines on postings, feedback, and dispute resolution. -------------------- I'm making some room for other items and have decided to sell the two complete Lisa 2's I've got. Both units are stock with 2 MB of RAM and in good comestic condition. One has a Profile 10 MB HD and the other has a Profile 5 MB HD. They include keyboards, no mice but they work fine with older 128/512/Plus mice. Both units were working as of 2 years ago. I brought them out recently and neither unit starts up. In the past this has been due to dirty contacts on the backplane and cards and I believe that is the case now. I simply don't have the time to go over them and clean the contacts up. I'll include copies of MacWorks Plus and MacWorks XL (various versions) as well as Lisa Office, Lisa Term, Lisa Calc. If I can find them all I'll also include files with Lisa schematics, repair utilities and Lisa Unix. All files will come burned on a CD and you can use a 400k floppy compatible Mac to transfer them and I'll toss in a bunch of 400k floppies. These are going to be heavy to ship so take that into consideration. The cpu's will be shipped in their own boxes and the Profiles and keyboards will be shipped in a third box. Shipping will be from 28609, count on 50 pounds approx. shipping weight for the cpu's and 35 pounds for the Profiles. I can ship by US Mail or motor freight if you have that delivery option. I'd like to get $500 + shipping for all of it. Any questions email me. Thanks, Randy -- LEM-Swap is sponsored by and... 123Inkjets.com Support Low End Mac LEM-Swap list info: --> AOL users, remove "mailto:" Send list messages to: To unsubscribe, email: For digest mode, email: Subscription questions: Archive: Join the SwapChat list: --------------------------------------------------------------- >The Think Different Store http://www.ThinkDifferentStore.com --------------------------------------------------------------- . From esharpe at uswest.net Fri Sep 26 00:11:45 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (ed sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: *****hayes modem history..... References: <00a901c38390$0e891520$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> <017c01c383b2$2e72d200$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> <3F73BB97.7050601@ao.com> Message-ID: <005c01c383ec$af35b940$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> The sig. of Dennis! now that is neat! well in looking into the s100 board it seems to indicate that many many options could be set under program control, however I am still not sure it is the at command set... maybe it was some binary sent to it..... I just wish I checked remember how the micromodem on the apple worked I suspect the same as the s100 board... ed ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Oliver" To: ; "On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 9:07 PM Subject: Re: *****hayes modem history..... > Yes, back in "those days" a DAA was required for connection to the > precious phone circuits... > > I had one of these modems when they were new (still have it, in fact - I > never throw anything away, alas.) While trying to establish a second > line for data connections, I was repeatedly asked "what kind of business > are you running?" Ma Bell had difficulty understanding a "hobby" use > for a modem. > > After *many* phone calls, I was eventually assigned a "data account > representative" and received the work order number and target > installation date for my provisioning. The day came and *three* guys > showed up with several boxes of equipment. They installed the extra > line, made measurements and recorded the line quality to the central > office and left me with a packet of paperwork. The installation charge > was $0 and the monthly charge was the normal residential rate (they got > quite a few more $$ from the commercial customers, most likely > explaining the extra effort expended on getting things "just right.") > > While in school, I moved several times over the next few years and each > time several people came out and reconnected everything and went through > the same line tests. This for the 'data' line only - the voice line got > the usual 15 second "it seems to work" treatment. > > I think I still have my cancelled check with Dennis' or his partner's > signature on it... They were a small company back then - having just > escaped from his garage. > > Those were the days! > -Gary > > > Ed Sharpe wrote: > > yes the s 100 part is that way also... the separate chingus is the data > > access arrangement (DAA) that makes it legal for the board to hook to ma > > bell... > > > > for interesting trip google carterphone decision > > > > Thanks! > > > > Ed Sharpe Archivist for SMECC > > > > See the Southwest Museum of Engineering, Communications and Computation > > online at: > > http://www.smecc.org > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Tothwolf" > > To: > > Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 12:30 PM > > Subject: Re: *****hayes modem history..... > > > > > From tothwolf at concentric.net Fri Sep 26 00:33:33 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: TRS-80 printer cable length? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Tony Duell wrote: > > Does anyone know what the length of the original TRS-80 model 1/3/4 > > printer cable was? I am considering making some (some for my own > > systems, and a few to sell), but I don't know what the original length > > was. I'm also curious about the length of the model 2/12/16 printer > > cable, though I'd imagine it was the same length. > > From memory, 6 feet / 1.8m. But I might be wrong. That sounds about right. I have a couple packed away somewhere, but I think they were made up by the computer's owner and not bought ready made. I should check their length anyway though. Now, can anyone point me to a FAQ about the different cable types? I found a number of catalog numbers for these cables. Some of the differences are pretty easy to see, but some are not. So far I've been able to come up with these catalog numbers, though there are probably a few others: Model I 26-1411, 26-1416 [LP2] Model I+EI/III/4 26-1401, 26-1415 [LP2] Model II 26-4401, 26-4402 [LP2] Color Computer 26-3020 Tandy 1000 Series (Not RL or TL/3) 26-225/26-222 (6'/12') All Others PC-Compatibles 26-227/26-223 (6'/12') I'm unsure as to why the LP2 has different cables. Does it not use the centronics-style 36 pin connector? I was planning to make up some cables which are probably 26-1401 and 26-4401, but I'd sure like to know more about the others before I get too involved in the project. Maybe someone knows of a resource out there that lists all of these cables and their properties? -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Fri Sep 26 00:46:18 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: *****hayes modem history..... In-Reply-To: <005c01c383ec$af35b940$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> References: <00a901c38390$0e891520$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> <017c01c383b2$2e72d200$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> <3F73BB97.7050601@ao.com> <005c01c383ec$af35b940$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, ed sharpe wrote: > well in looking into the s100 board it seems to indicate that many many > options could be set under program control, however I am still not sure > it is the at command set... maybe it was some binary sent to it..... I > just wish I checked remember how the micromodem on the apple worked I > suspect the same as the s100 board... The photo I saw of the S100 board looks very similar to the Apple version I have here in front of me. It seems to contain most of the same components, including those two orange epoxy covered modules. The board I have here has 'Micromodem II' silkscreened onto the center of the board. -Toth From eric at brouhaha.com Fri Sep 26 01:53:31 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: *****hayes modem history..... In-Reply-To: <005c01c383ec$af35b940$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> References: <00a901c38390$0e891520$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> <017c01c383b2$2e72d200$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net><3F73BB97.7050601@ao.com> <005c01c383ec$af35b940$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> Message-ID: <34044.64.169.63.74.1064559211.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "ed sharpe" wrote: > well in looking into the s100 board it seems to indicate that many many > options could be set under program control, however I am still not sure > it is the at command set... As I wrote before, it is not. Definitely. No question about it. It doesn't have ANY command set in the sense of sending it a string of characters that it would parse as a command. It's a dumb device. (And there's nothing wrong with that!) > maybe it was some binary sent to it..... If by "sent to it" you mean "the user program fiddles with bits in registers using 8080/Z-80 style input and output instructions", yes, that is how it is controlled. Want it to pick up the phone line? Set a particular port bit. Clear the bit to hang up (or maybe it was the other way around). Pulse dial by toggling that bit with the appopriate timing. Enable the modulator (transmit) with a different bit, and write to the UART to send bytes. Read a bit of a port for receive carrier detect. Etc. > I just > wish I checked remember how the micromodem on the apple worked I suspect > the same as the s100 board... Basically the same though the registers are memory mapped since the 6502 doesn't have I/O instructions. However, the Apple version has firmware that makes it easier to use. It's still not the AT command set, but from BASIC you type "IN#2" (if it was in slot two), then use Control-A as an attention character to send it commands from the keyboard. I suppose you probably printed a control-A followed by a command in order to control it from BASIC, just like printing a control-D followed by a DOS command, but my memory is fuzzy on that as I mostly programmed it in assembly. From menadeau at comcast.net Fri Sep 26 01:49:00 2003 From: menadeau at comcast.net (Michael Nadeau) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: ***CLEAR*** HP-85 FS on E-bay References: <3.0.6.32.20030925082620.007b5100@pop-server.cfl.rr.com><014201c38340$c7a91b40$0b01a8c0@michael> Message-ID: <002801c383fa$4845c320$0b01a8c0@michael> That explanation makes sense. Compaq told me they used the clear case to show off their engineering skill. To an editor, that sounds more impressive than saying they just wanted to make sure the case fit right. --Mike > On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Michael Nadeau wrote: > > > This is probably more aptly called a demo model rather than a prototype. > > Computer makers would sometimes create a handful of a model prior to > > launch to privately show it off to the press, retailers, investors, etc. > > Compaq once gave me a laptop to preview for BYTE that was in a clear > > case. It was essentially a production unit on the inside. > > > > My guess is that HP made fewer than 10 of these HP-85s in a clear case. > > This is a way cool find. > > Clear cases are usually made just prior to any texture being added to the > production molds. Usually they are used for engineering purposes (making > sure it all fits), but sometimes they will also use those cases for > demo/promotional purposes too. > > -Toth From Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com Fri Sep 26 07:59:39 2003 From: Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com (Feldman, Robert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: OT: Apple Lisa in today's Dilbert cartoon Message-ID: http://www.unitedmedia.com/comics/dilbert/ Bob From Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com Fri Sep 26 08:36:06 2003 From: Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com (Feldman, Robert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? Message-ID: The HP 95LX (MS-DOS 3.3 in ROM) came out slightly after the Poqet, and it also does not have a fully PCMCIA 1.0 compatable card slot. The HP 100LX (MS-DOS 5.0 in ROM), which came out in 1993, has does have a fully compatable slot, PCMCIA Revision 2.0, IIRC. The PCMCIA (Personal Computer Memory Card Industry Association) was formed in June of 1989. -----Original Message----- From: Fred Cisin [mailto:cisin@xenosoft.com] Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 7:39 PM To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts Subject: Re: Old DOS on topic yet? On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Ron Hudson wrote: > I would like to get an old single floppy DOS laptop machine > on my local network. Anyone know how to get DOS to work with > a PCMCIA card (uh too new?) The Poqet computer came out just over ten years ago. It used two memory cards that were PCMCIA, but before the official PCMCIA standard was developed. Does anybody know offhand exactly when the PCMCIA standard came about? PCMCIA = "People Can't memorize Computer Industry Acronyms" The Toshiba 1100, and the Atari Portfolio wer out about that time, and like the Poqet, they had versions of DOS in ROM. (The Portfolio was a wannabe, Toshiba and Poqet were MS-DOS) From Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com Fri Sep 26 08:52:37 2003 From: Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com (Feldman, Robert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? Message-ID: There is a good selection of 16-bit MS-DOS software for networking the HP LX palmtops (XT-class, but with an 80186 processor), including TC/IP and PPP, as well as simple browsers HTML readers, and email programs (look at http://www.dasoft.com/WWW/wv3.htm, for example). Many are free. There are a number of PCMCIA network cards that have DOS support (look for a 16-bit card; I have a 3Com 574). The selection is more restricted for the HP palmtops, though, because of its power limitations (<125mA, IIRC). The favorite card is the Accton EN2216, no longer produced by sometimes available on eBay. If you search the HPLX mailing list archives (http://www.technoir.nu/hplx/hplx-l/), you will find instructions on setting up DOS networking, email, etc. If you want to hook an MS-DOS computer to an MS network, there is always http://www.wown.com/j_helmig/dosclien.htm. You could also hook the DOS computer to a network using a serial port and PPP (MochaSoft PPP http://www.mochasoft.dk/f_download2.html is highly recommended on the HPLX list). Bob -----Original Message----- From: Joe [mailto:rigdonj@cfl.rr.com] Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 9:08 PM To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts Subject: Re: Old DOS on topic yet? At 05:16 PM 9/25/03 -0700, you wrote: >> I would like to get an old single floppy DOS laptop machine >> on my local network. Anyone know how to get DOS to work with >> a PCMCIA card (uh too new?) > >Well.... One question comes to mind, if it's a single floppy laptop (I >translate that as meaning it doesn't have a HD), does it even have a PCMCIA >card slot? If it doesn't, does it have an bidirectional parallel port >(isn't that called EPP?). If you have the PCMCIA slot, you'll need to find >a card that is old enough that there was DOS support for it. Hopefully you >can get one that includes the drivers and instructions. > >Warning, setting such a thing up is not fun. The next question is, what do >you plan on using for networking software? Such things for DOS weren't >exactly common either. > > Zane > IIRC somewhere on the net is a HP 200LX palmtop that's operating as a server. IIRC it has one or two PCMCIA slots and 2Mb of RAM with MS-DOS 5 in ROM and NO disk drives. Don't recall what networking software it was using but it shouldn't be to hard to find if it's still on the net. Ah! Found it! it's at . It's now been taken off-line but the details are still posted. Joe From fmc at reanimators.org Fri Sep 26 09:22:45 2003 From: fmc at reanimators.org (Frank McConnell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? In-Reply-To: <2F60C194-EFAE-11D7-AC5F-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> (Ron Hudson's message of "Thu, 25 Sep 2003 18:15:42 -0500") References: <2F60C194-EFAE-11D7-AC5F-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> Message-ID: <200309261422.h8QEMjI3027606@daemonweed.reanimators.org> Ron Hudson wrote: > I would like to get an old single floppy DOS laptop machine > on my local network. Anyone know how to get DOS to work with > a PCMCIA card (uh too new?) Thinking a bit further on this. Yes, it was/is possible -- the earlier PCMCIA Ethernet cards came with drivers for MS-DOS (and Windows 3.x). And there was sometimes a way to avoid the need for the card and socket services morass, called a "point enabler" -- this was a program, usually somewhat specific to the PCMCIA card and maybe to the PCMCIA chipset in the computer, which simply did whatever was needed to get the PCMCIA card mapped to appropriate addresses. Then you would load a packet or ODI or NDIS driver for the card. -Frank McConnell From vance at neurotica.com Fri Sep 26 09:56:07 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: QuickBASIC Message-ID: Does anyone have a copy of the last version of Microsoft QuickBASIC for DOS? I think it's version 4.5, but I'm not absolutely sure. Peace... Sridhar From design.fort at ns.sympatico.ca Fri Sep 26 11:14:29 2003 From: design.fort at ns.sympatico.ca (The Design Fort DTP) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Kenbak-1 discoveries In-Reply-To: <002d01c3833c$4b2b2120$2cb2d642@WaynePC> Message-ID: Hi all, I finally have more news from the Kenbak-1 front. Earlier this year I posted a message on this list that I discovered a Kenbak-1. Well as it turned out the source I had the machine from had 7 (!) more Kenbak-1s. After long negotiations we finally agreed on a price for the collection of 6 machines and incredible paperwork. (The seller wanted to keep one machine) After some more struggle to get the money together I finally purchased what I consider the "find of my life". Here is what I could acquire: - 6 Kenbak-1 computers - the original schematics (a big folder!) - original training films from 1974 and the early eighties. - an original sales flyer from CTI, a company that tried to market the Kenbak-1. - programming manuals, flow charts etc. I drove all from Nova Scotia, Canada to Charleston, South Carolina to pick the lot up. (3000 miles) More information about the computers, where they are from and most importantly photos of the Kenbaks are on my website: http://www.computermuseum.20m.com/kenbak.htm I currently try to convert the original training films. I'm also in the process of taking photos from the insides of all the machines. Those photos will be online within the next days. Four of the seven Computers have the original Kenbak-1 logo, the others the CTI logo. You will see that al of the computers have six holes drilled on the top cover. It turned out that the Kenbak-1s had overheating problems and the hole were the cure for that. One of the Kenbaks is slightly modified and has toggle switches instead of the push-button switches. This machine is the only one I have tested so far. It works perfectly. All I can say is that the Kenbak-1 is fun to work with! Greetings Herbert Computer Museum of Nova Scotia From jplist at kiwigeek.com Fri Sep 26 10:47:34 2003 From: jplist at kiwigeek.com (JP Hindin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: QuickBASIC In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 26 Sep 2003 vance@neurotica.com wrote: > Does anyone have a copy of the last version of Microsoft QuickBASIC for > DOS? I think it's version 4.5, but I'm not absolutely sure. Greetings; http://63.149.103.32/misc/qb45.tar.gz The very first piece of software I ever bought (Well, in fact, bought for me by my father) was QB 4.5. Unfortunately, I don't have a copy of the install disk images, which sets the run directory, so this is _expecting_ to be in C:\QB45\ If its not in this directory, when you try and compile, it'll want to know where the runtime libs are - which, of course, you can override. Anyways; Enjoy; (I also have PowerBASIC 7, the "Enterprise" version of QB4.5 if you'd like) JP From design.fort at ns.sympatico.ca Fri Sep 26 12:16:48 2003 From: design.fort at ns.sympatico.ca (The Design Fort DTP) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Kenbak-1 discoveries Message-ID: Hi all, I finally have more news from the Kenbak-1 front. Earlier this year I posted a message on this list that I discovered a Kenbak-1. Well as it turned out the source I had the machine from had 7 (!) more Kenbak-1s. After long negotiations we finally agreed on a price for the collection of 6 machines and incredible paperwork. (The seller wanted to keep one machine) After some more struggle to get the money together I finally purchased what I consider the "find of my life". Here is what I could acquire: - 6 Kenbak-1 computers - the original schematics (a big folder!) - original training films from 1974 and the early eighties. - an original sales flyer from CTI, a company that tried to market the Kenbak-1. - programming manuals, flow charts etc. I drove all from Nova Scotia, Canada to Charleston, South Carolina to pick the lot up. (3000 miles) More information about the computers, where they are from and most importantly photos of the Kenbaks are on my website: http://www.computermuseum.20m.com/kenbak.htm I currently try to convert the original training films. I'm also in the process of taking photos from the insides of all the machines. Those photos will be online within the next days. Four of the seven Computers have the original Kenbak-1 logo, the others the CTI logo. You will see that al of the computers have six holes drilled on the top cover. It turned out that the Kenbak-1s had overheating problems and the hole were the cure for that. One of the Kenbaks is slightly modified and has toggle switches instead of the push-button switches. This machine is the only one I have tested so far. It works perfectly. All I can say is that the Kenbak-1 is fun to work with! Greetings Herbert Computer Museum of Nova Scotia From cb at mythtech.net Fri Sep 26 11:43:08 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Diablo 620 Ribbon, Printronix 300 ribbon Message-ID: I have two new Diablo 620 ribbons, and one new Printronix 300 ribbon. Anyone want them, just send me a mailing address and they're yours. -chris From sipke at wxs.nl Fri Sep 26 11:50:09 2003 From: sipke at wxs.nl (Sipke de Wal) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: QuickBASIC References: Message-ID: <020401c3844e$3f21c880$030101ac@boll.casema.net> Mail me off list ...... Sipke de Wal http://xgistor.ath.cx ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, September 26, 2003 4:56 PM Subject: QuickBASIC > > Does anyone have a copy of the last version of Microsoft QuickBASIC for > DOS? I think it's version 4.5, but I'm not absolutely sure. > > Peace... Sridhar > From dzubint at vcn.bc.ca Fri Sep 26 11:57:24 2003 From: dzubint at vcn.bc.ca (Thomas Dzubin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Fwd: Canadian Collection Message-ID: *sigh* I wish there were more collectors out in Western Canada (I'm in Calgary at this moment...occasionally in Vancouver & Saskatoon) Whenever I search for old stuff (even just to look at and admire such as in a museum it's always in Ontario (or further east) which ends up being a two-day drive for me. There's been lots of PDP-11 stuff recently on ebay.ca, but it too is all in Ontario I'd LOVE to to see those Kenbak-1s...but they'r too far away. Oh well... From jos.mar at bluewin.ch Fri Sep 26 14:06:41 2003 From: jos.mar at bluewin.ch (Marian Capel / Jos Dreesen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Canadian Collection Message-ID: <4573827E-F056-11D7-81FA-000A9585D8F6@bluewin.ch> Thomas Dzubin heeft op vrijdag, 26 sep 2003 om 18:57 (Europe/Zurich) het volgende geschreven: > > I'd LOVE to to see those Kenbak-1s...but they'r too far away. > Oh well... What is too far away ? I was able to seen the Nova Scotia Kenbak on a trip from Switzerland.... Herbert was even kind enough to open in up for me. Thanks ! Jos Dreesen ( And Nova Scotia was not too bad either !) From cb at mythtech.net Fri Sep 26 14:22:36 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Citizen's GSX-190 dot matrix printer Message-ID: Anyone have a manual for a Citizen's GSX-190 printer? I'm trying to find out how many multi-copy pages it can support. I need a dot matrix printer that supports AT LEAST five carbonless copies (counting the original). Mac compatible is prefered, but I can deal with Parallel. I have an old Citizen GSX-190, and it supports underside paper feed, which I have found is usually a good sign for a printer designed to use multi-part forms... but I want to verify how many pages it is designed for before I go thru the effort of trying to get it hooked up (only to find that it looses grip on the pages just like my Imagewriters do, the Imagewriter is only designed to handle 4 copies max) -chris From jos.mar at bluewin.ch Fri Sep 26 14:36:07 2003 From: jos.mar at bluewin.ch (Marian Capel / Jos Dreesen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Kenbak-1 discoveries In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The Design Fort DTP heeft op vrijdag, 26 sep 2003 om 19:16 (Europe/Zurich) het volgende geschreven: > the "find of my life". Here is what I could acquire: > - 6 Kenbak-1 computers > - the original schematics (a big folder!) > Good find... Any chance for scans of the doku and schematics ? Jos Dreesen From design.fort at ns.sympatico.ca Fri Sep 26 15:49:18 2003 From: design.fort at ns.sympatico.ca (The Design Fort DTP) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Kenbak discoveries Message-ID: Hi Jos, It was a pleasure to show you the Museum and the Kenbak :) I hope you had a nice vacation in Nova Scotia. I will eventually scan all the material and make them available for everybody interested in the Kenbaks. It will most likely be published on CD-Rom since it is a lot of material (especially the schematics). It will take a bit time since I do all this in my spare time. Greetings Herbert From geoffreythomas at onetel.net.uk Fri Sep 26 15:28:32 2003 From: geoffreythomas at onetel.net.uk (Geoffrey Thomas) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? References: <2F60C194-EFAE-11D7-AC5F-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> <20030925173510.A64458@newshell.lmi.net> Message-ID: <005101c3846c$c1cedd40$c8494ed5@geoff> Should be " People Can't Memorise Computer Industry Abbreviations " Acronyms are abbreviations that are pronounceable as a word - e.g. DOS . Sorry to be so pedantic , I'll go away and get a life. Geoff. