From jarkko.teppo at er-grp.com Mon Jul 1 00:34:25 2002 From: jarkko.teppo at er-grp.com (jarkko.teppo@er-grp.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:51 2005 Subject: HP 9000/300 (And some Help Needed) In-Reply-To: <0206261311270B.00704@simon> References: <0206261311270B.00704@simon> Message-ID: <20020701053425.GA9941@mail.er-grp.com> On Wed, Jun 26, 2002 at 01:11:27PM -0500, Tarsi wrote: > Recent Acquire: HP 9000/300 in a rolling case, quite sexy. > > HP 9000/300 in two cases that link together through a many-pinned connector. The top-case is just an expander. I've been toying around with the idea of adding a third DIO-expander but that'd probably wreak havoc with signal timing and stuff. > > TOP CASE > > *Card 1 > HP4BL REV C > 49A > Has an Intel 80286-8mHz CPU on it http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF8&threadm=75885b%24rs2%241%40verkko.uwasa.fi&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Ftab%3Dwg%26sa%3DN%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26oe%3DUTF8%26q%3Djarkko%2Bteppo%2B286 Sorry for the ridiculous URL. It's a HP DOS co-processor card. I've got one but no software. > Card 2 > HP 98658A SCSI Controller Nice to have :) I haven't seen that many of them. > *Card 2 > CPU Card - Motorola M68030 > A-2903-40 > 2922-6135 I couldn't find anything with those numbers but I didn't look hard. What are the magic numbers on the crystal ? It might be a 9000/370. -- jht From jarkko.teppo at er-grp.com Mon Jul 1 01:22:10 2002 From: jarkko.teppo at er-grp.com (jarkko.teppo@er-grp.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:53 2005 Subject: Question about DECservers In-Reply-To: <005001c21efe$66695220$6c469280@y5f3q8> References: <200206282103.g5SL3K721338@shell1.aracnet.com> <005001c21efe$66695220$6c469280@y5f3q8> Message-ID: <20020701062210.GA10794@mail.er-grp.com> On Fri, Jun 28, 2002 at 07:46:13PM -0400, Robert Schaefer wrote: > > The 100 is LAT-only. Not a problem if you plug it in to a VAXherd, but it > might be a limiting factor if you want to use it in a non-VMS application. > I've been trying to get time to test this: http://theory.lcs.mit.edu/~fredette/latd/ with a DECServer 200MC but I haven't had the time (yet). Looks like fun though. Trick(y) question: What was the first non-DEC lat/decnet terminal server ? (I've got one with 32 out of possible 128 ports :) -- jht From eric at brouhaha.com Mon Jul 1 02:01:52 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:53 2005 Subject: Questions about Central Point Deluxe Option board In-Reply-To: <3D1F4268.F68336CF@gifford.co.uk> References: <3D1F4268.F68336CF@gifford.co.uk> Message-ID: <35322.64.169.63.74.1025506912.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> > Actually, I didn't notice any RAM on the board that was scanned > and put up on the web. But I did notice a little 8-pin chip that > I didn't recognise. A Google search for "UM8326" revealed > this information about a board called "Transcopy": That's a data separator for FM and MFM data. Using that chip, there is no way to read other formats like GCR. So it's not equivalent to the Central Point stuff. The Central Point boards let the software read the raw data from the drive at a point *before* any data separation would be done in a "normal" disk controller. From lgwalker at mts.net Mon Jul 1 02:28:46 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:53 2005 Subject: DEC 350 Message-ID: <3D1FBE5E.32551.31AD4F7@localhost> On a run to the local dump I came up with a DEC 350. It is missing the center HD. My buddy who spotted it and pulled it out swore it had the central section before we lugged it down from a pile of scrap. He gave me the model so it must have been there. I am debating whether it's worth the effort to go back and find it or is it not too difficult to replace. It has 4cards in the cage and the 2 daughter boards. lawrence lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From jarkko.teppo at er-grp.com Mon Jul 1 05:50:29 2002 From: jarkko.teppo at er-grp.com (Jarkko Teppo) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:53 2005 Subject: Question about DECservers In-Reply-To: <20020701062210.GA10794@mail.er-grp.com> References: <20020701062210.GA10794@mail.er-grp.com> Message-ID: <62633.62.148.198.97.1025520629.squirrel@mail.er-grp.com> > > Trick(y) question: What was the first non-DEC lat/decnet terminal > server ? (I've got one with 32 out of possible 128 ports :) Oh, am I full of it today. I just started thinking about it and now I'm not so sure that Datability is actually the correct answer. Could be Emulex or someone else. Anyone know for sure ? Anyway, I've got one Vista VCP-1000 and it's pretty nice. telnet/lat and other nifty stuff. Goes in nicely with the rest of my "forgotten manufacturers" networking equipment (synoptics, DEC etc.) :-) -- jht From jfoust at threedee.com Mon Jul 1 07:45:44 2002 From: jfoust at threedee.com (John Foust) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:53 2005 Subject: Fwd: Teletype model 33 TBP in UK Message-ID: <5.0.0.25.0.20020701074521.03a18b60@pc> Return-Path: Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 17:31:37 +0100 From: Cheryl Williams Reply-To: chezzy.williams@virgin.net Organization: Netscape Online member Subject: Teletype machine for preservation Hi, I have a Teletype model 33 TBP that I need to get rid of. I have had this for years and obtained it as part of a deal when I bought a Commodore VIC 20 many moons ago. The unit is (I believe) in full working order. Would you be aware of anyone in the UK who might be interested in preserving this unit. If so could you please forward details to me a.s.a.p. regards, Ed Williams please reply to ed.williams@virgin.net From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Mon Jul 1 09:05:19 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:53 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: <3D1FBE5E.32551.31AD4F7@localhost> Message-ID: <20020701140520.87683.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> --- Lawrence Walker wrote: > On a run to the local dump I came up with a DEC 350. It is missing the > center HD... He gave me the model so it must have been there... RD51? RD52? > I am debating whether it's worth the effort to go > back and find it or is it not too difficult to replace. The RD50 is a real Seagate ST-506, the RD51 is an ST-412 and the RD52 is one of several 30MB MFM drives including a Quantum 540. How hard it is to replace is up to the scarcity of MFM drives in your area. > It has 4cards in the cage and the 2 daughter boards. Mine has a full boat: a double-card video card set, two CTI bus RAM cards, a floppy controller and a hard disk controller. I'd give handle numbers, but they are not here with me. Those daughter cards can be upgraded from 128K to 512K by replacing the 4164 DRAMs with 41256s and adding W1 and W2. Not sure if you pull both cards and install one upgrade or if you can install two 512K cards; haven't tried it yet. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com From allain at panix.com Mon Jul 1 10:25:39 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:53 2005 Subject: non DEC drives (was: DEC 350) References: <20020701140520.87683.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <027101c22113$8e9f6060$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> > How hard it is to replace is up to the > scarcity of MFM drives in your area. Does DEC, for example with the RQDX3, only accept the RD5{0..4} _geometries_ with this controller or can there be others. Could a larger drive be used in a "waste some tracks" mode with the RQDX3? This all assumes a seperate formatter, mv2000 or XXDDP. John A. From mbg at TheWorld.com Mon Jul 1 12:42:56 2002 From: mbg at TheWorld.com (Megan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:53 2005 Subject: non DEC drives (was: DEC 350) References: <20020701140520.87683.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200207011742.NAA3768719@shell.TheWorld.com> >Does DEC, for example with the RQDX3, only accept the RD5{0..4} >_geometries_ with this controller or can there be others. Could a larger >drive be used in a "waste some tracks" mode with the RQDX3? This all >assumes a seperate formatter, mv2000 or XXDDP. Somewhere I have a set of the sources for the RQDX1/2 boards. They were designed to recognize certain disks from certain vendors. The code does not make much attempt to truly determine geometry, it uses hard-wired values, which is why only certain ones work. I have no doubt that when the RQDX3 was done it was implemented in the same way... that only certain disks from certain vendors would be recognized. To have it recognize another disk, you would have to add an entry to the disk characteristics table in the source for the firmware and blast a new set of ROMs. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | email: gentry at zk3.dec.com (work) | | Unix Support Engineering Group | mbg at world.std.com (home) | | Hewlett Packard | (s/ at /@/) | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 (DEC '77-'98) | required." - mbg KB1FCA | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ From hjagnew at mba1.mba-consulting.com Mon Jul 1 12:39:00 2002 From: hjagnew at mba1.mba-consulting.com (H. Jared Agnew) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:54 2005 Subject: help with majordomo Message-ID: <200207011739.g61Hd0R11530@mba1.mba-consulting.com> I'm really sorry to post but I have no choice, there is no admin link on the web page that tells me where else to go for problem resolution. I want to unsubscribe from the list but huey.classiccmp.org is not accepting mail for majordomo. Here is a copy of my session with smtp. Thanks for any help! Jared hjagnew:mba1:~/mail > telnet huey.classiccmp.org 25 Trying 209.145.140.36... Connected to huey.classiccmp.org. Escape character is '^]'. 220 huey.classiccmp.org ESMTP Sendmail 8.11.6/8.11.6; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 12:41:01 -0500 (CDT) HELO mba1.mba-consulting.com 250 huey.classiccmp.org Hello hjagnew@mba1.mba-consulting.com [207.154.57.74], pleased to meet you MAIL FROM: hjagnew@mba1.mba-consulting.com 250 2.1.0 hjagnew@mba1.mba-consulting.com... Sender ok RCPT To: majordomo@classiccmp.org 550 5.1.1 majordomo@classiccmp.org... User unknown quit 221 2.0.0 huey.classiccmp.org closing connection Connection closed by foreign host. From jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de Mon Jul 1 12:45:17 2002 From: jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de (Jochen Kunz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:54 2005 Subject: non DEC drives (was: DEC 350) In-Reply-To: <027101c22113$8e9f6060$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06>; from allain@panix.com on Mon, Jul 01, 2002 at 17:25:39 CEST References: <20020701140520.87683.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> <027101c22113$8e9f6060$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <20020701194517.C204960@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> On 2002.07.01 17:25 John Allain wrote: > Does DEC, for example with the RQDX3, only > accept the RD5{0..4} _geometries_ with this > controller or can there be others. Could a larger > drive be used in a "waste some tracks" mode > with the RQDX3? Hmmm. I dim remember that I have read somwhere on the net, that the geometry info is written onto the disk. The RQDX3 reads this and will be able to use any disk, if it is already formated properly. (E.g. on a VS2k.) Ahh: http://vaxarchive.sevensages.org/hw/vs2000/fmtbob.html -- tsch??, Jochen Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/ From ccraft at springsips.com Mon Jul 1 13:09:12 2002 From: ccraft at springsips.com (Chris Craft) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:54 2005 Subject: Fw: DEC Vax 6000-310 In-Reply-To: <3D1DD80C.7D54D8CC@liveround.com> References: <004f01c21efe$65a788c0$6c469280@y5f3q8> <3D1DD80C.7D54D8CC@liveround.com> Message-ID: <20020701180907.753676125F@mamacass.springsips.com> Heh... I have family in the area and might be able to jump up to a machine with much more VCF (VAX Coolness Factor). :) Regards, Chris, VAX Fanatic On Saturday 29 June 2002 09:53, you wrote: > Wow..Unfortunately, while I'm probably the closest VAX enthusiast, I really > can't justify the VUPS/meter^3 - if I had the room for it, I would grab it, > but I'm very soon going to be forced to clean out the one space I have to > store inactive stuff, and I can't get something that size down my basement > stairs (really - I've got a fridge and a washer/drier that I hope never > break, cause they're stuck down here). From fmc at reanimators.org Mon Jul 1 13:08:37 2002 From: fmc at reanimators.org (Frank McConnell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:54 2005 Subject: help with majordomo In-Reply-To: "H. Jared Agnew"'s message of "Mon, 1 Jul 2002 13:39:00 -0400 (EDT)" References: <200207011739.g61Hd0R11530@mba1.mba-consulting.com> Message-ID: <200207011808.g61I8bN3008694@daemonweed.reanimators.org> "H. Jared Agnew" wrote: > I'm really sorry to post but I have no choice, there is no admin link > on the web page that tells me where else to go for problem resolution. > I want to unsubscribe from the list but huey.classiccmp.org is not > accepting mail for majordomo. Here is a copy of my session with smtp. In the header of every message sent to this list is the following: List-Unsubscribe: , -Frank McConnell From RCini at congressfinancial.com Mon Jul 1 10:17:17 2002 From: RCini at congressfinancial.com (Cini, Richard) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:54 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] PC board storage Message-ID: <69DBC74E5784D6119BEA0090271EB8E5126C02@MAIL10> Hello, all: I'm seeking opinions on long-term PC board storage. Is it better for longer term storage of "classic" boards to individually pack them in "metal out" static bags and store them in conventional cardboard boxes or should I buy a few static dissipative cardboard boxes or Bentron plastic totes and store the boards there? Rich _______________________________________________ cctech mailing list cctech@classiccmp.org http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From mmcfadden at cmh.edu Mon Jul 1 11:40:15 2002 From: mmcfadden at cmh.edu (McFadden, Mike) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: Help booting CTOS/BTOS Message-ID: Doc I have 3 or 4 CTOS/BTOS machines, power supplies and cables. One of the machines has a hard disk and a floopy. I suspect there is an OS on the hard disk. I don't have a console terminal. I'll try and look at it this week. mike mmcfadden@cmh.edu -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020701/ac4488c0/attachment.html From cisin at xenosoft.com Mon Jul 1 13:42:43 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: help with majordomo In-Reply-To: <200207011739.g61Hd0R11530@mba1.mba-consulting.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 1 Jul 2002, H. Jared Agnew wrote: > I'm really sorry to post but I have no choice, there is no admin link > on the web page that tells me where else to go for problem resolution. > I want to unsubscribe from the list but huey.classiccmp.org is not > accepting mail for majordomo. Hmmm. Could that be because majordomo is NOT the list management program being used? I think that this list is run using mailman. Is there a REASON why you did your attempt to send email to majordomo by telneting in instead of sending email from your machine? > Here is a copy of my session with smtp. > > Thanks for any help! > > Jared > > hjagnew:mba1:~/mail > telnet huey.classiccmp.org 25 > Trying 209.145.140.36... > Connected to huey.classiccmp.org. > Escape character is '^]'. > 220 huey.classiccmp.org ESMTP Sendmail 8.11.6/8.11.6; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 12:41:01 -0500 (CDT) > HELO mba1.mba-consulting.com > 250 huey.classiccmp.org Hello hjagnew@mba1.mba-consulting.com [207.154.57.74], pleased to meet you > MAIL FROM: hjagnew@mba1.mba-consulting.com > 250 2.1.0 hjagnew@mba1.mba-consulting.com... Sender ok > RCPT To: majordomo@classiccmp.org > 550 5.1.1 majordomo@classiccmp.org... User unknown > quit > 221 2.0.0 huey.classiccmp.org closing connection > Connection closed by foreign host. From foo at siconic.com Mon Jul 1 13:43:20 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues In-Reply-To: <3D1F481A.4060605@chisp.net> Message-ID: On Sun, 30 Jun 2002, Michael Maginnis wrote: > Maybe it's time to drag my two Lisa 1's out of storage... > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2033627836 > > And the reserve isn't even met yet! The reserve was met at $10,000, which is exactly the value that I would place on a working Lisa 1 of this caliber, with the accessories included. I know of around maybe a dozen in existence now (with you having two that brings the total up :) I need to start a Lisa 1 registry. Who's got one (or two)? Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From foo at siconic.com Mon Jul 1 13:52:23 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues In-Reply-To: <3D1F481A.4060605@chisp.net> Message-ID: On Sun, 30 Jun 2002, Michael Maginnis wrote: > Maybe it's time to drag my two Lisa 1's out of storage... > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2033627836 > > And the reserve isn't even met yet! The seller (lenny15) has had a ton of early Apple ][ and Lisa stuff up for sale in the past month. My guess is that he bought out the crusty old inventory of a former Apple dealer. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From mythtech at mac.com Mon Jul 1 13:57:45 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues Message-ID: >I need to start a Lisa 1 registry. Who's got one (or two)? Who's got one (or two) and wants to give one to ME? And when is a working 128k going to pull 10 g's? I have two of those I could hock (and one dead one). -chris From doc at mdrconsult.com Mon Jul 1 14:07:43 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: Help booting CTOS/BTOS In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 1 Jul 2002, McFadden, Mike wrote: > Doc > I have 3 or 4 CTOS/BTOS machines, power supplies and cables. One of the > machines has a hard disk and a floopy. I suspect there is an OS on the hard > disk. I don't have a console terminal. I'll try and look at it this week. Cool! I believe, from what I've been reading, you can use a serial terminal on "RS232 1" as a console. I've posted questions about it on comp.sys.unisys and alt.folklore.computers (there's been a lot of traffic there about the B-series), and if all else fails, Unisys still sells BTOS command references. :( Doc From foo at siconic.com Mon Jul 1 14:18:45 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 1 Jul 2002, Chris wrote: > >I need to start a Lisa 1 registry. Who's got one (or two)? > > Who's got one (or two) and wants to give one to ME? > > And when is a working 128k going to pull 10 g's? I have two of those I > could hock (and one dead one). Wait another 20 years on that. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From cisin at xenosoft.com Mon Jul 1 14:25:44 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: Questions about Central Point Deluxe Option board In-Reply-To: <35322.64.169.63.74.1025506912.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: > > Actually, I didn't notice any RAM on the board that was scanned > > and put up on the web. But I did notice a little 8-pin chip that > > I didn't recognise. A Google search for "UM8326" revealed On Mon, 1 Jul 2002, Eric Smith wrote: > That's a data separator for FM and MFM data. Using that chip, there is > no way to read other formats like GCR. So it's not equivalent to the > Central Point stuff. > no way to read other formats like GCR. So it's not equivalent to the > Central Point stuff. Is, or is not, the picture being discussed a picture of an option board? > The Central Point boards let the software read the raw data from the > drive at a point *before* any data separation would be done in a "normal" > disk controller. The option board was designed for making unauthorized copies of copy protected software. Being able to read non-MFM diskettes was a bonus, NOT part of the original primary design goals. It actually has some serious difficulties with trying to read some non-MFM formats. If it uses a UM8326, that could account for some of the problems. 'course being able to read some other stuff was VERY handy, in being able to point to a use for it OTHER THAN piracy. Brown of Central Point was VERY adament that the board was NOT a tool for piracy, even though that's all that most folks ever used it for. From meltie at myrealbox.com Mon Jul 1 14:24:04 2002 From: meltie at myrealbox.com (Alex White) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: help with majordomo In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1025551447.2484.1.camel@stolichnaya.meltie.mine.nu> On Mon, 2002-07-01 at 19:42, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > On Mon, 1 Jul 2002, H. Jared Agnew wrote: > > I'm really sorry to post but I have no choice, there is no admin link > > on the web page that tells me where else to go for problem resolution. > > I want to unsubscribe from the list but huey.classiccmp.org is not > > accepting mail for majordomo. > > Hmmm. Could that be because majordomo is NOT the list management program > being used? I think that this list is run using mailman. > > Is there a REASON why you did your attempt to send email to majordomo by > telneting in instead of sending email from your machine? Probably to see what the error was instead of seeing mails to what was believed to be the correct address just not go through. Putting it in the headers is a nice touch but hardly the first place i'd look for unsub info. Alex -- Live like you will never die, love like you've never been hurt, dance like no-one is watching. Boink like she's the first woman you've ever seen naked. From mythtech at mac.com Mon Jul 1 14:31:24 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues Message-ID: >> And when is a working 128k going to pull 10 g's? I have two of those I >> could hock (and one dead one). > >Wait another 20 years on that. Think my credit card bank will take that as an answer :-) -chris From foo at siconic.com Mon Jul 1 14:29:32 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card Message-ID: I found a few interesting cards for the Apple ][ the other day. On it are the markings "Computer Networking Specialists" with a copyright of 1988. It has two whole chips: a 6116 and a PAL. The remaining components are three caps, one which has blown. In fact, of all the cards I found, they all have the same cap blown, in some cases completely obliterated with only the two leads remaining with only a huge swath of soot in the path of the explosion. The cap seems to filter the ground line (it goes from what I believe is the GND pin on the ICs to the ground plane on the card). Each computer with the card had a cable with an RJ-45 connector on one end and a four-pin flat connector on the other protuding from the case. I found other computers without the card but with the cable. The inside end of the cable (with the 4-pin connector) was loose. There is no mating connector on the card for it either. It seems to me that these computers were part of some network scheme, and that these cards possibly held some networking firmware. How the cap blew off the cards is a mystery. I could imagine a power spike coming down the network cable and damaging the card, but like I said, the cable didn't plug directly into the card, and I can't imagine the Apple ][ bus passing along a power surge to the card from the cable. I didn't bother to check any of the Apple's that I pulled the cards from to see if they were working. Anyway, anyone have any knowledge of these? Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From foo at siconic.com Mon Jul 1 14:29:51 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 1 Jul 2002, Sellam Ismail wrote: > On Mon, 1 Jul 2002, Chris wrote: > > > >I need to start a Lisa 1 registry. Who's got one (or two)? > > > > Who's got one (or two) and wants to give one to ME? > > > > And when is a working 128k going to pull 10 g's? I have two of those I > > could hock (and one dead one). > > Wait another 20 years on that. Or until another dot.com gold rush, whichever comes first. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From lgwalker at mts.net Mon Jul 1 14:42:01 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: <20020701140520.87683.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> References: <3D1FBE5E.32551.31AD4F7@localhost> Message-ID: <3D206A39.19258.5BA3BC8@localhost> Scored !! I went back to the dump today and found the missing cover-plate but no HD. BUT there was another 350 complete with face-plate, HD, and cables. It had a handwritten tape "last used in Dec.xx/99" The RX50s on one had a label pasted over a previous one dated 22jun1992. possibly reconditioned ? The previous owners were an international Gas corp. Since this is in the middle of nowhere, that explains why they wound up here. Likely hooked up to headquarters. > > RD51? RD52? > RD52. Quantum 540 full-ht. > > I am debating whether it's worth the effort to go > > back and find it or is it not too difficult to replace. > > The RD50 is a real Seagate ST-506, the RD51 is an ST-412 and the RD52 > is one of several 30MB MFM drives including a Quantum 540. How hard it > is to replace is up to the scarcity of MFM drives in your area. > > > It has 4cards in the cage and the 2 daughter boards. > > Mine has a full boat: a double-card video card set, two CTI bus RAM cards, > a floppy controller and a hard disk controller. I'd give handle numbers, > but they are not here with me. > The cards are labeled 000401, 002004, 001002, 000034. The same on both machines. > Those daughter cards can be upgraded from 128K to 512K by replacing the > 4164 DRAMs with 41256s and adding W1 and W2. Not sure if you pull both > cards and install one upgrade or if you can install two 512K cards; haven't > tried it yet. > > -ethan > What's W1 and W2 ? There's no KBds. but IIRC from postings here it can use the lk201's that I have with my Rainbows. I also have VR201 and VR241 monitors which I believe will work. I have some blank 5 1/4 DEC floppies and from discussions here I can use a 'bow to format more for them. I have a DECMATE manual that had system disks but also a demo disk which would work with my r'bow. I wonder if it might also work with the 350. With Tony D's strictures in mind I'll move cautiously before trying to fire them up. Lawrence lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From edick at idcomm.com Mon Jul 1 14:44:38 2002 From: edick at idcomm.com (Richard Erlacher) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: OT: Power Line Carrier communications ... Message-ID: <004501c22137$bddeac40$9cc762d8@dslres-156.idcomm.com> If anyone has some recent COTS-equipment experience with this technology, please contact me off-list. thanks, Dick From celt at chisp.net Mon Jul 1 14:46:52 2002 From: celt at chisp.net (Michael Maginnis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues References: Message-ID: <3D20B1AC.8040207@chisp.net> Sellam Ismail wrote: > On Sun, 30 Jun 2002, Michael Maginnis wrote: > > >>Maybe it's time to drag my two Lisa 1's out of storage... >> >>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2033627836 >> >>And the reserve isn't even met yet! > > > The reserve was met at $10,000, which is exactly the value that I would > place on a working Lisa 1 of this caliber, with the accessories included. > > I know of around maybe a dozen in existence now (with you having two that > brings the total up :) > > I need to start a Lisa 1 registry. Who's got one (or two)? > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > wow. i had no idea they were THAT wanted... i knew they were popular, but... mine are a little dirtier than the one he listed, but were in working condition at last check (about 3 months ago), and have most of the accessories his had. reserve wasn't met when i posted - but it had to be moderator-approved cause of the url... From acme_ent at bellsouth.net Mon Jul 1 14:50:36 2002 From: acme_ent at bellsouth.net (Glen Goodwin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: Apple ][ ignorance Message-ID: <20020701195217.NWIH25736.imf04bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Okay, dug out the Apple ][e, DuoDisk, and ImageWriter II I was given some time back, got a SuperSerial card installed and configured and the ImageWriter II works fine. DuoDisk works too, but what is the command to select a specific drive? At this point all I can read/write to is the boot drive (left-most drive) TIA -- Glen 0/0 If I am not for myself, then who will be for me? And if not now, when? -- Pirkei Avot From mythtech at mac.com Mon Jul 1 15:05:42 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: Apple ][ ignorance Message-ID: >Okay, dug out the Apple ][e, DuoDisk, and ImageWriter II I was given some >time back, got a SuperSerial card installed and configured and the >ImageWriter II works fine. DuoDisk works too, but what is the command to >select a specific drive? > >At this point all I can read/write to is the boot drive (left-most drive) I'm REALLY rusty on my Apple II stuff, but IIRC, you swap drives with the D command (D1 for drive one D2 for drive 2). So for a catalog, it is "catalog D2" to show what is on drive 2. And IIRC once it is issued, it stays on the last drive used, so from there, RUN and similar commands will effect drive 2. You would issue a new "catalog D1" to swap back to drive 1. Ok, that is my rusty as hell rememberance (I haven't done anything on an Apple II in YEARS other than boot them to see if they come on), so I am eager to see just how wrong my memory is. -chris From doc at mdrconsult.com Mon Jul 1 15:08:21 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 1 Jul 2002, Chris wrote: > >> And when is a working 128k going to pull 10 g's? I have two of those I > >> could hock (and one dead one). > > > >Wait another 20 years on that. > > Think my credit card bank will take that as an answer :-) Yeah, sure. American bankers ALWAYS take the long view. Doc From mbg at TheWorld.com Mon Jul 1 15:33:01 2002 From: mbg at TheWorld.com (Megan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: DEC 350 References: <3D1FBE5E.32551.31AD4F7@localhost> Message-ID: <200207012033.QAA3861789@shell.TheWorld.com> >The cards are labeled 000401, 002004, 001002, 000034. The same on both >machines. Then all you probably need for the first Pro350 you got is a drive in the DEC RDxx series. > I have a DECMATE manual that had system disks but also a demo disk >which would work with my r'bow. I wonder if it might also work with the >350. Nope... entirely different instruction architectures... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | email: gentry at zk3.dec.com (work) | | Unix Support Engineering Group | mbg at world.std.com (home) | | Hewlett Packard | (s/ at /@/) | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 (DEC '77-'98) | required." - mbg KB1FCA | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ From fmc at reanimators.org Mon Jul 1 15:47:19 2002 From: fmc at reanimators.org (Frank McConnell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: help with majordomo In-Reply-To: Alex White's message of "01 Jul 2002 20:24:04 +0100" References: <1025551447.2484.1.camel@stolichnaya.meltie.mine.nu> Message-ID: <200207012047.g61KlJMs011741@daemonweed.reanimators.org> Alex White wrote: > Putting it in the headers is a nice touch but hardly the first place i'd > look for unsub info. It seems to be the wave of the present for automated mailing lists. Personally I miss the days when, given a list addressed "list@host", list-request@host could reasonably be assumed to be read by someone who understood words like "please", or at least didn't reply to such words with an error report. I like automated list-management software too, I just don't appreciate the change of the old convention. -Grumpy Ol' Frank From foo at siconic.com Mon Jul 1 16:01:27 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues In-Reply-To: <3D20B1AC.8040207@chisp.net> Message-ID: On Mon, 1 Jul 2002, Michael Maginnis wrote: > wow. i had no idea they were THAT wanted... i knew they were popular, > but... mine are a little dirtier than the one he listed, but were in > working condition at last check (about 3 months ago), and have most of > the accessories his had. They represent the genesis of the Mac as well as the birth of the GUI in the consumer market (the Xerox 8010 beat the Lisa by 2 years but that found its way only into business installations). The Lisa represents one of the most glorious flops of the computer age, but has a lot of significance as a progenitor of what a lot of us use for computers today. Combined with the relative rarity of finding a Lisa 1 intact and working, in my opinion, it is THAT significant. As far as I know, there are less Lisa 1's than Apple 1's. My guess is that over time we'll start to see more and more Lisa 1's come out of the woodwork as word gets around that they're selling for $10K on eBay, and their value will drop. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From foo at siconic.com Mon Jul 1 16:03:22 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: Apple ][ ignorance In-Reply-To: <20020701195217.NWIH25736.imf04bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Message-ID: On Mon, 1 Jul 2002, Glen Goodwin wrote: > Okay, dug out the Apple ][e, DuoDisk, and ImageWriter II I was given some > time back, got a SuperSerial card installed and configured and the > ImageWriter II works fine. DuoDisk works too, but what is the command to > select a specific drive? When you're in DOS (either DOS 3.3 or ProDOS) add a modified to your command when accessing the disk. For instance, to get a catalog of the second drive: CATALOG,D2 You can even access other disk drives attached to cards in other slots: CATALOG,S5,D1 ...will give you the catalog of the disk in drive 1 attached to the controller card in slot 5. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From vaxzilla at jarai.org Mon Jul 1 16:11:17 2002 From: vaxzilla at jarai.org (Brian Chase) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: help with majordomo In-Reply-To: <200207012047.g61KlJMs011741@daemonweed.reanimators.org> Message-ID: On 1 Jul 2002, Frank McConnell wrote: > Alex White wrote: > > Putting it in the headers is a nice touch but hardly the first place i'd > > look for unsub info. > > It seems to be the wave of the present for automated mailing lists. Some e-mail clients, like Pine, recognize those headers and provide the user with options based on their values for unsubscribing and viewing the archived messages. I'm not sure how widely supported those header fields are in current e-mail clients, but it doesn't seem like /too/ bad of a practice. -brian. From ghldbrd at ccp.com Mon Jul 1 16:10:52 2002 From: ghldbrd at ccp.com (Gary Hildebrand) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues References: <3D1F481A.4060605@chisp.net> Message-ID: <3D20C55C.339C0B33@ccp.com> Michael Maginnis wrote: > > Maybe it's time to drag my two Lisa 1's out of storage... > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2033627836 > > And the reserve isn't even met yet! > > /mpm I just saw that the 'winner' paid $10k. This all proves that P.T. Barnum was right when he said, "There's a sucker born every minute." At least that sucker will never be me. Not to that price anyway. Gary Hildebrand St. Joseph, MO From lgwalker at mts.net Mon Jul 1 16:37:26 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: <200207012033.QAA3861789@shell.TheWorld.com> Message-ID: <3D208546.2116.623EBFF@localhost> Yay ! The one with the RX52 fired up using the VR201, displayed the logo and went thru a date thing, loaded P/OS V. 3.1 and, of course started the log- in process demanding a user name and password. Anyone know how I can bypass or disable the name and password ? > >The cards are labeled 000401, 002004, 001002, 000034. The same on both > >machines. > > Then all you probably need for the first Pro350 you got is a drive > in the DEC RDxx series. > > > I have a DECMATE manual that had system disks but also a demo disk > >which would work with my r'bow. I wonder if it might also work with the > >350. > > Nope... entirely different instruction architectures... > I wondered if the Deskmate demo might be some sort of generic disk since it did work on the Rainbow and the Deskmate is also a different architecture. Of course the Deskmate System disks were rejected. Lawrence > Megan Gentry > Former RT-11 Developer > lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Mon Jul 1 17:28:35 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: <3D206A39.19258.5BA3BC8@localhost> Message-ID: <20020701222835.70749.qmail@web10308.mail.yahoo.com> --- Lawrence Walker wrote: > > RD51? RD52? > > > RD52. Quantum 540 full-ht. Nice. Probably the best thing for it. > > Those daughter cards can be upgraded from 128K to 512K by replacing the > > 4164 DRAMs with 41256s and adding W1 and W2. Not sure if you pull both > > cards and install one upgrade or if you can install two 512K cards; > > haven't tried it yet. > > What's W1 and W2 ? Two marked jumper positions on the daughtercard. > There's no KBds. but IIRC from postings here it can use the lk201's that > I have with my Rainbows. Absolutely. > I also have VR201 and VR241 monitors which I believe will work. Yep - the VR201 will work on any Pro350 configuration. Not sure if the VR241 will work if you don't have the color option. Again, I don't have the handle numbers here, but if you have two cards in the CTI cage with a ribbon cable connecting the two, but attached to nothing else, you probably have the color option. In fact, with 4 cards total, I'd suspect you have the color video board set, an RX50 controller and an MFM drive controller. > I have some blank 5 1/4 DEC floppies and from discussions > here I can use a 'bow to format more for them. Yes. You can also use a 5.25" drive in a PC (Teac FD55GFR is one of the best to have for this) and format *double density* blanks for it (the coercitivity of the HD media is different than the DD media - the RX50 uses DD media, formatted single-sided, 80 tracks, rather than double-sided, 40 tracks like for a PC, but it's the same media). -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com From blacklord at telstra.com Mon Jul 1 17:40:38 2002 From: blacklord at telstra.com (blacklord) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: Classic Computer Spider Message-ID: <3db8d33daa93.3daa933db8d3@bigpond.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: Chad Fernandez Date: Saturday, June 29, 2002 1:07 am Subject: Re: Classic Computer Spider > David Barnes wrote: > > and aren't brown recluse spiders VERY dangerous? > > Well not like the Sidney Funnel Web, but yes they are dangerous. SYDNEY!!!! They're *very* nasty, ranks up there as about the most deadly spider in the world, the females bite can kill within 2 hours, the males within 15 minutes. However, they generally don't lurk in old computers :-) Shoes, clothes & beds are better :-) Deaths are fairly rare though, anti venom has been available for some time. This thread recently came up in the Fidonet SF echo too, wonder if it's spreading..... Lance ---------------- Powered by telstra.com From pete at dunnington.u-net.com Mon Jul 1 18:14:33 2002 From: pete at dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: non DEC drives (was: DEC 350) In-Reply-To: Megan "Re: non DEC drives (was: DEC 350)" (Jul 1, 13:42) References: <20020701140520.87683.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> <200207011742.NAA3768719@shell.TheWorld.com> Message-ID: <10207020014.ZM4195@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> On Jul 1, 13:42, Megan wrote: > Somewhere I have a set of the sources for the RQDX1/2 boards. They > were designed to recognize certain disks from certain vendors. The > code does not make much attempt to truly determine geometry, it > uses hard-wired values, which is why only certain ones work. > > I have no doubt that when the RQDX3 was done it was implemented in > the same way... that only certain disks from certain vendors would > be recognized. To have it recognize another disk, you would have > to add an entry to the disk characteristics table in the source > for the firmware and blast a new set of ROMs. Actually, you wouldn't, that's one of the big differences between the RQDX1/2 and RQDX3. The 1/2 perform various tricks to try to work out what disk is connected, especially when formatting. The tricks vary between versions of the firmware, so I have a 10MB Rodime disk which one RQDX2 version will "recognise" and format but other versions won't. Several years ago, I had an interesting email conversation with Chuck O'Toole who wrote the sniffer code (and most of the MSCP, geometry, and access code) for the RQDX1, which is part of the DUP utilities in the firmware. It was intended to autosize certain known drive types that DEC would/might sell, to differentiate between them, and it was known that the succesor (eventually, the RQDX3) would be along later, so there was no great incentive to make it fully general. However, the RQDX3 doesn't depend on the tricks. The formatter doesn't rely on DUP utilities built into the RQDX firmware but uses tables in the formatter software (XXDP ZRQC??.BIN). It only uses the DUP utilities to perform the actual track formatting. There's an option to force it to use a table entry of your choice (including entries for common drives like ST-251 and ST225) and even an option to bypass the tables and enter all the necessary values by hand, though it takes a bit of effort to work out what they all should be for any given drive. Tim Shoppa posted some information to the list in 1997 about the makeup of the various numbers, and I have some more in some manuals which I might be persuaded to dig out if anyone is really enthusiastic. It would still take a bit of exprimentation and guesswork, though. DEC's patent describes the basic ideas and the TLAs: http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=/netahtml/search-bool.html&r=1&f=G&l=50&co1=AND&d=pall&s1=''4,434,487''.WKU.&OS=PN/"4,434,487"&RS=PN/"4,434,487" -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 1 18:35:35 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: from "Sellam Ismail" at Jul 1, 2 12:29:32 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1635 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020702/de69b125/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 1 18:40:12 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: <3D206A39.19258.5BA3BC8@localhost> from "Lawrence Walker" at Jul 1, 2 02:42:01 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1665 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020702/bd7105a8/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 1 18:42:18 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: <200207012033.QAA3861789@shell.TheWorld.com> from "Megan" at Jul 1, 2 04:33:01 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 258 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020702/419bf525/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 1 18:20:42 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: <20020701140520.87683.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> from "Ethan Dicks" at Jul 1, 2 07:05:19 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 534 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020702/a8c68757/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 1 18:22:54 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] PC board storage In-Reply-To: <69DBC74E5784D6119BEA0090271EB8E5126C02@MAIL10> from "Cini, Richard" at Jul 1, 2 11:17:17 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 714 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020702/76ebcf67/attachment.ksh From lgwalker at mts.net Mon Jul 1 19:13:59 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: <20020701222835.70749.qmail@web10308.mail.yahoo.com> References: <3D206A39.19258.5BA3BC8@localhost> Message-ID: <3D20A9F7.25997.6B3441B@localhost> I accessed the FTP site and downloaded some files from the toolkit. It's been a while since I used Teledisk so it should be fun. Is Teledisk the best app for transferring the files. I believe I also have 22disk, RainDos, and Uniform. Sifting thru the various programs I was very impressed by the possible capabilities of the 350. It seems quite a bit more powerful than the Rainbow. I hope it looks for floppies before the passworded HD. They mention that you can make a new startdsk and link it to the old one bypassing the password. The default password is SYSTEM according to a file on the FTP site but doesn't give a substitute for username. Lawrence > > --- Lawrence Walker wrote: > > > RD51? RD52? > > > > > RD52. Quantum 540 full-ht. > > Nice. Probably the best thing for it. > > > > Those daughter cards can be upgraded from 128K to 512K by replacing the 4164 > > > DRAMs with 41256s and adding W1 and W2. Not sure if you pull both cards and > > > install one upgrade or if you can install two 512K cards; haven't tried it > > > yet. > > > > What's W1 and W2 ? > > Two marked jumper positions on the daughtercard. > > > There's no KBds. but IIRC from postings here it can use the lk201's that > > I have with my Rainbows. > > Absolutely. > > > I also have VR201 and VR241 monitors which I believe will work. > > Yep - the VR201 will work on any Pro350 configuration. Not sure if > the VR241 will work if you don't have the color option. Again, I don't > have the handle numbers here, but if you have two cards in the CTI cage > with a ribbon cable connecting the two, but attached to nothing else, > you probably have the color option. In fact, with 4 cards total, I'd > suspect you have the color video board set, an RX50 controller and an > MFM drive controller. > > > I have some blank 5 1/4 DEC floppies and from discussions > > here I can use a 'bow to format more for them. > > Yes. You can also use a 5.25" drive in a PC (Teac FD55GFR is one > of the best to have for this) and format *double density* blanks > for it (the coercitivity of the HD media is different than the DD > media - the RX50 uses DD media, formatted single-sided, 80 tracks, > rather than double-sided, 40 tracks like for a PC, but it's the same > media). > > -ethan > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup > http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From jingber at ix.netcom.com Mon Jul 1 19:38:27 2002 From: jingber at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey H. Ingber) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:56 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues In-Reply-To: <3D1F481A.4060605@chisp.net> References: <3D1F481A.4060605@chisp.net> Message-ID: <1025570310.1183.0.camel@netfinity> I'll hand on to mine, maybe just a little while longer. =) Jeff On Sun, 2002-06-30 at 14:04, Michael Maginnis wrote: > Maybe it's time to drag my two Lisa 1's out of storage... > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2033627836 > > And the reserve isn't even met yet! > > /mpm > > From at258 at osfn.org Mon Jul 1 19:53:52 2002 From: at258 at osfn.org (Merle K. Peirce) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: New Acquisition In-Reply-To: <20020701195217.NWIH25736.imf04bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Message-ID: On Thursday, we rescued a Data General Eclipse S130 from the bowels of the Harvard Cyclotron. It came with an EMI master control console. System seems to date from very early 1980. There was also a spare, but only partially complete S130. M. K. Peirce Rhode Island Computer Museum, Inc. Shady Lea, Rhode Island "Casta est quam nemo rogavit." - Ovid From jingber at ix.netcom.com Mon Jul 1 19:40:19 2002 From: jingber at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey H. Ingber) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1025570422.1240.3.camel@netfinity> On Mon, 2002-07-01 at 14:43, Sellam Ismail wrote: > > I need to start a Lisa 1 registry. Who's got one (or two)? You can add me to your registry, although it's non-operable at the present time. Time to crack it open I think. Jeff > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > From foo at siconic.com Mon Jul 1 20:01:49 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > With those chip, all it can be is a 2K RAM card (with the PAL used as an > address decoder/chip select generator). My guess is that it maps into the > 2K shared ROM space for Apple ][ I/O cards. Yep. > Could it be between the +5V line and ground? Could it be nothing more > than a decoupling capacitor? Tantalum caps do sometimes explode for no > good reason, although to find several boards where this has happened > would be unusual. It was a very cursory examination. It very well may have been between +5 and Ground. I didn't look up any of the chips in a reference because I didn't have the time. > > It seems to me that these computers were part of some network scheme, and > > that these cards possibly held some networking firmware. How the cap blew > > Yes, they probably held the netork drivers, loaded from disk when the > machine booted. But I'm still trying to figure out where the cable went to. Unless there was a second board in another slot involved, I can't figure out how it connected to the computer. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Mon Jul 1 20:28:07 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020702012807.23411.qmail@web10303.mail.yahoo.com> --- Tony Duell wrote: > > Mine has a full boat... > > There are at least 2 other CTI bus cards out there. At least. Might be one or two more. > One is the console interface for the VAXen that used the Pro as the > console. If I could work out how to drive it it might actually be useful > as it seems to contain a couple of serial ports and a GPIB interface. Really?!? I used to have one (my Pro380 was a console to an 8530). I have not seen it in many years. Wish I had it when I was at Lucent as a consultant. They had one die and had to have one same-day shipped from a digital broker - $150 for the card, $200 for shipping. I did go home to look for mine - probably could have gotten the $150 and maybe a little for delivery. :-( I had no idea they were so neat. By "seems to contain..." do you mean that there's a couple of 2661s (or some other UART) and some sort of GPIB chip? (68488? There was a National Semi one, too, ISTR). > The other (which I am told is difficult to find) is the Ethernet card. The elusive DECNA... -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org Mon Jul 1 21:48:10 2002 From: gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org (Gunther Schadow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: VAX11/780 going further Message-ID: <3D21146A.8030307@aurora.regenstrief.org> Hi, today I received the PCS module replacement I needed for the 11/780. And it helped indeed. See the transcript below. I do get some timeout at step 54, please have a look. I don't know what the problem is. May be it was going to test the DW780 and I didn't have the UNIBUS cabinet powered? Thanks, -Gunther CPU HALTED,SOMM CLEAR,STEP=NONE,CLOCK=NORM RAD=HEX,ADD=PHYS,DAT=LONG,FILL=00,REL=00000000 INIT SEQ DONE HALTED AT 00000000 (RELOADING WCS) LOAD DONE, 0800 MICROWORDS LOADED VER: PCS=01 WCS=0E-10 FPLA=0F CON=V07-00-L ?WARNING-WCS & FPLA VER MISMATCH >>>TEST ZZ-ESKAB V14.0 ESKAD -- V13.1 01,02,03,04, NO. OF 1K BANKS OF WCS = 0002 05,06,07,08,09,0A,0B,0C,0D,0E,0F,10,11,12,13,14,15,16,17, 18,19,1A,1B,1C,1D,1E,1F, ESKAH-V13.2 20, SYSTEM ID REGISTER = 0140B63E KE780 FPLA NOT PRESENT 21,22,23,24,25,26,27,28,29,2A,2B,2C,2D,2E, 2F,30,31,32,33,34,35,36,37,38,39,3A,3B,3C, END PASS 0001 MOUNT FLOPPY ZZ-ESZAD & TYPE "DI" MIC>DI ESKAR-V2.0 3D,3E, CPU TR = 00000010 MS780H 256K CHIP AT TR 00000001 LOWER CNTRLLR MAX ADDRESS+1= 01000000 UPPER CNTRLLR MAX ADDRESS+1= 01000000 DW780 AT TR 00000003 RH780 AT TR 00000008 RH780 AT TR 00000009 3F,40,41,42,43,44,45,46,47,48,49,4A,4B,4C,4D,4E,4F,50,51,52, MS780-E/H IO BASE ADDRESS = 20002000 LOWER CONTROLLER MAX ADDR + 1 = 01000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000000 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000001 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000002 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000003 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 MS780-E/H IO BASE ADDRESS = 20002000 UPPER CONTROLLER MAX ADDR + 1 = 01000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000000 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000001 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000002 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000003 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 53, MS780-H 256K CHIP AT TR 00000001 M8376 ROMS OK 54, ?TIMEOUT IN TEST 01FF UPC= 1241 MIC> -- Gunther Schadow, M.D., Ph.D. gschadow@regenstrief.org Medical Information Scientist Regenstrief Institute for Health Care Adjunct Assistant Professor Indiana University School of Medicine tel:1(317)630-7960 http://aurora.regenstrief.org From jhfinepw4z at compsys.to Mon Jul 1 22:26:30 2002 From: jhfinepw4z at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: non DEC drives (was: DEC 350) References: <20020701140520.87683.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> <200207011742.NAA3768719@shell.TheWorld.com> <10207020014.ZM4195@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> Message-ID: <3D211D66.40DE612D@compsys.to> >Pete Turnbull wrote: > > On Jul 1, 13:42, Megan wrote: > > Somewhere I have a set of the sources for the RQDX1/2 boards. They > > were designed to recognize certain disks from certain vendors. The > > code does not make much attempt to truly determine geometry, it > > uses hard-wired values, which is why only certain ones work. > > I have no doubt that when the RQDX3 was done it was implemented in > > the same way... that only certain disks from certain vendors would > > be recognized. To have it recognize another disk, you would have > > to add an entry to the disk characteristics table in the source > > for the firmware and blast a new set of ROMs. > Actually, you wouldn't, that's one of the big differences between the > RQDX1/2 and RQDX3. The 1/2 perform various tricks to try to work out what > disk is connected, especially when formatting. The tricks vary between > versions of the firmware, so I have a 10MB Rodime disk which one RQDX2 > version will "recognise" and format but other versions won't. Several > years ago, I had an interesting email conversation with Chuck O'Toole who > wrote the sniffer code (and most of the MSCP, geometry, and access code) > for the RQDX1, which is part of the DUP utilities in the firmware. It was > intended to autosize certain known drive types that DEC would/might sell, > to differentiate between them, and it was known that the succesor > (eventually, the RQDX3) would be along later, so there was no great > incentive to make it fully general. Jerome Fine replies: A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away, I took two Micropolis 1325 Hard drives (one also had a bit of sticky material with the letters "RD53") plus two MFM controllers, an RQDX2 and an Emulex DM01. I also managed to locate the micronote about the Micropolis 1325 in respect of the jumper "R7". To make a very long story a bit shorter, while both drives worked perfectly with the Emulex DM01 before I added the "R7" jumper to the drive without that bit of sticky material and only one drive worked with the RQDX2, after I added the "R7" jumper, that drive also worked with the RQDX2. This story is no longer very helpful since almost all RD53 and plain vanilla Micropolis 1325 drives no longer function in a reliable manner - I think someone suggested that they could be relied upon to be used as a scratch drive if you could write on them in the first place and then kept the power on. However, can anyone enlighten us as to how DEC managed to use "R7" on a Micropolis 1325 so as to tell the RQDX2 that an RD53 was present if "R7" was jumpered? > However, the RQDX3 doesn't depend on the tricks. The formatter doesn't > rely on DUP utilities built into the RQDX firmware but uses tables in the > formatter software (XXDP ZRQC??.BIN). It only uses the DUP utilities to > perform the actual track formatting. There's an option to force it to use > a table entry of your choice (including entries for common drives like > ST-251 and ST225) and even an option to bypass the tables and enter all the > necessary values by hand, though it takes a bit of effort to work out what > they all should be for any given drive. Tim Shoppa posted some information > to the list in 1997 about the makeup of the various numbers, and I have > some more in some manuals which I might be persuaded to dig out if anyone > is really enthusiastic. It would still take a bit of exprimentation and > guesswork, though. > > DEC's patent describes the basic ideas and the TLAs: > > http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=/netahtml/search-bool.html&r=1&f=G&l=50&co1=AND&d=pall&s1=''4,434,487''.WKU.&OS=PN/"4,434,487"&RS=PN/"4,434,487" > > Pete Peter Turnbull > Network Manager > University of York Thank you for the patent number and the URL to look at it!!! Based on the granting data (February 28th, 1984), it would seem that it is now in the public domain and that the MSCP "invention" can now be used by anyone. Is this true or does HP now control the MSCP patent? It is my understanding that a number of individuals were considering a Qbus MSCP controller for IDE drives. Is there anyone on the list who is still actively considering this option? At one time, I understand that one other option for this Qbus controller for IDE drives would have been to use the HD.SYS hard disk interface defined in the Ersatz-11 emulator. If anyone ever does that, I will complete the demo version I produced of the HDX.SYS device driver that handles a 256 MByte "device" as HD0: => HD7: in RT-11. In theory, there is no reason why the code should not be extended to allow drives up to 65536 RT-11 partitions or 2 TerraBytes of hard drive capacity. That same extension could also be done for DU(X).SYS in RT-11 although it should be recognized that the same basic limitation of 64 active RT-11 partitions would still apply unless some eager beaver (again probably myself) used the ability to tie multiple device drivers together (which has already been done - hopefully I could obtain the code) and extended those device drivers. However, due to lack of commercial interest in such a project, there is little probability it will be done. Hobby users rarely use large data bases and I don't know of any commercial applications that have a requirement greater than 2 GBytes of storage - which is already 64 RT-11 partitions. Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From donm at cts.com Mon Jul 1 23:31:16 2002 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: <3D20A9F7.25997.6B3441B@localhost> Message-ID: On Mon, 1 Jul 2002, Lawrence Walker wrote: > I accessed the FTP site and downloaded some files from the toolkit. It's been > a while since I used Teledisk so it should be fun. Is Teledisk the best app for > transferring the files. I believe I also have 22disk, RainDos, and Uniform. Of those listed, I believe that TeleDisk may be your only choice. Uniform and 22Disk take dead aim at CP/M format disks - with a couple minor exceptions - and RainDos sticks pretty much to the Rainbow. TeleDisk is rather more flexible. - don > Sifting thru the various programs I was very impressed by the possible > capabilities of the 350. It seems quite a bit more powerful than the Rainbow. > > I hope it looks for floppies before the passworded HD. They mention that you > can make a new startdsk and link it to the old one bypassing the password. > The default password is SYSTEM according to a file on the FTP site but > doesn't give a substitute for username. > > Lawrence > > > > > > > --- Lawrence Walker wrote: > > > > RD51? RD52? > > > > > > > RD52. Quantum 540 full-ht. > > > > Nice. Probably the best thing for it. > > > > > > Those daughter cards can be upgraded from 128K to 512K by replacing the 4164 > > > > DRAMs with 41256s and adding W1 and W2. Not sure if you pull both cards and > > > > install one upgrade or if you can install two 512K cards; haven't tried it > > > > yet. > > > > > > What's W1 and W2 ? > > > > Two marked jumper positions on the daughtercard. > > > > > There's no KBds. but IIRC from postings here it can use the lk201's that > > > I have with my Rainbows. > > > > Absolutely. > > > > > I also have VR201 and VR241 monitors which I believe will work. > > > > Yep - the VR201 will work on any Pro350 configuration. Not sure if > > the VR241 will work if you don't have the color option. Again, I don't > > have the handle numbers here, but if you have two cards in the CTI cage > > with a ribbon cable connecting the two, but attached to nothing else, > > you probably have the color option. In fact, with 4 cards total, I'd > > suspect you have the color video board set, an RX50 controller and an > > MFM drive controller. > > > > > I have some blank 5 1/4 DEC floppies and from discussions > > > here I can use a 'bow to format more for them. > > > > Yes. You can also use a 5.25" drive in a PC (Teac FD55GFR is one > > of the best to have for this) and format *double density* blanks > > for it (the coercitivity of the HD media is different than the DD > > media - the RX50 uses DD media, formatted single-sided, 80 tracks, > > rather than double-sided, 40 tracks like for a PC, but it's the same > > media). > > > > -ethan > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup > > http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com > > > lgwalker@mts.net > bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com > From cbajpai at attbi.com Tue Jul 2 05:47:09 2002 From: cbajpai at attbi.com (Chandra Bajpai) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000601c221b5$d12d4f80$177ba8c0@ne.client2.attbi.com> I'm a huge Lisa fan (and have a Lisa 2/10)...I would love to have a Lisa 1, but my wallet won't allow for paying ridiculous prices for one. If they ever do drop in price I'll be tempted to bid on it...but it's a close one...would I rather have an Altair or Lisa? -Chandra -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Sellam Ismail Sent: Monday, July 01, 2002 5:01 PM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: Re: And, the insanity continues On Mon, 1 Jul 2002, Michael Maginnis wrote: > wow. i had no idea they were THAT wanted... i knew they were popular, > but... mine are a little dirtier than the one he listed, but were in > working condition at last check (about 3 months ago), and have most of > the accessories his had. They represent the genesis of the Mac as well as the birth of the GUI in the consumer market (the Xerox 8010 beat the Lisa by 2 years but that found its way only into business installations). The Lisa represents one of the most glorious flops of the computer age, but has a lot of significance as a progenitor of what a lot of us use for computers today. Combined with the relative rarity of finding a Lisa 1 intact and working, in my opinion, it is THAT significant. As far as I know, there are less Lisa 1's than Apple 1's. My guess is that over time we'll start to see more and more Lisa 1's come out of the woodwork as word gets around that they're selling for $10K on eBay, and their value will drop. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From class at fliptronics.com Tue Jul 2 07:10:48 2002 From: class at fliptronics.com (Philip Freidin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Philips Garage Sale and Auction, update Message-ID: Hi, Philip's garage sale and auction, phase 1, is comming to an end. I have updated the web site with more details, and some new items. Please see this URL for auction details, and the new pics. http://www.fliptronics.com/garagesale/ Thanks for your interest, Philip Freidin From cbajpai at attbi.com Tue Jul 2 07:57:45 2002 From: cbajpai at attbi.com (Chandra Bajpai) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000501c221c8$0fdcce60$177ba8c0@ne.client2.attbi.com> I always wondered about lenny15 and where he gets his stuff...He has some really neat (and sometimes rare) Apple items for sale consistently...he also commands some premium pricing! (and gets it) :-( He seems like a nice enough guy...he helped me out with a couple of questions on my Lisa 2/10. -Chandra -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Sellam Ismail Sent: Monday, July 01, 2002 2:52 PM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: Re: And, the insanity continues On Sun, 30 Jun 2002, Michael Maginnis wrote: > Maybe it's time to drag my two Lisa 1's out of storage... > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2033627836 > > And the reserve isn't even met yet! The seller (lenny15) has had a ton of early Apple ][ and Lisa stuff up for sale in the past month. My guess is that he bought out the crusty old inventory of a former Apple dealer. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From celt at chisp.net Tue Jul 2 08:40:29 2002 From: celt at chisp.net (Michael Maginnis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues References: Message-ID: <3D21AD4D.9030704@chisp.net> Sellam Ismail wrote: > On Mon, 1 Jul 2002, Michael Maginnis wrote: > > >>wow. i had no idea they were THAT wanted... i knew they were popular, >>but... mine are a little dirtier than the one he listed, but were in >>working condition at last check (about 3 months ago), and have most of >>the accessories his had. > > > They represent the genesis of the Mac as well as the birth of the GUI in > the consumer market (the Xerox 8010 beat the Lisa by 2 years but that > found its way only into business installations). > > The Lisa represents one of the most glorious flops of the computer age, > but has a lot of significance as a progenitor of what a lot of us use for > computers today. > > Combined with the relative rarity of finding a Lisa 1 intact and > working, in my opinion, it is THAT significant. As far as I know, there > are less Lisa 1's than Apple 1's. My guess is that over time we'll start > to see more and more Lisa 1's come out of the woodwork as word gets around > that they're selling for $10K on eBay, and their value will drop. > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > maybe i'll clean them up for the next vcf - assuming there is one. i just finished checking out the first one - boots smoothly to office system on the profile drive. both twiggy drives seem to be stable as well. image is clean and crisp (at least a clean and crisp as it's going to get on a lisa). mike From jhfinepw4z at compsys.to Tue Jul 2 08:46:25 2002 From: jhfinepw4z at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: DEC 350 References: <20020701140520.87683.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3D21AEB1.BF418171@compsys.to> >Ethan Dicks wrote: > > --- Lawrence Walker wrote: > > It has 4cards in the cage and the 2 daughter boards. > Mine has a full boat: a double-card video card set, two CTI bus RAM cards, > a floppy controller and a hard disk controller. I'd give handle numbers, > but they are not here with me. Jerome Fine replies: You may remember seeing the PRO350 systems in the stack in front. > Those daughter cards can be upgraded from 128K to 512K by replacing the > 4164 DRAMs with 41256s and adding W1 and W2. Not sure if you pull both > cards and install one upgrade or if you can install two 512K cards; haven't > tried it yet. I can't remember how much memory is in each system. But if the chips are 4164, I do have some 41256 chips I can swap. I might need some help with W1 and W2. I will tackle the long e-mail ASAP!! Have a safe July 4th and regards to your SO!!!! Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From jhfinepw4z at compsys.to Tue Jul 2 08:49:35 2002 From: jhfinepw4z at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Philips Garage Sale and Auction, update References: Message-ID: <3D21AF6F.A6067B98@compsys.to> >Philip Freidin wrote: > Philip's garage sale and auction, phase 1, is comming to an end. > I have updated the web site with more details, and some new items. > Please see this URL for auction details, and the new pics. > http://www.fliptronics.com/garagesale/ > Thanks for your interest, > Philip Freidin Jerome Fine replies: Tried your site - no response! Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From jfoust at threedee.com Tue Jul 2 11:05:49 2002 From: jfoust at threedee.com (John Foust) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Philips Garage Sale and Auction, update In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.0.0.25.0.20020702110512.03a3dd28@pc> What's the interface on the CCD cameras, what were they used for? - John At 05:10 AM 7/2/2002 -0700, you wrote: >Hi, > >Philip's garage sale and auction, phase 1, is comming to an end. >I have updated the web site with more details, and some new items. > >Please see this URL for auction details, and the new pics. > > http://www.fliptronics.com/garagesale/ > >Thanks for your interest, > >Philip Freidin From michael at passer.us Mon Jul 1 13:36:00 2002 From: michael at passer.us (Michael Passer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Questions about Central Point Deluxe Option board In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200207011436.00498.michael@passer.us> Certainly no one would ever have used one to make a backup of the copy-protected software he legitimately purchased. That it was primarily a piracy tool is the mentality that brought us the DMCA, and that is driving the TCPA. That board did and does have legitimate, non-infringing uses. > 'course being able to read some other stuff was VERY handy, in being able > to point to a use for it OTHER THAN piracy. Brown of Central Point was > VERY adament that the board was NOT a tool for piracy, even though that's > all that most folks ever used it for. From philip at fliptronics.com Tue Jul 2 05:17:52 2002 From: philip at fliptronics.com (philip@fliptronics.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Philips Garage Sale and Auction, update Message-ID: <45v2iuocaem2tk164cuti4kfukeqbscjn2@4ax.com> Hi, Philip's garage sale and auction, phase 1, is comming to an end. I have updated the web site with more details, and some new items. Please see this URL for auction details, and the new pics. http://www.fliptronics.com/garagesale/ Thanks for your interest, Philip Freidin From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 2 12:42:22 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: from "Sellam Ismail" at Jul 1, 2 06:01:49 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2045 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020702/95785e73/attachment.ksh From foo at siconic.com Tue Jul 2 13:19:58 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > Wel, on the 6116 and also on every PAL I've come across, the +5V pin is > the highest numbered one. The ground pin is the diagonally-opposite one > (pin 12 on the 6116). Ok, then it looks like it is filtering between +5 and Ground. > > But I'm still trying to figure out where the cable went to. Unless there > > was a second board in another slot involved, I can't figure out how it > > connected to the computer. > > Is there any reason to assume that there wasn't a second board? It seems > quite likely to me. That's what I assumed from the beginning, but I realize I failed to mention that in my initial message. > Somewhere I have parts of what I think is some kind of shared hard disk > system for Apple ][s. I have one card that seems to contain the host > adapter circuitry (and has a connector to go to the hard disk box) and > another card that contains a firmware ROM (and not much else) which I > believe allows a diskless Apple ][ to boot from the hard disk. I know > _nothing_ about it (I got those boards in a pile of 'junk' that also > included a lot of Apple ][ 80 col cards, a Z80 Softcard, serial cards, > EPROM programmer cards, and a couple of things that weren't even related > to the Apple ][ (A user I/O card -- PIOs and CTC for the RML 380Z...) All of the Apple //e's I pulled the card from also had a disk controller, some with drives still attached. I would love to find out eventually what this was. There may well have been a card in slot 7 that the cable plugged in to, which the computer would then boot from. The card I pulled was in slot 2 of all the computers. If it was in slot 3 then I might imagine it would take over when the computer booted. On the other hand, I didn't have a lot of time when I was pulling these so I didn't pay close attention. One of the boards has a cap that is still identifiable. I'll repair one of these and experiment with it in different slots to see what it does (when I have time). Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From pat at purdueriots.com Tue Jul 2 08:33:51 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: DPE 5000 Message-ID: I just picked up a Quantel Limited DPE-5000 video switcher. You ask how this relates to computers? The interface box is an LSI-11/02 with 4KW of RAM. Wahoo! Does anyone have more info on this thing? It has an 'interface unit' - the LSI-11/02 in a 2U 19" rack case, 4 Q/Q quad-wide slots, some control boxes, cables, and a big switcher unit that is about 14" tall and 19" wide (might be rack mount using slide rails that I didn't get because they were broken. Any info would be appreciated, thanks! Also, if anyone needs one of these, I might be willing to part with it for a decent amount of money - a bit more than a few tens of dollars. -- Pat From ghldbrd at ccp.com Tue Jul 2 13:46:29 2002 From: ghldbrd at ccp.com (Gary Hildebrand) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: DPE 5000 References: Message-ID: <3D21F505.1A6A61D8@ccp.com> Patrick Finnegan wrote: > > I just picked up a Quantel Limited DPE-5000 video switcher. You ask how > this relates to computers? The interface box is an LSI-11/02 with 4KW of > RAM. Wahoo! > > Does anyone have more info on this thing? It has an 'interface unit' - > the LSI-11/02 in a 2U 19" rack case, 4 Q/Q quad-wide slots, some control > boxes, cables, and a big switcher unit that is about 14" tall and 19" > wide (might be rack mount using slide rails that I didn't get because > they were broken. > > Any info would be appreciated, thanks! Also, if anyone needs one of > these, I might be willing to part with it for a decent amount of money > - a bit more than a few tens of dollars. > > -- Pat I've never seen a Quantel close up, as they were one of the 'also ran' manufacturer of production switchers. My experience has been with Grass Valley, Ross, and Vital. The main guts of the switcher is in that tall 19" wide rackmount unit. No slides are used; it is bolted in solid, and should have gobs of BNC connectors on the back for all the video/sync inputs. I presume the computer part is for either controlling the wipes, or communications between the control panel and the box of guts. You should also have the 'tub', the switcher control panel. It would have multiple rows of pushbuttons (usually internally lighted and lableled) in pairs of rows, and a fader bar (Tee handle that toggles from A to B rows). If you don't have that, you have not much more than junk on your hands. About the only value of that stuff would be to someone who still has one in service, and they could use it for spare boards. Analog video switchers nowdays are just so much more fodder for the landfills. Gary Hildebrand St. Joseph, MO From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Tue Jul 2 14:01:44 2002 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Questions about Central Point Deluxe Option board References: <200207011436.00498.michael@passer.us> Message-ID: <000d01c221fa$ea3249a0$0100000a@deepspacenine> "Michael Passer" said: > Certainly no one would ever have used one to make a backup of the > copy-protected software he legitimately purchased. Really? I used to use CopyIIPC for that... > That it was primarily a piracy tool is the mentality that brought us the DMCA, > and that is driving the TCPA. That board did and does have legitimate, > non-infringing uses. *sigh*. More insanity... Hollywood: "People are pirating our movies" Senators: "Let's make it illegal to own or use any device with a CPU that doesn't have a copyright protection chip" Stupid and impractical. Need I say more? If this sort of thing starts happening over here in the UK, then I'm jumping ship. I hear the Bahamas are nice this time of year :-) Later. -- Phil. philpem@dsl.pipex.com http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ From pat at purdueriots.com Tue Jul 2 09:11:09 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: DPE 5000 In-Reply-To: <3D21F505.1A6A61D8@ccp.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Jul 2002, Gary Hildebrand wrote: > Patrick Finnegan wrote: > > > > I just picked up a Quantel Limited DPE-5000 video switcher. You ask how > > this relates to computers? The interface box is an LSI-11/02 with 4KW of > > RAM. Wahoo! > > > > -- Pat > > > The main guts of the switcher is in that tall 19" wide rackmount unit. > No slides are used; it is bolted in solid, and should have gobs of BNC > connectors on the back for all the video/sync inputs. I presume the > computer part is for either controlling the wipes, or communications > between the control panel and the box of guts. I thought there were slides, but I might be wrong. There were breakout cables with bnc's on one end and a DC37 or similar on the other. > You should also have the 'tub', the switcher control panel. It would > have multiple rows of pushbuttons (usually internally lighted and > lableled) in pairs of rows, and a fader bar (Tee handle that toggles > from A to B rows). If you don't have that, you have not much more than > junk on your hands. It's not really the usual tub you get with the stuff... either one small box with the controls, or a few small boxes with controls. I've played with 'real equipment' before. I'll try to post a URL with pictures as soon as I get some shots of it. > About the only value of that stuff would be to someone who still has one > in service, and they could use it for spare boards. Analog video > switchers nowdays are just so much more fodder for the landfills. Actually, with small markets - like cable-company run stations, community TV channels, and LPTV stations, there is a definate market for analog video 'stuff'. My high school TV 'club' still uses analog equipment dating back far enough to make it on-top for this list, at least time-wise. Personally, I don't see analog TV going away for at least another 10 years. There's a lot of people/community stations that can't afford to spend the rediculous prices on new digital equipment when replacements for their analog gear are still available and usable for so much less. > Gary Hildebrand > St. Joseph, MO > From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 2 14:42:47 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: <3D21AEB1.BF418171@compsys.to> Message-ID: <20020702194247.15611.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> --- "Jerome H. Fine" wrote: > You may remember seeing the PRO350 systems in the stack in front. Among other things... I think I recall it. > > Those daughter cards can be upgraded from 128K to 512K by replacing the > > 4164 DRAMs with 41256s and adding W1 and W2. > > I can't remember how much memory is in each system. But if the > chips are 4164, I do have some 41256 chips I can swap. I might > need some help with W1 and W2. I'd be happy to help. It's a two-layer board, so it's not _too_ hard to pull the old chips. The jumpers can be just a pair of wires (0 ohm resistors are nice - single black band, but not critical). Sockets are a good idea, and there's clearance for them - I checked. For mine, I was going to drop in a bunch of 41256s I pulled from some MS820 boards about 10 years ago (we needed some BIICs and they were $350 new from DEC, or $50 when attached to a used 2MB memory card ;-). I have a chip tester and have verified that I've only ever lost one DRAM that I've desoldered that had its leads intact (and only a few by losing a lead). -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From class at fliptronics.com Tue Jul 2 14:52:17 2002 From: class at fliptronics.com (Philip Freidin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Philips Garage Sale and Auction, update In-Reply-To: <5.0.0.25.0.20020702110512.03a3dd28@pc> References: <5.0.0.25.0.20020702110512.03a3dd28@pc> Message-ID: <0l04iuc2kld0qckli2q3c9ktsg0kh18geg@4ax.com> On Tue, 02 Jul 2002 11:05:49 -0500, you wrote: > >What's the interface on the CCD cameras, what were >they used for? > >- John No docs available for the CCD cameras. They are Panasonic, model WV-CD51. I think they are from a machine vision system. Philip ================= Philip Freidin philip@fliptronics.com From jrkeys at concentric.net Tue Jul 2 15:10:40 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Fw: Good Finds Message-ID: <003901c22204$8bc767b0$10000240@oemcomputer> Can anyone help this guy out? I will have to look around and see if I have a manual for one of these but that will take awhile. ----- Original Message ----- From: Rasmus Djupedal To: jrkeys@concentric.net Sent: Tuesday, July 02, 2002 6:36 AM Subject: Re: Good Finds hey i just saw your mail adress on an old messageboard on the net. im wondering if you have any info about the Sharp CE-150.. i mean list of available commands and how to use them. I would really appriciate if you could reply tot his message with some info or a link som get site on the net explaining all the commands and how to use the CE-150. thanks /Rasmus -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020702/876d83f7/attachment.html From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 2 13:16:18 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: <20020702012807.23411.qmail@web10303.mail.yahoo.com> from "Ethan Dicks" at Jul 1, 2 06:28:07 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1885 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020702/bc90ff52/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 2 15:23:18 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: from "Sellam Ismail" at Jul 2, 2 11:19:58 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1675 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020702/0f6e63be/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 2 15:28:50 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Fw: Good Finds In-Reply-To: <003901c22204$8bc767b0$10000240@oemcomputer> from "Keys" at Jul 2, 2 03:10:40 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 530 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020702/123cef50/attachment.ksh From pat at purdueriots.com Tue Jul 2 11:08:58 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: DPE 5000 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I've got pics of the stuff up on my web site: http://purdueriots.com/dpe5000/ -- Pat On Tue, 2 Jul 2002, Patrick Finnegan wrote: > On Tue, 2 Jul 2002, Gary Hildebrand wrote: > > > Patrick Finnegan wrote: > > > > > > I just picked up a Quantel Limited DPE-5000 video switcher. You ask how > > > this relates to computers? The interface box is an LSI-11/02 with 4KW of > > > RAM. Wahoo! > > > > > > -- Pat > > I thought there were slides, but I might be wrong. There were > breakout cables with bnc's on one end and a DC37 or similar on the other. There are slides, but the unit also has rack-mount brackets. Go figure. From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Tue Jul 2 16:07:10 2002 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: [maybe OT]: WTD: Panasonic KXP4400 RAM upgrade board Message-ID: <004101c2220c$6f9ce3a0$0100000a@deepspacenine> Hi, About a month ago, I bought myself a laser printer. Specifically, a Panasonic KX-P4400 (OK, so it's an LED printer, not a laser, big deal). Unfortunately, the thing only has 1MB of RAM onboard. Panasonic want $400 for a 4MB upgrade board ($100 per megabyte? WHAT?) and Kingston have discontinued their $40 clone. Sooo... Has anyone got a Panasonic "KX-PEM1", "KX-PEM2" or "KX-PEM3" module lying around somewhere? Alternatively, the Kingston Technology equivalents, "KT4400LP/2" or "KT4400LP/4" would be suitable. Anyone got one of these boards they feel like parting with? Printing out schematics on this thing is damn near impossible with only 1MB of RAM... Contact me off-list if you've got one of the aforementioned boards; I wouldn't want to end up pushing the signal-to-noise ratio on Classiccmp any higher :-) Thanks. -- Phil. philpem@dsl.pipex.com http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ From jingber at ix.netcom.com Tue Jul 2 16:55:40 2002 From: jingber at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey H. Ingber) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues In-Reply-To: <000501c221c8$0fdcce60$177ba8c0@ne.client2.attbi.com> References: <000501c221c8$0fdcce60$177ba8c0@ne.client2.attbi.com> Message-ID: <1025646943.1240.17.camel@netfinity> On Tue, 2002-07-02 at 08:57, Chandra Bajpai wrote: > I always wondered about lenny15 and where he gets his stuff...He has > some really neat (and sometimes rare) Apple items for sale > consistently...he also commands some premium pricing! (and gets it) :-( He's a good guy. I've dealt with him "offline" for some Lisa and NeXT parts in the past, and he's more than reasonable with prices (he practically gave me a 1.8A Lisa PSU, Lisa Parallel card, and some various case pieces). It's the glutons on E-bay that hike his prices up. Jeff > > He seems like a nice enough guy...he helped me out with a couple of > questions on my Lisa 2/10. > > -Chandra > > > -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] > On Behalf Of Sellam Ismail > Sent: Monday, July 01, 2002 2:52 PM > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: And, the insanity continues > > On Sun, 30 Jun 2002, Michael Maginnis wrote: > > > Maybe it's time to drag my two Lisa 1's out of storage... > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2033627836 > > > > And the reserve isn't even met yet! > > The seller (lenny15) has had a ton of early Apple ][ and Lisa stuff up > for > sale in the past month. My guess is that he bought out the crusty old > inventory of a former Apple dealer. > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer > Festival > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ------ > International Man of Intrigue and Danger > http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at > www.VintageTech.com * > From jrice at texoma.net Tue Jul 2 18:34:56 2002 From: jrice at texoma.net (James Rice) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues References: <000501c221c8$0fdcce60$177ba8c0@ne.client2.attbi.com> Message-ID: <3D2238A0.5060407@texoma.net> I have dealt with John (lenny15) both as a buyer and a seller for almost two years. He's one of the best ebay people out there. Check out his site, http://www.vintagemicros.com James Chandra Bajpai wrote: >I always wondered about lenny15 and where he gets his stuff...He has >some really neat (and sometimes rare) Apple items for sale >consistently...he also commands some premium pricing! (and gets it) :-( > >He seems like a nice enough guy...he helped me out with a couple of >questions on my Lisa 2/10. > >-Chandra > > From foo at siconic.com Tue Jul 2 19:41:39 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues In-Reply-To: <3D2238A0.5060407@texoma.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Jul 2002, James Rice wrote: > I have dealt with John (lenny15) both as a buyer and a seller for almost > two years. He's one of the best ebay people out there. Check out his > site, http://www.vintagemicros.com Where does he get his inventory from? Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From foo at siconic.com Tue Jul 2 19:42:36 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Need IC Master Catalogs (1989-1991) Message-ID: I am in need of IC Master catalogs for the years 1989-1991. Anyone have any to part with or know where I can get them? Please reply directly to Thanks! Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From ghldbrd at ccp.com Tue Jul 2 19:44:14 2002 From: ghldbrd at ccp.com (Gary Hildebrand) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: DPE 5000 References: Message-ID: <3D2248DE.67616F3F@ccp.com> Looks like a DVE (Digital video effects) unit. That is used to squeeze and manipulate video images. These do the key shots of the box in the corner, and sometimes they do flips and perspective shots too. If it works they are worth a few bucks. Gary Hildebrand Patrick Finnegan wrote: > > I've got pics of the stuff up on my web site: > http://purdueriots.com/dpe5000/ > > -- Pat > > On Tue, 2 Jul 2002, Patrick Finnegan wrote: > > > On Tue, 2 Jul 2002, Gary Hildebrand wrote: > > > > > Patrick Finnegan wrote: > > > > > > > > I just picked up a Quantel Limited DPE-5000 video switcher. You ask how > > > > this relates to computers? The interface box is an LSI-11/02 with 4KW of > > > > RAM. Wahoo! > > > > > > > > -- Pat > > > > I thought there were slides, but I might be wrong. There were > > breakout cables with bnc's on one end and a DC37 or similar on the other. > > There are slides, but the unit also has rack-mount brackets. Go figure. From classiccmp at mail.vintage-computer.com Tue Jul 2 20:17:43 2002 From: classiccmp at mail.vintage-computer.com (Erik S. Klein) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: C8080A needed Message-ID: Due to a small mishap I find myself in need of one or two C8080As or some other variant of that chip. Does anyone out there have any functional ones for sale or maybe for trade? Thanks, Erik From jd at hq.sjaa.com.au Tue Jul 2 21:05:10 2002 From: jd at hq.sjaa.com.au (Justin M Dunlop) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Lisa 1 Registry (WAS Re: And, the insanity continues) Message-ID: Hi Sellam, Well better count me in for my "frankenlisa" as you previously referred to it. You may remember it was upgraded to a Lisa 2/5 and I subsequently 'downgraded' (?) to a Lisa 1. Had to find the I/O ROM, twiggy drives and cage and the front panel, reconnect the two resisters etc,etc. I even managed to find a complete set of Lisa OS and Office v1 disks. Unfortunately, the Lisa OS disk 1 went bad before I could install the Profile. I now have a new (copied) set on the way. I have got it to boot the Lisa 1 version of BPI accounting though. I've also got a copy of Unix for Lisa 1 but the serialized ROM is causing me trouble. Anyone ever found a technician's video ROM with no serial number? If so I'd love to get a copy! I remember someone contacted me about an application they were writing to take images of twiggy floppies - a flurry of activity at first, then nothing. Anyone else heard from them? Kind regards, Justin Dunlop Melbourne, Australia >The reserve was met at $10,000, which is exactly the value that I would >place on a working Lisa 1 of this caliber, with the accessories included. >I know of around maybe a dozen in existence now (with you having two that >brings the total up :) >I need to start a Lisa 1 registry. Who's got one (or two)? > >Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival >------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * -- ___________________________________________________________________________ Justin M. Dunlop email: jd@hq.sjaa.com.au ____________________________________________________________________________ From cbajpai at attbi.com Tue Jul 2 21:13:45 2002 From: cbajpai at attbi.com (Chandra Bajpai) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Lisa 1 Registry (WAS Re: And, the insanity continues) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001c22237$42b99740$177ba8c0@ne.client2.attbi.com> Justin...I bet you had some real adventures trying to find all those items..esp. in Australia (my relatives are in Brisbane)...love to hear how you managed to get all those items together. -Chandra Wishing for his own Lisa-1 someday -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Justin M Dunlop Sent: Tuesday, July 02, 2002 10:05 PM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: Lisa 1 Registry (WAS Re: And, the insanity continues) Hi Sellam, Well better count me in for my "frankenlisa" as you previously referred to it. You may remember it was upgraded to a Lisa 2/5 and I subsequently 'downgraded' (?) to a Lisa 1. Had to find the I/O ROM, twiggy drives and cage and the front panel, reconnect the two resisters etc,etc. I even managed to find a complete set of Lisa OS and Office v1 disks. Unfortunately, the Lisa OS disk 1 went bad before I could install the Profile. I now have a new (copied) set on the way. I have got it to boot the Lisa 1 version of BPI accounting though. I've also got a copy of Unix for Lisa 1 but the serialized ROM is causing me trouble. Anyone ever found a technician's video ROM with no serial number? If so I'd love to get a copy! I remember someone contacted me about an application they were writing to take images of twiggy floppies - a flurry of activity at first, then nothing. Anyone else heard from them? Kind regards, Justin Dunlop Melbourne, Australia >The reserve was met at $10,000, which is exactly the value that I would >place on a working Lisa 1 of this caliber, with the accessories included. >I know of around maybe a dozen in existence now (with you having two that >brings the total up :) >I need to start a Lisa 1 registry. Who's got one (or two)? > >Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival >----------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- >International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * -- ________________________________________________________________________ ___ Justin M. Dunlop email: jd@hq.sjaa.com.au ________________________________________________________________________ ____ From foo at siconic.com Tue Jul 2 21:19:09 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: Lisa 1 Registry (WAS Re: And, the insanity continues) In-Reply-To: <000001c22237$42b99740$177ba8c0@ne.client2.attbi.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Jul 2002, Chandra Bajpai wrote: > Justin...I bet you had some real adventures trying to find all those > items..esp. in Australia (my relatives are in Brisbane)...love to hear > how you managed to get all those items together. Ditto. It is a pretty amazing accomplishment :) Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From rdd at rddavis.org Tue Jul 2 23:31:47 2002 From: rdd at rddavis.org (R. D. Davis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues In-Reply-To: References: <3D2238A0.5060407@texoma.net> Message-ID: <20020703043147.GA12364@rhiannon.rddavis.org> Quothe Sellam Ismail, from writings of Tue, Jul 02, 2002 at 05:41:39PM -0700: > On Tue, 2 Jul 2002, James Rice wrote: > > > I have dealt with John (lenny15) both as a buyer and a seller for almost > > two years. He's one of the best ebay people out there. Check out his > > site, http://www.vintagemicros.com > > Where does he get his inventory from? Is he that guy who goes to hamfests and makes an offer for everything Apple that a vendor has? I was at one hamfest where someone did that, while I was looking at something, and the vendor wouldn't even let me purchase the system that I'd picked up to buy (before that offer was made)... I regret not "accidentally" dropping the system onto the asphalt and someone's toes. "Here, you want this too? [start to hand it too the greedy *&#!$@%]... Ooops! Sorry about your toes." -- Copyright (C) 2001 R. D. Davis The difference between humans & other animals: All Rights Reserved an unnatural belief that we're above Nature & rdd@rddavis.org 410-744-4900 her other creatures, using dogma to justify such http://www.rddavis.org beliefs and to justify much human cruelty. From fernande at internet1.net Wed Jul 3 01:37:15 2002 From: fernande at internet1.net (Chad Fernandez) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: big IBM on Ebay?? Message-ID: <3D229B9B.10405@internet1.net> Don't really know what it is, but it claims to have MCA slots?? http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2036499330 Chad Fernandez Michigan, USA From g at kurico.com Wed Jul 3 01:51:01 2002 From: g at kurico.com (g@kurico.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: big IBM on Ebay?? In-Reply-To: <3D229B9B.10405@internet1.net> Message-ID: <3D225885.24381.7FA206B@localhost> Looks like an AT&T logo on the front. Probably an NCR if it has MCA slots. George On 3 Jul 2002 at 2:37, Chad Fernandez wrote: > Don't really know what it is, but it claims to have MCA slots?? > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2036499330 > > Chad Fernandez > Michigan, USA > From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Wed Jul 3 02:00:29 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: big IBM on Ebay?? In-Reply-To: <3D225885.24381.7FA206B@localhost> Message-ID: <20020703070029.95946.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> --- g@kurico.com wrote: > Looks like an AT&T logo on the front. Probably an NCR if it has MCA > slots. > > George > > On 3 Jul 2002 at 2:37, Chad Fernandez wrote: > > > Don't really know what it is, but it claims to have MCA slots?? > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2036499330 ISTR "3555" is a model of NCR box. We used them when I was at Lucent (they were bought before AT&T "trivested" into AT&T, NCR and Lucent). They typically run SYSVr4, but I was told that you _could_ boot them to DOS and play DOOM on them (I didn't ask ;-) Big ones like that were MCA. Newer NCR servers were 1/3 the size and PCI. I think most of ours were quad Pentium-90 boxes. The thing of it is, I was brought into the group because they wanted to move to Sun SPARC hardware and Solaris and all of their expertise was with NCR (and older) UNIX platforms. I think when I left, they were over 50% Sun (in the data center our group ran. OK boxes, but nothing special unless you have a Dayton, OH, fetish (NCR headquarters). -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From jbmcb at hotmail.com Wed Jul 3 09:16:57 2002 From: jbmcb at hotmail.com (Jason McBrien) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:57 2005 Subject: big IBM on Ebay?? References: <20020703070029.95946.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Definiatley NCR. I saw a couple at the UofM property disposition a year ago. Those had 486 boards in them as I recall. If anyone needs power supplies grab one of these, the entire bottom half is full of power supplies and fans. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ethan Dicks" To: Sent: Wednesday, July 03, 2002 3:00 AM Subject: Re: big IBM on Ebay?? > > --- g@kurico.com wrote: > > Looks like an AT&T logo on the front. Probably an NCR if it has MCA > > slots. > > > > George > > > > On 3 Jul 2002 at 2:37, Chad Fernandez wrote: > > > > > Don't really know what it is, but it claims to have MCA slots?? > > > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2036499330 > > ISTR "3555" is a model of NCR box. We used them when I was at Lucent > (they were bought before AT&T "trivested" into AT&T, NCR and Lucent). > > They typically run SYSVr4, but I was told that you _could_ boot them > to DOS and play DOOM on them (I didn't ask ;-) > > Big ones like that were MCA. Newer NCR servers were 1/3 the size and > PCI. I think most of ours were quad Pentium-90 boxes. > > The thing of it is, I was brought into the group because they wanted to > move to Sun SPARC hardware and Solaris and all of their expertise was > with NCR (and older) UNIX platforms. I think when I left, they were > over 50% Sun (in the data center our group ran. > > OK boxes, but nothing special unless you have a Dayton, OH, fetish (NCR > headquarters). > > -ethan > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free > http://sbc.yahoo.com > From DAW at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu Wed Jul 3 09:38:31 2002 From: DAW at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: big IBM on Ebay?? Message-ID: <9011A52E011ED311B4280004AC1BA61501467A75@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu> > From: Ethan Dicks > > --- g@kurico.com wrote: > > Looks like an AT&T logo on the front. Probably an NCR if it has MCA > > slots. > > > > George > > > > On 3 Jul 2002 at 2:37, Chad Fernandez wrote: > > > > > Don't really know what it is, but it claims to have MCA slots?? > > > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2036499330 > > ISTR "3555" is a model of NCR box. We used them when I was at Lucent > (they were bought before AT&T "trivested" into AT&T, NCR and Lucent). > > They typically run SYSVr4, but I was told that you _could_ boot them > to DOS and play DOOM on them (I didn't ask ;-) > > Big ones like that were MCA. Newer NCR servers were 1/3 the size and > PCI. I think most of ours were quad Pentium-90 boxes.... > > __________________________________________________ > Pretty neat box. Quad Pentium 133 with 256 MB of RAM? Just how much RAM could that beast take? It'd be quite the conversation piece as a workstation running NetBSD (or something) and XWindows... 8-) -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1 - Darwin Kernel Version 5 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash From meltie at myrealbox.com Wed Jul 3 09:34:40 2002 From: meltie at myrealbox.com (Alex White) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: big IBM on Ebay?? In-Reply-To: <9011A52E011ED311B4280004AC1BA61501467A75@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu> References: <9011A52E011ED311B4280004AC1BA61501467A75@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu> Message-ID: <1025706882.2469.0.camel@stolichnaya.meltie.mine.nu> On Wed, 2002-07-03 at 15:38, David Woyciesjes wrote: > > From: Ethan Dicks > > > > --- g@kurico.com wrote: > > > Looks like an AT&T logo on the front. Probably an NCR if it has MCA > > > slots. > > > > > > George > > > > > > On 3 Jul 2002 at 2:37, Chad Fernandez wrote: > > > > > > > Don't really know what it is, but it claims to have MCA slots?? > > > > > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2036499330 > > > > ISTR "3555" is a model of NCR box. We used them when I was at Lucent > > (they were bought before AT&T "trivested" into AT&T, NCR and Lucent). > > > > They typically run SYSVr4, but I was told that you _could_ boot them > > to DOS and play DOOM on them (I didn't ask ;-) > > > > Big ones like that were MCA. Newer NCR servers were 1/3 the size and > > PCI. I think most of ours were quad Pentium-90 boxes.... > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Pretty neat box. Quad Pentium 133 with 256 MB of RAM? Just how much > RAM could that beast take? > It'd be quite the conversation piece as a workstation running NetBSD > (or something) and XWindows... 8-) There a quad i486 one sitting in a garage in Scotland if anyone wants it... Alex -- Live like you will never die, love like you've never been hurt, dance like no-one is watching. Boink like she's the first woman you've ever seen naked. From jfoust at threedee.com Wed Jul 3 14:02:16 2002 From: jfoust at threedee.com (John Foust) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: Interesting adware PDF utilities Message-ID: <5.0.0.25.0.20020703140136.0362eb88@pc> Apropos the endless discussions about the best ways to convert docs to electronic form, http://www.pdf995.com/ . - John From jingber at ix.netcom.com Wed Jul 3 17:41:36 2002 From: jingber at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey H. Ingber) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: What is this item? Message-ID: <1025736099.1238.41.camel@netfinity> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2036592395 Seller claims it's a "Hardware Service Unit". Looks like a 5161 expansion unit to me. I assume this is something else, since the expansion unit is clearly marked as such on the IBM logo. (?) Jeff From kenziem at sympatico.ca Wed Jul 3 18:26:37 2002 From: kenziem at sympatico.ca (Mike) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: DPE 5000 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20020703232732.DJKR18351.tomts7-srv.bellnexxia.net@there> On Tuesday 02 July 2002 12:08, Patrick Finnegan wrote: > I've got pics of the stuff up on my web site: > http://purdueriots.com/dpe5000/ I've seen something very similar by SONY but I couldn't recognize the cards. Can the computer be extracted for other purposes? From pat at purdueriots.com Wed Jul 3 13:42:53 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: DPE 5000 In-Reply-To: <20020703232732.DJKR18351.tomts7-srv.bellnexxia.net@there> Message-ID: That's one of my hopes. It's an LSI-11/2 in a QBUS chassis, with dec power supply and all, a 4KW memory card, DPE card with eproms on it (could be useful for other purposes without the current ROMS, it has 4 sockets total, only 2 used), an ADC card of some sort, and two DRV11's. Not too bad by itself. If I cant get the whole thing to function (or find a good use for it), I'm definately keeping this interface computer. It'd be nice if it had a bit more RAM, or was a nicer CPU, but still it's QBUS, so it's expandable, so I'm happy :). -- Pat On Wed, 3 Jul 2002, Mike wrote: > On Tuesday 02 July 2002 12:08, Patrick Finnegan wrote: > > I've got pics of the stuff up on my web site: > > http://purdueriots.com/dpe5000/ > > I've seen something very similar by SONY but I couldn't recognize the > cards. > > Can the computer be extracted for other purposes? > From foo at siconic.com Wed Jul 3 19:39:22 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: What is this item? In-Reply-To: <1025736099.1238.41.camel@netfinity> Message-ID: On 3 Jul 2002, Jeffrey H. Ingber wrote: > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2036592395 > > Seller claims it's a "Hardware Service Unit". Looks like a 5161 > expansion unit to me. I assume this is something else, since the > expansion unit is clearly marked as such on the IBM logo. (?) It's most likely what you say. The pictures are blurry, but at any rate the seller doesn't know what he's talking about. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From jhfinepw4z at compsys.to Wed Jul 3 21:43:41 2002 From: jhfinepw4z at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: DEC 350 References: <20020702194247.15611.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3D23B65D.79854FBE@compsys.to> >Ethan Dicks wrote: > > --- "Jerome H. Fine" wrote: > > > Those daughter cards can be upgraded from 128K to 512K by replacing the > > > 4164 DRAMs with 41256s and adding W1 and W2. > > I can't remember how much memory is in each system. But if the > > chips are 4164, I do have some 41256 chips I can swap. I might > > need some help with W1 and W2. > I'd be happy to help. It's a two-layer board, so it's not _too_ > hard to pull the old chips. The jumpers can be just a pair of > wires (0 ohm resistors are nice - single black band, but not > critical). > Sockets are a good idea, and there's clearance for them - I checked. > For mine, I was going to drop in a bunch of 41256s I pulled from some > MS820 boards about 10 years ago (we needed some BIICs and they were $350 > new from DEC, or $50 when attached to a used 2MB memory card ;-). I > have a chip tester and have verified that I've only ever lost one DRAM > that I've desoldered that had its leads intact (and only a few by losing > a lead). Jerome Fine replies: I have enough difficulty with soldering - the reverse is something I doubt if I will ever want to tackle. If I have a change in the next few weeks, I will try and look at the memory boards and see what I have. Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From donm at cts.com Thu Jul 4 00:31:28 2002 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: IDT Screenmax System Message-ID: Does anyone have any knowledge of a machine put out by Industrial Data Terminals back in the '80s that was called the IDT Screenmax System. It was a non-standard unit that utilized a hard drive, single 5" floppy, and bubble memory to be a custom video design package. The unit in question was used to create industrial process control screens. IDT was taken over by Cutler Hammer Automation and when the unit failed in service recently it was returned to them for repair. They replaced the hard drive, did not install CP/M-86 to make it bootable, and proceeded to lose the master diskettes that they had requested be sent with the unit. From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Thu Jul 4 10:44:46 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: <3D23B65D.79854FBE@compsys.to> Message-ID: <20020704154446.39922.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> --- "Jerome H. Fine" wrote: > >Ethan Dicks wrote: > > > > Those daughter cards can be upgraded from 128K to 512K... > > Jerome Fine replies: > > I have enough difficulty with soldering - the reverse is something > I doubt if I will ever want to tackle. If I have a change in the next > few weeks, I will try and look at the memory boards and see what > I have. I've been digging through my pile of Professionals this week as a result of these threads. Turns out I have one nice Pro350 (extended bitmap card, hard disk controller), one former-console Pro380 and a couple of diskette-only, lightly loaded Pro-350s (memory and RX50 controller). For ready-to-go disks, I have an RD50 with P/OS 2.0 (from the console processor) and an RD51 that won't boot that I _think_ had/has Venix on it. I will probably scare up an ST225/RD32 for use as an RT-11 disk. While I was booting the Pro380, the floppy began to seek at a high rate (didn't sound normal) and the PSU shut down and the white-button breaker popped. It will not stay in, telling me there's a fatal short somewhere in the PSU - I was watching it; the VR201 showed the "d|i|g|i|t|a|l" logo, the RX50 went bananas and it shut down. The Pro appears to have a spot for a bitmap card or something, on the front left of the motherboard. Mine is blank. It does have a single 512K daughter card. I pulled it, and dropped it into a Pro 350 for a test. With one 128K card, one 512K card and as many 256K CTI cards as I could stuff in there, I got a Pro350 up to ~1.4MB. If I pulled the RX50 controller (and it didn't whine about that) and upgraded a 128K card to 512K, presumably, 2MB is about the physical limit of what fits in there. Since the CTI memory cards are marked "PC 350 Memory", I presume they don't work in the Pro380 (and my testing seems to suggest that, but I have to re-do things - I appear to have one 256K card that locks up the machine its in). So... the theoretical (effective) max is 2048K in a Pro350 and 1024K in a Pro380 (one 512K daughter card and 512K on the motherboard). Does anyone have any info from the literature to support or refute that? Also, my extended bitmap card for the Pro350 has a stuck bit and fails POST. It prints a code which I would post here, but I don't have it in front of me. I would expect that it's a bad 4164 or a bad multiplexer or buffer next to the memory area, but I don't want to pull all that RAM and test it externally if I can narrow the search to a chip or two. One of my goals here is to put 2BSD on a Pro. Another goal is to set one up with RT-11. Looks like I have enough parts, but I wanted to consider the options and figure out between memory and video and processor, which OS better went with which box. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From pat at purdueriots.com Thu Jul 4 12:12:11 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: LSI-11/2 Message-ID: I've got an embeded syatem based around an LSI-11/2 processor board, M8044-BB (8KW?) memory, pair of DRV-11's, a MDB eprom board and ADC board. What do I need to do to make this into a functional PDP-11? I've got a DEC MSCP ESDI controller (don't remeber the part #), DLV-11 (8-port version) serial card, TQK50, and drives from my VAXstation 3200 I can try to use in it. It's from my DPE 5000, the video part of which let out a bunch of magic smoke being powered on - can't find any obvious burned parts, but haven't checked the power supply yet. Still, it's worth more to me as a LSI(PDP)-11 than a video effects box that I can't fix. First, however, I'm sure I need DEC boot roms for it, or some other way to get boot code into it. Does anyone happen to have some laying around they could maybe send me an image of? Also, I'm on the lookout for a RLV12 and berg cable to connect to the RL02 I have sitting around here.. Any ideas/help would be appreciated, and thanks in advance. -- Pat From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Jul 4 18:54:15 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: <20020704154446.39922.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> from "Ethan Dicks" at Jul 4, 2 08:44:46 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 536 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020705/d6d1ce8d/attachment.ksh From mrbill at mrbill.net Thu Jul 4 20:31:14 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: FREE STUFF in Austin, TX Message-ID: <20020705013114.GX7164@mrbill.net> I've got some FREE STUFF in Austin, Texas. Only thing is, you *HAVE* to pick it up, *IN PERSON*. I"m tired of people saying they'll arrange something, have someone come by, etc. Its up for grabs for the first person who shows up and can actually put this stuff to use, or emails me with a *convincing* reason why I should hold/ship it for them and has something to trade for what they want. First batch, some Sun VME boards and a 4/6x0 memory board: http://www.mrbill.net/~mrbill/freestuff/ (pictures) (the DELNI and the GRiD laptops are spoken for) Some of the cards are FDDI: http://www.mrbill.net/~mrbill/fddi/ (pictures) Second, a Toshiba T3100 orange-plasma-screen laptop. CMOS battery is dead, but it works fine if you have a DOS boot disk and put the time in manually. Makes a GREAT serial console for a *NIX machine: http://www.mrbill.net/~mrbill/laptop/ (pictures) (well, its more of a "portable"; it only takes AC power and is rather heavy.. if you've seen "Medicine Man" with Sean Connery, one of these is the machine he's using in his "lab" IIRC...) Third, I have a pair of IBM P70 portable (486?) systems with orange plasma displays. When I got these, one powered up but gave a "bad HD" error code, one didnt power up at all. I attempted to swap out the hard drives between the two, but after I tried that, neither would power up. I beleive they are both missing the back system cover, but would be great for replacement parts to keep another P70 running. Fourth, I have an IBM PC Convertible laptop, with dual 720K floppy drives, LCD screen (of course), battery pack, and the I/O-port "pack", in original IBM canvas carry case. Last time I fired it up (early '99?) the backlight was intermittent, but otherwise everything worked fine. Great keyboard; might make a good serial console for something. Again, free, but you must pick these up in Austin, TX, at my house. I will NOT ship anything (unless you have a REALLY good trade offer, and pay for shipping). If you want something held, you will have to trade me something interesting for what you want. I'm tired of people telling me "oh, I'll pick those up soon" or "I'll have $relative who lives near there contact you", etc. First come, first serve. I need this stuff out of the way, but its too good to trash.. Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From mrbill at mrbill.net Thu Jul 4 20:49:46 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: FT: TI Silent 700 terminal Message-ID: <20020705014946.GA7164@mrbill.net> I've got a TI Silent 700 portable thermal printing terminal (has 300 baud modem, acoustic coupler cups, etc)... but this isnt just *any* Silent 700 (model 765): This has the bubble memory expansion (which from what I understand, is rather rare). On a sticker inside the paper compartment: DATA ACCESS SYSTEMS, INC - HOUSTON Servide 713-682-6820 Sales 713-682-5965 Model # TI 765 Serial # 04766-17603 DASI OPTION VENDOR 1B07 80 K. MEM KIT II 1B10 (CHAR MAP.) Last time I fired this up a couple of years ago, it worked, although the thermal print head either needed cleaning or replacing - a pin was "missing" in some of the output. I didnt have time, at the time, to take it apart and clean it or diagnose the problem. Has the "snap-on-top" cover with carrying handle, etc. Cover was the victim of some slight paint overspray (white) when we painted part of this room, but no paint got on the unit itself. The cover only got slightly dusted on one corner; it may come off with rubbing alcohol. Would like to swap for something else interesting. I had two of these (the other didnt have all the spiffy options), and gave the other away a year or so ago... I just dont have room for this anymore, and would like to see it go to a good home. Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From mbg at TheWorld.com Thu Jul 4 21:33:02 2002 From: mbg at TheWorld.com (Megan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: LSI-11/2 Message-ID: <200207050233.WAA4161022@shell.TheWorld.com> >I've got an embeded syatem based around an LSI-11/2 processor board, >M8044-BB (8KW?) memory, pair of DRV-11's, a MDB eprom board and ADC >board. What do I need to do to make this into a functional PDP-11? I've >got a DEC MSCP ESDI controller (don't remeber the part #), DLV-11 (8-port >version) serial card, TQK50, and drives from my VAXstation 3200 I can >try to use in it. It's from my DPE 5000, the video part of which let out >a bunch of magic smoke being powered on - can't find any obvious burned >parts, but haven't checked the power supply yet. Still, it's worth more >to me as a LSI(PDP)-11 than a video effects box that I can't fix. You haven't mentioned what kind of backplane it has (Q/Q vs. Q/CD), whether it has 22-bit (I suspect just 18-bit) and how many slots. These will all affect what the suggestions. Going with what you have, I might suggest upping the power from an 11/2 to an 11/73 (KDJ11-A), which takes up no more room in the backplane. >First, however, I'm sure I need DEC boot roms for it, or some other way >to get boot code into it. Does anyone happen to have some laying around >they could maybe send me an image of? Also, I'm on the lookout for a >RLV12 and berg cable to connect to the RL02 I have sitting around here.. I would suggest an MXV11-B, which gives you two serial lines, memory and boot code in one dual-high board. Beyond that, the DEC MSCP board is probably an RQDX(3?) and is not ESDI (I don't think there was an ESDI board made by DEC... all the ones I got while inside DEC were made by Andromeda -- the ESDC board). Finally, a DELQA for network and you're all set. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | email: gentry at zk3.dec.com (work) | | Unix Support Engineering Group | mbg at world.std.com (home) | | Hewlett Packard | (s/ at /@/) | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 (DEC '77-'98) | required." - mbg KB1FCA | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ From marvin at rain.org Thu Jul 4 22:45:52 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: New Haul References: <200207050233.WAA4161022@shell.TheWorld.com> Message-ID: <3D251670.57AC9D66@rain.org> In my continuing efforts to get rid of stuff, I fell off the wagon when I was offered some Tandy computers that turned out to be Coco2 computers. Not too unusual by itself, but the peripherals and documentation were amazing. Besides the original manuals, etc., the service manual for both the Coco2 and the Coco Floppy disk drives were included. Then add another 8 or 10 books about Coco assembly and basic programming, and things started to get interesting. The final clincher was that this whole lot of stuff was used to control an "NC" drill that used a dremel tool for the drill ... and that drill along with the scope and control program was included for programming and drilling holes. So far, I haven't found any schematics for the unit but I will try and get in contact with the person that had the stuff and find out what they know. From the nametags on the equipment, it was used by a local company to fabricate some of their products. From edick at idcomm.com Thu Jul 4 23:04:24 2002 From: edick at idcomm.com (Richard Erlacher) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] PC board storage Message-ID: <001701c223d9$0cdd4ba0$9cc762d8@dslres-156.idcomm.com> If you're talking assembled and working boards, you probably want to put them in static-dissipative (primary) packaging and put that in antistatic (secondary) packaging that's capable of protecting them mechanically. The totes aren't all they're cracked up to be unless you have a way of sealing them. The "nickel" bags as primary packaging with pink-poly (non-static-generating) secondary packaging to protect them from physical trauma and the whole thing in a sturdy box together with other similarly packaged and protected boards should do the trick. A little dessicant to prevent condensation inside the primary packaging is helpful as well. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Cini, Richard To: 'CCLTech' Date: Monday, July 01, 2002 12:39 PM Subject: [CCTECH] PC board storage >Hello, all: > > I'm seeking opinions on long-term PC board storage. Is it better for >longer term storage of "classic" boards to individually pack them in "metal >out" static bags and store them in conventional cardboard boxes or should I >buy a few static dissipative cardboard boxes or Bentron plastic totes and >store the boards there? > >Rich > >_______________________________________________ >cctech mailing list >cctech@classiccmp.org >http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech > From vaxzilla at jarai.org Fri Jul 5 00:07:29 2002 From: vaxzilla at jarai.org (Brian Chase) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: New Haul In-Reply-To: <3D251670.57AC9D66@rain.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Jul 2002, Marvin Johnston wrote: > [...] The final clincher > was that this whole lot of stuff was used to control an "NC" drill that > used a dremel tool for the drill ... and that drill along with the scope > and control program was included for programming and drilling holes. So > far, I haven't found any schematics for the unit but I will try and get > in contact with the person that had the stuff and find out what they > know. From the nametags on the equipment, it was used by a local company > to fabricate some of their products. Wow, excellent find. My first job out of college was doing sysadmin work for a company that had a number of mold building shops with large CNC machines--mostly Fadals. I'd have never guessed that Tandy Color Computers were used for that type of work. Nice find. -brian. From kris at catonic.net Fri Jul 5 00:10:38 2002 From: kris at catonic.net (Kris Kirby) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: [geeks] FT: TI Silent 700 terminal In-Reply-To: <20020705014946.GA7164@mrbill.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Jul 2002, Bill Bradford wrote: > I've got a TI Silent 700 portable thermal printing terminal (has 300 baud > modem, acoustic coupler cups, etc)... but this isnt just *any* Silent > 700 (model 765): 300/110, IIRC. The switch just says `slow'. -- Kris Kirby, KE4AHR | TGIFreeBSD... 'Nuff said. | IM: KrisBSD | HSV, AL. ------------------------------------------------------- "Fate, it seems, is not without a sense of irony." From fernande at internet1.net Fri Jul 5 00:25:28 2002 From: fernande at internet1.net (Chad Fernandez) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: Trying to thin things out via Ebay Message-ID: <3D252DC8.5050106@internet1.net> I've listed a few auctions on Ebay. If your anyplace besides the US or Canada please let me know ahead of time, if you'd like to bid. http://cgi6.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewListedItems&userid=fernande&include=0&since=-1&sort=2&rows=25&rdir=0 Chad Fernandez Michigan, USA From marvin at rain.org Fri Jul 5 00:28:33 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: New Haul References: Message-ID: <3D252E81.4EFB6520@rain.org> What is interesting is that during this time span, I had acquired an NC driller/router for my PC shop! I don't think the dremel tool will withstand the sidethrust for very long to do routing, but that is kind of what I would like to do ... assuming there is still enough there to get it working! Brian Chase wrote: > > On Thu, 4 Jul 2002, Marvin Johnston wrote: > > > [...] The final clincher > > was that this whole lot of stuff was used to control an "NC" drill that > > used a dremel tool for the drill ... and that drill along with the scope > > and control program was included for programming and drilling holes. So > > far, I haven't found any schematics for the unit but I will try and get > > in contact with the person that had the stuff and find out what they > > know. From the nametags on the equipment, it was used by a local company > > to fabricate some of their products. > > Wow, excellent find. My first job out of college was doing sysadmin > work for a company that had a number of mold building shops with large > CNC machines--mostly Fadals. I'd have never guessed that Tandy Color > Computers were used for that type of work. Nice find. > > -brian. From doc at mdrconsult.com Fri Jul 5 00:47:55 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: New Haul In-Reply-To: <3D252E81.4EFB6520@rain.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Jul 2002, Marvin Johnston wrote: > > What is interesting is that during this time span, I had acquired an NC > driller/router for my PC shop! I don't think the dremel tool will > withstand the sidethrust for very long to do > routing, but that is kind of what I would like to do ... assuming there > is still enough there to get it working! The Dremel will do routing for many thousands of hours, as long as you limit the feed appropriately. It takes very little pressure to cut as quickly as the bit is capable of cutting. Doc From classiccmp at vintage-computer.com Wed Jul 3 19:38:21 2002 From: classiccmp at vintage-computer.com (Erik S. Klein) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: What is this item? In-Reply-To: <1025736099.1238.41.camel@netfinity> Message-ID: <015601c222f3$1921d480$6e7ba8c0@piii933> I think you're right. It's an expansion unit and the seller just doesn't know it. Erik -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Jeffrey H. Ingber Sent: Wednesday, July 03, 2002 3:42 PM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: What is this item? http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2036592395 Seller claims it's a "Hardware Service Unit". Looks like a 5161 expansion unit to me. I assume this is something else, since the expansion unit is clearly marked as such on the IBM logo. (?) Jeff From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 5 01:33:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020705063300.27768.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> --- Tony Duell wrote: > > While I was booting the Pro380, the floppy began to seek at a high > > rate (didn't sound normal) and the PSU shut down and the white-button > > breaker popped. It will not stay in, telling me there's a fatal > > short somewhere in the PSU > > Why do I think this sounds like defective capacitors in the PSU box? Could easily be. I need to get back my security torx (out on loan) before I can remove the board from the PSU. It's held in place by several philips-head bolts and one torx with the button in the middle. Caps are a good guess. There are a couple of large ones near the input side. Don't know where I'm going to find replacements. > Can > you get the PSU to run on dummy load (indicating the short is elsewhere > in the machine)? I would guess not. It does not. With a 5.25" drive as a load or with no load at all, the breaker pops. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From jpl15 at panix.com Fri Jul 5 03:23:00 2002 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: New Haul In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 5 Jul 2002, Doc Shipley wrote: > On Thu, 4 Jul 2002, Marvin Johnston wrote: > [snippage] > > driller/router for my PC shop! I don't think the dremel tool will > > withstand the sidethrust for very long to do > > The Dremel will do routing for many thousands of hours, as long as you > limit the feed appropriately. It takes very little pressure to cut as You also might look into the extension cable for the Dremel motor unit; this would take the load off the main bearings and put it on the relatively cheap cable end. Obclassiccmp: In the late 70's, I bid on (and won) a Cincinnati Milacron single-axis NC X-Y pcb drill unit, that accepted standard 8-level paper tabe (as might be punched on a Flexowriter) and made holes in thin stuff accordingly. It was in running shape, and still had a spool of program tape, which, when rewound, commanded the drill to punch a pattern of holes in whatever was on the platten. The logic of the device was all DEC Flip-Chip modules in individual sockets, but the reader was a photoelectric type with mechanical sprocket feed. Sold it two weeks later to a PCB fab house, for over 20 times what I'd bid it for. Made the Boss grin... Cheers John From tothwolf at concentric.net Fri Jul 5 03:41:29 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: FREE STUFF in Austin, TX In-Reply-To: <20020705013114.GX7164@mrbill.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Jul 2002, Bill Bradford wrote: Hey Bill, been awhile since I've seen any posts from you, guess you are still around afterall... > Only thing is, you *HAVE* to pick it up, *IN PERSON*. I"m tired of > people saying they'll arrange something, have someone come by, etc. > > Its up for grabs for the first person who shows up and can actually > put this stuff to use, or emails me with a *convincing* reason why I > should hold/ship it for them and has something to trade for what they > want. > Third, I have a pair of IBM P70 portable (486?) systems with orange > plasma displays. When I got these, one powered up but gave a "bad HD" > error code, one didnt power up at all. I attempted to swap out the > hard drives between the two, but after I tried that, neither would > power up. I beleive they are both missing the back system cover, but > would be great for replacement parts to keep another P70 running. These are actually 386 aren't they? > Again, free, but you must pick these up in Austin, TX, at my house. > I will NOT ship anything (unless you have a REALLY good trade offer, > and pay for shipping). If you want something held, you will have to > trade me something interesting for what you want. > > I'm tired of people telling me "oh, I'll pick those up soon" or "I'll > have $relative who lives near there contact you", etc. > > First come, first serve. I need this stuff out of the way, but its > too good to trash.. Maybe it is wrong of me to take this to the list, but I feel offended by this email. If you ask anyone who knows me well, I'm more or less very easy going, and don't offend too easily. On to the point... You promised me the pair of P70 systems quite some time ago, but seem to be nearly impossible to get in contact with. I did pass on the contact information you gave me to my uncle who lives not all that far from you. He told me he feels bad because he has tried to make contact with you time after time, but has not been able to reach you (left messages, (with your wife?), and so on.) Now maybe I've taken this totally out of context, or there is just some miscommunication going on, but I haven't been able to get a response from you directly anytime recently, and your email here feels very offensive. -Toth From mrbill at mrbill.net Fri Jul 5 08:21:14 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: FREE STUFF in Austin, TX In-Reply-To: References: <20020705013114.GX7164@mrbill.net> Message-ID: <20020705132114.GG7164@mrbill.net> On Fri, Jul 05, 2002 at 03:41:29AM -0500, Tothwolf wrote: > On to the point... You promised me the pair of P70 systems quite some time > ago, but seem to be nearly impossible to get in contact with. I did pass > on the contact information you gave me to my uncle who lives not all that > far from you. He told me he feels bad because he has tried to make contact > with you time after time, but has not been able to reach you (left > messages, (with your wife?), and so on.) You kept telling me "my uncle will get in touch with you soon", over and over. From what I know, he tried to call here *once*, and didnt leave any return-call information. I'm not going to go out of my way to call *him* and arrange for pickup; these have been here for months waiting for you to get them or arrange for someone to get them. If you want them, have *him* contact *me* and tell me when he can come pick them up. > Now maybe I've taken this totally out of context, or there is just some > miscommunication going on, but I haven't been able to get a response from > you directly anytime recently, and your email here feels very offensive. I've also been holding these for a long time, and got ONE phone call from your uncle months ago (who never followed up or contacted me again to arrange pickup). You've had your chance to get them (its been 4-5 months, IIRC). I can only be nice and hold things for people for so long... You're also not the first person to do this to me ("hold it, I'll pick it up soon.." and they never show), so thats why I'm pissed off. I've also got a Sun 2/170 here that someone else never showed up for after repeated emails and phone calls. Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From pat at purdueriots.com Fri Jul 5 04:01:31 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: LSI-11/2 In-Reply-To: <200207050233.WAA4161022@shell.TheWorld.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Jul 2002, Megan wrote: > > >I've got an embeded syatem based around an LSI-11/2 processor board, > >M8044-BB (8KW?) memory, pair of DRV-11's, a MDB eprom board and ADC > >board. What do I need to do to make this into a functional PDP-11? I've > >got a DEC MSCP ESDI controller (don't remeber the part #), DLV-11 (8-port > >version) serial card, TQK50, and drives from my VAXstation 3200 I can > >try to use in it. It's from my DPE 5000, the video part of which let out > >a bunch of magic smoke being powered on - can't find any obvious burned > >parts, but haven't checked the power supply yet. Still, it's worth more > >to me as a LSI(PDP)-11 than a video effects box that I can't fix. > > You haven't mentioned what kind of backplane it has (Q/Q vs. Q/CD), > whether it has 22-bit (I suspect just 18-bit) and how many slots. I'm betting it's as small as QBUS comes. It's a Q/Q backplane, with 4 quad-with slots. However, I could stick it into the backplane for my VAXstation 3200, which should be 22-bit Q/Q for most of the backplane (perhaps Q/CD for the top three quad-width slots). > These will all affect what the suggestions. > > Going with what you have, I might suggest upping the power from > an 11/2 to an 11/73 (KDJ11-A), which takes up no more room in the > backplane. OK, well, I have an 11/2 CPU and not an 11/73 CPU. If you want to dontate an 11/73 CPU, I'd be happy to take it off your hands. :) > >First, however, I'm sure I need DEC boot roms for it, or some other way > >to get boot code into it. Does anyone happen to have some laying around > >they could maybe send me an image of? Also, I'm on the lookout for a > >RLV12 and berg cable to connect to the RL02 I have sitting around here.. > > I would suggest an MXV11-B, which gives you two serial lines, memory > and boot code in one dual-high board. Beyond that, the DEC MSCP board > is probably an RQDX(3?) and is not ESDI (I don't think there was an > ESDI board made by DEC... all the ones I got while inside DEC were > made by Andromeda -- the ESDC board). Finally, a DELQA for network > and you're all set. The 'MSCP ESDI' board, part # "SCD-RQD11/EC" (I guess it's not a DEC part, even though it says "MFG UNDER LICENSE FROM DIGITAL EQUIPMENT CORP" on the back, is in my VAXstation 3200, and runs a pair of 600MB-650MB drives that appear to be ESDI. I've got a DECNA (i think) network adaptor in my VS3200 I could try to use. Right now, I'm wanting to try and re-use hardware I have instead of search for hardware that is hard to find. Also, is it possible/easy to change the M8044-BB board (8KW?) to have at least 16KW if not 32KW of memory? That'd be a nice upgrade for the machine if I can do it myself with 'stock' DRAMs. -- Pat From Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com Fri Jul 5 10:15:05 2002 From: Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com (Andreas Freiherr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: LSI-11/2 References: Message-ID: <3D25B7F9.AF633BBF@Vishay.com> Patrick, your BA11-M box (if it is the one from the video effects box you described earlier) is probably the second-smallest Qbus box. There is one with a backplane half as wide as yours, so you can put in only four dual-height modules. This is the BA11-S, aka shoebox. You lost your bet ;-) > I'm betting it's as small as QBUS comes. It's a Q/Q backplane, with 4 > quad-with slots. However, I could stick it into the backplane for my > VAXstation 3200, which should be 22-bit Q/Q for most of the backplane > (perhaps Q/CD for the top three quad-width slots). Your BA11-M has a Q18 backplane, sufficient for 256kB or 128kW of RAM (124.kW after subtracting the I/O page). Enough to get started with any of the typical PDP-11 operating systems at least, and more than your 11/2 can support (it delivers only 16 address bits because it doesn't have a MMU). So, the limiting factor is the CPU, and then the amount of memory you actually _have_. However, a small system should be runnable on this box. What you'll definitely need is at least one serial line to use as the console, so a MXV-11, as suggested by Megan, would indeed be a good idea. Another choice, if easier to get, would be a DLV-11J, which has four serial lines, one of which can be jumpered to the correct CSR and vector to be a console. Details available here upon request, if you cannot find them by googling. The disadvantage of the DLV11-J would be that it has no boot ROM, so you'd still need something like a TEV-11, IIRC. That ESDI controller (seems to really be ESDI, and not made by DEC), it does not possibly happen to carry the proper boot ROMs around with it? - Some third-party Qbus disk controllers do, but you may need different ROMs or jumper settings for VAX or PDP-11 use. > > >First, however, I'm sure I need DEC boot roms for it, or some other way > > >to get boot code into it. Does anyone happen to have some laying around > > >they could maybe send me an image of? Also, I'm on the lookout for a > > >RLV12 and berg cable to connect to the RL02 I have sitting around here.. What ROMs you need may depend on the card (MXV-11, TEV-11, ...). Unfortunately, I don't think I have any spares. However, since you have a ROM board (hopefully, it can be convinced to decode the chip selects to the right address range...), you may simply burn one of the publicly available bootstraps into suitable chips. That's not a lot of wizardry, once you know which device you want to support. It becomes more difficult if you want to offer a choice to the operator, which is what DEC's ROMs sometimes do... Same for the RLV12: quite a good choice, given that you already have a suitable drive, but no parts available from me. The older RLV11 would not help because it needs CD wiring to interconnect the two boards it consists of. The cable is not too critical at the controller side: get any ribbon cable from your local store, perhaps they will even be able to put the connectors on for you. But, they will certainly not have the matching connector for the drive. BTW, do you have the bulkhead connector for transition from the ribbon cable to the round drive bus cable, and a terminator for the drive bus? (The terminator looks like a connector with no cable attached, has a resistor array inside.) > I've got a DECNA (i think) network > adaptor in my VS3200 I could try to use. Right now, I'm wanting to try > and re-use hardware I have instead of search for hardware that is hard to > find. Sure, you can expand later. That's what these boxes are made for. If your network interface is plugged into a Qbus, it must be a DEQNA or a DELQA (if you cannot find the M numbers through Google, look at the board: the letters must be printed on it somewhere, etched in copper). The DECNA is for the Professional machines (desktop PDP-11, as in Pro 350 or Pro 380, seen lately in this mailing list). The DEQNA is the older board, which will not work in a VAX with VMS versions later than V5.something. For PDP-11 use, either a DEQNA or DELQA will do, but you'll need sufficient memory to support a network interface and protocol stack. > Also, is it possible/easy to change the M8044-BB board (8KW?) to have at > least 16KW if not 32KW of memory? That'd be a nice upgrade for the > machine if I can do it myself with 'stock' DRAMs. I have no docs available here in the office, but I seem to remember that the M8044 (MSV-11?) was available in several flavors (identified by the letters after the dash) with different capacities, so it might be possible. I'll look up more about this at home. There should be boards to examine. Stay tuned. I think Megan was thinking of a pretty comfortable machine, while you first need to get started at all, after yanking the PDP-11 from the video effects processor it was embedded in. Since I also started with a rather small configuration, but have meanwhile grown to a total of three PDP-11s (one UNIBUS, two Qbus) to fill a room, this must be possible for you, too. A remark about the power supply in your BA11-M: it is switch mode, but does not require a minimum load current. With very low output currents, it runs as a linear regulator, and with increasing load, it starts switching, but with the load further increasing, it will slowly loose efficiency (read: get hot). I try to keep mine only fairly loaded to extend their life. -- Andreas Freiherr Vishay Semiconductor GmbH, Heilbronn, Germany http://www.vishay.com From lemay at cs.umn.edu Fri Jul 5 10:40:50 2002 From: lemay at cs.umn.edu (Lawrence LeMay) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: LSI-11/2 parts In-Reply-To: <3D25B7F9.AF633BBF@Vishay.com> Message-ID: <200207051540.KAA23981@caesar.cs.umn.edu> > > However, a small system should be runnable on this box. What you'll > definitely need is at least one serial line to use as the console, so a > MXV-11, as suggested by Megan, would indeed be a good idea. Another > choice, if easier to get, would be a DLV-11J, which has four serial > lines, one of which can be jumpered to the correct CSR and vector to be > a console. Details available here upon request, if you cannot find them > by googling. Would any of these be good choices: M7940 serial line unit M8028 asynchronous line interface > > > Also, is it possible/easy to change the M8044-BB board (8KW?) to have at > > least 16KW if not 32KW of memory? That'd be a nice upgrade for the > > machine if I can do it myself with 'stock' DRAMs. > > I have no docs available here in the office, but I seem to remember that > the M8044 (MSV-11?) was available in several flavors (identified by the > letters after the dash) with different capacities, so it might be > possible. I'll look up more about this at home. There should be boards > to examine. Stay tuned. I have these boards: M8044DE 32K 18 bit mos mem M8044DM 32K 18 bit mos mem plus a pair of non-dec boards, different manufacturers, 4 rows of 4116 chips, 8 per row. The M8044's say how much memory they contain, on the back of the circuit board. Let me know if you need any of this stuff. I have 4 M7270 LSI-11 cpu boards as well. -Lawrence LeMay lemay@cs.umn.edu From pat at purdueriots.com Fri Jul 5 07:08:51 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: LSI-11/2 In-Reply-To: <3D25B7F9.AF633BBF@Vishay.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 5 Jul 2002, Andreas Freiherr wrote: > Patrick, > > your BA11-M box (if it is the one from the video effects box you > described earlier) is probably the second-smallest Qbus box. There is > one with a backplane half as wide as yours, so you can put in only four > dual-height modules. This is the BA11-S, aka shoebox. You lost your bet > ;-) I sort of meant address bus width, not physical size, but yeah, it's pretty small size-wize too. > That ESDI controller (seems to really be ESDI, and not made by DEC), it > does not possibly happen to carry the proper boot ROMs around with it? - > Some third-party Qbus disk controllers do, but you may need different > ROMs or jumper settings for VAX or PDP-11 use. It has a ROM on it labelled "SDC-RQD11/EC 100097-0100E", but if it's a boot rom, it's definately has VAX code in it. On the other hand, the controller does do MSCP, so I should be able to use anything that can boot from an MSCP device, right? Unfortunately, it has no port for an floppy drive (RX50/RX01/RX02/etc). > > > >First, however, I'm sure I need DEC boot roms for it, or some other way > > > >to get boot code into it. Does anyone happen to have some laying around > > > >they could maybe send me an image of? Also, I'm on the lookout for a > > > >RLV12 and berg cable to connect to the RL02 I have sitting around here.. > > What ROMs you need may depend on the card (MXV-11, TEV-11, ...). > Unfortunately, I don't think I have any spares. However, since you have > a ROM board (hopefully, it can be convinced to decode the chip selects > to the right address range...), you may simply burn one of the publicly > available bootstraps into suitable chips. That's not a lot of wizardry, > once you know which device you want to support. It becomes more > difficult if you want to offer a choice to the operator, which is what > DEC's ROMs sometimes do... Not a big concern to me really... > Same for the RLV12: quite a good choice, given that you already have a > suitable drive, but no parts available from me. The older RLV11 would > not help because it needs CD wiring to interconnect the two boards it > consists of. The cable is not too critical at the controller side: get > any ribbon cable from your local store, perhaps they will even be able > to put the connectors on for you. But, they will certainly not have the > matching connector for the drive. BTW, do you have the bulkhead > connector for transition from the ribbon cable to the round drive bus > cable, and a terminator for the drive bus? (The terminator looks like a > connector with no cable attached, has a resistor array inside.) All I have is the physical RL02 drive and one disk pack. I even had to splice on a new power cord when I got the thing from Purdue. No cables or terminators (or controllers, unfortunately) were to be had. Does anyone have an RLV12? I'd be willing to pay *some* money for it, but can't afford the going rate on ebay probably. > > I've got a DECNA (i think) network > > adaptor in my VS3200 I could try to use. Right now, I'm wanting to try > > and re-use hardware I have instead of search for hardware that is hard to > > find. > > Sure, you can expand later. That's what these boxes are made for. > > If your network interface is plugged into a Qbus, it must be a DEQNA or > a DELQA (if you cannot find the M numbers through Google, look at the > board: the letters must be printed on it somewhere, etched in copper). > The DECNA is for the Professional machines (desktop PDP-11, as in Pro > 350 or Pro 380, seen lately in this mailing list). The DEQNA is the > older board, which will not work in a VAX with VMS versions later than > V5.something. For PDP-11 use, either a DEQNA or DELQA will do, but > you'll need sufficient memory to support a network interface and > protocol stack. I'm not to worried right now. It also appears to actually be a DELQA-M (M7516). Oh well, I can use it if I get any more QBUS vax stuff. > > Also, is it possible/easy to change the M8044-BB board (8KW?) to have at > > least 16KW if not 32KW of memory? That'd be a nice upgrade for the > > machine if I can do it myself with 'stock' DRAMs. > > I have no docs available here in the office, but I seem to remember that > the M8044 (MSV-11?) was available in several flavors (identified by the > letters after the dash) with different capacities, so it might be > possible. I'll look up more about this at home. There should be boards > to examine. Stay tuned. Yup, from 4kW to 32kW, there's some description of the differences here: http://www.not-compatible.org/PDP-11/modules/msv11-d.html However, it doesn't tell me what I need to look for in a RAM IC for it, like if a standard 4116 or 4164 will work (possibly grounding extra R/C address lines on the 4164...) There's a total of 32 memory IC's, all non-standard looking part numbers on the MSV11 I have. > I think Megan was thinking of a pretty comfortable machine, while you > first need to get started at all, after yanking the PDP-11 from the > video effects processor it was embedded in. Since I also started with a > rather small configuration, but have meanwhile grown to a total of three > PDP-11s (one UNIBUS, two Qbus) to fill a room, this must be possible for > you, too. That's the basic idea I had. > A remark about the power supply in your BA11-M: it is switch mode, but > does not require a minimum load current. With very low output currents, > it runs as a linear regulator, and with increasing load, it starts > switching, but with the load further increasing, it will slowly loose > efficiency (read: get hot). I try to keep mine only fairly loaded to > extend their life. Intersting, I'll keep that in mind. Thanks for the help! -- Pat > -- > Andreas Freiherr > Vishay Semiconductor GmbH, Heilbronn, Germany > http://www.vishay.com > From root at parse.com Fri Jul 5 09:29:00 2002 From: root at parse.com (Robert Krten) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: 11/70 in VA Message-ID: <200207051429.KAA15194@parse.com> I've stumbled across a PDP-11/70 in VA (+1 540 area code). It has a tape associated with it. I'm not sure how much they want, but I believe that I'll be getting some 11/70's closer to home (which are already spoken for :-)). I currently have a person who is #1 on the list for the system, and his #1 priority expires on Monday. I'm looking for a #2 person to give the system to (if my #1 doesn't want it). Any takers? Also, anyone have any PDP stuff they're getting rid of (perhaps the novelty has worn off?) :-) Cheers, -RK -- Robert Krten, PARSE Software Devices +1 613 599 8316. Realtime Systems Architecture, Consulting and Training at www.parse.com From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Fri Jul 5 15:58:37 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: DEC 350 In-Reply-To: <20020705063300.27768.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> from "Ethan Dicks" at Jul 4, 2 11:33:00 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1378 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020705/47e684f7/attachment.ksh From marvin at rain.org Fri Jul 5 16:56:48 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: Scrap Hard Drive & PC Card Prices? References: Message-ID: <3D261620.1617C8BE@rain.org> Anyone know what the current pricing is for scrap hard drives? I'm guessing I probably have 30 - 50 drives ranging from 5 1/4 to 3 1/2" drives that are non-working. What about scrap PC cards, and does age (gold content?) make a difference in what they bring? I am assuming the cards get bought for the gold scrap, but if there is more to it, I would appreciate hearing about it! From jingber at ix.netcom.com Fri Jul 5 16:53:48 2002 From: jingber at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey H. Ingber) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: Scrap Hard Drive & PC Card Prices? In-Reply-To: <3D261620.1617C8BE@rain.org> References: <3D261620.1617C8BE@rain.org> Message-ID: <1025906031.1238.46.camel@netfinity> I would imagine that small quantities of PCBs won't net you much, nor would the small amounts of HDDs - although the drives would probably be worthwhile due to their weight. Jeff On Fri, 2002-07-05 at 17:56, Marvin Johnston wrote: > > Anyone know what the current pricing is for scrap hard drives? I'm > guessing I probably have 30 - 50 drives ranging from 5 1/4 to 3 1/2" > drives that are non-working. What about scrap PC cards, and does age > (gold content?) make a difference in what they bring? I am assuming the > cards get bought for the gold scrap, but if there is more to it, I would > appreciate hearing about it! From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 5 18:23:32 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: LSI-11/2 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020705232332.37410.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> --- Patrick Finnegan wrote: > Yup, from 4kW to 32kW, there's some description of the differences here: > http://www.not-compatible.org/PDP-11/modules/msv11-d.html > However, it doesn't tell me what I need to look for in a RAM IC for it, > like if a standard 4116 or 4164 will work (possibly grounding extra > R/C address lines on the 4164...) There's a total of 32 memory IC's, all > non-standard looking part numbers on the MSV11 I have. AFAIK, the MSV11-D takes 4116 DRAMs, but I've seen them with other part numbers (8xxx?) You can't drop in 4164s for a couple of reasons: refresh and voltage. The 4116 and its 4kbit predecessor are multi-voltage; the 4164 and its descendents are +5VDC only. I have upgraded other DEC memory boards that were half populated. You might be able to do the same here. All of the MSV11D modules I've ever seen were already up to 32KW. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From mbg at TheWorld.com Fri Jul 5 18:40:03 2002 From: mbg at TheWorld.com (Megan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: LSI-11/2 Message-ID: <200207052340.TAA2753904@shell.TheWorld.com> >I'm betting it's as small as QBUS comes. It's a Q/Q backplane, with 4 >quad-with slots. However, I could stick it into the backplane for my >VAXstation 3200, which should be 22-bit Q/Q for most of the backplane >(perhaps Q/CD for the top three quad-width slots). Doesn't make sense to put it in the 22-bit backplane if the processor and memory can't use it... The backplane you have is fine... >OK, well, I have an 11/2 CPU and not an 11/73 CPU. If you want to >donate an 11/73 CPU, I'd be happy to take it off your hands. :) :-) Fine... an 11/23 (KDF11-A) will work there as well... and if you don't have that or can't get it, the 11/2 is fine to get the machine going. >The 'MSCP ESDI' board, part # "SCD-RQD11/EC" (I guess it's not a DEC >part, even though it says "MFG UNDER LICENSE FROM DIGITAL EQUIPMENT CORP" >on the back, is in my VAXstation 3200, and runs a pair of 600MB-650MB >drives that appear to be ESDI. I've got a DECNA (i think) network >adaptor in my VS3200 I could try to use. Right now, I'm wanting to try >and re-use hardware I have instead of search for hardware that is hard to >find. Okay, it isn't DEC... and is ESDI... great... you have disks (do you have a floppy to attach to it so that you can install software?) The DECNA is for the PRO series of machines... you need a DEQNA or DELQA... since you are going to be running PDP-11 OSes, the DEQNA should be fine if you can get one. If you can't, you will still have a workable machine. >Also, is it possible/easy to change the M8044-BB board (8KW?) to have at >least 16KW if not 32KW of memory? That'd be a nice upgrade for the >machine if I can do it myself with 'stock' DRAMs. Yes, you can replace the M8044-B with an M8044-C (for 16kw) or M8044-D (for 32kw). The above parts are fine, but you still need a boot board (REV-11) and a serial line unit (DLV11 or, better, a DLV11-J). If you can find an MXV11-B, you can add its memory to that of the M8044-B you already have and get up to 24kw plus two serial lines and boot code which will boot from MSCP type disks (as well as code for DX, DY, and DL). Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | email: gentry at zk3.dec.com (work) | | Unix Support Engineering Group | mbg at world.std.com (home) | | Hewlett Packard | (s/ at /@/) | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 (DEC '77-'98) | required." - mbg KB1FCA | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ From zaft at azstarnet.com Fri Jul 5 18:41:21 2002 From: zaft at azstarnet.com (Gordon Zaft) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: non DEC drives (was: DEC 350) In-Reply-To: <20020701194517.C204960@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> References: <027101c22113$8e9f6060$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> <20020701140520.87683.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> <027101c22113$8e9f6060$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20020705163933.02447960@mail.azstarnet.com> >On 2002.07.01 17:25 John Allain wrote: > > > Does DEC, for example with the RQDX3, only > > accept the RD5{0..4} _geometries_ with this > > controller or can there be others. Could a larger > > drive be used in a "waste some tracks" mode > > with the RQDX3? As far as I know, the RD54 (aka Maxtor something or other, or Priam 519, or other similar) was the largest MFM drive ever made. If you wanted to use a bigger drive it would have to be something other than MFM (e.g. ESDI, or better yet IDE). G From fernande at internet1.net Fri Jul 5 17:03:56 2002 From: fernande at internet1.net (Chad Fernandez) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: Qbus, ISA cards free plus shipping Message-ID: <3D2617CC.6080209@internet1.net> Free plus the cost of shipping. -3 M8043 DLVJ1-M Q 4-Line Asynchronous Interface -1 M7504 DEQNA-M Q Qbus to ethernet adapter, Q22, obsolete for VMS 5.x and above (use DELQA). -1 M7165 KDA50-Q Q Qbus SDI disk adapter, Q22 (2 of 2) (QDA SDI) -1 M7602 VCB01, QVSS Q Qbus Video Sub System module for Q22 systems (uVAX I, II) -1 M8061 RLV12 Q RL01/RL02 disk control -1 Adaptec 1542B ISA SCSI card -1 Western Digital VGA 8/16 ISA card 256K -1 IBM serial/parallel card 8-bit ISA NS16450N UART -1 Maxtor MXT-540S scsi drive made for IBM FRU 92F0406 540mb -1 IBM WDS-380 scsi drive 80mb -1 generic PC floppy cable If I've promised you cards before, please accept my apologies for not shipping yet. I'll have things boxed soon. I was working a lot of hours, and got behind with everything else. Chad Fernandez Michigan, USA From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 5 21:10:45 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: non DEC drives (was: DEC 350) In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20020705163933.02447960@mail.azstarnet.com> Message-ID: <20020706021045.50768.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> --- Gordon Zaft wrote: > > >On 2002.07.01 17:25 John Allain wrote: > > > > > Does DEC, for example with the RQDX3, only > > > accept the RD5{0..4} _geometries_ with this > > > controller or can there be others. With the right formatter (i.e., the Field Service one for the MicroVAX), you can specify the geometry at low-level format time. With the ROM- based formatter in the MicroVAX 2000, I _think_ you are limited to DEC drive geometries and, in many cases, exact models (cf jumper R7 in the Micropolis drive that's the RD53 (1335?)) > As far as I know, the RD54 (aka Maxtor something or other... XT2190 -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From mrbill at mrbill.net Fri Jul 5 23:01:17 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: Free: Amiga 1080 monitor (Austin) Message-ID: <20020706040117.GO13206@mrbill.net> I've got an Amiga 1080 RGB-or-Composite-input monitor, free for pickup in Austin, TX. Works great; I've been using it as the preview monitor (and to watch TV on) off a VCR for a few months now.. but its just too big and too bulky and puts out too much heat for what I use it for - so I'm gonna try to find a normal TV set to use for that stuff (or even one of the little 3" black and white models). Any leads on that appreciated 8-) Anyway, Amiga 1080. Works fine. Pick it up and its yours. (BTW, sticker on back says mfg. 01/96). Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Sat Jul 6 02:18:23 2002 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: WTD: Microtan 65 info Message-ID: <005f01c224bd$513a7680$0100000a@deepspacenine> Hi, I'm looking for a copy (scanned or otherwise) of the Microtan 65 mainboard schematic and a copy of the Microtan 65 parts list. I'm planning to adapt the video circuitry to a 6502-based computer I'm currently building. Thanks. -- Phil. philpem@dsl.pipex.com http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ From tothwolf at concentric.net Sat Jul 6 04:39:03 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: Scrap Hard Drive & PC Card Prices? In-Reply-To: <3D261620.1617C8BE@rain.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 5 Jul 2002, Marvin Johnston wrote: > Anyone know what the current pricing is for scrap hard drives? I'm > guessing I probably have 30 - 50 drives ranging from 5 1/4 to 3 1/2" > drives that are non-working. What about scrap PC cards, and does age > (gold content?) make a difference in what they bring? I am assuming > the cards get bought for the gold scrap, but if there is more to it, I > would appreciate hearing about it! I've used such "scrap" drives to repair otherwise nonfunctional drives before, so they are not completely useless. I doubt there is much in the way of valuable materials in the drives, though for some of the early ATA and RLL/MFM drives, some of the parts on the boards might be useful to someone who tinkers with electronics. The stepper motors on the early drives that didn't use a voice coil to move the heads, and the powerful magnets in later drives might also be useful to someone who experiments. I think you could probably get more cash for a pile of scrap lead or lead-zinc batteries then you could get for a pile of old nonworking hard drives... I don't know about other folks here on the list, but I very often scrounge (and sometimes buy) lots of old cards (PC/AT included) to upgrade and maintain older systems. There really isn't much in the way of gold in individual boards, so the real scrapers are going to be buying 1000s of pounds of old boards, not just a few boards at a time... -Toth From allain at panix.com Sat Jul 6 08:31:08 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:58 2005 Subject: non DEC drives (was: DEC 350) References: <027101c22113$8e9f6060$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06><20020701140520.87683.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com><027101c22113$8e9f6060$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> <4.3.2.7.2.20020705163933.02447960@mail.azstarnet.com> Message-ID: <02b801c224f1$63700840$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> > the RD54 ... was the largest MFM drive ever made. This I've heard as well. Also, I have seen the RD54 listed as a Maxtor XT-2190 John A. From marvin at rain.org Sat Jul 6 09:30:38 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Scrap Hard Drive & PC Card Prices? References: Message-ID: <3D26FF0E.970C25CC@rain.org> I was offered about $0.15 per pound for the hard drives a while ago and $1.00 per pound for the circuit boards. Since I probably have about 500 - 1000 pounds of drives and cards, it is something worth looking into :). Right now, this excess is too much of a distraction and slows down getting other stuff done. Additionally, I've been throwing out stuff (non computer related) and saving the gold connectors, gold plated boards, etc. without any idea of what it might be worth. Time to find out :). Tothwolf wrote: > > On Fri, 5 Jul 2002, Marvin Johnston wrote: > > > Anyone know what the current pricing is for scrap hard drives? I'm > > guessing I probably have 30 - 50 drives ranging from 5 1/4 to 3 1/2" > > drives that are non-working. What about scrap PC cards, and does age > > (gold content?) make a difference in what they bring? I am assuming > > the cards get bought for the gold scrap, but if there is more to it, I > > would appreciate hearing about it! > > I've used such "scrap" drives to repair otherwise nonfunctional drives > before, so they are not completely useless. I doubt there is much in the > way of valuable materials in the drives, though for some of the early ATA > and RLL/MFM drives, some of the parts on the boards might be useful to > someone who tinkers with electronics. The stepper motors on the early > drives that didn't use a voice coil to move the heads, and the powerful > magnets in later drives might also be useful to someone who experiments. > > I think you could probably get more cash for a pile of scrap lead or > lead-zinc batteries then you could get for a pile of old nonworking hard > drives... > > I don't know about other folks here on the list, but I very often scrounge > (and sometimes buy) lots of old cards (PC/AT included) to upgrade and > maintain older systems. There really isn't much in the way of gold in > individual boards, so the real scrapers are going to be buying 1000s of > pounds of old boards, not just a few boards at a time... > > -Toth From Innfogra at aol.com Sat Jul 6 11:46:32 2002 From: Innfogra at aol.com (Innfogra@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Scrap Hard Drive & PC Card Prices? Message-ID: <21.20794196.2a5878e8@aol.com> In a message dated 7/6/02 7:31:59 AM Pacific Daylight Time, marvin@rain.org writes: > I was offered about $0.15 per pound for the hard drives a while ago and > $1.00 per pound for the circuit boards. Since I probably have about 500 > - 1000 pounds of drives and cards, it is something worth looking into > :). Right now, this excess is too much of a distraction and slows down > getting other stuff done. Additionally, I've been throwing out stuff > (non computer related) and saving the gold connectors, gold plated > boards, etc. without any idea of what it might be worth. Time to find > out :). > Those are good prices on your scrap. Aluminum Breakage (Hard Drives) is about 16 cents a pound and cards run from 40 cents to $2 per pound depending on the age and how heavy the gold plate it. Cut fingers go for more. HP gold plated boards go for $3 to $3.50 per pound. Ask your scrapper how to sort your cards for maximum value. Remove all Aluminum and Iron for maximum value. There are several chip recyclers out there also who will pay a premium if the cards have chips they want to pull for resale. Many scrappers will buy small quantities. I could direct you to one in Portland, OR but I think you can find one locally. Paxton Astoria, OR -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020706/623ce7a1/attachment.html From red at bears.org Sat Jul 6 12:08:11 2002 From: red at bears.org (r. 'bear' stricklin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: SGI's first MIPS workstation Message-ID: I recall this was the subject of some debate earlier. I dug up a primary source last night, and offer the following article from the Summer 1987 edition of IRIS Universe: "announcing the IRIS 4D/60 turbo option" In March, Silivon Graphics demonstrated its commitment to being the undisputed leader in the superworkstation market by introducing the IRIS 4D/60, the industry's first RISC-based superworkstation. This new product introduction generated more interest and excitement than any other single event in Silicon Graphics' history. Certainly a major reason for the industry's excitement is the IRIS 4D/60's premier graphics performance. Equally important, however, is the new RISC and floating point technology incorporated in the IRIS 4D/60. Users' response to this level of computing performance from the RIS 4D/60 continues to be very enthusiastic. Now, four months after the introduction of the IRIS 4D/60, Silicon Graphics once again leads the industry by introducint the IRIS 4D/60 Turbo Option, a high-performance computing upgrade for the IRIS 4D/60 Superworkstation. By integrating the latest in RISC and floating point technoloyg, the IRIS 4D/60 Turbo Option breaks both the 10 MIPS and 1 MFLOPS performance barriers! While the IRIS 4D/60 is already the best all-around performer in its price range, the integer and floating point performance of the new Turbo Option make this upgrade truly phenomenal. The IRIS 4D/60 Turbo Option incorporates a 12.5 MHz RISC CPU, 50 percent faster than the 8 MHz CPU introduced with the IRIS 4D/60. This CPU is tightly coupled with a new single-chip floating point coprocessor. By using custom VLSI technology, the the [sic]Turbo Option increases the floating point performance of the IRIS 4D/60 by a factor of three. The Turbo Option's new CPU board also includes cache memory, up to 16 Mbytes of on board CPU memory, and an interface to SCSI peripherals. By having all of the major components of the CPU architecture on a single board, the rate of data transfer between components is significantly improved, thereby maximizing system performance. The IRIS 4F/60 Turbo Option employs a dual-cache architecture incorporating 64 Kbytes of instruction cache plus 32 Kbytes of data cache. The dual cache architecture increases system performance byholding large portions of the application program in efficient cache memory, and ensures that instructions and data will not compete for the same cache locations. This architecture improves performance of large applications by reducint the time required to access instructions and data. How fast is fast? Using the Dhrystone benchmark, the industry standard for measuring integer computing performance, an IRIS 4D/60 with the Turbo Option leads the superworkstation pack at 10 MIPS (ten times a VAX 11/780). Using the Linpack benchmark to measure floating point performance, the Turbo Option performs 1.1 million double precision floating point operations per second (1.1 MFLOPS). In addition to theis significatn boost in computing performance, Silicon Graphics announces support for advanced lighting models on the IRIS 4D/60, with or without the Turbo Option. Both infinite and local light sources are supported, including attenuation of local light sources with distance from the source. Diffuse and specular (Phong) lighting are also supported, and up to eight colored light sources may be modeled simultaneously. The Turbo Option may be purchased as a field installable upgrade for the IRIS 4D/60. Please contact your local sales representative. -- typos solely my responsibility. ok r. From pat at purdueriots.com Sat Jul 6 08:21:29 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: RS/6000 580 Message-ID: YAY! I've got it partially IPLing off of the drives that came out of my 55L. It seems to halt with a message of '552' - IPL Varyon falied. Does anyone know enough IBM-speak to tell me what that means? Aparently, the problem it was having earlier with powering off automagically was caused by the power supply thinking a fan was broken - once I fixed that problem, it magically started doing stuff again. I'm about to try booting in service mode with a set of diagnostic disks and see if I can figure anything else out. One more thing -- I'm still getting just a black picture out of the video card, like I was with the 5%L. Does anyone know if that's what it should be doing, or if something there is amiss, too? I've got a 'real' rs/6000 keyboard and mouse hooked up to the system this time, and haven't tried booting with a serial terminal yet. Thanks for any help. -- Pat From mrbill at mrbill.net Sat Jul 6 13:29:28 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: [geeks] Free: Amiga 1080 monitor (Austin) In-Reply-To: <20020706040117.GO13206@mrbill.net> References: <20020706040117.GO13206@mrbill.net> Message-ID: <20020706182928.GU13206@mrbill.net> On Fri, Jul 05, 2002 at 11:01:17PM -0500, Bill Bradford wrote: > I've got an Amiga 1080 RGB-or-Composite-input monitor, free for pickup in > Austin, TX. Gone to Doc Shipley, along with a SZ12 expansion box. Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From pat at purdueriots.com Sat Jul 6 12:34:01 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: RS/6000 580 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 6 Jul 2002, Patrick Finnegan wrote: > YAY! I've got it partially IPLing off of the drives that came out of my > 55L. It seems to halt with a message of '552' - IPL Varyon falied. Does > anyone know enough IBM-speak to tell me what that means? > > Aparently, the problem it was having earlier with powering off > automagically was caused by the power supply thinking a fan was broken - > once I fixed that problem, it magically started doing stuff again. > > I'm about to try booting in service mode with a set of diagnostic disks > and see if I can figure anything else out. OK, after booting off the first 'diagnostics disk', the system looks like its booting - it clears for a second and then displays a few numbers, and halts with 'c05' -- "A diskette error occurred" on the screen. I've verified that the image is properly getting written to the floppy, and have tried different floppies. Any ideas? -- Pat From univac2 at earthlink.net Sat Jul 6 20:03:22 2002 From: univac2 at earthlink.net (Owen Robertson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Some Vacation Finds Message-ID: Well, I went to a glorified scrap yard today, and picked up some neat stuff, and left some neater stuff behind. Other than a VT100, I got only books. The neatest one being DEC's "Introduction To Minicomputer Networks". Being on vacation and having limited hauling capacity I had to leave behind: MicroVAX 3500 DECserver 500 Some kind of IBM RS/6000 thingy Quite a bit of Sun stuff, some SparcStation 1/2s, keyboards, monitors, etc... Some newer DEC stuff and some misc old equipment like printing terminals, a Magnetic Tape Selectric, and a ton of Apple stuff. IBM Office System 6 - I remember reading a little about this. It's like a small desk with two 8" floppy drives and a selectric keyboard, basically. I would really like to get this if possible. Anyone know anything about it? I hope to make it back over here in my truck someday. -- Owen Robertson From Admin at IrisSYSTEMS.net Fri Jul 5 20:18:51 2002 From: Admin at IrisSYSTEMS.net (Ananda Wijesinghe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Dual floppy drive Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020705181714.03365890@mail.IrisSYSTEMS.net> I have the same problem with the FD505 and would like to get a copy of the documentation. Can you please e-mail me a scanned copy or fax a paper copy to 925-606-9421? Many thanks! From kenziem at sympatico.ca Sat Jul 6 20:09:13 2002 From: kenziem at sympatico.ca (Mike) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Swap meet failure Message-ID: <20020707011024.RBJF10226.tomts19-srv.bellnexxia.net@there> Tried a Swap meet in Ottawa today. Most people misunderstand the meaning of swap. There were more machines on my driveway after the event that when it started. Traded 2 small case fans for cash, and a partial HP 9000/715 for a Cromemco system 3, 2 apple II clones, a TI 99, 3 HP external disk drives, a few commodore 64's and a bunch of documentation . Left behind was a MAC PLUS, LC II, LC III, ACER ?? all with monitors, a few external scsi boxes, and socket 7 mobo's. On my door step last night was a TRS 80 model III and a Commodre 128, And the night before I picked up a SGI personal iris and a compaq contura aero. And my favorite scrapper has a commodore SX-64 in the back. All in all a good week, but the next swap will have to be on someone elses drive way I no longer have space to have another. From mrbill at mrbill.net Sat Jul 6 21:59:59 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: WTB: MMJ cables and adapters Message-ID: <20020707025959.GK18182@mrbill.net> I'm in need of a couple MMJ (to MMJ) cables and some MMJ-to-DB9 and MMJ-to-DB25 adapters. I'd like to avoid paying Blackbox $8/ea for the cables if possible Length is unimportant, heck, 3" or 6" will work, I just need to turn MMJ into DB9 or DB25. (I'm borrowing one from Doc for the VT1200 right now, and need to return his soon) The VT1200 and VRE01 is *beautiful*, but I also need a pair of 10b2 T-connectors and some terminators before I can get it on the network (picked up a D-Link hub with 10b2 on back today at Goodwill for $11). Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From mrbill at mrbill.net Sun Jul 7 01:17:17 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Free: Sony NEWS workstation (Austin, TX) Message-ID: <20020707061717.GS18182@mrbill.net> I've got a Sony NEWS workstation (keyboard, system unit, and external SCSI tape drive) free for pickup in Austin, TX. Its a NWS-841. I no longer have the monitor for the unit (has a 3W3 connector on the back; monitor was a GDM-1962B-style), but I do have the keyboard (in original box, no mouse) and external tape drive (uses a Centronics-style SCSI-I cable). Has a floppy drive (with yellow plastic drive protector) and even still has the red "caps" covering some of the I/O ports in back. It looks very unused, but its been years since I tried to power it up; I dont even remember anymore where I got it from. Best specs I've been able to find on it: http://groups.google.com/groups?q=NWS-841&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=24800002%40iuvax&rnum=7 " There was a short blurb about the new Sony workstations in INFOWORLD (Feb 1, 1988 page 3, "AT DEADLINE"). ...Internally called the "Sun Killer," the NWS-841 will sport two 16-MHz 68020 microprocessors, a 68881 math coprocessor, 8M of RAM, a 286- MB floppy drive, six I/O ports, including an EtherNET interface, one rep. said. The machine will sell for about $19,900. Supported software will include BSD4.2, NFS, and X. " Anyway, if anybody is interested, let me know. I'd like to get this out of the way, but dont want to scrap it. It just must go to a good home. Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From jhellige at earthlink.net Tue Jul 2 08:20:42 2002 From: jhellige at earthlink.net (Jeff Hellige) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: And, the insanity continues In-Reply-To: <000501c221c8$0fdcce60$177ba8c0@ne.client2.attbi.com> References: <000501c221c8$0fdcce60$177ba8c0@ne.client2.attbi.com> Message-ID: <02Jul7.022438edt.119047@gateway.mediacen.navy.mil> >I always wondered about lenny15 and where he gets his stuff...He has >some really neat (and sometimes rare) Apple items for sale >consistently...he also commands some premium pricing! (and gets it) :-( > >He seems like a nice enough guy...he helped me out with a couple of >questions on my Lisa 2/10. I've had mixed results with dealing with him. I've bought a couple of things from him but when I was looking for a CPU board with original Lisa boot and videostate ROMs he would never give a definate answer or close the deal. The things I did get from him worked out good though and were in nice shape. I've always thought the LisaVision kits he was selling looked interesting. Jeff -- Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File http://www.cchaven.com http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757 From g at kurico.com Sun Jul 7 01:35:14 2002 From: g at kurico.com (g@kurico.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Free: Sony NEWS workstation (Austin, TX) In-Reply-To: <20020707061717.GS18182@mrbill.net> Message-ID: <3D279AD2.28907.10515F@localhost> Will you be around tomorrow. Do you still have the Sun2? I'll pick up both the Sun2 and the Sony if they are both available. Hopefully this time we'll connect. George On 7 Jul 2002 at 1:17, Bill Bradford wrote: > I've got a Sony NEWS workstation (keyboard, system unit, and > external SCSI tape drive) free for pickup in Austin, TX. > > Its a NWS-841. I no longer have the monitor for the unit (has a 3W3 > connector on the back; monitor was a GDM-1962B-style), but I do have > the keyboard (in original box, no mouse) and external tape drive > (uses a Centronics-style SCSI-I cable). Has a floppy drive (with yellow > plastic drive protector) and even still has the red "caps" covering some of > the I/O ports in back. It looks very unused, but its been years since I tried > to power it up; I dont even remember anymore where I got it from. > > Best specs I've been able to find on it: > > http://groups.google.com/groups?q=NWS-841&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=24800002%40iuvax&rnum=7 > > " There was a short blurb about the new Sony workstations in > INFOWORLD (Feb 1, 1988 page 3, "AT DEADLINE"). > > ...Internally called the "Sun Killer," the NWS-841 will sport > two 16-MHz 68020 microprocessors, a 68881 math coprocessor, 8M of RAM, > a 286- MB floppy drive, six I/O ports, including an EtherNET > interface, one rep. said. The machine will sell for about $19,900. > Supported software will include BSD4.2, NFS, and X. " > > Anyway, if anybody is interested, let me know. I'd like to get this > out of the way, but dont want to scrap it. It just must go to a good > home. > > Bill > > -- > Bill Bradford > mrbill@mrbill.net > Austin, TX From jrkeys at concentric.net Fri Jul 5 13:25:54 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] It's getting Bad A Lisa 2 is now worth a lot ? Message-ID: <00a601c22451$67a32050$0a000240@oemcomputer> Check out this Lisa 2 that went for $1500' http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2034952824 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020705/17937343/attachment.html From g at kurico.com Sun Jul 7 01:43:44 2002 From: g at kurico.com (g@kurico.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Free: Sony NEWS workstation (Austin, TX) In-Reply-To: <3D279AD2.28907.10515F@localhost> References: <20020707061717.GS18182@mrbill.net> Message-ID: <3D279CD0.21444.181A1F@localhost> Dang, sorry about that, it's getting late .... On 7 Jul 2002 at 1:35, g@kurico.com wrote: > Will you be around tomorrow. Do you still have the Sun2? I'll pick up both the Sun2 and > the Sony if they are both available. Hopefully this time we'll connect. > > George > > On 7 Jul 2002 at 1:17, Bill Bradford wrote: > > > I've got a Sony NEWS workstation (keyboard, system unit, and > > external SCSI tape drive) free for pickup in Austin, TX. > > > > Its a NWS-841. I no longer have the monitor for the unit (has a 3W3 > > connector on the back; monitor was a GDM-1962B-style), but I do have > > the keyboard (in original box, no mouse) and external tape drive > > (uses a Centronics-style SCSI-I cable). Has a floppy drive (with yellow > > plastic drive protector) and even still has the red "caps" covering some of > > the I/O ports in back. It looks very unused, but its been years since I tried > > to power it up; I dont even remember anymore where I got it from. > > > > Best specs I've been able to find on it: > > > > http://groups.google.com/groups?q=NWS-841&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=24800002%40iuvax&rnum=7 > > > > " There was a short blurb about the new Sony workstations in > > INFOWORLD (Feb 1, 1988 page 3, "AT DEADLINE"). > > > > ...Internally called the "Sun Killer," the NWS-841 will sport > > two 16-MHz 68020 microprocessors, a 68881 math coprocessor, 8M of RAM, > > a 286- MB floppy drive, six I/O ports, including an EtherNET > > interface, one rep. said. The machine will sell for about $19,900. > > Supported software will include BSD4.2, NFS, and X. " > > > > Anyway, if anybody is interested, let me know. I'd like to get this > > out of the way, but dont want to scrap it. It just must go to a good > > home. > > > > Bill > > > > -- > > Bill Bradford > > mrbill@mrbill.net > > Austin, TX > > From doc at mdrconsult.com Sun Jul 7 02:10:46 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Amiga 1000 Message-ID: Well, I held off for a year and a half, but when the A1000 hit $5 I couldn't help it. I bought it. Now all I need is a keyboard, joystick, and a clue, none of which were available at Goodwill. I do have a display, thanks to Bill Bradford. Will a 1541 or 1571 external floppy be a good addition? Which? ISTR that there's no reasonable hope of genning up a boot floppy on a PC or Mac, right? So I need to find someone to dupe disks to get started? Or pay for them? Anybody have a pile of spare keyboards & mice? Doc From doc at mdrconsult.com Sun Jul 7 02:14:11 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: QuickTake 150 to PC cable pinouts. Message-ID: Does anybody have the actual "QuickTake 150 Windows Connection Kit" cable? Would you be willing to either trace the pinout or point me at the _right_ pinouts on the Web? I've found no less than 3 different pinouts, and the two I've tried don't work. Bah! Doc From cbajpai at attbi.com Sun Jul 7 06:27:09 2002 From: cbajpai at attbi.com (Chandra Bajpai) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] It's getting Bad A Lisa 2 is now worth a lot ? In-Reply-To: <00a601c22451$67a32050$0a000240@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <000201c225a9$3bc40cc0$177ba8c0@ne.client2.attbi.com> The reason it went for so much was some dunderhead thought it was paying $1500 for a Lisa 2 with documentation + printer was worth it. Previously I've seen such Lisa 2 systems with docs+printer go for $800 or so bucks, but this is a new record. Could the economy be turning around? :-) -Chandra -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Keys Sent: Friday, July 05, 2002 2:26 PM To: cctech@classiccmp Subject: [CCTECH] It's getting Bad A Lisa 2 is now worth a lot ? Check out this Lisa 2 that went for $1500' http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem &item=2034952824 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020707/6d358d8b/attachment.html From tothwolf at concentric.net Sun Jul 7 07:03:09 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: WTB: MMJ cables and adapters In-Reply-To: <20020707025959.GK18182@mrbill.net> Message-ID: On Sat, 6 Jul 2002, Bill Bradford wrote: > I'm in need of a couple MMJ (to MMJ) cables and some MMJ-to-DB9 and > MMJ-to-DB25 adapters. I'd like to avoid paying Blackbox $8/ea for the > cables if possible I'm looking at buying a die set to crimp MMJ connectors in the very near future, and was wondering what the demand for these cables is like. I'd not mind making cables for hobbyist use, but I don't want to turn it into a business right now. What type of wire to the original DEC MMJ cables use? Shielded/unshielded/flat/round? -Toth From rschaefe at gcfn.org Sun Jul 7 07:22:19 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: WTB: MMJ cables and adapters References: Message-ID: <003a01c225b0$f21aa720$72469280@kazenotani.net> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tothwolf" To: Sent: Sunday, July 07, 2002 08:03 AM Subject: Re: WTB: MMJ cables and adapters > I'm looking at buying a die set to crimp MMJ connectors in the very near > future, and was wondering what the demand for these cables is like. I'd > not mind making cables for hobbyist use, but I don't want to turn it into > a business right now. Ideal (www.idealindustries.com Watch out, they assume a broadband connection!) has a set that does MMJ & RJ45 in thte same frame, #30-497, and ones that do various other combinations of RJ11, RJ12, , RJ45 and handset crimps. I've got one on order, haven't gotten around to picking it up yet. Should be less than $35-- don't pay the $50 that Microcenter wants. > > What type of wire to the original DEC MMJ cables use? > Shielded/unshielded/flat/round? Ivory colored flat unshielded 6 conductor. All Electronics (www.allelectronics.com) had some the last time I checked, but I don't know how their price holds up-- I haven't shopped the cable around yet. Dunno where to get the ends yet either. > > -Toth Bob From tothwolf at concentric.net Sun Jul 7 07:55:06 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: WTB: MMJ cables and adapters In-Reply-To: <003a01c225b0$f21aa720$72469280@kazenotani.net> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Robert Schaefer wrote: > Ideal (www.idealindustries.com Watch out, they assume a broadband > connection!) has a set that does MMJ & RJ45 in thte same frame, > #30-497, and ones that do various other combinations of RJ11, RJ12, , > RJ45 and handset crimps. I've got one on order, haven't gotten around > to picking it up yet. Should be less than $35-- don't pay the $50 that > Microcenter wants. I already have a ratchet-type crimper that accepts interchangeable die sets, so all I need is the die set. I've seen the MMJ die set as low as $18 and as high as $60, but I think I can get it for about $20-25. -Toth From ghldbrd at ccp.com Sun Jul 7 09:07:25 2002 From: ghldbrd at ccp.com (Gary Hildebrand) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Amiga 1000 References: Message-ID: <3D284B1D.DE0C74EB@ccp.com> Doc Shipley wrote: > > Well, I held off for a year and a half, but when the A1000 hit $5 I > couldn't help it. I bought it. > Now all I need is a keyboard, joystick, and a clue, none of which > were available at Goodwill. I do have a display, thanks to Bill > Bradford. Keyboards are the tricky part Quite a few of them were destroyed during a trade-up scheme by Commodore for the A2000. You can use a keyboard for any of the big box Amigas if you make an adapter cable, but then again it won't fit underneath the 1000 like the original did. > Will a 1541 or 1571 external floppy be a good addition? Which? Neither. Amigas use 3.5" DSDD drives, so what you need is a 1010 or 1011 or reasonable facsimile thereof. There was a 1020 5.25" drive that looks almost identical to a 1571, but it is primarily for reading old IBM DSDD floppies for file transfer. > ISTR that there's no reasonable hope of genning up a boot floppy on a > PC or Mac, right? So I need to find someone to dupe disks to get > started? Or pay for them? You will need three disks. Kickstart, Workbench and Extras. Get 1.3 (the latest) as it has bugfixes and supports autobooting of harddrives, if you ever find a HD controller for it. > Anybody have a pile of spare keyboards & mice? The mouse is still commercially available through various Amiga vendors for about $15-20 each. Keyboards are about $50 each and very rare, as they are not the same as PC keyboards. Look for 10 function keys instead of 12, and fewer keys in the area between the QWERTY and the numeric keypad. A2000/3000 keyboards have a 5 pin DIN plug; the A4000 uses a mini-DIN. If you buy a keyboard and mouse, you will have more in the 1000 than it is worth, sad to say. One little known slick trick is that you can use the keyboard to emulate mouse movements (Amiga patent). Awkward, but it works. Gary Hildebrand St. Joseph, MO From spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu Sun Jul 7 11:04:59 2002 From: spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Amiga 1000 In-Reply-To: from Doc Shipley at "Jul 7, 2 02:10:46 am" Message-ID: <200207071604.JAA27124@stockholm.ptloma.edu> > Well, I held off for a year and a half, but when the A1000 hit $5 I > couldn't help it. I bought it. > Now all I need is a keyboard, joystick, and a clue, none of which > were available at Goodwill. I do have a display, thanks to Bill > Bradford. > Will a 1541 or 1571 external floppy be a good addition? Which? Neither :-) those are for the Commodore 8-bits. Your (only?) choice for the A1000 is a 1010, which is a single external 3.5", or maybe a 1020, which is an external 5.25". The 1020 looks like a 1571, though. > ISTR that there's no reasonable hope of genning up a boot floppy on a > PC or Mac, right? So I need to find someone to dupe disks to get > started? Or pay for them? I used to have some Kickstart disks around here that *might* start a A1000 but I'm not sure if I packed them off with the A1200 when I sold it (one of my more stupid decisions). I'll look around. -- ----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser@stockholm.ptloma.edu -- armadillo, n. the act of providing weapons to a Spanish pickle. ------------ From celt at chisp.net Sun Jul 7 11:14:14 2002 From: celt at chisp.net (Michael Maginnis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] It's getting Bad A Lisa 2 is now worth a lot ? References: <00a601c22451$67a32050$0a000240@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <3D2868D6.9010208@chisp.net> Keys wrote: > Check out this Lisa 2 that went for $1500' > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2034952824 > I think this one went for as much as it did because of all the extras (i.e., unopened manuals, complete software sets, etc). Still a bit high , even for escam. /mpm From celt at chisp.net Sun Jul 7 11:17:59 2002 From: celt at chisp.net (Michael Maginnis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: QuickTake 150 to PC cable pinouts. References: Message-ID: <3D2869B7.9090700@chisp.net> Doc Shipley wrote: > Does anybody have the actual "QuickTake 150 Windows Connection Kit" > cable? Would you be willing to either trace the pinout or point me at > the _right_ pinouts on the Web? > I've found no less than 3 different pinouts, and the two I've tried > don't work. > Bah! > > Doc > I know I used to - may still have it in the basement somewhere. I'll take a look. /mpm From celt at chisp.net Sun Jul 7 11:20:34 2002 From: celt at chisp.net (Michael Maginnis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Amiga 1000 References: Message-ID: <3D286A52.5050100@chisp.net> Doc Shipley wrote: > Well, I held off for a year and a half, but when the A1000 hit $5 I > couldn't help it. I bought it. > Now all I need is a keyboard, joystick, and a clue, none of which > were available at Goodwill. I do have a display, thanks to Bill > Bradford. > Will a 1541 or 1571 external floppy be a good addition? Which? > ISTR that there's no reasonable hope of genning up a boot floppy on a > PC or Mac, right? So I need to find someone to dupe disks to get > started? Or pay for them? > Anybody have a pile of spare keyboards & mice? > > Doc > What part of the country are you in? There's an Amiga store here in Denver that's pretty well stocked. I could ask them if you're interested. /mpm From marvin at rain.org Sun Jul 7 11:31:17 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Versatec Board References: <3D2869B7.9090700@chisp.net> Message-ID: <3D286CD5.EBDB906B@rain.org> I've got a Versatec Board with the only ID I can recognize being "C-NOVA/F10/DMA". Most of the chips are code dated 1979; anyone know what this thing is and does anyone need it? From rdd at rddavis.org Sun Jul 7 12:00:34 2002 From: rdd at rddavis.org (R. D. Davis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Odd Connectors (was: WTB: MMJ cables and adapters) In-Reply-To: <20020707025959.GK18182@mrbill.net> References: <20020707025959.GK18182@mrbill.net> Message-ID: <20020707170033.GB20978@rhiannon.rddavis.org> Quothe Bill Bradford, from writings of Sat, Jul 06, 2002 at 09:59:59PM -0500: > I'm in need of a couple MMJ (to MMJ) cables and > some MMJ-to-DB9 and MMJ-to-DB25 adapters. I'd like to > avoid paying Blackbox $8/ea for the cables if possible For a temporary hack, you can always use a standard RJ45 connector with the tab removed, and then use more easily obtainable supplies to put a cable together from junkbox parts. Speaking of odd connectors used with terminals, I need to locate a 10-pin modular connector (and a way to attach it to a cable) before I can use my AT&T 705MT terminal with my VAX... and need to have an MMJ connector on the other end of the cable. Since the 10-pin connectors are still RJ45 connectors, I'm wondering if my crimping tool will work with these... one way to find out. Alas, 10-pin modular connectors don't appear easy to find locally. In case anyone else finds one of these 705MT terminals with a missing keyboard, note that any PeeCee keyboard with a miniature DIN connector will work with it. -- Copyright (C) 2001 R. D. Davis The difference between humans & other animals: All Rights Reserved an unnatural belief that we're above Nature & rdd@rddavis.org 410-744-4900 her other creatures, using dogma to justify such http://www.rddavis.org beliefs and to justify much human cruelty. From Innfogra at aol.com Sun Jul 7 11:50:43 2002 From: Innfogra at aol.com (Innfogra@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] It's getting Bad A Lisa 2 is now worth a lot ? Message-ID: <16d.10276ae6.2a59cb63@aol.com> In a message dated 7/7/02 9:15:29 AM Pacific Daylight Time, celt@chisp.net writes: > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2034952824 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020707/3076b411/attachment.html From Innfogra at aol.com Sun Jul 7 11:52:52 2002 From: Innfogra at aol.com (Innfogra@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] It's getting Bad A Lisa 2 is now worth a lot ? Message-ID: <9f.29c89b6d.2a59cbe4@aol.com> Note that the buyer is from Italy. After reading the feedback He is a collector. Paxton Astoria, OR Sorry for the blank email. My fingers were too quick. From doc at mdrconsult.com Sun Jul 7 12:09:31 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: QuickTake 150 to PC cable pinouts. In-Reply-To: <3D2869B7.9090700@chisp.net> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Michael Maginnis wrote: > Doc Shipley wrote: > > Does anybody have the actual "QuickTake 150 Windows Connection Kit" > > cable? Would you be willing to either trace the pinout or point me at > > the _right_ pinouts on the Web? > > I've found no less than 3 different pinouts, and the two I've tried > > don't work. > > I know I used to - may still have it in the basement somewhere. I'll > take a look. Thanks! Doc From doc at mdrconsult.com Sun Jul 7 12:11:38 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Amiga 1000 In-Reply-To: <3D286A52.5050100@chisp.net> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Michael Maginnis wrote: > > What part of the country are you in? There's an Amiga store here in > Denver that's pretty well stocked. I could ask them if you're interested. I'm in Austin Texas. I've been there, I think. About 3 blocks South of all the Middle Eastern restaurants? VERY cool place, but I can't remember the street name. Doc From mrbill at mrbill.net Sun Jul 7 12:21:42 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Success story (VT1200) Message-ID: <20020707172142.GE26024@mrbill.net> Success story. Got the VT1200, took the mouse apart, fixed it, hooked up the VRE01 flatpanel, got it tweaked and working.. Got a MMJ and a DB9 adapter from Doc Shipley, they work fine (serial console). Went to Goodwill, got a 12port (gak!) 10baseT hub (old D-Link) with a 10base2 uplink on the back. Got cables. Got home. No 10b2 Ts and terminators. Called friends. Friend had a box of them, left four Ts and two terminators on my porch this morning. Hooked everything up... mrbill@chip:~> ping -s vt1200 PING vt1200: 56 data bytes 64 bytes from 192.168.123.250: icmp_seq=0. time=7. ms 64 bytes from 192.168.123.250: icmp_seq=1. time=7. ms 64 bytes from 192.168.123.250: icmp_seq=2. time=7. ms 64 bytes from 192.168.123.250: icmp_seq=3. time=7. ms 64 bytes from 192.168.123.250: icmp_seq=4. time=7. ms 64 bytes from 192.168.123.250: icmp_seq=5. time=7. ms ^C ----vt1200 PING Statistics---- 6 packets transmitted, 6 packets received, 0% packet loss round-trip (ms) min/avg/max = 7/7/7 mrbill@chip:~> xdpyinfo name of display: 192.168.123.250:0.0 version number: 11.0 vendor string: DECWINDOWS DigitalEquipmentCorp. vendor release number: 11 maximum request size: 16384 bytes motion buffer size: 0 bitmap unit, bit order, padding: 32, LSBFirst, 32 image byte order: LSBFirst number of supported pixmap formats: 1 supported pixmap formats: depth 1, bits_per_pixel 1, scanline_pad 32 keycode range: minimum 86, maximum 251 focus: window 0x10000e, revert to None number of extensions: 1 ServerManagementExtension default screen number: 0 number of screens: 1 screen #0: dimensions: 1024x864 pixels (260x219 millimeters) resolution: 100x100 dots per inch depths (1): 1 root window id: 0x8006b depth of root window: 1 plane number of colormaps: minimum 1, maximum 1 default colormap: 0x80066 default number of colormap cells: 2 preallocated pixels: black 0, white 1 options: backing-store NO, save-unders NO largest cursor: 16x16 current input event mask: 0x0 number of visuals: 1 default visual id: 0x80065 visual: visual id: 0x80065 class: StaticGray depth: 1 plane available colormap entries: 2 red, green, blue masks: 0x0, 0x0, 0x0 significant bits in color specification: 1 bits Unfortunately: mrbill@chip:~> xterm Warning: Cannot convert string "5x7" to type FontStruct xterm: unable to locate a suitable font ugh. I did NOT want to have to mess with remote fonts, considering I have ZERO documentation for this thing... I just wish it had SSH built-in. Cool and useful, regardless.. Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From mrbill at mrbill.net Sun Jul 7 12:40:00 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Odd Connectors (was: WTB: MMJ cables and adapters) In-Reply-To: <20020707170033.GB20978@rhiannon.rddavis.org> References: <20020707025959.GK18182@mrbill.net> <20020707170033.GB20978@rhiannon.rddavis.org> Message-ID: <20020707174000.GK26024@mrbill.net> On Sun, Jul 07, 2002 at 01:00:34PM -0400, R. D. Davis wrote: > For a temporary hack, you can always use a standard RJ45 connector > with the tab removed, and then use more easily obtainable supplies to > put a cable together from junkbox parts. Actually, an RJ11. Been there, done that. thank god for dremel tools. 8-) Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From rcini at optonline.net Sun Jul 7 08:03:05 2002 From: rcini at optonline.net (Richard A. Cini, Jr.) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Sept. 85 BYTE article needed Message-ID: > Hello, all: > > I'm looking for an article in the September 1985 issue of BYTE on > the EGO Homebrewed CPU (Part 1) by Clifford Kelley. I have part 2, but > not part 1. > > Please contact me off-list if someone has it and can scan it for me. > Thanks. > > Rich > > Rich Cini > Collector of classic computers > Build Master for the Altair32 Emulation Project > Web site: http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/ > /************************************************************/ > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: winmail.dat Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 1812 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020707/ba519e4b/winmail.bin From foo at siconic.com Sun Jul 7 12:59:53 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] It's getting Bad A Lisa 2 is now worth a lot ? In-Reply-To: <00a601c22451$67a32050$0a000240@oemcomputer> Message-ID: On Fri, 5 Jul 2002, Keys wrote: > Check out this Lisa 2 that went for $1500' > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2034952824 Definitely a bit excessive but the buyer was an Italian, and those Europeans are going hog wild on eBay now that the Euro has gained considerably against the Dollar ;) Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * _______________________________________________ cctech mailing list cctech@classiccmp.org http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From cbajpai at attbi.com Sun Jul 7 06:27:09 2002 From: cbajpai at attbi.com (Chandra Bajpai) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] It's getting Bad A Lisa 2 is now worth a lot ? In-Reply-To: <00a601c22451$67a32050$0a000240@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <000201c225a9$3bc40cc0$177ba8c0@ne.client2.attbi.com> The reason it went for so much was some dunderhead thought it was paying $1500 for a Lisa 2 with documentation + printer was worth it. Previously I've seen such Lisa 2 systems with docs+printer go for $800 or so bucks, but this is a new record. Could the economy be turning around? :-) -Chandra -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Keys Sent: Friday, July 05, 2002 2:26 PM To: cctech@classiccmp Subject: [CCTECH] It's getting Bad A Lisa 2 is now worth a lot ? Check out this Lisa 2 that went for $1500' http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem &item=2034952824 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020707/6d358d8b/attachment-0001.html From curt at atari-history.com Sun Jul 7 13:51:38 2002 From: curt at atari-history.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Amiga 1000 References: Message-ID: <004d01c225e7$53b10b60$01000001@cvendel> Doc... you'll need an A1010 disk drive, the 8bit C64/128 disk drives (1541, 1571, 1581) will not work with the Amiga, different interfaces. Curt ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doc Shipley" To: "Classic Computers" Sent: Sunday, July 07, 2002 3:10 AM Subject: Amiga 1000 > Well, I held off for a year and a half, but when the A1000 hit $5 I > couldn't help it. I bought it. > Now all I need is a keyboard, joystick, and a clue, none of which > were available at Goodwill. I do have a display, thanks to Bill > Bradford. > Will a 1541 or 1571 external floppy be a good addition? Which? > ISTR that there's no reasonable hope of genning up a boot floppy on a > PC or Mac, right? So I need to find someone to dupe disks to get > started? Or pay for them? > Anybody have a pile of spare keyboards & mice? > > Doc > From curt at atari-history.com Sun Jul 7 14:05:13 2002 From: curt at atari-history.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card References: Message-ID: <007b01c225e9$395cdcb0$01000001@cvendel> Probably some yo-yo plugged it into a telco outlet and the first time the phone rang, ZAP! 50volts DC to fry the hardware ;-) Curt ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sellam Ismail" To: "Classic Computers Mailing List" Sent: Monday, July 01, 2002 3:29 PM Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card > > I found a few interesting cards for the Apple ][ the other day. > > On it are the markings "Computer Networking Specialists" with a copyright > of 1988. It has two whole chips: a 6116 and a PAL. The remaining > components are three caps, one which has blown. In fact, of all the cards > I found, they all have the same cap blown, in some cases completely > obliterated with only the two leads remaining with only a huge swath of > soot in the path of the explosion. The cap seems to filter the ground > line (it goes from what I believe is the GND pin on the ICs to the ground > plane on the card). > > Each computer with the card had a cable with an RJ-45 connector on one end > and a four-pin flat connector on the other protuding from the case. I > found other computers without the card but with the cable. The inside end > of the cable (with the 4-pin connector) was loose. There is no mating > connector on the card for it either. > > It seems to me that these computers were part of some network scheme, and > that these cards possibly held some networking firmware. How the cap blew > off the cards is a mystery. I could imagine a power spike coming down the > network cable and damaging the card, but like I said, the cable didn't > plug directly into the card, and I can't imagine the Apple ][ bus passing > along a power surge to the card from the cable. I didn't bother to check > any of the Apple's that I pulled the cards from to see if they were > working. > > Anyway, anyone have any knowledge of these? > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > From cisin at xenosoft.com Sun Jul 7 14:46:45 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: <007b01c225e9$395cdcb0$01000001@cvendel> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Curt Vendel wrote: > Probably some yo-yo plugged it into a telco outlet and the first time the > phone rang, ZAP! 50volts DC to fry the hardware ;-) I get 90 volts AC at 20 Hz From cisin at xenosoft.com Sun Jul 7 14:57:43 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Amiga 1000 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Doc Shipley wrote: > Now all I need is a keyboard, joystick, and a clue, none of which Hmmmm. Often the cheapest source of a keyboard, mouse, external drive, etc. would be to buy a complete computer, keep the acessories that you want, and then sell the main box that you don't want for $5 to somebody like Doc. try VCF in September As to the clue, ... most of us are clueless. From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Sun Jul 7 15:08:08 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Amiga 1000 In-Reply-To: <200207071604.JAA27124@stockholm.ptloma.edu> Message-ID: <20020707200808.69330.qmail@web10303.mail.yahoo.com> > > Well, I held off for a year and a half, but when the A1000 hit $5 I > > couldn't help it. I bought it. Nice find. > > Now all I need is a keyboard, joystick, and a clue, none of which > > were available at Goodwill. Keyboards for A1000s are in short supply, especially compared to CPU units. Commodore had a trade-in deal at one point where you traded-in your A1000 on an A2000 by taking the keyboard to the dealer. It is possible to fashion an RJ11<->DIN5 adapter to use an A2000/A3000 keyboard with an A1000, and the A4000 keyboard works if you add a PS/2- DIN5 converter in the chain. There are also commercial products and freeware projects to adapt an AT keyboard to the Amiga. As for Joysticks, any Atari 2600-compatible joystick will do - get one from a C-64 or wherever. If you are *lucky*, you can find a real C= joystick, or if even luckier, an Amiga joystick. They weren't common even when available new. > > Will a 1541 or 1571 external floppy be a good addition? Which? There _was_ a box to adapt the 1541 to the parallel port, but just for reading C-64 disks. Natively, you need a 23-pin external floppy, either the A1010 or a third-party drive. In any case, it's a "1MB" (raw) floppy, giving you 880KB on the Amiga. And get real low-density media - don't just tape over the hole on a high-density disk. > > ISTR that there's no reasonable hope of genning up a boot floppy on a > > PC or Mac, right? Exactly so. The Amiga reads and writes an entire track at a time, giving 11 sectors of 512 bytes by skimping on the inter-sector gap. In case you didn't know, the graphics chips are used to transform the MFM data from the diskette to binary data buffers. There is no one dedicated floppy chip as in a PeeCee. > So I need to find someone to dupe disks to get started? Or pay > for them? You'll need someone to dup them for you. I don't think there's anywhere to buy them from anymore. What you probably want is KS1.2 or KS1.3 (little difference to an A1000). 2.04 was too large (512K) to fit in the WCS board on the A1000 (256K). You probably have the 256KB memory upgrade behind the plastic panel next to the internal floppy. Given that, you'll find little to run on a 512KB Amiga these days. Some old stuff that also runs on an unexpanded A500 is about all you'll have. c. 1986, when I had a 512KB A1000 with a single floppy drive, I remember playing Larn, Silent Service, Halley Project and Leather Goddesses of Phobos. Other than that, I used it as an 80-col terminal with VT100. It wasn't until I got another 1.5MB of RAM and a 20MB disk (c. 1987) that the Amiga became a programming tool for me. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Sun Jul 7 15:12:22 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Amiga 1000 In-Reply-To: <3D284B1D.DE0C74EB@ccp.com> Message-ID: <20020707201222.49871.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> --- Gary Hildebrand wrote: > Keyboards are about $50 each and very rare, as > they are not the same as PC keyboards. Look for 10 function keys > instead of 12, and fewer keys in the area between the QWERTY and the > numeric keypad. Speaking of A1000 keyboards, does anyone have a destroyed one they can let parts go from? I am repairing an A1000 keyboard for a friend (two or three of the keys are shot from playing the same game over and over) and I have no parts. I was going to pull a switch or two from an uninteresting place (like "HELP" which never seems to get any use) to get his letter keys functional. What I _should_ do is give him an A500 in exchange for his A1000. It'll play the same games and he won't miss the A1000 (not that I need another one - I still have my original one from 1986, massively expanded). I just figure it will be easier to support him if he has an A500. If he _had_ a PeeCee, I'd get him an Amiga emulator. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From foo at siconic.com Sun Jul 7 15:09:39 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Curt Vendel wrote: > > Probably some yo-yo plugged it into a telco outlet and the first time the > > phone rang, ZAP! 50volts DC to fry the hardware ;-) > > I get 90 volts AC at 20 Hz True, 90VAC on the ring cycle. In the off-hook you have 48VDC (nominal) at 20mA. At any rate, the jack on the end was RJ45, so it wouldn't have been easy for someone to plug it into a phone jack, but I'm sure a determined idiot could manage :) Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Sun Jul 7 15:15:57 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:23:59 2005 Subject: QuickTake 150 to PC cable pinouts. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020707201557.70247.qmail@web10302.mail.yahoo.com> --- Doc Shipley wrote: > Does anybody have the actual "QuickTake 150 Windows Connection Kit" > cable? I have one somewhere. It came with my used QT150. I've been using it with a Mac, so I don't remember where the cable got off to. > Would you be willing to either trace the pinout or point me at > the _right_ pinouts on the Web? If you don't get it from someone else this week, I'll try and find my cable. > I've found no less than 3 different pinouts, and the two I've tried > don't work. By this can I assume you _have_ the PeeCee software? I have the Mac disk images. They are _not_ available from Apple due to licensing issues with a third-party package included. I'd be happy to swap software. I've _never_ had the Windoze version. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From tothwolf at concentric.net Sun Jul 7 15:27:55 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Sellam Ismail wrote: > True, 90VAC on the ring cycle. In the off-hook you have 48VDC > (nominal) at 20mA. > > At any rate, the jack on the end was RJ45, so it wouldn't have been > easy for someone to plug it into a phone jack, but I'm sure a > determined idiot could manage :) I've seen damaged network cards and network gear where someone plugged a RJ11-RJ11 cord from an analog phone system into the RJ45. I've also seen damage caused the same way by commercial phone systems, which used RJ45 connectors. -Toth From marvin at rain.org Sun Jul 7 15:28:54 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: What is this? References: <20020707200808.69330.qmail@web10303.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3D28A486.23D62A06@rain.org> In cleaning out the garage, I ran across three brand new what appear to be 8" removeable cartridge units with no manufacturers ID that I recognize. These three units are still sealed in their original plastic wrapping except for the one I opened to try and find out what it is. There are two dates, 11/26/84 on a test report taped to the unit, and 10/31/89 loose in the package; both refer to the same serial number. The model is DP100 and it requires 24VDC @ 3.8A, 5VDC @ 2.5A max, and -12VDC @ .5A. The only name I recognize is on the Pass/Fail Report and it has a PASS.AS.DATAPOINT on it. Anyone have any clues as to what this might be? From celt at chisp.net Sun Jul 7 15:35:32 2002 From: celt at chisp.net (Michael Maginnis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Amiga 1000 References: Message-ID: <3D28A614.7030401@chisp.net> Doc Shipley wrote: > On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Michael Maginnis wrote: > >>What part of the country are you in? There's an Amiga store here in >>Denver that's pretty well stocked. I could ask them if you're interested. > > > I'm in Austin Texas. I've been there, I think. About 3 blocks South > of all the Middle Eastern restaurants? VERY cool place, but I can't > remember the street name. > > Doc > Yeah, that's the one (in Aurora) - drawing a blank on the name as well. Tons of Amiga A/V equipment along with the boxen. /mpm From cisin at xenosoft.com Sun Jul 7 15:37:28 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Amiga 1000 In-Reply-To: <20020707200808.69330.qmail@web10303.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Ethan Dicks wrote: > > > Will a 1541 or 1571 external floppy be a good addition? Which? > There _was_ a box to adapt the 1541 to the parallel port, but just for > reading C-64 disks. Natively, you need a 23-pin external floppy, either > the A1010 or a third-party drive. In any case, it's a "1MB" (raw) floppy, > giving you 880KB on the Amiga. And get real low-density media - don't > just tape over the hole on a high-density disk. The popular (sloppy terminology) name for those is "720K disk" While the unformatted capacity is a better way to differentiate diskettes, the popular name is what you'll probably need to know when trying to buy some. > > > ISTR that there's no reasonable hope of genning up a boot floppy on a > > > PC or Mac, right? > Exactly so. The Amiga reads and writes an entire track at a time, giving > 11 sectors of 512 bytes by skimping on the inter-sector gap. In case > you didn't know, the graphics chips are used to transform the MFM data > from the diskette to binary data buffers. There is no one dedicated floppy > chip as in a PeeCee. IFF somebody were to go to the effort of some relatively trivial software, then they could be done with a Central Point Option Board (or Catweasel), or even with almost any computer that uses a Western Digita 179x disk controller chip (such as Coco or Kaypro). Those have a raw track read/write cpability, as opposed to the multi-sector read/write supported by the 765. -- Fred Cisin cisin@xenosoft.com XenoSoft http://www.xenosoft.com From jhellige at earthlink.net Sun Jul 7 15:37:04 2002 From: jhellige at earthlink.net (Jeff Hellige) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >I've seen damaged network cards and network gear where someone plugged a >RJ11-RJ11 cord from an analog phone system into the RJ45. I've also seen >damage caused the same way by commercial phone systems, which used RJ45 >connectors. I was with a guy who was testing out LAN drops with a laptop to see which ones were working and we went into a conference room where none of the drops were labeled and due to painting and such you couldn't tell the difference between them and the phone lines, which were for a multiline system with intercom and all the other goodies. He plugged the laptop up to what ended up being one of the phone jacks and there was a nice shower of sparks. Somehow the laptop cmae out of it without any damage. Jeff -- Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File http://www.cchaven.com http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757 From jingber at ix.netcom.com Sun Jul 7 15:34:27 2002 From: jingber at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey H. Ingber) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] It's getting Bad A Lisa 2 is now worth a lot ? In-Reply-To: <000201c225a9$3bc40cc0$177ba8c0@ne.client2.attbi.com> References: <000201c225a9$3bc40cc0$177ba8c0@ne.client2.attbi.com> Message-ID: <1026074071.1240.68.camel@netfinity> I would never pay an ~$800 premium for documentation, no matter what condition they may be, esp. when ALL of the docs included with that system are available in .PDF, online. I would be happy to recieve the docs with the system, but I woulnd't pay that kind of premium. I can think of some very valuable first-edition books and manuscripts that don't come close to the extra $800.00. Jeff On Sun, 2002-07-07 at 07:27, Chandra Bajpai wrote: > The reason it went for so much was some dunderhead thought it was paying > $1500 for a Lisa 2 with documentation + printer was worth it. > Previously I've seen such Lisa 2 systems with docs+printer go for $800 > or so bucks, but this is a new record. Could the economy be turning > around? :-) > > -Chandra > > > -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] > On Behalf Of Keys > Sent: Friday, July 05, 2002 2:26 PM > To: cctech@classiccmp > Subject: [CCTECH] It's getting Bad A Lisa 2 is now worth a lot ? > > Check out this Lisa 2 that went for $1500' > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem > > &item=2034952824 From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sun Jul 7 17:16:55 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Versatec Board In-Reply-To: <3D286CD5.EBDB906B@rain.org> from "Marvin Johnston" at Jul 7, 2 09:31:17 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 745 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020707/72a99d91/attachment.ksh From marvin at rain.org Sun Jul 7 17:52:26 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Versatec Board References: Message-ID: <3D28C62A.5FC5053F@rain.org> Tony Duell wrote: > > > I've got a Versatec Board with the only ID I can recognize being > > "C-NOVA/F10/DMA". Most of the chips are code dated 1979; anyone know > > what this thing is and does anyone need it? > > COuld it be a board that fits into a Nova (is it the right size and edge > connector patterns)? If so, I would guess it's an interface to link one > of those Versatec printer/plotters to the Nova (and one that used DMA to > transfer the large (for the time) bitmaps to the printer). Somewhere I This board is approximately 14" or 15" square and has two edge connectors on the bottom approximately 6' - 7" long; I don't recall what the Nova boards look like. While it has some test points on it, it does not have any connectors to the outside world. From marvin at rain.org Sun Jul 7 18:52:49 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: For Sale or Trade References: <3D28C62A.5FC5053F@rain.org> Message-ID: <3D28D451.501EF819@rain.org> As with several of us, I *NEED* to pare down the collection as it is *WAY* out of control as a number of people who have been here can attest to. I will most likely hold the collection down to pre 1982 or so, and will sell/trade off the rest. This list is off the top of my head and this is just a portion of the collection. If you see something you are interested in, make an offer! I've got several Philips Word Processors circa 1984 or so, and since they fall outside of the computers I intend to collect, they are up for sale or trade. Two of the units are approximately 30" square with 8" drives, and the other one is integrated with a monitor and has 5 1/4" drives. Their condition is unknown but they were working when they were removed from service 10 years or so ago. There might be a few disks and some documentation, but I don't know for sure. These units are fairly heavy! I also have an 8" Cado hard drive that was removed from a Cado system some 10+ years ago. In checking, I have TOO many 400/800 Atari computers ... it seems everywhere I turn I see another one. These are all working but don't have any docs, peripherals, or cartridges with them. I *may* have extra docs but they will take some time to find. Ditto for the Apple ii+, iic, iie computers, monitors, and disk drives. Ditto for the Commodore C-64 computers, 1571 drives, and 1701 (I think) color monitors. Ditto for the Macs. Most are SEs but the Classic, 512K, Plus, and probably a few other models are included. I do want to keep one of each model for the collection (realizing they are post 1984 :) ) Ditto for the Eagle II computers. Ditto for the Mattel Aquarius computers. Ditto for the Radio Shack Model 4. Ditto for the Radio Shack Model 100. Ditto for the Tandy 1000tx and I don't remember what other suffixes. Ditto for the IBM convertibles (don't recall the model #.) They may not have the power supply modules. Ditto for the IBM PC. Ditto for the Compaq luggable. Ditto for the Zenith Data Systems Z-170 except they do have the owner's manual. Ditto for the Radio Shack Model II, the ones with the 8" drives. Unfortunately, they don't have any keyboard with them. Ditto for the Sharp PC-5000 except they most likely do have the Docs but have a good chance of not working. I also have quite a collection of laptops that I really don't need. There are also a lot of 198x databooks by TI and others that I have no use for. Things that are (ugh) ebayable but I'll offer to the list first are: S-100 CompuPro 8/16 computer with the 8" drives in a separate box. PDP-11/05 Complete but I don't know if it is still working. I've had it for almost 20 years. PDP 11/08? PDP MicroVax (doesn't really look complete, missing a front cover at the very least) On a similar note, I have a couple hundred S-100 cards, and if you are looking for one, let me know and I might just have an extra one. Someone (don't remember off the top of my head) wanted one of the Novell 68000 systems, and I am probably within about 6 feet or so of it. Another couple of days and it should be within reach :). From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sun Jul 7 19:20:57 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Versatec Board In-Reply-To: <3D28C62A.5FC5053F@rain.org> from "Marvin Johnston" at Jul 7, 2 03:52:26 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 429 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020708/ac61c931/attachment.ksh From mrbill at mrbill.net Sun Jul 7 19:31:52 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Free: Heath PDP-11-compatible 8" dual-drive unit Message-ID: <20020708003152.GL26024@mrbill.net> I've got a RX01-compatible dual-8" floppy drive unit made by Heath in the bottom of my closet.. I do *not* have the required Heath-made controller card to go with it... Free, YOU MUST PICK IT UP, in Austin, TX. This is too heavy to ship - heck, its almost too heavy to *move*. Probably weighs at least 75-100 lbs. Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From fdebros at verizon.net Sun Jul 7 18:49:40 2002 From: fdebros at verizon.net (Fred deBros) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Success story (VT1200) In-Reply-To: <20020707172142.GE26024@mrbill.net> Message-ID: <000001c22610$f64b7df0$6501a8c0@fred> Maybe I confuse you: VT1200 only supports Xwindow over LAT. IP is only usable for a text terminal window (telnet). That's what you run! So u need the lk401 kbd in addition! I heard about upgrade ROMs for VT1200. Do they support Xwindow over TCP/IP? Where could I get them? DEC said years ago, that they don't sell the upgrades anymore... or does someone copy eeproms? Else run LAT under Linux! Fred From jrkeys at concentric.net Sun Jul 7 20:31:58 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Fw: It's getting Bad A Lisa 2 is now worth a lot ? Message-ID: <003801c2261f$41d8bcc0$18000240@oemcomputer> ----- Original Message ----- From: Keys To: cctech@classiccmp Sent: Friday, July 05, 2002 1:25 PM Subject: It's getting Bad A Lisa 2 is now worth a lot ? Check out this Lisa 2 that went for $1500. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2034952824 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020707/aa7be556/attachment.html From edick at idcomm.com Sun Jul 7 20:51:23 2002 From: edick at idcomm.com (Richard Erlacher) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Versatec Board Message-ID: <001801c22621$f6e3dda0$9cc762d8@dslres-156.idcomm.com> The only context in which I've run into Versatec of that time frame is as a maker of electrostatic plotters. These were essentially big laser printers, albeit shaped a little differently than the desktop variety, much larger, and VERY costly. They're just a memory now, though. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Tony Duell To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Date: Sunday, July 07, 2002 6:39 PM Subject: Re: Versatec Board >> This board is approximately 14" or 15" square and has two edge >> connectors on the bottom approximately 6' - 7" long; I don't recall what > >That does sound like a board from a DG Nova... > >> the Nova boards look like. While it has some test points on it, it does >> not have any connectors to the outside world. > >Hmmm... THat's strange. But didn't some Nova cards route the I/O >connections through the main backplane???? > >-tony > From mrbill at mrbill.net Sun Jul 7 21:09:25 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Success story (VT1200) In-Reply-To: <000001c22610$f64b7df0$6501a8c0@fred> References: <20020707172142.GE26024@mrbill.net> <000001c22610$f64b7df0$6501a8c0@fred> Message-ID: <20020708020925.GN26024@mrbill.net> On Sun, Jul 07, 2002 at 07:49:40PM -0400, Fred deBros wrote: > VT1200 only supports Xwindow over LAT. Nope. TCP/IP and LAT, as well as two-port serial console. > IP is only usable for a text terminal window (telnet). Nope, does X-Windows as well over IP (thats what this was *designed* for; XWin over LAT *or* TCP/IP) > That's what you run! So u need the lk401 kbd in addition! I've been doing XWindows via TCP/IP all afternoon, displaying stuff from a SPARC machine running Solaris. Would you like some pictures of it displaying the Solaris Management Console, or Netscape, perhaps? I've got an LK401-AA and a "hockey puck" 3-button mouse attached. > I heard about upgrade ROMs for VT1200. Do they support > Xwindow over TCP/IP? Mine says "Terminal Manager 2.1". > Else run LAT under Linux! No need. It does TCP/IP natively; I dont have to even think about LAT. Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From marvin at rain.org Sun Jul 7 22:29:54 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: For Sale or Trade References: <3D28C62A.5FC5053F@rain.org> <3D28D451.501EF819@rain.org> Message-ID: <3D290732.AF57D839@rain.org> Thanks to everyone who has emailed. I'll be replying sometime later tonight. Couple of corrections: > Ditto for the Commodore C-64 computers, 1571 drives, and 1701 (I think) > color monitors. The drives are 1541, and NOT 1571. > PDP 11/08? That sounded strange when I wrote it; it is actually a PDP 11/03. Adding another item to the list, I have two Lasermaster controllers, both new in the box, with cable, all software, and documentation. The board is the LXPC/B. There is another box of LM boards that include the AT interface board and the board that plugs into one of the printers (doesn't look like the HP II, maybe the LJ+?) From curt at atari-history.com Sun Jul 7 23:07:20 2002 From: curt at atari-history.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: What is this? References: <20020707200808.69330.qmail@web10303.mail.yahoo.com> <3D28A486.23D62A06@rain.org> Message-ID: <008801c22634$f50537f0$01000001@cvendel> Sounds like the good old original Bournelli Box data cartridges.... first removal hard drives for PC's.... I remember working on those beasties.... the original design had an issue with the power board assembly and the capacitors used to explode. They were packaged into IBM XT type cases and when the caps blew it sounded like someone hit the case with the metal baseball bat... when the case was opened, underneath the cover would be the marks where the cap blew out.... of course this "feature" was fixed in later versions ;-) Curt b ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marvin Johnston" To: Sent: Sunday, July 07, 2002 4:28 PM Subject: What is this? > > In cleaning out the garage, I ran across three brand new what appear to > be 8" removeable cartridge units with no manufacturers ID that I > recognize. These three units are still sealed in their original plastic > wrapping except for the one I opened to try and find out what it is. > There are two dates, 11/26/84 on a test report taped to the unit, and > 10/31/89 loose in the package; both refer to the same serial number. The > model is DP100 and it requires 24VDC @ 3.8A, 5VDC @ 2.5A max, and -12VDC > @ .5A. The only name I recognize is on the Pass/Fail Report and it has a > PASS.AS.DATAPOINT on it. Anyone have any clues as to what this might be? From foo at siconic.com Sun Jul 7 23:46:57 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: What is this? In-Reply-To: <3D28A486.23D62A06@rain.org> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Marvin Johnston wrote: > In cleaning out the garage, I ran across three brand new what appear to > be 8" removeable cartridge units with no manufacturers ID that I > recognize. These three units are still sealed in their original plastic > wrapping except for the one I opened to try and find out what it is. > There are two dates, 11/26/84 on a test report taped to the unit, and > 10/31/89 loose in the package; both refer to the same serial number. The > model is DP100 and it requires 24VDC @ 3.8A, 5VDC @ 2.5A max, and -12VDC > @ .5A. The only name I recognize is on the Pass/Fail Report and it has a > PASS.AS.DATAPOINT on it. Anyone have any clues as to what this might be? Ah, they are probably date carthridges for a Datapoint removeable carthridge hard drive system. I have a couple of the drives for them (big suckers). Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From marvin at rain.org Mon Jul 8 00:11:29 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: What is this? References: Message-ID: <3D291F01.DAA0F2D6@rain.org> Sellam Ismail wrote: > > On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Marvin Johnston wrote: > > > In cleaning out the garage, I ran across three brand new what appear to > > be 8" removeable cartridge units with no manufacturers ID that I > > recognize. These three units are still sealed in their original plastic > > wrapping except for the one I opened to try and find out what it is. > > There are two dates, 11/26/84 on a test report taped to the unit, and > > 10/31/89 loose in the package; both refer to the same serial number. The > > model is DP100 and it requires 24VDC @ 3.8A, 5VDC @ 2.5A max, and -12VDC > > @ .5A. The only name I recognize is on the Pass/Fail Report and it has a > > PASS.AS.DATAPOINT on it. Anyone have any clues as to what this might be? > > Ah, they are probably date carthridges for a Datapoint removeable > carthridge hard drive system. I have a couple of the drives for them (big > suckers). Thanks, I wasn't aware that Datapoint made removeable HD systems. Unfortunately, these are the drives only and I don't have any of the cartridges ... at least as far as I know :). From groovelists at yahoo.com Mon Jul 8 00:20:29 2002 From: groovelists at yahoo.com (Andy Berg) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: QuickTake 150 to PC cable pinouts. In-Reply-To: <20020707201557.70247.qmail@web10302.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20020708052029.72930.qmail@web20504.mail.yahoo.com> Hi! :) I popped up a sort of temporary site with the cable pinouts and a few docs / qtake1_5.zip at: http://www.geocities.com/moreube/ (Please forgive the GeoCities - me poor webhost seems to be on their last legs.) I have a QT100 - IIRC, the cameras are roughly the same. I think both were made by Chinon. Perhaps the only difference is compression methods for "high" quality images? I found the original image at http://www.andybaird.com/qt200/cables.html - uploaded by a kind fellow by the name of Steven Palm. His wiring was originally for the QT150, but it did work for my QT100, too. The Windows software is a bit picky sometimes, but eventually got it working. :) HTH! Andy _____________________ groovelists@yahoo.com --- Ethan Dicks wrote: > > --- Doc Shipley wrote: > > Does anybody have the actual "QuickTake 150 > Windows Connection Kit" > > cable? > > I have one somewhere. It came with my used QT150. > I've been using it > with a Mac, so I don't remember where the cable got > off to. > > > Would you be willing to either trace the pinout or > point me at > > the _right_ pinouts on the Web? > > If you don't get it from someone else this week, > I'll try and find my > cable. > > > I've found no less than 3 different pinouts, and > the two I've tried > > don't work. > > By this can I assume you _have_ the PeeCee software? > I have the Mac > disk images. They are _not_ available from Apple > due to licensing > issues with a third-party package included. I'd be > happy to swap > software. I've _never_ had the Windoze version. > > -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From kyrrin at bluefeathertech.com Sun Jul 7 23:10:35 2002 From: kyrrin at bluefeathertech.com (Bruce Lane) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Shameless Plug Alert Message-ID: <200207072110350261.1A544EFA@192.168.42.129> Hi, gang, Well, Lord knows I tried to subscribe. Several times. The classiccmp.org mailer doesn't seem to want to recognize 'majordomo' as a valid user. Anyway... Shameless plug: I have an Intel MCS-85 development board with manual and schematics up for auction on E-pay. Here's the link if you're interested. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2036649143 The most recent bid is around $25.00. Thanks for putting up with me and my occasional ads. ;-) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy, Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com ARS KC7GR (Formerly WD6EOS) since 12-77 -- kyrrin@bluefeathertech.com "I'll get a life when someone demonstrates that it would be superior to what I have now..." (Taki Kogoma, aka Gym Z. Quirk) From mythtech at mac.com Mon Jul 8 08:25:42 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Shameless Plug Alert Message-ID: > Well, Lord knows I tried to subscribe. Several times. The classiccmp.org >mailer doesn't seem to want to recognize 'majordomo' as a valid user. >Anyway... Since this was the 2nd person to complain that majordomo isn't a valid address, I thought something might be amiss. Sure 'nuff, the subscribe info on www.classiccmp.org was never updated to reflect the new mailing list server info. It still tells you to send a message to majordomo@classiccmp.org. I know Jay in on 'vacation' right now, so there is probably nothing that can be done. Anyone else have the power to update the web site? -chris From oliv555 at arrl.net Mon Jul 8 11:15:59 2002 From: oliv555 at arrl.net (no) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Bernoulli drives was:Re: What is this? References: <20020707200808.69330.qmail@web10303.mail.yahoo.com> <3D28A486.23D62A06@rain.org> <008801c22634$f50537f0$01000001@cvendel> Message-ID: <3D29BABF.6090200@arrl.net> Curt Vendel wrote: > Sounds like the good old original Bournelli Box data cartridges.... first > removal hard drives for PC's.... I remember working on those beasties.... > the original design had an issue with the power board assembly and the > capacitors used to explode. They were packaged into IBM XT type cases and > when the caps blew it sounded like someone hit the case with the metal > baseball bat... when the case was opened, underneath the cover would be the > marks where the cap blew out.... of course this "feature" was fixed in later > versions ;-) > > > > Curt > for those interested in this sort of thing... ... there are 3 dual bournoulli 90 drives sitting at the 290/Goodwill here in NW houston. At least 4 of the drives had cartridges in them -nick From foo at siconic.com Mon Jul 8 10:29:42 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: OT: eBay to buy PayPal - yet another ruination of a good thing :( Message-ID: I just saw on the news that eBay is buying PayPal for US$1.5 billion. Good for the folks at PayPal, but this does not bode well for PayPal customers if eBay's history of trying to wring profits out of it's customers in creative ways is any indication. It also does nothing for competition. This sucks. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From bkr at WildHareComputers.com Mon Jul 8 10:41:07 2002 From: bkr at WildHareComputers.com (Bruce Ray) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: eBay to buy PayPal - yet another ruination of a good thing :( References: Message-ID: <01e301c22695$e14763d0$acaafea9@NEWHARE> ...or sounds like an opportunity for an emerging new competitive business - SellamPal. ;-) Bruce Ray ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sellam Ismail" To: "Classic Computers Mailing List" Sent: Monday, July 08, 2002 9:29 AM Subject: OT: eBay to buy PayPal - yet another ruination of a good thing :( > > I just saw on the news that eBay is buying PayPal for US$1.5 billion. > Good for the folks at PayPal, but this does not bode well for PayPal > customers if eBay's history of trying to wring profits out of it's > customers in creative ways is any indication. It also does nothing for > competition. > > This sucks. > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From univac2 at earthlink.net Mon Jul 8 13:00:59 2002 From: univac2 at earthlink.net (Owen Robertson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: OT: eBay to buy PayPal - yet another ruination of a good thing :( In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I wondered how long it would be before this happened. eBay should have bought them long ago. Didn't PayPal just go public a few months back? $1.5 billion is quite a sum. The people at PayPal should be very proud. I'm going to go beat my head against the wall as I consider why I didn't buy stock in eBay a few years ago. -- Owen Robertson on 7/8/02 10:29 AM, Sellam Ismail at foo@siconic.com wrote: > > I just saw on the news that eBay is buying PayPal for US$1.5 billion. > Good for the folks at PayPal, but this does not bode well for PayPal > customers if eBay's history of trying to wring profits out of it's > customers in creative ways is any indication. It also does nothing for > competition. > > This sucks. > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From lemay at cs.umn.edu Mon Jul 8 13:35:14 2002 From: lemay at cs.umn.edu (Lawrence LeMay) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: OT: eBay to buy PayPal - yet another ruination of a good thing :( In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <200207081835.NAA18727@caesar.cs.umn.edu> > I wondered how long it would be before this happened. eBay should have > bought them long ago. Didn't PayPal just go public a few months back? $1.5 > billion is quite a sum. The people at PayPal should be very proud. I'm going > to go beat my head against the wall as I consider why I didn't buy stock in > eBay a few years ago. > > -- > Owen Robertson For teh same reason you didnt buy stock in ebay today. Its a great concept, but the stock is way overpriced. Consider a nice stock like ConAgra instead ;) -Lawrence LeMay From mtapley at swri.edu Mon Jul 8 15:03:13 2002 From: mtapley at swri.edu (Mark Tapley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: cctalk digest, Vol 1 #76 - 40 msgs In-Reply-To: <20020708170001.91176.86489.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: >From: "Bruce Ray" >To: >Subject: Re: eBay to buy PayPal - yet another ruination of a good thing :( >Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 09:41:07 -0600 > >...or sounds like an opportunity for an emerging new competitive business - >SellamPal. ;-) No, no. "PayToSellam!" - Mark From allain at panix.com Mon Jul 8 15:24:25 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: cctalk digest, Vol 1 #76 - 40 msgs References: Message-ID: <004801c226bd$747e3da0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> >> SellamPal. ;-) > "PayToSellam!" "Ismail Merchant" ? jea From jpl15 at panix.com Mon Jul 8 15:43:46 2002 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: PayPuns In-Reply-To: <004801c226bd$747e3da0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: Buy 'em - Sellam J. From rschaefe at gcfn.org Mon Jul 8 17:08:57 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Fw: equipment available (possibly!) Message-ID: <003f01c226cc$0f304240$a5469280@kazenotani.net> Came across this a few minutes ago... Bob ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Gunshannon" Newsgroups: comp.os.vms Sent: Monday, July 08, 2002 12:58 PM Subject: OT: equipment available (possibly!) > I realize this is kind of off topic, but I also figure the people > here are the ones most likely to be able to make use of this, so.... > > As part of a package deal I have come into possesion of some rather > large pieces of Compaq gear. I don't see us ever being able to use > it, much less actualy need it and I don't see the boss wanting to > store it as space is premium around here, That means I may be getting > rid of it at real bargain prices (especially being as I have no idea > what its value might be!) > > I am sure everyone is on the edge of their seats right now, so here > goes. > > I have two huge boxes labeled "StorageWorks". > One measures 31x35x67 and the other 23.5x35x44. > I have what I assume are chassis w/power supply that go into these. > There are no disks or sleds with these. :-( > > I also have a BA350 containing 2 HSJ40's. > > I also have two of the older style DEC racks labeled SC008-AC > each containing a pair of boxes labeled SC008-AB. > > And cables and terminators for said boxes galore!! > > If my boss says, "get rid of it." is there likely to be anyone > interested or should I be contacting a scrap yard?? > > This stuff was all in use until about a month ago. > > Do people like Island ever buy old stuff?? > > Sorry for bothering everybody, but maybe someone elses needs > will intersect with my good fortune. > > > bill > > -- > Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves > bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. > University of Scranton | > Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include From curt at atari-history.com Mon Jul 8 17:57:19 2002 From: curt at atari-history.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Conquest??? References: <20020707200808.69330.qmail@web10303.mail.yahoo.com> <3D28A486.23D62A06@rain.org> <008801c22634$f50537f0$01000001@cvendel> <3D29BABF.6090200@arrl.net> Message-ID: <00d601c226d2$d0b3b0e0$01000001@cvendel> When I was in college (thats right, I is an edumacated guy!) we used to play in the computer labs during the evening a game called Conquest on DEC VT100's... the school only had an 11/750 at the time and when about a dozen or more of us were playing while others were compiling programs we'd bring the VAX to its knees. So the Admin eventually removed it from the system and that was the end of that. Conquest was a Star Trek game, you had ships from Federation, Orion and Klingon star systems, you'd orbit a planet to repair damage and such.... So, the question here is, has anyone else ever played this game and does anyone know where I can find it to load onto a 3100 ??? Curt From dan at ekoan.com Mon Jul 8 18:13:03 2002 From: dan at ekoan.com (Dan Veeneman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Olympia Electronic Compact In-Reply-To: <003f01c226cc$0f304240$a5469280@kazenotani.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020708190346.04493ec0@enigma> I recently picked up an Olympia "Electronic Compact" typewriter/printer and was wondering if anyone had any documentation on this device. It appears to be a functional typewriter, but also has a DB-25 connector with pins 1, 2, 3, 7 and 20 pinned (looks suspiciously like TX, RX and DTR along with frame and signal ground). I haven't yet had a chance to power it up to determine baud rates and other communications parameters, but if anyone has more detailed documentation on this item please let me know. Cheers, Dan From lists at subatomix.com Mon Jul 8 18:20:00 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] Test Message, Ignore Message-ID: <5816105538.20020708181724@subatomix.com> Testing list configuration changes. _______________________________________________ cctech mailing list cctech@classiccmp.org http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Mon Jul 8 18:21:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] Entering single-user mode on Pro/Venix? Message-ID: <20020708100154.25959.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> Still playing with my Professional 3xx boxes. Managed to clean one memory board of 8264 chips; will populate with 50256s when I locate my bag of 16 pin sockets. On the software side, I managed to get my RD51 with Pro/Venix 1.0 up and running on a 640KB Pro350. It was a gift some years ago; the donor even brought it by my house - no pickup! He didn't recall the root password, so I stuck it in the back of the basement and only recently dug it out. So... even though I have the manuals, it's not obvious how to get a Pro to enter single-user mode. Any suggestions? Barring that, I suppose I could wipe and re-install, but I'd like to poke around to see what's on the disk first. Thanks, -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ cctech mailing list cctech@classiccmp.org http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From djenner at earthlink.net Mon Jul 8 18:21:04 2002 From: djenner at earthlink.net (David C. Jenner) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] Entering single-user mode on Pro/Venix? References: <20020708100154.25959.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3D29D1AE.CB949501@earthlink.net> If you truly succeed in upgrading the memory board from 64K to 256K chips, be sure to let us know. I seem to recall that it's impossible! (The required signals aren't on the board?). Are you sure it's Pro/Venix and not Venix/Pro? (If it's Venix/Pro, the root password may be "gnomes".) If you do have floppies for Pro/Venix, again please let us know. I don't know of any surviving Version 1 Pro/Venix floppies. (Venix/Pro is easily available on the 'Net.) Version 1 Pro/Venix floppies should be put in the Ancient Unix archive. Dave Ethan Dicks wrote: > > Still playing with my Professional 3xx boxes. Managed to clean one > memory board of 8264 chips; will populate with 50256s when I locate > my bag of 16 pin sockets. On the software side, I managed to get > my RD51 with Pro/Venix 1.0 up and running on a 640KB Pro350. It was > a gift some years ago; the donor even brought it by my house - no > pickup! He didn't recall the root password, so I stuck it in the back > of the basement and only recently dug it out. > > So... even though I have the manuals, it's not obvious how to get > a Pro to enter single-user mode. Any suggestions? Barring that, > I suppose I could wipe and re-install, but I'd like to poke around > to see what's on the disk first. > > Thanks, > > -ethan > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free > http://sbc.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > cctech mailing list > cctech@classiccmp.org > http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech -- David C. Jenner djenner@earthlink.net _______________________________________________ cctech mailing list cctech@classiccmp.org http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From lists at subatomix.com Mon Jul 8 18:43:00 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Test Message, Ignore Message-ID: <20020708234133.90080.qmail@saghotta.pair.com> Testing 'X-NoArchive'. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Jul 8 18:59:01 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: OT: eBay to buy PayPal - yet another ruination of a good thing :( In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020708195339.452ffe80@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 08:29 AM 7/8/02 -0700, you wrote: > >I just saw on the news that eBay is buying PayPal for US$1.5 billion. >Good for the folks at PayPal, but this does not bode well for PayPal >customers if eBay's history of trying to wring profits out of it's >customers in creative ways is any indication. It also does nothing for >competition. > >This sucks. I'm not so sure that this sucks. Have you seen the number of complaints about paypal lately?? Here is just a small sample . My only question is what makes PayPal worth $1.5B ???? Customers are leaving it in droves, they've been ordered to stop doing business in at least one state, they have several class action law suits pending and they're being investigated for operating as a non-licensed bank in several states. Frankly I'd say they're worth nothing at the moment. FWIW I've heard that C2IT offers a much better service and the security of a real bank. Joe From pat at purdueriots.com Mon Jul 8 19:17:01 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: NOT paypal puns (VT-1200) Message-ID: I managed to pick up a couple of VT-1200's/VX10A-AA's (no kb/mouse/etc) today at Purdue Salvage. If anyone wants one, give me an offer. I'd like to keep at least one to use. Also, does anyone know what sync rate they use? I'd like to be able to use them with something besides my IBM POWERdisplay 20 if that's possible (and besides the 'real' monitor that goes with them. -- Pat From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 8 19:20:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Versatec Board In-Reply-To: <001801c22621$f6e3dda0$9cc762d8@dslres-156.idcomm.com> from "Richard Erlacher" at Jul 7, 2 07:51:23 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2157 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020708/79b85cde/attachment.ksh From lists at subatomix.com Mon Jul 8 19:33:00 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] List Management Q/A In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <17720491675.20020708193030@subatomix.com> This email contains answers to recent member questions, some new questions for members, and news of recent changes. RESPONSE TO QUESTIONS: > Is the email address obfuscation in the archive up and running, Yes, but it has problems. It only obfuscates the 'From:' address. Many people include email addresses in their sig blocks or introduce quoted text with "On mm/dd/yyyy, name wrote:" or similar lines. The obfuscator doesn't obfuscate these things, so the whole feature seems rather worthless to me. The spam-conscious should definitely use a different safety method. > Does the list archiver honor the 'X-NoArchive: Yes' line? No. > Can it be made to? I don't see any options for that. > I'd like to be able to announce something (like the username/password for > my private FTP site), but I don't want it to live forever in the archive. Workaround: announce on the list that you will give out the info, but make people email you to request it. Send the info out privately to those who request it. NEW QUESTIONS: Considering how vulnerable it is (see above), would anybody mind if I turned off the obfuscator? Currently, "[CCTECH]" is prepended to all subject headers sent to cctech. Would anyone mind if I lowercased that to "[cctech]"? The capital letters seem to be screaming a little too much. Would anyone mind if "[cctalk]" was appended to all subject headers sent to cctalk? What are our opinions on the two-lists solution? Cctech isn't currently moderated. In fact, it never has been AFAIK. It seems to have stayed on-topic without moderation. Are we ready for moderation to be turned on, or should we consider alternatives? RECENT CHANGES The problem with the autocrossposting of cctech posts has been fixed. Posts from cctech subscribers should no longer require approval before they forward to cctalk. If the problem still occurs for you, you can stop it by subscribing to cctalk and disabling mail delivery for it on the options page. The date shown for archived posts has been changed from the 'sent' date (what the author says the date is) to the 'resent' date (what the classiccmp server thinks the date is). This will protect our archive from the people whose computers think it is 1970. -- Jeffrey Sharp The email address lists@subatomix.com is for mailing list traffic. Please send off-list mail to roach jay ess ess at wasp subatomix beetle dot com. You may need to remove some bugs first. _______________________________________________ cctech mailing list cctech@classiccmp.org http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From mythtech at mac.com Mon Jul 8 19:51:01 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] List Management Q/A Message-ID: >Would anyone mind if "[cctalk]" was appended to all subject headers sent to >cctalk? As long as it doesn't cause replies to get into a battle over the prepending being before or after the Re: which rapidly turns into a subject line of "[cctalk] Re: [cctalk] Re: [cctalk] Re: [cctalk] Re: [cctalk]". Personally, I hate ALL list prepending for just this reason. I haven't seen one that works well with replies (probably because email clients battle how a reply is handled. I constantly see long threads turn into "RE: Re: RE: Re:"). Of course, I can live without the prepending just fine because my email client sorts the emails for me, so I don't need it to see in the subject where something is from. I do sympathize with those that are using clients that don't presort. -chris From foo at siconic.com Mon Jul 8 20:53:01 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Olympia Electronic Compact In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20020708190346.04493ec0@enigma> Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Jul 2002, Dan Veeneman wrote: > I recently picked up an Olympia "Electronic Compact" typewriter/printer > and was wondering if anyone had any documentation on this device. > It appears to be a functional typewriter, but also has a DB-25 connector > with pins 1, 2, 3, 7 and 20 pinned (looks suspiciously like TX, RX and DTR > along with frame and signal ground). > > I haven't yet had a chance to power it up to determine baud rates and > other communications parameters, but if anyone has more detailed > documentation on this item please let me know. I pass up dozens of these as they are everywhere. I always wondered what the feasibility would be of turning them into a working computer with BASIC in ROM? My guess is that a lot if not most of these run on Z80 processors and have an adequate amount of RAM, probably 64K at least. Anyone ever investigate this possibility? Might make a fun project some day. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From fmc at reanimators.org Mon Jul 8 20:58:01 2002 From: fmc at reanimators.org (Frank McConnell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: List Management Q/A In-Reply-To: Jeffrey Sharp's message of "Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:30:30 -0500" References: <17720491675.20020708193030@subatomix.com> Message-ID: <200207090134.g691Yo8c050155@daemonweed.reanimators.org> Jeffrey Sharp wrote: > > Does the list archiver honor the 'X-NoArchive: Yes' line? > > No. Um, I think the canonical spelling is "X-No-Archive:". You might want to try another test with that. > Would anyone mind if "[cctalk]" was appended to all subject headers sent to > cctalk? Appended or prepended? Either way, yes, I mind. I'll deal with it, but I'd rather not have to. And in contrast to Chris, I'm not at all sympathetic to people who say they need this to sort their received mail; the list provides other headers that are usable for selecting cctalk mail. For example, "Sender: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org". -Frank McConnell From foo at siconic.com Mon Jul 8 21:00:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: OT: eBay to buy PayPal - yet another ruination of a good thing :( In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020708195339.452ffe80@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: > I'm not so sure that this sucks. Have you seen the number of > complaints about paypal lately?? Here is just a small sample > . My only question is what makes PayPal > worth $1.5B ???? Customers are leaving it in droves, they've been ordered > to stop doing business in at least one state, they have several class > action law suits pending and they're being investigated for operating as > a non-licensed bank in several states. Frankly I'd say they're worth > nothing at the moment. Everyone can come up with some reason to bitch. My biggest bitch about PayPal is that, having a business account, I get something like 4% of the amount eaten out of my payments received, but oh well, that's the cost of using the service and I (reluctantly) accept them as it is a very good service (in my opinion). I have read about the various legal actions against them but just chalk that up to a fledgling industry trying to establish itself. To me, PayPal represents the first online fiduciary establishment that successfully bridged the divide between the online world and the real world. Why, just today I used my PayPal Visa Check card to pay for the shipping at the post office of an item I sold online and received funds for through PayPal, drawing the funds directly from my PayPal account. Pretty slick. > FWIW I've heard that C2IT offers a much better service and the > security of a real bank. Like eBay s the king of all auction sites, so too is PayPal the king of all online payment franchises. I haven't heard of CC2IT, and will make an effort to check them out, but I'm guessing it will be hard to knock down PayPal, if it's possible at all. If they are cheaper than PayPal and offer the same level of service and features, I may give switching to them a lot of consideration. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From edick at idcomm.com Mon Jul 8 21:36:00 2002 From: edick at idcomm.com (Richard Erlacher) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: Bernoulli drives was:Re: What is this? Message-ID: <001701c226f0$a2830fe0$9cc762d8@dslres-156.idcomm.com> One weakness that Iomega products in general, but the Bernoulli drives specifically, had, was that the media would develop defects which it was difficult to map out. The large drives of the early-mid '80's with FD media in their cartridges came with software that could, to limited extent, fix these defects or map them out. The later rigid media drives, which I don't believe IOMEGA manufactured, came with no such utility, and the still-current, though probably obsolete, JAZ drives come with a utility set that doesn't really do much. I've used nearly every version of these devices, from the 8" to the 3-1/2", and I have to say that I've never encountered a product line that was as disappointing. Every one of them had a set of features that looked good in the marketing literature but never met the mark. I've got a basement full of 'em. Dick -----Original Message----- From: no To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Date: Monday, July 08, 2002 9:20 AM Subject: Bernoulli drives was:Re: What is this? >Curt Vendel wrote: >> Sounds like the good old original Bournelli Box data cartridges.... first >> removal hard drives for PC's.... I remember working on those beasties.... >> the original design had an issue with the power board assembly and the >> capacitors used to explode. They were packaged into IBM XT type cases and >> when the caps blew it sounded like someone hit the case with the metal >> baseball bat... when the case was opened, underneath the cover would be the >> marks where the cap blew out.... of course this "feature" was fixed in later >> versions ;-) >> >> >> >> Curt >> > for those interested in this sort of thing... > ... there are 3 dual bournoulli 90 drives sitting at the >290/Goodwill here in NW houston. At least 4 of the drives had cartridges >in them > >-nick > > > From pat at purdueriots.com Mon Jul 8 21:44:00 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:00 2005 Subject: NOT paypal puns (VT-1200) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: They've been spoken for. -- Pat On Mon, 8 Jul 2002, Patrick Finnegan wrote: > I managed to pick up a couple of VT-1200's/VX10A-AA's (no kb/mouse/etc) > today at Purdue Salvage. If anyone wants one, give me an offer. I'd > like to keep at least one to use. Also, does anyone know what sync rate > they use? I'd like to be able to use them with something besides my IBM > POWERdisplay 20 if that's possible (and besides the 'real' monitor that > goes with them. > > -- Pat > > > > > From norm-classiccmp at docnorm.com Mon Jul 8 21:59:01 2002 From: norm-classiccmp at docnorm.com (norm-classiccmp@docnorm.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: List Management Q/A In-Reply-To: <200207090134.g691Yo8c050155@daemonweed.reanimators.org> Message-ID: Re prepending (or appending) "[cctalk]" on the subject line, I agree with Frank ... I'd hate it. I'd live, but I'm much happier having it gone. Anyone who can filter on subject *should* be able to filter on another header; anyone who can't filter probably wants to get the digest version anyway. Norm On 8 Jul 2002, Frank McConnell wrote: > Jeffrey Sharp wrote: > [...] > > Would anyone mind if "[cctalk]" was appended to all subject headers sent to > > cctalk? > > Appended or prepended? Either way, yes, I mind. I'll deal with it, > but I'd rather not have to. > > And in contrast to Chris, I'm not at all sympathetic to people who say > they need this to sort their received mail; the list provides other > headers that are usable for selecting cctalk mail. For example, > "Sender: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org". From owad at applefritter.com Mon Jul 8 22:34:00 2002 From: owad at applefritter.com (Tom Owad) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: Wanted: TU10 brackets Message-ID: <20020709033216.17411@mail.earthlink.net> I'm looking for the brackets/mechanisms to mount my TU10 in the rack. Having never seen them, I don't have much of an idea what they're like, but it looks like two hinges. I'll buy or trade. Thanks, Tom Applefritter www.applefritter.com From allain at panix.com Mon Jul 8 22:34:10 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: OT: eBay to buy PayPal - yet another ruination of a good thing:( References: Message-ID: <00e801c226f9$2d774aa0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> > To me, PayPal represents the first online fiduciary > establishment that successfully bridged the divide between the > online world and the real world. I can't help but think that PayPal is super meaty for some hacker to get into, being that it's product is Money itself. Superior security, or the lack of availability if it is probably what held the name companies back long enough for PayPal to get ahead. John A. From doc at mdrconsult.com Tue Jul 9 00:11:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: Goodwill Rulez! Message-ID: Hi. I was at the Goodwill Computer works today - big, big haul. Picked up: A Commodore cassette deck, in the box, for the Commodore 128D, with keyboard, that I grabbed Saturday to go with the Amiga 1080 display Bill gave me A 1541 floppy drive for same An Atari SF354 floppy, in the box, looks new. Tidbits and cables. I think one is the QuickTake-to-PC cable I needed. Will check pinouts later. Oh, Yeah! A TRS-80 trackpad. I think I gotta go back tomorrow for the Model 4 to go with it. Best of all. I was walking by the front counter, asked the guy "Are you holding that pile for someone?" He says "No, somebody just donated it. It's some kind of terminal. If you want it, you can take it all for $5." So I took the VT320, the LK402 (?!) keyboard and the VAXstation 4000vlc they were sitting on. WooHoo! Doc From celigne at celigne.freeserve.co.uk Tue Jul 9 01:00:00 2002 From: celigne at celigne.freeserve.co.uk (Paul Williams) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] List Management Q/A References: <17720491675.20020708193030@subatomix.com> Message-ID: <3D2A79EC.3988106E@celigne.freeserve.co.uk> Jeffrey Sharp wrote: > > Would anyone mind if "[cctalk]" was appended to all subject headers > sent to cctalk? Yes. This has been asked and answered already, around 15-17 May. I proposed dumping of the headers and there were about five posts supporting the motion and no dissenters, IIRC. From ajw at best.com Tue Jul 9 01:20:01 2002 From: ajw at best.com (Anthony Wood) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: Classic BASIC Games Message-ID: <008b01c22710$679b5bb0$0200a8c0@VAIO1> Howdy! If you are interested in classic BASIC games running on Windows, check out my collection of classic BASIC games! Each game included in this collection is an original, un-cut classic game from the '70s and early '80s. Although these versions are TRS-80 versions, they are very similar, if not identical, to versions for other computers of the day (Apple II, PDP-11, etc.) These games run as native windows apps via a Microsoft Level 2 BASIC compatible interpreter that I wrote. The interpreter will run original tokenized or ASCII programs. Included in the package are classic games, like Hamurabi, Elisa, Star Trek, etc. http://www.awsoftware.org - Anthony -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020709/b3a96f32/attachment.html From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 9 01:22:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] Entering single-user mode on Pro/Venix? In-Reply-To: <3D29D1AE.CB949501@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20020709062110.15586.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> --- "David C. Jenner" wrote: > If you truly succeed in upgrading the memory board from 64K to 256K > chips, be sure to let us know. I seem to recall that it's impossible! > (The required signals aren't on the board?). According to the Pro FAQ, it's possible. There's a "W1" and "W2" jumper you have to populate (marked on the top of the board). I presume that's the missing address line (i.e., it's NC for 64kbit chips and connected for 256kbit chips). As I said, I've cleaned off the old chips. I haven't found my bag of machined pin sockets that I bought at Dayton. Should be close to the top of the pile, though. As a side note, does anyone have a good source for surplus/inexpensive machined pin IC sockets? I'd be happy with just the pins (they were sold in strips, but I forget the brand name). I lack 8-pin, 14-pin and 16-pin sockets. I have a quantity of 20-pin sockets and a pad or two of 22-pin "skinny DIPs" that were surplus from Software Results (PAL sockets). Wouldn't mind some 40-pin sockets, either. > Are you sure it's Pro/Venix and not Venix/Pro? No. Not sure. You are probably right. I don't think it's anything rare and special. > (If it's Venix/Pro, the root password may be "gnomes".) I know about that password (googling for "venix root password" will find it). It didn't work. :-( I'm back to either finding a way to single-user mode or wiping and re-installing the OS. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From mrbill at mrbill.net Tue Jul 9 02:08:00 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: Goodwill Rulez! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20020709070707.GH11752@mrbill.net> On Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 12:09:37AM -0500, Doc Shipley wrote: > I was walking by the front counter, asked the guy "Are you holding > that pile for someone?" He says "No, somebody just donated it. It's > some kind of terminal. If you want it, you can take it all for $5." So > I took the VT320, the LK402 (?!) keyboard and the VAXstation 4000vlc > they were sitting on. Bitch! Oh well, thats still not as cool as the VRE01 for $5. 8-) Is the 402 the pc-layout one? Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From doc at mdrconsult.com Tue Jul 9 02:18:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: VS 4000vlc; Was Re: Goodwill Rulez! In-Reply-To: <20020709070707.GH11752@mrbill.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Jul 2002, Bill Bradford wrote: > On Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 12:09:37AM -0500, Doc Shipley wrote: > > I was walking by the front counter, asked the guy "Are you holding > > that pile for someone?" He says "No, somebody just donated it. It's > > some kind of terminal. If you want it, you can take it all for $5." So > > I took the VT320, the LK402 (?!) keyboard and the VAXstation 4000vlc > > they were sitting on. > > Bitch! Oh well, thats still not as cool as the VRE01 for $5. 8-) > > Is the 402 the pc-layout one? As far as I can tell, yes. Nice action, good weight, but it's really cheesy-looking. BTW, I can't get any response at the boot monitor. HELP, SHO DEV, ?, all the stuff I'm used to gets ILL CMD. BOOT works - VMS 5.5 Are the console commands different from the 4000/60? Doc From pete at dunnington.u-net.com Tue Jul 9 02:19:00 2002 From: pete at dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] List Management Q/A In-Reply-To: Jeffrey Sharp "[CCTECH] List Management Q/A" (Jul 8, 19:30) References: <17720491675.20020708193030@subatomix.com> Message-ID: <10207090819.ZM9784@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> On Jul 8, 19:30, Jeffrey Sharp wrote: > > Does the list archiver honor the 'X-NoArchive: Yes' line? > > No. As Frank wrote, the normal form is "X-No-Archive: yes". > Would anyone mind if "[cctalk]" was appended to all subject headers sent to > cctalk? I could live with it, but I'd really prefer not to. It's not necessary for filtering, given that several headers already have th list name in them: >From cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org Tue Jul 9 06:50:13 2002 To: cctech@classiccmp.org X-BeenThere: cctech@classiccmp.org Sender: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org Errors-To: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org X-BeenThere: cctalk@classiccmp.org Reply-To: cctalk@classiccmp.org X-Reply-To: cctech@classiccmp.org List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: Classic Computer Discussion - Unmoderated List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: These are headers from your post, originally to CCTECH, but you can see that by the time it was crossposted to CCTALK, most had become CCTALK headers. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York From Antonio.Carlini at riverstonenet.com Tue Jul 9 03:31:00 2002 From: Antonio.Carlini at riverstonenet.com (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: VS 4000vlc; Was Re: Goodwill Rulez! Message-ID: > BTW, I can't get any response at the boot monitor. HELP, SHO DEV, ?, >all the stuff I'm used to gets ILL CMD. BOOT works - VMS 5.5 > Are the console commands different from the 4000/60? Since BOOT works and HELP does not, my guess is that the security password has been activated and you either need to type LOGIN followed by the correct 16 hex-digit code (which I assume you don't know) or you need to pop the lid and do the magic to circumvent the password (which I cannot remember but will look up tonight if you need it). Antonio From doc at mdrconsult.com Tue Jul 9 05:31:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: VS 4000vlc; Was Re: Goodwill Rulez! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Jul 2002, Antonio Carlini wrote: > > BTW, I can't get any response at the boot monitor. HELP, SHO DEV, ?, > >all the stuff I'm used to gets ILL CMD. BOOT works - VMS 5.5 > > Are the console commands different from the 4000/60? > > Since BOOT works and HELP does not, my guess is that the > security password has been activated and you either need to > type LOGIN followed by the correct 16 hex-digit code (which > I assume you don't know) or you need to pop the lid and > do the magic to circumvent the password (which I cannot > remember but will look up tonight if you need it). Thanks, Antonio! I Googled "vaxstation console password" and found the first hit with your name on it. Shorted the 2 triangular solder pads next to the TOY, and I'm in. This list is _so_ much easier than RTFM.... Thanks again. Doc From mrbill at mrbill.net Tue Jul 9 10:03:01 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: VRE01/VT1200 pictures Message-ID: <20020709150121.GN11752@mrbill.net> For those of you who've never seen a VT1200 with a VRE01 plasma display: http://gallery.mrbill.net/view_album.php?set_albumName=vre01 The "darker orange" colors are closer to what it actually looks like. I was able to get these pictures after switching to "full spectrum" compact flourescent bulbs in the computer room. The pictures where the display appears "yellow" are from when I had one of the GE Reveal bulbs up overhead. Interesting how it makes a difference. Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From bob_lafleur at technologist.com Tue Jul 9 10:17:00 2002 From: bob_lafleur at technologist.com (Bob Lafleur) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: VRE01/VT1200 pictures In-Reply-To: <20020709150121.GN11752@mrbill.net> Message-ID: <000001c2275b$7cf2f680$023ca8c0@blafleur> Does your camera have automatic white balance? If so, that would make the difference - the camera is automatically adjusting colors based on the total picture, so when you use different light sources, it adjusts differently. If you have a MANUAL white balance, put up a piece of white paper, zoom to it, and balance whites on that. Then take the white paper away and take your pictures. One thing you learn in photography is that what we "see" as white can vary quite a bit. Our brain automatically adjusts based on the setting, but there are really a wide range of whites, and a camera sees them all differently. - Bob -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Bill Bradford Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2002 11:01 AM To: geeks@sunhelp.org; rescue@sunhelp.org; cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: VRE01/VT1200 pictures For those of you who've never seen a VT1200 with a VRE01 plasma display: http://gallery.mrbill.net/view_album.php?set_albumName=vre01 The "darker orange" colors are closer to what it actually looks like. I was able to get these pictures after switching to "full spectrum" compact flourescent bulbs in the computer room. The pictures where the display appears "yellow" are from when I had one of the GE Reveal bulbs up overhead. Interesting how it makes a difference. Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From n6idlron at lanset.com Tue Jul 9 10:49:00 2002 From: n6idlron at lanset.com (Ron Ward) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: Mikbug info? Message-ID: <000601c2271c$56f639e0$0107398a@main> Hi Mike: My name is Ron. I just found a sybex 6800 trainer that someone removed the monitor ROM from. I paid $5.00 for it. Do you still have engineering note 100 available? If so how can I get a copy. If it's in a .pdf document, where can I down load it? If you photocopy it I will pay for your copying and postage costs. Please contact me by e-mail so we can set up the details. Thanks, Ron Ward -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020709/ed1484b9/attachment.html From DAW at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu Tue Jul 9 10:52:00 2002 From: DAW at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] List Management Q/A Message-ID: <9011A52E011ED311B4280004AC1BA61501467A7C@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu> - My opinions and thoughts are inline... > From: Jeffrey Sharp > > This email contains answers to recent member questions, some new questions > for members, and news of recent changes. > > .. Many > people include email addresses in their sig blocks or introduce quoted > text > with "On mm/dd/yyyy, name wrote:" or similar lines. The > obfuscator doesn't obfuscate these things, so the whole feature seems > rather > worthless to me. The spam-conscious should definitely use a different > safety > method. > - Keep the obfuscator running anyway... > .... > > NEW QUESTIONS: > > Considering how vulnerable it is (see above), would anybody mind if I > turned > off the obfuscator? > - Yes. Heh, looks like I answered this before you even asked. ;) > Currently, "[CCTECH]" is prepended to all subject headers sent to cctech. > Would anyone mind if I lowercased that to "[cctech]"? The capital letters > seem to be screaming a little too much. > - Go ahead. Sounds fine to me. > Would anyone mind if "[cctalk]" was appended to all subject headers sent > to > cctalk? > - Hmmm, I recall a bit of noise when it was used originally. Isn't that why it was killed before? Personally, I don't mind it, though. > What are our opinions on the two-lists solution? > - So far, so good. > Cctech isn't currently moderated. In fact, it never has been AFAIK. It > seems > to have stayed on-topic without moderation. Are we ready for moderation to > be turned on, or should we consider alternatives? > - Keep it as-is. The threat of moderation seems to be working okay. If it does get out of hand, then turn on the moderation. > RECENT CHANGES > > ... > > The date shown for archived posts has been changed from the 'sent' date > (what the author says the date is) to the 'resent' date (what the > classiccmp > server thinks the date is). This will protect our archive from the people > whose computers think it is 1970. > - Ahhh. Consistency is a good thing. :) Overall, many thanks to those who put in much time keeping these lists running smoothly. -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1 - Darwin Kernel Version 5 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash _______________________________________________ cctech mailing list cctech@classiccmp.org http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From dtwright at uiuc.edu Tue Jul 9 10:59:01 2002 From: dtwright at uiuc.edu (Dan Wright) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: AV 4300 RAM? Message-ID: <20020709155756.GA522524@uiuc.edu> Hello all, I just got a DG AViiON AV4300 from a helpful list member (thanks dan!), and I need to find RAM for it. Now, it appears that it would take PC-ish 72pin SIMMs -- is this true? If so, what are the details? ECC? Parity? Actually some crazy DG RAM? I'd love to get this machine running -- it even has a "monday and wednesday" backup tape still in the drive :) - Dan Wright (dtwright@uiuc.edu) (http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright) -] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [- ``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread, For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.'' Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan From bill at timeguy.com Tue Jul 9 12:40:01 2002 From: bill at timeguy.com (Bill Richman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: Memorex 9-track Drive Available - Act now! Message-ID: <20020709115409.M71803-100000@outpost.timeguy.com> I just found out my company is planning to scrap a Memorex tape drive, controller, and power supply, models 8222, 8224, and 8228 tomorrow (Wednesday, July 10th). It's huge and heavy and located in Lincoln, Nebraska. If you want it, speak now and I'll try to hold it for you - otherwise it's going to the scrapper tomorrow. From lists at subatomix.com Tue Jul 9 12:54:00 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] List Management Q/A In-Reply-To: <10207090819.ZM9784@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> References: <17720491675.20020708193030@subatomix.com> <10207090819.ZM9784@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> Message-ID: <8755214704.20020709125107@subatomix.com> On Tuesday, July 9, 2002, Pete Turnbull wrote: > > > Does the list archiver honor the 'X-NoArchive: Yes' line? > > > > No. > > As Frank wrote, the normal form is "X-No-Archive: yes". Yes. That works. -- Jeffrey Sharp The email address lists@subatomix.com is for mailing list traffic. Please send off-list mail to roach jay ess ess at wasp subatomix beetle dot com. You may need to remove some bugs first. _______________________________________________ cctech mailing list cctech@classiccmp.org http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From DAW at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu Tue Jul 9 13:05:00 2002 From: DAW at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] List Management Q/A Message-ID: <9011A52E011ED311B4280004AC1BA61501467A7D@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu> > From: Jeffrey Sharp > > On Tuesday, July 9, 2002, Pete Turnbull wrote: > > > > > Does the list archiver honor the 'X-NoArchive: Yes' line? > > > > > > No. > > > > As Frank wrote, the normal form is "X-No-Archive: yes". > > Yes. That works. > > -- > - If that does prevent a message from being archived, I still think it's a good idea to send sensitive info directly to people, and _not_ through the lists. What if (as it does happen) someone accidentally replies to that message, unedited, to the list? It'll get archived anyway. Or does the "X-No-Archive" line stay in the reply? -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1 - Darwin Kernel Version 5 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash _______________________________________________ cctech mailing list cctech@classiccmp.org http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From aw288 at osfn.org Tue Jul 9 13:35:00 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: Apple 3 Memory Upgrade Message-ID: Remember those weird RAMs I asked about a week or so back? They are from an Apple 3 memory upgrade, and being that I don't have an Apple 3, I don't need them. So... The first person with a suitable trade*, bribe, barter, or pile of cash, gets them. 32 weird chips, in a bag labelled "Tested" (for whatever that is worth). Email me off list. *Trade? I like mainframe things - books, parts, software, etc. I also need R, B, and S series DEC Flip Chips. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 9 13:50:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] List Management Q/A In-Reply-To: <17720491675.20020708193030@subatomix.com> from "Jeffrey Sharp" at Jul 8, 2 07:30:30 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1336 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020709/749b3e6b/attachment.ksh From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 9 14:23:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: IBM PC 5150 rescue in Central Indiana Message-ID: <20020709192123.87364.qmail@web10308.mail.yahoo.com> I was contacted by a fellow about a 64K 5150 that seems to have the older 16K-64K motherboard, with all the trimmings... his messages follow. Contact him directly, not me. He is moving and needs this picked up by this weekend or it goes to Goodwill or the dumpster. I _have_ checked with him. Pick-up is OK. First come, first served. -ethan --- JESMason@aol.com I have an original IBM-PC (64K, 2-drive, cassette port model hardwired with serial # sticker deteriorated ending in 9248(?) complete with an Epson FX85 printer, Zenith monitor (the IBM monitor expired 2 months after purchase) and software including Wordstar, VisiCalc, DOS1.1, and all manuals in original binders and cases and most original IBM software diskettes. I am moving in one week (7/16) and just want to put this with someone who would appreciate its uniqueness and get some pleasure from it. It worked when stored but I have not tested it. The only repair was a new power supply shortly before I replaced it -- about 1982-ish. Shipping costs paid by buyer would be about $200 (those suckers were heavy!) paid to my PayPal account (JESMason) for your protection. If this is not for you, perhaps you know of someone who would be interested. ~~> Scott Mason 317-580-1950 Indianapolis --- I'm not an expert but I believe it meets your need. I know it would not expand beyond 64K (I had a choice of 16K, 32K, or 64K and the only way to expand it was a cassette. And mine cost $10,900 new. 8-) If you can pick it up by this Sunday 7/14, great. Otherwise it goes to Goodwill on Monday. My only interest is that someone enjoy it. I shoved it into the attic and forgot about it until now. The address is: 10719 Braewick Drive, Carmel, IN 46033 317-580-1950 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de Tue Jul 9 16:33:00 2002 From: jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de (Jochen Kunz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: AV 4300 RAM? In-Reply-To: <20020709155756.GA522524@uiuc.edu>; from dtwright@uiuc.edu on Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 17:57:56 CEST References: <20020709155756.GA522524@uiuc.edu> Message-ID: <20020709232557.C221770@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> On 2002.07.09 17:57 Dan Wright wrote: > Now, it appears that it would take PC-ish 72pin > SIMMs -- is this true? Once I oned a AV5500 (traded for a DEC3k6 with a M88k freak...). AFAIK it used 40 Bit ECC PS/2 SIMMs. I tested the SIMMs in my AlphaStation 200 and the Alpha recognized them as 4MB, but they where 16MB. The AV5500 needs 4 SIMMs per bank. -- tsch??, Jochen Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/ From sieler at allegro.com Tue Jul 9 17:29:00 2002 From: sieler at allegro.com (Stan Sieler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: List Management Q/A In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3D2AE461.29042.5CF0BE6@localhost> Re: > Re prepending (or appending) "[cctalk]" on the subject line, I agree with > Frank ... I'd hate it. I'd live, but I'm much happier having it gone. > Anyone who can filter on subject *should* be able to filter on another > header; anyone who can't filter probably wants to get the digest version > anyway. NOPE! Due to a bug in Samsung Contact (successor to the hated OpenMail from HP), I now have to have all my classiccmp/cctalk/cctech mail forward from our Samsung Contact system to a system that does POP correctly. But, that forwarding screws up the sender/reply info (from Pegasus's viewpoint, anyway). The short of it is: if it isn't in the subject line, or from the simple "From" line (e.g., john@foo.com), I can't usefully filter on it now. I.e.: I *WANT* the CCTALK/CCTECH in the header! Besides...it ought to be optional on a per-user basis, anyway :) As it is in LISTSERV: http://www.lsoft.com/products/default.asp?item=listserv-powered -- Stan Sieler sieler@allegro.com www.allegro.com/sieler/wanted/index.html www.allegro.com/sieler From Frank.Denk at MCCookMETALS.com Tue Jul 9 17:30:31 2002 From: Frank.Denk at MCCookMETALS.com (Denk, Frank) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: Televideo 802 computer Message-ID: A friend of mine gave me a TeleVideo terminal, and I believe it's a TS-803. There is no model number listed on the outside of the case, but the board is labeled 'TS 803'. The DIP switches on this terminal aren't labeled. Does anybody have any information about the DIP switches? Thank You, Frank Denk frank.denk@mccookmetals.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020709/84e66365/attachment.html From foo at siconic.com Tue Jul 9 19:01:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: List Management Q/A In-Reply-To: <3D2AE461.29042.5CF0BE6@localhost> Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Jul 2002, Stan Sieler wrote: > Besides...it ought to be optional on a per-user basis, anyway :) That's actually a good suggestion that should make everyone save for the most curmudgeonly (even Fred :) happy Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From healyzh at aracnet.com Tue Jul 9 19:55:01 2002 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] List Management Q/A In-Reply-To: from "Jeffrey Sharp" at Jul 08, 2002 07:30:30 PM Message-ID: <200207100054.g6A0s3q14853@shell1.aracnet.com> > Currently, "[CCTECH]" is prepended to all subject headers sent to cctech. > Would anyone mind if I lowercased that to "[cctech]"? The capital letters > seem to be screaming a little too much. Why not just do away with it? > Would anyone mind if "[cctalk]" was appended to all subject headers sent to > cctalk? I for one definitly mind having [cctalk] appended, it creates a real mess! Zane From celt at chisp.net Tue Jul 9 23:14:00 2002 From: celt at chisp.net (Michael Maginnis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: QuickTake 150 to PC cable pinouts. References: Message-ID: <3D2BB41F.9010800@chisp.net> Doc Shipley wrote: > On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Michael Maginnis wrote: > > >>Doc Shipley wrote: >> >>> Does anybody have the actual "QuickTake 150 Windows Connection Kit" >>>cable? Would you be willing to either trace the pinout or point me at >>>the _right_ pinouts on the Web? >>> I've found no less than 3 different pinouts, and the two I've tried >>>don't work. >> >>I know I used to - may still have it in the basement somewhere. I'll >>take a look. > > > Thanks! > > Doc > Bad luck, it seems. I've got the camera still, but the accessories pack (software, cables, etc), seems to have moved out without giving it's 30-days notice. /mpm From stephenb at supertex.com Wed Jul 10 06:42:00 2002 From: stephenb at supertex.com (Stephen Bragg) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: help with rl01 and rl02 disk drives. Message-ID: <012f01c227a9$8ffa5860$2934a141@supertex.com> Hi, I was wondering if anyone could help me get an old pdp 11/23 working with some rl01 and rl02 disk drives? Please respond if you can. Thanks, Stephen Bragg -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020710/06490d8b/attachment.html From eratech at citlink.net Wed Jul 10 06:44:04 2002 From: eratech at citlink.net (Rodney Jones) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: Last(?) Altair -- Re: Unassembled Altair kits Message-ID: <000601c227c2$e3bc43a0$6fcb43d8@oemcomputer> Hi, I am a model engine enthusiast / builder and am very interested in your un-finished Morton M-5 kit if you still have it and are interested in selling, please e-mail me info Thanks, Rod Jones -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020710/bfbbab32/attachment.html From jhfinepw4z at compsys.to Wed Jul 10 08:33:00 2002 From: jhfinepw4z at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: help with rl01 and rl02 disk drives. References: <012f01c227a9$8ffa5860$2934a141@supertex.com> Message-ID: <3D2C374B.C6D78A99@compsys.to> >Stephen Bragg wrote: > I was wondering if anyone could help me get an old pdp 11/23 working > with some rl01 and rl02 disk drives?Please respond if you > can.Thanks,Stephen Bragg Jerome Fine replies: First you can try and turn off the html in your request. Many readers are not equipped and the users do not appreciate html. Second, you have provided only enough information to define the area in which the questions will be answered. Until you specify both: (a) Your level of capability (b) The pieces of hardware and software you want to use (c) What you have done thus far it is almost impossible to know if anyone can help you. But most of us like a challenge. Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From jwest at classiccmp.org Wed Jul 10 09:11:01 2002 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: [CCTECH] paging bill dawson Message-ID: <00e101c2281b$201e7450$9701a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Sorry to waste the bandwidth with this but... I have been trying to get in touch with Bill Dawson...anyone know if he is ok or maybe changed email addresses? Jay West --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] _______________________________________________ cctech mailing list cctech@classiccmp.org http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From DAW at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu Wed Jul 10 09:17:00 2002 From: DAW at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: List Management Q/A Message-ID: <9011A52E011ED311B4280004AC1BA61501467A82@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu> > From: Sellam Ismail > > On Tue, 9 Jul 2002, Stan Sieler wrote: > > > Besides...it ought to be optional on a per-user basis, anyway :) > > That's actually a good suggestion that should make everyone save for the > most curmudgeonly (even Fred :) happy > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer > Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ---- > If it makes a difference, I say yes to this option also, well assuming it's possible. -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1 - Darwin Kernel Version 5 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash From mrbill at mrbill.net Wed Jul 10 10:42:00 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: LAST CALL: Free Parts/Stuff in Austin, TX Message-ID: <20020710154057.GE4269@mrbill.net> Lastt call on the following parts, or they will probably end up at Goodwill ComputerWorks or in a box in the back corner of my garage: Sun VME boards: http://www.mrbill.net/~mrbill/freestuff/ Heath H11 dual-8" floppy drive: http://www.pdp11.org/pics/parts/thumbs/eight-inch-floppys-front.jpg.html http://www.pdp11.org/pics/parts/thumbs/eight-inch-floppys-switches.jpg.html http://www.pdp11.org/pics/parts/thumbs/floppys-zenith-logo.jpg.html I've also got a SPARCstation 10 chassis and a SPARCstation 20 chassis (both with power supply, motherboard, and case - you'll need CPU/RAM/HDs to get them operational). I need these out of the way as well. Free for pickup in Austin, TX. Contact me if interested. Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From mrbill at mrbill.net Wed Jul 10 10:44:00 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: WTB: BA11-VA enclosure Message-ID: <20020710154240.GF4269@mrbill.net> I'm looking for another BA11-VA enclosure, similar to what I have pictured here: http://www.pdp11.org/pics/parts/thumbs/pdp-back-closeup-1.jpg.html http://www.pdp11.org/pics/parts/thumbs/pdp-back-closeup-2.jpg.html http://www.pdp11.org/pics/parts/thumbs/pdp-back.jpg.html http://www.pdp11.org/pics/parts/thumbs/pdp-front-logo-closeup.jpg.html http://www.pdp11.org/pics/parts/thumbs/pdp-front.jpg.html Thanks. Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Wed Jul 10 12:10:00 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: LAST CALL: Free Parts/Stuff in Austin, TX Message-ID: <200207101708.KAA12055@clulw009.amd.com> >From: "Bill Bradford" > >Lastt call on the following parts, or they will probably end up at Goodwill >ComputerWorks or in a box in the back corner of my garage: > >Sun VME boards: > >http://www.mrbill.net/~mrbill/freestuff/ > >Heath H11 dual-8" floppy drive: > >http://www.pdp11.org/pics/parts/thumbs/eight-inch-floppys-front.jpg.html >http://www.pdp11.org/pics/parts/thumbs/eight-inch-floppys-switches.jpg.html >http://www.pdp11.org/pics/parts/thumbs/floppys-zenith-logo.jpg.html > >I've also got a SPARCstation 10 chassis and a SPARCstation 20 chassis >(both with power supply, motherboard, and case - you'll need CPU/RAM/HDs > to get them operational). I need these out of the way as well. > >Free for pickup in Austin, TX. Contact me if interested. > >Bill > >-- >Bill Bradford >mrbill@mrbill.net >Austin, TX > Hi Bill I would vary much like to have the H11 floppy ( actually to use on my MDS-800, Intel developement system ). I don't think the drives care what machine I use. Anyway, I'm in California but I have friends in Austin. Can you let me know your address and I'll contact someone there that should be able to pick up the drives. Dwight From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Wed Jul 10 12:36:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: H-11/H-27 (was Re: LAST CALL: Free Parts/Stuff in Austin, TX) In-Reply-To: <200207101708.KAA12055@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: <20020710173433.30471.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> --- "Dwight K. Elvey" wrote: > >http://www.pdp11.org/pics/parts/thumbs/eight-inch-floppys-front.jpg.html > >http://www.pdp11.org/pics/parts/thumbs/eight-inch-floppys-switches.jpg.html > >http://www.pdp11.org/pics/parts/thumbs/floppys-zenith-logo.jpg.html > > Hi Bill > I would vary much like to have the H11 floppy ( actually to use > on my MDS-800, Intel developement system ). I don't think the drives > care what machine I use. I forget what the drives are inside the box, but just keep in mind that the H-27 (the drive sub-system for the H-11) is an intellegent drive that talks to the Qbus through a 40-pin cable that is its own standard. The RX01 is also a (semi-)intellegent drive on a 40-pin cable, but they are not cross-compatible from a cable/drive/controller standpoint. They _are_ compatible at the controller register/device driver level. I suspect you need a raw 50-pin SA800-style interface for your Intel MDS-800. You could probably use the H-27 case and PSU if you bypass the controller board inside the H-27. I suspect you could probably pull the drives (if they are physically and electrically compatible) and drop them into the MDS-800, presuming it doesn't have its own external arrangement for its drives (not sure; never seen one, only heard of them). If you do get the H-27 and you don't need bits and pieces of it (like the enclosure or PSU or internal controller), let me know. I have a working H-11 and a working H-27 box with a not-totally-working Qbus controller card (problems with the interrupts*). I would like to have spare parts. -ethan * I have consulted some scans of docs from people and I've been unable to deduce what's wrong. At the moment, I think I need to learn what the purpose of the configuration jumpers are and get them set right. The previous owner cut and rejumped them a couple of times and I don't know that they are correct. The board is all sockted ICs and I have run each TTL chip through an IC tester. The Nat'l Semi bus drivers and receivers can't be tested that way, so I have analyzed the schematics to figure out which 8837 or whatever else is related to the interrupt chain, but with no positive results as of yet. I don't need to format and blank media, so I can get along with a real DEC RX01/RX02 and a real RXV11/RXV21, but I'd like to be able to use the H-27 with the H-11 since that's what it goes with and it should all work. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Wed Jul 10 12:40:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: help with rl01 and rl02 disk drives. In-Reply-To: <012f01c227a9$8ffa5860$2934a141@supertex.com> Message-ID: <20020710173851.36212.qmail@web10303.mail.yahoo.com> --- Stephen Bragg wrote: > Hi, > > I was wondering if anyone could help me get an old pdp 11/23 working with > some rl01 and rl02 disk drives? What backplane do you have? What controller? What isn't working? No bootstrap? Cable issues? Missing packs? Depending on the exact box you have, you can get away with an RLV11 (18-bit, requires CD slots) or might require an RLV12 (22-bit, single card, works in MicroVAXen as well as Qbus PDP-11s). Do you have all the parts you need and don't know how to put them together, or are you seeking missing parts? -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From dan at ekoan.com Wed Jul 10 12:50:01 2002 From: dan at ekoan.com (Dan Veeneman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: H-11/H-27 (was Re: LAST CALL: Free Parts/Stuff in Austin, TX) In-Reply-To: <20020710173433.30471.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <200207101708.KAA12055@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020710134314.0389a710@enigma> At 10:34 AM 7/10/02 -0700, Ethan Dicks wrote: >--- "Dwight K. Elvey" wrote: > > Hi Bill > > I would vary much like to have the H11 floppy ( actually to use > > on my MDS-800, Intel developement system ). I don't think the drives > > care what machine I use. [...] >You could probably use the H-27 case and PSU if you bypass >the controller board inside the H-27. I suspect you could probably >pull the drives (if they are physically and electrically compatible) >and drop them into the MDS-800, presuming it doesn't have its own >external arrangement for its drives (not sure; never seen one, only >heard of them). > >If you do get the H-27 and you don't need bits and pieces of it (like >the enclosure or PSU or internal controller), let me know. I have >a working H-11 and a working H-27 box with a not-totally-working Qbus >controller card (problems with the interrupts*). I would like to have >spare parts. This is painful to read. I also have an H-11 with a partially working paper tape punch and have been looking for the floppy drive subsystem. If it's at all possible I'd like to keep the H-27 intact, even if it ends up with Ethan. I have several eight-inch floppy drives along with a Cromemco system if you need floppy drives, but I'd hate to see the Heath subsystem pulled apart just for the drives. Cheers, Dan From Gary.Messick at itt.com Wed Jul 10 13:00:00 2002 From: Gary.Messick at itt.com (Messick, Gary) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: H-11/H-27 (was Re: LAST CALL: Free Parts/Stuff in Austin, TX ) Message-ID: <998FEBD9C16DD211881200A0C9D61AD704468AF0@acdfwx3.acdin.de.ittind.com> > -----Original Message----- > From: Dan Veeneman [mailto:dan@ekoan.com] > Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2002 12:48 PM > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: H-11/H-27 (was Re: LAST CALL: Free Parts/Stuff in Austin, > TX) > > > This is painful to read. > > I also have an H-11 with a partially working paper tape punch and have > been looking for the floppy drive subsystem. If it's at all > possible I'd like > to keep the H-27 intact, even if it ends up with Ethan. > > I have several eight-inch floppy drives along with a Cromemco system > if you need floppy drives, but I'd hate to see the Heath > subsystem pulled > apart just for the drives. > > > Cheers, > > Dan > Dan, I think I've rescued the drives. I have an H-27 that is using a Shugart drive as a replacement for a bad Memorex. I hope to pick the drives up around X-Mas. I've sent Bill a non-refundable "storgae fee" (read bribe) to keep them until then. The H-27 doesn't include the controller (needed!), so I'm not sure the drives would be of much use to you. I plan on keeping them as a spare to my H-27, but if you ever find a controller, let me know, and if I haven't need to use the second set, I'd let you have them just to get 1 more H-27 up! Gary ************************************ If this email is not intended for you, or you are not responsible for the delivery of this message to the addressee, please note that this message may contain ITT Privileged/Proprietary Information. In such a case, you may not copy or deliver this message to anyone. You should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by reply email. Information contained in this message that does not relate to the business of ITT is neither endorsed by nor attributable to ITT. ************************************ From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Wed Jul 10 13:02:01 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: H-11/H-27 (was Re: LAST CALL: Free Parts/Stuff in Austin, TX) Message-ID: <200207101800.LAA12106@clulw009.amd.com> >From: "Dan Veeneman" > >At 10:34 AM 7/10/02 -0700, Ethan Dicks wrote: > >>--- "Dwight K. Elvey" wrote: >> > Hi Bill >> > I would vary much like to have the H11 floppy ( actually to use >> > on my MDS-800, Intel developement system ). I don't think the drives >> > care what machine I use. > >[...] > >>You could probably use the H-27 case and PSU if you bypass >>the controller board inside the H-27. I suspect you could probably >>pull the drives (if they are physically and electrically compatible) >>and drop them into the MDS-800, presuming it doesn't have its own >>external arrangement for its drives (not sure; never seen one, only >>heard of them). >> >>If you do get the H-27 and you don't need bits and pieces of it (like >>the enclosure or PSU or internal controller), let me know. I have >>a working H-11 and a working H-27 box with a not-totally-working Qbus >>controller card (problems with the interrupts*). I would like to have >>spare parts. > >This is painful to read. > >I also have an H-11 with a partially working paper tape punch and have >been looking for the floppy drive subsystem. If it's at all possible I'd like >to keep the H-27 intact, even if it ends up with Ethan. > >I have several eight-inch floppy drives along with a Cromemco system >if you need floppy drives, but I'd hate to see the Heath subsystem pulled >apart just for the drives. > > >Cheers, > >Dan > > Hi Dan I had no intentions of destroying anything. I even have hopes of getting a H-11 one of these days. I was just going to run a cable from my MDS-800 ( that only uses external drives ) because I need drives that will do double density. The H-27 has what I need, a box, a power supply and drives. It would stay a H-27. What kind of animal do you think I am? Dwight From quapla at xs4all.nl Wed Jul 10 15:16:01 2002 From: quapla at xs4all.nl (The Wanderer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: SGI Origin 2000 References: <10206250944.ZM28068@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> <20020625130900.GA18927@rhiannon.rddavis.org> <10206260032.ZM28504@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> Message-ID: <3D2C953C.10ECD905@xs4all.nl> Hello Pete, I might get an SGI Origin 2000, this particular machine consists of 2 cabinets. If I'm not mistaken, we talked about such a machine when we were sitting outside in the garden. Do you know if it can be split into a single cabinet system? If that is the case, I think I'll take it (it actually belongs to Sun as it is a trade-in) and let the other cabinet for what it is (space saving). As the cpu's are in both cabinets, I was thinking of splitting it up, whereby the primary cabinet has all the necessary components to be able to run, and where the 2nd cabinet contains the non essential boards. Best regards, Ed -- The Wanderer | Politici zijn gore oplichters. quapla@xs4all.nl | Europarlementariers: zakkenvullers http://www.groenenberg.net | en neuspeuteraars. Unix Lives! M$ Windows is rommel! | Kilometerheffing : De overheid '97 TL1000S | weet waar je bent geweest! From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Jul 10 15:39:00 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:01 2005 Subject: List Management Q/A In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > Besides...it ought to be optional on a per-user basis, anyway :) > That's actually a good suggestion that should make everyone save for the > most curmudgeonly (even Fred :) happy What makes you think that I give a damn? Actually, I think that the current system is almost working. The CCTECH posts are labeled, and the chat posts (on CCTALK) aren't. If you only want to read filtered, rigidly on-topic posts, subscribe to CCTECH. If you want to read everything, subscribe to CCTALK. If you want to read everything, and be able to post to both, subscribe to both, and go "no-mail" on CCTECH to avoid getting duplicates. But, the real test remains. So far, since the changes, there hasn't yet been a major off-topic flamewar. Doesn't anybody care what Clinton did to the availability of good carburetors? -- Grumpy Ol' Fred From quapla at xs4all.nl Wed Jul 10 15:42:00 2002 From: quapla at xs4all.nl (The Wanderer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: SGI Origin 2000 References: <10206250944.ZM28068@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> <20020625130900.GA18927@rhiannon.rddavis.org> <10206260032.ZM28504@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> <3D2C953C.10ECD905@xs4all.nl> Message-ID: <3D2C9B47.9565D0A5@xs4all.nl> Oops, that wasn't supposed to go to the list..... The Wanderer wrote: > > Hello Pete, > > I might get an SGI Origin 2000, this particular machine consists of 2 > cabinets. > If I'm not mistaken, we talked about such a machine when we were sitting > outside > in the garden. Do you know if it can be split into a single cabinet > system? > If that is the case, I think I'll take it (it actually belongs to Sun as > it is > a trade-in) and let the other cabinet for what it is (space saving). > > As the cpu's are in both cabinets, I was thinking of splitting it up, > whereby > the primary cabinet has all the necessary components to be able to run, > and > where the 2nd cabinet contains the non essential boards. > > Best regards, > > Ed > > -- > The Wanderer | Politici zijn gore oplichters. > quapla@xs4all.nl | Europarlementariers: zakkenvullers > http://www.groenenberg.net | en neuspeuteraars. > Unix Lives! M$ Windows is rommel! | Kilometerheffing : De overheid > '97 TL1000S | weet waar je bent geweest! -- The Wanderer | Politici zijn gore oplichters. quapla@xs4all.nl | Europarlementariers: zakkenvullers http://www.groenenberg.net | en neuspeuteraars. Unix Lives! M$ Windows is rommel! | Kilometerheffing : De overheid '97 TL1000S | weet waar je bent geweest! From dave at naffnet.org.uk Wed Jul 10 15:47:00 2002 From: dave at naffnet.org.uk (Dave Woodman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: List Management Q/A References: Message-ID: <3D2C9CE3.AD3D8D2A@naffnet.org.uk> "Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)" wrote: > > But, the real test remains. So far, since the changes, there hasn't yet > been a major off-topic flamewar. Doesn't anybody care what Clinton did to > the availability of good carburetors? No. Next! Dave. From spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu Wed Jul 10 18:47:00 2002 From: spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: List Management Q/A In-Reply-To: from Fred Cisin at "Jul 10, 2 01:37:58 pm" Message-ID: <200207102353.QAA11288@stockholm.ptloma.edu> > But, the real test remains. So far, since the changes, there hasn't yet > been a major off-topic flamewar. Doesn't anybody care what Clinton did to > the availability of good carburetors? Thanks to Clinton, everything sucked (*ba dum-bum*). -- ----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser@stockholm.ptloma.edu -- The early bird may get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese. ----- From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Jul 10 19:26:00 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: SGI Origin 2000 In-Reply-To: <3D2C9B47.9565D0A5@xs4all.nl> References: <10206250944.ZM28068@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> <20020625130900.GA18927@rhiannon.rddavis.org> <10206260032.ZM28504@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> <3D2C953C.10ECD905@xs4all.nl> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020710202604.5147fb00@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 10:38 PM 7/10/02 +0200, you wrote: > >Oops, that wasn't supposed to go to the list..... That's ok. The list as been rather quite today. Joe > > >The Wanderer wrote: >> >> Hello Pete, >> >> I might get an SGI Origin 2000, this particular machine consists of 2 >> cabinets. >> If I'm not mistaken, we talked about such a machine when we were sitting >> outside >> in the garden. Do you know if it can be split into a single cabinet >> system? >> If that is the case, I think I'll take it (it actually belongs to Sun as >> it is >> a trade-in) and let the other cabinet for what it is (space saving). >> >> As the cpu's are in both cabinets, I was thinking of splitting it up, >> whereby >> the primary cabinet has all the necessary components to be able to run, >> and >> where the 2nd cabinet contains the non essential boards. >> >> Best regards, >> >> Ed >> >> -- >> The Wanderer | Politici zijn gore oplichters. >> quapla@xs4all.nl | Europarlementariers: zakkenvullers >> http://www.groenenberg.net | en neuspeuteraars. >> Unix Lives! M$ Windows is rommel! | Kilometerheffing : De overheid >> '97 TL1000S | weet waar je bent geweest! > >-- >The Wanderer | Politici zijn gore oplichters. >quapla@xs4all.nl | Europarlementariers: zakkenvullers >http://www.groenenberg.net | en neuspeuteraars. >Unix Lives! M$ Windows is rommel! | Kilometerheffing : De overheid >'97 TL1000S | weet waar je bent geweest! > From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 10 19:28:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: help with rl01 and rl02 disk drives. In-Reply-To: <012f01c227a9$8ffa5860$2934a141@supertex.com> from "Stephen Bragg" at Jul 9, 2 05:34:33 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1449 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020710/41bb6ebc/attachment.ksh From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Wed Jul 10 19:49:01 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: Help with sparc 5 Message-ID: <200207110047.RAA12413@clulw009.amd.com> Hi I'm not sure if this is old enough. I have a sparc 5 that has stopped booting. I'm not sure if it is the nvram that has failed or the disk. Does anyone know the full name of the normal internal disk drive? I'd like to compare it with the one it says it is trying to boot from. Dwight From RCini at congressfinancial.com Wed Jul 10 21:17:00 2002 From: RCini at congressfinancial.com (Cini, Richard) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: ANN: Altair32 v.2.3 released / 680b Progress Message-ID: <69DBC74E5784D6119BEA0090271EB8E5126C4A@MAIL10> Hello, all: I wanted to drop the group a note to announce that version 2.3 of the Altair32 emulator was released last night. There were a few minor bug fixes and the addition of source-level debugging. Again, I would like to thank Jim Battle for graciously letting me borrow his Sol debugger for the Altair32 project. The main Web site for the Altair32 is: http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/Altair32.htm I also wanted to mention that the Altair 680b emulation project is progressing nicely. I have a few minor problems with the operation of the front panel that need to be fixed. Once that's done, I can start testing it with live 6800 code, including the 680b Monitor. That project page is: http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/Altair680.htm Enjoy! Rich From protheus at seabrook.aurdev.com Wed Jul 10 21:18:41 2002 From: protheus at seabrook.aurdev.com (Chris Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: Unsub'ing for a while. Message-ID: Hey guys, It's Chris Smith -- formerly (yep...) csmith@amdocs.com. I wanted to let everybody know not to attempt to contact me at csmith@amdocs.com any more. I'm not subscribed from home, and will probably remain unsub'd while I look for work. Chris echo 'set p [image create photo -height 200 -width 320 -palette {64/64/64}] $p blank;set c {#DD00FF #000000 #AA99AA};canvas .w -height 200 -width 320 set z 0;.w create image 0 0 -anchor nw -image $p;pack .w;for {} {$z<64000} { incr z} {set w 0;set m [expr $z%320];set x [expr 0.001875*$m];set n [ expr $z/320];set y [expr (-0.0855)*$n];while {($w<1000)&&((pow($x,2)+pow($y,2)) <=400000)} {set x [expr pow($x,2)-pow($y,2)+$m];set y [expr 2*$x*$y+$n];incr w} $p put [lindex $c [expr $w%3]] -to $m $n;update}'|wish - From notwax at yahoo.com Wed Jul 10 21:20:10 2002 From: notwax at yahoo.com (Wayne Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: Cosmac Pictures In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020711020819.16197.qmail@web40203.mail.yahoo.com> I have posted a number of pictures of the Cosmac 1802 Development System I recently discovered, including shots of the individual boards. 6 are green and 6 are blue. Does anyone know why there's a difference? Wayne Smith __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From msell at ontimesupport.com Wed Jul 10 21:51:00 2002 From: msell at ontimesupport.com (Matthew Sell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: VAX 11/750 boot probs - help appreciated Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020710214854.02798bf0@127.0.0.1> Guys, I've finished restoring a VAX 11/750 back to good physical condition, and have (by trial and error) selected a boardset that "appears" to be operating correctly as far as I can tell. The problem I'm having deals with booting from the integral TU-58. When the machine starts up (set to halt on boot) - it presents the proper message: 00000000 16 Running the microdiagnostics gives no errors: %% 00000000 01 However, attempting to boot from the TU-58 (B DDA0) results in the following message: FFFFFFFE 05 The strange thing is that the diagnostic LED on the TU-58 controller does not respond as I would think it should. From what I understand of it's operation, the diag LED on the controller is supposed to blink once when power is applied, pause while internal controller diagnostics are performed, and the light constantly when diagnostics pass (on the controller). On mine, the LED blinks, and then stays unlit. But, if I disconnect P2 (the communications cable to the 750 CPU), this controller diag LED operates as expected. This same behavior is observed if I remove L0004 in slot 4, then the TU-58 controller behaves as I have read it should. This machine did have the remote diagnostics option installed, and I had to move the TU-58 and console communication connectors to the alternate position on the backplane as if the remote diagnostics option was not installed. If I put these connectors back in the original positions (as if the remote diag option was installed), the TU-58 controller passes diagnostics, but the console does not respond (duh....). Could the L0004 be sending a garbled request to the TU-58 controller? I have tried two different L0004 boards, both exhibit the same problem. I have tried different memory controllers to test the boot PROMs, and swapped (and removed!) the L0008s, etc. Erf. Any ideas? From what I understand of the installation of the remote diagnostics module, the only modifications required were the installation of the board (L0006), moving the TU-58 and console comm plugs to the left row of backplane pins, and the installation of the modem. Could I be missing another modification that needs to be "undone" ? I really appreciate any hints or guidance. Thanks! - Matt Matthew Sell Programmer On Time Support, Inc. www.ontimesupport.com (281) 296-6066 Join the Metrology Software discussion group METLIST! http://www.ontimesupport.com/subscribe_t&c.html. "One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad "Ein Volk, Ein Reich, Ein Fuhrer" - Adolf Hitler Many thanks for this tagline to a fellow RGVAC'er... -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020710/4d64346d/attachment.html From wmsmith at earthlink.net Wed Jul 10 23:16:01 2002 From: wmsmith at earthlink.net (Wayne M. Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: Cosmac Pictures References: <20020711020819.16197.qmail@web40203.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <003501c22891$aa316cd0$b641cd18@wayne052602> A link? You want a link? Oh. http://home.earthlink.net/~msmith6020/Cosmac/ > I have posted a number of pictures of the Cosmac 1802 > Development System I recently discovered, including > shots of the individual boards. 6 are green and 6 are > blue. Does anyone know why there's a difference? > > Wayne Smith From GOOI at oce.nl Thu Jul 11 02:39:01 2002 From: GOOI at oce.nl (Gooijen H) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 Message-ID: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB0@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Hi all. I am having trouble with my 11/70 because it works only partial. Since things are quiet on the list, I have something to ask. It is a long story, but as said on the list this week, the more info you give, the less not relevant suggestions are typed. First the description of the machine. The machine has only all CPU boards (with FP), the DL11-W and 3 MASSBUSS interfaces. The fourth MASSBUS interface has in the correct slot a G727. All other UNIBUS slots have a G727 in the card position D. The MOS memory box is also connected to the CPU. This is what I have done so far. When I turn on the machine everything "looks" fine. With the switch ENABLE/HALT on HALT and pressing START, the machine sort of resets. With the panel I can dump data in the MOS memory at address 00000000. I did this also at 00001000 and 00010000. It 'works' and when I read the contents back from those addresses, it is the correct data. So, my first conclusion is that (part of) the CPU is OK and that the address and data path to the MOS memory and the MOS memory box itself are all OK as well. Here is the part that worries me. In slot #40 (IIRC) is the DL11-W (M7856) console interface. I am trying to write to the transmit buffer address (XBUF - 17777566). I set the knobs on the 11/70 console to "CONS PHY" and "DATA REGISTER" so that the address on the switches is the real physical address and the data on the switches is what I want to store. After the reset of the machine (HALT/START) I set the switches to 17777566, and press LOAD ADRS. On the ADDRESS leds appears 17777566. Now, I set the switches to 00000071 (should give a "9" on the VT220). When I toggle the DEP button, the PAUSE led goes on. According to the handbook that means the the CPU tries to finish the instruction as far as possible and then waits for an event to finish. The event could be (I assume) an interrupt or, in this case, access to the UNIBUS section. Next test was checking the DL11-W interface. First I switched on my 11/34C. With address 165020/START, I get the dump of the registers on the VT102. So, I mad sure that the M7856 in the 11/34C is OK. Now, I swapped the M7856 of the 11/70 with the M7856 of the 11/34C. First, I started the 11/34C again. I get the register dump on the screen. So, the M7856 from the 11/70 was OK. Just to make sure I tried the 11/70 again (with M7856 of the 34C), but I get the same result: PAUSE led goes on. Yesterday, I had a long conversation on the phone with Edward. We talk about all kind of (PDP-11) things, and also the 11/70 problem. One suggestion was that the UNIBUS map is not yet initialised, and that would cause the UNIBUS accesses to fail. My guess is that when the console panel knob is set to "CONS PHY", I have full access to all addresses without any mapping taking place. Is this correct? Anyway, to test the "UNIBUS map initialisation" theory, I read the M9312 bootstrap manual. The 11/70 (and 11/60) have a different PROM that stores the diagnostics. The 11/04--11/55 PROM also contains a console monitor, but the 60 and 70 PROM only has diagnostics. The manuals says to load address 17765744, then set the switches 8-0 to the device code and then press START. I checked the M9312 to look at the diag PROM. According the M9312 manual the PROM code must be 248F1 (IIRC) for the 11/04-11/55, and 233F1 for the 11/60-11/70. My M9312 has a PROM with code 616F1. Is that a new type for the 11/70? The M9312 is the card that was in the 11/70 when I got it, and another 11/70 (with remote console) that I have has the same PROM. Edward's 11/70's (he has also 2) one has a 233F1, the other has a 616F1. So, I did that test, but the PAUSE led goes on again. Trying to boot from an RX01 should need at least the RX11 card in a UNIBUS slot ... I did that, so I put the M7846 in slot 41 (IIRC), next to the DL11-W. Tried the test again: 17765744 - LOAD ADRS - set the device code on switches 8 to 0 - START. Alas, PAUSE on again. What puzzles me is the "device code" you must set on the 9 least significant switches. I have set that to 170 as that are the LSB's of the start address fro the bootstrap of the RX11. Is that correct? Come to think of the good advice from Tony: I will check the power supply voltages this evening. Especially the one that supplies the cards that deal with the UNIBUS section ... tnx for reading all this, and TIA for all responses, - Henk. From pete at dunnington.u-net.com Thu Jul 11 02:45:01 2002 From: pete at dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: SGI Origin 2000 In-Reply-To: The Wanderer "SGI Origin 2000" (Jul 10, 22:12) References: <10206250944.ZM28068@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> <20020625130900.GA18927@rhiannon.rddavis.org> <10206260032.ZM28504@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> <3D2C953C.10ECD905@xs4all.nl> Message-ID: <10207110840.ZM11009@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> Hi, Ed. On Jul 10, 22:12, The Wanderer wrote: > I might get an SGI Origin 2000, this particular machine consists of 2 > cabinets. > If I'm not mistaken, we talked about such a machine when we were sitting > outside > in the garden. Yes, I used to look after one at Computer Science. > Do you know if it can be split into a single cabinet > system? Yes, you can split it up, but only one half will be a compete Origin 2000, with half the processors. I've sent you a longer private email with some information. I might phone you about this... -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York From uban at ubanproductions.com Thu Jul 11 07:49:01 2002 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB0@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20020711073249.01ae68e0@ubanproductions.com> Hi Henk, Have you tried to read the DL11-W status register? Do you only get the PAUSE on a deposit? As you indicate, checking the power supply voltages is an important first step. It sounds like you might have a bus request/grant jumper problem or problem in the CPU hardware. Since you are using slot 40 (the first UNIBUS slot) for your DL11-W, it would seem that the problem would be either in the MASSBUS jumpers or a CPU hardware problem. Of course, it could also be a backplane wire problem. Have you tried to execute a very simple program such as jump to self (0777) by depositing that value at location 01000 and starting there? This is a good basic CPU test. Do you have a KM11 diagnostic board? Using the KM11, you can cycle through the microcode flows listed in the printset. This will help you diagnose the problem at a finer level then just watching the pause lamp turn on. Of course, you will likely need a set of board extenders and minimally an o-scope as well. If you don't have a KM11 and want to build one, check out the one I built here: http://www.ubanproductions.com/museum.html --tom At 09:31 AM 7/11/2002 +0200, you wrote: >Hi all. > >I am having trouble with my 11/70 because it works only partial. >Since things are quiet on the list, I have something to ask. >It is a long story, but as said on the list this week, the more >info you give, the less not relevant suggestions are typed. > >First the description of the machine. >The machine has only all CPU boards (with FP), the DL11-W and >3 MASSBUSS interfaces. The fourth MASSBUS interface has in the >correct slot a G727. All other UNIBUS slots have a G727 in the >card position D. The MOS memory box is also connected to the CPU. > >This is what I have done so far. >When I turn on the machine everything "looks" fine. With the switch >ENABLE/HALT on HALT and pressing START, the machine sort of resets. >With the panel I can dump data in the MOS memory at address 00000000. >I did this also at 00001000 and 00010000. It 'works' and when I read >the contents back from those addresses, it is the correct data. >So, my first conclusion is that (part of) the CPU is OK and that the >address and data path to the MOS memory and the MOS memory box itself >are all OK as well. > >Here is the part that worries me. >In slot #40 (IIRC) is the DL11-W (M7856) console interface. >I am trying to write to the transmit buffer address (XBUF - 17777566). >I set the knobs on the 11/70 console to "CONS PHY" and "DATA REGISTER" >so that the address on the switches is the real physical address and >the data on the switches is what I want to store. >After the reset of the machine (HALT/START) I set the switches to >17777566, and press LOAD ADRS. On the ADDRESS leds appears 17777566. >Now, I set the switches to 00000071 (should give a "9" on the VT220). >When I toggle the DEP button, the PAUSE led goes on. >According to the handbook that means the the CPU tries to finish the >instruction as far as possible and then waits for an event to finish. >The event could be (I assume) an interrupt or, in this case, access >to the UNIBUS section. > >Next test was checking the DL11-W interface. >First I switched on my 11/34C. With address 165020/START, I get the >dump of the registers on the VT102. So, I mad sure that the M7856 >in the 11/34C is OK. >Now, I swapped the M7856 of the 11/70 with the M7856 of the 11/34C. >First, I started the 11/34C again. I get the register dump on the >screen. So, the M7856 from the 11/70 was OK. >Just to make sure I tried the 11/70 again (with M7856 of the 34C), >but I get the same result: PAUSE led goes on. > >Yesterday, I had a long conversation on the phone with Edward. We >talk about all kind of (PDP-11) things, and also the 11/70 problem. >One suggestion was that the UNIBUS map is not yet initialised, and >that would cause the UNIBUS accesses to fail. My guess is that when >the console panel knob is set to "CONS PHY", I have full access to >all addresses without any mapping taking place. Is this correct? > >Anyway, to test the "UNIBUS map initialisation" theory, I read the >M9312 bootstrap manual. The 11/70 (and 11/60) have a different PROM >that stores the diagnostics. The 11/04--11/55 PROM also contains a >console monitor, but the 60 and 70 PROM only has diagnostics. >The manuals says to load address 17765744, then set the switches >8-0 to the device code and then press START. >I checked the M9312 to look at the diag PROM. According the M9312 >manual the PROM code must be 248F1 (IIRC) for the 11/04-11/55, and >233F1 for the 11/60-11/70. My M9312 has a PROM with code 616F1. >Is that a new type for the 11/70? The M9312 is the card that was >in the 11/70 when I got it, and another 11/70 (with remote console) >that I have has the same PROM. Edward's 11/70's (he has also 2) >one has a 233F1, the other has a 616F1. >So, I did that test, but the PAUSE led goes on again. > >Trying to boot from an RX01 should need at least the RX11 card in >a UNIBUS slot ... I did that, so I put the M7846 in slot 41 (IIRC), >next to the DL11-W. Tried the test again: 17765744 - LOAD ADRS - set >the device code on switches 8 to 0 - START. Alas, PAUSE on again. > >What puzzles me is the "device code" you must set on the 9 least >significant switches. I have set that to 170 as that are the LSB's >of the start address fro the bootstrap of the RX11. Is that correct? > >Come to think of the good advice from Tony: I will check the >power supply voltages this evening. Especially the one that supplies >the cards that deal with the UNIBUS section ... > >tnx for reading all this, >and TIA for all responses, > >- Henk. From GOOI at oce.nl Thu Jul 11 08:48:01 2002 From: GOOI at oce.nl (Gooijen H) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 Message-ID: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB1@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Thanks for the advice, Tom. I knew I had forgotten a few things. > Have you tried to read the DL11-W status register? > Do you only get the PAUSE on a deposit? Did a reset and then EXAM on 1777560 (CSR) --> PAUSE goes on > As you indicate, checking the power supply voltages is > an important first step. Agreed, but I could not do that yesterday evening when I thought of it, because the washing machine was also running ... > It sounds like you might have a bus request/grant jumper problem or > problem in the CPU hardware. Since you are using slot 40 (the first > UNIBUS slot) for your DL11-W, it would seem that the problem would > be either in the MASSBUS jumpers or a CPU hardware problem. Of > course, it could also be a backplane wire problem. Looks like it :-( > Have you tried to execute a very simple program such as jump to > self (0777) by depositing that value at location 01000 and starting > there? This is a good basic CPU test. Yes, that was the other test I forgot to write. This test is also succesfull. > Do you have a KM11 diagnostic board? Using the KM11, you can > cycle through the microcode flows listed in the printset. This will > help you diagnose the problem at a finer level then just watching > the pause lamp turn on. Of course, you will likely need a set of > board extenders and minimally an o-scope as well. If you don't > have a KM11 and want to build one, check out the one I built here: > > http://www.ubanproductions.com/museum.html Nice pages. Had seen them before, but lost the URL ... I hope that I do not have to dig in that deep, but I have a quad and a double sized extender board and a good Tektronix 465. If building the KM11 was the problem, I did not have a problem. To build something as simple as that is a "piece of cake". - Henk. > At 09:31 AM 7/11/2002 +0200, you wrote: > >Hi all. > > > >I am having trouble with my 11/70 because it works only partial. > >Since things are quiet on the list, I have something to ask. > >It is a long story, but as said on the list this week, the more > >info you give, the less not relevant suggestions are typed. > > > >First the description of the machine. > >The machine has only all CPU boards (with FP), the DL11-W and > >3 MASSBUSS interfaces. The fourth MASSBUS interface has in the > >correct slot a G727. All other UNIBUS slots have a G727 in the > >card position D. The MOS memory box is also connected to the CPU. > > > >This is what I have done so far. > >When I turn on the machine everything "looks" fine. With the switch > >ENABLE/HALT on HALT and pressing START, the machine sort of resets. > >With the panel I can dump data in the MOS memory at address 00000000. > >I did this also at 00001000 and 00010000. It 'works' and when I read > >the contents back from those addresses, it is the correct data. > >So, my first conclusion is that (part of) the CPU is OK and that the > >address and data path to the MOS memory and the MOS memory box itself > >are all OK as well. > > > >Here is the part that worries me. > >In slot #40 (IIRC) is the DL11-W (M7856) console interface. > >I am trying to write to the transmit buffer address (XBUF - > 17777566). > >I set the knobs on the 11/70 console to "CONS PHY" and "DATA > REGISTER" > >so that the address on the switches is the real physical address and > >the data on the switches is what I want to store. > >After the reset of the machine (HALT/START) I set the switches to > >17777566, and press LOAD ADRS. On the ADDRESS leds appears 17777566. > >Now, I set the switches to 00000071 (should give a "9" on the VT220). > >When I toggle the DEP button, the PAUSE led goes on. > >According to the handbook that means the the CPU tries to finish the > >instruction as far as possible and then waits for an event to finish. > >The event could be (I assume) an interrupt or, in this case, access > >to the UNIBUS section. > > > >Next test was checking the DL11-W interface. > >First I switched on my 11/34C. With address 165020/START, I get the > >dump of the registers on the VT102. So, I mad sure that the M7856 > >in the 11/34C is OK. > >Now, I swapped the M7856 of the 11/70 with the M7856 of the 11/34C. > >First, I started the 11/34C again. I get the register dump on the > >screen. So, the M7856 from the 11/70 was OK. > >Just to make sure I tried the 11/70 again (with M7856 of the 34C), > >but I get the same result: PAUSE led goes on. > > > >Yesterday, I had a long conversation on the phone with Edward. We > >talk about all kind of (PDP-11) things, and also the 11/70 problem. > >One suggestion was that the UNIBUS map is not yet initialised, and > >that would cause the UNIBUS accesses to fail. My guess is that when > >the console panel knob is set to "CONS PHY", I have full access to > >all addresses without any mapping taking place. Is this correct? > > > >Anyway, to test the "UNIBUS map initialisation" theory, I read the > >M9312 bootstrap manual. The 11/70 (and 11/60) have a different PROM > >that stores the diagnostics. The 11/04--11/55 PROM also contains a > >console monitor, but the 60 and 70 PROM only has diagnostics. > >The manuals says to load address 17765744, then set the switches > >8-0 to the device code and then press START. > >I checked the M9312 to look at the diag PROM. According the M9312 > >manual the PROM code must be 248F1 (IIRC) for the 11/04-11/55, and > >233F1 for the 11/60-11/70. My M9312 has a PROM with code 616F1. > >Is that a new type for the 11/70? The M9312 is the card that was > >in the 11/70 when I got it, and another 11/70 (with remote console) > >that I have has the same PROM. Edward's 11/70's (he has also 2) > >one has a 233F1, the other has a 616F1. > >So, I did that test, but the PAUSE led goes on again. > > > >Trying to boot from an RX01 should need at least the RX11 card in > >a UNIBUS slot ... I did that, so I put the M7846 in slot 41 (IIRC), > >next to the DL11-W. Tried the test again: 17765744 - LOAD ADRS - set > >the device code on switches 8 to 0 - START. Alas, PAUSE on again. > > > >What puzzles me is the "device code" you must set on the 9 least > >significant switches. I have set that to 170 as that are the LSB's > >of the start address fro the bootstrap of the RX11. Is that correct? > > > >Come to think of the good advice from Tony: I will check the > >power supply voltages this evening. Especially the one that supplies > >the cards that deal with the UNIBUS section ... > > > >tnx for reading all this, > >and TIA for all responses, > > > >- Henk. > > From uban at ubanproductions.com Thu Jul 11 09:02:01 2002 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB1@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20020711085424.01a88ea0@ubanproductions.com> At 03:37 PM 7/11/2002 +0200, you wrote: >Thanks for the advice, Tom. >I knew I had forgotten a few things. > > > Have you tried to read the DL11-W status register? > > Do you only get the PAUSE on a deposit? > >Did a reset and then EXAM on 1777560 (CSR) --> PAUSE goes on Can you examine the bootstrap ROMs on your M9312? This should fall in the UNIBUS space as well (I would think), but is at the front of the bus, so if you can talk to it, perhaps the CPU is OK, but there is just a grant problem down stream. > > As you indicate, checking the power supply voltages is > > an important first step. > >Agreed, but I could not do that yesterday evening when I >thought of it, because the washing machine was also running ... Did you catch your washing machine;-) Just curious what the washing machine has to do with checking your power supply voltage? The voltages you want to check are the DC +5, +15, -15, etc. Also you ought to check the ACLO and DCLO signals. I had a case where the regulator board in my lower h7420a was asserting ACLO when in fact all of the voltages were fine. > > It sounds like you might have a bus request/grant jumper problem or > > problem in the CPU hardware. Since you are using slot 40 (the first > > UNIBUS slot) for your DL11-W, it would seem that the problem would > > be either in the MASSBUS jumpers or a CPU hardware problem. Of > > course, it could also be a backplane wire problem. > >Looks like it :-( If the bootstrap test above works out, then I would consider removing the various MASSBUS cards and putting in the grant cards, just to eliminate any possible problems that they may be causing. > > Have you tried to execute a very simple program such as jump to > > self (0777) by depositing that value at location 01000 and starting > > there? This is a good basic CPU test. > >Yes, that was the other test I forgot to write. >This test is also succesfull. > > > Do you have a KM11 diagnostic board? Using the KM11, you can > > cycle through the microcode flows listed in the printset. This will > > help you diagnose the problem at a finer level then just watching > > the pause lamp turn on. Of course, you will likely need a set of > > board extenders and minimally an o-scope as well. If you don't > > have a KM11 and want to build one, check out the one I built here: > > > > http://www.ubanproductions.com/museum.html > >Nice pages. Had seen them before, but lost the URL ... >I hope that I do not have to dig in that deep, but I have a quad and >a double sized extender board and a good Tektronix 465. >If building the KM11 was the problem, I did not have a problem. >To build something as simple as that is a "piece of cake". > >- Henk. Thanks. Yes, it is a "simple" board, but without it, it can be very difficult to locate CPU problems... --tom > > At 09:31 AM 7/11/2002 +0200, you wrote: > > >Hi all. > > > > > >I am having trouble with my 11/70 because it works only partial. > > >Since things are quiet on the list, I have something to ask. > > >It is a long story, but as said on the list this week, the more > > >info you give, the less not relevant suggestions are typed. > > > > > >First the description of the machine. > > >The machine has only all CPU boards (with FP), the DL11-W and > > >3 MASSBUSS interfaces. The fourth MASSBUS interface has in the > > >correct slot a G727. All other UNIBUS slots have a G727 in the > > >card position D. The MOS memory box is also connected to the CPU. > > > > > >This is what I have done so far. > > >When I turn on the machine everything "looks" fine. With the switch > > >ENABLE/HALT on HALT and pressing START, the machine sort of resets. > > >With the panel I can dump data in the MOS memory at address 00000000. > > >I did this also at 00001000 and 00010000. It 'works' and when I read > > >the contents back from those addresses, it is the correct data. > > >So, my first conclusion is that (part of) the CPU is OK and that the > > >address and data path to the MOS memory and the MOS memory box itself > > >are all OK as well. > > > > > >Here is the part that worries me. > > >In slot #40 (IIRC) is the DL11-W (M7856) console interface. > > >I am trying to write to the transmit buffer address (XBUF - > > 17777566). > > >I set the knobs on the 11/70 console to "CONS PHY" and "DATA > > REGISTER" > > >so that the address on the switches is the real physical address and > > >the data on the switches is what I want to store. > > >After the reset of the machine (HALT/START) I set the switches to > > >17777566, and press LOAD ADRS. On the ADDRESS leds appears 17777566. > > >Now, I set the switches to 00000071 (should give a "9" on the VT220). > > >When I toggle the DEP button, the PAUSE led goes on. > > >According to the handbook that means the the CPU tries to finish the > > >instruction as far as possible and then waits for an event to finish. > > >The event could be (I assume) an interrupt or, in this case, access > > >to the UNIBUS section. > > > > > >Next test was checking the DL11-W interface. > > >First I switched on my 11/34C. With address 165020/START, I get the > > >dump of the registers on the VT102. So, I mad sure that the M7856 > > >in the 11/34C is OK. > > >Now, I swapped the M7856 of the 11/70 with the M7856 of the 11/34C. > > >First, I started the 11/34C again. I get the register dump on the > > >screen. So, the M7856 from the 11/70 was OK. > > >Just to make sure I tried the 11/70 again (with M7856 of the 34C), > > >but I get the same result: PAUSE led goes on. > > > > > >Yesterday, I had a long conversation on the phone with Edward. We > > >talk about all kind of (PDP-11) things, and also the 11/70 problem. > > >One suggestion was that the UNIBUS map is not yet initialised, and > > >that would cause the UNIBUS accesses to fail. My guess is that when > > >the console panel knob is set to "CONS PHY", I have full access to > > >all addresses without any mapping taking place. Is this correct? > > > > > >Anyway, to test the "UNIBUS map initialisation" theory, I read the > > >M9312 bootstrap manual. The 11/70 (and 11/60) have a different PROM > > >that stores the diagnostics. The 11/04--11/55 PROM also contains a > > >console monitor, but the 60 and 70 PROM only has diagnostics. > > >The manuals says to load address 17765744, then set the switches > > >8-0 to the device code and then press START. > > >I checked the M9312 to look at the diag PROM. According the M9312 > > >manual the PROM code must be 248F1 (IIRC) for the 11/04-11/55, and > > >233F1 for the 11/60-11/70. My M9312 has a PROM with code 616F1. > > >Is that a new type for the 11/70? The M9312 is the card that was > > >in the 11/70 when I got it, and another 11/70 (with remote console) > > >that I have has the same PROM. Edward's 11/70's (he has also 2) > > >one has a 233F1, the other has a 616F1. > > >So, I did that test, but the PAUSE led goes on again. > > > > > >Trying to boot from an RX01 should need at least the RX11 card in > > >a UNIBUS slot ... I did that, so I put the M7846 in slot 41 (IIRC), > > >next to the DL11-W. Tried the test again: 17765744 - LOAD ADRS - set > > >the device code on switches 8 to 0 - START. Alas, PAUSE on again. > > > > > >What puzzles me is the "device code" you must set on the 9 least > > >significant switches. I have set that to 170 as that are the LSB's > > >of the start address fro the bootstrap of the RX11. Is that correct? > > > > > >Come to think of the good advice from Tony: I will check the > > >power supply voltages this evening. Especially the one that supplies > > >the cards that deal with the UNIBUS section ... > > > > > >tnx for reading all this, > > >and TIA for all responses, > > > > > >- Henk. > > > > From Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com Thu Jul 11 10:12:00 2002 From: Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com (Andreas Freiherr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 References: <5.1.1.6.0.20020711085424.01a88ea0@ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <3D2D9FBB.233B3D72@Vishay.com> Easy to guess: > > > As you indicate, checking the power supply voltages is > > > an important first step. > > > >Agreed, but I could not do that yesterday evening when I > >thought of it, because the washing machine was also running ... > > Did you catch your washing machine;-) Just curious what the washing > machine has to do with checking your power supply voltage? It's eating the power that is required to feed the PDP, right? -- Andreas Freiherr Vishay Semiconductor GmbH, Heilbronn, Germany http://www.vishay.com From uban at ubanproductions.com Thu Jul 11 10:42:00 2002 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <3D2D9FBB.233B3D72@Vishay.com> References: <5.1.1.6.0.20020711085424.01a88ea0@ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20020711104059.01ab9df0@ubanproductions.com> At 05:09 PM 7/11/2002 +0200, you wrote: >Easy to guess: > > > > > As you indicate, checking the power supply voltages is > > > > an important first step. > > > > > >Agreed, but I could not do that yesterday evening when I > > >thought of it, because the washing machine was also running ... > > > > Did you catch your washing machine;-) Just curious what the washing > > machine has to do with checking your power supply voltage? > >It's eating the power that is required to feed the PDP, right? Perhaps, but the switching regulators in the PDP should regulate to the correct voltage even with a slightly low incoming AC... --tom >-- >Andreas Freiherr >Vishay Semiconductor GmbH, Heilbronn, Germany >http://www.vishay.com From mbg at TheWorld.com Thu Jul 11 10:55:00 2002 From: mbg at TheWorld.com (Megan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 Message-ID: <200207111554.LAA5027071@shell.TheWorld.com> Sounds like a bus hang... make sure all the unibus slots which are otherwise without options have the bus grant cards... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | email: gentry at zk3.dec.com (work) | | Unix Support Engineering Group | mbg at world.std.com (home) | | Hewlett Packard | (s/ at /@/) | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 (DEC '77-'98) | required." - mbg KB1FCA | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ From Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com Thu Jul 11 10:57:00 2002 From: Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com (Andreas Freiherr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 References: <5.1.1.6.0.20020711085424.01a88ea0@ubanproductions.com> <5.1.1.6.0.20020711104059.01ab9df0@ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <3D2DAA73.1CECD4CC@Vishay.com> see below, please! Tom Uban wrote: > > At 05:09 PM 7/11/2002 +0200, you wrote: > >Easy to guess: > > > > > > > As you indicate, checking the power supply voltages is > > > > > an important first step. > > > > > > > >Agreed, but I could not do that yesterday evening when I > > > >thought of it, because the washing machine was also running ... > > > > > > Did you catch your washing machine;-) Just curious what the washing > > > machine has to do with checking your power supply voltage? > > > >It's eating the power that is required to feed the PDP, right? > > Perhaps, but the switching regulators in the PDP should regulate > to the correct voltage even with a slightly low incoming AC... Sure, but there will be incoming AC only as long as the circuit breaker (presumably shared between washing machine and PDP-11) does not trip... -- Andreas Freiherr Vishay Semiconductor GmbH, Heilbronn, Germany http://www.vishay.com From dtwright at uiuc.edu Thu Jul 11 11:39:00 2002 From: dtwright at uiuc.edu (Dan Wright) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: Help with sparc 5 In-Reply-To: <200207110047.RAA12413@clulw009.amd.com> References: <200207110047.RAA12413@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: <20020711163719.GC695907@uiuc.edu> It should be something like /iommu/sbus/espdma/sd@3,0:a [1] (that's from memory so there are some other numbers missing, but it should be close...they aren't important numbers anyway as there's only 1 iommu, sbus, and espdma in the system :) what's the exact error you're getting as it's trying to boot? [1] sd@3,0 is the bottom SCA drive slot. sd@1,0 is the top (I believe). if the boot disk is in the top slot try moving it to the bottom. Dwight K. Elvey said: > Hi > I'm not sure if this is old enough. I have a > sparc 5 that has stopped booting. I'm not sure > if it is the nvram that has failed or the disk. > Does anyone know the full name of the normal > internal disk drive? I'd like to compare it > with the one it says it is trying to boot from. > Dwight > - Dan Wright (dtwright@uiuc.edu) (http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright) -] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [- ``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread, For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.'' Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Thu Jul 11 12:24:00 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: Help with sparc 5 Message-ID: <200207111722.KAA12931@clulw009.amd.com> Hi Dan I get a 'boot device not ready' message. I'll have to look to see exactly what the device is but I do remember it does include the sd@3,0. I guess it is just a bad drive. I'm the only one to look into it so I don't think it is an issue of the wrong slot. I'll have to see if there is any F-code diagnostics for the disk. Some times there is something there that can help check. It means spending a couple of hours hacking through the open boot code. The disk spins up and makes the bleep-bleep sounds that they normally do. Dwight >From: "Dan Wright" > >It should be something like /iommu/sbus/espdma/sd@3,0:a [1] (that's from memory >so there are some other numbers missing, but it should be close...they aren't >important numbers anyway as there's only 1 iommu, sbus, and espdma in the >system :) > >what's the exact error you're getting as it's trying to boot? > >[1] sd@3,0 is the bottom SCA drive slot. sd@1,0 is the top (I believe). if >the boot disk is in the top slot try moving it to the bottom. > >Dwight K. Elvey said: >> Hi >> I'm not sure if this is old enough. I have a >> sparc 5 that has stopped booting. I'm not sure >> if it is the nvram that has failed or the disk. >> Does anyone know the full name of the normal >> internal disk drive? I'd like to compare it >> with the one it says it is trying to boot from. >> Dwight >> >- Dan Wright >(dtwright@uiuc.edu) >(http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright) > >-] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [- >``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread, > For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.'' > Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan > From bqt at update.uu.se Thu Jul 11 12:26:00 2002 From: bqt at update.uu.se (Johnny Billquist) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: Hung 11/70 In-Reply-To: <20020711170001.16840.31768.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: A suggestion is to add info-pdp11 to these kind of questions, since some of us don't really have the energy to plow through all of cctalk... :-) Anyhow, just like some others have suggested, it definitely sounds like a hung Unibus. Check NRP jumpers on all the slots. Remove the massbus interfaces. See if you can access anything in the I/O page. Those are the first things I'd try. Also, the 11/70 have different regulators for different parts of the backplane, and one regulator us just for the Unibus slots at the end. Check that regulator as well. Also, I hope you have a good terminator card. :-) Johnny Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt@update.uu.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Thu Jul 11 12:32:01 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: i432 Message-ID: <200207111730.KAA12935@clulw009.amd.com> Hi It looks like I made a nice find. I bought an Intel 200 series expansion box, mainly because it had the two card set for the Intel double density. (Intel's double density is not compatible with others.) There was another board in the chassis that I didn't even look at much. I just assumed it was some ICE board without the dongle so I didn't give it much thought. I then noticed that the extraction ear said 432IP. Looking closer, it seems to be a 432 card with a 432 chip. It is a 432/602 board. I nice find. Now, I know that information on these are rare but I thought I'd ask, does anyone have any of the software to run one of these? Thanks Dwight From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Thu Jul 11 12:54:00 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: i432 Message-ID: <200207111752.KAA12974@clulw009.amd.com> Hi A quick look at Eric's web page shows that it isn't a 432 processor, it is only one piece of a three chip set. It is what is called the interface processor. Still, an interesting board. Dwight >From: "Dwight K. Elvey" > >Hi > It looks like I made a nice find. I bought an >Intel 200 series expansion box, mainly because it >had the two card set for the Intel double density. >(Intel's double density is not compatible with others.) > There was another board in the chassis that I >didn't even look at much. I just assumed it was >some ICE board without the dongle so I didn't >give it much thought. I then noticed that the >extraction ear said 432IP. Looking closer, it >seems to be a 432 card with a 432 chip. It is >a 432/602 board. > I nice find. Now, I know that information on >these are rare but I thought I'd ask, does anyone >have any of the software to run one of these? >Thanks >Dwight > > > From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Jul 11 13:59:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB0@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> from "Gooijen H" at Jul 11, 2 09:31:28 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 3989 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020711/078a19f9/attachment.ksh From foo at siconic.com Thu Jul 11 14:03:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: i432 In-Reply-To: <200207111730.KAA12935@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 11 Jul 2002, Dwight K. Elvey wrote: > There was another board in the chassis that I > didn't even look at much. I just assumed it was > some ICE board without the dongle so I didn't > give it much thought. I then noticed that the > extraction ear said 432IP. Looking closer, it > seems to be a 432 card with a 432 chip. It is > a 432/602 board. WOW! Very cool. This is the first I've heard of anyone actually finding one. Nice score. You'll have to bring it to Stan's get together this weekend after Foothill. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From dtwright at uiuc.edu Thu Jul 11 14:47:00 2002 From: dtwright at uiuc.edu (Dan Wright) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: Help with sparc 5 In-Reply-To: <200207111722.KAA12931@clulw009.amd.com> References: <200207111722.KAA12931@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: <20020711194552.GA717670@uiuc.edu> It sounds like it is a bad drive. you could try a "probe-scsi-all" command to see if the disk responds to an inquiry command and shows up in the scsi device list... Dwight K. Elvey said: > Hi Dan > I get a 'boot device not ready' message. I'll have to look to > see exactly what the device is but I do remember it does include > the sd@3,0. I guess it is just a bad drive. I'm the only one > to look into it so I don't think it is an issue of the wrong > slot. I'll have to see if there is any F-code diagnostics for > the disk. Some times there is something there that can help > check. It means spending a couple of hours hacking through > the open boot code. > The disk spins up and makes the bleep-bleep sounds that they > normally do. > Dwight > > > >From: "Dan Wright" > > > >It should be something like /iommu/sbus/espdma/sd@3,0:a [1] (that's from memory > >so there are some other numbers missing, but it should be close...they aren't > >important numbers anyway as there's only 1 iommu, sbus, and espdma in the > >system :) > > > >what's the exact error you're getting as it's trying to boot? > > > >[1] sd@3,0 is the bottom SCA drive slot. sd@1,0 is the top (I believe). if > >the boot disk is in the top slot try moving it to the bottom. > > > >Dwight K. Elvey said: > >> Hi > >> I'm not sure if this is old enough. I have a > >> sparc 5 that has stopped booting. I'm not sure > >> if it is the nvram that has failed or the disk. > >> Does anyone know the full name of the normal > >> internal disk drive? I'd like to compare it > >> with the one it says it is trying to boot from. > >> Dwight > >> > >- Dan Wright > >(dtwright@uiuc.edu) > >(http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright) > > > >-] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [- > >``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread, > > For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.'' > > Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan > > > - Dan Wright (dtwright@uiuc.edu) (http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright) -] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [- ``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread, For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.'' Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan From sieler at allegro.com Thu Jul 11 14:48:00 2002 From: sieler at allegro.com (Stan Sieler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: List Management Q/A In-Reply-To: <3D2AE461.29042.5CF0BE6@localhost> References: Message-ID: <3D2D6BB9.24248.53CBC3@localhost> Re: > Due to a bug in Samsung Contact (successor to the hated OpenMail from HP), > I now have to have all my classiccmp/cctalk/cctech mail forward from our We got a patch ... so now I can filter on from/sender/etc! -- Stan Sieler sieler@allegro.com www.allegro.com/sieler/wanted/index.html www.allegro.com/sieler From lists at subatomix.com Thu Jul 11 15:26:00 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: List Management Q/A In-Reply-To: <3D2D6BB9.24248.53CBC3@localhost> References: <3D2D6BB9.24248.53CBC3@localhost> Message-ID: <1582958454.20020711152405@subatomix.com> On Thursday, July 11, 2002, Stan Sieler wrote: > We got a patch ... so now I can filter on from/sender/etc! That's good, because the [CCTECH] prepend may go away in the near future. I'm currently discussing with Jay some cool ideas... -- Jeffrey Sharp The email address lists@subatomix.com is for mailing list traffic. Please send off-list mail to roach jay ess ess at wasp subatomix beetle dot com. You may need to remove some bugs first. From geoffr at zipcon.net Thu Jul 11 15:57:00 2002 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: Help with sparc 5 In-Reply-To: <200207111722.KAA12931@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020711140819.00ab6410@mail.zipcon.net> At 10:22 AM 7/11/02 -0700, you wrote: >Hi Dan > I get a 'boot device not ready' message. I'll have to look to >see exactly what the device is but I do remember it does include >the sd@3,0. I guess it is just a bad drive. I'm the only one what do you get when you do a probe-scsi-all at the OK prompt? From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Thu Jul 11 16:44:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: KM-11 (was RE: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70) In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20020711085424.01a88ea0@ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <20020711214216.32016.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> --- Tom Uban wrote: > > > http://www.ubanproductions.com/museum.html > > > >Nice pages. Had seen them before, but lost the URL ... Indeed. BTW, how much did that KM-11 replica PCB cost? I wish I could find hobby-level PCB vendors that _could_ do gold fingers, but for as much as that card would be used, I can tolerate tin. I have a TM11 and an RK11C that I'd love to stick one of these onto. I've seen Tony's pages in the past, but never worked up enough energy to do a point-to-point replica. At least I do have a single-height prototype card or two, but I was hoping to save them for, say, crystal-controlled baud-rate generators for a PDP-8/L (to run a VT52 reliably at a comfortable split 9600/150 baud rate). Worst case, I do have some bare copper-clad board of the right dimension (not sure about thickness without checking), but I'd still miss the gold fingers. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From doc at mdrconsult.com Thu Jul 11 16:52:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: Help with sparc 5 In-Reply-To: <200207110047.RAA12413@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Jul 2002, Dwight K. Elvey wrote: > Hi > I'm not sure if this is old enough. I have a > sparc 5 that has stopped booting. I'm not sure > if it is the nvram that has failed or the disk. There's an issue with dead nvram that plagues a lot of the older Sparcs, and will stop the autoboot. IIRC, that problem _always_ sets the MAC address to ffffffffffff, so it should be easy to check. I do remember that the ELC will still boot, but you have to manually fix the MAC and boot path on every power-cycle. Doc From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Thu Jul 11 16:58:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB0@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Message-ID: <20020711215627.27344.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> --- Gooijen H wrote: > Hi all. > > I am having trouble with my 11/70 because it works only partial... > First the description of the machine. > The machine has only all CPU boards (with FP), the DL11-W and > 3 MASSBUSS interfaces. The fourth MASSBUS interface has in the > correct slot a G727. All other UNIBUS slots have a G727 in the > card position D... One thing to check is the NPR jumper. If any of the Unibus options were NPR devices, they would have been in a slot that had the NPR wire removed from the back. If you remove a single-slot DMA device from a Unibus, you have to either re-wire the backplane (rarely done) or insert a dual-height grant card in slots C and D. We used to ship a dual-height grant card with every backplane along with the instructions on now to remove the NPR wire. One time, I remember getting tripped up on uncrating and setting up a brand-new 11/750 because I forgot to *remove* the NPR wire from under the TU80 controller. Either way, leaving it in when it needs to come out or leaving it out when it needs to be granted will cause things to sieze up. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Thu Jul 11 17:03:00 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: Help with sparc 5 Message-ID: <200207112201.PAA13102@clulw009.amd.com> >From: "Geoff Reed" > >At 10:22 AM 7/11/02 -0700, you wrote: >>Hi Dan >> I get a 'boot device not ready' message. I'll have to look to >>see exactly what the device is but I do remember it does include >>the sd@3,0. I guess it is just a bad drive. I'm the only one > >what do you get when you do a probe-scsi-all at the OK prompt? ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > Hi Goeff and Dan I'll give it a check tonight when I get home. Dwight From uban at ubanproductions.com Thu Jul 11 17:09:00 2002 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: KM-11 (was RE: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70) In-Reply-To: <20020711214216.32016.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> References: <5.1.1.6.0.20020711085424.01a88ea0@ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20020711170241.01b7ddc0@ubanproductions.com> At 02:42 PM 7/11/2002 -0700, you wrote: >--- Tom Uban wrote: > > > > http://www.ubanproductions.com/museum.html > > > > > >Nice pages. Had seen them before, but lost the URL ... > >Indeed. > >BTW, how much did that KM-11 replica PCB cost? I wish I >could find hobby-level PCB vendors that _could_ do >gold fingers, but for as much as that card would be used, >I can tolerate tin. I looked it up and it was $130 for two boards back in 10/2000. They are about the cheapest board house that I''ve found and the free layout software that they have is simple to use. If you can squeeze your design into a double sided 2.5"x3.75" layout, they will sell you two boards for $60 with a 2 day turnaround. >I have a TM11 and an RK11C that I'd love to stick one of >these onto. I've seen Tony's pages in the past, but never >worked up enough energy to do a point-to-point replica. At >least I do have a single-height prototype card or two, but >I was hoping to save them for, say, crystal-controlled >baud-rate generators for a PDP-8/L (to run a VT52 reliably at >a comfortable split 9600/150 baud rate). I used to do point to point work, but now I find that my time is more valuable when the design has more than a few components. >Worst case, I do have some bare copper-clad board of the right >dimension (not sure about thickness without checking), but I'd >still miss the gold fingers. Standard 0.062" thick board. --tom >-ethan > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free >http://sbc.yahoo.com From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Jul 11 17:19:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: KM-11 (was RE: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70) In-Reply-To: <20020711214216.32016.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> from "Ethan Dicks" at Jul 11, 2 02:42:16 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1798 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020711/f9b0cde4/attachment.ksh From uban at ubanproductions.com Thu Jul 11 17:37:00 2002 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: KM-11 (was RE: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70) In-Reply-To: References: <20020711214216.32016.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20020711173500.01a46388@ubanproductions.com> >Talking of the RK11-C, has anyone ever tried the lights panel for it? DEC >made a 3U rack panel with 144 LEDs (!) on it. It could be connected to >some of the older controllers (permanently, not just for diagnostics), >and it displayed (normally) the state of all the programmer-accessible >registers, and perhaps a few other signals. There are the right >connectors for one on a RK11-C backplane. I have a couple of the panels, >but the only bezels I have for them are labelled for the DX11. > >I am sure this thing is not particularly _useful_, but flashing lights >are always fun... > >-tony The RP03 controller which I used to maintain (years ago) had one of those light panels on it... I've never seen one connected to an RK11-C though. --tom From zaft at azstarnet.com Thu Jul 11 18:01:00 2002 From: zaft at azstarnet.com (Gordon Zaft) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: Conquest??? In-Reply-To: <00d601c226d2$d0b3b0e0$01000001@cvendel> References: <20020707200808.69330.qmail@web10303.mail.yahoo.com> <3D28A486.23D62A06@rain.org> <008801c22634$f50537f0$01000001@cvendel> <3D29BABF.6090200@arrl.net> Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20020711155614.0242e8b0@mail.azstarnet.com> At 06:57 PM 7/8/2002 -0400, you wrote: >[snip] >So, the question here is, has anyone else ever played this game and does >anyone know where I can find it to load onto a 3100 ??? Yes, Conquest was basically a VMS version of the great Plato game, Empire (or =empire if you are a purist). I used to have a tarball with the source but I have no idea where it is anymore, alas. I assume you google'd a bit? You might do a usenet archive search. GZ From lgwalker at mts.net Thu Jul 11 18:13:00 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: OT: MECOS frequency device ? Message-ID: <3D2DCAC9.13918.22834D1D@localhost> Likely way off topic, but I acquired some sort of frequency device in an auction junk box. It's a well machined device made by MECOS, made in W.Germant. It's about 2" square by 1/2" powered by a Li. battery and has micro-switches labelled 3 hz, 7.8 hz, 14.0 hz and a small led that flashes at the selected frequency. Anyone have any idea what it might be ? A search turned up that MECOS makes Active Magnetic Bearings and control boards and programs. Lawrence lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From jhfinepw4z at compsys.to Thu Jul 11 18:15:01 2002 From: jhfinepw4z at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: Anyone Care About RT-11 Message-ID: <3D2E10BD.A36A1E07@compsys.to> In regard to the Freeware CDs for RSX-11 and RT-11 I have now finished the verification tasks that I feel are needed to ensure that I am producing correct images. I will be making some copies of the CD images from: ftp://ftp.trailing-edge.com/pub/cd-images/ http://www.classiccmp.org/PDP-11/RT-11/ http://www.classiccmp.org/PDP-11/RSX-11/ At this point, the only thing that I still want to do is to have a label which accurately reflects the contents. Obviously, the same label that Tim Shoppa used would be best. Failing that, at least the same words. Since I already have my own copy of the RT-11 CD, that is NOT why I am sending this e-mail. Does anyone on this list know where I might obtain a copy of the RSX-11 CD labels? If I have not been able to obtain a copy of the RSX-11 CD labels by the end of July, then I will just do the best I can! For those users who receive a personal copy of this e-mail, you are already on my list. I will send you a mailing address when I am ready to burn the CDs. Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From hansp at aconit.org Thu Jul 11 19:57:01 2002 From: hansp at aconit.org (Hans B Pufal) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:02 2005 Subject: Mikbug info? References: <000601c2271c$56f639e0$0107398a@main> Message-ID: <3D2E28E4.6060201@aconit.org> Ron Ward wrote: > I just found a sybex 6800 trainer that someone removed the monitor ROM > from. I paid $5.00 for it. > Do you still have engineering note 100 available? The first Google hit on MIKBUG throws up a web page with this link: http://www.srecord.freewebsites.com/mikbug/eng100.pdf -- hbp From eric at brouhaha.com Fri Jul 12 00:39:00 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: non DEC drives (was: DEC 350) In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20020705163933.02447960@mail.azstarnet.com> References: <027101c22113$8e9f6060$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> <20020701140520.87683.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> <027101c22113$8e9f6060$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> <4.3.2.7.2.20020705163933.02447960@mail.azstarnet.com> Message-ID: <33624.64.169.63.74.1026452258.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Gordon Zaft wrote: > As far as I know, the RD54 (aka Maxtor something or other, or > Priam 519, or other similar) was the largest MFM drive ever made. Not even close. For example, the Fujitsu Eagle (M2351) had a capacity of 380 MB, vs. 150 MB for the Maxtor XT-2190. I'm pretty sure there were other drives using MFM had even higher capacity. Of course, modern drives use RLL rather than MFM because they can get 50-100% better data density for a given channel bandwidth. And they use ZBR to pack more data into the outer cyclinders, whereas MFM drives generally used the same data rate on all cylinders. From eric at brouhaha.com Fri Jul 12 01:03:00 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Dual floppy drive In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020705181714.03365890@mail.IrisSYSTEMS.net> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020705181714.03365890@mail.IrisSYSTEMS.net> Message-ID: <33692.64.169.63.74.1026453723.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> > I have the same problem with the FD505 and would like to get a copy of > the documentation. Can you please e-mail me a scanned copy or fax a > paper copy to 925-606-9421? Many thanks! Why not just get it online from Teac? http://www.teac.com/DSPD/catalog.htm Document SFD0010A, about 3/4 of the way down the page. Their floppy drive knowledge base is sometimes useful for newer drives, but not the FD505: http://www.teac.com/DSPD/support/floppy_drives/floppy_drives.htm From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 12 01:19:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: KM-11 (was RE: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70) In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20020711170241.01b7ddc0@ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <20020712061736.25202.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> --- Tom Uban wrote: > At 02:42 PM 7/11/2002 -0700, you wrote: > > >BTW, how much did that KM-11 replica PCB cost? > > I looked it up and it was $130 for two boards back in 10/2000. That's not bad, considering what we used to pay for setup charges. Still, that's more than I can spring for a toy. > I used to do point to point work, but now I find that my time > is more valuable when the design has more than a few components. Understood. I spent way too many hours on this: http://www.penguincentral.com/retrocomputing/retrogaming/scoreboard.html -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From eric at brouhaha.com Fri Jul 12 01:31:00 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <33707.64.169.63.74.1026455376.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> > I was with a guy who was testing out LAN drops with a laptop > to see which ones were working and we went into a conference room > where none of the drops were labeled and due to painting and such you > couldn't tell the difference between them and the phone lines, which > were for a multiline system with intercom and all the other goodies. > He plugged the laptop up to what ended up being one of the phone > jacks and there was a nice shower of sparks. Somehow the laptop cmae > out of it without any damage. Strange, a 10baseT/100baseT Ethernet interface should be able withstand telephone voltages (even ringing), even if the jack has them wired to the data pairs. Even if it sustained damage, there should not have been any sparks. From GOOI at oce.nl Fri Jul 12 01:38:01 2002 From: GOOI at oce.nl (Gooijen H) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 Message-ID: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB2@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> I measured the voltages at the connected on the backplane yesterday. They are all fine, but ... the +5V on P2, pins #5 and #6, is 0.6V. This +5V powers the slots 2-3-4-5 where the floating point sits. Since I swapped all boards from my 11/70 with remote console with the boards from the 11/70 with full console I suspected that the remote console 1/70 had the FP option and the other did not. Checking ... yes indeed! To my shame I see that the H744 in position A is in the "remote-70" and position A in the "console-70" is empty! Easy to say that FP would not work! I moved the H744 from the remote-70 to the console-70 and checked the voltages again. Now, the pins #5 and #6 on P2 also show 4,98 V. Unfortunately, this installed PSU does not solve the problem. I still have the PAUSE led on with any access to 1777756x (read/write). My new question. When you have an 11/70 without the floating point boards and you want to install the FP option, you do the following things. - carefully slide the 4 FP boards in the correct position, in the slots 2-3-4-5. - install an H744 in the upper power supply, position A (nearest to the transformer compartment) and connect it to P9. - is there something else you shuld do ? TIA, - Henk. > -----Original Message----- > From: Gooijen H [mailto:GOOI@oce.nl] > Sent: donderdag 11 juli 2002 9:31 > To: 'cctalk@classiccmp.org' > Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 > > > Hi all. > > I am having trouble with my 11/70 because it works only partial. > Since things are quiet on the list, I have something to ask. > It is a long story, but as said on the list this week, the more > info you give, the less not relevant suggestions are typed. > > First the description of the machine. > The machine has only all CPU boards (with FP), the DL11-W and > 3 MASSBUSS interfaces. The fourth MASSBUS interface has in the > correct slot a G727. All other UNIBUS slots have a G727 in the > card position D. The MOS memory box is also connected to the CPU. > > This is what I have done so far. > When I turn on the machine everything "looks" fine. With the switch > ENABLE/HALT on HALT and pressing START, the machine sort of resets. > With the panel I can dump data in the MOS memory at address 00000000. > I did this also at 00001000 and 00010000. It 'works' and when I read > the contents back from those addresses, it is the correct data. > So, my first conclusion is that (part of) the CPU is OK and that the > address and data path to the MOS memory and the MOS memory box itself > are all OK as well. > > Here is the part that worries me. > In slot #40 (IIRC) is the DL11-W (M7856) console interface. > I am trying to write to the transmit buffer address (XBUF - 17777566). > I set the knobs on the 11/70 console to "CONS PHY" and "DATA REGISTER" > so that the address on the switches is the real physical address and > the data on the switches is what I want to store. > After the reset of the machine (HALT/START) I set the switches to > 17777566, and press LOAD ADRS. On the ADDRESS leds appears 17777566. > Now, I set the switches to 00000071 (should give a "9" on the VT220). > When I toggle the DEP button, the PAUSE led goes on. > According to the handbook that means the the CPU tries to finish the > instruction as far as possible and then waits for an event to finish. > The event could be (I assume) an interrupt or, in this case, access > to the UNIBUS section. > > Next test was checking the DL11-W interface. > First I switched on my 11/34C. With address 165020/START, I get the > dump of the registers on the VT102. So, I mad sure that the M7856 > in the 11/34C is OK. > Now, I swapped the M7856 of the 11/70 with the M7856 of the 11/34C. > First, I started the 11/34C again. I get the register dump on the > screen. So, the M7856 from the 11/70 was OK. > Just to make sure I tried the 11/70 again (with M7856 of the 34C), > but I get the same result: PAUSE led goes on. > > Yesterday, I had a long conversation on the phone with Edward. We > talk about all kind of (PDP-11) things, and also the 11/70 problem. > One suggestion was that the UNIBUS map is not yet initialised, and > that would cause the UNIBUS accesses to fail. My guess is that when > the console panel knob is set to "CONS PHY", I have full access to > all addresses without any mapping taking place. Is this correct? > > Anyway, to test the "UNIBUS map initialisation" theory, I read the > M9312 bootstrap manual. The 11/70 (and 11/60) have a different PROM > that stores the diagnostics. The 11/04--11/55 PROM also contains a > console monitor, but the 60 and 70 PROM only has diagnostics. > The manuals says to load address 17765744, then set the switches > 8-0 to the device code and then press START. > I checked the M9312 to look at the diag PROM. According the M9312 > manual the PROM code must be 248F1 (IIRC) for the 11/04-11/55, and > 233F1 for the 11/60-11/70. My M9312 has a PROM with code 616F1. > Is that a new type for the 11/70? The M9312 is the card that was > in the 11/70 when I got it, and another 11/70 (with remote console) > that I have has the same PROM. Edward's 11/70's (he has also 2) > one has a 233F1, the other has a 616F1. > So, I did that test, but the PAUSE led goes on again. > > Trying to boot from an RX01 should need at least the RX11 card in > a UNIBUS slot ... I did that, so I put the M7846 in slot 41 (IIRC), > next to the DL11-W. Tried the test again: 17765744 - LOAD ADRS - set > the device code on switches 8 to 0 - START. Alas, PAUSE on again. > > What puzzles me is the "device code" you must set on the 9 least > significant switches. I have set that to 170 as that are the LSB's > of the start address fro the bootstrap of the RX11. Is that correct? > > Come to think of the good advice from Tony: I will check the > power supply voltages this evening. Especially the one that supplies > the cards that deal with the UNIBUS section ... > > tnx for reading all this, > and TIA for all responses, > > - Henk. From GOOI at oce.nl Fri Jul 12 03:58:00 2002 From: GOOI at oce.nl (Gooijen H) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: KM-11 (was RE: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70) Message-ID: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB6@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Hi all. > BTW, how much did that KM-11 replica PCB cost? I wish I > could find hobby-level PCB vendors that _could_ do > gold fingers, but for as much as that card would be used, I did a quick check in my cards stock. I guess that the simple M105 address selected is a cheap candidate to get a new life as KM11. Just remove the few parts and, to be sure there are no interconnections, cut the trace a bit after the fingers. Then solder a flat cable to the traces that are used for the KM11. ** Do not extend the length of the flat cable too long! Stray capacitance between the wires can induce a voltage in the wire next to it. I had that problem a few years ago. The thing worked nice, but after a few months it died on me and I could not figure out what went wrong at first. With the oscilloscope the problems became visible: due to crosstalk/induction between the wires, the signal voltage on some wires went negative, more than -0.6 Volts. TTL circuits really hate that! - Henk. (with a busy weekend ahead...) From quapla at xs4all.nl Fri Jul 12 04:29:01 2002 From: quapla at xs4all.nl (quapla@xs4all.nl) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: KM-11 (was RE: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70) In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB6@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> References: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB6@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Message-ID: <9070.192.18.42.11.1026466049.squirrel@webmail.xs4all.nl> > Hi all. > >> BTW, how much did that KM-11 replica PCB cost? I wish I >> could find hobby-level PCB vendors that _could_ do >> gold fingers, but for as much as that card would be used, > > I did a quick check in my cards stock. > I guess that the simple M105 address selected is a cheap > candidate to get a new life as KM11. Just remove the few parts > and, to be sure there are no interconnections, cut the trace > a bit after the fingers. > Then solder a flat cable to the traces that are used for the > KM11. ** Do not extend the length of the flat cable too long! > > Stray capacitance between the wires can induce a voltage > in the wire next to it. I had that problem a few years ago. > The thing worked nice, but after a few months it died on me > and I could not figure out what went wrong at first. > With the oscilloscope the problems became visible: due to > crosstalk/induction between the wires, the signal voltage on > some wires went negative, more than -0.6 Volts. > TTL circuits really hate that! > > - Henk. > (with a busy weekend ahead...) From GOOI at oce.nl Fri Jul 12 04:39:00 2002 From: GOOI at oce.nl (Gooijen H) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 Message-ID: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB8@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Ok, many tips to check on this weekend. > Did you catch your washing machine;-) Just curious what the washing > machine has to do with checking your power supply voltage? The > voltages you want to check are the DC +5, +15, -15, etc. Also you > ought to check the ACLO and DCLO signals. I had a case where the > regulator board in my lower h7420a was asserting ACLO when in fact > all of the voltages were fine. I meant the power supply voltages at the secundary side of course. As Andreas says, when the washing machine runs, turning on any big PDP-11 blows the fuse. I have to reset all clock radios and the clock on the microwave oven. I definitely will check the DCLO and ACLO signals! I will use the scope also to check the +5V lines for any ripple. [.. test with diagnostic PROM on M9312 ..] > It's not clear to me _when_ PAUSE goes on here. Do you mean that when > you try to run the code from the boot ROM (i.e. when you press START) > then the PAUSE LED goes on? Or do you mean that the code runs correctly > but that even after running it you get a PAUSE when trying to access > the DL11-W? To clear things on the question from Tony, when I push the START button the PAUSE led goes on immediately. I will not get that far that I can try to access to the DL11-W again. I will swap the M9302 at the end of the backplane (it is there, I just forgot to mention it) with an M930. All slots that need a grant card according to the Field Maintenance Print Set (FMPS) have one installed. The FMPS shows G727 flip chips for one slot of the 4 slots per MASSBUS interface that not installed, and all UNIBUS slots at the end of the backplane. I had the same experience as Ethan did. When I removed the TU80 interface from my 11/34C the system hung. I inserted a double grant card G7273 and all was fine again. Have I nice weekend, - Henk. From rschaefe at gcfn.org Fri Jul 12 05:46:00 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Fw: Used Alpha's and Vax's Message-ID: <000501c22991$371c6640$ac469280@y5f3q8> respond to the original poster, please. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Bustamante" To: "'Robert Schaefer'" Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2002 10:53 PM Subject: RE: Used Alpha's and Vax's > Feel free to pass this on. The 3100's are 3100-20 & 3100-80. Their > availabilty > TBD. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Schaefer [mailto:rschaefe@gcfn.org] > Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2002 4:34 AM > To: ACBustamante@bigfoot.com > Subject: Re: Used Alpha's and Vax's > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Andy Bustamante" > To: "'Robert Schaefer'" > Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2002 03:40 AM > Subject: RE: Used Alpha's and Vax's > > > > I'm in San Diego CA. The VAX includes 2 HSZ50's assorted 2 GB disks. > I > > can > > check tomorrow if you're interested. We're shopping it around. Our > > office is moving > > and I won't have space for this beast. Pity, it makes a bang up > > web server. > > I'm in Columbus, Ohio. :( If you like, I can pass it along to the > classiccmp mailing list. > > Bob > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Robert Schaefer [mailto:rschaefe@gcfn.org] > > Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2002 6:29 PM > > To: acbustamante@bigfoot.com > > Subject: Re: Used Alpha's and Vax's > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Andy Bustamante" > > Newsgroups: comp.os.vms > > Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2002 07:03 PM > > Subject: Re: Used Alpha's and Vax's > > > > > > > We will have several VAX 3100's available in the next few months, > and > > have > > a > > > VAX 7000-730 (3 CPU) we're retiring. Any interrest? > > > > Where are you located? > > > > > > > > The 7000 is my (internal) web server, formerly a customer system. > > > -- > > > > > > Andy Bustamante > > > > Bob > > > > > remove the ascii-95's to reply by e-mail > > > > > > > > > > > > "David J. Dachtera" wrote in message > > > news:3D2B9156.508C17F6@fsi.net... > > > > Jim Rizzolo wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I am trying to locate used OpenVMS systems (Alpha and VAX). Does > > > > > anyone know of any websites where I can find sellers? Thank > you. > > > > > > > > A few listings at: > > > > > > > > http://www.djesys.com/vms/hobbyist/support.html > > > > http://www.djesys.com/vms/hobbyist/support.html#hardware > > > > > > > > -- > > > > David J. Dachtera > > > > dba DJE Systems > > > > http://www.djesys.com/ > > > > > > > > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: > > > > http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ > > > > > > > > > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 12 05:55:00 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: i432 In-Reply-To: <200207111730.KAA12935@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020712065252.5047d1ac@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Dwight, A 432 is a very unusual find! Can you post a picture of the board and the chip? Eric Smith is the expert on those things AFIK. Joe At 10:30 AM 7/11/02 -0700, you wrote: >Hi > It looks like I made a nice find. I bought an >Intel 200 series expansion box, mainly because it >had the two card set for the Intel double density. >(Intel's double density is not compatible with others.) > There was another board in the chassis that I >didn't even look at much. I just assumed it was >some ICE board without the dongle so I didn't >give it much thought. I then noticed that the >extraction ear said 432IP. Looking closer, it >seems to be a 432 card with a 432 chip. It is >a 432/602 board. > I nice find. Now, I know that information on >these are rare but I thought I'd ask, does anyone >have any of the software to run one of these? >Thanks >Dwight > > > From uban at ubanproductions.com Fri Jul 12 07:13:00 2002 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: KM-11 (was RE: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70) In-Reply-To: <20020712061736.25202.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> References: <5.1.1.6.0.20020711170241.01b7ddc0@ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20020712071231.01b55f88@ubanproductions.com> At 11:17 PM 7/11/2002 -0700, you wrote: >--- Tom Uban wrote: > > At 02:42 PM 7/11/2002 -0700, you wrote: > > > > >BTW, how much did that KM-11 replica PCB cost? > > > > I looked it up and it was $130 for two boards back in 10/2000. > >That's not bad, considering what we used to pay for setup charges. >Still, that's more than I can spring for a toy. > > > I used to do point to point work, but now I find that my time > > is more valuable when the design has more than a few components. > >Understood. I spent way too many hours on this: > >http://www.penguincentral.com/retrocomputing/retrogaming/scoreboard.html > >-ethan Nice! --tom From DAW at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu Fri Jul 12 10:07:01 2002 From: DAW at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: OT: Need help setting up Pine... Message-ID: <9011A52E011ED311B4280004AC1BA61501467A90@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu> Please reply directly to me... Since there are a few of you here using Pine, maybe someone can give me a little hand. :) When I tried to send a test message, I got a No Relaying message. BTW, it's an Exchange 5.5 e-mail server I'm trying to use. -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1 - Darwin Kernel Version 5 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash From uban at ubanproductions.com Fri Jul 12 11:00:00 2002 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB2@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20020712101757.01b63180@ubanproductions.com> At 08:27 AM 7/12/2002 +0200, you wrote: >Unfortunately, this installed PSU does not solve the problem. >I still have the PAUSE led on with any access to 1777756x (read/write). Have you tried to read from the bootstrap ROM locations? Since the bootstrap is at the front of the bus, it might give you some insight if it works properly and the DL11 at the rear of the bus does not. >My new question. >When you have an 11/70 without the floating point boards and you want >to install the FP option, you do the following things. >- carefully slide the 4 FP boards in the correct position, > in the slots 2-3-4-5. >- install an H744 in the upper power supply, position A > (nearest to the transformer compartment) and connect it to P9. >- is there something else you shuld do ? Usually, there are some jumpers on the main CPU boards which will have to change when an option such as FP is installed or removed. For instance, if you look at your M8132 (IR DECODE & COND CODES IRC) board, you will see that Jumper W1 should be installed if the FP is installed (and removed otherwise). There may be other jumpers and or switches which should be changed when installing/removing the FP, you will have to do some research, but you should be able to tell if the FP was originally installed (or not) based on the one jumper on M8132. --tom >TIA, >- Henk. From curt at atari-history.com Fri Jul 12 11:25:00 2002 From: curt at atari-history.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Conquest??? References: <20020707200808.69330.qmail@web10303.mail.yahoo.com> <3D28A486.23D62A06@rain.org> <008801c22634$f50537f0$01000001@cvendel> <3D29BABF.6090200@arrl.net> <4.3.2.7.2.20020711155614.0242e8b0@mail.azstarnet.com> Message-ID: <00f801c229c0$44091220$01000001@cvendel> I found a few sites with the Unix of Conquest for Solaris, Linux and BSD so I'm going to try it out and see if it comes close enough, otherwise I'll keep digging around until I find the VMS version, thanks! Curt ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gordon Zaft" To: Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2002 6:58 PM Subject: Re: Conquest??? > > At 06:57 PM 7/8/2002 -0400, you wrote: > >[snip] > >So, the question here is, has anyone else ever played this game and does > >anyone know where I can find it to load onto a 3100 ??? > > Yes, Conquest was basically a VMS version of the great Plato game, > Empire (or =empire if you are a purist). I used to have a tarball with the > source but I have no idea where it is anymore, alas. I assume you google'd > a bit? You might do a usenet archive search. > > GZ > > From jrkeys at concentric.net Fri Jul 12 12:00:01 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Fw: This weks finds for the museum Message-ID: <007c01c229c5$5106a000$fe000240@oemcomputer> fyi ----- Original Message ----- From: Keys To: cctech@classiccmp Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 11:56 AM Subject: This weks finds for the museum A little slow this week as the funds get lower for the collection, but I was able to get the following items. 1. AS/400 9406 rack unit with new unopened software (OS) on 8mm tape, 8 manuals, 9337 RAB RAID Level 5 unit, 9337 controller unit, and much more for me document later. (cost was $7.50 + 5% at auction) 2. PowerServer 570 unit almost complete. 3. NES Gyromite cartridge for R.O.B. the robot, still looking for the Stack-up cartridge. 4. PCOM Honeywell 19" monitor color (made by IBM). 5. Laird 1450 character generator. 6. iomega cartridge disk subsystem CDS-PC/20. 7. Mac Performa 580CD. 8. Tandy 128K Color computer 3. 9. Book called ENIAC by Scott McCartney. 10. IBM 3516 model 7VD DASD hot swap storage expansion enclosure. 11. IBM 3151 terminal was free. 12.imapro 4x5 module (film recorder) QCR-35 with 2 other large pieces, will be traded or selling this item. Works with PC's or Mac's. Built around 1990. Got everything above and more for about $45 and a mad wife. :-( It took 4 of us to load the 9406 on my van at the auction site and then the guy next to me at the warehouse complex used his forklift to upright the unit so we could push it into the warehouse. I had already pushed it off my van onto the ground, dumb move. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020712/52c6d455/attachment.html From tothwolf at concentric.net Fri Jul 12 12:11:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: <33707.64.169.63.74.1026455376.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 11 Jul 2002, Eric Smith wrote: > Strange, a 10baseT/100baseT Ethernet interface should be able > withstand telephone voltages (even ringing), even if the jack has them > wired to the data pairs. Even if it sustained damage, there should > not have been any sparks. Many of those commercial/digital phone systems often have 24VAC or something similar available to power the phone on one of the pairs. Most of them also have quite a bit of current available. I've seen a few cable pair testers loose their magic smoke due to those types of phone systems. -Toth From bqt at update.uu.se Fri Jul 12 12:41:01 2002 From: bqt at update.uu.se (Johnny Billquist) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: 11/70 problems... In-Reply-To: <20020712170004.25430.58620.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: [...] > Unfortunately, this installed PSU does not solve the problem. > I still have the PAUSE led on with any access to 1777756x (read/write). [...] > Ok, many tips to check on this weekend. > > > Did you catch your washing machine;-) Just curious what the washing > > machine has to do with checking your power supply voltage? The > > voltages you want to check are the DC +5, +15, -15, etc. Also you > > ought to check the ACLO and DCLO signals. I had a case where the > > regulator board in my lower h7420a was asserting ACLO when in fact > > all of the voltages were fine. > > I meant the power supply voltages at the secundary side of course. > As Andreas says, when the washing machine runs, turning on any big > PDP-11 blows the fuse. I have to reset all clock radios and the clock > on the microwave oven. > > I definitely will check the DCLO and ACLO signals! > I will use the scope also to check the +5V lines for any ripple. Time for a reality check now! The machine runs! DCLO and ACLO is not the problem. What is the problem is a total hang when trying to access the DL11. The question is if he can access the I/O page at all. I haven't heard any confirmation if it is possible to read from the bootstrap code locations. They are also in the I/O page, and thus is a very interesting test. PAUSE goes on when you start boot, but that don't tell us enough. The boot roms don't access the console, so we atleast know that the DL11 isn't the only problem. I suspect you have problems accessing the I/O page in general. But can you access the MMU registers, and other processor registers at the I/O page? And still, NPR might be the problem. If I remember correctly, a broken NPR might show up just like this. The same goes for the BG lines. Remove and reinsert the grant cards, check the I/O page more. You have access to memory, and can run programs, so let's skip the stuff that we know is working correctly. Johnny Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt@update.uu.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol From pcw at mesanet.com Fri Jul 12 12:44:01 2002 From: pcw at mesanet.com (Peter C. Wallace) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Tothwolf wrote: > On Thu, 11 Jul 2002, Eric Smith wrote: > > > Strange, a 10baseT/100baseT Ethernet interface should be able > > withstand telephone voltages (even ringing), even if the jack has them > > wired to the data pairs. Even if it sustained damage, there should > > not have been any sparks. > > Many of those commercial/digital phone systems often have 24VAC or > something similar available to power the phone on one of the pairs. Most > of them also have quite a bit of current available. I've seen a few cable > pair testers loose their magic smoke due to those types of phone systems. > > -Toth > > 100BT Ethernet coupling transformers should easily be able to withstand most faults from a telephone line, since they typically have less than .2 Ohms dc resistance. That makes it hard to dissipate much power in the transformer unless you have much more than 1A available. 10BT transformers with a common mode choke are around 1 ohm so your 24 vac power would probably damage them, though normal telephone line current would not... As far as damaging the rest of the circuitry goes that depends on whether the PHY can take the 48V ~1 usec spikes resulting from connection the isolation transformer input to one (or many) 48V steps as the connectors are mated... Peter Wallace From curt at atari-history.com Fri Jul 12 12:48:01 2002 From: curt at atari-history.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? References: Message-ID: <015f01c229cb$f891a670$01000001@cvendel> I'm looking for anyone that worked at Digital Research in 83-85 that may have been part of the "Monterey Group" that ported GEM over to the Atari ST computers? I'm also looking for anyone from DRI that accompanied Gary Kildall up to Grass Valley, CA. to Cyan Engineering's labs. They were owned by Atari under Warner Comm. From what I've been told Gary Kildall and a group of DRI engineers travelled up to Grass Valley to disconnect and remove the VAX 11/730 or 750, not sure which. It was payment from Atari to DRI for the GEM porting work. I've gotten one person's account, but I need to confirm this with a 2nd witness before I can publish this onto the atarimuseum.com website as fact, thanks. Curt From foo at siconic.com Fri Jul 12 12:55:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Ectomic Group ASPS Process Controller? Message-ID: Some guy contacted me wanting information about a series of equipment that controlled a "huge circular saw used for cutting huge quantities of wood". I'm looking for any information on the following: ASPS Process Controller ASPS Executive Controller ASPS Schedule Controller ASPS Monitor Controller The labels he found indicate it was made by Ectomic Group out of Arlington, Texas. Along with these large racks are two Teletype ASR-33's. Apparently this is from the 1970s. My guess is that this is a process controller that may well be based on some mini-computer like a DEC or other mini-computer of the day. The guy who relayed this information to me is basically computer illiterate, so he probably can't be of any help to identify anything beyond what he already gave me. He's located near St. Louis in Pacific, Missouri. He is tasked by the owner of the equipment with trying to sell it to get the highest amount possible for it. I told him at best, if anything, to expect someone to come and take it away at their cost. He also has a Wang computer that is the "size of a dishwasher" that is separate from the lot above. Merle? (Sorry, no model number.) If someone thinks these things are worth saving, let me know and I'll put you in touch. My guess is that the guy will try to extract some cash from you for it, but that's up for any potential rescuer to deal with. An offer of scrap value should do it. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From doc at mdrconsult.com Fri Jul 12 13:07:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Fw: This weks finds for the museum In-Reply-To: <007c01c229c5$5106a000$fe000240@oemcomputer> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Keys wrote: > 2. PowerServer 570 unit almost complete. I have almost anything that box might need - body panels, expansion cards, drive sleds, maybe a working floppy. Anything except RAM boards and, as Pat Finnegan knows, a working SCSI cable (much harder than it sounds to replace) Doc From pete at dunnington.u-net.com Fri Jul 12 13:12:01 2002 From: pete at dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: Gooijen H "RE: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70" (Jul 12, 8:27) References: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB2@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Message-ID: <10207121912.ZM12087@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> On Jul 12, 8:27, Gooijen H wrote: > To my shame I see that the H744 in position A is in the "remote-70" > and position A in the "console-70" is empty! Well, obviously the H744 isn't the problem, but it looks like you're one short. I have a spare, and I'll be seeing Ed in 2/3 weeks. Do you want it? -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York From uban at ubanproductions.com Fri Jul 12 13:25:01 2002 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <10207121912.ZM12087@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> References: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB2@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20020712132231.01a99d80@ubanproductions.com> Actually, each of the two h7420a power supply racks has one open slot in a normal system. Not sure if Henk is missing a supply or not. --tom At 06:12 PM 7/12/2002 +0000, you wrote: >On Jul 12, 8:27, Gooijen H wrote: > > > To my shame I see that the H744 in position A is in the "remote-70" > > and position A in the "console-70" is empty! > >Well, obviously the H744 isn't the problem, but it looks like you're one >short. I have a spare, and I'll be seeing Ed in 2/3 weeks. Do you want it? > >-- >Pete Peter Turnbull > Network Manager > University of York From Antonio.Carlini at riverstonenet.com Fri Jul 12 13:40:01 2002 From: Antonio.Carlini at riverstonenet.com (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Conquest??? Message-ID: There was a game called Empire which had a VMS incarnation (start with one city, build armies, conquer the world, ASCII only). If that's what you are looking for, I'll see if I can dig it out. Antonio > -----Original Message----- > From: Curt Vendel [SMTP:curt@atari-history.com] > Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 5:22 PM > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: Conquest??? > > I found a few sites with the Unix of Conquest for Solaris, Linux and BSD so > I'm going to try it out and see if it comes close enough, otherwise I'll > keep digging around until I find the VMS version, thanks! > > > > Curt > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Gordon Zaft" > To: > Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2002 6:58 PM > Subject: Re: Conquest??? > > > > > > At 06:57 PM 7/8/2002 -0400, you wrote: > > >[snip] > > >So, the question here is, has anyone else ever played this game and does > > >anyone know where I can find it to load onto a 3100 ??? > > > > Yes, Conquest was basically a VMS version of the great Plato > game, > > Empire (or =empire if you are a purist). I used to have a tarball with > the > > source but I have no idea where it is anymore, alas. I assume you > google'd > > a bit? You might do a usenet archive search. > > > > GZ > > > > > From bernd at kopriva.de Fri Jul 12 13:54:00 2002 From: bernd at kopriva.de (Bernd Kopriva) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: OS/2 for PowerPC Message-ID: <17T5XQ-20NKVcC@fmrl03.sul.t-online.com> Hi, does anyone have that OS ? I've got a Motorola PowerStack, which i want to use with something more exotic than Linux or AIX .... ... OS/2 PPC should run, but i've never seen it ... Is there any other (exotic) OS available for that machine ? Thanks Bernd Bernd Kopriva Phone: ++49-7195-179452 Weilerstr. 24 E-Mail: bernd@kopriva.de D-71397 Leutenbach Germany From doc at mdrconsult.com Fri Jul 12 14:11:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: OS/2 for PowerPC In-Reply-To: <17T5XQ-20NKVcC@fmrl03.sul.t-online.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Bernd Kopriva wrote: > Hi, > does anyone have that OS ? > > I've got a Motorola PowerStack, which i want to use with something more exotic > than Linux or AIX .... > ... OS/2 PPC should run, but i've never seen it ... Hey, does that run standard 36-bit parity SIMMs, or the not-quite-standard SIMMs the IBM 7248-1xx, 40P and 42T use? Doc From bernd at kopriva.de Fri Jul 12 14:22:00 2002 From: bernd at kopriva.de (Bernd Kopriva) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: OS/2 for PowerPC In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <17T5yv-2E36I4C@fmrl03.sul.t-online.com> Hi Doc, the manual says, that you can run either no-parity, parity or ECC FPM Simms ... ... i only tested no-parity and parity simms (32 MB), and both work. BTW: the no-parity Simms are called unprotected Simm Modules in the manual, and are listed as XX * 36, but this seems to be an error, as 'normal' XX * 32 Simms will do the job ! I've tried some Kingston KTC1481/64 modules as well (64 MB parity), but for these, only 32 MB will be detected ... Bernd On Fri, 12 Jul 2002 14:09:55 -0500 (CDT), Doc Shipley wrote: >On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Bernd Kopriva wrote: > >> Hi, >> does anyone have that OS ? >> >> I've got a Motorola PowerStack, which i want to use with something more exotic >> than Linux or AIX .... >> ... OS/2 PPC should run, but i've never seen it ... > > Hey, does that run standard 36-bit parity SIMMs, or the >not-quite-standard SIMMs the IBM 7248-1xx, 40P and 42T use? > > Doc > Bernd Kopriva Tel: 07195 / 179452 Weilerstr. 24 E-Mail : bernd@kopriva.de 71397 Leutenbach From curt at atari-history.com Fri Jul 12 14:48:00 2002 From: curt at atari-history.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Conquest??? References: Message-ID: <001601c229dc$c1972fd0$01000001@cvendel> Actually this is a Star Trek game involving ascii graphics on VT100 terminals, you would choose from Federation, Orion or Klingon ships. It was a really cool multi-user game, you could talk to the other players in real time and it got very addictive (until the Admin pulled it off the Vax cause it was killing it! :-) Curt ----- Original Message ----- From: "Antonio Carlini" To: Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 2:38 PM Subject: RE: Conquest??? > There was a game called Empire which had a VMS > incarnation (start with one city, build armies, > conquer the world, ASCII only). > > If that's what you are looking for, I'll see if I can dig it out. > > Antonio > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Curt Vendel [SMTP:curt@atari-history.com] > > Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 5:22 PM > > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > > Subject: Re: Conquest??? > > > > I found a few sites with the Unix of Conquest for Solaris, Linux and BSD so > > I'm going to try it out and see if it comes close enough, otherwise I'll > > keep digging around until I find the VMS version, thanks! > > > > > > > > Curt > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Gordon Zaft" > > To: > > Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2002 6:58 PM > > Subject: Re: Conquest??? > > > > > > > > > > At 06:57 PM 7/8/2002 -0400, you wrote: > > > >[snip] > > > >So, the question here is, has anyone else ever played this game and does > > > >anyone know where I can find it to load onto a 3100 ??? > > > > > > Yes, Conquest was basically a VMS version of the great Plato > > game, > > > Empire (or =empire if you are a purist). I used to have a tarball with > > the > > > source but I have no idea where it is anymore, alas. I assume you > > google'd > > > a bit? You might do a usenet archive search. > > > > > > GZ > > > > > > > > From doc at mdrconsult.com Fri Jul 12 15:09:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: OS/2 for PowerPC In-Reply-To: <17T5yv-2E36I4C@fmrl03.sul.t-online.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Bernd Kopriva wrote: > Hi Doc, > the manual says, that you can run either no-parity, parity or ECC FPM Simms ... > ... i only tested no-parity and parity simms (32 MB), and both work. > > BTW: the no-parity Simms are called unprotected Simm Modules in the manual, > and are listed as XX * 36, but this seems to be an error, as 'normal' XX * 32 Simms will do the job ! Thanks. That's *very* cool. I have a whole bag of 32-bit EDO 32M SIMMs that have been pretty useless till now. I was going to trade them in for 64M parity for my Indigo2, but at a 6 to 1 trade rate, I think I'll populate the PowerStack instead. I'm assuming it'll run AIX 4.3.x without trouble? Or do I need a special version, like the Apple Network Servers did? Doc From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 12 15:13:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Empire for VMS (was RE: Conquest???) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020712201148.92006.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> --- Antonio Carlini wrote: > There was a game called Empire which had a VMS > incarnation (start with one city, build armies, > conquer the world, ASCII only). > > If that's what you are looking for, I'll see if I can dig it out. I used to play that game for hours and hours. The thing that saved me was that my boss played it more than me. :-) My recollection is that it was freely available as a binary, but that the FORTRAN source was kept by the developer. Did that change? Are FORTRAN sources now available? -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 12 15:15:56 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: non DEC drives (was: DEC 350) In-Reply-To: <33624.64.169.63.74.1026452258.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <20020712201002.45000.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> --- Eric Smith wrote: > Gordon Zaft wrote: > > As far as I know, the RD54 (aka Maxtor something or other, or > > Priam 519, or other similar) was the largest MFM drive ever made. > > Not even close. For example, the Fujitsu Eagle (M2351) had a capacity > of 380 MB, vs. 150 MB for the Maxtor XT-2190. There was a Fuji MFM drive also called the Eagle? When I think of an "Eagle", I think of the ~10" platter, 10.5" tall, 19" wide SMD drive that clocks in around 400MB - I have several of them, and some SI9900 controllers with Massbus cards. > I'm pretty sure there were other drives using MFM had even higher > capacity. I wouldn't claim that the XT2190 was the absolute largest capacity MFM drive, but it's pretty close, ISTR. Right about the time that 16 heads by 1024 cyls was about the largest you could get is when ESDI began to take over the large end of the small computer market and IDE began to take over the small end. > Of course, modern drives use RLL rather than MFM because they can get > 50-100% better data density... And they use ZBR to pack more data into > the outer cyclinders, whereas MFM drives generally used the same data > rate on all cylinders. Modern drives do indeed use all those tricks (and some older drives, too; the Commodore 1541 has 4 bit densities to pack a variable number of sectors per track depending on the physical track length at a given radius). The important thing is to not violate the linear bit density of the media. Once you have that figured out, you can add another sector every few tracks. I am fairly certain that all MFM drives use a clocked data rate that ensures the bits on the inner tracks aren't too close together for the capabilities of the media and heads to discriminate. It's easier to build a disk controller when you don't have to calculate on the fly where your sector might be, but it's a poor use of the disk from a magnetic domain standpoint. -ethan > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From Antonio.Carlini at riverstonenet.com Fri Jul 12 15:19:00 2002 From: Antonio.Carlini at riverstonenet.com (Antonio Carlini) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Conquest??? Message-ID: I have a vague recollection of a game that might fit the bill - assuming it's sources still bore traces of having travelled through RSX at some stage. I'll have to see if I still have my old tapes kicking around the attic - it's about time I migrated them all to CD anyway. Antonio From bernd at kopriva.de Fri Jul 12 15:22:00 2002 From: bernd at kopriva.de (Bernd Kopriva) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: OS/2 for PowerPC In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <17T6u2-1lvRAWC@fmrl03.sul.t-online.com> Hi Doc, : > I'm assuming it'll run AIX 4.3.x without trouble? Or do I >need a special version, like the Apple Network Servers did? > I got an AIX 4.1 version with the system (which i haven't installed until now) ... ... the CD's are named AIX 4.1 on Powerstack and have the Motorola labels ... > Doc > Bernd Bernd Kopriva Phone: ++49-7195-179452 Weilerstr. 24 E-Mail: bernd@kopriva.de D-71397 Leutenbach Germany From pat at purdueriots.com Fri Jul 12 16:35:01 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: semi-OT Message-ID: I've 'rescued' a stack of HM6116LP-3 SRAM's from a circuit board. Apart from the fact that they're 2Kx8 SRAM's, I haven't been able to find any useful datasheets with both pinouts and timing diagrams for the chips. By any chance, does anyone have one laying around in PDF or that they'd be willing to scan? Minimally, I'd like to know the pinout, basic timing requirements, max clock speed, and data retention voltage. I've also removed an Intel P8291A, which has been just as hard to find information on, anything would be useful. Thanks! -- Pat From jrkeys at concentric.net Fri Jul 12 17:05:00 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: [CCTECH]This weks finds for the museum Message-ID: <006a01c229c5$0faa2460$fe000240@oemcomputer> A little slow this week as the funds get lower for the collection, but I was able to get the following items. 1. AS/400 9406 rack unit with new unopened software (OS) on 8mm tape, 8 manuals, 9337 RAB RAID Level 5 unit, 9337 controller unit, and much more for me document later. (cost was $7.50 + 5% at auction) 2. PowerServer 570 unit almost complete. 3. NES Gyromite cartridge for R.O.B. the robot, still looking for the Stack-up cartridge. 4. PCOM Honeywell 19" monitor color (made by IBM). 5. Laird 1450 character generator. 6. iomega cartridge disk subsystem CDS-PC/20. 7. Mac Performa 580CD. 8. Tandy 128K Color computer 3. 9. Book called ENIAC by Scott McCartney. 10. IBM 3516 model 7VD DASD hot swap storage expansion enclosure. 11. IBM 3151 terminal was free. 12.imapro 4x5 module (film recorder) QCR-35 with 2 other large pieces, will be traded or selling this item. Works with PC's or Mac's. Built around 1990. Got everything above and more for about $45 and a mad wife. :-( It took 4 of us to load the 9406 on my van at the auction site and then the guy next to me at the warehouse complex used his forklift to upright the unit so we could push it into the warehouse. I had already pushed it off my van onto the ground, dumb move. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020712/0b9cf202/attachment.html From at258 at osfn.org Fri Jul 12 17:08:00 2002 From: at258 at osfn.org (Merle K. Peirce) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Ectomic Group ASPS Process Controller? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Wang? Sounds like a first generation VS cabinet. Likely to be a VS-45, but could be a VS-85. On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Sellam Ismail wrote: > > Some guy contacted me wanting information about a series of equipment > that controlled a "huge circular saw used for cutting huge quantities of > wood". > > I'm looking for any information on the following: > > ASPS Process Controller > ASPS Executive Controller > ASPS Schedule Controller > ASPS Monitor Controller > > The labels he found indicate it was made by Ectomic Group out of > Arlington, Texas. > > Along with these large racks are two Teletype ASR-33's. > > Apparently this is from the 1970s. My guess is that this is a process > controller that may well be based on some mini-computer like a DEC or > other mini-computer of the day. > > The guy who relayed this information to me is basically computer > illiterate, so he probably can't be of any help to identify anything > beyond what he already gave me. > > He's located near St. Louis in Pacific, Missouri. He is tasked by the > owner of the equipment with trying to sell it to get the highest amount > possible for it. I told him at best, if anything, to expect someone to > come and take it away at their cost. > > He also has a Wang computer that is the "size of a dishwasher" that is > separate from the lot above. Merle? (Sorry, no model number.) > > If someone thinks these things are worth saving, let me know and I'll put > you in touch. My guess is that the guy will try to extract some cash from > you for it, but that's up for any potential rescuer to deal with. An > offer of scrap value should do it. > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > > M. K. Peirce Rhode Island Computer Museum, Inc. Shady Lea, Rhode Island "Casta est quam nemo rogavit." - Ovid From jrkeys at concentric.net Fri Jul 12 17:47:01 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Fw: This weks finds for the museum References: Message-ID: <00df01c229f5$caacbe00$fe000240@oemcomputer> Great I will put together a list of need items and contact you. Thanks ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doc Shipley" To: "cctalk@classiccmp" Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 1:05 PM Subject: Re: Fw: This weks finds for the museum > On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Keys wrote: > > > 2. PowerServer 570 unit almost complete. > > I have almost anything that box might need - body panels, expansion > cards, drive sleds, maybe a working floppy. Anything except RAM boards > and, as Pat Finnegan knows, a working SCSI cable (much harder than it > sounds to replace) > > Doc > > From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Fri Jul 12 18:03:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB8@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> from "Gooijen H" at Jul 12, 2 11:33:39 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1088 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020712/7df61630/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Fri Jul 12 18:06:05 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EB2@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> from "Gooijen H" at Jul 12, 2 08:27:00 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 770 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020712/06e1b31a/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Fri Jul 12 18:10:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: semi-OT In-Reply-To: from "Patrick Finnegan" at Jul 12, 2 11:40:23 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2518 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020712/b8485e88/attachment.ksh From tothwolf at concentric.net Fri Jul 12 18:27:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: OT: MECOS frequency device ? In-Reply-To: <3D2DCAC9.13918.22834D1D@localhost> Message-ID: On Thu, 11 Jul 2002, Lawrence Walker wrote: > Likely way off topic, but I acquired some sort of frequency device in > an auction junk box. It's a well machined device made by MECOS, made > in W.Germant. It's about 2" square by 1/2" powered by a Li. battery > and has micro-switches labelled 3 hz, 7.8 hz, 14.0 hz and a small led > that flashes at the selected frequency. Anyone have any idea what it > might be ? > > A search turned up that MECOS makes Active Magnetic Bearings and > control boards and programs. Could this be some sort of timing device used for calibrating the speed of something? Is the led separate from the chassis? -Toth From allain at panix.com Fri Jul 12 18:41:01 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? References: <015f01c229cb$f891a670$01000001@cvendel> Message-ID: <006601c229fc$dda6f8c0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> > I'm also looking for anyone from DRI that accompanied Gary Kildall > up to Grass Valley, CA. to Cyan Engineering's labs... For that matter I'm intertested in just about Any stories on DRI, from any period. There aren't too many books published on them that I've seen, and no book published _entirely_ on the subject of DRI. and not one entry in Levy's 'Hackers', geesh. John A. From jim at jkearney.com Fri Jul 12 19:11:00 2002 From: jim at jkearney.com (Jim Kearney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:03 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? References: <015f01c229cb$f891a670$01000001@cvendel> Message-ID: <012f01c22a01$8e9fb3c0$1301090a@xpace.net> I wasn't an employee, but I worked with the GEM developers a bit in '85 while writing a GEM app. I still have a list of names in my Rolodex that you might be able to follow up on: Raimund Pohl, Germany Tony Harris, UK Rob LaTulipe, US Don Heiskell, US Lee Lorenzen, US Chris Lusby-Taylor, UK While googling for some of those names, I came across http://www.maxframe.com/DREMAIL1.HTM; most of these people have email addresses listed there. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Curt Vendel" To: Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 1:45 PM Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? > I'm looking for anyone that worked at Digital Research in 83-85 that may > have been part of the "Monterey Group" that ported GEM over to the Atari ST > computers? From curt at atari-history.com Fri Jul 12 19:36:00 2002 From: curt at atari-history.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? References: <015f01c229cb$f891a670$01000001@cvendel> <012f01c22a01$8e9fb3c0$1301090a@xpace.net> Message-ID: <001701c22a04$f849b110$01000001@cvendel> Jim, This is great, that you very much... this is a big help and I agree with John... I think it is WAY overdue to read an in-depth book on the history of Digital "Galactic" Research and Gary Kildall... Bill Gates should foot the bill, he owes all his wealth and fame to Gary! Curt ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Kearney" To: Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 8:09 PM Subject: Re: Any DRI employees out there??? > I wasn't an employee, but I worked with the GEM developers a bit in '85 > while writing a GEM app. I still have a list of names in my Rolodex that > you might be able to follow up on: > > Raimund Pohl, Germany > Tony Harris, UK > Rob LaTulipe, US > Don Heiskell, US > Lee Lorenzen, US > Chris Lusby-Taylor, UK > > While googling for some of those names, I came across > http://www.maxframe.com/DREMAIL1.HTM; most of these people have email > addresses listed there. > > Jim > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Curt Vendel" > To: > Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 1:45 PM > Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? > > > > I'm looking for anyone that worked at Digital Research in 83-85 that may > > have been part of the "Monterey Group" that ported GEM over to the Atari > ST > > computers? > > From jim at jkearney.com Fri Jul 12 20:01:00 2002 From: jim at jkearney.com (Jim Kearney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? References: <015f01c229cb$f891a670$01000001@cvendel> <012f01c22a01$8e9fb3c0$1301090a@xpace.net> <001701c22a04$f849b110$01000001@cvendel> Message-ID: <015c01c22a08$a2ca7f40$1301090a@xpace.net> >From: "Curt Vendel" > Jim, > > This is great, that you very much... this is a big help and I agree with > John... I think it is WAY overdue to read an in-depth book on the history > of Digital "Galactic" Research and Gary Kildall... Bill Gates should foot > the bill, he owes all his wealth and fame to Gary! You're welcome. Thinking back, I'm not sure which of those people were sales or application engineers and which were developers. I'm pretty sure than Lee Lorenzen was the GEM lead developer. Jim From allain at panix.com Fri Jul 12 20:05:00 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? References: <015f01c229cb$f891a670$01000001@cvendel> <012f01c22a01$8e9fb3c0$1301090a@xpace.net> Message-ID: <003f01c22a08$d57c6700$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> > While googling for some of those names, I came > across http://www.maxframe.com/DREMAIL1.HTM ... Yeow! Great site, especially the memorials, http://www.maxframe.com/DR.HTM . Thanks Jim! John A. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 12 20:08:00 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: NorPak??? Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020712191029.0ec77b3e@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Today I picked up some modules marked with the Square D logo and the name NorPak on them along with Class 8853 and Type TO-7. The modules are about 2 1/2" square and about 2" high and have two symbols of Op_Amps on them along with three ten contact terminal strips. The terminals have holes for some kind of small pins to plug into them. Next to the Op-Amp symbols they're marked "250 Ma DC Amplifier (2)". They look like plug-in modules for some kind of electronic training device. Is anyone familar with these?? Google didn't turn up anything. Joe From foo at siconic.com Fri Jul 12 20:32:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? In-Reply-To: <001701c22a04$f849b110$01000001@cvendel> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Curt Vendel wrote: > of Digital "Galactic" Research and Gary Kildall... Bill Gates should foot Intergalactic Digital Research I third the motion...we need a book on DRI and Kildall. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From curt at atari-history.com Fri Jul 12 20:49:00 2002 From: curt at atari-history.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? References: Message-ID: <005701c22a0f$1bf3be30$01000001@cvendel> and Gates should pay for it!!! ;-) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sellam Ismail" To: Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 9:27 PM Subject: Re: Any DRI employees out there??? > On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Curt Vendel wrote: > > > of Digital "Galactic" Research and Gary Kildall... Bill Gates should foot > > Intergalactic Digital Research > > I third the motion...we need a book on DRI and Kildall. > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > From eric at brouhaha.com Fri Jul 12 21:18:00 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <60925.209.66.107.17.1026526594.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> "Peter C. Wallace" wrote:wrote: > As far as damaging the rest of the circuitry goes that depends on > whether the PHY can take the 48V ~1 usec spikes resulting from > connection the isolation transformer input to one (or many) 48V steps > as the connectors are mated... A well-designed Ethernet card has some Zener diodes for protection against that. I suppose there are probably plenty of poorly designed cards out there, though. From mbg at TheWorld.com Fri Jul 12 21:22:00 2002 From: mbg at TheWorld.com (Megan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Conquest??? Message-ID: <200207130220.WAA15017301@shell.TheWorld.com> From eric at brouhaha.com Fri Jul 12 21:26:00 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: non DEC drives (was: DEC 350) In-Reply-To: <20020712201002.45000.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> References: <33624.64.169.63.74.1026452258.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> <20020712201002.45000.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <60963.209.66.107.17.1026527035.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Ethan Dicks wrote: > There was a Fuji MFM drive also called the Eagle? When I think of an > "Eagle", I think of the ~10" platter, 10.5" tall, 19" wide SMD > drive that clocks in around 400MB - I have several of them, and > some SI9900 controllers with Massbus cards. That's the one. Definitely MFM. Not an ST-506 interface, though, which I later realized is what this discussion is apparently about. > I wouldn't claim that the XT2190 was the absolute largest capacity MFM > drive, but it's pretty close, ISTR. Right about the time that 16 heads > by 1024 cyls was about the largest you could get is when > ESDI began to take over the large end of the small computer market and > IDE began to take over the small end. 1224 cylinders for the XT-2190. Some controllers couldn't handle that many; typically they were limited to 1024. From jrice at texoma.net Fri Jul 12 22:07:00 2002 From: jrice at texoma.net (James Rice) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: NorPak??? References: <3.0.6.16.20020712191029.0ec77b3e@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3D2F998B.1080406@texoma.net> As I recall, the NorPaks are an obsolete line of AC and DC motor drives that Square D produced in the mid to late '70's. The modules you have were used as sensor interface units to monitor motor current by way of current transformers or CT's. The NorPaks are so old that you probably would have to search long and far to even find a SqD employee who remembers them. They were kind of an orphan product even when new. I no longer have my copies of old SqD digests as a reference and there is nothing on the SqD site about them. SqD was bought in the early '90s by Group Schneider, a French company who proceded to dismantle all support for older products. Joe wrote: > Today I picked up some modules marked with the Square D logo and the name NorPak on them along with Class 8853 and Type TO-7. The modules are about 2 1/2" square and about 2" high and have two symbols of Op_Amps on them along with three ten contact terminal strips. The terminals have holes for some kind of small pins to plug into them. Next to the Op-Amp symbols they're marked "250 Ma DC Amplifier (2)". They look like plug-in modules for some kind of electronic training device. Is anyone familar with these?? Google didn't turn up anything. > > Joe > > > > > > From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 12 22:14:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? In-Reply-To: <003f01c22a08$d57c6700$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <20020713031235.74895.qmail@web10302.mail.yahoo.com> Check out, I think, "Accidental Empires" by Robert X. Cringely. ISTR there's some great stuff in there about DRI, among other companies (like Sierra OnLine, to name one) -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From cbajpai at attbi.com Fri Jul 12 22:35:00 2002 From: cbajpai at attbi.com (Chandra Bajpai) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? In-Reply-To: <015f01c229cb$f891a670$01000001@cvendel> Message-ID: <000001c22a1d$ed16ae60$177ba8c0@ne2.client2.attbi.com> I could put you in touch with a guy I used to work with Bill O'Connell. He was the VP of Sales for SystemSoft when I worked with him. I remember him telling me about Gary Kildall (personal stuff, an account of the IBM NDA issue etc.). I believe he was trying to sell DRI GEM to Leading Edge (clone mfg) where I was working....I was very impressed with GEM compared to Windows 1.0. Comparing the two was my first project back in 1985. He left DRI to go to Phoenix Technologies. -Chandra -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Curt Vendel Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 1:46 PM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? I'm looking for anyone that worked at Digital Research in 83-85 that may have been part of the "Monterey Group" that ported GEM over to the Atari ST computers? I'm also looking for anyone from DRI that accompanied Gary Kildall up to Grass Valley, CA. to Cyan Engineering's labs. They were owned by Atari under Warner Comm. From what I've been told Gary Kildall and a group of DRI engineers travelled up to Grass Valley to disconnect and remove the VAX 11/730 or 750, not sure which. It was payment from Atari to DRI for the GEM porting work. I've gotten one person's account, but I need to confirm this with a 2nd witness before I can publish this onto the atarimuseum.com website as fact, thanks. Curt From cisin at xenosoft.com Fri Jul 12 23:34:00 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? In-Reply-To: <005701c22a0f$1bf3be30$01000001@cvendel> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Curt Vendel wrote: > and Gates should pay for it!!! ;-) Do you really want billG involved in it?????? You won't be able to get his money without his participation! On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Sellam Ismail wrote: > Intergalactic Digital Research > I third the motion...we need a book on DRI and Kildall. If it will help anybody, I have an off the air tape of the Computer Chronicles eulogy of Kildall. It consists of 1/2 hour or so of interviews with his friends. NO real attempt to be objective about some issues. For example: how many people here think that it is appropriate business behavior (besides wanting to do it as a statement!) to blow off IBM "in order to deliver some documentation to Oakland". Yeah, right. The head of the company can't send a courier or employee, and has to miss the meeting in order to deliver documentation?!? NOTE: I have my students discuss whether it was the stupidest move evewr made, or the bravest. - "how many of you would like to thumb your nose at IBM and tell them to wait their turn in line?" "But would that be worth $40 billion to you?" -- Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin@xenosoft.com From foo at siconic.com Fri Jul 12 23:45:01 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > NOTE: I have my students discuss whether it was the stupidest move evewr > made, or the bravest. - "how many of you would like to thumb your nose at > IBM and tell them to wait their turn in line?" "But would that be worth > $40 billion to you?" Bill Gates kowtowing to IBM could have been seen as him selling himself to the Devil. But in fact it was more like Billy stealing the Devil's soul. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From cisin at xenosoft.com Fri Jul 12 23:56:00 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Sellam Ismail wrote: > Bill Gates kowtowing to IBM could have been seen as him selling himself to > the Devil. But in fact it was more like Billy stealing the Devil's soul. "Bill Gates and the Devil entered into negotiations. The devil is still trying to figure out how he ended up signing over his soul to Gates." - inaccurate quote from a John Dvorak column? From gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org Sat Jul 13 00:13:00 2002 From: gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org (Gunther Schadow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: VAX 11/750 boot probs - help appreciated References: <5.1.0.14.0.20020710214854.02798bf0@127.0.0.1> Message-ID: <3D2FB67D.5060202@aurora.regenstrief.org> Hi Matt, sorry I can't help you with the 750, but still want to congratulate you for having dug that thing out of that place :-). Did you get your devil's VAX yet? Did you get any further with the 11/780? good luck, -Gunther Matthew Sell wrote: > > Guys, > > > I've finished restoring a VAX 11/750 back to good physical condition, > and have (by trial and error) selected a boardset that "appears" to be > operating correctly as far as I can tell. > > The problem I'm having deals with booting from the integral TU-58. > > When the machine starts up (set to halt on boot) - it presents the > proper message: > > 00000000 16 > > Running the microdiagnostics gives no errors: > > %% > 00000000 01 > > However, attempting to boot from the TU-58 (B DDA0) results in the > following message: > > FFFFFFFE 05 > > The strange thing is that the diagnostic LED on the TU-58 controller > does not respond as I would think it should. From what I understand of > it's operation, the diag LED on the controller is supposed to blink once > when power is applied, pause while internal controller diagnostics are > performed, and the light constantly when diagnostics pass (on the > controller). On mine, the LED blinks, and then stays unlit. But, if I > disconnect P2 (the communications cable to the 750 CPU), this controller > diag LED operates as expected. > > This same behavior is observed if I remove L0004 in slot 4, then the > TU-58 controller behaves as I have read it should. > > This machine did have the remote diagnostics option installed, and I had > to move the TU-58 and console communication connectors to the alternate > position on the backplane as if the remote diagnostics option was not > installed. If I put these connectors back in the original positions (as > if the remote diag option was installed), the TU-58 controller passes > diagnostics, but the console does not respond (duh....). > > Could the L0004 be sending a garbled request to the TU-58 controller? I > have tried two different L0004 boards, both exhibit the same problem. I > have tried different memory controllers to test the boot PROMs, and > swapped (and removed!) the L0008s, etc. > > Erf. > > Any ideas? > > From what I understand of the installation of the remote diagnostics > module, the only modifications required were the installation of the > board (L0006), moving the TU-58 and console comm plugs to the left row > of backplane pins, and the installation of the modem. > > Could I be missing another modification that needs to be "undone" ? > > I really appreciate any hints or guidance. > > Thanks! > > > - Matt > > > > > > > > > > Matthew Sell > Programmer > On Time Support, Inc. > www.ontimesupport.com > (281) 296-6066 > > Join the Metrology Software discussion group METLIST! > http://www.ontimesupport.com/subscribe_t&c.html > . > > > "One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad > "Ein Volk, Ein Reich, Ein Fuhrer" - Adolf Hitler > > Many thanks for this tagline to a fellow RGVAC'er... > -- Gunther Schadow, M.D., Ph.D. gschadow@regenstrief.org Medical Information Scientist Regenstrief Institute for Health Care Adjunct Assistant Professor Indiana University School of Medicine tel:1(317)630-7960 http://aurora.regenstrief.org From gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org Sat Jul 13 00:17:01 2002 From: gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org (Gunther Schadow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: IBM PC 5150 rescue in Central Indiana References: <20020709192123.87364.qmail@web10308.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3D2FB743.1070508@aurora.regenstrief.org> Hi Scott, I am in Indianapolis, so I guess I should resue this if you want. Where are you exactly? I'm on the North side of town and work downtown. thanks, -Gunther Ethan Dicks wrote: > I was contacted by a fellow about a 64K 5150 that seems to have the > older 16K-64K motherboard, with all the trimmings... his messages > follow. Contact him directly, not me. He is moving and needs > this picked up by this weekend or it goes to Goodwill or the dumpster. > > I _have_ checked with him. Pick-up is OK. First come, first served. > > -ethan > > --- > > JESMason@aol.com > > I have an original IBM-PC (64K, 2-drive, cassette port model hardwired > with serial # sticker deteriorated ending in 9248(?) complete with an > Epson FX85 printer, Zenith monitor (the IBM monitor expired 2 months after > purchase) and software including Wordstar, VisiCalc, DOS1.1, and all > manuals in original binders and cases and most original IBM software > diskettes. > > I am moving in one week (7/16) and just want to put this with someone who > would appreciate its uniqueness and get some pleasure from it. It worked > when stored but I have not tested it. The only repair was a new power > supply shortly before I replaced it -- about 1982-ish. > > Shipping costs paid by buyer would be about $200 (those suckers were > heavy!) paid to my PayPal account (JESMason) for your protection. > > If this is not for you, perhaps you know of someone who would be > interested. > > ~~> Scott Mason > 317-580-1950 > Indianapolis > > --- > > I'm not an expert but I believe it meets your need. I know it would not > expand beyond 64K (I had a choice of 16K, 32K, or 64K and the only way to > expand it was a cassette. And mine cost $10,900 new. 8-) > > If you can pick it up by this Sunday 7/14, great. Otherwise it goes to > Goodwill on Monday. My only interest is that someone enjoy it. I shoved it > into the attic and forgot about it until now. > > The address is: > 10719 Braewick Drive, Carmel, IN 46033 > 317-580-1950 > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free > http://sbc.yahoo.com > -- Gunther Schadow, M.D., Ph.D. gschadow@regenstrief.org Medical Information Scientist Regenstrief Institute for Health Care Adjunct Assistant Professor Indiana University School of Medicine tel:1(317)630-7960 http://aurora.regenstrief.org From jimw at agora.rdrop.com Sat Jul 13 02:35:01 2002 From: jimw at agora.rdrop.com (James Willing) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Need: Imation DC2080 Cartridges Message-ID: <20020712173953.Q25783-100000@agora.rdrop.com> Subject pretty much says it all... Anyone have between 8 and 12 or so of these carts that they could be parted with? Hopefully for less than the $15/ea that the various dists want for them? Need them for backups on a new, old thing that has jumped into the 'Garage'. Thanks; -jim --- jimw@agora.rdrop.com The Computer Garage - http://www.rdrop.com/~jimw From calte at fibertel.com.ar Sat Jul 13 02:38:21 2002 From: calte at fibertel.com.ar (Alejandro B. Casale) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: MIT Rescue Note Message-ID: <004101c22a6d$a9eeda40$0600a8c0@Casale> Dear Alan ? 'm looking for a SONY MP-F73W-50 You advised that 2 of them will be in the Flea Market this Sunday. I'm a little far from there (in Buenos Aires - Argentina); can you buy them for me? My I supose they are OK ? How may I send you the money ? I will be looking for your answer Best regards Al Casale (I apologise for my English....) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020713/bae10cd0/attachment.html From russ at eagle-audio.com Sat Jul 13 02:41:28 2002 From: russ at eagle-audio.com (Russell Sherwood) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: at&t 6300 Message-ID: <3.0.32.20020712214402.006b9f50@pop.registeredsite.com> Hi there, Am looking for one or two of those nice 102 key keyboards for an at&t 6300/olivetti m-24 ibm-xt compatable computers. If you know where there are any, please email me back. These keyboards have flat key tops and a very nice action. Thanks, Russ Sherwood From lgwalker at mts.net Sat Jul 13 04:50:01 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: OT: MECOS frequency device ? In-Reply-To: References: <3D2DCAC9.13918.22834D1D@localhost> Message-ID: <3D2FB16B.21635.104F5E8@localhost> No the LED is in the chassis. I started thinking it might be some sort of heart device timer as the deceased former owner of the auctioned items was quite elderly. I guess you could use it as a timer strobe. Lawrence > On Thu, 11 Jul 2002, Lawrence Walker wrote: > > > Likely way off topic, but I acquired some sort of frequency device in > > an auction junk box. It's a well machined device made by MECOS, made > > in W.Germant. It's about 2" square by 1/2" powered by a Li. battery > > and has micro-switches labelled 3 hz, 7.8 hz, 14.0 hz and a small led > > that flashes at the selected frequency. Anyone have any idea what it > > might be ? > > > > A search turned up that MECOS makes Active Magnetic Bearings and > > control boards and programs. > > Could this be some sort of timing device used for calibrating the speed of > something? Is the led separate from the chassis? > > -Toth > lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sat Jul 13 07:15:01 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Star Trek Re: Classic BASIC Games In-Reply-To: <008b01c22710$679b5bb0$0200a8c0@VAIO1> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020713080822.0ea71562@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I looked at the stuff on your site including StarTrek (actually Super StarTrek). Supposedly it was originally writtten (in Fortran) for the CDC 6600 in about 1974. Shortly afterwards it was rewrittten (in BASIC) at Intel to run on the Intel Intellec MDS-800. A few months ago I found a copy of the source code for Super StarTrek version 2 on-line. It's at . Does anyone still have the source code for the CDC version? You may want to add it to your site or add a link to it. Joe At 11:18 PM 7/8/02 -0700, you wrote: >Howdy! > >If you are interested in classic BASIC games running on Windows, check out my collection of classic BASIC games! Each game included in this collection is an original, un-cut classic game from the '70s and early '80s. Although these versions are TRS-80 versions, they are very similar, if not identical, to versions for other computers of the day (Apple II, PDP-11, etc.) > >These games run as native windows apps via a Microsoft Level 2 BASIC compatible interpreter that I wrote. The interpreter will run original tokenized or ASCII programs. > >Included in the package are classic games, like Hamurabi, Elisa, Star Trek, etc. > >http://www.awsoftware.org > >- Anthony > >Attachment Converted: "C:\EUDORA\Attach\ClassicB.htm" > From apple at cmc.net Sat Jul 13 08:05:00 2002 From: apple at cmc.net (Jack Noble) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: unsubscribe classiccmp Message-ID: <028f01c22a6d$7c916360$770fbbd0@oemcomputer> unsubscribe classiccmp -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020713/ce0c46a3/attachment.html From curt at atari-history.com Sat Jul 13 11:01:00 2002 From: curt at atari-history.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? References: Message-ID: <002c01c22a86$2b5748c0$01000001@cvendel> Very well put Sellam! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sellam Ismail" To: Sent: Saturday, July 13, 2002 12:40 AM Subject: Re: Any DRI employees out there??? > On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > > > NOTE: I have my students discuss whether it was the stupidest move evewr > > made, or the bravest. - "how many of you would like to thumb your nose at > > IBM and tell them to wait their turn in line?" "But would that be worth > > $40 billion to you?" > > Bill Gates kowtowing to IBM could have been seen as him selling himself to > the Devil. But in fact it was more like Billy stealing the Devil's soul. > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > From curt at atari-history.com Sat Jul 13 11:06:01 2002 From: curt at atari-history.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Star Trek Re: Classic BASIC Games References: <3.0.6.16.20020713080822.0ea71562@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <003401c22a86$530d9ae0$01000001@cvendel> Speaking of CDC, whatever happened to them and their Plato Online Service? Curt ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe" To: Sent: Saturday, July 13, 2002 8:08 AM Subject: Star Trek Re: Classic BASIC Games > I looked at the stuff on your site including StarTrek (actually Super StarTrek). Supposedly it was originally writtten (in Fortran) for the CDC 6600 in about 1974. Shortly afterwards it was rewrittten (in BASIC) at Intel to run on the Intel Intellec MDS-800. A few months ago I found a copy of the source code for Super StarTrek version 2 on-line. It's at > . Does anyone still have the source code for the CDC version? > > You may want to add it to your site or add a link to it. > > Joe > > > At 11:18 PM 7/8/02 -0700, you wrote: > >Howdy! > > > >If you are interested in classic BASIC games running on Windows, check out my collection of classic BASIC games! Each game included in this collection is an original, un-cut classic game from the '70s and early '80s. Although these versions are TRS-80 versions, they are very similar, if not identical, to versions for other computers of the day (Apple II, PDP-11, etc.) > > > >These games run as native windows apps via a Microsoft Level 2 BASIC compatible interpreter that I wrote. The interpreter will run original tokenized or ASCII programs. > > > >Included in the package are classic games, like Hamurabi, Elisa, Star Trek, etc. > > > >http://www.awsoftware.org > > > >- Anthony > > > >Attachment Converted: "C:\EUDORA\Attach\ClassicB.htm" > > > > From menadeau at attbi.com Sat Jul 13 13:15:00 2002 From: menadeau at attbi.com (Michael Nadeau) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? References: Message-ID: <001901c22a97$dfb981a0$0b01a8c0@ValuedCustomer> I vaguely recall a biography of Kildall--might have been just a section of a book. Let me do some digging. --Mike Michael Nadeau Editor/Publisher Classic Tech, the Vintage Computing Resource www.classictechpub.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sellam Ismail" To: Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 9:27 PM Subject: Re: Any DRI employees out there??? > On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Curt Vendel wrote: > > > of Digital "Galactic" Research and Gary Kildall... Bill Gates should foot > > Intergalactic Digital Research > > I third the motion...we need a book on DRI and Kildall. > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > From claudew at videotron.ca Sat Jul 13 15:15:01 2002 From: claudew at videotron.ca (Claude.W) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: "Rare" DEC finds in Montreal...? Message-ID: <006301c22aad$cf21c1c0$6400a8c0@gamerclaude> Hi all... Space is getting to be a problem here and I am mostly into home/hobby micros from the 70s and 80s (thats what I grew up with) but could not pass this up...since I hear so many discussions about DEC on this newsgroup... I dont think the models and equipement are rare, but getting any kinda DEC stuff up here in Montreal, for free, in perfect cosmetic and working condition with tons of software is rare...for me anyways...I guess the trick was tracking down some older ex DEC employees around here... Vaxstation 4000 VLC Vaxstation 4000 - 60 Storage Expansion with tape drive DEC mouse VRT19-HA monitor and a few cables... No missing parts, no cracks, no broken doors... I only see occasionnal DEC stuff at a scrap/surplus computer place here and its always in very bad shape...and owner always asks for $s in the "what???" range.... I dont really know this equipement...but fun to explore I guess... And the guys says : oh!....I have more DEC...way more at one of my houses if you are interested...! I guess I might be... Claude http://computer_collector.tripod.com From doc at mdrconsult.com Sat Jul 13 15:44:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: "Rare" DEC finds in Montreal...? In-Reply-To: <006301c22aad$cf21c1c0$6400a8c0@gamerclaude> Message-ID: On Sat, 13 Jul 2002, Claude.W wrote: > I dont think the models and equipement are rare, but getting any kinda DEC > stuff up here in Montreal, for free, in perfect cosmetic and working > condition with tons of software is rare...for me anyways...I guess the trick > was tracking down some older ex DEC employees around here... > > Vaxstation 4000 VLC > Vaxstation 4000 - 60 > Storage Expansion with tape drive > DEC mouse > VRT19-HA monitor > and a few cables... > > No missing parts, no cracks, no broken doors... Sweet! The VS4000/60 will usually sell for well over $100 US on eBay, if it has any add-on RAM (8M on-board) and drives at all. Very spiffy box. The VRT-19 is a pretty nice display too. The Storage Expansion boxes are good-looking, but suck up a lot of power, and mine is really noisy. If the VS4000/60 has the CD/tape sled I'd mount the tape drive internally. Actually, first, after cleaning & inspection, but before changing any SCSI IDs, I'd hook the expansion box up to the /60 and see what boots. Then hook it to the VLC & do the same. I just picked up a 4000vlc last week (the guy at Goodwill was pretty contemptuous of "that old terminal" and sold me the VLC, a VT320, and an LK402 keyboard for $5) It's not as fast as the /60, and according to DEC spec will only take 24M of memory, but it does take regular 36-bit (parity) 4MB SIMMs. It's also got a rep for being darn picky about hard drives. NetBSD labelled and partitioned a Seagate OEM 2G just fine, so I think the pickiness is more VMS than VLC. Voh-doh-di-oh. :) > And the guys says : oh!....I have more DEC...way more at one of my houses if > you are interested...! I guess I might be... Yep. You're bitten. You might as well go rent another storage barn now. You should also explain to your family that you'll be preoccupied and mentally absent for the next few years. Doc From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sat Jul 13 16:16:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Interesting Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: <60925.209.66.107.17.1026526594.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> from "Eric Smith" at Jul 12, 2 07:16:34 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 408 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020713/131d6a81/attachment.ksh From cbajpai at attbi.com Sat Jul 13 16:44:00 2002 From: cbajpai at attbi.com (Chandra Bajpai) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? In-Reply-To: <001901c22a97$dfb981a0$0b01a8c0@ValuedCustomer> Message-ID: <000001c22ab5$f5253a20$177ba8c0@ne2.client2.attbi.com> I think it was it Red Herring or Upside that did a 5+ page bio...it covered the time up to his death...pretty tragic, he never came to terms with Bill Gates and turned to being alcoholic. He is one guy I would have liked to meet (along with a few others - including Woz/Jobs/Gates). Follow up: Found it! http://www.upside.com/texis/mvm/story?id=34712c0d2f Nice picture: http://webdomain.batnet.com/portrayals/kildall.html -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Michael Nadeau Sent: Saturday, July 13, 2002 2:05 PM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: Re: Any DRI employees out there??? I vaguely recall a biography of Kildall--might have been just a section of a book. Let me do some digging. --Mike Michael Nadeau Editor/Publisher Classic Tech, the Vintage Computing Resource www.classictechpub.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sellam Ismail" To: Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 9:27 PM Subject: Re: Any DRI employees out there??? > On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Curt Vendel wrote: > > > of Digital "Galactic" Research and Gary Kildall... Bill Gates should foot > > Intergalactic Digital Research > > I third the motion...we need a book on DRI and Kildall. > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > From allain at panix.com Sat Jul 13 17:24:00 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Need: Imation DC2080 Cartridges References: <20020712173953.Q25783-100000@agora.rdrop.com> Message-ID: <007701c22abb$a7659ae0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> > Subject pretty much says it all. Verbatim DC2120's any good for you? These were sideways reeled so as to fit ~2.5X more tape in. John A. From ajw at best.com Sat Jul 13 19:08:00 2002 From: ajw at best.com (Anthony Wood) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Star Trek Re: Classic BASIC Games Message-ID: <000701c22aca$4e8eb190$0200a8c0@VAIO1> I tried running the MDS version of Super Star Trek (from your link). Unfortunately, it uses the DEF function, which is not currently supported in my interpreter (On the TRS-80, which is the version of BASIC I used for the spec, DEF is a "DISK BASIC" function, not in the standard MS BASIC Level 2. But, I've added several DISK BASIC statements, and DEF is the next on my list to add, one of these days. The version of Super Star Trek I included in my collection is from Creative Computing, and doesn't use the DEF statement. There is also a great version of Star Trek that uses some TRS-80 graphics that will work, on trs-80.com in the model I software section. Here is a history of Super Star Trek as noted by David Ahl (editor of Creative Computing): ---- Many versions if Star Trek have been kicking around various college campuses since the late sixties. I recall playing one at Carnegie-Mellon UNiv. in 1967 or 1968, and a very different one at Berkeley. However, these were a far cry fron the one written by Mike Mayfield of Centerline Engineering and/or Custom Data. This was written for an HP2000C and completed in October 1972. It became the "standard" Star Trek in February 1973 when it was put in the HP contributed program library and onto a number of HP Data Center machines. In the summer of 1973, I converted the HP version to BASIC-PLUS for DEC's RSTS-11 compiler and added a few bits and pieces while I was at it. Mary Cole at DEC contributed enormously to this task too. Later that year I published it under the name SPACWAR (Space War - in retrospect, an incorrect name) in my book 101 Basic Computer Games. It is difficult today to find an interactive computer installation that does not have one of these versions of Star Trek available. --- - Anthony ----- Play classic basic games: http://www.awsoftware.org From menadeau at attbi.com Sat Jul 13 19:31:00 2002 From: menadeau at attbi.com (Michael Nadeau) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? References: <000001c22ab5$f5253a20$177ba8c0@ne2.client2.attbi.com> Message-ID: <00dd01c22acc$69570200$0b01a8c0@ValuedCustomer> Yes. That's it, although I had remembered it as being longer. --Mike Michael Nadeau Editor/Publisher Classic Tech, the Vintage Computing Resource www.classictechpub.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chandra Bajpai" To: Sent: Saturday, July 13, 2002 5:40 PM Subject: RE: Any DRI employees out there??? > I think it was it Red Herring or Upside that did a 5+ page bio...it > covered the time up to his death...pretty tragic, he never came to terms > with Bill Gates and turned to being alcoholic. He is one guy I would > have liked to meet (along with a few others - including Woz/Jobs/Gates). > > > Follow up: Found it! > http://www.upside.com/texis/mvm/story?id=34712c0d2f > > Nice picture: > > http://webdomain.batnet.com/portrayals/kildall.html > > > -----Original Message----- > From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] > On Behalf Of Michael Nadeau > Sent: Saturday, July 13, 2002 2:05 PM > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: Any DRI employees out there??? > > I vaguely recall a biography of Kildall--might have been just a section > of a > book. Let me do some digging. > > --Mike > > Michael Nadeau > Editor/Publisher > Classic Tech, the Vintage Computing Resource > www.classictechpub.com > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Sellam Ismail" > To: > Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 9:27 PM > Subject: Re: Any DRI employees out there??? > > > > On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Curt Vendel wrote: > > > > > of Digital "Galactic" Research and Gary Kildall... Bill Gates > should > foot > > > > Intergalactic Digital Research > > > > I third the motion...we need a book on DRI and Kildall. > > > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer > Festival > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -- > ---- > > International Man of Intrigue and Danger > http://www.vintage.org > > > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at > www.VintageTech.com * > > > > From mrbill at mrbill.net Sat Jul 13 20:28:00 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: "Rare" DEC finds in Montreal...? In-Reply-To: References: <006301c22aad$cf21c1c0$6400a8c0@gamerclaude> Message-ID: <20020714012635.GL20263@mrbill.net> On Sat, Jul 13, 2002 at 03:43:09PM -0500, Doc Shipley wrote: > I just picked up a 4000vlc last week (the guy at Goodwill was pretty > contemptuous of "that old terminal" and sold me the VLC, a VT320, and an > LK402 keyboard for $5) It's not as fast as the /60, and according to > DEC spec will only take 24M of memory, but it does take regular 36-bit > (parity) 4MB SIMMs. It's also got a rep for being darn picky about hard > drives. NetBSD labelled and partitioned a Seagate OEM 2G just fine, so > I think the pickiness is more VMS than VLC. Voh-doh-di-oh. :) WHen I had a VLC it was picky about cd-rom drives too; it refused to properly complete a VMS install off a Plextor CD-ROM, but worked off a RRD42 just fine. This was an OEM / no-logo Plextor though. Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From glenslick at hotmail.com Sat Jul 13 20:57:00 2002 From: glenslick at hotmail.com (Glen Slick) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: HP 9133H Configuration switch? Message-ID: Anyone know what the 10 position Configuration switch does on the back of an HP 9133H drive unit? I tried some google searching for info on this drive unit and didn't come up with much. I just picked up one of these drive units at a surplus store and hooked it up to my HP Integral PC. It looks like it shows up as 9 different devices, where D001 is the floppy and D000, D100, ..., D700 are 8 disk partitions. Can you configure the drive so that it shows up as fewer and larger partitions? -Glen _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx From doc at mdrconsult.com Sat Jul 13 23:18:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: SparcStation 1 RAM question Message-ID: Hi, all. Will a Sparcstation 1 run OK with mixed parity & non-parity SIMMs? Each bank is a matched set, but I have 8 parity sticks and 8 non-parity. The "test-memory" diagnostic from the boot monitor seems not to mind, but I thought I ought to ask anyhow. Doc From wmsmith at earthlink.net Sun Jul 14 00:55:01 2002 From: wmsmith at earthlink.net (Wayne M. Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:04 2005 Subject: HP 9133H Configuration switch? References: Message-ID: <003a01c22afa$d7158ea0$4140cd18@wayne052602> > Anyone know what the 10 position Configuration switch does on the back of an > HP 9133H drive unit? I tried some google searching for info on this drive > unit and didn't come up with much. > > I just picked up one of these drive units at a surplus store and hooked it > up to my HP Integral PC. It looks like it shows up as 9 different devices, > where D001 is the floppy and D000, D100, ..., D700 are 8 disk partitions. > Can you configure the drive so that it shows up as fewer and larger > partitions? > > -Glen > I have the manual for this drive. Regarding the settings, for running Series 200 BASIC it advises to set the address between 0 to 7, and then to set the config switch based on the partition size you want. The settings are as follows: Setting No. of Vols. Size of Vols. 256 Bytes/Sect. 1024 Bytes/Sect. 0 One 19.92MB/Vol. 23.33MB/Vol. 1 One 19.92MB/Vol. 23.33MB/Vol. 2 Two 9.92MB/Vol. 11.09MB/Vol. 3 Three 6.61MB/Vol. 7.37MB/Vol. 4 Four 4.94MB/Vol. 5.49MB/Vol. 5 Five 3.93 " 4.34 " 6 Six 3.27 " 3.61 " 7 Seven 2.81 " 3.09 " 8 Eight 2.45 " 2.69 " 9 One 19.92 " 23.33 " The setup portion, which assumes you have an unformatted drive and seems to have been written with the HP Touchscreen in mind, says to set the address at 9 and the configuration switch at zero. To configure the drive it says to boot the 9133, put the System Master Disk in the floppy, boot the PC, select "EASY CONFIG," select "Start Applic," select "Disc Drives," select "Next Step," select 9133D/H, select "Main Screen" and select "Exit Config." To format, the manual says to insert the master disk, select "Reread Discs", after PAM appears, select "Format," select "Start Applic", select "Drive B," select "Copy System," select "Start Format," select "Yes," -- after formatting is done select "Return." Once the drive is formatted, the manual says to return the address back to 0. To boot from the HDD turn it on, wait for the completion of the self test, then turn on the PC. Let me know if you need any further info. -W From wmsmith at earthlink.net Sun Jul 14 02:44:00 2002 From: wmsmith at earthlink.net (Wayne M. Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: HP 9133H Configuration switch? References: <003a01c22afa$d7158ea0$4140cd18@wayne052602> Message-ID: <004b01c22b0a$245961a0$4140cd18@wayne052602> Specs reformatted below. > > Anyone know what the 10 position Configuration switch does on the back > of an > > HP 9133H drive unit? I tried some google searching for info on this > drive > > unit and didn't come up with much. > > > > I just picked up one of these drive units at a surplus store and > hooked it > > up to my HP Integral PC. It looks like it shows up as 9 different > devices, > > where D001 is the floppy and D000, D100, ..., D700 are 8 disk > partitions. > > Can you configure the drive so that it shows up as fewer and larger > > partitions? > > > > -Glen > > > I have the manual for this drive. Regarding the settings, for running > Series 200 BASIC it advises to set the address between 0 to 7, and then > to set the config switch based on the partition size you want. The > settings are as follows: > Setting No. Vols. Size of Vols. 256 Bytes/Sect. 1024 B/S 0 1 19.92MB/Vol. 23.33MB/Vol. 1 1 19.92MB/Vol. 23.33MB/Vol. 2 2 9.92MB/Vol. 11.09MB/Vol. 3 3 6.61MB/Vol. 7.37MB/Vol. 4 4 4.94MB/Vol. 5.49MB/Vol. 5 5 3.93 " 4.34 " 6 6 3.27 " 3.61 " 7 7 2.81 " 3.09 " 8 8 2.45 " 2.69 " 9 1 19.92 " 23.33 " > > The setup portion, which assumes you have an unformatted drive and seems > to have been written with the HP Touchscreen in mind, says to set the > address at 9 and the configuration switch at zero. To configure the > drive it says to boot the 9133, put the System Master Disk in the > floppy, boot the PC, select "EASY CONFIG," select "Start Applic," select > "Disc Drives," select "Next Step," select 9133D/H, select "Main Screen" > and select "Exit Config." > > To format, the manual says to insert the master disk, select "Reread > Discs", after PAM appears, select "Format," select "Start Applic", > select "Drive B," select "Copy System," select "Start Format," select > "Yes," -- after formatting is done select "Return." > > Once the drive is formatted, the manual says to return the address back > to 0. To boot from the HDD turn it on, wait for the completion of the > self test, then turn on the PC. > > Let me know if you need any further info. > > -W > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sun Jul 14 09:08:00 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: HP 9133H Configuration switch? In-Reply-To: <003a01c22afa$d7158ea0$4140cd18@wayne052602> References: Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020714094513.434f24f2@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Wayne is correct except for one point. See below. At 10:53 PM 7/13/02 -0700, you wrote: >> Anyone know what the 10 position Configuration switch does on the back >of an >> HP 9133H drive unit? I tried some google searching for info on this >drive >> unit and didn't come up with much. >> >> I just picked up one of these drive units at a surplus store and >hooked it >> up to my HP Integral PC. It looks like it shows up as 9 different >devices, >> where D001 is the floppy and D000, D100, ..., D700 are 8 disk >partitions. >> Can you configure the drive so that it shows up as fewer and larger >> partitions? >> >> -Glen >> >I have the manual for this drive. Regarding the settings, for running >Series 200 BASIC it advises to set the address between 0 to 7, and then >to set the config switch based on the partition size you want. The >settings are as follows: > >Setting No. of Vols. Size of >Vols. > 256 >Bytes/Sect. 1024 Bytes/Sect. >0 One 19.92MB/Vol. >23.33MB/Vol. >1 One 19.92MB/Vol. >23.33MB/Vol. >2 Two 9.92MB/Vol. >11.09MB/Vol. >3 Three 6.61MB/Vol. >7.37MB/Vol. >4 Four 4.94MB/Vol. >5.49MB/Vol. >5 Five 3.93 " >4.34 " >6 Six 3.27 " >3.61 " >7 Seven 2.81 " >3.09 " >8 Eight 2.45 " >2.69 " >9 One 19.92 " >23.33 " > > > >The setup portion, which assumes you have an unformatted drive and seems >to have been written with the HP Touchscreen in mind, says to set the >address at 9 and the configuration switch at zero. To configure the >drive it says to boot the 9133, put the System Master Disk in the >floppy, boot the PC, select "EASY CONFIG," select "Start Applic," select >"Disc Drives," select "Next Step," select 9133D/H, select "Main Screen" >and select "Exit Config." > >To format, the manual says to insert the master disk, select "Reread >Discs", after PAM appears, select "Format," select "Start Applic", >select "Drive B," select "Copy System," select "Start Format," select >"Yes," -- after formatting is done select "Return." > >Once the drive is formatted, the manual says to return the address back >to 0. You mean set the Configuration switch back to 0. That prevents the drive from being accidently reformated. You can set the address switch to any desired address. Joe To boot from the HDD turn it on, wait for the completion of the >self test, then turn on the PC. > >Let me know if you need any further info. > >-W > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sun Jul 14 10:59:01 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: test Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020714115941.0137f976@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> From wmsmith at earthlink.net Sun Jul 14 12:13:00 2002 From: wmsmith at earthlink.net (Wayne M. Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: HP 9133H Configuration switch? References: <3.0.6.16.20020714094513.434f24f2@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <000f01c22b59$83cba400$4140cd18@wayne052602> > Wayne is correct except for one point. See below. > > > At 10:53 PM 7/13/02 -0700, you wrote: > >> Anyone know what the 10 position Configuration switch does on the back > >of an > >> HP 9133H drive unit? I tried some google searching for info on this > >drive > >> unit and didn't come up with much. > >> > >> I just picked up one of these drive units at a surplus store and > >hooked it > >> up to my HP Integral PC. It looks like it shows up as 9 different > >devices, > >> where D001 is the floppy and D000, D100, ..., D700 are 8 disk > >partitions. > >> Can you configure the drive so that it shows up as fewer and larger > >> partitions? > >> > >> -Glen > >> > >I have the manual for this drive. Regarding the settings, for running > >Series 200 BASIC it advises to set the address between 0 to 7, and then > >to set the config switch based on the partition size you want. The > >settings are as follows: > > > >Setting No. of Vols. Size of > >Vols. > > 256 > >Bytes/Sect. 1024 Bytes/Sect. > >0 One 19.92MB/Vol. > >23.33MB/Vol. > >1 One 19.92MB/Vol. > >23.33MB/Vol. > >2 Two 9.92MB/Vol. > >11.09MB/Vol. > >3 Three 6.61MB/Vol. > >7.37MB/Vol. > >4 Four 4.94MB/Vol. > >5.49MB/Vol. > >5 Five 3.93 " > >4.34 " > >6 Six 3.27 " > >3.61 " > >7 Seven 2.81 " > >3.09 " > >8 Eight 2.45 " > >2.69 " > >9 One 19.92 " > >23.33 " > > > > > > > >The setup portion, which assumes you have an unformatted drive and seems > >to have been written with the HP Touchscreen in mind, says to set the > >address at 9 and the configuration switch at zero. To configure the > >drive it says to boot the 9133, put the System Master Disk in the > >floppy, boot the PC, select "EASY CONFIG," select "Start Applic," select > >"Disc Drives," select "Next Step," select 9133D/H, select "Main Screen" > >and select "Exit Config." > > > >To format, the manual says to insert the master disk, select "Reread > >Discs", after PAM appears, select "Format," select "Start Applic", > >select "Drive B," select "Copy System," select "Start Format," select > >"Yes," -- after formatting is done select "Return." > > > >Once the drive is formatted, the manual says to return the address back > >to 0. > > You mean set the Configuration switch back to 0. That prevents the drive from being accidently reformated. You can set the address switch to any desired address. > > Joe Yes, that's right. Typed it wrong. -W > > To boot from the HDD turn it on, wait for the completion of the > >self test, then turn on the PC. > > > >Let me know if you need any further info. > > > >-W > > > > > > From meltie at myrealbox.com Sun Jul 14 12:21:00 2002 From: meltie at myrealbox.com (Alex White) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: Bull Estrella Model 340. Message-ID: <1026667168.4207.23.camel@stolichnaya.meltie.mine.nu> Does anyone have knowledge of getting an OS running on such a beast? It's on AIX at the moment, which it's owner really doesne like. He'd prefer a bsd or l**ux if it's possible...? Alex -- Live like you will never die, love like you've never been hurt, dance like no-one is watching. From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Sun Jul 14 13:26:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: SparcStation 1 RAM question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020714182520.51395.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> --- Doc Shipley wrote: > Hi, all. > Will a Sparcstation 1 run OK with mixed parity & non-parity SIMMs? > Each bank is a matched set, but I have 8 parity sticks and 8 non-parity. > The "test-memory" diagnostic from the boot monitor seems not to mind, > but I thought I ought to ask anyhow. I would have told you no, but your experiences seem to show different. I was under the impression that all SPARCs that take 30-pin memory want parity. I _have_ put 16 x 4MB in mine (back when it was my primary machine and had just paid $800 for it!), in case you've read that it only takes 1MB sticks. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From rhudson at cnonline.net Sun Jul 14 14:49:00 2002 From: rhudson at cnonline.net (Ron Hudson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: Do old Calculators count as Classic Computers? Message-ID: <200207141247.49025.rhudson@cnonline.net> from the I-thought-it-was-programmable department: Anyone know what the K key does on my Texas Insturments SR-40 (I'ts got an LED display, it 'gots' to be old!) I have googled, I found lots of stuff on a signal processor (?) with that name, and a few pages that show the calculator, and give a date range for Mfg. but nothing that describes the keyboard. I tried pressing the K key in several cases 5 sin = 5 K sin 543 = 54K3 (K does not end a number ) tis a puzzlement. : ^ ) From celigne at celigne.freeserve.co.uk Sun Jul 14 15:08:00 2002 From: celigne at celigne.freeserve.co.uk (Paul Williams) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: Do old Calculators count as Classic Computers? References: <200207141247.49025.rhudson@cnonline.net> Message-ID: <3D31DA65.36A5D374@celigne.freeserve.co.uk> Ron Hudson wrote: > > Anyone know what the K key does on my Texas Insturments SR-40 (I'ts > got an LED display, it 'gots' to be old!) I don't know this model, but on some calculators the K key means "Constant" and it allows you to repeat an operation on more than one number, for example: 5 X K 10 = (displays 50) 3 = (displays 15). -- Paul From rhudson at cnonline.net Sun Jul 14 17:26:00 2002 From: rhudson at cnonline.net (Ron Hudson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: Do old Calculators count as Classic Computers? In-Reply-To: <3D31DA65.36A5D374@celigne.freeserve.co.uk> References: <200207141247.49025.rhudson@cnonline.net> <3D31DA65.36A5D374@celigne.freeserve.co.uk> Message-ID: <200207141524.41841.rhudson@cnonline.net> On Sunday 14 July 2002 01:09 pm, Paul Williams wrote: > Ron Hudson wrote: > > Anyone know what the K key does on my Texas Insturments SR-40 (I'ts > > got an LED display, it 'gots' to be old!) > > I don't know this model, but on some calculators the K key means > "Constant" and it allows you to repeat an operation on more than one > number, for example: > > 5 X K > 10 = (displays 50) > 3 = (displays 15). Thanks Paul, that seems to be it... ! ron. From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Sun Jul 14 17:48:01 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: test Message-ID: <3D305C50.6040505@jetnet.ab.ca> Are you working $%^! mailing list? From glenslick at hotmail.com Sun Jul 14 18:47:01 2002 From: glenslick at hotmail.com (Glen Slick) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: HP 9133H Configuration switch? Message-ID: Thanks for the config switch info. The 9133H unit I picked up came with the config switch in position 8 and I originally formatted it on the IPC with 8 volumes. Maybe there is a limit on how many volumes the IPC can mount at the same time? Only the first 6 volumes appeared to be mounted automatically. I change the config switch to position 2 and reformatted the drive as 2 volumes and that seems like it might be a better choice. What controls the 256/1024 byte sector size? Is that up to the OS format routine? Is there a CS/80 or SS/80 spec available anywhere to find out more about how these HPIB drives work? Are there any other sources of software for the IPC besides Pete's IPC website? http://www.coho.org/~pete/IPC/integral.html Now that I have a hard drive I don't really have anything interesting to load on it yet. -Glen _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com From archer at topnow.com Sun Jul 14 20:12:01 2002 From: archer at topnow.com (Ross Archer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: Introduction and greetings! Message-ID: <3D322107.97F6C1F2@topnow.com> Hi, This is Ross -- just saying hello to the group. I'm a software engineer by profession, but an 8-bit hacker by avocation. While I'm especially interested in 6502 hardware, Z80, 8080, and even 1802 stuff is also of keen interest. It's partly nostalgia, and partly that these old systems are understandable by mere mortals with a reasonable amount of effort. I love how one could get a book or two and know everything you need to program one of those old machines, vs. today when the number of standards and interfaces has gone spinning out of control of the individual hobbyist, at which point it becomes more "work" than "play". I still think studying those older micros is a perfect way to truly understand the principles involved in computing without all the distractions of multi-level caching, out-of-order execution, branch prediction, branch delay slots, etc. etc. Once grounded in those basic principles, you can build the rest. IMHO. Currently, my stable of hardware includes: 1) A nearly pristine KIM-1, currently serving as a 24-hour clock. I posted some "ready-to run" software and scans of user manuals, and a few songs played by KIM, etc. at http://www.learnmicros.com. 2) Commodore 128. I like this because it can be used to learn CP/M and Z80 ML as well as hack at the '02 and C64. :) 3) Apple IIe. Nice accessible hardware to hack with. 4) TI99/4A. Anyone want for the cost of shipping? I just can't fit this one into my collection very well, and there are only a few cartridges for it. 5) Daryl Rictor's SBC2. I got that SBC tweaked to run at the blazing speed of 6 Mhz running a variant of BASIC called EHBASIC. This is my current timesink. A 6502 at 6Mhz is not too shabby. :) Anyways, holas again to the group and hope you all are having great summers. -- Ross From spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu Sun Jul 14 20:18:00 2002 From: spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: Introduction and greetings! In-Reply-To: <3D322107.97F6C1F2@topnow.com> from Ross Archer at "Jul 14, 2 06:10:31 pm" Message-ID: <200207150124.SAA28876@stockholm.ptloma.edu> > This is Ross -- just saying hello to the group. You again! Larry Anderson, Jim Brain and Ken Ross(?) should be around here also. -- ----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser@stockholm.ptloma.edu -- Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere. -- M. L. King, Jr. --- From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sun Jul 14 20:36:00 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: test In-Reply-To: <3D305C50.6040505@jetnet.ab.ca> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020714213613.4867d5e2@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> It seems to be now. I sent several test messages earlier in the day but they weren't forwarded. I only had ONE message between last night and this afternoon. I did get TWO messages this evening. FWIW I sent the test messages to the old CC list address, CC Tech and CC Talk so it seems that they're all down. Joe At 10:58 AM 7/13/02 -0600, you wrote: >Are you working $%^! mailing list? > > From archer at topnow.com Sun Jul 14 20:42:00 2002 From: archer at topnow.com (Ross Archer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: Introduction and greetings! References: <200207150124.SAA28876@stockholm.ptloma.edu> Message-ID: <3D322827.18AE95E0@topnow.com> Cameron Kaiser wrote: > > > This is Ross -- just saying hello to the group. > > You again! Yup, I guess. Was on the old classiccmp list before it went away; can't resist hearing about people's old systems still being used. :-) -- Ross > > Larry Anderson, Jim Brain and Ken Ross(?) should be around here also. > > -- > ----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- > Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser@stockholm.ptloma.edu > -- Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere. -- M. L. King, Jr. --- From marvin at rain.org Sun Jul 14 22:52:00 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: New Finds References: <200207150124.SAA28876@stockholm.ptloma.edu> <3D322827.18AE95E0@topnow.com> Message-ID: <3D324694.EE04FABC@rain.org> Saturday was the local amateur radio club bazaar, and found a couple of interesting things. Probably the most interesting thing to me was an ICM816 calculator produced in about 1971. A Google search gave a good web site for information - http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Lab/7510/icm816.html Also got a Commodore Plus/4 with the 1541-2 (I think) drive and a printer. The most interesting Commodore item was a VHS cassette about the Plus/4. Found a Sparc 1 and have no idea of its condition although it looks fine. If anyone wants it for the usual 1.2 x shipping, let me know. I saw the IBM portable Tandy Data Terminal and (reluctantly) passed on both. As usual, I volunteered to take everything that was left, and ended up with probably 50+ computers, printers, monitors, etc. that will go to the scrap yard and local thrift stores (a lot of LJ IIs, dot matrix printers, 486s, etc.) From red at bears.org Mon Jul 15 02:45:00 2002 From: red at bears.org (r. 'bear' stricklin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: recovered software Message-ID: I spent last week in San Jose for an off-topic class at Sun. While I was down there I spent more time than was probably healthy scouring the as-is shelves for lost software. This is a partial list of what I came up with. Who knows, maybe I came up with something somebody's been looking for. All software is on QIC tape except as noted. * UNIX SYSTEM V RELEASE 3.1.1 FOR AT&T 3B4000 and 3B15 VERSION 1 COMPUTERS ROOT FILE SYSTEM; BOOT BLOCK DOMESTIC RELEASE (9-track tape) * iRMX III Rel 2.1 * HP Network Peripheral Interface for SunOS 4.1.1 on Sun SPARCsystems Host Software rev A.02.00 dated 0592 * Interphase Network Coprocessor NC400 rel 1.4.2 * Motorola System Software Gold for Sys. V/88 R32V3.2 * Motorola System Software 88K Unix R4 Binary System Tape * Motorola System Software DeltaPRO SDS Source R4V4.3 88K * Motorola System Software DeltaWindows MOTIF 1.3.1 Source * Motorola System Software DeltaWindows X11 1.3.3 Source * Motorola System Software R32V3.2 NSE Object * Motorola System Software NCDware 3.1 for R40 * Motorola System Software 88K UNIX R4 BOS Source * Motorola System Software Commercial Network Ext Pkg. * Motorola System Software * MIPS RISC/os 4.52 Binary tape 2 * MIPS RISC/os 4.52B2 * Onyx Systems, Inc. Initialization Tape UNIX System III Ver 3.0.5A April 1985 * INFORMIX 4-GL ver 1.10.00A for ALTOS Series 2000, Xenix v5.2a maybe this will help somebody. ok r. From GOOI at oce.nl Mon Jul 15 03:19:00 2002 From: GOOI at oce.nl (Gooijen H) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 Message-ID: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EBB@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Thanks all for the many good replies. This is what I have done so far. At the end is what I did *not* do (yet). At first, I kept the 3 MASSBUS interfaces installed. They were in the machine, so I did not suspect them. - I installed the H744 in the upper PSU. All +5, -15 and +15 V. all look OK, measured with a Fluke. I am not yet in the stage to pull out the scope and do "difficult" things. - I will check the jumper on the M8132. Normally I make notes of steps I do on my machines, but Murphy is still alive. I cleaned the 11/70 with remote console *completely*. Got the 11/70 with full console 2 weeks later. Since I am keeping one and donate the other 11/70 to a museum, I did not want to clean the second 11/70 also. The guy at the museum may do his share of this bargain. So I swapped the consoles, and (AFAIK) the boards. That is the problem: I can not remember that last action. Perhaps I did not swap all CPU boards between the 2 machines and only moved the FP option boards (and forgot/didn't know about the H744 to supply +5V to slots 2-3-4-5). As Tom wrote, the 11/40 indeed needs on 2 boards (IIRC) change of jumpers for FIS/EIS (or was it MMU)? - I kept a G727 in the 4th MASSBUS slot at the correct position. Removed from all not used UNIBUS slots the G727 and replaced them with G7273 dual-height grant cards. Result is still NOK: hung on console address access (read/write). - Removed the other 3 MASSBUS interfaces. Put a G727 instead of the M8153, according to FMPS. Hung remains. - The "golden" tip from Tony. Removed the M9302. No more hung! XBUF status shows octal 200 (indicating TX buffer empty, ready to receive byte to transmit). Store octal 71 in the TX buffer and a "9" appears on the VT320!! Basically, I have a complete working machine, but ... - Put an M930 as terminator in the 11/70. Still all is fine. - Put an onther M9302 (from the working 11/34C) in the 11/70. The hung is back. - Put the M930 back in again. LOADed address 17765744 (from the M9312 manual) and pressed START. All LEDs flicker for a few seconds, then all go off, except ADDRESS LED #2, so address 00000004. I guess this is a TRAP because the boot device was not accessible. Makes sense, there are no devices connected! What I did not do. - Remove the RX11 (non-DMA) RX01 interface and replace it with an RX211 (DMA) RX02 interface to see how that affects the NPR line. - Did not check the ACLO and DCLO signals. Since I can run "a small program", memory interconnections, the memory and the CPU itself have no apparent problem. - Did not try to read the ROM on the M9312 with the M9302 installed. Will do that this evening (probably). The weekend was shorter than I expected it to be. As usual ... I did read the CPU registers (IIRC), but check on that again. - I will read the M9312 manual again. The numbers Johnny writes about sound familiar. However, it this moment I do not have any disks (RX,RL) connected. Thanks again so far, - Henk. From GOOI at oce.nl Mon Jul 15 03:38:00 2002 From: GOOI at oce.nl (Gooijen H) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 Message-ID: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EBC@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Reading the replies, not from the screen, but printed, I notice a comment from Tony. This could be important! > Of course you might still have an open NPG jumper on the slot > where the DL11-W is (this card does not short CA1 to CB1). That's an eye-opener for me! I thought that the DL11 would short CA1 to CB1. I guess that some cards that do not use DMA (NPR) short these 2 pins and some *do not*. Since the machine was originally with a remote console, (hard lesson: DO take notes on any action you do to a PDP-11, if you do: make better/more elaborate ones), I think that there was no DL11 in it, but the Unibus serial remote console M8255 was in slot #40. I swapped the M8255 for an M7856. Now, if the M8255 *does* bridge/use NPR ... I will check this evening of course, no matter what pops up! I will do the other tests anyway, and make notes! They will be very useful for future reference. Again, thanks all so far, - Henk. From frustum at pacbell.net Mon Jul 15 04:56:00 2002 From: frustum at pacbell.net (Jim Battle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: [CCTECH]74123 woes Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020715023643.02176080@postoffice.pacbell.net> I've been working on trying to get a Sol Helios disk system up and running so I can recover and archive a bunch of disk images. If I can't get it working (I'd really like to get it running for its own sake), I'll get a catweasel card, a conventional 8" disk, and attempt to write my own bit-level decoding software to recover the disks. Anyway, I found and fixed the first problem: one of the satellite circuit boards on the persci had a tantalum cap that had a dead short, taking out the whole +24V power supply (it used a 3-terminal rgulator that detected the problem and cut off power, thus there was no pop nor any telltale burnt traces or wires). I fixed that and things are working somewhat better, but I still can't seek to any track except 0 (via the restore line). After discovering that the schematics I have are for a somewhat different revision of the logic board than I have (doh!), I tracked down the problem to what appears to be a busted 74123 (not LS123, which is slightly different logically). The positive trigger is always high, and the Q-bar output is always low -- that is, the thing looks like it is always triggered despite the fact that there is no edge on the trigger input. I could remove the 74123, replace the resistor and cap and see if that fixes it, but doing it would require a lot more disassembly than I'd like to do without being confident that what I'm seeing really is a problem. Here is where I need advice. I can't find my TTL databook, but it would appear that the trigger inputs are edge triggered, not level triggered, right? Secondly, I haven't done board-level design in more than 10 years, but from what I recall, 99 times out of 100 when I thought I had tracked down a bug to a back chip, it was something else (then again, that was during design, not just working on ostensibly correctly designed boards). I have little experience with the '123 since using one for any timing critical function simply hasn't been kosher for the past 20 years at least. Does anybody know in such a situation like this, is it more likely to be a bad cap or a bad '123, or a short somewhere else on the trace? I can measure the resistance of the R and it is in spec. I've buzzed the circuit to see that the R and C are connected to the pins of the '123. Any other suggestions? Oh, the C is a mylar (I think) with a 5% precision rating stamped on it (100pf). Thanks. ----- Jim Battle == frustum@pacbell.net _______________________________________________ cctech mailing list cctech@classiccmp.org http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From tractorb at ihug.co.nz Mon Jul 15 05:20:01 2002 From: tractorb at ihug.co.nz (Dave Brown) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: CRT problem References: <3.0.6.16.20020620143422.443f66fe@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <008701c22be9$0353e7c0$0101a8c0@athlon> I have a 10 or12 inch green screen CRT off an HP 9845B I need to clean up. . It has been stored in a damp environment and the silicon rubber 'bonding' the protective glass screen to the front of the CRT proper has developed large mould spots in side itself for an inch or two around the outside edge of the screen. I guess I am looking for suggestions as to how to readily separate theses two glass items without scratching etc so I can clean and rebond them. I thought at first there was a cavity between the glass on the CRT face and the protective glass out front- just a seal of silicon rubber round the edge- but no such luck-- seems like the silicon rubber stuff covers the whole area of the tube face- so I need to chemically remove it or ?? Any ideas?? The 9845B is running OK- getting a partial memory test failure at boot up but I don't expect that will be too hard to sort. Anyway-- that's next week's problem! Dave Brown Christchurch, NZ From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Jul 15 08:25:01 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: What's wrong with the list? Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020715092530.474f33fe@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Anybody know what's going on with the list? I didn't recieve any messages for 18 hours and I've only had about 8 messages in the past 12 hours. Joe From uban at ubanproductions.com Mon Jul 15 09:17:00 2002 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: CRT problem In-Reply-To: <008701c22be9$0353e7c0$0101a8c0@athlon> References: <3.0.6.16.20020620143422.443f66fe@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20020715090317.01b57858@ubanproductions.com> Hi Dave, I have a similar problem with a couple of CRTs from my Imlac graphics machine. After doing some research, the I did locate a company which would rebuild the CRT for something like $700, with no guarantee that they would not destroy the tube. They also had expensive replacement tubes, which were not the correct phosphor. Another solution, which I haven't tried yet is to remove the CRT from it's electronics and soak the face in a bath of acetone for an extended period of time (or until the secondary lens is separated from the tube. Once separated, clean and reattach using optic cement. This was suggested by a friend who repairs large antique camera lenses. I'm not sure if acetone will dissolve the cement which holds the lens to the tube, so a pre-test may be a good idea. Some people have indicated a fear of removing the lens from the tube face thinking that the tube may well implode without it. I do not think that will be the case, but I suppose that it is possible. I believe that the lens is simply added protect from day to day use for the face of the tube and is not inherently required to maintain the strength of the tube against the vacuum inside. In any case, as always, great care should be taken to protect you, your eyes, etc. when handling CRTs, as they do carry the risk of implosion. --tom At 10:18 PM 7/15/2002 +1200, you wrote: >I have a 10 or12 inch green screen CRT off an HP 9845B I need to clean up. . >It has been stored in a damp environment and the silicon rubber 'bonding' >the protective glass screen to the front of the CRT proper has developed >large mould spots in side itself for an inch or two around the outside edge >of the screen. I guess I am looking for suggestions as to how to readily >separate theses two glass items without scratching etc so I can clean and >rebond them. I thought at first there was a cavity between the glass on the >CRT face and the protective glass out front- just a seal of silicon rubber >round the edge- but no such luck-- seems like the silicon rubber stuff >covers the whole area of the tube face- so I need to chemically remove it or >?? >Any ideas?? > >The 9845B is running OK- getting a partial memory test failure at boot up >but I don't expect that will be too hard to sort. Anyway-- that's next >week's problem! > >Dave Brown >Christchurch, NZ From DAW at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu Mon Jul 15 10:01:00 2002 From: DAW at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: New Finds Message-ID: <9011A52E011ED311B4280004AC1BA61501467A95@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu> > From: Marvin Johnston > > > Saturday was the local amateur radio club bazaar, and found a couple of > interesting things... > > ... > > As usual, I volunteered to take everything that was left, and ended up > with probably 50+ computers, printers, monitors, etc. that will go to > the scrap yard and local thrift stores (a lot of LJ IIs, dot matrix > printers, 486s, etc.) > I'm surprised Chris hasn't asked about those HP LJIIs yet. There's a IIID here waiting for him. Still. :) Or did he reply privately? -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1 - Darwin Kernel Version 5 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash From jwest at classiccmp.org Mon Jul 15 10:09:00 2002 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: test please ignore Message-ID: <002f01c22c11$3cfaa2c0$9701a8c0@HPLAPTOP> test --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] From jwest at classiccmp.org Mon Jul 15 10:14:00 2002 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: What's wrong with the list? References: <3.0.6.16.20020715092530.474f33fe@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <004101c22c11$e4956f60$9701a8c0@HPLAPTOP> I just posted to the list with a test joe, I got the redistribution of it within 2 minutes. All SEEMS to be well. Are you still having trouble? Jay West ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe" To: ; ; Sent: Monday, July 15, 2002 9:25 AM Subject: What's wrong with the list? > Anybody know what's going on with the list? I didn't recieve any messages for 18 hours and I've only had about 8 messages in the past 12 hours. > > Joe > > > > --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] From rschaefe at gcfn.org Mon Jul 15 10:50:00 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert F Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: New Finds In-Reply-To: <9011A52E011ED311B4280004AC1BA61501467A95@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu> References: <9011A52E011ED311B4280004AC1BA61501467A95@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu> Message-ID: <64779.128.146.70.182.1026747903.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> >> From: Marvin Johnston >> >> >> Saturday was the local amateur radio club bazaar, and found a couple >> of interesting things... >> >> ... >> >> As usual, I volunteered to take everything that was left, and ended up >> with probably 50+ computers, printers, monitors, etc. that will go to >> the scrap yard and local thrift stores (a lot of LJ IIs, dot matrix >> printers, 486s, etc.) >> > I'm surprised Chris hasn't asked about those HP LJIIs yet. There's a > IIID here waiting for him. Still. :) > Or did he reply privately? Speaking of III series LJs, does anyone in or near to Colmbus, Ohio have a IIIP for parts? I've got one that works fine, but it doesn't have the paper drawer assembly underneath, and I'm getting tired of feeding it by hand. > > -- > --- David A Woyciesjes Bob From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Mon Jul 15 11:17:00 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: OT: MECOS frequency device ? Message-ID: <200207151615.JAA15336@clulw009.amd.com> Hi It might be some kind of bearing failure detection devise. The switches would be to select the frequency to listen at. In a large shop, with a lot of machines running ( like a printing press ), one needs something check each bearing to see if it about to fail. When a bearing is just starting to go bad, it growls. The frequencies mentioned are in the range one would expect for larger bearings. Dwight >From: "Lawrence Walker" > > No the LED is in the chassis. I started thinking it might be some sort of heart >device timer as the deceased former owner of the auctioned items was quite >elderly. I guess you could use it as a timer strobe. > >Lawrence > >> On Thu, 11 Jul 2002, Lawrence Walker wrote: >> >> > Likely way off topic, but I acquired some sort of frequency device in >> > an auction junk box. It's a well machined device made by MECOS, made >> > in W.Germant. It's about 2" square by 1/2" powered by a Li. battery >> > and has micro-switches labelled 3 hz, 7.8 hz, 14.0 hz and a small led >> > that flashes at the selected frequency. Anyone have any idea what it >> > might be ? >> > >> > A search turned up that MECOS makes Active Magnetic Bearings and >> > control boards and programs. >> >> Could this be some sort of timing device used for calibrating the speed of >> something? Is the led separate from the chassis? >> >> -Toth >> > > >lgwalker@mts.net >bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com > From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Mon Jul 15 11:36:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: New Finds In-Reply-To: <64779.128.146.70.182.1026747903.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> Message-ID: <20020715163430.37671.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> --- Robert F Schaefer wrote: > Speaking of III series LJs, does anyone in or near to Colmbus, Ohio have > a IIIP for parts? I've got one that works fine, but it doesn't have the > paper drawer assembly underneath, and I'm getting tired of feeding it by > hand. I have a II for parts (my working printers are a IIID and a IIISi that needs a transfer pad so it stops picking up multiple pages). If what you need is on it, we can tear it apart and split the bits (I need to keep the fuser roller and a couple other items). Try Ohio State - they usually have a variety of laser printers. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From foo at siconic.com Mon Jul 15 11:46:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: ASR-33's available in Missouri Message-ID: Two ASR-33 teletypes available in Pacific, Missouri. Not free. Anyone interested? Contact me directly . Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From marvin at rain.org Mon Jul 15 12:15:00 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: Sparc 1 Parts References: <20020715163430.37671.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3D3302C9.FB4F954D@rain.org> I took a look at the Sparc 1, and the only thing left was the power supply, video board, and logic board. They seem to be complete except the memory had been pulled. As usual, I have no idea if they work. If nobody wants them (1.2 x shipping), they will head off to the scrap pile by the end of the week. From P.Gebhardt at gmx.de Mon Jul 15 12:18:01 2002 From: P.Gebhardt at gmx.de (P.Gebhardt@gmx.de) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: [CCTECH](no subject) Message-ID: <12712.1026725415@www15.gmx.net> Hello, is it possible to use an EMulex QD32 Controller (Qbus) with a PDP11/23 ? I asked a friend and he told me that the bandwith of the bus could be drifferent. Is it right ? Greetings Pierre -- GMX - Die Kommunikationsplattform im Internet. http://www.gmx.net _______________________________________________ cctech mailing list cctech@classiccmp.org http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From enginr at iglou.com Mon Jul 15 12:19:44 2002 From: enginr at iglou.com (It's Dave) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: EPROM programmers Message-ID: <000601c22c19$b28413c0$d8e6ffcc@accounting> Did you ever find the software & hardware for the Triple Crown 700? Dave Riddle -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020715/b8a1dc64/attachment.html From jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de Mon Jul 15 12:49:00 2002 From: jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de (Jochen Kunz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: EMulex QD32 Controller with a PDP11/23? In-Reply-To: <12712.1026725415@www15.gmx.net>; from P.Gebhardt@gmx.de on Mon, Jul 15, 2002 at 11:30:15 CEST References: <12712.1026725415@www15.gmx.net> Message-ID: <20020715194150.C11086@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> On 2002.07.15 11:30 P.Gebhardt@gmx.de wrote: > is it possible to use an EMulex QD32 Controller (Qbus) with a PDP11/23? Why not? > I asked a friend and he told me that the bandwith of the bus could be > drifferent. You mean the bus with, that is not the same as the bandwith? Perhaps he means that the /23 uses only 18 bit. The first (low end) QBus implementations used only 18 bits for address space. The QD32 can use all 22 bits of a "full blown" QBus. AFAIK you can jumper the QD32 to use only 18 bit adressing. Sorry I have my QD32/33 manual not at my hands... -- tsch??, Jochen Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/ From tbilby at rave.com Mon Jul 15 12:51:00 2002 From: tbilby at rave.com (Tad Bilby) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: SCO Unix and Unixware, Sparc 2 Message-ID: <3D330AED.78F0ACB7@rave.com> I am cleaning house and will scrap the below items if nobody wants them: (free for pickup in greater Detroit area) 1. SCO Unix 3.2.4 All manuals media and boxes with license. 2. SCO Xenix 2.3.4 GT (?) can't remember exactly about p/n 3. SCO OpenServer 5.02 with 2 licenses. 4. SCO Unixware 2.1 (?) if I recall 5. SCO Unixware 7 Items 1 and 2 are fully licensed with books media etc. Items 3-5 are the educational promos with just 2 licenses. 6. Sparc 2 with 128MB RAM, Weitek PowerUp (80MHz) GX framebuffer 500MB HD needs new Sun NVRAM or battery (TOY) I currently program it if I power down via below procedure: e.g. modify the hostid of an IPX to be 57c0ffee and the ethernet address to be 08:00:20:c0:ff:ee. At the OpenBoot monitor prompt (ok) 1 0 mkp 55 1 mkp 8 2 mkp 0 3 mkp 20 4 mkp c0 5 mkp ff 6 mkp ee 7 mkp 0 8 mkp 0 9 mkp 0 a mkp 0 b mkp c0 c mkp ff d mkp ee e mkp 0 f 0 do i idprom@ xor loop f mkp here is the FAQ link: http://www.squirrel.com/sun-nvram-hostid.faq.html -- ---- Tad email: tad at rave dot com ******************************* From RMeenaks at OLF.COM Mon Jul 15 12:57:00 2002 From: RMeenaks at OLF.COM (Ram Meenakshisundaram) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: SCO Unix and Unixware, Sparc 2 Message-ID: <92322E4B3209D511A19100508B558478021E9D54@exchange.olf.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020715/fdb047d2/attachment.html From gstreet at indy.net Mon Jul 15 12:59:00 2002 From: gstreet at indy.net (Robert Greenstreet) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: cctalk digest, Vol 1 #83 - 27 msgs In-Reply-To: <20020715170001.53201.85319.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20020715125635.007e0c90@pop.onemain.com> Hello Dave and Tom, This is my first response to cctalk, so I don't know if it'll "take" or not. Just a couple of comments: I've also got a CRT with crack outer glass. I don't know what type of gel they used to bond the CRT to the outer protective glass, but Tom's suggestion seem plausible--depends on whether or not the "gel" is soluble by acetone and also whether or not the gel is destroyed in the process. Even with optic cement, would it be able to fill large voids left by dissolved gel? I don't have any idea--just asking. If any void remains, it's going to appear as a large "bubble" in your viewing area... Also, I tend to think that gel and protective glass may only be for extra protection. In the "old days" I used to see lots of CRT's that had no protective glass bonded to the front. If you broke the front, you broke the CRT itself. I seem to recall having broken a few of these things with pellet guns when I was much younger and never getting the hoped-for catastrophic implosion (my 6th grade science teacher warned us of when he shot an old TV CRT with a .22 and created a massive and dangerous implosion. Could it be that older and larger tubes were more dangerous for some reason??). I don't know. Maybe the glass is thicker these days. I still respect CRT's, not only for high voltage, but also for possible imposion dangers. Good luck on a solution. Regards, Robert Greenstreet gstreet@indy.net ----------------------------------------------------- Message: 20 Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:16:45 -0500 To: cctalk@classiccmp.org From: Tom Uban Subject: Re: CRT problem Reply-To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Hi Dave, I have a similar problem with a couple of CRTs from my Imlac graphics machine. After doing some research, the I did locate a company which would rebuild the CRT for something like $700, with no guarantee that they would not destroy the tube. They also had expensive replacement tubes, which were not the correct phosphor. Another solution, which I haven't tried yet is to remove the CRT from it's electronics and soak the face in a bath of acetone for an extended period of time (or until the secondary lens is separated from the tube. Once separated, clean and reattach using optic cement. This was suggested by a friend who repairs large antique camera lenses. I'm not sure if acetone will dissolve the cement which holds the lens to the tube, so a pre-test may be a good idea. Some people have indicated a fear of removing the lens from the tube face thinking that the tube may well implode without it. I do not think that will be the case, but I suppose that it is possible. I believe that the lens is simply added protect from day to day use for the face of the tube and is not inherently required to maintain the strength of the tube against the vacuum inside. In any case, as always, great care should be taken to protect you, your eyes, etc. when handling CRTs, as they do carry the risk of implosion. --tom At 10:18 PM 7/15/2002 +1200, you wrote: >I have a 10 or12 inch green screen CRT off an HP 9845B I need to clean up. . >It has been stored in a damp environment and the silicon rubber 'bonding' >the protective glass screen to the front of the CRT proper has developed >large mould spots in side itself for an inch or two around the outside edge >of the screen. I guess I am looking for suggestions as to how to readily >separate theses two glass items without scratching etc so I can clean and >rebond them. I thought at first there was a cavity between the glass on the >CRT face and the protective glass out front- just a seal of silicon rubber >round the edge- but no such luck-- seems like the silicon rubber stuff >covers the whole area of the tube face- so I need to chemically remove it or >?? >Any ideas?? > >The 9845B is running OK- getting a partial memory test failure at boot up >but I don't expect that will be too hard to sort. Anyway-- that's next >week's problem! > >Dave Brown >Christchurch, NZ From Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com Mon Jul 15 13:08:00 2002 From: Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com (Andreas Freiherr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: [CCTECH]PDP11/23 and Emulex Qbus Controller References: <12712.1026725415@www15.gmx.net> <30663.1026735352@www13.gmx.net> Message-ID: <3D330F00.6EBC750F@Vishay.com> Pierre, maybe someone else will provide practical experience with the combination QD32 & 11/23, but my first guess would be that bandwidth is not a problem: as long as all devices on the bus obey all the bus specifications, they should be compatible. Was your friend possibly talking about address width (in other words, the number of address lines on the bus)? - There are three variants, with 16, 18, or 22 address lines. Incompatibilities can arise if a *DMA controller* drives *less* address bits than the system actually uses. Non-DMA controllers have no problem because they never address memory themselves. A typical problem of this type is the RXV211 (RX02 floppy disk controller: DMA, 18 address bits) used in a 22 bit system. The problem can be circumvented in driver software by reserving a buffer area in the lower 256kB of main memory. IIRC, older versions of the 11/23 drive 18 address lines, making them capable of using up to 256kB (or 128kW) of memory. Later models (in particular, the 11/23-PLUS) supply all 22 possible address lines, allowing for up to 4MB (2MW) of RAM. I was told several years ago that some /23s can be upgraded by adding a couple of wires (and maybe a handful of bus drivers). The QD32 is no doubt a DMA controller, but I think I know it is 22 bit. Hence, it should be possible to use this controller in any Qbus system. Also IIRC, the QD32 uses MSCP to communicate with its driver software, so it should not even require any special software: a vanilla DU driver would be OK for RT-11 or RSX-11, for example. Anyone have better information to correct me? Regards, Andreas P.Gebhardt@gmx.de wrote: > Hello, > > is it possible to use an EMulex QD32 Controller (Qbus) with a PDP11/23 ? > I asked a friend and he told me that the bandwith of the bus could be > drifferent. > Is it right ? > > Greetings > > Pierre -- Andreas Freiherr Vishay Semiconductor GmbH, Heilbronn, Germany http://www.vishay.com _______________________________________________ cctech mailing list cctech@classiccmp.org http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From tbilby at rave.com Mon Jul 15 13:10:01 2002 From: tbilby at rave.com (Tad Bilby) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: SCO Unix and Unixware, Sparc 2 References: <92322E4B3209D511A19100508B558478021E9D54@exchange.olf.com> Message-ID: <3D330FCC.26BF60DD@rave.com> I would prefer not to strip a running system, but if nobody claims it I will be happy to pull the CPU. Tad Ram Meenakshisundaram wrote: > > > I'll take the sparc 2's weitek powerup processor if possible... > > Ram > > -----Original Message----- > From: Tad Bilby [mailto:tbilby@rave.com] > Sent: Monday, July 15, 2002 1:48 PM > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: SCO Unix and Unixware, Sparc 2 > > I am cleaning house and will scrap the below items > if nobody wants them: (free for pickup in greater > Detroit area) > > 1. SCO Unix 3.2.4 All manuals media and boxes with license. > 2. SCO Xenix 2.3.4 GT (?) can't remember exactly about p/n > 3. SCO OpenServer 5.02 with 2 licenses. > 4. SCO Unixware 2.1 (?) if I recall > 5. SCO Unixware 7 > > Items 1 and 2 are fully licensed with books media etc. > Items 3-5 are the educational promos with just 2 licenses. > > 6. Sparc 2 with 128MB RAM, > Weitek PowerUp (80MHz) > GX framebuffer > 500MB HD > needs new Sun NVRAM or battery (TOY) > I currently program it if I power down via below procedure: > e.g. modify the hostid of an IPX to be 57c0ffee and the > ethernet address to be 08:00:20:c0:ff:ee. At the OpenBoot > monitor prompt (ok) > > 1 0 mkp > 55 1 mkp > 8 2 mkp > 0 3 mkp > 20 4 mkp > c0 5 mkp > ff 6 mkp > ee 7 mkp > 0 8 mkp > 0 9 mkp > 0 a mkp > 0 b mkp > c0 c mkp > ff d mkp > ee e mkp > 0 f 0 do i idprom@ xor loop f mkp > > here is the FAQ link: > http://www.squirrel.com/sun-nvram-hostid.faq.html > > -- > ---- > Tad > email: tad at rave dot com > ******************************* > > > ? 