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fred Cisin" To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Friday, September 26, 2003 1:38 AM Subject: Re: Old DOS on topic yet? > On Thu, 25 Sep 2003, Ron Hudson wrote: > > I would like to get an old single floppy DOS laptop machine > > on my local network. Anyone know how to get DOS to work with > > a PCMCIA card (uh too new?) > > The Poqet computer came out just over ten years ago. It used two memory > cards that were PCMCIA, but before the official PCMCIA standard was > developed. Does anybody know offhand exactly when the PCMCIA standard > came about? > > PCMCIA = "People Can't memorize Computer Industry Acronyms" > > > The Toshiba 1100, and the Atari Portfolio wer out about that time, and > like the Poqet, they had versions of DOS in ROM. (The Portfolio was a > wannabe, Toshiba and Poqet were MS-DOS) > > From cisin at xenosoft.com Fri Sep 26 16:48:43 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Old DOS on topic yet? In-Reply-To: <005101c3846c$c1cedd40$c8494ed5@geoff> References: <2F60C194-EFAE-11D7-AC5F-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> <20030925173510.A64458@newshell.lmi.net> <005101c3846c$c1cedd40$c8494ed5@geoff> Message-ID: <20030926144541.O82760@newshell.lmi.net> On Fri, 26 Sep 2003, Geoffrey Thomas wrote: > Should be " People Can't Memorise Computer Industry Abbreviations " > Acronyms are abbreviations that are pronounceable as a word - e.g. DOS . > Sorry to be so pedantic , I'll go away and get a life. You are entirely correct Now, if I could only remember who was the originator (10+ years ago). A number of computer industry acronyms are also relatively unpronouncable, or of marginally arguable pronunciation, such as SQL and SCSI. From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Fri Sep 26 17:17:56 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: TRS-80 printer cable length? In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Sep 26, 3 00:33:33 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2874 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030926/3f511c14/attachment.ksh From tothwolf at concentric.net Fri Sep 26 19:12:09 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: TRS-80 printer cable length? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 26 Sep 2003, Tony Duell wrote: > Tothwolf wrote: > > > > From memory, 6 feet / 1.8m. But I might be wrong. > > > > That sounds about right. I have a couple packed away somewhere, but I > > think they were made up by the computer's owner and not bought ready > > made. > > That's why I don't know the length either. I made my own cables back > then (still do, of course). And I made them to be a convenient length > for me... Of course. Thats what I tend to do too, but not everyone has the patience or tools to put them together. > > So far I've been able to come up with these catalog numbers, though > > there are probably a few others: > > All from memory.... > > > Model I 26-1411, 26-1416 [LP2] > > cable, 36 pin Blue Ribbon on one end (Centronics connector), 40 pin edge > connector (no, I don't mean 34 pin) on the other. The other part is > short, and has a little box of electronics with a 40 pin card edge on > one end and a ribbon cabel with a 40 pin edge connector (M1 bus) on the > other. The circuitry is an address decoder, data latch and buffers -- > basically the printer port bit of the EI. It lets you connect a > Centronics printer to an M1 without an EI, but it needs a printer that > supplies +5V on the the Centronics connector. Ok, thanks for reminding me of that. I'd long forgotten about those little black/gray boxes attached to those cables. > > Model I+EI/III/4 26-1401, 26-1415 [LP2] > > 36 pin Blue Ribbon to 34 pin edge connector. Thats what I thought... > > Model II 26-4401, 26-4402 [LP2] > > 34 pin (? maybe 40 pin) 2 row header socket to 36 pin Blue Ribbon. I believe it is 34 pins. I'll check my Model 2 to be sure though. > > Color Computer 26-3020 > > 4 pin DIN to 4 pin DIN (this is a serial interface cable!) > > > Tandy 1000 Series (Not RL or TL/3) 26-225/26-222 (6'/12') > > I think this is a shielded version of the 36 pin Blue Ribbon to 34 pin > Edge connector. The strange thing is, I think I have two versions of this cable somewhere. They look identical, but have different part numbers. Time to pull them out of storage... > > All Others PC-Compatibles 26-227/26-223 (6'/12') > > What you think. 36 pin Blue Ribbon to DB25 plug. Of course, just on the list for semi-completeness ;) > > I'm unsure as to why the LP2 has different cables. Does it not use the > > centronics-style 36 pin connector? > > I have an idea it didn't. I think it used a 34 pin (or was it 40 pin) > card edge (!). That sounds about right, but I don't think I have an LP2, so I can't verify for sure what connector it used. Does someone out there have one that they can check? Looking at the different cables, it would appear the most commonly needed cables would be the Model I+EI/III/4 (26-1401), Model II (26-4401), and Color Computer (26-3020). Does that seem about right? Is there much in the way of demand for shielded cables for the Tandy 1000 line? Are there many LP2s out there that need cables? -Toth From ohh at drizzle.com Fri Sep 26 20:19:55 2003 From: ohh at drizzle.com (O. Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Remex Director Tape Reader Docs? Message-ID: Hi, all: Does someone on the list have documentation for the Remex "Director" paper tape readers (model numbers RRS9000 or RRS9006)? I've read manuals for other Remex models online, but not much of use for this one. In particular I'm curious about what effect the "spool/loop" switch has on operation, what kind of checking is done by the power-up self-check, and if there's some good sensible way to test the stepper motor driving the tape sprocket. If I can get some more data, it may save at least _one_ paper tape reader from having a long and dusty servitude in a storage room. :) -O.- From gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org Fri Sep 26 22:27:00 2003 From: gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org (Gunther Schadow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: UNIBUS woes (was: Re: VAX 11/780 progress ... just a little) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F750384.9070905@aurora.regenstrief.org> Johnny Billquist wrote: > Don't know the answer to that one, but the terminator cards are normally > very sturdy, so a safe bet is that it's ok. >>So, I should put in more cards >>and grants in slots 7 and 8, right? Do I need to put a grant >>also in slot 9C (since the terminator is only in 9A and B)? The little grant cards go in row D, right? While the grant + NPG go in slot C+D, right? I still have the problem that things seem to work better without terminator than with terminator. And I am not the only guy who has that problem. Another PDP-11 friend has the same issue with his UDA50, responds to host without terminator but not with terminator. No luck. -Gunther From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Sep 26 22:29:12 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: Remex Director Tape Reader Docs? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030926232912.007d1590@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I was just about to post a message about this. I found a Technical Manual for the Remex models RR-1002BB/LB/RB and was wondering if Al or somebody else wanted to scan it and post it. This manual is dated 1966 and covers EVERYTHING for the Remex PT readers; General Description, Installation, Operation, Theory of Operation, Maintenance, Parts Lists, Drawings, etc. Joe At 06:19 PM 9/26/03 -0700, you wrote: > >Hi, all: > >Does someone on the list have documentation for the Remex "Director" paper >tape readers (model numbers RRS9000 or RRS9006)? I've read manuals for >other Remex models online, but not much of use for this one. > >In particular I'm curious about what effect the "spool/loop" switch has >on operation, what kind of checking is done by the power-up self-check, >and if there's some good sensible way to test the stepper motor driving >the tape sprocket. > >If I can get some more data, it may save at least _one_ paper tape reader >from having a long and dusty servitude in a storage room. :) > > -O.- > > From tponsford at theriver.com Fri Sep 26 23:04:24 2003 From: tponsford at theriver.com (Tom Ponsford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: A russian pdp-11?? Message-ID: <3F750C48.6010405@theriver.com> Hi All !! A good haul at the local University auction has netted me a coupla Sun Ulta2's, a few vt420 monitors an IBM3151 terminal and the neatest find in the last few months.... A russian pdp-11. It appears to be an exact replica of a dec professional 350. It has the same case as the decmate/ rainbow/professional series. All the labels, everything, is in cyrillic, but it is an exact replica of my 350, the only difference is that instead of the funky dec dual RX50, it has two ordinary looking 51/4 floppies, and the color is what my friend calls a soyuz silver or moscow gray, as opposed to the dec beige/sand. It has what appears to be a RD50/52 but it is all labeled in russian. It even has the CTI bus cage with the cards for the drives. On sliding the mainboard out, it is identical to my 350, except for a few oddities, and all the chips are labeled in cyrillic!. It dates from 1988 and seems to be in excellent condition, except for the upper plastic cover is missing the front plate. I was really tempted to fire it up, as it appears to have, an US style 110 power receptical. But second thoughts, made me cautious as I'm not sure of its electrical requirements and would hate to toast the power supply or boards as it is a bit different from the 350 in size and various connectors. If anybody has seen one of these or has info, I'd apreciate a little help!! In the mean time I'll did up my russian-english dictionary and maybe try to trans-literate the cyrillic characters. Cheers Tom Ponsford From classiccmp at vintage-computer.com Fri Sep 26 23:18:35 2003 From: classiccmp at vintage-computer.com (Erik S. Klein) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: TRS-80 rescue - help needed in RI Message-ID: <056701c384ae$6b828e40$947ba8c0@p933> I've been working on trying to get a pair of TRS-80 systems transferred from Southern RI to sunny NorCal but I'm finding that the extent of the collection makes it prohibitively expensive to pack and ship (5 boxes of stuff from what I'm told). Is there anyone in the RI area interested in rescuing a TRS-80 Model III and a TRS-80 Model 1000SX (Early PC Clone)? There are peripherals (at least one printer, for instance) and lots of docs and software for these. I'm just trying to back gracefully out of the deal without leaving the donor hanging. I've belatedly realized that I can't justify the expense of shipping these relatively common systems from coast to coast. Please contact me if you've got an interest and I'll do what I can to set you up. Erik Klein www.vintage-computer.com/vcforum The Vintage Computer Forum From curt at atarimuseum.com Fri Sep 26 23:44:50 2003 From: curt at atarimuseum.com (Curt vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: TDX Format Tapes? References: <056701c384ae$6b828e40$947ba8c0@p933> Message-ID: <005301c384b2$4d0368a0$1a02a8c0@starship1> Anyone familiar with this format, I've got about 200 6" tapes that all say TDX Format or TDX Tape. I've found nothing about it through Google, these were used on a Vax 11/780 under either VMS or UCB Unix 4.1, unclear as to which OS. Standard TU78 was used. This is all I know so far... Is this some kind of compression format or something? Any help on this would be greatly appreciated, thanks. Curt From nico at farumdata.dk Sat Sep 27 00:06:38 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: TDX Format Tapes? References: <056701c384ae$6b828e40$947ba8c0@p933> <005301c384b2$4d0368a0$1a02a8c0@starship1> Message-ID: <006501c384b5$25077aa0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> The name as such doesnt mean much to me, but I've seen many identical formats but with different names. What physical format are those tapes ? 9 track reel to reel ? Nico -- It has been noticed, that hackers and other lowlifes use my e-mail address as a hiding place. I regret the inconvenience these pirates give you ----- Original Message ----- From: "Curt vendel" To: ; "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Saturday, September 27, 2003 6:44 AM Subject: TDX Format Tapes? > Anyone familiar with this format, I've got about 200 6" tapes that all say > TDX Format or TDX Tape. > > I've found nothing about it through Google, these were used on a Vax 11/780 > under either VMS or UCB Unix 4.1, unclear as to which OS. Standard TU78 > was used. This is all I know so far... > > Is this some kind of compression format or something? Any help on this > would be greatly appreciated, thanks. > > > > Curt > > > > From geoffr at zipcon.net Sat Sep 27 03:14:30 2003 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: QuickBASIC In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.2.20030927011318.04a3e740@mail.zipcon.net> >(I also have PowerBASIC 7, the "Enterprise" version of QB4.5 if you'd >like) do you mean Microsoft Basic Professional development system version 7 and 7.1? there's also Visual basic for dos Version 1.0 which came after QB 4.5 From jplist at kiwigeek.com Sat Sep 27 08:18:07 2003 From: jplist at kiwigeek.com (JP Hindin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: QuickBASIC In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.22.2.20030927011318.04a3e740@mail.zipcon.net> Message-ID: On Sat, 27 Sep 2003, Geoff Reed wrote: > >(I also have PowerBASIC 7, the "Enterprise" version of QB4.5 if you'd > >like) > do you mean Microsoft Basic Professional development system version 7 and 7.1? > there's also Visual basic for dos Version 1.0 which came after QB 4.5 Actually; Yea. I got the names mixed up, somehow. I haven't used QBasic/MSBasic for... well. I moved to Linux six years ago now, so that gives you an idea :P I have a CD I got from a boss, about two bosses ago, of some 50 different versions of some 30 languages. Kinda a cool CD, a little use now and then. Not often. :) JP From curt at atarimuseum.com Sat Sep 27 08:39:41 2003 From: curt at atarimuseum.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: TDX Format Tapes? Message-ID: <200309271347.h8RDlfwr039892@huey.classiccmp.org> Hi Nico, Yes, they are 9 track reel to reels. Curt > The name as such doesnt mean much to me, but I've seen many identical formats but with different names. > What physical format are those tapes ? 9 track reel to reel ? > > Nico > -- It has been noticed, that hackers and other lowlifes use my e-mail address as a hiding place. > I regret the inconvenience these pirates give you > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Curt vendel" > To: ; "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" > Sent: Saturday, September 27, 2003 6:44 AM > Subject: TDX Format Tapes? > > > > Anyone familiar with this format, I've got about 200 6" tapes that all say > > TDX Format or TDX Tape. > > > > I've found nothing about it through Google, these were used on a Vax 11/780 > > under either VMS or UCB Unix 4.1, unclear as to which OS. Standard TU78 > > was used. This is all I know so far... > > > > Is this some kind of compression format or something? Any help on this > > would be greatly appreciated, thanks. > > > > > > > > Curt > > > > > > > > > From dittman at dittman.net Sat Sep 27 10:15:30 2003 From: dittman at dittman.net (Eric Dittman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: TDX Format Tapes? In-Reply-To: <005301c384b2$4d0368a0$1a02a8c0@starship1> from "Curt vendel" at Sep 27, 2003 12:44:50 AM Message-ID: <20030927151530.A4E20801B@narnia.int.dittman.net> > Anyone familiar with this format, I've got about 200 6" tapes that all say > TDX Format or TDX Tape. > > I've found nothing about it through Google, these were used on a Vax 11/780 > under either VMS or UCB Unix 4.1, unclear as to which OS. Standard TU78 > was used. This is all I know so far... > > Is this some kind of compression format or something? Any help on this > would be greatly appreciated, thanks. They may be tapes for a Sentry tester. A development system was available for VMS and there was a program to read and write TDX tapes for exchanging data and programs with the tester. If I remember correctly TDX stood for Tester Data eXchange. This may be a completely different TDX format. Is there any other information on the labels? -- Eric Dittman dittman@dittman.net From esharpe at uswest.net Sat Sep 27 12:41:43 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: museum needs a documation reader that interfaces to a pc Message-ID: <001601c3851e$9dc8c700$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> need a documation reader or other that will interface to a pc so that we can archive card data... need something that is ready to go as with all the projects we have here on the table currently we would not have the time to enjoy doing a conversion ourselves... please advise Thanks! Ed Sharpe Archivist for SMECC See the Southwest Museum of Engineering, Communications and Computation online at: http://www.smecc.org From acme at gbronline.com Sat Sep 27 12:27:55 2003 From: acme at gbronline.com (Glen Goodwin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: test Message-ID: <01C384FB.2962BBA0.acme@gbronline.com> sorry for the intrusion . . . new ISP . . . From curt at atarimuseum.com Sat Sep 27 12:39:03 2003 From: curt at atarimuseum.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: TDX Format Tapes? Message-ID: <200309271747.h8RHl2wr040430@huey.classiccmp.org> Eric, You hit the head right on the nail ;-) All kidding aside, that is exactly it! thanks to all for your input. Curt > > Anyone familiar with this format, I've got about 200 6" tapes that all say > > TDX Format or TDX Tape. > > > > I've found nothing about it through Google, these were used on a Vax 11/780 > > under either VMS or UCB Unix 4.1, unclear as to which OS. Standard TU78 > > was used. This is all I know so far... > > > > Is this some kind of compression format or something? Any help on this > > would be greatly appreciated, thanks. > > They may be tapes for a Sentry tester. A development system was available > for VMS and there was a program to read and write TDX tapes for exchanging > data and programs with the tester. If I remember correctly TDX stood for > Tester Data eXchange. > > This may be a completely different TDX format. Is there any other information > on the labels? > -- > Eric Dittman > dittman@dittman.net From emu at ecubics.com Sat Sep 27 13:10:15 2003 From: emu at ecubics.com (emanuel stiebler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: A russian pdp-11?? In-Reply-To: <3F750C48.6010405@theriver.com> References: <3F750C48.6010405@theriver.com> Message-ID: <3F75D287.1030403@ecubics.com> Tom Ponsford wrote: > Hi All !! > > A russian pdp-11. Pictures ? From vcf at siconic.com Sat Sep 27 13:27:20 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:08 2005 Subject: museum needs a documation reader that interfaces to a pc In-Reply-To: <001601c3851e$9dc8c700$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: On Sat, 27 Sep 2003, Ed Sharpe wrote: > need a documation reader or other that will interface to a pc so that we > can archive card data... need something that is ready to go as with all > the projects we have here on the table currently we would not have the > time to enjoy doing a conversion ourselves... please advise Ed, Your best bet is Brian Knittel's USB interface. I don't have a link to his webpage but you can contact Brian at . -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From kth at srv.net Sat Sep 27 15:02:28 2003 From: kth at srv.net (Kevin Handy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: PDP 11/83 Clock Error In-Reply-To: <1064451305.20621.6.camel@unix> References: <1064451305.20621.6.camel@unix> Message-ID: <3F75ECD4.5000206@srv.net> Christopher McNabb wrote: >Well, I seem to have gotten my power supply straightened out. It wasn't >the switch after all, but the power supply itself. A different problem >has now manifested itself. > >On power on I am getting this on the console: > >Error 61 >M8190 Clock Error > > >It then spits out the contents of various registers and asks if I want >to run the test again. > >I couldn't find this particular error via the normal search engines. >Does any have any ideas as to what the problem may be and how to correct >it? > > > > Not a clue. Doesn't sound good, but may just be someting to do with a TOY clock, but I don't think the 83 had one of those. Other possibilities are the 60hz interrupt from the power line, or the main CPU's clock. They used "clock" to refer to a lot of different things. I suggust posting to alt.sys.pdp11 where there are a lot of pdp-11 gurus hang out. From allain at panix.com Sat Sep 27 15:15:54 2003 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: Heathkit CRT Test device. References: <1064451305.20621.6.camel@unix> <3F75ECD4.5000206@srv.net> Message-ID: <009901c38534$2821c040$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Today I picked up a "Heathkit CRT Tester and Rejuvenator IT-5230" in case. It has 5 standard socket adaptors for various tubes plus two more, including alligator clips, for the rest. Also 2 potentiometers, 4 meters, 6 switches, and 10 lights. Knowing what I do about some people on the list getting stuck with CRT's that are hard to replace I thought I would give this a try. Give me an offer for shipping and handling and it's yours, else I think it goes back in a week. John A. From esharpe at uswest.net Sat Sep 27 16:17:40 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: museum needs a documation reader that interfaces to a pc References: Message-ID: <007d01c3853c$c8e83920$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> Thanks Sellam! Brian has contacted me... did you end up with the cardpunch ibm 129? Thanks! Ed Sharpe Archivist for SMECC See the Southwest Museum of Engineering, Communications and Computation online at: http://www.smecc.org ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vintage Computer Festival" To: "Classic Computers Mailing List" Sent: Saturday, September 27, 2003 11:27 AM Subject: Re: museum needs a documation reader that interfaces to a pc > On Sat, 27 Sep 2003, Ed Sharpe wrote: > > > need a documation reader or other that will interface to a pc so that we > > can archive card data... need something that is ready to go as with all > > the projects we have here on the table currently we would not have the > > time to enjoy doing a conversion ourselves... please advise > > Ed, > > Your best bet is Brian Knittel's USB interface. I don't have a link to > his webpage but you can contact Brian at . > > -- > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage mputers ] > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] > > > From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sat Sep 27 15:22:11 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: UNIBUS woes (was: Re: VAX 11/780 progress ... just a little) In-Reply-To: <3F750384.9070905@aurora.regenstrief.org> from "Gunther Schadow" at Sep 26, 3 10:27:00 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1154 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030927/e611b6ac/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sat Sep 27 15:18:44 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: TRS-80 printer cable length? In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Sep 26, 3 07:12:09 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1447 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030927/2f7a51e1/attachment.ksh From doc at mdrconsult.com Sat Sep 27 16:03:00 2003 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: PDP11/84 continued Message-ID: <3F75FB04.2090204@mdrconsult.com> After several hours with the 11/84 last night, it appears that I'm in the same boat as Gunther with respect to the Unibus terminator. First off, in *any* configuration with an M9302 Terminator in A-B of the last slot, the CPU hangs at boot at LED 77. I have plenty of G7273 NPG-grant continuity cards, as well as non-NPG knuckle-busters. Which they are. I'm pretty sure my configuration of the card cage isn't right. Here's the original layout (forgive any misalignment in the drawing - Mozilla apparently translates tabs to whitespace, and not correctly): A B C D E F || M7677 - 11/84 Monitor || || M8190-AE - CPU || || M8637-BC - 1MB || || M8637-DF - 1MB || || M8191 - Unibus PMI || || G7273 - NBPG || || M7860 General Dev Interface? || || M7860 General Dev Int. || || M7819 - 8-Line Async || || M7819 - 8-Line Async || || TCU-150 - Custom serial splitter, NPG unkn. || || M8526 - RX211 || || UniB OUT || M7258 - LP11 Printer Int. || The TCU-150 is entirely undocumented except for a couple of invoices for etching and assembly. It's supposed to be part of a system of splitting an available serial line into multiple comm channels, but that's all I know. For whatever it's worth, the original configuration map on the lid of the system unit is accurate, and appears not to have been altered, so I'd guess that the backplane is in its original state, too. What I want is some variation of this: A B C D E F || M7677 - 11/84 Monitor || || M8190-AE - CPU || || M8637-BC - 1MB || || M8637-DF - 1MB || || M8191 - Unibus PMI || || M7486 - UDA50-A || || M7485 - UDA52 || || M7521 - DELUA ethernet || || M8526 - RX211 || ...although the DELUA isn't strictly needed. Even without the DELUA, with the last 5 C slots populated with non-NPG grants or with G7273 NPG grants, I