2002 OpenLink Financial > > Copyright in this message and any attachments remains with us. It is > confidential and may be legally privileged. If this message is not > intended for you it must not be read, copied or used by you or > disclosed to anyone else. Please advise the sender immediately if > you have received this message in error. > > Although this message and any attachments are believed to be free of > any virus or other defect that might affect any computer system into > which it is received and opened, it is the responsibility of the > recipient to ensure that it is virus free and no responsibility > is accepted by Open Link Financial, Inc. for any loss or damage in any > way arising from its use. > -- ---- Tad Bilby Rave Computer Assoc. Technical Support 800-966-7283 x224 tbilby@rave.com ******************************* From mythtech at mac.com Mon Jul 15 13:55:01 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: New Finds Message-ID: > I'm surprised Chris hasn't asked about those HP LJIIs yet. There's a >IIID here waiting for him. Still. :) > Or did he reply privately? Nah... too broke to afford shipping anything else around. But thanks for reminding me that I have to take a drive up to you to pick up the remaining "stuff" (junk is a little harsh of a word, but may fit some of it better). We'll have to hash out a good time off list. -chris From coredump at gifford.co.uk Mon Jul 15 14:00:00 2002 From: coredump at gifford.co.uk (John Honniball) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: [CCTECH]74123 woes References: <5.1.0.14.0.20020715023643.02176080@postoffice.pacbell.net> Message-ID: <3D331AAB.DAE76EDE@gifford.co.uk> Jim Battle wrote: > Anyway, I found and fixed the first problem: one of the satellite circuit > boards on the persci had a tantalum cap that had a dead short, taking out > the whole +24V power supply... Yes, that's a typical failure mode for tantalums! > Secondly, I haven't done board-level design in more than 10 years, but from > what I recall, 99 times out of 100 when I thought I had tracked down a bug > to a back chip, it was something else (then again, that was during design, > not just working on ostensibly correctly designed boards). Until recently, I'd have blamed something other than a 74 logic chip just going bad. However, I've seen a few chips do just that in RL01 disk drives, which must be about the same age as your chips (late 1970s.) So, I'd say it's possible that the 74123 has just ceased to function "all by itself". Due to age, that is, not due to external factors. In the end though, it's up to you to decide whether you suspect chip failure enough to warrant replacing it (with all the associated taking apart, soldering and putting together again). -- John Honniball coredump@gifford.co.uk _______________________________________________ cctech mailing list cctech@classiccmp.org http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From lists at subatomix.com Mon Jul 15 15:00:19 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: Test Message, Ignore Message-ID: <158131631616.20020715145811@subatomix.com> Testing new feature. From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Mon Jul 15 15:09:00 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: [CCTECH]74123 woes Message-ID: <200207152008.NAA15459@clulw009.amd.com> >From: "John Honniball" > >Jim Battle wrote: >> Anyway, I found and fixed the first problem: one of the satellite circuit >> boards on the persci had a tantalum cap that had a dead short, taking out >> the whole +24V power supply... > >Yes, that's a typical failure mode for tantalums! > >> Secondly, I haven't done board-level design in more than 10 years, but from >> what I recall, 99 times out of 100 when I thought I had tracked down a bug >> to a back chip, it was something else (then again, that was during design, >> not just working on ostensibly correctly designed boards). > >Until recently, I'd have blamed something other than a 74 logic chip >just going bad. However, I've seen a few chips do just that in RL01 >disk drives, which must be about the same age as your chips (late >1970s.) > >So, I'd say it's possible that the 74123 has just ceased to function >"all by itself". Due to age, that is, not due to external factors. >In the end though, it's up to you to decide whether you suspect chip >failure enough to warrant replacing it (with all the associated taking >apart, soldering and putting together again). > Hi The capacitors used with 74123's tend to fail over time because they are slightly back biased at the of the discharge part of the cycle. This does in tantalums and electrolytics, over time. Non-polar parts are usually OK. Dwight From lists at subatomix.com Mon Jul 15 15:31:12 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: IMPORTANT LIST CHANGES Message-ID: <157133449870.20020715152830@subatomix.com> This is your interim list admin speaking. Jay and I have been working together to bring about a major change for the better for the ClassicCmp mailing list system. It is important that you read this entire message. Ever since the two-list system was implemented earlier this year, cctalk and cctech have been somewhat separate communities. Posts from cctech were automagically forwarded to cctalk, but no posts from cctalk were forwarded to cctech. This could result in many on-topic conversations taking place in cctalk but never reaching cctech, which greatly detracted from cctech's value. This is no longer the case. As of a few minutes ago, all posts to cctalk will be forwarded to cctech. Each one will be subject to moderation, where I will weed out any off-topic posts. All posts to cctech are still forwarded to cctalk as they have been. In effect, the list has become a single unified ClassicCmp again, but now with two interfaces. All on-topic posts to either list will be sent to both lists. Off-topic posts will only be sent to cctalk. Subscribers to cctech won't be left out of the conversation. In a related change, posts to cctech will no longer have the "[CCTECH]" string prepended to their subject headers. This change may slightly adversely affect some subscribers. If you are subscribed to both cctalk and cctech, you will need to either unsubscribe from one of them or set the "no-mail" option on one of them. If you do not do this, you will receive two copies of each on-topic message. If you do stay subscribed to both lists, please exercise extreme caution when posting. Your messages will forward between the two lists without generally being subjected to moderator approval. Do not post off-topic messages when your subscription is configured in this way. Thanks, and enjoy the new ClassicCmp! Look for a new web site and FAQ soon! -- Jeffrey Sharp The email address lists@subatomix.com is for mailing list traffic. Please send off-list mail to roach jay ess ess at wasp subatomix beetle dot com. You may need to remove some bugs first. From tractorb at ihug.co.nz Mon Jul 15 16:09:01 2002 From: tractorb at ihug.co.nz (Dave Brown) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: CRT problem References: <3.0.6.16.20020620143422.443f66fe@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <5.1.1.6.0.20020715090317.01b57858@ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <009701c22c43$b7c83ee0$0101a8c0@athlon> Tks for comments, Tom. > Another solution, which I haven't tried yet is to remove the CRT from it's > electronics > and soak the face in a bath of acetone Thats the sort of thing I had in mind- cost of replacement is likely to be prohibitive-as you suggest! A 50/50 mix of acetic and formic acids is reputed to dissolve epoxy resin but is probably not the best in this case as the stuff I have described as silicon rubber is probably something else but looks very similar. I need to find out exactly what it is I guess and then look for a solvent. > > Some people have indicated a fear of removing the lens from the tube face > thinking > that the tube may well implode without it. I had expected the front protective screen to be either totally separate (as it often was in very old tv sets etc) or only 'bonded' round the screen edge but the bonding material plus front glass is obviously intended to form a better lens/protective arrangement as well as better screen vision from the tinting in the added glass. Been working with CRTs a lot over the years and have not had an accidental implosion yet - but it certainlay pays to always be protected in case. Cheers Dave From pete at dunnington.u-net.com Mon Jul 15 16:43:01 2002 From: pete at dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:05 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: Gooijen H "RE: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70" (Jul 15, 10:14) References: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EBB@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Message-ID: <10207152243.ZM14549@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> On Jul 15, 10:14, Gooijen H wrote: > - The "golden" tip from Tony. Removed the M9302. > No more hung! XBUF status shows octal 200 (indicating TX buffer > empty, ready to receive byte to transmit). Store octal 71 in the > TX buffer and a "9" appears on the VT320!! > Basically, I have a complete working machine, but ... > - Put an M930 as terminator in the 11/70. Still all is fine. > - Put an onther M9302 (from the working 11/34C) in the 11/70. > The hung is back. I got caught by that exact same thing a few months ago, and once again it was Tony who reminded me of what I once knew: the 9302 makes it hang if the grant chain is broken. I was tidying up an 11/34 which I was trading to a friend, moved some boards, forgot an NPR jumper, and spent two days trying to figure out why the RUN light came on and I couldn't HALT the CPU. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York From archer at topnow.com Mon Jul 15 16:49:17 2002 From: archer at topnow.com (Ross Archer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: "modern" CP/M system? Message-ID: <3D33430E.174CA8AF@topnow.com> Hi, I noted off a link on this list that somebody had implemented a "modern" CP/M SBC based on the Z180 CPU. This, unfortunately, is no longer being made. With the rise of retrocomputing (The new IMSAI and the upcoming Commodore C=1 come to mind), I was wondering if anybody knew of at least a PCB solution with a ready-made CP/M port? Also, are there any good "CP/M internals" books I should be looking out for in the used bookshops? Preferably with enough detail to understand what's needed to do a port? P.S.: I'd love to see CP/M running at 20+ Mhz. :) -- Ross From groovelists at yahoo.com Mon Jul 15 16:56:11 2002 From: groovelists at yahoo.com (Andy Berg) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: Mark-8 *Faints* Message-ID: <20020715215456.34530.qmail@web20508.mail.yahoo.com> 'Evening all! :) I don't quite know what to say... I suppose I just wanted to tell some people. I'd purchased a computer on ebay listed as, "another VERY EARLY HOMEBREW COMPUTER," a while back for $9.00. It didn't come in a bit over a month... I contacted the owner and waited some more, but had pretty much given up hope on it. It arrived today... I peered about inside... It appears to be a Mark-8. Has at least the same CPU board... I came very close to thumping onto the floor... It has a homebuilt case... it's about sewing machine sized. It has 8 ports of some type, a tape port, a control port. Inside, it has the CPU board, some input type board, some output type board, a board labelled add, and 2 1011 1k memory cards, all attached to a homemade bus. I know it is missing at least a 74xx something chip and the power supply, but... I'll put up pictures of it sometime in the next day or two. Thanks for hearing me rant! :) Oh yes! Thanks, too, to the kindly people who helped me out with the AT&T 3B1 - your help was so very appreciated! :) Andy ___________________ grooveman@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From pete at dunnington.u-net.com Mon Jul 15 17:03:00 2002 From: pete at dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: CRT problem In-Reply-To: Tom Uban "Re: CRT problem" (Jul 15, 9:16) References: <3.0.6.16.20020620143422.443f66fe@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <5.1.1.6.0.20020715090317.01b57858@ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <10207152259.ZM14562@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> On Jul 15, 9:16, Tom Uban wrote: > Hi Dave, > > Another solution, which I haven't tried yet is to remove the CRT from it's > electronics > and soak the face in a bath of acetone for an extended period of time (or > until the > secondary lens is separated from the tube. Once separated, clean and reattach > using optic cement. This was suggested by a friend who repairs large antique > camera lenses. I'm not sure if acetone will dissolve the cement which holds the > lens to the tube, so a pre-test may be a good idea. If the substance bonding the front glass to the the CRT is some sort of RTV silicone compound, you might be able to remove it with silicone sealant remover. I don't know exactly what's in that stuff, but plumbers use it to remove old silicone sealant from shower panels, tiles, and fittings. You might be able to get it from a plumbers' supplier. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York From healyzh at aracnet.com Mon Jul 15 17:06:00 2002 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: "modern" CP/M system? In-Reply-To: from "Ross Archer" at Jul 15, 2002 02:47:58 PM Message-ID: <200207152204.g6FM4TJ13309@shell1.aracnet.com> > P.S.: I'd love to see CP/M running at 20+ Mhz. :) > > -- Ross You could always try CP/M-86 then, I've had it up around 266Mhz. Zane From davebarnes at adelphia.net Mon Jul 15 17:38:00 2002 From: davebarnes at adelphia.net (David Barnes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: [CCTECH](no subject) References: <12712.1026725415@www15.gmx.net> Message-ID: <3D335D40.304568A1@adelphia.net> should work fine with no problem... I used one for years. P.Gebhardt@gmx.de wrote: > Hello, > > is it possible to use an EMulex QD32 Controller (Qbus) with a PDP11/23 ? > I asked a friend and he told me that the bandwith of the bus could be > drifferent. > Is it right ? > > Greetings > > Pierre > > -- > GMX - Die Kommunikationsplattform im Internet. > http://www.gmx.net > > _______________________________________________ > cctech mailing list > cctech@classiccmp.org > http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech From jhellige at earthlink.net Mon Jul 15 17:49:01 2002 From: jhellige at earthlink.net (Jeff Hellige) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: more stuff available In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20020715090317.01b57858@ubanproductions.com> References: <3.0.6.16.20020620143422.443f66fe@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <5.1.1.6.0.20020715090317.01b57858@ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: Still trying to cut things down a bit so have the following available. Due to the size and weight I would prefer someone local. - DEC Pro380 lots of stuff ,including the ethernet and TMS options. also various manuals and microfiche. Is in the pedestal case. not yellowed at all. POS loaded on the hard disk. - DEC DECmate II color and APU options. It was handled very roughly at some point and the hard disk drive rails broke apart on the case. Likely would need a new hard disk. some manuals. - Coleco ADAM memory console with printer and keyboard. I have just a single VR201 and LK201 to go with both DEC machines. The LK201 is labled for use with WPS on the DECmate II. Thanks Jeff -- Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File http://www.cchaven.com http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757 From jhellige at earthlink.net Mon Jul 15 17:53:01 2002 From: jhellige at earthlink.net (Jeff Hellige) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: more stuff available In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.6.16.20020620143422.443f66fe@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <5.1.1.6.0.20020715090317.01b57858@ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: Ooops...it's all located just outside of Washington D.C. Jeff > Still trying to cut things down a bit so have the following >available. Due to the size and weight I would prefer someone local. > > - DEC Pro380 > lots of stuff ,including the ethernet and TMS >options. also various manuals and microfiche. Is in the pedestal >case. not yellowed at all. POS loaded on the hard disk. > > - DEC DECmate II > color and APU options. It was handled very roughly >at some point and the hard disk drive rails broke apart on the case. >Likely would need a new hard disk. some manuals. > > - Coleco ADAM memory console with printer and keyboard. > > I have just a single VR201 and LK201 to go with both DEC >machines. The LK201 is labled for use with WPS on the DECmate II. > > Thanks > Jeff > >-- > Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File > http://www.cchaven.com > http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757 -- Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File http://www.cchaven.com http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757 From foo at siconic.com Mon Jul 15 18:13:13 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: Mark-8 *Faints* In-Reply-To: <20020715215456.34530.qmail@web20508.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Jul 2002, Andy Berg wrote: > I don't quite know what to say... I suppose I just wanted to tell some > people. I'd purchased a computer on ebay listed as, "another VERY EARLY > HOMEBREW COMPUTER," a while back for $9.00. It didn't come in a bit over > a month... I contacted the owner and waited some more, but had pretty > much given up hope on it. It arrived today... I peered about inside... > It appears to be a Mark-8. Has at least the same CPU board... I came > very close to thumping onto the floor... It has a homebuilt case... it's > about sewing machine sized. It has 8 ports of some type, a tape port, a > control port. Inside, it has the CPU board, some input type board, some > output type board, a board labelled add, and 2 1011 1k memory cards, all > attached to a homemade bus. I know it is missing at least a 74xx > something chip and the power supply, but... I'll put up pictures of it > sometime in the next day or two. Wow! What an amazing find! And on eBay no less, and for only $9. This is some sort of omen for the beginning of the end perhaps :) I look forward to the pictures. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From pat at purdueriots.com Mon Jul 15 18:29:01 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: can someone ID a DEC board? Message-ID: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2038627297 Seller says it's an m8719, and that's not listed in the Unibus/QBus handbook of cards. Any idea what this is? -- Pat From foo at siconic.com Mon Jul 15 18:29:37 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: Documents need (bounty $$$) Message-ID: I have a bounty outstanding for the following: Early 1990s data sheet for the HP HCPL-7800 Isolation Amplifier Government Microcircuit Applications Conference (GOMAC) Proceedings for 1986 & 1990 If you have these, please contact me directly . Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 15 18:31:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: [CCTECH]74123 woes In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20020715023643.02176080@postoffice.pacbell.net> from "Jim Battle" at Jul 15, 2 02:53:28 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1584 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020715/fe4c981e/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 15 18:31:31 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: CRT problem In-Reply-To: <008701c22be9$0353e7c0$0101a8c0@athlon> from "Dave Brown" at Jul 15, 2 10:18:49 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1451 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020715/25368bee/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 15 18:31:48 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: CRT problem In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20020715090317.01b57858@ubanproductions.com> from "Tom Uban" at Jul 15, 2 09:16:45 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 997 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020715/43c6c2cf/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 15 18:32:16 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EBB@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> from "Gooijen H" at Jul 15, 2 10:14:11 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2092 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020715/3f0e84f2/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 15 18:33:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EBC@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> from "Gooijen H" at Jul 15, 2 10:27:19 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 986 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020715/b8b6c972/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 15 18:33:19 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: cctalk digest, Vol 1 #83 - 27 msgs In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20020715125635.007e0c90@pop.onemain.com> from "Robert Greenstreet" at Jul 15, 2 12:56:35 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1366 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020715/003da39c/attachment.ksh From healyzh at aracnet.com Mon Jul 15 18:50:01 2002 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: can someone ID a DEC board? In-Reply-To: from "Patrick Finnegan" at Jul 15, 2002 06:27:51 PM Message-ID: <200207152349.g6FNnFd17947@shell1.aracnet.com> > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2038627297 > > Seller says it's an m8719, and that's not listed in the Unibus/QBus > handbook of cards. Any idea what this is? > > -- Pat Good question, it's not in the "YET ANOTHER DEC MODULE LIST" at ftp://zane.brouhaha.com/pub/ModuleList.txt either, which trys to contain all the non-Unibus and non-Qbus boards. I suppose it is possible that it belongs in a tape drive or some such. Zane From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Mon Jul 15 18:55:01 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: [CCTECH]74123 woes References: Message-ID: <3D335FC8.8090905@jetnet.ab.ca> Tony Duell wrote: >>Here is where I need advice. I can't find my TTL databook, but it would >>appear that the trigger inputs are edge triggered, not level triggered, right? The 74LS123 will trigger on the rising edge on the clear input if A = L , B = H. The 74123 does not. -- Ben Franchuk - Dawn * 12/24 bit cpu * www.jetnet.ab.ca/users/bfranchuk/index.html From mbg at TheWorld.com Mon Jul 15 18:55:19 2002 From: mbg at TheWorld.com (Megan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: can someone ID a DEC board? Message-ID: <200207152354.TAA29800041@shell.TheWorld.com> Checking my bible... M8719 Unibus to D-Bus cable (I/O Daisy chain bus) control and interface. Where used = IP112 Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | email: gentry at zk3.dec.com (work) | | Unix Support Engineering Group | mbg at world.std.com (home) | | Hewlett Packard | (s/ at /@/) | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 (DEC '77-'98) | required." - mbg KB1FCA | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ p.s. Looks like another one to make sure I include in the update to the field guide, which I'm working on... From carlos_murillo at epm.net.co Mon Jul 15 18:56:01 2002 From: carlos_murillo at epm.net.co (Carlos Murillo) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: book finds Message-ID: <3.0.2.32.20020715195343.0078caf8@pop1.epm.net.co> I went to Bogota this weekend and found some good books, including: -VAX Architecture Reference Manual (1987) -Samuel Seely, Electron Tube Circuits, 2nd. Ed., McGraw-Hill (1958). This book is a gem. I saw it once at a library a long time ago and had been looking for it ever since. -A. Khinchin, A Course of Mathematical Analysis, translated from the 3rd. russian ed. and published by Hindustan Publishing Corp., Delhi, India. Not CC related but a real find. I paid less than $3 for all three books. Something to calm the collecting itch for a few days :-) . -------------------------------------------------------------- Carlos E. Murillo-Sanchez carlos_murillo@nospammers.ieee.org From jim at jkearney.com Mon Jul 15 19:42:00 2002 From: jim at jkearney.com (Jim Kearney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: Mark-8 *Faints* References: <20020715215456.34530.qmail@web20508.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001001c22c61$66124b40$1301090a@xpace.net> Rats! I had noted that auction, and was planning on bidding, but ended up being away from the computer for the last few days of it. Anyway, if you need any help getting it running, drop me a line. I ended up with a pretty good knowledge of the design after debugging mine (recent construction, but original design). Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Berg" To: Sent: Monday, July 15, 2002 5:54 PM Subject: Mark-8 *Faints* > 'Evening all! :) > > I don't quite know what to say... I suppose I just > wanted to tell some people. I'd purchased a computer > on ebay listed as, "another VERY EARLY HOMEBREW > COMPUTER," a while back for $9.00. It didn't come in a > bit over a month... I contacted the owner and waited > some more, but had pretty much given up hope on it. It > arrived today... I peered about inside... It appears > to be a Mark-8. Has at least the same CPU board... I > came very close to thumping onto the floor... It has a > homebuilt case... it's about sewing machine sized. It > has 8 ports of some type, a tape port, a control port. > Inside, it has the CPU board, some input type board, > some output type board, a board labelled add, and 2 > 1011 1k memory cards, all attached to a homemade bus. > I know it is missing at least a 74xx something chip > and the power supply, but... I'll put up pictures of > it sometime in the next day or two. > > Thanks for hearing me rant! :) > > Oh yes! Thanks, too, to the kindly people who helped > me out with the AT&T 3B1 - your help was so very > appreciated! :) > > Andy > ___________________ > grooveman@yahoo.com > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes > http://autos.yahoo.com > From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 15 20:21:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: [CCTECH]74123 woes In-Reply-To: <3D335FC8.8090905@jetnet.ab.ca> from "Ben Franchuk" at Jul 15, 2 05:50:32 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1010 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020715/542cc353/attachment.ksh From sloboyko at yahoo.com Mon Jul 15 21:37:01 2002 From: sloboyko at yahoo.com (Loboyko Steve) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: Mark-8 *Faints* In-Reply-To: <001001c22c61$66124b40$1301090a@xpace.net> Message-ID: <20020716023548.66078.qmail@web11802.mail.yahoo.com> And they say that there are no bargains on eBay...bargains can be had by the patient and / or lucky! Are you SURE what you have isn't a SCELBI? (the 8 portsYour description sounds scelbi-like. Please let us know when pictures are up. --- Jim Kearney wrote: > Rats! I had noted that auction, and was planning on > bidding, but ended up > being away from the computer for the last few days > of it. > > Anyway, if you need any help getting it running, > drop me a line. I ended up > with a pretty good knowledge of the design after > debugging mine (recent > construction, but original design). > > Jim > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Andy Berg" > To: > Sent: Monday, July 15, 2002 5:54 PM > Subject: Mark-8 *Faints* > > > > 'Evening all! :) > > > > I don't quite know what to say... I suppose I just > > wanted to tell some people. I'd purchased a > computer > > on ebay listed as, "another VERY EARLY HOMEBREW > > COMPUTER," a while back for $9.00. It didn't come > in a > > bit over a month... I contacted the owner and > waited > > some more, but had pretty much given up hope on > it. It > > arrived today... I peered about inside... It > appears > > to be a Mark-8. Has at least the same CPU board... > I > > came very close to thumping onto the floor... It > has a > > homebuilt case... it's about sewing machine sized. > It > > has 8 ports of some type, a tape port, a control > port. > > Inside, it has the CPU board, some input type > board, > > some output type board, a board labelled add, and > 2 > > 1011 1k memory cards, all attached to a homemade > bus. > > I know it is missing at least a 74xx something > chip > > and the power supply, but... I'll put up pictures > of > > it sometime in the next day or two. > > > > Thanks for hearing me rant! :) > > > > Oh yes! Thanks, too, to the kindly people who > helped > > me out with the AT&T 3B1 - your help was so very > > appreciated! :) > > > > Andy > > ___________________ > > grooveman@yahoo.com > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes > > http://autos.yahoo.com > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From groovelists at yahoo.com Mon Jul 15 21:51:13 2002 From: groovelists at yahoo.com (Andy Berg) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: Mark-8??? Popped some pictures up. In-Reply-To: <20020716023548.66078.qmail@web11802.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20020716024949.41883.qmail@web20502.mail.yahoo.com> Hi! :) Whelp... I actually lack total confidence as to what it is. :\ The CPU board, at least looks like a Mark-8 one. Alas, I don't have anything that looks like the LED output board, but there also doesn't seem to be a slot for one. :( I've popped some pictures up at: http://66.30.18.171/MARK8/ - please forgive if it is a bit slow - 'tis on a cable modem. (I put it up under MARK8, but I truly don't know. :( ) If something doesn't work, please don't hesitate to toss a note this way! --- Loboyko Steve wrote: > And they say that there are no bargains on > eBay...bargains can be had by the patient and / or > lucky! > > Are you SURE what you have isn't a SCELBI? (the 8 > portsYour description sounds scelbi-like. Please let > us know when pictures are up. > > --- Jim Kearney wrote: > > Rats! I had noted that auction, and was planning > on > > bidding, but ended up > > being away from the computer for the last few days > > of it. > > > > Anyway, if you need any help getting it running, > > drop me a line. I ended up > > with a pretty good knowledge of the design after > > debugging mine (recent > > construction, but original design). > > > > Jim Thanks kindly for the offer. I truly, truly do appreciate your kindness and intellectual generosity - it means a lot to me. Thanks, Andy _____________________ groovelists@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From sloboyko at yahoo.com Mon Jul 15 22:17:00 2002 From: sloboyko at yahoo.com (Loboyko Steve) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: Mark-8??? Popped some pictures up. In-Reply-To: <20020716024949.41883.qmail@web20502.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20020716031528.49495.qmail@web11807.mail.yahoo.com> This does look like a Mark-8 that's been modified (rather craftily) to use a plug backplane. I'll bet the control socket on the front is where the Front panel (or maybe EPROM or ROM or maybe even diode?) board would go. Keep in mind that ROMs of any kind were very expensive in 1974-6 for a home budget, and no one had programmers. There's a lot of glare on the 8008 CPU but I think this is an example of a VERY early package (there are at least 2 types of C8008 packages). If you actually intend to get this going, I'd be concerned about the Molex sockets. They are constructed using PURE EVIL and were unreliable when new. Judging from the chips utilized (some no-name chips) and the sockets I suspect that this was built by a very skilled hobbyist, probably an engineer or senior technician working at home. Also, definitely check that you have +5 and -9 on the 8008. You could damage it with one missing (and never mind the 1101's). Someone mentioned to me at the xtal on the mark-8 was optional, and you might have an RC oscillator and one-shots on there instead. The clock was 2-phase and would require a scope to adjust so if you see pots don't adjust them. --- Andy Berg wrote: > Hi! :) > > Whelp... I actually lack total confidence as to what > it is. :\ The CPU board, at least looks like a > Mark-8 > one. Alas, I don't have anything that looks like the > LED output board, but there also doesn't seem to be > a > slot for one. :( > > I've popped some pictures up at: > http://66.30.18.171/MARK8/ - please forgive if it is > a > bit slow - 'tis on a cable modem. (I put it up under > MARK8, but I truly don't know. :( ) > > If something doesn't work, please don't hesitate to > toss a note this way! > > > --- Loboyko Steve wrote: > > And they say that there are no bargains on > > eBay...bargains can be had by the patient and / or > > lucky! > > > > Are you SURE what you have isn't a SCELBI? (the 8 > > portsYour description sounds scelbi-like. Please > let > > us know when pictures are up. > > > > --- Jim Kearney wrote: > > > Rats! I had noted that auction, and was > planning > > on > > > bidding, but ended up > > > being away from the computer for the last few > days > > > of it. > > > > > > Anyway, if you need any help getting it running, > > > drop me a line. I ended up > > > with a pretty good knowledge of the design after > > > debugging mine (recent > > > construction, but original design). > > > > > > Jim > > Thanks kindly for the offer. I truly, truly do > appreciate your kindness and intellectual generosity > - > it means a lot to me. > > Thanks, > Andy > _____________________ > groovelists@yahoo.com > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes > http://autos.yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From jim at jkearney.com Mon Jul 15 22:20:01 2002 From: jim at jkearney.com (Jim Kearney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: Mark-8??? Popped some pictures up. References: <20020716024949.41883.qmail@web20502.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <00ab01c22c77$7e98d1f0$1301090a@xpace.net> Definitely a heavily modified Mark-8. Look at the board prints towards the end of http://www.jkearney.com/8008/Mark-8.pdf ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Berg" To: Sent: Monday, July 15, 2002 10:49 PM Subject: Re: Mark-8??? Popped some pictures up. > Hi! :) > > Whelp... I actually lack total confidence as to what > it is. :\ The CPU board, at least looks like a Mark-8 > one. Alas, I don't have anything that looks like the > LED output board, but there also doesn't seem to be a > slot for one. :( > > I've popped some pictures up at: > http://66.30.18.171/MARK8/ - please forgive if it is a > bit slow - 'tis on a cable modem. (I put it up under > MARK8, but I truly don't know. :( ) > > If something doesn't work, please don't hesitate to > toss a note this way! > > > --- Loboyko Steve wrote: > > And they say that there are no bargains on > > eBay...bargains can be had by the patient and / or > > lucky! > > > > Are you SURE what you have isn't a SCELBI? (the 8 > > portsYour description sounds scelbi-like. Please let > > us know when pictures are up. > > > > --- Jim Kearney wrote: > > > Rats! I had noted that auction, and was planning > > on > > > bidding, but ended up > > > being away from the computer for the last few days > > > of it. > > > > > > Anyway, if you need any help getting it running, > > > drop me a line. I ended up > > > with a pretty good knowledge of the design after > > > debugging mine (recent > > > construction, but original design). > > > > > > Jim > > Thanks kindly for the offer. I truly, truly do > appreciate your kindness and intellectual generosity - > it means a lot to me. > > Thanks, > Andy > _____________________ > groovelists@yahoo.com > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes > http://autos.yahoo.com > From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Mon Jul 15 22:24:01 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: [CCTECH]74123 woes References: Message-ID: <3D3390E0.6040209@jetnet.ab.ca> > Odd. The TI databooks I've looked in (both versions) show the _same_ > function table for the '123 and 'LS123 (and the older edition includes > the 'L123 in the same table). All devices claim to trigger on a rising > edge of clear under the specified conditions. The Philips databook I have > only lists the '123, and yes, it is claimed to trigger that way too. This was Fairchild application notes. Something I found on the web. > I will admit I've not tried it, in fact I try to avoid using monostables. > So either the databooks are wrong (which is entirely possible), or this > is a manufacturer-specific thing. I think National may also be the same. -- Ben Franchuk - Dawn * 12/24 bit cpu * www.jetnet.ab.ca/users/bfranchuk/index.html From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Mon Jul 15 22:32:01 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: [CCTECH]74123 woes References: Message-ID: <3D3392AB.8040303@jetnet.ab.ca> BTW the timing notes for the Fairchild 123 are tw = .34 * R * C * ( 1 + .7 * R ) for the 74123 and tw = .37 * R * C for 74LS123. C >> 1000 pf and R >= 5 K -- Ben Franchuk - Dawn * 12/24 bit cpu * www.jetnet.ab.ca/users/bfranchuk/index.html From groovelists at yahoo.com Mon Jul 15 22:54:18 2002 From: groovelists at yahoo.com (Andy Berg) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: Mark-8??? Popped some pictures up. In-Reply-To: <20020716031528.49495.qmail@web11807.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20020716035256.11727.qmail@web20507.mail.yahoo.com> Very nifty! It is so amazing to have such knowledgable people a click away - you all are great! :) I promise I'll stay away from the pots. I don't know exactly what my immediate plans are for the fellow, ahm... I'd love to get it up and working sometime. I'll peer about online and see if I can scare up a suitable surplus power supply of some type. This is perhaps the oldest machine I've had the chance to work on... I'm quite excited, but, I think somewhat rightfully, nervous. Oh! I don't know if anybody would like such a thing, but I put a little bit clearer picture of the CPU up at: http://66.30.18.171/MARK8/CPU3.jpg (Big file warning: ~420K) --- Loboyko Steve wrote: > This does look like a Mark-8 that's been modified > (rather craftily) to use a plug backplane. > > I'll bet the control socket on the front is where > the > Front panel (or maybe EPROM or ROM or maybe even > diode?) board would go. Keep in mind that ROMs of > any > kind were very expensive in 1974-6 for a home > budget, > and no one had programmers. > > There's a lot of glare on the 8008 CPU but I think > this is an example of a VERY early package (there > are > at least 2 types of C8008 packages). > > If you actually intend to get this going, I'd be > concerned about the Molex sockets. They are > constructed using PURE EVIL and were unreliable when > new. Judging from the chips utilized (some no-name > chips) and the sockets I suspect that this was built > by a very skilled hobbyist, probably an engineer or > senior technician working at home. > > Also, definitely check that you have +5 and -9 on > the > 8008. You could damage it with one missing (and > never > mind the 1101's). > > Someone mentioned to me at the xtal on the mark-8 > was > optional, and you might have an RC oscillator and > one-shots on there instead. The clock was 2-phase > and > would require a scope to adjust so if you see pots > don't adjust them. Thanks for the terrific PDF - I was hoping that some kind person might've put the scans up as you did. Some bedtime reading material, I think. and --- Jim Kearney wrote: > Definitely a heavily modified Mark-8. Look at the > board prints towards the > end of http://www.jkearney.com/8008/Mark-8.pdf Thanks again for everything! Andy _____________________ groovelists@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Mon Jul 15 22:57:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: NPR and the RX11 (was Re: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020716035557.52652.qmail@web10306.mail.yahoo.com> --- Tony Duell wrote: > THat's right. Later cards (like the DZ11) do short CA1 to CB1. Older > cards (DL11, RX11, etc) don't. This suggests that the RX11 is not a DMA device. Is that so? I never played with 8" floppies much with Unibus, mostly with OMNIBUS and Qbus. I have an RX11 but it's in an 11/05 that I haven't dug down to yet. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From lgwalker at mts.net Mon Jul 15 23:16:01 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: OT: MECOS frequency device ? In-Reply-To: <200207151615.JAA15336@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: <3D335771.17800.C24FA0E@localhost> That sounds plausable since MECOS makes Active Magnetic Bearings. I drove taxi part-time some 20 years ago and listened in fascination to a software engineer who had developed a program to use frequencies to check for metal stress on large process machines thereby eliminating regular inspections with expensive shutdowns . His manufacturer host had just flown him in to Toronto from the US and they were discussing the process. Lawrence > Hi > It might be some kind of bearing failure detection > devise. The switches would be to select the frequency > to listen at. In a large shop, with a lot of machines > running ( like a printing press ), one needs something > check each bearing to see if it about to fail. When > a bearing is just starting to go bad, it growls. > The frequencies mentioned are in the range one would > expect for larger bearings. > Dwight > > > >From: "Lawrence Walker" > > > > No the LED is in the chassis. I started thinking it might be some sort of > heart > >device timer as the deceased former owner of the auctioned items was quite > >elderly. I guess you could use it as a timer strobe. > > > >Lawrence > > > >> On Thu, 11 Jul 2002, Lawrence Walker wrote: > >> > >> > Likely way off topic, but I acquired some sort of frequency device in > >> > an auction junk box. It's a well machined device made by MECOS, made > >> > in W.Germant. It's about 2" square by 1/2" powered by a Li. battery > >> > and has micro-switches labelled 3 hz, 7.8 hz, 14.0 hz and a small led > >> > that flashes at the selected frequency. Anyone have any idea what it > >> > might be ? > >> > > >> > A search turned up that MECOS makes Active Magnetic Bearings and > >> > control boards and programs. > >> > >> Could this be some sort of timing device used for calibrating the speed of > >> something? Is the led separate from the chassis? > >> > >> -Toth > >> > > > > > >lgwalker@mts.net > >bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com > > > > lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From mbg at TheWorld.com Mon Jul 15 23:23:00 2002 From: mbg at TheWorld.com (Megan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: NPR and the RX11 (was Re: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70) Message-ID: <200207160418.AAA28747975@shell.TheWorld.com> The RX11 isn't DMA... when you give a command, it reads to a silo which the driver has to dump, a character at a time, or writes the silo which has been written, a character at a time... I just checked the RT-11 RX01 driver source to confirm it... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | email: gentry at zk3.dec.com (work) | | Unix Support Engineering Group | mbg at world.std.com (home) | | Hewlett Packard | (s/ at /@/) | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 (DEC '77-'98) | required." - mbg KB1FCA | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ From vaxzilla at jarai.org Mon Jul 15 23:44:02 2002 From: vaxzilla at jarai.org (Brian Chase) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: Mark-8??? Popped some pictures up. In-Reply-To: <00ab01c22c77$7e98d1f0$1301090a@xpace.net> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Jul 2002, Jim Kearney wrote: > Definitely a heavily modified Mark-8. Look at the board prints > towards the end of http://www.jkearney.com/8008/Mark-8.pdf Given that this is apparently a rather unique machine, it might be interesting to dig up more info about the person who put it together. It certainly couldn't hurt to ask the eBay seller about the origins of the system. -brian. From frustum at pacbell.net Tue Jul 16 00:28:04 2002 From: frustum at pacbell.net (Jim Battle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: [CCTECH]74123 woes In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.0.14.0.20020715023643.02176080@postoffice.pacbell.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020715222304.02183d00@postoffice.pacbell.net> At 11:46 PM 7/15/02 +0100, Tony Duell wrote in response to my question: >... > > Here is where I need advice. I can't find my TTL databook, but it would > > appear that the trigger inputs are edge triggered, not level triggered, > right? > >None of the databooks explicitily state this (they all show a timing >diagram where a second _pulse_ on one of the inputs restarts the time >period, but that's why it's called a retriggerable monostable). But a >couple of them _imply_ it's edge triggered. I would want to check this >more carefully, possibly by experimenting with a 'loose' chip before >deciding, though. The syndrome is that the active high/positive-edge triggered input is high, and the Q-bar output is stuck low. So just by inspection I can't tell if the thing is level triggered (which would be consistent with what I see on the broken board) or edge triggered but with a broken device. >Do check the timing capacitor, particularly if electrolytic. It's a >common problem with such circuits. It isn't an electolytic -- the time constant is on the order of 1-10uS or so. I think it is a mica cap (100pF), which of course is unpolarized. >-tony Thanks. I've ordered a couple replacement 74123s and a couple caps too, just in case. Since I don't do hobby electronics much, I don't have these things lying around, so I'll pay the price in shipping and time. ----- Jim Battle == frustum@pacbell.net From GOOI at oce.nl Tue Jul 16 01:38:00 2002 From: GOOI at oce.nl (Gooijen H) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: NPR and the RX11 (was Re: help needed: problem with UNIBUS ac cess on my PDP-11/70) Message-ID: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EBF@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Hi Ethan. Yes, the RX11 (M7846) is programmed I/O only. I checked the RX board yesterday for my NPR problem in the 11/70. Indeed, the pins CA1 and CB1 are *not* wired on the board ... back to the 11/70 thread with this result. - Henk. > -----Original Message----- > From: Megan [mailto:mbg@TheWorld.com] > Sent: dinsdag 16 juli 2002 6:19 > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: NPR and the RX11 (was Re: help needed: problem > with UNIBUS > access on my PDP-11/70) > > > The RX11 isn't DMA... when you give a command, it reads to a > silo which > the driver has to dump, a character at a time, or writes the > silo which > has been written, a character at a time... > > I just checked the RT-11 RX01 driver source to confirm it... > > Megan Gentry > Former RT-11 Developer From Fritz_Chwolka at t-online.de Tue Jul 16 01:59:00 2002 From: Fritz_Chwolka at t-online.de (Fritz Chwolka) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: "modern" CP/M system? In-Reply-To: <3D33430E.174CA8AF@topnow.com> Message-ID: <17UMGu-14IA1AC@fwd00.sul.t-online.com> On Mon, 15 Jul 2002 14:47:58 -0700, Ross Archer wrote: > >Hi, > >I noted off a link on this list that somebody had >implemented >a "modern" CP/M SBC based on the Z180 CPU. > >This, unfortunately, is no longer being made. > >P.S.: I'd love to see CP/M running at 20+ Mhz. :) > >-- Ross Look here Hello all, I am working on a new single board computer design for CP/M & MP/M 80. I want this to replace my present S-100 unit. The design will be similar to Dave Brook's P112 design. I will add an IDE interface. If you have any ideas as to features I should include, message here. Estimated completion date is 20XX ;). For info on Dave's system visit: http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/p112/p112.html#updates MfG. Fritz Chwolka >> collecting old computers just for fun << << at www.alterechner.de >> From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Tue Jul 16 02:07:01 2002 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: [possibly OT]: Tektronix 466 - spares needed Message-ID: <003c01c22c97$2a0d6540$0100000a@deepspacenine> Hi, A few days ago I picked up a very nice Tektronix 466 storage oscilloscope, complete with service manual. Catch is, I don't have the operator's manual. The service manual is thick with schematics and parts manifests, a fair bit of technical info ("this part does x function", etc). No real information on how to actually *use* this thing. I've worked out what 90% of the controls do by trial and error (that, plus the fact I used another scope before this one), but the storage section and some of the trigger section still eludes me... Scanned images or photocopy prefered, original manual would be even better. Also, it seems to be missing the blue cover that goes over the front panel and a set of Tek 1x/10x probes that were supposed to come with it. Anyone got a 466 as a junker they wouldn't mind parting out? I've been told Tek abandoned this scope a long time ago... Thanks. -- Phil. philpem@dsl.pipex.com http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ From GOOI at oce.nl Tue Jul 16 02:19:00 2002 From: GOOI at oce.nl (Gooijen H) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 Message-ID: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EC0@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> OK, the continuing story goes on to its conclusion. It looks I have been bit by the RX11 experiment. Some evenings ago I swapped the RX11 for an RX211 card, but I did not have the time to do some tests after the swap. Wish I did ... But first some replies to suggestions made. With the RX211 in slot 41, the DL11 in slot #40 and a M9302 + I can access the diags at 765000 on the M9312 successful + I can access the PROM at 773000 on the M9312 + access to CPU registers and MMR0-1-2 (777572 /4 /6) are all OK. + read/write the DL11 registers also OK! ??? I do not have a problem ??? Going back through my notes I see that the swap RX11 -> RX211 was the last action. So, back to the previous state: RX211 out, RX11 in. Guess what. The hung condition is back. The RX11 is a programmed I/O device. I knew that. But thanks to Tony's e-mail that older cards *do not* wire CA1 to CB1 if they do not use DMA, I checked the RX11. CA1 is not connected to CB1. That explains the hung. > It's OK to solder a wire (carefully) between the 'inside' > end of these fingers to make a DL11 (or whatever) that will > work in any slot. Some of my cards have been modified in > this way by the previous owner. I don't do that -- I fit the > wire-wrap jumper on the back of the backplane as DEC intended Again, Tony has the same thoughts I had yesterday. I did consider soldering a wire to the first 2 pins on the component side of the RX11 card. I did not. To make sure, I put the RX211 back in: all OK again. I made a note that slot 41 has the NPR wire on the backplane cut and that slot 40 has the NPR wired on the backplane. By experiment I will check the NPR wire of the other UNIBUS slots. You know why once you have seen the backplane of an 11/70. However ... (I will check this again) RX11 in slot 41 --> hung and we know why. RX211 in slot 41 --> all OK and we know why. G7273 double grant in slot 41 --> THE HUNG IS BACK! Huh?? Although the G7273 card puzzles me, I want to thank everybody for their contribution to solve this problem. I learned a lot from it. Also learned what that "SWR" column means in the M9312 manual. I had it right under my nose Johnny! It is even on my website in the tree "PDP-11/34A/CPU info/options/bootstrap". On that page all the ROM tables are listed including links. http://home.hetnet.nl/~tshaj kind regards, - Henk. From eric at brouhaha.com Tue Jul 16 03:44:08 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EC0@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> References: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EC0@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Message-ID: <32908.64.169.63.74.1026809008.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> > However ... (I will check this again) > RX11 in slot 41 --> hung and we know why. > RX211 in slot 41 --> all OK and we know why. > G7273 double grant in slot 41 --> THE HUNG IS BACK! Huh?? Very strange. You've got the G7273 in the right slots (C&D)? And not upside-down? If it's inserted correctly, it can't help but pass the grants through! From tothwolf at concentric.net Tue Jul 16 03:54:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: Mark-8??? Popped some pictures up. In-Reply-To: <20020716031528.49495.qmail@web11807.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Jul 2002, Loboyko Steve wrote: > This does look like a Mark-8 that's been modified (rather craftily) to > use a plug backplane. It appears that the builder also created a number of custom boards which are mounted to the Mark-8 boards. > I'll bet the control socket on the front is where the Front panel (or > maybe EPROM or ROM or maybe even diode?) board would go. Keep in mind > that ROMs of any kind were very expensive in 1974-6 for a home budget, > and no one had programmers. Or even a toggle switch board. Using a socket on the front panel adds a lot of versatility. I imagine those boards are missing simply because they were the easiest for someone to scrap. Toggle switches and LEDs are always useful, and someone not knowing what a treasure this system is would have had no problem at all with reusing those parts. > If you actually intend to get this going, I'd be concerned about the > Molex sockets. They are constructed using PURE EVIL and were unreliable > when new. Judging from the chips utilized (some no-name chips) and the > sockets I suspect that this was built by a very skilled hobbyist, > probably an engineer or senior technician working at home. When you look at the custom boards, and the fact someone took the time to bundle up the wiring to create harnesses, the builder had to be someone with a lot of design experience. The custom backplane took someone handy with machine tools too. I'd sure like to know who built this thing... -Toth From GOOI at oce.nl Tue Jul 16 04:09:01 2002 From: GOOI at oce.nl (Gooijen H) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 Message-ID: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EC5@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Hi Eric. Yes, very strange indeed. The G7273 is placed in slot positions C & D, the correct way. Edward suggested to use the Ohmmeter and check for a very fine disconnect on the etch of the G7273. The etched wire is indeed quite thin, I remember from yesterday. We'll see this evening ... - Henk. > -----Original Message----- > From: Eric Smith [mailto:eric@brouhaha.com] > Sent: dinsdag 16 juli 2002 10:43 > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: RE: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 > > > However ... (I will check this again) > > RX11 in slot 41 --> hung and we know why. > > RX211 in slot 41 --> all OK and we know why. > > G7273 double grant in slot 41 --> THE HUNG IS BACK! Huh?? > > Very strange. You've got the G7273 in the right slots (C&D)? And > not upside-down? If it's inserted correctly, it can't help but pass > the grants through! From bqt at update.uu.se Tue Jul 16 04:37:01 2002 From: bqt at update.uu.se (Johnny Billquist) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EC0@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Message-ID: On Tue, 16 Jul 2002, Gooijen H wrote: > Going back through my notes I see that the swap RX11 -> RX211 > was the last action. So, back to the previous state: RX211 out, > RX11 in. Guess what. The hung condition is back. > The RX11 is a programmed I/O device. I knew that. But thanks > to Tony's e-mail that older cards *do not* wire CA1 to CB1 if > they do not use DMA, I checked the RX11. CA1 is not connected > to CB1. That explains the hung. And what was the first thing most people said? Check your NPR line! Perhaps we didn't stress it enough. :-) But I saw that you had the funny assumption that if a card was inserted you did't need the check the NPR line. Oh well, you learn something every day. :-) Anyway, I'm glad you got it working. > By experiment I will check the NPR wire of the other UNIBUS slots. > You know why once you have seen the backplane of an 11/70. Huh? It's no more difficult checking the NPR wire in the 11/70, than on any other Unibus backplane. And it *is* rather simple to see if the jumper is there or not. And it's much faster than doing empirical tests. Just take a peek at the backplane, and you'll see it. > G7273 double grant in slot 41 --> THE HUNG IS BACK! Huh?? A bad G7273? Inserted wrong? Something like that anyway. > Also learned what that "SWR" column means in the M9312 manual. SWitch Register, yes. :-) Johnny Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt@update.uu.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol From tractorb at ihug.co.nz Tue Jul 16 06:42:01 2002 From: tractorb at ihug.co.nz (Dave Brown) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:06 2005 Subject: CRT problem References: Message-ID: <014c01c22cbd$b85b7dc0$0101a8c0@athlon> Tks for the comments- Peter & Tony. A phone call to plumber bro-in-law is in order I guess. There's no question of going back as I'm beyond the pont of no return now- the CRT was not really useable as it was. I don't have too much concern using the CRT without the protective screen bonded back on if I have to- something totally separate can be arranged fairly easily due to the shape of the CRT bezel. But if I can get it off, then rebonding it with something similar (but not hygroscopic) should not be too difficult. I have never till now seen a tube with this particular construction-Usually the lamination is done with something that looks like clear epoxy resin or similar. In any event a hard solid material. As a matter of interest I have not seen a tube implode in service yet- that's in over 40 years working in/around them. I suspect most accidents occur as a result of inappropriate CRT handling. Of the maybe 200 or so of all types I have deliberately 'depressurised' over the years the front face has never fragmented as it is almost always the strongest and thickest glass (except for the front corners) in the whole tube. It takes a hell of a whack with a hammer on a depressurised CRT front face to break it- I know- I've done it-several times! And most of those were old non-laminated front face types-but in recent years I have learned more 'acceptable' behaviour as I have matured. Now I collect them rather than destroy them!! Acetic acid and acetone were high on the 'possibles' list. Something called THF is evidently another. If I can't find a chemical solution (unlikely) I may have to resort to a piano wire and a pair of heavy weights- and I'll be well out of the room when that's going on! Cheers Dave Brown CH CH, NZ From jim at jkearney.com Tue Jul 16 09:18:01 2002 From: jim at jkearney.com (Jim Kearney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: Mark-8??? Popped some pictures up. References: <20020716035256.11727.qmail@web20507.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <01d301c22cd3$7b4c3a30$1301090a@xpace.net> Looking at the custom boards, it looks to me like: - the boards mounted to the address latch are a cassette interface. The one on the right is the modulator/demodulator and the one on the left appears to generate various pulse widths. It's a little hard to make out the chip numbers. - the one on the input board adds 7 input ports - the one on the output board adds 3 output ports I think the crystal is missing... I don't see any added parts that would suggest an oscillator. It's possible, since the builder made all these new boards, that he or she hand-made the Mark-8 boards from the construction booklet too, making it even more rare. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Berg" To: Sent: Monday, July 15, 2002 11:52 PM Subject: Re: Mark-8??? Popped some pictures up. > Very nifty! > > It is so amazing to have such knowledgable people a > click away - you all are great! :) > > I promise I'll stay away from the pots. I don't know > exactly what my immediate plans are for the fellow, > ahm... I'd love to get it up and working sometime. > I'll peer about online and see if I can scare up a > suitable surplus power supply of some type. This is > perhaps the oldest machine I've had the chance to work > on... I'm quite excited, but, I think somewhat > rightfully, nervous. > > Oh! I don't know if anybody would like such a thing, > but I put a little bit clearer picture of the CPU up > at: > http://66.30.18.171/MARK8/CPU3.jpg (Big file warning: > ~420K) > > --- Loboyko Steve wrote: > > This does look like a Mark-8 that's been modified > > (rather craftily) to use a plug backplane. > > > > I'll bet the control socket on the front is where > > the > > Front panel (or maybe EPROM or ROM or maybe even > > diode?) board would go. Keep in mind that ROMs of > > any > > kind were very expensive in 1974-6 for a home > > budget, > > and no one had programmers. > > > > There's a lot of glare on the 8008 CPU but I think > > this is an example of a VERY early package (there > > are > > at least 2 types of C8008 packages). > > > > If you actually intend to get this going, I'd be > > concerned about the Molex sockets. They are > > constructed using PURE EVIL and were unreliable when > > new. Judging from the chips utilized (some no-name > > chips) and the sockets I suspect that this was built > > by a very skilled hobbyist, probably an engineer or > > senior technician working at home. > > > > Also, definitely check that you have +5 and -9 on > > the > > 8008. You could damage it with one missing (and > > never > > mind the 1101's). > > > > Someone mentioned to me at the xtal on the mark-8 > > was > > optional, and you might have an RC oscillator and > > one-shots on there instead. The clock was 2-phase > > and > > would require a scope to adjust so if you see pots > > don't adjust them. > > Thanks for the terrific PDF - I was hoping that some > kind person might've put the scans up as you did. Some > bedtime reading material, I think. > > and --- Jim Kearney wrote: > > Definitely a heavily modified Mark-8. Look at the > > board prints towards the > > end of http://www.jkearney.com/8008/Mark-8.pdf > > Thanks again for everything! > > Andy > _____________________ > groovelists@yahoo.com > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes > http://autos.yahoo.com > From jim at jkearney.com Tue Jul 16 10:04:01 2002 From: jim at jkearney.com (Jim Kearney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: Mark-8??? Popped some pictures up. References: <20020716035256.11727.qmail@web20507.mail.yahoo.com> <01d301c22cd3$7b4c3a30$1301090a@xpace.net> Message-ID: <020201c22cd9$cf9fb1b0$1301090a@xpace.net> OK, duh, I overlooked the front panel picture where there are connectors for all those ports, making the boards' functions kinda obvious. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Kearney" To: Sent: Tuesday, July 16, 2002 10:17 AM Subject: Re: Mark-8??? Popped some pictures up. > Looking at the custom boards, it looks to me like: > > - the boards mounted to the address latch are a cassette interface. The one > on the right is the modulator/demodulator and the one on the left appears to > generate various pulse widths. It's a little hard to make out the chip > numbers. > > - the one on the input board adds 7 input ports > > - the one on the output board adds 3 output ports > > I think the crystal is missing... I don't see any added parts that would > suggest an oscillator. > > It's possible, since the builder made all these new boards, that he or she > hand-made the Mark-8 boards from the construction booklet too, making it > even more rare. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Andy Berg" > To: > Sent: Monday, July 15, 2002 11:52 PM > Subject: Re: Mark-8??? Popped some pictures up. > > > > Very nifty! > > > > It is so amazing to have such knowledgable people a > > click away - you all are great! :) > > > > I promise I'll stay away from the pots. I don't know > > exactly what my immediate plans are for the fellow, > > ahm... I'd love to get it up and working sometime. > > I'll peer about online and see if I can scare up a > > suitable surplus power supply of some type. This is > > perhaps the oldest machine I've had the chance to work > > on... I'm quite excited, but, I think somewhat > > rightfully, nervous. > > > > Oh! I don't know if anybody would like such a thing, > > but I put a little bit clearer picture of the CPU up > > at: > > http://66.30.18.171/MARK8/CPU3.jpg (Big file warning: > > ~420K) > > > > --- Loboyko Steve wrote: > > > This does look like a Mark-8 that's been modified > > > (rather craftily) to use a plug backplane. > > > > > > I'll bet the control socket on the front is where > > > the > > > Front panel (or maybe EPROM or ROM or maybe even > > > diode?) board would go. Keep in mind that ROMs of > > > any > > > kind were very expensive in 1974-6 for a home > > > budget, > > > and no one had programmers. > > > > > > There's a lot of glare on the 8008 CPU but I think > > > this is an example of a VERY early package (there > > > are > > > at least 2 types of C8008 packages). > > > > > > If you actually intend to get this going, I'd be > > > concerned about the Molex sockets. They are > > > constructed using PURE EVIL and were unreliable when > > > new. Judging from the chips utilized (some no-name > > > chips) and the sockets I suspect that this was built > > > by a very skilled hobbyist, probably an engineer or > > > senior technician working at home. > > > > > > Also, definitely check that you have +5 and -9 on > > > the > > > 8008. You could damage it with one missing (and > > > never > > > mind the 1101's). > > > > > > Someone mentioned to me at the xtal on the mark-8 > > > was > > > optional, and you might have an RC oscillator and > > > one-shots on there instead. The clock was 2-phase > > > and > > > would require a scope to adjust so if you see pots > > > don't adjust them. > > > > Thanks for the terrific PDF - I was hoping that some > > kind person might've put the scans up as you did. Some > > bedtime reading material, I think. > > > > and --- Jim Kearney wrote: > > > Definitely a heavily modified Mark-8. Look at the > > > board prints towards the > > > end of http://www.jkearney.com/8008/Mark-8.pdf > > > > Thanks again for everything! > > > > Andy > > _____________________ > > groovelists@yahoo.com > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes > > http://autos.yahoo.com > > > From Lee.Davison at merlincommunications.com Tue Jul 16 10:35:04 2002 From: Lee.Davison at merlincommunications.com (Davison, Lee) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: Peek65 magazine, March, 1985 Message-ID: <707AA588EE28D311BCD50090276D7D0002146E81@BUSH02> Does anyone have a copy of this magazine or know where such can be found? Lee. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- This email is intended only for the above named addressee(s). The information contained in this email may contain information which is confidential. The views expressed in this email are personal to the sender and do not in any way reflect the views of the company. If you have received this email and you are not a named addressee please delete it from your system and contact Merlin Communications International IT Department on +44 20 7344 5888. ________________________________________________________________________ This e-mail has been scanned for all viruses by Star Internet. The service is powered by MessageLabs. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working around the clock, around the globe, visit: http://www.star.net.uk ________________________________________________________________________ From P.Gebhardt at gmx.de Tue Jul 16 10:51:30 2002 From: P.Gebhardt at gmx.de (P.Gebhardt@gmx.de) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: [CCTECH]PDP11/23 and Emulex Qbus Controller References: <3D330F00.6EBC750F@Vishay.com> Message-ID: <31335.1026811236@www44.gmx.net> Thanks alot for your answers, Andreas & David. Actually, the Emulex QD32 is built for Q-22. My idea was to get a PDP11/23 and to connect several SMD-Drives on the QD32 controller. The types of the drives are a PRIAM 807-21, 2x Fujitsu M2333K and 3x CDC FSD-500 drives with own power supplies. I tried to get information about the CDC drives from Seagate as they bought CDC at the beginning of the 90's but they weren't interessested in answering me. If anybody has information about the drives especially the PRIAM and CDC drives, it would be nice if he could contact me. I'm grateful for your answers and suggestions. Pierre P.Gebhardt@gmx.de > Pierre, > > maybe someone else will provide practical experience with the > combination QD32 & 11/23, but my first guess would be that bandwidth is > not a problem: as long as all devices on the bus obey all the bus > specifications, they should be compatible. > > Was your friend possibly talking about address width (in other words, > the number of address lines on the bus)? - There are three variants, > with 16, 18, or 22 address lines. Incompatibilities can arise if a *DMA > controller* drives *less* address bits than the system actually uses. > Non-DMA controllers have no problem because they never address memory > themselves. A typical problem of this type is the RXV211 (RX02 floppy > disk controller: DMA, 18 address bits) used in a 22 bit system. The > problem can be circumvented in driver software by reserving a buffer > area in the lower 256kB of main memory. > > IIRC, older versions of the 11/23 drive 18 address lines, making them > capable of using up to 256kB (or 128kW) of memory. Later models (in > particular, the 11/23-PLUS) supply all 22 possible address lines, > allowing for up to 4MB (2MW) of RAM. I was told several years ago that > some /23s can be upgraded by adding a couple of wires (and maybe a > handful of bus drivers). > > The QD32 is no doubt a DMA controller, but I think I know it is 22 bit. > Hence, it should be possible to use this controller in any Qbus system. > > Also IIRC, the QD32 uses MSCP to communicate with its driver software, > so it should not even require any special software: a vanilla DU driver > would be OK for RT-11 or RSX-11, for example. > > Anyone have better information to correct me? > > Regards, > Andreas > > P.Gebhardt@gmx.de wrote: > > > Hello, > > > > is it possible to use an EMulex QD32 Controller (Qbus) with a PDP11/23 ? > > I asked a friend and he told me that the bandwith of the bus could be > > drifferent. > > Is it right ? > > > > Greetings > > > > Pierre > > -- > Andreas Freiherr > Vishay Semiconductor GmbH, Heilbronn, Germany > http://www.vishay.com > _______________________________________________ > cctech mailing list > cctech@classiccmp.org > http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech > -- GMX - Die Kommunikationsplattform im Internet. http://www.gmx.net From paulrsm at buckeye-express.com Tue Jul 16 12:18:00 2002 From: paulrsm at buckeye-express.com (Paul R. Santa-Maria) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: Laserjet IIIp in Ohio Message-ID: <236680-220027216171713613@buckeye-express.com> Someone was asking about paper trays for a LaserJet IIIp in Ohio. I have a half-dozen broken LaserJet IIp's and one IIIp for parts, including the paper trays. I live just north of Toledo. Contact me if you still need it. -- Paul R. Santa-Maria Monroe, Michigan USA From gkicomputers at yahoo.com Tue Jul 16 12:38:00 2002 From: gkicomputers at yahoo.com (steve) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: Mark-8??? Popped some pictures up. In-Reply-To: <20020716024949.41883.qmail@web20502.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20020716173712.69437.qmail@web12406.mail.yahoo.com> Andy, These are original Mark-8 boards with custom daughter boards and custom (redefined) expansion bus. This was a common modification made to Mark-8 boards as people got frustrated with the original bus design. I don't know why the crystal is missing, as the crystal wasn't optional (the original Mark-8 in the Radio Electronics magazine didn't have one, but those boards never made it to production). I have extra Mark-8 boards if you need them (originals and copies from the artwork, I sold them on ebay a while back) as well as all the spare parts necessary to built one (to the original spec anyway), drop me an email if you need some parts. I also can help with technical questions as I have built 5 working Mark-8's in the past 2 years, most likely though I probably won't be much help with this heavily modified version. steve --- Andy Berg wrote: > Hi! :) > > Whelp... I actually lack total confidence as to what > it is. :\ The CPU board, at least looks like a > Mark-8 > one. Alas, I don't have anything that looks like the > LED output board, but there also doesn't seem to be > a > slot for one. :( > > I've popped some pictures up at: > http://66.30.18.171/MARK8/ - please forgive if it is > a > bit slow - 'tis on a cable modem. (I put it up under > MARK8, but I truly don't know. :( ) > > If something doesn't work, please don't hesitate to > toss a note this way! > > > --- Loboyko Steve wrote: > > And they say that there are no bargains on > > eBay...bargains can be had by the patient and / or > > lucky! > > > > Are you SURE what you have isn't a SCELBI? (the 8 > > portsYour description sounds scelbi-like. Please > let > > us know when pictures are up. > > > > --- Jim Kearney wrote: > > > Rats! I had noted that auction, and was > planning > > on > > > bidding, but ended up > > > being away from the computer for the last few > days > > > of it. > > > > > > Anyway, if you need any help getting it running, > > > drop me a line. I ended up > > > with a pretty good knowledge of the design after > > > debugging mine (recent > > > construction, but original design). > > > > > > Jim > > Thanks kindly for the offer. I truly, truly do > appreciate your kindness and intellectual generosity > - > it means a lot to me. > > Thanks, > Andy > _____________________ > groovelists@yahoo.com > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes > http://autos.yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com Tue Jul 16 13:11:01 2002 From: Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com (Andreas Freiherr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: HM6116 (was: semi-OT) References: Message-ID: <3D34556D.DA38E1BC@Vishay.com> Patrick, there's a 1982 "Semiconductor Data Book Hitachi IC Memories" on my desk, and a scanner in the next room. The book has seven pages about the HM6116LP-2, HM6116LP-3, and HM6116LP-4, including a general decription, pinout, data tables, signal waveforms, and various diagrams. I might send some GIFs by mail to you privately, or if somebody has a place to make them available on the Web, please let me know. I don't think Hitachi would mind. I didn't even find a copyright notice in the book. Minimum Cycle Time for the "-3" version is 150ns, access times from either chip select or address input are also 150ns. Minimum VCC for data retention: 2.0V. Anything else you need in advance? Nothing about the Intel chip, however. Regards, Andreas Patrick Finnegan wrote: > > I've 'rescued' a stack of HM6116LP-3 SRAM's from a circuit board. Apart > from the fact that they're 2Kx8 SRAM's, I haven't been able to find any > useful datasheets with both pinouts and timing diagrams for the chips. > By any chance, does anyone have one laying around in PDF or that they'd be > willing to scan? Minimally, I'd like to know the pinout, basic timing > requirements, max clock speed, and data retention voltage. > > I've also removed an Intel P8291A, which has been just as hard to find > information on, anything would be useful. > > Thanks! > > -- Pat -- Andreas Freiherr Vishay Semiconductor GmbH, Heilbronn, Germany http://www.vishay.com From Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com Tue Jul 16 13:11:19 2002 From: Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com (Andreas Freiherr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: LSI-11/2 References: Message-ID: <3D345D06.554233AB@Vishay.com> Hello again, Patrick, another question that was not yet answered: > > > Also, is it possible/easy to change the M8044-BB board (8KW?) to have at > > > least 16KW if not 32KW of memory? That'd be a nice upgrade for the > > > machine if I can do it myself with 'stock' DRAMs. > > > > I have no docs available here in the office, but I seem to remember that > > the M8044 (MSV-11?) was available in several flavors (identified by the > > letters after the dash) with different capacities, so it might be > > possible. I'll look up more about this at home. There should be boards > > to examine. Stay tuned. > > Yup, from 4kW to 32kW, there's some description of the differences here: > http://www.not-compatible.org/PDP-11/modules/msv11-d.html > However, it doesn't tell me what I need to look for in a RAM IC for it, > like if a standard 4116 or 4164 will work (possibly grounding extra > R/C address lines on the 4164...) There's a total of 32 memory IC's, all > non-standard looking part numbers on the MSV11 I have. Last night, I finally made it into the basement to dig out something like this. Found a M8044-DC (obviously a MSV11-DD) and a M8044-DF (apparently also a MSV11-DD). Both have regular 16k*1 chips in a 4*8 array. I didn't find a difference between M8044-DF and -DC (rev level, perhaps?), aside from one using ceramic Hitachi chips (HM4716A-3) while the other has plastic Fairchild ones (MB8116E). If you're interested, I took a couple of pictures before storing the modules back. Let me know if you want them (~40kB * 6 .JPG files). Besides replacing the DRAM chips, you'll need to fiddle with some jumpers and maybe one additional resistor in order to convert a MSV11-DB to a MSV11-DD. There's some information in my 1981 "d|i|g|i|t|a|l microcomputers amd memories" manual that will certainly help. 20 pages in total, with lots of tables, block diagrams, and functional descriptions. No complete schematics, but might suffice to do the conversion. A scanner is nearby. Want me to...? -- Andreas Freiherr Vishay Semiconductor GmbH, Heilbronn, Germany http://www.vishay.com From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Jul 16 13:17:02 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: Intel 8291 was Re: semi-OT In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020716132504.57cfcada@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> The 8291 is a GPIB Talker/Listener IC. It's in Volume II of the 1985 Intel Microsystem Components Handbook. I have Vol I but not Vol II so I can't give you any details about the part. Joe At 11:40 AM 7/12/02 -0500, you wrote: > >I've also removed an Intel P8291A, which has been just as hard to find >information on, anything would be useful. > >Thanks! > >-- Pat > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Jul 16 13:17:12 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: IPC and 9133 Re: HP 9133H Configuration switch? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020716141103.5eff58be@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 04:45 PM 7/14/02 -0700, you wrote: >Thanks for the config switch info. The 9133H unit I picked up came with the >config switch in position 8 and I originally formatted it on the IPC with 8 >volumes. Maybe there is a limit on how many volumes the IPC can mount at >the same time? I don't know. I don't think it's mentioned in the IPC manuals. I've never tried more than five units at a time. Only the first 6 volumes appeared to be mounted >automatically. I change the config switch to position 2 and reformatted the >drive as 2 volumes and that seems like it might be a better choice. > >What controls the 256/1024 byte sector size? Mostly the operating system of the computer. Also with 9133s other than the 9133H it will format to 1024 bytes/sec instead of 256 if it's an option 001 drive (true for series 100 and 200 computers, I don't know about the IPC). Some systems will let you specify an optional Format Option number on the Format command line and you can change the number of Bytes/Sector with that. I don't think the IPC supports that. You can also optionally specify the interleave factor. The series 200 machines with BASIC or Pascal support the optional parameters but I don't think that the IPC or the Series 100 machines do since their format programs are usually menu driven. MORE INFO: I just checked and settings 0, 1 or 9 on the configuration dial all cause the system to create one volume. I know that one setting prevents the drive from being re-formatted and one setting permits it to be re-formatted but I don't know what the third setting does.** According to my 9133H manual, the setting of the configuration dial does not affect the number of Bytes/Sector. ** I just checked the change pages. According to them configuration 9 causes the drive to be formatted into two volumes, one 4.68 Mb and the other 15.20 Mb. That very different from what's in the original manual. I wonder if this may only apply to later units? Is that up to the OS format >routine? Is there a CS/80 or SS/80 spec available anywhere to find out more >about how these HPIB drives work? I know that a couple of people on the list have them but I don't. I do have the Command Set docs for the flexible drives. The docs don't say so but I think this is the Amigo Command Set. > >Are there any other sources of software for the IPC besides Pete's IPC >website? http://www.coho.org/~pete/IPC/integral.html I've got piles of the stuff but no way to duplicate it at the moment. And I STILL can't get TeleDisk to work with anything! > >Now that I have a hard drive I don't really have anything interesting to >load on it yet. FWIW I've found that a number of drives that aren't specified for the IPC will still work fine with it. I'm using a HP 7958 on mine. WARNING: I'll repeat this here for the ones of you that haven't heard it yet. The HP double sided floppy drives **including those used in 9133H and the IPC** are prone to gumming up from dried gease. If you have ANY trouble inserting or ejecting a disk, DON"T FORCE IT! The top head will catch on the disk and be damaged. Remove the drive and clean it and then relube it with good quality grease then reinstall it. There's plenty of discussions and directions about how to do this in previous list messages so I won't go into details here. joe > >-Glen > > >_________________________________________________________________ >Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. >http://www.hotmail.com > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Tue Jul 16 13:17:22 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: Any DRI employees out there??? In-Reply-To: <000001c22a1d$ed16ae60$177ba8c0@ne2.client2.attbi.com> References: <015f01c229cb$f891a670$01000001@cvendel> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020716141336.1a17a650@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> What about John(?) Pierce? He was supposed to be DRI employee #3. I don't have his address but he has a large on-line computer museum so he should be easy to find. Joe > >I'm also looking for anyone from DRI that accompanied Gary Kildall up to >Grass Valley, CA. to Cyan Engineering's labs. They were owned by Atari >under Warner Comm. From what I've been told Gary Kildall and a group >of >DRI engineers travelled up to Grass Valley to disconnect and remove the >VAX >11/730 or 750, not sure which. It was payment from Atari to DRI for the >GEM >porting work. I've gotten one person's account, but I need to confirm >this >with a 2nd witness before I can publish this onto the atarimuseum.com >website as fact, thanks. > > > >Curt > > > From emu at ecubics.com Tue Jul 16 13:38:01 2002 From: emu at ecubics.com (emanuel stiebler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: LSI-11/2 References: <3D345D06.554233AB@Vishay.com> Message-ID: <3D346817.8179327B@ecubics.com> Andreas Freiherr wrote: > > Last night, I finally made it into the basement to dig out something > like this. Found a M8044-DC (obviously a MSV11-DD) and a M8044-DF > (apparently also a MSV11-DD). Both have regular 16k*1 chips in a 4*8 > array. I didn't find a difference between M8044-DF and -DC (rev level, > perhaps?), aside from one using ceramic Hitachi chips (HM4716A-3) while > the other has plastic Fairchild ones (MB8116E). > > If you're interested, I took a couple of pictures before storing the > modules back. Let me know if you want them (~40kB * 6 .JPG files). When did the vaxarchive go out of stile ? ;-) Specially: http://www.vaxarchive.org/hw/vfg/ddual.html cheers From eric at brouhaha.com Tue Jul 16 14:39:06 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: References: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EC0@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Message-ID: <33393.64.169.63.74.1026848257.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Gooijen H wrote: > By experiment I will check the NPR wire of the other UNIBUS slots. You > know why once you have seen the backplane of an 11/70. Johnny Billquist wrote: > Huh? It's no more difficult checking the NPR wire in the 11/70, than on > any other Unibus backplane. And it *is* rather simple to see if the > jumper is there or not. On the 11/70 Mike and I have been working on, the NPR grant jumpers were wrapped before most of the other wiring, rather than after. This makes it fairly difficult to see them. From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 16 14:53:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: [CCTECH]74123 woes In-Reply-To: <3D3392AB.8040303@jetnet.ab.ca> from "Ben Franchuk" at Jul 15, 2 09:27:39 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 367 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020716/11268e66/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 16 14:53:28 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EC0@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> from "Gooijen H" at Jul 16, 2 09:14:56 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2893 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020716/d3717f29/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 16 14:53:55 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: NPR and the RX11 (was Re: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70) In-Reply-To: <20020716035557.52652.qmail@web10306.mail.yahoo.com> from "Ethan Dicks" at Jul 15, 2 08:55:57 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 119 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020716/f79384c3/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 16 14:54:10 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: [possibly OT]: Tektronix 466 - spares needed In-Reply-To: <003c01c22c97$2a0d6540$0100000a@deepspacenine> from "Philip Pemberton" at Jul 16, 2 08:05:26 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 867 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020716/ae7a8716/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 16 14:54:19 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: CRT problem In-Reply-To: <014c01c22cbd$b85b7dc0$0101a8c0@athlon> from "Dave Brown" at Jul 16, 2 11:41:26 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2715 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020716/acfdf37d/attachment.ksh From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Tue Jul 16 15:06:01 2002 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: [possibly OT]: Tektronix 466 - spares needed References: Message-ID: <001101c22d03$ed733f20$0100000a@deepspacenine> "Tony Duell" said: > Can't you work out what the controls do from the schematics? I normally > find it easier to do that than to understand the user manual... Er... I gave up after the third page of schematics... > Anyway, most Tekky scopes work in much the same way. What controls are > you having problems with? It's likely that one of us will know what they > are for. Mainly the Storage and Delay Sweep functions. My old Gould OS1100A had a single "Delay" control that adjusted the delay. This Tek seems to have two triggers and the Delay Sweep control is in the "Trigger B" section. And there's no obvious way to use it... As for the storage section, I've worked out how to reset the storage tube (push "RESET"), get the thing into Variable Persistence mode and that the FAST storage function will only work in the uS range... The SAVE button is a real pain in the neck to work out. Thanks. -- Phil. philpem@dsl.pipex.com http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ From sloboyko at yahoo.com Tue Jul 16 15:16:00 2002 From: sloboyko at yahoo.com (Loboyko Steve) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: [possibly OT]: Tektronix 466 - spares needed In-Reply-To: <003c01c22c97$2a0d6540$0100000a@deepspacenine> Message-ID: <20020716201426.93106.qmail@web11806.mail.yahoo.com> I don't think this is that OT: Everyone who expects to fix any of this equipment should have one - and, given their incredibly inexpensive prices on eBay, they should! On the manuals, there are two places you can easily find with Google who will have manual reprints. I've dealt with both and although not inexpensive, the manual copies are absoutely first-rate. There are also books on how to use a scope that are generic, but will help a lot. You can pickup probes from anywhere; just make sure you get 100 mhz+ probes if you expect to use your scope at 100 mhz. There are used ones on eBay, but unless you know what you are doing, it's hard to get a good one. I got come probes from Jameco and they are pretty good given the price. I would also advise getting probes with little test clips on the ends, which are not too good on the Mhz, but they are cheap. There is a Yahoo group specifically geared to the repair and maint. of Tek scopes: mostly oriented to the older tube types, but they apparently don't get mad about people discussing newer transtorized scopes. I have a 464, but it started to blow fuses, and I suspect one of the HV diodes in the "flyback" is bad; but I got an entire working 464 for $75 shipped recently instead (I will probably fix the older one eventually). I also have two working Tek 1230 logic analyzers with 4 pods, one as a spare and all manuals including training materials. Total investment on this originally over $14,000 dollars of logic analyzers: 180.00. --- Philip Pemberton wrote: > Hi, > A few days ago I picked up a very nice Tektronix > 466 storage > oscilloscope, complete with service manual. Catch > is, I don't have the > operator's manual. The service manual is thick with > schematics and parts > manifests, a fair bit of technical info ("this part > does x function", etc). > No real information on how to actually *use* this > thing. I've worked out > what 90% of the controls do by trial and error > (that, plus the fact I used > another scope before this one), but the storage > section and some of the > trigger section still eludes me... > Scanned images or photocopy prefered, original > manual would be even > better. > Also, it seems to be missing the blue cover that > goes over the front > panel and a set of Tek 1x/10x probes that were > supposed to come with it. > Anyone got a 466 as a junker they wouldn't mind > parting out? I've been told > Tek abandoned this scope a long time ago... > > Thanks. > -- > Phil. > philpem@dsl.pipex.com > http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 16 15:45:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: [possibly OT]: Tektronix 466 - spares needed In-Reply-To: <001101c22d03$ed733f20$0100000a@deepspacenine> from "Philip Pemberton" at Jul 16, 2 09:03:59 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2408 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020716/cda7ba4b/attachment.ksh From allain at panix.com Tue Jul 16 15:58:03 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: IMPORTANT LIST CHANGES References: <157133449870.20020715152830@subatomix.com> Message-ID: <047601c22d0a$aee596c0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> > ... you will need to ... or set the "no-mail" > option on one of them. If you do not > do this, you will receive two copies ... How is this done, with no mojordomo to send to, and http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctalk offering no such option? John A. From pat at purdueriots.com Tue Jul 16 16:43:01 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: Quadram Quadboard Message-ID: Hi all, I'm trying to get two of these to work in a single PC XT so I can max out the memory. I have figure out the 'left' set of dip switches sets the memory starting address, but need to determine the functions on the right set of switches so I can modify the printer port I/O address, serial port address, and hopefully the size of memory that it thinks is on the board. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. -- Pat From al at thefox1049.com Tue Jul 16 17:17:00 2002 From: al at thefox1049.com (Alan Simpson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: lexbook arlington 10 Message-ID: <001601c22d06$92c605a0$2001000a@bscn.com> I have a lexbook arlington 10, does anyone out their know where I can get a copy of the owners manual, factory software and especially any info on it's motherboard and manufacturer. lexmark quit all support long ago. note: I've expanded it to 16mb, 810mb hard drive, win 95b, it has 256 color 640x480 lcd. it has a 50mhz 486 slc2 with 25mhz bus, floppy drive, com port and parallel port. any info on the chip that goes in the blank spot for ethernet on board would be appreciated. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020716/9724d26b/attachment.html From dwoycies at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu Tue Jul 16 17:17:23 2002 From: dwoycies at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: IMPORTANT LIST CHANGES In-Reply-To: <047601c22d0a$aee596c0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: On 07/16/02, John Allain scribbled: > > ... you will need to ... or set the "no-mail" > > option on one of them. If you do not > > do this, you will receive two copies ... > > How is this done, with no mojordomo to send to, and > http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctalk offering > no such option? > > John A. > > When the change was made, you (should've) gotten a Welcome letter, with a link to a webpage for changing this option... Should be something like... http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/options/cctalk/%EMAIL_ADDRESS ...you can retrieve you password from there too. -- --- David A. Woyciesjes --- C&IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ# - 905818 Mac OSX 10.1 - Darwin Kernel V. 5 Running since 01/22/02 without a crash From coredump at gifford.co.uk Tue Jul 16 17:24:02 2002 From: coredump at gifford.co.uk (John Honniball) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: cctalk digest, Vol 1 #83 - 27 msgs References: Message-ID: <3D349AFC.C0F4124B@gifford.co.uk> Tony Duell wrote: > [1] Yes, at one time, TVs had a seprate thick plastic or laminated glass > screen in front of the CRT, to protect the viewer. Am I the only person > to remember working on such sets? No! I remember those sets! We had a 405-line Pye TV set which must have been made in the late 1950s, and it had a separate glass screen. It also had the latest innovation in electronics, a printed circuit board. Shame I don't still have it... -- John Honniball coredump@gifford.co.uk From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 16 17:31:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020716223018.33818.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> --- Tony Duell wrote: > ...Incidentally, leaving the jumper in and putting an NPR-device in the > slot will also cause 'interesting' problems! That's what I spent a couple hours debugging, c. 1986 - a new, never- before-seen-the-light-of-day VAX 11/750 and a TU80 controller. Prior to that, I'd only ever worked on used VAXen that had previously been stripped of all NPR wires (since we *sold* DMA Unibus cards and had as many NPR grant cards as we needed). > That's why when I refit a jumper, I use red wire, to make it easy to > spot next time! Good advice. At least use a color other than the typical straw-yellow wires. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From bqt at update.uu.se Tue Jul 16 18:19:00 2002 From: bqt at update.uu.se (Johnny Billquist) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <33393.64.169.63.74.1026848257.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 16 Jul 2002, Eric Smith wrote: > Gooijen H wrote: > > By experiment I will check the NPR wire of the other UNIBUS slots. You > > know why once you have seen the backplane of an 11/70. > > Johnny Billquist wrote: > > Huh? It's no more difficult checking the NPR wire in the 11/70, than on > > any other Unibus backplane. And it *is* rather simple to see if the > > jumper is there or not. > > On the 11/70 Mike and I have been working on, the NPR grant jumpers were > wrapped before most of the other wiring, rather than after. This makes > it fairly difficult to see them. They are on "mine" too, but I still don't consider it hard to see. And compared to testing empirically, it's definitely easier, I'd say. Johnny Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt@update.uu.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol From pete at dunnington.u-net.com Tue Jul 16 19:00:01 2002 From: pete at dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: CRT problem In-Reply-To: "Dave Brown" "Re: CRT problem" (Jul 16, 23:41) References: <014c01c22cbd$b85b7dc0$0101a8c0@athlon> Message-ID: <10207161854.ZM15200@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> On Jul 16, 23:41, Dave Brown wrote: > I don't have too much concern using the CRT without the protective screen > bonded back on if I have to- something totally separate can be arranged > fairly easily due to the shape of the CRT bezel. But if I can get it off, > then rebonding it with something similar (but not hygroscopic) should not be > too difficult. I remember when I was a teenager and started fixing old tellys, that many of them had a flat laminated glass sheet, about 1/4" thick, in front of a plain CRT. The laminated glass was mounted in the cabnet, not bonded to, or even touching, the CRT. So that might be a reasonable thing to do in this case. Polycarbonate might be even better (and easier to handle). -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 16 19:06:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: cctalk digest, Vol 1 #83 - 27 msgs In-Reply-To: <3D349AFC.C0F4124B@gifford.co.uk> from "John Honniball" at Jul 16, 2 11:15:24 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 258 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020716/846edb1d/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 16 19:09:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:07 2005 Subject: CRT problem In-Reply-To: <10207161854.ZM15200@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> from "Pete Turnbull" at Jul 16, 2 05:54:13 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 682 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020716/1ea1d0a1/attachment.ksh From jwest at classiccmp.org Tue Jul 16 19:16:03 2002 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:08 2005 Subject: "majordomo" address (was Re: IMPORTANT LIST CHANGES) References: Message-ID: <000901c22d26$f9886d30$9601a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Someone said.... > > How is this done, with no mojordomo to send to, and > > http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctalk offering > > no such option? Bear in mind that mailman DOES support email based commands as opposed to the website interface to your account. So, a "majordomo" email functional equivalent is present. Regards, Jay West From lgwalker at mts.net Tue Jul 16 20:13:01 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:08 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? Message-ID: <3D33992B.25636.6D897D@localhost> Well I finally got back to the salvage/surplus place to get a list of the HP stuff they had and found they had another big room full of stuff they had removed from a large government installation. This was in the attic of a large building during one of the hottest days we've had up here and my sweat was dripping on my notepad so please excuse my attempts to decipher my notes. You must also realize that I'm a complete mini neophyte. The original HP stuff I saw : HP 12979A I/O expander HP 96MX System controller HP 7970B Tape Unit HP 1000 w/ cybernex 1100 term HP System 2748B There were also several HP 2624 A, B, and Standard K-Bs and some monitors or terminals on the skid. The big room was dominated by about 50-60 Sybernex workstations (which are similar to the Wyse ones so often tossed by thift stores), heavy duty monitor arm stands, and metal desks. But then the goodies. About 20 DEC VT420/320/220 terminals A box of LK402 keyboards (20-30 of them) An IBM 3278 terminal A DEC VAX SA482 rack w/4 populated banks About 10 Decwriter II's and III's A DEC VAX 6310 in rack 2 very impressive-looking 5' MagTape racks Honeywell CPUE 111 Morel DP S6/92 There were many other things. Honeywell equipment, large printers. etc. that I didn't write down. Do you think that the Gods are now demanding that I collect mini's, teasing me first with the Pro 350's I rescued from the town dump recently? And in the wilds of north central Manitoba.(Where in hell is that ?) "Winnipegosis sounds like a disease." Lawrence lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From lgwalker at mts.net Tue Jul 16 20:13:38 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:08 2005 Subject: Quadram Quadboard In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3D33992B.31458.6D89A9@localhost> I have acouple of files on the Quadboard with settings that I'll send you off- list as attachments. Lawrence > Hi all, I'm trying to get two of these to work in a single PC XT so I can > max out the memory. I have figure out the 'left' set of dip switches sets > the memory starting address, but need to determine the functions on the > right set of switches so I can modify the printer port I/O address, serial > port address, and hopefully the size of memory that it thinks is on the > board. > > Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. > > -- Pat > lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From doc at mdrconsult.com Tue Jul 16 20:24:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:08 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? In-Reply-To: <3D33992B.25636.6D897D@localhost> Message-ID: On Tue, 16 Jul 2002, Lawrence Walker wrote: > > The big room was dominated by about 50-60 Sybernex workstations > (which are similar to the Wyse ones so often tossed by thift stores), > heavy duty monitor arm stands, and metal desks. But then the goodies. > > About 20 DEC VT420/320/220 terminals > A box of LK402 keyboards (20-30 of them) > An IBM 3278 terminal > A DEC VAX SA482 rack w/4 populated banks > About 10 Decwriter II's and III's > A DEC VAX 6310 in rack > 2 very impressive-looking 5' MagTape racks > Honeywell CPUE 111 > Morel DP S6/92 > > There were many other things. Honeywell equipment, large printers. etc. > that I didn't write down. Oh, drool. Oh, my. I would be begging if it were small enough to ship. I may beg for the 6310 _anyway_. :) > Do you think that the Gods are now demanding that I collect mini's, teasing > me first with the Pro 350's I rescued from the town dump recently? Well, yes. Everybody gets around to Digital, eventually. Doc From jrkeys at concentric.net Tue Jul 16 20:40:01 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:08 2005 Subject: URL Wanted Message-ID: <004a01c22d32$a4bc6520$32000240@oemcomputer> Earlier today their was a URL given for an article on the Mark-8 and my system hung and I lost it. Could you please post it again. Thanks -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020716/9677b277/attachment.html From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Tue Jul 16 20:40:18 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:08 2005 Subject: Z8000 processor Olivetti M20 Message-ID: <200207170139.SAA16369@clulw009.amd.com> >From: "Hans B Pufal" > >Dwight K. Elvey wrote: > >> I have a machine with a Z8000 that is working. >> It is the Olivetti M20. You should be able to find these >> in Europe. They were many sold in Italy and Germany. >> It uses a OS made by Olivetti called PCOS. > >Yep, I finally found one in Germany. Do you have software for the >machine? I did snag three manuals, one being the hardware reference >complete with schematics. The other two are the user manuals and PCOS >manual both in english. I could scan or copy in exchange for software. > > -- hbp > > Hi Hans How did the site I pointed you to work out? I am really quite interested in the hardware manual. Dwight From mbg at TheWorld.com Tue Jul 16 20:59:04 2002 From: mbg at TheWorld.com (Megan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:08 2005 Subject: LSI-11/2 References: Message-ID: <200207170157.VAA30029472@shell.TheWorld.com> >Last night, I finally made it into the basement to dig out something >like this. Found a M8044-DC (obviously a MSV11-DD) and a M8044-DF >(apparently also a MSV11-DD). Both have regular 16k*1 chips in a 4*8 >array. I didn't find a difference between M8044-DF and -DC (rev level, >perhaps?), aside from one using ceramic Hitachi chips (HM4716A-3) while >the other has plastic Fairchild ones (MB8116E). You found the difference... the 'x' part of M8044-Dx is the vendor who supplied the chips which went on the board. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | email: gentry at zk3.dec.com (work) | | Unix Support Engineering Group | mbg at world.std.com (home) | | Hewlett Packard | (s/ at /@/) | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 (DEC '77-'98) | required." - mbg KB1FCA | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ From jwest at classiccmp.org Tue Jul 16 20:59:26 2002 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:08 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? References: Message-ID: <002201c22d35$5dbed7e0$9601a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Doc wrote... > Well, yes. Everybody gets around to Digital, eventually. Yup, they do. Usually after collecting the more interesting HP systems first, then they do go after the lesser systems like DEC ;) Just Kidding! Jay West From healyzh at aracnet.com Tue Jul 16 21:34:01 2002 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:08 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? In-Reply-To: from "Jay West" at Jul 16, 2002 08:57:52 PM Message-ID: <200207170233.g6H2XRs16663@shell1.aracnet.com> > Doc wrote... > > Well, yes. Everybody gets around to Digital, eventually. > > Yup, they do. Usually after collecting the more interesting HP systems > first, then they do go after the lesser systems like DEC ;) > > Just Kidding! > > Jay West You'd better duck and run! After all we all know that the real reason HP bought Compaq was so that they'd finally have some real computers to sell! :^) Zane From pat at purdueriots.com Tue Jul 16 21:36:01 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:08 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? In-Reply-To: <002201c22d35$5dbed7e0$9601a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Message-ID: On Tue, 16 Jul 2002, Jay West wrote: > Doc wrote... > > Well, yes. Everybody gets around to Digital, eventually. > > Yup, they do. Usually after collecting the more interesting HP systems ^^^^ You meant IBM, I'm sure. :) > first, then they do go after the lesser systems like DEC ;) -- Pat From healyzh at aracnet.com Tue Jul 16 21:41:00 2002 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:08 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? In-Reply-To: <3D33992B.25636.6D897D@localhost> from "Lawrence Walker" at Jul 16, 2002 03:55:23 AM Message-ID: <200207170240.g6H2e7S16914@shell1.aracnet.com> > Honeywell CPUE 111 > Morel DP S6/92 > > There were many other things. Honeywell equipment, large printers. etc. > that I didn't write down. As much as I hate Honeywell computers, I'd say that whatever you found there that's Honeywell related is probably the most worthy of being rescued. All in all, it seems to be pretty rare for any collector to have Honeywell stuff in their collection (I know Sellam has a DPS-6). BTW, I'm wondering if that "Morel DP S6/92" isn't a Honeywell DPS-6/92. > Do you think that the Gods are now demanding that I collect mini's, teasing > me first with the Pro 350's I rescued from the town dump recently? > And in the wilds of north central Manitoba.(Where in hell is that ?) > "Winnipegosis sounds like a disease." Warning, collecting Mini's is a dangerous disease that will seriously effect you mentally (what might be even worse is how it effects your amount of empty storage space). I recommend avoiding it at all costs. Zane From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Tue Jul 16 21:52:00 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:08 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? References: <200207170240.g6H2e7S16914@shell1.aracnet.com> Message-ID: <3D34DAB5.8040302@jetnet.ab.ca> > Warning, collecting Mini's is a dangerous disease that will seriously effect > you mentally (what might be even worse is how it effects your amount of empty > storage space). I recommend avoiding it at all costs. It also has a tendancy to empty the old wallet too. :) From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 16 22:08:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:08 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020717030649.39030.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> --- Doc Shipley wrote: > Well, yes. Everybody gets around to Digital, eventually. I more or less _started_ with DEC - c. 1982. My very first computer was a PET (new), followed by an Elf (new, kit), followed by the first of many PDP-8s (14-year-old PDP-8/L for $35 at Dayton). ISTR, a clearance-sale VIC-20 was next, then a C-64 (new) and a PDP-8/a... all before my freshman year of college. My first PDP-11 was a PDP-11/23, returned by a customer at work when they stopped using it - $300 (BA11-N, KDF11, 4 x MSV11-D, RXV21, LPV11) and another $100 for an RLV11 - I recycled the RL01s, the RX02, the VT220, and the LA180 from the PDP-8/a and earned a living for a year, writing MACRO software on contract under RT-11. The target system at the customer site was a loaded 11/73 rack-mount with 4MB of RAM and a Fuji Eagle running TSX-11 back when it all ran *many* thousands of dollars (1987). The cost differential between the development and target systems always made me happy. I got bit by the DEC bug early; haven't found a cure for it yet. At least I've been lucky enough to be paid to make them sing and dance. It hasn't all been money _out_ the door. Wish I'd been able to claim "pro" status for the PDP-8 - that's been strictly a hobby. Financially, though, the VAX has been very, very good to me; much better than the PeeCee. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 16 22:15:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:08 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? In-Reply-To: <200207170240.g6H2e7S16914@shell1.aracnet.com> Message-ID: <20020717031340.74016.qmail@web10302.mail.yahoo.com> --- "Zane H. Healy" wrote: > Warning, collecting Mini's is a dangerous disease that will seriously > effect you mentally (what might be even worse is how it effects your > amount of empty storage space). True. I have mine spread amongst 4 locations (several thousand sq ft total). I'm looking into buying a warehouse between my house and the airport. The main building (of four) is 100' x 160'. The good news is that it happens to already *be* one of my four locations (the owner has been casually looking to sell for a couple of years and recently asked me if I was interested; I'm crunching numbers ;-). One nice thing is I'll finally be able to deploy my raised floor (rescued from a former employer 10 years ago). If this doesn't work, I'll be putting up a new (much smaller than that) building next to the quonset hut at the farm. > I recommend avoiding it at all costs. > > Zane Absolutely. In fact, you should call one of us to save you from the peril. :-) -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From healyzh at aracnet.com Tue Jul 16 22:32:00 2002 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? In-Reply-To: from "Ethan Dicks" at Jul 16, 2002 08:13:40 PM Message-ID: <200207170330.g6H3UgB18627@shell1.aracnet.com> > --- "Zane H. Healy" wrote: > > Warning, collecting Mini's is a dangerous disease that will seriously > > effect you mentally (what might be even worse is how it effects your > > amount of empty storage space). > > True. I have mine spread amongst 4 locations (several thousand sq ft > total). I'm looking into buying a warehouse between my house and the > airport. The main building (of four) is 100' x 160'. The good news > is that it happens to already *be* one of my four locations (the owner > has been casually looking to sell for a couple of years and recently > asked me if I was interested; I'm crunching numbers ;-). One nice > thing is I'll finally be able to deploy my raised floor (rescued from > a former employer 10 years ago). If this doesn't work, I'll be putting > up a new (much smaller than that) building next to the quonset hut at > the farm. > > > I recommend avoiding it at all costs. > > > > Zane > > Absolutely. In fact, you should call one of us to save you from > the peril. :-) You do realized that you just proved my point (as well as Ben's)? Zane From geoffr at zipcon.net Tue Jul 16 22:53:01 2002 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: Quadram Quadboard In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716210546.048787b0@mail.zipcon.net> At 04:41 PM 7/16/02 -0500, you wrote: >Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. how about this URL... http://kibmcz.tripod.com/quad.htm From pat at purdueriots.com Tue Jul 16 23:07:01 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: Quadram Quadboard In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716210546.048787b0@mail.zipcon.net> Message-ID: Thanks your all your guys help. I did find this site earlier, and it's what I used to pack a nice 704KB into my XT. Now, I just need to figure out why I get snow in 80 column text mode on the CGA card (and not in any other mode... 40 col text or graphics). Also next is seeing if I can make myself a program that'll set the memory reported by BIOS to be 704KB and then load and execute a boot sector. -- Pat On Tue, 16 Jul 2002, Geoff Reed wrote: > At 04:41 PM 7/16/02 -0500, you wrote: > > >Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. > > how about this URL... > http://kibmcz.tripod.com/quad.htm From jrkeys at concentric.net Tue Jul 16 23:07:30 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: Check out the Analog Computer on eBay Message-ID: <009001c22d47$3ef7cb70$32000240@oemcomputer> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2039245615 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020716/7dea9fd7/attachment.html From gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org Tue Jul 16 23:07:48 2002 From: gunther at aurora.regenstrief.org (Gunther Schadow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: VAX11/780 memory / UNIBUS interaction??? Message-ID: <3D34ED3A.5080006@aurora.regenstrief.org> Hi, I'm still debuggingmy VAX 11/780 that doesn't pass full diagnostics. Here is a dump of the micro-diagnostic run and second stage SBI/memory/options diagnostics: CPU HALTED,SOMM CLEAR,STEP=NONE,CLOCK=NORM RAD=HEX,ADD=PHYS,DAT=LONG,FILL=00,REL=00000000 INIT SEQ DONE HALTED AT 00000000 (RELOADING WCS) LOAD DONE, 0800 MICROWORDS LOADED VER: PCS=01 WCS=0E-10 FPLA=0F CON=V07-00-L ?WARNING-WCS & FPLA VER MISMATCH >>>TEST ?FILE NOT FOUND >>>TEST ZZ-ESKAB V14.0 ESKAD -- V13.1 01,02,03,04, NO. OF 1K BANKS OF WCS = 0002 05,06,07,08,09,0A,0B,0C,0D,0E,0F,10,11,12,13,14,15,16,17, 18,19,1A,1B,1C,1D,1E,1F, ESKAH-V13.2 20, SYSTEM ID REGISTER = 0140B63E KE780 FPLA NOT PRESENT 21,22,23,24,25,26,27,28,29,2A,2B,2C,2D,2E, 2F,30,31,32,33,34,35,36,37,38,39,3A,3B,3C, END PASS 0001 MOUNT FLOPPY ZZ-ESZAD & TYPE "DI" MIC>DI ESKAR-V2.0 3D,3E, CPU TR = 00000010 MS780H 256K CHIP AT TR 00000001 LOWER CNTRLLR MAX ADDRESS+1= 01000000 UPPER CNTRLLR MAX ADDRESS+1= 01000000 DW780 AT TR 00000003 RH780 AT TR 00000008 RH780 AT TR 00000009 3F,40,41,42,43,44,45,46,47,48,49,4A,4B,4C,4D,4E,4F,50,51,52, MS780-E/H IO BASE ADDRESS = 20002000 LOWER CONTROLLER MAX ADDR + 1 = 01000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000000 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000001 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000002 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000003 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 MS780-E/H IO BASE ADDRESS = 20002000 UPPER CONTROLLER MAX ADDR + 1 = 01000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000000 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000001 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000002 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 BOARD NUMBER = 00000003 NUMBER OF CRD ERRORS = 00000000 53, MS780-H 256K CHIP AT TR 00000001 M8376 ROMS OK 54, ?ERROR: 10B8 TEST: 01FF SUBTEST: 0001 DATA: 20002000 20002008 FFFFFFFF FFFFFF00 FFFFFFFF FFFFFFFF 00000000 00000000 TRACE: 00, FAILING MODULES: M8375-L, M8376, I had two more M8375 and another M8376 that came with the VAX 11/785 board set that I bought from Jeffrey Sharp last year. But none of the M8375s changed the problem. When I replaced the M8376 it was even worse: ESKAR-V2.0 3D,3E, CPU TR = 00000010 DW780 AT TR 00000003 RH780 AT TR 00000008 RH780 AT TR 00000009 NO MEMORY CNTRLLRS DEP MS780EH ADDR IN RC0, TYPE LO ?ERROR: 11FA TEST: 0180 SUBTEST: 0001 TRACE: 00, FAILING MODULES: M8376, this time it didn't even go beyond test 3F. So, I put the old M8376 back. And tried to swap the lower and upper M8375s to see if I'd get the problem on the other end. After all, I assume that the message: 54, ?ERROR: 10B8 TEST: 01FF SUBTEST: 0001 DATA: 20002000 20002008 FFFFFFFF FFFFFF00 FFFFFFFF FFFFFFFF 00000000 00000000 TRACE: 00, FAILING MODULES: M8375-L, M8376, means that the M8375-L with "L" for LOWER is causeing the problem. So, I expected M8375-U to be blamed next. But not so. I always get M8375-L, M8376 error. However, what's really strange and the focus of my question is that the outcome depends on whether or not the UNIBUS cabinet is powered on or off. If I have the UNIBUS powered on I get that above error. However, when I have the UNIBUS off, I get this: 54, ?TIMEOUT IN TEST 01FF UPC= 1241 That is, TEST 01FF always fails, but when UNIBUS is off it just times out, when UNIBUS is on we get that failing modules error. Isn't there a way to decouple the UNIBUS issue from the memory subsystem diagnostics? I sort of hope that the boards really aren't broken but some other wires are crossed? I appreciate any advice of you VAX veterans out there! thanks, -Gunther -- Gunther Schadow, M.D., Ph.D. gschadow@regenstrief.org Medical Information Scientist Regenstrief Institute for Health Care Adjunct Assistant Professor Indiana University School of Medicine tel:1(317)630-7960 http://aurora.regenstrief.org From jrkeys at concentric.net Tue Jul 16 23:18:00 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: Need Info on MicroHelp Digitizer Message-ID: <00ab01c22d48$bc223990$32000240@oemcomputer> Picked up a microhelp digitizer made in 1990 and it is a very small box with a ribbon cable hanging out one end with a 25 pin female connector on it. The other end has female phono connector. I looked on the web using google but had no luck. Thanks -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020716/7ab3a4f1/attachment.html From lgwalker at mts.net Wed Jul 17 00:20:00 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? In-Reply-To: <200207170240.g6H2e7S16914@shell1.aracnet.com> References: <3D33992B.25636.6D897D@localhost> from "Lawrence Walker" at Jul 16, 2002 03:55:23 AM Message-ID: <3D33D31D.28741.14FECCC@localhost> > > Honeywell CPUE 111 > > Morel DP S6/92 > > > > There were many other things. Honeywell equipment, large printers. etc. > > that I didn't write down. > > As much as I hate Honeywell computers, I'd say that whatever you found there > that's Honeywell related is probably the most worthy of being rescued. All in > all, it seems to be pretty rare for any collector to have Honeywell stuff in > their collection (I know Sellam has a DPS-6). > > BTW, I'm wondering if that "Morel DP S6/92" isn't a Honeywell DPS-6/92. > > > Do you think that the Gods are now demanding that I collect mini's, teasing > > me first with the Pro 350's I rescued from the town dump recently? > > And in the wilds of north central Manitoba.(Where in hell is that ?) > > "Winnipegosis sounds like a disease." > > Warning, collecting Mini's is a dangerous disease that will seriously effect you > mentally (what might be even worse is how it effects your amount of empty > storage space). I recommend avoiding it at all costs. > > Zane > After years of cramming my micro collection in 1 BR city apartments, I finally have a place with enough room to to mount them. And now this !! The Gods are being unfair. Neither I nor the proprietors have any idea of the value of these items. But of couure it is likely to be inflated if there is any interest. And how in the hell could you afford the freight charges if you wanted to ship them. I might just offer my first-born childrens children and become rich on e-pay sales of DEC key boards. Paxton, where are you when I need you. I must admit that those Mag units were sexy. ( In a Liiinux kind of way) BUT it's NOT Atari !!! Lawrence lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From lgwalker at mts.net Wed Jul 17 00:20:45 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? In-Reply-To: <200207170240.g6H2e7S16914@shell1.aracnet.com> References: <3D33992B.25636.6D897D@localhost> from "Lawrence Walker" at Jul 16, 2002 03:55:23 AM Message-ID: <3D33D31D.3478.14FECF9@localhost> That's what I've always thought, but the sleek cabinets on the Mags are VERY sexy. :^} I was quite comforrtable with my new house with it's 3 BR space not quite giving me enough room to free me to Micro heaven after years of cramming my collection into 1 BR apartments in Toronto aand singing the lack of space collectors blues . Should I succumb and sell off my first-born computers ? Lawrence > > Honeywell CPUE 111 > > Morel DP S6/92 > > > > There were many other things. Honeywell equipment, large printers. etc. > > that I didn't write down. > > As much as I hate Honeywell computers, I'd say that whatever you found there > that's Honeywell related is probably the most worthy of being rescued. All in > all, it seems to be pretty rare for any collector to have Honeywell stuff in > their collection (I know Sellam has a DPS-6). > > BTW, I'm wondering if that "Morel DP S6/92" isn't a Honeywell DPS-6/92. > > > Do you think that the Gods are now demanding that I collect mini's, teasing > > me first with the Pro 350's I rescued from the town dump recently? > > And in the wilds of north central Manitoba.(Where in hell is that ?) > > "Winnipegosis sounds like a disease." > > Warning, collecting Mini's is a dangerous disease that will seriously effect you > mentally (what might be even worse is how it effects your amount of empty > storage space). I recommend avoiding it at all costs. > > Zane > lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From lists at subatomix.com Wed Jul 17 01:07:54 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: IMPORTANT LIST CHANGES In-Reply-To: <047601c22d0a$aee596c0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> References: <157133449870.20020715152830@subatomix.com> <047601c22d0a$aee596c0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <16010724981.20020716171748@subatomix.com> On Tuesday, July 16, 2002, John Allain wrote: >> ... you will need to ... or set the "no-mail" option on one of them. If >> you do not do this, you will receive two copies ... > > How is this done, with no mojordomo to send to, and > http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctalk offering no such option? Check near the bottom of the page, where it says "To change your subscription (set options like digest and delivery modes, get a reminder of your password, or unsubscribe from cctalk) ..." and you will be enlightened. -- Jeffrey Sharp The email address lists@subatomix.com is for mailing list traffic. Please send off-list mail to roach jay ess ess at wasp subatomix beetle dot com. You may need to remove some bugs first. From classiccmp at vintage-computer.com Wed Jul 17 01:08:12 2002 From: classiccmp at vintage-computer.com (Erik S. Klein) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: Quadram Quadboard In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <002a01c22d24$99e1f470$6e7ba8c0@piii933> Patrick, I have a Quadboard Operation Manual, first edition, from March of 1982. From aek at spies.com Wed Jul 17 01:08:26 2002 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: free system 34 in Cincinatti Message-ID: <200207170028.g6H0SOOg031795@spies.com> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2037121806 I wanted to get this for the documentation, but I'm not going to be able to deal with this by the end of the month, which is when it has to be gone. If someone can get it out of there, let me know. From jimdavis at gorge.net Wed Jul 17 01:08:34 2002 From: jimdavis at gorge.net (Jim Davis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: IMPORTANT LIST CHANGES References: Message-ID: <3D34D593.2D90E046@gorge.net> I clicked and got Bad request! Your browser (or proxy) sent a request that this server could not understand. If you think this is a server error, please contact the webmaster Error 400 www.classiccmp.org Tue Jul 16 21:27:27 2002 Apache/2.0.36 (Unix) DAV/2 David Woyciesjes wrote: > > On 07/16/02, John Allain scribbled: > > > > ... you will need to ... or set the "no-mail" > > > option on one of them. If you do not > > > do this, you will receive two copies ... > > > > How is this done, with no mojordomo to send to, and > > http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctalk offering > > no such option? > > > > John A. > > > > > When the change was made, you (should've) gotten a Welcome letter, > with a link to a webpage for changing this option... > Should be something like... > http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/options/cctalk/%EMAIL_ADDRESS > ...you can retrieve you password from there too. > > -- > --- David A. Woyciesjes > --- C&IS Support Specialist > --- Yale University Press > --- (203) 432-0953 > --- ICQ# - 905818 > Mac OSX 10.1 - Darwin Kernel V. 5 > Running since 01/22/02 without a crash From lgwalker at mts.net Wed Jul 17 01:08:53 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? In-Reply-To: <002201c22d35$5dbed7e0$9601a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Message-ID: <3D33D31D.2617.14FEC9F@localhost> I'm waiting for Joe to check in. Then you'll pay !! Infidel !! Lawrence > Doc wrote... > > Well, yes. Everybody gets around to Digital, eventually. > > Yup, they do. Usually after collecting the more interesting HP systems > first, then they do go after the lesser systems like DEC ;) > > Just Kidding! > > Jay West > > lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From geoffr at zipcon.net Wed Jul 17 01:22:01 2002 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716233429.02a89c60@mail.zipcon.net> Anyone have any docs for this beastie? trying to get it up and running, need to know what sort of KB it uses, it looks like a funky RJ-45 ish KB connection :( also, what OS' are supported on this machine? biggest Hard Drive, etc..... and where can I find an OS for this machine??? From GOOI at oce.nl Wed Jul 17 01:58:00 2002 From: GOOI at oce.nl (Gooijen H) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 Message-ID: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EC6@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> > Gooijen H wrote: > > By experiment I will check the NPR wire of the other > > UNIBUS slots. You know why once you have seen the > > backplane of an 11/70. > > Johnny Billquist wrote: > > Huh? It's no more difficult checking the NPR wire in the > > 11/70, than on any other Unibus backplane. And it *is* > > rather simple to see if the jumper is there or not. > > On the 11/70 Mike and I have been working on, the NPR grant > jumpers were wrapped before most of the other wiring, rather > than after. This makes it fairly difficult to see them. On the 11/70 backplane I have, the NPR grant is also wired before all other wires. That is what makes me nervous when I start thinking about cutting a wire for a DMA device. A DD11-DK 9 slot gen purpose backplane is a lot easier when it comes to accessing the NPR wires. I agree that *looking* with a good light source is not too difficult. - Henk. From pat at purdueriots.com Wed Jul 17 02:00:00 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716233429.02a89c60@mail.zipcon.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 16 Jul 2002, Geoff Reed wrote: > Anyone have any docs for this beastie? trying to get it up and running, No, but it's like my 715, so I have 'some clue' > need to know what sort of KB it uses, it looks like a funky RJ-45 ish KB It's called HPIL I think .. HP Interface loop. You can find these on eBay of from collectors that have excess stock :). > connection :( also, what OS' are supported on this machine? biggest Hard NetBSD, Linux, and HP-UX should all work. > Drive, etc..... and where can I find an OS for this machine??? It uses narrorow scsi-2, so that shouldn't be an issue, except for booting perhaps. I know some Sun systems have bugs that prevent booting off a partition past the 1G or 2G mark on the drive, there may be a similar thing here. Memory is a bit funky if I remember correctly, not 'standard' SIMMS. There's some more info on HP's PA-RISC systems over here: http://parisc-linux.org/ -- Pat From GOOI at oce.nl Wed Jul 17 02:08:00 2002 From: GOOI at oce.nl (Gooijen H) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 Message-ID: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EC7@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> The results of the last tests. I measured the contacts on the G7273: all ok. Next test. Conditions: console in slot 40, G7273 in slot 41, M9302 in last slot. slots 42 till last also have G7273's. Result: hung. I swapped (sorry Tony) the G7273 of slot 42 and slot 41. Again: hung. Last test. Moved G7273 from slot 41 back into slot 42 and put the RX211 in #41. The machine runs fine. PROMs on M9312, console, CPU regs, all are accessed without PAUSE going on. > OK, it appears there are 3 possibilities to check out : > > 1) The G7273 card is faulty and/or not making proper contact, > and is thus not actually completing the NPG chain. > > 2) The device _before_ this slot (possibly the arbiter > itself) can drive the input of the RX211 card, but can't drive the > terminator. I have no idea if the latter is a significantly heavier > load, but it might be!. > > 3) There is a problem before this slot (fault on the arbiter), > which is genuinely asserting a grant signal, but the RX211 is > getting into a state where it doesn't pass on grants, so said > errant grant never gets to the M8302 to cause problems. > > Yet again I have to ask you to stop swapping cards around > essentially at random, and to get out the test gear and make some > measurements. With the G7273 card in, look at the grant lines at > the teminator. Is one high? which one? Is it genuinely high, or > marginal? What are the grant lines doing at the arbiter? All low > as they should be? Can you get continuity along the grant chain > with just G7273 cards in the machine? If not, why not? And so on. > Actually get some evidence before trying to cure the fault. > > -tony Well, I am not swapping at random, but at this point the simple tests are exhausted. With the tests/swapping I established good starting points where to look. I agree it is time to pull out the "heavier" tools. This means more than just a quick glance at the schematics. I will post those results, but that might take a while ... tnx all, - Henk. From eric at brouhaha.com Wed Jul 17 02:57:09 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716233429.02a89c60@mail.zipcon.net> Message-ID: <33649.64.169.63.74.1026892535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> >> need to know what sort of KB it uses, it looks like a funky RJ-45 ish >> KB > > It's called HPIL I think .. HP Interface loop. You can find these on > eBay of from collectors that have excess stock :). It might use HP-HIL, Hewlett-Packard Human Interface Loop. But it does *not* use HP-IL (Hewlett-Packard Interface Loop). HP-IL is *completely* different, and won't do anything for you. Roughly speaking, HP-IL is a serial equivalent of IEEE-488 (aka HPIB, GPIB). While it's theoretically possible to build a keyboard with an HP-IL interface, as far as I know HP never offered one. An HP-IL interface was standard on the HP-75 handheld computers and the HP-110 and Portable Plus laptops. HP-IL interface modules were available for the HP-41 calculator, HP-71B handheld computer, Series-80 desktop computers, HP-9807 Integral. An ISA-bus interface card was available for PCs. When HP-IL was introduced, HP published the detailed specifications, but they weren't sure whether they wanted to sell their interface chip, part number 1LB3. I was a beta tester for the component kit, which included the 1LB3, pulse transformers, HP-IL connectors, passive components, and documentation. I built an interface card for the Apple ][, which almost became a Mountain Computer product. HP introduced the component kit as the 82166C. At one time it was announced that National Semiconductor would second source the 1LB3 chip; IIRC the part number was to be NSC851. As far as I know, National never actually offered it for sale. From lgwalker at mts.net Wed Jul 17 04:34:04 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? In-Reply-To: <200207170240.g6H2e7S16914@shell1.aracnet.com> References: <3D33992B.25636.6D897D@localhost> from "Lawrence Walker" at Jul 16, 2002 03:55:23 AM Message-ID: <3D340EB7.31614.238C528@localhost> Which is part of why I avoided collecting minis for a long time, Was it you that rented a 3-story building to house your mini collection ? That's what finally scared me. There's serious collecting and then there's SERIOUS collecting. > > Honeywell CPUE 111 > > Morel DP S6/92 > > > > There were many other things. Honeywell equipment, large printers. etc. > > that I didn't write down. > > As much as I hate Honeywell computers, I'd say that whatever you found there > that's Honeywell related is probably the most worthy of being rescued. All in > all, it seems to be pretty rare for any collector to have Honeywell stuff in > their collection (I know Sellam has a DPS-6). > > BTW, I'm wondering if that "Morel DP S6/92" isn't a Honeywell DPS-6/92. > > > Do you think that the Gods are now demanding that I collect mini's, teasing > > me first with the Pro 350's I rescued from the town dump recently? > > And in the wilds of north central Manitoba.(Where in hell is that ?) > > "Winnipegosis sounds like a disease." > > Warning, collecting Mini's is a dangerous disease that will seriously effect you > mentally (what might be even worse is how it effects your amount of empty > storage space). I recommend avoiding it at all costs. > > Zane > lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From lgwalker at mts.net Wed Jul 17 04:47:01 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? In-Reply-To: <3D33992B.25636.6D897D@localhost> Message-ID: <3D3411C8.25620.244C030@localhost> As much as I enjoy the foreplay could some of you mini freaks do me a line by line description of what each of these "boxens" are ? Again. I am a mini neophyte. Neither I nor the "owners" have a clue. Thanks Lawrence > Well I finally got back to the salvage/surplus place to get a list of the HP > stuff they had and found they had another big room full of stuff they had > removed from a large government installation. This was in the attic of a large > building during one of the hottest days we've had up here and my sweat was > dripping on my notepad so please excuse my attempts to decipher my notes. You > must also realize that I'm a complete mini neophyte. > > The original HP stuff I saw : > HP 12979A I/O expander > HP 96MX System controller > HP 7970B Tape Unit > HP 1000 w/ cybernex 1100 term > HP System 2748B > There were also several HP 2624 A, B, and Standard K-Bs and some > monitors or terminals on the skid. > > The big room was dominated by about 50-60 Sybernex workstations > (which are similar to the Wyse ones so often tossed by thift stores), > heavy duty monitor arm stands, and metal desks. But then the goodies. > > About 20 DEC VT420/320/220 terminals > A box of LK402 keyboards (20-30 of them) > An IBM 3278 terminal > A DEC VAX SA482 rack w/4 populated banks > About 10 Decwriter II's and III's > A DEC VAX 6310 in rack > 2 very impressive-looking 5' MagTape racks > Honeywell CPUE 111 > Morel DP S6/92 > > There were many other things. Honeywell equipment, large printers. etc. > that I didn't write down. > > Do you think that the Gods are now demanding that I collect mini's, teasing me > first with the Pro 350's I rescued from the town dump recently? And in the wilds > of north central Manitoba.(Where in hell is that ?) "Winnipegosis sounds like a > disease." > > Lawrence > > > lgwalker@mts.net > bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From tractorb at ihug.co.nz Wed Jul 17 05:54:00 2002 From: tractorb at ihug.co.nz (Dave Brown) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: CRT problem References: <014c01c22cbd$b85b7dc0$0101a8c0@athlon> <10207161854.ZM15200@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> Message-ID: <02bd01c22d80$22eb6070$0101a8c0@athlon> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pete Turnbull" > I remember when I was a teenager and started fixing old tellys, that many > of them had a flat laminated glass sheet, about 1/4" thick, in front of a > plain CRT. Exactly what I had in mind as an alternative. The 9845 screen surround lends itself to doing that very easily and 'elegantly' as it projects forward about an inch or so- all the way round. Reminds me of the first TV I ever had-- an old Ekco (darned if I know how that fine product of the UK got to NZ-'twas a 'modified' dual std beast -- 405 and 625 line stds- for the usa readers) It had a 1/4 inch plate glass separate screen about an inch out front of the tube face. Several NZ TV set manufacturers had the same arrangement in the early years. That Ekco had horrible series filament tubes types in it- real oddball ones- One night the picture started to get smaller and brighter-- finally disappeared with a mild band about three days later so I went out and got a replacement- but it lasted several years-- what a dog!!! But it was cheap at the time. Dave B, NZ From tractorb at ihug.co.nz Wed Jul 17 06:07:00 2002 From: tractorb at ihug.co.nz (Dave Brown) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: CRT problem References: Message-ID: <02c201c22d82$0adbf1a0$0101a8c0@athlon> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Duell" < > My only worry would be if the CRT envelope requires the extra bonded > faceplate for strength. In other words, is the remaining glass layer > thick enough to withstand atmospheric pressure? Fair comment but I doubt it's an issue. This CRT has the look of an HP jackup to it- it's basically a plain vanilla green screen CRT that looks like they literally just glued this other stuff on it's front. I've never seen anything quite like it before. Most of the computer terminals from this era ( eg Ball monitors etc) had unbonded tubes I think- with separate safety glass, often curved and usually tinted- this looks like HP were trying to make it all look a bit better cosmetically without too much extra expense. I had a 'disposal' contract with ICL locally thru most of the 70's and early 80's--bonded CRTs only started to appear in their terminals towards the end of that period. Think I tossed out the last of the 10" Ball monitors and spares fairly recently. Dave B, NZ From rumi_ml at rtfm.hu Wed Jul 17 06:24:00 2002 From: rumi_ml at rtfm.hu (Rumi Szabolcs) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716233429.02a89c60@mail.zipcon.net> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716233429.02a89c60@mail.zipcon.net> Message-ID: <200207171322510324.00E22E34@mail.local> On 2002.07.16 at 23:36 Geoff Reed wrote: >Anyone have any docs for this beastie? trying to get it up and running, >need to know what sort of KB it uses, it looks like a funky RJ-45 ish KB >connection :( also, what OS' are supported on this machine? biggest Hard >Drive, etc..... and where can I find an OS for this machine??? The HP 9000/710 is a very nice box indeed. With 64MB RAM and a 4GB disk in it HPUX 10.20 runs like a charm. With 32MB or less maybe you should try HPUX 9.x. It needs a HP-HIL keyboard and mouse, those are sometimes offered on eBay. But you can also use a serial console, just don't ask me how to switch to it on that model... ;) Regards, Szabolcs Rumi - From jim at jkearney.com Wed Jul 17 07:29:04 2002 From: jim at jkearney.com (Jim Kearney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716233429.02a89c60@mail.zipcon.net> <200207171322510324.00E22E34@mail.local> Message-ID: <006801c22d8d$61e15070$1301090a@xpace.net> I have some RAM for this if you want it... Kingston KTH715/64s. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rumi Szabolcs" To: Sent: Wednesday, July 17, 2002 8:22 AM Subject: Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). > On 2002.07.16 at 23:36 Geoff Reed wrote: > > >Anyone have any docs for this beastie? trying to get it up and running, > >need to know what sort of KB it uses, it looks like a funky RJ-45 ish KB > >connection :( also, what OS' are supported on this machine? biggest Hard > >Drive, etc..... and where can I find an OS for this machine??? > > The HP 9000/710 is a very nice box indeed. With 64MB RAM and a 4GB disk > in it HPUX 10.20 runs like a charm. With 32MB or less maybe you should > try HPUX 9.x. It needs a HP-HIL keyboard and mouse, those are sometimes > offered on eBay. But you can also use a serial console, just don't ask > me how to switch to it on that model... ;) > > Regards, > > Szabolcs Rumi > > - > > From palazzol at comcast.net Wed Jul 17 07:32:00 2002 From: palazzol at comcast.net (Frank Palazzolo) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: Tape Drive Questions Message-ID: <3D352A2A.15265.28EA8A@localhost> Hello, I've spent some time over the past year or so reverse-engineering the Mattel Intellivision Keyboard Component. This was a prototype computer add-on for the Mattel Intellivision game system, which was test-marketed but never released. I'm basically done figuring almost everything out about it, and working on emulating it. You can read about it here: http://www.intellivisionlives.com/bluesky/hardware/keyboard_tech.ht ml The tape drives in these units were unusually sophisticated. They were essentially random-access 4-track cassette drives. Side A was read-only, and side B was read-write. Also, on each side, the left channel was audio and the right channel was digital data, directly recorded. This would allow for applications to Read/Write digital data and play/record audio simulataneously. They also has the ability to detect the tape leader via an optical sensor. The 2 questions I have are: 1) Does this drive sound like a drive from any other vintage computer system? 2) Anyone know who could tackle repairing such a thing? I've had no trouble fixing electrical problems, but tape drives are a whole different animal... I've basically examined 4 of these units and they all have mechanical problems. Emulating the system may prove to be the only way to ever see the software running. Thanks, Frank P.S. - If I make it to VCF 5.0, I'd like to do a talk about emulating old systems in general, and using this one as an example in particular. It's quite a beast. From rumi_ml at rtfm.hu Wed Jul 17 07:41:00 2002 From: rumi_ml at rtfm.hu (Rumi Szabolcs) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). In-Reply-To: <006801c22d8d$61e15070$1301090a@xpace.net> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716233429.02a89c60@mail.zipcon.net> <200207171322510324.00E22E34@mail.local> <006801c22d8d$61e15070$1301090a@xpace.net> Message-ID: <200207171440200669.01291FB5@mail.local> On 2002.07.17 at 08:27 Jim Kearney wrote: >I have some RAM for this if you want it... Kingston KTH715/64s. Just watch out with that, because although the 712/715 memory sticks are really compatible with the 710 generally, but the KTH 715/64 kit has two 32MB sticks AFAIK, and specs are saying 8x8MB is the maximum RAM for the 9000/710 so I'm not sure if 32MB modules would work there... Regards, Szabolcs Rumi - From carlos_murillo at epm.net.co Wed Jul 17 07:41:13 2002 From: carlos_murillo at epm.net.co (Carlos Murillo) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716233429.02a89c60@mail.zipcon.net> Message-ID: <3.0.2.32.20020717084040.019db434@pop1.epm.net.co> At 11:36 PM 7/16/02 -0700, you wrote: >Anyone have any docs for this beastie? trying to get it up and running, >need to know what sort of KB it uses, it looks like a funky RJ-45 ish KB >connection :( also, what OS' are supported on this machine? biggest Hard >Drive, etc..... and where can I find an OS for this machine??? The HP 9000/710 is a first generation HPPA system featuring a 50MHz PA-7000 processor. It can run HPUX 8.05 to 10.2 . It won't run Linux when it is available (needs at least a PA-7100 processor). You need an HP-HIL keyboard and mouse. The boot HD's size can be at least 2GB with HPUX 10.2 AFAIK; the original configurations sold by HP are shown below: Boot Model Description Type Rom OS support A2208A ?Model 710 grey,diskless DeskTop 2.0 8.05-9.07 .10.01-10.20 . A2209A ?Model 710 grey,420 Mbyte,flex. DeskTop 2.0 8.05-9.07 .10.01-10.20 . A2210A ?Model 710 1024 color,diskless DeskTop 2.0 8.05-9.07 .10.01-10.20 . A2211A ?Model 710 1024 color,420 Mbyte DeskTop 2.0 8.05-9.07 .10.01-10.20 . A2212A ?Model 710 grey,420 Mbyte DeskTop 2.0 8.05-9.07 .10.01-10.20 . A2213A ?Model 710 1280 color,diskless DeskTop 2.0 8.05-9.07 .10.01-10.20 . A2214A ?Model 710 1280 color,420 Mbyte DeskTop 2.0 8.05-9.07 .10.01-10.20 . A2215A ?Model 710 1280 color,840 Mbyte DeskTop 2.0 8.05-9.07 .10.01-10.20 . A2222A ?Model 710 1280 color,420 Mbyte,DDS DeskTop 2.0 8.05-9.07 .10.01-10.20 . Does it have a framebuffer? What are the model numbers on it? It might be that 710 FB's still use the 60Hz refresh rate of earlier series 400 systems. How much RAM does it have? Contact me off the list for info on bootable install media. carlos. -------------------------------------------------------------- Carlos E. Murillo-Sanchez carlos_murillo@nospammers.ieee.org From carlos_murillo at epm.net.co Wed Jul 17 07:59:01 2002 From: carlos_murillo at epm.net.co (Carlos Murillo) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). In-Reply-To: <200207171440200669.01291FB5@mail.local> References: <006801c22d8d$61e15070$1301090a@xpace.net> <5.1.0.14.2.20020716233429.02a89c60@mail.zipcon.net> <200207171322510324.00E22E34@mail.local> <006801c22d8d$61e15070$1301090a@xpace.net> Message-ID: <3.0.2.32.20020717085801.019d8b1c@pop1.epm.net.co> At 02:40 PM 7/17/02 +0100, you wrote: >On 2002.07.17 at 08:27 Jim Kearney wrote: > >>I have some RAM for this if you want it... Kingston KTH715/64s. > >Just watch out with that, because although the 712/715 memory >sticks are really compatible with the 710 generally, but the >KTH 715/64 kit has two 32MB sticks AFAIK, and specs are saying >8x8MB is the maximum RAM for the 9000/710 so I'm not sure if >32MB modules would work there... >Szabolcs Rumi I think that 710 memory is installed in quads, so it could different from 715 memory. From the hardware compatibility guide: RAM products: Formal Product Number Description Type SPU Hardware Support Comments A2201A 8 Mbyte ECC RAM (one)Model 710 e A2202A 16 MB (o e) Models 710 e ,745 i A2216A 8 Mbyte RAM pair (2,4MB@)Models 705,710 Excluding Model 710 e . A2217A 16 Mbyte RAM pair (2,8MB@)Models 705,710 Excluding Model 710 e . A2218A 32 Mbyte RAM pair (2,16MB@)Models 705,710 Excluding Model 710 e . Note: I think that 710e stands for an upgraded 425s, so it seems that the original 710 can accept 8 16MB sticks for up to 128MB RAM (though you probably need to put the HD in an external enclosure to limit power consumption if you max out the RAM like this). Also from the hardware compatibility guide: CPU RAM Designs: SPU Model RAM Slots RAM Design Speed Comments 710?[/50] 8,2 quads - - Must be used in quads -------------------------------------------------------------- Carlos E. Murillo-Sanchez carlos_murillo@nospammers.ieee.org From ClassicComputers at bouncy-castle.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 17 08:04:01 2002 From: ClassicComputers at bouncy-castle.demon.co.uk (Greg Elkin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: "majordomo" address (was Re: IMPORTANT LIST CHANGES) In-Reply-To: <000901c22d26$f9886d30$9601a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Message-ID: <3D3578FD.21902.67687089@localhost> friend of mine located in Leicester has the following manuals : "set of VME Series 39 manuals. VME is the operating system that runs on ICL mainframes. Nottingham City Council used to have one, but it was sold to an oursourcing company a few years ago when we started migrating off of the mainframe onto unix. Now we are come to the Day of Doom for our mainframe apps - all will be gone in a couple of months. I've been clearing out cupboards and have discovered a few manuals that escaped the earlier purge, to wit and viz: Vocabulary of SCL Command Specifications (4-volume epic) System Management Dictionary System Management (2 off) Moving Workloads Work Scheduling SAM User Guide File Transfer System Performance Accounting, Charging & Budgeting (2 off) ICL Cobol C2 compiler (on open reel tape!) VME-X System Administrator's Reference Manual VME-X User's Reference Manual OPENframework/92 Systems Integration Guide ...plus a handful of smaller guides about diverse subjects All in good nick. I will let anyone have them who wants them, on a first- come, first-serve basis. Just pay for the postage. To give you an idea of the size, this should all fit into 3 Walker's Crisps boxes." contact richardh@mail.com if you're interested. From ClassicComputers at bouncy-castle.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 17 08:10:00 2002 From: ClassicComputers at bouncy-castle.demon.co.uk (Greg Elkin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: ICL VME manuals - was Re: "majordomo" address (was Re: IMPORTANT LIST CHANGES) In-Reply-To: <3D3578FD.21902.67687089@localhost> References: <000901c22d26$f9886d30$9601a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Message-ID: <3D357A7A.9940.676E4273@localhost> next time I change the subject line as appropriate & remember to say "located in the UK" before hitting send... greg > friend of mine located in Leicester has the following manuals : > > "set of VME Series 39 manuals. VME is the operating system that runs > on ICL mainframes. Nottingham City Council used to have one, but it > was sold to an oursourcing company a few years ago when we started > migrating off of the mainframe onto unix. > > Now we are come to the Day of Doom for our mainframe apps - all will > be gone in a couple of months. I've been clearing out cupboards and > have discovered a few manuals that escaped the earlier purge, to wit > and viz: Vocabulary of SCL Command Specifications (4-volume epic) > System Management Dictionary System Management (2 off) Moving > Workloads Work Scheduling SAM User Guide File Transfer System > Performance Accounting, Charging & Budgeting (2 off) ICL Cobol C2 > compiler (on open reel tape!) VME-X System Administrator's Reference > Manual VME-X User's Reference Manual OPENframework/92 Systems > Integration Guide ...plus a handful of smaller guides about diverse > subjects > > All in good nick. I will let anyone have them who wants them, on a > first- come, first-serve basis. Just pay for the postage. To give you > an idea of the size, this should all fit into 3 Walker's Crisps > boxes." > > contact richardh@mail.com if you're interested. > > From jim at jkearney.com Wed Jul 17 08:22:00 2002 From: jim at jkearney.com (Jim Kearney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). References: <006801c22d8d$61e15070$1301090a@xpace.net> <5.1.0.14.2.20020716233429.02a89c60@mail.zipcon.net> <200207171322510324.00E22E34@mail.local> <006801c22d8d$61e15070$1301090a@xpace.net> <3.0.2.32.20020717085801.019d8b1c@pop1.epm.net.co> Message-ID: <004101c22d94$d4a50730$1901090a@xpace.net> I did some research, and you're right. The list of computer this RAM will work in is: HP 3000/9X8 ? 918RX / 928LX / 928RX/ 968LX/968RX/978LX/978RX/ 988LX/ 988RX HP 9000 725/100, 715/50? 715/75?725/50? 725/75, 715/100?715/100CX?715/64? 715/80, 715/33, 745i(100MHz)?745i(50MHz)?747i(100MHz)?747i(50MHz) Sorry for the confusion. I guess I'll be putting these up on eBay. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carlos Murillo" To: Sent: Wednesday, July 17, 2002 8:58 AM Subject: Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). > At 02:40 PM 7/17/02 +0100, you wrote: > >On 2002.07.17 at 08:27 Jim Kearney wrote: > > > >>I have some RAM for this if you want it... Kingston KTH715/64s. > > > >Just watch out with that, because although the 712/715 memory > >sticks are really compatible with the 710 generally, but the > >KTH 715/64 kit has two 32MB sticks AFAIK, and specs are saying > >8x8MB is the maximum RAM for the 9000/710 so I'm not sure if > >32MB modules would work there... > >Szabolcs Rumi > > I think that 710 memory is installed in quads, so it could > different from 715 memory. From the hardware compatibility guide: > > RAM products: > > Formal > Product > Number Description Type SPU Hardware Support Comments > > A2201A 8 Mbyte ECC RAM (one)Model 710 e > A2202A 16 MB (o e) Models 710 e ,745 i > A2216A 8 Mbyte RAM pair (2,4MB@)Models 705,710 Excluding Model 710 e . > A2217A 16 Mbyte RAM pair (2,8MB@)Models 705,710 Excluding Model 710 e . > A2218A 32 Mbyte RAM pair (2,16MB@)Models 705,710 Excluding Model 710 e . > > Note: I think that 710e stands for an upgraded 425s, so it seems that the > original 710 can accept 8 16MB sticks for up to 128MB RAM (though you > probably need to put the HD in an external enclosure to limit power > consumption if you max out the RAM like this). Also from > the hardware compatibility guide: > > CPU RAM Designs: > > SPU > Model RAM Slots RAM Design Speed Comments > 710?[/50] 8,2 quads - - Must be used in quads > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > Carlos E. Murillo-Sanchez carlos_murillo@nospammers.ieee.org > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Jul 17 08:43:09 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) In-Reply-To: <33649.64.169.63.74.1026892535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com > References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716233429.02a89c60@mail.zipcon.net> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020717094308.444fec28@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 12:55 AM 7/17/02 -0700, Eric wrote: >>> need to know what sort of KB it uses, it looks like a funky RJ-45 ish >>> KB >> >> It's called HPIL I think .. HP Interface loop. You can find these on >> eBay of from collectors that have excess stock :). > >It might use HP-HIL, Hewlett-Packard Human Interface Loop. Eric is correct. The keyboards use HP-HIL and not HP-IL. They're two completely different things. I don't know how it got started but a lot of E-bay sellers list HP_HIL devices and call them HP-IL. HP-HIL is used for operator input devices; keyboards, mice, tablets, numeric keypads, etc. HP-IL is a two wire serial version of HP-IB and it used for peripheral interfaces to things like cassette drives, some meters, O-scopes, logic analyzers, printers, etc. It has never been used for any keyboards, mice or related items to my knowledge. You might try searching E-bay for "HP-IL" and find a keyboard and/or mouse. They're quite common. Bear in mind that if it's a keyboard or similar device they will be HP-HIL even if the seller claims it's HP-IL. As you noted, HP-HIL uses the RJ-45 ish connector. Usually there will be two sockets close together so that you can daisy chain other HP-HIL devices to it. The connectors and sockets are identified by one or two dots or raised dimple so that's another way to identify them. The dots are used to idetify which socket to plug additional devices into. Plug the connector with a single dot into the socket with a single dot, ditto for items with two dots. Joe From zmerch at 30below.com Wed Jul 17 09:42:05 2002 From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:09 2005 Subject: Commodore stuff for goodbye... (and one OT item...) Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020717100031.0241bf30@mail.30below.com> Have some commodore stuff to get rid of; most needs to be boxed; will see what I can do to alleviate cost of boxing... Shipping from 49783; have a "Pack -n- ship" place next door, so there is usually a surcharge to normal UPS/Fedex prices (being next door, we usually get a bit of a break, however). All of these items are "condition unknown" - they were given to me, and I've never had 'em hooked up. No warranties, and all that jazz. (1) MPS802 printer - in original box with original styrofoam; ready to ship (just needs to be taped up) - looks to be in really good shape, but that's just looks... (1) MPS802 printer - no box, no top cover. (1) Model 1351 mouse (2) old-style C=64s; 1 looks complete, the 2nd missing keys from the keyboard. (1) new-style C=64 (similar case to the C=128) - looks complete, has a "document support stand" attached just above the function keys. (3) Model 1541 floppy drives - one is in the original box, and has a garage sale sticker that says "doesn't work, $1.00" - the other two are bare; obviously; condition unknown. (1) commie (clone) drive of unknown specific origin: sole marking on the front says "excelerator plus"; back says on small sticker: "Oceanic Electronics Corp. / FCC ID: GLB3390C-118 / Golden Image / Made in Taiwan / [FCC blurb]" - serial # 1149152. Your guess is better than mine... :-) (2) manuals - one listed as C64 user's manual, one listed as C64 user's guide; printed in prolly 1984 & 1983 respectively. All for cost of shipping, and boxing if I can't find the materials... If local pickup (Sault Ste. Marie, Michigan; take I-75 north until everyone says "eh?" ;-) it's free, but I'm not holding my breath... The stuff's gotta go ASAP, so unforch, it's first come, first served... =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= OT blurb: I have a PlayStation 1 available with some interesting goodies; $100 shipped; contact me off-list if interested. -- Roger "Merch" Merchberger --- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers Recycling is good, right??? Ok, so I'll recycle an old .sig. If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead disarmament should *not* be your first career choice. From mrbill at mrbill.net Wed Jul 17 10:37:04 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: [phunt@ICW.ie: PDP-11's] (Ireland) Message-ID: <20020717153534.GZ11452@mrbill.net> Please contact Patrick directly. Bill ----- Forwarded message from phunt@ICW.ie ----- From: phunt@ICW.ie To: mrbill@pdp11.org Subject: PDP-11's Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 16:00:21 +0100 Hi, Not sure if you meant it, but have two full working PDP-11's with various disks, drives etc which we have just decomissioned and are about to dispose of. If you know anyone interested in any of the parts, let me know quickly. thanks, Pat Patrick Hunt IS Services Nexans Ireland Limited Athlone Co.Westmeath Ireland Ph: +353-902-75001 Fax: +353-902-74968 e-mail: pat.hunt@nexans.com Web: www.nexans.ie ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Bill Bradford mrbill@mrbill.net Austin, TX From pat at purdueriots.com Wed Jul 17 10:57:00 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) In-Reply-To: <33649.64.169.63.74.1026892535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 17 Jul 2002, Eric Smith wrote: > >> need to know what sort of KB it uses, it looks like a funky RJ-45 ish > >> KB > > > > It's called HPIL I think .. HP Interface loop. You can find these on > > eBay of from collectors that have excess stock :). > > It might use HP-HIL, Hewlett-Packard Human Interface Loop. Arrrgh. That's what I *meant* to say. -- Pat From Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com Wed Jul 17 11:14:00 2002 From: Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com (Andreas Freiherr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: LSI-11/2 References: <3D345D06.554233AB@Vishay.com> <3D346817.8179327B@ecubics.com> Message-ID: <3D352F90.DA8372FC@Vishay.com> No, I hope it didn't go out of style, but according to http://www.vaxarchive.org/hw/vfg/vfglist.txt, there are scans ready for upload at least since 19-APR-1999, so sending another copy wouldn't really help. In addition, I took closeups of the chips, just in case we need some detail information in order to upgrade a board. emanuel stiebler wrote: > > Andreas Freiherr wrote: > > > > Last night, I finally made it into the basement to dig out something > > like this. Found a M8044-DC (obviously a MSV11-DD) and a M8044-DF > > (apparently also a MSV11-DD). Both have regular 16k*1 chips in a 4*8 > > array. I didn't find a difference between M8044-DF and -DC (rev level, > > perhaps?), aside from one using ceramic Hitachi chips (HM4716A-3) while > > the other has plastic Fairchild ones (MB8116E). > > > > If you're interested, I took a couple of pictures before storing the > > modules back. Let me know if you want them (~40kB * 6 .JPG files). > > When did the vaxarchive go out of stile ? > ;-) > > Specially: > > http://www.vaxarchive.org/hw/vfg/ddual.html > > cheers -- Andreas Freiherr Vishay Semiconductor GmbH, Heilbronn, Germany http://www.vishay.com From Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com Wed Jul 17 11:14:26 2002 From: Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com (Andreas Freiherr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: LSI-11/2 References: <200207170157.VAA30029472@shell.TheWorld.com> Message-ID: <3D353E79.AF180EAB@Vishay.com> Thanks, Megan! I just couldn't believe it's THAT simple! :-) Andreas Megan wrote: > > >Last night, I finally made it into the basement to dig out something > >like this. Found a M8044-DC (obviously a MSV11-DD) and a M8044-DF > >(apparently also a MSV11-DD). Both have regular 16k*1 chips in a 4*8 > >array. I didn't find a difference between M8044-DF and -DC (rev level, > >perhaps?), aside from one using ceramic Hitachi chips (HM4716A-3) while > >the other has plastic Fairchild ones (MB8116E). > > You found the difference... the 'x' part of M8044-Dx is the vendor > who supplied the chips which went on the board. -- Andreas Freiherr Vishay Semiconductor GmbH, Heilbronn, Germany http://www.vishay.com From dwoycies at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu Wed Jul 17 11:14:41 2002 From: dwoycies at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: OT: MS/S.Ballmer fesses up... a little Message-ID: I just thought everybody here might appreciate this. He's finally admitting something world+dog already knew. From dwoycies at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu Wed Jul 17 11:15:00 2002 From: dwoycies at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: IMPORTANT LIST CHANGES In-Reply-To: <3D34D593.2D90E046@gorge.net> Message-ID: On 07/16/02, Jim Davis scribbled: > I clicked and got > Bad request! > > Your browser (or proxy) sent a request that this server could not > understand. > > If you think this is a server error, please contact the webmaster > > Error 400 > > www.classiccmp.org > Tue Jul 16 21:27:27 2002 > Apache/2.0.36 (Unix) DAV/2 > Did you put in the email (address your subscribed under) in place of %EMAIL_ADDRESS in the URL? Or did you get that when you clicked on something else? > David Woyciesjes wrote: > > > > On 07/16/02, John Allain scribbled: > > > > > > ... you will need to ... or set the "no-mail" > > > > option on one of them. If you do not > > > > do this, you will receive two copies ... > > > > > > How is this done, with no mojordomo to send to, and > > > http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctalk offering > > > no such option? > > > > > > John A. > > > > > > > > When the change was made, you (should've) gotten a Welcome letter, > > with a link to a webpage for changing this option... > > Should be something like... > > http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/options/cctalk/%EMAIL_ADDRESS > > ...you can retrieve you password from there too. > > > > -- > > --- David A. Woyciesjes > -- --- David A. Woyciesjes --- C&IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ# - 905818 Mac OSX 10.1 - Darwin Kernel V. 5 Running since 01/22/02 without a crash From lists at subatomix.com Wed Jul 17 12:37:00 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: IMPORTANT LIST CHANGES In-Reply-To: <3D34D593.2D90E046@gorge.net> References: <3D34D593.2D90E046@gorge.net> Message-ID: <1788611552.20020717123134@subatomix.com> For those who are having trouble getting to their preferences page: Go here: http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctalk or here: http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctech depending on which list you want to change the options of. Go to (almost) the very bottom of the page. You will see "To change your subscription (set options like digest and delivery modes, get a reminder of your password, or unsubscribe from cctech)". Enter your email address in this box and click "Edit Options" to (you guessed it) edit your options. Note that this will work only once you're subscribed. -- Jeffrey Sharp The email address lists@subatomix.com is for mailing list traffic. Please send off-list mail to roach jay ess ess at wasp subatomix beetle dot com. You may need to remove some bugs first. From xds_sigma7 at hotmail.com Wed Jul 17 13:19:01 2002 From: xds_sigma7 at hotmail.com (Will Jennings) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? Message-ID: A DPS-6/92 is a 32-bit member of the DPS-6 (formerly known as Level 6) family.. Ran GCOS mod 400 or mod 600, possibly the Ultimate OS as well (a Pick OS for DPS-6s).. Well I'm fairly sure its 32-bit, earlier DPS-6s were 16-bitters but I'm nearly certain that a 6/92 is a 32 bit.. I believe the maximum memory for it is 4 million words.. Fast fast machine, mid to late 1980's vintage.. What peripherals are wih it? Honeywell's line printers were mainly Dataproducts units, the terminals should be VIP7xxx family I believe, could possibly be branded as Bull, since Groupe Bull bought Honeywell's computer division after years of co-development.. Disk drives I believe are OEM'd CDC units, same with mag tape drives... I don't know if anyone else would, but I'd sure pay money for it and all the related bits.. Hope you've gained some info on it from my description.. Will J _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Wed Jul 17 15:28:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? In-Reply-To: <200207170330.g6H3UgB18627@shell1.aracnet.com> Message-ID: <20020717202709.88360.qmail@web10303.mail.yahoo.com> --- "Zane H. Healy" wrote: > > --- "Zane H. Healy" wrote: > > > Warning, collecting Mini's is a dangerous disease... > > > > True. I have mine spread amongst 4 locations... > > You do realized that you just proved my point (as well as Ben's)? > > Zane Well... yes. As one of my housemates has said (many times ;-) "It couldn't be *stamps*?!?" -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Jul 17 15:44:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: Tape Drive Questions In-Reply-To: <3D352A2A.15265.28EA8A@localhost> Message-ID: On Wed, 17 Jul 2002, Frank Palazzolo wrote: > 2) Anyone know who could tackle repairing such a thing? I've had no > trouble fixing electrical problems, but tape drives are a whole > different animal... > > I've basically examined 4 of these units and they all have mechanical > problems. Emulating the system may prove to be the only way to ever see > the software running. Does there appear to be a common failure for all 4 drives? I'd have to guess (without seeing the drives anyway) that they failed simply because they need maintenance. Tapes drives in general are highly failure prone anyway, due to their inherent design. -Toth From chd_1 at nktelco.net Wed Jul 17 18:51:14 2002 From: chd_1 at nktelco.net (Chuck Dickman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: free system 34 in Cincinatti References: <200207170028.g6H0SOOg031795@spies.com> Message-ID: <3D3601D5.F1FD54AE@nktelco.net> Not sure what I am getting myself in for, but I am only 100 miles north of Cincinnati on I-75. I can pick it up, if they can load it on the back of a pickup truck, I can bring it back to my garage. If all you want is the documentation, I can ship that out to you. I could even send the PDP-14 info that I was going to send you. If you have no other offers, I can get it. Al Kossow wrote: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2037121806 > > I wanted to get this for the documentation, but I'm not going to > be able to deal with this by the end of the month, which is when > it has to be gone. > > If someone can get it out of there, let me know. From e_cloud at yahoo.com Wed Jul 17 18:55:01 2002 From: e_cloud at yahoo.com (Shawn Rutledge) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: Stuff available: PDP-8 desk, Masscomp Message-ID: <20020717235140.26255.qmail@web14311.mail.yahoo.com> I have to get rid of some of this bulky stuff that I'm not getting much use out of... I have a PDP8 desk (sunken area for console, rack under the left side) that I was using for my PC workstation but have since built another desk that holds more equipment, so this one is now surplus. The power controller that came with it is available depending on how much you want to offer. I never had the computer itself; I found this desk at ASU surplus several years ago. I found a picture of it on the 'net a while ago but have lost the link. I have a Masscomp of some kind. It's dusty now and I haven't tested it, but a friend unloaded it on me a couple years ago and told me it worked the last he knew; it has a hard drive and floppy, and a lot of serial ports. It is mounted in a rack about 4' high, which is half-empty. I have a lot of manuals and disks etc. for it. I was told this is an early real-time Unix system using the 68K processor. I live in Phoenix, AZ and you would need to pick these up. I'm open for offers of any kind on either of them. Please email e_cloud@yahoo.com; I will try to check the list but I'm subscribed in digest mode and will be more likely to notice if you email me directly. ===== . _______ Shawn T. Rutledge / KB7PWD ecloud@bigfoot.com (_ | |_) http://ecloud.org/ kb7pwd@kb7pwd.ampr.org __) | | \______________________________________________ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From rhudson at cnonline.net Wed Jul 17 18:56:31 2002 From: rhudson at cnonline.net (Ron Hudson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: I don't remember... help.. Message-ID: <200207171653.13575.rhudson@cnonline.net> I am trying to remember the apollo systems I was administrating in about 1984 while I worked for CALMA. They were very large, slightly smaller than a 3 foot cube, They had very large monochrome displays (21") and ran an os known as appollo domian, which was very unix like. They keyboards all had touch pads. The systems were connected via the same type of coax used in cable tv. They were connected in a loop. One system had a open reel tape drive, one of the slide in reel types that threaded itself. There may have been a color version too. From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 17 19:13:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? In-Reply-To: <200207170240.g6H2e7S16914@shell1.aracnet.com> from "Zane H. Healy" at Jul 16, 2 07:40:07 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 810 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020717/082def8f/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 17 19:14:35 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716233429.02a89c60@mail.zipcon.net> from "Geoff Reed" at Jul 16, 2 11:36:09 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 237 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020717/a609327d/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 17 19:16:08 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: help needed: problem with UNIBUS access on my PDP-11/70 In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EC7@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> from "Gooijen H" at Jul 17, 2 09:00:16 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 3188 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020717/11fa73c2/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 17 19:18:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) In-Reply-To: <33649.64.169.63.74.1026892535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> from "Eric Smith" at Jul 17, 2 00:55:35 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2390 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020717/5f324431/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 17 19:19:31 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: CRT problem In-Reply-To: <02bd01c22d80$22eb6070$0101a8c0@athlon> from "Dave Brown" at Jul 17, 2 10:53:07 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 4006 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020717/3236af41/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 17 19:21:17 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: CRT problem In-Reply-To: <02c201c22d82$0adbf1a0$0101a8c0@athlon> from "Dave Brown" at Jul 17, 2 11:06:45 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 448 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020717/5ca8be30/attachment.ksh From archer at topnow.com Wed Jul 17 20:22:05 2002 From: archer at topnow.com (Ross Archer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) Message-ID: <3D3617FA.BBCA2BB8@topnow.com> I'm suffering from what one might call the "first program" problem. That is, I want to download CP/M programs (editor, assembler, and BASICK for starters) from the 'net and transfer them from my PC to my "CP/M" machine (A Commie 128 running CP/M+) to save on floppy for later use. I can boot CP/M+ on Commie, but the distribution is very minimal. It doesn't even include ED. It does have PIP, if this is useful, but no MAC, BASIC, or any other goodies that might be used to pull in xmodem or some other file transfer program into the machine and thus create a mechanism for transferring binary files into the machine from the PC. This must be a common problem, but surprisingly a web search yielded little insight on how to get the "first file" in. My extreme ignorance of CP/M at this point in time is not helpful either. With Apples, I know there was a trick to basically feed a BASIC program in from the serial port as if it were entered by the keyboard. With Commie-doors, there's the XE1541 cable and software to do the trick (but I don't think it can write MFM as needed by C128 CP/M mode.) Is there any similar "tricks" for CP/M? Without an assembler I would need to get a binary file into the CP/M floppy somehow. I don't have a 5 1/4" floppy drive in any PC but would consider scouring the Junque places for one if that could write files on my PC readable on CP/M. Or maybe I'm missing something and it's all so simple that nobody bothers to document it? Thanks for any clues. I want to be conversant with CP/M. Something to put on my resume. ;) -- Ross which is surely very common but oddly websearches have yielded no real insight as to how to fix it. From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Wed Jul 17 20:31:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: Stuff available: PDP-8 desk, Masscomp In-Reply-To: <20020717235140.26255.qmail@web14311.