don't get a reasonable response from the RX02. And as I said, with the terminator installed, the box just hangs at powerup. Can anybody tell me what I'm doing wrong? Doc From jrkeys at concentric.net Sat Sep 27 17:07:49 2003 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: Sellar won't Take $100 for mag Message-ID: <00b401c38543$cb651bd0$6108dd40@oemcomputer> Here's a Popular Electronics that went to $100 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2753642221 From ss at allegro.com Sat Sep 27 17:27:40 2003 From: ss at allegro.com (Stan Sieler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: HP 9835 avail; and: HP 9835 tape conversion request Message-ID: <3F75AC6C.9373.50665D4@localhost> Hi, I received the following two-part email this week... A free 9835... ... I moved up to an HP 9835. [It's in Canada] ... Now the good news, I still have the 9835 in my basement. I think it's still close to being functional, it turns on without clouds of blue smoke but the monitor appears to have given up so no way of seeing if it is really booting up. I'm not sure about the tape drive? If you could locate a monitor, maybe you could get a functioning 9835. It's free to a good home And, the project: I have been looking everywhere for anyone who might have a functioning 9835/45 because I still have about 10 tapes with thousands of pages of HP BASIC that I would love to off load to some form of modern media in ASCII and translate into modern BASIC. If you could help me with this problem I would even pay the shipping of the 9835 to you, if you are interested? Anyone interested, reply (offline) to me, and I'll pass the contact info on to you. thanks, Stan From vcf at siconic.com Sat Sep 27 17:40:52 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: museum needs a documation reader that interfaces to a pc In-Reply-To: <007d01c3853c$c8e83920$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: On Sat, 27 Sep 2003, Ed Sharpe wrote: > Thanks Sellam! Brian has contacted me... > > did you end up with the cardpunch ibm 129? Nope. Someone snatched it from under my nose >:( -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From kittstr at access-4-free.com Sat Sep 27 00:38:07 2003 From: kittstr at access-4-free.com (Andrew Strouse) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: QuickBASIC References: Message-ID: <000201c3854a$c5fd93f0$9c4d4a43@amscomputer> I'd like.... :-) Andrew Strouse ( kittstr@access-4-free.com ) ----- Original Message ----- From: "JP Hindin" To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Friday, September 26, 2003 11:47 AM Subject: Re: QuickBASIC > > > On Fri, 26 Sep 2003 vance@neurotica.com wrote: > > Does anyone have a copy of the last version of Microsoft QuickBASIC for > > DOS? I think it's version 4.5, but I'm not absolutely sure. > > Greetings; > > http://63.149.103.32/misc/qb45.tar.gz > > The very first piece of software I ever bought (Well, in fact, bought for > me by my father) was QB 4.5. > Unfortunately, I don't have a copy of the install disk images, which sets > the run directory, so this is _expecting_ to be in C:\QB45\ > If its not in this directory, when you try and compile, it'll want to know > where the runtime libs are - which, of course, you can override. > > Anyways; > Enjoy; > > (I also have PowerBASIC 7, the "Enterprise" version of QB4.5 if you'd > like) > > JP > > From classiccmp at trailing-edge.com Sat Sep 27 18:42:10 2003 From: classiccmp at trailing-edge.com (Tim Shoppa) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: PDP 11/83 Clock Error In-Reply-To: <3F75ECD4.5000206@srv.net> References: <1064451305.20621.6.camel@unix> <3F75ECD4.5000206@srv.net> Message-ID: <3F762052.nailEW11182T3@mini-me.trailing-edge.com> >Error 61 >M8190 Clock Error On the front of your BA23 there are two DIPswitches. Flip the direction of the one nearest the AC power switch. This will re-enable 60Hz clock interrupts, which is what self-test 61 looks for. Tim. From netsurfer_x1 at fastmailbox.net Sat Sep 27 18:46:17 2003 From: netsurfer_x1 at fastmailbox.net (David Vohs) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: DC-100 tape cartridges. Message-ID: <20030927234617.2BA553D1CD@www.fastmail.fm> Anyone know if anyone still makes DC-100 tape cartridges any more? I'll be getting an HP-85 soon & I want to find a source for blank DC-100 tape cartridges. My searching so far has turned up nil, but maybe I'm just looking in the wrong places. Any help is more than welcome. -- David Vohs netsurfer_x1@fastmailbox.net -- http://www.fastmail.fm - Sent 0.000002 seconds ago From ss at allegro.com Sat Sep 27 18:56:21 2003 From: ss at allegro.com (Stan Sieler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: HP 7914, HP 7908, HP 7911 for sale in Atascadero, CA Message-ID: <3F75C135.16772.557963F@localhost> Hi, I spotted three old HP disk (and disk/tape) drives indoors at a salvage yard (Heillman Salvage) in Atascadero, California(about 170 miles south of the SF Bay Area): HP 7914 HP 7908 HP 7911 They didn't look like they're in immediate danger of destruction (they're currently working on breaking up a Cray 2 ... no, they didn't have the entire machine ... apparently, the Computer History Museum got the CPU, and Heillman got most of the rest). The HP drives were a bit dirty, and I have no idea of the price. The phone number is 1-805-466-4893. Also spotted (outside): carcass of a Lisa (3.5" drive, no faceplate), a badly burned HP 9845, a probably stripped CE control panel for some 12 bit computer (no brand name visible, had a rotary dial with a semi-transparent plastic disk in lower-left corner of panel ... couldn't get close enough to read anything). Stan From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sat Sep 27 19:37:51 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: PDP11/84 continued In-Reply-To: <3F75FB04.2090204@mdrconsult.com> from "Doc Shipley" at Sep 27, 3 04:03:00 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2017 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030928/793b017f/attachment.ksh From doc at mdrconsult.com Sun Sep 28 00:32:20 2003 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: PDP11/84 continued In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F767264.5080406@mdrconsult.com> Tony Duell wrote: >>Doc wrote: >> What I want is some variation of this: >> >> A B C D E F >> >>|| M7677 - 11/84 Monitor || >>|| M8190-AE - CPU || >>|| M8637-BC - 1MB || >>|| M8637-DF - 1MB || >>|| M8191 - Unibus PMI || >>|| M7486 - UDA50-A || >>|| M7485 - UDA52 || >>|| M7521 - DELUA ethernet || >> || M8526 - RX211 || >> >> >> ...although the DELUA isn't strictly needed. Even without the DELUA, >>with the last 5 C slots populated with non-NPG grants or with G7273 NPG >>grants, I don't get a reasonable response from the RX02. And as I said, >>with the terminator installed, the box just hangs at powerup. Part of the problem was that since the NPG jumper goes on pins CA1 to CB1, I thought the G727A goes in slot C. After discovering the mistake, further thought and a look at a G7273 tells me that that logic was screwed anyway. :( > I thnik the problem is that you've moved the RX211 into a slot where the > NPG jumper isn't cut. Put it back in the next-to-last slot, and put a > grant continuity card (either type should work) in the last slot. Have > all other slots dilled with G7273s for the moment (leave out the DELUA > and the UDA50). See if you can get the RX02 to behave like that. Well, with only the RX211 installed in its original slot, the M9302 terminator properly installed, and G7273's everywhere else, the CPU still hangs. With G727A cards instead of G7273's, the RX02 will boot an RT-11 installation floppy. > Once you've got that working, you'll need to check the backplane to > remove the NPG jumpers on the slots where you put the UDA50 and the > DELUA. Both are NPR/NPG devices. IIRC, the UDA50 is a 2-board set. You > have to remove the jumper from the 'digital' card's slot, it doesn't > matter about the other one, so you might as well take out both jumpers to > avoid confusion. The above, and the fact that installing the UDA50 pair and trying to boot DU0 hangs the box, tells me I'll have to pull the backplane and do some snipping. Thanks *very* much for the help, everyone. Just getting a normal boot off the RX02 validates the system and the backplane, and warms the cockles of my heart! In other news, the PDP11V03-L that came with the 11/03 boots and runs perfectly. It's not nearly as slow as I had expected, either. The friend who is helping with this and providing space for it all was quite impressed with it. The 11/03 is several years older than he is.... Doc From frustum at pacbell.net Sun Sep 28 01:19:10 2003 From: frustum at pacbell.net (Jim Battle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: WangEmu 1.1 released Message-ID: <3F767D5E.1010205@pacbell.net> I've updated my Wang 2200 emulator to version 1.1. It has been about six months since the last update. This release adds two signficant features: 1) disk support. You can now plug in disk controllers, each of which can control two drives. Drives can be any legal size, and the timing can model that of 5.25" or 8" floppies, or hard disks (even the interleave factor is modelled). You can optionally turn of the emulated timing and make it run as fast as possible. 2) when an error message is displayed on the screen (which are just two digit codes), double click on that line and a detailed explanation will pop up. the explanations come directly from the Wang BASIC manual. Adding the first feature was a lot of work. I started with the microcode dump from the disk controller and a document describing the microarchitecture (believe it or not, the 2200 has a 4b ALU and the disk controller has an 8B ALU). From there, I wrote a disassembler and studied the listing until I thought I understood the protocol. I implemented it and ironed the wrinkles out of my assumptions. Please have a look if you are interested. Web site: http://www.thebattles.net/wang/wang.html The emulator: http://www.thebattles.net/wang/emu.html Cool error message feature, in relaxing Wang green: http://www.thebattles.net/wang/emu/html/error_help.gif Release notes: http://www.thebattles.net/wang/emu/relnotes.txt The program is a Win32 executable. Source code is online. From cmcnabb at 4mcnabb.net Sun Sep 28 07:11:40 2003 From: cmcnabb at 4mcnabb.net (Christopher McNabb) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: PDP 11/83 Clock Error In-Reply-To: <3F762052.nailEW11182T3@mini-me.trailing-edge.com> References: <1064451305.20621.6.camel@unix> <3F75ECD4.5000206@srv.net> <3F762052.nailEW11182T3@mini-me.trailing-edge.com> Message-ID: <1064750619.31631.1.camel@unix> On Sat, 2003-09-27 at 19:42, Tim Shoppa wrote: > >Error 61 > >M8190 Clock Error > > On the front of your BA23 there are two DIPswitches. Flip the > direction of the one nearest the AC power switch. This will re-enable > 60Hz clock interrupts, which is what self-test 61 looks for. > Yeah, I saw that when searching deja. Tried it, didn't work. I'm wondering if this 'new' power supply also has a problem. -- Christopher McNabb The McNabb Family From musicman38 at comcast.net Sun Sep 28 12:51:31 2003 From: musicman38 at comcast.net (musicman38) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: Lantastic Network Software Version 7 References: <1064451305.20621.6.camel@unix> <3F75ECD4.5000206@srv.net><3F762052.nailEW11182T3@mini-me.trailing-edge.com> <1064750619.31631.1.camel@unix> Message-ID: <001901c385e9$26ec4b40$0200a8c0@alico01.fl.comcast.net> One of my clients just gave me their copy of Lantastic Ver 7 (10 user). Does anyone know if Lantastic Version 7 Network Software is compatible with Windows 98 ? I used to install and use Lantastic on many of my clients because it allowed DOS, Windows 3.1, and Even Windows 95, to share Drives and printers. It was really stable and reliable network software. Microsoft used to have drivers for Lantastic on Windows 95, but I think dropped support after they ran them out of business. I have an old DOS based computer with some very cool stuff on it, and it would be fun to share printers and drives on it across my home network. Also does anyone have a copy of Version 8, their last version before Microsoft ran them out of business. Thanks, Phil From vcf at siconic.com Sun Sep 28 14:13:59 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: Lantastic Network Software Version 7 In-Reply-To: <001901c385e9$26ec4b40$0200a8c0@alico01.fl.comcast.net> Message-ID: On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, musicman38 wrote: > One of my clients just gave me their copy of Lantastic Ver 7 (10 user). > Does anyone know if Lantastic Version 7 Network Software is compatible with > Windows 98 ? Technically yes, realistically no. I had a lot of problems with it when I was using it. If you have DOS boxes that you want to network with Win9x then it's good for that, but on Win95 it was very buggy. Maybe it's more stable on Win98. It should certainly work with it. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From trash_tmp at poczta.onet.pl Sun Sep 28 15:08:02 2003 From: trash_tmp at poczta.onet.pl (trashcan man) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: sanyo lat-200a. Message-ID: <20030928200802.GA387@trashcan.ds7> not sure if it's on-topic here, but anyway... i have an ISA board marked 'Sanyo LAT-200A'. it contains amd286 cpu, couple of headland chips, four SIMM sockets, and two (even/odd) empty bios sockets. does anybody know what it is, where to find bios images and how to use it? From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sun Sep 28 12:01:11 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: PDP11/84 continued In-Reply-To: <3F767264.5080406@mdrconsult.com> from "Doc Shipley" at Sep 28, 3 00:32:20 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1035 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030928/35643549/attachment.ksh From bqt at update.uu.se Sun Sep 28 15:43:36 2003 From: bqt at update.uu.se (Johnny Billquist) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: PDP11/84 continued In-Reply-To: <200309281701.h8SH04wu044167@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 Doc Shipley wrote: > After several hours with the 11/84 last night, it appears that I'm in > the same boat as Gunther with respect to the Unibus terminator. What's the problem with you guys??? The Unibus is really simple to get right. :-) One thing you should know about the 11/84 is that you don't use wire wraps on the backplane for the NPG slots in the CPU box. The M7677 (MDM) have NPG switches for all card slots instead. Go to that card and check it out... Second. The 11/84 must have a minimum load on both the PMI and Unibus. The minimum load module (MLM) is M7556. Since you have two memory cards, that MLM is not in. But depending on the configuration of the Unibus, you might want to have the MLM in there. However, I don't think you have a problem here, since I suspect that if the machine powers up, that aspect is ok. It would be nice to hear how Gunther is doing. I'm very sporadic on classiccmp though. If you need help on pdp-11 stuff, I'd recommend you post to info-pdp11, or alt.sys.pdp-11 (or whatever it's called). Johnny Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt@update.uu.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol From tothwolf at concentric.net Sun Sep 28 17:24:36 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: sanyo lat-200a. In-Reply-To: <20030928200802.GA387@trashcan.ds7> References: <20030928200802.GA387@trashcan.ds7> Message-ID: On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, trashcan man wrote: > not sure if it's on-topic here, but anyway... > > i have an ISA board marked 'Sanyo LAT-200A'. it contains amd286 cpu, > couple of headland chips, four SIMM sockets, and two (even/odd) empty > bios sockets. does anybody know what it is, where to find bios images > and how to use it? Sounds like a single board computer for a passive backplane. Finding a BIOS probably isn't gonna be easy. You may be able to get it from the company that made the board, or you might be able to copy the BIOS from a 286 motherboard that uses the exact same chipset. Are there any markings on the board? What chipset does it use? -Toth From doc at mdrconsult.com Sun Sep 28 22:07:58 2003 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: PDP11/84 continued References: Message-ID: <3F77A20E.4080900@mdrconsult.com> Tony Duell wrote: >> Well, with only the RX211 installed in its original slot, the M9302 >>terminator properly installed, and G7273's everywhere else, the CPU >>still hangs. With G727A cards instead of G7273's, the RX02 will boot an >>RT-11 installation floppy. > > You are telling me it will work with the single-height grant cards in > slot D, but not with the dual-height ones in C and D? Yes. Specifically, with G272A grant cards in slot D of rows 5-10 and row 12, an RX211 in C-F of row 11, and an M9302 terminator in AB of row 12, the 11/84 will boot from an RT-11 floppy in an RX02 drive. Replace the G727A cards with G7273 dual-height cards, or add other boards, and the boot aborts with a Controller error. > This is impossible -- the only difference between the 2 types of grant > card is that the dual-height ones also complete the NPG jumper. If it > works with the single-height ones, then the NPG chain must be complete > along the backplane. Adding a second 'jumper' (on the dual height card) > in parallel with the wire-wrapped on on the backplane can't make any > difference. That's actually good to hear. It doesn't make sense to me either. I've pulled the backplane (H9277-A), and there are no broken traces or any other obvious damage, but there are no jumpers between the first pins of slot C in *any* row. There is a lot of wire-wrap back there, but I'll be a couple of days just mapping it, much less figuring out the purpose. > It sounds like you have backplane problems. Maybe some of the dual-height > cards aren't making proper contact. Maybe the slots you're putting them > in aren't satnadard Unibus slots (unlikely, but...) and the 'extra' > jumper is shorting a couple of signals that it shouldn't... This machine was in production till about 2 months ago, and was reportedly in good health when decomissioned. However, it's not acting in a manner that I'd expect from anything I've read. At this point, I'm looking at the 11/44 next to it an thinking that's gotta be better. :) As bad as it sounds, the primary goal is to validate a couple dozen RA60 disk packs, not nw\ecessarily to bring up the 11/84. Whatever gets us there quickest is best. Doc From jplist at kiwigeek.com Sun Sep 28 17:16:15 2003 From: jplist at kiwigeek.com (JP Hindin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: SGI Indigo/Crimson - PS/2 to SGI adaptors found Message-ID: Greetings; I don't know if its any form of blasphemy to do this. But for only $40, you can get a prebuilt convertor of standard PS/2 keyboard + mouse to proprietary SGI keyb/mouse bus for Indigo/Crimson. (The dude says Onyx uses them too, but I was kinda sure that was PS/2 like Indy. No matter) The adaptor guarantees an endless supply of working Granite keyboards and mice from Indys and upwards. I'm not a representative of the guy at all, but I think its damned useful and I figure some of you might too: chris 'at' ckcomputersystems 'dot' com Enjoy folks; JP From tothwolf at concentric.net Sun Sep 28 17:41:57 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: TRS-80 printer cable length? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, 27 Sep 2003, Tony Duell wrote: > > That sounds about right, but I don't think I have an LP2, so I can't > > verify for sure what connector it used. Does someone out there have > > one that they can check? > > Somewhere I have a TRS-80 printer that prints on narrow (about 2" wide) > aluminised paper. IIRC, it has 3 connectors on the back -- a 40 pin card > edge, a 34 pin card edge, and a 5 pin DIN socket. THe last one is a > serial interface (but not for the CoCo -- this long predates that). The > 40 pin card edge is a Model 1 system bus (!) -- you can connect it to a > M1 without an EI. The 34 pin card edge is Centronics parallel. I don't > think this is a LP2, but I will have to dig it out to check. I thought > it was Quick Printer 2, but,.... I came across this bit of text after searching extensively: http://support.radioshack.com/support_accessories/doc4/4000.htm It lists a large number of the different printers and which cables are required by what. I noticed a few things missing and a few things that were inaccurate, but it looks like a good place to start to build up a list of cables. I did find my Model 1 and Model II printer cables. The Model II cables are 6ft long, and the Model 1 cables are around 3ft. long. The Model 1 cables look like they are either aftermarket or home-brew. > > Looking at the different cables, it would appear the most commonly > > needed cables would be the Model I+EI/III/4 (26-1401), Model II > > (26-4401), and Color Computer (26-3020). Does that seem about right? > > Is there much in the > > Yes. There were 3rd party cables for the CoCo which either had 4 pin DIN > to DB25 (to use with other serial printers) or 4 pin DIN to 36 pin BLue > Ribbon (and a lot of electronics to do the serial to parallel > conversion) that are useful. THe latter, though would be a lot of work > to make up. Probably easiest to just use a 4 pin DIN to DB25M and just use a generic serial to parallel converter box for parallel printers. > > way of demand for shielded cables for the Tandy 1000 line? Are there > > many LP2s out there that need cables? > > I suspect most people who seriously want to use an LP2 would be able to > make their own cable. Looks like there are more TRS80/Tandy printers that use the 34 position card edge connector than just the LP2. The url above lists a number of them. There may still not be enough of a demand to warrant making up some extra cables for those though. Does anyone know what the pinout for the Model 100's parallel cable (26-1409) is like? I don't have one to refer to. Heck, I haven't even seen a Model 100 in person since 1993 or so. -Toth From doc at mdrconsult.com Mon Sep 29 00:12:54 2003 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: PDP11/84 continued References: Message-ID: <3F77BF56.502@mdrconsult.com> Johnny Billquist wrote: > On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 Doc Shipley wrote: > > >> After several hours with the 11/84 last night, it appears that I'm in >>the same boat as Gunther with respect to the Unibus terminator. > > > What's the problem with you guys??? The Unibus is really simple to get > right. :-) > > One thing you should know about the 11/84 is that you don't use wire wraps > on the backplane for the NPG slots in the CPU box. > The M7677 (MDM) have NPG switches for all card slots instead. Go to that > card and check it out... > > Second. The 11/84 must have a minimum load on both the PMI and Unibus. The > minimum load module (MLM) is M7556. Since you have two memory cards, that > MLM is not in. But depending on the configuration of the Unibus, you might > want to have the MLM in there. However, I don't think you have a problem > here, since I suspect that if the machine powers up, that aspect is ok. Give the man a good cigar! I pulled the M7677 and sure enough, the NPG grant was dip-switched off for slot 11 and on everywhere else. Setting it properly for the UDA50 seems to have made all devices quite happy. Currently configuring vtserver to boot utilities, since I don't have an XXDP floppy. Doc From jwest at classiccmp.org Sun Sep 28 19:32:16 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: hard drive advice requested Message-ID: <000a01c38621$2501e5f0$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> I finally started refurb on a drive rack, a nice low-boy HP 29425 with wood top. It's my first HP drive project that uses the 13037 subsystem, with a 7906 drive. This is so I can finally start going through all the 7905/7906 drives I have and figure out what works and what doesn't. After going over the drive very carefully with a fine tooth comb, checking all the power supply voltages, test point voltages, etc... the moment of truth - hit the load switch, then turned it off just before the heads loaded. Did this a few times to make sure the blowers sucked any stray particles up and to the filter before letting the heads load. Finally I let them load and got a nice clean (fortunately quiet) "drive ready". Which leads me to my question... In testing unknown drives and cartridges... one never knows if the heads will come out the first time and shred against the platter. I've never been standing around when a head crashes, but I envision horrible grinding noise as metal shards shoot everywhere inside the drive. Is there anything I can do other than visual inspection, before spinning up an unknown drive and letting the heads load, to help alleviate the bad possibility of a crash on a drive that probably hasn't been used in 25+ years? Jay West From tradde at excite.com Sun Sep 28 19:37:57 2003 From: tradde at excite.com (Tim) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: PDP-11/84 continued Message-ID: <20030929003757.841F8B6DC@xmxpita.excite.com> >What's the problem with you guys??? The Unibus is really simple to get >right. :-) >One thing you should know about the 11/84 is that you don't use wire >wraps >on the backplane for the NPG slots in the CPU box. >The M7677 (MDM) have NPG switches for all card slots instead. Go to >that >card and check it out... --------------------------------- I am having a similar problem, but my system does not have an M7677. Mine is an 11/84E. The CPU is in slot 1, memory cards in slots 2 and 3, and the Unibus adaptor in slot 4. 5 and 6 are empty, 7 and 8 have the UDA50, and 9 has a printer card of some sort. For mine the NPG grant jumpers are actually on the bottom of the backplane. I have set them for where the boards are not. I had believed this system to be configured as working, but it is not. It has a second backplane but had no M9202. If I put the terminator in slot 9 of the primary backplane it hangs. I know the UDA50 needs the NPG out. I will have to examine to see if the printer card needs it or not. I would guess the Unibus adaptor would not? Tim Radde _______________________________________________ Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com The most personalized portal on the Web! From vp at mcs.drexel.edu Thu Sep 25 09:24:46 2003 From: vp at mcs.drexel.edu (Vassilis Prevelakis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: HP-85: Pictures of the PCB of the programmable ROM drawer Message-ID: <200309251424.h8PEOkjg014848@king.mcs.drexel.edu> After popular demand :-) I am posting the URLs for said PCB: Top View (with ICs): http://www.series80.org/Pictures/HP-Prog-ROM-Top.jpg Bottom view: http://www.series80.org/Pictures/HP-Prog-ROM-Bottom.jpg Installation Note for the programmable ROM drawer: http://www.series80.org/Manuals/HP82929A.pdf Notice the custom ICs between the TTL components and the bus. Since the HP-85 bus uses 12V clocks and +6V logic, and that the bus is bidirectional (thanks Tony), does anybody have suggestions on how we can construct a replacement of the custom ICs? Thanks **vp From al_macdonaldjw at milchstrasse.de Sat Sep 20 03:40:34 2003 From: al_macdonaldjw at milchstrasse.de (Abby L. Macdonald) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: hardware problems Message-ID: <8bba01c37f52$88134cf3$6fcd9053@xk023e1> From bkherbert at adelphia.net Thu Sep 25 20:03:13 2003 From: bkherbert at adelphia.net (Brian Herbert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: RCA Appnotes Message-ID: <009201c383c9$f67f7840$0200a8c0@cognitoijigjag> Dear Bob; I am puting together a history of low power systems and came across the RCA 1802 as maybe the earliest single chip CMOS processor (along with Intersil 6100). I am trying to figure out when the RCA ICAN-7029 appnote was written and wonder if it is in your Microsystems Manual or if you have other databooks.Thank you. Best Regards, Brian From vp at mcs.drexel.edu Fri Sep 26 14:10:05 2003 From: vp at mcs.drexel.edu (Vassilis Prevelakis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: 9915A without tape drive Message-ID: <200309261910.h8QJA5Lu014875@king.mcs.drexel.edu> For those that have been claiming that HP always sold 9915s with a the tape drive installed, here is a picture of a 9915A WITHOUT a tape drive. Notice that it has a blank faceplate, not covers over the tapedrive slot. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3049594024&category=11175 **vp From ko6jt at comser.com Fri Sep 26 17:34:44 2003 From: ko6jt at comser.com (B.L. Hutcherson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: Kaypro II boot disk Message-ID: <3F74BF04.6020209@comser.com> Hello I have a Kaypro II computer in need of a boot disk CP/M what is the price for this item thanks Bob -- ARS KO6JT Bob Hutcherson 7330 White House Dr. #8 Anderson, Calif. 96007-9422 Ph. 530-241-0771 pager. 530-224-3691 Only in Shasta County. Cel Phone. ------------ Email. ko6jt@comser.com Webpage. http://www.qsl.net/ko6jt From sieler at allegro.com Fri Sep 26 19:48:33 2003 From: sieler at allegro.com (Stan Sieler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: HP 9835 avail; and: HP 9835 tape conversion request Message-ID: <3F747BF1.10000.6103CA@localhost> Hi, I received the following two-part email this week... A free 9835... ... I moved up to an HP 9835. [It's in Canada] ... Now the good news, I still have the 9835 in my basement. I think it's still close to being functional, it turns on without clouds of blue smoke but the monitor appears to have given up so no way of seeing if it is really booting up. I'm not sure about the tape drive? If you could locate a monitor, maybe you could get a functioning 9835. It's free to a good home And, the project: I have been looking everywhere for anyone who might have a functioning 9835/45 because I still have about 10 tapes with thousands of pages of HP BASIC that I would love to off load to some form of modern media in ASCII and translate into modern BASIC. If you could help me with this problem I would even pay the shipping of the 9835 to you, if you are interested? Anyone interested, reply (offline) to me, and I'll pass the contact info on to you. thanks, Stan -- Stan Sieler sieler@allegro.com www.allegro.com/sieler/wanted/index.html From wrking at dadaboom.com Sat Sep 27 12:25:20 2003 From: wrking at dadaboom.com (William King) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: Available: DEC LA120 printer Message-ID: I have a fair condition DEC LA-120 printer available for free. It needs a bit of cleanup, but it does work just fine. Available for pickup in the S.F. Bay area. Otherwise you need to pay for the shipping. First come, first serve. Let me know. Thanks, Bill From montym at swbell.net Sat Sep 27 22:28:29 2003 From: montym at swbell.net (Monty McGraw) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: Tektronix 4054 Message-ID: <001901c38570$966f6520$6501a8c0@Evo6000> Wolfgang, try contacting Richard Heming also in Germany , who has a Tek museum with a 4054 on the web at http://www.tekscope-museum.de monty Tektronix 4054 cctalk@classiccmp.org cctalk@classiccmp.org Tue Sep 2 19:45:15 2003 a.. Previous message: PDP-11/73 or 11/83's in the US for sale? b.. Next message: Looking for HP 10342B Bus Preprocessor software c.. Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hi Monty, I'm from Germany and I also have a 4054. My problem is, that I can get no doks for the system - can you help? Wolfgang -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- a.. Previous message: PDP-11/73 or 11/83's in the US for sale? b.. Next message: Looking for HP 10342B Bus Preprocessor software c.. Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] From m351super at netscape.net Sun Sep 28 07:21:24 2003 From: m351super at netscape.net (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: HP 9835 avail; and: HP 9835 tape conversion request Message-ID: <3F76D244.2080804@netscape.net> Hello i am interested in the HP 9835 for my collection.I live in PA 19007. Thanks Chris From patrick at evocative.com Sun Sep 28 20:16:41 2003 From: patrick at evocative.com (Patrick Rigney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: Free DEC LA-36 (Boston Area) Message-ID: Recently posted on the Vintage Computer Marketplace, check it out... http://marketplace.vintage.org/view.cfm?ad=192 --Patrick From jpl15 at panix.com Sun Sep 28 21:29:09 2003 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: hardware problems In-Reply-To: <8bba01c37f52$88134cf3$6fcd9053@xk023e1> References: <8bba01c37f52$88134cf3$6fcd9053@xk023e1> Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Sep 2003, Abby L. Macdonald wrote: > > > Ah, yes. It appears that your Keyboard is sending all NULs. Cheers John From jcwren at jcwren.com Sun Sep 28 21:43:49 2003 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: RCA Appnotes In-Reply-To: <009201c383c9$f67f7840$0200a8c0@cognitoijigjag> References: <009201c383c9$f67f7840$0200a8c0@cognitoijigjag> Message-ID: <200309282243.49174.jcwren@jcwren.com> Have you seen the www.cosmacelf.com site? While I don't know if it specifically has what you're looking for, there's a lot of history and info available. The 1802 is considered to be the first CMOS microprocessor, from everything I've ever read. --John On Thursday 25 September 2003 21:03 pm, Brian Herbert wrote: > Dear Bob; > > I am puting together a history of low power systems and came > across the RCA 1802 as maybe the earliest single chip CMOS > processor (along with Intersil 6100). I am trying to figure out when > the RCA ICAN-7029 appnote was written and wonder if it is in > your Microsystems Manual or if you have other databooks.Thank > you. > > Best Regards, > > > Brian From cb at mythtech.net Sun Sep 28 22:26:09 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes Message-ID: I came across a decent stash of 9 track reel tapes during my clean out. (4 cases, so maybe 50 or so of them) A while ago, I sold or gave away (don't remember) a whole bunch of the write protect rings for them. So I'm wondering, do those rings stop you from writing, or enable you to write when installed? I want to try selling the 9 track tapes on ebay, but I want to make sure I specify the correct status of the rings (that don't exist). Also, are these safe to bulk erase with an electromagnet? So far none of them have any data on them that I am worried about erasing, so I'm not planning to bother... but I want to know if it is safe or not in case I find one I need to. And finally, are all 9 track tapes the same? These were used on our General Automation Zebra machine. So will they work on any machine that needs 9 track, or only on other Zebras? -chris From nico at farumdata.dk Mon Sep 29 00:50:11 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: CCCP Message-ID: <001901c3864d$90d83c80$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> I have now retyped everyting from this document (24 pages in Courier 10 pkt) and scanned the tables etc, in total 7 MB after ZIP. The material is now on its way to Fred, so he can convert it to PDF format. It could be interesting to hear the comments of someone involved in the original ES project, so we can see how close the CIA was with regard to the project. Nico -- It has been noticed, that hackers and other lowlifes use my e-mail address as a hiding place. I regret the inconvenience these pirates give you From donm at cts.com Mon Sep 29 01:06:55 2003 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: Kaypro II boot disk In-Reply-To: <3F74BF04.6020209@comser.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 26 Sep 2003, B.L. Hutcherson wrote: > Hello I have a Kaypro II computer > in need of a boot disk CP/M > what is the price for this item > thanks Bob Bob, pull the cover on your Kaypro and get the numbers on the paper label on the EPROM nearest the center of the motherboard. Necessary to know in order to get you the proper revision of CP/M for your II. Pass the information to me off-list and we'll see what can be done for you. - don > -- > ARS KO6JT > Bob Hutcherson > 7330 White House Dr. #8 > Anderson, Calif. 96007-9422 > > Ph. 530-241-0771 > pager. 530-224-3691 Only in Shasta County. > Cel Phone. ------------ > Email. ko6jt@comser.com > Webpage. http://www.qsl.net/ko6jt > > > > From trash_tmp at poczta.onet.pl Mon Sep 29 04:51:46 2003 From: trash_tmp at poczta.onet.pl (trashcan man) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: sanyo lat-200a. In-Reply-To: References: <20030928200802.GA387@trashcan.ds7> Message-ID: <20030929095146.GA1945@trashcan.ds7> On Sun, Sep 28, 2003 at 05:24:36PM -0500, Tothwolf wrote: > > not sure if it's on-topic here, but anyway... > > > > i have an ISA board marked 'Sanyo LAT-200A'. it contains amd286 cpu, > > couple of headland chips, four SIMM sockets, and two (even/odd) empty > > bios sockets. does anybody know what it is, where to find bios images > > and how to use it? > > Sounds like a single board computer for a passive backplane. Finding a > BIOS probably isn't gonna be easy. You may be able to get it from the > company that made the board, or you might be able to copy the BIOS from a > 286 motherboard that uses the exact same chipset. > > Are there any markings on the board? What chipset does it use? hm. markings? besides 'Sanyo LAT-200A' there is '2EC4BIPB32100 revision 2' ('I' or '1', don't know). chipset is made by Headland Technology, three IC's are marked as: HT101A/B14A4924, GC113-PC and HT102/B1A4000. there are also two sanyo chips: PH80C42A and MB622160/16LT-DUAL. what 'passive backplane' should do? provide power from PSU? what will happen if i stick this into a normal pc? From mikeford at socal.rr.com Mon Sep 29 03:29:48 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: Socal Swapmeets Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030929010350.00a213b0@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Here in Socal we have 5 going on 6 monthly or semimonthly old computer often containing swapmeets. The first two saturdays of the month are Santee and Fontana, which are either small or too far for me most of the time, but I did manage Pomona last weekend, and TRW and ACP this weekend, and plan to try for the new Chino Hills next weekend. The bad news is that space prices seem to have risen enough to drive away most of the small non regular sellers, and that most of the stuff is recent junk (Belkin is local and TONS of returns get dumped to swapmeet sellers). So what did I see, good stuff first, ACP had a pair of fresh from the shed Imsai something 40 boxes with like 9 in CRTS on the front, and dual 8" floppy box and a Selectric. I didn't buy or even offer on any of that, sticking to a mini R/C tank and some hifi cables. Pretty boring when the results of 3 swapmeets are just some cheap parts. From mikeford at socal.rr.com Mon Sep 29 02:59:40 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: CMC 7910KQ MicroTerminal In-Reply-To: <200309251424.h8PEOkjg014848@king.mcs.drexel.edu> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030929002231.00a24a80@pop-server.socal.rr.com> A couple people expressed interest in these so I did pick up a couple today, and after a fair amount of hunting also found the company on the net. Unfortunately not only nothing I could find on the site for this product, but the same product number points to a newer fancier version. These are about half the size of the current model, and no telling what subset of functions. CMC 7910KQ MicroTerminal They come in a two pocket padded zipper case maybe 8x5x2, bottom pouch has the unit, top has two sides one for a test cable (plain old phone cable with RJ11 on each end if anything in most, but one had a full linemans headset rig with the funky alligator clips), and the other has a holder for 3x AA batterys and a small adapter with a RJ11 connection that goes through hole in the padded case into the side of the 7910 (line cord goes in the bottom). The face of the unit has a 4 line 20 char lcd, Qwerty membrane on the bottom half and telco numeric on the top right. Pushing the on button gives a loud beep, and the display comes up with CMC 7910KQ something something V3.3, runs a self test, and plugged into nothing (I am a chicken so far) reports lines free as 1710, press menu or return. Menu brings up lot of choices, but it does sound like this device includes some type if modem of not fancier and funkier functions. Took me about half an hour digging in boxes to find decent looking units, cases, that didn't have broken or missing battery holders, and that the unit would power on. My guess is "maybe" one or two more could be matched up, but not quite what I would call clean looking. From geoffreythomas at onetel.net.uk Mon Sep 29 02:55:30 2003 From: geoffreythomas at onetel.net.uk (Geoffrey Thomas) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:09 2005 Subject: hardware problems References: <8bba01c37f52$88134cf3$6fcd9053@xk023e1> Message-ID: <001a01c3865f$16709d40$655f4ed5@geoff> Is this encrypted ? I can't read it . : >) Geoff. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Abby L. Macdonald" To: Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2003 9:40 AM Subject: Re: hardware problems From musicman38 at comcast.net Mon Sep 29 08:00:13 2003 From: musicman38 at comcast.net (musicman38) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Lantastic Network Software Version 7 References: Message-ID: <001b01c38689$9fca9080$0200a8c0@alico01.fl.comcast.net> > > One of my clients just gave me their copy of Lantastic Ver 7 (10 user). > > Does anyone know if Lantastic Version 7 Network Software is compatible with > > Windows 98 ? > > Technically yes, realistically no. I had a lot of problems with it when > I was using it. If you have DOS boxes that you want to network with Win9x > then it's good for that, but on Win95 it was very buggy. Maybe it's more > stable on Win98. It should certainly work with it. There was a Version 8 that Lantastic released before going under, from what I read it was compatible with Windows 95,98,and 2000.. Any experiance with that version ? From asholz at topinform.com Mon Sep 29 08:02:01 2003 From: asholz at topinform.com (Andreas Holz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Are there any hints for re-powering up an Varian Data Machines fixed-head disk In-Reply-To: <200309271747.h8RHl2wr040430@huey.classiccmp.org> References: <200309271747.h8RHl2wr040430@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <3F782D49.2040707@topinform.com> Hello, in a previous mail to the list (some month's ago) I posted to the list, that I got a Varian Data Machines 620L/100 and a corresponding fixed-head disk. After checking the CPU (and fixing some cables) and a first succesful powerup of the cpu I would like to dare to attach the fixed-head disk. This disk has been running the last time some 15-20 years ago and I would like to know, if there are some advices available how to take some precautions before powering up the disk. Andreas From musicman38 at comcast.net Mon Sep 29 08:21:32 2003 From: musicman38 at comcast.net (musicman38) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Sellar won't Take $100 for mag References: <00b401c38543$cb651bd0$6108dd40@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <004b01c3868c$99d7b560$0200a8c0@alico01.fl.comcast.net> > Here's a Popular Electronics that went to $100 > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2753642221 WOW !! Thats amazing !! I just looked and I have that same magazine myself and many more in that age range, even the first Kilobaud magazines. They are amazing reads. One has an article on the original Apple Computer board kit, and the original ad to purchase it. Wonder how much that one is worth ? Musicman, From Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com Mon Sep 29 08:41:32 2003 From: Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com (Feldman, Robert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: RCA Appnotes Message-ID: As an aside, a version of the 1802 was the main processor on the Galileo space probe, which recently ended its mission by being crashed into Jupiter. (There's a nice, general article about Galileo in the September 8 issue of "The New Yorker" magazine, starting on p. 38.) -----Original Message----- From: Brian Herbert [mailto:bkherbert@adelphia.net] Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 8:03 PM To: cctech@classiccmp.org Subject: RCA Appnotes Dear Bob; I am puting together a history of low power systems and came across the RCA 1802 as maybe the earliest single chip CMOS processor (along with Intersil 6100). I am trying to figure out when the RCA ICAN-7029 appnote was written and wonder if it is in your Microsystems Manual or if you have other databooks.Thank you. Best Regards, Brian From nico at farumdata.dk Mon Sep 29 10:05:20 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing Message-ID: <001601c3869c$3e3cd4a0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> The document has now been completed. Fred has converted the Word document to PDF format. Because of the scanned figures, the filesize is rather big : about 10 MB You can find the overview of Soviet computing at http://www.microwalt.nl/fred/soviet.zip The zip file contains a PDF version as well as a .DOC version Again, it would be informative if some of the guys involved in parts of this project, could comment on the accuracy. Nico From nico at farumdata.dk Mon Sep 29 10:24:01 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes References: Message-ID: <000401c3869d$b705bd60$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> >. So I'm wondering, do those rings stop you > from writing, or enable you to write when installed? I want to try > selling the 9 track tapes on ebay, but I want to make sure I specify the > correct status of the rings (that don't exist). > > Also, are these safe to bulk erase with an electromagnet? > > And finally, are all 9 track tapes the same? The hymn of the day is "no ring, no write". Yes, you can erase them with a powerful magnet. I dont remember the exact strength the magnet must have. In my 30-odd years of IT, I've only come across tapes with a mounting hole of some 9 cm (3.5 inch or so, so physically there is no problem. However, magtapes come in various densities, and it is very common that tapes certified for 800 bpi cannot be written succesfully on 6250 bpi drives. If I were you,I would specificy the reel diameter and the certified density. The tape I'm looking at at this instant, says on the label "3M Scotch 777 6250 bpi", so in this case I would say "7 inch reel, 6250 bpi" Many installations using tapes, have the policy that they have only as many rings as they have tape drives. This is a very secure way to ensure that tapes are not accidentally overwritten, as you have mount a ring before you can write, and even todays operators can think. A bit. :-) Nico From lcourtney at mvista.com Mon Sep 29 10:33:48 2003 From: lcourtney at mvista.com (Lee Courtney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <004f01c3869f$148d1c20$800101df@lcourtney22k> > So I'm wondering, do those rings stop you from writing, or enable you to write when installed? Write rings enable writing. There are such things as 'write-protect rings' which when fitted on a reel prvent a write ring from being inserted, but I haven;t been able to locate any since my mainframe days in the 1970s. > And finally, are all 9 track tapes the same? >From a function perspective yes, from a quality perspective no. Lee Courtney > -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-bounces@classiccmp.org > [mailto:cctalk-bounces@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of chris > Sent: Sunday, September 28, 2003 8:26 PM > To: Classic Computers > Subject: 9 track reel tapes > > > I came across a decent stash of 9 track reel tapes during my > clean out. > (4 cases, so maybe 50 or so of them) > > A while ago, I sold or gave away (don't remember) a whole > bunch of the > write protect rings for them. So I'm wondering, do those > rings stop you > from writing, or enable you to write when installed? I want to try > selling the 9 track tapes on ebay, but I want to make sure I > specify the > correct status of the rings (that don't exist). > > Also, are these safe to bulk erase with an electromagnet? So > far none of > them have any data on them that I am worried about erasing, > so I'm not > planning to bother... but I want to know if it is safe or not > in case I > find one I need to. > > And finally, are all 9 track tapes the same? These were used on our > General Automation Zebra machine. So will they work on any > machine that > needs 9 track, or only on other Zebras? > > -chris > > > From nico at farumdata.dk Mon Sep 29 10:46:01 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: sanyo lat-200a. References: <20030928200802.GA387@trashcan.ds7> <20030929095146.GA1945@trashcan.ds7> Message-ID: <001401c386a0$cc4e9fe0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> > what 'passive backplane' should do? provide power from PSU? > what will happen if i stick this into a normal pc? > A passive backplan can be considered a bus, i.e. the bus interconnecting all controllers. I have e.g. the parts for an ACER500D, which had 1 card with CPU/memory/floppy disk/comport and printerport, one card for the video, etc. If you stick it into a normal pc, you will have a disaster. Nico From andyh at andyh-rayleigh.freeserve.co.uk Mon Sep 29 11:09:44 2003 From: andyh at andyh-rayleigh.freeserve.co.uk (Andy Holt) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000a01c386a4$18c30b60$4d4d2c0a@atx> They are actually Write Permit Rings - ie need to be in place to write to a tape. Bulk erasing no problem - there may be a few unusual cases where they could be used with some form of random access with block headers, but such systems will have their own specialised formatting software. Although a few drives may be "picky" about taking certain sizes of 9t 1/2" tape I would expect almost all to take 600', 1200', and 2400' with no problems (though autoloaders might not like anything not on the 2400' reels) - the 3600' (thinner tape on 2400' reels - not very common) might cause problems with some early drives. Andy > -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-bounces@classiccmp.org > [mailto:cctalk-bounces@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of chris > Sent: 29 September 2003 04:26 > To: Classic Computers > Subject: 9 track reel tapes > > > I came across a decent stash of 9 track reel tapes during my clean out. > (4 cases, so maybe 50 or so of them) > > A while ago, I sold or gave away (don't remember) a whole bunch of the > write protect rings for them. So I'm wondering, do those rings stop you > from writing, or enable you to write when installed? I want to try > selling the 9 track tapes on ebay, but I want to make sure I specify the > correct status of the rings (that don't exist). > > Also, are these safe to bulk erase with an electromagnet? So far none of > them have any data on them that I am worried about erasing, so I'm not > planning to bother... but I want to know if it is safe or not in case I > find one I need to. > > And finally, are all 9 track tapes the same? These were used on our > General Automation Zebra machine. So will they work on any machine that > needs 9 track, or only on other Zebras? > > -chris > > > From cb at mythtech.net Mon Sep 29 11:40:42 2003 From: cb at mythtech.net (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes Message-ID: >If I were you,I would specificy the reel diameter and the certified >density. The tape I'm looking at at this instant, says on the label "3M >Scotch 777 6250 bpi", so in this case I would say "7 inch reel, 6250 bpi" I just pulled one out, and I rather assume all are the same. This one says Endura 800 BPI to 6250 CPI BASF It has an inner diameter of about 3.5" and an outer of about 7" A quick look on ebay last night turned up some disappointing results. It seems a bunch of 9 track reel tapes failed to sell in the last 30 days. Maybe I'll try them on the Vintage list instead. -chris From esharpe at uswest.net Mon Sep 29 12:44:08 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: museum needs a documation reader that interfaces to a pc References: Message-ID: <007801c386b1$496e3ac0$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> THE PUNCH DEAL SEEMED PRETTY GOOD BUT WHEN YOU PUT FREIGHT ON TOP OF IT TO ARIZONA..... WE DO NEED SOME PUNCHED CARDS THOUGH... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vintage Computer Festival" To: "Classic Computers Mailing List" Sent: Saturday, September 27, 2003 3:40 PM Subject: Re: museum needs a documation reader that interfaces to a pc > On Sat, 27 Sep 2003, Ed Sharpe wrote: > > > Thanks Sellam! Brian has contacted me... > > > > did you end up with the cardpunch ibm 129? > > Nope. Someone snatched it from under my nose >:( > > -- > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage mputers ] > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] > > > From esharpe at uswest.net Mon Sep 29 12:44:08 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: museum needs a documation reader that interfaces to a pc References: Message-ID: <007801c386b1$496e3ac0$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> THE PUNCH DEAL SEEMED PRETTY GOOD BUT WHEN YOU PUT FREIGHT ON TOP OF IT TO ARIZONA..... WE DO NEED SOME PUNCHED CARDS THOUGH... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vintage Computer Festival" To: "Classic Computers Mailing List" Sent: Saturday, September 27, 2003 3:40 PM Subject: Re: museum needs a documation reader that interfaces to a pc > On Sat, 27 Sep 2003, Ed Sharpe wrote: > > > Thanks Sellam! Brian has contacted me... > > > > did you end up with the cardpunch ibm 129? > > Nope. Someone snatched it from under my nose >:( > > -- > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage mputers ] > [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] > > > From esharpe at uswest.net Mon Sep 29 12:50:02 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing References: <001601c3869c$3e3cd4a0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: <008401c386b2$1c09a280$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> Great stuff! need to read this through this evening. on a slightly related fictional cccp topic, colossus and guardian the forbin project. any one know where I can et a movie tape or dvd on this? is it even still available? ed sharpe ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nico de Jong" To: Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 8:05 AM Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing > The document has now been completed. > > Fred has converted the Word document to PDF format. > Because of the scanned figures, the filesize is rather big : about 10 MB > You can find the overview of Soviet computing at http://www.microwalt.nl/fred/soviet.zip > > The zip file contains a PDF version as well as a .DOC version > > Again, it would be informative if some of the guys involved in parts of this project, could comment on the accuracy. > > Nico > > > From curt at atarimuseum.com Mon Sep 29 11:59:48 2003 From: curt at atarimuseum.com (Curt vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: PDP11/84 continued References: Message-ID: <00bb01c386ab$21b893a0$1a02a8c0@starship1> Anyone have a spare M8191 Unibus Adapter for an 11/84 for sale? Curt ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Duell" To: Sent: Sunday, September 28, 2003 1:01 PM Subject: Re: PDP11/84 continued > > Well, with only the RX211 installed in its original slot, the M9302 > > terminator properly installed, and G7273's everywhere else, the CPU > > still hangs. With G727A cards instead of G7273's, the RX02 will boot an > > RT-11 installation floppy. > > You are telling me it will work with the single-height grant cards in > slot D, but not with the dual-height ones in C and D? > > This is impossible -- the only difference between the 2 types of grant > card is that the dual-height ones also complete the NPG jumper. If it > works with the single-height ones, then the NPG chain must be complete > along the backplane. Adding a second 'jumper' (on the dual height card) > in parallel with the wire-wrapped on on the backplane can't make any > difference. > > It sounds like you have backplane problems. Maybe some of the dual-height > cards aren't making proper contact. Maybe the slots you're putting them > in aren't satnadard Unibus slots (unlikely, but...) and the 'extra' > jumper is shorting a couple of signals that it shouldn't... > > -tony > From rhudson at cnonline.net Mon Sep 29 12:11:47 2003 From: rhudson at cnonline.net (Ron Hudson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <01E0FAA8-F2A0-11D7-8664-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> On Sunday, September 28, 2003, at 10:26 PM, chris wrote: > I came across a decent stash of 9 track reel tapes during my clean out. > (4 cases, so maybe 50 or so of them) > > A while ago, I sold or gave away (don't remember) a whole bunch of the > write protect rings for them. So I'm wondering, do those rings stop you > from writing, or enable you to write when installed? I want to try > selling the 9 track tapes on ebay, but I want to make sure I specify > the > correct status of the rings (that don't exist). No ring, no Write. IIRC. :^) From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Mon Sep 29 12:13:26 2003 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (ben franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: RCA Appnotes References: Message-ID: <3F786836.90409@jetnet.ab.ca> Feldman, Robert wrote: > As an aside, a version of the 1802 was the main processor on the Galileo space probe, which recently ended its mission by being crashed into Jupiter. (There's a nice, general article about Galileo in the September 8 issue of "The New Yorker" magazine, starting on p. 38.) I thought that was a crash proof CPU :D From esharpe at uswest.net Mon Sep 29 13:21:46 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: *****hayes modem history..... References: <00a901c38390$0e891520$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> <017c01c383b2$2e72d200$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net><3F73BB97.7050601@ao.com><005c01c383ec$af35b940$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> <34044.64.169.63.74.1064559211.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <00c001c386b6$8ade4c20$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> yep that is the way... but not with the AT commands... amazing that you were able to remotely control it though through program. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eric Smith" To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 11:53 PM Subject: Re: *****hayes modem history..... > "ed sharpe" wrote: > > well in looking into the s100 board it seems to indicate that many many > > options could be set under program control, however I am still not sure > > it is the at command set... > > As I wrote before, it is not. Definitely. No question about it. > It doesn't have ANY command set in the sense of sending it a string > of characters that it would parse as a command. It's a dumb device. > (And there's nothing wrong with that!) > > > maybe it was some binary sent to it..... > > If by "sent to it" you mean "the user program fiddles with bits in > registers using 8080/Z-80 style input and output instructions", yes, > that is how it is controlled. Want it to pick up the phone line? > Set a particular port bit. Clear the bit to hang up (or maybe it was > the other way around). Pulse dial by toggling that bit with the > appopriate timing. Enable the modulator (transmit) with a different > bit, and write to the UART to send bytes. Read a bit of a port for > receive carrier detect. Etc. > > > I just > > wish I checked remember how the micromodem on the apple worked I suspect > > the same as the s100 board... > > Basically the same though the registers are memory mapped since the > 6502 doesn't have I/O instructions. > > However, the Apple version has firmware that makes it easier to use. > It's still not the AT command set, but from BASIC you type "IN#2" (if > it was in slot two), then use Control-A as an attention character to > send it commands from the keyboard. I suppose you probably printed a > control-A followed by a command in order to control it from BASIC, just > like printing a control-D followed by a DOS command, but my memory is > fuzzy on that as I mostly programmed it in assembly. > > > From brian at projectsst.com Sun Sep 28 21:19:57 2003 From: brian at projectsst.com (Brian Scura) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Casio CFX-400 LCD Message-ID: <35C970DB43AFD511895B00E01890866D0120A4@sstserver01.projectsst.com> Robbie, >From your e-mail reply to Stan (included below), you apparently have some knowledge of Casio CFX-400 watches. The display on my CFX-400 got wet and isn't displaying all the numbers correctly. I would appreciate it if you could e-mail me the contact info you have for Casio so I can get a new LCD for my watch. If you know anyone that has a CFX-400, I'd be willing to pay up to US$500 for a CFX-400 in good condition and up to US$200 for one that's not in working condition. Brian Scura... Scura Speed & Technology Inc. 23011 Alcalde Dr., Unit A Laguna Hills, CA 92653 Tel: (949) 462-9995 ext. 11 Fax: (949) 462-3957 E-mail: brian@projectsst.com Stan, I've done some calling around and emailing. Casio has four distributors that they send replacement parts to. None of them have the case in stock. The last time a case was sold from Casio was on April 30, 1996. It was to an individual, not a distributor. The CFX-400 case with key pad has two part numbers. The first is 73081910. It was later changed to 73081928, but it is the same part and description. There are two parts still in production and available from Casio that you may want to consider buying. They are the rubber backing seal and the LCD (not the module, just the screen). Good Luck. From r.mueller at fz-juelich.de Mon Sep 29 10:53:37 2003 From: r.mueller at fz-juelich.de (R. Mueller) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Quick Basic Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.0.20030929174047.02923d60@iffpcsrv.iff.kfa-juelich.de> When I wanted a copy of QuickBasic, not yesterday, but not so long ago, I was able to download it from the Internet. As far as I know Microsoft has released it for all to use. It is, however, not supported in any way. You can find the interpreted version on some versions of MSDOS; I believe DOS 5 contains it. What I got from the Internet was QB4.5 and a professional version 7.X. If it has ceased to be available I can send a copy if it has really been opened to public distribution. I must just find a set of diskettes. I know I have 4.5 but I am not so sure I can locate QB 7. If I get too many requests, I will ask those getting it from me to fulfill the condition of passing it on to others asking!!! Shareware=share the responsibility! Bob PS Warning; stay away from those versions of Visual Basic offered as free on CDs. I loaded one of these, it gave me NO WARNING as it told me I needed some components it would have to download from the Internet and then it dumped a bunch of junk on my hard disk, including substituting a new and unwanted "Desktop" and changed my Internet browser to something else, even less wanted than the new Desktop. Windows was never normal after that. From cmellink at xs4all.nl Mon Sep 29 11:01:03 2003 From: cmellink at xs4all.nl (Kees Mellink) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Persci 299 Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20030929180103.007cc350@pop.xs4all.nl> Hallo Peter, Yes, I have the wanted service manual of the Persci 299 drive somewhere in a carton box. Let me know if you still needed! I used to repair these drives, and have some spareparts left like heads, bulbs for the sector indicator (plastic black box) and some very hard to find driverchips for the voice-coil wich I found in Bangkok. Best regards, Kees Th Netherlands From r.mueller at fz-juelich.de Mon Sep 29 10:59:30 2003 From: r.mueller at fz-juelich.de (R. Mueller) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Quick Basic ( a bit of detail) Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.0.20030929175544.02912c40@iffpcsrv.iff.kfa-juelich.de> If you should ask me to send a copy of Quick Basic, please be sure you can receive it. I once sent it to a fellow behind a firewall and the firewall bounced it. The set contains executable files and they could be dangerous (Indeed, you have to trust ME not to insert a virus, but then again, I don't know how! Don't even want to know how.) Bob From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 29 12:35:46 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Les Objets book free for shipping Message-ID: I ended up with a book in French that is of no use to me. The title is Les Objets and it's a book on object-oriented design. It seems to be the second edition and is copyright 1997. The ISBN is 2-212-08957-0. It's in near new condition. If any French-speaking (or otherwise) person wants it then it's your for the cost of shipping. Otherwise I guess I'll just leave it in my archive and wait for some French-speaking dude to come by my office who I can dump it on. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From waltje at pdp11.nl Mon Sep 29 12:45:18 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Teletype 33 engineering drawings? Message-ID: Hiya, While going through (some more) Old Stuff, I found the drawings for the ASR33. They look quite delicate, so probably should be scanned asap. Is anyone else in for a copy of these? Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From kth at srv.net Mon Sep 29 13:36:53 2003 From: kth at srv.net (Kevin Handy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F787BC5.6090506@srv.net> chris wrote: >I came across a decent stash of 9 track reel tapes during my clean out. >(4 cases, so maybe 50 or so of them) > >A while ago, I sold or gave away (don't remember) a whole bunch of the >write protect rings for them. So I'm wondering, do those rings stop you >from writing, or enable you to write when installed? I want to try >selling the 9 track tapes on ebay, but I want to make sure I specify the >correct status of the rings (that don't exist). > > No ring-ee, no writ-ee >Also, are these safe to bulk erase with an electromagnet? So far none of >them have any data on them that I am worried about erasing, so I'm not >planning to bother... but I want to know if it is safe or not in case I >find one I need to. > > Yes. They are not pre-formatted. RadioShack at least used to sell a bulk eraser for video/cassette tapes (44-233A) that can do about 4 or 5 tapes before it overheats (wait 1 hour, and then repeat). Don't do a quick 'zap' and expect it to be blank. Take your time and run it over both sides. >And finally, are all 9 track tapes the same? These were used on our >General Automation Zebra machine. So will they work on any machine that >needs 9 track, or only on other Zebras? > > Some tapes were rated for higher density than others. Common densities were 800, 1600, and 6250 bpi. Others existed like 100, 200, and 3200. Most tapes were rated at 6250, but are usable on all the 800+. I don't know about the <800. Also, you could get tapes with just a few feet (<100) of tape, up to the common 2400' reels. Some auto-loaders don't like the shorter tapes. The seals on the tape varied too. You could get cannisters, rings that you removed before mounting the tapes, and rings designed for IBM automatic tape loaders. Some of the tapes age better than others. I had some that would lose large amounts of oxide onto the tape heads after just a few years. Also, some of the tape manufacturers would forget to put a EOF marker on a large percentage of their tapes. It depends on what additional "extras" your tape drive required, but for the most part all of the 9 track tapes were the same. From jwest at classiccmp.org Mon Sep 29 12:53:15 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Equipment Available Message-ID: <012a01c386b2$8eb17100$033310ac@kwcorp.com> The following equipment is in New York (Buffalo area). Free for the effort to go pick it up. Anyone interested? If so, I'd like just the RX02 and controller out of the deal. > The following 2 DEC systems are available: > > System 1 > PDP11/44 Processor (RSX11M+) > Cipher M890340 Mag Tape Drive > RX02 Floppy Drive > RA82 Hard Drive > 2- RL01 > Monitors: VT240, VT125, ADM5 > Decwriter III > Documentation > Spare Boards > System Tapes > > > System 2 > MINC-23/ RT11 > Documentation > System Software --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] From gehrich at tampabay.rr.com Mon Sep 29 13:10:39 2003 From: gehrich at tampabay.rr.com (Gene Ehrich) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes In-Reply-To: <000a01c386a4$18c30b60$4d4d2c0a@atx> References: Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20030929135608.02439278@pop-server> At 05:09 PM 9/29/2003 +0100, you wrote: >They are actually Write Permit Rings - ie need to be in place to write to a >tape. That reminds me of a true story from my days as an IBM Systems Engineer. I had a small account that ran CICS on a 9370 or 4370 (don't remember which) IBM Computer. I was always bugging him to start doing a back up and also storing it off site. He called me one day to say the system had crashed and needed to be restored and was going home to get the weekly backup. I said great you are backing up and storing it offsite. He said there was one problem, the ICCF Library backup was bad on that backup but they backed that up every day and the tape was already in the shop. ICCF was the source code library. He asked me to come over and help if needed. When I got there they had already restored the system tape and were ready to restore the ICCF libraries from the daily backup. I went in to see the systems programer to help him with a CICS problem and the DP manager came running in to say that the operator had goofed and had told the system backup instead of restore. I told him no problem as long as you didn't have the ring in the tape you were safe. He said we always keep the ring in the tapes otherwise we cannot find them when we need them but the backup only ran for a few seconds when we aborted it. I told him that the tape may not now be recoverable due to record length and placement and we can then use the previous days backup and only lose a few files. He said thats a problem since we always backup on the same tape. I said if we cannot recover this tape what do we lose. He said all of the source code that has been created at the company for the past eleven years. My immediate thought was I wonder if his resume is up to date. I won't go into the details but was able to finally recover the tape for him and for years he was my biggest fan. ================================= Gene Ehrich gehrich@tampabay.rr.com From nico at farumdata.dk Mon Sep 29 13:58:11 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Fw: CCDP / Soviet computing Message-ID: <003901c386bb$a9d63520$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> From: "Nico de Jong" To: Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 5:05 PM Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing > The document has now been completed. > > Fred has converted the Word document to PDF format. > Because of the scanned figures, the filesize is rather big : about 10 MB > You can find the overview of Soviet computing at http://www.microwalt.nl/fred/soviet.zip > > The zip file contains a PDF version as well as a .DOC version > > Again, it would be informative if some of the guys involved in parts of this project, could comment on the accuracy. > > Nico A slip of my mind, I'm sorry to say. I forgot to ask Fred if he could host the document. It is there for the time being, but as it probably is going to be around for a long time, we need someone who can have this document on-line. The document is at present on my FTP server, but I would prefer a more "regular" archival function Nico > > From eric at brouhaha.com Mon Sep 29 14:02:44 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: RCA Appnotes In-Reply-To: <200309282243.49174.jcwren@jcwren.com> References: <009201c383c9$f67f7840$0200a8c0@cognitoijigjag> <200309282243.49174.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: <1466.4.20.168.111.1064862164.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "J.C. Wren" wrote: > The 1802 is considered to be the first CMOS microprocessor, from > everything > I've ever read. The CDP1802 was probably the first single-chip microprocessor, but if you're willing to consider multiple-chip processors, the distinction would probably go to the CDP1801. It consisted of two chips, a data path chip containing the registers and ALU, and a control chip. The instruction set is a subset of that of the 1802. From cisin at xenosoft.com Mon Sep 29 14:40:39 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Casio CFX-400 LCD In-Reply-To: <35C970DB43AFD511895B00E01890866D0120A4@sstserver01.projectsst.com> References: <35C970DB43AFD511895B00E01890866D0120A4@sstserver01.projectsst.com> Message-ID: <20030929123543.T38314@newshell.lmi.net> The CFX-400 and CFX-40 are interchangeable (black v chrome, different bands). (The CFX-20 and CFX-200 are a completely different unit) Scott Mueller has some in your price range! -- Fred Cisin cisin@xenosoft.com On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, Brian Scura wrote: > >From your e-mail reply to Stan (included below), you apparently have some > knowledge of Casio CFX-400 watches. The display on my CFX-400 got wet and > isn't displaying all the numbers correctly. I would appreciate it if you > could e-mail me the contact info you have for Casio so I can get a new LCD > for my watch. > If you know anyone that has a CFX-400, I'd be willing to pay up to US$500 > for a CFX-400 in good condition and up to US$200 for one that's not in > working condition. > Brian Scura... > Scura Speed & Technology Inc. > 23011 Alcalde Dr., Unit A > Laguna Hills, CA 92653 > Tel: (949) 462-9995 ext. 11 > Fax: (949) 462-3957 > E-mail: brian@projectsst.com > Stan, > > I've done some calling around and emailing. Casio has four distributors > that they send replacement parts to. None of them have the case in stock. > The last time a case was sold from Casio was on April 30, 1996. It was to > an individual, not a distributor. > > The CFX-400 case with key pad has two part numbers. The first is 73081910. > > It was later changed to 73081928, but it is the same part and description. > > There are two parts still in production and available from Casio that you > may want to consider buying. They are the rubber backing seal and the LCD > (not the module, just the screen). > > Good Luck. > > > -- Fred Cisin cisin@xenosoft.com XenoSoft http://www.xenosoft.com PO Box 1236 (510) 558-9366 Berkeley, CA 94701-1236 From eric at brouhaha.com Mon Sep 29 14:50:12 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1503.4.20.168.111.1064865012.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "chris" wrote: > A while ago, I sold or gave away (don't remember) a whole bunch of the > write protect rings for them. So I'm wondering, do those rings stop you > from writing, or enable you to write when installed? The presence of the ring enables writing. > Also, are these safe to bulk erase with an electromagnet? Yes. > And finally, are all 9 track tapes the same? The tapes and reels normally are. IBM did have some special reels or cartridges for early autoload equipment, but those are very uncommon. The main regard in which the tapes vary is quality. Some of the tapes shed oxide. Memorex tapes are particularly bad about this. 3M Blackwatch was generally considered to be about the best, IIRC. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Sep 29 15:11:45 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: sanyo lat-200a. In-Reply-To: <001401c386a0$cc4e9fe0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> References: <20030928200802.GA387@trashcan.ds7> <20030929095146.GA1945@trashcan.ds7> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030929161145.007dc320@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 05:46 PM 9/29/03 +0200, you wrote: > >> what 'passive backplane' should do? There's no active components on the "backplane". OK there mayu be a few LEDs of something to show presense of power but no vital components vital to the system. The S-100 backplanes are a good example. The CPU, system memory, video circuits, I/O ports etc are all on plug in cards. >> provide power from PSU? Usually but not always. >> what will happen if i stick this into a normal pc? Both CPUs (and bus drivers, clocks, etc) will try to drive the buss simultanously and one of them will lose in a spectacular way! Joe From kth at srv.net Mon Sep 29 16:55:25 2003 From: kth at srv.net (Kevin Handy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F78AA4D.5000009@srv.net> chris wrote: >>If I were you,I would specificy the reel diameter and the certified >>density. The tape I'm looking at at this instant, says on the label "3M >>Scotch 777 6250 bpi", so in this case I would say "7 inch reel, 6250 bpi" >> >> > >I just pulled one out, and I rather assume all are the same. > >This one says Endura 800 BPI to 6250 CPI BASF > >It has an inner diameter of about 3.5" and an outer of about 7" > > >A quick look on ebay last night turned up some disappointing results. It >seems a bunch of 9 track reel tapes failed to sell in the last 30 days. >Maybe I'll try them on the Vintage list instead. > > They probably just failed to put the necessary "rare", "1337", and "historically significant" in the description. ;) Tapes are a hard sell, because the cost to ship them is often more than you can buy brand new ones for. You need to find someone who doesn't know they are still being made, but has a tape drive without many tapes. From tosteve at yahoo.com Mon Sep 29 16:27:49 2003 From: tosteve at yahoo.com (steven) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Socal Swapmeets In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030929010350.00a213b0@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: <20030929212749.62403.qmail@web40904.mail.yahoo.com> Well, I did pick up Windows version 1.0 at TRW last week. Original box, manuals and floppies. Cost me a whole dollar. Steve. --- Mike Ford wrote: > Here in Socal we have 5 going on 6 monthly or > semimonthly old computer > often containing swapmeets. The first two saturdays > of the month are Santee > and Fontana, which are either small or too far for > me most of the time, but > I did manage Pomona last weekend, and TRW and ACP > this weekend, and plan to > try for the new Chino Hills next weekend. The bad > news is that space prices > seem to have risen enough to drive away most of the > small non regular > sellers, and that most of the stuff is recent junk > (Belkin is local and > TONS of returns get dumped to swapmeet sellers). > > So what did I see, good stuff first, ACP had a pair > of fresh from the shed > Imsai something 40 boxes with like 9 in CRTS on the > front, and dual 8" > floppy box and a Selectric. > > I didn't buy or even offer on any of that, sticking > to a mini R/C tank and > some hifi cables. Pretty boring when the results of > 3 swapmeets are just > some cheap parts. > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com From emu at ecubics.com Mon Sep 29 16:50:23 2003 From: emu at ecubics.com (emanuel stiebler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Colossus, forbin project was: Re: CCDP / Soviet computing In-Reply-To: <008401c386b2$1c09a280$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> References: <001601c3869c$3e3cd4a0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> <008401c386b2$1c09a280$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: <3F78A91F.2090708@ecubics.com> Ed Sharpe wrote: > Great stuff! need to read this through this evening. > > on a slightly related fictional cccp topic, colossus and guardian the > forbin project. any one know where I can et a movie tape or dvd on this? is > it even still available? Try amazon --> VHS --> forbin project ;-) From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 29 16:32:49 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Casio CFX-400 LCD In-Reply-To: <35C970DB43AFD511895B00E01890866D0120A4@sstserver01.projectsst.com> from "Brian Scura" at Sep 28, 3 07:19:57 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1020 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030929/d4454c9f/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 29 16:35:57 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: hard drive advice requested In-Reply-To: <000a01c38621$2501e5f0$c800a8c0@HPLAPTOP> from "Jay West" at Sep 28, 3 07:32:16 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 944 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030929/944a3df4/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 29 16:41:09 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes In-Reply-To: from "chris" at Sep 28, 3 11:26:09 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1382 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030929/5d9ba48b/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Sep 29 16:27:55 2003 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: TRS-80 printer cable length? In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Sep 28, 3 05:41:57 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1424 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20030929/1efe7c0f/attachment.ksh From jwstephens at msm.umr.edu Mon Sep 29 19:00:39 2003 From: jwstephens at msm.umr.edu (jim) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes [Backup horror stories] References: <3F787BC5.6090506@srv.net> Message-ID: <3F78C7A7.2EBB5DE@msm.umr.edu> Kevin Handy wrote: > chris wrote: I had an account that was supposed to do backups every day, and they did for a long time. Finally they got enough data that they had to go to two reels to back all of the data up. We showed them how to do the backup, and included that they would have to use the second tape we left for them to finish the saves. Well, we hit the aformentioned day of 'oh crap we have to do a restore' and had to get the backup loaded. We started the restore and everything went fine till we got to the second reel. it was blank. mild panic, but who knows, so went to earlier backup. went thru all backups... We asked them anything you can tell us about the backup process? "sure, when we got thru the first reel, it was around 530pm and time to go, and when it asked if we wanted a second reel, we said N(o). time to go home. ... never did recover that account Jim From jcwren at jcwren.com Mon Sep 29 19:25:25 2003 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Casio CFX-400 LCD In-Reply-To: <20030929123543.T38314@newshell.lmi.net> References: <35C970DB43AFD511895B00E01890866D0120A4@sstserver01.projectsst.com> <20030929123543.T38314@newshell.lmi.net> Message-ID: <200309292025.25654.jcwren@jcwren.com> Are there any pictures of these things anywhere? I googled for a couple variations of "cfx 400" and "cfx-400", but no hits with pictures. --John On Monday 29 September 2003 15:40 pm, Fred Cisin wrote: > The CFX-400 and CFX-40 are interchangeable (black v chrome, different > bands). (The CFX-20 and CFX-200 are a completely different unit) > > Scott Mueller > has some in your price range! > > -- > Fred Cisin cisin@xenosoft.com > > On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, Brian Scura wrote: > > >From your e-mail reply to Stan (included below), you apparently have > > > some > > > > knowledge of Casio CFX-400 watches. The display on my CFX-400 got wet > > and isn't displaying all the numbers correctly. I would appreciate it if > > you could e-mail me the contact info you have for Casio so I can get a > > new LCD for my watch. > > If you know anyone that has a CFX-400, I'd be willing to pay up to US$500 > > for a CFX-400 in good condition and up to US$200 for one that's not in > > working condition. > > Brian Scura... > > Scura Speed & Technology Inc. > > 23011 Alcalde Dr., Unit A > > Laguna Hills, CA 92653 > > Tel: (949) 462-9995 ext. 11 > > Fax: (949) 462-3957 > > E-mail: brian@projectsst.com > > > > > > Stan, > > > > I've done some calling around and emailing. Casio has four distributors > > that they send replacement parts to. None of them have the case in > > stock. The last time a case was sold from Casio was on April 30, 1996. > > It was to an individual, not a distributor. > > > > The CFX-400 case with key pad has two part numbers. The first is > > 73081910. > > > > It was later changed to 73081928, but it is the same part and > > description. > > > > There are two parts still in production and available from Casio that you > > may want to consider buying. They are the rubber backing seal and the > > LCD (not the module, just the screen). > > > > Good Luck. > > -- > Fred Cisin cisin@xenosoft.com > XenoSoft http://www.xenosoft.com > PO Box 1236 (510) 558-9366 > Berkeley, CA 94701-1236 From esharpe at uswest.net Mon Sep 29 21:06:30 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing References: <003901c386bb$a9d63520$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: <00b401c386f7$772d2fc0$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> we would be happy to host it on the SMECC server.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nico de Jong" To: Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 11:58 AM Subject: Fw: CCDP / Soviet computing > From: "Nico de Jong" > To: > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 5:05 PM > Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing > > > > The document has now been completed. > > > > Fred has converted the Word document to PDF format. > > Because of the scanned figures, the filesize is rather big : about 10 MB > > You can find the overview of Soviet computing at http://www.microwalt.nl/fred/soviet.zip > > > > The zip file contains a PDF version as well as a .DOC version > > > > Again, it would be informative if some of the guys involved in parts of this project, could comment on the accuracy. > > > > Nico > > A slip of my mind, I'm sorry to say. > > I forgot to ask Fred if he could host the document. It is there for the time being, but as it probably is going to be around for a long time, we need someone who can have this document on-line. > > The document is at present on my FTP server, but I would prefer a more "regular" archival function > > Nico > > > > > > > From vcf at siconic.com Mon Sep 29 20:14:10 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: RCA Appnotes In-Reply-To: <1466.4.20.168.111.1064862164.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 29 Sep 2003, Eric Smith wrote: > The CDP1802 was probably the first single-chip microprocessor, but if How do you figure? -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From rhudson at cnonline.net Mon Sep 29 21:30:51 2003 From: rhudson at cnonline.net (Ron Hudson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: hard drive advice requested In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1C1BF9F8-F2EE-11D7-8664-000393C5A0B6@cnonline.net> > It's rare for the aluminium disk to get seriously cut up. The oxide is > scraped off, the aluminium is scored, and the head gets some lovely > grooves in the surface, but you don't get loads of stuff thrown all > over > the inside of the drive. At least not normally. > > -tony > On one fine saturday at work [I went in on saturdays and had the VAX 11/780 all to myself :^) ] in the late what 70's, I was down in my cubicle writing DCL toys and playing empire, when suddenly the system slowed drastically (froze even) and started saying things something line "uh, I think the disk is offline". I got up and walked quickly to the computer room (raised floor and all) to find a brownish haze floating in the air and the system drive on the 11/780 making a serious scraping sound. I shut everything down and called my Boss at home... Later I found out that one of the heads in the middle of the pack had turned sideways, spreading those two platters apart, disturbing other heads... The haze in the air was ejected magnetic coating. From cisin at xenosoft.com Mon Sep 29 21:54:20 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Casio CFX-400 LCD In-Reply-To: <200309292025.25654.jcwren@jcwren.com> References: <35C970DB43AFD511895B00E01890866D0120A4@sstserver01.projectsst.com> <20030929123543.T38314@newshell.lmi.net> <200309292025.25654.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: <20030929194154.G51744@newshell.lmi.net> try google: "CFX-40" or "Casio scientific calculator watch" The 40 and 400 are the same except for case - the 40 is black plastic, the 400 is chrome. On Mon, 29 Sep 2003, J.C. Wren wrote: > Are there any pictures of these things anywhere? I googled for a couple > variations of "cfx 400" and "cfx-400", but no hits with pictures. > > --John > > On Monday 29 September 2003 15:40 pm, Fred Cisin wrote: > > The CFX-400 and CFX-40 are interchangeable (black v chrome, different > > bands). (The CFX-20 and CFX-200 are a completely different unit) > > > > Scott Mueller > > has some in your price range! > > > > -- > > Fred Cisin cisin@xenosoft.com > > > > On Sun, 28 Sep 2003, Brian Scura wrote: > > > >From your e-mail reply to Stan (included below), you apparently have > > > > some > > > > > > knowledge of Casio CFX-400 watches. The display on my CFX-400 got wet > > > and isn't displaying all the numbers correctly. I would appreciate it if > > > you could e-mail me the contact info you have for Casio so I can get a > > > new LCD for my watch. > > > If you know anyone that has a CFX-400, I'd be willing to pay up to US$500 > > > for a CFX-400 in good condition and up to US$200 for one that's not in > > > working condition. > > > Brian Scura... > > > Scura Speed & Technology Inc. > > > 23011 Alcalde Dr., Unit A > > > Laguna Hills, CA 92653 > > > Tel: (949) 462-9995 ext. 11 > > > Fax: (949) 462-3957 > > > E-mail: brian@projectsst.com > > > > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > I've done some calling around and emailing. Casio has four distributors > > > that they send replacement parts to. None of them have the case in > > > stock. The last time a case was sold from Casio was on April 30, 1996. > > > It was to an individual, not a distributor. > > > > > > The CFX-400 case with key pad has two part numbers. The first is > > > 73081910. > > > > > > It was later changed to 73081928, but it is the same part and > > > description. > > > > > > There are two parts still in production and available from Casio that you > > > may want to consider buying. They are the rubber backing seal and the > > > LCD (not the module, just the screen). > > > > > > Good Luck. > > > > -- > > Fred Cisin cisin@xenosoft.com > > XenoSoft http://www.xenosoft.com > > PO Box 1236 (510) 558-9366 > > Berkeley, CA 94701-1236 > > > -- Fred Cisin cisin@xenosoft.com XenoSoft http://www.xenosoft.com PO Box 1236 (510) 558-9366 Berkeley, CA 94701-1236 From cisin at xenosoft.com Mon Sep 29 21:57:18 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:10 2005 Subject: Casio CFX-400 LCD In-Reply-To: <200309292025.25654.jcwren@jcwren.com> References: <35C970DB43AFD511895B00E01890866D0120A4@sstserver01.projectsst.com> <20030929123543.T38314@newshell.lmi.net> <200309292025.25654.jcwren@jcwren.com> Message-ID: <20030929195634.I51744@newshell.lmi.net> On Mon, 29 Sep 2003, J.C. Wren wrote: > Are there any pictures of these things anywhere? I googled for a couple > variations of "cfx 400" and "cfx-400", but no hits with pictures. Will you be at VCF? I'm not willing to part with any, but I could bring some along to show you. From nico at farumdata.dk Mon Sep 29 23:19:31 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes References: Message-ID: <009b01c3870b$d046d980$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> > This one says Endura 800 BPI to 6250 CPI BASF > > It has an inner diameter of about 3.5" and an outer of about 7" > > > A quick look on ebay last night turned up some disappointing results. I've never had problems with BASF tapes, so that would be ok. 800 to 6250 means in fact that they can be used on all 9 track drives. However, I dont think you can sell 7" tapes. The capacity is too limited, A wild guess is that the tape length is about 600 ft = (600 x 12) = 7.200 inches. Even at 6250 bpi and without interblock gaps, the capacity would be only 45 MB. As interblock gaps are 0.6" at least, a datablock of 6250 bytes would occupy 1.6". So, 7200 / 1.6 = 4500 blocks = 28 MBbyte Another example : datablocks of 1600 bytes would occupy (0.4 + 0.6) = 1.0" Again: 7200 / 1 = 7200 blocks of 1600 bytes = 11.5 MB.... I've only _seen_ those tapes used in connection with software patches from IBM, and on data-entry equipment like the Mohawk . Horrible system. My (biased) opinion is that _if_ 9-track tapes can be sold, it will only be the full size (2400 or 3600 feet) Nico From nico at farumdata.dk Mon Sep 29 23:26:19 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes References: <5.2.0.9.2.20030929135608.02439278@pop-server> Message-ID: <009c01c3870b$d0686b40$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> > and the DP manager came > running in to say that the operator had goofed Which reminds me of a true story too. When I was an operator on a 360/40, most jobs were done via tape, as we had only 2 or 3x 2311. All data was saved for 3 generations. Then, at a time, it was discovered that 2 generations of the master member file, were wonky. So, the boss stepped in, took the last surviving member file and said "I'll keep this one safe", and put it under his desk phone, one of the phones with a 60V electromagnet in it. I dont have to tell you what happened when his phone rang.... It took the programmers about 3 months (IIRC) to recreate the member file from other related files. Nico From nico at farumdata.dk Mon Sep 29 23:28:55 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes References: <3F78AA4D.5000009@srv.net> Message-ID: <009d01c3870b$d0aa0820$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin Handy" To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 11:55 PM Subject: Re: 9 track reel tapes > Tapes are a hard sell, because the cost to ship them is often more > than you can buy brand new ones for. You need to find someone who > doesn't know they are still being made, but has a tape drive without > many tapes. To the best of my knowledge, the last company to manufacture tapes, eMag, has closed down production. There still is a stock left, the but production has seized. If you know for a fact that tapes are still being made, I'd like to know it Nico From nico at farumdata.dk Mon Sep 29 23:31:08 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing References: <003901c386bb$a9d63520$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> <00b401c386f7$772d2fc0$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: <009e01c3870b$d0f65360$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> thats great. If you care to give me sme FTP information I'll transfer it today Nico -- It has been noticed, that hackers and other lowlifes use my e-mail address as a hiding place. I regret the inconvenience these pirates give you ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ed Sharpe" To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2003 4:06 AM Subject: Re: CCDP / Soviet computing > we would be happy to host it on the SMECC server.... > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nico de Jong" > To: > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 11:58 AM > Subject: Fw: CCDP / Soviet computing > > > > From: "Nico de Jong" > > To: > > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 5:05 PM > > Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing > > > > > > > The document has now been completed. > > > > > > Fred has converted the Word document to PDF format. > > > Because of the scanned figures, the filesize is rather big : about 10 MB > > > You can find the overview of Soviet computing at > http://www.microwalt.nl/fred/soviet.zip > > > > > > The zip file contains a PDF version as well as a .DOC version > > > > > > Again, it would be informative if some of the guys involved in parts of > this project, could comment on the accuracy. > > > > > > Nico > > > > A slip of my mind, I'm sorry to say. > > > > I forgot to ask Fred if he could host the document. It is there for the > time being, but as it probably is going to be around for a long time, we > need someone who can have this document on-line. > > > > The document is at present on my FTP server, but I would prefer a more > "regular" archival function > > > > Nico > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From esharpe at uswest.net Tue Sep 30 00:26:38 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (ed sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing References: <003901c386bb$a9d63520$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> <00b401c386f7$772d2fc0$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> <009e01c3870b$d0f65360$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: <006901c38713$6ecec980$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> transferring as I write here! ed! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nico de Jong" To: "Ed Sharpe" ; "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 9:31 PM Subject: Re: CCDP / Soviet computing thats great. If you care to give me sme FTP information I'll transfer it today Nico -- It has been noticed, that hackers and other lowlifes use my e-mail address as a hiding place. I regret the inconvenience these pirates give you ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ed Sharpe" To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2003 4:06 AM Subject: Re: CCDP / Soviet computing > we would be happy to host it on the SMECC server.... > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nico de Jong" > To: > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 11:58 AM > Subject: Fw: CCDP / Soviet computing > > > > From: "Nico de Jong" > > To: > > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 5:05 PM > > Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing > > > > > > > The document has now been completed. > > > > > > Fred has converted the Word document to PDF format. > > > Because of the scanned figures, the filesize is rather big : about 10 MB > > > You can find the overview of Soviet computing at > http://www.microwalt.nl/fred/soviet.zip > > > > > > The zip file contains a PDF version as well as a .DOC version > > > > > > Again, it would be informative if some of the guys involved in parts of > this project, could comment on the accuracy. > > > > > > Nico > > > > A slip of my mind, I'm sorry to say. > > > > I forgot to ask Fred if he could host the document. It is there for the > time being, but as it probably is going to be around for a long time, we > need someone who can have this document on-line. > > > > The document is at present on my FTP server, but I would prefer a more > "regular" archival function > > > > Nico > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From eric at brouhaha.com Tue Sep 30 00:43:38 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: RCA Appnotes In-Reply-To: References: <1466.4.20.168.111.1064862164.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <36197.64.169.63.74.1064900618.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> I wrote: > The CDP1802 was probably the first single-chip microprocessor, but if Sellam wrote: > How do you figure? The discussion was of CMOS microprocessors; the word CMOS should have been in that sentence. From lbickley at bickleywest.com Tue Sep 30 00:14:28 2003 From: lbickley at bickleywest.com (Lyle Bickley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: Tape for HP 5423A Message-ID: <200309292214.28664.lbickley@bickleywest.com> The HP 5423A is a vintage piece of test equipment with an embedded HP-MX processor. If you happen to have a master or copy of the "control" tape (system tape) for the critter, I'd really appreciate borrowing one so I can make a copy. Thanks, Lyle -- Lyle Bickley Bickley Consulting West Inc. Mountain View, CA 94040 "Black holes are where God is dividing by zero" From eric at brouhaha.com Tue Sep 30 01:19:53 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes In-Reply-To: <009b01c3870b$d046d980$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> References: <009b01c3870b$d046d980$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: <36259.64.169.63.74.1064902793.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "Nico de Jong" > I've never had problems with BASF tapes, so that would be ok. 800 to 6250 > means in fact that they can be used on all 9 track drives. > However, I dont think you can sell 7" tapes. The capacity is too limited, There exist some small rack-mount 9-track drives that will not work with full-size reels. I'm not talking about front (slot) load units, but rather units that had two small reels side by side. DEC made one, but it wasn't very popular. I don't recall the model number. And no, I'm not talking about DECtape, which used even smaller reels of 3/4 inch tape. Anyhow, 7-inch reels are useful to people with those drives. From GOOI at oce.nl Tue Sep 30 01:43:38 2003 From: GOOI at oce.nl (Gooijen H) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes Message-ID: <1A9EACFF5B9EB9489F00104C00ECF641027B0DA1@hqvenlomail.oce.nl> The small rack-mount tape drive from DEC is the TS03. By joke, the "TS" was for "Tape Stretcher" as the TS03 did not have a sort of vacuum column, but just a roller with a spring to keep the tape tensioned. - Henk. > -----Original Message----- > From: Eric Smith [mailto:eric@brouhaha.com] > Sent: dinsdag 30 september 2003 8:20 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts > Subject: Re: 9 track reel tapes > > > "Nico de Jong" > > I've never had problems with BASF tapes, so that would be > ok. 800 to 6250 > > means in fact that they can be used on all 9 track drives. > > However, I dont think you can sell 7" tapes. The capacity > is too limited, > > There exist some small rack-mount 9-track drives that will > not work with full-size reels. I'm not talking about front > (slot) load units, but rather units that had two small reels > side by side. DEC made one, but it wasn't very popular. > I don't recall the model number. > And no, I'm not talking about DECtape, which used even smaller > reels of 3/4 inch tape. > > Anyhow, 7-inch reels are useful to people with those drives. From nico at farumdata.dk Tue Sep 30 01:44:54 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes References: <009b01c3870b$d046d980$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> <36259.64.169.63.74.1064902793.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <002501c3871e$6342d9c0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> From: "Eric Smith" To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2003 8:19 AM Subject: Re: 9 track reel tapes > > Anyhow, 7-inch reels are useful to people with those drives. > I have some 30-40 7-inch reels. Anyone who wants to pay freight, can have them. I'm located in Denmark. Nico From nico at farumdata.dk Tue Sep 30 01:48:56 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing References: <003901c386bb$a9d63520$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk><00b401c386f7$772d2fc0$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net><009e01c3870b$d0f65360$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> <006901c38713$6ecec980$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> Message-ID: <004001c3871e$ed280f20$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> BTW Ed, there is a file on my server which does not belong to this project. It is the one called STM040.zip or something like that. Please discard it, it contains invoices from a customer Thanks Nico -- It has been noticed, that hackers and other lowlifes use my e-mail address as a hiding place. I regret the inconvenience these pirates give you ----- Original Message ----- From: "ed sharpe" To: "Nico de Jong" ; "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2003 7:26 AM Subject: Re: CCDP / Soviet computing > transferring as I write here! > > ed! > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nico de Jong" > To: "Ed Sharpe" ; "General Discussion: On-Topic and > Off-Topic Posts" > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 9:31 PM > Subject: Re: CCDP / Soviet computing > > > thats great. > If you care to give me sme FTP information I'll transfer it today > > Nico > -- It has been noticed, that hackers and other lowlifes use my e-mail > address as a hiding place. > I regret the inconvenience these pirates give you > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ed Sharpe" > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" > > Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2003 4:06 AM > Subject: Re: CCDP / Soviet computing > > > > we would be happy to host it on the SMECC server.... > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Nico de Jong" > > To: > > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 11:58 AM > > Subject: Fw: CCDP / Soviet computing > > > > > > > From: "Nico de Jong" > > > To: > > > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 5:05 PM > > > Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing > > > > > > > > > > The document has now been completed. > > > > > > > > Fred has converted the Word document to PDF format. > > > > Because of the scanned figures, the filesize is rather big : about 10 > MB > > > > You can find the overview of Soviet computing at > > http://www.microwalt.nl/fred/soviet.zip > > > > > > > > The zip file contains a PDF version as well as a .DOC version > > > > > > > > Again, it would be informative if some of the guys involved in parts > of > > this project, could comment on the accuracy. > > > > > > > > Nico > > > > > > A slip of my mind, I'm sorry to say. > > > > > > I forgot to ask Fred if he could host the document. It is there for the > > time being, but as it probably is going to be around for a long time, we > > need someone who can have this document on-line. > > > > > > The document is at present on my FTP server, but I would prefer a more > > "regular" archival function > > > > > > Nico > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From vcf at siconic.com Tue Sep 30 01:56:30 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: RCA Appnotes In-Reply-To: <36197.64.169.63.74.1064900618.