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20020718013024.12551.qmail@web10308.mail.yahoo.com> --- Shawn Rutledge wrote: > I have a PDP8 desk... I found a picture of it on the 'net a > while ago but have lost the link. It's the one on the cover of the PDP-8/a minicomputer handbook. I have one (surplused from work a long time ago). Very nice. I used to have an RL01 and an RX02 in mine, with the -8/a in its half-deep rack in front of your knees (the external fans on the OMNIBUS box make it a real "treat" to mount and dismount). The power and boot switches are a nice touch (the boot switch goes to a Berg connector that you fit into the DKC8AA and the power switch goes to a DEC power bus cable for the power sequencer). One warning: ground the desk if you are going to use the power sequencer. I walked over to mine in stocking feet when I had it in college, and stepped on a furnace grate right as I touched a metal part of the desk and got a nice shock. There _is_ a large yellow warning sticker on the back of the desk mentioning that it's important to have a dedicated ground lead. Believe it. The depression, BTW, is just the right size for a VT52. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From geoffrob at stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au Wed Jul 17 20:45:01 2002 From: geoffrob at stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au (Geoff Roberts) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: CRT problem References: Message-ID: <003b01c22dfc$83cd3ef0$de2c67cb@helpdesk> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Duell" To: Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2002 9:21 AM Subject: Re: CRT problem > > Reminds me of the first TV I ever had-- an old Ekco (darned if I know how > > that fine product of the UK got to NZ-'twas a 'modified' dual std east -- > > 405 and 625 line stds- for the usa readers) It had a 1/4 inch plate glass Made it to Oz as well. We had one of those as our very first tv set circa 1963. Finally blew up permanently around 1969. (As in smoke/flame etc). Mum & Dad bought a Kriesler, still valve based. (No colour here until mid 70's). Worked fairly well, needed a visit from a valve jockey about once a year on average. the 1S2 EHT Rectifier and/or the 6CM5 HOP valve were the usual culprits. Some of the Decca valve/transistor Colour hybrids made it here as well. Fixed one for some friends as recently as 5 years ago. AFAIK, it's still going. They called a local tv repair place, the guy took the back off and stared at it for a minute or so, then put the back on and told them he had no idea where to get valves these days. So they rang me. 10 min and a Line Output tube later, it was going again. (I had a small collection of valves, mostly ex tv stuff, fortunately I had one of the right type.) Cheers Geoff From spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu Wed Jul 17 21:00:01 2002 From: spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) In-Reply-To: <3D3617FA.BBCA2BB8@topnow.com> from Ross Archer at "Jul 17, 2 06:20:58 pm" Message-ID: <200207180207.TAA07234@stockholm.ptloma.edu> > I can boot CP/M+ on Commie, but the distribution > is very minimal. It doesn't even include ED. Eh? I could have sworn that ED was on the disk, or at least somewhere in the C128 distribution set. How many disks do you have? > It does have PIP, if this is useful, Oh, only slightly. :-) > software to do the trick (but I don't think it can write MFM > as needed by C128 CP/M mode.) The Commodore CP/M format is actually GCR -- the 1571 just can read MFM formats as well, but it's natively GCR actually (so that the 1541 can be used to boot C128 CP/M too). -- ----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser@stockholm.ptloma.edu -- Life is too short to use anything but a Mac. -- Roger Ebert ---------------- From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 17 21:02:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: CRT problem In-Reply-To: <003b01c22dfc$83cd3ef0$de2c67cb@helpdesk> from "Geoff Roberts" at Jul 18, 2 11:13:27 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 843 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020717/1238a47a/attachment.ksh From allain at panix.com Wed Jul 17 21:12:06 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: I don't remember... help.. References: <200207171653.13575.rhudson@cnonline.net> Message-ID: <000b01c22e00$4b209760$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> How about a DN4x0 series? The tape drives were probably cypher 880's. The disk drives were probably FSD/SMD. Check with Birol Aytek in Oxnard or Charlie Mengler -- they might know a bit more John A. From archer at topnow.com Wed Jul 17 21:46:04 2002 From: archer at topnow.com (Ross Archer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) References: <200207180207.TAA07234@stockholm.ptloma.edu> Message-ID: <3D362B94.10C6D16A@topnow.com> Cameron Kaiser wrote: > > > I can boot CP/M+ on Commie, but the distribution > > is very minimal. It doesn't even include ED. > > Eh? I could have sworn that ED was on the disk, or at least somewhere in > the C128 distribution set. It's second-hand (or more). For all I know, the original owner accidentally deleted those files. It seemed strange to me too, that there was help for so many commands that just weren't there on the disk. > How many disks do you have? One CP/M disk. > > > It does have PIP, if this is useful, > > Oh, only slightly. :-) > > software to do the trick (but I don't think it can write MFM > > as needed by C128 CP/M mode.) > > The Commodore CP/M format is actually GCR -- the 1571 just can read MFM > formats as well, but it's natively GCR actually (so that the 1541 can be > used to boot C128 CP/M too). Hmm, are you sure that's not the C64 with CP/M cartridge only, and the C128 is actually true MFM-capable? That's what I've read on the web somewhere. My C128 manual recommends you purchase CP/M software formatted for various Kaypro and Osborne machines, which are obviously MFM. Since at least some of these programs have to write configuration files (pretty sure Wordstar had to run a "Winstall" (ironically) program). It would seem pretty useless if you could purchase software and then couldn't configure it. At least I didn't see anything in the C128 manual about converting your Kaypro disks before you installed the software. May have missed something though. Maybe I could DMA in the data for an XMODEM program with toggle switches. :) -- Ross > > -- > ----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- > Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser@stockholm.ptloma.edu > -- Life is too short to use anything but a Mac. -- Roger Ebert ---------------- From archer at topnow.com Wed Jul 17 21:49:03 2002 From: archer at topnow.com (Ross Archer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: CRT problem References: Message-ID: <3D362C01.937FBDDA@topnow.com> Tony Duell wrote: > > > Some of the Decca valve/transistor Colour hybrids made it here as well. I thought Decca was a record company famous for such standards as Ella Fitzgerald. Or is this another one of those "Lyon" stories like when a restaurant chain became a computer company, a record company made tubes. :) From geoffrob at stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au Wed Jul 17 21:51:00 2002 From: geoffrob at stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au (Geoff Roberts) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: CRT problem References: Message-ID: <006201c22e05$99b55ff0$de2c67cb@helpdesk> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Duell" To: Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2002 11:23 AM Subject: Re: CRT problem > > Some of the Decca valve/transistor Colour hybrids made it here as well. > > Hey, I remember those too. I also remember (just) the Philips G6 colour > set with a mostly valved colour decoder. That was _complicated_... Still > have schematics for them as well.... First Philips sets here were the C9 chassis, closely followed by the K9's. Still a few of them around. They had a habit of the tubes fracturing at the point where the neck is bonded on as they got on in years (like 20+) > If it came from the UK, I'll bet it was a PL509 or equivalent. Colour > sets _always_ used that line output valve... Can't remember for sure, sounds right though. Cheers Geoff From geoffrob at stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au Wed Jul 17 22:09:00 2002 From: geoffrob at stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au (Geoff Roberts) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: CRT problem References: <3D362C01.937FBDDA@topnow.com> Message-ID: <009801c22e08$513a8180$de2c67cb@helpdesk> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ross Archer" To: Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2002 12:16 PM Subject: Re: CRT problem > Tony Duell wrote: > > > > > Some of the Decca valve/transistor Colour hybrids made it here as well. > > I thought Decca was a record company famous > for such standards as Ella Fitzgerald. > > Or is this another one of those "Lyon" > stories like when a restaurant chain became > a computer company, a record company made > tubes. :) Decca made lots of things. Radio, radar etc. Even hyperbolic radio navigation systems amongst other things. Decca (the nav system) is the same/similar to LORAN. LORAN, OMEGA and other similar style systems were a sort of predecessor to GPS using LF and VLF radio from a series of ground stations. Trivia: It's a little known fact that during WW2 the Germans built such a system that covered the Bay of Biscay, apparently for the use of their U Boats. The Brits, via Enigma decodes and such became aware of it, analysed it and were prepared to jam it. Before they did, however, British Scientific Intelligence asked RAF Coastal Command if they could use an accurate radio nav system that covered the Bay of Biscay. Told YES in no uncertain terms, charts and equipment to use it were produced, and Coastal Command used the system the Germans had so kindly provided with great success until the wars end. The system was taken over post war and was still in use for marine nav in the region until relatively recently, (around 10-15 years ago IIRC). Geoff in Oz From spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu Wed Jul 17 23:02:00 2002 From: spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) In-Reply-To: <3D362B94.10C6D16A@topnow.com> from Ross Archer at "Jul 17, 2 07:44:36 pm" Message-ID: <200207180409.VAA10408@stockholm.ptloma.edu> > > How many disks do you have? > > One CP/M disk. Single- or double-sided? Did you look on side two? I have a whole mess of utilities on the second side. > > The Commodore CP/M format is actually GCR -- the 1571 just can read MFM > > formats as well, but it's natively GCR actually (so that the 1541 can be > > used to boot C128 CP/M too). > > Hmm, are you sure that's not the C64 with CP/M > cartridge only, and the C128 is actually true > MFM-capable? That's what I've read on the web somewhere. Ah, misunderstanding. I thought you wanted to get the *Commodore* CP/M disks, which are actually GCR, but you're really after CP/M software :-) Yes, the C128 (with a 1571) can read MFM formats, but as you observe, > My C128 manual recommends you purchase CP/M > software formatted for various Kaypro and > Osborne machines, which are obviously MFM. ... Kaypro and Osbourne are more or less "specifically" supported. -- ----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser@stockholm.ptloma.edu -- I couldn't care less about apathy. ----------------------------------------- From frustum at pacbell.net Wed Jul 17 23:32:03 2002 From: frustum at pacbell.net (Jim Battle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) In-Reply-To: <3D3617FA.BBCA2BB8@topnow.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020717211702.0215dcb0@postoffice.pacbell.net> At 06:20 PM 7/17/02 -0700, Ross Archer wrote: >I'm suffering from what one might call the >"first program" problem. That is, I want to >download CP/M programs (editor, assembler, >and BASICK for starters) from the 'net and >transfer them from my PC to my "CP/M" >machine (A Commie 128 running CP/M+) to save >on floppy for later use. > >I can boot CP/M+ on Commie, but the distribution >is very minimal. It doesn't even include ED. >It does have PIP, if this is useful, but no >MAC, BASIC, or any other goodies that might be This is what tried doing for my Sol. Yes, PIP is essential. Hook up a serial cable from your PC to your CP/M machine. Of course, there are all the problems of figuring out baud rate, parity, stop bits, and whether you need a null modem or not. I can't help you there. From the CP/M side, type (this is from memory, so you should consult any online CP/M command reference to get it right, such as: http://www.iso.port.ac.uk/~mike/interests/chistory/documents/cpm-22-manual/ch1.html ) a>PIP FOO.HEX=RDR: RDR: is logical device which might be a paper tape reader in the old days, but is perhaps mapped to your serial port. You need to figure out which device is connected to the serial port. (PUN: perhaps?) Then on the PC, use hyperterm or whatever to transfer the program you want to send in intel HEX format. You can't send a straight binary file (well, perhaps the O option flag might allow it, but I don't know). There are some useful options, such as H, which verifies that the received file is in legal intel hex format. One problem I had was that as the file is received, PIP stops every so often to write sectors to disk. The Sol serial port doesn't have any type of flow control, so the file would get corrupted since characters would be dropped during that time. The B option might be useful to prevent it, but I didn't know about it at the time. Experiment and see if that works for you. So once you have the file, type a>LOAD FOO and FOO.HEX will be read and will generate FOO.COM. Of course, if you don't have LOAD, you are kind of out of luck there. What I ended up doing for my Sol was that there is a very primitive monitor for doing some basic probing and such. One command allows entering bytes directly into memory via hex input. There is another command that redirects input to come from the serial port instead of the keyboard. What I did was started CP/M, then jumped back to the monitor, redirected the input to the monitor to come from the serial port, transferred my hex file, switched back to input from the keyboard, re-entered CP/M, then used the SAVE command (which is built into CP/M; it isn't a transient program so it won't appear on your disk -- you always have it) to create the .COM file. Good luck. ----- Jim Battle == frustum@pacbell.net From eric at brouhaha.com Wed Jul 17 23:33:50 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) In-Reply-To: References: <33649.64.169.63.74.1026892535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> from "Eric Smith" at Jul 17, 2 00:55:35 am Message-ID: <34261.64.169.63.74.1026966663.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> I wrote: >> It might use HP-HIL, Hewlett-Packard Human Interface Loop. Tony wrote: > Are you sure that's _loop_? HP-HIL is not physically a loop. It's a > point-to-point serial interface. It's my understanding that electrically it forms a loop, because the last device loops the data back. I could be wrong -- it wouldn't be the first time. > Amd there's an I/O card for the HP150 that adds an 8 bit parallel port > (normally used for a Centronics printe) and an HPIL port. Forgot about that one. I'd like to get one for my 150. >> the 1LB3, pulse transformers, HP-IL connectors, passive components, >> and documentation. I built an interface card for the Apple ][, which >> almost > > IIRC, it also contained a couple of microcontrollers that contained the > code to allow you to make the 82166 HPIL -> parallel converter. And > some development software (HP41 DevIL ROM, HP75 IOCMDS lexfile). I've > never seen this kit complete, but I do have what I believe to be the > documentation for it. I've scanned the HP-IL specifications and the HP-IL chip manual, but I don't have the kit documentation, which had the schematics for the converter and various other useful information. From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Wed Jul 17 23:39:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:10 2005 Subject: free system 34 in Cincinatti In-Reply-To: <3D3601D5.F1FD54AE@nktelco.net> Message-ID: <20020718043752.75308.qmail@web10302.mail.yahoo.com> --- Chuck Dickman wrote: > Not sure what I am getting myself in for, but I am only 100 miles north > of Cincinnati on I-75. You aren't far to the west, then. I'm 100 miles north of Cinti along I-71, but I *know* what I'd be getting myself in for and that's why I'm giving it a pass. I'd _love_ some IBM hardware (especially since I have so much HASP/3780/SNA gear for VAXen), but I cannot handle something that large right now. Enjoy. Maybe I can come visit it sometime. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Jul 18 00:28:05 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) In-Reply-To: <34261.64.169.63.74.1026966663.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com > References: <33649.64.169.63.74.1026892535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020718012830.490f835c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 09:31 PM 7/17/02 -0700, Eric wrote: >I wrote: >>> It might use HP-HIL, Hewlett-Packard Human Interface Loop. > >Tony wrote: >> Are you sure that's _loop_? HP-HIL is not physically a loop. It's a >> point-to-point serial interface. > >It's my understanding that electrically it forms a loop, because the >last device loops the data back. I could be wrong -- it wouldn't be the >first time. I'm pretty sure that you're correct about the name but I don't understand how they know what device to put the "loop" into since almost any HP-HIL device could be the last one on the chain. For example, you might have only a keyboard, or you could have a keyboard and then a mouse or you could have a keyboard, a graphics tablet and then a mouse or maybe just a keyboard and a tablet. The possiblities are astronomical. IIRC you have have up to 8 devices on the HIL chain. Oh! And just to add to the confusion, the HP IPC has TWO HP-HIL ports. The IPC keyboard doesn't have a second port for daisy chaining to other devices so you're supposed to plug the (HP-HIL) mouse into the second port on the IPC. I've tried standard HP-HIL keyboards on the IPC and they work fine. I've also used the second port for a mouse with no problems but I've never tried daisy chaining a mouse off of HP-HIL keyboard attached to an IPC. Hmm, it might be interesting to put a keyboard and a mouse into EACH of the ports. (yes, I have IPCs to spare!) BTW I have two different manuals for the HP-HIL mouse and one manual for the HP-HIL keyboard and NONE of them tells what HP-HIL stands for! Joe From eric at brouhaha.com Thu Jul 18 00:36:04 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020718012830.490f835c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <33649.64.169.63.74.1026892535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> <3.0.6.16.20020718012830.490f835c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <34416.64.169.63.74.1026970487.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> I wrote (about HP-HIL): >> It's my understanding that electrically it forms a loop, because the >> last device loops the data back. I could be wrong -- it wouldn't be >> the first time. Joe wrote: > I'm pretty sure that you're correct about the name but I don't > understand how they know what device to put the "loop" into since > almost any HP-HIL device could be the last one on the chain. The last device can tell that there are no further devices chained to it. I should have said "logically" rather than "electrically"; I do NOT think there is electrical connectivity of the data line. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Jul 18 00:41:03 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020718012830.490f835c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <34261.64.169.63.74.1026966663.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com > <33649.64.169.63.74.1026892535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020718014134.51c791d8@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> For those that don't know what a HP-HIL port looks like here's a picture that I found on an E-bay auction. It's on the bottom card in the second picture. You can clearly see word Keybd, the name HP-HIL and the two dots that I mentioned earlier. See . Joe From ghldbrd at ccp.com Thu Jul 18 00:48:00 2002 From: ghldbrd at ccp.com (Gary Hildebrand) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) References: <200207180207.TAA07234@stockholm.ptloma.edu> <3D362B94.10C6D16A@topnow.com> Message-ID: <3D36558A.5FC84794@ccp.com> Ross Archer wrote: > > Cameron Kaiser wrote: > > > > > I can boot CP/M+ on Commie, but the distribution > > > is very minimal. It doesn't even include ED. > > > > Eh? I could have sworn that ED was on the disk, or at least somewhere in > > the C128 distribution set. > > It's second-hand (or more). > For all I know, the original > owner accidentally deleted those files. > It seemed strange to me too, that there was help > for so many commands that just weren't there > on the disk. > > > How many disks do you have? > > One CP/M disk. > > > > > > It does have PIP, if this is useful, > > > > Oh, only slightly. :-) > > > > software to do the trick (but I don't think it can write MFM > > > as needed by C128 CP/M mode.) > > > > The Commodore CP/M format is actually GCR -- the 1571 just can read MFM > > formats as well, but it's natively GCR actually (so that the 1541 can be > > used to boot C128 CP/M too). > > Hmm, are you sure that's not the C64 with CP/M > cartridge only, and the C128 is actually true > MFM-capable? That's what I've read on the web somewhere. > > My C128 manual recommends you purchase CP/M > software formatted for various Kaypro and > Osborne machines, which are obviously MFM. > Since at least some of these programs have to > write configuration files (pretty sure Wordstar > had to run a "Winstall" (ironically) program). > > It would seem pretty useless if you could purchase > software and then couldn't configure it. > > At least I didn't see anything in the C128 manual > about converting your Kaypro disks before you > installed the software. May have missed something > though. > > Maybe I could DMA in the data for an XMODEM > program with toggle switches. :) > > -- Ross I do know that the 1571 will read an IBM 360k DSDD disk format. I was going to try to copy my Osborne software off, but it is SSSD and the 1571 don't do those disks, only the double density Ozzie disks. NUTS!! I'm looking for a working 360k IBM drive to copy stuff from the Linux PC here to the 128 cp/m system. Serial transfers work too, and since the files are pretty short as a rule it shouldn't take long. That is a project that was put on the back burner here . . . . keep us posted Gary Hildebrand St. Joseph, MO From marvin at rain.org Thu Jul 18 01:18:00 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Keyword 8000 References: <33649.64.169.63.74.1026892535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> <3.0.6.16.20020718012830.490f835c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3D365D49.985A4121@rain.org> I've been curious for a while about a couple of Keyword 8000 8" drives and power supply I picked up at a swapfest. I just found an article over in Germany about these drives. In checking the power supply, one of the chips had a code date of 1987, so at least I have a time frame! If anyone would like them for the usual 1.2 x shipping, let me know. ********** Keyword offers Keypak: TV programs into universe in one compatibly COMPUTER WEEK No. 50 of 09.12.1988 AACHEN(pi) - Missing compatibility with text processing programs do not stand to an exchange of documents in principle into ways. Now a software package offers the key Fords Office Technologies Ltd. with Keypak, which permits the transmission between PCS in Dec environment, which work with different word processing systems. A compelling condition for application is the office automation program universe in one of Dec. If Keypak is integrated into the program, users of IBM PC, Macintosh, Dec Vaxmate or other computers, which is connectable to a VAX computer, can exchange documents. The user does not have to leave its used text processing program. Its document is set off in the usual format and converted then from the software into the format of the receiver. in detail the procedure looks in such a way: The documents are sent to the VAX computer and stored there in the electronic mail box. At the same time it is signaled to the receiver that a message is arrived and ready to be collected. For the correct format readable with the receiver, the software provides, in which the user profiles are stored. Keypak converts IBM PC text 4, ms Word, Macintosh Word, Multimate, Wang, Wordstar, Wordperfect, WPS plus, Xerox 860, DCA and further programs. Also enterprises with pure text processing systems can feed documents into the net. In addition the software producer developed Keyword 8000. The product, which consists of a CONTROLLER, a floppy disk drive and software, can read and convert independently of diskette formats dedicated word processing systems, since the software recognizes most text processing formats. In the Federal Republic both products are sold by the Macbyte GmbH. Information: Macbyte GmbH, steppe mountain avenue 5, 5100 Aachen, telephone 02 41/87 00 55. From doc at mdrconsult.com Thu Jul 18 01:37:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) In-Reply-To: <3D36558A.5FC84794@ccp.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, Gary Hildebrand wrote: > > I do know that the 1571 will read an IBM 360k DSDD disk format. I was > going to try to copy my Osborne software off, but it is SSSD and the > 1571 don't do those disks, only the double density Ozzie disks. NUTS!! > > I'm looking for a working 360k IBM drive to copy stuff from the Linux PC > here to the 128 cp/m system. Serial transfers work too, and since the > files are pretty short as a rule it shouldn't take long. To make a 360k floppy in Linux: fdformat /dev/fdXh360 mkfs -t msdos /dev/fdXh360 # or mkdosfs /dev/fdXh360 on my Debian box, with a standard 1.2M 5.25" drive. "X" is the drive #. On older Slackware, IIRC, it was fdXH360, so you might wanna check. So let me get this straight. I have a 128D, with an external 1541. Assuming that the 6-pin DIN male-male cable that came with it is right, I can format a DSDD floppy in the 1541, and read files from a 360k DOS floppy to the Commodore-formatted disk. In my googling for the pinout of the above-mentioned cable, I came across some plans & software to attach a 1541 drive to a PCs parallel port. Has anybody tried it? Doc From rumi_ml at rtfm.hu Thu Jul 18 02:06:00 2002 From: rumi_ml at rtfm.hu (Rumi Szabolcs) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) In-Reply-To: <34416.64.169.63.74.1026970487.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> References: <33649.64.169.63.74.1026892535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> <3.0.6.16.20020718012830.490f835c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <34416.64.169.63.74.1026970487.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <200207180905410897.00BA361B@mail.local> Hello! HP-HIL stands for Hewlett-Packard Human Interface Link, as far as I know. Regards, Szabolcs Rumi - From tothwolf at concentric.net Thu Jul 18 02:36:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: SGI IRIS 1400 (longish) Message-ID: As many folks might have already noticed, I've been a little absent from the mailing list as of late. One reason is the current status of upgrading my day to day workstation, but the other is the latest SGI system that I got from Nick here in Houston. The small amount of information I found on the web about SGI IRIS 1x00 line seems to indicate that the 1400 is the first "workstation" class system SGI sold. The 1000 and 1200 were both GUI terminals without any local storage. These systems were all made in the early 1980s, and no one seems to know just how many were made. For those folks who have never seen a 1x00 or 2x00 desk-side SGI IRIS, the chassis is about twice the size of a DEC BA123 (not too much wider), but it seems to weigh a little less. (The custom Hitachi monitor for the 1400 actually seems to weigh more than the system.) This 1400 is more or less complete. It has it's monitor, all the cables (except for the two power cords), the keyboard, mouse, and a set of programmers manuals. If someone has an OS or diagnostics tape (of even knows which versions of IRIX this system will support), please let me know. A hardware manual would also be very nice, but I'm not going to hold my breath... While breaking the system down for a complete cleaning and inspection, I found a couple of notes and tags in the system from a previous sysadmin. One is a hand-drawn card cage ribbon cable/led diagram on a scrap of paper (which might turn out to be useful ;) There was a tag attached to the corner of the ST-506 interface board, that states something along the lines of "Board removed from IRIS, suspect U/S, no prints.", and has a set of initials on it. There was also a tag attached to the ribbon cable that connects the AUI connector on the rear of the system to the network interface board. The cable had been unplugged, and the tag stated something along the lines of "This cable was found to be damaged when removing the PSU, do not reconnect!", and showed a date of 1996 and two sets of initials. It turned out the "damage" was minor, and could have been safely ignored. The ribbon cable had originally been 15 conductor, but had been stripped down to 14 conductors, except for one loose 8" wire at the AUI end. That wire is connected to pin 1 of the AUI connector, and it appears someone had crimped a 0.25" quick connect terminal to it and connected it to an unused chassis ground terminal on the line filter. Pin 1 didn't even exist on the card end of the cable, so my guess is someone modified the cable due to interference problems. When I found the loose wire, it had been pulled loose from the quick connect terminal, and had some (cheap) electrical tape wrapped around the end. This particular system was located in England from around 1983 to 1998 or so, and had been converted for 240V operation. It appears the conversion was done by a SGI field tech, since the rear of the system has a sticker that states "115V", while the metal plate with the IEC connector states "230V". The PSU has a typewritten SGI sticker with a 184-260V(?) voltage range covering the 115V rating next to the supply terminals. After looking at the PSU itself, it appears conversion back to 115/120V requires little more than desoldering/resoldering some jumper wires. The 3 system fans will also have to be replaced when converting the system back to 120V. I also noticed an extra white wire run up to the front panel where the power switch is mounted. There is a black wire used for hot, and a red wire used for the switched hot. The white wire is connected to the unswitched hot (or what would be neutral for 120V operation), so I'm guessing this system would have originally used a lighted rocker switch before the 240V conversion (there are no power on indicators on the front of the system). There are also 4 extra wires in the junction box behind the bottom rear panel. Two are white and are on what would be the neutral side, one is black, which is unswitched hot, and the other is red, again switched hot. My guess is that these were originally used for accessory outlets on the original panel, which was replaced during the 240V conversion. I found quite a few things that had not been reinstalled properly at some point, but one thing that really sticks out were the "missing" spacer washers used for the 5V 100A power supply connections. I actually found the pair of washers used under two of the bolts that mount the PSU to the system chassis. I ended up replacing some of the crimp-on connectors for some of the power supply connections. I think the original system builder must have been having a bad day, because there were a number of those terminals that were not crimped properly. About 50% of the screws that are supposed to hold the system together were also missing. I guess one of the former service techs in England didn't like removing/installing screws... After completing the cleanup/inspection, I checked out the supply voltages (without any boards installed in the card cage and without any drives installed) and found all the supply voltages to be within spec. I reinstalled all the boards, and checked it out again, at which point the system appeared to be functioning properly (according to the diagnostic display on the rear of the system). I then reinstalled the hard drive, and connected the monitor. I got an image on the monitor, but the picture was very, very poor. It looks like the monitor will need to be recapped. I was able to read it well enough to see that I got the initial monitor display with a 'boot>' prompt. I wasn't able to boot the system though, since there does indeed appear to be something wrong with the ST-506 interface (I got continuous "timeout" errors for md:0). There could also be something wrong with the hard drive (which appears to have been serviced at some point), but since there was a tag attached to the ST-506 interface board, it is my primary suspect. The SGI sticker under the front panel on this system shows it as serial number 95 (same as on a rear sticker), and all the boards installed in the card cage (with the exception of the ST-506 interface) appear to match the numbers on that sticker. I'm kinda wondering if someone might have used this 1400 as a source for a spare ST-506 interface, but I'll probably never know. The ST-506 interface thats currently installed in this system appears to be of 3rd party origin, though maybe all of the ST-506 interface boards for the 1x00 and 2x00 systems were. The SGI sticker also shows the backplane cut to be 9/10, but inspection showed that it actually has a 11/12 cut. There is also another SGI sticker underneath the visible one, and it appears this system was originally serial number 47, also with a 11/12 backplane cut. Does anyone have any info on these systems? There doesn't seem to be much information left, and very little can be found on the web. I'm somewhat tempted to try contacting SGI for a little more information, but I don't know if there would still be anyone still there who would know anything about this system. If there is any interest, I'll see about putting up some pictures of this system over the next couple of weeks. -Toth From geoffr at zipcon.net Thu Jul 18 03:08:01 2002 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716233429.02a89c60@mail.zipcon.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020718011823.00ac0b40@mail.zipcon.net> There's a guy in the UK that is selling an adaptor for PS/2 KB's/mice to HP-HIL that is supposedly just wired through... is this possible?!?!?! does anyone have the pinouts for the HP-HIL port? From tractorb at ihug.co.nz Thu Jul 18 03:21:00 2002 From: tractorb at ihug.co.nz (Dave Brown) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: CRT problem References: Message-ID: <009901c22e33$cfcf3bf0$56e1adcb@athlon> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Duell" > Almost all UK TVs used series-string heaters. Normally P-series valves (P > = 300mA heater), or their equivalents (such as the Mazda 30xx series (30, > again, meaning 300mA). Some of the ones I remember in that Ekco were definitely in the 30 prefix series -- pretty much unknown here- but there were P series (well known here) equivalents or near equivalents, needing only one or two base wiring changes!! Loved the OT tube/valve list- lotsa memories- and not all bad!! DaveB From ghldbrd at ccp.com Thu Jul 18 06:38:01 2002 From: ghldbrd at ccp.com (Gary Hildebrand) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) References: Message-ID: <3D36A7A6.F4E1BAB2@ccp.com> Doc Shipley wrote: > So let me get this straight. I have a 128D, with an external 1541. > Assuming that the 6-pin DIN male-male cable that came with it is right, > I can format a DSDD floppy in the 1541, and read files from a 360k DOS > floppy to the Commodore-formatted disk. AFAIK, that would work, but I'd probably stay in a DSDD format to get more room for files. The native 1541 GCR recording is single sided only. For all practical purposes yo should have 2 1571 type drives for cp/m. And keep in mind that the 1541 is slower than molasses in January for data output. > > In my googling for the pinout of the above-mentioned cable, I came > across some plans & software to attach a 1541 drive to a PCs parallel > port. Has anybody tried it? > > Doc Is that the X1541 cable and software? Haven't tried it yet. Gary Hildebrand St. Joseph, MO From rschaefe at gcfn.org Thu Jul 18 07:56:00 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert F Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: VAX 4000 200 console bulkhead wanted Message-ID: <65108.128.146.70.114.1026996680.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> I just moved my '200 boardset into what used to be a BA440 expansion chassis, and now I need to replace the MVII-style console bulkhead. If anyone has one they'd be willing to get rid of/trade for, let me know. Thanks! Bob From dtwright at uiuc.edu Thu Jul 18 09:03:01 2002 From: dtwright at uiuc.edu (Dan Wright) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020718011823.00ac0b40@mail.zipcon.net> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716233429.02a89c60@mail.zipcon.net> <5.1.0.14.2.20020718011823.00ac0b40@mail.zipcon.net> Message-ID: <20020718140129.GB1238723@uiuc.edu> Geoff Reed said: > There's a guy in the UK that is selling an adaptor for PS/2 KB's/mice to > HP-HIL that is supposedly just wired through... is this > possible?!?!?! does anyone have the pinouts for the HP-HIL port? Well, no. What that box ACTUALLY is (probably) is a thing HP sold with some of their workstations (715 & others) that plugged into an RJ45-ish port (but with the tab on the top rather then the sides, like HP-HIL) that broke out into 1) PS/2 KB and mouse, and 2) HP-HIL connector. As far as I know, you can't use that box on any arbitrary HP with an HIL port and get a working keyboard and mouse. On the other hand, I have serveral of those boxes, so if you get it and it works I'd be very interested to know that :) - Dan Wright (dtwright@uiuc.edu) (http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright) -] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [- ``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread, For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.'' Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Thu Jul 18 09:05:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020718140307.46662.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> --- Doc Shipley wrote: > So let me get this straight. I have a 128D, with an external 1541. > Assuming that the 6-pin DIN male-male cable that came with it is right, > I can format a DSDD floppy in the 1541, and read files from a 360k DOS > floppy to the Commodore-formatted disk. The 1541 is single-sided. You will not be able to format it DSDD. I have heard of MFM disk tools for Commodores (Big Blue Reader) but I have never used one. I've always resorted to serial transfer between Commies and PeeCees (that and archiving 1541/4040 disks with a 1541 and an X1541 cable over a PeeCee parallel port under DOS). -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From dtwright at uiuc.edu Thu Jul 18 09:07:01 2002 From: dtwright at uiuc.edu (Dan Wright) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) In-Reply-To: References: <33649.64.169.63.74.1026892535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <20020718140520.GC1238723@uiuc.edu> Tony Duell said: > > It might use HP-HIL, Hewlett-Packard Human Interface Loop. > > Are you sure that's _loop_? HP-HIL is not physically a loop. It's a > point-to-point serial interface. I have always heard that acronym broken down as "Hewlett-Packard Human Interface Loop", but that doesn't necessarily mean that it's right. Of course, even if that is the correct translation of the acronym, that doesn't mean the name has much relation to the interface's actual properties... - Dan Wright (dtwright@uiuc.edu) (http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright) -] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [- ``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread, For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.'' Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan From dtwright at uiuc.edu Thu Jul 18 09:15:01 2002 From: dtwright at uiuc.edu (Dan Wright) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: SGI IRIS 1400 (longish) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20020718141415.GD1238723@uiuc.edu> Tothwolf said: > > Does anyone have any info on these systems? There doesn't seem to be much > information left, and very little can be found on the web. I'm somewhat > tempted to try contacting SGI for a little more information, but I don't > know if there would still be anyone still there who would know anything > about this system. Er, I talk to SGI pretty frequently, and it almost certainly wouln't be worth the pain. It almost isn't for their new hardware :( I wouldn't do it, personally, but you're welcome to try... - Dan Wright (dtwright@uiuc.edu) (http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright) -] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [- ``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread, For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.'' Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan From rschaefe at gcfn.org Thu Jul 18 09:38:00 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert F Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: SGI IRIS 1400 (longish) In-Reply-To: <20020718141415.GD1238723@uiuc.edu> References: <20020718141415.GD1238723@uiuc.edu> Message-ID: <65440.128.146.70.157.1027002843.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> > Tothwolf said: >> >> Does anyone have any info on these systems? There doesn't seem to be >> much information left, and very little can be found on the web. I'm >> somewhat tempted to try contacting SGI for a little more information, >> but I don't know if there would still be anyone still there who would >> know anything about this system. > > Er, I talk to SGI pretty frequently, and it almost certainly wouln't be > worth the pain. It almost isn't for their new hardware :( I wouldn't > do it, personally, but you're welcome to try... What kind of pain? An arbitrary `NO', or just following the finger- pointing to the right desk? If I knew I'd just get the former I wouldn't bother, but the latter I could deal with to get some info on my 4D/35. > > - Dan Wright Bob From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Jul 18 09:48:03 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: HP IPC for sale on E-bay Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020718104602.495f542e@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Jul 18 09:49:50 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Sharp PC-7000 with accessories for sale on E-bay Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020718104846.44b7ba22@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> A nice clean Sharp PC-7000 portable computer complete with disks, manuals, cover, etc. From doc at mdrconsult.com Thu Jul 18 10:02:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) In-Reply-To: <3D36A7A6.F4E1BAB2@ccp.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, Gary Hildebrand wrote: > AFAIK, that would work, but I'd probably stay in a DSDD format to get > more room for files. The native 1541 GCR recording is single sided > only. For all practical purposes yo should have 2 1571 type drives for > cp/m. And keep in mind that the 1541 is slower than molasses in January > for data output. I wholly agree about the 2 1571 drives. The deal is, the 1541 was 2 bux and I haven't found an external 1571 at any price. > > In my googling for the pinout of the above-mentioned cable, I came > > across some plans & software to attach a 1541 drive to a PCs parallel > > port. Has anybody tried it? > > > > Doc > > Is that the X1541 cable and software? Haven't tried it yet. That's it. Looks like a really simple build. I'm sort of leaning toward a serial transfer link instead, though. It's on the back burner for me too; I brought a literal pick-up load of RS/5000 junque home last night. AIX v3.2.4, anyone? Doc From doc at mdrconsult.com Thu Jul 18 10:11:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: C= floppies; Was Re: Bootstrapping a CP/M... In-Reply-To: <20020718140307.46662.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, Ethan Dicks wrote: > The 1541 is single-sided. You will not be able to format it DSDD. Yeah, my wording was _really_ unclear. I know the 1541 is single-sided, I meant "Can I use standard PC DSDD media?" > I have heard of MFM disk tools for Commodores (Big Blue Reader) but I > have never used one. I've always resorted to serial transfer between > Commies and PeeCees (that and archiving 1541/4040 disks with a 1541 > and an X1541 cable over a PeeCee parallel port under DOS). So the X1541 cable works, huh? I may have to do some soldering. Doc From jhking at airmail.net Thu Jul 18 10:20:01 2002 From: jhking at airmail.net (Jason King) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability References: <20020718150201.85560.13350.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <3D36DC07.5080107@airmail.net> This one is simple. 1) Get a 5.25" drive for your pc. 2) Download a copy of 22 disk. 3) Download any cp/m stuff you want 4) Use 22 disk to format a floppy as Osborne DD or Kaypro DD 5) Copy the files to the floppy 6) Stick the floppy in your 1571 Keep the 22-disk handy as you can transfer the other way as well. This is how I moved boat-load of cp/m stuff to my pc about 15 years ago when I converted to the dark side. From bpope at wordstock.com Thu Jul 18 10:25:00 2002 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: C= floppies; Was Re: Bootstrapping a CP/M... In-Reply-To: from "Doc Shipley" at Jul 18, 02 10:10:19 am Message-ID: <200207181521.LAA30819@wordstock.com> And thusly Doc Shipley spake: > > Yeah, my wording was _really_ unclear. I know the 1541 is > single-sided, I meant "Can I use standard PC DSDD media?" Yes.. To use the flip side you just notch the disk. A hole punch works wonders, as long as it is lined up with the write protect sensor. > So the X1541 cable works, huh? I may have to do some soldering. Yes... I have made my own cable with success.. :) If you have newer PC you would want to make the XE1451 cable, though. Cheers, Bryan From doc at mdrconsult.com Thu Jul 18 10:59:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: C= floppies; Was Re: Bootstrapping a CP/M... In-Reply-To: <200207181521.LAA30819@wordstock.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, Bryan Pope wrote: > Yes.. To use the flip side you just notch the disk. A hole punch works > wonders, as long as it is lined up with the write protect sensor. Oh, cool. I'da never thunk it. :) > > > So the X1541 cable works, huh? I may have to do some soldering. > > Yes... I have made my own cable with success.. :) If you have newer PC you > would want to make the XE1451 cable, though. Groovy. Thanks for the tip. Doc From dtwright at uiuc.edu Thu Jul 18 11:57:00 2002 From: dtwright at uiuc.edu (Dan Wright) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: SGI IRIS 1400 (longish) In-Reply-To: <65440.128.146.70.157.1027002843.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> References: <20020718141415.GD1238723@uiuc.edu> <65440.128.146.70.157.1027002843.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> Message-ID: <20020718165551.GC1242777@uiuc.edu> Robert F Schaefer said: > > What kind of pain? An arbitrary `NO', or just following the finger- > pointing to the right desk? If I knew I'd just get the former I wouldn't > bother, but the latter I could deal with to get some info on my 4D/35. It's pretty much the latter. The only time I get what I would call good service is on my Origin 200, which we pay 24x7 hardware support for -- and then, the service is great. Actually, the hardware support isn't too bad in general, the software support is what can be a pain in the ass... And remember, this is calling for NEW computers that we pay support on. You can't really get into their system without a supported system serial #. You could always try giving them the serial for your 4D/35 -- who knows, someone might (accidently) still be paying maintenace on it :) good luck, in any case... > > > > > - Dan Wright > > Bob > - Dan Wright (dtwright@uiuc.edu) (http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright) -] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [- ``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread, For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.'' Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Thu Jul 18 12:01:28 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) Message-ID: <200207181700.KAA17971@clulw009.amd.com> >From: "Jim Battle" > >At 06:20 PM 7/17/02 -0700, Ross Archer wrote: > >>I'm suffering from what one might call the >>"first program" problem. That is, I want to >>download CP/M programs (editor, assembler, >>and BASICK for starters) from the 'net and >>transfer them from my PC to my "CP/M" >>machine (A Commie 128 running CP/M+) to save >>on floppy for later use. >> >>I can boot CP/M+ on Commie, but the distribution >>is very minimal. It doesn't even include ED. >>It does have PIP, if this is useful, but no >>MAC, BASIC, or any other goodies that might be > > >This is what tried doing for my Sol. > >Yes, PIP is essential. > >Hook up a serial cable from your PC to your CP/M machine. Of course, there >are all the problems of figuring out baud rate, parity, stop bits, and >whether you need a null modem or not. I can't help you there. > > From the CP/M side, type (this is from memory, so you should consult any >online CP/M command reference to get it right, such as: > >http://www.iso.port.ac.uk/~mike/interests/chistory/documents/cpm-22-manual/ch1. html > >) > > >a>PIP FOO.HEX=RDR: > >RDR: is logical device which might be a paper tape reader in the old days, >but is perhaps mapped to your serial port. You need to figure out which >device is connected to the serial port. (PUN: perhaps?) > ---snip--- Hi I find it easier to white a simple serial to memory routine and then use SAVE to create the image files. One doesn't have to worry about handshake since the program can run at full speed. Since this is a true image, one can transfer .HEX or .COM files without dealing with LOAD that is not built into the command processor. Dwight From rschaefe at gcfn.org Thu Jul 18 12:20:00 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert F Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: SGI IRIS 1400 (longish) In-Reply-To: <20020718165551.GC1242777@uiuc.edu> References: <20020718165551.GC1242777@uiuc.edu> Message-ID: <64688.128.146.70.187.1027012511.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> >> > And remember, this is calling for NEW computers that we pay support on. > You can't really get into their system without a supported system > serial #. You could always try giving them the serial for your 4D/35 > -- who knows, someone might (accidently) still be paying maintenace on > it :) You wouldn't happen to have a name or email address of a friendly tech, would you? I can play that game for a good while before I get too bored. > > good luck, in any case... Thanks >> > - Dan Wright Bob From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Jul 18 12:40:09 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: vintage stuff on E-bay Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020718134027.4f475efe@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I've just finished putting a bunch of stuff on E-bay that may interest this group. (I know, I know, but I have to try and keep this hobby self-supporting). Items include a Sharp PC-7000 Portable computer, some DRI C language manuals, a couple of HP 9815 interfaces, a RAID controller for IDE drives, a SUN type 5 mechanical mouse, a National Instruments VME GP-IB interface and lots of other odds and ends. If you're interested see Joe From spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu Thu Jul 18 13:07:04 2002 From: spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) In-Reply-To: <20020718140307.46662.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> from Ethan Dicks at "Jul 18, 2 07:03:07 am" Message-ID: <200207181813.LAA11268@stockholm.ptloma.edu> > I have heard of MFM disk tools for Commodores (Big Blue Reader) but I > have never used one. I've always resorted to serial transfer between > Commies and PeeCees (that and archiving 1541/4040 disks with a 1541 > and an X1541 cable over a PeeCee parallel port under DOS). I have a tool called MSDOSCOPY that will read from a 1571 or 1581 with a FAT floppy and allow you to copy files. Obviously it has some LFN issues but it works fine otherwise. Mine is modified to work with device 11 since my 1581 is not device 9. There's also Craig Bruce's Little Red Reader which is out on the Net somewhere and supposedly works well, although I haven't tried it yet. -- ----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser@stockholm.ptloma.edu -- When you're in love, the whole world is German! -- "Hogan's Heroes" -------- From zmerch at 30below.com Thu Jul 18 13:08:56 2002 From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: update: Commodore stuff for goodbye... (and one OT item...) Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020718140131.02304540@mail.30below.com> =-=-= Most of the commodore stuff has been claimed, but the claimant wasn't "as interested" in the following items; so they're still available (for a short time, this stuff's gotta go...) : =-=-= Shipping from 49783; have a "Pack -n- ship" place next door, so there is usually a surcharge to normal UPS/Fedex prices (being next door, we usually get a bit of a break, however). All of these items are "condition unknown" - they were given to me, and I've never had 'em hooked up. No warranties, and all that jazz. (1) MPS802 printer - in original box with original styrofoam; ready to ship (just needs to be taped up) - looks to be in really good shape, but that's just looks... (1) MPS802 printer - no box, no top cover. The stuff's gotta go ASAP, so unforch, it's first come, first served... =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= OT blurb: I have a PlayStation 1 available with some interesting goodies; $100 shipped; contact me off-list if interested. -- Roger "Merch" Merchberger --- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers Recycling is good, right??? Ok, so I'll recycle an old .sig. If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead disarmament should *not* be your first career choice. From cisin at xenosoft.com Thu Jul 18 13:15:01 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, Doc Shipley wrote: > So let me get this straight. I have a 128D, with an external 1541. > Assuming that the 6-pin DIN male-male cable that came with it is right, > I can format a DSDD floppy in the 1541, and read files from a 360k DOS > floppy to the Commodore-formatted disk. NO. > I can format a DSDD floppy in the 1541, You could use DSDD floppies that were intended for PC use as BLANKS to be reformatted SSGCR in the 1541 for Com use. > in the 1541, > and read files from a 360k DOS > floppy to the Commodore-formatted disk. The 1541 is SINGLE SIDED and GCR. The "360K DOS floppy" is DOUBLE SIDED and MFM. You can NOT "read files from a 360K DOS floppy" in a 1541. There is no usable overlap between what can be read or written with the 1541 and what can be read or written with the PC disk controller. Instead, you should look for a 1571, which is capable of doing MFM. With appropriate additional software, it could read or write DOS diskettes, or read or write a SHORT LIST of MFM CP/M formats (including Kaypro and Osborne DD), which the PC can read and write with appropriate additional software. Or do a serial transfer or connect a Comm drive to a PC, using X1541 cable or a IEEE488 board. > In my googling for the pinout of the above-mentioned cable, I came > across some plans & software to attach a 1541 drive to a PCs parallel > port. Has anybody tried it? Sorry, I haven't used X1541, but I have heard that it can be made to work. -- Fred Cisin cisin@xenosoft.com XenoSoft http://www.xenosoft.com From spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu Thu Jul 18 13:21:00 2002 From: spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) In-Reply-To: from Fred Cisin at "Jul 18, 2 11:14:03 am" Message-ID: <200207181827.LAA09706@stockholm.ptloma.edu> > Sorry, I haven't used X1541, but I have heard that it can be made to work. I use it regularly (a real old-sk00l X1541) with a 486/DX40 and it works just fine. The modern cables are much faster and have a better chance with working with current motherboards, though. http://sta.c64.org/ -- ----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser@stockholm.ptloma.edu -- There are three kinds of people: those who can count and those who can't. -- From doc at mdrconsult.com Thu Jul 18 13:47:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, Doc Shipley wrote: > > So let me get this straight. I have a 128D, with an external 1541. > > Assuming that the 6-pin DIN male-male cable that came with it is right, > > I can format a DSDD floppy in the 1541, and read files from a 360k DOS > > floppy to the Commodore-formatted disk. > > NO. Argh. I am _not_ communicating clearly today. Sorry. The big picture is, I couldn't pass up a C128D at Goodwill. Keyboard, 1084S display, 1541 and cable, a 1571 diagnostics floppy and a 1541 diags was all ~17. That's the entire extent of my Commodore posessions (aside from a bare-naked A1000) and roughly the extent of my knowledge. Learning CP/M is one of the goals. Micros are still a complete mystery to me. The main reason this thread was interesting is that it sounds like a way to get some useful s/w running on the 128 without having to trouble someone to ship me physical media. > > I can format a DSDD floppy in the 1541, > > You could use DSDD floppies that were intended for PC use as BLANKS to be > reformatted SSGCR in the 1541 for Com use. That was the intent, yes. > The 1541 is SINGLE SIDED and GCR. > The "360K DOS floppy" is DOUBLE SIDED and MFM. > > You can NOT "read files from a 360K DOS floppy" in a 1541. > There is no usable overlap between what can be read or written with the > 1541 and what can be read or written with the PC disk controller. > > Instead, you should look for a 1571, which is capable of doing MFM. Yes. In my original query, I did say that this is all [theoretically] happening on a C128, with built-in 1571. Read files from 360k DOS SSDD-formatted floppy *in the 1571*, write them to a SS GCR floppy in the external 1541. > With appropriate additional software, it could read or write DOS > diskettes, or read or write a SHORT LIST of MFM CP/M formats (including > Kaypro and Osborne DD), which the PC can read and write with appropriate > additional software. The other-CP/M format idea sounds better, I just didn't know the 1571 would read them when I asked originally. I have 22disk, and can/will do all that on the PC side. What software do I need on the C128 side? > Or do a serial transfer or connect a Comm drive to a PC, using X1541 > cable or a IEEE488 board. > > > In my googling for the pinout of the above-mentioned cable, I came > > across some plans & software to attach a 1541 drive to a PCs parallel > > port. Has anybody tried it? > > Sorry, I haven't used X1541, but I have heard that it can be made to work. Couple of others have said that they use it. After I know everything works attached to the C128, I will probably try it. But my original concern still stands. I'm not at all sure that the 6-pin DIN cable I got is correct. Do you have the pinout handy? Or a URL bookmarked? I admit I got tired of Google on about page 6 of hits. Doc From pete at dunnington.u-net.com Thu Jul 18 14:01:01 2002 From: pete at dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: SGI IRIS 1400 (longish) In-Reply-To: Dan Wright "Re: SGI IRIS 1400 (longish)" (Jul 18, 11:55) References: <20020718141415.GD1238723@uiuc.edu> <65440.128.146.70.157.1027002843.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> <20020718165551.GC1242777@uiuc.edu> Message-ID: <10207181836.ZM16915@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> On Jul 18, 11:55, Dan Wright wrote: > Robert F Schaefer said: > > > > What kind of pain? An arbitrary `NO', or just following the finger- > > pointing to the right desk? If I knew I'd just get the former I wouldn't > > bother, but the latter I could deal with to get some info on my 4D/35. > It's pretty much the latter. [...] > You > can't really get into their system without a supported system serial #. You > could always try giving them the serial for your 4D/35 -- who knows, someone > might (accidently) still be paying maintenace on it :) I'm afraid my experience (in the UK) is similar to Dan's. If you try to call SGI nowadays, you won't get far without a support contract and a serial number to match. Otherwise, you tend to just get referred to sales, who will try to sell you support (or an OS upgrade or whatever) if the machine is recent enough to be supportable. You might have some luck if you can find someone with a support contract who regularly sees the engineer. The older ones tend to be quite knowledgable and may even have worked on such a system or know someone who has -- and might put you in touch. Otherwise, the best resources are the comp.sys.sgi.* newsgroups, which are fairly active and populated by a number of SGI employees as well as enthusiasts. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Jul 18 14:02:03 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Op-Amp? Analog computer? trainer? or ? Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020718150244.10978c12@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Does anyone know what this is? Another picture at Joe From coredump at gifford.co.uk Thu Jul 18 15:10:02 2002 From: coredump at gifford.co.uk (John Honniball) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) References: <34261.64.169.63.74.1026966663.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com > <33649.64.169.63.74.1026892535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> <3.0.6.16.20020718014134.51c791d8@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3D371E4D.678D2F83@gifford.co.uk> Joe wrote: > For those that don't know what a HP-HIL port looks like here's a > picture that I found on an E-bay auction. If anyone's interested, I could photograph the logic analyser in the lab at HP (where I now work). It's got the RJ-45-like plug, the dots on the cable, and a keyboard. -- John Honniball coredump@gifford.co.uk From coredump at gifford.co.uk Thu Jul 18 15:10:35 2002 From: coredump at gifford.co.uk (John Honniball) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) References: <34261.64.169.63.74.1026966663.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com > <33649.64.169.63.74.1026892535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> <3.0.6.16.20020718014134.51c791d8@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3D371E4D.678D2F83@gifford.co.uk> Joe wrote: > For those that don't know what a HP-HIL port looks like here's a > picture that I found on an E-bay auction. If anyone's interested, I could photograph the logic analyser in the lab at HP (where I now work). It's got the RJ-45-like plug, the dots on the cable, and a keyboard. -- John Honniball coredump@gifford.co.uk From coredump at gifford.co.uk Thu Jul 18 15:11:02 2002 From: coredump at gifford.co.uk (John Honniball) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) References: <34261.64.169.63.74.1026966663.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com > <33649.64.169.63.74.1026892535.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> <3.0.6.16.20020718014134.51c791d8@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3D372038.B55A81E7@gifford.co.uk> Joe wrote: > For those that don't know what a HP-HIL port looks like here's a > picture that I found on an E-bay auction. If anyone's interested, I could photograph the logic analyser in the lab at HP (where I now work). It's got the RJ-45-like plug, the dots on the cable, and a keyboard. -- John Honniball coredump@gifford.co.uk From dogbert at mindless.com Thu Jul 18 15:33:00 2002 From: dogbert at mindless.com (Ross Archer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability References: <20020718150201.85560.13350.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> <3D36DC07.5080107@airmail.net> Message-ID: <008f01c22e7e$d8f5f570$c400a8c0@amer.cisco.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jason King" To: Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2002 8:17 AM Subject: Re: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability > This one is simple. > 1) Get a 5.25" drive for your pc. > 2) Download a copy of 22 disk. > 3) Download any cp/m stuff you want > 4) Use 22 disk to format a floppy as Osborne DD or Kaypro DD > 5) Copy the files to the floppy > 6) Stick the floppy in your 1571 > Thanks for the tip, and thanks to all for many good ideas. For the CP/M, yours sounds like the best approach. I have a stack of 360K floppies I want to archive anyways, so a 360K floppy drive is an investment in junk that pays dividends anyways. Off to Weird Stuff in search of... :) For C64/128 stuff, I may resort to the XE1541 cable approach -- after I sort through about 100 disks completely jammed with C64 software. :) I did a bunch of dejanewsing (as opposed to googling I guess) late last night and found an ftp site with a program you can download to format, read, and write floppies in a PeeCee drive in various CP/M formats. I'll lalso look for 22disk now. > Keep the 22-disk handy as you can transfer the other way as well. > This is how I moved boat-load of cp/m stuff to my pc about 15 years ago > when I converted to the dark side. I converted to the dark side about then too. But I like Cameron Kaiser's organization field. I want to be an 8-bit subversive. :) -- Ross > > > > From charlesleecourtney at yahoo.com Thu Jul 18 15:33:20 2002 From: charlesleecourtney at yahoo.com (lee courtney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: HP IPC for sale on E-bay In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020718104602.495f542e@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <20020718160635.24100.qmail@web20804.mail.yahoo.com> The HP Integral PC is a neat little system. Its an example of HP's approach to the PC marketplace, a great solution looking for a problem to solve. BTW the unit runs a version of UNIX and not DOS/Windows. Seller doesn;t indicate if he has the original software discs. If not, and the system software is trashed on disc could be a problem getting it going. Lee Courtney --- Joe wrote: > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Thu Jul 18 17:03:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020718220203.91798.qmail@web10303.mail.yahoo.com> --- Doc Shipley wrote: > But my original concern still stands. I'm not at all sure that the > 6-pin DIN cable I got is correct. Do you have the pinout handy? Or a > URL bookmarked? I admit I got tired of Google on about page 6 of hits. AFAIK, it's pin-1 to pin-1, pin-2 to pin-2, etc. There's no crossovers or anything odd like that. It's not based on any sort of RS-232-like arrangement - there's one clock line, one data line, and anyone on the chain can drive it. It's up to the (software) protocol to help you figure out who should be doing what, and when. But the pinout is: 1 - /SRQ_IN - Service Request 2 - GND 3 - ATN - Attention 4 - CLOCK 5 - DATA 6 - /EXT RESET (cf. schematics at http://www.funet.fi/pub/cbm/schematics/computers/c64/250469-rev.A-left.gif) The protocol flow is at: http://www.funet.fi/pub/cbm/schematics/misc/iec-protocol.gif Here's a pinout (and warnings) about the IEC driver chips (7406/74LS14/MOS 8713) http://www.student.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de/~mjk/nepa/chips/invdrv.html -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From msspcva at yahoo.com Thu Jul 18 17:27:01 2002 From: msspcva at yahoo.com (Clayton Frank Helvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: FS: Old monitors for PCs and DEC Pro/Rainbow Message-ID: <20020718222625.81838.qmail@web14612.mail.yahoo.com> Hi all: I have the following which I'd like to sell: 1> VR201-C PRO or Rainbow monitor - no burn visible but I can't test it without a Pro or Rainbow. 2> Amdek Color II Plus compatible CGA/EGA monitor - working no burn - built April 1984. 3> IBM 5154, M/N 5154001 PC EGA monitor - works but has a failing transformer - no burn - built 07 1987 I'd like to get $10 OBO for each, plus shipping. -- Frank ===== = M O N T V A L E S O F T W A R E S E R V I C E S P. C.= Clayton Frank Helvey, President Montvale Software Services, P. C. P.O. Box 840 Blue Ridge, VA 24064-0840 Phone: 540.947.5364 Email: msspcva@yahoo.com ============================================================ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From donm at cts.com Thu Jul 18 18:10:12 2002 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability :) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, Doc Shipley wrote: > > So let me get this straight. I have a 128D, with an external 1541. > > Assuming that the 6-pin DIN male-male cable that came with it is right, > > I can format a DSDD floppy in the 1541, and read files from a 360k DOS > > floppy to the Commodore-formatted disk. > > NO. > > > I can format a DSDD floppy in the 1541, > > You could use DSDD floppies that were intended for PC use as BLANKS to be > reformatted SSGCR in the 1541 for Com use. > > > in the 1541, > > and read files from a 360k DOS > > floppy to the Commodore-formatted disk. > > The 1541 is SINGLE SIDED and GCR. > The "360K DOS floppy" is DOUBLE SIDED and MFM. > > You can NOT "read files from a 360K DOS floppy" in a 1541. > There is no usable overlap between what can be read or written with the > 1541 and what can be read or written with the PC disk controller. > > > Instead, you should look for a 1571, which is capable of doing MFM. > With appropriate additional software, it could read or write DOS > diskettes, or read or write a SHORT LIST of MFM CP/M formats (including > Kaypro and Osborne DD), which the PC can read and write with appropriate > additional software. Please note that Fred speaks to Osborne DD format disks. It is unlikely that your PC floppy controller can read/write SD. - don > Or do a serial transfer or connect a Comm drive to a PC, using X1541 > cable or a IEEE488 board. > > > In my googling for the pinout of the above-mentioned cable, I came > > across some plans & software to attach a 1541 drive to a PCs parallel > > port. Has anybody tried it? > > Sorry, I haven't used X1541, but I have heard that it can be made to work. > > -- > Fred Cisin cisin@xenosoft.com > XenoSoft http://www.xenosoft.com > > From edick at idcomm.com Thu Jul 18 18:26:01 2002 From: edick at idcomm.com (Richard Erlacher) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: [not at all OT since it's over 20 years old]: Tektronix 466 - spares needed References: <20020716201426.93106.qmail@web11806.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001a01c22eb2$6d421960$9cc762d8@idcomm.com> For anyone willing to invest the time and effort into a Tek storage scope, of which I've looked at over a dozen in the last decade, yet never yet seen one that worked properly, I'd certainly recommend investing in the "real McCoy" probes, i.e. Tek P6106's or the like, and I'd not buy them unless they're complete with everything that came with them when sold new. An old TEK catalog will clear up what that is, but I've often bought stuff that was incomplete, only to find that it cost more to make it complete than it would have cost to buy it complete in the first place. The probes that were shipped with the 465 and 466 were 2-meter probes with the very useful end-clips and a couple of replacement probe tips. Be sure that they have the black plastic sleeve with the ground contact that tells the 'scope that it's a 10x probe that's attached, so that it will correctly display the voltage setting at the attenuator. There should also be both a long and a short groundig strap with a 'gator clip at the end. This should have a polyethylene boot on it so it won't contact other equipment. It should also have a few plastic identifier rings that snap at each end of the probe, so you can tell which trace you're going to impact with whatever you're doing with the probe. When you've got a probe on each channel, one on the external sweep input, and one on the 'Z' modulator at the rear of the instrument, it's pretty important to keep track of who's who. The Z-modulator, BTW, requires a 1x probe, so the ones shipped with the instrument won't be useable in that context. It's primarily useful for putting timing markers on the display when you're operating in uncalibrated timing or doing something else that's out of the ordinary. Generating high-speed timing to check the 'scope's calibration against a typical 100 ppm is quite straightforward. IF you have a 100 MHz oscillator and a 4.5ns GAL, you can double the frequency and generate /2 /5 and /10 outputs, which will line up (VERY nearly) with marks on the display on a properly calibrated instrument. If they don't line up precisely, you can make note and "live" with the uncalibrated instrument, which is not impossible, or you can get someone to help you with the calibration procedure. You can even spend a fortune to have it done, but it may not be worth it to you. If you make a table of deviation on each attenuation and each timing scale, you can pretty reliably interpolate the correct values. This will be less convenient if the linearity of the sweep is out of whack. Check your local libraries for information about the TEK 4xx series of solid state 'scopes. Other (5xxx, 7xxx)-series scopes don't work exactly the same and most universities have at least a few of this series in house, having stashed the user manuals somewhere. Perhaps, if you have a contact at the computer science lab in one of the local colleges, you can get a look at the user manual, which is not a huge document. You might even be able to arrange to photocopy it. Dick ----- Original Message ----- From: Loboyko Steve To: Sent: Tuesday, July 16, 2002 2:14 PM Subject: Re: [possibly OT]: Tektronix 466 - spares needed > I don't think this is that OT: Everyone who expects to > fix any of this equipment should have one - and, given > their incredibly inexpensive prices on eBay, they > should! > > On the manuals, there are two places you can easily > find with Google who will have manual reprints. I've > dealt with both and although not inexpensive, the > manual copies are absoutely first-rate. There are also > books on how to use a scope that are generic, but will > help a lot. > > > You can pickup probes from anywhere; just make sure > you get 100 mhz+ probes if you expect to use your > scope at 100 mhz. There are used ones on eBay, but > unless you know what you are doing, it's hard to get a > good one. I got come probes from Jameco and they are > pretty good given the price. I would also advise > getting probes with little test clips on the ends, > which are not too good on the Mhz, but they are cheap. > > There is a Yahoo group specifically geared to the > repair and maint. of Tek scopes: mostly oriented to > the older tube types, but they apparently don't get > mad about people discussing newer transtorized scopes. > > I have a 464, but it started to blow fuses, and I > suspect one of the HV diodes in the "flyback" is bad; > but I got an entire working 464 for $75 shipped > recently instead (I will probably fix the older one > eventually). I also have two working Tek 1230 logic > analyzers with 4 pods, one as a spare and all manuals > including training materials. Total investment on this > originally over $14,000 dollars of logic analyzers: > 180.00. > > > > > > --- Philip Pemberton wrote: > > Hi, > > A few days ago I picked up a very nice Tektronix > > 466 storage > > oscilloscope, complete with service manual. Catch > > is, I don't have the > > operator's manual. The service manual is thick with > > schematics and parts > > manifests, a fair bit of technical info ("this part > > does x function", etc). > > No real information on how to actually *use* this > > thing. I've worked out > > what 90% of the controls do by trial and error > > (that, plus the fact I used > > another scope before this one), but the storage > > section and some of the > > trigger section still eludes me... > > Scanned images or photocopy prefered, original > > manual would be even > > better. > > Also, it seems to be missing the blue cover that > > goes over the front > > panel and a set of Tek 1x/10x probes that were > > supposed to come with it. > > Anyone got a 466 as a junker they wouldn't mind > > parting out? I've been told > > Tek abandoned this scope a long time ago... > > > > Thanks. > > -- > > Phil. > > philpem@dsl.pipex.com > > http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes > http://autos.yahoo.com > From Mzthompson at aol.com Thu Jul 18 18:34:00 2002 From: Mzthompson at aol.com (Mzthompson@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Motherlode or scrap ? Message-ID: Zane wrote: > You'd better duck and run! After all we all know that the real reason HP > bought Compaq was so that they'd finally have some real computers to sell! > :^) But I thought Compaq already got rid of all the DEC 'puters. :^)) Mike From jrkeys at concentric.net Thu Jul 18 18:35:01 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:11 2005 Subject: Todays Find Message-ID: <010901c22eb3$8abc38d0$1a000240@oemcomputer> At a auction today I purchased a lot to get a Mac Performa that was in one of the 3 boxes that made up the lot. Later I was loading stuff on dolly to haul out to the van and found a HP 97 calculator in a leather carrying case. In the case was the calculator and two little notebooks marked HP-67/HP-97 Games Pac 1 (with 23 games) and the other was HP-67/HP-97 Standard Pac (with 14 ). It's missing the charger (the batteries are dead) and there are no manuals. There was 6 19" Sun monitors left by another bidder and I picked up one of them, it's a model GDM-1962B. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020718/3b2c8e30/attachment.html From Mzthompson at aol.com Thu Jul 18 18:41:00 2002 From: Mzthompson at aol.com (Mzthompson@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Latest Haul^H^H^H^H Delivery Message-ID: <4b.2063db5d.2a68abae@aol.com> It's nice once you finally get 'em trained. My daughter's friend knows I am a computer packrat. She had a couple things left behind by an old boyfriend. She took them over to my daughter who in turn gave them to my wife who brought them home and delivered them right to me. I now have two Cisco Catalyst 2900 series XL switches. One is a 2912 (12 holer) and the other is a 2924 (24 holer). Mike From Mzthompson at aol.com Thu Jul 18 18:51:01 2002 From: Mzthompson at aol.com (Mzthompson@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Indianapolis Hamfest Haul Message-ID: <17e.b3982fd.2a68ae1c@aol.com> Many did not think it was a great hamfest this year, but if a whole carload of stuff hauled home is any indication then I say it wasn't bad. One good item was a Compaq Portable III, good clean condition, fully working, and had the internal modem installed. $5 This year I stuck around a little longer which means good deals on stuff they don't want to pack back up. One dealer had two eight foot tables full of customer returns and other 'as is'. I saw one item in particular and made an offer. He counter offered with a price for the entire contents of both tables for less than $10. I said what the heck. So far everything I have tested seems to work fine. I suspect a lot of customers try to install it themselves and just don't get it right and return it. Then there is the stuff that is pitched as it all winds down. A friend and I were standing next to a trash barrel when someone brought over some stuff. We grabbed some items. Among that was two full tower PC cases, and a old 486DX2/66 desktop. Turns out the 486 is a good machine for testing various components, so it has found a home on my test bench. Also a couple ATI video cards that are the same card as in the machine I am writing this on, the same right down to the firmware numbers on the EPROMS. It's nice to have some spares. Mike From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Thu Jul 18 19:22:05 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP IPC for sale on E-bay In-Reply-To: <20020718160635.24100.qmail@web20804.mail.yahoo.com> References: <3.0.6.16.20020718104602.495f542e@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020718201934.3b4f0680@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 09:06 AM 7/18/02 -0700, Lee wrote: >The HP Integral PC is a neat little system. Yeah, tell me about it. I still have eight of them! Its an >example of HP's approach to the PC marketplace, a >great solution looking for a problem to solve. Actually it was intended to replace the HP-85. As strange as that may sound! BTW the >unit runs a version of UNIX and not DOS/Windows. Actually it runs HP-UX. >Seller doesn;t indicate if he has the original >software discs. If not, and the system software is >trashed on disc could be a problem getting it going. No problem. There are a number of people on this list that have IPCs and the SW. Besides the buyer might get lucky and find that it has the Software Engineering ROM in it. The SE ROM has a pretty complete HP-UX built into it. There's also a Technical BASIC ROM that has a MOL complete BASIC in it. Joe From john_boffemmyer_iv at boff-net.dhs.org Thu Jul 18 19:49:00 2002 From: john_boffemmyer_iv at boff-net.dhs.org (John Boffemmyer IV) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Indianapolis Hamfest Haul In-Reply-To: <17e.b3982fd.2a68ae1c@aol.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020718203609.009de2e0@n.ml.org> As I imitate James Hetfield of Metallica... ATi Good. ATi GOOD! (instead of beer). All of my ATi cards (save one RageXL based Xpert98 and one Mach64 original PCI) are still working to this day. Well, ok, sorta - the Radeon VE still doesn't have real support for direct draw and has to compensate by updated drivers and firmware updates to get around it, but it works on my system and I use it for all my games. I'd say since you have all the same EPROMs with firmware, you're a lucky bastard, it isn't easy to get the older ones like that. =) Can't say anything good about the Compaq, I've repaired too many and worked with too many to go delving into my personal opinion... -John At 07:49 PM 7/18/02, you wrote: >Many did not think it was a great hamfest this year, but if a whole >carload of stuff hauled home is any indication then I say it wasn't bad. > >One good item was a Compaq Portable III, good clean condition, fully >working, and had the internal modem installed. $5 > >This year I stuck around a little longer which means good deals on >stuff they don't want to pack back up. One dealer had two eight foot >tables full of customer returns and other 'as is'. I saw one item >in particular and made an offer. He counter offered with a price for >the entire contents of both tables for less than $10. I said what the >heck. So far everything I have tested seems to work fine. I suspect >a lot of customers try to install it themselves and just don't get it >right and return it. > >Then there is the stuff that is pitched as it all winds down. A friend >and I were standing next to a trash barrel when someone brought over some >stuff. We grabbed some items. Among that was two full tower PC cases, >and a old 486DX2/66 desktop. Turns out the 486 is a good machine for >testing various components, so it has found a home on my test bench. >Also a couple ATI video cards that are the same card as in the machine I >am writing this on, the same right down to the firmware numbers on the >EPROMS. It's nice to have some spares. > >Mike ---------------------------------------- Founder, Lead Writer, Tech Analyst and Web Designer Boff-Net Technologies http://boff-net.dhs.org/index.html --------------------------------------- From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Jul 18 19:51:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020718012830.490f835c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> from "Joe" at Jul 18, 2 01:28:30 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2742 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020718/4ba24548/attachment.ksh From mythtech at mac.com Thu Jul 18 19:56:00 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Todays Find Message-ID: >At a auction today I purchased a lot to get a Mac Performa that was in one >of the 3 boxes that made up the lot. Later I was loading stuff on dolly >to haul out to the van and found a HP 97 calculator in a leather carrying >case. In the case was the calculator and two little notebooks marked >HP-67/HP-97 Games Pac 1 (with 23 games) and the other was HP-67/HP-97 >Standard Pac (with 14 ). It's missing the charger (the batteries are dead) >and there are no manuals. There was 6 19" Sun monitors left by another >bidder and I picked up one of them, it's a model GDM-1962B. Yeah Yeah Yeah thats nice... now tell me about the Mac! :-) -chris From john_boffemmyer_iv at boff-net.dhs.org Thu Jul 18 20:10:01 2002 From: john_boffemmyer_iv at boff-net.dhs.org (John Boffemmyer IV) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Latest Haul^H^H^H^H Delivery In-Reply-To: <4b.2063db5d.2a68abae@aol.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020718204828.009dfec0@n.ml.org> Damn you Mike. You always get the fun toys. Though, I'd like to get one of the 2513 series routers at some point with Ethernet and Token Ring support for my sick looking network. I already have a NetGear 4 port 10/100 RP114 Router, a 3Com LinkBuilder FMS TR 12 - 12port Token Ring Hub without management cards and a Bay Networks / Nortel BayStack 504 24port Managed Token Ring Hub with MDA NMM DCM and console cards installed. Now, to find the goddamned software and manual for the 504. Nortel wants $300+ for a license to use the friggen unit. No way when I got it for $5. Any ideas? My big goal is to make the two work together through hardware, not two cards in a Linux box and software routing. -John At 07:39 PM 7/18/02, you wrote: >It's nice once you finally get 'em trained. My daughter's friend knows >I am a computer packrat. She had a couple things left behind by an old >boyfriend. She took them over to my daughter who in turn gave them >to my wife who brought them home and delivered them right to me. > >I now have two Cisco Catalyst 2900 series XL switches. One is a 2912 >(12 holer) and the other is a 2924 (24 holer). > >Mike ---------------------------------------- Founder, Lead Writer, Tech Analyst and Web Designer Boff-Net Technologies http://boff-net.dhs.org/index.html --------------------------------------- From carlos_murillo at epm.net.co Thu Jul 18 20:22:00 2002 From: carlos_murillo at epm.net.co (Carlos Murillo) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.6.16.20020718012830.490f835c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.2.32.20020718212133.01a385a0@pop1.epm.net.co> At 01:42 AM 7/19/02 +0100, you wrote: >Some of the points I make below also apply to other messages, but I'll >attempt to save bandwidth by putting them all together. I have found some >technical info on HP-HIL (actually in an HP-SUX manual...) >-tony Hey, I *like* HPUX... I've been a user since '89. Not too sophisticated, but very robust. For me, that counts a lot. When I sysadmined (basic tasks) a few Solaris and Linux systems I found that I had to spend much more time on those than on HPUX. Note: I like them all. carlos. -------------------------------------------------------------- Carlos E. Murillo-Sanchez carlos_murillo@nospammers.ieee.org From Mzthompson at aol.com Thu Jul 18 20:28:01 2002 From: Mzthompson at aol.com (Mzthompson@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: New (but selling used) computer shop, and hauls Message-ID: There seems to be a number of shops springing up around here selling used Wintel. I try to visit each new one just to see what is what. Most times, one visit is enough. The latest one was an experience. The owner knows absolutely nothing beyond Intel. On the first visit, he took me to one back room. It is full of of Apple stuff and more. He mentioned some keyboards in another back room and said they use a modular phone plug. We went for a look and he held one up with the keys facing me. I told him to look at the tag, it should say LK401. His mouth dropped open. Also had a couple IBM model M keyboards. I was then out of time and had to leave. On my next visit I made a couple of offers and picked up some stuff. The first was the box full of LK201/401/402 keyboards. Just over a dozen for $5 for the box. Also got three Apple IIc's with power supplies, but no monitors nor mice. I suspect they are there if I were to dig deep enough. A friend wanted these and was content to get just the machines for $5 each. A rough list of known Apple stuff remaining is 6 SE's, 6 ImageWriters, 5 or 6 external drives, 3 GS's, and a scanner. There was three LaserWriter II's the first time and he seemed willing to sell them for around $10 each. However, I goofed by not taking them then and there. Someone offered him $50 each before I got back. My friend and I are trying to decide what to offer for the remaining Apple pile. After having sold some stuff (i.e. cash in his pocket), he was eager to show me some more old stuff in the basement. He mentioned having a lot of terminals down there and I assumed might be DEC to go with the keyboards. Nope, most it was absolutely total junk. He is quite proud of his store and proud of the fact that he is doing a booming business selling internet ready 486 machines for $50. A lot of those sales are made because he is willing to extend financing to his customers. Yep, that's right, customers financing a $50 computer. He wasn't too happy when I told him I give them away because I got more of than I know what to do with from people bringing them by all the time and other sources. I have since been told by a more 'upscale' store that he is bugging them all the time, wanting technical advice and the like. Oh well, each to his own. Mike From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Jul 18 21:41:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: CRT problem In-Reply-To: <3D362C01.937FBDDA@topnow.com> from "Ross Archer" at Jul 17, 2 07:46:25 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 352 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020718/598b5826/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Jul 18 21:41:57 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: CRT problem In-Reply-To: <009901c22e33$cfcf3bf0$56e1adcb@athlon> from "Dave Brown" at Jul 18, 2 08:19:16 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 698 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020718/9360a297/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Jul 18 21:42:08 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: CRT problem In-Reply-To: <006201c22e05$99b55ff0$de2c67cb@helpdesk> from "Geoff Roberts" at Jul 18, 2 12:18:30 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 398 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020718/fe614a4c/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Jul 18 21:42:19 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP-IL (was Re: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700).) In-Reply-To: <34261.64.169.63.74.1026966663.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> from "Eric Smith" at Jul 17, 2 09:31:03 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2500 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020718/145cb3f7/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Jul 18 21:43:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020718011823.00ac0b40@mail.zipcon.net> from "Geoff Reed" at Jul 18, 2 01:19:37 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 448 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020718/809d6ac2/attachment.ksh From cisin at xenosoft.com Thu Jul 18 21:56:00 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > > There's a guy in the UK that is selling an adaptor for PS/2 KB's/mice to > > HP-HIL that is supposedly just wired through... is this > > possible?!?!?! does anyone have the pinouts for the HP-HIL port? > Totally impossible [1]. The signals are not even close between the 2 > interfaces. > [1] OK, somebody could make a keyboard that could work with either PS/2 > or HP-HIL interfacee sgnals with just a plug change, but AFAIK HP never did. Well, . . . you could make one out of a PC, an HPIL interface card, and some software, ... The HPIL card will cost you, but the PC is cheaper than buying any of its compnent parts. From jrkeys at concentric.net Thu Jul 18 22:32:01 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Todays Find - answer to Mac Question References: Message-ID: <015001c22ed4$af297770$1a000240@oemcomputer> The Mac in that lot was a Performa 578 and was on my list to look for. In one of the other lots I got two Performa 5200CD's, one in bad shape but will be used for parts. Also one of the bidders there seen me getting all the Mac stuff and went to his truck and came back with a Performa 635CD and gave it to me for free. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris" To: "Classic Computer" Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2002 7:55 PM Subject: Re: Todays Find > >At a auction today I purchased a lot to get a Mac Performa that was in one > >of the 3 boxes that made up the lot. Later I was loading stuff on dolly > >to haul out to the van and found a HP 97 calculator in a leather carrying > >case. In the case was the calculator and two little notebooks marked > >HP-67/HP-97 Games Pac 1 (with 23 games) and the other was HP-67/HP-97 > >Standard Pac (with 14 ). It's missing the charger (the batteries are dead) > >and there are no manuals. There was 6 19" Sun monitors left by another > >bidder and I picked up one of them, it's a model GDM-1962B. > > Yeah Yeah Yeah thats nice... now tell me about the Mac! > > :-) > > -chris > > > From mythtech at mac.com Thu Jul 18 23:01:00 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Todays Find - answer to Mac Question Message-ID: >The Mac in that lot was a Performa 578 and was on my list to look for. In >one of the other lots I got two Performa 5200CD's, one in bad shape but will >be used for parts. Also one of the bidders there seen me getting all the Mac >stuff and went to his truck and came back with a Performa 635CD and gave it >to me for free. Doesn't that put you like 3 Macs away from having one of each? Lucky dog -chris From tothwolf at concentric.net Thu Jul 18 23:09:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, Tothwolf wrote: > The SGI sticker under the front panel on this system shows it as serial > number 95 (same as on a rear sticker), and all the boards installed in > the card cage (with the exception of the ST-506 interface) appear to > match the numbers on that sticker. I'm kinda wondering if someone might > have used this 1400 as a source for a spare ST-506 interface, but I'll > probably never know. The ST-506 interface thats currently installed in > this system appears to be of 3rd party origin, though maybe all of the > ST-506 interface boards for the 1x00 and 2x00 systems were. I double checked all the board numbers, and everything but the ST-506 interface does indeed match the build/maintenance sticker. The tag from that board states "Removed from IRIS Suspect U/S - no diagram". The 'U/S' might actually be 'U/5', but it is somewhat hard to read. The board is a standard Multibus board. It was made by Data Systems Design (Qualogy) and has a part number of 805215-08. Does anyone have a databook or even prints for this board? I'm going to assume for now that there is indeed something wrong with it, since it appears someone "borrowed" the original ST-506 interface from this 1400 for another system. This particular board might have come from a later IRIS system, but it appears the 2000s and later used a 5217 instead of a 5215. -Toth From aek at spies.com Fri Jul 19 00:20:00 2002 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: SGI IRIS 1400 (longish) Message-ID: <200207190132.g6J1WSX2029641@spies.com> Does anyone have any info on these systems? There doesn't seem to be much information left, and very little can be found on the web. -- There is a VERY detailed FAQ that I helped write about 10 years ago that gives all the service passwords, switch settings, board types, et. http://www.futuretech.vuurwerk.nl/iris-faq.html is one place to find it. You might also try emailing the guy that just sold the 3130 and all those 24xx series boards on eBay and try to get copies of what he has before he ships it, or email the guys that bought the stuff. From densnet at earthlink.net Fri Jul 19 00:20:32 2002 From: densnet at earthlink.net (den) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP 1600A State analyzer available Message-ID: <009b01c22e37$e4c219c0$b100a8c0@ph.cox.net> Chuck I know it has been quite a while, Do you still have this puppy? or a book for it? Den www.densnet.com den@densnet.com Sorry but it has no probes, these will have to be scavenged for. Its in pretty good shape and easily meets the 10 year rule. Probes aren't too hard to find if you look carefully. Anyway, its free for the cost of shipping it somewhere, or if you are near Sunnyvale California (94087) then you can just pick it up. --Chuck -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020719/b519dc56/attachment.html From aek at spies.com Fri Jul 19 00:20:53 2002 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) Message-ID: <200207190458.g6J4whia011095@spies.com> > Does anyone have a databook I have the user's manual. I'll see about scanning it. From tothwolf at concentric.net Fri Jul 19 00:54:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: SGI IRIS 1400 (longish) In-Reply-To: <200207190132.g6J1WSX2029641@spies.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, Al Kossow wrote: > > Does anyone have any info on these systems? There doesn't seem to be > > much information left, and very little can be found on the web. > > There is a VERY detailed FAQ that I helped write about 10 years ago that > gives all the service passwords, switch settings, board types, et. > > http://www.futuretech.vuurwerk.nl/iris-faq.html is one place to find it. I found that url a few weeks ago when I did my initial search on the 1400, but I didn't realize you helped write it. That FAQ and some other bits I found on the web have been my primary source of information so far. Thanks for taking the time to help write it :) Who maintains the FAQ now? I may have some info from this 1400 to help add to the 1000 series section. > You might also try emailing the guy that just sold the 3130 and all > those 24xx series boards on eBay and try to get copies of what he has > before he ships it, or email the guys that bought the stuff. Will do. Thanks for the heads up. A little digging on Data Systems Design/Qualogy turned up the name Paul Bonderson. According to the page I found here (and a few others): http://www.brocade.com/brocdoc/company_info/Bio_Details.jsp?where=exec&id=1012009638 he was over the group who designed the ST-506 interface boards. Does anyone here know him or think contacting him would be worthwhile? -Toth From Fritz_Chwolka at t-online.de Fri Jul 19 05:57:01 2002 From: Fritz_Chwolka at t-online.de (Fritz Chwolka) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Bootstrapping a CP/M system to usability In-Reply-To: <3D36DC07.5080107@airmail.net> Message-ID: <17VVPp-1uoVBAC@fwd11.sul.t-online.com> On Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:17:27 -0500, Jason King wrote: >Keep the 22-disk handy as you can transfer the other way as well. >This is how I moved boat-load of cp/m stuff to my pc about 15 years ago >when I converted to the dark side. > So you seemd to be a shadow between both sides.-) MfG. Fritz Chwolka >> collecting old computers just for fun << << at www.alterechner.de >> From rschaefe at gcfn.org Fri Jul 19 07:16:05 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert F Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: New (but selling used) computer shop, and hauls In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <64512.128.146.70.112.1027080719.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> > booming business selling internet ready 486 machines for $50. A lot of > those sales are made because he is willing to extend financing to his > customers. Yep, that's right, customers financing a $50 computer. He > wasn't too happy when I told him I give them away because I got more of > than I know what to do with from people bringing them by all the time > and other sources. Sounds like a good place to visit once a week. Maybe you could kill two birds with one stone-- trade him those old peaseas for store credit! BTW, where is this place located? > > I have since been told by a more 'upscale' store that he is bugging > them all the time, wanting technical advice and the like. > > Oh well, each to his own. > > Mike Bob From mvg1 at earthlink.net Fri Jul 19 08:27:01 2002 From: mvg1 at earthlink.net (Mark Grieshaber) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: SGI support -- the easy way In-Reply-To: <10207181836.ZM16915@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> References: <20020718141415.GD1238723@uiuc.edu> <65440.128.146.70.157.1027002843.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> <20020718165551.GC1242777@uiuc.edu> <10207181836.ZM16915@mindy.dunnington.u-net.com> Message-ID: <20020719132516.GA1567@earthlink.net> Everything you say about the difficulty of getting SGI phone support over the hotline (800-800-4SGI) is quite true -- it is engineered to be that way. However... I'm an ex-SGI Systems Engineer. The Systems Engineers are part of the Sales division, and as such are charged with (my words) being "very friendly and supportive of ANYONE interested in SGI stuff". Obviously this has limits, as SEs tend to be quite busy (especially now, as there are fewer of them). But here's the trick to getting great, interested personal support: get friendly with your local SGI Systems Engineer. S/He will be (generally) very interested in your call and problem, and won't (generally) even bother asking for serial numbers, etc. In my experience working at SGI, the SEs were a very dedicated, helpful and knowledgeable lot. And believe me, SEs have access to a *LOT* of information buried inside the company (including knowing who the old-timers are, etc). I miss that easy access to info... Mark Grieshaber mvg1@earthlink.net On Thu, Jul 18, 2002 at 05:36:21PM +0000, Pete Turnbull wrote: > On Jul 18, 11:55, Dan Wright wrote: > > Robert F Schaefer said: > > > > > > What kind of pain? An arbitrary `NO', or just following the finger- > > > pointing to the right desk? If I knew I'd just get the former I > wouldn't > > > bother, but the latter I could deal with to get some info on my 4D/35. > > > It's pretty much the latter. > [...] > > You > > can't really get into their system without a supported system serial #. > You > > could always try giving them the serial for your 4D/35 -- who knows, > someone > > might (accidently) still be paying maintenace on it :) > > I'm afraid my experience (in the UK) is similar to Dan's. If you try to > call SGI nowadays, you won't get far without a support contract and a > serial number to match. Otherwise, you tend to just get referred to sales, > who will try to sell you support (or an OS upgrade or whatever) if the > machine is recent enough to be supportable. > > You might have some luck if you can find someone with a support contract > who regularly sees the engineer. The older ones tend to be quite > knowledgable and may even have worked on such a system or know someone who > has -- and might put you in touch. > > Otherwise, the best resources are the comp.sys.sgi.* newsgroups, which are > fairly active and populated by a number of SGI employees as well as > enthusiasts. > > -- > Pete Peter Turnbull > Network Manager > University of York From rschaefe at gcfn.org Fri Jul 19 08:52:01 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert F Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: SGI support -- the easy way In-Reply-To: <20020719132516.GA1567@earthlink.net> References: <20020719132516.GA1567@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <64610.128.146.70.159.1027086463.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> > Everything you say about the difficulty of getting SGI phone support > over the hotline (800-800-4SGI) is quite true -- it is engineered to be > that way. However... > > I'm an ex-SGI Systems Engineer. The Systems Engineers are part of the > Sales division, and as such are charged with (my words) being "very > friendly and supportive of ANYONE interested in SGI stuff". Obviously > this has limits, as SEs tend to be quite busy (especially now, as there > are fewer of them). But here's the trick to getting great, interested > personal support: get friendly with your local SGI Systems Engineer. > S/He will be (generally) very interested in your call and problem, and > won't (generally) even bother asking for serial numbers, etc. In my > experience working at SGI, the SEs were a very dedicated, helpful and > knowledgeable lot. And believe me, SEs have access to a *LOT* of > information buried inside the company (including knowing who the > old-timers are, etc). I miss that easy access to info... I'd love to play phone tag with one of them. My only problem is that I don't have a local SGI Systems Engineer. I've never had a support contract with SGI, and quite honestly, I doubt I'm *ever* going to have a service contract on *any* of my computers (as the newest one I own is only a few years away from being On Topic, and may be upwards of fifth-hand). Perhaps you remember the extension of a helpful soul who would like to see the older machines saved from the evil scrappers? > > Mark Grieshaber > mvg1@earthlink.net Bob From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 09:06:07 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: <200207190458.g6J4whia011095@spies.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719094653.3c578ba0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 09:58 PM 7/18/02 -0700, Al wrote: > >> Does anyone have a databook > >I have the user's manual. I'll see about scanning it. > Do you mean for the Intel Multibus ST-506 controller (iSBC 215 IIRC) or what? I have several of the cards and the catalog but no user's manual. Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 09:06:23 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: New (but selling used) computer shop, and hauls In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719095855.3bff8992@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Interesting story. You should trade him some of your give away machines for some of his "worthless antiques"! Joe At 09:26 PM 7/18/02 EDT, you wrote: >There seems to be a number of shops springing up around here selling >used Wintel. I try to visit each new one just to see what is what. >Most times, one visit is enough. > >The latest one was an experience. The owner knows absolutely nothing beyond >Intel. On the first visit, he took me to one back room. It is full of >of Apple stuff and more. He mentioned some keyboards in another back room >and said they use a modular phone plug. We went for a look and he held >one up with the keys facing me. I told him to look at the tag, it should >say LK401. His mouth dropped open. Also had a couple IBM model M keyboards. >I was then out of time and had to leave. > >On my next visit I made a couple of offers and picked up some stuff. >The first was the box full of LK201/401/402 keyboards. Just over a >dozen for $5 for the box. Also got three Apple IIc's with power supplies, >but no monitors nor mice. I suspect they are there if I were to dig deep >enough. A friend wanted these and was content to get just the machines >for $5 each. > >A rough list of known Apple stuff remaining is 6 SE's, 6 ImageWriters, >5 or 6 external drives, 3 GS's, and a scanner. There was three >LaserWriter II's the first time and he seemed willing to sell them for >around $10 each. However, I goofed by not taking them then and there. >Someone offered him $50 each before I got back. My friend and I are >trying to decide what to offer for the remaining Apple pile. > >After having sold some stuff (i.e. cash in his pocket), he was eager to >show me some more old stuff in the basement. He mentioned having a lot >of terminals down there and I assumed might be DEC to go with the keyboards. >Nope, most it was absolutely total junk. > >He is quite proud of his store and proud of the fact that he is doing >a booming business selling internet ready 486 machines for $50. A lot >of those sales are made because he is willing to extend financing to >his customers. Yep, that's right, customers financing a $50 computer. >He wasn't too happy when I told him I give them away because I got >more of than I know what to do with from people bringing them by all >the time and other sources. > >I have since been told by a more 'upscale' store that he is bugging them >all the time, wanting technical advice and the like. > >Oh well, each to his own. > >Mike > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 09:06:33 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP 1600A State analyzer available In-Reply-To: <009b01c22e37$e4c219c0$b100a8c0@ph.cox.net> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719094010.3c579df4@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> FWIW several HP logic analyzers and some of their other test equipment use the same probes so they're easy to find around surplus places. They also show up on e-bay frequently and usually cheap. I may have a book for it. I'll look. Joe At 01:48 AM 7/18/02 -0700, Den wrote: > >Chuck >I know it has been quite a while, Do you still have this puppy? or a book for it? >Den www.densnet.com den@densnet.com > >Sorry but it has no probes, these will have to be scavenged for. Its in >pretty good shape and easily meets the 10 year rule. Probes aren't too hard >to find if you look carefully. Anyway, its free for the cost of shipping it >somewhere, or if you are near Sunnyvale California (94087) then you can >just pick it up. > >--Chuck > > > >Attachment Converted: "C:\EUDORA\Attach\ReHP1600.htm" > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 09:06:51 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719100403.3bff31c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 07:55 PM 7/18/02 -0700, Fred wrote: >On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: >> > There's a guy in the UK that is selling an adaptor for PS/2 KB's/mice to >> > HP-HIL that is supposedly just wired through... is this >> > possible?!?!?! does anyone have the pinouts for the HP-HIL port? >> Totally impossible [1]. The signals are not even close between the 2 >> interfaces. >> [1] OK, somebody could make a keyboard that could work with either PS/2 >> or HP-HIL interfacee sgnals with just a plug change, but AFAIK HP never did. > >Well, . . . >you could make one out of a PC, an HPIL interface card, and some software, Again it's the wrong thing. HP-IL is NOT the same as HP-HIL. >... > >The HPIL card will cost you, You're not kidding! One just sold on E-Overpay for something like $330! but the PC is cheaper than buying any of its >compnent parts. > > Joe From roosmcd at dds.nl Fri Jul 19 09:17:00 2002 From: roosmcd at dds.nl (roosmcd@dds.nl) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP-HIL to ps/2 convertor possibility In-Reply-To: <20020719135200.95978.79603.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> References: <20020719135200.95978.79603.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <1027086825.3d3819e946ca2@webmail.dds.nl> > > There's a guy in the UK that is selling an adaptor for PS/2 KB's/mice to > > HP-HIL that is supposedly just wired through... is this > > possible?!?!?! does anyone have the pinouts for the HP-HIL port? > > Totally impossible [1]. The signals are not even close between the 2 > interfaces. > > [1] OK, somebody could make a keyboard that could work with either PS/2 > or HP-HIL interfacee sgnals with just a plug change, but AFAIK HP never > did. I've heard this before, the item is listed here: http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk/parts_unix.html with a picture of it here: http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk/ps2_cable.jpg So what about it? It looks suspiciously like it's just a few wires. My guess is that since he mentions it's for certain machines, that those machines have ps/2 signals on the hp-hil connector. Any other ideas? greetings, Michiel From kd7bcy at teleport.com Fri Jul 19 09:29:01 2002 From: kd7bcy at teleport.com (John Rollins) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Old Macs - ROM p/n's, etc... Message-ID: It's been a long time since I've done anything with my really old Macs(128k, 512k, SE), so my memory is really straining here. Can anyone point me towards some web sites or maybe post info on which ROMs are which, various P/N's, and other useful info. I'm trying to build a system for a friend that wants to play with an old Mac. I have an old Mac case with an unknown system board or ROMs, but it doesn't have a floppy drive in it right now. I have a nice little pile of 800k drives, so I need to know which chips to look for when I go searching for my Mac Plus ROMs(I think I still have at least two lose sets around). Links to places with software would also be useful. Hmm. I'll probably have to setup my LC to make the disks for the system. Used to be that I could identify almost any Mac part from 50 feet... OK, maybe closer for the IC's ;-) I haven't touched them in so long I can't remember anything. I guess I can blame it on my iMac(I named it Thumper because it has an iSub behind it - the whole thing would bounce around the table back when I was using MacOS 9 with the iSub controls. Still nice sound with X, but not quite as much. Gotta love that green jellyfish look at night...). -- /------------------------------------\ | http://jrollins.tripod.com/ | | KD7BCY kd7bcy@teleport.com | \------------------------------------/ From dtwright at uiuc.edu Fri Jul 19 09:40:00 2002 From: dtwright at uiuc.edu (Dan Wright) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP-HIL to ps/2 convertor possibility In-Reply-To: <1027086825.3d3819e946ca2@webmail.dds.nl> References: <20020719135200.95978.79603.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> <1027086825.3d3819e946ca2@webmail.dds.nl> Message-ID: <20020719143918.GC1326949@uiuc.edu> roosmcd@dds.nl said: > > I've heard this before, the item is listed here: > > http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk/parts_unix.html > > with a picture of it here: > > http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk/ps2_cable.jpg > > So what about it? It looks suspiciously like it's just a few wires. My guess > is that since he mentions it's for certain machines, that those machines have > ps/2 signals on the hp-hil connector. Any other ideas? That's for the same machines you can plug the little HP-HIL and PS/2 box into, just without the HP-HIL breakout. I think what HP did was decide to use some extra pins in the RJ45-ish port to pass PS/2 signals in addition to HP-HIL. Then they decided that might be too confusing, so they changed the plug from "two-little-tabs-on-the-side" to "one-little-tab-on-the-top"... because of that, this device won't plug into a normal hp-hip port and a normal HIL device won't plug into the port this thing goes into. > > greetings, > Michiel - Dan Wright (dtwright@uiuc.edu) (http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright) -] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [- ``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread, For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.'' Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan From roosmcd at dds.nl Fri Jul 19 09:45:01 2002 From: roosmcd at dds.nl (roosmcd@dds.nl) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP-HIL update In-Reply-To: <20020719135200.95978.79603.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> References: <20020719135200.95978.79603.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <1027088537.3d38209994e45@webmail.dds.nl> You've just got to love Google: "You can! The 715/80 has both HIL and PS/2 signals in this 10 pin connector. Here's the pinout of the adapter box (no guarantee, of course): | Pin Signal | Workstation HIL PS2 Mouse PS2 Kbd ----------------+---------------------------------------- HIL +12V | 1 1 HIL SI | 2 2 HIL SO | 3 3 GND | 4 4 3 3 PS2 Mouse Clock | 5 5 PS2 Mouse Data | 6 1 GND | 7 3 3 PS2 Kbd Data | 8 1 PS2 Kbd Clock | 9 5 PS2 +5V | 10 4 4 " So that's what inside the UKP 19.50 cable.. Can anyone please confirm if this really works? Or if it just blows up your workstation (pictures!). It looks like my C110 doesn't have all the pins in the HP-HIL socket. greetings, Michiel From dtwright at uiuc.edu Fri Jul 19 09:50:01 2002 From: dtwright at uiuc.edu (Dan Wright) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP-HIL update In-Reply-To: <1027088537.3d38209994e45@webmail.dds.nl> References: <20020719135200.95978.79603.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> <1027088537.3d38209994e45@webmail.dds.nl> Message-ID: <20020719144832.GE1326949@uiuc.edu> roosmcd@dds.nl said: > You've just got to love Google: > > "You can! The 715/80 has both HIL and PS/2 signals in this 10 pin ^^^ Note that it's for THIS PARTICULAR MODEL!! Also a few others, but by NO MEANS all HP-HIL workstations... - Dan Wright (dtwright@uiuc.edu) (http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright) -] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [- ``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread, For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.'' Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan From jim at jkearney.com Fri Jul 19 10:21:01 2002 From: jim at jkearney.com (Jim Kearney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP 1600A State analyzer available In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020719094010.3c579df4@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> References: <009b01c22e37$e4c219c0$b100a8c0@ph.cox.net> <3.0.6.16.20020719094010.3c579df4@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: I have an HP 1600A "for parts" if anyone wants it. No probes though. Boston area pickup or I will ship for cost. Jim -----Original Message----- From: Joe To: cctech@classiccmp.org Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 09:40:10 Subject: Re: HP 1600A State analyzer available > FWIW several HP logic analyzers and some of their other test > equipment use the same probes so they're easy to find around surplus > places. They also show up on e-bay frequently and usually cheap. I > may have a book for it. I'll look. > > Joe > > At 01:48 AM 7/18/02 -0700, Den wrote: > > > >Chuck > >I know it has been quite a while, Do you still have this puppy? or a > book for it? > >Den www.densnet.com den@densnet.com > > > >Sorry but it has no probes, these will have to be scavenged for. Its > in > >pretty good shape and easily meets the 10 year rule. Probes aren't > too hard > >to find if you look carefully. Anyway, its free for the cost of > shipping it > >somewhere, or if you are near Sunnyvale California (94087) then you > can > >just pick it up. > > > >--Chuck > > > > > > > >Attachment Converted: "C:\EUDORA\Attach\ReHP1600.htm" > > > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 10:35:10 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Does anyone have a SB-180 with option 2 for the COMM180 card? Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719113113.3c479618@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Option 2 is the voice synthesizer option for the COMM/SCSI controller card. Does anyone have one installed or does anyone have the docs for this option? I have the COMM180 card without the option and I'd like to try and add it. I have docs for the card but they don't give the complete details for the option. Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 10:35:41 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Mitsubishi floppy drive question Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719112807.2e978e7e@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I have a floppy drive that has the front panel light that's coming on anytime any of the drives on the system are accessed. Does anyone have the manual and can tell me what jumpers control the front panel light? The drive is a Mitsubishi 4853 Rev U 80 track 5 1/4" floppy drive. Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 10:35:52 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Need November December 1985 Byte article -- SB-180 parts 3 & 4. Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719113453.3c47858c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Does anyone have parts 3 & 4 of Steve Ciarcia's SB-180 article? I think they were in the November and December 1985 issues of Byte. Can you send me a copy? (fax, photo-copy, scan or ?? Joe From dwoycies at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu Fri Jul 19 10:45:01 2002 From: dwoycies at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Todays Find In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 07/18/02, Chris scribbled: > >At a auction today I purchased a lot to get a Mac Performa that was in one > >of the 3 boxes that made up the lot. Later I was loading stuff on dolly > >to haul out to the van and found a HP 97 calculator in a leather carrying > >case. In the case was the calculator and two little notebooks marked > >HP-67/HP-97 Games Pac 1 (with 23 games) and the other was HP-67/HP-97 > >Standard Pac (with 14 ). It's missing the charger (the batteries are dead) > >and there are no manuals. There was 6 19" Sun monitors left by another > >bidder and I picked up one of them, it's a model GDM-1962B. > > Yeah Yeah Yeah thats nice... now tell me about the Mac! > > :-) > > -chris > > Is that all you can think about Chris? Man, too bad those 19"s aren't close to CT. I have a couple Suns that could use them... And that HP sounds like a neat little find too, even though that's not my area of collection... -- --- David A. Woyciesjes --- C&IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ# - 905818 Mac OSX 10.1 - Darwin Kernel V. 5 Running since 01/22/02 without a crash From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 10:47:03 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP-HIL to ps/2 convertor possibility In-Reply-To: <1027086825.3d3819e946ca2@webmail.dds.nl> References: <20020719135200.95978.79603.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> <20020719135200.95978.79603.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719114359.2e97cd10@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> That connector doesn't look like a HP-HIL connector. The HIL connector uses two plastic locking tabs, one on each side of the connector. This one only has one tab and it's on the bottom. If you look at the picture that I referenced the other day, , you can see the notches for the locking tabs on each side and none on the bottom (actuallyit would be on top in this view). My guess is that the machines that he's making thse for DO NOT use HP-HIL but something else. Why don't you buy one and try it and let us know what you find out? Joe At 03:53 PM 7/19/02 +0200, you wrote: >> > There's a guy in the UK that is selling an adaptor for PS/2 KB's/mice to >> > HP-HIL that is supposedly just wired through... is this >> > possible?!?!?! does anyone have the pinouts for the HP-HIL port? >> >> Totally impossible [1]. The signals are not even close between the 2 >> interfaces. >> >> [1] OK, somebody could make a keyboard that could work with either PS/2 >> or HP-HIL interfacee sgnals with just a plug change, but AFAIK HP never >> did. > > I've heard this before, the item is listed here: > > http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk/parts_unix.html > > with a picture of it here: > > http://www.unixnerd.demon.co.uk/ps2_cable.jpg > > So what about it? It looks suspiciously like it's just a few wires. My guess >is that since he mentions it's for certain machines, that those machines have >ps/2 signals on the hp-hil connector. Any other ideas? > > greetings, > Michiel > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 10:47:23 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP-HIL update In-Reply-To: <1027088537.3d38209994e45@webmail.dds.nl> References: <20020719135200.95978.79603.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> <20020719135200.95978.79603.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719114552.2e97a9c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Ah! That makes sense now! Love that Google! I use it so much that I've set it as my home page. Joe At 04:22 PM 7/19/02 +0200, Michiel wrote: > You've just got to love Google: > >"You can! The 715/80 has both HIL and PS/2 signals in this 10 pin >connector. Here's the pinout of the adapter box (no guarantee, of course): > > | Pin > Signal | Workstation HIL PS2 Mouse PS2 Kbd > ----------------+---------------------------------------- > HIL +12V | 1 1 > HIL SI | 2 2 > HIL SO | 3 3 > GND | 4 4 3 3 > PS2 Mouse Clock | 5 5 > PS2 Mouse Data | 6 1 > GND | 7 3 3 > PS2 Kbd Data | 8 1 > PS2 Kbd Clock | 9 5 > PS2 +5V | 10 4 4 >" > > So that's what inside the UKP 19.50 cable.. Can anyone please confirm if this >really works? Or if it just blows up your workstation (pictures!). It looks >like my C110 doesn't have all the pins in the HP-HIL socket. > > greetings, > Michiel > From jrkeys at concentric.net Fri Jul 19 10:54:00 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Todays Find - answer to Mac Question References: Message-ID: <007501c22f3c$5e504fa0$77000240@oemcomputer> No, I'm 23 short to have all 103 models between 1984 and 1995. I have also collected over 30 other models that were not on my original list. I also have many dup's that I will be trading/selling in the near future. I now have over 250 Mac's in storage right now. I stopped counting the II's, IIplus, IIe's, IIc's, IIc+, and IIgs's I have in storage also. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris" To: Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2002 10:59 PM Subject: Re: Todays Find - answer to Mac Question > >The Mac in that lot was a Performa 578 and was on my list to look for. In > >one of the other lots I got two Performa 5200CD's, one in bad shape but will > >be used for parts. Also one of the bidders there seen me getting all the Mac > >stuff and went to his truck and came back with a Performa 635CD and gave it > >to me for free. > > Doesn't that put you like 3 Macs away from having one of each? > > Lucky dog > > -chris > > > From jrkeys at concentric.net Fri Jul 19 10:59:00 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Todays Find References: Message-ID: <008101c22f3c$fb4065c0$77000240@oemcomputer> Yes, the cost of shipping would be high (the last time I shipped a 20" apple it was $60) and the packing to keep them from getting damaged. Sorry :-( ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Woyciesjes" To: "Classic Computer" Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 9:00 AM Subject: Re: Todays Find > On 07/18/02, Chris scribbled: > > > >At a auction today I purchased a lot to get a Mac Performa that was in one > > >of the 3 boxes that made up the lot. Later I was loading stuff on dolly > > >to haul out to the van and found a HP 97 calculator in a leather carrying > > >case. In the case was the calculator and two little notebooks marked > > >HP-67/HP-97 Games Pac 1 (with 23 games) and the other was HP-67/HP-97 > > >Standard Pac (with 14 ). It's missing the charger (the batteries are dead) > > >and there are no manuals. There was 6 19" Sun monitors left by another > > >bidder and I picked up one of them, it's a model GDM-1962B. > > > > Yeah Yeah Yeah thats nice... now tell me about the Mac! > > > > :-) > > > > -chris > > > > > Is that all you can think about Chris? Man, too bad those 19"s > aren't close to CT. I have a couple Suns that could use them... > And that HP sounds like a neat little find too, even though that's > not my area of collection... > -- > --- David A. Woyciesjes > --- C&IS Support Specialist > --- Yale University Press > --- (203) 432-0953 > --- ICQ# - 905818 > Mac OSX 10.1 - Darwin Kernel V. 5 > Running since 01/22/02 without a crash > > From doc at mdrconsult.com Fri Jul 19 11:06:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: HP-HIL update In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020719114552.2e97a9c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: > Ah! That makes sense now! Love that Google! I use it so much that I've set it as my home page. Doesn't *everybody*? Doc From uban at ubanproductions.com Fri Jul 19 11:14:04 2002 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Does anyone have a SB-180 with option 2 for the COMM180 card? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020719113113.3c479618@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20020719105509.01b978a8@ubanproductions.com> I have the COMM/SCSI card, but not the voice synthesizer option. The set is in a box and has not been touched for probably 12 years... --tom At 11:31 AM 7/19/2002 +0000, you wrote: > Option 2 is the voice synthesizer option for the COMM/SCSI controller > card. Does anyone have one installed or does anyone have the docs for > this option? I have the COMM180 card without the option and I'd like to > try and add it. I have docs for the card but they don't give the complete > details for the option. > > Joe From doc at mdrconsult.com Fri Jul 19 12:15:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:12 2005 Subject: Todays Find - answer to Mac Question In-Reply-To: <007501c22f3c$5e504fa0$77000240@oemcomputer> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Keys wrote: > No, I'm 23 short to have all 103 models between 1984 and 1995. I have also > collected over 30 other models that were not on my original list. I also > have many dup's that I will be trading/selling in the near future. I now > have over 250 Mac's in storage right now. I stopped counting the II's, > IIplus, IIe's, IIc's, IIc+, and IIgs's I have in storage also. Hey, you want original boxes for a IIe, a beige external 5.25 floppy, and a mono display? The display box is the only one with the styrofoam inserts. They're all 80-90% intact. I just picked up a huge load of AIX docs and guess what they came in? If you want them, I'll trade them all for a IIe joystick & a set of ProDOS floppies. (I have a IIe card for my LC and all I lack is the joystick & software) Doc From foo at siconic.com Fri Jul 19 12:23:04 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: Todays Find - answer to Mac Question In-Reply-To: <007501c22f3c$5e504fa0$77000240@oemcomputer> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Keys wrote: > No, I'm 23 short to have all 103 models between 1984 and 1995. I have also > collected over 30 other models that were not on my original list. I also > have many dup's that I will be trading/selling in the near future. I now > have over 250 Mac's in storage right now. I stopped counting the II's, > IIplus, IIe's, IIc's, IIc+, and IIgs's I have in storage also. Speaking of which, if anyone wants a few buttloads of Apple //e's or Macs of all different flavors, visit the Alameda County Computer Resouce Center in Oakland, California: http://www.accrc.org It would be best if you could stop by when you're in town and grab a few. They can be bribed to ship them if you make it worth their time and effort. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From foo at siconic.com Fri Jul 19 12:25:03 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: HP cassette equivalents? Message-ID: Didn't we discuss a while back that HP82167 data carthridges were the equivalent of some other type that is still on the market? These would be for the HP 82161A drive. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 19 12:52:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: *Home* page (was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020719175113.18219.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> --- Doc Shipley wrote: > On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: > > > Ah! That makes sense now! Love that Google! I use it so much that > I've set it as my home page. > > Doesn't *everybody*? > > Doc Nope... I use "blank" - loads faster, especially when the network isn't cooperating (usually problems connecting to DNS servers). Now... I _do_ Google several times a day, but I *like* the blank page as my home page. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Fri Jul 19 13:00:01 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: *Home* page (was Re: HP-HIL update) References: <20020719175113.18219.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3D3852A4.5000808@jetnet.ab.ca> > Nope... I use "blank" - loads faster, especially when the network > isn't cooperating (usually problems connecting to DNS servers). Is that http://www.dev.null :) > Now... I _do_ Google several times a day, but I *like* the blank > page as my home page. I use Google as my home page too. I liked Yahoo before they became "Pop up city" for Yahoo ads and changed the news format around. What I can't stand is home pages that are just adverting for the software product you are using. From rschaefe at gcfn.org Fri Jul 19 13:09:00 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert F Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: *Home* page (was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: <20020719175113.18219.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20020719175113.18219.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <65251.128.146.70.111.1027101883.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> > > --- Doc Shipley wrote: >> On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: >> >> > Ah! That makes sense now! Love that Google! I use it so much >> > that >> I've set it as my home page. >> >> Doesn't *everybody*? >> >> Doc > > Nope... I use "blank" - loads faster, especially when the network > isn't cooperating (usually problems connecting to DNS servers). Why in the world would anyone use something other than a blank page? You still have to tell it where to go, and at least with a blank page you don't have to wait for it to load. > > Now... I _do_ Google several times a day, but I *like* the blank > page as my home page. I've found it's faster to type the query into the URL and search from there than to load google and then fill in the blank. Probably the single biggest reason I like google-- the URL for a search is pretty easy to decode. Between a blank home page and searching from the address line, it really cuts down on the delay. That's important when the shared (!) company modem (!!) won't connect over 26k8 due to the lovely condition of the phonelines out here in the boonies. > > -ethan Bob BTW, when would be a good time to stop by and look at that printer? From mythtech at mac.com Fri Jul 19 13:11:01 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: Todays Find Message-ID: >> Yeah Yeah Yeah thats nice... now tell me about the Mac! > Is that all you can think about Chris? No, I think about sex too... but since I got married, I think I get more Mac. :-) -chris From msell at ontimesupport.com Fri Jul 19 13:27:00 2002 From: msell at ontimesupport.com (Matthew Sell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: *Home* page (was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: <65251.128.146.70.111.1027101883.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> References: <20020719175113.18219.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> <20020719175113.18219.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020719132229.0270fe90@127.0.0.1> I use Opera - it's got this neat feature of having the Google search built into the browser. It appears next to the URL entry box, so you enter your search terms and hit enter. Neat. There are add-ons for other browsers available from Google that add this functionality. - Matt >I've found it's faster to type the query into the URL and search from there >than to load google and then fill in the blank. Probably the single >biggest reason I like google-- the URL for a search is pretty easy to >decode. > >Between a blank home page and searching from the address line, it really >cuts down on the delay. That's important when the shared (!) company modem >(!!) won't connect over 26k8 due to the lovely condition of the phonelines >out here in the boonies. > > > > > -ethan > >Bob > >BTW, when would be a good time to stop by and look at that printer? Matthew Sell Programmer On Time Support, Inc. www.ontimesupport.com (281) 296-6066 Join the Metrology Software discussion group METLIST! http://www.ontimesupport.com/subscribe_t&c.html. "One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad "Ein Volk, Ein Reich, Ein Fuhrer" - Adolf Hitler Many thanks for this tagline to a fellow RGVAC'er... -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020719/3467d535/attachment.html From r.stek at snet.net Fri Jul 19 13:28:16 2002 From: r.stek at snet.net (Bob Stek) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: Does anyone have a SB-180 with option 2 for the COMM180 card? Message-ID: <000001c22f51$d3531890$6401a8c0@mycroft1> Joe - I think I might have complete docs, and luckily for you I was planning on doing some cleaning and re-organizing in my basement this weekend. Let me look. Another possibility is to email Jeff Bachiochi [Jeff.Bachiochi@circuitcellar.com] with any specific questions. You can tell him I told you to contact him - if he's in a good mood, he won't hold that against you . Bob Stek Saver of Lost Sols From edick at idcomm.com Fri Jul 19 14:35:01 2002 From: edick at idcomm.com (Richard Erlacher) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) References: <3.0.6.16.20020719094653.3c578ba0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <001401c22f5b$456e9680$9cc762d8@idcomm.com> The iSBC215 doesn't have a drive-specific interface on it, as it requires an external board to provide the signal interface and data separator. Much of that is actually on the iSBC215, but the data separator and signal level buffers aren't. I have the iSBC215, including the manual and schematics, but that won't help if you haven't got the drive interface module. Dick ----- Original Message ----- From: Joe To: Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 9:46 AM Subject: Re: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) > At 09:58 PM 7/18/02 -0700, Al wrote: > > > >> Does anyone have a databook > > > >I have the user's manual. I'll see about scanning it. > > > > Do you mean for the Intel Multibus ST-506 controller (iSBC 215 IIRC) or what? I have several of the cards and the catalog but no user's manual. > > Joe > > > From edick at idcomm.com Fri Jul 19 14:42:04 2002 From: edick at idcomm.com (Richard Erlacher) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: HP 1600A State analyzer available References: <3.0.6.16.20020719094010.3c579df4@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <001e01c22f5c$2be01e40$9cc762d8@idcomm.com> There's a pretty complete HP LA in Denver's Gateway electronics store. It has the accessory bag, pods, probes, manual. Of course I don't recall which model it is ... Their phone # is 303-458-5444. The web page set up by the St.Louis store doesn't pertain in any way to the Denver store, aside from the fact that you can probably get most of what's on the St.Louis store's shelves from the Denver store. I don't know about the other direction. Dick ----- Original Message ----- From: Joe To: Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 9:40 AM Subject: Re: HP 1600A State analyzer available > FWIW several HP logic analyzers and some of their other test equipment use the same probes so they're easy to find around surplus places. They also show up on e-bay frequently and usually cheap. I may have a book for it. I'll look. > > Joe > > At 01:48 AM 7/18/02 -0700, Den wrote: > > > >Chuck > >I know it has been quite a while, Do you still have this puppy? or a book for it? > >Den www.densnet.com den@densnet.com > > > >Sorry but it has no probes, these will have to be scavenged for. Its in > >pretty good shape and easily meets the 10 year rule. Probes aren't too hard > >to find if you look carefully. Anyway, its free for the cost of shipping it > >somewhere, or if you are near Sunnyvale California (94087) then you can > >just pick it up. > > > >--Chuck > > > > > > > >Attachment Converted: "C:\EUDORA\Attach\ReHP1600.htm" > > > > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 16:08:20 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: Does anyone have a SB-180 with option 2 for the COMM180 card? In-Reply-To: <000001c22f51$d3531890$6401a8c0@mycroft1> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719164101.44074632@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Thanks Bob. Keep me in mind if you find anything for the SB-180 while you're cleaning up. I think mine is going to need a new hard drive (uses some odd-ball SCSI drive) :-( Joe At 02:26 PM 7/19/02 -0400, you wrote: >Joe - > >I think I might have complete docs, and luckily for you I was planning >on doing some cleaning and re-organizing in my basement this weekend. >Let me look. Another possibility is to email Jeff Bachiochi >[Jeff.Bachiochi@circuitcellar.com] with any specific questions. You can >tell him I told you to contact him - if he's in a good mood, he won't >hold that against you . > >Bob Stek >Saver of Lost Sols > > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 16:08:53 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: HP cassette equivalents? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719163838.4407468e@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Sellam, The only tapes that I've seen that I thought might work in the 82161 were the ones that Fluke used for their 9010 MicroSystem Trouble Shooter. That tapes appear to be identical but I haven't tried one. I did find a few of the Fluke tapes but they have data on them so I don't want to experiment with them. Here is the URL for one that's on E-bay. You can see the tapes in the bottom pictures. Joe At 02:25 AM 7/19/02 -0700, you wrote: > >Didn't we discuss a while back that HP82167 data carthridges were the >equivalent of some other type that is still on the market? These would >be for the HP 82161A drive. > >Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival >------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 16:09:07 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: Does anyone have a SB-180 with option 2 for the COMM180 card? In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20020719105509.01b978a8@ubanproductions.com> References: <3.0.6.16.20020719113113.3c479618@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719163210.44074736@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Tom, Are you interested in parting with it? I have a 2nd SB-180 that doesn't have one and I could put it to good use. Joe At 11:13 AM 7/19/02 -0500, you wrote: >I have the COMM/SCSI card, but not the voice synthesizer option. The set is >in a box and >has not been touched for probably 12 years... > >--tom > >At 11:31 AM 7/19/2002 +0000, you wrote: >> Option 2 is the voice synthesizer option for the COMM/SCSI controller >> card. Does anyone have one installed or does anyone have the docs for >> this option? I have the COMM180 card without the option and I'd like to >> try and add it. I have docs for the card but they don't give the complete >> details for the option. >> >> Joe > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 16:09:28 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: *Home* page (was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: <20020719175113.18219.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> References: Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719165357.44074632@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 10:51 AM 7/19/02 -0700, you wrote: > >--- Doc Shipley wrote: >> On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: >> >> > Ah! That makes sense now! Love that Google! I use it so much that >> I've set it as my home page. >> >> Doesn't *everybody*? >> >> Doc > >Nope... I use "blank" - loads faster, especially when the network >isn't cooperating (usually problems connecting to DNS servers). > >Now... I _do_ Google several times a day, but I *like* the blank >page as my home page. > >-ethan Network problems are one of the reasons that I use Google instead of blank. I can tell immediately if there's a problem. If there's a problem loading I can just about guarantee that it's a network problem. I've never seen Google go down. Also Google is such a "clean" page that there's no delay in loading it compared to Yahoo and almost any other page. Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 16:09:43 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: HP-HIL update In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.6.16.20020719114552.2e97a9c0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719164844.44074666@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 11:04 AM 7/19/02 -0500, Doc wrote: >On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: > >> Ah! That makes sense now! Love that Google! I use it so much that I've set it as my home page. > > Doesn't *everybody*? Certainly not judging from the level of ignorance shown by most modern PeeCee users! Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 16:10:01 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: Pop-up Ads was Re: *Home* page (was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: <3D3852A4.5000808@jetnet.ab.ca> References: <20020719175113.18219.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719165933.440746fa@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 11:55 AM 7/19/02 -0600, you wrote: > >> Nope... I use "blank" - loads faster, especially when the network >> isn't cooperating (usually problems connecting to DNS servers). > >Is that http://www.dev.null :) > >> Now... I _do_ Google several times a day, but I *like* the blank >> page as my home page. > >I use Google as my home page too. I liked Yahoo before they became >"Pop up city" for Yahoo ads I HATE pop-up ads. I've installed GuideScope on my computer and it eliminates the pop-up ads and lets me selectively accept or refuse cookies. I recommend it highly. Give it a try, Google will find it faster than you can say lickidy-split. and changed the news format around. >What I can't stand is home pages that are just adverting for the >software product you are using. Do you mean like the one that WinBlows defaults to at MSN.COM? Joe > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 16:10:13 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: <001401c22f5b$456e9680$9cc762d8@idcomm.com> References: <3.0.6.16.20020719094653.3c578ba0@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719170756.44074682@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 01:34 PM 7/19/02 -0600, Dick wrote: >The iSBC215 doesn't have a drive-specific interface on it, as it requires an >external board to provide the signal interface and data separator. Much of >that is actually on the iSBC215, but the data separator and signal level >buffers aren't. > >I have the iSBC215, including the manual and schematics, but that won't help >if you haven't got the drive interface module. I don't need it, I was just replying to Al's request. FWIW the iSBC supports three different type drives. 506/412 and a couple of others that I don't recall at the moment. I just got a hard drive for my intel MDS-235 and I think it uses a modified iSBC 215 so I may get some experience with it soon. If so can I get a copy of those docs? Joe PS If you're interested, there's an iSBC 215 for sale on E-bay right now. It has the 1/4" tape drive controller and floppy drive controller daughter boards with it. > >Dick > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Joe >To: >Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 9:46 AM >Subject: Re: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) > > >> At 09:58 PM 7/18/02 -0700, Al wrote: >> > >> >> Does anyone have a databook >> > >> >I have the user's manual. I'll see about scanning it. >> > >> >> Do you mean for the Intel Multibus ST-506 controller (iSBC 215 IIRC) or >what? I have several of the cards and the catalog but no user's manual. >> >> Joe >> >> >> > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 16:17:04 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: manuals was Re: HP 1600A State analyzer available Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719171750.44072d3c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I checked my manuals and I have ones for the 1601, 1607, 1615 and 1630. The 1607 is almost exactly the same as a 1600 but it doesn't have a built-in display. Instead you have to use an XYZ display or couple it to a 1600. Give me a shout if you need the part numbers for the probes or other info. Joe > > FWIW several HP logic analyzers and some of their other test equipment use the same probes so they're easy to find around surplus places. They also show up on e-bay frequently and usually cheap. I may have a book for it. I'll look. > > Joe > >At 01:48 AM 7/18/02 -0700, Den wrote: >> >>Chuck >>I know it has been quite a while, Do you still have this puppy? or a book for it? >>Den www.densnet.com den@densnet.com >> >>Sorry but it has no probes, these will have to be scavenged for. Its in >>pretty good shape and easily meets the 10 year rule. Probes aren't too hard >>to find if you look carefully. Anyway, its free for the cost of shipping it >>somewhere, or if you are near Sunnyvale California (94087) then you can >>just pick it up. >> >>--Chuck >> >> >> >>Attachment Converted: "C:\EUDORA\Attach\ReHP1600.htm" >> From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 16:27:07 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719172340.3c175872@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> A whole LOT of stuff there! Joe From jhfinepw4z at compsys.to Fri Jul 19 16:43:01 2002 From: jhfinepw4z at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay References: <3.0.6.16.20020719172340.3c175872@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3D388731.484673F7@compsys.to> >Joe wrote: > A whole LOT of stuff there! Jerome Fine replies: At $ 9.99, it is worth the price, but it sounds too good to be true. Also, how is it that he has 134 eBay transactions? It certainly sounds like some sort of con, but I will wait until I see the final auction price. Maybe I am too suspicious! Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Fri Jul 19 16:51:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: HP9000 model 710 workstation(Apollo 700). In-Reply-To: from "Fred Cisin" at Jul 18, 2 07:55:19 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 672 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020719/81c804ff/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Fri Jul 19 16:51:34 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: HP cassette equivalents? In-Reply-To: from "Sellam Ismail" at Jul 19, 2 02:25:13 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 564 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020719/6abf6aca/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Fri Jul 19 16:51:45 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: HP-HIL update In-Reply-To: <1027088537.3d38209994e45@webmail.dds.nl> from "roosmcd@dds.nl" at Jul 19, 2 04:22:17 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 680 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020719/c4f44980/attachment.ksh From marvin at rain.org Fri Jul 19 17:33:00 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay References: <3.0.6.16.20020719172340.3c175872@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <3D388731.484673F7@compsys.to> Message-ID: <3D389343.A1944839@rain.org> BUT, there is a reserve price, and that amount isn't mentioned in the description! I have most of what he is offering ... but it would be nice to have the Model 12 and 16!!! > >Joe wrote: > > > A whole LOT of stuff there! > > Jerome Fine replies: > > At $ 9.99, it is worth the price, but it sounds too good to be true. > Also, how is it that he has 134 eBay transactions? It certainly > sounds like some sort of con, but I will wait until I see the final > auction price. Maybe I am too suspicious! From lincoln.fessenden at verizon.net Fri Jul 19 20:54:00 2002 From: lincoln.fessenden at verizon.net (linc fessenden) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: Todays Find - answer to Mac Question In-Reply-To: <007501c22f3c$5e504fa0$77000240@oemcomputer> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Keys wrote: > No, I'm 23 short to have all 103 models between 1984 and 1995. I have also > collected over 30 other models that were not on my original list. I also > have many dup's that I will be trading/selling in the near future. I now > have over 250 Mac's in storage right now. I stopped counting the II's, > IIplus, IIe's, IIc's, IIc+, and IIgs's I have in storage also. Where's the pictures of your collection! I gotta see this! -- -Linc Fessenden In the Beginning there was nothing, which exploded - Yeah right... From aek at spies.com Fri Jul 19 20:55:59 2002 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) Message-ID: <200207192101.g6JL1sr8013994@spies.com> DSD 5215/17 and 6214 docs are now up at www.spies.com/aek/pdf/dsd From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Fri Jul 19 21:33:04 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay In-Reply-To: <3D388731.484673F7@compsys.to> References: <3.0.6.16.20020719172340.3c175872@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020719223201.3c072242@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 05:40 PM 7/19/02 -0400, Jerome Fine wrote: >>Joe wrote: > >> A whole LOT of stuff there! > >Jerome Fine replies: > >At $ 9.99, it is worth the price, but it sounds too good to be true. >Also, how is it that he has 134 eBay transactions? It certainly >sounds like some sort of con, but I will wait until I see the final >auction price. Maybe I am too suspicious! Hey at $9.99 even I can afford to find out! Joe From healyzh at aracnet.com Fri Jul 19 21:46:01 2002 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay In-Reply-To: from "Joe" at Jul 19, 2002 10:32:01 PM Message-ID: <200207200244.g6K2iZi21496@shell1.aracnet.com> > At 05:40 PM 7/19/02 -0400, Jerome Fine wrote: > >>Joe wrote: > > > >> A whole LOT of stuff there! > > > >Jerome Fine replies: > > > >At $ 9.99, it is worth the price, but it sounds too good to be true. > >Also, how is it that he has 134 eBay transactions? It certainly > >sounds like some sort of con, but I will wait until I see the final > >auction price. Maybe I am too suspicious! > > > Hey at $9.99 even I can afford to find out! > > Joe In looking at that, anyone considering bidding on this should make sure that they're aware of the VOLUME of stuff listed here. I'm wondering if there aren't a couple of DESK sized systems in that pile. BTW, I really don't know anything about TRS-80 systems, but I do have some TRS-80 manuals that sound like the ones listed, and the pictures show a BIG computer. Zane From foo at siconic.com Fri Jul 19 22:29:05 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: OT: Pop-Up window killers was Re: Pop-up Ads was Re: *Home* page (was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020719165933.440746fa@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: > I HATE pop-up ads. I've installed GuideScope on my computer and it > eliminates the pop-up ads and lets me selectively accept or refuse > cookies. I recommend it highly. Give it a try, Google will find it > faster than you can say lickidy-split. Ditto. I use Pop-Up Stopper. Works most excellently. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From foo at siconic.com Fri Jul 19 22:31:04 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay In-Reply-To: <3D389343.A1944839@rain.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Marvin Johnston wrote: > BUT, there is a reserve price, and that amount isn't mentioned in the > description! I have most of what he is offering ... but it would be nice > to have the Model 12 and 16!!! I've got either one or both of those (and all the rest). N'yah ;) Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From carlos_murillo at epm.net.co Fri Jul 19 22:47:01 2002 From: carlos_murillo at epm.net.co (Carlos Murillo) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: *Home* page (was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20020719132229.0270fe90@127.0.0.1> References: <65251.128.146.70.111.1027101883.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> <20020719175113.18219.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> <20020719175113.18219.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3.0.2.32.20020719234602.01a4312c@pop1.epm.net.co> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text/enriched Size: 720 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020719/8ccdc607/attachment.bin From marvin at rain.org Fri Jul 19 23:17:01 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay References: Message-ID: <3D38E3E7.FB18CD6E@rain.org> Sellam Ismail wrote: > > On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Marvin Johnston wrote: > > > BUT, there is a reserve price, and that amount isn't mentioned in the > > description! I have most of what he is offering ... but it would be nice > > to have the Model 12 and 16!!! > > I've got either one or both of those (and all the rest). > > N'yah ;) Okay, this could get interesting :). Since we are talking about TRS-80 stuff ... how about an almost complete set of CLOAD cassettes :)? I rather suspect we could both go on for a while with stuff one of us has, but not the other!!! From tothwolf at concentric.net Fri Jul 19 23:39:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: <200207192101.g6JL1sr8013994@spies.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Al Kossow wrote: > DSD 5215/17 and 6214 docs are now up at www.spies.com/aek/pdf/dsd Nice. Thanks very much. I briefly looked it over, and it mentions how to run diagnostics on the board, so it looks like I can at least troubleshoot it some. It's too bad DSD didn't publish the diagnostic result codes in the manual though. Maybe a service manual will turn up if I end up really needing one... -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Fri Jul 19 23:41:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: OT: Pop-Up window killers was Re: Pop-up Ads was Re: *Home* page (was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Sellam Ismail wrote: > On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: > > > I HATE pop-up ads. I've installed GuideScope on my computer and it > > eliminates the pop-up ads and lets me selectively accept or refuse > > cookies. I recommend it highly. Give it a try, Google will find it > > faster than you can say lickidy-split. > > Ditto. I use Pop-Up Stopper. Works most excellently. I've got a junkbuster proxy running on one of my *nix systems. It works quite well, since I can filter my whole LAN's web traffic at once :) -Toth From ghldbrd at ccp.com Sat Jul 20 00:05:01 2002 From: ghldbrd at ccp.com (Gary Hildebrand) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: OT: Pop-Up window killers was Re: Pop-up Ads was Re: *Home* page(was Re: HP-HIL update) References: Message-ID: <3D38EE7F.33F52066@ccp.com> Sellam Ismail wrote: > > On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: > > > I HATE pop-up ads. I've installed GuideScope on my computer and it > > eliminates the pop-up ads and lets me selectively accept or refuse > > cookies. I recommend it highly. Give it a try, Google will find it > > faster than you can say lickidy-split. > > Ditto. I use Pop-Up Stopper. Works most excellently. > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival I agree, is there anything like that for Linux users???? Gary Hildebrand St. Joseph, MO From msspcva at yahoo.com Sat Jul 20 00:25:00 2002 From: msspcva at yahoo.com (Clayton Frank Helvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:13 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay In-Reply-To: <200207200244.g6K2iZi21496@shell1.aracnet.com> Message-ID: <20020720052415.46807.qmail@web14601.mail.yahoo.com> --- "Zane H. Healy" wrote: > > At 05:40 PM 7/19/02 -0400, Jerome Fine wrote: > > >>Joe wrote: > > > > > >> A whole LOT of stuff there! > > ...snip... > > In looking at that, anyone considering bidding on > this should make sure that > they're aware of the VOLUME of stuff listed here. > I'm wondering if there > aren't a couple of DESK sized systems in that pile. > > BTW, I really don't know anything about TRS-80 > systems, but I do have some > TRS-80 manuals that sound like the ones listed, and > the pictures show a BIG > computer. > > Zane > From micheladam at theedge.ca Sat Jul 20 01:10:01 2002 From: micheladam at theedge.ca (Michel Adam) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: OT: Pop-Up window killers was Re: Pop-up Ads was Re: *Home* page(was Re: HP-HIL update) References: <3D38EE7F.33F52066@ccp.com> Message-ID: <001401c110e2$2b3484c0$78697ed8@theedge.ca> The easiest solution I have found: Turn off scripting in the browser for the internet zone. ALL SCRIPTING. 99.99% of sites have no good reasons whatsoever of using java to begin with. I only put a few trusted sites in the 'safe' zone. The rest are in the 'internet' zone, and 'no java' for these. The side benefit is that you don't have to install any other source of bugs on your box. Works like a charm. Michel Adam ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Hildebrand" To: Sent: Friday, 19 July, 2002 23:00 Subject: Re: OT: Pop-Up window killers was Re: Pop-up Ads was Re: *Home* page(was Re: HP-HIL update) > Sellam Ismail wrote: > > > > On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: > > > > > I HATE pop-up ads. I've installed GuideScope on my computer and it > > > eliminates the pop-up ads and lets me selectively accept or refuse > > > cookies. I recommend it highly. Give it a try, Google will find it > > > faster than you can say lickidy-split. > > > > Ditto. I use Pop-Up Stopper. Works most excellently. > > > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > > > I agree, is there anything like that for Linux users???? > > Gary Hildebrand > St. Joseph, MO From tothwolf at concentric.net Sat Jul 20 02:16:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, Tothwolf wrote: > I double checked all the board numbers, and everything but the ST-506 > interface does indeed match the build/maintenance sticker. The tag from > that board states "Removed from IRIS Suspect U/S - no diagram". The > 'U/S' might actually be 'U/5', but it is somewhat hard to read. The > board is a standard Multibus board. It was made by Data Systems Design > (Qualogy) and has a part number of 805215-08. Does anyone have a > databook or even prints for this board? I'm going to assume for now that > there is indeed something wrong with it, since it appears someone > "borrowed" the original ST-506 interface from this 1400 for another > system. This particular board might have come from a later IRIS system, > but it appears the 2000s and later used a 5217 instead of a 5215. Maybe replying to my own emails is a little "different", but oh well :) Tonight, armed with the user's manual for the DCD 5215, I managed to run various diagnostics in order to help troubleshoot the board. Test 1F (8085 Environment Self-Test) seemed to pass, and test 1A (CR1, CR2 Blinking Wakeup Address) seemed to pass as well. When I ran test 1B (R/WC Self-Test), I got an error 45 (Read/Write Controller Error). Further investigation seemed to indicate the hard drive itself wasn't spinning, so I removed the top panels and powered up the drive. It seems to spin up ok for about a minute, then shuts down completely. At this point, it certainly looks like I'm looking at a malfunctioning drive instead of the DCD 5215. Due to the fan noise, I never even heard the drive spin down until I pulled the top panels back off, sigh... This system uses a Vertex V170 (60MB?) ST-506 drive. Is anyone familiar with them? I'm guessing I may just end up having to replace the drive with something else. Does anyone have any brands/models they'd suggest trying in this system? -Toth From stanb at dial.pipex.com Sat Jul 20 03:47:00 2002 From: stanb at dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: OT: Pop-Up window killers was Re: Pop-up Ads was Re: *Home* page(was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sat, 20 Jul 2002 00:00:47 CDT." <3D38EE7F.33F52066@ccp.com> Message-ID: <200207200752.IAA28193@citadel.metropolis.local> Hi, Gary Hildebrand said: > Sellam Ismail wrote: > > > > On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: > > > > > I HATE pop-up ads. I've installed GuideScope on my computer and it > > > eliminates the pop-up ads and lets me selectively accept or refuse > > > cookies. I recommend it highly. Give it a try, Google will find it > > > faster than you can say lickidy-split. > > > > Ditto. I use Pop-Up Stopper. Works most excellently. > > > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > > > I agree, is there anything like that for Linux users???? Yep...Junkbuster, or wwwoffle - which is what I use as it also works as a cache. -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com The future was never like this! From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sat Jul 20 06:42:05 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020720073935.3bdf3a1c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 02:22 AM 7/20/02 -0500, you wrote: > >This system uses a Vertex V170 (60MB?) ST-506 drive. Is anyone familiar >with them? I'm guessing I may just end up having to replace the drive with >something else. Does anyone have any brands/models they'd suggest trying >in this system? I once attempted to repair one of HP's HP-IB hard drives used a Vertex drive internally. I THINK it was a V160 but I'm not sure now. I never did find a replacement that would work. IIRC I tried other brand drives but I couldn't LL format the new drive with the normal user stuff from HP so I don't know if the replacement drives were incompatible or ?? or if the replacements failed due to my inability to LL format them. I suspect you'll run into a similar problem. In addition, you'll lose all your SW if you replace the drive. If I were you I'd do my best to get that drive working again. The fact that it spins up initailly is a promising sign. I did look through my HP disk drive notes but I couldn't find anything that told what model HP used the Vertex drive. If you find a useable replacement or manage to resurrect that drive I'd be interested in hearing what you learn. Joe From zmerch at 30below.com Sat Jul 20 08:30:01 2002 From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: OT: Pop-Up window killers was Re: Pop-up Ads was Re: *Home* page(was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: <200207200752.IAA28193@citadel.metropolis.local> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020720092153.0296a780@mail.30below.com> Rumor has it that Stan Barr may have mentioned these words: >Gary Hildebrand said: > > Sellam Ismail wrote: [snip] > > > Ditto. I use Pop-Up Stopper. Works most excellently. For Winders, around here we've had good luck with "Proxomitron" - beware of spelling; I don't use it myself... > > I agree, is there anything like that for Linux users???? > >Yep...Junkbuster, or wwwoffle - which is what I use as it also works as >a cache. Or for Winders & Linux users: Mozilla version 1.0; it doesn't have all the cruft of Nutscrape, is faster than that & Internet Exploder, and you can selectively turn off javascript functions: Allow webpages to: open unrequested windows open a link in a new window move or resize existing windows raise or lower windows change status bar text change images create or change cookies read cookies seperately, you can: enable cookies for the originating website only disable cookies in Mail & Newsgroups and one of my favorite features: tell images to loop only once, no matter what. And it's under 11 Megs... www.mozilla.org HTH, Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- Roger "Merch" Merchberger --- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers Recycling is good, right??? Ok, so I'll recycle an old .sig. If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead disarmament should *not* be your first career choice. From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Sat Jul 20 11:24:01 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: OT: Pop-Up window killers was Re: Pop-up Ads was Re: *Home* page(was Re: HP-HIL update) References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020720092153.0296a780@mail.30below.com> Message-ID: <3D398DAD.8060105@jetnet.ab.ca> Roger Merchberger wrote: > Or for Winders & Linux users: Mozilla version 1.0; it doesn't have all > the cruft of Nutscrape, is faster than that & Internet Exploder, and you > can selectively turn off javascript functions: The only downside with it is there is no spelling checker. -- Ben Franchuk - Dawn * 12/24 bit cpu * www.jetnet.ab.ca/users/bfranchuk/index.html From zmerch at 30below.com Sat Jul 20 12:32:00 2002 From: zmerch at 30below.com (Roger Merchberger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: OT: Pop-Up window killers was Re: Pop-up Ads was Re: *Home* page(was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: <3D398DAD.8060105@jetnet.ab.ca> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020720092153.0296a780@mail.30below.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020720132658.02335d60@mail.30below.com> Rumor has it that Ben Franchuk may have mentioned these words: >Roger Merchberger wrote: > >>Or for Winders & Linux users: Mozilla version 1.0; it doesn't have all >>the cruft of Nutscrape, is faster than that & Internet Exploder, and you >>can selectively turn off javascript functions: > >The only downside with it is there is no spelling checker. That's only a downside for those who cannot spell... :-) Laterz, Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- Roger "Merch" Merchberger --- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers Recycling is good, right??? Ok, so I'll recycle an old .sig. If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead disarmament should *not* be your first career choice. From foo at siconic.com Sat Jul 20 12:52:05 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay In-Reply-To: <3D38E3E7.FB18CD6E@rain.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Marvin Johnston wrote: > Okay, this could get interesting :). Since we are talking about TRS-80 > stuff ... how about an almost complete set of CLOAD cassettes :)? I > rather suspect we could both go on for a while with stuff one of us has, > but not the other!!! You're right. We'd better call a truce before we make each other extremely envious ;) Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From foo at siconic.com Sat Jul 20 12:56:04 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: OT: Pop-Up window killers was Re: Pop-up Ads was Re: *Home* page(was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: <3D398DAD.8060105@jetnet.ab.ca> Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Ben Franchuk wrote: > > Or for Winders & Linux users: Mozilla version 1.0; it doesn't have all > > the cruft of Nutscrape, is faster than that & Internet Exploder, and you > > can selectively turn off javascript functions: > > The only downside with it is there is no spelling checker. Lern to spell ;) Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From Mzthompson at aol.com Sat Jul 20 13:42:00 2002 From: Mzthompson at aol.com (Mzthompson@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: Latest Haul^H^H^H^H Delivery Message-ID: John Boffemmyer IV wrote: > Damn you Mike. You always get the fun toys. Now, now, John, be nice. Actually I get my share of duds. I was testing a hard disk last night and the software finally gave up saying 'You gotta be kidding'. Sounded like the drive would spin down, then spin back up, 'chew' on the platters a while, then spin down again. The secret, John, is knowing what you will drool over. ;^) Mike From Mzthompson at aol.com Sat Jul 20 13:43:01 2002 From: Mzthompson at aol.com (Mzthompson@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: Indianapolis Hamfest Haul Message-ID: John Boffemmyer IV wrote: > As I imitate James Hetfield of Metallica... ATi Good. ATi GOOD! (instead of > beer). Or maybe Bobby 'Boris' Picket saying.... Mash Good Or the Toyes parody of Bobby's song saying.... Hash Good > Can't say anything good about the Compaq, I hear that! > I've repaired too many and worked with too many to go delving into my > personal opinion... Probably not too far from mine. Since I already had a Portable III, hard to turn down another one. The 5 1/4 went out on my first one and I replaced it with 3 1/2, so at least this one is still 'original' equipment. As far as later Compaq gear, give it to someone else, or gut it out for useful items. Mike From Mzthompson at aol.com Sat Jul 20 13:43:13 2002 From: Mzthompson at aol.com (Mzthompson@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: New (but selling used) computer shop, and hauls Message-ID: <6e.1fc6342d.2a6b0907@aol.com> Robert F Schaefer wrote: > Sounds like a good place to visit once a week. Maybe you could kill two > birds with one stone-- trade him those old peaseas for store credit! Yeah, he is looking for some items in particular. > BTW, where is this place located? Terre Haute, Indiana Mike From john_boffemmyer_iv at boff-net.dhs.org Sat Jul 20 14:18:01 2002 From: john_boffemmyer_iv at boff-net.dhs.org (John Boffemmyer IV) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: New (but selling used) computer shop, and hauls In-Reply-To: <6e.1fc6342d.2a6b0907@aol.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020720150711.00a440d0@n.ml.org> Mike, got any P133 or higher ATX machines (standard clones) laying around? I finally give up on this goddamned Compaq ProLiant 1500 (P-100, 96MB ram, 2.1GB scsi, 1GB scsi, scsi 8x cd-rom, all eisa and pci, Compaq proprietary crap as usual). Slackware versions 7.1-8.1 and even the latest with the 2.4.18 kernel don't work happy on it. boot refusals, lilo getting stuck at li randomly, intermittently working with hardware that is known good, failing proper network configurations and connections and blowing up the routing. I'd just dumped about 43+ hours into this thing and it still isn't happy. Time to scrap it and dumpster the rest. Any luck on finding a nice standard machine? Looking to do smtp, apache web serving, routing between token ring and ethernet and file management. I know, i'm probly reaching, but it's worth a try. -John At 02:42 PM 7/20/02, you wrote: >Robert F Schaefer wrote: > > > Sounds like a good place to visit once a week. Maybe you could kill two > > birds with one stone-- trade him those old peaseas for store credit! > >Yeah, he is looking for some items in particular. > > > BTW, where is this place located? > >Terre Haute, Indiana > >Mike ---------------------------------------- Founder, Lead Writer, Tech Analyst and Web Designer Boff-Net Technologies http://boff-net.dhs.org/index.html --------------------------------------- From cube1 at charter.net Sat Jul 20 14:32:01 2002 From: cube1 at charter.net (Jay Jaeger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: NPR and the RX11 (was Re: help needed: problem with UNIBUS ac cess on my PDP-11/70) In-Reply-To: <30DBA2DACC0CD611B3E60008C7092D8F2F8EBF@hqvenloexch.oce.nl> Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20020720142659.040f6ef0@cirithi> >Indeed, the pins CA1 and CB1 are *not* wired on the board ... >back to the 11/70 thread with this result. Perhaps to state the obvious: this means, of course, that unless you wired these two pins together on the slot the RX11 is in, the RX11 would *break* the NPR chain! Jay Jaeger --- Jay R. Jaeger The Computer Collection cube1@charter.net From felten at vaxnet.de Sat Jul 20 14:44:00 2002 From: felten at vaxnet.de (VAXnet) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: PDP 11/44 startup: ?CP didn't start Message-ID: <83KF297ZTIEON1UONF083C9YS52U76.3d394159@hugl> Hi, I just repaired the powersupply of my pdp 11/44 and cleaned the box. When powering up, the console terminal only shows: (Console V3.40C) (Program) (Console) ?CP didn't start >>> I guess this is bad news.... Does it mean Central Processor didn't start? (just guessing, but the RUN- light stays dark, DC-LED is on and the key works) Since i don't have a manual for the 11/44 i really don't know where to start. I searched the web for a scanned KD-11-Z manual, but found nothing. The actual configuraton is minimal, I insterted the processor, cache, ram, CIM and bus terminator like this: A - B - C - D - E - F M7090 X X X X CIM / CIS (option) X X X X X X CIS (option) --------M7093-------- FP11-F FPU --------M7094-------- KD11-Z data path --------M7095-------- KD11-Z control module --------M7096-------- KD11-Z multifuncion module --------M7097-------- KK11-B cache --------M7098-------- KD11-Z UNIBUS interface --------M8743-------- MS11-PB 1 Meg Ram X X X X X X MEM (option) X X X X X X MEM (option) X X X X X X MEM (option) X X X G X X UNIBUS M9302 X G X X UNIBUS G=Grant card. I do have the "processor handbook pdp11/04/24/34a/44/70" (printed in 1981, EB-19402-20) and tried some of the console commands. HELP works fine and gives a lot of HELP-text, but doesn't help much: all other commands tell me ?CP didn't start. I tried using the processor without FPU and disabled cache, but nothing changes. All DIP switches and 'Jumpers' (soldered) are still in default position. What can i do now ? Any idea is very welcome.... Regards, Lothar PS: Would it be usefull to anybody to scan the (entire?) processor handbook? I don't know how usefull this book can be to someone else... From lists at subatomix.com Sat Jul 20 14:44:32 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: List Change Updates Message-ID: <135164332657.20020720142943@subatomix.com> The first pages of the new ClassicCmp web site are up. It isn't much, but at least the correct instructions/forms for subscribing are there. Expect more in time. The site will be kept simple and (mostly) text-only, just like its predecessor. Comments/criticism are welcome. A few issues have popped up for people who are subscribed to both cctalk and cctech. To solve these, the following changes will be made shortly. These changes will _only_ affect people who are subscribed to _both_ cctalk and cctech. - People who haven't disabled mail delivery for either list will be unsubscribed from cctech. This stops duplicate mail. - People who have disabled mail delivery for cctech only will be unsubscribed from cctech. This stops off-topic messages sent to cctalk from forwarding to cctech without moderation. - People who have disabled mail delivery for cctalk only will be unsubscribed from cctalk. Other methods are in place to make their cctech posts forward to cctalk. - People who have disbled mail delivery for both cctalk and cctech will be unsubscribed from cctech. This prevents any issues if/when they decide to get ClassicCmp mail again. With the recent list changes, subscription to both cctalk and cctech is unnecessary and can create problems. -- Jeffrey Sharp The email address lists@subatomix.com is for mailing list traffic. Please send off-list mail to roach jay ess ess at wasp subatomix beetle dot com. You may need to remove some bugs first. From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Sat Jul 20 15:01:01 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: new retro computing Message-ID: <3D39C070.4080000@jetnet.ab.ca> Still plugging away of a TTL style cpu in a FPGA I have found some terminals localy. How ever I am still looking for a serial RS232 mass storage device in Canada that is not tacky looking like a old Pee-Cee. For now I am using a old 486 with a serial program to download bootstrap programs but looking around since summer is a good time to collect stuff. Baud rate of 300 or better would be nice. -- Ben Franchuk - Dawn * 12/24 bit cpu * www.jetnet.ab.ca/users/bfranchuk/index.html From donm at cts.com Sat Jul 20 16:09:01 2002 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Tothwolf wrote: > On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, Tothwolf wrote: > > > I double checked all the board numbers, and everything but the ST-506 > > interface does indeed match the build/maintenance sticker. The tag from > > that board states "Removed from IRIS Suspect U/S - no diagram". The > > 'U/S' might actually be 'U/5', but it is somewhat hard to read. The > > board is a standard Multibus board. It was made by Data Systems Design > > (Qualogy) and has a part number of 805215-08. Does anyone have a > > databook or even prints for this board? I'm going to assume for now that > > there is indeed something wrong with it, since it appears someone > > "borrowed" the original ST-506 interface from this 1400 for another > > system. This particular board might have come from a later IRIS system, > > but it appears the 2000s and later used a 5217 instead of a 5215. > > Maybe replying to my own emails is a little "different", but oh well :) > > Tonight, armed with the user's manual for the DCD 5215, I managed to run > various diagnostics in order to help troubleshoot the board. Test 1F (8085 > Environment Self-Test) seemed to pass, and test 1A (CR1, CR2 Blinking > Wakeup Address) seemed to pass as well. When I ran test 1B (R/WC > Self-Test), I got an error 45 (Read/Write Controller Error). Further > investigation seemed to indicate the hard drive itself wasn't spinning, so > I removed the top panels and powered up the drive. It seems to spin up ok > for about a minute, then shuts down completely. At this point, it > certainly looks like I'm looking at a malfunctioning drive instead of the > DCD 5215. Due to the fan noise, I never even heard the drive spin down > until I pulled the top panels back off, sigh... > > This system uses a Vertex V170 (60MB?) ST-506 drive. Is anyone familiar > with them? I'm guessing I may just end up having to replace the drive with > something else. Does anyone have any brands/models they'd suggest trying > in this system? > > -Toth Vertex was apparently taken over by Priam and the PC Ref shows the V170 as: cap 60 hds 7 cyl 987 spt 17 rwc 988 wpc 988 intfc ST412/506 If your drive spins up and then stops shortly, it is likely that it either does not come fully up to speed or it is unable to unlock (or unstick) the heads from the park position. (I'd bet on the heads.) Can you hear the usual clickety noises that a drive makes when it initializes? - don From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sat Jul 20 16:15:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 20, 2 02:22:10 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1971 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020720/92f1e3b7/attachment.ksh From tothwolf at concentric.net Sat Jul 20 16:51:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020720073935.3bdf3a1c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: > At 02:22 AM 7/20/02 -0500, you wrote: > > >This system uses a Vertex V170 (60MB?) ST-506 drive. Is anyone familiar > >with them? I'm guessing I may just end up having to replace the drive with > >something else. Does anyone have any brands/models they'd suggest trying > >in this system? > > I once attempted to repair one of HP's HP-IB hard drives used a Vertex > drive internally. I THINK it was a V160 but I'm not sure now. I never > did find a replacement that would work. IIRC I tried other brand drives > but I couldn't LL format the new drive with the normal user stuff from > HP so I don't know if the replacement drives were incompatible or ?? or > if the replacements failed due to my inability to LL format them. I > suspect you'll run into a similar problem. In addition, you'll lose all > your SW if you replace the drive. If I were you I'd do my best to get > that drive working again. The fact that it spins up initailly is a > promising sign. I did look through my HP disk drive notes but I couldn't > find anything that told what model HP used the Vertex drive. > > If you find a useable replacement or manage to resurrect that drive I'd > be interested in hearing what you learn. The DCD 5215 will support several different types of drives depending on how the configuration jumpers are set, so hopefully if I can't resurrect the V170, I can at least make some sort of 60MB+ ST-506 drive work in the system... -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Sat Jul 20 17:09:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > Firstly, there are 2 circuit boards on the bottom of the HDA. The one > you can see contains the R/W chain, index circuit and the > microcontroller (8051-thing). That microcontroller enables the spindle > motor, controls the head movement for seeks, and so on. > > The board under it (right next to the HDA) contains the servo circuitry. > There are at least 2 versions, one covered with little hybrid circuits, > the other using mode conventional (but SMD) components. I think that's > the later version, but I wouldn't bet on it. The boards on the V170 sound identical. The board with the servo circuitry does use those hybrid circuit things (they kinda remind me of SIP memory modules and time delays). > Can you find the servo preamp (if there is a 2-wire servo jumper between > the PCBs, then it goes to the input of this stage). If so, is there any > signal on the output when the drive is trying to spin up? What about > positioner drive (there's a larger 2-wire connector for this on the > servo board, going to a cable that goes into the HDA). Anything there? > Can you feel/hear the heads attempt to move when the drive is spinning > up? The 2-wire jumper is there... Unfortunately I don't have a functional 'scope. I have 3 60MHz scopes all sitting without probes (or docs, but I can manage). I didn't hear the head load noise I'm used to hearing from FH ESDI drives. Would it sound very similar? > You might have an electronic fault that can be cured. If you think the > drive is in any way similar to the V150, I can provide a little more > info. It sounds nearly identical, so maybe it isn't a lost cause after all :) I'm not sure if I mentioned this in an earlier email or not, but the foil seals that cover the screws on the top of the drive have been tampered with. Its possible someone may have opened up the HDA in a non-clean environment, or the drive might have been serviced at some point. The spindle motor is exposed on this drive with the boards removed, and I noticed it felt "sticky". Is that normal for these drives? Do they have some sort of brake? -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Sat Jul 20 17:12:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Don Maslin wrote: > > This system uses a Vertex V170 (60MB?) ST-506 drive. Is anyone familiar > > with them? I'm guessing I may just end up having to replace the drive with > > something else. Does anyone have any brands/models they'd suggest trying > > in this system? > > If your drive spins up and then stops shortly, it is likely that it > either does not come fully up to speed or it is unable to unlock (or > unstick) the heads from the park position. (I'd bet on the heads.) Can > you hear the usual clickety noises that a drive makes when it > initializes? I didn't hear the standard head load clicks I'm used to hearing, so it very well may be the heads. I'd have to try spinning it up again, but I think it shuts down right about the time it tries to load the heads. -Toth From glenslick at hotmail.com Sat Jul 20 17:20:00 2002 From: glenslick at hotmail.com (Glen Slick) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: What's the value of an rtVAX 4000-300 with no drives? Message-ID: At a surplus store today I saw a couple of rtVAX 4000-300 boxes. I don't know anything about these types of systems. Are they interesting to people on the list? What is their value without any disk drives? They were marked $75 each. They had KA670-BA cpus, which I guess is standard for that box according to some info I just found googling around. They both had TK70 drives and at least one had a TQK70 board installed, which I guess is the controller for the drive. I'm not sure how much memory they had. -Glen _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sat Jul 20 17:30:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: PDP 11/44 startup: ?CP didn't start In-Reply-To: <83KF297ZTIEON1UONF083C9YS52U76.3d394159@hugl> from "VAXnet" at Jul 20, 2 12:54:17 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2032 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020720/de68b97b/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sat Jul 20 17:30:22 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: new retro computing In-Reply-To: <3D39C070.4080000@jetnet.ab.ca> from "Ben Franchuk" at Jul 20, 2 01:56:32 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 812 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020720/770984f6/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sat Jul 20 17:30:39 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Don Maslin" at Jul 20, 2 02:08:28 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 397 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020720/e2a3c64b/attachment.ksh From spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu Sat Jul 20 17:40:00 2002 From: spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: new retro computing In-Reply-To: from Tony Duell at "Jul 20, 2 10:26:36 pm" Message-ID: <200207202246.PAA09134@stockholm.ptloma.edu> > Not RS232, but fairly easy to interface, would be a Commodore 1541 or > similar. It wouldn't take much extra logic to send it enough commands to > read back a file, I think. You might also look for one of the Model 100 series RS-232 floppy drives. I'm trying to teach an NEC 8201A how to talk to one of these. -- ----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser@stockholm.ptloma.edu -- He is rising from affluence to poverty. -- Mark Twain ---------------------- From mvg1 at earthlink.net Sat Jul 20 17:40:14 2002 From: mvg1 at earthlink.net (Mark Grieshaber) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: SGI support -- the easy way In-Reply-To: <64610.128.146.70.159.1027086463.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> References: <20020719132516.GA1567@earthlink.net> <64610.128.146.70.159.1027086463.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> Message-ID: <20020720223847.GB3490@earthlink.net> On Fri, Jul 19, 2002 at 09:47:43AM -0400, Robert F Schaefer wrote: > > are fewer of them). But here's the trick to getting great, interested > > personal support: get friendly with your local SGI Systems Engineer. > > S/He will be (generally) very interested in your call and problem, and > > won't (generally) even bother asking for serial numbers, etc. In my > > experience working at SGI, the SEs were a very dedicated, helpful and > > knowledgeable lot. And believe me, SEs have access to a *LOT* of > > information buried inside the company (including knowing who the > > old-timers are, etc). I miss that easy access to info... > > I'd love to play phone tag with one of them. My only problem is that I > don't have a local SGI Systems Engineer. I've never had a support contract > with SGI, and quite honestly, I doubt I'm *ever* going to have a service > contract on *any* of my computers (as the newest one I own is only a few > years away from being On Topic, and may be upwards of fifth-hand). > > Perhaps you remember the extension of a helpful soul who would like to see > the older machines saved from the evil scrappers? > > Bob I exited SGI over a year ago now (along with about 1000 other folks at the same time). A year ago I could easily have given you names and numbers of half a dozen SEs who would have been delighted to talk with you at length. At this point, I unfortunately no longer recall phone numbers (and many of those folks are gone, of course -- there have been at least two more purges since I departed). If you want to give me a few days to get an ok, I might be able to pass on a contact for the most experienced Field Service Engineer I know (also no longer with SGI!). He was my FSE when I was a customer, back when we had one of the first 4D/240s, and one of the first 4D/340s, etc. He knows it all. I'll contact him and ask if he has time for questions (like me, he's currently swamped with startup stuff). Mark mvg1@earthlink.net From jrkeys at concentric.net Sat Jul 20 18:15:01 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: New (but selling used) computer shop, and hauls References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020720150711.00a440d0@n.ml.org> Message-ID: <004301c23043$12fb33f0$2e000240@oemcomputer> Got to check the thrifts. I just picked up a HP 6350 P-333, 64 meg memory, 8gig HD, 24x cd-rom, 56k modem for $10 and it works great with win98 loaded on it. I missed another one at the flea market today that went for $8. I got the mouse for $1. Keep looking they are out there. ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Boffemmyer IV" To: Sent: Saturday, July 20, 2002 2:15 PM Subject: Re: New (but selling used) computer shop, and hauls > Mike, got any P133 or higher ATX machines (standard clones) laying around? > I finally give up on this goddamned Compaq ProLiant 1500 (P-100, 96MB ram, > 2.1GB scsi, 1GB scsi, scsi 8x cd-rom, all eisa and pci, Compaq proprietary > crap as usual). Slackware versions 7.1-8.1 and even the latest with the > 2.4.18 kernel don't work happy on it. boot refusals, lilo getting stuck at > li randomly, intermittently working with hardware that is known good, > failing proper network configurations and connections and blowing up the > routing. I'd just dumped about 43+ hours into this thing and it still isn't > happy. Time to scrap it and dumpster the rest. Any luck on finding a nice > standard machine? Looking to do smtp, apache web serving, routing between > token ring and ethernet and file management. I know, i'm probly reaching, > but it's worth a try. > -John > > At 02:42 PM 7/20/02, you wrote: > >Robert F Schaefer wrote: > > > > > Sounds like a good place to visit once a week. Maybe you could kill two > > > birds with one stone-- trade him those old peaseas for store credit! > > > >Yeah, he is looking for some items in particular. > > > > > BTW, where is this place located? > > > >Terre Haute, Indiana > > > >Mike > > ---------------------------------------- > Founder, Lead Writer, Tech Analyst > and Web Designer Boff-Net Technologies > http://boff-net.dhs.org/index.html > --------------------------------------- > > > From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sat Jul 20 18:16:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 20, 2 05:15:19 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2819 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020720/2f5c8f49/attachment.ksh From tothwolf at concentric.net Sat Jul 20 18:20:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > > If your drive spins up and then stops shortly, it is likely that it > > either does not come fully up to speed or it is unable to unlock (or > > unstick) the heads from the park position. (I'd bet on the heads.) > > Something I forgot to mention in my last posting. Early versions (?) of > the V150 have a head lock solenoid. Does the V170? If so, is it being > activated to release the heads? No idea, but I imagine if the earlier V150 drives did, the V170 likely does too. There is a small dip relay on the second board, which I'd imagine would be used for such a solenoid... -Toth From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sat Jul 20 18:30:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 20, 2 06:25:50 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 709 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020720/98a9d7ae/attachment.ksh From jrkeys at concentric.net Sat Jul 20 18:37:00 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: NES Special Cartridge Finds Message-ID: <00bb01c23046$1d8c4090$2e000240@oemcomputer> Well I now have two of the special Gyromite cartridges with the Famicom board and Famicom-to-NES converter inside. After reading about these and the 4 other cartridges that have these special boards I started looking for them at my normal stops. Of the 4 cartridges I purchased 2 had the boards inside. With these I can run Famicom games cartridges on the NES box. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020720/0fd5c361/attachment.html From foo at siconic.com Sat Jul 20 19:08:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: new retro computing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > > Still plugging away of a TTL style cpu in a FPGA I have found some terminals > > localy. How ever I am still looking for a serial RS232 mass storage device > > in Canada that is not tacky looking like a old Pee-Cee. For now I am using a > > There have been paper tape punches/readers, digital tape drives and even > disk drives with RS232 interfaces. But most of them didn't have any form > of block addressing -- they just saved data to replay it later. Would > that be any use? This reminds me (for no stringently particular reason) that I have an interesting Anderson-Jacobsen ASR terminal that has a disk drive instead of paper tape for storing the data stream. This is only slightly more interesting than the TI Silent 700 Model 733's I have that use digital cassette tapes. http://siconic.com/computers/ASR733-1.jpg I've actually played around with them quite a bit by way of a data recovery job I did. Very neat machines. They store data in something like 66 byte chunks. The tape drive actually advances in discrete steps that you can observe. It writes start and end marks for each block, and also has an ASCII search capability. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From foo at siconic.com Sat Jul 20 19:09:01 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: NES Special Cartridge Finds In-Reply-To: <00bb01c23046$1d8c4090$2e000240@oemcomputer> Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Keys wrote: > Well I now have two of the special Gyromite cartridges with the Famicom > board and Famicom-to-NES converter inside. After reading about these and > the 4 other cartridges that have these special boards I started looking > for them at my normal stops. Of the 4 cartridges I purchased 2 had the > boards inside. With these I can run Famicom games cartridges on the NES > box. Interesting. Can you point me to any web pages with info on these? I have a Famicom and a few carts for it. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From rschaefe at gcfn.org Sat Jul 20 19:09:14 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: SGI support -- the easy way References: <20020719132516.GA1567@earthlink.net> <64610.128.146.70.159.1027086463.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> <20020720223847.GB3490@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <001a01c2304a$7baf62c0$68469280@y5f3q8> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Grieshaber" To: Sent: Saturday, July 20, 2002 06:38 PM Subject: Re: SGI support -- the easy way > > Perhaps you remember the extension of a helpful soul who would like to see > > the older machines saved from the evil scrappers? > > > > Bob > > I exited SGI over a year ago now (along with about 1000 other folks at > the same time). A year ago I could easily have given you names and > numbers of half a dozen SEs who would have been delighted to talk with > you at length. At this point, I unfortunately no longer recall phone > numbers (and many of those folks are gone, of course -- there have been > at least two more purges since I departed). I hope you found greener pastures! > > If you want to give me a few days to get an ok, I might be able to pass > on a contact for the most experienced Field Service Engineer I know > (also no longer with SGI!). He was my FSE when I was a customer, back > when we had one of the first 4D/240s, and one of the first 4D/340s, > etc. He knows it all. I'll contact him and ask if he has time for > questions (like me, he's currently swamped with startup stuff). That'd be great! Tell him I'm very low-maintenance and properly awestruck by people who remember The Good Old Days. > > Mark Bob From rschaefe at gcfn.org Sat Jul 20 19:12:00 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: New (but selling used) computer shop, and hauls References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020720150711.00a440d0@n.ml.org> <004301c23043$12fb33f0$2e000240@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <001e01c2304b$371ca5e0$68469280@y5f3q8> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Keys" To: Sent: Saturday, July 20, 2002 07:13 PM Subject: Re: New (but selling used) computer shop, and hauls > Got to check the thrifts. I just picked up a HP 6350 P-333, 64 meg memory, > 8gig HD, 24x cd-rom, 56k modem for $10 and it works great with win98 loaded > on it. I missed another one at the flea market today that went for $8. I got > the mouse for $1. Keep looking they are out there. Not in Ohio. I just passed on a pair of 33 MHz '486s w/ 14" monitors, CDROMs, and who knows what else for $90 each. No thanks. I even passed on the AST 486 w/ SCSI-2 10bT and 100bTX for $20, I've got too many of 'em already. The rotten people who run most of the thrift stores around here seem to think these poor people are made of money. The sad thing is that the systems seem to sell... :( Bob From tothwolf at concentric.net Sat Jul 20 19:19:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sun, 21 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > > No idea, but I imagine if the earlier V150 drives did, the V170 likely > > THinking about it some more, I now seem to remember that the head lock > was only present on drives using the servo board _without_ the bybrids. > > > does too. There is a small dip relay on the second board, which I'd > > imagine would be used for such a solenoid... > > No, the relay is almost certainly the spindle motor brake. The head lock > solenoid was driven by a power transistor transistor. IIRC the head lock > iteslf was a cylindrical metal housing on the bottom of the HDA next to > the spindle motor. It fitted through a hole in the servo board and had a > 2 wire cable that plugged into the servo board alongside the hole. The V170 I have does not have that, so I guess it probably does not have a head lock solenoid. -Toth From lgwalker at mts.net Sat Jul 20 19:36:00 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:14 2005 Subject: OT: Pop-Up window killers was Re: Pop-up Ads was Re: *Home* page(was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020720132658.02335d60@mail.30below.com> References: <3D398DAD.8060105@jetnet.ab.ca> Message-ID: <3D39BB89.16580.14E5CC72@localhost> I'll second that emotion. In all the years I've used a computer I've never used a spell-checker. I figure if I don't know the spelling, I should look it up in a dictionary for next time. And after some 60 years of reading, if something is mispelled it doesn't look right on the page. Punctuation now, is another issue. Lawrence > Rumor has it that Ben Franchuk may have mentioned these words: > >Roger Merchberger wrote: > > > >>Or for Winders & Linux users: Mozilla version 1.0; it doesn't have all > >>the cruft of Nutscrape, is faster than that & Internet Exploder, and you can > >>selectively turn off javascript functions: > > > >The only downside with it is there is no spelling checker. > > That's only a downside for those who cannot spell... :-) > > Laterz, > Roger "Merch" Merchberger > > -- > Roger "Merch" Merchberger --- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers > Recycling is good, right??? Ok, so I'll recycle an old .sig. > > If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead > disarmament should *not* be your first career choice. > lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From lgwalker at mts.net Sat Jul 20 19:36:23 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay In-Reply-To: <20020720052415.46807.qmail@web14601.mail.yahoo.com> References: <200207200244.g6K2iZi21496@shell1.aracnet.com> Message-ID: <3D39BB89.2.14E5CCD1@localhost> > > --- "Zane H. Healy" wrote: > > > At 05:40 PM 7/19/02 -0400, Jerome Fine wrote: > > > >>Joe wrote: > > > > > > > >> A whole LOT of stuff there! > > > > > ...snip... > > > > In looking at that, anyone considering bidding on > > this should make sure that > > they're aware of the VOLUME of stuff listed here. > > I'm wondering if there > > aren't a couple of DESK sized systems in that pile. > From what I recall, the Model 12 and 16 systems were > about the size of a modern 19 or 21 inch CRT, and that > was the entire system - monitor, keybd, CPU and > floppies all built together more or less. Hard drives > would hang off the back IO bus adapter or possibly > could be mounted internally. > How do you "hang" PC XT sized HDs off the back ? Lawrence > The old Model 1 dual diskette system may have had more > 'sprawl' factor. It's been 20+ years since I last used > one of those. My Model 4 is a small sized box tho. > > But you're right - this is a lot of stuff! > > -- Frank > > > ===== > = M O N T V A L E S O F T W A R E S E R V I C E S P. C.= > Clayton Frank Helvey, President > Montvale Software Services, P. C. > P.O. Box 840 > Blue Ridge, VA 24064-0840 > Phone: 540.947.5364 Email: msspcva@yahoo.com > ============================================================ > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better > http://health.yahoo.com lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From lgwalker at mts.net Sat Jul 20 19:36:40 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: new retro computing In-Reply-To: <3D39C070.4080000@jetnet.ab.ca> Message-ID: <3D39BB89.10031.14E5CC47@localhost> There's a surplus dealer in the Calgary "oilpatch" called GEOS that seems to have an amazing amount of stock that they sell mainly on E-Pay. Their Can. shipping is also very reasonable. Lawrence > Still plugging away of a TTL style cpu in a FPGA I have found some terminals > localy. How ever I am still looking for a serial RS232 mass storage device in > Canada that is not tacky looking like a old Pee-Cee. For now I am using a old > 486 with a serial program to download bootstrap programs but looking around > since summer is a good time to collect stuff. Baud rate of 300 or better would > be nice. -- Ben Franchuk - Dawn * 12/24 bit cpu * > www.jetnet.ab.ca/users/bfranchuk/index.html > lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From lgwalker at mts.net Sat Jul 20 19:36:58 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay In-Reply-To: References: <3D389343.A1944839@rain.org> Message-ID: <3D39BB89.2136.14E5CCA4@localhost> A model 2 w/external HD and 3 TRS HDs, And most all the MICRO 80 mags ? And a 6 tape audio demo of Scripsit ? Without looking. So there !! Mind you I haven't got a warehouse like Sellam and John Keys so I have to be selective. More or less. :^)) Lawrence > On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Marvin Johnston wrote: > > > BUT, there is a reserve price, and that amount isn't mentioned in the > > description! I have most of what he is offering ... but it would be nice > > to have the Model 12 and 16!!! > > I've got either one or both of those (and all the rest). > > N'yah ;) > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From lgwalker at mts.net Sat Jul 20 19:37:11 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: *Home* page (was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20020719132229.0270fe90@127.0.0.1> References: <65251.128.146.70.111.1027101883.squirrel@www.gcfn.org> Message-ID: <3D39BB89.6044.14E5CC0E@localhost> I have Opera installed but still use IE with Google as my home page. It is a neat browser but I have occasionally had problems accessing some sites. I used blank for a long time but found I was using Google most of the time on first access anyway. I always used to use Netscape for years but was forced to turn to the MS behemoth when Netscape went beyond v. 3 and became unreliable. Lawrence > I use Opera - it's got this neat feature of having the Google search built into > the browser. It appears next to the URL entry box, so you enter your search > terms and hit enter. > > Neat. There are add-ons for other browsers available from Google that add > this functionality. > > > - Matt > > > >I've found it's faster to type the query into the URL and search from there > >than to load google and then fill in the blank. Probably the single biggest > >reason I like google-- the URL for a search is pretty easy to decode. > > > >Between a blank home page and searching from the address line, it really > >cuts down on the delay. That's important when the shared (!) company modem > >(!!) won't connect over 26k8 due to the lovely condition of the phonelines out > >here in the boonies. > > > > > > > > -ethan > > > >Bob > > > >BTW, when would be a good time to stop by and look at that printer? > > > > Matthew Sell > Programmer > On Time Support, Inc. > www.ontimesupport.com > (281) 296-6066 > > Join the Metrology Software discussion group METLIST! > http://www.ontimesupport.com/subscribe_t&c.html. > > > "One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad > "Ein Volk, Ein Reich, Ein Fuhrer" - Adolf Hitler > > Many thanks for this tagline to a fellow RGVAC'er... > lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From doc at mdrconsult.com Sat Jul 20 19:41:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: OT: Pop-Up window killers was Re: Pop-up Ads was Re: *Home* page(was Re: HP-HIL update) In-Reply-To: <3D39BB89.16580.14E5CC72@localhost> Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Lawrence Walker wrote: > I'll second that emotion. In all the years I've used a computer I've never used > a spell-checker. I figure if I don't know the spelling, I should look it up in a > dictionary for next time. And after some 60 years of reading, if something is > mispelled it doesn't look right on the page. Punctuation now, is another issue. Well, it's nice to have one. The older I get, the more trouble I have with the -ise vs -ize thing. Doc From jrkeys at concentric.net Sat Jul 20 19:51:01 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: NES Special Cartridge Finds References: Message-ID: <013001c23050$7b150fd0$2e000240@oemcomputer> Sure http://www.atarihq.com/tsr/odd/scans/adapter.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sellam Ismail" To: Sent: Saturday, July 20, 2002 11:08 AM Subject: Re: NES Special Cartridge Finds > On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Keys wrote: > > > Well I now have two of the special Gyromite cartridges with the Famicom > > board and Famicom-to-NES converter inside. After reading about these and > > the 4 other cartridges that have these special boards I started looking > > for them at my normal stops. Of the 4 cartridges I purchased 2 had the > > boards inside. With these I can run Famicom games cartridges on the NES > > box. > > Interesting. Can you point me to any web pages with info on these? I > have a Famicom and a few carts for it. > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > > From tothwolf at concentric.net Sat Jul 20 20:59:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > Argh!. Unfortunately the drive I worked on was the type without the > hybrids. While I think the circuitry is _very_ similar, there will be > differences in the component designations. So I can't tell you exactly > which testpoint to look at :-( Ouch. Well, I imagine one way or another I'll get something working... > Do you have an analogue voltmeter? If so, connect it between the pins of > the larger 2 pin connector at the front edge of the servo board (black > and white wires?). That's the drive to the positioner coil. If you get a > voltage there it's attempting to move the heads. Of course! Who doesn't? :) I got 0.4VDC across the connector. It jumps to 0.4 after it spins up for about 8 seconds. The drive spins down after about 20 seconds total. I hear a "click" at the 8 second point right when the heads are trying to load, but it doesn't sound like they load. At the 20 second point, I hear a loud "clunk" and the drive spins down. > It's quieter than one of the old stepper-motor-positioner drives, but > you should be able to hear something. How fast do these drives spin? It sounds like it is spinning quite fast for such an old drive... > Argh!. We have no idea what condition the heads or platters are in, > then. Do you know if it's ever worked since being dismantled? Is it > worth taking the cover off again (in as clean an environment as you can) > to have a look? I have no idea who took it apart, but it would have been done while the system was still in England. I don't know if it worked or not after that, but considering there was a tag on the DSD 5215 that stated something was wrong with it, I'd guess the drive wasn't working. Best I can tell (without another drive to test with) the 5215 is actually working just fine. It appears the original system owner must have owned more than one 1000 series IRIS, and just swapped the hard drive and controller when it quit working. I'm somewhat tempted to take the cover off the HDA, but the cleanest place I have to take a peek is the shower after I let the room steam and then dissipate. Granted, that may be cleaner then the last place the HDA was taken apart. I really should build a clean-box... > There's an electronic brake on the servo board (that's what the relay K1 > is for), but with the motor disconnected from the servo board (the > multi-pin connector at the back edge), the motor should feel fairly > free. It will tend to settle in one of a few positions though, as the > magnetised rotor goes past the cores of the coils. Would the small connector with the two white wires that is near the servo connector be the spindle brake? I took some some fuzzy photos of the HDA and boards with the digital camera. If you think they might help identify anything, you can find them here: http://www.techmonkeys.org/~tothwolf/v170/ -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Sat Jul 20 21:23:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > Argh!. We have no idea what condition the heads or platters are in, > then. Do you know if it's ever worked since being dismantled? Is it > worth taking the cover off again (in as clean an environment as you can) > to have a look? I also just noticed someone cut off the spindle ground strap. I wonder if it built up a static charge and damaged part of the head amplifier electronics? -Toth From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Sat Jul 20 22:05:01 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: new retro computing References: Message-ID: <3D3A23CD.40203@jetnet.ab.ca> Tony Duell wrote: > There have been paper tape punches/readers, digital tape drives and even > disk drives with RS232 interfaces. But most of them didn't have any form > of block addressing -- they just saved data to replay it later. Would > that be any use? This is for bootstrap/diagnostic style programing similar to a pdp-8 with 4kw of memory and a TTY. The current CPU design on reset will load a RIM style program from a bootstrap device that is currently the serial port. In time I get a PCB board made and burn a erial prom for the FPGA and add a real floppy disk or IDE interface i/o board. -- Ben Franchuk - Dawn * 12/24 bit cpu * www.jetnet.ab.ca/users/bfranchuk/index.html From msspcva at yahoo.com Sat Jul 20 22:07:00 2002 From: msspcva at yahoo.com (Clayton Frank Helvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay In-Reply-To: <3D39BB89.2.14E5CCD1@localhost> Message-ID: <20020721030611.55429.qmail@web14607.mail.yahoo.com> --- Lawrence Walker wrote: > > > > ...snippage... > > Clayton Frank Helvey wrote: > > From what I recall, the Model 12 and 16 systems > > were about the size of a modern 19 or 21 inch CRT, > > and that was the entire system - monitor, keybd, > > CPU and floppies all built together more or less. > > > Hard drives > > would hang off the back IO bus adapter or possibly > > could be mounted internally. > > > How do you "hang" PC XT sized HDs off the back ? > > Lawrence > Sorry - the Model 4 uses an external HD controller which attaches to the IO bus output of the main system unit with a 50 pin (or so) ribbon cable. I think the Model 12 and 16 systems either used that same type of interface, or the HD and controller could be put inside the case. Since the drives are located outside the box via the ribbon cable I describe it as 'hanging' off the back. The Model 4 system I have will work with any ST506 interface disk, so the drives don't have to be full-height 5.25 inch ones. But, there's only so much storage the Model 4's LSDOS can handle - I think my 20MB St225 ended up being 4 2.25 MB partitions, for instance. Since the original disks RS sold for these were maybe 5MB, it wasn't a big deal. The Xenix O/S on the Model 12 and/or 16 could probably use a larger drive, but I don't know. -- Frank ===== = M O N T V A L E S O F T W A R E S E R V I C E S P. C.= Clayton Frank Helvey, President Montvale Software Services, P. C. P.O. Box 840 Blue Ridge, VA 24064-0840 Phone: 540.947.5364 Email: msspcva@yahoo.com ============================================================ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From foo at siconic.com Sat Jul 20 22:29:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay In-Reply-To: <3D39BB89.2136.14E5CCA4@localhost> Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Lawrence Walker wrote: > A model 2 w/external HD and 3 TRS HDs, And most all the MICRO 80 > mags ? And a 6 tape audio demo of Scripsit ? > Without looking. > So there !! Uh, just about, yeah :) > Mind you I haven't got a warehouse like Sellam and John Keys so I have to > be selective. More or less. :^)) Even when I didn't have a warehouse, "selective" was not in my vocabulary. And at least a few people can vouch for that. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From donm at cts.com Sat Jul 20 22:50:01 2002 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > > If your drive spins up and then stops shortly, it is likely that it > > either does not come fully up to speed or it is unable to unlock (or > > unstick) the heads from the park position. (I'd bet on the heads.) > > Something I forgot to mention in my last posting. Early versions (?) of > the V150 have a head lock solenoid. Does the V170? If so, is it being > activated to release the heads? > > -tony The summary specs for the V170 and V150 differ only in 7 vs 5 heads and 60 vs 43 MB capacity, so all else being the same would be a good bet. - don From lincoln.fessenden at verizon.net Sat Jul 20 23:58:00 2002 From: lincoln.fessenden at verizon.net (linc fessenden) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: New (but selling used) computer shop, and hauls In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020720150711.00a440d0@n.ml.org> Message-ID: On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, John Boffemmyer IV wrote: > Mike, got any P133 or higher ATX machines (standard clones) laying around? > I finally give up on this goddamned Compaq ProLiant 1500 (P-100, 96MB ram, > 2.1GB scsi, 1GB scsi, scsi 8x cd-rom, all eisa and pci, Compaq proprietary > crap as usual). Slackware versions 7.1-8.1 and even the latest with the > 2.4.18 kernel don't work happy on it. boot refusals, lilo getting stuck at > li randomly, intermittently working with hardware that is known good, > failing proper network configurations and connections and blowing up the > routing. I'd just dumped about 43+ hours into this thing and it still isn't > happy. Time to scrap it and dumpster the rest. Any luck on finding a nice > standard machine? Looking to do smtp, apache web serving, routing between > token ring and ethernet and file management. I know, i'm probly reaching, > but it's worth a try. > -John Slap a copy of SCO on there. Should work fine. -- -Linc Fessenden In the Beginning there was nothing, which exploded - Yeah right... From jhellige at earthlink.net Sun Jul 21 00:22:00 2002 From: jhellige at earthlink.net (Jeff Hellige) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Atari 1090 XL expansion chasis on eBay In-Reply-To: <000001c2275b$7cf2f680$023ca8c0@blafleur> References: <000001c2275b$7cf2f680$023ca8c0@blafleur> Message-ID: <02Jul21.012507edt.119129@gateway.mediacen.navy.mil> For those of you into the Atari 8bit line, an Atari 1090XL expansion chasis has popped up for sale on eBay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2037963703 Just passing it on... Jeff -- Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File http://www.cchaven.com http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757 From fmc at reanimators.org Sun Jul 21 00:29:01 2002 From: fmc at reanimators.org (Frank McConnell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Joe's message of "Sat, 20 Jul 2002 07:39:35" References: <3.0.6.16.20020720073935.3bdf3a1c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <200207210457.g6L4vmRm051949@daemonweed.reanimators.org> Joe wrote: > I once attempted to repair one of HP's HP-IB hard drives used a > Vertex drive internally. I THINK it was a V160 but I'm not sure now. > I never did find a replacement that would work. IIRC I tried other > brand drives but I couldn't LL format the new drive with the normal > user stuff from HP so I don't know if the replacement drives were > incompatible or ?? or if the replacements failed due to my inability > to LL format them. Part of the problem is that the HP controller in the drive expects to see a high-level format on the drive. Back around HP-UX 7.0 I found some arguments to mediainit (-GD I think; the finding was done by running "strings" on the mediainit executable and looking for a getopt(3)-style option parsing string) that got it to tell the drive to do a low-level format and write a new high-level format as well. Made the disk portion of a 7946 usable again after going "bad" and being formatted in a PC for testing. -Frank McConnell From eric at brouhaha.com Sun Jul 21 01:47:01 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: new retro computing In-Reply-To: <3D3A23CD.40203@jetnet.ab.ca> References: <3D3A23CD.40203@jetnet.ab.ca> Message-ID: <34563.64.169.63.74.1027233972.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Ben Franchuk wrote: > This is for bootstrap/diagnostic style programing similar to a pdp-8 > with 4kw of memory and a TTY. The current CPU design on reset will > load a RIM style program from a bootstrap device that is currently the > serial port. In time I get a PCB board made and burn a erial prom for > the FPGA and add a real floppy disk or IDE interface i/o board. Just store your RIM loader in the serial PROM after the FPGA configuration. After the FPGA is configured, it can read the serial PROM into memory. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sun Jul 21 07:04:01 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: FSOT: AT&T 6300 DOS, GW-BASIC disks and manuals Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020721080344.0e476e78@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I picked up a load of old software the other day and found a copy of MS-DOS for the AT&T 6300. It's in the original boxed set and includes both original disks with MS-DOS 2.11 & GW-BASIC and the manual. Everything is in perfect condition with no marks, tears, wear, etc. If anyone wants it I'd like to swap it for something that I can use. If interested contact me directly. Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sun Jul 21 07:09:36 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: FSOT: Lotus 123 v 1A for the Wang Proessional PC Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020721080416.0e47b952@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I picked up a load of old software the other day and found a copy of Lotus 123 v 1A for the Wang Proessional PC. It's in the original boxed set and is like new but it's missing a couple of the disks. The Tutorial disk and Utility disk are there but the others are missing. If anyone wants it I'd like to swap it for MS-DOS version or a CPM version (if there is such a thing) as long as they're in the same condition. Again this one is in perfect condition and is as good as new with no marks, tears, wear, etc. If interested, contact me directly. Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sun Jul 21 07:09:59 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Intel 8291 was Re: semi-OT Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020721074712.3c4fe250@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I was in a surplus store yesterday and found a copy of an Intel Communications Handbook. It has the complete listing of all of the specs for the 8291 and several application notes for it as well. If you want it, contact me directly and see about getting it and mailing it to you. Joe > > The 8291 is a GPIB Talker/Listener IC. It's in Volume II of the 1985 Intel Microsystem Components Handbook. I have Vol I but not Vol II so I can't give you any details about the part. > > Joe > > >At 11:40 AM 7/12/02 -0500, you wrote: >> >>I've also removed an Intel P8291A, which has been just as hard to find >>information on, anything would be useful. >> >>Thanks! >> >>-- Pat >> >> From at258 at osfn.org Sun Jul 21 07:30:01 2002 From: at258 at osfn.org (Merle K. Peirce) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: NuDecs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Yesterday we did a joint rescue with RCS/RI, and brought back some nice bits. RCS got a MINC-23, an 11/70 and an 11/84 plus a number of parts, we got an 11/44,11/84 and an 11/94, plus a number of parts. Of course, if I hadn't forgotten my automatic weapons, we'd have probably got the MINC-23. Due in this week: Vax 6000, Vax 7000, HP Optical Storage Library and a couple of Symbolics. M. K. Peirce Rhode Island Computer Museum, Inc. Shady Lea, Rhode Island "Casta est quam nemo rogavit." - Ovid From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sun Jul 21 07:37:01 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: <200207210457.g6L4vmRm051949@daemonweed.reanimators.org> References: <3.0.6.16.20020720073935.3bdf3a1c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020721083711.1a17e7dc@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 09:57 PM 7/20/02 -0700, Frank wrote: >Joe wrote: >> I once attempted to repair one of HP's HP-IB hard drives used a >> Vertex drive internally. I THINK it was a V160 but I'm not sure now. >> I never did find a replacement that would work. IIRC I tried other >> brand drives but I couldn't LL format the new drive with the normal >> user stuff from HP so I don't know if the replacement drives were >> incompatible or ?? or if the replacements failed due to my inability >> to LL format them. > >Part of the problem is that the HP controller in the drive expects to >see a high-level format on the drive. Back around HP-UX 7.0 I found >some arguments to mediainit (-GD I think; the finding was done by >running "strings" on the mediainit executable and looking for a >getopt(3)-style option parsing string) that got it to tell the drive >to do a low-level format and write a new high-level format as well. >Made the disk portion of a 7946 usable again after going "bad" and >being formatted in a PC for testing. The problem was that I was running it off of a HP 9000 Series 200 and only had access to BASIC and Pascal. They have routines for high level formatting a drive but not LL formating. On some drives the high level format command seemed to do the LL format as well and I could replace the internal HD, run format and all for well. But on other drives I couldn't get the high level format to run. I don't remember the error msgs now but it indicated that the drive needed a LL format. I had a whole pile of defective drives that I played around with and IIRC I was able to replace the internal HDs in those that used Seagate drives and reformat them successfully but not the ones that used the Vertex or HP built HDs. Joe From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Sun Jul 21 07:37:20 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: new retro computing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020721081903.479f0e5e@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I had a couple of Disk-A-Tape units from a CNC systems that were controlled by a PDP-11/04s. They appear to have RS-232 I/O and a parallel port that emulates a paper tape reader. I don't know if the parallel port handles input too so that data can be saved to disk or if they output only. They have a 360k floppy drive in them and used it for storage but looked like a paper tape reader to the rest of the system. There's a calcualtor like display and keypad on the front that I'm guessing allows the operator to select the block of data to be used. They look interesting and I've fired them up and they appear to work but I have no idea how to connect or operate them so I gutted all of them except one for parts. Joe At 09:07 AM 7/20/02 -0700, Sellam wrote: >On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > >> > Still plugging away of a TTL style cpu in a FPGA I have found some terminals >> > localy. How ever I am still looking for a serial RS232 mass storage device >> > in Canada that is not tacky looking like a old Pee-Cee. For now I am using a >> >> There have been paper tape punches/readers, digital tape drives and even >> disk drives with RS232 interfaces. But most of them didn't have any form >> of block addressing -- they just saved data to replay it later. Would >> that be any use? > >This reminds me (for no stringently particular reason) that I have an >interesting Anderson-Jacobsen ASR terminal that has a disk drive instead >of paper tape for storing the data stream. > >This is only slightly more interesting than the TI Silent 700 Model 733's >I have that use digital cassette tapes. > >http://siconic.com/computers/ASR733-1.jpg > >I've actually played around with them quite a bit by way of a data >recovery job I did. Very neat machines. They store data in something >like 66 byte chunks. The tape drive actually advances in discrete steps >that you can observe. It writes start and end marks for each block, and >also has an ASCII search capability. > >Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival >------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > > From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Sun Jul 21 09:07:00 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: new retro computing References: <3D3A23CD.40203@jetnet.ab.ca> <34563.64.169.63.74.1027233972.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <3D3ABEFF.6010101@jetnet.ab.ca> Eric Smith wrote: > Just store your RIM loader in the serial PROM after the FPGA configuration. > After the FPGA is configured, it can read the serial PROM into memory. If the FPGA design used a micro-controler and Flash memory I would have no problems with that idea. The design uses a One-Time-Programable serial prom Altera EPC1441 in a 20 pin PLCC package. A rather hard part for me to find and get programmed localy. Thanks for the idea however. From davebarnes at adelphia.net Sun Jul 21 09:51:01 2002 From: davebarnes at adelphia.net (David Barnes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Atari 1090 XL expansion chasis on eBay References: <000001c2275b$7cf2f680$023ca8c0@blafleur> <02Jul21.012507edt.119129@gateway.mediacen.navy.mil> Message-ID: <3D3AD8FD.D65192@adelphia.net> wow! I always thought that was an urban legend!!!! I never even saw one! Jeff Hellige wrote: > For those of you into the Atari 8bit line, an Atari 1090XL > expansion chasis has popped up for sale on eBay: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2037963703 > > Just passing it on... > Jeff > -- > Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File > http://www.cchaven.com > http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020721/af448f18/attachment.html From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sun Jul 21 12:44:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay In-Reply-To: from "Sellam Ismail" at Jul 20, 2 12:29:11 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 414 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020721/34334d6d/attachment.ksh From eric at brouhaha.com Sun Jul 21 12:55:01 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: new retro computing In-Reply-To: <3D3ABEFF.6010101@jetnet.ab.ca> References: <3D3A23CD.40203@jetnet.ab.ca> <34563.64.169.63.74.1027233972.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> <3D3ABEFF.6010101@jetnet.ab.ca> Message-ID: <35016.64.169.63.74.1027274040.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> >> Just store your RIM loader in the serial PROM after the FPGA >> configuration. After the FPGA is configured, it can read the serial >> PROM into memory. > If the FPGA design used a micro-controler and Flash memory I would have > no problems with that idea. The design uses a One-Time-Programable > serial prom Altera EPC1441 in a 20 pin PLCC package. A rather hard > part for me to find and get programmed localy. Thanks for the idea > however. Why not use the Atmel or Xilinx reprogrammable parts? They will work fine with Altera FPGAs. They don't have special programming requirements, so you can burn them yourself, over and over without spending more money. Also, I don't see any reason why you'd need a microcontroller to be involved. Some of my FPGA designs read extra data from their own config PROM, with no microcontroller involved. I just hooked up the config pins to some I/O pins. During config, all the I/O pins are high-Z, so they don't interfere with the configuration. From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sun Jul 21 13:00:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 20, 2 09:05:11 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 3581 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020721/cb6068a9/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sun Jul 21 13:02:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 20, 2 09:29:19 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 474 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020721/c7f243a1/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sun Jul 21 13:11:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: FSOT: Lotus 123 v 1A for the Wang Proessional PC In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020721080416.0e47b952@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> from "Joe" at Jul 21, 2 08:04:16 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1420 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020721/35825663/attachment.ksh From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Sun Jul 21 14:07:00 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: new retro computing References: <3D3A23CD.40203@jetnet.ab.ca> <34563.64.169.63.74.1027233972.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> <3D3ABEFF.6010101@jetnet.ab.ca> <35016.64.169.63.74.1027274040.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <3D3B0567.1060401@jetnet.ab.ca> Eric Smith wrote: > Why not use the Atmel or Xilinx reprogrammable parts? They will work > fine with Altera FPGAs. They don't have special programming requirements, > so you can burn them yourself, over and over without spending more money. Since I live in "The Great White North" all electronic components have to be ordered thru the mail and information pulled off the web. Programing the FPGA is not a problem for testing as I have a download cable. Right now I have about 20 pages of TTL schematics that need to tested for the CPU design once I re-write a assembler for new opcodes. About 2 ALU logic boards and 3 Control boards if I used TTL. Other than finding 16x4 Non Inverting RAM (low power) I can still get all the LS parts needed, but I am using the FPGA becase it handy. > Also, I don't see any reason why you'd need a microcontroller to be > involved. Some of my FPGA designs read extra data from their own config > PROM, with no microcontroller involved. I just hooked up the config pins > to some I/O pins. During config, all the I/O pins are high-Z, so they > don't interfere with the configuration. Nice but I am emulating a PDP-8/TTY style computer system.Built in Bootstrap is the primary input method. Even if I used non-volitile memory I still have to have "nnnn nnnn ?" entered from the bootstrap device. Thanks again for your help. From doc at mdrconsult.com Sun Jul 21 14:09:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Fwd: Old vaxes available Message-ID: From: bmeyygoogle@bmegroup.com (Brad) Newsgroups: comp.sys.dec,comp.os.vms Subject: Old vaxes available Date: 21 Jul 2002 08:49:04 -0700 I have two older vaxes: one microvax 2000 and the other maybe a little older. These are available at very low cost or free to a worthy cause. Please email me if you are interested. I would prefer not to throw them out. I am in the Philly suburbs. Thanks, Brad From dan at ekoan.com Sun Jul 21 14:14:00 2002 From: dan at ekoan.com (Dan Veeneman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: FSOT: Lotus 123 v 1A for the Wang Proessional PC In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.6.16.20020721080416.0e47b952@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020721150912.03b478d0@enigma> At 07:02 PM 7/21/02 +0100, you wrote: >There never was a CP/M version of 1-2-3. There were versions customised for >non-PC-compatible MS-DOS machines, such as the HP150 and Portable+ I've got built-in versions for the Portable Plus and the HP 200LX. I've also got a version for Sun SPARC machines, still in the shrink-wrap if anyone is interested. Cheers, Dan From doc at mdrconsult.com Sun Jul 21 14:24:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Fwd: Old vaxes available In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I forgot all the standard disclaimers. I just found it in comp.sys.dec and thought some of y'all around Philidelphia might want them. Doc On Sun, 21 Jul 2002, Doc wrote: > From: bmeyygoogle@bmegroup.com (Brad) > Newsgroups: comp.sys.dec,comp.os.vms > Subject: Old vaxes available > Date: 21 Jul 2002 08:49:04 -0700 > > I have two older vaxes: one microvax 2000 and the other maybe a little older. > These are available at very low cost or free to a worthy cause. > > Please email me if you are interested. > I would prefer not to throw them out. > > I am in the Philly suburbs. > > Thanks, > > Brad > From pcw at mesanet.com Sun Jul 21 15:05:00 2002 From: pcw at mesanet.com (Peter C. Wallace) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: new retro computing In-Reply-To: <35016.64.169.63.74.1027274040.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 21 Jul 2002, Eric Smith wrote: > >> Just store your RIM loader in the serial PROM after the FPGA > >> configuration. After the FPGA is configured, it can read the serial > >> PROM into memory. > > If the FPGA design used a micro-controler and Flash memory I would have > > no problems with that idea. The design uses a One-Time-Programable > > serial prom Altera EPC1441 in a 20 pin PLCC package. A rather hard > > part for me to find and get programmed localy. Thanks for the idea > > however. > > Why not use the Atmel or Xilinx reprogrammable parts? They will work > fine with Altera FPGAs. They don't have special programming requirements, > so you can burn them yourself, over and over without spending more money. Another option is to use a SST45LV010 (1 mbit) serial flash chip and an 8 pin PIC. The combination costs less than the Xilinx or Atmel PROMS and the FPGA configuration can be downloaded to the flash chip via a standard serial port... > > Also, I don't see any reason why you'd need a microcontroller to be > involved. Some of my FPGA designs read extra data from their own config > PROM, with no microcontroller involved. I just hooked up the config pins > to some I/O pins. During config, all the I/O pins are high-Z, so they > don't interfere with the configuration. > > > > Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Sun Jul 21 15:27:01 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: new retro computing References: Message-ID: <3D3B1818.1050901@jetnet.ab.ca> Peter C. Wallace wrote: > Another option is to use a SST45LV010 (1 mbit) serial flash chip and an 8 pin > PIC. The combination costs less than the Xilinx or Atmel PROMS and the FPGA > configuration can be downloaded to the flash chip via a standard serial > port... Good for new designs but the FPGA prototype board I have still uses the Altera serial prom. I would like to use a fuse-link FPGA and have it boot up like a real CPU but is more a wish list idea. Also to add to my wish list I am looking for manuals ( service/use ) at low cost for the B&K 1460 scope. -- Ben Franchuk - Dawn * 12/24 bit cpu * www.jetnet.ab.ca/users/bfranchuk/index.html From fernande at internet1.net Sun Jul 21 15:42:01 2002 From: fernande at internet1.net (Chad Fernandez) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: next batch of things to sell/give away Message-ID: <3D3B1BE5.6050402@internet1.net> I've got another batch of things to get rid of. Not everthing is free this time. If any of my prices are out of line, please feel free to counter offer. Free + shipping: -2 empty drive bay covers for BA440 series DEC cabinets -M7165 with ribbon cables -IBM WDS-380 scsi drive, 80megs, full height 3.5" -big pot with knob, new, made by Clarostat? 3 terminals, 06-115921-019, 625-7917, unknown values -Namco limit switch, mounted on a plate, rated for both AC and DC, 125v at 15amps AC or .5amps DC. -IBM 8bit ISA serial/parallel card with NS16450N uart, from an AT -generic PC floppy cable :-) -WDC 8/16 bit ISA 256K VGA card For sale plus shipping: -2 fan trays with fans from a DEC R400X DSSI expansion chassis.... these are the same as the ones in any BA440 chassis right? $10.00 each -1 power supply from DEC R400X DSSI expansion chassis. I assume this os also the same as for the BA440. $20 -Kensington System Saver Mac, this is for a Plus, SE, etc. It's in great shape. $20.00 -SCO Open Desktop 2.0.0 on QIC tape. I tried installing it, and I think I had a bad tape drive.... NT wouldn't see the drive either. I picked it up used but the tape had never been opened until I opened it. It is in the original box with all manuals and license card. $5.00 -2 Belkin narrow centronics style 6 foot scsi cables and a no-name terminator of some kind, probably passsive. All in new condition. $15.00 -generic scsi drive case, narrow with centronics style connectors, will accept either a HD or a cdrom.... has two face plates. Never used for more than a few minutes, stored most of the time. Still in box. $15.00 Chad Fernandez Michigan, USA From tothwolf at concentric.net Sun Jul 21 19:30:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sun, 21 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > > I also just noticed someone cut off the spindle ground strap. I wonder if > > it built up a static charge and damaged part of the head amplifier > > electronics? > > Possibly. The preamp is on the flexiprint inside the HDA (:-(). If you > can get a 'scope you can look for the servo sigals on the 2 wire jumper > between the boards. If you get nothing there, then you can syspect HDA > problems, I think. Without a 'scope it's difficult to make any > meaningful tests :-( Would the preamp even be replaceable if it turns out to be faulty? Any suggestions for a (temporary) home-brew scope probe? -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Sun Jul 21 19:53:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sun, 21 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > You'd be suprised how many people have a DMM only these days. I've even > been told that analogue multimeters are obsolete and useless (!). > Needless to say I don't believe that. Yes, digital meters are better for > making accurate measurements of steady signals, but analogue meters are > _far_ better for looking at changing signals, or for spotting the peak > in voltage when adjusting something, or.... > > What do I use? Both, of course, but normally an analogue one. Accurate > measuemetns are rarely needed in electronics. I've got dozens of meters (though only a few sets of good probes...) Most of them are digital, but I still find myself using an analog fairly often. > Eh? Do you mean it's at 0V, and goes up to 0.4V after 8s, or what. Your > message seems to say it changes from 0.4V to 0.4V. It starts out at 0V, then jumps to 0.4V at ~8 seconds. > I think that sounds far to low to move the heads -- I would expect a few > volts at least. So you might well have a servo problem. As a first > attempt (not having schematics), check the power transistors on the > servo board. I think 6 of them are to drive the spindle motor, the other > 4 (?) are the servo power amplifer. The V150 I worked on used discrete > transistors (not an amplifier chip), so I would guess the V170 does too. There are a whole mess of transistors mounted to heat sinks on the servo board. I think I see which 4 are for the servo. > Maybe some kind of head lock releasing. I didn't exactly hear the heads load though. Maybe I'm expecting a noise these drives don't make. > Now that I can't remember. 3600 rpm??? That seems about right, but this drive sounds different. Maybe it is just designed in such a way that it sounds different than most drives I'm used to. > > I really should build a clean-box... > > As should I... Are there any "complete" plans for one anywhere? The only reason I haven't built one yet is that I haven't had time to design one... > No, there is no separate spindle brake. The spindle brake is a relay > that disconnects the motor windings from the drive electronics and > connects resistors across them. Why would the motor still feel fairly stiff then? Are the magnets used for the spindle motor very strong? > There's no similar connector on my V150, so I have no idea what it is > for. Maybe there is a positioner lock that's fitted inside the HDA, and > this is the connector for it. > > What connectors do you have on your servo board? the V150 (new style?) > one has a small 2 pin connector for the servo input from the other > board, a larger 2 pin connector near it for the positioner coil (that's > the one you should have been checking the voltage one), a 10 pin (or so) > connector for the spindle motor at the back edge, another 2 pin > connector for the positioner lock solenoid and a 34 pin (or so) > connector for the control signals from the other board. That sounds identical to what this one has. Maybe the positioner lock solenoid is located entirely inside the HDA on the V170. There was still (factory?) orange epoxy-paint over the 4 screws that held the pc boards in place before I removed them, so I don't think anyone else previously removed them. -Toth From jwest at classiccmp.org Sun Jul 21 19:56:00 2002 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Query as to Frieden calculator value Message-ID: <001e01c2311a$71660fa0$9601a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Just received an old Frieden electro-mechanical calculator from the estate of a family member. There's some sentimental attachment to it so I'm not looking to sell it. However, I am somewhat curious as to what it may be worth. It is in perfect working (and cosmetic) condition. Model is SBT10. Any of the calculator oriented list members have any idea? Jay West From tothwolf at concentric.net Sun Jul 21 20:22:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sun, 21 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > I think that sounds far to low to move the heads -- I would expect a few > volts at least. So you might well have a servo problem. As a first > attempt (not having schematics), check the power transistors on the > servo board. I think 6 of them are to drive the spindle motor, the other > 4 (?) are the servo power amplifer. The V150 I worked on used discrete > transistors (not an amplifier chip), so I would guess the V170 does too. I checked the voltage again, with the servo plug disconnected, and got just under 12VDC across the terminals. With the servo plug connected, it reads right at 0.4VDC. Maybe the head lock is indeed stuck? -Toth From jpero at sympatico.ca Sun Jul 21 20:30:01 2002 From: jpero at sympatico.ca (jpero@sympatico.ca) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Minox 35 GL shutter sticking occasionally. In-Reply-To: References: <1027088537.3d38209994e45@webmail.dds.nl> from "roosmcd@dds.nl" at Jul 19, 2 04:22:17 pm Message-ID: <20020722012914.LSLS8571.tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net@duron> Hi Tony, Years ago, I did tear apart junked cameras when I was younger and curious. It was been repaired before for that same shutter sticking problem but problem remains. Then owner gave it to me and told me "fix it for yourself and keep it". This is manual camera with two Cds, can adjust the shutter timing etc and hot plate for flash which I have for it as well. Only thing I would like to know for suggestions on hopefully getting at the shutter mechism without tear most of the camera apart. To complicate this issue it has flip down door intead of dust cap that extends and retract the lense (reminds of old large format bellows camera). The shutter is on rear of moveable lenses assembly. Body is made of glass reinforced plastic and some metal in key areas. Made by Germany. Small size camera like those disposable but it's much older and has quality and use 35mm film. Cheers, Wizard From curt at atari-history.com Sun Jul 21 21:10:00 2002 From: curt at atari-history.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Atari 1090 XL expansion chasis on eBay References: <000001c2275b$7cf2f680$023ca8c0@blafleur> <02Jul21.012507edt.119129@gateway.mediacen.navy.mil> <3D3AD8FD.D65192@adelphia.net> Message-ID: <000201c23124$9ab4d080$01000001@cvendel> They are extremely rare, only 50 were made, only 5 top covers were made and only 2 sets of expansion cards were made, for more info, visit 1090XL section of my site: http://www.atarimuseum.com/1090xl.html Curt ----- Original Message ----- From: David Barnes To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Sent: Sunday, July 21, 2002 11:53 AM Subject: Re: Atari 1090 XL expansion chasis on eBay wow! I always thought that was an urban legend!!!! I never even saw one! Jeff Hellige wrote: For those of you into the Atari 8bit line, an Atari 1090XL expansion chasis has popped up for sale on eBay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2037963703 Just passing it on... Jeff -- Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File http://www.cchaven.com http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020721/5ad5434a/attachment.html From jpero at sympatico.ca Sun Jul 21 23:15:01 2002 From: jpero at sympatico.ca (jpero@sympatico.ca) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20020722041400.NIYQ8571.tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net@duron> > > > I think that sounds far to low to move the heads -- I would expect a few > > volts at least. So you might well have a servo problem. As a first > > attempt (not having schematics), check the power transistors on the > > servo board. I think 6 of them are to drive the spindle motor, the other > > 4 (?) are the servo power amplifer. The V150 I worked on used discrete > > transistors (not an amplifier chip), so I would guess the V170 does too. > > I checked the voltage again, with the servo plug disconnected, and got > just under 12VDC across the terminals. With the servo plug connected, it > reads right at 0.4VDC. > That means poor power drive to kick in that servo. Voltage should go up to ~12V or then settle down to holding voltages like 6V or so depending on that design. In all TV sets that uses power relay to turn on set using standby power it's always either 12V or 24V across coil when on. On one set, I had diode go leaky across that coil. That one I could push down on that relay and it will stay shut and tv come up. (too weak for initial pull in.) Cheers, Wizard From ghldbrd at ccp.com Mon Jul 22 01:21:00 2002 From: ghldbrd at ccp.com (Gary Hildebrand) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: OT: the pinouts for a Mini-Din connector labled a/v out Message-ID: <3D3BA35D.C697DB46@ccp.com> JUst came up with a Diamond Speedstar A70 video card and in addition to the usual 15 pin monitor jack, it has a seven pin mini-DI jack marked as A/V OUT. I presume this is an NTSC output, and I'm assuming that it may have a hardware MPEG decoder for DVD playback? I'm wondering if any of you guy know where I can get the break out cable for this plug, or at least the pinout so I can build one of my own. Gary Hildebrand St. Joseph, MO From tothwolf at concentric.net Mon Jul 22 01:48:05 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: <20020722041400.NIYQ8571.tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net@duron> Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Jul 2002 jpero@sympatico.ca wrote: > > I checked the voltage again, with the servo plug disconnected, and got > > just under 12VDC across the terminals. With the servo plug connected, it > > reads right at 0.4VDC. > > That means poor power drive to kick in that servo. Voltage should go up > to ~12V or then settle down to holding voltages like 6V or so depending > on that design. Would that happen even if the load solenoid is stuck, and the servo can't move? > In all TV sets that uses power relay to turn on set using standby power > it's always either 12V or 24V across coil when on. On one set, I had > diode go leaky across that coil. That one I could push down on that > relay and it will stay shut and tv come up. (too weak for initial pull > in.) This board uses 2 MJE200 transistors, 2 MJE210 transistors, and 4 1N4001 diodes that appear to form some sort of H-bridge. -Toth From jim at jkearney.com Mon Jul 22 06:08:01 2002 From: jim at jkearney.com (Jim Kearney) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:15 2005 Subject: OT: the pinouts for a Mini-Din connector labled a/v out In-Reply-To: <3D3BA35D.C697DB46@ccp.com> References: <3D3BA35D.C697DB46@ccp.com> Message-ID: Gary, You can still find the manual and drivers still at www.diamondmm.com. According to it, it's a standard S-Video connector. No hardware DVD, though. -----Original Message----- From: Gary Hildebrand To: Classic computing mailing list Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 01:17:01 -0500 Subject: OT: the pinouts for a Mini-Din connector labled a/v out > JUst came up with a Diamond Speedstar A70 video card and in addition > to > the usual 15 pin monitor jack, it has a seven pin mini-DI jack marked > as > A/V OUT. > > I presume this is an NTSC output, and I'm assuming that it may have a > hardware MPEG decoder for DVD playback? > > I'm wondering if any of you guy know where I can get the break out > cable > for this plug, or at least the pinout so I can build one of my own. > > Gary Hildebrand > St. Joseph, MO From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Jul 22 08:14:01 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: FA: E & L Instruments Mini-Micro Designer Model MMD-1 Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020722082824.5a179118@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Located in Oz but currently only $11 US. The seller has two of them! From jhellige at earthlink.net Mon Jul 22 10:09:01 2002 From: jhellige at earthlink.net (Jeff Hellige) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: another Lisa 1 In-Reply-To: <20020722041400.NIYQ8571.tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net@duron> References: <20020722041400.NIYQ8571.tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net@duron> Message-ID: Another Lisa 1 owner looking to get $10k for the maching on eBay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2040749898 Jeff -- Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File http://www.cchaven.com http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757 From acme_ent at bellsouth.net Mon Jul 22 10:20:01 2002 From: acme_ent at bellsouth.net (Glen Goodwin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed Message-ID: <20020722152055.JFWG1189.imf05bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Hope someone can help . . . I have two Seagate ST-225 drives and a WD1002SWX2A controller. Both drives have previously lived in XT-class DOS-based PCs. One of the drives is bootable, the other is not. What I need to do is set both drives up in the same PC, booting from the bootable drive (duh) so that I can extract the data from the non-bootable drive. The object of the game is to move the data to a modern (Duron-based) system. I can't boot from a floppy disk drive due to a fault in the motherboard, but I do have a SCSI controller and hard drive in the XT system. I can move the SCSI drive to the newer system once I can get to the data on the non-bootable ST-225. What is the proper configuration for the ST-225 drives and the WD controller? Any help is greatly appreciated. Glen 0/0 If I am not for myself, then who will be for me? And if not now, when? -- Pirkei Avot From pcw at mesanet.com Mon Jul 22 11:38:01 2002 From: pcw at mesanet.com (Peter C. Wallace) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sun, 21 Jul 2002, Tothwolf wrote: > On Sun, 21 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > > > > I also just noticed someone cut off the spindle ground strap. I wonder if > > > it built up a static charge and damaged part of the head amplifier > > > electronics? > > > > Possibly. The preamp is on the flexiprint inside the HDA (:-(). If you > > can get a 'scope you can look for the servo sigals on the 2 wire jumper > > between the boards. If you get nothing there, then you can syspect HDA > > problems, I think. Without a 'scope it's difficult to make any > > meaningful tests :-( > > Would the preamp even be replaceable if it turns out to be faulty? Any > suggestions for a (temporary) home-brew scope probe? For high frequencies (up to 500 MHz for a simple probe), a homemade resistive divider probe will easily outperform a standard scope probe (capacitive divider) in pulse fidelity and input impedance. For a 100 to 1 probe, use a non inductive 4.99k 1% resistor connected to the centerlead of a 50 Ohm coax. For a 10 to 1 probe, use a 453 Ohm input resistor. Terminate the scope end of the coax with a 50 Ohm terminator (Ethernet (10B2) cables and terminators will do up to a couple hundred MHz). Now you may say that 5K (or 500 Ohm in the 10/1 case) is too low an input impedance for a good probe: well at a measily 10 MHz your fancy 10M Ohm / 20 pF probe has a (reactive) input impedance of around 800 Ohms. So at anything greater than about 16 MHz, even a 10/1 resistive divider probe with a 500 Ohm input impedance is superior, and typically has much better pulse fidelity than a standard 10/1 capacitive divider scope probe... > > -Toth > > Peter Wallace From jfoust at threedee.com Mon Jul 22 13:27:01 2002 From: jfoust at threedee.com (John Foust) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Fwd: Old Computer seeking new home (IBM Pr Jr., NW Chicago) Message-ID: <5.0.0.25.0.20020722131346.02199df0@pc> >From: Nkjvcjs@aol.com >Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 17:19:52 EDT >Subject: Old Computer seeking new home >To: jfoust@threedee.com > >I am looking for a new home for my IBM PC jr. I don't have room for it anymore, but It was my first computer that my daddy got for me when I was 4 years old, so I can't bear to throw it away. >It is currently hooked up and working. >It is the PC jr system with the 64kb internal memory expansion, the power attachment, two memory expansion sidecars and the printer parallel port attachment. It is the system with the internal modem. It also has the corded keyboard and color monitor, and dot matrix printer. >I also have the basic cartridge and manual; DOS 5&1/2 floppies and manual; IBM writing assistant & IBM filing assistant with manuals; and Exploring the IBM PC jr floppies & manuals. >I don't want any money or anything for it, just to know that it is going to a good home. >I am in Illinois, Chicago western suburbs. Any help you can offer in finding it a new home would be appreciated. >Nicole From uban at ubanproductions.com Mon Jul 22 13:37:01 2002 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Got to look at the PDP7 In-Reply-To: <6f.2903d815.2a3c46f5@aol.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20020722133637.01a69a98@ubanproductions.com> It has been a while and I am curious what will or has become of the PDP7 ? --tom At 07:29 AM 6/15/2002 +0000, you wrote: >Finally was able to get a look at the PDP 7. I think it qualifies as the find >of the week, or year, for me. > >I have corresponded with those most interested in it. If interested please >contact me offlist at whoagiii@aol.com. > >Pictures at: > >http://members.aol.com/innfogra/pdp7.html > >or > >http://hometown.aol.com/innfogra/pdp7.html > >Here is the report; > >I saw the PDP 7. It is a delight. It is too bad the entire Lab could not be >saved as a museum. The computer was installed in 1965 to run a 5 MEV Van de >Graff Generator which had been installed in 1964. There is still one >experiment running in the lab so it is not being shut down yet. > >The PDP 7 was replaced in 1992 with a RIDGE 32. The RIDGE 32 was replaced in >1999 with a SUN IPX which runs the Van de Graf via a GPIB connection. > >However the PDP7 was not removed or even disconnected. Harlan fired it up, >tried to load a program off a disk drive, by first running a punch tape. >Finally got the tape loaded and you could see action in the homemade disk >drive controller, but nada. >He was able to key in a simple program via the front switches that ran. >Classic blinkin lights, wow! > >Evidently it is a Germanium transistor computer. Germanium, not being as >stable as silicon, needs more love, care and attention to keep it running. >There are two cabinets of boards and parts including extra core. It >originally came with 4K of Core but they upgraded it with 4K more for a total >of 8K. > >It has a 555 DECTAPE drive, a paper tape reader and desk in the central >cabinet. It is 6 cabinets wide, however these are a narrow double door >cabinet so the entire computer doesn't seem massive. It is cute! The paper >tape punch is in the cabinet to the far left with 4K of core underneath. >Second to the left is the other 4K and the power supplies for the memory. The >third from the left is the console, desk and paper tape reader. IIRC there >are three more cabinets to the left, the last two sparsely populated. All the >cards are singles, early flip chip style. > >It originally came with a KSR 33 Teletype which is long gone. They used an >ADM terminal in a roll around rack. Above the terminal is a HP1300 display. >At the top are two DEC floppy drives with the Lab's own homemade disk >controller. All this should be visible in the pictures. > >There is an entire file cabinet drawer of docs and paper tapes. Several boxes >of boards and components, as Harlan said, a complete set of spares. he also >indicated they were familiar with board level repairs and that is what it >took to keep it running. They inherited lots of tapes from a PDP10 at one >time, because they could use the same ones. There are several cabinets of >small tapes. > >It is a classic museum piece. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Jul 22 14:15:01 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: another Lisa 1 In-Reply-To: References: <20020722041400.NIYQ8571.tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net@duron> <20020722041400.NIYQ8571.tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net@duron> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020722151342.11375da2@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> It's up to $1275 and it still has 9 days to go. Sheesh! Is this the same seller? If so he must be getting rich! Joe At 11:07 AM 7/22/02 -0400, you wrote: > Another Lisa 1 owner looking to get $10k for the maching on eBay: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2040749898 > > Jeff >-- > Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File > http://www.cchaven.com > http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757 > > From donm at cts.com Mon Jul 22 14:55:01 2002 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <20020722152055.JFWG1189.imf05bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Jul 2002, Glen Goodwin wrote: > Hope someone can help . . . > > I have two Seagate ST-225 drives and a WD1002SWX2A controller. Both drives > have previously lived in XT-class DOS-based PCs. One of the drives is > bootable, the other is not. > > What I need to do is set both drives up in the same PC, booting from the > bootable drive (duh) so that I can extract the data from the non-bootable > drive. The object of the game is to move the data to a modern > (Duron-based) system. I can't boot from a floppy disk drive due to a fault > in the motherboard, but I do have a SCSI controller and hard drive in the > XT system. I can move the SCSI drive to the newer system once I can get to > the data on the non-bootable ST-225. > > What is the proper configuration for the ST-225 drives and the WD > controller? Is the WD controller the same one that the drives running on in the XT? If not, it is possible that you will not be able to boot/read the drives. Assuming that this is not a problem, and assuming that you are using a cable with a twist, both drives should be set as the second DS and the bootable one should be connected beyond the twist. Be sure that you connect the proper 20 pin connectors to the appropriate drives. Set the BIOS to no hard drives and let the BIOS on the controller handle the drives. Boot 'er up. Hopefully, you will be able to write to a floppy, or it might be difficult to save your data from the data disk. - don > Any help is greatly appreciated. > > Glen > 0/0 > > If I am not for myself, then who will be for me? > And if not now, when? > -- Pirkei Avot > > From acme_ent at bellsouth.net Mon Jul 22 15:52:01 2002 From: acme_ent at bellsouth.net (Glen Goodwin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed Message-ID: <20020722205102.NLJG1203.imf28bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> > From: Don Maslin > To: classiccmp > Subject: Re: ST-225 help needed > Date: Monday, July 22, 2002 3:53 PM > > > Is the WD controller the same one that the drives running on in the XT? > If not, it is possible that you will not be able to boot/read the > drives. It is the same controller that originally wrote the data to the drives. > Assuming that this is not a problem, and assuming that you are using a > cable with a twist, both drives should be set as the second DS and the > bootable one should be connected beyond the twist. Be sure that you > connect the proper 20 pin connectors to the appropriate drives. No problem there. Both drives are set to second channel, and the cable has a twist, but the controller does not see the second drive. Now I need to know how to configure this controller for a dual-drive setup. > Set > the BIOS to no hard drives and let the BIOS on the controller handle > the drives. Boot 'er up. Hmm, no BIOS setup program on XT-class machines ;>) > Hopefully, you will be able to write to a floppy, or it might be > difficult to save your data from the data disk. Actually, the system can't write to a floppy, but the system does recognize a SCSI drive connected to an 8-bit controller, so I can move the data to the SCSI drive and then put the SCSI drive into a system with a usable floppy drive. Thanks -- Glen 0/0 From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Jul 22 16:04:01 2002 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <20020722205102.NLJG1203.imf28bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Message-ID: Have you verified the usual things, like making sure there is a terminating resistor pack on the last drive in the chain? You've got the drive select jumpers correctly set? What about the two data cables? 0 going to drive 0 and 1 going to drive 1? Does the control cable have the correct twist to it? (afaik, the control & floppy cables had the same number of lines, but the twist was different between them) g. From marvin at rain.org Mon Jul 22 16:09:01 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed References: <20020722205102.NLJG1203.imf28bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Message-ID: <3D3C7442.F4E7EC73@rain.org> One way to actually see if the HD is being recognized by the system is to use fdisk, option 4 (display ...). If fdisk doesn't see it, then there is a hardware problem someplace ... bad cable, wrong jumper settings on the HD and/or controller, bad HD controller, bad HD, etc. If both drives are being recognized, there will be an option to change drives when viewing the parameters for the first drive to view the parameters for the second drive. Also, if a disk manager was used on the second drive, fdisk could show a non-dos partion on the second drive. If there is a motherboard problem, why not just use an AT motherboard with the CMOS set to no drives? Besides being able to read the HDs, you will be able to use high density floppys. I don't recall the parameters for your HD controller ... the older ones needed to have a jumper set on the controller for each drive, while some of the newer ones did that with software and some information put on the HD itself. How do you know the motherboard is a fault for not being able to read the 360K drive? Glen Goodwin wrote: > > > From: Don Maslin > > To: classiccmp > > Subject: Re: ST-225 help needed > > Date: Monday, July 22, 2002 3:53 PM > > > > > > Is the WD controller the same one that the drives running on in the XT? > > If not, it is possible that you will not be able to boot/read the > > drives. > > It is the same controller that originally wrote the data to the drives. > > > Assuming that this is not a problem, and assuming that you are using a > > cable with a twist, both drives should be set as the second DS and the > > bootable one should be connected beyond the twist. Be sure that you > > connect the proper 20 pin connectors to the appropriate drives. > > No problem there. Both drives are set to second channel, and the cable has > a twist, but the controller does not see the second drive. Now I need to > know how to configure this controller for a dual-drive setup. > > > Set > > the BIOS to no hard drives and let the BIOS on the controller handle > > the drives. Boot 'er up. > > Hmm, no BIOS setup program on XT-class machines ;>) > > > Hopefully, you will be able to write to a floppy, or it might be > > difficult to save your data from the data disk. > > Actually, the system can't write to a floppy, but the system does recognize > a SCSI drive connected to an 8-bit controller, so I can move the data to > the SCSI drive and then put the SCSI drive into a system with a usable > floppy drive. > > Thanks -- > > Glen > 0/0 From marvin at rain.org Mon Jul 22 16:11:00 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed References: Message-ID: <3D3C749C.C6E4BD76@rain.org> OH, and speaking of the cable, are you using a twisted HD cable and NOT a floppy disk cable? The difference it the twist is closer to the edge on the HD cable than the floppy cable. Gene Buckle wrote: > > Have you verified the usual things, like making sure there is a > terminating resistor pack on the last drive in the chain? You've got the > drive select jumpers correctly set? What about the two data cables? 0 > going to drive 0 and 1 going to drive 1? Does the control cable have the > correct twist to it? (afaik, the control & floppy cables had the same > number of lines, but the twist was different between them) From acme_ent at bellsouth.net Mon Jul 22 16:12:01 2002 From: acme_ent at bellsouth.net (Glen Goodwin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed Message-ID: <20020722211224.UQGK9213.imf16bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> ---------- > From: Gene Buckle > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: ST-225 help needed > Date: Monday, July 22, 2002 5:03 PM > > Have you verified the usual things, like making sure there is a > terminating resistor pack on the last drive in the chain? Yup. > You've got the > drive select jumpers correctly set? Yup. > What about the two data cables? 0 > going to drive 0 and 1 going to drive 1? Yup. > Does the control cable have the > correct twist to it? (afaik, the control & floppy cables had the same > number of lines, but the twist was different between them) Yup. The problem *must* be that the controller is not configured to recognize that there are two drives. Thanks -- Glen 0/0 If I am not for myself, then who will be for me? And if not now, when? -- Pirkei Avot From acme_ent at bellsouth.net Mon Jul 22 16:16:00 2002 From: acme_ent at bellsouth.net (Glen Goodwin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed Message-ID: <20020722211655.USUU9213.imf16bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> ---------- > From: Marvin Johnston > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: ST-225 help needed > Date: Monday, July 22, 2002 5:08 PM > > > One way to actually see if the HD is being recognized by the system is > to use fdisk, option 4 (display ...). If fdisk doesn't see it, then > there is a hardware problem someplace ... bad cable, wrong jumper > settings on the HD and/or controller, bad HD controller, bad HD, etc. FDISK sees only one drive. > If there is a motherboard problem, why not just use an AT motherboard > with the CMOS set to no drives? Besides being able to read the HDs, you > will be able to use high density floppys. The other MBs I have here are all '486 and higher and do not recognize the controller card (I have two identical cards). > I don't recall the parameters for your HD controller ... the older ones > needed to have a jumper set on the controller for each drive, while some > of the newer ones did that with software and some information put on the > HD itself. This controller has jumpers. > How do you know the motherboard is a fault for not being able to read > the 360K drive? Because I replaced the FDD controller and floppy disk drive with known good units, and still cannot read any floppy diskette. Thanks -- Glen 0/0 If I am not for myself, then who will be for me? And if not now, when? -- Pirkei Avot From lgwalker at mts.net Mon Jul 22 16:16:31 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: whole collection of TRS computers FA on E-bay In-Reply-To: References: from "Sellam Ismail" at Jul 20, 2 12:29:11 pm Message-ID: <3D3C2F89.5446.1E7B4B0D@localhost> Another of the money-extracting ideas that marketing execs come up with. Fortunately mine was a thrift-shop find. It is kind of neat as an artifact tho. Lawrence > > > mags ? And a 6 tape audio demo of Scripsit ? > > Is it just me, or was that audio course for Scripsit one of the most > useless, brain-dead, insulting, ideas ever tried? Particulalry as the > version of Scripsit that I bought (new, back when it was a current > product) didn't come with a proper manual (just the pictures for the > course), so you _had_ to listen to those darn tapes to learn how to use it. > > -tony > lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From acme_ent at bellsouth.net Mon Jul 22 16:20:00 2002 From: acme_ent at bellsouth.net (Glen Goodwin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed Message-ID: <20020722212004.UUJE9213.imf16bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> ---------- > From: Marvin Johnston > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: ST-225 help needed > Date: Monday, July 22, 2002 5:09 PM > > > OH, and speaking of the cable, are you using a twisted HD cable and NOT > a floppy disk cable? The difference it the twist is closer to the edge > on the HD cable than the floppy cable. It's a twisted HDD cable. Thanks -- Glen 0/0 If I am not for myself, then who will be for me? And if not now, when? -- Pirkei Avot From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Jul 22 16:24:01 2002 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <3D3C7442.F4E7EC73@rain.org> Message-ID: You might also try doing "g=c800:5" from debug to enter the controller rom and see if there is a setup you have to perform. g. From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Jul 22 16:26:01 2002 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <20020722211224.UQGK9213.imf16bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Message-ID: > > Yup. The problem *must* be that the controller is not configured to > recognize that there are two drives. > Try the g=c800:5 trick from debug then. That's all I can think of. Pretty good for not having touched that style drive in over a decade. :) (then again, I could be mis-remembering it all) g. From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Jul 22 16:28:00 2002 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <20020722211655.USUU9213.imf16bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Message-ID: > Because I replaced the FDD controller and floppy disk drive with known good > units, and still cannot read any floppy diskette. > Is the motherboard old enough to have the switch block that tell it how many floppy drives are connected? g. From acme_ent at bellsouth.net Mon Jul 22 16:31:00 2002 From: acme_ent at bellsouth.net (Glen Goodwin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed Message-ID: <20020722213111.UZZA9213.imf16bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> ---------- > From: Gene Buckle > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: ST-225 help needed > Date: Monday, July 22, 2002 5:24 PM > > You might also try doing "g=c800:5" from debug to enter the controller rom > and see if there is a setup you have to perform. > > g. > Thanks Gene -- that didn't occur to me. I'll try it tomorrow. Later -- Glen 0/0 If I am not for myself, then who will be for me? And if not now, when? -- Pirkei Avot From acme_ent at bellsouth.net Mon Jul 22 16:33:01 2002 From: acme_ent at bellsouth.net (Glen Goodwin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed Message-ID: <20020722213403.VBNF9213.imf16bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> ---------- > From: Gene Buckle > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: ST-225 help needed > Date: Monday, July 22, 2002 5:27 PM > > Is the motherboard old enough to have the switch block that tell it how > many floppy drives are connected? > > g. Yes! But, I don't know how to set the switches. If I do a "DIR A:" the drive spins and DOS ultimately reports "Error reading Drive A" Thanks again -- Glen 0/0 If I am not for myself, then who will be for me? And if not now, when? -- Pirkei Avot From geneb at deltasoft.com Mon Jul 22 16:51:01 2002 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <20020722213403.VBNF9213.imf16bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Message-ID: > > > > g. > > Yes! But, I don't know how to set the switches. If I do a "DIR A:" the > drive spins and DOS ultimately reports "Error reading Drive A" > If it's got dip switches for setting the drives, then it should (and I say "should " loosely) follow the IBM standard. Here's a link to the standard switch settings... http://www.can.ibm.com/helpware/switches.html If you can tell me who made the board and what model, I might be able to find out more. g. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Jul 22 17:22:01 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <20020722213403.VBNF9213.imf16bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020722182131.527f2e50@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 05:32 PM 7/22/02 -0400, you wrote: >---------- >> From: Gene Buckle >> To: cctalk@classiccmp.org >> Subject: Re: ST-225 help needed >> Date: Monday, July 22, 2002 5:27 PM >> >> Is the motherboard old enough to have the switch block that tell it how >> many floppy drives are connected? >> >> g. > >Yes! But, I don't know how to set the switches. Glen: I have a manual around somewhere that tells how to set them. Let me know if need it. For everyone else: I talked to Glen on the phone and I have the manual for his HD controller. I'm dropping it off to him tomorrow so we won't need to guess about the settings. If I do a "DIR A:" the >drive spins and DOS ultimately reports "Error reading Drive A" You DID try cleaning the drive didn't you? I'll drop off a couple of 360k drives tomorrow too. Joe From geoffr at zipcon.net Mon Jul 22 17:24:01 2002 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <20020722152055.JFWG1189.imf05bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020722153847.04731b30@mail.zipcon.net> can you take a digital pic or scan the front of the card? I can't find ANY references to that controller anywhere :( At 11:19 AM 7/22/02 -0400, you wrote: >Hope someone can help . . . > >I have two Seagate ST-225 drives and a WD1002SWX2A controller. Both drives >have previously lived in XT-class DOS-based PCs. One of the drives is >bootable, the other is not. From jrkeys at concentric.net Mon Jul 22 17:54:01 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Todays Find - answer to Mac Question References: Message-ID: <004101c231d2$8b7307a0$33000240@oemcomputer> Sorry they are sitting in my camera as I do not have my web site completed yet. I started it almost 2 years ago and stopped, I was using FrontPage to design it. If you are every in Houston Texas give me a call and I will give you a tour. ----- Original Message ----- From: "linc fessenden" To: Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 9:55 AM Subject: Re: Todays Find - answer to Mac Question > On Fri, 19 Jul 2002, Keys wrote: > > > No, I'm 23 short to have all 103 models between 1984 and 1995. I have also > > collected over 30 other models that were not on my original list. I also > > have many dup's that I will be trading/selling in the near future. I now > > have over 250 Mac's in storage right now. I stopped counting the II's, > > IIplus, IIe's, IIc's, IIc+, and IIgs's I have in storage also. > > Where's the pictures of your collection! I gotta see this! > > -- > -Linc Fessenden > > In the Beginning there was nothing, which exploded - Yeah right... > > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Jul 22 18:10:01 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020722153847.04731b30@mail.zipcon.net> References: <20020722152055.JFWG1189.imf05bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020722185639.4d57f2ac@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> I have two copies of the manual. The proper number is WD1002S-WX2. Joe At 03:39 PM 7/22/02 -0700, you wrote: >can you take a digital pic or scan the front of the card? I can't find ANY >references to that controller anywhere :( > >At 11:19 AM 7/22/02 -0400, you wrote: >>Hope someone can help . . . >> >>I have two Seagate ST-225 drives and a WD1002SWX2A controller. Both drives >>have previously lived in XT-class DOS-based PCs. One of the drives is >>bootable, the other is not. > > From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Jul 22 18:10:29 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Adaptec ACB-4070 was Re: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020722153847.04731b30@mail.zipcon.net> References: <20020722152055.JFWG1189.imf05bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020722191100.439fabc6@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Does anyone have a Setup and Installation manual for an Adaptec ACB-4070 bridge board? Adaptec has dropped support of these and it's no longer on the web. Does anyone know if I can simply replace this and the MFM drive that's connected to it with a regular SCSI drive? My SB-180 uses this board and a Tulin TL 226 drive and the drive is dying. Joe From r.stek at snet.net Mon Jul 22 19:15:27 2002 From: r.stek at snet.net (Bob Stek) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: COMM180 docs Message-ID: <000001c231dd$d8aec120$6401a8c0@mycroft1> Joe - I found a copy of the COMM180 Technical Manual Release 1.0 dated 1985. It's about 60 pages long. Is this what you have? What specifically were you looking for? Bob Stek Saver of Lost Sols From donm at cts.com Mon Jul 22 19:38:00 2002 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020722185639.4d57f2ac@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: > I have two copies of the manual. The proper number is WD1002S-WX2. > > Joe There is also a WD1002S-WX2A, Joe. Don't know what the differences are, if any, but I have the manual for the WX2A version. - don > >> > >>I have two Seagate ST-225 drives and a WD1002SWX2A controller. Both drives > >>have previously lived in XT-class DOS-based PCs. One of the drives is > >>bootable, the other is not. > > > > > > > From donm at cts.com Mon Jul 22 19:52:01 2002 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Adaptec ACB-4070 was Re: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020722191100.439fabc6@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: > Does anyone have a Setup and Installation manual for an Adaptec > ACB-4070 bridge board? Adaptec has dropped support of these and it's > no longer on the web. Does anyone know if I can simply replace this > and the MFM drive that's connected to it with a regular SCSI drive? > My SB-180 uses this board and a Tulin TL 226 drive and the drive is dying. > > Joe The ACB-4000 Series User Manual is about 1/2" thick, Joe, and is not partitioned by specific models. But, I see no reason why a regular SCSI drive could not be installed in lieu of the ACB-4070 and ST-411/506 interface drive. Seems to me that I have gone the other way once. - don From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 22 20:04:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Minox 35 GL shutter sticking occasionally. In-Reply-To: <20020722012914.LSLS8571.tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net@duron> from "jpero@sympatico.ca" at Jul 21, 2 09:36:09 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2967 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020722/7ea2b0d7/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 22 20:04:33 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 21, 2 08:27:58 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 604 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020722/2b9898c2/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 22 20:05:08 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 21, 2 07:36:05 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 767 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020722/20ba404e/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 22 20:05:38 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 21, 2 07:59:41 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1246 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020722/08c345af/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 22 20:06:08 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 22, 2 01:54:04 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 764 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020722/e2866aa5/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 22 20:06:33 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <20020722152055.JFWG1189.imf05bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> from "Glen Goodwin" at Jul 22, 2 11:19:11 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 977 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020722/1dc2ba51/attachment.ksh From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Mon Jul 22 20:28:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Adaptec ACB-4070 was Re: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020723012652.70311.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> --- Don Maslin wrote: > The ACB-4000 Series User Manual is about 1/2" thick, Joe, and is not > partitioned by specific models. But, I see no reason why a regular SCSI > drive could not be installed in lieu of the ACB-4070 and ST-411/506 > interface drive. Seems to me that I have gone the other way once. My experiences with Adaptec bridge controllers is that they don't support an IDENT packet, so the host has to "know" the geometry, meaning that _you_ will have to know the geometry of the embedded SCSI drive and tell the host since it will not think to ask the drive itself. Additionally, whatever (low level) formatting software comes with the host might or not might not work with an embedded drive. Modern drives will ignore harmful commands, so it's not a risk to the drive, but if there is a canned procedure for installing the OS (old variants of UNIX come to mind), it might or might not succeed with an embedded drive if it was written to expect an ACB-4xxx. Finally, most Adaptec bridge controllers I know of did support multiple LUNs. Some SCSI drives won't like being probed for LUNs and may return a hit for every LUN probed (I've seen that happen with some drives on an Amiga 3000 which optionally supports multiple LUNs per target ID) If none of the above differences trip you up, then you should have no problem using an embedded SCSI drive in place of your ACB-4070. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From tothwolf at concentric.net Mon Jul 22 20:45:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > > This board uses 2 MJE200 transistors, 2 MJE210 transistors, and 4 1N4001 > > diodes that appear to form some sort of H-bridge. > > As does the V150... I think that much is identical to the V150. > The emitters of the MJE201s (PNP) go to +12V. The emitters of the > MJE200s (NPN) go to the 0V rail via 0.499 ohm resistors (current > sensing). The collectors of each pair of transistors are connected > together and go to one side of the positioner coil connector. There's a > diode (1N4001?) across each truansistor, C-E, to protect it against > back-emf spikes. I also just finished sketching out the schematic for that part of the board. The four diodes are indeed 1N4001. > The base circuit involves several resistors and the 4 sections of an > MPQ6002 transistor array (U39 on my board). Thats where my board differers. The 4 transistors on this board are connected to one of the hybrid circuits (A103 on this board). > But I would start by testing all 4 power transistors and the 2 current > sense resistors. Those are the most likely things to fail. Well, I'm not so sure any of it is at fault after thinking about it... When I connected a meter from ground to each of the servo connector pins while the servo coil was connected, I got just under 11VDC. When I checked the voltage across the two pins, the 0.4VDC was just the voltage differential. When I checked the voltage across the servo connector with the servo coil disconnected, it was near 12VDC because it was trying to move the coil. It seems like that part of the circuit may be working fine, because the H-bridge controller chips on that hybrid package are switching those 4 transistors on and off to position the coil. Does that sound right? Sigh. If I had a pair of probes for one of my scopes, I could verify this easily... -Toth From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Mon Jul 22 21:03:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 22, 2 08:51:20 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1709 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020722/44bdc5c3/attachment.ksh From tothwolf at concentric.net Mon Jul 22 21:44:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > > Thats where my board differers. The 4 transistors on this board are > > connected to one of the hybrid circuits (A103 on this board). > > Ah, so the transistor array, etc are somehow inside this hybrid circuit. > Pity... I guess its not exactly a hybrid circuit. Some of those small SMT boards are coated with the same material most ceramic caps are coated with. Most of the boards are not coated, and the standard SMT parts are somewhat accessible. I think A103 contains 3 small 8 pin chips which control the 4 amplifier transistors. How many transistors made up the original transistor array? > > Well, I'm not so sure any of it is at fault after thinking about it... > > I would still check them. I've had hard drive servo amplifiers fail > before. What would be the easiest way for me to check them? > > When I connected a meter from ground to each of the servo connector pins > > while the servo coil was connected, I got just under 11VDC. When I checked > > I would have expected them to be close to 6V if the servo amplifier was > working correctly. Having them both so close to the +ve supply makes me > suspect the NPN transistors or the sense resistors. The sense resistors read very close to their printed value. How else should I test them? > > the voltage across the two pins, the 0.4VDC was just the voltage > > differential. When I checked the voltage across the servo connector with > > the servo coil disconnected, it was near 12VDC because it was trying to > > move the coil. It seems like that part of the circuit may be working fine, > > because the H-bridge controller chips on that hybrid package are switching > > those 4 transistors on and off to position the coil. > > So you think the servo may be locking on-track? Possible, but then why > does it spin down? And why are the 2 positioner coil pins both close to > the +ve supply? I'm not so sure its locking on-track either... Do you think the drive would spin down if it had trouble reading only some of the servo tracks? The drive doesn't sound like it has any head/platter damage, and spins up smoothly. Should the positioner coil pins be right about half the +ve supply for most servo circuits? I certainly don't hear the clicking noises I'm used to hearing when heads are seeking. -Toth From geoffr at zipcon.net Mon Jul 22 21:48:01 2002 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (geoffr@zipcon.net) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed References: <3.0.6.16.20020722185639.4d57f2ac@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3d3cc3fa5811f0.81788787@zipcon.net> http://www.aquascape.com/theref/controllers/layouts/cs_wd1002s-wx2.html this will give you the setup for your card :) From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Jul 22 22:54:01 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Adaptec ACB-4070 was Re: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <20020723012652.70311.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> References: Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020722235412.4d57483c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 06:26 PM 7/22/02 -0700, Ethan wrote: >--- Don Maslin wrote: >> The ACB-4000 Series User Manual is about 1/2" thick, Joe, and is not >> partitioned by specific models. But, I see no reason why a regular SCSI >> drive could not be installed in lieu of the ACB-4070 and ST-411/506 >> interface drive. Seems to me that I have gone the other way once. > >My experiences with Adaptec bridge controllers is that they don't >support an IDENT packet, That's correct according to what I've been able to find out. so the host has to "know" the geometry, >meaning that _you_ will have to know the geometry of the embedded >SCSI drive and tell the host since it will not think to ask the >drive itself. Hmmm. But how do you tell it the geometry? The User's manual for the system indicated that there are only two drives that work with this system. I wonder if that's because the geometry is hard coded into the HD setup program? > >Additionally, whatever (low level) formatting software comes with the host >might or not might not work with an embedded drive. Modern drives will >ignore harmful commands, so it's not a risk to the drive, but if there >is a canned procedure for installing the OS (old variants of UNIX come >to mind), it might or might not succeed with an embedded drive if it >was written to expect an ACB-4xxx. That's what I'm afraid of. > >Finally, most Adaptec bridge controllers I know of did support multiple >LUNs. Some SCSI drives won't like being probed for LUNs and may return >a hit for every LUN probed (I've seen that happen with some drives on >an Amiga 3000 which optionally supports multiple LUNs per target ID) Wonderfull! More problems. > >If none of the above differences trip you up, then you should have no >problem using an embedded SCSI drive in place of your ACB-4070. I think that should have been IF! Joe > >-ethan > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better >http://health.yahoo.com > From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Mon Jul 22 23:14:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Adaptec ACB-4070 was Re: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020722235412.4d57483c@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <20020723041244.38689.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> --- Joe wrote: > At 06:26 PM 7/22/02 -0700, Ethan wrote: > >--- Don Maslin wrote: > >> ...I see no reason why a regular SCSI > >> drive could not be installed in lieu of the ACB-4070 and ST-411/506 > >> interface drive. > > > >My experiences with Adaptec bridge controllers is that they don't > >support an IDENT packet, > > That's correct according to what I've been able to find out. I figured, but I didn't want to come right out and make a blanket statement and have someone who knows lots more than me quote chapter and verse of a very late model board that I've never heard of. > so the host has to "know" the geometry, > >meaning that _you_ will have to know the geometry of the embedded > >SCSI drive and tell the host since it will not think to ask the > >drive itself. > > Hmmm. But how do you tell it the geometry? That entirely depends on the software/firmware on the host. > The User's manual for the system indicated that there are only two > drives that work with this system. I wonder if that's because the > geometry is hard coded into the HD setup program? Very likely. In the case of the Amiga and SunOS (4.x), with which I have lots of experience, you edit a text file (a mountlist for AmigaDOS and format.dat for SunOS) and throughly describe the geometry to the SCSI driver. The OS then uses that information to place various filesystem goodies on cylinder boundaries for efficiency (switching heads is a lot less time consuming than moving them). > >Additionally, whatever (low level) formatting software comes with the > >host might or not might not work with an embedded drive... if there > >is a canned procedure for installing the OS (old variants of UNIX come > >to mind), it might or might not succeed with an embedded drive if it > >was written to expect an ACB-4xxx. > > That's what I'm afraid of. It all depends on how modern your target box is (from a software standpoint). In the case of UNIX, the low level format is typically optional, but a newfs (and possibly a disklabel operation) isn't. Same goes for AmigaDOS - if you can write to every sector, you can bypass the low level format and go right to partitioning (either with a mountlist for older versions of the OS, or with a more modern disk tool, presuming your driver supports RDB (Rigid Disk Blocks)). > >Finally, most Adaptec bridge controllers I know of did support multiple > >LUNs. Some SCSI drives won't like being probed for LUNs and may return > >a hit for every LUN probed (I've seen that happen with some drives on > >an Amiga 3000 which optionally supports multiple LUNs per target ID) > > Wonderfull! More problems. It's only a problem for certain embedded SCSI drives. The solution under AmigaDOS, presuming you *don't* have an Adaptec bridge controller or a multi-LUN SCSI CD-ROM disc changer is to disable LUN support in the driver - the "modern" model is one target ID, one LUN (typically '0'). Even the Adaptec can be set up with one LUN - only put one ST506/ST412 drive on it. The difference is that since the Adaptec won't respond to IDENT, it can't mis-report how many LUNs are populated. > >If none of the above differences trip you up, then you should have no > >problem using an embedded SCSI drive in place of your ACB-4070. > > > I think that should have been IF! I don't know about that - mostly, stuff should work fine. I just wanted to point out a few places where things are substantially different between using a bridge controller and having an embedded SCSI drive. I presume much the same is true for the Emuled MD-21 ESDI bridge controller that was common back in the days of Sun3 (MC680x0) hardware... I've seen them but never had to format drives on them. Once they are formatted and partitioned, they should behave much the same as an embedded drive - the trick is getting past the setup software. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Mon Jul 22 23:59:01 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.6.16.20020722185639.4d57f2ac@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020723000731.263fbdce@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Yeah, I meant WD1002S-WX2A. My point was that there is a - in the middle of the part number and that might be why he couldn't find it when he searched for it. joe At 05:37 PM 7/22/02 -0700, you wrote: > > >On Mon, 22 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: > >> I have two copies of the manual. The proper number is WD1002S-WX2. >> >> Joe > >There is also a WD1002S-WX2A, Joe. Don't know what the differences are, >if any, but I have the manual for the WX2A version. > > - don > >> >> >> >>I have two Seagate ST-225 drives and a WD1002SWX2A controller. Both drives >> >>have previously lived in XT-class DOS-based PCs. One of the drives is >> >>bootable, the other is not. >> > >> > >> >> >> > > From RCini at congressfinancial.com Tue Jul 23 08:54:07 2002 From: RCini at congressfinancial.com (Cini, Richard) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: Mac Portable problems Message-ID: <69DBC74E5784D6119BEA0090271EB8E5126C79@MAIL10> Hello, all: I decided to pull-out my Mac Portable to charge it after it being on the shelf for about 1 year. I put the battery in and plugged in the power adapter. As soon as I insert the battery, the unit immediately starts up but doesn't boot and I get lots of vertical lines on the screen (in no discernable pattern). I know that the screen has a few defective rows near the bottom but had no other issues the last time I used it. It wasn't stored in extreme temperatures (either cold or warm). I hope that some of the screen drivers didn't go flaky on me. Since I haven't used it in a while, I've forgotten a lot about it. Does this have a reset button on it? Any thoughts on what else to look for? Rich ========================== Richard A. Cini, Jr. Congress Financial Corporation 1133 Avenue of the Americas 30th Floor New York, NY 10036 (212) 545-4402 (212) 840-6259 (facsimile) From Mzthompson at aol.com Tue Jul 23 08:59:00 2002 From: Mzthompson at aol.com (Mzthompson@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:16 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Jul 2002; "Glen Goodwin" wrote: > I have two Seagate ST-225 drives and a WD1002SWX2A controller. Both drives > have previously lived in XT-class DOS-based PCs. One of the drives is > bootable, the other is not. > > What I need to do is set both drives up in the same PC, booting from the > bootable drive (duh) so that I can extract the data from the non-bootable > drive. The object of the game is to move the data to a modern > (Duron-based) system. I can't boot from a floppy disk drive due to a fault > in the motherboard, but I do have a SCSI controller and hard drive in the > XT system. I can move the SCSI drive to the newer system once I can get to > the data on the non-bootable ST-225. > > What is the proper configuration for the ST-225 drives and the WD > controller? I've got two WD1002S-WX2 controllers in front of me. one ie Rev E, the other Rev F. I'll assume that is close enough for government work. Towards the back of the card is J1. You will need a ribbon cable with a 34 pin header connector to plug into J1. There should be two other connectors on the cable and this will plug into both drives. The drive connectors should already have a 'key tab' in them that lines up with the notch on the drive's circuit boards. Left of J1 is J2, a 20 pin header connector. You will need a ribbon cable to plug into J2 and that will connect to the bootable drive. Left of J2 is J3, also a 20 pin header connector. You will need another ribbon cable to plug into J3 and that will connect to the non-bootable drive. Between the two boards there are some differences in the setup, i.e. the jumpers in place on the board. First is W6 near the back of the board. First board has a jumper on 1-2, the other on 2-3. Also right at the back of the board is a 16 pin header connector. It is labeled SW1. I suppose some versions may have a dip switch instead. Watch the numbering, it is numbered 1 2 3 4 8 7 6 5. First board has jumpers on 3 and 5, the other board has 3 & 5 open. I have no documentation on these particular boards, so no idea what those jumpers are for. Years ago, I was able to find documentation (pdf files) on similar controllers on the web. It may still be available. One thing that comes to mind here is the drive interleave. The controller you have is 3:1 interleave. So I have to ask. If your drive(s) were formatted on a controller with a different interleave, are you going to be able to access the data on this controller? Since I haven't messed with an MFM drive in a long time, that is a question for someone else on the list that has worked with them more recently. HTH Mike From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 23 09:30:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Adaptec ACB-4070 was Re: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020723080003.36678b84@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <20020723142923.62711.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> --- Joe wrote: > At 09:12 PM 7/22/02 -0700, you wrote: > > > >--- Joe wrote: > >> At 06:26 PM 7/22/02 -0700, Ethan wrote: > >> >--- Don Maslin wrote: > >> >> ...I see no reason why a regular SCSI > >> >> drive could not be installed in lieu of the ACB-4070 and ST-411/506 > >> >> interface drive. > >> so the host has to "know" the geometry, > >> > >> Hmmm. But how do you tell it the geometry? > > > >That entirely depends on the software/firmware on the host. > > This is on a CPM machine so the program isn't that fancy. But I was > reading through the manual again last night and it says that the source > code for the HD install program was included so that you could modify it > for the particular drive. I don't have that file with my stuff so I'll > have to search for it. That would be essential I would think. Almost certainly, the expected drive geometry is embedded in the partitioning software which may or may not be tightly coupled with the low-level formatting software you reference above. With source code, you could turn off any features you don't want, and change the tables as needed (although you *could* just ignore the rest of the drive and only use the first few megs; unlike an ST506/ST412/ESDI/SMD drive, modern SCSI and IDE drives present a virtual model of tracks and sectors because they have a variable number of sectors per track and you can't easily *know* what physical cylinder you are on). In a similar vein, between myself and some folks in Michigan, Finland and Germany, we've managed to tweak the partition tables for a Commodore D9090 disk drive which happens to have an OMTI SASI<->ST506 bridge controller so that it can use other drives like the ST225. One project that I have on my long-term plate is to tweak the ROMs to handle embedded SCSI drives (the formatting and partitioning software is *in* the drive and run by one of its two microprocessors; the PET is completely out of the loop - it just sends a "N0:diskname,nn" command to the drive and the drive does all the hard work). It's not exactly the same situation, but there are similarities - you have to understand the formatter to know what changes are needed. > >> >Additionally, whatever (low level) formatting software comes with the > >> >host might or not might not work with an embedded drive... > Since whatever replacement drive that I get will most likely come from > a MS-DOS machine I'll almost certainly have to LL format it. Even more so > since CPM only handles ~8 Mb partitions. According to the manual I > SHOULD have both the LL formatting program and something equivelent to > NEWFS. Again I don't know if I actually have the files. I got a large > box of SW with the system but loaned it to someone and now he can't find > it. Generally speaking, you only have to LL format an embedded SCSI disk if you are trying to whack and refresh the bad block table because the disk is aging or you need a different sector size. LL formatting has to be done *before* partitioning; it's not the _same_ as partitioning. Think of it this way - in the PC/XT DOS world, you LL format an ST225 drive with debug the command "G=C800:5" that jumps into the controller's BIOS You partition with fdisk, and you high-level format with "FORMAT". Three seperate steps. If your embedded drive works on some other system, you can probably jump right to "partition" under CP/M, unless for some strange reason, you can't use 512 byte sectors (almost certainly what your SCSI drive has on it now, but I _have_ seen other sizes in non-Intel systems) > What do you think of trying to use some kind of removeable media > drive such as an IOMEGA ZIP drive or an old Syquest drive? Should be no different to your host than any other embedded drive. I don't know about LUN issues, but I wouldn't expect them. I have both a SCSI ZIP and a 44MB SQ555 (just got a stack of cartridges from the Micro Center for $3 each, new off the bargain table!) and have had no compatibility problems on Suns or Amigas or Macs or PeeCees (would love to try them out on a PDP-8 but I'm still searching for an OMNIBUS SCSI controller). > Thanks for your advice. I'll look for a SCSI drive to try our in it. I > may contact you again if I run into other problems. No problem. Good luck. -ethan P.S. - found an interesting historical document on Segate controllers and drives at http://www.mm.mtu.edu/drives/seagate/misc/pc_hints.txt If you didn't used to have to mess with PeeCee drives 10-15 years ago, there's some good information in there. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From Mzthompson at aol.com Tue Jul 23 11:47:01 2002 From: Mzthompson at aol.com (Mzthompson@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: DEC Manuals Available Message-ID: <14d.11309cf7.2a6ee239@aol.com> The following manuals are available. The cost listed with each manual is just to cover mailing costs. If you want one of these: 1) Send an email reserving your manual(s) *** US destinations only *** 2) I will email you to confirm your reservation (or to say sorry, too late) 3) After confirmation of your reservation, send the funds (cash, check, or stamps) to cover the cost of mailing. Title: VT320 Installation & User's Guide P/N: EK-VT320-UG-001 Quant: 2 Cost: $3 Title: TZK10 Cartridge Tape Drive; User Guide P/N: EK--TZK10-OG-001 Quant: 1 Cost: $2 TZK12 525mb SCSI Tape Drive; Installation Guide - 2 copies P/N: EK-XATAA-IG.001 Quant: 2 Cost: $2 Title: VR320 Color Monitor - Installation & User's Guide P/N: EK-VR320-IN-001 Quant: 2 Cost: $2 Title: DECserver 200 Hardware Installation/Owner's Guide P/N: EK-D200C-IN-001 Quant: 2 Cost: $3 Title: Ultrix Basic Installation Guide P/N: AA-PBL0A-TE Quant: 1 Cost: $3 Mike From sipke at wxs.nl Tue Jul 23 13:06:00 2002 From: sipke at wxs.nl (Sipke de Wal) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed References: Message-ID: <00a101c23273$7e54a6e0$030101ac@boll.casema.net> There is also the matter of termination Only the last drive on the 34-pin controller cable needs a resistorpacket installed somewhere on the HD-controllerboard If both drives have terminators things could go wrong if none has terminators things will go wrong IRCC the 34-pin controller cable had no twist and each drive had its own datacable (20-pin) Sipke de Wal --------------------------------------------------- http://xgistor.ath.cx --------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2002 3:57 PM Subject: Re: ST-225 help needed > On Mon, 22 Jul 2002; "Glen Goodwin" wrote: > > > I have two Seagate ST-225 drives and a WD1002SWX2A controller. Both drives > > have previously lived in XT-class DOS-based PCs. One of the drives is > > bootable, the other is not. > > > > What I need to do is set both drives up in the same PC, booting from the > > bootable drive (duh) so that I can extract the data from the non-bootable > > drive. The object of the game is to move the data to a modern > > (Duron-based) system. I can't boot from a floppy disk drive due to a fault > > in the motherboard, but I do have a SCSI controller and hard drive in the > > XT system. I can move the SCSI drive to the newer system once I can get to > > the data on the non-bootable ST-225. > > > > What is the proper configuration for the ST-225 drives and the WD > > controller? > > I've got two WD1002S-WX2 controllers in front of me. one ie Rev E, the other > Rev F. I'll assume that is close enough for government work. > > Towards the back of the card is J1. You will need a ribbon cable with > a 34 pin header connector to plug into J1. There should be two other > connectors on the cable and this will plug into both drives. The drive > connectors should already have a 'key tab' in them that lines up with > the notch on the drive's circuit boards. > > Left of J1 is J2, a 20 pin header connector. You will need a ribbon cable > to plug into J2 and that will connect to the bootable drive. > > Left of J2 is J3, also a 20 pin header connector. You will need another > ribbon cable to plug into J3 and that will connect to the non-bootable > drive. > > Between the two boards there are some differences in the setup, i.e. the > jumpers in place on the board. First is W6 near the back of the board. > First board has a jumper on 1-2, the other on 2-3. Also right at the > back of the board is a 16 pin header connector. It is labeled SW1. > I suppose some versions may have a dip switch instead. Watch the numbering, > it is numbered 1 2 3 4 8 7 6 5. First board has jumpers on 3 and 5, the > other board has 3 & 5 open. I have no documentation on these particular > boards, so no idea what those jumpers are for. > > Years ago, I was able to find documentation (pdf files) on similar controllers > on the web. It may still be available. > > One thing that comes to mind here is the drive interleave. The controller > you have is 3:1 interleave. So I have to ask. If your drive(s) were > formatted on a controller with a different interleave, are you going to > be able to access the data on this controller? > > Since I haven't messed with an MFM drive in a long time, that is a question > for someone else on the list that has worked with them more recently. > > HTH > Mike From steven_j_robertson at hotmail.com Tue Jul 23 14:00:06 2002 From: steven_j_robertson at hotmail.com (Steve Robertson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: HARRIS 7611's Message-ID: Hey guys, I need another set of BOOT ROMS for a HP1000 and cannot find a burner for those devices. Does anyone have the resources (burner) to duplicate HARRIS 7611's? Thanks, SteveRob _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com From jwest at classiccmp.org Tue Jul 23 14:07:00 2002 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: HARRIS 7611's References: Message-ID: <00be01c2327b$ef329130$9701a8c0@HPLAPTOP> I have a data I/O 28 that I believe does those. I'll check tonight. Jay West Re: > Does anyone have the resources (burner) to duplicate HARRIS > 7611's? --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] From coredump at gifford.co.uk Tue Jul 23 15:02:01 2002 From: coredump at gifford.co.uk (John Honniball) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: HARRIS 7611's References: Message-ID: <3D3DB58E.E8E14F05@gifford.co.uk> Steve Robertson wrote: > I need another set of BOOT ROMS for a HP1000 and cannot find a burner for > those devices. Does anyone have the resources (burner) to duplicate HARRIS > 7611's? I have a Stag PPZ Universal Programmer that'll do them. But I'm in Bristol (UK). I presume you're in the USA somewhere? -- John Honniball coredump@gifford.co.uk From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 23 15:22:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 22, 2 09:50:00 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 3654 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020723/f47436b3/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 23 15:35:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: HARRIS 7611's In-Reply-To: from "Steve Robertson" at Jul 23, 2 02:59:23 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 835 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020723/7603efc4/attachment.ksh From edick at idcomm.com Tue Jul 23 16:10:01 2002 From: edick at idcomm.com (Richard Erlacher) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Adaptec ACB-4070 was Re: ST-225 help needed References: <20020722152055.JFWG1189.imf05bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> <3.0.6.16.20020722191100.439fabc6@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <000801c2328d$298429a0$9cc762d8@idcomm.com> Yep! I have that manual. Now ... where? That may take a day or two. The 4070 is an RLL adapter, IIRC. The 4010 was the MFM version, methinks. BTW, it may be just the speed control on the drive. If it drifts off, the existing format may not "fit" the time window the controller allows. regards, Dick ----- Original Message ----- From: Joe To: Sent: Monday, July 22, 2002 7:11 PM Subject: Adaptec ACB-4070 was Re: ST-225 help needed > Does anyone have a Setup and Installation manual for an Adaptec ACB-4070 bridge board? Adaptec has dropped support of these and it's no longer on the web. Does anyone know if I can simply replace this and the MFM drive that's connected to it with a regular SCSI drive? My SB-180 uses this board and a Tulin TL 226 drive and the drive is dying. > > Joe > > > From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 23 16:40:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <00a101c23273$7e54a6e0$030101ac@boll.casema.net> Message-ID: <20020723213929.46410.qmail@web10306.mail.yahoo.com> --- Sipke de Wal wrote: > IRCC the 34-pin controller cable had no twist > and each drive had its own datacable (20-pin) In PeeCees with Western Digital controllers, a twist on the 34-pin daisy-chain cable was common, but as has been mentioned, it is not the same twist that was used for floppies. If you strap the drives for 0 and 1, you don't need/want the twist. Most PeeCees had both drives strapped to 1 and the twist turned the farthest drive to "0". One or the other, but not both. -ethan P.S. - DEC, of course, did it differently... it's entirely possible to hose yourself by moving ST506/ST412 drives from PeeCees onto an RQDX3 without moving any jumpers - unlike a PeeCee, the RQDX can blow away critial portions of the lower tracks if you have two drives responding to the same select - the hardware is fine, but you'll have to reprep the drive. I'm pretty sure I've done this to myself at least once. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From dogas at bellsouth.net Tue Jul 23 17:05:01 2002 From: dogas at bellsouth.net (Mike) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: (no subject) References: <20020722152055.JFWG1189.imf05bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> <3.0.6.16.20020722191100.439fabc6@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> <000801c2328d$298429a0$9cc762d8@idcomm.com> Message-ID: <000701c23294$1527be70$e0db3fd0@DOMAIN> Wow... A Mac XL cpu on ebay for $20 'Buy it Now'... http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2041176168 > ;) - Mike: dogas@bellsouth.net From acme_ent at bellsouth.net Tue Jul 23 18:35:00 2002 From: acme_ent at bellsouth.net (Glen Goodwin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed Message-ID: <20020723233601.VEBH1218.imf13bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> ---------- > From: geoffr@zipcon.net > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Cc: geoffr@zipcon.net > Subject: Re: Re: ST-225 help needed > Date: Monday, July 22, 2002 10:48 PM > > http://www.aquascape.com/theref/controllers/layouts/cs_wd1002s-wx2.html > > this will give you the setup for your card :) > Okay, the drawing show settings for Rev G and Rev H BIOS -- anyone know how I can tell which version these cards have? Thanks -- Glen 0/0 If I am not for myself, then who will be for me? And if not now, when? -- Pirkei Avot From cisin at xenosoft.com Tue Jul 23 21:03:01 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <20020723213929.46410.qmail@web10306.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: > --- Sipke de Wal wrote: > > IRCC the 34-pin controller cable had no twist > > and each drive had its own datacable (20-pin) On Tue, 23 Jul 2002, Ethan Dicks wrote: > In PeeCees with Western Digital controllers, a twist > on the 34-pin daisy-chain cable was common, but as > has been mentioned, it is not the same twist that was > used for floppies. > If you strap the drives for 0 and 1, you don't > need/want the twist. Most PeeCees had both drives > strapped to 1 and the twist turned the farthest > drive to "0". > One or the other, but not both. A generic PC can be done with a twisted cable (as mentioned: different twist than the floppy cable), or could be done with jumpers. _IBM_ XT (NOT generic) used a twisted cable. ALWAYS. The reason why IBM used twisted cables instead of jumpers? Because they could NOT count on their filed technicians or sales representatives being able to get the jumpers right. So they jumpered all of the drives the same, and relied on the cable for drive selection. In their early days of the PC, IBM had worse field staff than Radio Shack did! -- Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin@xenosoft.com From doc at mdrconsult.com Tue Jul 23 21:19:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Jul 2002, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > In their early days of the PC, IBM had worse field staff than Radio Shack > did! Oh, man. Oh, Fred, you tempt me most foully. I work with IBM field service pretty regularly. It's a good thing, for the sake of comparison, that Radio Shack is getting worse. Those guys ARE very good at what they know. They really suck at knowing when they're clueless. Doc, who always assumes he's clueless From jhfinepw4z at compsys.to Tue Jul 23 21:50:00 2002 From: jhfinepw4z at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed References: <20020723213929.46410.qmail@web10306.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3D3E1540.156A3F4F@compsys.to> Ethan Dicks wrote: > P.S. - DEC, of course, did it differently... it's > entirely possible to hose yourself by moving ST506/ST412 > drives from PeeCees onto an RQDX3 without moving > any jumpers - unlike a PeeCee, the RQDX can blow away > critial portions of the lower tracks if you have two > drives responding to the same select - the hardware > is fine, but you'll have to reprep the drive. I'm > pretty sure I've done this to myself at least once. Jerome Fine replies: It also happens with the RQDX1 and probably the RQDX2, but only when you use the BA23 box. In that case, DU0: must be set as DS3 and DU1 must be set as DS4. If you happen the use 2 * RD52 hard drives and set both as DS3, then you will find out very quickly that a FORMAT operation for BOTH drives is the next operation that is required. My knowledge was also acquired from personal experience. Fortunately, if you use the BA123 box with the standard I/O distribution board specifically made for the BA123, all hard drives use DS3. Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From jrkeys at concentric.net Tue Jul 23 22:30:01 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Help with New Find Message-ID: <011501c232c2$33749dc0$2d000240@oemcomputer> Picked up a Victor Comptometer Duolectric today at a auction for free and I can't locate any info on it. I tried to google but got nothing but info on the company not the machine. Anyone know of a source for information on this model? Also got a Nintendo Virtual Boy ($6), Mac Color Classic ($10), Mac Centris 650 (free), and a Toshiba Satellite Pro ($1). -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020723/81f90c85/attachment.html From jhfinepw4z at compsys.to Tue Jul 23 22:31:01 2002 From: jhfinepw4z at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: How to Print CD Label Message-ID: <3D3E1EFA.A21BEE4@compsys.to> I need some help with a ".tif" file. A scan was made of a CD label. The label can be printed on a laser printer and the result is great, but in the wrong position. I am a dummy using Windows 98 SE. When I use Windows Explorer and click on the file name, up comes the image of the label. It can be rotated, but there does not seem to be anything that will allow me to move the image sideways nor down so that the image is printed on top of the label. Can anyone suggest what I need to do? Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From donm at cts.com Tue Jul 23 23:49:01 2002 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <20020723233601.VEBH1218.imf13bis.bellsouth.net@thegoodw> Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Jul 2002, Glen Goodwin wrote: > ---------- > > From: geoffr@zipcon.net > > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > > Cc: geoffr@zipcon.net > > Subject: Re: Re: ST-225 help needed > > Date: Monday, July 22, 2002 10:48 PM > > > > http://www.aquascape.com/theref/controllers/layouts/cs_wd1002s-wx2.html > > > > this will give you the setup for your card :) > > > > Okay, the drawing show settings for Rev G and Rev H BIOS -- anyone know how > I can tell which version these cards have? I would take either of two approaches: 1] bring up debug and enter d=c800:0 and step your way through text and see if the Rev is there. 2] bring up debug and enter g=c800:5 and see if the text presented tells you the revision letter. - don > Thanks -- > > Glen > 0/0 > > If I am not for myself, then who will be for me? > And if not now, when? > -- Pirkei Avot > > > > From tarsi at binhost.com Wed Jul 24 00:04:01 2002 From: tarsi at binhost.com (Tarsi) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Sun IPC OS? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com> What do you all recommend I run on my Sun IPC machines for an OS? I've never messed with them before, myself. Just got some new harddrives for them, eager to try them out. Thanks! Tarsi From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Jul 24 00:20:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > > I guess its not exactly a hybrid circuit. Some of those small SMT boards > > are coated with the same material most ceramic caps are coated with. Most > > of the boards are not coated, and the standard SMT parts are somewhat > > I thought some/all of the resistors were formed as thick film components > on the ceramic substrate. Which makes it a sort-of hybrid circuit. You're right. I wasn't thinking about those. > > accessible. I think A103 contains 3 small 8 pin chips which control the 4 > > amplifier transistors. How many transistors made up the original > > transistor array? > > The original transistor array was 2 NPN transistor and 2 PNP > transistors. A 14 pin DIL package, I think > > Those 8 pin chips sound like single/dual op-amps (of which there are > many in the servo circuit). Are there also discrete SMD transistors on > this board? The 8 pin chips are marked 4558. They probably are op-amps, but I haven't looked them up yet. There are indeed 4 SMT transistors on A103. I overlooked them the last time I had the board off the drive. > Desolder them, and at least use a diode check (on your DMM?) to check > the base-emitter and base-collector junctions. And make sure that > collector-emitter tests as open-circuit both ways round. > > If you have a better transistor tester (I use a Tekky 575, but then I > would!), you can use that, but then you don't need me to tell you how. I don't have a really nice transistor checker yet, but I do have a couple of pocket types that work well. I desoldered and tested all 4 1N4001s and all 4 transistors. I checked all of them with a one of the small testers, and then checked them all again manually with my DMM. None of those 8 parts appear to be bad. > > would spin down if it had trouble reading only some of the servo tracks? > > Possibly? But then again, I'd expect it to attempt to move the heads > under such conditions. A drive where the heads don't move is either > locked on-track, or has a servo amplifier failure, at least most of the > time. I certainly don't hear the heads moving, but I'm not sure how noisy these drives are anyway. -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Jul 24 00:24:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <3D3E1540.156A3F4F@compsys.to> Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Jul 2002, Jerome H. Fine wrote: > Fortunately, if you use the BA123 box with the standard I/O distribution > board specifically made for the BA123, all hard drives use DS3. Speaking of which, should a BA123 have a write protect/operator-panel for each drive installed in the system? My BA123 has 3 drives, but only two such panels are installed. -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Jul 24 00:30:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: How to Print CD Label In-Reply-To: <3D3E1EFA.A21BEE4@compsys.to> Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Jul 2002, Jerome H. Fine wrote: > I need some help with a ".tif" file. A scan was made of a CD label. The > label can be printed on a laser printer and the result is great, but in > the wrong position. > > I am a dummy using Windows 98 SE. When I use Windows Explorer and click > on the file name, up comes the image of the label. It can be rotated, > but there does not seem to be anything that will allow me to move the > image sideways nor down so that the image is printed on top of the > label. > > Can anyone suggest what I need to do? Can I assume you are using Avery labels? If so, I believe they sell or give away software (fairly basic, might not handle the graphic) to print their labels. Another option is some sort of page layout software. Pagemaker comes to mind for windows, but it is expensive and somewhat difficult to learn (of course, it is preferred by many page layout experts.) -Toth From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Jul 24 00:53:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: How to Print CD Label In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Jul 2002, Tothwolf wrote: > On Tue, 23 Jul 2002, Jerome H. Fine wrote: > > > I need some help with a ".tif" file. A scan was made of a CD label. The > > label can be printed on a laser printer and the result is great, but in > > the wrong position. > > > > I am a dummy using Windows 98 SE. When I use Windows Explorer and click > > on the file name, up comes the image of the label. It can be rotated, > > but there does not seem to be anything that will allow me to move the > > image sideways nor down so that the image is printed on top of the > > label. > > > > Can anyone suggest what I need to do? > > Can I assume you are using Avery labels? If so, I believe they sell or > give away software (fairly basic, might not handle the graphic) to print > their labels. Another option is some sort of page layout software. > Pagemaker comes to mind for windows, but it is expensive and somewhat > difficult to learn (of course, it is preferred by many page layout > experts.) gLabel? GNU Labeling software, probably not available for Windows yet. I'm guessing the easiest thing will be to generate a blank page the size of your printer's sheet size, open the label image, "Copy" it, and "Paste" it into the blank image in the appropriate postition. Doc From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Jul 24 00:54:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Jul 2002, Tothwolf wrote: > On Tue, 23 Jul 2002, Jerome H. Fine wrote: > > > Fortunately, if you use the BA123 box with the standard I/O distribution > > board specifically made for the BA123, all hard drives use DS3. > > Speaking of which, should a BA123 have a write protect/operator-panel for > each drive installed in the system? My BA123 has 3 drives, but only two > such panels are installed. All four of the BA123s I've been close enough to play with had one panel per drive. Doc From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Jul 24 01:15:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: How to Print CD Label In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Jul 2002, Doc Shipley wrote: > gLabel? GNU Labeling software, probably not available for Windows yet. It probably could be compiled under cygwin to create a win32 binary, but I donno how difficult that would be. -Toth From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Jul 24 01:21:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Classic Assumption Message-ID: Hey. This is sort of long, but relates a major wake-up call for me. I have a J-Series RS/6000 7013-560 that I rescued from Goodwill awhile back. It's an awesome machine, and one of my favorites. My company works occasionally with/for a firm who produces traveling AIX classes. They move machines from city to city, doing one-week IBM curricula. About 15-18 months ago, their shippers lost 8 of 12 machines on the way to San Antonio. My boss & I rented them all our equipment - 6 RS6ks and a couple of terminals - for a week to keep the class from folding. The 560 went, against my better judgment. When the computers came home, the first thing I did was reinstall a clean OS on each one. It's amazing how many ways students can hose an install. The 560 stays on 4.3.2, for sentimental reasons. It wouldn't load properly. The BOS would install with no errors, and come up on reboot to a 554 error code. Unable to find bootable device. I swapped drives, I reset jumpers, I verified termination, I unplugged everything that spins. I even found a replacement IBM CD-ROM. I eventually narrowed it down to the SCSI cable. (A J-box internal SCSI cable is a nightmare to behold, and hell to replace. Let alone _find_ one) Last week I picked up a 520 and swapped the cable, then the SCSI adapter. Same problem. The 520 also came with full hardware docs and diagnostic floppy set, so I ran a full suite. Everything checked out, except for that 554 error. I finally decided to load v3.2.5, which also came with the 520, just because. When I pulled the 4.3.2 CD out of the caddy, where it's lived for 2 years, I found an ugly little dob of some pink gel on the data side. I cleaned the disk, put it back, installed AIX v4.3.2 on my 560, and it's running happily right now. I get so accustomed to old hardware having issues, and especially after it had been transported, and unsupervised lusers had their hands on it, that I completely bypassed some elementary checkpoints and lost the use of my machine for a year. Bah. I'd feel like an idiot if it wasn't so, ummm, "classic". Doc From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Jul 24 01:55:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: How to Print CD Label In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Jul 2002, Tothwolf wrote: > On Wed, 24 Jul 2002, Doc Shipley wrote: > > > gLabel? GNU Labeling software, probably not available for Windows yet. > > It probably could be compiled under cygwin to create a win32 binary, but I > donno how difficult that would be. I think, for what Jerome needs, MS Paint will work just fine. I have to remind myself that all the world isn't Unix. Doc From jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de Wed Jul 24 02:49:00 2002 From: jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de (Jochen Kunz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Sun IPC OS? In-Reply-To: <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com>; from tarsi@binhost.com on Mon, Jul 22, 2002 at 06:57:03 CEST References: <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com> Message-ID: <20020724094154.S28047@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> On 2002.07.22 06:57 Tarsi wrote: > What do you all recommend I run on my Sun IPC machines for an OS? NetBSD if it has to be a free *ix, because it runs well on that hardware and it is a good, nice and clean *ix. I use a SPARC ELC (same age) with NetBSD for toasting CDRs. (Wait for NetBSD 1.6. It will be released soon.) SunOS 4 if you happen to have a copy / license, because this is the "native" OS for this hardware. It is somewhat "old", but still a good bais for your work. I don't have any experience with OpenBSD, so I can't say more about it. It may do as well as NetBSD. Linux will do too, but to my experience it creeps on Sun4c machines and is / was buggy as hell. -- tsch??, Jochen Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/ From wmsmith at earthlink.net Wed Jul 24 03:00:01 2002 From: wmsmith at earthlink.net (Wayne M. Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Mac Portable problems References: <69DBC74E5784D6119BEA0090271EB8E5126C79@MAIL10> Message-ID: <004501c232e7$b6eb18d0$f743cd18@D73KSM11> > Hello, all: > > I decided to pull-out my Mac Portable to charge it after it being on > the shelf for about 1 year. I put the battery in and plugged in the power > adapter. As soon as I insert the battery, the unit immediately starts up but > doesn't boot and I get lots of vertical lines on the screen (in no > discernable pattern). I know that the screen has a few defective rows near > the bottom but had no other issues the last time I used it. It wasn't stored > in extreme temperatures (either cold or warm). I hope that some of the > screen drivers didn't go flaky on me. > > Since I haven't used it in a while, I've forgotten a lot about it. > Does this have a reset button on it? Any thoughts on what else to look for? > > Rich > In all likelihood the problem is that your battery isn't holding a charge and all you are feeding it is power off the adapter. The Mac Portable power adapter (which is in actuality more of a batter charger than it is an adapter) does not put out enough power (only 1.5a at 7.5v I believe) to spin up the hard drive or fully power the display. The best solution is to find a Powerbook 100 adapter which puts out the same amount of current (2.0a) as the portable battery is designed to (presumably this is because the PB100 is essentially a reworked Mac Portable). I have also used a PB170 adapter (model M5652) with success, but it puts out 3.0a and so you're running a bit hot. A PB100 adapter is currently up for auction on e-pay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2040343427. They are hard to come by, BTW. -W From carlos_murillo at epm.net.co Wed Jul 24 07:30:01 2002 From: carlos_murillo at epm.net.co (Carlos Murillo) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Sun IPC OS? In-Reply-To: <20020724094154.S28047@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> References: <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com> <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com> Message-ID: <3.0.2.32.20020724082945.0076678c@pop1.epm.net.co> At 09:41 AM 7/24/02 +0200, you wrote: >On 2002.07.22 06:57 Tarsi wrote: > >> What do you all recommend I run on my Sun IPC machines for an OS? >NetBSD if it has to be a free *ix, because it runs well on that hardware >and it is a good, nice and clean *ix. I use a SPARC ELC (same age) with >NetBSD for toasting CDRs. (Wait for NetBSD 1.6. It will be released >soon.) I second this if you want to run a free Unix. >SunOS 4 if you happen to have a copy / license, because this is the >"native" OS for this hardware. It is somewhat "old", but still a good >bais for your work. > >I don't have any experience with OpenBSD, so I can't say more about it. >It may do as well as NetBSD. >Linux will do too, but to my experience it creeps on Sun4c machines and >is / was buggy as hell. I second the commentary on Linux. However, regarding the use of Sun OS 4.1, I disagree. While SunOS 4.x is interesting because of its usage of NeWS (something like displaypostscript), it is hopelessly behind, not Y2K compliant and there is no support. You will have trouble building the newer GNU utilities. If the machines have at least 32MB RAM (64MB is better), you can run Solaris 2.6 on them, which is still supported, comprehensive patches are still being released and is Y2K compliant and furthermore, 2.6-specific pre-built packages can still be found at www.sunfreeware.com. 2.7 will also run, but it will be hopelessly slow. The only reason to use Sun 4.x is if you have interesting hardware for which only 4.x drivers were released (I have one such system with a GPIB interface; I only have 4.x drivers, so I've added a second HD with 4.1.4 in it). carlos. -------------------------------------------------------------- Carlos E. Murillo-Sanchez carlos_murillo@nospammers.ieee.org From bshannon at tiac.net Wed Jul 24 08:19:01 2002 From: bshannon at tiac.