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 29 Sep 2003, Eric Smith wrote: > I wrote: > > The CDP1802 was probably the first single-chip microprocessor, but if > > Sellam wrote: > > How do you figure? > > The discussion was of CMOS microprocessors; the word CMOS should have > been in that sentence. Got it. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From mikeford at socal.rr.com Tue Sep 30 02:13:25 2003 From: mikeford at socal.rr.com (Mike Ford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: Flood of old meters In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030929224224.00a2d730@pop-server.socal.rr.com> I am really disturbed by the number of old meters I am seeing going into the breakage (junk) bins at surplus places. Most of these are the big old black Simpson 360 type things, and they are in a condition that reflects 30 to 50 years of use, but until this moment of being tossed, treated carefully and with respect. Personally I have all the antique meters I think I will ever need, a 360, a 3601 VTVM, but I couldn't see not picking out one more from the batch getting tossed today a Bell System KS 14510 L1 VOM with a really clean new looking leather case, and a handheld sized clamp on meter that just says General Electric. Weird thing on the GE meter is that the range knob on the bottom extends through the meter face with the scale marks on a cylinder so as the range changes the meter scale also changes. Worst thing is that often a flood of some item shows up like this, then pretty soon you never see them anymore. Feels like the end of the era of "instruments", crafted items that needed carefull handling, but lasted decades. From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Tue Sep 30 02:51:18 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: WangEmu 1.1 released In-Reply-To: <3F767D5E.1010205@pacbell.net> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030930035024.00a70510@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> Hello Jim, That's very nice looking. Kudos and ... Best Regards At 11:19 PM 9/27/03 -0700, you wrote: >I've updated my Wang 2200 emulator to version 1.1. It has been about six >months since the last update. > >This release adds two signficant features: > > 1) disk support. You can now plug in disk controllers, each of which > can control two drives. Drives can be any legal size, and the timing can > model that of 5.25" or 8" floppies, or hard disks (even the interleave > factor is modelled). You can optionally turn of the emulated timing and > make it run as fast as possible. > > 2) when an error message is displayed on the screen (which are just > two digit codes), double click on that line and a detailed explanation > will pop up. the explanations come directly from the Wang BASIC manual. > >Adding the first feature was a lot of work. I started with the microcode >dump from the disk controller and a document describing the >microarchitecture (believe it or not, the 2200 has a 4b ALU and the disk >controller has an 8B ALU). From there, I wrote a disassembler and studied >the listing until I thought I understood the protocol. I implemented it >and ironed the wrinkles out of my assumptions. > > >Please have a look if you are interested. > >Web site: > http://www.thebattles.net/wang/wang.html > >The emulator: > http://www.thebattles.net/wang/emu.html > >Cool error message feature, in relaxing Wang green: > http://www.thebattles.net/wang/emu/html/error_help.gif > >Release notes: > http://www.thebattles.net/wang/emu/relnotes.txt > >The program is a Win32 executable. Source code is online. From james at jfc.org.uk Tue Sep 30 03:33:30 2003 From: james at jfc.org.uk (James Carter) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: SGI Indigo/Crimson - PS/2 to SGI adaptors found In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1064910810.1301.38.camel@pc004> On Sun, 2003-09-28 at 23:16, JP Hindin wrote: > Greetings; > > I don't know if its any form of blasphemy to do this. But for only $40, > you can get a prebuilt convertor of standard PS/2 keyboard + mouse to > proprietary SGI keyb/mouse bus for Indigo/Crimson. (The dude says Onyx > uses them too, but I was kinda sure that was PS/2 like Indy. No matter) i think the sight has been mentioned on this list before but you could always build your own, to: http://rshockley.dyndns.org/indigo.htm -- James F. Carter http://www.jfc.org.uk/ From knightstalkerbob at netscape.net Tue Sep 30 07:54:32 2003 From: knightstalkerbob at netscape.net (Bob Mason) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: Quick Basic ( a bit of detail) Message-ID: <461567A2.055815E4.CF1A260E@netscape.net> Could you zip the files? This will "hide" the exe. By the way, what is the size of the archive? Bob Mason "R. Mueller" wrote: >If you should ask me to send a copy of Quick Basic, please be sure you can >receive it. I once sent it to a fellow behind a firewall and the firewall >bounced it. The set contains executable files and they could be >dangerous (Indeed, you have to trust ME not to insert a virus, but then >again, I don't know how! Don't even want to know how.) > >Bob > > -- Bob Mason 2x Amiga 500's, GVP A530 (40mhz 68030/68882, 8meg Fast, SCSI), 1.3/3.1, 2meg Chip, full ECS chipset, EZ135, 1084S, big harddrives, 2.2xCD Homebrew AMD Athlon 2400+, 512MB, etc. Heathkit H-89A, 64K RAM, hard and soft-sectored floppies, SigmaSoft and Systems 256K RAM Drive/Print Spooler/Graphics board HDOS 2 & CP/M 2.2.03/2.2.04 __________________________________________________________________ McAfee VirusScan Online from the Netscape Network. Comprehensive protection for your entire computer. Get your free trial today! http://channels.netscape.com/ns/computing/mcafee/index.jsp?promo=393397 Get AOL Instant Messenger 5.1 free of charge. Download Now! http://aim.aol.com/aimnew/Aim/register.adp?promo=380455 From trash_tmp at poczta.onet.pl Tue Sep 30 07:12:12 2003 From: trash_tmp at poczta.onet.pl (trashcan man) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: sanyo lat-200a. In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030929161145.007dc320@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <20030928200802.GA387@trashcan.ds7> <20030929095146.GA1945@trashcan.ds7> <3.0.6.32.20030929161145.007dc320@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <20030930121212.GA5071@trashcan.ds7> On Mon, Sep 29, 2003 at 04:11:45PM -0400, Joe wrote: > >> what 'passive backplane' should do? > > There's no active components on the "backplane". OK there mayu be a few > LEDs of something to show presense of power but no vital components vital > to the system. The S-100 backplanes are a good example. The CPU, system > memory, video circuits, I/O ports etc are all on plug in cards. ok, but can i safely assume that connector between this board and backplane is a normal ISA bus and stick it into a strange ISA... hm, splitter? (don't know the proper word, it has one male ISA edge connector, two female ISA sockets and three decoupling capacitors) with wires from PSU connected to the proper bus pins? From foxvideo at wincom.net Tue Sep 30 08:12:55 2003 From: foxvideo at wincom.net (Charles E. Fox) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing In-Reply-To: <008401c386b2$1c09a280$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net> References: <001601c3869c$3e3cd4a0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20030930091036.02060a38@mail.wincom.net> At 01:50 PM 29/09/2003, you wrote: >Great stuff! need to read this through this evening. > >on a slightly related fictional cccp topic, colossus and guardian the >forbin project. any one know where I can et a movie tape or dvd on this? is >it even still available? I got mine from reel.com in 1999. Regards Charlie Fox Charles E. Fox Video Production 793 Argyle Rd. Windsor Ontario Canada N8Y 3J8 519-254-4991 foxvideo@wincom.net Check out the "Camcorder Kindergarten" at http://chasfoxvideo.com From nico at farumdata.dk Tue Sep 30 08:53:41 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: sanyo lat-200a. References: <20030928200802.GA387@trashcan.ds7><20030929095146.GA1945@trashcan.ds7><3.0.6.32.20030929161145.007dc320@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <20030930121212.GA5071@trashcan.ds7> Message-ID: <001001c3875a$4384f820$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> > > There's no active components on the "backplane". OK there mayu be a few > > LEDs of something to show presense of power but no vital components vital > > to the system. The S-100 backplanes are a good example. The CPU, system > > memory, video circuits, I/O ports etc are all on plug in cards. > > ok, but can i safely assume that connector between this board > and backplane is a normal ISA bus and stick it into a strange ISA... > hm, splitter? (don't know the proper word, it has one male ISA edge > connector, two female ISA sockets and three decoupling capacitors) > with wires from PSU connected to the proper bus pins? > I would say yes, as all ISA controllers are supposed to adhere to the same standard. Quite logical, as they otherwise wouldnt run on an ISA bus. The fact that a processor etc. is on a board for itself, doesnt disturb the other controllers. So, logically, it should be safe Nico From eric at brouhaha.com Tue Sep 30 09:09:25 2003 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes In-Reply-To: <1A9EACFF5B9EB9489F00104C00ECF641027B0DA1@hqvenlomail.oce.nl> References: <1A9EACFF5B9EB9489F00104C00ECF641027B0DA1@hqvenlomail.oce.nl> Message-ID: <36334.64.169.63.74.1064930965.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "Gooijen H" wrote: > The small rack-mount tape drive from DEC is the TS03. That's the one I was thinking of, thanks! > The small rack-mount tape drive from DEC is the TS03. > By joke, the "TS" was for "Tape Stretcher" as the TS03 > did not have a sort of vacuum column, but just a roller > with a spring to keep the tape tensioned. It was not the TS03 but rather the TS11 that is the tape stretcher. When you load a tape, it sometimes can get into a mode where it applies full torque to both reels, with predictable results. I've never heard of that happening on the TS03. From esharpe at uswest.net Tue Sep 30 09:49:28 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (ed sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing References: <003901c386bb$a9d63520$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk><00b401c386f7$772d2fc0$4291a8c0@aoldsl.net><009e01c3870b$d0f65360$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> <006901c38713$6ecec980$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> <004001c3871e$ed280f20$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: <00af01c38762$0d4b4f90$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> wish you had told me that before! that thing s huge!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nico de Jong" To: "ed sharpe" ; "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 11:48 PM Subject: Re: CCDP / Soviet computing BTW Ed, there is a file on my server which does not belong to this project. It is the one called STM040.zip or something like that. Please discard it, it contains invoices from a customer Thanks Nico -- It has been noticed, that hackers and other lowlifes use my e-mail address as a hiding place. I regret the inconvenience these pirates give you ----- Original Message ----- From: "ed sharpe" To: "Nico de Jong" ; "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2003 7:26 AM Subject: Re: CCDP / Soviet computing > transferring as I write here! > > ed! > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nico de Jong" > To: "Ed Sharpe" ; "General Discussion: On-Topic and > Off-Topic Posts" > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 9:31 PM > Subject: Re: CCDP / Soviet computing > > > thats great. > If you care to give me sme FTP information I'll transfer it today > > Nico > -- It has been noticed, that hackers and other lowlifes use my e-mail > address as a hiding place. > I regret the inconvenience these pirates give you > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ed Sharpe" > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" > > Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2003 4:06 AM > Subject: Re: CCDP / Soviet computing > > > > we would be happy to host it on the SMECC server.... > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Nico de Jong" > > To: > > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 11:58 AM > > Subject: Fw: CCDP / Soviet computing > > > > > > > From: "Nico de Jong" > > > To: > > > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 5:05 PM > > > Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing > > > > > > > > > > The document has now been completed. > > > > > > > > Fred has converted the Word document to PDF format. > > > > Because of the scanned figures, the filesize is rather big : about 10 > MB > > > > You can find the overview of Soviet computing at > > http://www.microwalt.nl/fred/soviet.zip > > > > > > > > The zip file contains a PDF version as well as a .DOC version > > > > > > > > Again, it would be informative if some of the guys involved in parts > of > > this project, could comment on the accuracy. > > > > > > > > Nico > > > > > > A slip of my mind, I'm sorry to say. > > > > > > I forgot to ask Fred if he could host the document. It is there for the > > time being, but as it probably is going to be around for a long time, we > > need someone who can have this document on-line. > > > > > > The document is at present on my FTP server, but I would prefer a more > > "regular" archival function > > > > > > Nico > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From eric at rothfus.com Tue Sep 30 10:52:43 2003 From: eric at rothfus.com (Eric J. Rothfus) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: Kaypro II boot disk In-Reply-To: (message from Don Maslin on Sun, 28 Sep 2003 23:06:55 -0700 (PDT)) References: Message-ID: <1064933408@rothfus.com> Is there an image of the Kaypro II CP/M disk(s) on the Internet somewhere? From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 30 10:37:02 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: CCDP / Soviet computing In-Reply-To: <00af01c38762$0d4b4f90$0100a8c0@SONYDIGITALED> Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Sep 2003, ed sharpe wrote: > wish you had told me that before! that thing s huge!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1 Nah, only 280MB or so, Ed... stop whining :) (*grumbles at Nico for not telling*) By the way... half the list seems to have grabbed it from my server already, soo.. :) --f From Innfogra at aol.com Tue Sep 30 10:57:20 2003 From: Innfogra at aol.com (Innfogra@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes Message-ID: <33.3e93ab0f.2cab01e0@aol.com> Data General also had a delightful small two reel 7" tape drive also. Used with the Nova series of computers BASF Endura is good tape. It shouldn't delaminate. When I got boxes of new tape I looked for a reseller in the back of Processor Magazine that specializes in tape. Shipping is a killer though. I was never able to sell a box of 7" reels of tape (1200') though. No one wanted them. From jwstephens at msm.umr.edu Tue Sep 30 11:51:04 2003 From: jwstephens at msm.umr.edu (jim) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: Socal Swapmeets References: <20030929212749.62403.qmail@web40904.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3F79B478.EA0D9AD5@msm.umr.edu> > > > So what did I see, good stuff first, ACP had a pair > > of fresh from the shed > > Imsai something 40 boxes with like 9 in CRTS on the > > front, and dual 8" > > floppy box and a Selectric. > > which the owner wanted $1000 for most of the day, then offered them for $500. Anyone buy these? Jim From tosteve at yahoo.com Tue Sep 30 12:10:14 2003 From: tosteve at yahoo.com (steven) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: WANTED: TRS-80 model II keyboard In-Reply-To: <3F79B478.EA0D9AD5@msm.umr.edu> Message-ID: <20030930171014.99669.qmail@web40911.mail.yahoo.com> >From http://oldcomputers.net 'wanted' page: I WOULD LIKE TO BUY KEYBOARD TRS-80 ALL MY BUSINESS WORK ON COMPUTER TRS-80 MODEL II AND I NEED USED OR NEW KEY BOARD PLEASE SEND SOME INFORMATION. THANK YOU the next day: I WANT YO BUY TRS MODEL II KEYBOARD TELPHONE 201-487-4313 NEED THE KEYBOARD NOW!!!! __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com From nico at farumdata.dk Tue Sep 30 12:49:37 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: WANTED: TRS-80 model II keyboard References: <20030930171014.99669.qmail@web40911.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000601c3877b$3bbee800$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> From: "steven" To: Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2003 7:10 PM Subject: WANTED: TRS-80 model II keyboard > >From http://oldcomputers.net 'wanted' page: > > > I WOULD LIKE TO BUY KEYBOARD TRS-80 ALL MY BUSINESS > WORK ON COMPUTER TRS-80 MODEL II AND I NEED USED OR > NEW KEY BOARD PLEASE SEND SOME INFORMATION. THANK YOU > > > the next day: > I WANT YO BUY TRS MODEL II KEYBOARD TELPHONE > 201-487-4313 NEED THE KEYBOARD NOW!!!! > > Obviously a hoax, as his keyboard is still working... Nico From vance at neurotica.com Tue Sep 30 13:11:08 2003 From: vance at neurotica.com (vance@neurotica.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: WANTED: TRS-80 model II keyboard In-Reply-To: <20030930171014.99669.qmail@web40911.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Go jump off a cliff with your shouting. Peace... Sridhar On Tue, 30 Sep 2003, steven wrote: > >From http://oldcomputers.net 'wanted' page: > > > I WOULD LIKE TO BUY KEYBOARD TRS-80 ALL MY BUSINESS > WORK ON COMPUTER TRS-80 MODEL II AND I NEED USED OR > NEW KEY BOARD PLEASE SEND SOME INFORMATION. THANK YOU > > > the next day: > I WANT YO BUY TRS MODEL II KEYBOARD TELPHONE > 201-487-4313 NEED THE KEYBOARD NOW!!!! > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search > http://shopping.yahoo.com > From bpope at wordstock.com Tue Sep 30 13:09:57 2003 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: WANTED: TRS-80 model II keyboard In-Reply-To: <000601c3877b$3bbee800$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> from "Nico de Jong" at Sep 30, 03 07:49:37 pm Message-ID: <200309301809.OAA12607@wordstock.com> And thusly Nico de Jong spake: > > > >From http://oldcomputers.net 'wanted' page: > > > > > > I WOULD LIKE TO BUY KEYBOARD TRS-80 ALL MY BUSINESS > > WORK ON COMPUTER TRS-80 MODEL II AND I NEED USED OR > > NEW KEY BOARD PLEASE SEND SOME INFORMATION. THANK YOU > > > > > > the next day: > > I WANT YO BUY TRS MODEL II KEYBOARD TELPHONE > > 201-487-4313 NEED THE KEYBOARD NOW!!!! > > > > > Obviously a hoax, as his keyboard is still working... > Nico Maybe he wants to scavenge all of the lowercase letters from another keyboard? Cheers, Bryan Pope From cisin at xenosoft.com Tue Sep 30 13:25:22 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: WANTED: TRS-80 model II keyboard In-Reply-To: <000601c3877b$3bbee800$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> References: <20030930171014.99669.qmail@web40911.mail.yahoo.com> <000601c3877b$3bbee800$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> Message-ID: <20030930112430.E6806@newshell.lmi.net> On Tue, 30 Sep 2003, Nico de Jong wrote: > > >From http://oldcomputers.net 'wanted' page: > > I WOULD LIKE TO BUY KEYBOARD TRS-80 ALL MY BUSINESS > > WORK ON COMPUTER TRS-80 MODEL II AND I NEED USED OR > > NEW KEY BOARD PLEASE SEND SOME INFORMATION. THANK YOU > > the next day: > > I WANT YO BUY TRS MODEL II KEYBOARD TELPHONE > > 201-487-4313 NEED THE KEYBOARD NOW!!!! > Obviously a hoax, as his keyboard is still working... except the shift key From jhfinexgs2 at compsys.to Tue Sep 30 14:16:11 2003 From: jhfinexgs2 at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: V5.01A Distribution of RT-11 Message-ID: <3F79D67B.22473B6@compsys.to> Does anyone have access to V5.01A of RT-11? I would prefer the RL02 image which has a Volume ID / Owner of: BC-P607C-BC RL2 1/1 However, any other media would be great if the RL02 image is not available! I already have V5.00, V5.01, V5.01C (V5.01B does not exist) and V5.02 of RT-11. So it is ONLY V5.01A of RT-11 that I do not have. All of these distributions (any prior to V5.03) are allowed to be used under the Supnik emulator by hobby users of RT-11, so It would be "nice" to be able to have all of the versions that are allowed and make them available to other hobby users. Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From tothwolf at concentric.net Tue Sep 30 15:04:23 2003 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: WANTED: TRS-80 model II keyboard In-Reply-To: <20030930171014.99669.qmail@web40911.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030930171014.99669.qmail@web40911.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Sep 2003, steven wrote: > From http://oldcomputers.net 'wanted' page: > > > i would like to buy keyboard trs-80 all my business work on computer > > trs-80 model ii and i need used or new key board please send some > > information. thank you I'm looking for one myself, or at least the outer case for one. My model II keyboard works, but it was dropped at some point, and barely stays together. I'd like to find one before next year's VCF, as finances permitting, I'd like to show some of my TRS80 systems. (Wanted list to be posted soon.) If anyone has one of these keyboards that is surplus to their collection, please email me off-list. -Toth From ss at allegro.com Tue Sep 30 14:46:48 2003 From: ss at allegro.com (Stan Sieler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: Epson RC-20 : Looking for software and cable Message-ID: <3F797B38.8443.42BCDFD@localhost> Hi, I just got an Epson RC-20 ... with no software and with no cable :( I'm looking for software, naturally :) And, if anyone has a cable or information about how to make a cable, I'd be interested! thanks, Stan sieler@allegro.com From donm at cts.com Tue Sep 30 15:18:52 2003 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: Kaypro II boot disk In-Reply-To: <1064933408@rothfus.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Sep 2003, Eric J. Rothfus wrote: > Is there an image of the Kaypro II CP/M disk(s) > on the Internet somewhere? Not to my knowledge. But, there are in fact three different revisions of the Kaypro 2/II system disks - each of which will work with only a single revision of the boot EPROM. - don From sieler at allegro.com Mon Sep 29 17:11:55 2003 From: sieler at allegro.com (Stan Sieler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: HP 9835 avail; and: HP 9835 tape conversion reques Message-ID: <3F784BBB.14697.F44B108@localhost> The user with the HP 9835 tapes is now talking with a local (to him) CCTALK/CCTECH subscriber. thanks! -- Stan Sieler sieler@allegro.com www.allegro.com/sieler/wanted/index.html From gschil at orthomed.org Mon Sep 29 19:59:44 2003 From: gschil at orthomed.org (Greg Schilhab) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: PS/1 computer Message-ID: Hi, I was wondering if you still had that PS/1 computer for sale. Our PS/1 died at work and we need to replace the monitor which has the power supply. Please drop me a line and let me know Greg Schilhab Journal of Orthomolecular Medicine. 16 Florence Avenue, Toronto, ON, Canada. M2N 1E9. Tel. (416)733-2117 Fax (416) 733-2352 E-mail centre@orthomed.org From scottmueller at compuserve.com Tue Sep 30 01:29:16 2003 From: scottmueller at compuserve.com (Scott Mueller) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: Casio CFX-40 available - *brand new* or used Message-ID: <200309300229_MC3-1-5097-4EC1@compuserve.com> Fred, Thanks for the heads-up. I do in fact still have a couple of *brand new* CFX-40s left for sale at $500 each. They are absolutely brand new, unused, never worn, in the original box, with manual and hang-tag. I also have *one* used CFX-40 in very good condition (it has a crack in the side of the case which has been repaired with cyanoacrylate glue), which is fully functional (everything works properly, including the light), has the original band, and which also includes the original box, manual and hang-tag for $300. For either new or used, add $10 S&H (incl. insurance). Email me directly if interested, I can send pictures and references if necessary, Scott. From jwest at classiccmp.org Tue Sep 30 15:57:37 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: ADMIN: filtering for spam + other stuff Message-ID: <001401c38795$7ac4caa0$033310ac@kwcorp.com> Just wanted to let folks on the list know.... 1) I am putting some spam-related keyword searches on posts to both lists. This is an effort to make my pseudo-daily moderation of posts easier, because the lists get a LOT of spam I have to filter out manually. 