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: HARRIS 7611's References: Message-ID: <3D3EA949.9010900@tiac.net> Its not quite that simple Tony! We have used 82S129's from Jameco with a Xeltek SuperPro III and discovered many strange facts about old bipolar ROM's. Our first order arrived with 5 parts, one 74S287A and four 82S129A's. The Xeltek lists each of these parts, as well as the other (Harris and MMI?) manufactuers seperately. These were ordered as 74S287's. The 74S287A worked fine, but several of the 82S129A's died in the burner before I discovered the settings that would get them to program and verify corretly. These then also worked fine as boot ROM's in the HP1000 CPU's. Needing more ROM's, I re-ordered and learned that the 74S287 part number was discontinued, and they offered 82S129A's as compatible parts. Ok, they worked before, so why not... The new order of 5 82S129A arrived, but were from a different manufactuer. Again several died in the burner until I found the settings that would get these to program and verify in the programmer. With a few parts left, I programed and verifed several copies of an HP boot loader (for CS/80 drives) and all verifed correctly. However NONE of these roms will load good data into the HP-1000 CPU. The data loaded into memory is all 1's. So once programed, reading is not fully compatible from device to device due to access speeds, circuit loading, and maybe the phase of the moon as well. These ROM's that load all 1's still verify in a programmer. Now I do admit the Xeltek programmer is not one of the best out there, but this is clearly a real device compatibility issue. Steve has some Harris parts in hand, and we know that ROM is used by HP, so they should work fine as boot loaders (HP also used 82S129's, but not 82S129A's it seems). All thats needed is someone with a programmer who can duplicate some existing ROM's in-hand. Tony Duell wrote: >>Hey guys, >> >>I need another set of BOOT ROMS for a HP1000 and cannot find a burner for= >>=20 >>those devices. Does anyone have the resources (burner) to duplicate HARRI= >>S=20 >>7611's? >> > >Do you need them to be Harris parts? (do you have blank Harris 7611s?) >According to my databooks, the 7611 is a 256*4 PROM, equivalent _for >reading_ to the 74S287, etc. > >Many manufactuers made those under a variety of numbers (Signetics 82S129 >is probably the easiest to find). They are all essentially equivalent for >reading (which is all the HP1000 cares about), but have different >programming algorithms (some manufacturers published these, others >didn't). > >I would suggest seeing which blanks you can find first (these chips are >most certainly one-time-programmable only!), then find a programmer that >can handle them. > >-tony > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020724/26a4f71c/attachment.html From jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de Wed Jul 24 08:48:01 2002 From: jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de (Jochen Kunz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Sun IPC OS? In-Reply-To: <3.0.2.32.20020724082945.0076678c@pop1.epm.net.co>; from carlos_murillo@epm.net.co on Wed, Jul 24, 2002 at 08:29:45AM -0400 References: <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com> <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com> <20020724094154.S28047@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> <3.0.2.32.20020724082945.0076678c@pop1.epm.net.co> Message-ID: <20020724160223.B1882@unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> On Wed, Jul 24, 2002 at 08:29:45AM -0400, Carlos Murillo wrote: > I second the commentary on Linux. Hehehe. ;-) [The audience should know that I am not that Linux friendly...] > However, regarding the use of Sun OS 4.1, I disagree. > While SunOS 4.x is interesting because of its usage of > NeWS (something like displaypostscript), it is hopelessly behind, not Y2K > compliant and there is no support. There are some patches. I know a Sun 3 collector (http:www.sun3zoo.de) who has Y2K patches for sun3(x) SunOS 4. I am sure you can get them for SPARC as well. SunOS 4 in general is not that behind, as it was quite modern at its days. (Shared libs, lots of SysV extensions, ...) > You will have trouble building the newer GNU utilities. You will have trouble building GNU stuff on anything other than Linux, or at least a x86 / litle endian / 32 bit machine with gcc. > you can run Solaris 2.6 on them, Yes. But SunOS 4 is more "classic" and we are on the classic computers mailing list... ;-) -- tsch??, Jochen Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/ From dtwright at uiuc.edu Wed Jul 24 09:11:00 2002 From: dtwright at uiuc.edu (Dan Wright) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Sun IPC OS? In-Reply-To: <20020724160223.B1882@unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> References: <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com> <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com> <20020724094154.S28047@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> <3.0.2.32.20020724082945.0076678c@pop1.epm.net.co> <20020724160223.B1882@unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> Message-ID: <20020724140949.GB330068@uiuc.edu> Jochen Kunz said: > > However, regarding the use of Sun OS 4.1, I disagree. > > While SunOS 4.x is interesting because of its usage of > > NeWS (something like displaypostscript), it is hopelessly behind, not Y2K > > compliant and there is no support. > There are some patches. I know a Sun 3 collector (http:www.sun3zoo.de) > who has Y2K patches for sun3(x) SunOS 4. I am sure you can get them > for SPARC as well. SunOS 4 in general is not that behind, as it was > quite modern at its days. (Shared libs, lots of SysV extensions, ...) > That's good to know... I have a copy of SunOS 4.1.4 for the day I get a sun old enough to put it on :) > > You will have trouble building the newer GNU utilities. > You will have trouble building GNU stuff on anything other than Linux, > or at least a x86 / litle endian / 32 bit machine with gcc. That's not true. I've built a significant portion of the GNU stuff on IRIX 6.5.x, Solaris 2.5-2.8, HPUX 10.20 and 11i, and AIX 4.3.2, in addition to the usual suspects like Linux and FreeBSD. Usually pretty painlessly, too, though things occasionally need a little tweaking. Generally not more then 10 minutes of extra fiddling... - Dan Wright (dtwright@uiuc.edu) (http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright) -] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [- ``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread, For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.'' Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan From spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu Wed Jul 24 09:17:00 2002 From: spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Sun IPC OS? In-Reply-To: <20020724140949.GB330068@uiuc.edu> from Dan Wright at "Jul 24, 2 09:09:49 am" Message-ID: <200207241424.HAA10184@stockholm.ptloma.edu> > > > You will have trouble building the newer GNU utilities. > > You will have trouble building GNU stuff on anything other than Linux, > > or at least a x86 / litle endian / 32 bit machine with gcc. > That's not true. I've built a significant portion of the GNU stuff on IRIX > 6.5.x, Solaris 2.5-2.8, HPUX 10.20 and 11i, and AIX 4.3.2, in addition to the > usual suspects like Linux and FreeBSD. I've had trouble on AIX 4.1, though. -- ----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser@stockholm.ptloma.edu -- The best defense against logic is ignorance. ------------------------------- From jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de Wed Jul 24 09:40:01 2002 From: jkunz at unixag-kl.fh-kl.de (Jochen Kunz) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Sun IPC OS? In-Reply-To: <20020724140949.GB330068@uiuc.edu>; from dtwright@uiuc.edu on Wed, Jul 24, 2002 at 09:09:49AM -0500 References: <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com> <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com> <20020724094154.S28047@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> <3.0.2.32.20020724082945.0076678c@pop1.epm.net.co> <20020724160223.B1882@unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> <20020724140949.GB330068@uiuc.edu> Message-ID: <20020724165445.A2270@unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> On Wed, Jul 24, 2002 at 09:09:49AM -0500, Dan Wright wrote: > > You will have trouble building GNU stuff on anything other than Linux, > > or at least a x86 / litle endian / 32 bit machine with gcc. > That's not true. I've built a significant portion of the GNU stuff on IRIX > 6.5.x, Solaris 2.5-2.8, HPUX 10.20 and 11i, and AIX 4.3.2, GCC or the "native" compiler of the *ix? (e.g. MIPS Pro on IRIX?) I must admit that it is not that bad than my statemant above may sound. But I have build a lot of GNU stuff (including lage parts GNOME) on my Alpha running Tru64 5.1 with the DEC/Comcrap/HPaq C compiler and sometimes it was really nasty. -- tsch??, Jochen Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/ From mythtech at mac.com Wed Jul 24 11:48:04 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: How to Print CD Label Message-ID: >I need some help with a ".tif" file. A scan was made of a CD label. >The label can be printed on a laser printer and the result is great, >but in the wrong position. If you are printing to an Avery or compatible label, you can download free templates from Avery's web site. The templates work with in MS Word IIRC. Avery also sells some very nice label printing software that works with 99% of their labels (they are a little slow to update the software, so the newest label formats may not be supported, but as of right now, everything I have ever seen sold is supported). Their label software allows you to print full sheets of labels, or any number of labels to a sheet, and lets you pick the starting point on the sheet (so you can use a partially used sheet). They also support graphic importing, as well as mail merge, so you can print custom worded labels for each label. The software is available for Mac or Windows (the Mac version has a slight bug if you use a large high resolution screen, when you open a new empty template, it draws the label off the side of the editable window... you then have to quit the app and restart it to use that template, annoying as all hell, but at least it doesn't do it with saved templates, so my often used ones I just saved a blank version of it and open it that way) -chris From MTPro at aol.com Wed Jul 24 12:25:00 2002 From: MTPro at aol.com (MTPro@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Some people need help! Message-ID: <217D05B4.5D128F8E.0000EF7A@aol.com> Hello, I received both of these message yesterday and I cannot help the people. Anyone have an answer for them? Please respond driectly to them and not me, thanks: ----------------------------------------------- I am looking for a converter to convert some old Wordstar documents. I'm wondering if you might have one handy and could email it here (Sydney, Australia). Or else, do you have any idea where I could get one on the web. I have had a search but with little precise luck. It looks like Microsoft offers a massive 12+ Mb solution to everything which likely would contain it. I will come at that if needs be but thought I'd first try to just get a simple worstar-only translator if I can. Years ago I used to have such things myself but I no longer could locate it now. Kind Regards John Byrnes, Geologist byrnesj@minerals.nsw.gov.au ----------------------------------------------- Ref: xerox computer/ser.#m92-013062/1983/bios ver. 5.00 Would you have any info on this machine? I am not certain if it works so I need to obtain it's original operating system or at least a start-up disk. I would like to try and move it for a friend. He has a pawn shop, and this is a case where he got the shaft. A little joke. He is a fair person as far as I can see, and I just want to help him if I can. Any help you might send my way about this machine would be helpful. All it has as far as a model is xerox both on the monitor, and the cpu. I needed to type aa: to get it to recognize the floppy drive of which it has two 51/4" drives. The monitor is connected to the cpu with two wide insulated ribbon cables. the serial, parallel, and keyboard ports are at the back of the monitor at the bottom. It is a different configuration than I am used to, but it seems to work. I don't believe it has a hard drive, but I haven't taken the hood off to check. The drives search the disks I have put in, but to no avail. I think it might be that cm/p operating system, like the old kpro I have, but there again I am not certain. I hope that what info I have given is sufficient to identify this machine. Thanks , Jimmy Dean Fisher ,phydauex56@yahoo.com From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Jul 24 12:33:28 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: IBM field service was Re: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: References: <20020723213929.46410.qmail@web10306.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020724114009.43af43d6@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> At 07:02 PM 7/23/02 -0700, Fred wrote: >In their early days of the PC, IBM had worse field staff than Radio Shack >did! Wow! That's hard to beleive! Especially since RS had no field service AFIK and the service in the "Service Centers" was utterly worthlss! Joe From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Jul 24 13:46:01 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: IBM field service was Re: ST-225 help needed In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020724114009.43af43d6@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: > >In their early days of the PC, IBM had worse field staff than Radio Shack > >did! On Wed, 24 Jul 2002, Joe wrote: > Wow! That's hard to beleive! Especially since RS had no field service AFIK and the service in the "Service Centers" was utterly worthlss! Before I offend any more people, I'd better be a lot clearer about my statement! 1. I said "In their early days of the PC" (20 years ago!). I was NOT referring to how they were before the PC, nor anything "recent" . 2. I meant their PC staff, NOT referring to any of their mainframe or mini people. (often significantly different!) 3. I misused the word "field" to include all of their operations that were NOT "factory", including their "service technicians" at their retail sites, and "field service center"s. 4. I unfairly lumped in with IBM's people all of the non-IBM people who REPRESENTED them, including Computerland, "IBM sales centers". If you bought an IBM drive for an IBM XT, the People installing it on behalf of IBM would be likely to pinch the cable, and the only reason they got the cable on the right way around was the keying; the only reason they got the drive select right was the cable twist; they often (usually?) did NOT get the termination right. I saw a "technician" at an "IBM Product Center" trying to connect an XT hard disk using a floppy cable (AFTER the twist), including trying to cut a new notch in the card edge! (BTW, RS WOULD sometimes send somebody out to the customer's site for Model 2 and Tandy 10 systems) From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Wed Jul 24 13:59:01 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Hidden codes in NEC 8080A Message-ID: <200207241856.LAA25233@clulw009.amd.com> Hi I started to look and see what hidden codes might be in this processor. My memory said that there was something useful but I couldn't find anything. Here is what I saw: 08 nop 10 nop 18 nop 20 nop 28 nop 30 nop 38 nop CB JMP D9 CALL DD CALL ED CALL FD CALL I did see something unusual. Looking at the PSW, bit# 5 would change, depending on if an add or subtract was done on an earlier instruction. If there was a subtract, it would be set to a '1'. It would set to '0' on anything that did an add, ADD, ADI, ACI, ADC, DAD, INR and INX. It would go to '1' on DCR, DCX, SUB, SUI and SBB. I looked for anything related to overflow conditions but didn't see anything. None of the NOP codes effected any of the registers or flags. The PSW bits 1 and 3 were always set to '1'. How dull! Dwight From aek at spies.com Wed Jul 24 13:59:25 2002 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: HARRIS 7611's Message-ID: <200207232021.g6NKLPqV021401@spies.com> here are parts compatible with 7611's 256*4 +------+ A6 |1 16| Vcc A5 |2 15| A7 A4 |3 14| CE2/ A3 |4 13| CE1/ A0 |5 12| O1 A1 |6 11| O2 A2 |7 10| O3 GND|8 9| O4 +------+ Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Intel --------- --- -- ------ -------- --- -------- ----- TS 82S129 (50ns) 6301-1 24S10 7611-5 29661 27S21 74S287 3621 82S129A(27ns) 63S141 - 7611A - 27S21A - - Intersil Fujitsu -------- ------- 7052 From NAVACCHIA at desdcad.cea.fr Wed Jul 24 13:59:55 2002 From: NAVACCHIA at desdcad.cea.fr (NAVACCHIA Frederic 145692) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Need Compaticard II jumper and driver docs Message-ID: hello I have also a COMPATICARD II and the manual only treat about Compaticard IV. There are any documentation about DMA and IRQ. The jumpers J1 and J2 A and B position respectively. IRQ 6 and DMA 2 (two jumpers). I have lost the software to enable the overdrive 1200. Can you send me a copy by e-mail? Thanks ---------------------------------- Fr?d?ric NAVACCHIA CEA Cadarache DEN/DED/SCCD/LECC B?t. 238 13108 St Paul Lez Durance ----------------------------------- t?l: 04-42-25-64-38 fax: 04-42-25-35-53 navacchia@cea.fr From curt at atari-history.com Wed Jul 24 14:07:00 2002 From: curt at atari-history.com (Curt Vendel) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: IBM field service was Re: ST-225 help needed References: <20020723213929.46410.qmail@web10306.mail.yahoo.com> <3.0.6.16.20020724114009.43af43d6@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <00f001c23344$f638b760$01000001@cvendel> That's cause the IBM field service guys spent too much time typing to fellow friends and co-workers on their wireless XT handhelds.... man those things were cool!!!!!!!!!!!! Curt ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe" To: Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 11:40 AM Subject: IBM field service was Re: ST-225 help needed > At 07:02 PM 7/23/02 -0700, Fred wrote: > > > >In their early days of the PC, IBM had worse field staff than Radio Shack > >did! > > Wow! That's hard to beleive! Especially since RS had no field service AFIK and the service in the "Service Centers" was utterly worthlss! > > Joe > > From pechter at ureach.com Wed Jul 24 14:19:00 2002 From: pechter at ureach.com (Bill Pechter) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: cctalk digest, Vol 1 #97 - 34 msgs Message-ID: <200207241917.PAA12642@stage20.ureach.com> > From: Tarsi > Organization: OrangeNET > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: Sun IPC OS? > Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 23:57:03 -0500 > Reply-To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > > What do you all recommend I run on my Sun IPC machines for an OS? I've never > messed with them before, myself. Just got some new harddrives for them, > eager to try them out. > > Thanks! > > Tarsi > All my experience says SunOS 4.1.4 or 4.1.3_U1 with the y2k patches works ok. Replacing the resolver with resolv+ v2.1 is also recommended by me. Somewhere I've got a tape with the 4.1.4 patches cpio'd up to be overlayed on a 4.1.4 system for Sparc2... I did all the y2k patching for my group at Lucent and found the "drop the cpio on top" method of patching got me down to 15 minutes per machine and one reboot after I did the first Sparc10 and Sparc2 and made the tapes. Bill pechter@ureach.com From DAW at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu Wed Jul 24 14:23:01 2002 From: DAW at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: IBM field service was Re: ST-225 help needed Message-ID: <9011A52E011ED311B4280004AC1BA61501467AA8@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu> > From: "Joe" > > > At 07:02 PM 7/23/02 -0700, Fred wrote: > > > > > > >In their early days of the PC, IBM had worse field staff than Radio > Shack > > >did! > > > > Wow! That's hard to beleive! Especially since RS had no field service > AFIK and the service in the "Service Centers" was utterly worthlss! > > > > Joe > > > > > > ---------- > From: Curt Vendel > > That's cause the IBM field service guys spent too much time typing to > fellow > friends and co-workers on their wireless XT handhelds.... man those things > were cool!!!!!!!!!!!! > > Curt > > Are you talking about those things with the 2 (or is it 3?) line LCD displays? You know, the brick? That's about the size of them... -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1 - Darwin Kernel Version 5 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash From eric at brouhaha.com Wed Jul 24 14:26:02 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:17 2005 Subject: Hidden codes in NEC 8080A In-Reply-To: <200207241856.LAA25233@clulw009.amd.com> References: <200207241856.LAA25233@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: <39484.64.169.63.74.1027538529.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Dwight Elvey wrote: > I started to look and see what hidden > codes might be in this processor. Is that different than what an Intel 8080A does? The undefined opcodes of the Intel 8085 are rather more interesting, I'm told. From dtwright at uiuc.edu Wed Jul 24 15:41:01 2002 From: dtwright at uiuc.edu (Dan Wright) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Sun IPC OS? In-Reply-To: <20020724165445.A2270@unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> References: <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com> <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com> <20020724094154.S28047@MissSophie.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> <3.0.2.32.20020724082945.0076678c@pop1.epm.net.co> <20020724160223.B1882@unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> <20020724140949.GB330068@uiuc.edu> <20020724165445.A2270@unixag-kl.fh-kl.de> Message-ID: <20020724204018.GB366613@uiuc.edu> Jochen Kunz said: > On Wed, Jul 24, 2002 at 09:09:49AM -0500, Dan Wright wrote: > > > > You will have trouble building GNU stuff on anything other than Linux, > > > or at least a x86 / litle endian / 32 bit machine with gcc. > > That's not true. I've built a significant portion of the GNU stuff on IRIX > > 6.5.x, Solaris 2.5-2.8, HPUX 10.20 and 11i, and AIX 4.3.2, > GCC or the "native" compiler of the *ix? (e.g. MIPS Pro on IRIX?) Native, usually. > > I must admit that it is not that bad than my statemant above may > sound. But I have build a lot of GNU stuff (including lage parts > GNOME) on my Alpha running Tru64 5.1 with the DEC/Comcrap/HPaq > C compiler and sometimes it was really nasty. I used to test new (to me) UNIX computers by getting them to run Enlightenment. That is a lot of fun ;) the most painful part of the process is usually not the GNU stuff, but getting a non-broken (i.e., not mangled by the vendor) version of X installed... > -- > > > > tsch??, > Jochen > > Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/ - Dan Wright (dtwright@uiuc.edu) (http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright) -] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [- ``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread, For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.'' Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Wed Jul 24 15:49:01 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Hidden codes in NEC 8080A Message-ID: <200207242047.NAA25306@clulw009.amd.com> >From: "Eric Smith" > >Dwight Elvey wrote: >> I started to look and see what hidden >> codes might be in this processor. > >Is that different than what an Intel 8080A does? Hi Eric I'll have to try it out. I'm not sure how the intel ones respond. > >The undefined opcodes of the Intel 8085 are >rather more interesting, I'm told. There were suppose to be a couple of block move instructions. They put these in to compete with Z80 ones but never released them as part of the instruction set. This was why I thought there was something extra in the NEC chip. I recall, way back when I was working for Intel that we had a list of the hidden operations that chips did. I could swear that there was something in the NEC 8080A that I'd confirmed by running some code on my Poly-88. I guess my mind is just playing tricks. The 8085 stuff is for real, though. I don't have something easy to test it on. The Poly-88 has a great monitor that I can single step with and examine every thing. I think I have a 8085/8088 S100 board around someplace. Maybe for future fiddling I'll see what it does. If I think of it, I can check the intel 8080A tonight. Later Dwight From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 24 20:02:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 24, 2 00:26:11 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1878 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020724/0169bcec/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 24 20:06:58 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: HARRIS 7611's In-Reply-To: <3D3EA949.9010900@tiac.net> from "Bob Shannon" at Jul 24, 2 09:19:05 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 3393 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020724/bc4f8a97/attachment.ksh From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Jul 24 21:10:09 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > > The 8 pin chips are marked 4558. They probably are op-amps, but I haven't > > The 4558 is a very common dual op-amp. Thats good news I guess. > > I don't have a really nice transistor checker yet, but I do have a couple > > of pocket types that work well. I desoldered and tested all 4 1N4001s and > > all 4 transistors. I checked all of them with a one of the small testers, > > and then checked them all again manually with my DMM. None of those 8 > > parts appear to be bad. > > Pity. So the fault is elsewhere. Alas the rest of the circuitry is > sufficiently different in layout that I probably can't help you. I could > tell you that there are interesting signals on the outputs of op-amps, > but you'd never find them on your board. If the 4558 is common, why would I not find them? > But if you can get a 'scope, try looking at the signals on the 2 pin > servo input connector (preferably use a 'scope with differential -- A-B > -- mode). It would at least tell you if the servo head is reading > anything. I actually have a lead on some P6120 probes for my Tek 2213 scopes now, so maybe I'll be able to use them in a few weeks. Now if only I could find the Operator and Service manuals... > > I certainly don't hear the heads moving, but I'm not sure how noisy these > > drives are anyway. > > Try holding the drive in your hand as it spins up (you only need to have > the power cable connected, of course). You can normally feel the heads > moving. Of course, I'll have to reassemble the unit again. I'm afraid I'm gonna wear the connectors out taking the boards off so much. Maybe I should build some cable extenders to help while troubleshooting... -Toth From foo at siconic.com Wed Jul 24 21:29:01 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Weird assed Apple ][ card Message-ID: Has anyone ever heard of a PaceMark Technologies IIEasy Print card for the Apple ][? You'd think it was some sort of printer interface with the name. However, the edge connector simply has power leads, no data or address. So this card cannot communicate with the Apple ][. I imagine it must have been a daughterboard for some other card? It has a copyright date of 1989 silk-screened on the board. It also has a DB-25 connector tail on the rear. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From jhfinepw4z at compsys.to Wed Jul 24 21:44:01 2002 From: jhfinepw4z at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: How to Print CD Label References: Message-ID: <3D3F6561.125D07E8@compsys.to> >chris wrote: > >I need some help with a ".tif" file. A scan was made of a CD label. > >The label can be printed on a laser printer and the result is great, > >but in the wrong position. > If you are printing to an Avery or compatible label, you can download > free templates from Avery's web site. The templates work with in MS Word > IIRC. Jerome Fine replies: While I am not sure who produced the labels I have, I did manage to download the Avery software. Thank you. Thank you also to John Foust for his suggestions and everyone else who replied. > Avery also sells some very nice label printing software that works with > 99% of their labels (they are a little slow to update the software, so > the newest label formats may not be supported, but as of right now, > everything I have ever seen sold is supported). > > Their label software allows you to print full sheets of labels, or any > number of labels to a sheet, and lets you pick the starting point on the > sheet (so you can use a partially used sheet). They also support graphic > importing, as well as mail merge, so you can print custom worded labels > for each label. I was able to transfer the image from the ".tif" files that I was sent (THANK YOU - you know who you are) to both of the labels in the template of CD labels. But when I printed the file on a blank sheet of paper, I was surprised that the quality is rather poor compared to the original RT-11 CD label that I already have. This was NOT the fault of the scan, but of the conversion software. I assume that the original label which uses only normal characters of 3 different sizes was able to avoid the problem. The other difficulty is that the actual images of the labels are not correctly aligned with the location of where the physical label is located on the sheet which holds the actual sticky labels. While the offset is only about 1/4", that distance is quite noticeable. But when I attempt to use the Avery program, there does not seem to be anything I can do to shift the labels. Can anyone suggest anything from their experience? This is using Windows 98 SE where I am a dummy!! Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From SUPRDAVE at aol.com Wed Jul 24 22:05:01 2002 From: SUPRDAVE at aol.com (SUPRDAVE@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Weird assed Apple ][ card Message-ID: <38.2b65473f.2a70c4af@aol.com> In a message dated 7/24/2002 10:29:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time, foo@siconic.com writes: << Has anyone ever heard of a PaceMark Technologies IIEasy Print card for the Apple ][? You'd think it was some sort of printer interface with the name. However, the edge connector simply has power leads, no data or address. So this card cannot communicate with the Apple ][. I imagine it must have been a daughterboard for some other card? It has a copyright date of 1989 silk-screened on the board. It also has a DB-25 connector tail on the rear. >> hmmm, with a 1989 date, I wonder if it could be for the GS. -- Antique Computer Virtual Museum www.nothingtodo.org From mythtech at mac.com Wed Jul 24 22:10:00 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: How to Print CD Label Message-ID: >which holds the actual sticky labels. While the offset is only about 1/4", >that distance is quite noticeable. But when I attempt to use the Avery >program, there does not seem to be anything I can do to shift the labels. >Can anyone suggest anything from their experience? This is using >Windows 98 SE where I am a dummy!! If you are using the MS Word templates, I think you can just adjust the lines or margins to shift the image offset. If you are using the actual Avery LabelPro software, there is a printer nudge feature (at least on the Mac, I don't really use the PC version often so I'm not 100% sure on that, but I would think it is there too). With the printer nudge, you can tell it to offset the image in incriments (1/100th of an inch IIRC). That offset will let you move it up/down or left right. I have found that the Avery LablePro software doesn't seem to print the very bottom of the image on my DeskJet 855. It drops about the last 1/4" of the image (not offset, but rather just missing). It seems to be just that printer that it happens with, and I'm not 100% positive that it isn't the printer doing it (read: I haven't really tried it with other software to see if everything is just missing at that point, but nothing else has popped out at me). With my laser printers, the images always print correctly (so my color CD backgrounds I just used a striped image so you can't tell the bottom is cut off, rather it just looks like part of the image design) -chris From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Jul 24 22:17:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Weird assed Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Jul 2002, Sellam Ismail wrote: > Has anyone ever heard of a PaceMark Technologies IIEasy Print card for > the Apple ][? You'd think it was some sort of printer interface with > the name. However, the edge connector simply has power leads, no data > or address. So this card cannot communicate with the Apple ][. I > imagine it must have been a daughterboard for some other card? > > It has a copyright date of 1989 silk-screened on the board. It also has > a DB-25 connector tail on the rear. What kind of chips does it use? Maybe its a printer buffer of some sort? -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Jul 24 22:21:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: How to Print CD Label In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Jul 2002, Chris wrote: > I have found that the Avery LablePro software doesn't seem to print the > very bottom of the image on my DeskJet 855. It drops about the last 1/4" > of the image (not offset, but rather just missing). It seems to be just > that printer that it happens with, and I'm not 100% positive that it > isn't the printer doing it (read: I haven't really tried it with other > software to see if everything is just missing at that point, but nothing > else has popped out at me). With my laser printers, the images always > print correctly (so my color CD backgrounds I just used a striped image > so you can't tell the bottom is cut off, rather it just looks like part > of the image design) IIRC, the HP DeskJet 800 series can't print on the last 1/4" or so of the page due to their design. I think this is a common problem with other DeskJets too. -Toth From mythtech at mac.com Wed Jul 24 22:48:05 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: How to Print CD Label Message-ID: >IIRC, the HP DeskJet 800 series can't print on the last 1/4" or so of the >page due to their design. I think this is a common problem with other >DeskJets too. Well, at least in my case, I know the cutoff is kind of high. High enough, that I don't think it is page grab space. The CD label stops a good inch up from the bottom, so it is failing to print 1/4" above that. If it was something that mattered a whole lot to me, I would get around to testing to see if it is the DeskJet, or the Avery software, or an interaction between the two (the third is my guess, simply because I used to use the DeskJet all the time, and never noticed a problem, and the Avery software has no problems printing to my laser printers for full pages. Also, I know the latest version of the Mac software had a problem with Epson printers, where it froze the Mac... Avery recently released a patch to fix that, so they may have a problem with HP DeskJet printers as well). -chris From foo at siconic.com Thu Jul 25 00:14:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Weird assed Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Jul 2002, Tothwolf wrote: > > Has anyone ever heard of a PaceMark Technologies IIEasy Print card for > > the Apple ][? You'd think it was some sort of printer interface with > > the name. However, the edge connector simply has power leads, no data > > or address. So this card cannot communicate with the Apple ][. I > > imagine it must have been a daughterboard for some other card? > > > > It has a copyright date of 1989 silk-screened on the board. It also has > > a DB-25 connector tail on the rear. > > What kind of chips does it use? Maybe its a printer buffer of some sort? Good guess. That was the thought of a colleague. It has a few Toshiba chips on it. Sorry, I don't have it with me currently but they seemed to have been some sort of memory chips. By chance I found I have a //e with the same card in it but there is no daughter board connected to it so the mystery remains. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From lincoln.fessenden at verizon.net Thu Jul 25 04:20:00 2002 From: lincoln.fessenden at verizon.net (linc fessenden) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Sun IPC OS? In-Reply-To: <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 21 Jul 2002, Tarsi wrote: > What do you all recommend I run on my Sun IPC machines for an OS? I've never > messed with them before, myself. Just got some new harddrives for them, > eager to try them out. > > Thanks! > > Tarsi > NetBSD. -- -Linc Fessenden In the Beginning there was nothing, which exploded - Yeah right... From jbmcb at hotmail.com Thu Jul 25 07:47:01 2002 From: jbmcb at hotmail.com (Jason McBrien) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Sun IPC OS? References: <200207212357.03899.tarsi@binhost.com> Message-ID: Fun OSes: SunOS (4 or 2.x for an older Sparc) NetBSD (Runs on *anything*) OpenBSD (Similar to NetBSD in it's support of Sparc) Linux (Debian has a nice Sparc distro. Older versions of Redhat, too) OpenStep (Hard to find, use the original MacOS X :) Amoeba (Like linux/beowulf) Inferno (Runs on Solaris 2.6?) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tarsi" To: Sent: Monday, July 22, 2002 12:57 AM Subject: Sun IPC OS? > What do you all recommend I run on my Sun IPC machines for an OS? I've never > messed with them before, myself. Just got some new harddrives for them, > eager to try them out. > > Thanks! > > Tarsi > > From jhfinepw4z at compsys.to Thu Jul 25 08:18:01 2002 From: jhfinepw4z at compsys.to (Jerome H. Fine) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: How to Print CD Label References: Message-ID: <3D3FFA30.909FD8F5@compsys.to> >Chris wrote: > >which holds the actual sticky labels. While the offset is only about 1/4", > >that distance is quite noticeable. But when I attempt to use the Avery > >program, there does not seem to be anything I can do to shift the labels. > >Can anyone suggest anything from their experience? This is using > >Windows 98 SE where I am a dummy!! > If you are using the actual Avery LabelPro software, there is a printer > nudge feature (at least on the Mac, I don't really use the PC version > often so I'm not 100% sure on that, but I would think it is there too). > With the printer nudge, you can tell it to offset the image in incriments > (1/100th of an inch IIRC). That offset will let you move it up/down or > left right. Jerome Fine replies: It does not seem as if the feature is there on the Windows 98 SE version. There is no icon that I have discovered that refers to "nudge". There are some alignment icons, but I have not, as yet, discovered how to activate them. > I have found that the Avery LablePro software doesn't seem to print the > very bottom of the image on my DeskJet 855. It drops about the last 1/4" > of the image (not offset, but rather just missing). It seems to be just > that printer that it happens with, and I'm not 100% positive that it > isn't the printer doing it (read: I haven't really tried it with other > software to see if everything is just missing at that point, but nothing > else has popped out at me). With my laser printers, the images always > print correctly (so my color CD backgrounds I just used a striped image > so you can't tell the bottom is cut off, rather it just looks like part > of the image design) In my case, I probably have about 1/2" at the top and bottom of leeway between the printed area and the edge of the form. The actual label that is ready to be lifted from the page - wasting all the rest of the page of course since that is the only economical way the manufacture the sheets which contain 2 labels on the standard 8 1/2" by 11" pages - is in the middle of the sheet and each start 9/16" below the top and 3/4" above the bottom with about 3/8" between the 2 labels. Since each label is 4 5/8" in diameter, the total is 10 15/16, so each of those measurements must be slightly low - or my eyes can't see well enough. In any case, the problem is NOT with the printer, but with my lack of being able to understand the Avery label program in that I can't figure out how to paste the scanned information to a slightly different location relative to the template location of the labels that Avery provides. Any ideas?????????????? Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year. From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Thu Jul 25 11:44:00 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Hidden codes in NEC 8080A Message-ID: <200207251642.JAA25958@clulw009.amd.com> >From: "Eric Smith" > >Dwight Elvey wrote: >> I started to look and see what hidden >> codes might be in this processor. > >Is that different than what an Intel 8080A does? Hi First, there was an error in my previous list. The 0D9h does a RET and not a CALL. I looked at a Intel 8080A last night. All of the codes seemed to do the same. The values in the PSW were different. On the Intel part, bits 5 and 3 always returned '0' while bit 1 always returned '1'. Compared to the NEC that always returned '1' on both 1 and 3 but had the -/+ on bit 5. Dwight > >The undefined opcodes of the Intel 8085 are >rather more interesting, I'm told. > > > > From dbwood at kc.rr.com Thu Jul 25 14:17:01 2002 From: dbwood at kc.rr.com (Douglas Wood) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: How to Print CD Label References: <3D3FFA30.909FD8F5@compsys.to> Message-ID: <0aa501c2340f$93bebd20$6401a8c0@kc.rr.com> Try Surething's CD Labeler v3.0 (you can get it at Best Buy). Comes with thousands of background images and clipart and will print on every type of CD label stock available. Douglas Wood Software Engineer dbwood@kc.rr.com Home of the EPICIS Development System for the PIC and SX http://epicis.piclist.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerome H. Fine" To: Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2002 8:16 AM Subject: Re: How to Print CD Label > >Chris wrote: > > > >which holds the actual sticky labels. While the offset is only about 1/4", > > >that distance is quite noticeable. But when I attempt to use the Avery > > >program, there does not seem to be anything I can do to shift the labels. > > >Can anyone suggest anything from their experience? This is using > > >Windows 98 SE where I am a dummy!! > > If you are using the actual Avery LabelPro software, there is a printer > > nudge feature (at least on the Mac, I don't really use the PC version > > often so I'm not 100% sure on that, but I would think it is there too). > > With the printer nudge, you can tell it to offset the image in incriments > > (1/100th of an inch IIRC). That offset will let you move it up/down or > > left right. > > Jerome Fine replies: > > It does not seem as if the feature is there on the Windows 98 SE version. > There is no icon that I have discovered that refers to "nudge". There are > some alignment icons, but I have not, as yet, discovered how to activate > them. > > > I have found that the Avery LablePro software doesn't seem to print the > > very bottom of the image on my DeskJet 855. It drops about the last 1/4" > > of the image (not offset, but rather just missing). It seems to be just > > that printer that it happens with, and I'm not 100% positive that it > > isn't the printer doing it (read: I haven't really tried it with other > > software to see if everything is just missing at that point, but nothing > > else has popped out at me). With my laser printers, the images always > > print correctly (so my color CD backgrounds I just used a striped image > > so you can't tell the bottom is cut off, rather it just looks like part > > of the image design) > > In my case, I probably have about 1/2" at the top and bottom of leeway > between the printed area and the edge of the form. The actual label > that is ready to be lifted from the page - wasting all the rest of the page > of course since that is the only economical way the manufacture the > sheets which contain 2 labels on the standard 8 1/2" by 11" pages - > is in the middle of the sheet and each start 9/16" below the top and 3/4" > above the bottom with about 3/8" between the 2 labels. Since each > label is 4 5/8" in diameter, the total is 10 15/16, so each of those > measurements must be slightly low - or my eyes can't see well enough. > > In any case, the problem is NOT with the printer, but with my lack > of being able to understand the Avery label program in that I can't > figure out how to paste the scanned information to a slightly different > location relative to the template location of the labels that Avery > provides. Any ideas?????????????? > > Sincerely yours, > > Jerome Fine > -- > If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail > address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk > e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be > obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the > 'at' with the four digits of the current year. > > > > From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Jul 25 14:58:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Weird assed Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: from "Sellam Ismail" at Jul 24, 2 11:28:25 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 905 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020725/768f55c0/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Thu Jul 25 15:00:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 24, 2 09:16:22 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1520 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020725/80777808/attachment.ksh From aw288 at osfn.org Thu Jul 25 18:49:01 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Teletypes and a Univac Message-ID: Two things of note: There is a warehouse in Northern New Jersey I am currently cleaning out with lots of Teletypes in all shapes, sizes, and flavors. There are old types, "new" types, 5 level, 8 level, probably some Kleinschmidts and Seimens, paper tape readers, repeaters, test sets, even some of the weird wall-mount Teletypes. And parts - thousands of parts, many never used, still in the wrappings. Many of these units are military surplus, some from World War 2. Prices are right - most of it can be had for a cold beverage. It all has to go, and the scrap metal dumpster is calling. Contact me off list for details. I can not ship anything - it is all pick-up only. Hours are mostly Monday thru Friday 10 thru 5-ish, although if you think you will take bunches of the stuff, Saturday *may* be an option. There is a loading dock. (if someone could post this to the Greenkeys list, that would be great) In other news... Somehow between days of backbreaking warehouse work in the Garden State, I need to pick up a big old Univac 9300 soon. Loading should not be a problem, but I may need a hand at my house, unloading, in Carmel, NY (that is near Danbury, CT). Pizza and beer on me. Any takers? William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From aw288 at osfn.org Thu Jul 25 20:06:01 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I would like to add that things are pretty much going to be first-come-first-served at the warehouse. Also, I have no inventory of what is there - just the experience of digging thru the piles. If you want, please ask about the availablitity of anything, but just don't quote me on it... William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From tony.eros at machm.org Thu Jul 25 20:21:01 2002 From: tony.eros at machm.org (Tony Eros) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.0.20020725211720.02f39e80@mail.njd.concentric.com> William - I'd like to snag some of the gear, if possible. I'll be in Lyndhurst (near the NJ Meadowlands) on Monday and Tuesday -- any chance I could stop by? Do you think there'll be much left by then? Thanks! -- Tony At 09:04 PM 7/25/2002 -0400, you wrote: >I would like to add that things are pretty much going to be >first-come-first-served at the warehouse. Also, I have no inventory of >what is there - just the experience of digging thru the piles. If you >want, please ask about the availablitity of anything, but just don't >quote me on it... > >William Donzelli >aw288@osfn.org From tony.eros at machm.org Thu Jul 25 20:31:01 2002 From: tony.eros at machm.org (Tony Eros) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more) In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.0.20020725211720.02f39e80@mail.njd.concentric.com> References: Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.0.20020725212741.02ecc7f8@mail.njd.concentric.com> Replied to the list again -- sorry... Sheesh! Now I've made it worse by replying to my reply! I feel like the Knights Who Say Ni! "Don't say it! Now I've said it! I've said it again!" -- Tony At 09:19 PM 7/25/2002 -0400, you wrote: >William - > >I'd like to snag some of the gear, if possible. I'll be in Lyndhurst >(near the NJ Meadowlands) on Monday and Tuesday -- any chance I could stop >by? Do you think there'll be much left by then? > >Thanks! > >-- Tony > >At 09:04 PM 7/25/2002 -0400, you wrote: >>I would like to add that things are pretty much going to be >>first-come-first-served at the warehouse. Also, I have no inventory of >>what is there - just the experience of digging thru the piles. If you >>want, please ask about the availablitity of anything, but just don't >>quote me on it... >> >>William Donzelli >>aw288@osfn.org > > From celt at chisp.net Thu Jul 25 20:33:01 2002 From: celt at chisp.net (/mpm) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Weird assed Apple ][ card References: Message-ID: <3D40A63B.2080807@chisp.net> Sellam Ismail wrote: > Has anyone ever heard of a PaceMark Technologies IIEasy Print card for the > Apple ][? You'd think it was some sort of printer interface with the > name. However, the edge connector simply has power leads, no data or > address. So this card cannot communicate with the Apple ][. I imagine it > must have been a daughterboard for some other card? > > It has a copyright date of 1989 silk-screened on the board. It also has a > DB-25 connector tail on the rear. > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > The II Easy Print system was a 256K or 512K (expandable to 2 Meg) self-switching buffered box that connected SuperSerial cards from up to 5 IIe's to the same ImageWriter II printer, though I recall hearing you could get up to 7 working connections with a little effort. On the IIgs and the Mac, it used ports (PCs were also supported). Made by PaceMark and available through various Apple hardware dealers of the day. Cost about $600 IIRC, for 5 connections and 512K. The card you have is a buffer for the box. Mike /mpm From foo at siconic.com Thu Jul 25 20:47:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Weird assed Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > Any other connectors on the board (possibly a 26 pin header for a > parallel input from another card)? What are the main chips on the board? Just a 14-pin header near the 25-pin header. Chips are: (2) Toshiba TC51832PL-12 Hyundai HY6116AP-15 a 64K ROM (6) Harris CDP65C51AE2 and a GTE 65SC102 (which is, what, a faster than 1Mhz 65C02?) > My first guesses are that it's either a printer buffer (takes in data > fast from a conventional Apple ][ printer card, sends it to the printer > as and when the latter can accept it) or that it's some kind of data > translater to make a strange printer emulate an Epson or similar. Would make sense but the 14-pin header doesn't lend credence to that theory. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From Pillboxman2002 at btopenworld.com Thu Jul 25 21:34:02 2002 From: Pillboxman2002 at btopenworld.com (Derek Thompson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Amstrad PPC640 Message-ID: <000801c2341b$fdfef0e0$984d01d5@z3v0v2> I have recently come across a nice Amstrad PPC640 portable (but heavy!) computer, with the case and the whole lot..even a power supply, which is often missing from this kind of stuff and it can take years of going round boot sales to get replacements with the more unusual ones...Upon plugging it in to the mains and switching on, everything seems to be fine..it starts buzzing and the screen comes up with "Please Wait...." It then scans drives a and b and lets out three short bleeps..I thought these may be due to it needing a boot disk, as these things have no hard disk so obviously need something..both drives a and b are 31/2" 720k, so I made some MS-DOS 6.22 boot disks on my 386 using 720k disks..obviously they did nothing in drive b, but when I put them in driveA I sti;ll got my bleeps, but it started to read from the disk..the screen went blank so I waited assuming it would ask for the date and time, or come up with command..but nothing - a blank screen...but when I typed in B: or A: followed by [enter] it procceed to try and scan that particular drive. I have no idea why this is and need help from someone more farmiliar with the machine..but just for a guess I'd say if this machine was made in 1988, Dos 6 ismore recent than the portable, so I'd need probably dos 3.3 or something. Can anyone help me with the laptop or getting dos 3.3? I'm totally stuck! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020725/8532aff6/attachment.html From aw288 at osfn.org Thu Jul 25 21:37:01 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more more) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Here are some answers to some common questions I have been getting: Pricing is damn good. Basically, all parts, even new, are free. I might actually *make* you take more than you need. Some of the Teletypes have a price tag - World War 2 TG-7s and MITEs will be market priced, 33s and 35s will be cheap (no Ebay prices here - probably free to $25), most others will actually cost you a cold beverage (the building has no water currently so *cold* drinks are most welcome) or two. Some of the more interesting Teletype doodads will also be in the free to cheap range (more free than cheap). The other junk in the warehouse (_no_ digital computer stuff, folks, so don't expect any PDP things) will actually cost money. I am far more interested at this point, however, in making the Teletype stuff disappear. If you come for Teletypes, certainly you can look around, however. I will need to have a few days notice, as I would like to give the building owners some warning that I will be having guests. Next week, or the week after, are probably good times - Mondays thru Fridays, business hours, in Paterson, NJ (bring a baseball bat and leave your expensive car in the garage). You will get dirty. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From foo at siconic.com Fri Jul 26 01:44:01 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Weird assed Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: <3D40A63B.2080807@chisp.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Jul 2002, /mpm wrote: > The II Easy Print system was a 256K or 512K (expandable to 2 Meg) > self-switching buffered box that connected SuperSerial cards from up to > 5 IIe's to the same ImageWriter II printer, though I recall hearing you > could get up to 7 working connections with a little effort. > > On the IIgs and the Mac, it used ports (PCs were also supported). > > Made by PaceMark and available through various Apple hardware dealers of > the day. Cost about $600 IIRC, for 5 connections and 512K. > > The card you have is a buffer for the box. Thanks for the info. Tony was mostly right after all ;) Have any idea what the box looks like so I can keep an eye out for it? Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From geoffr at zipcon.net Fri Jul 26 04:06:01 2002 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Weird assed Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020726021626.00aa9af0@mail.zipcon.net> This may give you a lead as to what it is..... Pace was also co-founder and President of PaceMark Technologies, a firm that designed and manufactured computer networking hardware and peripherals for the education marketplace. http://ground.icaen.uiowa.edu/apple2/Collections/AOL/Educational/Transcripts/Quality.Comp.chat.0123.txt At 08:40 PM 7/25/02 +0100, you wrote: > > > > > > Has anyone ever heard of a PaceMark Technologies IIEasy Print card for the > > Apple ][? You'd think it was some sort of printer interface with the > > name. However, the edge connector simply has power leads, no data or > > address. So this card cannot communicate with the Apple ][. I imagine it > > must have been a daughterboard for some other card? > > > > It has a copyright date of 1989 silk-screened on the board. It also has a > > DB-25 connector tail on the rear. > >Any other connectors on the board (possibly a 26 pin header for a >parallel input from another card)? What are the main chips on the board? > >My first guesses are that it's either a printer buffer (takes in data >fast from a conventional Apple ][ printer card, sends it to the printer >as and when the latter can accept it) or that it's some kind of data >translater to make a strange printer emulate an Epson or similar. > >-tony From celt at chisp.net Fri Jul 26 09:42:01 2002 From: celt at chisp.net (Mike Maginnis) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Weird assed Apple ][ card References: Message-ID: <3D415F66.6090504@chisp.net> Sellam Ismail wrote: > On Thu, 25 Jul 2002, /mpm wrote: > > >>The II Easy Print system was a 256K or 512K (expandable to 2 Meg) >>self-switching buffered box that connected SuperSerial cards from up to >>5 IIe's to the same ImageWriter II printer, though I recall hearing you >>could get up to 7 working connections with a little effort. >> >>On the IIgs and the Mac, it used ports (PCs were also supported). >> >>Made by PaceMark and available through various Apple hardware dealers of >>the day. Cost about $600 IIRC, for 5 connections and 512K. >> >>The card you have is a buffer for the box. > > > Thanks for the info. Tony was mostly right after all ;) > > Have any idea what the box looks like so I can keep an eye out for it? > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > I don't recall ever seeing one - just reading the press releases in the Apple II rags that were still around at the time ('88 or '89, IIRC). It was billed mostly as printer sharing solution for those who couldn't afford a network. I believe PaceMark was bought by Okidata in the early 90's, so they might be able to provide some insight. Mike /mpm From kentborg at borg.org Fri Jul 26 11:53:00 2002 From: kentborg at borg.org (Kent Borg) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more more) In-Reply-To: ; from aw288@osfn.org on Thu, Jul 25, 2002 at 10:33:58PM -0400 References: Message-ID: <20020726125155.A5873@borg.org> Teletypes in New Jersey, and I am in Boston. Damn. -kb From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Fri Jul 26 12:13:01 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more more) Message-ID: <200207261712.KAA26681@clulw009.amd.com> >From: "Kent Borg" > >Teletypes in New Jersey, and I am in Boston. Damn. > >-kb > Hi Maybe we could get someone that is in the area to deal with shipping various items ( for a small overhead ). I could use a few items myself, for a 33. Of course an entire machine would make a good spare but shipping cost a lot and they really are too heavy to put in a cardboard box ( that is why I need some parts ). Is there anyone in the area that could work as a middle man? Dwight wish list: 1. Outside plastic case for a asr33. 2. Tape reader latch or spare reader. 3. Power module for a tape reader. From andyh at andyh-rayleigh.freeserve.co.uk Fri Jul 26 12:39:00 2002 From: andyh at andyh-rayleigh.freeserve.co.uk (Andy Holt) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more more) In-Reply-To: <20020726125155.A5873@borg.org> Message-ID: <000301c234cb$369f2500$4d4d2c0a@atx> > Teletypes in New Jersey, and I am in Boston. Damn. > You are complaining? - It's a lot further to drive from England :-( Andy From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 26 12:47:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more more) In-Reply-To: <200207261712.KAA26681@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: <20020726174553.83171.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> --- "Dwight K. Elvey" wrote: > >From: "Kent Borg" > > > >Teletypes in New Jersey, and I am in Boston. Damn. > > > >-kb > > > > Hi > Maybe we could get someone that is in the area to > deal with shipping various items ( for a small overhead ). I'd love that. > wish list: > 1. Outside plastic case for a asr33. > 2. Tape reader latch or spare reader. > 3. Power module for a tape reader. I'd love to get a plastic print-area cover, the one that's hinged (not the entire cover), to replace a broken one. Depending on what kind of parts are there, I'd love to get the print mechanism assembly that slides on the rails. (all for ASR-33) Now... if there are any gram-weight tension gauges or spring hooks or other essential TTY maintenance tools in with the parts, I could *really* use a set of those - then I would have a chance of maintaining the 33 I have. Shame I'm in Ohio. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From doc at mdrconsult.com Fri Jul 26 14:34:04 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:18 2005 Subject: Fwd: who need a pdp11/20 Message-ID: In case anybody doesn't follow any of the 6 NGs this was posted to.... As usual, I don't know this guy from Adam, please respond to him not me. Doc From: "J.Fossy Weinzinger" Subject: who need a pdp11/20 Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10,alt.sys.pdp11,alt.sys.pdp8,comp.os.vms,de.comp.os.vms,vmsnet.pdp-11 Followup-To: alt.sys.pdp10 Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 14:37:52 +0200 hello, i own a pdp11/20 and in the near future i will not have enaugh room for it :-( so i will find sombody who want it the place where it is: austria, vienna, 1190 oh yes - it does not work :-( but you can repair it as i did 10 years ago so if you have interest and live near vienna write an email Fossy j.fossy@maxonline.at From mtapley at swri.edu Fri Jul 26 17:27:00 2002 From: mtapley at swri.edu (Mark Tapley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Calling PS2 owners: machine needed (in Texas?) In-Reply-To: <20020726170001.65235.85542.Mailman@huey.classiccmp.org> Message-ID: Folks with plenty of PS2 parts, etc. to spare, SwRI sent around the following notice this afternoon: >2. Old Computers/ Parts Needed > >Division 08 has a specific application where an old personal computer system >must be kept operational for a few more years. Can anyone make available >parts (hard drives, floppy drives, etc) or complete computers of the IBM >PS2, Model 30, 286 type? Please contact Brian Koehler at ext. 3588 or e-mail >(mail to: BKoehler@swri.org ). Payment can be arranged as needed. This isn't exactly a hobby use, but it does concern on-topic machines; apologies in advance if this kind of post is not welcome here. Full phone number is (210)-522-3588 for Brian, or (210)-522-6025 for me if you want to check with me first, or email me at mtapley@swri.edu. SwRI is in San Antonio, Texas, and I assume that that's where the machine is needed - will update if that's not true. - Mark From jcwren at jcwren.com Fri Jul 26 17:46:01 2002 From: jcwren at jcwren.com (J.C. Wren) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Calling PS2 owners: machine needed (in Texas?) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I see stacks of these at hamfests for $5 each, and they usually give them away at the end of the day. If he can't find one, he's not trying very hard. --John -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Mark Tapley Sent: Friday, July 26, 2002 18:24 To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Cc: BKoehler@swri.org Subject: Calling PS2 owners: machine needed (in Texas?) Folks with plenty of PS2 parts, etc. to spare, SwRI sent around the following notice this afternoon: >2. Old Computers/ Parts Needed > >Division 08 has a specific application where an old personal computer system >must be kept operational for a few more years. Can anyone make available >parts (hard drives, floppy drives, etc) or complete computers of the IBM >PS2, Model 30, 286 type? Please contact Brian Koehler at ext. 3588 or e-mail >(mail to: BKoehler@swri.org ). Payment can be arranged as needed. This isn't exactly a hobby use, but it does concern on-topic machines; apologies in advance if this kind of post is not welcome here. Full phone number is (210)-522-3588 for Brian, or (210)-522-6025 for me if you want to check with me first, or email me at mtapley@swri.edu. SwRI is in San Antonio, Texas, and I assume that that's where the machine is needed - will update if that's not true. - Mark From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Fri Jul 26 18:55:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Weird assed Apple ][ card In-Reply-To: from "Sellam Ismail" at Jul 25, 2 10:46:42 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 1176 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020726/dc98ca17/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Fri Jul 26 18:58:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Amstrad PPC640 In-Reply-To: <000801c2341b$fdfef0e0$984d01d5@z3v0v2> from "Derek Thompson" at Jul 25, 2 09:43:49 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 3429 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020726/0aab5f89/attachment.ksh From allain at panix.com Fri Jul 26 20:25:00 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: How to Print CD Label References: <3D3F6561.125D07E8@compsys.to> Message-ID: <06c601c2350c$3e1f17e0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Late to the subject but... I just measure the x,y offset of the label on its paper and subtract the x,y offset of the subject matter within the image. I then use these to set the margins in "Page Setup', assuming the image scale is correct. Else I use the 90% OnTopic program LView32.exe to scale it. It usually works out to: Print one on plain paper, measure the offset required, set the margins, print on label. John A. From notwax at yahoo.com Fri Jul 26 21:06:00 2002 From: notwax at yahoo.com (Wayne Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: pdp 11/34M (Military version) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020726202158.16747.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> I have an opportunity to get a pdp 11/34M + expansion unit which I understand is a militarized 11/34 sold by Norden and used in connection with the Nike missle system. Is this worth the effort to pay for cross-country shipping? Has anyone seen one of these before -- my understanding is that it doesn't look much like an off-the-shelf 11/34. -W __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From florit at unixville.com Fri Jul 26 21:08:07 2002 From: florit at unixville.com (Louis Florit) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: FF: Fortran Coding Form Pads... Message-ID: I found a stack (3) of 'Fortran Coding Form' pads with an IBM logo, GX28-7327-6 U/M 050, Printed in the USA. Legal size (8x17)Nice light green, one stack is pretty nice, the others show a little yellowing. Don't know what dates these were available for. The lab I found these at was created in 1973, so that's a good limit for the 'Wayback machine'. I assume these are what Fortran coders would arrange their code on before translating the code into the paperpunches. Header fields are Program, Programmer, Date, Punching Instructions (Graphic or Punch), Page Of, Card Electro Number. The main area is headed up with Comm (comment?), Statement Number, Cont (continue?), Fortran Statement, Identification Sequence, followed but miscellaneous squares numbered from 1 to 80. Asterisked comments at the bottom are "A standard card form, IBM 888157, is available for punching statements from this form" and "Number of forms per pad may vary slightly". [snicker- especially if you pulled a few out!] Anyone want For Free? I imagine it'd be a cool prop material for your classic cmp. I'll stuff it in an envelope and send it out bookrate. L From lists at subatomix.com Fri Jul 26 21:12:06 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more more) In-Reply-To: <200207261712.KAA26681@clulw009.amd.com> References: <200207261712.KAA26681@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: <3236361414.20020726211019@subatomix.com> On Friday, July 26, 2002, Dwight K. Elvey wrote: > Maybe we could get someone that is in the area to deal with shipping > various items ( for a small overhead ). YES! Someone *please* do this! I could *really* use an ASR-33! > shipping cost a lot and they really are too heavy to put in a cardboard > box Huh? Take 'em off their stand, and they're sufficiently small and light. I'd use a double-wall box (available from any serious box store), but they'll ship just fine. And I want one. -- Jeffrey Sharp The email address lists@subatomix.com is for mailing list traffic. Please send off-list mail to roach jay ess ess at wasp subatomix beetle dot com. You may need to remove some bugs first. From tothwolf at concentric.net Fri Jul 26 21:24:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > What I meant was that there are a dozen or more op-amps in the servo > circuitry. All much the same (sections of 4558s or similar). And what I > can't tell you is which of the dozen-or-more output pins you should clip > the 'scope onto. Which type of op-amp does your V150 drive use? > Are there not dealers in old manuals (or copies of same) in the States? > In the UK we have Mauritron who I would proably try first. There are a couple of commercial outfits that I'm aware of, but they charge $$$ for just photocopies. Maybe someone else here on the list knows of a better place to get them. > At least on the V150 there's a way of making up a kludgecable to connect > the end of the head flexiprint to the servo input connector and to power > lines. Then you can fold back the 'outer' board and still run the drive. I think I can do something similar with this one. I may end up having to make more than one cable though. > Just out of curiousity, what does it do if powered up with the head > flexipring unplugged? Any difference _at all_? It seems to act exactly the same. It certainly sounds different when I disconnect the servo connector though, so the head is at least trying to load. I don't hear it actually load though, so it may indeed be stuck. I think the V170 probably does have a head solenoid lock sealed inside the HDA, since it has a cable that would appear to power one. I'm wondering if the servo voltages are somewhat high because the microcontroller isn't able the swing the head in either direction... Seems like it might be time to open up the HDA... -Toth From lists at subatomix.com Fri Jul 26 21:44:17 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Misc free stuff available Message-ID: <14538264681.20020726214202@subatomix.com> First thing is a NeXT box. By this I mean an actual cardboard box that once contained a NeXTstation. It's white and has a big NeXT logo on each side. It has been taped and shipped several times, so it is only in OK condition. If you're into classic computer packaging, this might be nice. I've also got what looks like a HP-UX distribution. I've got the following 6 60m DDS tapes in a padded HP case: HP-UX INSTALL TAPE P/N 5011-0262 For the HP9000 S700 REV A.09.05 1 OF 1 Install FMT HP-UX RUNTIME 2-USER P/N B2352-13439 B2352A REV A.09.05 For the HP9000 S700 1 OF 1 Update FMT HP-UX RUNTIME SUPPORT P/N B2352-13440 B2352A REV A.09.05 For the HP9000 S700 1 OF 1 Support FMT X.25/9000 LINK P/N J2159-13604 For the Series 700 REV A.B9.00 J2159A OPT UJC 1 OF 1 UPDATE FMT For the HP9000 S700 DATE CODE 3345 FOCUS for HP-UX Rel651m 1.228C HP69C for OS 9.0 series 700/8004 HP9000 Series 700 P/N 24998-10692 CUSTOMIZED SOFTWARE Release 0901, VUF A.B9.01 I also have two media converters. One is 100Base-FX to 100Base-TX, and the other is 10Base-T to 10Base-FL. They don't come with wall warts, manuals, or anything else. This stuff is free, first come first served. You pay for the shipping. I will ship only to addresses within the USA. No exceptions. -- Jeffrey Sharp The email address lists@subatomix.com is for mailing list traffic. Please send off-list mail to roach jay ess ess at wasp subatomix beetle dot com. You may need to remove some bugs first. From rschaefe at gcfn.org Fri Jul 26 22:37:00 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill Message-ID: <007501c2351e$dc915c00$66469280@y5f3q8> Stopped in just on a lark, and listen to the wonderful deals to be had. 1) WebTV, console & keyboard, $49.99 2) IBM PC3270, apparently complete with docs, $49.99 And the deal of the day: 3) Gateway 4/66, box only, for the stunning price of (I kid you not) $149.99 #include obscene rant #twice And of course `We have a guy who prices stuff in the morning. I'll tell him about it. I can't change it.' I offered him $10 for the PC3270, but the odds of that price somehow getting on it are somewhere between a-snowball's-chance-in-h#ll and none. Maybe I should just move to Texas. Bob From doc at mdrconsult.com Fri Jul 26 23:00:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill In-Reply-To: <007501c2351e$dc915c00$66469280@y5f3q8> Message-ID: On Fri, 26 Jul 2002, Robert Schaefer wrote: > Stopped in just on a lark, and listen to the wonderful deals to be had. > Maybe I should just move to Texas. Nah, we're down to buying stuff off each other down here. :) Doc From fernande at internet1.net Fri Jul 26 23:20:01 2002 From: fernande at internet1.net (Chad Fernandez) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill References: <007501c2351e$dc915c00$66469280@y5f3q8> Message-ID: <3D421E8A.5060304@internet1.net> Robert Schaefer wrote: > Stopped in just on a lark, and listen to the wonderful deals to be had. > > 1) WebTV, console & keyboard, $49.99 > 2) IBM PC3270, apparently complete with docs, $49.99 > And the deal of the day: > 3) Gateway 4/66, box only, for the stunning price of (I kid you not) $149.99 > #include obscene rant > #twice > And of course `We have a guy who prices stuff in the morning. I'll tell him > about it. I can't change it.' > > I offered him $10 for the PC3270, but the odds of that price somehow getting > on it are somewhere between a-snowball's-chance-in-h#ll and none. > > Maybe I should just move to Texas. > > Bob That's about the way one of the two local Goodwills is here in Battle Creek, Michigan. Actually, I haven't found much of any computer stuff at that particular Goodwill in the last few months.... I wonder if they are turning it away or pitching it. I gave them a pair of monitors awhile back, and never saw them on the sales floor. I suppose they could have sold quickly, if they put a decent price on them. Chad Fernandez Michigan, USA From univac2 at earthlink.net Sat Jul 27 00:21:07 2002 From: univac2 at earthlink.net (Owen Robertson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more more) In-Reply-To: <3236361414.20020726211019@subatomix.com> Message-ID: on 7/26/02 9:10 PM, Jeffrey Sharp at lists@subatomix.com wrote: >> Maybe we could get someone that is in the area to deal with shipping >> various items ( for a small overhead ). > > YES! Someone *please* do this! I could *really* use an ASR-33! Just about everyone could. It's one of the things I need to complete my Nova 2 and 3 systems. Oh yeah, and my Honeywell 316, which I now have the manuals for. 8-) >> shipping cost a lot and they really are too heavy to put in a cardboard >> box > > Huh? Take 'em off their stand, and they're sufficiently small and light. I'd > use a double-wall box (available from any serious box store), but they'll > ship just fine. And I want one. Mine (now yours, Jeff) was shipped UPS and arrived just fine. So yes, they can be shipped. The man who sent it only did a so-so job of packing it, too, and it still made it all right. He took the main unit off the stand and wrapped it well, then put the rolls of paper and paper tape in the stand. -- Owen Robertson From jpero at sympatico.ca Sat Jul 27 01:11:01 2002 From: jpero at sympatico.ca (jpero@sympatico.ca) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20020727051509.UGNW6014.tomts15-srv.bellnexxia.net@duron> > Seems like it might be time to open up the HDA... > > -Toth > Is those one of V170 drives that made that *TINGggg!* like pong ping ball dropped on hard tabletop noise when finishes spun up and head arm hit zero track stop then made faint whir noise while it finds the servo track? I think these stops in those has no rubber (to stick) or locks so you don't have those that heads got stuck like on those early MFM/RLL, early small capacity with clear paint casing w/ aluninum top w/ cone head philips screws style micropolis drives. Head arm in parked position presses against one of rubber stop and got stuck hard enough that powerful voice coil couldn't pull free. Fix: open it up and with park lock soleoid (easy to see, it's external) depressed (from bottom), tug the arm free, put cover back on, run it up hooked to the computer, back up data, trash that crap. I fixed V170 up to get data recovered then threw out HD by wiping that platters. (!!) Because heads was squealing like crying pig with a painful thing somewhere. Heads were plowing through dirty tracks and it vibrated. That was around '94 or so. Cheers, Wizard From dave at naffnet.org.uk Sat Jul 27 01:13:01 2002 From: dave at naffnet.org.uk (Dave Woodman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more more) References: <000301c234cb$369f2500$4d4d2c0a@atx> Message-ID: <3D42398C.7EB1FF6C@naffnet.org.uk> Andy Holt wrote: > > Teletypes in New Jersey, and I am in Boston. Damn. > > > You are complaining? - It's a lot further to drive from England :-( > When we try, we get very, very wet, and the salt does the car's bodywork no good at all... Dave. From jpero at sympatico.ca Sat Jul 27 01:42:01 2002 From: jpero at sympatico.ca (jpero@sympatico.ca) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20020727051406.SIOO11295.tomts20-srv.bellnexxia.net@duron> > Seems like it might be time to open up the HDA... > > -Toth > Is those one of V170 drives that made that *TINGggg!* like pong ping ball dropped on hard tabletop noise when finishes spun up and head arm hit zero track stop then made faint whir noise while it finds the servo track? I think these stops in those has no rubber (to stick) or locks so you don't have those that heads got stuck like on those early MFM/RLL, early small capacity with clear paint casing w/ aluninum top w/ cone head philips screws style micropolis drives. Head arm in parked position presses against one of rubber stop and got stuck hard enough that powerful voice coil couldn't pull free. Fix: open it up and with park lock soleoid (easy to see, it's external) depressed (from bottom), tug the arm free, put cover back on, run it up hooked to the computer, back up data, trash that crap. I fixed V170 up to get data recovered then threw out HD by wiping that platters. (!!) Because heads was squealing like crying pig with a painful thing somewhere. Heads were plowing through dirty tracks and it vibrated. That was around '94 or so. Cheers, Wizard From jpero at sympatico.ca Sat Jul 27 03:01:01 2002 From: jpero at sympatico.ca (jpero@sympatico.ca) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20020727051509.UGNW6014.tomts15-srv.bellnexxia.net@duron> > Seems like it might be time to open up the HDA... > > -Toth > Is those one of V170 drives that made that *TINGggg!* like pong ping ball dropped on hard tabletop noise when finishes spun up and head arm hit zero track stop then made faint whir noise while it finds the servo track? I think these stops in those has no rubber (to stick) or locks so you don't have those that heads got stuck like on those early MFM/RLL, early small capacity with clear paint casing w/ aluninum top w/ cone head philips screws style micropolis drives. Head arm in parked position presses against one of rubber stop and got stuck hard enough that powerful voice coil couldn't pull free. Fix: open it up and with park lock soleoid (easy to see, it's external) depressed (from bottom), tug the arm free, put cover back on, run it up hooked to the computer, back up data, trash that crap. I fixed V170 up to get data recovered then threw out HD by wiping that platters. (!!) Because heads was squealing like crying pig with a painful thing somewhere. Heads were plowing through dirty tracks and it vibrated. That was around '94 or so. Cheers, Wizard From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Sat Jul 27 07:19:00 2002 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Panasonic KXP4400 - CHNG DRUM U27 Message-ID: <012b01c23567$5bef2ca0$0100000a@deepspacenine> Hi all, My prized laser printer, a Panasonic KXP4400, has just decided that the drum needs changing. I've put it into Service Mode and the drum pagecounter is only 2800; the drum is supposed to last 6000 sheets. I've come to the conclusion that the printer thinks the waste toner tank on the side of the OPC mech needs replacing. The OPC drum (the green roller) is fine; it's been printing OK for a while. Anyone know how to remove and empty the waste toner tank? To put it bluntly, I'm too cheap to buy a ?70 OPC drum when all that's wrong with the one I've got is a full waste toner tank! Thanks. -- Phil. philpem@dsl.pipex.com http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ From mythtech at mac.com Sat Jul 27 13:23:01 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: How to Print CD Label Message-ID: >It does not seem as if the feature is there on the Windows 98 SE version. >There is no icon that I have discovered that refers to "nudge". There are >some alignment icons, but I have not, as yet, discovered how to activate >them. I've looked and looked, but I can't find my PC version of the Avery Software (and it appears I uninstalled it at one point, as it isn't on my PC any more... I told you I don't use it very often, just the Mac version). In the Mac version, the Nudge option is in the File Menu, in place of what would normally be the Page Setup choice on a Mac (instead it says Printer Nudge). Maybe on the PC version it is also in the File Menu in place of the Page Setup? Sorry I can't be of better help (if I find the software soon, I'll install it and have a look around for the function) -chris From mythtech at mac.com Sat Jul 27 13:31:00 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill Message-ID: >Actually, I haven't found much of any computer stuff >at that particular Goodwill in the last few months.... I wonder if they >are turning it away or pitching it. The Salvation Army store near me, told me that they turn away CPU donations (but take all other computer parts). Beacuse they had too many people buying them, and then expecting support or wanting to return it when it didn't work right (I guess the large "everything is AS IS, all sales final" signs thruout the store weren't enough). However, on a whim, I drove around the back of their place where you drop off stuff one sunday (the place is closed on sundays... stupid blue laws of the town it is in). When I took a look, there were 3 early pentiums sitting on the ground, complete systems (CPU, monitor, keyboard, mouse, printer, software, speakers, you name it). So, my guess is, they only turn away those that they notice, I don't know what they do with the ones that get dropped off when no one is there (I would have taken them, but there was someone dropping off clothes at the time... I felt a little guilty ripping off a goodwill store, at least in front of other people). Maybe you can ask them at your store what their policy is. One of these days I plan to go in and mention my "sighting" in hopes that I can convince them to give me a chance to buy all unwanted CPUs before they do whatever with them. -chris From classiccmp at trailing-edge.com Sat Jul 27 13:34:00 2002 From: classiccmp at trailing-edge.com (Tim Shoppa) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: HARRIS 7611's In-Reply-To: from "Steve Robertson" at Jul 23, 2002 02:59:23 PM Message-ID: <20020727183326.279A218381@mudd.trailing-edge.com> > I need another set of BOOT ROMS for a HP1000 and cannot find a burner for > those devices. Does anyone have the resources (burner) to duplicate HARRIS > 7611's? I dug up my old Harris databooks (which I've kept largely for their wonderful IM6100 PDP-8-a-like CPU chips) and extracted the relevant pages. In addition to the programming algorithm, I've also included the list of recommended programmers and the paper tape format you can use if you want Harris to do the burning for you :-). See http://nomad.trailing-edge.com/~shoppa/harris/index.html Tim. From mythtech at mac.com Sat Jul 27 13:43:00 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more more) Message-ID: >> Maybe we could get someone that is in the area to deal with shipping >> various items ( for a small overhead ). > >YES! Someone *please* do this! I could *really* use an ASR-33! I'm very local to the town the warehouse is in (2 or so towns over, depending on what roads you take). And I am even used to the high crime areas it might be in (my wife is from one of the WORST parts of Jersey City... makes Paterson crime look peaceful). I would be happy to pick up and hold onto stuff, or ship it for people. BUT... I am rather ignorant when it comes to safely shipping heavy items (that is why I still have 4 IBM System 23 units on my floor... I can't figure out how to ship them, and I can't bear to throw them out when I know people that want them). If someone wants to give me a good breakdown of HOW to ship something heavy (how it needs to be packed, who to use as a carrier, where to get the packing materials)... AND if they want to cover the costs of said pickup (if I have to purchase the items from the warehouse), and shipping (materials and freight), I would be more than happy to go grab what peope want, and ship them off. Just remember, I am ignorant on how to do it, so don't get pissy if it doesn't survive, because any of this stuff will be a "learning experience" for me. Or if they will be in the NJ area and want to pick it up, I can store some stuff in a storage garage as long as it is out before the end of August (I am getting rid of it then). Anything longer than that has to go to the barnlike garage thing next to the leanto I live in. It is small and half full already, so I can't store much there (and it is open to the temperatures, and any animals that want to stop in since the walls stop about 4 inches short of the ground in most places) -chris From foo at siconic.com Sat Jul 27 13:46:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: pdp 11/34M (Military version) In-Reply-To: <20020726202158.16747.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 26 Jul 2002, Wayne Smith wrote: > I have an opportunity to get a pdp 11/34M + expansion > unit which I understand is a militarized 11/34 sold by > Norden and used in connection with the Nike missle > system. Is this worth the effort to pay for > cross-country shipping? Has anyone seen one of these > before -- my understanding is that it doesn't look > much like an off-the-shelf 11/34. I'll chime in a say yes. My suggestion for this is to use ForwardAir: http://www.forwardair.com It will require the person on the shipping end to take it to one of their depots (usually located near a major airport but not always) and it will have to be palletized and boxed (or at least covered with cardboard) but the shipping is cheap (around $.30/pound on average). You'll also have to pick it up at the depot on your end. You could also arrange local shipping from that point to your terminus. I've used ForwardAir twice with good success (once with a batch of Xerox 6085's and once with a large mainframe system on two pallets) but have heard stories of mishandling (some arcade game folks have had damage caused from the pallet being dropped). Just make sure it is secured onto the pallet well and you should have no problems. That being said, Brian Knittel got a good rate from a cross-country moving company (I forget which one) when he had his and Norm Alek's IBM 1030 shipped from Minnesota. Maybe either one will chime up here. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From foo at siconic.com Sat Jul 27 13:51:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Panasonic KXP4400 - CHNG DRUM U27 In-Reply-To: <012b01c23567$5bef2ca0$0100000a@deepspacenine> Message-ID: On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, Philip Pemberton wrote: > My prized laser printer, a Panasonic KXP4400, has just decided that > the drum needs changing. I've put it into Service Mode and the drum > pagecounter is only 2800; the drum is supposed to last 6000 sheets. I've > come to the conclusion that the printer thinks the waste toner tank on > the side of the OPC mech needs replacing. The OPC drum (the green > roller) is fine; it's been printing OK for a while. Anyone know how to > remove and empty the waste toner tank? To put it bluntly, I'm too cheap > to buy a £70 OPC drum when all that's wrong with the one I've got is a > full waste toner tank! We used one of these extensively at the company I used to work for, printing telephone service invoices. It was a very reliable printer. At any rate, Marilynn, our office manager, used to just dump the waste toner out of the collector bucket. It never seemed to adversely affect the printer, even though you're not supposed to do that. I had two of these (the one from the office and another one I picked up subsquently). I just got rid of one I believe as I have no more use for it since I got my very nice Xerox XD125f. I still have the other one but its fate is nearly decided. If you weren't all the way over in Jolly Olde England I would send you the one I still have for parts. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From foo at siconic.com Sat Jul 27 13:53:01 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, chris wrote: > However, on a whim, I drove around the back of their place where you > drop off stuff one sunday (the place is closed on sundays... stupid blue > laws of the town it is in). When I took a look, there were 3 early > pentiums sitting on the ground, complete systems (CPU, monitor, > keyboard, mouse, printer, software, speakers, you name it). So, my guess > is, they only turn away those that they notice, I don't know what they > do with the ones that get dropped off when no one is there (I would have > taken them, but there was someone dropping off clothes at the time... I > felt a little guilty ripping off a goodwill store, at least in front of > other people). Chance are they were probably sent off to be scrapped or something, so you should have come back later and grabbed them :) Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From mythtech at mac.com Sat Jul 27 15:13:01 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill Message-ID: >Chance are they were probably sent off to be scrapped or something, so you >should have come back later and grabbed them :) Yeah, I'm thinking they just chuck them in their dumpster... but I didn't poke around in it because of the other people there at the time. Since they were early Pentiums... I didn't care that much. Maybe tomorrow I will take a few old clothes to be "donated" and I'll poke around a bit more. I wonder if dumpsters are considered like curbside garbage, once you toss it, it is public domain? (I don't know the cops in that town as well, so I might get hassled if I am back there dumpster diving at 3am) -chris From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sat Jul 27 15:23:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more more) In-Reply-To: <3236361414.20020726211019@subatomix.com> from "Jeffrey Sharp" at Jul 26, 2 09:10:19 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 994 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020727/7044caaa/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sat Jul 27 15:24:44 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 26, 2 09:31:13 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 2158 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020727/31d737ab/attachment.ksh From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Sat Jul 27 17:35:01 2002 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Panasonic KXP4400 - CHNG DRUM U27 References: Message-ID: <002b01c235bd$83eaf620$0100000a@deepspacenine> "Sellam Ismail" said: > On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, Philip Pemberton wrote: > > > My prized laser printer, a Panasonic KXP4400, has just decided that > > the drum needs changing. I've put it into Service Mode and the drum > > pagecounter is only 2800; the drum is supposed to last 6000 sheets. I've > > come to the conclusion that the printer thinks the waste toner tank on > > the side of the OPC mech needs replacing. The OPC drum (the green > > roller) is fine; it's been printing OK for a while. Anyone know how to > > remove and empty the waste toner tank? To put it bluntly, I'm too cheap > > to buy a ?70 OPC drum when all that's wrong with the one I've got is a > > full waste toner tank! > > We used one of these extensively at the company I used to work for, > printing telephone service invoices. It was a very reliable printer. That's good to hear. Are they as reliable as a HP LJ-II? > At any rate, Marilynn, our office manager, used to just dump the waste > toner out of the collector bucket. It never seemed to adversely affect > the printer, even though you're not supposed to do that. I couldn't get the collector buchet off - only one screw on that side, took it out and it wouldn't pop off. So I pried it apart slightly and shook the junk into a sheet of newspaper. The green OPC drum was wrapped in a bin liner for protection and light proofing. Put it this way - I'll spend ?40 on four toner cartridges but I'm not going to spend ?75 on an OPC drum module. > I had two of these (the one from the office and another one I picked up > subsquently). I just got rid of one I believe as I have no more use for > it since I got my very nice Xerox XD125f. I still have the other one but > its fate is nearly decided. Damn... Could have used it as a parts machine... > If you weren't all the way over in Jolly Olde England I would send you the > one I still have for parts. Double DAMN!!!! Aparrently the 4400 has a "Life Over" error message - page count hits a certain number and the printer stops working. Period. Only way back is an E2PROM dump from a working machine. Knock the pagecount back to 00000 and the drum pagecount back to 00000 and that should sort the thing out. An evil hack but it should work. In theory. Does your one remaining KXP4400 have a RAM upgrade fitted? I need one for mine. 1MB is not enough for the sort of printing I do, Panasonic want $400 for a 4MB board and most companies over "the Big Pond" don't have any left :-( Thanks. -- Phil. philpem@dsl.pipex.com http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ From jrkeys at concentric.net Sat Jul 27 18:07:00 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill References: <007501c2351e$dc915c00$66469280@y5f3q8> Message-ID: <00ad01c235c2$237fa290$8c000240@oemcomputer> Do that we would love to have you here (it's a big place). :-) Because the webtv would have been $19.95 or less here. At Goodwill now most of their CPU's are $12.99 everyday and all monitors no matter how big or small cost $6.99. I see people with P-III's every time I go in, on Wednesday this guy was testing a P-III 850 mhz tower that was only $12.99. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Schaefer" To: Sent: Friday, July 26, 2002 10:36 PM Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill > Stopped in just on a lark, and listen to the wonderful deals to be had. > > 1) WebTV, console & keyboard, $49.99 > 2) IBM PC3270, apparently complete with docs, $49.99 > And the deal of the day: > 3) Gateway 4/66, box only, for the stunning price of (I kid you not) $149.99 > #include obscene rant > #twice > And of course `We have a guy who prices stuff in the morning. I'll tell him > about it. I can't change it.' > > I offered him $10 for the PC3270, but the odds of that price somehow getting > on it are somewhere between a-snowball's-chance-in-h#ll and none. > > Maybe I should just move to Texas. > > Bob > > From allain at panix.com Sat Jul 27 18:08:47 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Seeking Vectrix programming info. References: <002b01c235bd$83eaf620$0100000a@deepspacenine> Message-ID: <000901c235c2$24f5a0c0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Someone near where I live is selling a Vectrix for a decent price and while it would be OK as is... I programmed a vector graphics machine (Imlac) in my near-childhood (at 19) and it would be wonderful to be able to do that again. Does anybody remember seeing information on the instruction set of a Vectrix? It was closed architecture for a while but it should be publishable by now*. John A. (*and reply directly to me if you want to keep it private) From rschaefe at gcfn.org Sat Jul 27 18:23:04 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill References: Message-ID: <000a01c235c4$94f2d6c0$ac469280@y5f3q8> ----- Original Message ----- From: "chris" To: "Classic Computer" Sent: Saturday, July 27, 2002 04:12 PM Subject: Re: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill > >Chance are they were probably sent off to be scrapped or something, so you > >should have come back later and grabbed them :) > > Yeah, I'm thinking they just chuck them in their dumpster... but I didn't > poke around in it because of the other people there at the time. Since > they were early Pentiums... I didn't care that much. > > Maybe tomorrow I will take a few old clothes to be "donated" and I'll > poke around a bit more. I wonder if dumpsters are considered like > curbside garbage, once you toss it, it is public domain? (I don't know > the cops in that town as well, so I might get hassled if I am back there > dumpster diving at 3am) One of the places had a big sign making the claime that it was stealing to take anything in (I agree), on (maybe) or around (don't think so) their drop-off dumpster. It's since been replaced with a big sign claiming leaving anything on the ground is illegal dumping and will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. YMMV, IANAL, etc., etc., etc. Remember, it's only wrong if you get caught! ;) > > -chris Bob From foo at siconic.com Sat Jul 27 19:14:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Panasonic KXP4400 - CHNG DRUM U27 In-Reply-To: <002b01c235bd$83eaf620$0100000a@deepspacenine> Message-ID: On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, Philip Pemberton wrote: > > We used one of these extensively at the company I used to work for, > > printing telephone service invoices. It was a very reliable printer. > That's good to hear. Are they as reliable as a HP LJ-II? I don't know if they are AS reliable since I don't have any experience with the LJ-II, but in my estimation it was damn reliable, having printed probably at least a hundred thousand pages in its life with only minor servicing required once or twice (and its still good to go, just needs a new drum like yours). > > At any rate, Marilynn, our office manager, used to just dump the waste > > toner out of the collector bucket. It never seemed to adversely affect > > the printer, even though you're not supposed to do that. > I couldn't get the collector buchet off - only one screw on that side, took > it out and it wouldn't pop off. So I pried it apart slightly and shook the > junk into a sheet of newspaper. The green OPC drum was wrapped in a bin > liner for protection and light proofing. Put it this way - I'll spend £40 on > four toner cartridges but I'm not going to spend £75 on an OPC drum module. Oh wait. You're talking about a different model than the one I am. I'm talking about the 4420. I've never heard of the 4400. Sorry :) > > I had two of these (the one from the office and another one I picked up > > subsquently). I just got rid of one I believe as I have no more use for > > it since I got my very nice Xerox XD125f. I still have the other one but > > its fate is nearly decided. > Damn... Could have used it as a parts machine... I still have the other one if you want it, but I don't know if the parts are interchangeable with a 4400. Of course, the shipping will be outrageous. > Does your one remaining KXP4400 have a RAM upgrade fitted? I need one for > mine. 1MB is not enough for the sort of printing I do, Panasonic want $400 > for a 4MB board and most companies over "the Big Pond" don't have any left Nope. That's one upgrade we dearly needed but never got around to getting. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From foo at siconic.com Sat Jul 27 19:17:01 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Seeking Vectrix programming info. In-Reply-To: <000901c235c2$24f5a0c0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, John Allain wrote: > Someone near where I live is selling a Vectrix for a > decent price and while it would be OK as is... > I programmed a vector graphics machine (Imlac) in my Wow! I didn't know that. I guess it must have been quite a thrill for you to see the Imlac at VCF East then? > near-childhood (at 19) and it would be wonderful to be > able to do that again. > Does anybody remember seeing information on the > instruction set of a Vectrix? It was closed architecture > for a while but it should be publishable by now*. Here's just what you need: http://www.playvectrex.com/designit/chrissalo/toc.htm Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From foo at siconic.com Sat Jul 27 19:19:01 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill In-Reply-To: <000a01c235c4$94f2d6c0$ac469280@y5f3q8> Message-ID: On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, Robert Schaefer wrote: > One of the places had a big sign making the claime that it was stealing to > take anything in (I agree), on (maybe) or around (don't think so) their > drop-off dumpster. It's since been replaced with a big sign claiming > leaving anything on the ground is illegal dumping and will be prosecuted to > the full extent of the law. So taking stuff that others have dumped illegally would effectively be undoing that illegal act thereby nullifying it. That's one way to look at it at least :) Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From rschaefe at gcfn.org Sat Jul 27 19:27:00 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill References: Message-ID: <003c01c235cd$846e8ac0$ac469280@y5f3q8> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sellam Ismail" To: Sent: Saturday, July 27, 2002 12:18 PM Subject: Re: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill > On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, Robert Schaefer wrote: > > > One of the places had a big sign making the claime that it was stealing to > > take anything in (I agree), on (maybe) or around (don't think so) their > > drop-off dumpster. It's since been replaced with a big sign claiming > > leaving anything on the ground is illegal dumping and will be prosecuted to > > the full extent of the law. > > So taking stuff that others have dumped illegally would effectively be > undoing that illegal act thereby nullifying it. > > That's one way to look at it at least :) Of course, there's a fair to middling-good chance that the lawyers would *not* see it that way... > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival Bob From aw288 at osfn.org Sat Jul 27 21:19:00 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: pdp 11/34M (Military version) In-Reply-To: <20020726202158.16747.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: > I have an opportunity to get a pdp 11/34M + expansion > unit which I understand is a militarized 11/34 sold by > Norden and used in connection with the Nike missle > system. Is this worth the effort to pay for > cross-country shipping? Has anyone seen one of these > before -- my understanding is that it doesn't look > much like an off-the-shelf 11/34. I think the Nike systems were all out of US service by the time PDP-11/34Ms came out. Come to think of it, I think most Nike systems were all analog anyway (M38?). Anyway, I once had a control box for an 11/34M I gave away on the list many years ago. Long gone. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From rcini at optonline.net Sat Jul 27 21:26:01 2002 From: rcini at optonline.net (Richard A. Cini, Jr.) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Thinning the herd Message-ID: Hello, all: I'm starting to go through my collection and figure out what things I don't use enough to justify the space. It's a small list, but if anyone is interested, contact me off-list. * IBM ThinkPad 750T (pen-based computer with doc). Comes with power brick, dock and 185mb PCMCIA hard drive. PenWindows 95 installed. * IBM PC Convertible. Boots fine; battery shot. Comes with boot disks and monitor. * IBM PC Portable. Nice condition. Never really investigated what's on the HD. * Micromint MPX-16. Nice condition. In case; no floppy drives. Comes with tech manual and about 60 disks. This one comes directly from Steve Ciarcia's attic via Bob Stek. There's even a copy of the unreleased MS-DOS 1.25 (doesn't seem to boot, however). Only about 800 of these were made. * Spare Motorola MECB; untested. * Compaq SLT/286 with Windows. I may have the docking station for this, too. So, there you have it. Here's a list of things I'm looking for: * MAME-suitable monitor VGA-arcade style 21" or better. * "real" terminal: Hazeltine or ADM3 style. * S100 connectors (11, for a plain-jane Vector Electronics active backplane) and/or Vector S100 case. Alternatively, diagnostics services to get a N* working (actually, mostly VG cards in a N* case). * working drives for Radio Shack Model I with EI (has Percom interface) * Tandy PDD2 (portable disk drive) for Model 100. * ??? Open for suggestions. Thanks for the bandwith. Rich Rich Cini Collector of classic computers Build Master for the Altair32 Emulation Project Web site: http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/ /************************************************************/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: winmail.dat Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 2648 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020727/2d525156/winmail.bin From aw288 at osfn.org Sat Jul 27 21:41:00 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more more) In-Reply-To: <200207261712.KAA26681@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: > Maybe we could get someone that is in the area to > deal with shipping various items ( for a small overhead ). > I could use a few items myself, for a 33. Of course > an entire machine would make a good spare but shipping > cost a lot and they really are too heavy to put in > a cardboard box ( that is why I need some parts ). > Is there anyone in the area that could work as a middle > man? I do not care if someone acts as a middle man for shipping, however, some ground rules: 1) *I* will not ship this items. Period. I will certainly help move and load them into you vehicle, but that is it. This whole thing is a serious business deal for me, and I do have time constraints. 2) If you get a middleman for shipping. he *must* remove the gear from the warehouse and store it elsewhere. I can not hold things. 3) 33s are high on everyone's list, and I count 5 units so far (some preety good, some pretty bad). There may be more. First come first serve on these, one per TTYgeek, - I really can not tag things for people. I will warn the list when I *think* all of the 33s are gone. This warehouse is an enigma - I have been going there for six years, yet I still manage to uncover 600 pound racks of equipment I never saw before. There literally could be dozens of 33s buried. 4) Paterson, NJ is the place. Contact me before coming, as I would like to limit the number of TTYgeeks per day to about 2 (so the owners don't go bananas). 5) Monday (hopefully), the first people will start coming. They will receive emails with directions within minutes. 6) Yesterday, while looking, I see that there are lots of teletypewriter doodads. I mean lots. I can not even begin to inventory, or even answer specific wants, as I am simple swamped. I may try, but don't expect much. The best bet is to just take your chances and come on down. I will warn the list when the pile has really shrunk. 7) So far I have seen Teletypes, WU tagged units, Seimens, Kleinschmidts, lots of AN/UGCs, and probably some other weirdness. 8)You don't *have* to bring cold drinks, as there is a deli thing across the street. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From jfoust at threedee.com Sat Jul 27 22:10:01 2002 From: jfoust at threedee.com (John Foust) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill In-Reply-To: References: <000a01c235c4$94f2d6c0$ac469280@y5f3q8> Message-ID: <5.0.0.25.0.20020727215643.02694300@pc> At 09:18 AM 7/27/2002 -0700, Sellam Ismail wrote: >So taking stuff that others have dumped illegally would effectively be >undoing that illegal act thereby nullifying it. >That's one way to look at it at least :) I once had to call the cops on an idiot in my apartment building who, after I mentioned that I was donating a pile of stuff, thought that he could have whatever he wanted from it, and proceeded to steal a number of my soon-to-be donations. Why steal from the drop-off container? My conscience is clear and my results are satisfactory from raiding the *garbage* dumpsters at these places. Many have policies against selling computers, so they just dump them when they get them. They'll also dump anything that seems technological but too old - like an old calculator. - John From edick at idcomm.com Sat Jul 27 22:46:01 2002 From: edick at idcomm.com (Richard Erlacher) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... References: Message-ID: <000c01c235e9$2a92a1a0$9cc762d8@idcomm.com> Are these the ones with 24 lines of 80 columns? Several major vendors modeled their coding forms after the U.S. military coding forms, presumably cooked up by the Navy. I've only seen the blue ones, (blue lines) which I presume were patterned after the USAF ones. They worked great for coding when the work product was going to that huge room full of mini-skirted (back then) keypunch operators. (I'd have given a week's pay for a couple of hours hours to fish around in that room ... ... ) I did, BTW, code in Fortran back then. Dick ----- Original Message ----- From: Louis Florit To: Sent: Friday, July 26, 2002 5:21 PM Subject: FF: Fortran Coding Form Pads... > I found a stack (3) of 'Fortran Coding Form' pads with an IBM logo, > GX28-7327-6 U/M 050, Printed in the USA. Legal size (8x17)Nice light > green, one stack is pretty nice, the others show a little yellowing. > Don't know what dates these were available for. The lab I found these at > was created in 1973, so that's a good limit for the 'Wayback machine'. > > I assume these are what Fortran coders would arrange their code on before > translating the code into the paperpunches. > > Header fields are Program, Programmer, Date, Punching Instructions > (Graphic or Punch), Page Of, Card Electro Number. > > The main area is headed up with Comm (comment?), Statement Number, Cont > (continue?), Fortran Statement, Identification Sequence, followed but > miscellaneous squares numbered from 1 to 80. > > Asterisked comments at the bottom are "A standard card form, IBM 888157, > is available for punching statements from this form" and "Number of forms > per pad may vary slightly". [snicker- especially if you pulled a few out!] > > Anyone want For Free? I imagine it'd be a cool prop material for your > classic cmp. I'll stuff it in an envelope and send it out bookrate. > > L > > From mythtech at mac.com Sat Jul 27 22:51:01 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill Message-ID: >> Maybe tomorrow I will take a few old clothes to be "donated" and I'll >> poke around a bit more. I wonder if dumpsters are considered like >> curbside garbage, once you toss it, it is public domain? (I don't know >> the cops in that town as well, so I might get hassled if I am back there >> dumpster diving at 3am) > >One of the places had a big sign making the claime that it was stealing to >take anything in (I agree), on (maybe) or around (don't think so) their >drop-off dumpster. It's since been replaced with a big sign claiming >leaving anything on the ground is illegal dumping and will be prosecuted to >the full extent of the law. I'm really not looking to steal from the drop off (that does seem a bit wrong). My dumpster reference was to their garbage dumpster in the back. They don't have a drop off dumpster there... just the back parking lot near the back door. People appear to just drop stuff on the ground. I figure I will look in the garbage dumpster to see if they toss the unwanted CPUs in there. That is my question regarding legality... taking from a garbage dumpster. I know regular household garbage, as soon as you put it on curbside for pickup, is public domain, and anyone can help themselves to it (that includes non-bulk pickup, regular garbage... so it is legal for someone to root thru your garbage to pull out unwanted pre-approved credit card applications... it is just illegal for them to submit them to get a card in your name). So I didn't know if a business garbage dumpster was public domain as well, since you can't drag that to a curb. (I suppose there would be a trespassing issue, but that might be tough to enforce on a place that allows you to come on their property to drop off stuff) -chris From cube1 at charter.net Sat Jul 27 22:55:23 2002 From: cube1 at charter.net (Jay Jaeger) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: TU-58 dumps (was Re: VAX 11/730 Problem) In-Reply-To: <20020115232212.2874.qmail@web20110.mail.yahoo.com> References: Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20020727222637.04360ab8@cirithi> I have managed to read in all 58+ of my TU58 tapes, using a little Linux program to play the host side: VAX 11/750 console, 11/750 microcode and diagnostics FE and it looks like customer (CDD01 - CDD04). Also VMS updates (3.6, 3.7, 4.1, 4.2 4.4), and VMS stand alone backup programs (3.3, 4.0, 4.1 and 5.0). Finally, a couple of FORTRAN related tapes. Thanks to Allison for the tip on using rubber hose to replace rubber rollers gone to "glue". Worked great. I didn't glue mine to the hub, though I suppose I should -- one did start slipping some after reading in 30 tapes -- the aluminum hub got pretty hot. I also found I could be quite aggressive with isopropyl alcohol cleaning the heads. Is there someone who is maintaining an archive of TU58 tape images? If so, I may have a few to donate... 8^) Jay Jaeger At 03:22 PM 1/15/2002 -0800, Ethan Dicks wrote: >--- "Clint Wolff (VAX collector)" wrote: > > PS If you do get a dump, I'd appreciate a copy. I'm archiving all the > > TU58s I can find to CD-Rs... > >I'm doing the same thing. So far, I have about 20 tapes read in. :-( >The ones that have no read errors are fine. Most of the tapes take a >bit of work (lots of head cleaning and retrying). I have a quantity of >11/750 diagnostic tapes as well as boot tapes/standalone backup tapes. >Probably nothing horribly rare (except for partial VMS 3.x upgrade sets), >but you never know. We should trade tape titles sometime. > > > On Sun, 21 Oct 2001, Michael Schneider wrote: > > > > > Hello to all VAXenfolks, > > > > > > i do have a problem with a VAX-11/730... > > > It is now willing to boot and tries to load it's microcode tape from > > > the TU-58 drives... > > > But the TU-58's are so battered that i have not been able to read the > > > tape. > > > > > > I have repaced the rubber rollers, but the read/write-heads look, ummm, > > > bad! > > > > > > I have found somewhere some TU-58 simulator software for DOS which > > > looks like a promising alternative; i would place a mini-DOS-computer > > > inside a VT-102 and route some additional cables to the VAX and be >fine. > >That's one way to do it. You could also mount the "mini-DOS" computer in >the 11/730 where you extracted the TU-58 from (depending on which style >of VAX you have, it might or might not be easy. If I were going to do >this (and I just might someday), I'd consider a Linux-based TU-58 >emulator, and stick a tiny 486 in the base of the rack with a serial >cable going into the VAX (11/730 or 11/750), a spare serial cable >going to either a port on the VAX or a terminal server or the like, as >well as an ethernet connection to my LAN, so I could run a shell to >monitor the TU-58 tape images - manipulate file names, create "blanks" >for writing, that sort of thing. I'd also consider attaching a 4x20 LCD >display to the parallel port or a spare serial port, a-la LCDproc, with >a menu and a switch or two for easy "tape swapping". An old and slow >laptop might also be a good option. Don't need much horsepower to >flood a 38400 bps cable with bytes. > > > > BUT: How do i get the contents of the microcode tape of the tape, into > > > a DOS file without access to a working TU-58? > >As you say... either someone reads it for you or you get an image from >someone else of something that's close. > > > > Is someone on this list able to read the tape? > >Yes. > > > > Has someone already made a tape image i could just use? > >No. I could make one, but I don't have one at present, just real >11/730 console tapes. > > > > I mean, i have > > > a original DEC tape, with serial number and all. I might even come up > > > with a license document, if i search long enough... > >Do you have access to another VAX? I used to cut console tapes all the >time for our 11/730 (k-panda when it was in the UUCP maps) - I still >have it (and the tapes). > >The tape from DEC was sub-optimized. I wrote a quick DCL script to >write the files in optimal order and sped up boot time to under 3 >minutes. It was not an original idea, but it did work *great* (the >microprocessor in the TU-58 caches the directory AFAIK, so if you ask >for the next sequential file on the tape, it doesn't have to seek back >to the front to locate it - you just spin the tape to read it). > > > > Any help would be greatly welcomed. This old lady is just to beautifull > > > to use it as an electric heater only... > >Did you ever get a tape for your machine (this is an old message, after >all)? If not, this past weekend, I happened to run across the box with >my old console tapes (which is why I'm writing now). Let me know the >numbers off of your tape (since there are different revs of the stuff >on the tape, and something on there might or might not be VMS-version >dependent). > >If you ever did get things running, I know it's possible to build new >tapes from a running machine. I'd have to find my program on a backup >tape; I know I don't have it handy, and that 11/730 is in storage. > >-ethan > > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! >http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ --- Jay R. Jaeger The Computer Collection cube1@charter.net From sloboyko at yahoo.com Sat Jul 27 22:59:46 2002 From: sloboyko at yahoo.com (Loboyko Steve) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:19 2005 Subject: Seeking Vectrix programming info. In-Reply-To: <000901c235c2$24f5a0c0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <20020728034650.34150.qmail@web11807.mail.yahoo.com> I never had one of these machines, but I Googled the schematics + service manual. The service manual actually has significant programming information. I THINK it was a 6802 or 09, and the service manual has enough memory map info as I recall. IF you are really stuck I'll fish around for it. What struck me on the schematic was how ingenious (that is, cheap and effective) the hardware was; it used ONE moto 1408 D/A converter and a very inexpensive (but obviously good enough) sample and hold. Jeez, the chip wasn't that expensive (like, maybe $1.00) even in 1980. Most of the websites say that this was a great product but didn't sell quite enough to survive the Great Video Game Crash. --- John Allain wrote: > Someone near where I live is selling a Vectrix for a > > decent price and while it would be OK as is... > I programmed a vector graphics machine (Imlac) in my > > near-childhood (at 19) and it would be wonderful to > be > able to do that again. > Does anybody remember seeing information on the > instruction set of a Vectrix? It was closed > architecture > for a while but it should be publishable by now*. > > John A. > (*and reply directly to me if you want to keep it > private) > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From cisin at xenosoft.com Sat Jul 27 23:05:01 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, Chris wrote: > from a garbage dumpster. I know regular household garbage, as soon as you > put it on curbside for pickup, is public domain, and anyone can help > themselves to it (that includes non-bulk pickup, regular garbage... so it City of Berkeley v Eldridge Cleaver ~1988? Court ruled that it all belonged to the city, once at the curb! (and that Eldridge's recycling business constiuted "theft"!) But common sense says that since the intent was to get rid of it, that any disposal is OK. From doc at mdrconsult.com Sat Jul 27 23:17:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > City of Berkeley v Eldridge Cleaver ~1988? > Court ruled that it all belonged to the city, once at the curb! (and that > Eldridge's recycling business constiuted "theft"!) Thought that was much earlier. In any case, *any* court decision with Cleaver's name on it can't be regarded as indicative. Doc From eric at brouhaha.com Sat Jul 27 23:21:45 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: TU-58 dumps (was Re: VAX 11/730 Problem) In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20020727222637.04360ab8@cirithi> References: <4.3.2.7.2.20020727222637.04360ab8@cirithi> Message-ID: <34104.64.169.63.74.1027829778.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> > I have managed to read in all 58+ of my TU58 tapes, using a little > Linux program to play the host side: VAX 11/750 console, 11/750 > microcode and diagnostics FE and it looks like customer (CDD01 - > CDD04). Cool! If you don't mind sharing the program, I could probably dump some TU58s also. Anyone got a tape of the HSC50 software (CRONIC)? From dittman at dittman.net Sat Jul 27 23:34:00 2002 From: dittman at dittman.net (Eric Dittman) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill In-Reply-To: from "Chris" at Jul 27, 2002 11:47:39 PM Message-ID: <200207280429.g6S4TAw31272@narnia.int.dittman.net> > I figure I will look in the garbage dumpster to see if they toss the > unwanted CPUs in there. That is my question regarding legality... taking > from a garbage dumpster. I know regular household garbage, as soon as you > put it on curbside for pickup, is public domain, and anyone can help > themselves to it (that includes non-bulk pickup, regular garbage... so it > is legal for someone to root thru your garbage to pull out unwanted > pre-approved credit card applications... it is just illegal for them to > submit them to get a card in your name). This varies. Some places have laws against anyone except the designated garbage collectors from picking up items from the garbage. In some places these are due to recycling and proper disposal, and in others the laws are for health reasons. There are people that will climb in a dumpster and dig around to see what they can find, and dumpsters are exactly the healthiest places. In Plano, for instance, you can't take anything from someone's garbage: Sec. 18-6. Residential refuse container. ... (l) No person other than the current resident of the property containing a collection location, a city collector, or an authorized refuse contractor shall remove, pick up or transfer refuse materials which have been placed in a refuse container in any residential subdivision or at any single-family residence. Each violation of this provision which occurs from one (1) or more collection locations shall constitute a separate and distinct offense punishable as provided in section 18-3 of this chapter. ... Sec. 18-15 covers the same for business refuse and recyclable materials, and Sec. 18-16 covers the same for residential recyclable materials. The fine can be up to $2000.00. -- Eric Dittman dittman@dittman.net Check out the DEC Enthusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/ From cisin at xenosoft.com Sat Jul 27 23:39:00 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > City of Berkeley v Eldridge Cleaver ~1988? > > Court ruled that it all belonged to the city, once at the curb! (and that > > Eldridge's recycling business constiuted "theft"!) On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, Doc Shipley wrote: > Thought that was much earlier. In any case, *any* court decision with > Cleaver's name on it can't be regarded as indicative. Are you implying that the court ruled based on whose ox was gored, rather than on the legal issues? You're right that it must have been earlier. It was about 88 (or 90) when the police "found" Eldridge "beaten half to death with clubs", and took him to Herrick hospital. From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Sun Jul 28 01:05:01 2002 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: Panasonic KXP4400 - CHNG DRUM U27 References: Message-ID: <001001c235fc$4f5caea0$0100000a@deepspacenine> > On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, Philip Pemberton wrote: > > > > We used one of these extensively at the company I used to work for, > > > printing telephone service invoices. It was a very reliable printer. > > That's good to hear. Are they as reliable as a HP LJ-II? > > I don't know if they are AS reliable since I don't have any experience > with the LJ-II, but in my estimation it was damn reliable, having printed > probably at least a hundred thousand pages in its life with only minor > servicing required once or twice (and its still good to go, just needs a > new drum like yours). Mine doesn't need a new drum - the OPC is fine, I just needed to empty the waste toner bin on the side of the OPC. > > > At any rate, Marilynn, our office manager, used to just dump the waste > > > toner out of the collector bucket. It never seemed to adversely affect > > > the printer, even though you're not supposed to do that. > > I couldn't get the collector buchet off - only one screw on that side, took > > it out and it wouldn't pop off. So I pried it apart slightly and shook the > > junk into a sheet of newspaper. The green OPC drum was wrapped in a bin > > liner for protection and light proofing. Put it this way - I'll spend ?40 on > > four toner cartridges but I'm not going to spend ?75 on an OPC drum module. > > Oh wait. You're talking about a different model than the one I am. I'm > talking about the 4420. I've never heard of the 4400. Damn. The 4420 is a totally different beast if the manual is correct - looks like an LJ-II. The KXP4400 is a small (about 30cm high, 70cm deep and 12cm wide) machine with a fold-down paper input tray on the right hand side and a fold-out paper output tray on the top. It looks like it had the option for an RS232 interface, too. But I can kludge one of those with a PIC16F84 and a few connectors. And a PCB. > > > I had two of these (the one from the office and another one I picked up > > > subsquently). I just got rid of one I believe as I have no more use for > > > it since I got my very nice Xerox XD125f. I still have the other one but > > > its fate is nearly decided. > > Damn... Could have used it as a parts machine... > > I still have the other one if you want it, but I don't know if the parts > are interchangeable with a 4400. Of course, the shipping will be > outrageous. Doesn't look like any of the parts are the same. OPC is different, toner cart is different, RAM is different... > > Does your one remaining KXP4400 have a RAM upgrade fitted? I need one for > > mine. 1MB is not enough for the sort of printing I do, Panasonic want $400 > > for a 4MB board and most companies over "the Big Pond" don't have any left > > Nope. That's one upgrade we dearly needed but never got around to > getting. Curses... Looks like I'm going to end up spending GBP70 on the 4MB module... Oh, well. The printer was a reasonably good deal for GBP10 second-hand. At least it was in one piece and had the drum and some toner. I had to replace the toner cartridge soon after getting the machine, but ?10 per cartridge (1500 page life IIRC) is hardly going to break the bank. And when I got it, it only had 3000 sheets run through it and the drum had been replaced - current drum only has a few thousand pages on it. Considering this thing was made in about 1994, it's in pretty good shape. Just FYI, there are some KXPs that use the same printer engine - the KXP4401, for example, is an exact clone of the 4400 with the addition of a PostScript module. Hardly makes much difference; I can live with PCL3. Anyone got some docs on HP's PCL3 "Printer Control Language"? Later. -- Phil. philpem@dsl.pipex.com http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ From fmc at reanimators.org Sun Jul 28 01:29:01 2002 From: fmc at reanimators.org (Frank McConnell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more more) In-Reply-To: William Donzelli's message of "Sat, 27 Jul 2002 22:40:20 -0400 (EDT)" References: Message-ID: <200207280555.g6S5tnWw021597@daemonweed.reanimators.org> William Donzelli wrote: > 8)You don't *have* to bring cold drinks, as there is a deli thing across > the street. Shucky darn. Here I was, sitting on the other side of the continent, reading all the writing about how k00l it would be for someone to ship them a Model 33 or whatever, and thinking that delivery of cold drinks would be a much more interesting, and probably more appreciated, hack. -Frank McConnell From doc at mdrconsult.com Sun Jul 28 01:38:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > > > City of Berkeley v Eldridge Cleaver ~1988? > > > Court ruled that it all belonged to the city, once at the curb! (and that > > > Eldridge's recycling business constiuted "theft"!) > On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, Doc Shipley wrote: > > Thought that was much earlier. In any case, *any* court decision with > > Cleaver's name on it can't be regarded as indicative. > > Are you implying that the court ruled based on whose ox was gored, rather > than on the legal issues? Not sure I was implying anything. I will state unequivocally that IMHO, Eldridge Cleaver had for so long been such a thorn in the legal ass of California that any ruling against him could be considered payback, not law. Whether or not that ruling coincided with current law as it stood is and was irrelevant. > You're right that it must have been earlier. It was about 88 (or 90) when > the police "found" Eldridge "beaten half to death with clubs", and took > him to Herrick hospital. I Googled around a little, and mid/late 80's would be right for that case. I must have been thinking of something else. Doc From mythtech at mac.com Sun Jul 28 01:47:00 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill Message-ID: >City of Berkeley v Eldridge Cleaver ~1988? >Court ruled that it all belonged to the city, once at the curb! (and that >Eldridge's recycling business constiuted "theft"!) > > >But common sense says that since the intent was to get rid of it, that any >disposal is OK. I know at least in the local towns around here, curbside garbage picking is ok by law. I know this because I have been stopped on a number of occasions under the guise of a "suspicious vehicle" (which makes sense... driving around slowly at 1am shining a flashlight at houses). In every instance, once I explained what I was doing (and pointed out the load of stuff I had picked up), the officer sent me on my way... and on a few of those times, I have even had the officer tell me where they saw something good. I can however understand a town suing someone that makes a business out of taking general refuse from the curb, particularly recycling goods. I know at least one town around here sells their recycling, so if someone started driving around filling up their truck with it, you would be cutting into the town's money. -chris From doc at mdrconsult.com Sun Jul 28 01:52:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more more) In-Reply-To: <200207280555.g6S5tnWw021597@daemonweed.reanimators.org> Message-ID: On 27 Jul 2002, Frank McConnell wrote: > William Donzelli wrote: > > 8)You don't *have* to bring cold drinks, as there is a deli thing across > > the street. > > Shucky darn. Here I was, sitting on the other side of the continent, > reading all the writing about how k00l it would be for someone to ship > them a Model 33 or whatever, and thinking that delivery of cold drinks > would be a much more interesting, and probably more appreciated, hack. Heh. My littlest brother moved from Lubbock, Texas to Michigan in about 1979. He [rightly] complained that the diet there was killing him. Every year for about 8 years, on Rance's birthday, our mother packed 2 lb carne guisada, 1 lb pollo con arroz, 2 pints frijoles, 1 3lb can pickled jalapenos (with carrots, cauliflower, & onions), and 3 dozen fresh flour tortillas. Everything but the jalapenos was ordered fresh from the Corral Restaurant, packed on dry ice, and FedExed overnight. Rance claimed that he had to hide the carne guisada & the jalapenos from his roommates. Doc From ms at silke.rt.schwaben.de Sun Jul 28 04:05:02 2002 From: ms at silke.rt.schwaben.de (Michael Schneider) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: TU-58 dumps (was Re: VAX 11/730 Problem) In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20020727222637.04360ab8@cirithi> References: <4.3.2.7.2.20020727222637.04360ab8@cirithi> Message-ID: <1027847060.18057.7.camel@silke> And no '730 console tape? **SIGH** I still have none (Ok, i did not have too much time to look into this lately)... As for an archive of tape images: I would be able and willing to provide WEB/FTP-space for an archive. If you can wait 2-3 weeks; i'm going on vacation tomorrow.. ms On Sun, 2002-07-28 at 05:41, Jay Jaeger wrote: > I have managed to read in all 58+ of my TU58 tapes, using a little Linux > program to play the host side: VAX 11/750 console, 11/750 microcode and > diagnostics FE and it looks like customer (CDD01 - CDD04). Also > VMS updates (3.6, 3.7, 4.1, 4.2 4.4), and VMS stand alone backup programs > (3.3, 4.0, 4.1 and 5.0). Finally, a couple of FORTRAN related tapes. > > Thanks to Allison for the tip on using rubber hose to replace rubber > rollers gone to "glue". Worked great. I didn't glue mine to the hub, > though I suppose I should -- one did start slipping some after reading in > 30 tapes -- the aluminum hub got pretty hot. I also found I could be quite > aggressive with isopropyl alcohol cleaning the heads. > > Is there someone who is maintaining an archive of TU58 tape images? If so, > I may have a few to donate... 8^) > > Jay Jaeger > > > At 03:22 PM 1/15/2002 -0800, Ethan Dicks wrote: > >--- "Clint Wolff (VAX collector)" wrote: > > > PS If you do get a dump, I'd appreciate a copy. I'm archiving all the > > > TU58s I can find to CD-Rs... > > > >I'm doing the same thing. So far, I have about 20 tapes read in. :-( > >The ones that have no read errors are fine. Most of the tapes take a > >bit of work (lots of head cleaning and retrying). I have a quantity of > >11/750 diagnostic tapes as well as boot tapes/standalone backup tapes. > >Probably nothing horribly rare (except for partial VMS 3.x upgrade sets), > >but you never know. We should trade tape titles sometime. > > > > > On Sun, 21 Oct 2001, Michael Schneider wrote: > > > > > > > Hello to all VAXenfolks, > > > > > > > > i do have a problem with a VAX-11/730... > > > > It is now willing to boot and tries to load it's microcode tape from > > > > the TU-58 drives... > > > > But the TU-58's are so battered that i have not been able to read the > > > > tape. > > > > > > > > I have repaced the rubber rollers, but the read/write-heads look, ummm, > > > > bad! > > > > > > > > I have found somewhere some TU-58 simulator software for DOS which > > > > looks like a promising alternative; i would place a mini-DOS-computer > > > > inside a VT-102 and route some additional cables to the VAX and be > >fine. > > > >That's one way to do it. You could also mount the "mini-DOS" computer in > >the 11/730 where you extracted the TU-58 from (depending on which style > >of VAX you have, it might or might not be easy. If I were going to do > >this (and I just might someday), I'd consider a Linux-based TU-58 > >emulator, and stick a tiny 486 in the base of the rack with a serial > >cable going into the VAX (11/730 or 11/750), a spare serial cable > >going to either a port on the VAX or a terminal server or the like, as > >well as an ethernet connection to my LAN, so I could run a shell to > >monitor the TU-58 tape images - manipulate file names, create "blanks" > >for writing, that sort of thing. I'd also consider attaching a 4x20 LCD > >display to the parallel port or a spare serial port, a-la LCDproc, with > >a menu and a switch or two for easy "tape swapping". An old and slow > >laptop might also be a good option. Don't need much horsepower to > >flood a 38400 bps cable with bytes. > > > > > > BUT: How do i get the contents of the microcode tape of the tape, into > > > > a DOS file without access to a working TU-58? > > > >As you say... either someone reads it for you or you get an image from > >someone else of something that's close. > > > > > > Is someone on this list able to read the tape? > > > >Yes. > > > > > > Has someone already made a tape image i could just use? > > > >No. I could make one, but I don't have one at present, just real > >11/730 console tapes. > > > > > > I mean, i have > > > > a original DEC tape, with serial number and all. I might even come up > > > > with a license document, if i search long enough... > > > >Do you have access to another VAX? I used to cut console tapes all the > >time for our 11/730 (k-panda when it was in the UUCP maps) - I still > >have it (and the tapes). > > > >The tape from DEC was sub-optimized. I wrote a quick DCL script to > >write the files in optimal order and sped up boot time to under 3 > >minutes. It was not an original idea, but it did work *great* (the > >microprocessor in the TU-58 caches the directory AFAIK, so if you ask > >for the next sequential file on the tape, it doesn't have to seek back > >to the front to locate it - you just spin the tape to read it). > > > > > > Any help would be greatly welcomed. This old lady is just to beautifull > > > > to use it as an electric heater only... > > > >Did you ever get a tape for your machine (this is an old message, after > >all)? If not, this past weekend, I happened to run across the box with > >my old console tapes (which is why I'm writing now). Let me know the > >numbers off of your tape (since there are different revs of the stuff > >on the tape, and something on there might or might not be VMS-version > >dependent). > > > >If you ever did get things running, I know it's possible to build new > >tapes from a running machine. I'd have to find my program on a backup > >tape; I know I don't have it handy, and that 11/730 is in storage. > > > >-ethan > > > > > > > >__________________________________________________ > >Do You Yahoo!? > >Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! > >http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ > > --- > Jay R. Jaeger The Computer Collection > cube1@charter.net > > > -- Michael Schneider email: ms@vaxcluster.de Germany http://www.vaxcluster.de Sieben auf einen Streich From rschaefe at gcfn.org Sun Jul 28 06:27:04 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill References: Message-ID: <003901c23629$bf4f4ec0$ad469280@y5f3q8> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)" To: Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2002 12:04 AM Subject: Re: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill > On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, Chris wrote: > > from a garbage dumpster. I know regular household garbage, as soon as you > > put it on curbside for pickup, is public domain, and anyone can help > > themselves to it (that includes non-bulk pickup, regular garbage... so it > > City of Berkeley v Eldridge Cleaver ~1988? > Court ruled that it all belonged to the city, once at the curb! (and that > Eldridge's recycling business constiuted "theft"!) > > > But common sense says that since the intent was to get rid of it, that any > disposal is OK. You'd think so, wouldn't you. I don't know the laws around here, but they're either in our favor or not enforced. Around september, when the students come back to skool, it's like they just throw *EVERYTHING* out and ask daddy for more. Without going too far OT, I've gotten everything from complete peaseas and power macs throught RL05. I kid you not-- I pilled a pair of 'em from beside a dumpster last year. I'm gonna go back and look for the rest of it this year. ;) [OT] I heard on TV (so I know it really happened!) some crook got off because he pitched the murder weapon into someones' trash. The cops pulled it out and busted him, but the courts ruled that since he thought the trash couldn't be searched, the evidence was inadmissable. And my taxes go to pay these guys! > > Bob From tlindner at ix.netcom.com Sun Jul 28 10:22:01 2002 From: tlindner at ix.netcom.com (tim lindner) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: Seeking Vectrix programming info. Message-ID: <1184252823-5325043@watermarkpress.com> > Someone near where I live is selling a Vectrix for a decent price and while it > would be OK as is... I programmed a vector graphics machine (Imlac) in my > near-childhood (at 19) and it would be wonderful to be able to do that again. > Does anybody remember seeing information on the instruction set of a Vectrix? > It was closed architecture for a while but it should be publishable by now*. Do you mean Vectrex? The cartridge based vector video game made by CGE. Then sold to Milton Bradley? Try usenet: rec.games.vectrex. It is a very active newsgroup. Both for players and programmers. There are (RS-232 based) RAM carts avaiable. That makes testing much faster. http://www.vectrex.biz/ Also check out Sean Kelly's MultiCart http://www.xnet.com/~skelly/vmulti.htm -- tim lindner tlindner@ix.netcom.com "Life. Don't talk to me about life." - Marvin, the android From fernande at internet1.net Sun Jul 28 10:42:01 2002 From: fernande at internet1.net (Chad Fernandez) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: latest anti-haul from the local Goodwill References: <003901c23629$bf4f4ec0$ad469280@y5f3q8> Message-ID: <3D44100C.6090001@internet1.net> Robert Schaefer wrote: > You'd think so, wouldn't you. I don't know the laws around here, but > they're either in our favor or not enforced. Around september, when the > students come back to skool, it's like they just throw *EVERYTHING* out and > ask daddy for more. Without going too far OT, I've gotten everything from > complete peaseas and power macs throught RL05. I kid you not-- I pilled a > pair of 'em from beside a dumpster last year. I'm gonna go back and look > for the rest of it this year. ;) Garbage is also where many college kids go shoping for furniture :-) Your right though, it's amazing the amount of stuff that get pitched at the end if the year :-) Chad Fernandez Michigan, USA From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Sun Jul 28 10:54:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: TU-58 dumps (was Re: VAX 11/730 Problem) In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20020727222637.04360ab8@cirithi> Message-ID: <20020728155325.6931.qmail@web10304.mail.yahoo.com> --- Jay Jaeger wrote: > I have managed to read in all 58+ of my TU58 tapes, using a little Linux > program to play the host side: VAX 11/750 console, 11/750 microcode and > diagnostics FE and it looks like customer (CDD01 - CDD04). Also > VMS updates (3.6, 3.7, 4.1, 4.2 4.4), and VMS stand alone backup > programs > (3.3, 4.0, 4.1 and 5.0). Finally, a couple of FORTRAN related tapes. Cool. Care to share the program? I was using a DOS program to similar effect. It was kind of tedious. > Is there someone who is maintaining an archive of TU58 tape images? If > so, I may have a few to donate... 8^) > > Jay Jaeger I haven't read in any tapes lately, but I could start an archive from my website at penguincentral. If you don't get a better offer, write me offline and we'll see what it takes to get your stuff and my stuff in the same place. -ethan > At 03:22 PM 1/15/2002 -0800, Ethan Dicks wrote: > >--- "Clint Wolff (VAX collector)" wrote: > > > PS If you do get a dump, I'd appreciate a copy. I'm archiving all the > > > TU58s I can find to CD-Rs... > > > >I'm doing the same thing. So far, I have about 20 tapes read in. :-( > >...I have a quantity of 11/750 diagnostic tapes as well as boot > >tapes/standalone backup tapes... (...partial VMS 3.x upgrade sets) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From wmsmith at earthlink.net Sun Jul 28 12:50:01 2002 From: wmsmith at earthlink.net (Wayne M. Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: pdp 11/34M (Military version) References: Message-ID: <006b01c2365f$253887d0$f743cd18@D73KSM11> > > I have an opportunity to get a pdp 11/34M + expansion > > unit which I understand is a militarized 11/34 sold by > > Norden and used in connection with the Nike missle > > system. Is this worth the effort to pay for > > cross-country shipping? Has anyone seen one of these > > before -- my understanding is that it doesn't look > > much like an off-the-shelf 11/34. > > I think the Nike systems were all out of US service by the time > PDP-11/34Ms came out. Come to think of it, I think most Nike systems were > all analog anyway (M38?). > This site seems to suggest that the 11/34M was used with the Nike Hercules. http://www.goerigk-jever.de/update.html From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Sun Jul 28 13:07:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: Seeking Vectrix programming info. In-Reply-To: <000901c235c2$24f5a0c0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> from "John Allain" at Jul 27, 2 07:05:47 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 301 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020728/5817533b/attachment.ksh From kenziem at sympatico.ca Sun Jul 28 17:32:01 2002 From: kenziem at sympatico.ca (Mike) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:20 2005 Subject: SONY BVE-30004 Editing System Message-ID: <20020728223144.EDSR20747.tomts14-srv.bellnexxia.net@there> A while back some one mentioned an interesting machine used for video editing. The local scrap dealer has one of these, the CPU card has a 8080 chip on it and the memory card is very full. I 'd guess the box is 12" X 18. From raoul.somers at skynet.be Sun Jul 28 17:37:00 2002 From: raoul.somers at skynet.be (Raoul J.A. Somers) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: 8080 Message-ID: <000001c2353c$614029a0$0100a8c0@ax3s> Hello, I am looking for circuit diagrams of the original 8080 / 8085 to construct a prototype board Any hints? Raoul Somers Brussels, Belgium -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020728/e27e308e/attachment.html From mross666 at hotmail.com Sun Jul 28 17:39:59 2002 From: mross666 at hotmail.com (Mike Ross) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Hi folks... delurk Message-ID: Just introducing myself (although quite a few of you have probably encountered me elsewhere) - Mike Ross, Scottish, living in New York just now. Been collecting for over ten years, interested primarily in DEC and IBM equipment from mid-60s to mid-70s. Fairly extensive DEC collection - many 8s, 11s, a couple of 15s, a couple of 10s, and a 12. IBM so far is a few 3/360/370 front panels, although I've recently obtained an 1800. Always willing to trade, current wants list includes: Any IBM System/3 or System/360 or System/370 Bits for my 15s - RF15, RS09, RP02, TC15 My 12 is and always has been a bit of a mess - would love another 12, or at least a replacement perspex for the front panel. Also got a strange hankering for a VT05 (got a VT8e and love the shape!) I've also got a bit of a weakness for sexy supercomputers, Have a Convex and a couple of Connection Machines, always interested in more, maybe a Cray EL for completeness... A fair bit of my collection is online at: http://www.corestore.org Warning: corestore.org may be a bit of a mess for the next couple of weeks - major changes to content, look & feel are under way. Cheers! Mike _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx From errol.page at btinternet.com Sun Jul 28 17:42:58 2002 From: errol.page at btinternet.com (Errol Page) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Interak Computers. Message-ID: <011201c23667$b82a3360$f980fea9@errol> Is there anyone who is interested in the 'ancient' INTERAK home-build computer? I have a lot of stuff in the attic - including manuals. It seems a shame to just throw it all away!. BTW I live near Reading in Berkshire, England - and the stuff is hardly miniature. Cheers Errol -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020728/af567b13/attachment.html From ekklein at pacbell.net Sun Jul 28 17:46:05 2002 From: ekklein at pacbell.net (Erik S. Klein) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: IBM DOS 1.1 Message-ID: <000501c23674$685e4530$6e7ba8c0@piii933> An eBay auction for DOS 1.1 just ended at over $300. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem &item=2040680033 The seller incorrectly advertised this as the first released version of DOS, but even so I can't believe what folks will pay for this stuff. Could this mean that my copy of DOS 1.0 is worth $500 or more? Ouch. Erik -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020728/078f3cdf/attachment.html From aw288 at osfn.org Sun Jul 28 17:59:01 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: pdp 11/34M (Military version) In-Reply-To: <006b01c2365f$253887d0$f743cd18@D73KSM11> Message-ID: > This site seems to suggest that the 11/34M was used with the Nike Hercules. > > http://www.goerigk-jever.de/update.html Maybe for the overseas customers of Nike (and seeing that this is a German page, more maybe), but I really doubt for the US sites. Nike just did not last that long. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From geneb at deltasoft.com Sun Jul 28 18:16:01 2002 From: geneb at deltasoft.com (Gene Buckle) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Heathkit news (of a sort) In-Reply-To: <20020728223144.EDSR20747.tomts14-srv.bellnexxia.net@there> Message-ID: After fighting with sheet fed scanners and software (I lost both fights), I've finally been able to start processing the huge volume of Heathkit documentation (goodies!) that I've been given. I've started with a 31 issue set of The Staunch 8/89'er. Issue #1 is now available at http://www.retroarchive.org/machines/heath/staunch/Issue1-1.htm. These take about 2 to 3 hours to process each, so it'll be a while before I've got all 31 issues online. I'll let you folks know as more of them hit the scanner. g. (many thanks to the gentleman that sent me all of this neat stuff.) From uban at ubanproductions.com Sun Jul 28 18:37:00 2002 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Is there a problem with my IP address? In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20020722133637.01a69a98@ubanproductions.com> References: <6f.2903d815.2a3c46f5@aol.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20020728183538.01aad820@ubanproductions.com> Ever since my DSL line was re-provisioned and my IP address changed, I have not been receiving any classic computing email... --tom From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Sun Jul 28 18:40:15 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: 8080 References: <000001c2353c$614029a0$0100a8c0@ax3s> Message-ID: <3D447F1F.9020208@jetnet.ab.ca> Raoul J.A. Somers wrote: > Hello, > > I am looking for circuit diagrams of the original 8080 / 8085 to > construct a prototype board > > Any hints? > > Raoul Somers > Brussels, Belgium > The original 8080 used some strange voltages and non-overlaping timing pulses. The 8085 is a 5 volt upgraded version of the 8080 with a few more instructions. They are not pin compatable products. Check here for DOC's on the Altair (All docs link) http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/ -- Ben Franchuk - Dawn * 12/24 bit cpu * www.jetnet.ab.ca/users/bfranchuk/index.html From pat at purdueriots.com Sun Jul 28 18:52:00 2002 From: pat at purdueriots.com (Patrick Finnegan) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Hi folks... delurk In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sun, 28 Jul 2002, Mike Ross wrote: > equipment from mid-60s to mid-70s. Fairly extensive DEC collection - many > 8s, 11s, a couple of 15s, a couple of 10s, and a 12. Wow. I've never even seen a picture of a 15 or a 12. I'm envious. Now I just need to finish school, get a good job, and buy myself a warehouse and start _really_ collecting. > Any IBM System/3 or System/360 or System/370 Heh, about the same thing I'd want to have if I had somewhere to put it. > http://www.corestore.org Nice site. I've been interested for years, sorta-collecting for about 6 years, and starting last summer (after moving out of the dorms), I've started REALLY getting into collecting. The new place I'm moving into with some friends is a lot bigger than this place, fortunately. I end up getting most of my things from Purdue University's Salvage and Surplus op, but some of my more interesting things (IMHO) haven't been from there -- my Altos 8000 and 580, DEC Pro-380, Osborne, and Decwriter IV. I've got my collection up on my web site at http://purdueriots.com/compcollect/ for anyone interested; it's not perfectly up-to-date, but I try to keep it relatively correct. Once I get some time after summer school is over, I might work on revamping the look a bit. -- Pat From ghldbrd at ccp.com Sun Jul 28 19:32:00 2002 From: ghldbrd at ccp.com (Gary Hildebrand) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: SONY BVE-30004 Editing System References: <20020728223144.EDSR20747.tomts14-srv.bellnexxia.net@there> Message-ID: <3D448C25.EBEEE7E9@ccp.com> Mike wrote: > > A while back some one mentioned an interesting machine used for video > editing. > > The local scrap dealer has one of these, the CPU card has a 8080 chip on > it and the memory card is very full. I 'd guess the box is 12" X 18. Do you have a pic of it??? I'd be interested if it works. I think it is a 4 input a/b roll editor. Gary Hildebrand St. Joseph, MO From mythtech at mac.com Sun Jul 28 21:14:01 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: IBM DOS 1.1 Message-ID: >An eBay auction for DOS 1.1 just ended at over $300. Time to check my book case... I have a few copies that visually look like that pic, I wonder if any are v1.1... maybe I'll get lucky and can hock one to buy the new CD burner I want. -chris From marvin at rain.org Sun Jul 28 21:46:00 2002 From: marvin at rain.org (Marvin Johnston) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Seeking Vectrix programming info. References: <002b01c235bd$83eaf620$0100000a@deepspacenine> <000901c235c2$24f5a0c0$21fe54a6@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <3D44AC1E.C218654D@rain.org> John Allain wrote: > > Someone near where I live is selling a Vectrix for a > decent price and while it would be OK as is... > I programmed a vector graphics machine (Imlac) in my > near-childhood (at 19) and it would be wonderful to be > able to do that again. > Does anybody remember seeing information on the > instruction set of a Vectrix? It was closed architecture > for a while but it should be publishable by now*. I also would be interested in any Vectrix information. In the "pile" of stuff, there was one but there is nothing but the computer there. It is possible Hans might have some information on this machine. From geoffr at zipcon.net Sun Jul 28 22:21:01 2002 From: geoffr at zipcon.net (Geoff Reed) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: IBM DOS 1.1 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020728201714.04d02dd0@mail.zipcon.net> cool, and it had a MS decathalon disk with it too :) At 10:13 PM 7/28/02 -0400, you wrote: > >An eBay auction for DOS 1.1 just ended at over $300. > >Time to check my book case... I have a few copies that visually look like >that pic, I wonder if any are v1.1... maybe I'll get lucky and can hock >one to buy the new CD burner I want. > >-chris > From hansp at aconit.org Mon Jul 29 03:01:01 2002 From: hansp at aconit.org (Hans B Pufal) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Bull DPS-7000 rescue near Paris Message-ID: <3D44F5CC.30403@aconit.org> I have a lead on a Bull DPS-700 mini/mainframe computer available near Paris for a very short time. Unfortunately I cannot rescue it, any takers? Reply direct to me at hansp@aconit.org -- hbp From hansp at aconit.org Mon Jul 29 03:28:01 2002 From: hansp at aconit.org (Hans B Pufal) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Bull DPS-7000 rescue near Paris, France References: <3D44F5CC.30403@aconit.org> Message-ID: <3D44FC1D.4090205@aconit.org> Hans B Pufal wrote: > I have a lead on a Bull DPS-700 mini/mainframe computer available near > Paris for a very short time. Perhaps I should be more precise : Paris, France. > Unfortunately I cannot rescue it, any takers? > Reply direct to me at hansp@aconit.org -- hbp > From jwest at classiccmp.org Mon Jul 29 09:22:00 2002 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Teletypes (request) References: <200207261712.KAA26681@clulw009.amd.com> <3236361414.20020726211019@subatomix.com> Message-ID: <007901c2370b$178f4b30$9701a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Did anyone get together with others to handle pickup since William can't ship? I have been wanting a working ASR33 for years, but it doesn't look like I will be able to get up there to get one and set up shipping. If anyone is headed up there, I would be willing to pay something for their trouble if they would get one or two 33's for me, and then I would gladly pay the shipping charges to get them shipped back to me. Basically, I just need someone to get one or two and put them on a pallet, then I can have a freight company pick them up and ship them to me. Could anyone possibly help with this? THANKS!!! Jay West --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Mon Jul 29 11:52:00 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: 8080 Message-ID: <200207291651.JAA27608@clulw009.amd.com> Hi Raoul I have the schematic for an Intel 80/10. This is one of the early 8080 SBC's that Intel sold( I think the 80/05 was first ). Many of the parts would be vary hard to find. I would recommend doing a 8085 if you can. These are a lot more friendly. Other than an address latch, the rest is more like just tacking on various bussed parts. I don't recall but I think there are some simple circuits in the Intel 8085 manuals I have. Dwight >From: "Raoul J.A. Somers" > >Hello, > >I am looking for circuit diagrams of the original 8080 / 8085 to >construct a prototype board > >Any hints? > >Raoul Somers >Brussels, Belgium From fernande at internet1.net Mon Jul 29 11:56:00 2002 From: fernande at internet1.net (Chad Fernandez) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Things to sell/give away Message-ID: <3D457357.7000805@internet1.net> -IBM 8bit ISA serial/parallel card with NS16450N uart, from an AT (Free) -WDC 8/16 bit ISA 256K VGA card (Free) -2 fan trays with fans from a DEC R400X DSSI expansion chassis.... these are the same as the ones in any BA440 chassis right? ($10.00 both) -1 power supply from DEC R400X DSSI expansion chassis. I assume this os also the same as for the BA440. ($20) -Kensington System Saver Mac, this is for a Plus, SE, etc. It's in great shape. ($15.00) -SCO Open Desktop 2.0.0 on QIC tape. I tried installing it, and I think I had a bad tape drive.... NT wouldn't see the drive either. I picked it up used but the tape had never been opened until I opened it. It is in the original box with all manuals and license card. ($5.00) -2 Belkin narrow centronics style 6 foot scsi cables and a no-name terminator of some kind, probably passsive. All in new condition. ($10.00) Chad Fernandez Michigan, USA From uban at ubanproductions.com Mon Jul 29 12:00:01 2002 From: uban at ubanproductions.com (Tom Uban) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: 8080 In-Reply-To: <200207291651.JAA27608@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20020729115859.01b48a18@ubanproductions.com> I can provide schematics of an 8085 SBC which includes a processor, minimal RAM, ROM, serial, CTC, and parallel. --tom At 09:51 AM 7/29/2002 -0700, you wrote: >Hi Raoul > I have the schematic for an Intel 80/10. This is one >of the early 8080 SBC's that Intel sold( I think the 80/05 >was first ). Many of the parts would be vary hard to find. > I would recommend doing a 8085 if you can. These are a >lot more friendly. Other than an address latch, the rest >is more like just tacking on various bussed parts. I don't >recall but I think there are some simple circuits in >the Intel 8085 manuals I have. >Dwight > > >From: "Raoul J.A. Somers" > > > >Hello, > > > >I am looking for circuit diagrams of the original 8080 / 8085 to > >construct a prototype board > > > >Any hints? > > > >Raoul Somers > >Brussels, Belgium From eric at brouhaha.com Mon Jul 29 16:24:01 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Wanted WD-100x disk controllers -- NOT for ISA bus Message-ID: <32792.64.169.63.74.1027977784.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Does anyone have any spare WD-1000, WD-1001, or related disk controllers, or documentation on them? These are *not* ISA bus cards, they have a parallel interface to a host, and control up to four 5.25-inch Winchester disk drives using the ST-506 or ST-412 interface. (Some models supported older 8-inch drives as well). They use the Signetics 8X300 or 8X305 processor, WD-1100 series support chips, and firmware in bipolar PROMs. Thanks, Eric From bshannon at tiac.net Mon Jul 29 17:04:01 2002 From: bshannon at tiac.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Wanted WD-100x disk controllers -- NOT for ISA bus References: <32792.64.169.63.74.1027977784.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <3D45BBCF.5060805@tiac.net> I've got a SASI to ST-506 / SA400 controller, I think its 8X300 based, but I'm unsure... Eric Smith wrote: >Does anyone have any spare WD-1000, WD-1001, or related disk controllers, >or documentation on them? > >These are *not* ISA bus cards, they have a parallel interface to a host, >and control up to four 5.25-inch Winchester disk drives using the ST-506 >or ST-412 interface. (Some models supported older 8-inch drives as well). > >They use the Signetics 8X300 or 8X305 processor, WD-1100 series support >chips, and firmware in bipolar PROMs. > >Thanks, >Eric > > > > From aw288 at osfn.org Mon Jul 29 17:56:00 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) In-Reply-To: <007901c2370b$178f4b30$9701a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Message-ID: A couple of 33s went out today, but there are still three used ones left. There are also 2 unused, still-boxed 33s with 101A Datasets. For these latter items, I am accepting offers. Still pick up, or you arrange shipping. There also are several 35s (I think). William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From archer at topnow.com Mon Jul 29 18:47:00 2002 From: archer at topnow.com (Ross Archer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Synertek 6502 chips, 1984 date-code Message-ID: <3D45D3D6.86C67E1@topnow.com> I have some Synertek NMOS 6502s from various weeks in 1984, still in their (original?) Synertek static tubes. (At least, "Synertek" is stamped on the tubes.) A few "boy are these stupid" questions: 1. Does anyone have any cool Synertek lore they'd like to share with the group? All I know about them is they made the SYM-1 and were a 6530 second-source. I guess it's safe to conclude they were also a 6502 second-source. :) 2. Is this a "Find" in any sense? (I paid all of 30 cents each for them.) My motivation is to have enough replacement parts to keep all my 6502-based hardware humming for years to come. Though in this case I have several lifetimes' worth. :) 3. Is there any reason to fear that these chips will "go bad" at any significant rate as they age? Is there any way I could store them (reasonably, I mean, no vaccum or outer-space suggestions, please. :) to maximize their lifespan? My plan is to come into work some evening and suit up with the full anti-static treatment at an EMI bench with my little SBC (retrofitted with a 40 pin ZIF socket to avoid bending their machine-straight little legs), and test them all in rapid-fire succession. Is there anything inherently dumb about powering them up? Okay, well enough dumb questions. Just looking for any comments on any of the points, as the spirit moves you. :) -- Ross From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Mon Jul 29 19:19:01 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Synertek 6502 chips, 1984 date-code Message-ID: <200207300018.RAA28150@clulw009.amd.com> >From: "Ross Archer" >> >I have some Synertek NMOS 6502s from various weeks >in 1984, still in their (original?) Synertek static tubes. >(At least, "Synertek" is stamped on the tubes.) > >A few "boy are these stupid" questions: > >1. Does anyone have any cool Synertek lore they'd like to >share with the group? All I know about them is they made >the SYM-1 and were a 6530 second-source. I guess it's safe >to conclude they were also a 6502 second-source. :) > >2. Is this a "Find" in any sense? (I paid all of 30 cents >each for them.) My motivation is to have enough replacement >parts to keep all my 6502-based hardware humming for years >to >come. Though in this case I have several lifetimes' worth. >:) > >3. Is there any reason to fear that these chips will "go >bad" >at any significant rate as they age? Is there any way I >could >store them (reasonably, I mean, no vaccum or outer-space >suggestions, please. :) to maximize their lifespan? Hi Sitting in the tube, they should last for 1000's of years. Moisture is about the only problem. Keep them in a zip-loc with a packet a silca-gel and they will out live you and your grandchildren's grandchildren. Any temperature that a human can live in will have virtually no effect on them. > >My plan is to come into work some evening and suit up with >the full anti-static treatment at an EMI bench with my >little >SBC (retrofitted with a 40 pin ZIF socket to avoid bending >their machine-straight little legs), and test them all in >rapid-fire succession. Is there anything inherently dumb >about powering them up? If these are NOS and not test pulls, they should all be functional. No need to test them unless you just feel the urge. Dwight > >Okay, well enough dumb questions. Just looking for >any comments on any of the points, as the spirit moves you. >:) > >-- Ross > From archer at topnow.com Mon Jul 29 20:00:01 2002 From: archer at topnow.com (Ross Archer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Synertek 6502 chips, 1984 date-code References: <200207300018.RAA28150@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: <3D45E4DA.37FB5173@topnow.com> "Dwight K. Elvey" wrote: > > >From: "Ross Archer" > >> > >I have some Synertek NMOS 6502s from various weeks > >in 1984, still in their (original?) Synertek static tubes. > >(At least, "Synertek" is stamped on the tubes.) > > > >A few "boy are these stupid" questions: > > > >1. Does anyone have any cool Synertek lore they'd like to > >share with the group? All I know about them is they made > >the SYM-1 and were a 6530 second-source. I guess it's safe > >to conclude they were also a 6502 second-source. :) > > > >2. Is this a "Find" in any sense? (I paid all of 30 cents > >each for them.) My motivation is to have enough replacement > >parts to keep all my 6502-based hardware humming for years > >to > >come. Though in this case I have several lifetimes' worth. > >:) > > > >3. Is there any reason to fear that these chips will "go > >bad" > >at any significant rate as they age? Is there any way I > >could > >store them (reasonably, I mean, no vaccum or outer-space > >suggestions, please. :) to maximize their lifespan? > > Hi > Sitting in the tube, they should last for 1000's of > years. Moisture is about the only problem. Keep them > in a zip-loc with a packet a silca-gel and they will > out live you and your grandchildren's grandchildren. > Any temperature that a human can live in will have > virtually no effect on them. Humidity is pretty low in these parts, and so should be OK with silica gel. As an off-topic digression, isn't silica gel the stuff that always comes in little packages labelled "Do not eat"? Honestly. Do they really look that delicious? :) I wonder if this is a new trend and soon pink erasers will sport similar warnings... > > > > >My plan is to come into work some evening and suit up with > >the full anti-static treatment at an EMI bench with my > >little > >SBC (retrofitted with a 40 pin ZIF socket to avoid bending > >their machine-straight little legs), and test them all in > >rapid-fire succession. Is there anything inherently dumb > >about powering them up? > > If these are NOS and not test pulls, they should all be > functional. No need to test them unless you just feel > the urge. I do. :) Yes, they show all appearances of being NOS that's never been used in any way. I guess you could call it, to paraphrase a famous fast-food slogan, the "on and off urge." :) Thanks! -- Ross > Dwight > > > > >Okay, well enough dumb questions. Just looking for > >any comments on any of the points, as the spirit moves you. > >:) > > > >-- Ross > > From aw288 at osfn.org Mon Jul 29 20:06:00 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Synertek 6502 chips, 1984 date-code In-Reply-To: <3D45E4DA.37FB5173@topnow.com> Message-ID: > As an off-topic digression, isn't silica gel the stuff > that always comes in little packages labelled > "Do not eat"? Honestly. Do they really look that > delicious? :) Yup. And I should mention that anyone that comes to the warehouse can have all the silica gel you could ever want. Good on cereal. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Mon Jul 29 20:16:01 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Synertek 6502 chips, 1984 date-code Message-ID: <200207300114.SAA28212@clulw009.amd.com> >From: "Ross Archer" > >"Dwight K. Elvey" wrote: >> >> >From: "Ross Archer" >> >> >> >I have some Synertek NMOS 6502s from various weeks >> >in 1984, still in their (original?) Synertek static tubes. >> >(At least, "Synertek" is stamped on the tubes.) >> > >> >A few "boy are these stupid" questions: >> > >> >1. Does anyone have any cool Synertek lore they'd like to >> >share with the group? All I know about them is they made >> >the SYM-1 and were a 6530 second-source. I guess it's safe >> >to conclude they were also a 6502 second-source. :) >> > >> >2. Is this a "Find" in any sense? (I paid all of 30 cents >> >each for them.) My motivation is to have enough replacement >> >parts to keep all my 6502-based hardware humming for years >> >to >> >come. Though in this case I have several lifetimes' worth. >> >:) >> > >> >3. Is there any reason to fear that these chips will "go >> >bad" >> >at any significant rate as they age? Is there any way I >> >could >> >store them (reasonably, I mean, no vaccum or outer-space >> >suggestions, please. :) to maximize their lifespan? >> >> Hi >> Sitting in the tube, they should last for 1000's of >> years. Moisture is about the only problem. Keep them >> in a zip-loc with a packet a silca-gel and they will >> out live you and your grandchildren's grandchildren. >> Any temperature that a human can live in will have >> virtually no effect on them. > >Humidity is pretty low in these parts, >and so should be OK with silica gel. > >As an off-topic digression, isn't silica gel the stuff >that always comes in little packages labelled >"Do not eat"? Honestly. Do they really look that >delicious? :) >I wonder if this is a new trend and soon pink erasers will >sport >similar warnings... That is the stuff. I real don't recommend eating it. Some come in colored crystals. This will tell you when it needs to be regenerated. This can't be done while in the plastic stuff but you can remove it and put it into a metal pan. Put this in the oven ( I forget the temperature but I'm sure a web search will find the right info ). I forget the temperature but when it cools, it is back to a bluish ( slightly brown from the heat ) color, it is ready to use again. If it is pink, it has absorbed too much water and won't do much. Dwight > >> >> > >> >My plan is to come into work some evening and suit up with >> >the full anti-static treatment at an EMI bench with my >> >little >> >SBC (retrofitted with a 40 pin ZIF socket to avoid bending >> >their machine-straight little legs), and test them all in >> >rapid-fire succession. Is there anything inherently dumb >> >about powering them up? >> >> If these are NOS and not test pulls, they should all be >> functional. No need to test them unless you just feel >> the urge. > >I do. :) > >Yes, they show all appearances of being NOS that's never >been >used in any way. > >I guess you could call it, to paraphrase a famous fast-food >slogan, the "on and off urge." > >:) > >Thanks! > >-- Ross > >> Dwight >> >> > >> >Okay, well enough dumb questions. Just looking for >> >any comments on any of the points, as the spirit moves you. >> >:) >> > >> >-- Ross >> > > From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 30 00:00:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Synertek 6502 chips, 1984 date-code In-Reply-To: <3D45D3D6.86C67E1@topnow.com> Message-ID: <20020730045923.9646.qmail@web10308.mail.yahoo.com> --- Ross Archer wrote: > > I have some Synertek NMOS 6502s from various weeks > in 1984, still in their (original?) Synertek static tubes. > (At least, "Synertek" is stamped on the tubes.) Cool. The 6502 was so widely shipped (from PETs and Apples to Nintendo and even terminals/muxes/peripheral card embedded CPUs) that it's unlikely to be "R@RE" anytime soon, it's always nice to have a few on hand. > A few "boy are these stupid" questions: > > 1. Does anyone have any cool Synertek lore they'd like to > share with the group? All I know about them is they made > the SYM-1 and were a 6530 second-source. I guess it's safe > to conclude they were also a 6502 second-source. :) They were also a 68000 second-source for Motorola. I have a quantity of them, c. 1982. > 2. Is this a "Find" in any sense? (I paid all of 30 cents > each for them.) My motivation is to have enough replacement > parts to keep all my 6502-based hardware humming for years > to come. Though in this case I have several lifetimes' worth. > :) I wouldn't call it the find of the year, but it's probably the find of the week. I don't have any NOS, but between a crate of boards from text terminals (100% socketed ICs!) and two crates of boards from a mux (thanks Bob!), I have tubes of Rockwell and other brands, as pulls. > 3. Is there any reason to fear that these chips will "go > bad" at any significant rate as they age? Not if they are powered off and stored in static packaging in a dry place. > My plan is to come into work some evening... and test them all... No need to power them up unless you are intensely curious. Odds are, they probably all work. Personally, I'd wait until you needed one, then pull a tube and start with the first one. No major harm is likely to come to them, but you might as well keep them in their present state, protected from any random harm until you need one. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 30 00:11:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020730051010.39117.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> --- William Donzelli wrote: > There are also 2 unused, still-boxed 33s with 101A Datasets. Do you know if these have the rotary dial or the touch-tone keypad? I have one with the touch-tone pad that I stupidly removed when I was much younger and much more hasty than I am now. I would like to put it back, but I don't know where the leads go. I'm hoping that a) it's the touch- tone variety and b) whomever gets it from you is nice enough to send digital pictures and/or c) there are docs. > For these latter items, I am accepting offers. Still pick up, or you > arrange shipping. I'd love to, but as I mentioned before, you are bit far from Ohio. :-( Thanks, -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 30 00:13:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Wanted WD-100x disk controllers -- NOT for ISA bus In-Reply-To: <3D45BBCF.5060805@tiac.net> Message-ID: <20020730051219.39246.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> --- Bob Shannon wrote: > I've got a SASI to ST-506 / SA400 controller, I think its 8X300 based, > but I'm unsure... > > Eric Smith wrote: > > >Does anyone have any spare WD-1000, WD-1001, or related disk > >controllers, or documentation on them? I think I have something much like that from a "Davong" external box I picked up at Dayton some years ago - it was billed as "SCSI" and the host connector *is* 50 pins, but it's nothing like SCSI and does have an 8X300 chip on it. I have no docs. Sorry. I was asking about mine some years ago and got some interesting replies, but no concrete information. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From eric at brouhaha.com Tue Jul 30 01:08:00 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Wanted WD-100x disk controllers -- NOT for ISA bus In-Reply-To: <20020730051219.39246.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> References: <3D45BBCF.5060805@tiac.net> <20020730051219.39246.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <33000.64.169.63.74.1028009267.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Bob Shannon wrote: > I've got a SASI to ST-506 / SA400 controller, I think its 8X300 based, > but I'm unsure... Yes, some SASI (and perhaps even SCSI) bridge boards did use the 8X300. But the ones I'm looking for use the proprietary WD interface. Ethan Dicks wrote: > I think I have something much like that from a "Davong" external box I > picked up at Dayton some years ago - it was billed as "SCSI" and the > host connector *is* 50 pins, but it's nothing like SCSI and does have > an 8X300 chip on it. Could well be. > I have no docs. Sorry. I was asking about mine some years ago and got > some interesting replies, but no concrete information. Looks like Al has the OEM manual for the original WD1000 already online: http://www.spies.com/~aek/pdf/westernDigital/WD1000_OEMmanual.pdf The later models added features like ECC and suport for 1K sectors, but still used basically the same interface and command set. If you're familiar with the ATA (IDE) interface, the WD1000 registers and commands will seem quite familiar. Anyone got the WD1001 OEM manual? Or spare boards of either type? Back in the old days, I built my own host interface for the Apple ][. Since the WD100x buffers a full sector, the data transfer does not require DMA, so the interface card was very simple. Best regards, Eric From eric at brouhaha.com Tue Jul 30 01:13:00 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Synertek 6502 chips, 1984 date-code In-Reply-To: <20020730045923.9646.qmail@web10308.mail.yahoo.com> References: <3D45D3D6.86C67E1@topnow.com> <20020730045923.9646.qmail@web10308.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <33004.64.169.63.74.1028009526.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> >> 1. Does anyone have any cool Synertek lore they'd like to >> share with the group? All I know about them is they made >> the SYM-1 and were a 6530 second-source. I guess it's safe >> to conclude they were also a 6502 second-source. :) > > They were also a 68000 second-source for Motorola. I have a quantity > of them, c. 1982. Really? I knew that Mostek, Rockwell, Signetics, and SGS-Thompson were early second-sources for the 68000, but I haven't ever seen Synertek parts. In a Signetics data book they had a data sheet for the 68010, but I've never actually seen a 68010 made by a second source. And as far as I know, there were no second sources for the 68020, 68030, 68040, and 68060. From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Tue Jul 30 02:22:00 2002 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:21 2005 Subject: Synertek 6502 chips, 1984 date-code References: <3D45D3D6.86C67E1@topnow.com> Message-ID: <004701c23799$6dd82140$0100000a@deepspacenine> "Ross Archer" said: > I have some Synertek NMOS 6502s from various weeks > in 1984, still in their (original?) Synertek static tubes. > (At least, "Synertek" is stamped on the tubes.) Ooh! That'll be good to up the value on Ebay a few dollars... Let's see... L@@K!!!!! R@RE!!! SYNERTeK Sy6502 ***IN MANUFACTURERS PAKAGING*** ***NR*** :-) :-) :-) > A few "boy are these stupid" questions: > > 1. Does anyone have any cool Synertek lore they'd like to > share with the group? All I know about them is they made > the SYM-1 and were a 6530 second-source. I guess it's safe > to conclude they were also a 6502 second-source. :) I think I've got some e-mails from a guy who used to work for them. From memory, Synertek were a Honeywell subsidiary who signed a license with MOS Technology to second-source the 6502. MOS used the part numbers "MCS6502" and "MPS6502", Synertek used "SY6502". From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Tue Jul 30 02:28:00 2002 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: WTD: 6502, 6522, etc CPU and support ICs Message-ID: <004d01c2379a$48c422e0$0100000a@deepspacenine> Hi, I'm currently trying to build up a 6502-based SBC but - in true Sod's Law fashion - my supplier has dumped the entire 6502 CPU series, despite the fact they're still made by California Micro Devices. Anyone (preferably in the UK) got a few spare MOS Technology, Rockwell, Synertek or CalMicro 6502 ICs? I've also seen some photos of 6502 chips with a "VTI" logo - probably VLSI Technology; anyone ever seen one of these? There is a photo of one on http://65c02.tripod.com/ - see "SBC-1 Hardware", first photo (right at the top). If anyone with spare stock of 6502s and/or 6502 support ICs could e-mail me offlist with prices, I'd be very grateful. Thanks. -- Phil. philpem@dsl.pipex.com http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ From mranalog at attbi.com Tue Jul 30 02:38:01 2002 From: mranalog at attbi.com (Doug Coward) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: Books Message-ID: <3D464202.7CB9999E@attbi.com> I just found a great set of books online and ordered them right away. The books are a 1962, first edition set, published by Howard W. Sams called "Computer Basics". VOL I: INTRODUCTION TO ANALOG COMPUTERS VOL II: ANALOG COMPUTERS, MATHEMATICS AND CIRCUITRY VOL III: DIGITAL COMPUTERS MATH AND CIRCUITRY VOL IV: STORAGE AND LOGIC CIRCUITRY VOL V: COMPUTER ORGANIZATION, PROGRAMMING AND MAINTANANCE The first two volumes are also being auctioned off on eBay right now and there are some pictures. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1551960033 The surprising thing is that I didn't find these books on BookFinder.com. I found them on Barnes and Nobles website (www.bn.com) under their "out of print" section. While I was looking around also I came across this interesting sounding book, but decided not to buy it. Basics of Digital Computer Programming, John S. Murphy, John F. Rider Publisher Inc. 1964 115 pgs. Illustrated throughout with diagrams and charts. Book # m840 Price: US$ 5.00 http://dogbert.abebooks.com/abe/BookDetails?AID=7169465&PID=284433&bi=144553858 --Doug ========================================= Doug Coward @ home in Poulsbo, WA Analog Computer Online Museum and History Center http://dcoward.best.vwh.net/analog ========================================= From kentborg at borg.org Tue Jul 30 08:44:01 2002 From: kentborg at borg.org (Kent Borg) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) In-Reply-To: ; from aw288@osfn.org on Mon, Jul 29, 2002 at 06:55:27PM -0400 References: <007901c2370b$178f4b30$9701a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Message-ID: <20020730094339.A4628@borg.org> On Mon, Jul 29, 2002 at 06:55:27PM -0400, William Donzelli wrote: > There are also 2 unused, still-boxed 33s with 101A Datasets. For > these latter items, I am accepting offers. Still pick up, or you > arrange shipping. Jeepers! How about an opening bid of $200 plus actual shipping costs. (Maybe e-mail you a paid UPS shipping label?) Thanks, -kb From foo at siconic.com Tue Jul 30 10:54:01 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: Synertek 6502 chips, 1984 date-code In-Reply-To: <004701c23799$6dd82140$0100000a@deepspacenine> Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, Philip Pemberton wrote: > > 1. Does anyone have any cool Synertek lore they'd like to > > share with the group? All I know about them is they made > > the SYM-1 and were a 6530 second-source. I guess it's safe > > to conclude they were also a 6502 second-source. :) > I think I've got some e-mails from a guy who used to work for them. From > memory, Synertek were a Honeywell subsidiary who signed a license with MOS > Technology to second-source the 6502. MOS used the part numbers "MCS6502" > and "MPS6502", Synertek used "SY6502". Synertek 6502's are very common in Apple //e's. I was just working on one yesterday that had a SY6502. > > 2. Is this a "Find" in any sense? (I paid all of 30 cents > > each for them.) My motivation is to have enough replacement > > parts to keep all my 6502-based hardware humming for years > > to come. Though in this case I have several lifetimes' worth. > > :) > I would call it a find. How many have you got? Would you be interested in > selling me a few? I would also call it a "find" but it's nothing special. A tube of common 6502's does not make me moist. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From jbmcb at hotmail.com Tue Jul 30 11:38:00 2002 From: jbmcb at hotmail.com (Jason McBrien) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: U of M Property dispo References: <3D464202.7CB9999E@attbi.com> Message-ID: Took a trip to the University of Michigan property disposition, had some interesting things: A few IBM 7xxx serial disk array subsystems. One in the old white rack, and one double RS/6000 black rack. The double rack has 8x2GB, 8x2 rack drives for a total of 128GB of disk space. I think they wanted $10,000 for both racks. An older model (early 90's) tape autoloader and controller, with the *superbad* big green LED displays on top. An Ardent mini. Not sure what model, but it's about 2.5' wide and around 4.5' tall. $75 and it's yours :) A bunch of Sun SBUS FDDI cards. A bunch of Sun SPARC 10's, 20's, 4's and 5's. A bit overpriced at $100 each as many were stripped. A DEC TA-78 (I think) tape drive. A couple rackmount CD-ROM farms. Other fun stuff: A HUGE AmPro video projector. About a yard square and over a foot thick, must have been for a main lecture hall. A few complete, professional film developing systems. I think they had a 16mm movie developer as well. An X-ray machine, the big kind that swivels around a gurney. Misc. video editing gear, like S-video patchbays and editing VCR decks. I didn't pick up anything, but I might go back for a nice sun monitor and a few CD-ROM drives. From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 30 12:06:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: WTD: 6502, 6522, etc CPU and support ICs In-Reply-To: <004d01c2379a$48c422e0$0100000a@deepspacenine> Message-ID: <20020730170502.54667.qmail@web10302.mail.yahoo.com> --- Philip Pemberton wrote: > If anyone with spare stock of 6502s and/or 6502 support ICs could > e-mail me offlist with prices, I'd be very grateful. > > Thanks. It's not off-list because I figured others would be interested, too, but BG Micro (www.bgmicro.com) has a few support chips in their current catalog: 6522 - $2.70 6551 - $2.40 6545 - $2.10 6845P - $2.20 It's at least an idea of what the going rate is/should be. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 30 12:09:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: Synertek 6502 chips, 1984 date-code In-Reply-To: <33004.64.169.63.74.1028009526.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <20020730170746.64960.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> --- Eric Smith wrote: > >> 1. Does anyone have any cool Synertek lore they'd like to > >> share with the group? All I know about them is they made > >> the SYM-1 and were a 6530 second-source. I guess it's safe > >> to conclude they were also a 6502 second-source. :) > > > > They were also a 68000 second-source for Motorola. I have a quantity > > of them, c. 1982. > > Really? I knew that Mostek, Rockwell, Signetics, and SGS-Thompson were > early second-sources for the 68000, but I haven't ever seen Synertek > parts. Perhaps I'm confused. I may have been told "Synertek" by someone at work, c. 1984, and they might have meant Signetics. I _do_ have some 68000 chips with a "block S" logo... would that be Signetics, then? -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From Hans.Franke at mch20.sbs.de Tue Jul 30 12:21:00 2002 From: Hans.Franke at mch20.sbs.de (Hans Franke) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: New Comp in Old Cloth In-Reply-To: <20020730170746.64960.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> References: <33004.64.169.63.74.1028009526.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> Message-ID: <3D46E6CC.29108.17B1866@localhost> Take a look at: http://www.retrosystem.com A guy fitting actual Intel boxes into VCS, NES or Amiga 1000 cases (at the moment only the Amiga is available). Gruss H. -- VCF Europa 4.0 am 03./04. Mai 2003 in Muenchen http://www.vcfe.org/ From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Tue Jul 30 12:24:01 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: WTD: support ICs Message-ID: <200207301722.KAA28376@clulw009.amd.com> Hi I'm always looking for DTL chips. Finding these would be great. Anyone with some of these hiding away or some old surplus board with them on it, I'd be interested. I forget the numbers I need but one is a open collector nand ( something like 935? but that sounds like a RTL). I'll have to make list. Dwight From doc at mdrconsult.com Tue Jul 30 12:29:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: New Comp in Old Cloth In-Reply-To: <3D46E6CC.29108.17B1866@localhost> Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, Hans Franke wrote: > Take a look at: > http://www.retrosystem.com > A guy fitting actual Intel boxes into VCS, NES or Amiga 1000 > cases (at the moment only the Amiga is available). Bleah. I don't like Model-A Fords with V8 hemis, either. Doc From cisin at xenosoft.com Tue Jul 30 12:51:01 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: Substantial tweaking on more exotic platforms (fwd) Message-ID: Who is ? S/he/it appears to have Klez on their computer, and CLASSICCMP is one of the bogus return addresses that it is affixing to its outgoing crap. Probably putting MINE on some, also! PLEASE, download and run the Klez removal tool from Symantec at: http://securityresponse.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/w32.klez.removal.tool.html It sure is nice to run PINE on a shell account - total immunity to all of the Outhouse crap. -- Grumpy Ol' Fred From eric at brouhaha.com Tue Jul 30 13:12:00 2002 From: eric at brouhaha.com (Eric Smith) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: Synertek 6502 chips, 1984 date-code In-Reply-To: <20020730170746.64960.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> References: <33004.64.169.63.74.1028009526.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> <20020730170746.64960.qmail@web10305.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <32830.64.169.63.74.1028052668.squirrel@ruckus.brouhaha.com> > Perhaps I'm confused. I may have been told "Synertek" by someone at > work, c. 1984, and they might have meant Signetics. I _do_ have some > 68000 chips with a "block S" logo... would that be Signetics, then? Sounds like Signetics. Those are still relatively uncommon. Motorola parts are obviously the most common, perhaps followed by Rockwell and Hitachi. Anyone know whether Hitachi ever shipped their HD63000? That was to be a CMOS version of the 68000 that would have predated the Motorola MC68HC000. I heard somewhere that Mostek alone of the second sources had a license to make the 68020, but I don't think they ever did. From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 30 13:54:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: Synertek 6502 chips, 1984 date-code In-Reply-To: from "Sellam Ismail" at Jul 30, 2 00:54:13 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 562 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020730/bb59da1f/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 30 13:56:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: WTD: support ICs In-Reply-To: <200207301722.KAA28376@clulw009.amd.com> from "Dwight K. Elvey" at Jul 30, 2 10:22:02 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 930 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020730/54d2f24b/attachment.ksh From vaxzilla at jarai.org Tue Jul 30 13:57:45 2002 From: vaxzilla at jarai.org (Brian Chase) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: New Comp in Old Cloth In-Reply-To: <3D46E6CC.29108.17B1866@localhost> Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, Hans Franke wrote: > Take a look at: > http://www.retrosystem.com > A guy fitting actual Intel boxes into VCS, NES or Amiga 1000 > cases (at the moment only the Amiga is available). Why would anyone want to downgrade such lovely old computer systems with Intel gear? What a shame. -brian. From jpl15 at panix.com Tue Jul 30 14:50:00 2002 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: Monroe Mod 1 Calc Message-ID: At the Ft. Tuthill swapmeet last weekend in Flagstaff, AZ, I rescued an old Monroe Model 1 Electric Adding Calculator - 100 key panel, moving carriage with number drums behind windows - you get the picture. Since I am not at all interested in Yet Another Hobby, I thought I'd offer this to the List first, as I know there are some of you who love and collect these old babies. Cosmetically it is quite good, needs cleaning and touch-up; mechanically I am rather loath to fire it up, but all the knobs and keys seem to work, the carriage moves with both the side lever and the t-handled knob at the bottom of the keyboard, nothing seems gummed or jammed. I would like to get some small amount for it, and I will be pleased to pack and ship, weight will be about 15-20lb packed for the road from zip 95971. I will also be happy to send pix of it to you. Send offers to me privately please, not to the List, this is mostly Off Topic... Cheerz John From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Tue Jul 30 14:53:01 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: Synertek 6502 chips, 1984 date-code Message-ID: <200207301951.MAA28451@clulw009.amd.com> >From: "Eric Smith" > >> Perhaps I'm confused. I may have been told "Synertek" by someone at >> work, c. 1984, and they might have meant Signetics. I _do_ have some >> 68000 chips with a "block S" logo... would that be Signetics, then? > >Sounds like Signetics. > >Those are still relatively uncommon. Motorola parts are obviously >the most common, perhaps followed by Rockwell and Hitachi. > >Anyone know whether Hitachi ever shipped their HD63000? That was to be >a CMOS version of the 68000 that would have predated the Motorola MC68HC000. > >I heard somewhere that Mostek alone of the second sources had a license >to make the 68020, but I don't think they ever did. > Hi Toshiba did a 68301 varient of the 68000 that I know of. ( it is in my telescope control ). Dwight From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Tue Jul 30 14:58:01 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: WTD: support ICs Message-ID: <200207301957.MAA28455@clulw009.amd.com> >From: ard@p850ug1.demon.co.uk > >> >> Hi >> I'm always looking for DTL chips. Finding these >> would be great. Anyone with some of these hiding >> away or some old surplus board with them on it, >> I'd be interested. I forget the numbers I need >> but one is a open collector nand ( something like >> 935? but that sounds like a RTL). I'll have to make > >It's been a long time, but I thought the 935 was an hex inverter >(open-collecotr output, of course -- aren't _all_ DTL chips like that). >The quad 2-input NAND is the 846 (I was repairing a board that used one, >surrounded by TTL chips, the other day). > >Unless the _input_ characteristics are important (they were on this >board, as the inputs came from RC networks), you can often use the >equivalent TTL part (open-collector outputs, so something like a '03 for >the NAND or a '05 for the inverter) with resistor pull-ups (around 3k >from each output to Vcc). It's not original, but it normally works. > >-tony > > Hi Tony I think the one number I'm thinking of was something38 and not somthing35. Yes, it is true that a TTL will sub in most cases but there is one that doesn't work and that is where you have the expanded input ( also one of the chips I'm looking for ). This was only done on the DTL and not supported on the TTL of similar function. I have to go back and look to see what the numbers were. Dwight From stanb at dial.pipex.com Tue Jul 30 15:01:00 2002 From: stanb at dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: New Comp in Old Cloth In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 30 Jul 2002 11:54:20 PDT." Message-ID: <200207301955.UAA09521@citadel.metropolis.local> Hi, Brian Chase said: > On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, Hans Franke wrote: > > > Take a look at: > > http://www.retrosystem.com > > A guy fitting actual Intel boxes into VCS, NES or Amiga 1000 > > cases (at the moment only the Amiga is available). > > Why would anyone want to downgrade such lovely old computer systems > with Intel gear? What a shame. > Get your own back - put your Amiga 1200 in a PC-type tower case... http://www.powerc.com Sorta like that guy who put a Model A engine in a Pinto... -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com The future was never like this! From healyzh at aracnet.com Tue Jul 30 16:01:01 2002 From: healyzh at aracnet.com (Zane H. Healy) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: New Comp in Old Cloth In-Reply-To: from "Stan Barr" at Jul 30, 2002 08:55:37 PM Message-ID: <200207302100.g6UL0WZ00739@shell1.aracnet.com> > Get your own back - put your Amiga 1200 in a PC-type tower case... > http://www.powerc.com > > Sorta like that guy who put a Model A engine in a Pinto... > -- > Cheers, > Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com Keep in mind, there is a 'legitimate' reason for doing this. People are adding so much onto their A1200's that they have to tower them. I mean, good grief, they're even strapping PCI slots onto those suckers! Though I think the lastest addons sort of turn the A1200 system board into a co-processor to the actual computer. Zane From coredump at gifford.co.uk Tue Jul 30 17:59:01 2002 From: coredump at gifford.co.uk (John Honniball) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: Motorola 6800 parts Message-ID: <3D471981.D1713203@gifford.co.uk> Just to follow-up on a message from way back, I saw some Motorola XC6800 parts in a prototype board today. There was an XC6800 CPU (with clock module) and two XC6820 parallel port chips. The "XC" prefix, it seems, was a Motorola prefix for early pre-production parts. The date codes were from 1975. -- John Honniball coredump@gifford.co.uk From coredump at gifford.co.uk Tue Jul 30 18:04:01 2002 From: coredump at gifford.co.uk (John Honniball) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: Manual for GEC 2050 available (Bristol, UK) Message-ID: <3D471AD1.4DC01F8C@gifford.co.uk> If anybody has a GEC 2050, and needs a manual, I may be able to help. Some friends have just found a 2050 processor manual, and would like to find a good home for it. E-mail me off-list for details, please. Here's a web page for the machine: http://www.cucumber.demon.co.uk/geccl/2050/ -- John Honniball coredump@gifford.co.uk From archer at topnow.com Tue Jul 30 18:40:01 2002 From: archer at topnow.com (Ross Archer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:22 2005 Subject: New Comp in Old Cloth References: <200207301955.UAA09521@citadel.metropolis.local> Message-ID: <3D4723A3.DA191F35@topnow.com> Stan Barr wrote: > > Hi, > > Brian Chase said: > > On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, Hans Franke wrote: > > > > > Take a look at: > > > http://www.retrosystem.com > > > A guy fitting actual Intel boxes into VCS, NES or Amiga 1000 > > > cases (at the moment only the Amiga is available). > > > > Why would anyone want to downgrade such lovely old computer systems > > with Intel gear? What a shame. "The past was never like this." :) > > > > Get your own back - put your Amiga 1200 in a PC-type tower case... "The future should have been like this.." > http://www.powerc.com > > Sorta like that guy who put a Model A engine in a Pinto... > -- > Cheers, > Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com > > The future was never like this! I know. What a rip. From jrkeys at concentric.net Tue Jul 30 18:42:33 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Some Great Finds Today Message-ID: <033401c23822$40f61db0$78000240@oemcomputer> Well today was pretty good to me but I also missed some nice items at the auction. 1. A working Vectrex, console and one controller only no games with it. $5 2. A NES Stack-up cartridge for ROB the robot and it had the special Famicon board and Famicon-to-NES converter inside. $6 3. A Advanced Electronic Applications, Inc. Computer Patch Interface. It's a gray metal box with the following on the faceplate Filter - Tune - Var Shift - STBY/PTT - NORM - OFF/ON - PWR light. Under the Filter title are three buttons named VAR - 170 - CW. It's a model CP-1 and on the back are lots of phono ports. Anyone have info on this unit? 4. Got several books, generic pc's such as 386 and P166's, some 14" monitors, and some ink jets all for $10. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020730/78560b64/attachment.html From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Tue Jul 30 19:02:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Some Great Finds Today In-Reply-To: <033401c23822$40f61db0$78000240@oemcomputer> from "Keys" at Jul 30, 2 06:38:47 pm Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 738 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020730/36a01b38/attachment.ksh From jpl15 at panix.com Tue Jul 30 19:12:01 2002 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Some Great Finds Today In-Reply-To: <033401c23822$40f61db0$78000240@oemcomputer> Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, Keys wrote: > Well today was pretty good to me but I also missed some nice items at the auction. [snip] > 3. A Advanced Electronic Applications, Inc. Computer Patch Interface. > It's a gray metal box with the following on the faceplate Filter - Tune > - Var Shift - STBY/PTT - NORM - OFF/ON - PWR light. Under the Filter > title are three buttons named VAR - 170 - CW. > It's a model CP-1 and on the back are lots of phono ports. Anyone have >info on this unit? This is an early AEA (some years out of business now, assets bought by Timewave Inc., www.timewave.com) interface box for decoding Morse Code and Radio Teletype signals. 'Var Shift' refers to the different modulation methods used by RTTY signals, they are FSK and use one tone to denote a 'mark' and one tone to denote a 'space' with the difference between the two called the 'shift' of the signal. 'VAR - 170 - CW' is for Variable shift, a fixed shift of 170 Htz, or Morse Code... this is a filter adjustment and usually the code part is fixed on a center frequency of 500 - 900 htz. As for usefulness, opinions may vary, but it is quite a primitive little box, compared to thier other products, and similar products of competing manufacturers... there are quite a few of them around, in fact I saw two or three at the recent hamfest I attended over the weekend. Hope this helps a bit. Cheers John From jpl15 at panix.com Tue Jul 30 19:15:01 2002 From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Monroe Calc gone Message-ID: Gawd but youse guys is a buncha Vultures! ;} The Monroe Calculator has been Spoken For - thanks and 'sorry!' to the others who have responded or who have yet to respond. I wonder if I'd put it on Ebay - maybe I'd be able to think about that Cessna Twin I want... Cheerz John From gehrich at tampabay.rr.com Tue Jul 30 19:29:01 2002 From: gehrich at tampabay.rr.com (Gene Ehrich) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Texas Instruments TI-1025 Calculator still in original box with instructions In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20020730202611.00a18660@pop-server> >Texas Instruments TI-1025 Calculator still in original box with instructions It still works. Does it have any value? Gene From allain at panix.com Tue Jul 30 19:32:01 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) References: <20020730051010.39117.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001e01c23829$69308fc0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> >> There are also 2 unused, still-boxed 33s with 101A Datasets. > Do you know if these have the rotary dial or the touch-tone keypad? I The ones that I saw of the '33 type (me no expert) had touchtone, but this warehouse had many machines (some MIL, some teletype-type) with a pulse dialers on them. Here's a rave about the rest (long). A good word for the Donzie's woarehouse experience. First off to see is the magnitude of everything. The Armory encloses an area equal to the MIT swapmeet, with about 2~3 times the mass of items (in boxfulls instead of just covering tabletops) and of course no PeeSee. I spent a whole day there which was just about enough, considering the MIT swapmeet takes me about 3 hours. There certainly are enough teletypes... I estimate about 50 of them -various models- in complete assembly but in good/used condition, unboxed with a small amount of dust in them. There are also some same-era Siemens machines of teletype function. For teletypes there is about maybe 60' x 6' x 3' of boxed replacement parts, we also found informtion booklets and packets for TT scattered around (this is day 2 of WD's many-week holding of the warehouse) things will only get more orderly. Of interest to me The real neat stuff for me were beaucoup 19" racks with MIL stuff in them. We're talking here about meters, switches, actuators, scopes, waveguides, gear drive actuators, really the more interesting things you can find in racks, short of an actual PDP-1. Also many testsets (meter boxes) and on and on. I can keep writing about this but you may get the idea by now... Indiana Jones' lost Arc is in there someplace. John A. an unpaid endorsement From sloboyko at yahoo.com Tue Jul 30 19:46:01 2002 From: sloboyko at yahoo.com (Loboyko Steve) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: WTD: support ICs In-Reply-To: <200207301722.KAA28376@clulw009.amd.com> Message-ID: <20020731004507.60816.qmail@web11803.mail.yahoo.com> I have some very strange boards from a CNC controller that had video and an 8080, but is made mostly of what I think are DTL chips. All are in sockets. Send the list, these are taking up space! 846 930 830, etc. --- "Dwight K. Elvey" wrote: > Hi > I'm always looking for DTL chips. Finding these > would be great. Anyone with some of these hiding > away or some old surplus board with them on it, > I'd be interested. I forget the numbers I need > but one is a open collector nand ( something like > 935? but that sounds like a RTL). I'll have to make > list. > Dwight > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From sloboyko at yahoo.com Tue Jul 30 19:51:00 2002 From: sloboyko at yahoo.com (Loboyko Steve) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: 8080 In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20020729115859.01b48a18@ubanproductions.com> Message-ID: <20020731005012.61415.qmail@web11801.mail.yahoo.com> I don't think it's very hard to make a "minimal" 8008 system, even buffered. I used a 8080, 8224 clock driver (not hard to find), a 241 and a few 373's for the address buffering, a 138 to decode memory on 8K boundaries, a pair of 2114's and a 2716 on my demo display board. All are available from Jameco. a 7404 and an 00 were the only other TTL on the board. I'ts a pain to come up with the +12 and -5, but still, not a big deal. The "hard" part is finding nice, displayable components instead of second-source junky plastic chips. --- Tom Uban wrote: > I can provide schematics of an 8085 SBC which > includes a processor, > minimal RAM, ROM, serial, CTC, and parallel. > > --tom > > At 09:51 AM 7/29/2002 -0700, you wrote: > >Hi Raoul > > I have the schematic for an Intel 80/10. This is > one > >of the early 8080 SBC's that Intel sold( I think > the 80/05 > >was first ). Many of the parts would be vary hard > to find. > > I would recommend doing a 8085 if you can. These > are a > >lot more friendly. Other than an address latch, the > rest > >is more like just tacking on various bussed parts. > I don't > >recall but I think there are some simple circuits > in > >the Intel 8085 manuals I have. > >Dwight > > > > >From: "Raoul J.A. Somers" > > > > > > >Hello, > > > > > >I am looking for circuit diagrams of the original > 8080 / 8085 to > > >construct a prototype board > > > > > >Any hints? > > > > > >Raoul Somers > > >Brussels, Belgium > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From bpope at wordstock.com Tue Jul 30 19:54:01 2002 From: bpope at wordstock.com (Bryan Pope) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Some Great Finds Today In-Reply-To: <033401c23822$40f61db0$78000240@oemcomputer> from "Keys" at Jul 30, 02 06:38:47 pm Message-ID: <200207310050.UAA18820@wordstock.com> And thusly Keys spake: > > 1. A working Vectrex, console and one controller only no games with it. = > $5 ...Vectrex... *drool* $5!! ack! *sigh* From doc at mdrconsult.com Tue Jul 30 19:57:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Things to do in Kansas? Message-ID: Hi. It looks like I'm going to be in Overland Park (South end of KC?), Kansas next week. Are there any Classic Computing "must-see" places? any CCmp denizens? I'm flying, and working 7-6 every day, so I can't bring any PDPs or do any all-day treks, but I'd be up for meeting anyone who shares this obsession, err, hobby. Last time I was in Denver I got to meet Emanuel and Bill, and had a great time with them. It's nice having a face and a voice to go with the .sig. Doc From sloboyko at yahoo.com Tue Jul 30 19:59:22 2002 From: sloboyko at yahoo.com (Loboyko Steve) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) In-Reply-To: <001e01c23829$69308fc0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <20020731005414.70760.qmail@web11805.mail.yahoo.com> Tell us of these glorious finds, so we can enjoy them vicariouly! No time to visit, and no room for anything anyway! Sure would like an ASR-33, though. Heck, I'd like to hear an MP3 of one printing (all I've found on the 'net was model 19's). --- John Allain wrote: > >> There are also 2 unused, still-boxed 33s with > 101A Datasets. > > Do you know if these have the rotary dial or the > touch-tone keypad? I > > The ones that I saw of the '33 type (me no expert) > had touchtone, > but this warehouse had many machines (some MIL, some > teletype-type) > with a pulse dialers on them. > > Here's a rave about the rest (long). > > A good word for the Donzie's woarehouse experience. > First off to see > is the magnitude of everything. The Armory encloses > an area equal to > the MIT swapmeet, with about 2~3 times the mass of > items (in boxfulls > instead of just covering tabletops) and of course no > PeeSee. I spent a > whole day there which was just about enough, > considering the MIT > swapmeet takes me about 3 hours. > > There certainly are enough teletypes... I estimate > about 50 of them > -various models- in complete assembly but in > good/used condition, > unboxed with a small amount of dust in them. There > are also some > same-era Siemens machines of teletype function. For > teletypes there > is about maybe 60' x 6' x 3' of boxed replacement > parts, we also found > informtion booklets and packets for TT scattered > around (this is day 2 > of WD's many-week holding of the warehouse) things > will only get more > orderly. > > Of interest to me > The real neat stuff for me were beaucoup 19" racks > with MIL stuff in them. > We're talking here about meters, switches, > actuators, scopes, > waveguides, gear drive actuators, really the more > interesting things you > can find in racks, short of an actual PDP-1. > Also many testsets (meter boxes) and on and on. I > can keep writing about > this but you may get the idea by now... Indiana > Jones' lost Arc is in there > someplace. > > John A. > an unpaid endorsement > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From IVIE at cc.usu.edu Tue Jul 30 20:02:08 2002 From: IVIE at cc.usu.edu (Roger Ivie) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Wanted WD-100x disk controllers -- NOT for ISA bus Message-ID: <01KKPSRDVC42AKTKEE@cc.usu.edu> Eric Smith said: > Does anyone have any spare WD-1000, WD-1001, or related disk controllers, > or documentation on them? Yeah, I've got a couple of WD1002-05s, a couple of WD1002-HDOs from dead Kaypro 10s, a manual for the WD1002-05, and a manual for the WD1000. I can probably even find some of this stuff, as opposed to the Atari Portfolio stuff I promised someone a while ago. It'd cost you, though. Many years ago I sent you a couple of DECtapes with an OS/8 V3C distribution kit on them because you said you could read them with a DECtape to PC interface. It'd be nice to have those back. Or even better if you could get around to reading them and posting them somewhere for general download by the 12-bit community. -- Roger Ivie ivie@cc.usu.edu From doc at mdrconsult.com Tue Jul 30 20:15:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: RFD: List-member database Message-ID: There was a real brief discussion about this several months ago, and I never followed through. The broad strokes of my idea was to put together a questionnaire for anybody who'll answer, with city of residence, area of collecting, maybe real-world occupation and computing experience/expertise, etc. Gather that into a running database, mostly for member consumption only. We all seem to travel a fair amount, most of us seem to enjoy "hooking up" with other collectors, and such a database seems like a natural thing to do, and a very valuable resource. Personally, I'm really curious as to what the map will look like. There seem to be some fair concentrations in some not-obviously-reasonable places. Like the Great North Woods. :) If there's reasonable interest and no huge objections, and someone else will help design and implement the actual db, I'll put together the questionnaire & collate the responses. Preliminary ideas: Public and private info. Some info, like my webpage, I might be willing to put out as a public resource. My address I might make available to list members, but not for publication on a website. So the Q-sheet needs a flag for "privileged" info. All info, obviously, is optional. Areas of expertise & employment could be tricky. A lot of us are contractors and consultants, and there's a fuzzy line between making resources available and solicitation. Whether your collection is organised for viewing, or, like mine, piles here and there {and everywhere} that can be excavated for the needed item, would be relevant info. We'll need a hosting site. I might be able to provide that, but I'm not sure. So what do y'all think? Is it A Fun Thing To Do? Ideas about what info we want/don't want? Volunteers? Doc From aw288 at osfn.org Tue Jul 30 20:18:00 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) In-Reply-To: <001e01c23829$69308fc0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: > The ones that I saw of the '33 type (me no expert) had touchtone, > but this warehouse had many machines (some MIL, some teletype-type) > with a pulse dialers on them. It turns out one machine is a 33, one is a 32. > A good word for the Donzie's woarehouse experience. First off to see > is the magnitude of everything. The Armory encloses an area equal to > the MIT swapmeet, with about 2~3 times the mass of items (in boxfulls > instead of just covering tabletops) and of course no PeeSee. I spent a > whole day there which was just about enough, considering the MIT > swapmeet takes me about 3 hours. And you did not even dig too much. I have been going to that warehouse for six years, and even today I found dozens of good things I never knew about. > John A. > an unpaid endorsement Thanks! Come back and you will get a freebie...ummm...ummm...gyrocompass binnacle. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From aw288 at osfn.org Tue Jul 30 20:26:00 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) In-Reply-To: <20020730051010.39117.qmail@web10307.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: > Do you know if these have the rotary dial or the touch-tone keypad? Touch tone. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From aw288 at osfn.org Tue Jul 30 20:29:00 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) In-Reply-To: <20020730094339.A4628@borg.org> Message-ID: > Jeepers! How about an opening bid of $200 plus actual shipping costs. > (Maybe e-mail you a paid UPS shipping label?) I can not ship this item. Someone else would have to. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From allain at panix.com Tue Jul 30 20:33:00 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) References: <20020731005414.70760.qmail@web11805.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <016701c23831$f10e62c0$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> > Tell us of these glorious finds, so we can enjoy them > vicariouly! I'm a TTY wimp. The ones I looked at had a proprietary (IE normally inside the case) connector with what looked like a normal 5/12v power connector, only more pins, 5x4, instead of 1x4 IIRC. If someone can pin this out for me I'm goin' back! Also: Radar consoles, VGC. Would make a neat rack to house an early vector graphics system. About 6 of them of different types. And storage racks from medium to "Home Depot" scale. Also: WD now has his own under-wing radar system in aerodynamic pod. > Heck, I'd like to hear an MP3 of one printing (all I've found > the 'net was model 19's). Rent, no buy, 'Andromeda Strain' or 'Colossus'... everyone here should have a copy. John A. From aw288 at osfn.org Tue Jul 30 21:07:01 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.0.20020725211720.02f39e80@mail.njd.concentric.com> Message-ID: For the record, one known 33 is left (other than the new one). This may change - even today a 33 was uncovered in a place I was not aware of. There still are 35s. In fact, no one has expressed interest in them yet (oddly). William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From cmcnabb at 4mcnabb.net Tue Jul 30 21:12:00 2002 From: cmcnabb at 4mcnabb.net (Christopher McNabb) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: List-member database References: Message-ID: <000701c23837$a49414c0$3200a8c0@winnt> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doc Shipley" To: "Classic Computers" Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2002 9:14 PM Subject: RFD: List-member database > > So what do y'all think? Is it A Fun Thing To Do? Ideas about what > info we want/don't want? Volunteers? > I've been thinking about this lately too, with one addition - I think a searchable database of parts that people are willing to trade would be great. I can provide hosting on a machine at Virginia Tech. From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Tue Jul 30 21:22:00 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) References: Message-ID: <3D4748BE.8040608@jetnet.ab.ca> William Donzelli wrote: > For the record, one known 33 is left (other than the new one). This may > change - even today a 33 was uncovered in a place I was not aware of. > > There still are 35s. In fact, no one has expressed interest in them yet > (oddly). > > William Donzelli > aw288@osfn.org > > I am kind of looking for a serial paper tape reader and punch, but not at e-bay prices. Just what is a model 35? From doc at mdrconsult.com Tue Jul 30 21:24:31 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: List-member database In-Reply-To: <000701c23837$a49414c0$3200a8c0@winnt> Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, Christopher McNabb wrote: > > I've been thinking about this lately too, with one addition - I think > a searchable database of parts that people are willing to trade would > be great. I can provide hosting on a machine at Virginia Tech. > New toys, I mean parts! Yeah, I knew I was missing something really important. Want lists and To-Trade lists. Thanks! Doc From aw288 at osfn.org Tue Jul 30 21:28:00 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) In-Reply-To: <3D4748BE.8040608@jetnet.ab.ca> Message-ID: > I am kind of looking for a serial paper tape reader and punch, > but not at e-bay prices. Just what is a model 35? A Cadillac 33. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From cisin at xenosoft.com Tue Jul 30 21:31:00 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: HEADERS? Message-ID: Can somebody more familiar with such confirm whether that is indeed Richard Erlacher's machine that sent the following copy of Klez? (Headers only follow) ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Return-Path: Received: from mailhost.idcomm.com (mailhost.idcomm.com [207.40.196.14]) by lmi.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA05488 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 19:17:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Dqza (dsl-res156.idcomm.com [216.98.199.156]) by mailhost.idcomm.com (8.10.2/8.10.0) with SMTP id g6V2HSJ01036 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 20:17:29 -0600 Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 20:17:29 -0600 Message-Id: <200207310217.g6V2HSJ01036@mailhost.idcomm.com> From: JPLCSCH To: cisin@xenosoft.com Subject: Dialog under MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Q37LE02W0269aCiF037Kl967jS3g6 Content-Length: 177741 From sloboyko at yahoo.com Tue Jul 30 21:34:01 2002 From: sloboyko at yahoo.com (Loboyko Steve) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020731023222.57892.qmail@web11802.mail.yahoo.com> I'm surprised no one wants the model 35's. My godmother, who was a top level TTY repair person at the famous Western Electric Hawthorne Works plant in Cicero, Illinois, said that the 33 was a piece of junk compared to the 35. The 33 was never meant to be a computer output device and she junked a lot of them that had just gotten the you-know-what beaten out of them. The 35 was meant to be a serious, continuous duty unit, designed to be maintainable essentially forever. Apparently, lot of the adjustments to the 33 are made by "forming"-a polite word for bending. Of course, the 35 is a lot heavier and bigger! And was a lot more expensive. Anyone who gets one should take extra care for extra platens and plastic pieces. They were really cheap (like the platen knobs) and after this many years I don't think the plastic's gotten stronger. Watch for dried up platens. And take care of the ones you get (DONT, DONT clean with alchohol. Ever.) Unfortunately, she's really old and I don't think she could help me with one even if I lucked into one. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From jfoust at threedee.com Tue Jul 30 21:44:01 2002 From: jfoust at threedee.com (John Foust) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: HEADERS? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.0.0.25.0.20020730213647.02489bd8@pc> At 07:29 PM 7/30/2002 -0700, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: >Can somebody more familiar with such confirm whether that is indeed >Richard Erlacher's machine that sent the following copy of Klez? (Headers >only follow) One trick of Klez is that it harvests e-mail addresses from your mailboxes and uses them to spoof the From: line, in order to make it seem (on casual inspection) that person has the virus. They don't. Someone who received mail from Erlacher (perhaps a list subscriber) has Klez. - John From cisin at xenosoft.com Tue Jul 30 21:55:00 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: HEADERS? In-Reply-To: <5.0.0.25.0.20020730213647.02489bd8@pc> Message-ID: > At 07:29 PM 7/30/2002 -0700, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > >Can somebody more familiar with such confirm whether that is indeed > >Richard Erlacher's machine that sent the following copy of Klez? (Headers > >only follow) On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, John Foust wrote: > One trick of Klez is that it harvests e-mail addresses > from your mailboxes and uses them to spoof the From: line, > in order to make it seem (on casual inspection) that > person has the virus. They don't. Someone who received > mail from Erlacher (perhaps a list subscriber) has Klez. NO. PLEASE look again. Dick's address is in the RETURN PATH line, NOT the FROM line! It appears that Dick's computer is the one with Klez, and it put a false FROM: of JPLCSCH@aol.com MOST varieties of Klez put a bogus FROM:, but leave the Return-Path: intact. Return-Path: Received: from mailhost.idcomm.com (mailhost.idcomm.com [207.40.196.14]) by lmi.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA05488 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 19:17:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Dqza (dsl-res156.idcomm.com [216.98.199.156]) by mailhost.idcomm.com (8.10.2/8.10.0) with SMTP id g6V2HSJ01036 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 20:17:29 -0600 Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 20:17:29 -0600 Message-Id: <200207310217.g6V2HSJ01036@mailhost.idcomm.com> From: JPLCSCH To: cisin@xenosoft.com Subject: Dialog under MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Q37LE02W0269aCiF037Kl967jS3g6 From jfoust at threedee.com Tue Jul 30 22:18:00 2002 From: jfoust at threedee.com (John Foust) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: HEADERS? In-Reply-To: References: <5.0.0.25.0.20020730213647.02489bd8@pc> Message-ID: <5.0.0.25.0.20020730221207.0260f538@pc> At 07:54 PM 7/30/2002 -0700, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: >NO. PLEASE look again. Dick's address is in the RETURN PATH line, NOT >the FROM line! It appears that Dick's computer is the one with >Klez, and it put a false FROM: of JPLCSCH@aol.com I'm sorry - yes, that IP matches Dick's DSL, as seen on a previous CC-Talk message: Received: from dslres156 (dsl-res156.idcomm.com [216.98.199.156]) by mailhost.idcomm.com (8.10.2/8.10.0) with SMTP id g5JEXw624437 for ; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 08:33:58 -0600 - John From jimw at agora.rdrop.com Tue Jul 30 22:27:01 2002 From: jimw at agora.rdrop.com (James Willing) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Things to do in Kansas? Message-ID: <20020730202011.P56691-100000@agora.rdrop.com> On Tue, 30 Jul 2002 19:54:07 -0500 (CDT) the Doc wrote... > It looks like I'm going to be in Overland Park (South end of KC?), > Kansas next week. > Are there any Classic Computing "must-see" places? any CCmp denizens? > I'm flying, and working 7-6 every day, so I can't bring any PDPs or do > any all-day treks, but I'd be up for meeting anyone who shares this > obsession, err, hobby. Well... depends on yer definition of 'all-day' treks, and if yet 'Indiana Jones' card is up to date, but I (and the Computer Garage collection) now reside in Yates Center, which is a hundred miles (+/- 10~20) West of KC. The collection (having just completed its x-country trek) is stacked up in the warehouse, and I'm installing a computer-based scoring system in my Bowling Center which dates to the '80s (so its on topic) , so there might be something of interest... Too bad you are not coming from William Donzelli's neck of the woods... I'd love to have one of those '35s he has been talking about. ;^} -jim --- jimw@agora.rdrop.com The Computer Garage - http://www.rdrop.com/~jimw From jwest at classiccmp.org Tue Jul 30 22:39:01 2002 From: jwest at classiccmp.org (Jay West) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: List-member database References: Message-ID: <004501c23843$ba096f60$9601a8c0@HPLAPTOP> It was written... > We'll need a hosting site. I might be able to provide that, but I'm > not sure. > > So what do y'all think? Is it A Fun Thing To Do? Ideas about what > info we want/don't want? Volunteers? Why not just add it to the classiccmp website? Jay West From doc at mdrconsult.com Tue Jul 30 22:49:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: List-member database In-Reply-To: <004501c23843$ba096f60$9601a8c0@HPLAPTOP> Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, Jay West wrote: > It was written... > > We'll need a hosting site. I might be able to provide that, but I'm > > not sure. > > > > So what do y'all think? Is it A Fun Thing To Do? Ideas about what > > info we want/don't want? Volunteers? > > Why not just add it to the classiccmp website? I figured that was probably an option, but it'd be rude to ass-ume. Doc From florit at unixville.com Wed Jul 31 00:05:00 2002 From: florit at unixville.com (Louis Florit) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... Message-ID: Yes, they are 80x24. I plan to scan one of them for netposterity. :) Will post link when I get it done. Anyone know where the genesis of 80x24/40x24 screen dimensions (and quite a few other devices) has its origination in? I remember my old dot matrix epson used to be 80 columns wide, and most of the older 8 bit computers had 40 or 80 cols by 24 or 25 rows. "But why?" he cried... Regards, Louis From: "Richard Erlacher" To: Subject: Re: Fortran Coding Form Pads... Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 21:45:07 -0600 Organization: Erlacher Associates Reply-To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Are these the ones with 24 lines of 80 columns? Several major vendors modeled their coding forms after the U.S. military coding forms, presumably cooked up by the Navy. I've only seen the blue ones, (blue lines) which I presume were patterned after the USAF ones. They worked great for coding when the work product was going to that huge room full of mini-skirted (back then) keypunch operators. (I'd have given a week's pay for a couple of hours hours to fish around in that room ... ... ) I did, BTW, code in Fortran back then. Dick From mrbill at mrbill.net Wed Jul 31 00:07:43 2002 From: mrbill at mrbill.net (Bill Bradford) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: PDP-11/70 systems available - Williamsport, PA Message-ID: <20020729202432.GX15501@mrbill.net> Please contact Robert directly if you're interested. He's in Williamsport Pa (ZIP 17745) Bill ----- Forwarded message from "Villano, Robert" ----- From: "Villano, Robert" To: "'mrbill@pdp11.org'" Cc: "Cunningham, Scott" , "Codispoti, Pete" Subject: pdp11/70 systems are available Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 15:51:58 -0400 Hello, I'm the network admin for the Books Division of Brodart Company, a library services company. I have been asked to find a home for our (3) pdp11/70 systems. I found your site on the internet and wanted to know if you or someone you know would be interested in getting them a home. If someone would contact me by phone would be perferable because to amount of equipment we have is quite extensive. equipment summary in brief: (3) pdp11/70 main computer chassis.... all were working when shut down although some for the dz11 and dh11 serial interfaces may not be completely functional. (3) la36 system consoles (working). (6) la120 decwriter stations (2 working) others for parts. (5) ra81 disk drives (3 working) others for parts. (4) te16 tape units (2 working) others for parts. Enough spare parts to almost build another pdp11 main backplane with power supplies quite abit of documentation. If you are interested please contact me here at Brodart. Thank you Bob Villano Network Administrator Books Division rvillano@brodart.com 570.326.2461 ext 6612 ----- End forwarded message ----- -- bill bradford / mrbill@mrbill.net / austin, texas ------------------------------------------------------------------------- I'm reminded of the day my daughter came in, looked over my shoulder at some Perl 4 code, and said, "What is that, swearing?" -- Larry Wall From aek at spies.com Wed Jul 31 00:10:28 2002 From: aek at spies.com (Al Kossow) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Wanted WD-100x disk controllers -- NOT for ISA bus Message-ID: <200207292313.g6TND7LC007276@spies.com> > Does anyone have any spare WD-1000, WD-1001, or related disk controllers, > or documentation on them? www.spies.com/aek/pdf/westernDigital From vcf at siconic.com Wed Jul 31 00:12:48 2002 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: An Apple //e and (2) Apple //c systems to good home Message-ID: Please reply directly to the sender. Reply-to: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:44:02 -0400 From: EdMorcaldi To: vcf@siconic.com Subject: Donation I would like to donate my Apple //e system -- no charge. It has an Applied Engineering card for memory expansion. Can you use it? I would be willing to ship it. Also have 2 Apple IIci systems that I would like to give away. -- Ed Morcaldi System Administrator GIST Inc 203/479-7500 203/479-7575 FAX http://www.gist-image.com -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From dogbert at mindless.com Wed Jul 31 00:15:08 2002 From: dogbert at mindless.com (Ross Archer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Synertek 6502 chips, 1984 date-code References: <3D45D3D6.86C67E1@topnow.com> <004701c23799$6dd82140$0100000a@deepspacenine> Message-ID: <3D4644F4.9040102@mindless.com> Philip Pemberton wrote: >"Ross Archer" said: > > >>I have some Synertek NMOS 6502s from various weeks >>in 1984, still in their (original?) Synertek static tubes. >>(At least, "Synertek" is stamped on the tubes.) >> >> >Ooh! That'll be good to up the value on Ebay a few dollars... Let's see... >L@@K!!!!! R@RE!!! SYNERTeK Sy6502 ***IN MANUFACTURERS PAKAGING*** ***NR*** >:-) :-) :-) > Hehe, you're imitating the inimitable E-bay style perfectly. :) > > > >>A few "boy are these stupid" questions: >> >>1. Does anyone have any cool Synertek lore they'd like to >>share with the group? All I know about them is they made >>the SYM-1 and were a 6530 second-source. I guess it's safe >>to conclude they were also a 6502 second-source. :) >> >> >I think I've got some e-mails from a guy who used to work for them. From >memory, Synertek were a Honeywell subsidiary who signed a license with MOS >Technology to second-source the 6502. MOS used the part numbers "MCS6502" >and "MPS6502", Synertek used "SY6502". > Yup, all 90 are marked SY6502. Honeywell? Wonder if my Honeywell thermostat still uses a 6502 core. :) >>From what I've read, there were three licensees for the 6502 - >MOS Technology - later bought by Commodore to become Commodore >Semiconductor, logo changed to ugly Commodore chickenhead logo >Synertek (see above) >Rockwell - I've got a full set of d-sheets for their parts. > > > >>2. Is this a "Find" in any sense? (I paid all of 30 cents >>each for them.) My motivation is to have enough replacement >>parts to keep all my 6502-based hardware humming for years >>to come. Though in this case I have several lifetimes' worth. >>:) >> >> >I would call it a find. How many have you got? Would you be interested in >selling me a few? > I've got 90. If you only want a few, I can forget about the 30 cents each and just go for shipping. I can also hook you up with CMOS 65C02s for about $7 each, via Jameco, if I'm going to be shipping stuff to you anyway. With Jameco, sometimes you get a WDC65C02 (14 Mhz), sometimes Rockwell 65C02 (2 Mhz I think). So far nothing as old as 1984 though! I recommend at least one CMOS version since some code is written for the 65C02, as you're no doubt aware. Daryl Rictor's SBC2 board (I've built up 5) is one example. (What a nice board, by the way!) > > > >>3. Is there any reason to fear that these chips will "go >>bad" >>at any significant rate as they age? Is there any way I >>could >>store them (reasonably, I mean, no vaccum or outer-space >>suggestions, please. :) to maximize their lifespan? >> >> >They should be fine. If they've been drenched, expect some pin corrosion. >Any corrosion on the pins can be removed with a bit of contact cleaner. > > Nope, looks like it's been in some sort of dry warehouse all these years. Aside from some dust on the outside of the tubes and the date codes, I could be fooled into thinking these babies came right off the assembly line last week. :) > > >>My plan is to come into work some evening and suit up with >>the full anti-static treatment at an EMI bench with my >>little >>SBC (retrofitted with a 40 pin ZIF socket to avoid bending >>their machine-straight little legs), and test them all in >>rapid-fire succession. Is there anything inherently dumb >>about powering them up? >> >> >They'll lose their "L@@K R@RE UNUSED" status, reducing the value by a few >cents a piece :-) > > Oh, okay. I guess I could offer to test them if and only if they want me to. I plan to keep quite a few for myself, but 90 is so ridiculous that I'll be happy to help out homebuilders like Philip with onesey-twoseys basically at shipping. Maybe later I'll ask for a buck each or something. >Later. >-- >Phil. >philpem@dsl.pipex.com >http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ > > > From dogbert at mindless.com Wed Jul 31 00:17:33 2002 From: dogbert at mindless.com (Ross Archer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: WTD: 6502, 6522, etc CPU and support ICs References: <004d01c2379a$48c422e0$0100000a@deepspacenine> Message-ID: <3D464833.9080504@mindless.com> Philip Pemberton wrote: >Hi, > I'm currently trying to build up a 6502-based SBC but - in true Sod's >Law fashion - my supplier has dumped the entire 6502 CPU series, despite the >fact they're still made by California Micro Devices. Anyone (preferably in >the UK) got a few spare MOS Technology, Rockwell, Synertek or CalMicro 6502 >ICs? I've also seen some photos of 6502 chips with a "VTI" logo - probably >VLSI Technology; anyone ever seen one of these? There is a photo of one on >http://65c02.tripod.com/ - see "SBC-1 Hardware", first photo (right at the >top). > If anyone with spare stock of 6502s and/or 6502 support ICs could e-mail >me offlist with prices, I'd be very grateful. > >Thanks. >-- >Phil. >philpem@dsl.pipex.com >http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ > > > > Phil, I'd be happy to help with the NMOS 6502s, and if Jameco won't ship 65C51, 6522s or 65C02s to UK, then I'll be willing to drive up, pick them up, pack them and ship. We 6502 folks got to stick together. :) -- Ross From vcf at siconic.com Wed Jul 31 00:19:54 2002 From: vcf at siconic.com (Vintage Computer Festival) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:23 2005 Subject: Powerbook 145 to a good home Message-ID: Respond to the sender . ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 09:21:04 -0400 From: Hans Callenbach Subject: powerbook 145 I have an old working powerbook 145... trying to not send it to the trash heap... are you interested, if not can you suggest someone? Also, an old 28 powerport modem and a working laser writer pro printer. Many thanks, Hans -- Hans Callenbach Art Director North American Bear Co., Inc. 902 Broadway 20th floor New York, NY 10010 212-388-0700 fax 388-0089 -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From dogbert at mindless.com Wed Jul 31 00:23:01 2002 From: dogbert at mindless.com (Ross Archer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: WTD: 6502, 6522, etc CPU and support ICs References: <004d01c2379a$48c422e0$0100000a@deepspacenine> Message-ID: <3D46BE2A.8020602@mindless.com> Philip Pemberton wrote: >Hi, > I'm currently trying to build up a 6502-based SBC but - in true Sod's >Law fashion - my supplier has dumped the entire 6502 CPU series, despite the >fact they're still made by California Micro Devices. Anyone (preferably in >the UK) got a few spare MOS Technology, Rockwell, Synertek or CalMicro 6502 >ICs? I've also seen some photos of 6502 chips with a "VTI" logo - probably >VLSI Technology; anyone ever seen one of these? There is a photo of one on >http://65c02.tripod.com/ - see "SBC-1 Hardware", first photo (right at the >top). > If anyone with spare stock of 6502s and/or 6502 support ICs could e-mail >me offlist with prices, I'd be very grateful. > >Thanks. >-- >Phil. >philpem@dsl.pipex.com >http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ > > > > Phil, Check out: http://www.jameco.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ExecMacro/Jameco/searchResult.d2w/report?sort=BKW&search=65C02 http://www.jameco.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ExecMacro/Jameco/searchResult.d2w/report?sort=BKW&search=6522 http://www.jameco.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ExecMacro/Jameco/searchResult.d2w/report?sort=BKW&search=65C51 And of course, if you need just a few NMOS 6502s as I mentioned earlier, I can probably help and/or combine with the above (I live a short drive from Jameco.) :) -- Ross From mythtech at mac.com Wed Jul 31 00:48:00 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (Chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: PDP-11/70 systems available - Williamsport, PA Message-ID: Dang... I really need to get a house. I would drive to Williamsport, and thanks to all the PDP talk on this list, I am getting this itch to own one to see what all the fuss is about. But there is no way I would be able to have one in this rental shanty. -chris From lists at subatomix.com Wed Jul 31 01:03:09 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <16922360172.20020731010205@subatomix.com> On Tuesday, July 30, 2002, William Donzelli wrote: > There still are 35s. Am I correct in assuming that these are about twice as wide as a 33? Am I correct in assuming that these would be much more difficult and expensive to ship UPS? -- Jeffrey Sharp From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Jul 31 01:07:07 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: PDP-11/70 systems available - Williamsport, PA In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Chris wrote: > Dang... I really need to get a house. I would drive to Williamsport, and > thanks to all the PDP talk on this list, I am getting this itch to own > one to see what all the fuss is about. > > But there is no way I would be able to have one in this rental shanty. I dunno why.... The two I'm currently running are both almost exactly the size of a full-tower PeeCee. The only thing not in the BA23 is the terminal. I finally talked my boss into letting us have vanity pages on the company server. Pics of [some of] my stuff coming soon. Doc From lists at subatomix.com Wed Jul 31 01:32:08 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fwd: Latest release of PDP-11 field guide available In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <15024087566.20020731013052@subatomix.com> YES! Thank you, Megan! My screams of joy have just woke the neighbors! ---------- Begin forwarded message ---------- From: Megan To: info-pdp11 Date: Monday, July 29, 2002, 7:38:44 PM Subject: Latest release of PDP-11 field guide available Contrary to opinion... I have been working on the field guide... The latest copy has corrections supplied by various people as well as new entries. It can be found at http://world.std.com/~mbg/pdp11-field-guide.txt For those who carry mirrors of it, please send me email so that I can put you on a list to obtain new copies as soon as I make them available. Please supply the URL where your copy can be found. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | email: gentry at zk3.dec.com (work) | | Unix Support Engineering Group | mbg at world.std.com (home) | | Hewlett Packard | (s/ at /@/) | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 (DEC '77-'98) | required." - mbg KB1FCA | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ ---------- End forwarded message ---------- From lists at subatomix.com Wed Jul 31 02:14:09 2002 From: lists at subatomix.com (Jeffrey Sharp) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: PDP-11/70 systems available - Williamsport, PA In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3326597595.20020731021242@subatomix.com> On Wednesday, July 31, 2002, Doc Shipley wrote: > On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Chris wrote: > > Dang... I really need to get a house. I would drive to Williamsport, and > > thanks to all the PDP talk on this list, I am getting this itch to own > > one to see what all the fuss is about. > > > > But there is no way I would be able to have one in this rental shanty. > > The two I'm currently running are both almost exactly the size of a > full-tower PeeCee. I tell you what, Chris: You bring those 11/70s and peripherals to me in Oklahoma, and I'll *give* you (FREE!) my 11/23+, which lives in one of these magic full-tower-PC-like cases. Deal? I sure wish I could get those machines. It's the best-looking potential haul I've seen this year save for the PDP-7. If the startup that just hired me lasts until next year, I'll finally be able to afford another rescue. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed. -- Jeffrey Sharp The email address lists@subatomix.com is for mailing list traffic. Please send off-list mail to roach jay ess ess at wasp subatomix beetle dot com. You may need to remove some bugs first. From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Jul 31 02:33:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: PDP-11/70 systems available - Williamsport, PA In-Reply-To: <3326597595.20020731021242@subatomix.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Jeffrey Sharp wrote: > I tell you what, Chris: You bring those 11/70s and peripherals to me in > Oklahoma, and I'll *give* you (FREE!) my 11/23+, which lives in one of these > magic full-tower-PC-like cases. Deal? Come to Texas with 'em and I'll make it an 11/53!! And a lollipop! > I sure wish I could get those machines. It's the best-looking potential haul > I've seen this year save for the PDP-7. If the startup that just hired me > lasts until next year, I'll finally be able to afford another rescue. I'll > be keeping my fingers crossed. Ditto almost everything you said. Except my startup is a year old now and still shaky. I'm joking about the 11/70s, BTW. I've got my hands full, and I hate "I'll beat that offer" wars. Doc From lgwalker at mts.net Wed Jul 31 02:42:01 2002 From: lgwalker at mts.net (Lawrence Walker) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: HEADERS? In-Reply-To: References: <5.0.0.25.0.20020730213647.02489bd8@pc> Message-ID: <3D474EA2.16925.1FC9E58@localhost> I've just had a flock(5) of them and they all had the same return line as yours. I use Pegasus which does not automatically open HTML. I stupidly opened the first one but checking with both the Symantec and Kaspersky Klez tools say I'm clean. They all vary in size but average around 150k. 2 were supposedly from list members but the other 3 were unknown to me. I guess it is harvesting Richards mail. Lawrence > > At 07:29 PM 7/30/2002 -0700, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > > >Can somebody more familiar with such confirm whether that is indeed > > >Richard Erlacher's machine that sent the following copy of Klez? (Headers > > >only follow) > > On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, John Foust wrote: > > One trick of Klez is that it harvests e-mail addresses > > from your mailboxes and uses them to spoof the From: line, > > in order to make it seem (on casual inspection) that > > person has the virus. They don't. Someone who received > > mail from Erlacher (perhaps a list subscriber) has Klez. > > NO. PLEASE look again. Dick's address is in the RETURN PATH line, NOT > the FROM line! It appears that Dick's computer is the one with > Klez, and it put a false FROM: of JPLCSCH@aol.com > > MOST varieties of Klez put a bogus FROM:, but leave the > Return-Path: intact. > > > > Return-Path: > Received: from mailhost.idcomm.com (mailhost.idcomm.com [207.40.196.14]) > by lmi.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA05488 > for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 19:17:42 -0700 (PDT) > Received: from Dqza (dsl-res156.idcomm.com [216.98.199.156]) > by mailhost.idcomm.com (8.10.2/8.10.0) with SMTP id g6V2HSJ01036 > for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 20:17:29 -0600 > Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 20:17:29 -0600 > Message-Id: <200207310217.g6V2HSJ01036@mailhost.idcomm.com> > From: JPLCSCH > To: cisin@xenosoft.com > Subject: Dialog under > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > boundary=Q37LE02W0269aCiF037Kl967jS3g6 > > lgwalker@mts.net bigwalk_ca@yahoo.com From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Jul 31 03:25:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Anyone near Kingsport, TN? Message-ID: Is there anyone here on the list located near Kingsport, TN? I've been offered a huge pile of SGI IRIS boards, but I'm not sure that shipping will be feasible for them. They are likely to end up in a landfill otherwise... -Toth From Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com Wed Jul 31 03:29:09 2002 From: Andreas.Freiherr at Vishay.com (Andreas Freiherr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... References: Message-ID: <3D479F96.BF48323C@Vishay.com> Certainly, screen dimensions were modelled after punched cards: There were 80 columns on a punched card, and once everybody was used to that line length, it was an obvious choice to make the screen just as wide - except for a couple of clever guys who made the screen 64 columns wide, which happens to be a power of two. 40 columns was done on some home equipment. Reducing the number of columns also reduces the bandwidth required in the video path, so you were able to use a home TV instead of an expensive specialized monitor. I have heard that the gauge of today's railway tracks (1435mm or 4' 8.5"), and hence even the dimensions of Space Shuttle's boosters go back to ancient Roman vehicles built to the width of two horse's backs, maybe true or maybe not. But, why did punched cards have just 80 columns? Regards, Andreas Louis Florit wrote: > > Yes, they are 80x24. I plan to scan one of them for netposterity. :) > Will post link when I get it done. > > Anyone know where the genesis of 80x24/40x24 screen dimensions (and quite > a few other devices) has its origination in? I remember my old dot matrix > epson used to be 80 columns wide, and most of the older 8 bit computers > had 40 or 80 cols by 24 or 25 rows. "But why?" he cried... > > Regards, > Louis -- Andreas Freiherr Vishay Semiconductor GmbH, Heilbronn, Germany http://www.vishay.com From hansp at aconit.org Wed Jul 31 03:36:01 2002 From: hansp at aconit.org (Hans B Pufal) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... References: Message-ID: <3D47A12E.1040705@aconit.org> Louis Florit wrote: > Yes, they are 80x24. I plan to scan one of them for netposterity. :) > Will post link when I get it done. Cute, I can contribut a few nice onesa also if you want to set up a collection. Some time ago I came across a site with a collection of scans of punched cards but have not located it recently, anyone known where it is? -- hbp From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Jul 31 03:40:01 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > Interesting. Maybe the lock is not releasing. Or maybe the heads are > being rammed into one end stop due to the lack of servo signal from the > heads. But how come the drive voltage is so low? I don't hear the heads move much at all. It sounds like they are trying to load, but just don't move. I don't hear any of the typical sounds I hear from other drives when their heads load. > Have you traced out the connections to the connector you think is for a > positioned lock? On the V150, one pin is grounded. The other goes via a > power transistor to +123V (MJE210, PNP) to pull the solenoid in, and via > a resistor and annother MJE210 transsitor to +12V to hold it. Does that > sound similar? > > If this is the head lock solenoid, do you get any voltage across it when > the drive is attempting to spin up? I think I did get voltage on that connector when it seemed to pull in. I'll have to double check though. > A silly test, but one worth doing. The V150 uses a diode/capacitor > circuit driven (indirectly) from the master clock to generate a -ve > supply voltage to the op-amps. If it malfunctions, all sorts of things > will malfunction (both because of the missing supply and because a > protection circuit will clamp signals, etc). Can you just check the > voltage at pin 4 of some of the 4558s? I'll certainly check it. > Unless you have a clean box, I would do a few more checks outside the > HDA first Well, ok :P -Toth From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Jul 31 03:45:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Wangtek tape drive rollers (was: Re: TU-58 dumps ...) In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20020727222637.04360ab8@cirithi> Message-ID: On Sat, 27 Jul 2002, Jay Jaeger wrote: > Thanks to Allison for the tip on using rubber hose to replace rubber > rollers gone to "glue". Worked great. I didn't glue mine to the hub, > though I suppose I should -- one did start slipping some after reading > in 30 tapes -- the aluminum hub got pretty hot. I also found I could be > quite aggressive with isopropyl alcohol cleaning the heads. Has anyone tried replacing the rollers of old Wangtek drives with bits of rubber hose? Ideally, I'd like to find an inexpensive source for original rollers, but I don't currently know of one. -Toth From quapla at xs4all.nl Wed Jul 31 04:03:01 2002 From: quapla at xs4all.nl (quapla@xs4all.nl) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Texas Instruments TI-1025 Calculator still in original box with instructions In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020730202611.00a18660@pop-server> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020730202611.00a18660@pop-server> Message-ID: <10192.212.153.190.3.1028106149.squirrel@webmail.xs4all.nl> > >>Texas Instruments TI-1025 Calculator still in original box with >>instructions > > It still works. > > Does it have any value? About $5 for the collector Ed From fernande at internet1.net Wed Jul 31 04:34:00 2002 From: fernande at internet1.net (Chad Fernandez) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Vax 8600 on Ebay Message-ID: <3D47AEE7.1060305@internet1.net> I thought this would be a good canidate to post to the list. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2042185013 Is the seller or bidder here on the list? Chad Fernandez Michigan, USA From als at thangorodrim.de Wed Jul 31 05:09:01 2002 From: als at thangorodrim.de (Alexander Schreiber) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... In-Reply-To: <3D479F96.BF48323C@Vishay.com> References: <3D479F96.BF48323C@Vishay.com> Message-ID: <20020731100744.GA22844@frodo> On Wed, Jul 31, 2002 at 10:28:06AM +0200, Andreas Freiherr wrote: > > I have heard that the gauge of today's railway tracks (1435mm or 4' > 8.5"), and hence even the dimensions of Space Shuttle's boosters go back > to ancient Roman vehicles built to the width of two horse's backs, maybe > true or maybe not. That one is a verified urban legend, but still funny. http://www.snopes2.com/history/american/gauge.htm Regards, Alex. -- "Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work." -- Thomas A. Edison --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Derzeit auf Jobsuche: http://www-user.tu-chemnitz.de/~als/cv.html From allain at panix.com Wed Jul 31 06:57:00 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... References: <3D47A12E.1040705@aconit.org> Message-ID: <00c501c23889$1dede480$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> > Some time ago I came across a site with a collection of scans of > punched cards but have not located it recently, anyone known > where it is? While I don't know which site you found, The U.Iowa site is mentioned below. At this moment it seems to be offline. John A. On Thu, 7 Feb 2002, Tothwolf wrote: >On Thu, 7 Feb 2002, John Allain wrote: > One of our list members just made it to the big leagues. The NY Times > printed a large photo article on Douglas W. Jones today. Seems his > extensive collection of punched cards caught their eye. A good case > for a well-managed collection it seems. > > "When PC Still Means 'Punch Card'" > New York Times, 'Circuits', 07-Feb-2002 Heres a link to the story: http://www.nytimes.com/2002/02/07/technology/circuits/07CARD.html From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Jul 31 08:47:00 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Things to do in Kansas? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020731094128.137fcc50@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Hi Doc, I was out in Overland Park a few weeks ago. Srounging in KC area was a bust but I met up with Gary Hildebrand and we went to Topeka and made some nice finds out there. You might want to look for Gary's and my posts in the archives. I was flying also so the only thing that I brought back was a black Bell& Howell Apple II. You can e-mail Gary at . There's also another CC list member in the KC area but we never did connect. I don't remember his name, sorry. He'll probably see your message and reply directly, if he doesn't, e-mail me and I'll dig it out. Joe At 07:54 PM 7/30/02 -0500, you wrote: >Hi. > It looks like I'm going to be in Overland Park (South end of KC?), >Kansas next week. > Are there any Classic Computing "must-see" places? any CCmp denizens? >I'm flying, and working 7-6 every day, so I can't bring any PDPs or do >any all-day treks, but I'd be up for meeting anyone who shares this >obsession, err, hobby. > > Last time I was in Denver I got to meet Emanuel and Bill, and had a >great time with them. It's nice having a face and a voice to go with >the .sig. > > Doc > > From pcw at mesanet.com Wed Jul 31 09:20:01 2002 From: pcw at mesanet.com (Peter C. Wallace) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, William Donzelli wrote: > For the record, one known 33 is left (other than the new one). This may > change - even today a 33 was uncovered in a place I was not aware of. > > There still are 35s. In fact, no one has expressed interest in them yet > (oddly). Yes, much more fun to watch printing than 33's, with their rectangular character matrix selection. Somehow the name 'stunt box' comes to mind when thinking about 35s, dont remember why... > > William Donzelli > aw288@osfn.org > Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics From xds_sigma7 at hotmail.com Wed Jul 31 10:27:01 2002 From: xds_sigma7 at hotmail.com (Will Jennings) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Wanted WD-100x disk controllers -- NOT for ISA bus Message-ID: Eric, You should see http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2042604088 There is a WD-1002-SHD manual in that lot. Will J _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx From msspcva at yahoo.com Wed Jul 31 10:31:01 2002 From: msspcva at yahoo.com (Clayton Frank Helvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Anyone near Kingsport, TN? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020731153019.31816.qmail@web14603.mail.yahoo.com> Toth: It looks like I'm about 3 to 4 hours, probably closer to 3, from there. I can't do that trip for free of course, so contact me directly if you'd like to work out terms. -- Frank --- Tothwolf wrote: > Is there anyone here on the list located near > Kingsport, TN? I've been > offered a huge pile of SGI IRIS boards, but I'm not > sure that shipping > will be feasible for them. They are likely to end up > in a landfill > otherwise... > > -Toth > ===== = M O N T V A L E S O F T W A R E S E R V I C E S P. C.= Clayton Frank Helvey, President Montvale Software Services, P. C. P.O. Box 840 Blue Ridge, VA 24064-0840 Phone: 540.947.5364 Email: msspcva@yahoo.com ============================================================ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From philpem at dsl.pipex.com Wed Jul 31 10:48:00 2002 From: philpem at dsl.pipex.com (Philip Pemberton) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... References: <3D47A12E.1040705@aconit.org> <00c501c23889$1dede480$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: <002701c238a9$54e7c8a0$0100000a@deepspacenine> > > Some time ago I came across a site with a collection of scans of > > punched cards but have not located it recently, anyone known > > where it is? > While I don't know which site you found, The U.Iowa site is > mentioned below. At this moment it seems to be offline. [snip] > http://www.nytimes.com/2002/02/07/technology/circuits/07CARD.html 1m10s on Google later and the page is found alive and well: http://www.cs.uiowa.edu/~jones/cards/ Later. -- Phil. philpem@dsl.pipex.com http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ From gessler at ucla.edu Wed Jul 31 10:58:01 2002 From: gessler at ucla.edu (Nick Gessler) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... In-Reply-To: <3D479F96.BF48323C@Vishay.com> References: Message-ID: <5.1.1.5.2.20020731085723.0215d2b0@mail.ucla.edu> Although IBM cards were 80 columns wide, the last eight columns were reserved for a sequence number in case the deck was dropped. The deck could then be put back in order with a card sorter. That left 72 columns for code and/or data... Any 72 column monitors out there? Nick At 10:28 AM 7/31/02 +0200, you wrote: >Certainly, screen dimensions were modelled after punched cards: There >were 80 columns on a punched card, and once everybody was used to that >line length, it was an obvious choice to make the screen just as wide - >except for a couple of clever guys who made the screen 64 columns wide, >which happens to be a power of two. > >40 columns was done on some home equipment. Reducing the number of >columns also reduces the bandwidth required in the video path, so you >were able to use a home TV instead of an expensive specialized monitor. > >I have heard that the gauge of today's railway tracks (1435mm or 4' >8.5"), and hence even the dimensions of Space Shuttle's boosters go back >to ancient Roman vehicles built to the width of two horse's backs, maybe >true or maybe not. But, why did punched cards have just 80 columns? > >Regards, >Andreas > >Louis Florit wrote: > > > > Yes, they are 80x24. I plan to scan one of them for netposterity. :) > > Will post link when I get it done. > > > > Anyone know where the genesis of 80x24/40x24 screen dimensions (and quite > > a few other devices) has its origination in? I remember my old dot matrix > > epson used to be 80 columns wide, and most of the older 8 bit computers > > had 40 or 80 cols by 24 or 25 rows. "But why?" he cried... > > > > Regards, > > Louis > >-- >Andreas Freiherr >Vishay Semiconductor GmbH, Heilbronn, Germany >http://www.vishay.com From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Jul 31 11:01:01 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... In-Reply-To: <3D479F96.BF48323C@Vishay.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Andreas Freiherr wrote: > I have heard that the gauge of today's railway tracks (1435mm or 4' > 8.5"), and hence even the dimensions of Space Shuttle's boosters go back > to ancient Roman vehicles built to the width of two horse's backs, maybe > true or maybe not. But, why did punched cards have just 80 columns? The physical dimensions of the punched cards were chosen to match dollar bills, so that the processing hardware could make use of existing subassemblies. I don't know why that particular hole to hole spacing was chosen, but that combined with the size of the cards resulted in 80 column. From ghldbrd at ccp.com Wed Jul 31 11:05:01 2002 From: ghldbrd at ccp.com (Gary Hildebrand) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Some Great Finds Today References: Message-ID: <3D4809C7.BD01510E@ccp.com> Tony Duell wrote: > > > 3. A Advanced Electronic Applications, Inc. Computer Patch Interface. = > > It's a gray metal box with the following on the faceplate Filter - Tune = > > - Var Shift - STBY/PTT - NORM - OFF/ON - PWR light. Under the Filter = > > title are three buttons named VAR - 170 - CW. > > It's a model CP-1 and on the back are lots of phono ports. Anyone have = > > info on this unit? > > No real info (as in : no manual), but it sounds like it's got something > to do with amateur radio (ham radio). At least for RTTY (Radio Teletype) > and maybe for morse code as well. > > 170 (Hz) is a common shift between Mark and Space frequencies for amateur > RTTY IIRC. CW would be Continuous Wave, here used to mean on/off keying, > normally used for morse code. > > -tony It is a demodulator for AFSK signals used in ham radio and cmmercial TTY stations. Common shifts are 170 and 850 Hz, commercial boys use 425. Also copies CW morse code with proper software. You can hook it up to a SW receiver and copy news broadcasts with the computer, if you have a Baudot program. AEA is still in business, in Lynwood, WA, if you need more info. Gary HIldebrand ST. Joseph, MO From hansp at aconit.org Wed Jul 31 11:18:00 2002 From: hansp at aconit.org (Hans B Pufal) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... References: <5.1.1.5.2.20020731085723.0215d2b0@mail.ucla.edu> Message-ID: <3D480D66.7080006@aconit.org> Nick Gessler wrote: > Although IBM cards were 80 columns wide, the last eight columns were > reserved for a sequence number in case the deck was dropped. The deck > could then be put back in order with a card sorter. That left 72 > columns for code and/or data... The last 8 colums were only used for sequence numbers by convention and then normally only for program source code, a use of cards which came very late in their history. They were not reserved and many applications used all 80 columns for data. -- hbp From P.Gebhardt at gmx.de Wed Jul 31 12:24:13 2002 From: P.Gebhardt at gmx.de (P.Gebhardt@gmx.de) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Harddisks with SA1000 interface Message-ID: <28356.1028136204@www18.gmx.net> Hello everybody ! A Micropolis 8" HDD (1222-i), I got 1 year ago and anaother Quantum 8" drive (Q2020) are equipped with a SA1000 Interface. I'd like to test (and save) them but I don't know wich systems support that kind of interface. Does anybody know any systems, which support these drives ? I found manuals for the Quantum drive but I found nothing for the Micropolis drive on google. What is the configuration for the power connector ? Thanks alot for any help ! Pierre -- GMX - Die Kommunikationsplattform im Internet. http://www.gmx.net From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Wed Jul 31 12:27:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Things to do in Kansas? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.20020731094128.137fcc50@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <20020731172506.51666.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> --- Joe wrote: > Hi Doc, > > I was out in Overland Park a few weeks ago... I *almost* got a job there last year at GE ERC (Employee Reinvestment Corp?). It fell through at the last minute (i.e., the day before I was told I was supposed to start!) and I accepted the offer for my current job on the way back home. Got a buddy there who _should_ be on the list but he has no time. His toys are newer (like Multias and 2-way PPros) but eventually, I expect him to eventually gravitate to cooler and cooler boxes. When he does start collecting stuff that is on-topic, I'll be sure to direct him here. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From pcw at mesanet.com Wed Jul 31 12:34:01 2002 From: pcw at mesanet.com (Peter C. Wallace) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Harddisks with SA1000 interface In-Reply-To: <28356.1028136204@www18.gmx.net> Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002 P.Gebhardt@gmx.de wrote: > Hello everybody ! > > A Micropolis 8" HDD (1222-i), I got 1 year ago and anaother Quantum 8" drive > (Q2020) are equipped with a SA1000 Interface. I'd like to test (and save) > them but I don't know wich systems support that kind of interface. > Does anybody know any systems, which support these drives ? Sure, the Xerox Star can use the Quantum drive.... > > I found manuals for the Quantum drive but I found nothing for the Micropolis > drive on google. What is the configuration for the power connector ? > > Thanks alot for any help ! > > Pierre > > > > > > -- > GMX - Die Kommunikationsplattform im Internet. > http://www.gmx.net > > Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Wed Jul 31 12:43:01 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020731174200.54338.qmail@web10301.mail.yahoo.com> --- William Donzelli wrote: > > Do you know if these have the rotary dial or the touch-tone keypad? > > Touch tone. I am now seriously interested, especially if Dan Cohoe and I can work out transportation details. I could use one as a road map to get the other one working. ObFolklore - when I got mine at Dayton a number of years ago (for $35) and got it home, I had no idea how to test the dataset. Most BBSs (this being before the days of ISPs) had converted to 300/1200 baud racked modems and not all supported 110 baud anylonger. I thought of one that surely could do it - CompuServe. I looked up the number and was able to connect and get a logon prompt from the old Classic online service. Since I didn't have schematics, I didn't know where to tap in current loops, and had to continue my search for a PDP-8 console. Now that I _do_ have PDF scans of schematics and the maintenance manual, I can contemplate that conversion project I started so long ago, even if I never get the touch-tone pad reattached. Thanks, -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From mross666 at hotmail.com Wed Jul 31 12:45:08 2002 From: mross666 at hotmail.com (Mike Ross) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) (William Donzelli) Message-ID: >For the record, one known 33 is left (other than the new one). This may >change - even today a 33 was uncovered in a place I was not aware of. > >There still are 35s. In fact, no one has expressed interest in them yet >(oddly). > >William Donzelli I'm certainly up for a 33 and a 35. And I can pick up, if they're local to NYC... Mike http://www.corestore.org _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx From foo at siconic.com Wed Jul 31 12:49:01 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: RFD: List-member database In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, Doc Shipley wrote: > The broad strokes of my idea was to put together a questionnaire for > anybody who'll answer, with city of residence, area of collecting, maybe > real-world occupation and computing experience/expertise, etc. Gather > that into a running database, mostly for member consumption only. We > all seem to travel a fair amount, most of us seem to enjoy "hooking up" > with other collectors, and such a database seems like a natural thing to > do, and a very valuable resource. Personally, I'm really curious as to > what the map will look like. There seem to be some fair concentrations > in some not-obviously-reasonable places. Like the Great North Woods. :) Classic Computer Rescue List http://www.cs.unc.edu/~yakowenk/classiccmp/ccrs_list.html ...is a good start. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From mythtech at mac.com Wed Jul 31 12:51:00 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) Message-ID: >> There still are 35s. > >Am I correct in assuming that these are about twice as wide as a 33? > >Am I correct in assuming that these would be much more difficult and >expensive to ship UPS? The 35's that William pointed out to me were yes, very large and easily twice the size of a 33. They would definitly have to go on a pallet and be freighted from the looks of them (granted, I am ignorant in shipping something like this, and ignorant about teletypes, so maybe they can be broken down and boxed up in peices... but from the general look, it looks like it would be the equivlent of trying to ship a small metal desk). -chris From foo at siconic.com Wed Jul 31 12:55:01 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, William Donzelli wrote: > For the record, one known 33 is left (other than the new one). This may > change - even today a 33 was uncovered in a place I was not aware of. > > There still are 35s. In fact, no one has expressed interest in them yet > (oddly). I would absolutely love one but my budget is strained currently so having one shipped is out of the question. I think the problem is lack of recognition. If more people saw just how cool an ASR-35 is they would probably want one. To that end, there is a picture of one here: http://www.xs4all.nl/~rimmer/cpics/35asr.gif ...and here: http://www-unix.oit.umass.edu/~verts/things/things.html Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From jplist at globe.net.nz Wed Jul 31 12:58:01 2002 From: jplist at globe.net.nz (JP Hindin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: RFD: List-member database In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, Doc Shipley wrote: > > The broad strokes of my idea was to put together a questionnaire for > > anybody who'll answer, with city of residence, area of collecting, maybe > > real-world occupation and computing experience/expertise, etc. Gather > > that into a running database, mostly for member consumption only. We > > all seem to travel a fair amount, most of us seem to enjoy "hooking up" > > with other collectors, and such a database seems like a natural thing to > > do, and a very valuable resource. Personally, I'm really curious as to > > what the map will look like. There seem to be some fair concentrations > > in some not-obviously-reasonable places. Like the Great North Woods. :) There already exists a place with some of these features. The ComputerShelter, www.computershelter.org, is supposed to be a "Distributed Museum" where you can sign up as a "Curator", and then add your machines to your Stash, showing to everyone what you have. The idea is to get a collaborated museum of peoples equipment, where they can share information (and parts) about them. As related to this, it contains a function allowing you to find other curators within a certain distance of yourself or a given zip code... Sounds like what you want is already written. JP From mythtech at mac.com Wed Jul 31 13:02:00 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) (William Donzelli) Message-ID: >I'm certainly up for a 33 and a 35. And I can pick up, if they're local to >NYC... William's warehouse is in Paterson NJ, so about 20-30 minutes from NYC. However, I think he is only there during the day, during the week. If you can't work with that schedule, if William lets me go back, I can grab you a 35 and stick it in my storage garage, but you will have to pick it up before the end of August (my rental price doubles starting in Sept, so I plan to have everything out before then). My garage is in Ho-Ho-Kus NJ, which is also about 20-30 minutes from NYC. But I have 24x7 access to the garage, and since I live about 10 blocks from it (and work about 10 blocks the other direction from it), I can meet you there pretty much any day or time for pickup. Of course, I have to figure out how to get a 35 back out of my van and into my garage all by myself... that will be a serious challenge. -chris From mmcfadden at cmh.edu Wed Jul 31 13:04:00 2002 From: mmcfadden at cmh.edu (McFadden, Mike) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Some punch card information Message-ID: Pictures of punch cards http://inventors.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://www.fourmilab. ch/documents/univac/cards.html About hollerith http://inventors.about.com/library/inventors/blhollerith.htm When I worked for the state of Missouri in 1976-1977 they still manually sorted punch cards. There were card sorters that sorted the cards and dumped them into hoppers based on the punch that was selected. Thanks Mike mmcfadden@cmh.edu P.S. I'm the other CC member in Kansas City area. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020731/f6fbae47/attachment.html From foo at siconic.com Wed Jul 31 13:05:50 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... In-Reply-To: <3D47A12E.1040705@aconit.org> Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Hans B Pufal wrote: > Louis Florit wrote: > > Yes, they are 80x24. I plan to scan one of them for netposterity. :) > > Will post link when I get it done. > > Cute, I can contribut a few nice onesa also if you want to set up a > collection. To that end I just received some Univac 1100 coding forms. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From jrkeys at concentric.net Wed Jul 31 13:11:01 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) References: Message-ID: <010f01c238bd$7c6148c0$6c000240@oemcomputer> That did it for me were are these 35's and can I make the drive there in one day from Houston Texas? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sellam Ismail" To: Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 4:54 AM Subject: Re: Teletypes (more update) > On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, William Donzelli wrote: > > > For the record, one known 33 is left (other than the new one). This may > > change - even today a 33 was uncovered in a place I was not aware of. > > > > There still are 35s. In fact, no one has expressed interest in them yet > > (oddly). > > I would absolutely love one but my budget is strained currently so having > one shipped is out of the question. > > I think the problem is lack of recognition. If more people saw just how > cool an ASR-35 is they would probably want one. > > To that end, there is a picture of one here: > > http://www.xs4all.nl/~rimmer/cpics/35asr.gif > > ...and here: > > http://www-unix.oit.umass.edu/~verts/things/things.html > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > > From foo at siconic.com Wed Jul 31 13:14:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: OT: Horse's ass In-Reply-To: <20020731100744.GA22844@frodo> Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Alexander Schreiber wrote: > On Wed, Jul 31, 2002 at 10:28:06AM +0200, Andreas Freiherr wrote: > > > > I have heard that the gauge of today's railway tracks (1435mm or 4' > > 8.5"), and hence even the dimensions of Space Shuttle's boosters go back > > to ancient Roman vehicles built to the width of two horse's backs, maybe > > true or maybe not. > > That one is a verified urban legend, but still funny. > > http://www.snopes2.com/history/american/gauge.htm Well, upon reading the Snopes discourse, it is not really an urban legend at all, but is in reality a carry-over from ancient times based on practicality. In fact, they go on to say it is basically true but "for trivial and unremarkable reasons". So it is not myth. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From xds_sigma7 at hotmail.com Wed Jul 31 13:16:01 2002 From: xds_sigma7 at hotmail.com (Will Jennings) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) (William Donzelli) Message-ID: Well I carried a 33 down a ladder in a barn with the 33 above my head.. and this was one with the full stand attached... I'm not saying it was an enjoyable experience, but I did pull it off.. Will J _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com From foo at siconic.com Wed Jul 31 13:20:01 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > The physical dimensions of the punched cards were chosen to match dollar > bills, so that the processing hardware could make use of existing > subassemblies. I don't know why that particular hole to hole spacing was > chosen, but that combined with the size of the cards resulted in 80 > column. Are you sure? A punch card is a bit larger than a dollar bill. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Wed Jul 31 13:26:01 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... References: Message-ID: <3D482AC4.6090409@jetnet.ab.ca> Sellam Ismail wrote: > On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > > >>The physical dimensions of the punched cards were chosen to match dollar >>bills, so that the processing hardware could make use of existing >>subassemblies. I don't know why that particular hole to hole spacing was >>chosen, but that combined with the size of the cards resulted in 80 >>column. > > > Are you sure? A punch card is a bit larger than a dollar bill. The dollar was BIGGER in the 1890's. A good example of how your buying power is shrinking. From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Jul 31 13:30:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Sellam Ismail wrote: > On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > > > The physical dimensions of the punched cards were chosen to match dollar > > bills, so that the processing hardware could make use of existing > > subassemblies. I don't know why that particular hole to hole spacing was > > chosen, but that combined with the size of the cards resulted in 80 > > column. > > Are you sure? A punch card is a bit larger than a dollar bill. I'm looking at an E-series bill (pre-'60) and although I haven't seen a punchcard in a while, I think they're darn close. Doc From mythtech at mac.com Wed Jul 31 13:55:01 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) Message-ID: >That did it for me were are these 35's and can I make the drive there in one >day from Houston Texas? The 35's are in Paterson NJ... and you can make the drive in one day if you drive REALLY REALLY REALLY fast (but make sure to take all fire arms OUT of your car before you make it to Paterson... having them will only encourage the locals to shoot you first) -chris From foo at siconic.com Wed Jul 31 13:57:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Doc Shipley wrote: > On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Sellam Ismail wrote: > > > On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > > > > > The physical dimensions of the punched cards were chosen to match dollar > > > bills, so that the processing hardware could make use of existing > > > subassemblies. I don't know why that particular hole to hole spacing was > > > chosen, but that combined with the size of the cards resulted in 80 > > > column. > > > > Are you sure? A punch card is a bit larger than a dollar bill. > > I'm looking at an E-series bill (pre-'60) and although I haven't seen > a punchcard in a while, I think they're darn close. Ah, the thought hadn't even crossed my mind that bills have shrunk in size since the punch card was invented. I'm a product of the 1970s :) Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From foo at siconic.com Wed Jul 31 13:59:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? Message-ID: Does anyone here still use their old (say pre-1990) Macintosh as a regular practice? Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From fmc at reanimators.org Wed Jul 31 14:01:01 2002 From: fmc at reanimators.org (Frank McConnell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... In-Reply-To: Sellam Ismail's message of "Wed, 31 Jul 2002 03:20:09 -0700 (PDT)" References: Message-ID: <200207311833.g6VIXp8U007708@daemonweed.reanimators.org> Sellam Ismail wrote: > On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > > The physical dimensions of the punched cards were chosen to match dollar > > bills, so that the processing hardware could make use of existing > > Are you sure? A punch card is a bit larger than a dollar bill. US dollar bills were bigger in Hollerith's day. -Frank McConnell From Marion.Bates at Dartmouth.EDU Wed Jul 31 14:07:00 2002 From: Marion.Bates at Dartmouth.EDU (Marion Bates) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:24 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? Message-ID: <65583381@dasher.Dartmouth.EDU> --- Sellam Ismail wrote: Does anyone here still use their old (say pre-1990) Macintosh as a regular practice? --- end of quote --- Dunno if it falls within the time frame exactly, but I still use a Color Classic and/or SE/30 for writing papers when I wanna be alone upstairs, listening to music or whatever. The old Macs are connected to the G4 network downstairs via a really long phone cord and a localtalk-ethernet bridge, so I transfer files over AppleShare that way when I want to email/print stuff. There's something about that 9-inch screen I used throughout middle and high school (Mac Plus in that case) -- it just gets the creative juices flowing somehow. :) I also use that same Mac Plus for old games, but I think that's borderline "use" in this context. -- MB From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Wed Jul 31 14:13:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: WTD: support ICs In-Reply-To: <20020731004507.60816.qmail@web11803.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20020731191237.56639.qmail@web10302.mail.yahoo.com> --- Loboyko Steve wrote: > I have some very strange boards from a CNC controller > that had video and an 8080, but is made mostly of what > I think are DTL chips. All are in sockets. Send the > list, these are taking up space! > 846 > 930 > 830, etc. I am looking for some DTL chips to make a repro W706/W707 TTY interface set for my Straight-8 and PDP-8/S (got *no* serial I/O for them. :-( ) http://www.pdp8.net/w-boards/pics/w706.shtml?small http://www.pdp8.net/w-boards/pics/w707.shtml?small The chips there are: W707 MC799 Dual Power Buffer (1) MC790 Dual J-K Flip-Flop (8) MC724 Quad Input Gate (5) MC789 Hex Inverter (5) W706 MC790 Dual J-K Flip-Flop (9) MC789 Hex Inverter (6) MC724 Quad Input Gate (5) MC799 Dual Power Buffer (1) Obviously, I'd rather find a real W706 and W707 than build my own, but in the absence of any quantities of 35-year-old modules falling out of a heretofore unknown closet, I'm forced to contemplate reproductions. Thanks, -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From celigne at celigne.freeserve.co.uk Wed Jul 31 14:15:00 2002 From: celigne at celigne.freeserve.co.uk (Paul Williams) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... References: <5.1.1.5.2.20020731085723.0215d2b0@mail.ucla.edu> Message-ID: <3D48371D.C793F00F@celigne.freeserve.co.uk> Nick Gessler wrote: > > Any 72 column monitors out there? Yes, DEC's VT05. Out there somewhere, not here though. Sighs wistfully... From univac2 at earthlink.net Wed Jul 31 14:16:41 2002 From: univac2 at earthlink.net (Owen Robertson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 7/31/02 5:58 AM, Sellam Ismail at foo@siconic.com wrote: > Does anyone here still use their old (say pre-1990) Macintosh as a regular > practice? Until recently, I used a Mac Plus for Word Processing and other simple tasks. I still play around with older Macs pretty frequently. -- Owen Robertson From red at bears.org Wed Jul 31 14:21:00 2002 From: red at bears.org (r. 'bear' stricklin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Sellam Ismail wrote: > Does anyone here still use their old (say pre-1990) Macintosh as a regular > practice? Well, yeah. I use my SE/30 (and have spent way more money than is sensible keeping it happy) on a semi-regular basis. It is small, unobtrusive, and has just has good karma. I keep a journal on it, specifically for those reasons. ok r. From listor at melin.org Wed Jul 31 14:23:01 2002 From: listor at melin.org (Joacim Melin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Not me so much but my 2,5 year old daugher Sandra has one that she's allowed to play with. It's a fully functional Quadra 700 with a 44MB harddrive and 24MB RAM . It's a tad to slow for my taste but when she grows tired of it (or when it's time to upgrade her to a newer Mac with OS X on it, whichever comes first) I'm gonna try to install either apple/ux or some *bsd-version on it. Just for the fun of it. Joacim On onsdag, jul 31, 2002, at 12:58 Europe/Stockholm, Sellam Ismail wrote: > > Does anyone here still use their old (say pre-1990) Macintosh as a > regular > practice? > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer > Festival > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger > http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at > www.VintageTech.com * > > >"Even a stopped clock gives the correct time twice a day." > > email, desktop : joacim@melin.org > email, pocket : joacim.melin@euromail.se > phone, office : +46-8-692 66 39 > phone, pocket : +46-70-868 54 19 From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Jul 31 14:24:42 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Sellam Ismail wrote: > > Does anyone here still use their old (say pre-1990) Macintosh as a regular > practice? Define "regular practice". I use it a lot as a serial terminal. Also when I want to set up _small_. Doc From SUPRDAVE at aol.com Wed Jul 31 14:48:01 2002 From: SUPRDAVE at aol.com (SUPRDAVE@aol.com) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? Message-ID: In a message dated 7/31/2002 2:01:18 PM Central Daylight Time, foo@siconic.com writes: << Does anyone here still use their old (say pre-1990) Macintosh as a regular practice? Sellam Ismail Well, it's not old enough, but I finally had success in getting a Quadra 800 with PPC card up and running on my network and through the router for net access. Pretty neat machine. I presume earlier macs with ethernics and system 7.x would be similar. NOTE: if you use ASANTE NICs, I found out that they don't always like to establish a connection with a 100mb hub/router. To get this mac working, I had to plug it into a 10mb hub, and then into the router. From bob_lafleur at technologist.com Wed Jul 31 14:59:01 2002 From: bob_lafleur at technologist.com (Bob Lafleur) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001c238cc$9f3f3a00$023ca8c0@blafleur> Is a Powerbook 170 pre-1990? I don't know if it is, but I use one. I keep it on top of my MIDI keyboard controller and I use it for MIDI sequencing (Opcode Vision). -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-admin@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Sellam Ismail Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 6:58 AM To: Classic Computers Mailing List Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? Does anyone here still use their old (say pre-1990) Macintosh as a regular practice? Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From univac2 at earthlink.net Wed Jul 31 15:05:01 2002 From: univac2 at earthlink.net (Owen Robertson) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 7/31/02 5:58 AM, Sellam Ismail at foo@siconic.com wrote: > Does anyone here still use their old (say pre-1990) Macintosh as a regular > practice? I also used to carry around a Mac Classic when I was out of town. That is, until I got an 800MHz TiBook. I have lots of old Mac stuff and I enjoy using it. I used to have lots of old Macs networked via LocalTalk, then connected to my G4 Cube via a Mac II operating as a dedicated LocalTalk/Ethernet bridge. Ah, the good old days, before all this DEC and DG stuff started taking up all my storage space. :-) -- Owen Robertson From spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu Wed Jul 31 15:13:01 2002 From: spectre at stockholm.ptloma.edu (Cameron Kaiser) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? In-Reply-To: from Sellam Ismail at "Jul 31, 2 03:58:27 am" Message-ID: <200207312020.NAA30460@stockholm.ptloma.edu> > Does anyone here still use their old (say pre-1990) Macintosh as a regular > practice? That Mac Plus is still out next to the 7300. I use it for playing Zero Gravity and testing software. Occasionally it's retrofitted as a dummy terminal. Although not covered by your question, I have an SE/30 as a file server, and a IIci as the apartment Unix host (mail, file and print services). -- ----------------------------- personal page: http://www.armory.com/~spectre/ -- Cameron Kaiser, Point Loma Nazarene University * ckaiser@stockholm.ptloma.edu -- Predestination was doomed from the start. ---------------------------------- From Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com Wed Jul 31 15:21:00 2002 From: Robert_Feldman at jdedwards.com (Feldman, Robert) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Horse's ass Message-ID: Not really. According to http://www.railway.org/railroadgauge.htm, one of several railroad gauges used in England by George Stephenson, and the one that became popular in the US (over the objection, in a way, of President Lincoln, who proposed a 5' gauge), was based on a 5 foot spacing of cart wheels. Subtracting 2 inches for each rail gave 4'8". Stevenson later widened the spacing by 1/2" because (for unspecified reasons), that worked better. See also A.W. Worth's reported comments in http://www.spikesys.com/Trains/st_gauge.html; and http://www.straightdope.com/columns/000218.html -----Original Message----- From: Sellam Ismail [mailto:foo@siconic.com] Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 5:14 AM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: OT: Horse's ass So it is not myth. Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From stanb at dial.pipex.com Wed Jul 31 15:28:00 2002 From: stanb at dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 31 Jul 2002 03:58:27 PDT." Message-ID: <200207312014.VAA22523@citadel.metropolis.local> Hi, Sellam Ismail said: > > Does anyone here still use their old (say pre-1990) Macintosh as a regular > practice? I use a SE (1987) as a terminal both on this Linux box (either z-term or telnet/slip) or occasionally for packet radio. My 630 don't quite qualify (1994) but I use that for all my letter writing etc. plus I can watch tv on it as I type :-) -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com The future was never like this! From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Jul 31 15:31:01 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Sellam Ismail wrote: > > The physical dimensions of the punched cards were chosen to match dollar > > bills, so that the processing hardware could make use of existing > > subassemblies. I don't know why that particular hole to hole spacing was > > chosen, but that combined with the size of the cards resulted in 80 > > column. > > Are you sure? A punch card is a bit larger than a dollar bill. I have been unable to casually check the veracity of it, since I don't have any of the older (larger) bills. I'm sure that somewhere google could probably find the dimensions for comparison. From rigdonj at cfl.rr.com Wed Jul 31 15:37:01 2002 From: rigdonj at cfl.rr.com (Joe) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Harddisks with SA1000 interface In-Reply-To: <28356.1028136204@www18.gmx.net> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20020731162459.4977d9ea@pop-server.cfl.rr.com> Pierre, The S-100 Compupro computers supported the SA1000 interface. I have a friend of mine that has one in his system. FWIW I have an Intel iSBC216(?) Multibus card that also supports it but I don't have any software that supports that card and I don't know enough details about the card to write the necessary drivers. I recently got a hard drive for the Intel MDS 225. It has an 8' hard drive in it but I haven't opened it up to see what kind. I think it may use the iSBC 216 controller but I haven't checked. FWIW I have two Quantum 2040s that I'm saving for that specail project. BUT my guess is that in order to read those drives you're going to have to mount them on the system that they were used on. I doubt any other system will read them. Joe At 07:23 PM 7/31/02 +0200, you wrote: >Hello everybody ! > >A Micropolis 8" HDD (1222-i), I got 1 year ago and anaother Quantum 8" drive >(Q2020) are equipped with a SA1000 Interface. I'd like to test (and save) >them but I don't know wich systems support that kind of interface. >Does anybody know any systems, which support these drives ? > >I found manuals for the Quantum drive but I found nothing for the Micropolis >drive on google. What is the configuration for the power connector ? > >Thanks alot for any help ! > >Pierre > > > > > >-- >GMX - Die Kommunikationsplattform im Internet. >http://www.gmx.net > > From coredump at gifford.co.uk Wed Jul 31 15:46:00 2002 From: coredump at gifford.co.uk (John Honniball) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: RFD: List-member database References: Message-ID: <3D484BF5.F84E911B@gifford.co.uk> JP Hindin wrote: > There already exists a place with some of these features. > The ComputerShelter, www.computershelter.org, is supposed to be a > "Distributed Museum" where you can sign up as a "Curator", and then add > your machines to your Stash, showing to everyone what you have. I tried to sign up, but it complained that I'd left some fields blank in the sign-up form. I hadn't, though. Has anyone else been successful? For a non-US address? And, does anyone have an e-mail address for the organiser of the site? -- John Honniball coredump@gifford.co.uk From mythtech at mac.com Wed Jul 31 15:49:00 2002 From: mythtech at mac.com (chris) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? Message-ID: >Does anyone here still use their old (say pre-1990) Macintosh as a regular >practice? I have a shelf of Mac SE's (800k version) that I use for a Fax pool (either sending or receiving). Although they are not phsyically in use every day, they do spend more time hooked up and running than not. I also have a Mac Plus that I keep on the floor for working with old software and 400k/800k disks (400's aren't readable by my 6500, and 800s usually have problems on my 6500). Although that will probably be replaced by an SE FDHD eventually. I think I finally moved all my 68000 machines out of normal "human" use, but I might be wrong, knowing me, I have at least one more Plus or SE sitting at a remote office for word processing duties. I know up until the end of June, I had an SE in active use for writing letters and doing spreadsheets (we closed the location it was at, so now it is on the floor in hall outside my office) And of course, my firewall/nat router is a IIsi right now. And then there is my LC 520 that is acting as a music on hold server for my phone system (kept frying CD players, so now I play quicktime rips off the LC). I'm not sure if I have any other 020 or 030 machines in regular use (but I have LOTS in occasional use as needed) And I have MANY MANY 040's still in service for daily use, and I think all of them are pre-1990. These are all still used at work for daily tasks, and serve as many an employee's primary (and usually only) computer. As well as things like giving them to friends and family to do work on (my nephew LOVES the LC 575 I gave him to do his homework and use email). -chris From jhellige at earthlink.net Wed Jul 31 15:51:01 2002 From: jhellige at earthlink.net (Jeff Hellige) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >NOTE: if you use ASANTE NICs, I found out that they don't always like to >establish a connection with a 100mb hub/router. To get this mac working, I >had to plug it into a 10mb hub, and then into the router. I found the same problem with the Asante PDS NIC in my Color Classic and my dual-speed Netgear DS108. So far it's the only NIC to have this problem. Jeff -- Home of the TRS-80 Model 2000 FAQ File http://www.cchaven.com http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/lakes/6757 From jfoust at threedee.com Wed Jul 31 15:56:01 2002 From: jfoust at threedee.com (John Foust) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Fwd: Surplus 1-Philips 501 scanning electron microscope in DE, USA Message-ID: <5.0.0.25.0.20020731154419.03580358@pc> >Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 09:49:58 -0400 (EDT) >From: Chaoying Ni >To: Microscopy@sparc5.microscopy.com >Subject: Surplus 1-Philips 501 with windowless EDS & 2-complete EDXA 9800 > system (detector and analyzer) > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >The Microscopy ListServer -- Sponsor: The Microscopy Society of America >To Subscribe/Unsubscribe -- Send Email to ListServer@MSA.Microscopy.Com >On-Line Help http://www.msa.microscopy.com/MicroscopyListserver/FAQ.html >-----------------------------------------------------------------------. > > >Hello listers, > >We have a Philips 501 with windowless EDS, both working before being >dismantled, and also a complete 9800 EDXA system. Free for non-profit edus >or orgs, or best offer to coms. Please send me inquiries off-line. Thanks! > >**************************************** >Chaoying Ni, PhD >201 DuPont Hall >The W.M. Keck Electron Microscopy Facility >College of Engineering >University of Delaware >Newark, DE 19716 > >(302) 831-8354 (O); -2318(L); -4545(Fax) >http://eml.masc.udel.edu >***************************************** From jbmcb at hotmail.com Wed Jul 31 15:59:00 2002 From: jbmcb at hotmail.com (Jason McBrien) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? References: Message-ID: Got an SE/30 running as a general purpose network monitor/terminal/miniserver A Mac IIx running system 6.0.8 for old games. A Mac IIci extra souped up with disks/PPC/RAM for System 7.1 games/apps/stuff. Another Mac IIx will be pressed into service for BSD fun. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sellam Ismail" To: "Classic Computers Mailing List" Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 6:58 AM Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? > > Does anyone here still use their old (say pre-1990) Macintosh as a regular > practice? > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * > From sloboyko at yahoo.com Wed Jul 31 16:13:00 2002 From: sloboyko at yahoo.com (Loboyko Steve) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: WTD: support ICs In-Reply-To: <20020731191237.56639.qmail@web10302.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20020731211202.89579.qmail@web11803.mail.yahoo.com> I will look through the boards and see what I can come up with. I swear half of the chips on the boards (and there are about 10) are 846's, though. --- Ethan Dicks wrote: > > --- Loboyko Steve wrote: > > I have some very strange boards from a CNC > controller > > that had video and an 8080, but is made mostly of > what > > I think are DTL chips. All are in sockets. Send > the > > list, these are taking up space! > > 846 > > 930 > > 830, etc. > > I am looking for some DTL chips to make a repro > W706/W707 TTY > interface set for my Straight-8 and PDP-8/S (got > *no* serial > I/O for them. :-( ) > > http://www.pdp8.net/w-boards/pics/w706.shtml?small > http://www.pdp8.net/w-boards/pics/w707.shtml?small > > The chips there are: > > W707 > MC799 Dual Power Buffer (1) > MC790 Dual J-K Flip-Flop (8) > MC724 Quad Input Gate (5) > MC789 Hex Inverter (5) > W706 > MC790 Dual J-K Flip-Flop (9) > MC789 Hex Inverter (6) > MC724 Quad Input Gate (5) > MC799 Dual Power Buffer (1) > > Obviously, I'd rather find a real W706 and W707 than > build my own, but > in the absence of any quantities of 35-year-old > modules falling out of > a heretofore unknown closet, I'm forced to > contemplate reproductions. > > Thanks, > > -ethan > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better > http://health.yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From cisin at xenosoft.com Wed Jul 31 16:26:01 2002 From: cisin at xenosoft.com (Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > Are you sure? A punch card is a bit larger than a dollar bill. http://www.columbia.edu/acis/history/hollerith.html Has a few nice pictures. From tractorb at ihug.co.nz Wed Jul 31 16:27:54 2002 From: tractorb at ihug.co.nz (Dave Brown) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Some Great Finds Today References: <033401c23822$40f61db0$78000240@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <033d01c238d8$cd910580$0101a8c0@athlon> Think I have a CP-100 handbook in the system if it's any use. Can't tell you the differences. Fixed one for someone a long time back. I can remember seeing a CP-1 but never owned any of that 'commercial' stuff-- too expensive and never worked as well as home-built stuff anyway. Especially for RTTY. Dave Brown Christchurch NZ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Keys" To: "cctech@classiccmp" Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 11:38 AM Subject: Some Great Finds Today It's a model CP-1 and on the back are lots of phono ports. Anyone have info on this unit? From lincoln.fessenden at verizon.net Wed Jul 31 16:42:08 2002 From: lincoln.fessenden at verizon.net (linc fessenden) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Sellam Ismail wrote: > Are you sure? A punch card is a bit larger than a dollar bill. > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival Speaking of that, would anyone on the list be willing to send me a punch card? I have never actually seen one in person yet... -- -Linc Fessenden In the Beginning there was nothing, which exploded - Yeah right... From dwoycies at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu Wed Jul 31 16:44:12 2002 From: dwoycies at yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu (David Woyciesjes) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: RFD: List-member database In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 07/30/02, Doc Shipley scribbled: > There was a real brief discussion about this several months ago, and I > never followed through. > > The broad strokes of my idea was to put together a questionnaire for > anybody who'll answer, with city of residence, area of collecting, maybe > real-world occupation and computing experience/expertise, etc... > > So what do y'all think? Is it A Fun Thing To Do? Ideas about what > info we want/don't want? Volunteers? > > Doc > Sounds interesting to me. I think it would make a neat map. I'm not sure whatI'd be able to do to help, but let me know... -- --- David A. Woyciesjes --- C&IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ# - 905818 Mac OSX 10.1 - Darwin Kernel V. 5 Running since 01/22/02 without a crash From bshannon at tiac.net Wed Jul 31 16:53:00 2002 From: bshannon at tiac.net (Bob Shannon) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Harddisks with SA1000 interface References: <28356.1028136204@www18.gmx.net> Message-ID: <3D485AFA.4040705@tiac.net> I have some Apollo DN-300's and DN-330's that use these drives, and a pile of extra drives for them as well. P.Gebhardt@gmx.de wrote: >Hello everybody ! > >A Micropolis 8" HDD (1222-i), I got 1 year ago and anaother Quantum 8" drive >(Q2020) are equipped with a SA1000 Interface. I'd like to test (and save) >them but I don't know wich systems support that kind of interface. >Does anybody know any systems, which support these drives ? > >I found manuals for the Quantum drive but I found nothing for the Micropolis >drive on google. What is the configuration for the power connector ? > >Thanks alot for any help ! > >Pierre > > > > > From at258 at osfn.org Wed Jul 31 16:56:01 2002 From: at258 at osfn.org (Merle K. Peirce) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Horse's ass In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Seems to me that I read the Florida East Coast was originally 4'-8". There were some 4'-10" gauge lines, and I think the Strasburg was 4'-9". On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Feldman, Robert wrote: > Not really. According to http://www.railway.org/railroadgauge.htm, one of > several railroad gauges used in England by George Stephenson, and the one > that became popular in the US (over the objection, in a way, of President > Lincoln, who proposed a 5' gauge), was based on a 5 foot spacing of cart > wheels. Subtracting 2 inches for each rail gave 4'8". Stevenson later > widened the spacing by 1/2" because (for unspecified reasons), that worked > better. > > See also A.W. Worth's reported comments in > http://www.spikesys.com/Trains/st_gauge.html; and > http://www.straightdope.com/columns/000218.html > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sellam Ismail [mailto:foo@siconic.com] > Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 5:14 AM > To: cctalk@classiccmp.org > Subject: OT: Horse's ass > > > > So it is not myth. > > Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer > Festival > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > International Man of Intrigue and Danger > http://www.vintage.org > > * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com > * > M. K. Peirce Rhode Island Computer Museum, Inc. Shady Lea, Rhode Island "Casta est quam nemo rogavit." - Ovid From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Wed Jul 31 16:59:01 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... References: Message-ID: <3D485CA3.7020001@jetnet.ab.ca> linc fessenden wrote: > Speaking of that, would anyone on the list be willing to send me a punch > card? I have never actually seen one in person yet... > Check this link out until you get real Card. http://www.facade.com/legacy/punchcard/ Have fun. From vaxzilla at jarai.org Wed Jul 31 17:01:00 2002 From: vaxzilla at jarai.org (Brian Chase) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Jeff Hellige wrote: > > NOTE: if you use ASANTE NICs, I found out that they don't always like to > > establish a connection with a 100mb hub/router. To get this mac working, I > > had to plug it into a 10mb hub, and then into the router. > > I found the same problem with the Asante PDS NIC in my Color > Classic and my dual-speed Netgear DS108. So far it's the only NIC > to have this problem. Ah-HAH! That might explain the problem I've got with the Asante NIC in my Performa 476. I love this list. -brian. From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Jul 31 17:06:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Aahhh, Relief! Message-ID: My Gods. A responsible vendor. I am agog. I snarked an RRD46 (12x CD) drive off eBay a couple of weeks ago. It came in today, except it says RRD45. :( Like I wanted another 4x CD drive. I fired of a reasonably polite, low-intensity complaint to the seller, and less than an hour later, got an apology, an offer of a full refund including shipping or replacement if they still have an RRD46, and an offer, if I pay for the return shipping, to give me "extra" credit on any future purchase. Which I'm likely to do. I've been fighting off a client who thinks his 5 grand for a solid week's work entails lifetime support & handholding, not to mention training of his dweebs. All week I've been trying to get NextCard to quit hitting my bank with a completely unauthorized $125 direct withdrawal. They admit it's entirely their fault, but insist that they can't stop the withdrawal! They say _I_ have to put a stop on the charges at the bank. Meanwhile, they are adding charges to my credit card for late payment and over-limit, because they have the payment I did authorize, and which did clear the bank, on hold. Because there's a "dispute". I'm up three levels of their complaint desk, and have yet to speak to anyone who admits to any peculiarity in their actions. "But we already promised to pay the INS fees and the stop payment at your bank!" But not the late fees, nor my time off work, nor the expense of faxing them all the documentation. I can't even get a solid promise to drop all _their_ extra charges, incurred because THEY screwed up! I'd much rather "twmaster", the eBay dealer, had sent me the right thing to start with. But it's damn nice for somebody to own up to their shit, and make good on it. Doc From arlen at acm.org Wed Jul 31 17:08:01 2002 From: arlen at acm.org (Arlen Michaels) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: WTD: support ICs In-Reply-To: <20020731191237.56639.qmail@web10302.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: on 31/7/02 3:12 PM, Ethan Dicks at erd_6502@yahoo.com wrote: > I am looking for some DTL chips to make a repro W706/W707 TTY > interface set for my Straight-8 and PDP-8/S (got *no* serial > I/O for them. :-( ) > > http://www.pdp8.net/w-boards/pics/w706.shtml?small > http://www.pdp8.net/w-boards/pics/w707.shtml?small > > The chips there are: > > W707 > MC799 Dual Power Buffer (1) > MC790 Dual J-K Flip-Flop (8) > MC724 Quad Input Gate (5) > MC789 Hex Inverter (5) > W706 > MC790 Dual J-K Flip-Flop (9) > MC789 Hex Inverter (6) > MC724 Quad Input Gate (5) > MC799 Dual Power Buffer (1) The MC7xx were RTL, not DTL. Motorola made them. They typically used a 3.6 volt power supply, like the Fairchild uL9xx RTL series of the same era (late '60s I think). Arlen Michaels From donm at cts.com Wed Jul 31 18:24:01 2002 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: HPIB cables Message-ID: I have a couple of HPIB cables available at $15 the pair, shipped. They are: 1 HP10833A ~42" 1 HP92220R ~12" The 92220R has a right-angle connector at one end and the usual straight connector at the other. (I wonder if the 'R' indicates a right hand connector?) First come, first served. - don From jplist at globe.net.nz Wed Jul 31 18:35:00 2002 From: jplist at globe.net.nz (JP Hindin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: RFD: List-member database In-Reply-To: <3D484BF5.F84E911B@gifford.co.uk> Message-ID: > JP Hindin wrote: > > There already exists a place with some of these features. > > The ComputerShelter, www.computershelter.org, is supposed to be a > > "Distributed Museum" where you can sign up as a "Curator", and then add > > your machines to your Stash, showing to everyone what you have. On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, John Honniball wrote: > I tried to sign up, but it complained that I'd left some fields > blank in the sign-up form. I hadn't, though. Has anyone else > been successful? For a non-US address? I'm unable to reproduce this. Form is a bit clearer now - but as far as I can tell (Using NS4 and IE6 as test clients) everything works like its supposed to. > And, does anyone have an e-mail address for the organiser of the site? Erm. That'd be me. JP From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 31 18:48:00 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... In-Reply-To: <3D479F96.BF48323C@Vishay.com> from "Andreas Freiherr" at Jul 31, 2 10:28:06 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 533 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020731/8f2b244e/attachment.ksh From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 31 18:50:01 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: from "Tothwolf" at Jul 31, 2 03:47:26 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 678 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020731/b69d7aa2/attachment.ksh From coredump at gifford.co.uk Wed Jul 31 19:11:01 2002 From: coredump at gifford.co.uk (John Honniball) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: HPIB cables References: Message-ID: <3D487BCD.E5856797@gifford.co.uk> Don Maslin wrote: > I have a couple of HPIB cables available at $15 the pair, shipped. ... > The 92220R has a right-angle connector at one end and the usual > straight connector at the other. (I wonder if the 'R' indicates > a right hand connector?) The 92220R is a specially-shaped cable to connect an HP150 to a HPIB disk or tape unit. It's quite short with one straight and one right-angle connector. I have one in front of me here, off my HP150. Incidentally, the HP150 isn't working -- looks like a PSU failure to me. Any hints? Common failure modes? Links to circuit digrams (schematics)? -- John Honniball coredump@gifford.co.uk From aw288 at osfn.org Wed Jul 31 19:15:01 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) In-Reply-To: <20020731023222.57892.qmail@web11802.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: The NIB 33 has been sold. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From aw288 at osfn.org Wed Jul 31 19:19:00 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) In-Reply-To: <16922360172.20020731010205@subatomix.com> Message-ID: > Am I correct in assuming that these are about twice as wide as a 33? Almost. > Am I correct in assuming that these would be much more difficult and > expensive to ship UPS? To big. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From rschaefe at gcfn.org Wed Jul 31 19:24:00 2002 From: rschaefe at gcfn.org (Robert Schaefer) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Aahhh, Relief! References: Message-ID: <00e601c238f1$bce82740$9f469280@y5f3q8> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doc Shipley" To: "Classic Computers" Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 06:05 PM Subject: Aahhh, Relief! > My Gods. > A responsible vendor. I am agog. > I snarked an RRD46 (12x CD) drive off eBay a couple of weeks ago. It > came in today, except it says RRD45. :( > Like I wanted another 4x CD drive. > I fired of a reasonably polite, low-intensity complaint to the seller, > and less than an hour later, got an apology, an offer of a full refund > including shipping or replacement if they still have an RRD46, and an > offer, if I pay for the return shipping, to give me "extra" credit on > any future purchase. Which I'm likely to do. > I'd much rather "twmaster", the eBay dealer, had sent me the right > thing to start with. But it's damn nice for somebody to own up to their > shit, and make good on it. I've dealt with this fellow too-- he also sells direct. Bought a xyplex termserver about the same time they were popular on epay. I had no problems, and would have no trouble recommending him. Perhaps Honest Vendors would be a good field to add to the classiccmp database? With maybe a running total of votes, placed by customers? > > > Doc Bob From aw288 at osfn.org Wed Jul 31 19:27:01 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) (William Donzelli) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > If you can't work with that schedule, if William lets me go back, You, and anyone else that has graced the Armory's halls, can come back any time. Don't worry, if I don't like you, you will know about it. William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From aw288 at osfn.org Wed Jul 31 19:29:14 2002 From: aw288 at osfn.org (William Donzelli) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) In-Reply-To: <010f01c238bd$7c6148c0$6c000240@oemcomputer> Message-ID: > That did it for me were are these 35's and can I make the drive there in one > day from Houston Texas? One day?!!???!!!! William Donzelli aw288@osfn.org From dwightk.elvey at amd.com Wed Jul 31 19:32:01 2002 From: dwightk.elvey at amd.com (Dwight K. Elvey) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) Message-ID: <200208010028.RAA29746@clulw009.amd.com> >From: ard@p850ug1.demon.co.uk > >> > If this is the head lock solenoid, do you get any voltage across it when >> > the drive is attempting to spin up? >> >> I think I did get voltage on that connector when it seemed to pull in. >> I'll have to double check though. > >Yes, please do. We'll both feel right idiots if we spend time looking in >the servo circuitry and that real reaso the heads can't move is becuase >they're locked. > >> > Unless you have a clean box, I would do a few more checks outside the >> > HDA first >> >> Well, ok :P > >It's up to you, it's your drive. And don't you think the HDA has been >opened before? If that's the case, then it might not do any more daamge >to pull the cover again. > >-tony > > Hi I haven't been following this thread but I thought I'd add: When working inside of disk drives, wear a mask ( the ones you get from the drug store work fine ). Also, don't work in a room that has had someone smoking or while someone is frying stuff in the kitchen. Most dust particles are large enough that the head just kicks it of into the filter. Smoke particles are the right size to cause head crashes, as is a little bit of spittle from a sneeze or speech. Also, don't rotate the disk backwards, the heads will cut into the surface and damage them. Dwight From ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk Wed Jul 31 19:34:03 2002 From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: HPIB cables In-Reply-To: <3D487BCD.E5856797@gifford.co.uk> from "John Honniball" at Aug 1, 2 01:07:41 am Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 663 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/20020731/19ac53f5/attachment.ksh From jrkeys at concentric.net Wed Jul 31 19:36:02 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: RFD: List-member database References: <3D484BF5.F84E911B@gifford.co.uk> Message-ID: <01b901c238e3$2c4dc0e0$6c000240@oemcomputer> I just signed up about 2 hours ago and it worked fine but I live in the US. ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Honniball" To: Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 3:43 PM Subject: Re: RFD: List-member database > > JP Hindin wrote: > > There already exists a place with some of these features. > > The ComputerShelter, www.computershelter.org, is supposed to be a > > "Distributed Museum" where you can sign up as a "Curator", and then add > > your machines to your Stash, showing to everyone what you have. > > I tried to sign up, but it complained that I'd left some fields > blank in the sign-up form. I hadn't, though. Has anyone else > been successful? For a non-US address? > > And, does anyone have an e-mail address for the organiser of the site? > > -- > John Honniball > coredump@gifford.co.uk > From owad at applefritter.com Wed Jul 31 19:45:01 2002 From: owad at applefritter.com (Tom Owad) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) In-Reply-To: <20020731005414.70760.qmail@web11805.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20020731005414.70760.qmail@web11805.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20020731161926.2903@mail.earthlink.net> >Tell us of these glorious finds, so we can enjoy them >vicariouly! I was there on Monday. It really is worth visiting just to see the place. There is _lots_ of old radar, sonar, and other military equipment which is amazing to see. I ended up with a 33 and passed on the other teletypes due to lack of space. I wish I had room for another, older one. If you have any interest in teletype equipment you really have to visit. There are too many different models and boxes of parts to mention. Are there manuals for the 33 online? I was unable to find them. I'd also appreciate advice on what I should check on this Teletype before I power it on. Thanks, Tom Applefritter www.applefritter.com From jrkeys at concentric.net Wed Jul 31 20:02:00 2002 From: jrkeys at concentric.net (Keys) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) References: Message-ID: <01cb01c238f7$00665820$6c000240@oemcomputer> That's one day there and one day back plus one to load up and rest. A three day trip. ----- Original Message ----- From: "William Donzelli" To: Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 7:26 PM Subject: Re: Teletypes (more update) > > That did it for me were are these 35's and can I make the drive there in one > > day from Houston Texas? > > One day?!!???!!!! > > William Donzelli > aw288@osfn.org > From jfoust at threedee.com Wed Jul 31 20:07:00 2002 From: jfoust at threedee.com (John Foust) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) In-Reply-To: <20020731161926.2903@mail.earthlink.net> References: <20020731005414.70760.qmail@web11805.mail.yahoo.com> <20020731005414.70760.qmail@web11805.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.0.0.25.0.20020731200212.0258f930@pc> At 12:19 PM 7/31/2002 -0400, Tom Owad wrote: >>Tell us of these glorious finds, so we can enjoy them >>vicariouly! > >I was there on Monday. It really is worth visiting just to see the >place. There is _lots_ of old radar, sonar, and other military equipment >which is amazing to see. Here is another report: From: "Jack" To: Cc: "Denis Sharon W1AOK" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: [GreenKeys] I have been to the TTY graveyard!!!! Sender: greenkeys-admin@mailman.qth.net Errors-To: greenkeys-admin@mailman.qth.net X-BeenThere: greenkeys@mailman.qth.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.8 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Discussion of older radio teletype (RTTY) gear List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 20:56:38 -0400 Status: ZCZC Greenkeyers... I visited the famous "Paterson NJ warehouse" today and was just amazed at what it held. (The building is an old Government armory, built around 1903.) Amongst the TONS of 1940-1960 electical and electronic stuff, there was a lot of TTY gear: It appears the owner was the recipient of Western Union's entire TTY parts inventory (maybe from multiple locations). E.g., there are more than 100 28ROTR bases in boxes (no covers or perf units or gear shifts). I counted three unused Model 28ASR cabinets with some sheet metal missing, unfortunately, and there was another half dozen incomplete 28ASR's. Some of the ASR's had oddball TD's with WU markings instead of the normal Teletype Corp. LXD. There was a large fan on the back of those machines with some sort of electronic package in the base. Counted 10 28KSR's in various condition (mostly "sad"). Anyone for a Model 35ASR? There's six of them there (private line models) and two are crated. Siemens machines were all over the place. There are a few Model 33ASR's (no covers or bases) and a BRAND NEW 33ASR TWX machine in a box. There is also a BRAND NEW 32ASR TELEX machine in a box (unopened). There has to be tons of parts, mostly 28 stuff that I have never seen break. Lots of Model 33 covers and lids (some look new) and boxes of new keytops (the ones that always go bad and turn moldy white).. I found about a dozen of the oddball LBXD TD heads and one complete stand-along LBXD TD. There might be some standard LXD TD's there, too. Found a WW 2 Model 15 (TG-7) in the elusive crate (table). Good chance there's a few more of them there. No other Model 15 vintage stuff was seen except a banged up 14TD. A few Kleinschmidt TT-76's were in a pile and they didn't look salvageable. And, to top it off, there was a lonely UGC-74A on the floor. The person who is cleaning out this stuff wants to unload everything as quickly as possible. Since he has TONS of ship's radars, ship's gyro's and other really HEAVY stuff to worry about, I told him I'd tend to the TTY stuff for him. (I saw a huge gray box marked "NIMITZ"!) It is not practicle to try to ship the bits and pieces, so the only way to get at it would be to visit. He has some restrictions on access and the area is not the garden spot of NJ, so visits would have to be coordinated carefully (wear Kevlar). And, he wants the stuff gone; he doesn't want to bother with selling a dozen keytops. After wandering around for a day, I can pretty much guaranty that the TTY stuff is not operational and would need work (every machine seems to have something missing). And most of the 28's have oddball widgets and electrical whatsits that would have to be surgically removed to get the basic machine working. Except for those few unused cabiknets, most of the machines are banged up in one way or another. The 35's appear to be the most complete, orphans that they are. Depending on the timing, I might try to grab most of the incomplete TTY's and store them somewhere with the intention of getting them working (borrowing parts from here and there). I cannot fathom taking the boxed parts...I'd need a lot of space and a lot of time and, honestly, most of those parts were the ones that would never be used in normal maintenance. (for example, I didn't find any clutches, or gears, or the like...parts that would break under heavy use). I'm guessing that this stuff might have been from a repair depot that rebuilt machines, not from a local "TTY shop" that serviced customers. If anyone is interested, let me know off-list and I can help make the arrangements. Jack WA2HWJ NNNN _______________________________________________ GreenKeys mailing list GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys From erd_6502 at yahoo.com Wed Jul 31 20:15:00 2002 From: erd_6502 at yahoo.com (Ethan Dicks) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: WTD: support ICs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020801011426.5442.qmail@web10302.mail.yahoo.com> --- Arlen Michaels wrote: > on 31/7/02 3:12 PM, Ethan Dicks at erd_6502@yahoo.com wrote: > > > I am looking for some DTL chips to make a repro W706/W707... > The MC7xx were RTL, not DTL. Motorola made them. They typically used a > 3.6 volt power supply, like the Fairchild uL9xx RTL series of the same > era (late '60s I think). Ah. I stand corrected. RTL, then. I have a couple of MC8xx chips, but no MC7xx chips. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com From geoffrob at stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au Wed Jul 31 20:55:01 2002 From: geoffrob at stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au (Geoff Roberts) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:25 2005 Subject: Teletypes (update) References: <20020731005414.70760.qmail@web11805.mail.yahoo.com> <20020731161926.2903@mail.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <091601c238fe$59ab1c70$de2c67cb@helpdesk> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Owad" To: "Classic Computer" Sent: Thursday, August 01, 2002 1:49 AM Subject: Re: Teletypes (update) > >Tell us of these glorious finds, so we can enjoy them > >vicariouly! > > I was there on Monday. It really is worth visiting just to see the > place. There is _lots_ of old radar, sonar, and other military equipment > which is amazing to see. Radar? Sigh. Pity you are in the USA. We have a 3cm ex marine set but something ex mil would be nice. FLTLT (AAFC) Geoff Roberts Commanding Officer No. 614 (City of Port Pirie) Squadron 6 Wing Australian Air Force Cadets co.614sqn@adfc.gov.au From blacklord at telstra.com Wed Jul 31 21:45:01 2002 From: blacklord at telstra.com (blacklord) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: Anyone using their old Mac? Message-ID: <8f1148eb20.8eb208f114@bigpond.com> Hi Sellam, > > Does anyone here still use their old (say pre-1990) Macintosh as a > regularpractice? I've got a couple of 128's that act as shelf supports for some of my Commodore equipment - so I guess you could say that they are "still in use" :-) Lance ---------------- Powered by telstra.com From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Jul 31 21:56:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 1 Aug 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > I've seen 132 column screens too (why 132???) but did anyone ever try to > make a 128 column screen (or printer)? It would seem to be a logical size > to make it, but I've never seen one. I have an old Panasonic 24-pin wide-carriage that does 132. I think 132-column printers were fairly common. Doc From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Jul 31 22:04:01 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: Aahhh, Relief! In-Reply-To: <00e601c238f1$bce82740$9f469280@y5f3q8> Message-ID: My apologies to the list. This whole rant was supposed to be addressed to a different mailing list, where general rants are on topic. I didn't even notice the mistake till I saw Bob's reply. Now I'm blushing. On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Robert Schaefer wrote: > I've dealt with this fellow too-- he also sells direct. Bought a xyplex > termserver about the same time they were popular on epay. I had no > problems, and would have no trouble recommending him. Yeah, a mistake is just that until you start defending it. I'll have no qualms about going there again, if he follows through with this. > Perhaps Honest Vendors would be a good field to add to the classiccmp > database? With maybe a running total of votes, placed by customers? I like that idea. I'm going to see if I can post a sample questionnaire before I leave town Sunday. Not for filling out, but for suggestions & corrections. Doc From bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca Wed Jul 31 22:07:01 2002 From: bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca (Ben Franchuk) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... References: Message-ID: <3D48A473.8020208@jetnet.ab.ca> Doc Shipley wrote: > On Thu, 1 Aug 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > > >>I've seen 132 column screens too (why 132???) but did anyone ever try to >>make a 128 column screen (or printer)? It would seem to be a logical size >>to make it, but I've never seen one. > > > I have an old Panasonic 24-pin wide-carriage that does 132. I think > 132-column printers were fairly common. > > Doc > > Most printers can be put in condensed mode to give you 132. From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Jul 31 22:11:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) In-Reply-To: <01cb01c238f7$00665820$6c000240@oemcomputer> Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Keys wrote: > That's one day there and one day back plus one to load up and rest. A three > day trip. Man, it can be done. Realistcally, you can probably get there in abot 22-26 hours. But that's gonna be straight-through, hammer-down hauling butt. I did Lubbock to Groton, Connecticutt and back in about 80 hours once, so it's possible. It's also pure insanity. Have a nice trip. :) Doc From allain at panix.com Wed Jul 31 22:38:01 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) References: Message-ID: <017001c2390c$8ddda860$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> > that's gonna be straight-through, hammer-down hauling... > It's also pure insanity. Have a nice trip. :) Slogan on manufacturer's videotape: "The Porsche 928s. A realistic alternative to Air travel." (Top speed 156 MPH) Seriously, I can go back to the warehouse with a DigiCam if there are serious inquiries, to offer you a window in there via teleprescence. William says there are some pics available now too. John A. From allain at panix.com Wed Jul 31 22:41:00 2002 From: allain at panix.com (John Allain) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... References: <3D48A473.8020208@jetnet.ab.ca> Message-ID: <017a01c2390d$19da7320$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> >> ... too (why 132???) but did anyone ever try to... Try this at home: 80 colums x ( 14" / 8.5" ) = 132 cols (rounded) The two measures are two standard paper sizes, keeping the typing pitch a constant. This probably dates back to the infamous 140x printer (1403?) John A. From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Jul 31 23:04:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) In-Reply-To: <017001c2390c$8ddda860$8a0101ac@ibm23xhr06> Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, John Allain wrote: > > that's gonna be straight-through, hammer-down hauling... > > It's also pure insanity. Have a nice trip. :) > > Slogan on manufacturer's videotape: > "The Porsche 928s. A realistic alternative to Air travel." > (Top speed 156 MPH) Oh. Never mind. I had envisioned something big enough to _haul_ a teletype. The last 150mph car I had was a '68 Charger with a TRW 383 and no brakes to speak of. I still miss it. Ever notice how many sysadmin/geek types are also into serious horsepower? Doc From foo at siconic.com Wed Jul 31 23:12:00 2002 From: foo at siconic.com (Sellam Ismail) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads... In-Reply-To: <3D485CA3.7020001@jetnet.ab.ca> Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Ben Franchuk wrote: > Check this link out until you get real Card. > http://www.facade.com/legacy/punchcard/ Hey, that's really cool! Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com * From tothwolf at concentric.net Wed Jul 31 23:31:00 2002 From: tothwolf at concentric.net (Tothwolf) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: Multibus ST-506/QIC-02 (was: Re: SGI IRIS 1400 ...) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 1 Aug 2002, Tony Duell wrote: > Yes, please do. We'll both feel right idiots if we spend time looking in > the servo circuitry and that real reaso the heads can't move is becuase > they're locked. I double checked it, and it does have 11.5VDC across the connector when it seems to pull in. Two of the 4558s on A103 have -10.5VDC on pin 4, and 11.5VDC on pin 8. The third 4558 seems to have pin 4 grounded (according to an ohm meter), which seems strange, to say the least. > It's up to you, it's your drive. And don't you think the HDA has been > opened before? If that's the case, then it might not do any more daamge > to pull the cover again. The seals that cover the screws have been broken, so the HDA appears to have been opened by someone in the past. -Toth From lincoln.fessenden at verizon.net Wed Jul 31 23:39:13 2002 From: lincoln.fessenden at verizon.net (linc fessenden) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: Aahhh, Relief! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Doc Shipley wrote: > My Gods. > A responsible vendor. I am agog. > I snarked an RRD46 (12x CD) drive off eBay a couple of weeks ago. It > came in today, except it says RRD45. :( > Like I wanted another 4x CD drive. > I fired of a reasonably polite, low-intensity complaint to the seller, > and less than an hour later, got an apology, an offer of a full refund > including shipping or replacement if they still have an RRD46, and an > offer, if I pay for the return shipping, to give me "extra" credit on > any future purchase. Which I'm likely to do. > > I've been fighting off a client who thinks his 5 grand for a solid > week's work entails lifetime support & handholding, not to mention > training of his dweebs. > > All week I've been trying to get NextCard to quit hitting my bank with > a completely unauthorized $125 direct withdrawal. They admit it's > entirely their fault, but insist that they can't stop the withdrawal! > They say _I_ have to put a stop on the charges at the bank. Meanwhile, > they are adding charges to my credit card for late payment and > over-limit, because they have the payment I did authorize, and which > did clear the bank, on hold. Because there's a "dispute". I'm up three > levels of their complaint desk, and have yet to speak to anyone who > admits to any peculiarity in their actions. "But we already promised to > pay the INS fees and the stop payment at your bank!" But not the late > fees, nor my time off work, nor the expense of faxing them all the > documentation. I can't even get a solid promise to drop all _their_ > extra charges, incurred because THEY screwed up! > > I'd much rather "twmaster", the eBay dealer, had sent me the right > thing to start with. But it's damn nice for somebody to own up to their > shit, and make good on it. > > > Doc > If your twmaster person is selling from the MD/DC area, I happen to know him. He's a good friend and honest guy and you can bet it was just an honest mistake. Tell him you're a friend of mine. -- -Linc Fessenden In the Beginning there was nothing, which exploded - Yeah right... From donm at cts.com Wed Jul 31 23:42:01 2002 From: donm at cts.com (Don Maslin) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: HPIB cables In-Reply-To: <3D487BCD.E5856797@gifford.co.uk> Message-ID: On Thu, 1 Aug 2002, John Honniball wrote: > > Don Maslin wrote: > > I have a couple of HPIB cables available at $15 the pair, shipped. > ... > > The 92220R has a right-angle connector at one end and the usual > > straight connector at the other. (I wonder if the 'R' indicates > > a right hand connector?) > > The 92220R is a specially-shaped cable to connect an HP150 to > a HPIB disk or tape unit. It's quite short with one straight > and one right-angle connector. I have one in front of me here, > off my HP150. Aah! That makes sense. > Incidentally, the HP150 isn't working -- looks like a PSU failure > to me. Any hints? Common failure modes? Links to circuit > digrams (schematics)? My unfamiliarity with the HP150 is pretty gross, John. But perhaps one of the other readers can shed some light on your problem. Hope so! - don > -- > John Honniball > coredump@gifford.co.uk > From lemay at cs.umn.edu Wed Jul 31 23:53:09 2002 From: lemay at cs.umn.edu (Lawrence LeMay) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: Fortran Coding Form Pads...u In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <200208010452.XAA14654@caesar.cs.umn.edu> > > > > > > Certainly, screen dimensions were modelled after punched cards: There > > were 80 columns on a punched card, and once everybody was used to that > > line length, it was an obvious choice to make the screen just as wide - > > except for a couple of clever guys who made the screen 64 columns wide, > > which happens to be a power of two. > > I've seen 132 column screens too (why 132???) but did anyone ever try to > make a 128 column screen (or printer)? It would seem to be a logical size > to make it, but I've never seen one. > I'm fairly sure its because of wide printing terminals, using landscape paper orientation instead of portrait. And the limitations of the existing printheads. At least thats my theory and i'm sticking with it. -Lawrence LeMay From doc at mdrconsult.com Wed Jul 31 23:56:00 2002 From: doc at mdrconsult.com (Doc Shipley) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: Aahhh, Relief! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, linc fessenden wrote: > If your twmaster person is selling from the MD/DC area, I happen to know > him. He's a good friend and honest guy and you can bet it was just an > honest mistake. Tell him you're a friend of mine. He is in MD. I've gotten a bunch of private replies from people who have dealt with him, and like him. I was sure it was exactly as he said, just a shipping screwup. I can live with that, I do it all the time. It's really nice to deal with somebody who thinks they should be responsible for their mistake. What a freakin concept. Doc From mross666 at hotmail.com Wed Jul 31 23:58:06 2002 From: mross666 at hotmail.com (Mike Ross) Date: Sun Feb 27 13:24:26 2005 Subject: Teletypes (more update) (William Donzelli) Message-ID: >I'm certainly up for a 33 and a 35. And I can pick up, if they're local to >NYC... William's warehouse is in Paterson NJ, so about 20-30 minutes from NYC. However, I think he is only there during the day, during the week. If you can't work with that schedule, if William lets me go back, I can grab you a 35 and stick it in my storage garage, but you will have to pick it up before the end of August (my rental price doubles starting in Sept, so I plan to have everything out before then). My garage is in Ho-Ho-Kus NJ, which is also about 20-30 minutes from NYC. But I have 24x7 access to the garage, and since I live about 10 blocks from it (and work about 10 blocks the other direction from it), I can meet you there pretty much any day or time for pickup. Of course, I have to figure out how to get a 35 back out of my van and into my garage all by myself... that will be a serious challenge. Chris, Appreciate it. A 35 would be most cool. Hopefully I can get out there myself to help you pick it up - or just pick it up myself. (let's take the logistics off-list). I would also go for a 33 - I don't have a working one this side of the pond. If the price were halfways reasonable I'd take one of the 'new' 33s that were mentioned a few posts back! Cheers Mike http://www.corestore.org _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com