2) I would rather not post the specific rules I am putting in place in case a spammer has subbed to the list. Be just be advised that I would recommend that everyone be a little cognizant of the subject line of the message that they post. Messages which trigger the spam list will be rejected. 3) To my knowledge, all reported bugs/issues since the switchover to the upgraded mailman software have been addressed. If anyone feels there are still outstanding issues please email me directly. There is still some tweaking to sendmail to be done, and I need to regen the archives after getting rid of some posts and including some missing posts, that I am already aware of. Now, back to old computers :) --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Sep 30 16:20:29 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: sanyo lat-200a. In-Reply-To: <20030930121212.GA5071@trashcan.ds7> References: <3.0.6.32.20030929161145.007dc320@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <20030928200802.GA387@trashcan.ds7> <20030929095146.GA1945@trashcan.ds7> <3.0.6.32.20030929161145.007dc320@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030930172029.007b21e0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 02:12 PM 9/30/03 +0200, you wrote: >On Mon, Sep 29, 2003 at 04:11:45PM -0400, Joe wrote: >> >> what 'passive backplane' should do? >> >> There's no active components on the "backplane". OK there mayu be a few >> LEDs of something to show presense of power but no vital components vital >> to the system. The S-100 backplanes are a good example. The CPU, system >> memory, video circuits, I/O ports etc are all on plug in cards. > >ok, but can i safely assume that connector between this board >and backplane is a normal ISA bus and stick it into a strange ISA... Yes you can assume that it's a standard ISA connector if it looks ike one. There are some cards that have an extra connector but those will be obvious.* BUT even if it has a standard ISA connector you can not just plug it into a standard motherboard that already has CPU and memory. If you do, you will be connecting the outputs of the memory, CPU etc on one board to the outputs of memory, CPU etc of the other board. If any of the outputs are not in the same logic state (hi or Lo), and it's a near certainty that they're not, then they will try to force the other outputs and WILL burn up something. I didn't see the first part of this thread so I don't know the details of the card that you have. If it's a CPU or memory card, don't try to use it in a computer with a motherboard! If it's an I/O card then it's probably safe to use with a motherboard. >hm, splitter? (don't know the proper word, it has one male ISA edge >connector, two female ISA sockets and three decoupling capacitors) >with wires from PSU connected to the proper bus pins? In the PC industry those are usually called riser cards. They plug into the motherboard and stick up and you can plug several standard PC cards into them. The PC cards will then lay parallel to the motherboard instead of perpendicular as in the orginal PCs. That style system is called NTX. But to answer your question, yes you can make you own passive backplane using a riser card. Some backplanes have the keyboard and reset signals routed through them but most of the CPU cards for those systems can get the keyboard signals via the backplane or through some kind of wiring adapater that runs directly from the CPU card to the keyboard port in the case. BTW where are you located? I have some extra backplanes here (Florida). I can probably send you one. *FWIW a lot of the passive backplane systems use cards with an extra connector similar to the old VLB cards. They call it PICMIG. I don't know the details of it. Joe > > From esharpe at uswest.net Tue Sep 30 17:31:05 2003 From: esharpe at uswest.net (Ed Sharpe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: Socal Swapmeets References: <20030929212749.62403.qmail@web40904.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <007901c387a2$89d07e60$2ccf92ac@aoldsl.net> congrats great find! am looking for the hp 150 version of first windows for the hp 150 display here at the museum... has anyone seen one recently? Thanks! Ed Sharpe Archivist for SMECC See the Southwest Museum of Engineering, Communications and Computation online at: http://www.smecc.org ----- Original Message ----- From: "steven" To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 2:27 PM Subject: Re: Socal Swapmeets > Well, > I did pick up Windows version 1.0 at TRW last week. > Original box, manuals and floppies. > Cost me a whole dollar. > > Steve. > > > --- Mike Ford wrote: > > Here in Socal we have 5 going on 6 monthly or > > semimonthly old computer > > often containing swapmeets. The first two saturdays > > of the month are Santee > > and Fontana, which are either small or too far for > > me most of the time, but > > I did manage Pomona last weekend, and TRW and ACP > > this weekend, and plan to > > try for the new Chino Hills next weekend. The bad > > news is that space prices > > seem to have risen enough to drive away most of the > > small non regular > > sellers, and that most of the stuff is recent junk > > (Belkin is local and > > TONS of returns get dumped to swapmeet sellers). > > > > So what did I see, good stuff first, ACP had a pair > > of fresh from the shed > > Imsai something 40 boxes with like 9 in CRTS on the > > front, and dual 8" > > floppy box and a Selectric. > > > > I didn't buy or even offer on any of that, sticking > > to a mini R/C tank and > > some hifi cables. Pretty boring when the results of > > 3 swapmeets are just > > some cheap parts. > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search > http://shopping.yahoo.com > > From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 30 16:54:59 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: AVAIL: MSX stuff Message-ID: Hiyas, While going through Many Boxes (tm) of old stuff (yes, I finally found the PC I was looking for ;-) I also bumped into some old MSX home cputer stuff. Any takes for this, before I make it fly straight into a dumpster? Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 30 18:03:41 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: More Stuff available Message-ID: Hiyas, See above. I found some stuff that I can safely let go, without too much heartache: - several binders with manuals and periodicals from systems from The DIGITAL Group, Inc. (*NOT* DEC !!) - an Apple II Technical Manual an unsoldered, virgin AppleII clone board, once sold by Eijlander Electronice in Ede, The Netherlands. I never got around to assembling it, so its still virgin. - several master tapes from Informix for SCO Xenix/UNIX - a whole bunch of silly 9600/14400/19200 voice-band modems designed for (analog) leased line operation, including the power supplies. The PSU's do +5V and +12V at 1A, so might also be useful in other apps. Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From bshannon at tiac.net Tue Sep 30 18:11:52 2003 From: bshannon at tiac.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes References: <009b01c3870b$d046d980$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> <36259.64.169.63.74.1064902793.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <3F7A0DB8.20906@tiac.net> I could use some reels of 9-track tape, 7-inch reels are fine with me! From dancohoe at oxford.net Tue Sep 30 19:09:43 2003 From: dancohoe at oxford.net (Dan Cohoe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: Bruker Aspect 3000 computer and drives available Message-ID: <000201c387b0$51c82190$6501a8c0@DCOHOE> Hello all, At my favorite salvage spot near Rochester the other day I noticed a Bruker rack with an ASPECT 3000 mini, two 8" floppy drives (FDD 280) and a hard drive (BDS 160). Lots of cables as well. It appears from Google that this would mostly be used for NMR Spectroscopy, but if anyone is interested, I expect its available for a quite reasonable price as long as you speak up quickly. Get back to me off-list if you want me to call them to save it. Dan Cohoe From cmcnabb at 4mcnabb.net Tue Sep 30 19:32:54 2003 From: cmcnabb at 4mcnabb.net (Christopher McNabb) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: PDP 11/73 SLU Message-ID: <1064967860.3654.8.camel@unix> Our Physics Dept. recently decommissioned their old Bomem Interferometer computer, which was PDP-11/73 based. Somehow, when it got around to what to do with it, my name came up. The thing is now sitting in my cube. The only DEC cards in the box are the CPU and the disk controller. Everything else appears to be custom. One of the boards appears to be a custom multiport serial/EGA Video/PC Keyboard interface that wants the console to be on the PC Keyboard and EGA monitor. Unfortunately, none of the EGA monitors (NEC JC-1402P3A) that I got with the system will power-on. You plug them in, flip the switch, and nothing happens. Not even a power light. I really have no need for all the custom stuff and would just as soon remove it as use it. I do have a spare DHV11 here that I could put in the box, but I do not know if the DHV11 can be used as a standard serial console. The DHV11 tech manual does not seem to have any info on using the board as a console. Any help would be appreciated. -- Christopher McNabb The McNabb Family From jwest at classiccmp.org Tue Sep 30 19:24:22 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:11 2005 Subject: More HP Excitement Message-ID: <000701c387b2$5d32e1d0$6400a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Finally got the system processor (TSB) back up to snuff with no parity problems. Looks like the upper 8K of core suddenly got bit 12 stuck on. That's easy enough to fix, barring a core plane failure there's only about 5 discrete components per bit on the card. More exciting though, I got a 7906 drive up and working on the system via a 13037 rackmount box. Woohoo! The good news is the fixed platter (head 2) formats fine and passes diagnostics. The removable platter (heads 0 & 1) I'm not so lucky. I am not sure if the problem is the removable media, or the upper two heads. I'll grab another piece of media shortly and find out. This means that shortly I should be able to supply anyone who wants one - a 7906 disc cartridge with a complete set of HP diagnostics! I really need to boot up DOS so I can dump the diagnostics library to bootable mag tape too. Jay West From mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com Tue Sep 30 19:25:27 2003 From: mail.list at analog-and-digital-solutions.com (Mail List) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:12 2005 Subject: sanyo lat-200a. In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030930172029.007b21e0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <20030930121212.GA5071@trashcan.ds7> <3.0.6.32.20030929161145.007dc320@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <20030928200802.GA387@trashcan.ds7> <20030929095146.GA1945@trashcan.ds7> <3.0.6.32.20030929161145.007dc320@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030930202149.00a79020@mail.analog-and-digital-solutions.com> > *FWIW a lot of the passive backplane systems use cards with an extra > connector similar to the old VLB cards. They call it PICMIG. I don't know > the details of it. It's the PCI extension. PICMIG = PCI Industrial Computer Manufacturers Group a consortium of over 500 individual industrial computer product vendors established in 1994. Its' mission is to extend the PCI standard, as approved by the PCI Special Interest Group (PCI SIG), for computer systems such as passive backplane PCI/ISA and the CompactPCI Eurocard form factor. http://www.trentonprocessors.com/support/picmg.html At 05:20 PM 9/30/03 -0400, you wrote: >At 02:12 PM 9/30/03 +0200, you wrote: > >On Mon, Sep 29, 2003 at 04:11:45PM -0400, Joe wrote: > >> >> what 'passive backplane' should do? > >> > >> There's no active components on the "backplane". OK there mayu be a few > >> LEDs of something to show presense of power but no vital components vital > >> to the system. The S-100 backplanes are a good example. The CPU, system > >> memory, video circuits, I/O ports etc are all on plug in cards. > > > >ok, but can i safely assume that connector between this board > >and backplane is a normal ISA bus and stick it into a strange ISA... > > Yes you can assume that it's a standard ISA connector if it looks ike >one. There are some cards that have an extra connector but those will be >obvious.* BUT even if it has a standard ISA connector you can not just plug >it into a standard motherboard that already has CPU and memory. If you do, >you will be connecting the outputs of the memory, CPU etc on one board to >the outputs of memory, CPU etc of the other board. If any of the outputs >are not in the same logic state (hi or Lo), and it's a near certainty that >they're not, then they will try to force the other outputs and WILL burn up >something. I didn't see the first part of this thread so I don't know the >details of the card that you have. If it's a CPU or memory card, don't try >to use it in a computer with a motherboard! If it's an I/O card then it's >probably safe to use with a motherboard. > > > >hm, splitter? (don't know the proper word, it has one male ISA edge > >connector, two female ISA sockets and three decoupling capacitors) > >with wires from PSU connected to the proper bus pins? > > In the PC industry those are usually called riser cards. They plug into >the motherboard and stick up and you can plug several standard PC cards >into them. The PC cards will then lay parallel to the motherboard instead >of perpendicular as in the orginal PCs. That style system is called NTX. > > But to answer your question, yes you can make you own passive backplane >using a riser card. Some backplanes have the keyboard and reset signals >routed through them but most of the CPU cards for those systems can get the >keyboard signals via the backplane or through some kind of wiring adapater >that runs directly from the CPU card to the keyboard port in the case. > > BTW where are you located? I have some extra backplanes here (Florida). >I can probably send you one. > > *FWIW a lot of the passive backplane systems use cards with an extra >connector similar to the old VLB cards. They call it PICMIG. I don't know >the details of it. > > Joe > > > > > From jwest at classiccmp.org Tue Sep 30 19:28:50 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:12 2005 Subject: HP stuff available Message-ID: <000f01c387b2$fc8ddd70$6400a8c0@HPLAPTOP> I have a couple 6 foot HP racks that will be available shortly. Pretty nice racks actually. They are not the really old brownish/green racks, they are the slightly less old cream colored racks. Nothing inside them :) From jwest at classiccmp.org Tue Sep 30 19:30:39 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:12 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes References: <009b01c3870b$d046d980$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk><36259.64.169.63.74.1064902793.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> <3F7A0DB8.20906@tiac.net> Message-ID: <001701c387b3$3d5c22d0$6400a8c0@HPLAPTOP> actually, I could use about 4 of the 7 inch reels. Trade? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Shannon" To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2003 6:11 PM Subject: Re: 9 track reel tapes > I could use some reels of 9-track tape, 7-inch reels are fine with me! > > > > > From cisin at xenosoft.com Tue Sep 30 19:39:06 2003 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:12 2005 Subject: Epson RC-20 : Looking for software and cable In-Reply-To: <3F797B38.8443.42BCDFD@localhost> References: <3F797B38.8443.42BCDFD@localhost> Message-ID: <20030930172704.W16336@newshell.lmi.net> On Tue, 30 Sep 2003, Stan Sieler wrote: > Hi, > I just got an Epson RC-20 ... > with no software and with no cable :( > I'm looking for software, naturally :) > And, if anyone has a cable or information > about how to make a cable, I'd be interested! THAT is rare. (The RC-20 is a wristwatch computer from early to mid 80's with an imitation Z80, touch screen, and serial port) It was never exported. Is your RC-20 working? The software in mine was all Japanese. I never could figure out how to tell the "World Clock" program that Honolulu was WEST of us. The cable is a three conductor ("stereo") "ultra-mini" (smaller than walkman). Ground, transmit, receive - I don't know pinout, but I may have it somewhere. I have a book for it, (that might have the cable pinout) that has a bunch of sample programs - fairly straightforward Z80 code, but all comments, messages, explanations, etc. are in Japanese. A friend, who I haven't heard from in 15 years, had one and needed to reload the software. In Japan she bought an accessory for it that had a ZIF socket and cable to the watch. She insisted that it was called a "ROM ROADER". (Katakana doesn't differentiate between R and L sounds) I don't think that I can dig it out before VCF, but I'll try. -- Fred Cisin cisin@xenosoft.com From vcf at siconic.com Tue Sep 30 20:02:23 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:12 2005 Subject: Bruker Aspect 3000 computer and drives available In-Reply-To: <000201c387b0$51c82190$6501a8c0@DCOHOE> Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Sep 2003, Dan Cohoe wrote: > At my favorite salvage spot near Rochester the other day I noticed a Bruker > rack with an ASPECT 3000 mini, two 8" floppy drives (FDD 280) and a hard > drive (BDS 160). Lots of cables as well. > > It appears from Google that this would mostly be used for NMR Spectroscopy, > but if anyone is interested, I expect its available for a quite reasonable > price as long as you speak up quickly. This makes some sense. The Nicolet 1080 that I have, which is branded Bruker Data Systems (Bruker was acquired by NIC at some point I gather) is part of a larger console that used to be connected to an NMR chamber. In case you've never seen it, here's the cheezy Nicolet 1080 page I started on but never quite finished: http://www.vintage.org/nicolet/nicolet.htm -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Sep 30 20:04:39 2003 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:12 2005 Subject: interesting finds: Matrox VME Video card, AST Advantage Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030930210439.007bddb0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Stopped and looked through a bunch of scrap today. Found a Matrox VG-640 video card for the VME bus. Does anyone have any specs on this? Google didn't find ANY hits for it. Also picked up an AST Advantage card with the Advantage Pak daughterboard. Anyone need it? OT stuff: Also picked up a Beckman UV 5270 SpectroPhotometer. Man this thing is loaded! Will try to re-assemble it and get it working in a few days. Joe From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 30 20:05:36 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:12 2005 Subject: More Stuff available In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I wrote: > - an Apple II Technical Manual > an unsoldered, virgin AppleII clone board, once sold by > Eijlander Electronice in Ede, The Netherlands. I never > got around to assembling it, so its still virgin. Kiddies... read that AGAIN. The *board* is virgin. I am *not* offering *a* virgin. Duh! :) Just so yall know... Fred (who spent WAY too much time in his dirty basement today) -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From waltje at pdp11.nl Tue Sep 30 20:13:36 2003 From: waltje at pdp11.nl (Fred N. van Kempen) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:12 2005 Subject: Digital Group ? Message-ID: All, OK, so I just got bombed with requests for the Digital Group stuff. Which reminds me... what is/was so special about that company (from Colorado, I believe) or their systems? I used to have the whole nine yards of their stuff... about, oh, 8 or 10 2cuFt boxes or so. The only thing I liked in the system was that funky tape drive system... Phideck or something like that. Threw it all away (...) when I moved to the U.S. in '93, and had no more space in the shipping container :) These docs were strange leftovers from that.. must have forgotten to pack them at the time. Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje@pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA From jwest at classiccmp.org Tue Sep 30 20:53:08 2003 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:12 2005 Subject: Equipment Available Message-ID: <002c01c387be$c3792ba0$6400a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Yes, I have received everyones emails about this gear. I am still working out the particulars for who can get what, who responded first, etc.... I'll be in touch with all who expressed interest. Jay West From healyzh at aracnet.com Tue Sep 30 21:20:52 2003 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:12 2005 Subject: PDP 11/73 SLU In-Reply-To: <1064967860.3654.8.camel@unix> from "Christopher McNabb" at Sep 30, 2003 08:24:20 PM Message-ID: <200310010220.h912Kq9E019657@onyx.spiritone.com> > I really have no need for all the custom stuff and would just as soon > remove it as use it. I do have a spare DHV11 here that I could put in > the box, but I do not know if the DHV11 can be used as a standard serial > console. I think what you really need is a DLV11J. I used one for several years as my console, and a WQESD/04 as my bootroms. Zane From vcf at siconic.com Tue Sep 30 21:51:24 2003 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:12 2005 Subject: Digital Group ? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 1 Oct 2003, Fred N. van Kempen wrote: > OK, so I just got bombed with requests for the Digital Group > stuff. Which reminds me... what is/was so special about that > company (from Colorado, I believe) or their systems? Nothing other than it was one of the very earliest of the homebrew kit computer companies, and they made fairly wacky stuff, like the Phideck and multiple processor systems. They're sort of on par with OSI in terms of obscurity: not a whole lot of systems around. It's too bad you tossed your hardware :( -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ] From nico at farumdata.dk Tue Sep 30 23:40:26 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:12 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes References: <009b01c3870b$d046d980$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk><36259.64.169.63.74.1064902793.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com><3F7A0DB8.20906@tiac.net> <001701c387b3$3d5c22d0$6400a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Message-ID: <008001c387d6$71b452a0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jay West" To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2003 2:30 AM Subject: Re: 9 track reel tapes > actually, I could use about 4 of the 7 inch reels. Trade? > > As I said to Bob : 450 grams each, excl outer packing. Shop a bit around for shipping costs, and let me know how many you want. I have about 30-35 in stock. Nico From nico at farumdata.dk Tue Sep 30 23:37:55 2003 From: nico at farumdata.dk (Nico de Jong) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:12 2005 Subject: 9 track reel tapes References: <009b01c3870b$d046d980$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk><36259.64.169.63.74.1064902793.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> <3F7A0DB8.20906@tiac.net> Message-ID: <007f01c387d6$7192c0e0$2101a8c0@farumdata.dk> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Shannon" To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2003 1:11 AM Subject: Re: 9 track reel tapes > I could use some reels of 9-track tape, 7-inch reels are fine with me! > 1 7" reel weighs 450 grams = 1 UK pound. How many do you want ? Dont forget shipping costs ! Most reels I'm talking about have been used once or twice as release tapes for Philips PTS 6000 systems. Please mail me offline for evtl further details Nico (Denmark) From Ksessions at TroyCable.net Tue Sep 30 17:07:33 2003 From: Ksessions at TroyCable.net (Ken Sessions) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:13 2005 Subject: IIGs Vulcan & RAmKeeper Message-ID: <000801c3879f$403104d0$6501a8c0@k7somxppro> Can you supply any info on these two? Any info APPRECIATED! Thanks,Kenny From jack.rubin at ameritech.net Tue Sep 30 20:29:11 2003 From: jack.rubin at ameritech.net (Jack Rubin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:40:13 2005 Subject: Hayes S100 modem (80-103A) commands Message-ID: <000001c387bb$6c90aa00$1f6fa8c0@eths.k12.il.us> Sorry - I wasn't paying too much attention to this thread, but I have the manual for the Hayes S100 modem (80-103A) which includes a short modem control program written in 1977 by Dale Heatherington (the co-founder of DC Hayes; guess who was the marketing guy and who was the engineer!). Control was by bit-setting a couple of control bytes to handle bit (baud) rate (high/low - typically 300/110 bps, but low rate could also be set to 75 or 134.5 bps). Other bits set transmit enable (on/off), mode select (answer/originate), break, self-test, ring indicator, and off hook. The manual includes a chapter on "Applications". Section 5.5 Telecommuting is reproduced here: "The energy situation being what it is, more and more people are seriously considering alternatives to commuting. If your job consists mostly of slaving over a hot computer terminal, the 80-103A may offer an economical way for your job to come to you instead of the other way around. Of course you would want to make an occasional trip to the office for meetings, but think how much pain and energy you could save. You might even be able to move to that beautiful valley 'way up there in the mountains..." Of course the hot setup was the PMMI modem which could be overclocked to 450 baud, but Don Brown died in the late '70s (?) and the company disappeared. But what the world was really waiting for was a good 1200 baud modem... Jack Rubin USRobotics 1984-95